text
stringlengths 5.77k
196k
|
|---|
- Beak's week 1
- Handicapping the CI Fantasy Football Wk 1 Lines
- 9/8 NFL Kickoff O/U Play
- Ben nfl thurs nite 9-08
- BW Thursday NFL
- Thursday nfl day 1 plays
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's 2011 NFL Plays - Week 1
- Saints/Packers Pick
- Super Bowl Picks
- Odds to make the playoffs
- Season Win Totals
- Excited to be here!
- NFL Week 1
- Thursday nfl play of the day--post your play here
- Season Win Totals
- 49'rs @ Chargers 9/1
- Fantasy Draft Tomorrow @ 8pm (EST)
- BW Weekend Preseason
- Saturday Hurricane Irene Preseason Plays
- NFL preseason weekend Friday and Saturday
- BW Friday NFL Preseason Play
- Friday Night Football
- Pre Season Thursday Night Lights!!
- NFL Thursday preseason
- Thursday Night Teaser
- Thursday Night Preseason Play
- Early Week 1 Lines Look
- Superbowl Matchup Future
- Monday Night Football
- My Home League Fantasy Roster...
- Sunday nflx
- BW Sunday NFL Preseason
- BW Saturday NFL Preseason
- Two Pre-Season Plays For Saturday
- BW Friday NFLX
- Friday night NFL x
- Thurs night NFL x
- Need the Boards Help; My Keeper???
- Monday night teaser play
- BW Monday NFLX Play
- BW Saturday NFL Preseason
- BW Friday NFL Preseason
- BW Thursday NFL Preseason
- NFLX Thursday
- Nflx thursdays total plays
- NFL Preseason is Here (Two Plays)
- 2011 Survivor Pool Signup & Registration
- 2011-12 CI Fantasy Football: Regisration & Draft Date Discussion
- Lockout over!!!!!
- Field of Dreams 2: Lockout
- DirecTV Sunday Ticket Labor Issue
- Cappers Info Mock Draft
- Detroit Lions on Monday Night Football
- Ready for Super Bowl XLVI???
- 2010 final results
- Superbowl(so sad its over:()
- donkey's super bowl bonanza
- Louie's Complete Superbowl Card: Yes, I went a little nutso....
- BW Super Bowl Sheet
- Is this a bad way to bet the game?
- Packers Coverage vs. Steelers Coverage
- Betting
- Ever wonder what happens when you simulate Super Bowl XLV on Madden?
- Pro Bowl
- The "Big" Game
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 21 (Super Bowl) thread
- 2010-11 Superbowl Consensus & Game Discussion
- Early Superbowl Play
- BW Conference Championship Sunday
- Plays for Championship Sunday!!!
- Prop Plays for Championship Weekend
- Huge NFC Championship Play
- beak's sunday
- Minnow's nfl plays for sunday
- Vics Nfl 1-23 Picks
- Sunday
- Your Take: Best Team in the Playoffs
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 20 (Conference Round) thread
- Cappersinfo Consensus & Discussion: 2011 NFC Championship
- Cappersinfo Consensus & Discussion: 2011 AFC Championship
- Jets/Steelers Poll: AFC Championship Game Picks
- Packers/Bears Poll: NFC Championship Game Picks
- 2010-11 NFL Season....
- beaks sunday div.
- BW Sunday Divisional
- NFL Play for Sunday!!!
- Sunday Divsional Playoffs
- 1/15
- beaks sat
- saturday
- BW Saturday Divisional Playoffs
- 1/15 nfl
- Minnow's big play for saturday
- Louie's Saturday NFL Divisonal Playoff Plays
- Weekend Foots
- nfl plays .
- 1/15 & 1/16 nfl write-up
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 19 (Divisional Round) thread
- Jets/Patriots Poll
- nfl playoffs
- Philly/g.b.
- 1/9
- BW Sunday Wildcard Plays
- Wildcard Plays for Sunday!!!
- steelers to win the super bowl play
- beak's sunday wild card
- Sunday Playoffs
- Minnow's nfl plays for sunday
- Minnow's saturday night teaser
- beak's wild card saturday
- playoff saturday
- Wildcard
- Wildcard Plays for Saturday!!!
- Saturday Wildcard Plays
- 1/8 wild card
- Louie's Wildcard Weekend Plays
- Poll: Wild Card Weekend
- 1/8 nfl write-up
- arkansas +135 oddmskaer.
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 18 (Wild Card Round) thread
- Opening Wild Card Playoff Lines
- Week 17
- 1-2-11
- nfl picks with oddsmaker
- plays i like
- week 17 nfl
- BW Week 17
- Sundays nfl write-up
- Minnow's parley for sunday
- NFL Week 17 Plays
- Beak's 17
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 17 thread
- Congrats BPD67: 2010 Cappersinfo.com Fantasy Football Champion (Final Standings)
- TNF
- Tuesday's MNF Pick.....
- 12-28-10
- Week 16 Tuesday Night Football
- Tuesday game
- MNF
- 12/27 mnf write-up
- MNF Pick
- JT sunday NFL
- Bw week 16 nfl
- Week 16 nfl
- beak's week 16
- Sunday Plays 12-26-10
- teaser play
- Louie's Week 16...
- Sunday
- 12/26 nfl
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 16 thread
- Over/Under Play of The Day!!!
- Week 16
- Xmas day game play
- Christmas Day Play
- JT christmas play
- Minnow's x-mas big play
- X-mas day nfl write-up
- Thursday NFL Play fo The Day!!!
- Week XVI
- Thursday Football Teaser
- Minnow's thursday monster play
- 12/23 nfl write-up
- Panthers/Steelers Cappers Info Consensus
- This Sunday
- Play for Monday Night
- Mnf mess
- Monday
- nfl with oddsmaker.
- 12/20 nfl write-up
- BW MNF Teaser
- 4pm tease
- Week XV
- parlay
- Sunday Foots
- beak's picks
- Minnow's monster plays for sunday
- nfl plasy with justbet.
- Dog Day Sunday Afternoon
- Louie's Week 15 NFL Action
- Week 15
- MNF Consensus and Discussion: Chicago Bears @ Minnesota Vikings
- BW Sunday NFL
- Top plays for Sunday
- Sunday Picks
- Sun nfl week 15
- Thurs nfl
- nfl plasy with oddsmaker.
- BW Thursday NFL Play
- Thursday's Football
- Predict The Score & Win $300: 49ers @ Chargers - 12/16/2010 @ 8:20pm (EST)
- Cappersinfo.com 2010 Fantasy Football Superbowl; Louie vs. bpd67
- Thursday Night Homer Play
- Cappers Info Consensus: San Francisco 49ers @ San Diego Chargers Thursday Night
- Arizona ML
- Week 15 Thursday, SF @ SD
- !!!Watch the Giants vs. Vikings for Free!!!
- MNF
- Plays of The Day!!!
- nfl with oddsmaker.
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 15 thread
- BW Monday NFL
- Monday's Football
- 12/13 mnf
- I'm sorry Tampa Bay bettors
- Sunday Afternoon Play
- Sunday Foots
- Sunday's Football
- 2 unders i like
- Nfl winter storm picks
- Sundays nfl write-up
- 12/12 nfl
- beak's 14
- nfl plasy with justbet .
- Minnow's 2 for sunday
- BW's Week 14 Card
- Louie's Week 14 Plays
- MNF Picks and Ravens/Texans Consensus
- Atlanta -260 to win the division
- Anybody know what the longest stretch is in NFL history without a TD?
- Colts/titans
- Play of The Day
- Week 14 (part 2)
- One thread for week 14
- BW Thursday NFL
- Thursdays nhl write-up
- Minnow's total play for thursday night
- Colts/Titans Consensus and Analysis
- MNF
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 14 thread
- Bw mnf
- Monday Night Teaser....
- Play for Sunday Night
- JT sunday NFL
- BW Sunday NFL
- plays i like
- Sudnay nfl
- Monday Night Football Consensus Jets @ Patriots
- Minnow's huge play
- beak's dec 5
- 12/5 nfl
- Week 13 NFL - Big 4pm Play
- titans -3.
- 12-5 10
- Thurs night nfl
- Three Tream Multi Sport Tease
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 13 thread
- Week 14
- Fantasy Playoffs Round Two (week 1 of 2)
- Louie's Week 13 NFL Thread...
- Predict The Score & Win $300: Texans @ Eagles - 12/2/2010 @ 8:20pm (EST)
- BW Thursday Night
- Week Thirteen
- Texans/Eagles Game Matchup
- Derrick Anderson Post-Game Tirade
- Cortland Finnegan / Andre Johnson
- MNF
- Monday
- Week 12 NFL
- Predict the Score and Win $300 - Cardinals @ 49ers (11/29/2010)
- Monday's NFL
- Bw mnf
- Monday
- JT sunday NFL
- Sunday
- Last Minute Injury Information
- beaks 12
- Hammerin' Hank Goldberg Week 12 NFL Picks
- Nfl 11/28/10
- Predict The Score & Win $300: Chargers @ Colts - 11/27/2010 @ 8:35pm (EST)
- Cappersinfo Consensus: San Diego @ Indy -2 - O/U: 51 (VOTE & DISCUSS)
- 2 monster plays
- 11/28 nfl
- BW Sunday Card
- Fantasy Playoffs Round One (week 2 of 2)
- Louie's Week 12 Card - Big Teaser
- nfl sunday week ???
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 12 thread
- dallas cowboys +240 dsi.
- Thanksgiving day
- beak's thurs
- BW's Happy Thanksgiving NFL
- Thanksgiving
- Thanksgiving NFL
- Happy Thanksgiving - Louie's Plays
- Pick the Side AND Total - Bengals @ Jets -9 - O/U 43.5 - Thursday, November 25, 2010
- Saints @ Cowboys - Consensus & Game Discussion
- Patriots @ Lions - Consensus & Game Discussion
- Monday Night Football
- BW Monday Night
- Predict The Score & Win $300: Denver @ San Diego - 11/22/2010 @ 8:35pm (EST)
- JT sunday NFL
- Two NFL Plays 11-21-10
- first half
- Week 11 nfl
- beak's 11
- Sunday
- Sunday Round 1 pix
- early plays
- Nfl vegas battle
- Sunday's Football
- 11/21 nfl
- Louie's Week 11 NFL Card
- BW NFL Week 11
- Big time NFL Upsets on the horizon this week
- Week XI
- Week 11 NFL
- teaser tonight
- BW Thursday NFL
- Think the NFL doesn't condone sports betting...
- Thursday's Football
- Why the Bears are going to beat the you know what out of Miami...
- Hey Louie, How about a Pre-Playoff Fantasy update?
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 11 thread
- Why did McNabb get signed to a long term extension?
- mnf play
- Monday night
- redskings +160 and under with bookmaker.
- Bw mnf
- JT sunday NFL
- Nfl 11/14/10
- donkeys week 10 NFL
- #10
- Sunday 11-14 plays
- Nfl week 10
- BW Week 10
- sunday plays
- beak's week 10
- Sunday's Football
- Colts -7
- NFL plays with Hollywood sportsbook .
- Louie's Sunday Week 10 Plays
- Sun NFL
- Upsets in week 10?
- Week 10 tough matchup picks
- Thurs nfl
- Week 10 NFL
- atlanta-1 justbet.
- Thursday Night NFL
- Thursday's Football
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 10 thread
- Thursday Night NFL Play
- Predict The Score & Win $300: Ravens @ Falcons - 11/11/2010 @ 8:20pm (EST)
- Ravens/Falcons
- BW MNF Week 9
- Monday Night Football Play
- nfl sunday night
- Ndamukong Suh tried an extra point today...
- BW Week 9
- Week 9 NFL
- donkeys week 9 NFL plays
- Sunday sunday sunday>>>>
- beak's 9
- Sunday plays
- 3 Play Sunday
- I'M Baaaaack
- Week 9 Survivor Update
- Cappersinfo.com Fantasy Football Notice & Update
- Louie's Week 9 Sunday NFL Card
- Nfl 11/07/10
- SD/Houston Over 49.5 looks too easy
- Grandmasters Big BIG sucker bet of the year!!!
- Going with these
- Survivor Pool
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 9 thread
- Is it me?
- Mnf indy/hou
- Txans +210 justbet .
- BW Monday Night
- Week 8 Survivor Update After Week 8
- Mon. Night Football Week 8
- beak's sun night
- Sunday Afternoon Play
- J e t s .. Jets jets jets
- JT sunday NFL
- MikeOswald's NFL week 8 plays
- Week 8 nfl
- BW Sunday NFL Card
- donkey's week 8 NFL plays
- Sunday early games
- 1 Play Sunday
- Official Cappersinfo Consensus & Discussion Thread: Steelers @ Saints - 10/31/2010
- Predict The Score & Win $300: Steelers @ Saints - 10/31/2010 @ 8:25pm (EST)
- Week 8 Fantasy Football Update
- Nfl picks
- GMs pissed off sunday garbage
- Louie's Week 8 NFL Card
- Nothing is set in stone
- beak's week 8
- Funny Line Movement - Louie's 49ers
- Week 8 NFL Upsets
- No obvious picks for Survivor pools this week
- Mnf giants/dallas
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 8 thread
- Monday Night Play...
- Survivor Standings After Week 7
- Monday NFL
- Monday nite nfl info
- MONDAY NITE 7pt TEASER PLAY
- BW's Monday Night Play
- going going 0-6 bills 4;36
- NFL 10/24/10 Best Bet
- Nfl 10/24/10
- MikeOswald's NFL week 7 plays
- Week 7 nfl
- Plays 10-24-10
- beak's week 7
- Sunday Six Pack - Week 7
- Week 7 NFL
- PA All The Way
- sunday games
- MNF Game Picks
- 3 Play Sunday
- 5* MONSTER 7pt TEASER 1:00
- Badfish 10/24/10 NFL Picks
- Louie's Sunday Week 7 Plays
- Sun NFL
- donkey's week 7 NFL plays
- Announcement: NFL Week 7 Pre-Game Chat - Sunday at Noon (EST)
- Cf: You sob!
- Offenses will be soaring this week
- You want NFL Upsets? I've got NFL Upsets!
- Pregaming for Week 7
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 7 thread
- Mnf week 6
- Badfish MNF Pick 10/18/10
- Did anyone win yesterday?
- Week 6 Monday Night Football
- Survivior Standings (After Week 6)
- BW Monday Night
- MNF Teaser
- NFL 10/17/10 Late game
- Nothing Early
- Badfish NFL Picks 10/17/10
- Nfl 10/17/10
- My Sunday Return
- MikeOswald's NFL week 6 plays
- Nfl week 6
- Hammerin' Hank Goldberg Week 6 NFL Picks
- Cappersinfo Fantasy Football Trade..
- todays card
- Week 6 nfl
- 4 Play Sunday
- beak's week 6
- JT sunday NFL
- Fantasy Football Question (In Another League)
- BW's Week 6 Plays
- 3 NFL picks I like
- NFL Picks
- Louie's Ohio State Hangover NFL Card
- donkey's NFL week 6 plays
- nfl card .week 6 .
- week 6 plays .
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 6 thread
- Vikings/ Jets halftime
- 10/11 mnf
- Three Mon Night Plays
- Mnf toughy
- Monday night NFL
- The Play of the Day!!!
- 10/11 mnf
- Monday Night Football
- Monday nite teaser
- Badfish MNF Pick 10/11/10
- Sunday night teaser
- Sunday Night Game.
- Badfish Picks NFL 101/10/10
- Week 5 nfl
- 4 Plays today
- GM Sunday
- MikeOswald's NFL week 5 plays
- Week 5 NFL
- Survivor Players Still Alive...
- Early MNF Look
- NFL picks
- 2 Play Sunday
- NFL Sunday
- beak's week 5
- JT sunday NFL
- Louie's Week 5 NFL Plays (Sun & Mon)
- BW Sunday Card
- donkey's NFL week 5 plays
- Lotto Ticket Thread (2010-11 NFL Season): Post your Rediculous Parlays Here
- ESPN Personality Picks
- An interesting Prop bet....
- New & Bigger Prizes Added To The Streak Builder Contest
- NFL Upsets this weekend
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 5 thread
- Mon night 10/4
- All my rowdy friends are here...
- Monday Night Football
- Beware of the trap.
- Badfish Monday Niight 10/4/10
- Badfish Monday Niight 10/4-10
- Monday night week 4
- Monday Night Football
- NFL Monday
- Sun night nfl 10/2
- Nfl 10/3
- Week 4 NFL
- Minnow's 2 big teaser plays
- Falcons
- cardinals +335 .
- JT sunday NFL
- Badfish 10/3/10 NFL Picks
- MikeOswald's NFL week 4 plays
- 2 for today
- Nfl wee 4
- BW's Week 4 Card
- NFL Sunday
- beak's week 4
- Nfl plays
- 10/3 nfl
- Sunday's NFL
- ESPN Personality Picks
- Louie's Week 4 NFL Plays (Sun & Mon)
- donkeys week 4 NFL plays
- Wk 4 Upsets
- Week 4 Fantasy Football Update
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 4 thread
- Monday Night Football Week 3
- Monday Night Play
- NFL Monday
- Monday night play
- MNF WEEK 3 (First Post)
- NFL Commentating
- View From Louie's Couch
- week 3 late games
- NFL Chat...
- Wk 3 Picks
- Week 3 nfl
- 4 Plays for Week III
- Beaks week 3
- JT Sunday NFL
- MikeOswald's NFL week 3 plays
- Nfl 9/26
- 3 play sunday
- Badfish NFL Picks 9/26/10
- Sunday Seven Pack?
- Wolve's Week 3 plays
- NFL Week 3
- 3 HUGE 6pt TEASERS
- Louie's Entire Week 3 NFL Card (Sunday & Monday)
- NFL Live Odds
- Plays for Sunday!!!
- donkey's NFL week 3
- 4 Team Parley
- ESPN Personality Weekend Football Picks
- NFL Week 3
- Week 3 Survivor Update
- Cappersinfo.com 2010 Week 3 Fantasy Football Update
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 3 thread
- Michael Vick starter for week 3, possibly for season
- Week 3 Picks; YTD 3-2-2
- Monday nite teaser
- badfish's 2 seperate MNF plays
- Monday Night Football
- Mnf week 2
- Week 2 Monday Night Football
- NFL Monday
- JT monday night
- Monday night analysis
- Anyone think...?
- I admit I was wrong about LT
- sunday night prop
- Wolve's Week 2 plays
- beak's week 2
- squirrel's week 2
- Week 2 NFL
- MikeOswald's NFL week 2 plays
- Week Two NFL
- Week 2 Sunday Six Pack
- JT sunday NFL
- Week 2 NFL Trends
- Hammerin' Hank Goldberg Week 2 NFL Picks
- Week 2 NFL Picks
- Week 2 nfl picks
- 2 for sunday
- Minnow's nfl plays with a big 1 for sunday
- Week II
- Louie's Week 2 NFL Action w/ anylasis (sort of)
- just 2 totals
- Upsets for Wk 2
- donkey's NFL week 2 plays
- My NFL Week 2 Plays
- Week 2 Picks; YTD 2-2-1
- Post your monster teaser here
- "The Sports Scientist" Kenneth Corey's NFL Week 2 thread
- Monday Night 9/13
- MONDAY NIGHT 6pt TEASER
- Mnf week 1
- beak's monday
- One Monday Night Play
- Monday Night Tease
- Monday Night Football - Week 1
- Monday Night Football x2
- primetime Sunday
- Sunday Night Football Cowboys @ Redskins
- 9-12 Plays
- Week One NFL
- week 1 NFL
- Sunday NFL Week 1
- Sunday nfl ... Oh yeah!
- Hammerin' Hank Goldberg Week 1 NFL Picks
- Let the games begin!!!!!
- Sunday Six Pack - Week 1
- MikeOswald's NFL week 1 plays
- Minnow's loving the guppies plays for sunday
- beak's weak 1
- 3 for week 1
- Week 1 NFL
- Louie's Week 1 Sunday Slate
- 3 Plays for Sunday
- donkey's NFL week 1
- A brief introduction + Week 1 plays
- NFL Week 1
- My Thursday Night Play
- Opening Night NFL
- Week 1 analysis
- 49ers/Seahawks
- beak's thurs wk1
- Opening nfl game
- Vikes/Saints Preview
- NFL Week #1
- NFL Wk 1 Upsets
- NFL Playoff Picks
- steelers v falcons
- NFL Week 1 Picks
- Sunday NFL X Play
- Sat games
- Saturday Preseason Plays
- NFLX
- Two Sunday NFL Preseason Football Picks (with Analysis)
- Texans on Saturday
- Fri Games
- NFLX
- Week 1 NFL
- 2 for friday
- 2 Friday Preseason Plays
- Friday Night NFL Preseason Play
- Thursday NFLX
- Thurs nflx
- Thurs games
- NFLX
- Chargers/Saints Preview
- Indy/Green Bay... Blowout???
- Monday Night Under
- MNF NFLX Titans/Cards
- SNF NFLX Pick
- Sunday Preseason
- Sat preseason
- Saturday NFL Preseason Plays
- Saturday Preseason Play
- 2 Preseason Plays
- Win Totals and Super Bowl Winner
- First NFL Post 2010
- Friday nite nflx play
- Thursday night nflx play
- Preseason prop trend
- Hou/NO (Sat)
- Fantasy Draft Day Big Preseason Play
- Eagles/Bengals (Sat)
- Pats/Falcons
- hahahahaa
- Monday Night Football Preseason Style
- Reminder: Cappersinfo.com Fantasy Draft Thursday @ 7:45 ET
- MNF NFLX Jets/Giants
- Sunday NFL Preseason
- Sunday NFLX
- Saturday NFL Preseason
- Friday NFL Preseason
- Fri nfl
- Nflx play for friday
- Friday Preseason Play
- Thursday NFL Preseason Plays
- Baltimore -3.5 Tonight
- 0/u win totals for 2010
- Nflx play for thursday
- NFL Season Win Totals
- Sunday night pre-season play
- 2010 Cappersinfo NFL Survivor Pool ($35 Entry Fee) - Signup Here!
- Cappersinfo.com 2010 Fantasy Football League - Registration & Draft Date Discussion
- Week 1 NFL Lines Available
- NFL Draft Fill in the Blank
- Free Agency Discussion
- Biggest story you probably haven't heard about yet
- Last Sunday's Super Bowl
- Peyton Manning
- Super Sunday Play
- Super Bowl Selections
- My superbowl bet that wins every year!
- SuperBowl and Props
- Louie's Superbowl Sunday Plays
- beak's super sunday
- Last Night's Dream
- Cappersinfo Superbowl Consensus & Discussion Thread
- Sundays 4 tm nfl/nba 10 pt teaser
- Championship Sunday
- Championship games
- beak's afc nfc champ.
- Conference Championship Sunday
- Conference Championship Plays
- 2009 Champions Plate Added To The Trophy
- J.E.T.S...jets jets jets
- 1/17 nfl
- JT NFL playoffs
- beak's sunday
- Sunday Plays
- Louie's Sunday NFL Plays
- Who gonna beat dem Saints?
- JT sat night NFL
- beak's saturday
- you guys ready to let the dogs out?
- CARDINALS at NEW ORLEANS
- Indianapolis colts injury report
- Baltimore ravens injury report
- New orleans saints injury report
- Arizona cardinals injury report
- 1/16 nfl
- Predict The Score of the & Win $200 at Diamond Sportsbook; Baltimore @ Indianapolis
- Saturday's Playoff Picks
- Divisional Playoff Plays
- Nfl 1/10/10
- JT taking the dogs today
- Louie's Wildcard Sunday Plays
- Nfl 1/9/10
- Saturday night play
- Wildcard Weekend
- 1 For Saturday
- NEW SEASON Playoffs!
- MikeOswald's NFL Wild Card Weekend Card
- beak's wild card
- NFL Wildcard Saturday Plays
- Wild Card Plays
- donkey's NFL wildcard weekend plays
- Playoff Plays
- Cappersinfo.com 2009 Fantasy Football Final Champion
- Sunday night
- Sunday Plays
- MikeOswald's NFL week 17 plays
- Louie's Week 17 Plays
- Week 17
- beak's week 17
- BW's Week 17 Card
- Last confidence picks of the nfl season
- Nfl playoff scenarios
- Monday Night Football
- Final Survivor Standings; We have a winner!!!
- JT sunday NFL
- Educators Sunday Plays
- Sunday NFL Plays
- donkey's NFL plays for week 16
- beak's week 16
- MikeOswald's NFL week 16 plays
- Sunday teaser parlay
- 1 Play Sunday
- Louie's Week 16 Sunday Plays
- Xmas NFL
- Week IVI
- Christmas Play
- beak's christmas day play wk16
- Friday Week 16 Christmas Play
- Christmas pick
- Christmas Teaser
- Predict The Score of the & Win $200 at Diamond Sportsbook; New York @ Washington
- Survivor Update (Just Two People Left)
- Week 15 Monday Night Football
- Sunday sleep in picks
- 12/20 nfl
- Sunday Six Pack
- beak's 15
- Educator's Sunday Selections
- Week XV
- Louie's Sunday Week 15 Card
- JT sat night game
- Saturday NFL Pick
- Louie's Week 15 Saturday Night NFL Play
- Week 15 ESPN Radio "Expert" Picks (To Fade)
- MikeOswald's NFL week 15 plays
- donkey's week 15 plays
- Thursday Night OVER
- Thursday Night NFL
- Monday Night....
- Any thoughts?
- beak's monday
- Mnf 12/14
- Monday Night Football Week 14
- Monday Night Play
- Easy Sunday card
- Dallas ML
- Sunday picks
- Sunday Six Pack
- Sunday Plays
- Sunday Scaries
- Minnow's 6 team 6 pt teaser play
- beak's week 14
- 12/13
- Sunday's Football
- Louie's NFL Week 14 Sunday Card
- Survivor Week 14
- MikeOswald's NFL week 14 plays
- More Plays
- Thusday's Football
- Educator's Thursday Night Play
- Another Crap Thursday Night Matchup
- Mr. C's Thursday night Play
- donkey's NFL plays for week 14
- Yep, I'm doing it, and don't stop me
- NFL Thursday Night Week 14 Teaser
- Cowboys/Chargers
- Cappersinfo.com Fantasy Playoff Bracket & Final Standings
- New Board Member
- Minnow's monday night 6 pt teaser play
- MNF Pick
- Monday Night Football Side & Tease...
- Survivor Update After Week 13
- Sunday Night
- Donkeypunch and Oakas
- So Long Survivor
- Cleveland/San Diego Game Advice
- Nfl 12/6
- MikeOswald's NFL week 13 plays
- beak's week 13
- 16-0 plays
- Sunday Picks
- Week 13 Card
- JT sunday
- Week 13 picks
- 12/6 Plays
- Ssunday's Football
- Fantasy Points Play @ Diamond
- NFL Sunday
- The Sunday 1 o'clock tease....
- Louie's Week 13 NFL Plays
- donkeys week 13 nfl plays
- Week XIII
- ESPN Radio Picks To Fade; NFL & College Football Picks
- beak's thurs
- 12/3 ncaaf
- Thursday Night Football
- Thursday Night... Both
- Monday Night 11-30-09
- Monday Night Football
- Predict The Score of the & Win $200 at Diamond Sportsbook; New England @ New Orleans
- Survivor Pool Update & Important Rule
- Monday Night Consensus & Game Discussion: Patriots @ Saints -1.5 (O/U 42.5)
- Louie's Monday Night Side and Total...
- Nfl 11/29
- Injury Update: Warner Not Starting
- NFL Sunday
- Beak's sunday wk 12
- Week XII
- MikeOswald's NFL week 12 plays
- JT Sunday NFL
- Just a Tease Sunday
- Louie's Week 12 Sunday NFL Plays
- Sunday Sunday Sunday....
- Week 12 Plays
- Turkey day plays
- Thanksgiving Picks
- Cause I love a good tease.... lol
- turkey day plays
- Minnow's 6 pt teaser
- 1 For Turkey Day
- beak's thanksgiving plays
- Louie's Thanksgiving NFL Plays
- Turkey Day Consensus & Discussion: Raiders @ Cowboys -13.5 (O/U 40)
- Turkey Day Consensus & Discussion: Giants -6.5 @ Broncos (O/U 42.5
- Nfl turkey
- donkey's week 11 NFL plays
- Thanksgiving Day Plays
- Week 11 MNF
- Monday Night Football
- Nfl 11/22
- Sunday NFL Plays
- BIG Sunday Fun...
- donkey's NFL plays for week 11
- Week XI
- 2 for Sunday
- beak's week 11
- JT Sunday NFL
- Sunday Week 11
- Week 11 Survivor Update
- MikeOswald's NFL week 11 plays
- beak's thursday play
- Thurs Night
- Thursday NFL
- Thursday Night
- Louie's Week 11 NFL Card (Complete)
- Monday Night Play
- Monday Night Football Week 10
- NE/Indy game management
- Sunday Six Pack
- 11/15 nfl
- Week 10 nfl picks
- beak's week 10
- 2 For Sunday
- Sunday
- Week X
- Louie's NFL Week 10 Card
- donkey's NFL plays for week 10
- MikeOswald's NFL week 10 plays
- Thrusday Night Play
- Updated List of Sponsor Bonus Offers
- Three 100% Signup Bonus Offers From Three GREAT Books For Cappersinfo Members Only!!!
- Thursday Night Play
- Cappersinfo Consensus: Chicago Bears @ San Francisco 49ers (VOTE SIDE & TOTAL)
- Week 10 Survivor; IMPORTANT!
- BW's Big MNF Play
- Week 9 Monday Night Football Play
- 11/8 nfl
- Week 9 NFL
- JT sunday NFL
- MikeOswald's NFL week 9 plays
- beak's week 9
- Week 10 picks
- 3 Play Sunday
- Louie's Week 9 NFL Plays
- I Suck At NCAAF....NFL Week 9
- Week IX
- 11/08
- Week 9 Plays
- donkey's NFL plays for week 9
- MNF Teaser
- Monday Night Football Week 8
- Survivor Update For Week 8
- Week VIII
- Week 8 NFL Plays
- beak's week 8
- MikeOswald's NFL week 8 plays
- Sunday's Card
- JT NFL sunday
- Louie's Week 8 NFL Card
- Swami Sez...
- donkey's NFL plays for week 8
- Cappersinfo.com Week 8 Fantasy Football Update
- man tough MNF pick tonight
- Monday Night Football Week 7
- Monday Night Football
- yo, i couldnt get on the site this morning
- week 7
- Week VII
- JT sunday NFL
- beak's week 7
- 10/25 nfl
- 3 Play Sunday
- MikeOswald's NFL week 7 plays
- Louie's Week 7 NFL Card
- Week 7 Plays
- New York Jets -6.5
- Swami Sez...
- Tommy Gold NFL 2009 Week 7 Picks
- beak's week 7 possibilities
- Week 7 Leans...
- donkey's NFL plays for week 7
- Week 6 Survivor Update
- Week 6 plays
- I think the board....
- Sunday Six Pack
- Week 6
- JT sunday NFL lucky 3
- Sunday's Lucky 7?
- 3 Play Sunday
- Louie's Big Week 6 NFL Card
- Tommy Gold NFL 2009 Week 6 Picks
- beak's week 6
- MikeOswald's NFL week 6 plays
- Friday picks
- Don't Forget Your Survivor Plays!
- donkey's NFL plays for week 6
- Great Job Forum!
- MNF play
- Monday Night
- Week5 Survivor Plays
- Hello all, new member, here's my picks week 5
- 10/11 nfl
- Ready to roll the dice Week V
- JT NFL sunday
- beak's week 5
- 3 Play Sunday
- Bw wk5
- NFL picks
- Louie Week 5
- MikeOswald's NFL week 5 plays
- NFL Week 5
- Tommy Gold NFL 2009 Week 5 Picks
- Cappersinfo.com Pre-Week 5 Fantasy Football Update
- Week 5 Leans
- Thinking Out Loud
- donkey's NFL plays for week 5
- Week 5 confidence picks
- Monday Night play
- Week 4 Survivor Picks
- Week 4 Plays
- Wolve's Week #4 Plays
- beak's week 4
- 3 Week 4 Plays
- week 4
- 10/4 nfl
- Cappersinfo Consensus: Green Bay Packers @ Minnesota Vikings - VOTE SIDE & TOTAL... |
May 9, 2001May 9, 2001
WILL CONGRESSIONAL TAX-WRITERS EVADE THE BUDGET RESOLUTION LIMIT ON TAX CUTS?
Tax-Writers Could Do So Through Backloading and Other Gimmicks
by Joel Friedman, Richard Kogan, and Robert Greenstein
Summary
Congressional negotiators have agreed to set the overall size of the tax cut at $1.25 trillion over the next ten years (plus an additional $100 billion for economic stimulus, to be split in some proportion between this year and next year). The congressional tax-writing committees must now draft legislation that meets the plan's $1.25 trillion tax-cut target. The issue is how these committees will modify the President's tax-cut package which costs $1.775 trillion over ten years according to the latest Joint Committee on Taxation estimates to fit within Congress' somewhat smaller target. These committees will be under pressure not to scale back the President's proposed tax cuts very much, but rather to rely on budget gimmicks to shoehorn in most of his tax cuts and possibly additional tax reduction measures as well (such as pension tax cuts). As House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Bill Thomas said earlier this year, the trick is "to get a pound and a half of sugar in a one-pound bag."
- "Backloading" tax cuts that is, delaying the date on which they become fully effective is one gimmick likely to be employed.
- Another gimmick is to rely on the Alternative Minimum Tax to cancel out, on paper, a significant share of the income tax cuts, thereby reducing their cost. This constitutes a gimmick because virtually all observers agree that legislation will be enacted in the next few years to overhaul the AMT so it does not start to affect millions of middle-class taxpayers later in the decade; under that "must pass" legislation, the AMT would not have much of an effect in cancelling out the tax cuts, and their cost would rise accordingly.
- Still another gimmick is to defer action on expiring tax credits that do not expire this year, while extending the credits that do expire this year for one year only. This maneuver enables lawmakers to avoid counting against the $1.25 trillion limit the cost of extending these tax credits over the next decade a cost which is virtually certain, as these credits have been routinely extended in the past and are expected to be continued in the future.
If available gimmicks prove inadequate, Congress may go further and engage in a more blatant budget-busting strategy leaving certain popular tax cuts out of the $1.25 trillion package altogether, with the intention of enacting them later this year as part of a minimum-wage bill or other legislation likely to secure the 60 votes needed in the Senate to breach the budget resolution targets. The budget resolution is supposed to encompass all tax and spending legislation that Congress will consider this year. Senior Senate Republicans and Administration officials, however, have already been quoted as saying they will not be bound by the budget resolution's $1.25 trillion limit and will seek to append additional popular tax cuts to other legislation in the months ahead. If Congress can ignore the budget resolution targets in this manner, the $1.25 trillion tax-cut limit will essentially have become meaningless.
Backloading Already Used Heavily in House-Passed Bills
The House has demonstrated its willingness to engage in budget maneuvers such as these even before facing the new, lower $1.25 trillion target. For example, the tax bills the House has passed in recent weeks rely heavily on backloading.
- The House-passed estate tax bill (H.R. 8) phases in very slowly, repealing the estate tax in 2011. Since it takes a year or two to settle an estate, the full costs of repeal would not appear until after the end of the ten-year period that the budget resolution covers. This enables the cost of H.R. 8 to be held to $186 billion in the first ten years. In the second ten years, its costs skyrocket to approximately $1.1 trillion.
- Similarly, the principal provision in the House-passed H.R. 6 that focuses on married couples a provision that accounts for 80 percent of the cost of the bill's marriage provisions when the provisions are fully in effect would not start to phase in until 2004 and not take full effect until 2009. This provision costs $150 billion in the first ten years, but more than $400 billion in the second ten years.
AMT Reforms and Extenders Largely Ignored
Both the House and the Administration have made it clear they plan to defer "must do" tax legislation to a later date to make room for more tax cuts within the targets the budget resolution sets. The most egregious example involves the aforementioned Alternative Minimum Tax. A parallel tax system intended to ensure that high-income taxpayers do not avoid paying income taxes, the AMT will encroach heavily upon the middle class in coming years due to flaws in its design if nothing is done to address this problem. The Joint Tax Committee estimates that the number of taxpayers subject to the AMT will soar by 1,300 percent over the coming decade, rising from 1.5 million taxpayers this year to 21 million in 2011.
Knowledgeable observers agree that Congress and the Administration will not allow this to occur; changes will be made in the AMT to prevent it from hitting millions of middle-class families. The President's budget and the House-passed tax cuts, however, largely ignore this problem and the inevitable cost of addressing it; in fact, they make the problem more severe and raise the costs that ultimately will be incurred when the problem is addressed. Because taxpayers are required to pay the higher of their regular income tax liability or their AMT liability, proposals that substantially reduce regular income taxes without addressing the underlying problems in the AMT greatly increase the number of taxpayers who will become subject to the AMT if it is not reformed. The Joint Tax Committee estimates that the income tax rate reductions that are included in the Administration's package and that passed the House will increase the number of taxpayers subject to the AMT by another 15 million by 2011.
This aspect of the tax-cut proposals constitutes a budget gimmick for two reasons. First, the failure to include in the tax package the measures needed to address the problems in the AMT results in the cost of these inevitable measures not being counted against the $1.25 trillion budget target. Second, failing to include these measures in the tax bills under consideration substantially lowers the cost of those bills, since the cost estimates for the bills must be based on the dubious assumption that the AMT will remain unchanged, hit 36 million taxpayers by 2011, and thereby cancel out billions of dollars in tax cuts that otherwise would be provided to millions of tax filers. The Joint Tax Committee has estimated that the reductions in income tax rates in H.R. 3 would cost $292 billion more over ten years were it not for the effects of the AMT. Thus, when the problems in the AMT are eventually addressed, the cost of H.R. 3 will increase by roughly $300 billion.
Congress also is likely to rely on a similar type of gimmick in dealing with the 20 popular tax credits that expire every couple of years or so and always are renewed. The President's budget proposes a permanent extension of one of these credits, the research and experimentation credit. Since this credit does not expire until 2004, however, Congress may defer action on it, and thereby create more room for other tax cuts in this year's package. For the credits that do expire this year, Congress is likely to employ a gimmick the Administration's budget contains and extend the credits for one year only.
Whether tax credits that do not expire this year are extended this year or a few years from now, and whether these tax credits are made permanent or continue to be extended a few years at a time throughout the decade, does not affect their costs over the next ten years. The costs are essentially the same regardless of which course is pursued. The gimmick here, too, is that Congress seems likely to follow a course that enables it to avoid counting billions of dollars in cost that clearly will be incurred against the $1.25 trillion limit.
Gimmicks Swell Costs in Future Decades When Nation's Fiscal Situation Already is Tenuous
These gimmicks from backloading, to leaving tax cuts out of the pending tax bill and not counting their cost against the $1.25 trillion target, to using the failure to address the problems in the AMT now to shrink artificially the cost assumed for the pending legislation all mask the ultimate costs of the tax cuts. In the face of a determined Congressional majority, Congressional budget rules are no obstacle to such gimmicks.
These gimmicks increase the ultimate costs of the tax cuts because they let Congress pack more tax cuts into the current tax-cut legislation than it otherwise could do. Indeed, the Administration's tax cut plan, as embodied in the three tax-cut bills the House has already passed plus the remaining elements of the Bush package and the changes in the AMT that ultimately will be made, would cost nearly $5 trillion in the second ten years the legislation would be in effect, from 2012 to 2021.
It is in this second ten-year period, which falls outside the period the budget resolution covers, that the country). gimmicks such as backloading to shrink the cost of tax cuts in the first ten years and thereby making the total tax-cut package larger and ultimately more costly than it otherwise would be only makes the long-term fiscal situation more troublesome.
Congress Should Adhere to Basic Rules
Because of the long-term fiscal difficulties the nation faces and the high risk that Congress will employ an array of budget gimmicks to evade the tax-cut limits in the budget resolution, we offer three recommendations:
- All provisions in the tax bill should be fully effective no later than the fifth year, 2006. It may be noted that every major provision in President Bush's proposed tax package except for estate tax repeal would be fully phased in by 2006. In addition, most of the tax cuts in President Reagan's 1981 package were phased in fully in three years.
- The tax writers should commit to a "pay-as-you-go" requirement for any tax cuts considered later in the session that would otherwise breach the $1.25 trillion target. The budget targets are meaningless if Congress applies them only to one bill and breaches them in subsequent legislation.
- The tax bill should include provisions that substantially fix the AMT, so the number of taxpayers affected by it stays roughly constant or grows only modestly over the coming decade. The tax bill also should extend throughout the decade those tax credits that ultimately will be extended anyway.
The remainder of this analysis examines these issues in more detail.
Ten-Year Cost Estimates for Tax Bill Likely to Be Misleading
Ten-year figures often say little about the true cost of tax-cut proposals once the proposals are fully in effect. Phasing a tax cut in over a number of years reduces its cost in the first ten years, relative to the cost of making the tax cut fully effective immediately. But such phasing does nothing to reduce the tax cut's ultimate cost that is, its recurring annual cost in the years after the tax cut is fully in effect. It is a tax cut's recurring annual cost that is crucial for understanding the measure's ultimate fiscal impact.
To illustrate the effects of backloading, the table below presents three scenarios. In these scenarios, a hypothetical tax cut costing $1.25 trillion over the next ten years is assumed to be phased in fully at three different points in time: in 2002, 2006, and 2010.(2) Under each of the three scenarios, the revenue loss from the tax cut is assumed to reach its full cost in the year after the tax cut becomes fully effective. The table shows that while all three scenarios entail a cost of $1.25 trillion over ten years, their costs in the second ten years and in 2011, a year in which the tax cuts would be in full effect under all three scenarios differ markedly.
The first approach which has no backloading would cost $155 billion in the tenth year. By contrast, the third example the most backloaded would cost $242 billion in that year, almost 60 percent more. This large differential in the tenth-year cost continues into the future. The third scenario costs more than two-and-a-half times as much in the second ten years $3.2 trillion as in the first ten years, and costs $1.1 trillion more in the second ten years than the first scenario does even though the costs of both scenarios are identical over the initial ten-year period. These illustrative examples demonstrate that when a proposal is backloaded the ten-year estimates can be misleading.
Furthermore, backloading can be made more extreme than under any of these illustrative scenarios. The full cost of a tax cut can be pushed off beyond the ten-year budget window, by having the tax cut not become fully effective until after the end of the initial ten-year period. The House-passed estate-tax repeal bill (H.R. 8) takes such an approach. Under that bill, estate-tax repeal does not occur until 2011. Since the full cost of changes in the estate tax do not show up until a year or two after the effective date for such changes, the full cost of repeal is not captured in any of the first ten years. The Joint Tax Committee estimates that H.R. 8 would cost $186 billion between 2002 and 2011. But during the second ten years, when the full costs of estate-tax repeal would be felt, the bill would cost approximately $1.1 trillion, six times its cost in the first ten years.(3)
To keep the annual, recurring cost of the tax cuts that Congress is planning to adopt from exploding at the time the baby-boom generation starts retiring, the tax-writing committees could require that all provisions of tax-cut legislation be fully effective no later than the fifth year, or 2006. This would still allow substantial phasing in. As noted, the major income tax provisions of President Bush's tax-cut plan (although not the estate repeal provision) would be fully effective by 2006. The 1981 Reagan tax cuts generally phased in over three years.
Deferring AMT Reforms: Two Gimmicks for the Price of One
The authors of the bipartisan Senate floor amendment that reduced the size of the ten-year tax cut in the Senate budget resolution stated that the $1.188 trillion total in the Senate budget plan should accommodate AMT relief. This sensible recommendation may be largely ignored.
Under current law, flaws in the AMT's design are resulting in a growing number of middle-income taxpayers becoming subject to the alternative tax. The Treasury Department estimates that by the end of the decade, more than half of all taxpayers affected by the AMT will have incomes below $100,000, and more than two million will have incomes below $50,000. (4) This growth in the AMT is neither in keeping with its original policy intent nor politically sustainable. As a result, virtually all knowledgeable observers believe Congress will take action to reform the AMT.
AMT reform is expensive. For example, a proposal by Senator Blanche Lincoln that would hold the number of taxpayers affected by the AMT at or just below today's levels would cost $158 billion over ten years under current law and several hundred billion dollars more if the Bush tax cuts are enacted.
This creates an incentive to defer action on AMT relief. The "budget gimmick value" of deferring AMT reforms is great, because an unreformed AMT lowers the official cost estimates for various income tax cuts. The AMT requires a set of calculations that are separate and distinct from regular income tax calculations; taxpayers are required to pay the higher of their regular income tax or their AMT liability. The reductions in income tax rates that the Administration has proposed and the House has passed would lower regular income taxes substantially and thereby greatly increase the number of taxpayers whose AMT liability will be higher than their regular income tax liability if the problems in the AMT are not addressed. The Joint Tax Committee estimates that the reductions in income tax rates included in H.R. 3 would increase the number of taxpayers affected by the AMT by 15 million by 2011, raising the total number of taxpayers subject to the AMT to a startling 35.7 million that year.
In preparing a cost estimate for a tax-cut bill, the Joint Tax Committee is required to assume that the problems in the AMT will not have been addressed unless the bill contains a provision to remedy those problems. Accordingly, in estimating the cost of the rate reductions in H.R. 3, the Joint Committee was compelled to assume that 35.7 million taxpayers would, in fact, be subject to the AMT by 2011 and that this would substantially reduce the cost of the tax-rate reductions by canceling out a significant portion of the tax cuts that the rate reductions otherwise would provide.
The Joint Tax Committee has reported that the large increases in AMT liability it was compelled to assume in preparing the cost estimate for H.R. 3 reduce the cost of H.R. 3 by $292 billion over ten years. The Joint Committee estimates show that the cost of H.R. 3 would be 50 percent higher in 2011 if it were not for these assumed AMT effects. (Note: The House did include some AMT modifications in H.R. 6, primarily to ensure that the AMT does not limit the effect of the increase in the child tax credit. These AMT provisions are modest, however, and do little to counter the massive growth in the number of taxpayers who would be affected by the AMT as a result of the rate reductions in H.R. 3.)
Deferring action on AMT relief is essentially a "two-fer" in the world of budget gimmicks. First, it allows Congress to exclude the cost of needed AMT reforms that virtually all observers are convinced will be enacted in the next few years. Second, omitting the inevitable reforms in the AMT from the tax-cut legislation conveniently shrinks the cost of that legislation.
This strategy substantially increases the long-term costs of the tax cuts. It does so because it makes the cost of the pending tax cuts appear much lower than it really is, since the exclusion of AMT reform from the package artificially reduces the tax-cut package's cost. That, in turn, enables Congressional tax-writers to include additional, permanent tax cuts some of them backloaded in the package, while presenting the package as complying with the $1.25 trillion limit. Accurate accounting of anticipated income tax reductions would require Congress to include fundamental AMT reforms as part of the package. It appears that the Senate Finance Committee may be inclined to provide more AMT relief than the House. But the modest levels of AMT relief being discussed are unlikely to prevent the number of taxpayers affected by the AMT from increasing relative to current law as a result of the tax reductions or protect the middle class from the AMT. Failure to achieve even these goals guarantees that the future costs of reforming the AMT will remain substantial. It also means that the cost of the tax reductions now being considered will continue to be understated.
Busting the Budget Resolution Targets
Gimmicks are intended to create the illusion that budget discipline is being maintained. They make costs "disappear" on paper to create the appearance of compliance with the budget resolution targets. But these costs eventually "reappear." By its nature, a gimmick does not permanently reduce costs.
Some tax-cut advocates appear to be interested in a more direct approach directly breaching the budget resolution's $1.25 trillion tax-cut limit. Once a first round of tax cuts totaling $1.25 trillion has been enacted, the plan would be to continue enacting additional tax cuts by packaging them in legislation expected to secure the 60 votes needed in the Senate to waive the budget resolution targets. As Senator Phil Gramm stated: "I'm not bound by the tax number." The strategy appears to be to leave some popular tax cuts out of the current tax-cut legislation and then to package them in a way that makes them politically irresistible.
Senate Republican leaders, including Majority Leader Trent Lott has spoken openly about packaging various additional tax cuts into minimum-wage legislation later this year. There also is talk of writing tax cuts into Patients Bill of Right legislation. (In addition, according to media reports, Administration officials have promised conservative House Republicans and corporate lobbyists another substantial tax-cut bill next year.)
Breaching the budget resolution targets in this manner is a more blatant, in-your-face version of a budget gimmick. Like a budget gimmick, it circumvents the commitment to live within certain limits and undermines fiscal discipline. Moreover, such an approach could lead to a "tax-cut binge" that compromises the efforts of the past 15 years to restore fiscal balance and overcome the damaging fiscal effects of the last tax-cut binge in the early 1980s. Rather than repeating these mistakes, Congress should commit to pay-as-you-go rules for any tax cuts considered after the $1.25 trillion target has been reached.
Impact of Gimmicks Would Materialize in the Second Ten Years
Employing gimmicks to hold down the cost of tax cuts over the next ten years creates an illusion of affordability but does not reduce revenue losses over the long term. By masking the ultimate costs of tax cuts, these gimmicks conceal the tax cuts' eventual fiscal impact.)
Conclusion
With the budget resolution about to be approved, Congress will proceed quickly to craft legislation to meet the $1.25 trillion, ten-year tax-cut target. Congress should resist the temptation to rely on backloading and other gimmicks to squeeze 1½ pounds of sugar into a 1-pound bag and to produce tax-cut legislation whose costs explode in the years the baby-boom generation begins to retire in large numbers and the nation's fiscal outlook worsens. Congress should eschew both backloading and gimmicks designed to avoid counting against the $1.25 trillion limit the cost of additional tax cuts that Congress seems determined to pass this year (such as pension tax breaks) or that Congress unquestionably will pass in the near future, such as legislation addressing the problems in the Alternative Minimum Tax and extending the expiring tax credits. Deferring action on these matters and failing to leave room for their cost within the $1.25 trillion ceiling should be regarded as a budget gimmick. These gimmicks not only cloak costs that ultimately will be incurred, but they mislead the American public and weaken the nation's fiscal position over the long term.
End Notes:
1. Long-Term Budget Issues: Moving from Balancing the Budget to Balancing Fiscal Risk, Testimony of Comptroller General David M. Walker before the Senate Budget Committee, February 6, 2001.
2. The tax cuts are assumed to be phased in equal annual increments. For instance, the tax cut that is assumed to be fully in effect after five years, in 2006, is assumed to be phased in at a rate of 20 percent each year.
3. Joel Friedman, "Lower-Cost Estate Tax Repeal Reflects Slow Phase-In: Cost in the Second Ten Years Could Reach $1.3 Trillion," Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, April 4, 2001. Based on the recent Joint Tax Committee estimates of President Bush's revised proposal to repeal the estate tax, which now incorporates a carry-over basis provision and provisions to reduce income tax avoidance following repeal of the estate and gift tax, the cost of H.R. 8 in 2012 to 2021could reach $1.1 trillion, somewhat less than originally projected.
4. Robert Rebelein and Jerry Tempalski, "Who Pays the AMT?," Office of Tax Analysis, U.S. Treasury Department, OTA Paper 87, June 2000. The key design flaw is that the AMT exemptions and thresholds are not indexed for inflation. The parameters for the regular income tax, on the other hand, are indexed for inflation. Thus inflation has the effect of increasing AMT liability over time relative to regular income tax liability
5. If the effects of inflation are removed and the costs are expressed in constant 2001 dollars, the cost still doubles in the second ten years from $1.8 billion in the first ten years to $3.6 billion in the second ten years. For more details on the methodology behind the estimates, see Richard Kogan, Joel Friedman, and Robert Greenstein, "Cost of the Tax Cut Would More Than Double to $5 Trillion in Second Ten Years," Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, April 4, 2001. |
2012-R-0232
Susan Price, Senior Attorney
June 6, 2012
NOTICE TO READERS
This report provides brief highlights of new laws affecting Crime and Public Safety enacted during the 2012 regular session. Each entry indicates the public act (PA) number.
Not all provisions of the acts are included here. Complete summaries of all 2012 public acts will be available when OLR publishes its Public Act Summary book; some are already on OLR's website. (). All acts summarized here take effect October 1, 2012, unless otherwise noted.
Readers are encouraged to obtain the full text of acts that interest them from the Connecticut State Library, House Clerk's Office, or General Assembly's website ().
TABLE OF CONTENTS
TABLE ON PENALTIES 5
courts 6
Court Operation 6
Veterans' Eligibility for Pretrial Diversion Programs 6
crimeS and penalties 7
Animal Cruelty 7
Bank and Credit Union Robberies 7
Commercial Sexual Exploitation of a Child 7
Death Penalty Eliminated 7
Desecrating or Stealing War or Veterans' Memorials 8
Domestic Violence 8
Failing to Report a Child Missing 9
Fraudulent Fundraising 9
Habeas Corpus Reform 9
Legalizing the Palliative Use of Marijuana 10
Motor Vehicles 10
Completing Repealed Alcohol and Drug Addiction Treatment Program. 10
Drunk Driving. 11
Expressions of Remorse 11
“Move Over” Law 11
Poaching 12
Regulated Professions 12
Fine Art Secured Lenders 12
Massage Therapists. 12
Mechanical Contractors 12
Public Utilities 12
Unclassified Misdemeanors 13
Voter Intimidation and Interference 14
Zappers and Phantom-Ware 15
crime victims 15
law enforcement 16
Federal Probation Officers 16
Stolen Property Inventories 16
Traffic Stops and Racial Profiling 16
Training Fish and Game Constables 16
public safety 17
Firearms Evidence Databank 17
Public Safety Data Network 17
E 9-1-1 Program 17
Recording Pistol and Revolver Sales 17
Sexual Violence on College Campuses 18
The law authorizes courts to impose fines, imprisonment,.
PA 12-133 makes numerous changes in court operation, including:
1. allowing the Judicial Branch to enter into agreements with other agencies on a broader range of security matters;
2. expanding the courts' use of electronic documents and communications;
3. indemnifying attorneys appointed by the court to inventory the files of inactive, suspended, disbarred, or resigned attorneys in the same way as state employees;
4. specifying that someone who pleads not guilty to an infraction or certain violations can agree with the prosecutor on the amount of the fine and pay it without appearing before a judicial authority;
5. requiring the Department of Motor Vehicles to give the jury administrator the latest updated file of people holding identity cards to use when compiling the master list for summoning jurors;
6. requiring a defendant to make a motion for a nolle 13 months after a prosecutor continues a case and there is no prosecution or disposition in order to have the records erased, instead of having them automatically qualify for erasure;
7. allowing Court Support Services Division (CSSD) personnel to use videoconferencing to interview defendants at police stations, when determining bail and conditions of release; and
8. requiring the court to determine that a matter is not frivolous before it waives a court fee or the state pays service of process costs for an indigent party.
PA 12-208 (1) allows veterans and surviving spouses to use the accelerated rehabilitation program twice rather than just once and (2) broadens eligibility for diversionary programs for (a) people with psychiatric disabilities and (b) drug education by adding certain veterans and spouses. It also gives veterans and spouses access to state and federal departments of veterans' affairs services as alternatives to those offered by the Department of Mental Health and Addiction Services.
PA 12-86 increases the penalty for subsequent convictions for specified types of animal cruelty as defined in existing law. Under prior law, for first or subsequent offenses, violators could be imprisoned for up to one year, fined up to $1,000, or both. The act increases the penalties for subsequent offenses to imprisonment for up to five years, a fine of up to $5,000 or both.
PA 12-186 establishes the crime of 2nd degree robbery when certain activities are committed at a bank or credit union. Under the act, someone is guilty of this crime when, during the course of a larceny, he or she intimidates an employee by intentionally engaging in conduct that causes someone else to reasonably fear for his or her physical safety or the safety of another. The actor's purpose must be to (1) prevent or overcome resistance to the taking of the property or its retention immediately after the taking or (2) force the property owner or another person to deliver the property or engage in other conduct that aids in the crime's commission.
Second-degree robbery is a class C felony (see Table on Penalties).
PA 12-141 creates the class C felony (see Table on Penalties) of commercial sexual exploitation of a minor, which involves knowingly purchasing advertising space to advertise for a commercial sex act depicting a minor. (The act does not define “minor” but presumably it means a person under age 18.) The act specifies that (1) lack of knowledge of the depicted person's age or (2) reliance on a non-government identification are not defenses.
It permits the accused to avoid conviction by proving he or she made a reasonable, bona fide attempt to ascertain the victim's age by (1) requiring him or her to produce a government-issued identity card and (2) keeping and producing a copy. is commuted by the Board of Pardons and Paroles, or reduced by a court, to life without the possibility of release.
These inmates must be placed in administrative segregation (AS) while DOC reclassifies them. The options for these prisoners are: remaining in AS, or possess, buy, or attempt to buy one knowing that it has been unlawfully removed from its official location; or (3) transfer or dispose of any part of it.
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage
PA 12-114 gives family violence victims greater support from the courts, law enforcement agencies, and court-based victim service providers. Among other things, it:
1. extends, from six months to one year, the maximum period that a civil restraining order can remain in effect without a court-ordered extension;
2. makes stalking or patterns of threatening between family or household members forms of family violence;
3. modifies the Judicial Branch's CSSD's uniform, weighted, release criteria by adding that conditions be sufficient to reasonably ensure that a pretrial release will not endanger the safety of others;
4. adds to conduct that constitutes 1st degree threatening;
5. requires probation officers who notify the police that they suspect a probationer of violating his or her terms of probation to also notify (a) the crime victim if he or she has given contact information and (b) the Office of Victim Services (OVS);
6. allows OVS to award medical, psychiatric, psychological, and social and rehabilitative services as restitution to children who witness domestic violence, including those not related to the victim; and
7. establishes a statewide model family law enforcement policy that agencies must use.
PA 12-112 makes it a class A misdemeanor (see Table on Penalties).
PA 12-195 makes it a Class C misdemeanor (see Table on Penalties) to fraudulently solicit funds on behalf of a veterans' charitable organization in order to benefit financially from such contributions.
Regarding habeas corpus petitions, PA 12-115:
1. requires the court, on its own or if asked by a party, to determine if there is good cause to proceed to trial on the petition and
2. requires courts to dismiss petitions related to a criminal conviction that are not filed before certain dates unless the petitioner proves good cause for the delay.
Prior statutes and court rules did not authorize such preliminary reviews or impose filing deadlines.
The act does not apply to petitions (1) claiming actual innocence, (2) challenging prison conditions, or (3) challenging the imposition of the death penalty.
EFFECTIVE DATE: October 1, 2012 and applicable to petitions filed on or after that date.
Legalizing the Palliative Use of Marijuana, “dispensaries” (pharmacists), or growers from being (1) subject to prosecution or civil lawsuits or (2) denied any right or benefit for specified actions relating to palliative usage. The protections do not apply when the patient ingests marijuana at work or school, in the public or moving vehicles, or in front of children. The act also directs that palliative use be curtailed when required by federal law or to obtain federal funding.
The act allows the Department of Consumer Protection (DCP) to designate other debilitating conditions and charge various fees to cover direct and indirect costs. He must also:
1. set licensing, administrative, and practice rules and standards;
2. determine the number of dispensaries (the act specifies between three and 10); and
3. establish a board of expert physicians to (a) hold public hearings to evaluate petitions claiming that other conditions be designated as debilitating conditions, (b) recommend inclusion of new conditions, and (c) submit regulations making marijuana a Class II rather than Class I drug (the latter are subject to the most stringent regulation).
The act makes it a misdemeanor to tell certain lies to law enforcement officers about palliative marijuana use and specifies that insurers are not required to cover this treatment.
EFFECTIVE DATE: October 1, 2012, except the provisions (1) defining various terms, (2) providing for dispensary and producer licensing, and (3) creating the Board of Physicians are effective upon passage.
Completing Repealed Alcohol and Drug Addiction Treatment Program. PA 12-121 allows an individual (1) whose motor vehicle license, privilege, or certificate was suspended or revoked, under certain circumstances, on or before December 31, 2011, and (2) who was participating in, or eligible to participate in, the alcohol and drug treatment program eliminated by PAs 11-48 and 11-51, to complete it or an equivalent program the commissioner designates, and then seek reinstatement of his or her license or privilege.
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage
Drunk Driving. PA 12-178 makes a number of changes in the driving under the influence (DUI) laws, including:
1. placing restrictions on the first year of driving with an ignition interlock device after a second DUI conviction;
2. allowing a DUI offender whose license has been permanently revoked to request restoration after two, rather than six years, but be subject to lifetime use of an ignition interlock device after restoration, subject to a request for removal of the device for good cause after 15 years (under prior law, the first request could be made after 10 years) ; and
3. increasing, from $25 to $75, the maximum participation fee an organization conducting a victim impact panel program can charge a DUI offender the court orders to attend the program by the court (previously they could charge $75 for panels in the pretrial alcohol education program).
EFFECTIVE DATE: July 1, 2012, except the provisions on lifetime ignition interlock use after license reinstatement for third or subsequent DUI offenders are effective January 1, 2013.
Expressions of Remorse. PA 12-124 makes certain statements or other conduct by someone convicted of a motor vehicle offense that resulted in death or serious physical injury inadmissible as an admission of (1) liability or (2) against interest in a civil or criminal proceeding. The act applies to apologies and other expressions of remorse made to the victim or the victim's relative or representative after conviction but before sentencing.
PA 12-19 applies the “move over” law to highways with two or more lanes in each direction. The previous law applied to highways with three or more lanes in each direction.
The “move over” law requires a motorist approaching one or more stationary emergency vehicles, as defined by law, located in the travel or breakdown lane, or on the shoulder of a highway with their flashing lights activated to (1) immediately slow to a reasonable speed below the posted speed limit and (2) move over one lane if traveling in the lane adjacent to the location of the emergency vehicle, unless this would be unreasonable or unsafe.
A violation that results in the injury or death of the emergency vehicle operator carries a fine of up to $2,500 and $10,000, respectively; any other violation is an infraction.
PA 12-84 increases the penalty for poaching from a class C to class B misdemeanor (see Table on Penalties). By law, a person commits this crime by entering on any premises to hunt, trap, or fish despite knowing that he or she is not licensed or privileged to do so.
Fine Art Secured Lenders. PA 12-131 creates a fine art secured lending license that anyone, including a pawnbroker, in the business of loaning money on the deposit of fine art must obtain from designated town officials. Among other things, the act subjects licensees to performance and recordkeeping requirements and authorizes penalties similar to those that already apply to pawnbrokers.
Under the act, anyone who willfully engages in the fine art secured lending business without a license or after being notified that his or her license has been suspended or revoked commits a class D felony (see Table on Penalties). Any violation for which no penalty is specified is a class A misdemeanor.
Massage Therapists. PA 12-64 extends regulation of the massage therapy field to people who employ massage therapists, instead of just the practitioners. It also expands the list of practices and services that cannot be advertised unless performed by licensed massage therapists.
Mechanical Contractors. PA 12-18 establishes a penalty for unregistered mechanical contractors who willfully direct their employees, or supply someone else with unlicensed employees, to engage in plumbing and piping or heating, piping, and cooling work. Violators are subject to a $1,000 fine for a first offense and $2,500 for second and subsequent offenses.
Public Utilities. PA 12-148 requires the Public Utilities Regulatory Authority act requires PURA to open a proceeding to establish standards for restoring intrastate telecommunications under certain circumstances after an emergency. It also requires telephone telecommunications companies to issue credits to customers who lose service under certain circumstances.
The act also:
1. requires cell phone service providers to report on the backup power generation capabilities of their cell towers and
2. requires the Department of Energy and Environmental Protection (DEEP), in consultation with the utility companies, the Department of Transportation (DOT), the Department of Emergency Services and Public Protection (DESPP), and an association of municipalities, to develop a procedure for expedited road clearing for public safety personnel after an emergency by January 1, 2013..
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage, except the provisions regarding civil preparedness planning and training are effective July 1, 2012.
PA 12-80:
1. creates a new misdemeanor classification (a class D misdemeanor),
2. adjusts the penalties of currently unclassified misdemeanors to fit them into classifications while deeming others to be classified,
3. reduces the penalties for some unclassified misdemeanors to fine-only violations,
4. sets the possible probation term for the class D misdemeanor and changes the terms for some unclassified misdemeanors, and
5. repeals some unclassified misdemeanors.
By law, misdemeanors are punishable by imprisonment for up to one year. They are classified according to severity as class A, class B, and class C. There are also unclassified misdemeanors, which are punishable by imprisonment but not designated under one of these classes.
EFFECTIVE DATE: October 1, 2012, except the changes to probation terms are effective October 1, 2012 upon. They are used primarily by retailers and restaurateurs to hide a portion of their profits, thus reducing tax liability.
Under the act, these programs are contraband, thus, the Department of Revenue Services may confiscate them along with devices on which they have been installed. Also, the government may initiate forfeiture proceedings to seize profits obtained as a result of a user's unlawful activities.
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage
PA 12-133 makes several changes in laws concerning services for crime victims. It:
1. authorizes victim compensation when OVS or a victim compensation commissioner reasonably concludes that (a) an alleged crime of sexual assault or risk of injury to a minor occurred and (b) the personal injury was disclosed to certain individuals;
2. eliminates the $100 deductible on the total amount of victim compensation determined for an injury;
3. expands OVS's lien for reimbursement of compensation paid to someone; and
4. extends, from June 30, 2012 to June 30, 2013, the termination date for the Sexual Assault Forensic Examiners Advisory Committee, which advises OVS on a program to train sexual assault forensic examiners and make them available to sexual assault victims at participating hospitals.
EFFECTIVE DATE: October 1, 2012, except the provision extending the Sexual Assault Forensic Examiners Advisory Committee's termination date is effective upon passage.
PA 12-177 gives federal probation officers performing their duties access to the names and addresses of people issued (1) permits to sell or carry handguns, (2) eligibility certificates to possess them, or (3) certificates of possession for assault weapons.
Under prior law, police had to hold as evidence property valued at $250 or more seized in connection with an arrest or under a search warrant. PA 12-72 increases the threshold from $250 to $1,000.
PA 12-74 suspends police departments' duty to record and report traffic stop information on July 1, 2012. It requires them to resume recording the information starting on July 1, 2013, and annually reporting summary data starting on October 1, 2013, if the Office of Policy and Management (OPM) has developed new standardized methods. It creates a Racial Prohibition Project Advisory Board to work with the Criminal Justice Information System Governing Board and help OPM develop the methods. It makes other changes related to data recording, reporting, retention, and evaluation; review and disposition of complaints; officer training; and penalties for noncompliance, among other things.
EFFECTIVE DATE: July 1, 2012, except the provisions concerning the Racial Profiling Prohibition Project Advisory Board are effective upon passage.
PA 12-181 exempts certain fish and game protection constables from certification as police officers by the Police Officer Standards and Training Council (POST) if they (1) are appointed by a town in Hartford County having a population between 44,000 and 50,000 (i. e., Enfield) and (2) successfully complete a basic police training course tailored to their duties and provided by a POST-certified Enfield police officer. To carry a firearm in the course of their duties, they must be certified by a firearms trainer used by Enfield's Police Department and meet the recertification requirements that apply to the department's regular sworn officers.
PA 12-16 makes changes in the laws dealing with the state's firearms evidence databank.
Among other things, the act:
1. conforms the law to practice by expanding the types of images of discharged ammunition the databank must store to include images of other firearm ammunition, instead of just handguns (pistols and revolvers);
2. gives laboratory personnel discretion in determining what discharged ammunition to enter in the databank, and
3. eliminates the mandate for the laboratory to complete tests on handguns submitted to them within 60 days of submission.
PA 12-68 requires the (1) Department of Emergency Services and Public Protection (DESPP) to establish an electronic public safety data network (PSDN) for exchanging information among public safety and criminal justice entities. It requires the (1) Office of State-Wide Emergency Telecommunications (OSET) to create technical and operational standards for the network's establishment and (2) E 9-1-1 Commission, in consultation with the Coordinating Advisory Board, to advise the DESPP commissioner on its planning, design, implementation, coordination, and governance.
The act adds the expenses associated with implementing and maintaining the PSDN to the other expenses the commissioner must consider when determining the amount of funding necessary for the E 9-1-1 program.
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage for the establishment of the PSDN; July 1, 2012 for the remaining provisions.
E 9-1-1 Program. PA 12-114 requires OSET to study the cost, feasibility, and public safety considerations of redesigning the E 9-1-1 system to allow text messaging or communicating using other forms of mobile devices.
EFFECTIVE DATE: Upon passage
PA 12-191 requires gun dealers to (1) keep their handgun sales records in a form prescribed by federal law, rather than report budgetary resources, to offer (1) sexual assault and intimate partner violence primary prevention and awareness programming for all students and (2) ongoing prevention and awareness campaigns.
EFFECTIVE DATE: July 1, 2012
SP:ro |
We’re Shocked, Shocked! To Find David Frum Engaging in Character Assassination
Over at NRO, the online home of David Frum until January of this year, Frum's former colleagues are expressing shock and dismay at his attacks on Rush Limbaugh, most prominently in a cover story for Newsweek. Today, Andy McCarthy noted that Frum had insinuated to Chris Matthews on television that Limbaugh might be racist. McCarthy offered sarcastic congratulations to Frum on his notoriety and wrote, "David has arrived. From nowhere to Newsweek in a nanosecond."
Frum's attack on Limbaugh should surprise no one at NR. Frum has a long history of seeking to advance himself by smearing others, from his 1991 American Spectator cover story attacking Pat Buchanan as an antisemite to his 2003 National Review cover story denouncing Buchanan, Tom Fleming, and Sam Francis as "unpatriotic" for opposing a war that turned out to be as disastrous for America as they predicted it would be. If National Review is sincerely repentent over having provided journalistic cover to Frum for years, it might, in the spirit of Lent, announce that it regrets publishing Frum's 2003 attack and apologize to the "unpatriotic conservatives." But I'm not holding my breath.
What is bugging me about a lot of this Limbaugh business is that some paleos are so desperate to disparage Limbaugh and the conservative movement that he represents that they end up sounding like Frum or Steele or any of Limbaugh's other critics in the process. (As far as I know, no one at Chronicles has been guilty of this.)
Limbaugh and the movement clearly deserve criticism, but rightward criticism of Limbaugh and the movement must be identifiably rightward. And in the grand scheme of things deluded conservatives like Limbaugh's listeners are less of an enemy than are self conscious moderates like Frum, Steele, Parker, and the rest.
I never believed for a moment that Limbaugh is a pillar of conservative philosophy. Cliff Kincaid wrote an expose in the pages of Chronicles over a decade ago regarding his non-existant voter registration, his serial monogamy, etc. And Howard Stern once described Rush as a shill for the GOP, also true. But is he entertaining? I think so, and I tune in as often as my schedule permits. Limbaugh said early on that he wanted to make AM radio worth listening to again, and in this goal he has been spectacularly successful. So the fact that a pathetic, cringing milksop like Frum would bite Limbaugh in the butt only proves that Rush is out front. When the Obama White House attacks Frum (it won't) it'll be because he's a thorn in their side.
I think AM radio which once used to be Christian, is now almost exclusively Mexican, which must be a source of delight to the left-wing tolerance crowd.
I can't listen to Rush. His shilling for the GOP and phony conservatism drives me nuts. It just that he is less of a problem than the moderate boot Rush crowd. At least Rush's listeners think they are conservatives.
Red Phillips: "...but rightward criticism of Limbaugh and the movement must be identifiably rightward."
I completely agree.
Long, long ago, I listened to Rush primarily because he was often a source of information not disseminated by (note, I did not say "unavailable to") other media. Those days are long gone.
It was not long after he lost his monopoly (thank you, Internet) on hard-to-find information that he morphed from a semi-credible "conservative" into a swivel-chair, chemically-dependent, rich-as-Croesus warrior/fascist. It is no coincidence that he also ceased to be entertaining--to me, at least.
Unfortunately, his only legacy today are his pathetic "ditto-heads." I'd let them speak for themselves, but, well, they delegate their thinking entirely to the Maharushi.
I place much - maybe most - of the blame for the current disaster unfolding in DC in the lap of Rush and his cronies. Any marginally principled conservative would have told his listeners in '00 that they did not have a dog in the hunt, and repudiated W with the same vigour they attacked the Dem (whoever the hell it was) with. Same with W in '04 and McCain in '08. Harrumph.
Frum attacking Limbaugh shouldn't even be a story. But Frum is right in saying that the Republican party is extremely unpopluar. While it's worth hearing Mark Levin wipe the floor with Frum,it has not occured to either of them why the republicans are so unpopular; it's the war. and in the end it's all about Israel.
Etienne,
I'll be damned if you arent a very entertaining sort to read.
Beyond that, I would find much humor in David Frum sponsoring a single entry (that being him) lawn dart tournament.
McCallum
It is rather humorous to read that David Frum is complaining about being ostracized by others on the Right as he has been a prominent hitman on many occasions, most notably the "Unpatriotic Conservatives" rant that graced National Review just before the Iraq invasion. Frum is an odd mix of Talleyrand, Iago and Richard III, faithless to all but himself. But most readers of Chronicles knows that already.
Yet Pat Buchanan, Tom Fleming, Taki and the late Samuel Francis, among others, were right on Iraq and David Frum, Dick Cheney, George W. Bush, Rich Lowry, Michael Ledeen, the Kristols and the Podhoretzes, among others, were wrong. As long as oil flowed from Iraq in an orderly way and Iraq remained within its borders, who governed Iraq was unimportant to the interests of the American people. The invasion of Iraq has cost the lives of 4300 American soldiers, has caused over 20,000 other American casualties, has cost nearly $ 1 trillion so far, has created two Democratic political tidal waves which have reduced the Republicans to minorities in Congress and elected an inexperienced Gramscian Marxist as president. More importantly, the invasion and occupation of Iraq has soiled the credibility of conservatism.
David Frum thinks the cause of the last two Republican political debacles has been a Republican overidentification with Christian interests and a lack of effort in seriously addressing environmental problems. But he is wrong. Mr. Frum, along with all the other neo-conservatives and Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity and Mark Levin, should be honest enough to own up that it is their reckless adventure in Mesopotamia that has been the root cause of Republican political misfortune. David Frum only has to look in the mirror to locate a source of Republican and conservative decline.
Frum is, of course, a dishonorable courtier. Limbaugh, a shrewd carnival barker. My somewhat dissent from Dr. Phillips would be whether, in fact, Limbaugh's audience is reachable. I am skeptical.
And Frum's assertion of the over-influence of the "Christian Right" as the cause of the GOP's troubles is quite amusing given that GOP corruption was a substantial issue in 2006. Corruption exemplified by . . . the lobbying/corruption scandal master-minded by Orthodox Jew and ultra-zionist Abrahamoff (not exactly a Christian Right representative although he allied himself with Christian Zionists as did all the neocons), and the perverted flirtations of the homosexual Congressman Mark Foley. Neither of those reflect "social conservatism" or "Christian Right" by any stretch.
Maybe we could have Limbaugh and Frum fight a duel, and plug the barrels of both guns?
Frum attacks Limbaugh. Gingrich attacks Limbaugh. Limbaugh attacks them both. Let them cut each other up. We don’t have a dog in this fight and to watch it is simply entertainment.
As Dan Larison said, this is not a fight between “elites” and the “grassroots.” People who have private jets and live Citzen Kane style in a Palm Beach mansion are not “grassroots.” Limabugh has always wanted to be a part of the elite and now he is and is probably wealthier than Frum or Gingrich combined. The elite media in turn defers to him and makes him into a “leader.” No, this is a fight amongst Cosmos and so much the better.
That being said, Limbaugh and his talk show brethern (notice that we’re talking about him and none of the other would-be "leaders" like Hannity or Savage or O’Reilly which shows you the pecking order still remains) have a right to be upset that those politicians and former administration officials turned pundits and media talking heads, who would be nothing without all those Dittoheads voting for them, are turning on them and blaming them for their problems after spending a nearly two decades calling Rush “Leader of the Opposition” and “Honorary Member of the Class of 1994″. You can’t put that genie back in the bottle. After legitimizing Rush by the cover of your magazines and using his supporters as your political shock troop army, to turn around and try to kick him out of the cocktail party for being an uncouth is not only the height of hypocrisy, but also basically sums up what the phrase “being used” is all about.
And once again Frum maddens with his lack of prespective and or history. Apparently being ostratcized and being read out of the “movement” by his former collegues has not made him reflective or and wiser about his attempts to do just that to paleos in the pages of NR itself. Frum goes from being a Gramm Conservative of 1994 to being a Tom Dewey Republican of 2009 and doesn’t inform you as to why, you just have to accept evolutionary theory I guess. It only makes him look as shallow as the talk show hosts, always riding different popular waves. The same is true of politicians like Gingirich. No one amongst these Cosmos has any fealty to principle. No one.
As the old African proverb goes, when the elephants fight, the grass gets trampled. Getting trampled of course are the very grassroots who are now forced to pick sides among people they once considered allies or whose books fill their bookshelves at home. Red talks about the people hurt in “friendly fire” and I think it good point to be made. I have been critical of Rush and all the aforementioned, but to go after the Dittoheads too is counterproductive in the long run. I think there are a lot of us as young paleos who grew up as Rush and talk show listeners who ultimately stopped listening because we didn’t like what he was saying anymore. But we came to that decision on our own or were influenced by publications like Chronicles.
The talkshow audience is going to have to make up their own minds in the same way. Right now they blame the politicians for their problems and it may take more election defeats to get them to realize that the critiques of Larison and Derbyshire and others of whole genre are true in that what you are trying to sell, most U.S. citizens aren’t interested in anymore. But assulting them and scapegoating them only makes them cling to Limbaugh and other talk show hosts all the tighter as a defensive reaction.
The important thing is that when they realize that all their gods have failed, we are around with an alternative, a natural alternative that’s no longer poisioned by ideology or litmus tests or loyalty oaths. But they can only come on their own accord and only they can lead themselves to water when they thirst.
Great post, Mr. Scallon. And it is going to have to take more political defeats for the Republicans to re-examine themselves. Looking back to the Age of Reagan won't cut it; political life moves on. Jeffersonian Republicans, Jacksonian Democrats, Lincoln Republicans and FDR Democrats all had their day but now are relegated to the history books. So will go the Reagan Republicans.
Frum is an embarrassment to use Canadians, believe me.
I have always found Limbaugh entertaining. Believe it or not, he had a TV show about 15 years ago that was quite a lot of fun. He was doing the Stewart/Colbert stuff long before they existed, and he was doing it better, but his show lacked production values.
In Limbaugh's case, it's an "enemy of my enemy is my friend" situation. I'm delighted that he attacks socialism, feminism, etc. Thank God someone with a voice does. How I wish traditional Conservatisim had at least one voice with Limbaugh's reach.
Frum, on the other hand, is to U.S. conservatism what Joe Clark was to Canadian conservatism (and I guess only Canadians will get that reference) -- a traitor and an impediment to success. And that's just from a practical perspective. As a human being, he's pure scum.
As for causes of the Republican downfall, yes the Foley scandal and the concurrent Pastor Ted debacle were devastating. But before that, it was Katrina. Katrina did in the Republicans at least as much as Iraq did. You can mark the point of Bush's plummet in the polls right from Katrina. It made the left's accusations of incompetence stick.
I think Katrina was convenient for the left. After all it was a big ball of wind, the President - or any political leader - has no control on that. If the hurricane had not happened perhaps we could track the poll plummet directly to Iraq.
Thanks for the kind words Mr. Leadberry.
@9 Thanks McCallum!
The best conservative talk show is the Ron Smith Show on 1090 WBAL from 3 until 6 p.m. It can be streamed on your computer. But it's a Baltimore station, so quite a bit of the content is local. But Baltimore is a way more interesting city than either Washington or New York.
@17. Mark Levin but for domestic affairs only, not foreign policy.
@18 Jack
I disagree wholeheartedly. Levin is an Isreal-first loudmouth.
@19. Yes. that's why domestic only.
Like a good rat,Frum is abandoning a sinking ship.But the causes of the ship's sinking have little to do with Frum or his treachery.
Limbaugh and his moronic "ditto-heads" are relics of a dubious and malfeasant "Reagan Revolution."The sacred flame of Divus Ronnie's tomb has expired,and only embers remain to console his priestly colleges and forlorn votaries.
Est honor et Tumulis,as Ovid put it.
Limbaugh is a pretty good personification of "conservatism" as well as a broader "Americanoism."Ignorant,stupid,vulgar;so fat his swollen jowls look about to explode.With the manner and dress of a clown,had he showed up at a recent shindig in Washington dressed in bell-cap and motley,it would have hardly made a difference.
Ditto-heads are under the impression that tax-cuts can cure all ills.Thats all you've really got to know.Add some anachronistic nationalism,best displayed in contempt for Europe,and a few odds and ends,and our charming three-hundred pound loud-mouth can "earn" $33 million per year while sitting on a cyst,located on his ass, that conveniently kept him;cyst,ass,and all,out of Vietnam.
In a better country,Rush would have a lot more to concern himself with,than Frum.
Anyone who can stand to listen to Levin has a strong stomach and a tin ear. His voice alone is a real sign of what this pathetic country has become. Of course he is an Israel-firster and with good reason, but what is his second priority and his third, certainly not to whatever is left of this country.
What is the point of making fun of Limbaugh's weight or whatever? That just comes off as nastiness and like some kind of personal grudge. We need to make principled rightward criticisms of his policies that are not conservative.
As a public figure,RL's persona is fair game.He reeks and drips vulgarity.As for his girth,I was pointing to its emblematic nature.I would also add that,while looks are not relevant to political disputes,freakishness (Lincoln?) is not without legitimate concern.Certainly we all have some control over our weight.Is Rush "being the best that he can be?"
As for principled criticism,rejecting tax-cuts as a panacea is a start,no?
@24 Why in the world would anybody, remotely on the right, reject tax cuts for any reason? Who cares if they are a panacea? Good heavens, man. Talk about hyperbole. Just to make sure everyone knows you think RL is vulgar?
Because a better way of helping humble working Americanos would be some combination of spending restraint,especially with regard to defense and a faulty foreign policy,an end to immigration and labor arbitrage-falsely known as "free trade"-and some form of debt relief for the long suffering working stiff.And thats just for starters.
Mealy-mouthed "tax-cuts" are for the birds.
Beyond that,addressing non-economic concerns-too numerous to list-would go quite a way towards improving the lot of decent folk;North and South,East and West.Tax cutters tend to neglect so much that doesnt fall within their narrow purview.
RL's vulgarity is integral to his approach both to economics-classicly,"household management"-as well as broader issues.That is,when broader issues are attended to at all.
Huckleberry Finn's Pap told him to never pass up a chance to steal a chicken, if he couldn't use it somebody else could. That is the attitude we should have concerning tax cuts.
Limbaugh was not always wealthy. Despite both his father and grandfather being attorneys, he shunned college and worked in radio and for the Kansas City Royals. He regularly recalls his down-and-out days with a certain fondness. And the man who gave him syndicated fame, Edward F. McLaughlin of EFM Communications, is (or at least was) a proud liberal.
How interesting that Frum minds words over actions.
He's one of the core neocons who wanted the US to go to war with Iraq, doing his bit by terming the 'axis of evil'-phrase and crappy books titled 'an end to evil'. I don't have to tell anyone here about the consequences of that (mass killings, chaos, billions of money lost, ethnic cleansing, torture,...)
But don't be fooled by the support for all of this ruthlessness, deep down there's kind, gentle soul inside who's very concerned about racist comments against people of colour (no matter how privileged they are and how much they use their race for their career.)
"Sometimes, he [Rush]."
Think about that. Frum is morally responsible for a war that's bleeding the US and the Middle East respectively financially and literally, but he's more concerned nowadays with Rush Limbaugh's occasional crimethink. Real crimes go unpunished, thought crimes are on the front cover of Newsweek Magazine. How shameless.
What a complete and utter failure of a human being Frum is.
Marciano, I think David Frum's Kempian view on race might be altered if he switched his habitation from Foxhall Road in upper Northwest Washington with views of the Potomac River to Minnesota Avenue or Benning Road in Southeast Washington with views of the mighty Anacostia River.
From the left: I cannot think of two more wretched blowhards than Frum and Limbaugh. Frum has attacked Chronicles repeatedly and may I say with cro magnon intelligence. Rush Limbaugh is beyond wretched--he once supported Pat Buchanan a most honorable man--and then dumped him. One post remarks "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" but I would urge the writer not to be deceived. Limbaugh has no honor and would easily were it to his advantage become what I call a "neo-liberal". I do like the idea of Frum and Limbaugh fighting a duel; however do not be deceived neither are Col. Brandon. Both are some decayed form of Willoughby. |
2011 – The Captain’s Log will show 2011 to be a year of great accomplishment. With membership as a primary focus, we started the year with only 147 members, and a goal of achieving 200. Through very creative incentives and determined efforts of the Membership Growth committee, we added 66 new members, ending the year with 193 boating members, and 5 applications in process. The weather on Island Opening day presented a real challenge – in fact the event was cancelled, a detail learned by 3 brave mariners only upon reaching the Island, after braving howling winds and 4 foot waves to get there. The spring monsoons continued right through Memorial Day weekend. We were finally able to walk Swim Island again after the phragmites were cut down, as that reclamation effort continues. It was gratifying to again see the harbors full for the July 4th weekend. Club Island has what must be the last remaining Ash trees standing in the State of Michigan, as we removed those infected with the emerald ash borer and treated the few remaining healthy trees. 6 new docks were installed in the southeast harbor as the dock replacement program continues. The sprinkler system was the recipient of much attention as it was restored to working order. Upgrades to the shoreheads and showers continued, and the WiFi system was further improved as well. The Board was able to add $50,000 to our reserve fund, the result of remarkable fiscal management. A great entertainment calendar provided many memorable events. And in stark contrast to Opening Day, a spectacular warm day and sunshine made it all too hard to leave the Island for the season following Island Closing day.
2010 – “In with the old” – The most notable event of 2010 was the completion of the purchase of our beloved Club Island. We celebrated Independence Day on July 4th by observing the Birth of our Nation, as well as our own Independence from the State of Michigan. The Past Commodores planted our Flag on the Island and the Property Deed was presented to the Board of Directors. Mission accomplished! Deep gratitude was expressed to the Members for their support over the many years to attain this monumental goal.
And, “In with the new”- as Wireless Internet Service was made available to all boats in the Harbors. In the past we would escape to Club Island to “get away from it all”. But now, we can’t live without the connection to the rest of our World.
A 900-pound anchor that was recovered from a Great Lakes schooner in Lake Huron was presented to the Club by the Past Commodores. It will be used as a Memorial centerpiece.
The economic meltdown of 2009 had a dramatic effect on our Club. Our membership count decreased as the lake water levels lowered. The number of Boating Members plunged to 147 this year. Consequently, the budget depth sounder was closely monitored.
In an effort to increase Membership, the Board of Directors offered innovative incentives for sponsoring New Members. The Incentive Programs were successful and there is a significant influx of new members for the coming year.
A limited number of wells were made available for seasonal rental to generate additional revenue.
Pictures of Past Commodores in the Club House that were faded were scanned and restored.
Several more new docks were installed in the North Harbor.
An area in the Club House was designated for the “Tweens”. It features a ping-pong table, foosball game, TV and furniture.
The Annual Barge Party was spectacular even though it was postponed by unfavorable weather.
The gales of November arrived on Labor Day Weekend, yet many Members braved 40 mph winds and 50-degree temperatures and ventured to the Island.
Aerial spraying on Swim Island was done in the fall to treat the invasive Phragmites so that we can reclaim that land.
Full Speed Ahead!
2009 - After a hard winter, many repair projects needed to be made. Seawall repairs topped the list. More than 80 linear feet of seawall was repaired or replaced, where needed, and tie-backs were replaced also. In the course of the repair work there was damage to the grounds and the lawn irrigation system. Repairs were made as spring weather permitted. Just days before the 4th of July Holiday, a transformer that was struck by lightning and damaged beyond repair was replaced. Large blocks were placed to stabilize the “Swim Island” bridge. Although the “Work Boat” had provided service in the past, it became expensive to maintain and it was sold. Replacement of “unsafe” docks began in the North Harbor and this project will resume in 2010. Many events were on the Entertainment Calendar; annual favorites, as well as a new event, “The Diva Party”. Twenty boats went on the 10-day Rendezvous that included ports of Lake Erie and concluded at the Grosse Pointe Yacht Club. The annual “Barge Party” was cancelled twice due to unfavorable weather. Several Friday night cook-outs became “cook-ins” due to unfavorable weather also. All events, especially the Holiday weekends, continued to surprise and delight all. Lake water levels were the highest in the last decade. Membership reached 171, including 8 new members. The Population of children under the age of 18, at best count, was 202. Island Acquisition, begun in 2005, and accompanied by the struggle of bureaucracy, is approaching completion of the process, as initial payment toward the purchase was made and received by the State of Michigan. It is with much optimism and expectation that Club Island ownership will be a reality in 2010.
2008 - The interior of the Club House was painted and the Island Store was updated by removing the low ceiling thus providing more efficient air flow. Two Vulcan Hart commercial stoves were installed and they have doubled the cooking capacity for oven and surface cooking. Several large tree stumps were finally removed. The mounds of dredging spoils at the entrance to the South Harbor were leveled and also provided fill dirt where needed. These areas were then raked and seeded. The Members and their guests enjoyed an entertaining season at Club Island. The Entertainment Calendar was filled with events to be enjoyed by all. We are proud of our talented members who volunteer their time and energy. The Calendar was highlighted with the Mates Boat Handling Course in June, the CRBC Rendezvous at the Grosse Pointe Yacht Club in July, and Halloween in September. The Barge Party in Goose Bay continues to be a favorite event and this year was no different. The weather was outstanding. It was an afternoon of great food, new games, and a record setting attendance of 70 boats. The Purchase of Club Island from the State of Michigan has not yet been completed. The property has been surveyed, the paperwork submitted and we expect this purchase to be finalized in the near future. Membership stands at 194, and Members, their families and guests of the Clinton River Boat Club are appreciative of their beautiful gem, known as “Club Island”.
2007 - was a significant year for the Clinton River Boat Club. Through hard work and skillful negotiations we are very near closing the purchase of Club Island from the State of Michigan for one fourth the original estimated price, saving additional expense for our membership. We completed several facility maintenance projects in spite of Mother Nature challenging us with 70 MPH winds during a storm in early Spring which uprooted many trees and downed all the birdhouses. The electrical system in the West Harbor was upgraded. After nine consecutive barge trips laden with wood chips, we added 120 yards of new mulch to the playscape using our new barge ramp to transfer the materials. The clubhouse received a much needed face lift including new roof shingles, exterior repairs and paint and Club Store upgrades. Once again we had a full social calendar. The Barge Party set a new record with 63 boats. Finishing the year with 202 active boating members, the most in eight years...priceless
2006—On September 30th Club Island celebrated its 50th anniversary acknowledging the Island’s dedication in 1956. Ironically, fifty years later we are in the final steps of purchasing the Island. During the entire year a special committee pursued this purchase with the State. Late in the year the Michigan Legislature passed a bill, signed by Governor Granholm, which allowed the membership to purchase the Island. The next year will see many administrative processes with Clay Township and the DNR to obtain the deed and determine the final purchase price. We aggressively instituted a new membership drive which resulted in 35 new members. Twelve more trees were planted in the event we should lose some to the Emerald Ash Borer. The east side South Harbor received a long awaited electrical upgrade. Manhole cover assemblies were installed over the septic system along with a pump out. In the Spring we dredged over 1500 yards from both harbors creating “Club Mountain” on the east side. We had a full year of fun and diverse social activities, including our third rendezvous at the Cove Marina in Canada. Reminiscent of years past, we managed to squeeze 117 boats onto Club Island for our Labor Day celebration. Halloween on the Island tipped the scales with 108 trick or treating costumed goblins. After many beautiful sunrises and sunsets...it was a very good year.
2005—Club Island took full advantage of the newly acquired Pontoon Boat. The 38 ft long and 10 ft wide boat has the capacity to carry 7000 pounds of cargo. This vessel will be used to transport everything to the Island. One of the first deliveries to the Island was a used Gator purchased from former member Dean Holloway. This gator was in excellent shape and added to the Islands growing fleet of vehicles. The next large delivery was twelve trees that were added to the Island. There is always a need for trees, but the impending infestation of the Emerald Ash Borer made the need for trees more urgent this year. Later in the year the Island’s front end loader needed to be replaced and again the new pontoon boat was beneficial. The end of August, the 16 year old Ford lawn mower required replacing and again the new pontoon boat came through. The Board of Directors purchased a new Kubota lawn mower to replace the Ford lawn mower. Problems with the East side electrical and the need for more power on the West side of the Island made it necessary to form a committee to revamp the electrical system, work is still proceeding. A committee was formed to investigate the purchase of Club Island. The land today is currently under the lease which will expire in 2013. The Committee put forth a plan to purchase the Island and presented it to the Membership which overwhelming endorsed the plan to buy the Island. Work is still underway for the purchase.
2004 – Club Island was full of construction activity in early April. Massive loads of materials and heavy equipment were ferried to the island to prepare for the PlayScape. The Club saw unprecedented member support for the construction of the PlayScape project with financial donations and the many hours of physical labor. A new tradition began with free Friday night barbecues. The Commodore and his helpers personally prepared and served the dinners to promote mingling among the members. A second commercial-grade barbecue grill was purchased. In a combined project with Detroit Edison, the main electrical supply line from Harsens Island was removed from the telephone poles and buried under ground. The year was brought to a close by the demise of the Club’s 24-year-old pontoon boat. A committee was formed to research and procure a new pontoon boat that will meet the Club’s needs in time for the spring.
2003 - A new stand-by generator for the clubhouse was purchased and installed. The kitchen and bathroom plumbing and the septic system received serious maintenance performed by several of our hardier members. New Purple Martin birdhouses were installed. The by-laws underwent an in-depth review and the membership approved an update. The west side seawall cap was removed and replaced with welded cleat and electrical pedestal brackets. The kitchen remodeling was completed with final trim, painting and installation of the appliances. Six new Webber gas grills were installed. The island was treated with weekly insect control. The new work boat was put into service. The North dingy Well pilings were jetted into place and secured. The membership overwhelming supported the purchase and installation of a new children’s play-scape. The Board of Directors approved the funding for a swing set and play-scape and the installation of the play-scape in 2004.
2002 - Due to cost and onerous permitting requirements, the potable water project was abandoned. Necessary dredging was completed in the north and south harbors. Weekly insect spraying began in July and appeared to be highly successful. A 25 foot workboat was acquired through Marc Boeckl and will be refurbished over the winter. The barge had several leaks repaired. All propane tanks were upgraded with new safety valves. The big project of the year was a major renovation of the kitchen. Some two dozen dedicated and talented members removed appliances, replaced the floor, walls and ceiling, including light fixtures, then reinstalled everything; all over a period of three weeks in September.
2001 - The 2001 Grounds & Maintenance Committee was extremely active. The pole barns which stores the majority of supplies and equipment was completely reorganized. A storage platform was erected to store seldom-used articles. A new wash down sink and plumbing was installed in the maintenance garage. A new high-pressure pump was installed in the pump house. Locks were installed on the dry storage cabinets in the clubhouse. A new freezer was installed in the kitchen to store ice. New boards replaced rotten boards in the gazebo decks as well as decking around the clubhouse and all decking was re-stained. The entire back wall of the caretaker’s apartment facing the south lagoon and main support decking were replaced. A new door wall was also installed and the interior was painted. The exterior of the clubhouse was completely repainted. All clubhouse carpeting was steam cleaned. The ventilation systems for the men and women’s rest rooms were dismantled and a new air handling system installed for greatly improved ventilation. Six new Weber gas grills were installed. The barge and Lund boats were both painted and the barge was refitted with a new 50 HP Yamaha outboard. The sprinkler pump for the south lagoon (west) was rebuilt and the sound system for the island was completed. The fire truck was replaced with a trailer and pump-mounted apparatus. Numerous dock boards were repaired or replaced in the north harbor. Frames under power boxes in north harbor were replaced and power boxes painted. A seawall cap failure in the south harbor was repaired. Contracts for dredging both the north and south harbors were awarded and dredging scheduled to be completed prior to the 2002 boating season. Planning for a potable water system was authorized.
2000 - The new ships store opened in July with the hard work and generous donations of over 40 members. The new store was ahead of schedule and under budget. Seawall repairs were made in the South Lagoon. A new Power Lift for the Island Barge was installed in the North Lagoon and dredging was required at the North and South entrances due to low water.
1999 - New Tennis Courts were completed and officially opened in June. Plans for new Mates Store were approved and construction will be completed in summer of 2000. New transformer panel & wiring were installed at West End of South Lagoon with (11) new boxes. New cluster piles installed at North End for barge ramp area along with new piling for pontoon hoist. New lawn tractor & new snow fencing were purchased and sand bed installed around swing sets. New defibrillator purchased and installed in secure casing in Club House along with specialized training for several members.
1998 - Erosion areas were backfilled and repaired, along with dredging of the North & South Harbor entrances. Overhead lattice was removed from South end of Club house & new gutters and down spouts were added, also a new hot plate grill was replaced in the kitchen. The Tennis Court renovation was started after Island closing. The old Court was broken up & filler stone was added to raise the court 6”. The maintenance building and barn went through a major renovation and two new John Deere utility carts were purchased.
1997 - The renovation of the South Harbor was completed from a pilot project started in 1996. (66) wells were extended 50 ft. and all the steel pilings were replaced with wood. This was also a year of high water and our swim beach was washed away. We are applying for permits from the DNR to implement a plan to save Swim Island.
1996 - The underground sprinkler system for the entire island was completed. The system has thirty separate zones and (210) sprinkler heads. Seventy fiberglass picnic tables replaced all the old wooden tables. Twelve wells in the South Lagoon were renovated and extended to 50 ft. as a pilot project for the potential of a long range project.
1995 - Brought on the required repair of several seawall Tie-backs that had given away. The old Club house had a new ceiling, new lighting & new carpeting installed. Also, the Men’s & Ladies bathroom & hallway were freshly wallpapered. The underground sprinkling system was also started.
1994 - The Past Commodores’ Patio was built around the Clubs’ newly erected Flag pole. New windows, entrance door, and the Mates Show Case were installed in the old Club House. The old Club House and apartment were re-roofed. The repair of several docks had to be done because of the ice and severe cold. We also had to repair the tie-backs on approximately 300 feet of seawall at the North end.
1993 - This year brought on the completion of the new clubhouse addition, one of the finest projects done at Club Island. The Club also finished the new dinghy wells in the North lagoon.
1992 - The board decided to provide gas barbecue grills in strategic locations, in framed pits for each of the harbors. The new club house addition, facing the south harbor, was begun and fully enclosed before the end of the season. Based on a survey, the board also approved the addition of 20 new dinghy wells to be added in the North Lagoon, this project is to be completed by Memorial Day 1993.
1991 - The Club sent the red Farmall Tractor to a local rehabilitation center for a complete overhaul and rebuilding. Also we completed the Dinghy Lagoon with all new galvanized docks and wood pilings.
1990 - The Club finished the two gazebos and added decking around them. The Club purchased a new Ford lawn cutting tractor. The Fall brought the start of the rebuilding of the Dinghy Well Lagoon.
1989 - This year brought some major additions to our Club with the building of two gazebos by Club members at the beach area. We also painted and re-carpeted the Club House.
1988 - gave us the enjoyment of seeing green grass and a high and dry island. We also now have a very complete and operational kitchen which we were able to acquire at salvage prices with the help of Len Williams P/C. We added a pole barn for all of our equipment. The Club now has new sprinkling equipment and in the fall new large dingy wells were added at the end of the South Lagoon along with four new large boat wells.
1987 - Completed the seawall project. Also with Membership Labor, the club built a new play area for the children, purchased by the Mates. Planted 38 new trees around the island, laid sod & planted grass on the Southwest area of the island, and installed all new electrical service to the South Lagoon on the North & West Walls. The Club also negotiated a new lease with the State of Michigan with a 25 year extension thus renewing our present lease to the year 2063, thanks to Doug Busbey P/C.
1986 - Completed the North end seawall, landscaping & electrical projects. Also, installed with Membership Labor was a complete drain system around the Club House, tennis courts and garage areas. With an assessment of $1,000.00 per active member, the Club undertook the major task to secure the entire island with seawall.
1985 - The remaining work to the Clubhouse was completed and celebrated. The North Lagoon continued to suffer land erosion due to high water. Our membership took positive action by voting a $150,000 debt retirement program which provided funds to seawall the North Lagoon fill-in the land with over 6,000 yards dredged from the lagoon and install a modern electrical system. The mates contributed a much needed outdoor sound system.
1984 - This year the Club undertook several major projects. The Clubhouse was expanded to include a caretaker’s apartment, brand new and larger men’s and ladies bathrooms, a much needed increase capacity septic system and a covered patio. The Clubhouse was also completely redecorated with new carpet, paint and furnishings. Much to the relief of our members and Clay Township, we were able to remove the caretaker’s trailer from the island.
1983 - Early Spring arrived wet, windy and rainy, along with high water. Swim island was identified by a dock protruding from the water! North Lagoon docks were partially submerged. In the first week of May, a tornado passed northeast of the island; gratefully we suffered only minor damage. The pump house was replaced, plans for the Clubhouse were prepared and reviewed and approved. The garage acquired a drill press and a bench/cabinet/sink assembly. Needed replacement of spiles and rebuilding of some docks in the North Lagoon was completed. Plans for remodeling the Clubhouse were approved and included quarters for the caretaker and upgrading of the septic system.
1982 - Progress continued. CRBC joined the Harsen’s Island - St. Clair Flats Association. Lagoon entrances were dredged and lights installed on the entrance signs. First time ever, the trees were trimmed on the island. Two golf carts were purchased for authorized use and proved their usefulness quickly. A 32’ pontoon hull was purchased to be remodeled into a “barge” to reduce hauling costs. A part of the North Lagoon at swim island was dredged which will allow more swing room for boats.
1981 - An era of accelerated progress began. Additional expansion to the Clubhouse was being considered. The tennis courts were re-coated and the West wall of the South Lagoon was finished. A portable oxygen unit was donated to the Club and new tennis screens were installed. Dinghy harbor received new docks and new screens were placed on the Clubhouse. Drain pipes were installed in low areas on the island and patio blocks were placed at the cooking and tennis areas.
1980 - The North wall of the South Lagoon (300’), received needed repairs, and repairs began on the West wall of the South Lagoon. Tennis courts were re-seamed. Because sand was clogging the shower heads, water filters were installed. The Planning Committee began in earnest to assess the Island’s future requirements.
1979 - A new dinghy area, 40’ of seawall along the Westside of the South Lagoon was built to accommodate a few of the larger dinghy’s. We repaired the Middle Channel wall break. The West end of the North Lagoon also received 200’ of new steel seawall. The Michigan Legislature passed the “Wetlands Bill;” Clay Township, Harsen’s Island and St. Clair Flats, for a defense committee and the season ended with a possible threat to our efforts to acquire the island.
1978 - Machinery needed repairing and mud piles from dredging required leveling. The electrical and spile replacement project on the West side of the South Lagoon was completed. The bridge to the Swim Island was raised. We gained an additional pinball machine, bumper pool table and a new large portable grill. Increased use of the showers required time limiters to be installed. The Mates efforts resulted in a new wet-dry vac and teen furniture.
1977 - The season started with replacement of broken and rotted piling, including quite a few dock supporting piling. The new piling is steel pipe which should last longer. After much to-do with the D.N.R., a 10-year permit to do dredging was finally official, and dredging of both entrances was started because of the lower water level. The bridge over Obitz Cut was removed, partly to help with the dredging and to replace bridge supports. The Mates again supported the club by purchasing benches for the tennis courts and clocks for the courts and clubhouse. New plastic seat covers for the furniture and a sound system were supplied. Donated rose bushes and edging material made three beautiful rose plantings around the clubhouse. As Fall came on, electrical work, to bring the west side of the South Lagoon up to the same standards as the east side, was started, to be completed by the Spring of 1978.
1976 - the east side of the South Lagoon looked like a disaster area before the bull dozing and back-fill work was completed on the new steel wall, completed in the Fall of 1975. To cover the backfill, new sod was ordered and laid in place by members. The electrical work, consisting of new pedestals and wiring was also completed. Electrical wiring in the North Lagoon was fixed and two new pedestals were installed. A new drainage system consisting of two large basins, pipe trenching, and covers for the basins were installed as part of a filter-drain for the clubhouse. The ever faithful Farmall Cub Tractor was given a new lease on life with a new engine installation. The Mates were again very helpful. New furniture was purchased, subsidized with the proceeds of a special dinner for that purpose. A new vacuum cleaner was purchased and a shower and patio stones for the children to rinse the sand off when playing at the beach was installed.
1975 - First boaters to Club Island in the spring could see the slight drop in water level. It was a welcome sight, but the bridge over Obitz Cut ended in water instead of on land as the erosion continued. Spring maintenance started with replacement of rotted pilings, plugging holes in the South Lagoon seawall and the Planning Committee assessing the electrical service problems. Two new boat-wells were built on the east side of the South Lagoon using steel sheeting in anticipation of sheeting the entire lagoon. The outer wall of the dinghy docks was extended to provide additional protection there. The Board, acting on the recommendation of the Planning Committee, had the North Lagoon electrical service reworked and some repairs made for the South Lagoon. Restroom floors were tiled, walls painted, and in the Ladies’ head, wallpaper and new curtains were added. New bamboo curtains, table and chair caddies were purchased for the clubhouse. The kitchen was renovated; floor and wall tiled, painted, and two new large Formica covered work tables were donated to cover the stoves. This project delighted all the committees who use this area. Late in the fall, the Board made the final decision to start the replacement of the South Lagoon seawall’s, starting at the south end and to include the entire east side, including all new electrical power. The work began in November, and the wall was completed as ice filled the lagoon, entrapping the contractor’s equipment for the winter.
1974 - again a year of high water and much work to be done: back-filling and grading for the new bulk-heading, grading of land on the entrance, north side of South Lagoon. Sump pumps were installed to carry away water standing in low areas, along with sand bagging the North Lagoon shores to keep the water out. A pledge campaign was started to raise money necessary to build two tennis courts in the area of the original Tot Lot. The play equipment was moved to a new location near the beach. A real monumental task ensued to construct two regulation courts and a combination basketball court along with back stop fences, resulting in a beautiful addition to our Club. This project was spearheaded by then Commodore John Boll. All of the equipment, cement, gravel, sand, and two huge transit cement trucks were barged to the Island from the Clinton River. For instance: 237 tons of stone, 112 tons of fill sand, 180 tons of mason sand and 1400 bags of cement, plus graders, bulldozer’s and cranes. Finally, the finishing touches were added: grading and filling completed, sod laid around the new courts, and grass seed sown. The Mates donated a sunshade for the Clubhouse to prevent fading of the Past Commodore’s pictures, new pedestal and wall-mounted fans, redwood furniture
and drapes, a water slide for the beach and a large load of trees, planted around the Island to further enhance its beauty.
1973 - found the grounds covered with reeds and debris carried over the land by the winter storms and the continuing plague of high water. The Muscamoot Bay side of the Island was washed away to within a few feet from the south end of South Lagoon. An order to throw up a dike along this area was acted upon at once, until a decision could be made on what course of action would be taken to eliminate the problem. A General Membership meeting was held at the Island and approval was given to use reserve funds and secure a bank loan to bulkhead the Bay side from the entrance of the South Lagoon to the dinghy area, some 1700 feet in all. The dinghy area was also a disaster, 800 feet of all-new steel bulkheading was installed, as well as restoring the docks. It was also necessary to raise 14 docks in the South Lagoon which were under water. The Mates donated a new facing for the fireplace and new wood paneling was installed to hold all the Past Commodore’s pictures. The floor was tiled and new carpeting installed to finish the interior of the Clubhouse.
1972 - the trash disposal problem was resolved by purchasing (8) Dumpsters which were barged to the mainland. The trash pit was covered to make a much neater entrance to the Island. The steel seawall started in 1971 on the Middle Channel side of the Island (to connect the previously installed seawall on Obitz Cutand the entrance to the South Lagoon) was in place and back-filled by Fall. A 200’ opening was made to provide a beautiful sand beach near the pump house. The Mates purchased and installed new accent lights for the Clubhouse and a large spotlight for the flag pole. The newly remodeled kitchen, including new storage and power vent-hood over the stoves, received the final coats of paint.
1971 - marked another year of high water. Steel seawall was installed around the garage and the entrance of the South Lagoon to protect the shore and establish an area for the new Dumpsters, and a platform to hold them, in preparation for trash removal. The most outstanding item of the year was the purchase and installation of a new equipment and storage building to house the tractors and other equipment needed for maintenance of the Island.
1970 - the original Obitz Cut was closed, and a new channel opened; 235’ of steel seawall made the North Lagoon safer from the wash of passing boats. A new pump-house and two new large capacity pumps were purchased. The Clubhouse was remodeled and a new ceiling and lighting fixtures installed.
1964 - the water for swimming was declared unsafe, so a new beach, complete with diving board and foot bridge from the main island, was constructed.
1962 - marked the year that club members were able to enjoy breakfasts and parties under cover.
1961 - sod was laid in a six-foot area around the South Lagoon. Also in 1961 the cement was laid for the clubhouse building.
1960 - August Markus presented an entire plan for the further development of Club Island. This plan included drawings for the clubhouse as well as boat wells, electrical and plumbing layouts. In fact, at one point he devised a “Markus Goldberg” potable water system and it worked. Equipment was also purchased for maintaining the Island. The Island was maintained and the service to island equipment was done by Dick Sarns from 1956 to 1964 at no charge to the club except for parts.
1959 - Electricity was installed by R.E. Parsons, but soon proved inadequate.
1958 - grass seed was sown, but there was still no progress on getting electricity to the island.
1957 - it was agreed to convert the club to a non-profit corporate status. This meant an eventual increase in dues, and a requirement that each member must own one share of $10 common stock as a condition of membership. Also, anyone who felt able could further contribute by purchasing preferred stock, non-interest bearing, at $10 per share. By May of 1957, the progress included dredging of an entrance channel to a depth of 12’, dredging of a turning basin, installation of docks to accommodate boats up to 40’ in length, and a dry recreational area for the 250 members.
1956 - The summer was spent in feverish activity by Club members, who wielded shovels, rakes, sledge hammers, etc. On Sunday, September 30, 1956, with 33 boats at the docks and approximately 200 members and their families, the new property was formally dedicated. The official ceremonies were begun with a prayer by member Robert H. Wright, and a blessing by Monsignor Skrzycki of Mt. Clemens, followed by the introduction of the then Commodore Gerrit Schamhart. He described the accomplishment, complimented the membership for their interest and enthusiasm, and predicted great things for the future. Hunter Judd, a Director, properly named our acquisition “Club Island” and it was also agreed that l.D. cards in the form of yearly stickers be issued to each member, to be prominently displayed on their boat.
1955 - twenty acres of property consisting of an island located just off Lake St. Clair between the Middle Channel waterway and the area described as Muscamoot Bay was selected. The property seemed to be mostly swamp and had been in possession of Henry Obitz since 1914. Under the able guidance of Stanley Pelitier, countless details were worked out and the idea presented to the general membership who unanimously endorsed it. The Club sponsored the Sea Scout Ship, S.S. Ranger #147 from 1955 through 1958.
1951 - Following the 1950 annual meeting, Vice Commodore Richard Sarns sent a letter to all members, announcing “the Clinton River Boat Club is sponsoring a class in Pleasure Craft Operation & Maintenance with the ultimate goal of forming a Power Squadron.” On March 5, 1951, 14 members were present for the first organizational meeting of the Mount Clemens Power Squadron. Past Commodore Wallace Gerlach nominated Stanley Peltier to be the first Commander. Stan was a CRBC Director and editor of the newsletter. Mr. Peltier suggested that the Mount Clemens Power Squadron be considered primarily an educational organization and that care be taken not to have it interfere with the social aspects of CRBC. Seven CRBC Past Commodores are charter members of the Mt. Clemens Power Squadron.
1949 - the forerunner of our present roster was 4”x 6 1/2” and consisted of 23 pages. It included member’s names, city, boat name, and a short history as well as the constitution. The next years saw an even greater increase in members, including boaters from Detroit, Royal Oak, Farmington, Birmingham, Pontiac and Rochester. Summer cruises were planned and winter parties on shore were organized, but a need was felt for a permanent clubhouse.
1948 - the CRBC put up matching funds with the Michigan Waterways Commission to dredge and widen the entrance to the Clinton River.
1945 - Trombly assembled all the necessary material on a make-shift barge and started at the foot of 9 Mile Road towed with a 24’ Chris Craft. Several miles off shore one of those unexpected storms usual for Lake St. Clair came up. The barge was lost after pulling out the cleats on the tow boat. It ended up on shore near 12 Mile Road. The next day the barge was picked up and finally made it to the Old Club. During the next week Trombly and one of his sons erected the docks, driving the piles by hand. It was soon found that any and all boats were using the docks, other than Clinton River Boat Club members. During the winter the ice wrecked the dock and that ended the first attempt. Some other highlights were the meetings at Gowanie Golf Club. Arrangements were made with Alex MacDonald, the manager, to hold all meetings and parties at Gowanie.
1942 - the Club had grown to 52 members. Our first attempt to establish our own facility was made in 1945. Chris Matthews, who was a State Senator received permission from U.S. Corp of Engineers and Dept. of Natural Resources to build a landing dock on what we called Government Island which is South of the Old Club on the South Channel. Wallace S. Gerlach made arrangements with Albert Trombly from St. Clair Shores to construct a dock on the North end of the Island.
1940 - the club organized a Reserve Coast Guard Flotilla, #71, and also enrolled as a member of the Inter- Lakes Yachting Association. At the close of 1940 there were 36 members on the roster.
February 19, 1940 - the Clinton River Boat Club of Mt. Clemens, Michigan was founded by a group of local boaters interested in cruising, good fellowship, and boating safety. The annual dues were nominal and activities were limited to cruises in summer and shore parties in winter. The charter membership count totaled 22 under the guidance of Commodore J. R. Doll. John Ott made the motion to name the fledgling club The Clinton River Boat Club. The club burgee was designed by Msgr. J. C. Mies. On March 11, 1940, the Constitution and By-Laws were formed and a Board of Directors was elected. |
Registrar
Term Table
A Supplementary Catalogue listing all permanent changes to the curriculum
made since the publication of the 1998-2000
Catalogue.
April 13, 2000
(The updates below are correct as of this date.)
CHANGES TO THE AUGUST 1999-2000 TERM
TABLE (changes marked in bold):
*CHE 4-121 Chemical Principles I LIBERKO
CHE 5-225 Organic Chemistry I SCHEPMANN
CHE 6-326 Organic Chemistry II Lecture SCHEPMANN
CANCEL CSC 3-131 Computing Practice & Perspectives
*CSC 4-151 Discrete Mathematics for Computer Science TRIBBLE
CANCEL *ECB 9-101 Macroeconomics
*EDU 2-240 Human Relations BRENDLINGER
*EDU 3-240 Human Relations BRENDLINGER
*EDU 5-240 Human Relations SEARS
CANCEL*ENG 1-111-B Composition and Literataure WALDNER
CANCEL *ENG 6-111-B Shakespeare and Film LACEY
ADD *ENG 6-111-B Founders of American Confessional Poetry LAU
CANCEL *ENG 9-111-A Shakespeare and Film LACEY
ADD *ENG 9-111-A Writing and Place LAU
ENG 8-324 Shakespeare II DOLAN
FRE 5-102 Beginning French II OMAR
FRE 6-102 Beginning French II OMAR
FRE 8-103 Beginning French III OMAR
FRE 9-205 Intermediate French OMAR
CANCEL *GER 8-281 Contemporary Central Europe
LAL 9-352 Linguistics PANDICH
*MAT 2-112 Functions HILL
*MAT 3-112 Functions FREEMAN
*MAT 1-141 Calculus I JACOB
*MUS 5-101 Fundamentals of Music STILWELL
MUS 7-431 Methods & Materials for Music Education WITWER
*PED 8-213 Human Anatomy ROTELLA
PED 9-308 Kinesiology HASSELQUIST
*PHY 4-111 General Physics I JACOB
PHY 7-112 General Physics II LICHTY
*PSY 6-161 General Psychology DRAGON
PSY 7-394 Research Methods GANZEL
*REL 9-101 Introduction to Religion MUELLER
CANCEL RUS 7-311 19th Century Russian Literature
ADD RUS 7-315 Topics in Russian Literature: Chekhov IKACH
SPA 3-102 Beginning Spanish II ZAPATA
SPA 4-102-B Beginning Spanish II ZAPATA
SPA 8-103 Beginning Spanish III ZAPATA
CANCEL SPA 8-205 Intermediate Spanish
*THE 8-115 Acting I WHEELER
THE 3-260 Topics: Scene Painting DAVIES changed to THE 9-260
CANCEL WST 8-171 Theory & Methodology of Women's Studies
CHANGES IN ACADEMIC POLICY:
Adjunct Course Credit: No more than two 500-level (1/4 credit)
courses may be taken in any one semester; no more than two full course
credits earned in 500-level courses may be counted toward the minimum
32 course credits required for the B.A. or B.Mus. degree.
All-College Independent Study Courses: No more than four All-College
Independent Study course credits (280/380 [480], 289/389, 290/390, 299/399
[490]) may be counted toward satisfying the minimum credit requirement
for the Bachelor of Arts or Bachelor of Music degrees. No more than two
All-College Independent Study course credits (380 [480], 389, 390, 399
[490]) may be counted toward satisfying the minimum of nine course credits
numbered in the 300s or 400s required for the B.A. or B.Mus. degrees.
Bachelor of Special Studies Degree: requirements have been changed.
For the full text of current requirements, click
here.
OFF-CAMPUS COURSES TAUGHT BY CORNELL FACULTY 1999/2000:
These courses usually involve additional costs and require
advance planning. Consult the course descriptions below and the course
instructor for a description of the course, the prerequisites, deadlines,
and cost.
CHANGES IN MAJORS AND MINORS:
Geology (major): A minimum of 11 courses, including GEO 111, 112,
212, 215, 217, 316, 319, 324; plus three elective courses at or above
the 200 level, one of which must be taught in the field, as GEO 255, 329,
or an accredited summer field camp. Supporting coursework in chemistry,
physics, and mathematics is strongly recommended. Students planning to
pursue geology at the graduate level should also take GEO 312, 315, an
accredited summer field camp; CHE 121-122; MAT 141-142; and PHY 111-112
or 101-102; also an intermediate-level course in a foreign language.
Politics (major): Clarification of Major Requirements affecting
students who complete internship programs in Washington, D.C.: Questions
have arisen concerning the extent to which internship credits undertaken
in Washington, D.C., through the Washington Center or Capital Experience
programs count toward fulfilling major requirements in the Department
of Politics. Students participating in semester-long programs typically
earn three course credits for the internship proper and one course credit
for an academic course. Not all internship experiences available through
these off-campus programs are politics-related, but when they are, the
Department recognizes the course credits earned as Politics course credits
and counts a maximum of two such credits toward the eight course credits
required for a major. Course credits earned for political internships
do not fulfill the major's requirements for subfield distribution or for
a minimum of four 300-level courses. Not all academic courses available
through these off-campus programs are politics-related, but when a course
is politics-related, the Department recognizes the course credit earned
as a Politics course credit. This credit may be used to fulfill the major's
subfield distribution requirement, and it will be counted toward the major's
required minimum of four 300-level courses.
Russian (major): A minimum of seven course credits in Russian
at or above the 300 level, which include RUS 301 and four courses in Russian
literature selected from 311, 312, 341, 351, and 355. A maximum of two
courses in Russian history may be applied toward the major: HIS 321 (Muscovite
and Imperial Russia), HIS 322 (Revolutionary and Soviet Russia), and HIS
323 (Russia from 1941).
COURSE INFORMATION:
ANTHROPOLOGY
8-256. Topics in Anthropology: Latin America-Cultural Politics
and Social Movements. This course will examine what counts as "political"
and "cultural" in contemporary Latin America. It will consider
how various marginalized constituencies such as women, children, indigenous
people, racial and sexual minorities, and the poor are making claims for
full citizenship and democracy in a social climate that favors those who
are already socially and economically privileged. Assigned readings will
address policital and cultural struggles evoked by contemporary social
movements and the efforts of various groups to forge and negotiate identities.
No prerequisite. (Social Science) FORD
9-356. Advanced Topics: Medical Anthropology. Cross-cultural
examination of medical systems and beliefs as systems of knowledge and
as theories of reality. Symbolic, social, and political dimensions of
medicine in historical and comparative perspective. Ethno-medicine, alternative
medical and health systems, and shamanism. Prerequisites: ANT 101
and an additional course in one of the following disciplines: Anthropology,
Sociology, Biology, or Psychology. FORD
4-358. Advanced Topics: Culture, Environment, and Economy:
The Anthropology of American Agriculture.
American industrial agriculture has devastated rural communities and the
environment, while enriching a handful of large corporations. Anthropologists
see American agriculture as a cultural, environmental, and economic system
that lacks long term sustainability. This course will look at studies
that challenge the industrial model and propose a more sustainable model
for the future. The course may include a field trip to a working farm.This
course should be of interest to students in anthropology, economics, and
environmental studies. Prerequisites: ANT 101 or permission of instructor.
ZIEGENHORN
BIOLOGY
9-332. Plant Taxonomy. Class will spend one week of
the block at the Missouri Botanical Garden in St. Louis.
9-337. Entomology. The evolutionary
history, morphology, taxonomy, physiology, ecology, behavior, and economic
importance of insects. Laboratories will focus on sampling, preservation,
identification, and experimentation with insects. Prerequisites: BIO 141
and 142. Alternate years. (Laboratory Science) McCOLLUM
CLASSICS
9-382. Roman Archaeology. Introduction to excavating
techniques in Roman lands; study of the material culture of the ancient
Romans in order to understand their history and civilization--economy,
government, religion, family life, slavery, urbanization--from the monarchy
to the republic to the empire. Taught in Italy, the class will spend the
first two weeks in Rome and its environs and the third week in the Bay
of Naples region. Sites visited will include the Roman forum, the heart
of ancient Rome, the Colosseum, the Pantheon, and the Circus Maximus;
temples, theatres, markets, palaces; early christian churches and catacombs;
Ostia, Rome's port; cities of the ancient Etruscans; and, of course, Pompeii
and Herculaneum, cities covered by the eruption of Mt. Vesuvius. Offered
every fourth year. Prerequisite: one course from either Classical Studies
or Anthropology, or permission of the instructor. The trip will entail
additional costs. (Humanities) J. GRUBER-MILLER
ECONOMICS AND BUSINESS
337. Business Cycles and Forecasting.,
beginning in 2000-2001. (Social Science) KNOOP
1-111-A. Introduction to Jane Austen. We shall read
three or possibly four novels by Jane Austen, certainly including Pride
and Prejudice and Emma, and either Mansfield Park or
Northanger Abbey and Persuasion. Issues to be considered
will include the role of love and marriage in the world represented in
Jane Austen's novel; the gender arrangements in that world; and questions
of money, class, and freedom. Intensive discussion, several papers, at
least one revision, and perhaps a film or two will be included as well.
Also offered term five. Not open to students who have previously completed
ENG 111. EVANS
1-111-C. Nature Writers/Nature Writing. Students
will read selected American nature writers--writers who have been concerned
with our relation to the environment and who have helped us think about
the many dimensions of that relation. This course will involve several
kinds of writing: conventional papers, journals, and electronic newsgroups.
Students will also go on "excursions," which they will record in their
journals. Also offered term two. Not open to students who have
previously completed ENG 111. MARTIN, R.
2-111-C. Reading Drama. An introduction to modern
and contemporary drama in the forms of full-length plays, one-act plays,
and television scripts. The course follows a group discussion format,
with close reading of selected dramatic texts, examination of dramatic
terms and thematic issues, consideration of cultural contexts, and screening
of film adaptations. Because of the professor's background in writing
for television, the course includes the opportunity to study contemporary
drama in the form of a teleplay from a prime time network program. Also
offered term nine. Not open to students who have previously completed
ENG 111. RECKLING
3-111. Irish Literature and Film. This course introduces
students to Irish cultural identity as expressed in the works of the Irish
Literary Renaissance (1880s-1920s) and afterward. The course follows a
group discussion format to analyze drama, fiction, poetry, contemporary
nonfiction, and film. Having studied as an undergraduate in Dublin, the
professor selects works from William Butler Yeats and others of the Irish
Literary Renaissance to the contemporary dramas of John B. Keane and Brian
Friel, the fiction of Frank O'Connor, Edna O'Brien and Bernard MacLaverty,
the memoirs of Gerry Conlon, and current political events from The
Irish Times. Numerous films are screened and discussed. Among them
are The Quiet Man, Mister Johnson, The Field, Into
the West, Cal, The Crying Game, In the Name of The
Father, and Michael Collins. Also offered term eight. Not
4-111. Twentieth Century American Women Writers.
This course focuses on fiction, poetry, and drama by such writers as Edith
Wharton, Charlotte Perkins Gilman, Katherine Anne Porter, Susan Glaspell,
Zora Neale Hurston, Elizabeth Bishop, Paule Marshall, Alice Walker, Maya
Angelou, and others. A published fiction wirter and poet, as well as a
produced television writer, the professor offers a group discussion format,
with close reading of selected texts, examination of literary terms and
thematic issues, consideration of cultural contexts, and screening of
film adaptations. Not open to students who have previously completed
ENG 111. RECKLING
6-111-A. Romantic Hitchcock: Love and Art in the Romantic
Films of Alfred Hitchcock. Alfred Hitchcock, master of . . . .
romance? What kind of cupid is Hitchcock? What kind of artist? The course
will consider art and romance in selected Hitchcock films, including Rebecca,
Spellbound, Notorious, Suspicion, Vertigo, and others. Students will write
response portfolios, reviews, film criticism, and annotated bibliographies
on research articles. . Not open to students who have previously completed
ENG 111. HANKINS
6-111-B. Up Close and Personal: Founders of American Confessional
Poetry. The reading material will focus on four core poets: Robert
Lowell, Sylvia Plath, Anne Sexton, and D.W. Snodgrass. We also will explore
the roots to their groundbreaking style and read samples of current poetry
written in this vein. Student essays will include critical analyses, a
short research paper, and personal essays. In addition, this course will
emphasize active versus passive reading; students will maintain
a Reading and Writing Journal, and keep an individualized vocabulary list.
Not open to students who have previously completed ENG 111. LAU
7-111. Contemporary African-American Literature.
This introductory writing course reinforces essay skills, active
(versus passive) reading techniques, and vocabulary building. Experiencing
writing as a several-step process -- involving pre-writing, group and
instructor feedback, and revisions -- is another fundamental aspect of
the course. In addition, students will read and analyze four seminal works
of African-American literature: Their Eyes Were Watching Go, "Sonny's
Blues," Neon Vernacular and Beloved. Not open to
students who have previously completed ENG 111. LAU
8-111-A. Writing and Place. This introductory writing
course reinforces essay skills, active (versus passive) reading
techniques, and vocabulary building. Experiencing writing as a several-step
process -- involving pre-writing, group and instructor feedback, and revisions
-- is another fundamental aspect of the course. Students will also read
and analyze several contemporary works of fiction, poetry, and memoir
that emphasize place -- to shape the main characters, to set the
mood, to create unique challenges, and so forth. These books include A
River Runs Through It, American Primitive, and There are
no Children Here. Also offered term nine. Not open to students
who have previously completed ENG 111. LAU
9-111-C. Gender and Identity. A feminist look at
history and story. Not open to students who have previously completed
ENG 111. WALDNER
8-213. Writing Fiction I. This class will travel
to a fiction workshop in Fort Worden Park, on the Olympic peninsula in
Washington State. An additional fee of approximately $600 covering transportation
and housing is required, as is permission from Prof. Waldner. Prerequisite:
ENG 111 and permission of instructor. (Fine Arts) WALDNER
1-219. Special Topics: Writing Children's Books.
This course in writing for children will focus on short manuscripts of
900-5000 words. Participants will read some outstanding recent books for
children; read what respected authors in this field have written about
writing for children; and work on manuscripts of their own. Additional
topics will include manuscript submission procedures, and print and electronic
resources for those interested in writing for children. Prerequisite:
ENG 111 (Fine Arts) MARTIN, J.B.
5-322. Medieval and Rennaisance Drama. The class
will read plays by some of the foremost Elizabethan and Jacobean playwrights,
among them Christopher Marlowe, Ben Jonson, John Webster, William Shakespeare,
Thomas Heywood, and Thomas MIddleton, with attention to performance and
stage conditions as well as to the rich cultural environment of London
in the late 16th and early 17th centuries. This period saw an unprecedented
flourishing of the dramatic arts in England and the audience for which
these dramatists wrote was voracious in its appetite for stimulating,
relevant, and juicy entertainment. We will sample various popular Renaissance
genres such as the city comedy, the histsory play, the revenge tragedy,
and the pastoral. No prior experience with Renaissance drama is necessary;
imagination and a willingness to read out loud will be great assets. Assignments
will include short informal writing, a longer paper, and group work. Prerequisite:
ENG 111 (Humanities) HAUSKNECHT
1-103. Beginning French III.
We will spend the third weekend of the course (Thursday afternoon through
Sunday evening) in Louisiana to experience great music, delicious food,
and rich Francophone culture at the Festivals Acadians in Lafayette. Costs
for the 1999 trip are currently estimated at $150 per student, which includes
lodging, transportation, tour of the Acadian Memorial and Saint Martinville,
two delicious dinners, dancing at local spots. For more information, consult
the website for the September 1998 trip ()
or contact the course instructor (Diane Crowder) or the trip leader (Jan
Boney).
1-303. French and Francophone Culture.
Trip to Louisiana, third weekend of the block. See French 1-103. Costs
are currently estimated at $150 per student. For more information contact
the course's instructor and trip leader, Jan Boney.
5-411. Junior-Senior Seminar.
If you are a junior or senior in 1999-2000 and are completing a French
major, register for this course, which is taught alternating years. Required
for the French major; open to all who have completed French 311. Topic
to be announced. For more information, contact Jan Boney.
GEOLOGY
112. Historical Geology. Prerequisites:
either GEO 101, 105, 111, or 114.
212. Mineralogy I: Principles.
Prerequesites: CHE 121 and GEO 111 or 114.
217. Paleontology. Prerequisites:
GEO 112 or BIO 141-142.
6-255. Modern and Ancient Carbonate Systems of the Bahamas.
Prerequisite: any 100-level Geology course.
8. (Laboratory Science) GREENSTEIN
319. Igneous and Metamorphic Petrology.
Alternate years.
1-324. Sedimentology and Stragigraphy. Prerequisite:
GEO 111 and 112.
329. Geology of a Region. Prerequisites: GEO 111,
112, and 215.
512. Geographic Information Systems. (1/4 credit)
Learning the fundamentals of geographic information systems (GIS) by means
of tutorial exercises and exploration of selected websites. Working with
user-created and imported information, each student will design a project
that addresses a geographic issue (e.g. environmental, demographic) and
will use ArcView GIS to help resolve it. A final written report, that
will include maps, is required. Must be taken over four consecutive terms.
Prerequisites: GEO 111 or 114, and at least two upper-level courses from
any one of the following departments: biology, economics and business,
geology, politics, or sociology/anthropology, or permission of instructor.
GARVIN (CR)
GREEK
511. Greek Reading Group. (1/4 credit) Maintenance
of Greek language skills through reading a variety of Greek authors. Texts
selected in consultation with the students participating. Course meets
once a week for a semester. Prerequisite: GRE 102 or permission of instructor.
GRUBER-MILLER (CR)
HISTORY
*4-111. Introductory Seminar: Born to Rebel: American Identities.
Throughout history, individuals have stepped outside of the boundaries
of conventional society to redefine their own identity and challenge traditional
roles based on gender, class, nation, "race" and ethnicity. This course
will explore the fundamental conflict between American individualism and
the culture of conformity by examining the works and lives of twentieth-century
writers, artists, and radicals such as Malcolm X, Ayn Rand, Jack Kerouac,
and Margaret Mead, as well as cultural icons such as James Dean and Superman.
We will also treat this theme as a central question of historical method:
To what extent is our place within society and our individual experience
determined by larger historical forces, and to what extent are we, as
individuals, able to shape society and change the course of history? (Humanities)
STEWART
*7-114. Introductory Seminar: Peasants in Early Modern
Europe. This course will examine some of
the conflicts, large and less-noticed, of sixteenth and seventeenth century
Europe from the perspective of peasant culture. In addition to the effects
of the period's religious wars and land tenure changes, the course will
also examine the dynamics of gender and peasant consciousness using newer
cultural histories of rural Europe. Students will be assigned four short
papers, a mid-term, and final. (Humanities) KREITLOW
*4-116. Introductory Seminar: The
Holocaust.. Open to first and second year students only, except by permission
of instructor. (Humanities) CONNELL
5-257. Topics in History: Baseball-The American Game. This
course will cover the history of baseball since the mid-1800s with an
emphasis on how the game reflects changes and patterns in American society.
The course assignments emphasize writing. (Humanities) LUCAS
8-334. Topics in European History: Twentieth Century Britain.
Political, social, and cultural developments in Great Britain from the
death of Queen Victoria to the present. Particular focus will be placed
on the period of the two world wars, but the course will also cover post-war
decolonization, integration into Europe, and the Thatcherite revolution.
Prerequisite: HIS 104 or junior standing. (Humanities) SIMPSON
9-349. Topics in Latin American History: History of Brazil.
(same as LAS 9-349) This course presents the general features of
Brazil's history with a focus on the nation's environmental history. Warren
Dean's history of the Brazilian's coastal forest with Broadax and Firebrand
is the foundational text supplemented by original documents, scholarly
studies and a novel. Students are required to lead certain class discussions
and complete a lengthy paper drawing from assigned readings (i.e. not
an original research paper). Prerequisite: HIS/LAS 141. (Humanities)
KREITLOW
5-357. Seminar: The Documentary Imagination in American
History. This course investigates the issues of historical truth
and fiction through an examination of the documentary genre. Throughout
the Twentieth Century, American writers, photographers, filmmakers, and
social scientists struggled to document historical reality for the purposes
of social reform, governmental policy-making, historical preservation,
and the development of a cultural aesthetic. Topics will include: the
methods and techniques employed by documentary makers; how the search
for truth is undertaken in different documentary works, such as James
Agee's Let Us Now Praise Famous Men and Betty Lou Valentine's Hustling
and Other Hard Work: Lifestyles in the Ghetto; the ethics involved
in the project to document someone else's experience; and the obstacles
documentary makers faced in order to produce their representations. (Humanities)
STEWART
PHILOSOPHY
4-363. Topics in Philosophy: Free Will and Determinism.
Determinism is the view that all events, including human actions and choices,
are causally determined. It is often claimed that determinism (or generally
the scientific understanding of human behavior) has serious consequences
for our understanding of ourselves as free agents. We will consider arguments
concerned with determinism and its consequences for free will. We will
also consider the implications of such views for morality. (Humanities)
WHITE
PHYSICAL EDUCATION
511. Athletic Training Practicum. (1/4 credit) Provides
supervised practical experience in the prevention, evaluation, treatment,
management, and rehabilitation of athletic injuries and illness. Participation
in the administrative aspects of an athletic training program. Prerequisites:
Must be accepted into the Cornell College Athletic Training Program as
administered and supervised by Head Athletic Trainer Dick Simmons. Application
for admission to the program includes a written form, interview with the
Head Athletic Trainer, and two letters of reference from Cornell instructors
and/or coaches. There are no specific courses required as prerequisite
for admission to the program or to the Athletic Training Practicum. (CR)
POLITICS
240.. Alternate years, beginning in 2000-2001. (Social
Science) SUTHERLAND
8-315. Seminar: Public Ethics in the Deep South. A
study of efforts to recover and to build public integrity in state and
local governments in Mississippi and Louisiana, with special reference
to New Orleans. The course will travel for 7-10 days in Jackson, Baton
Rouge, New Orleans, and Gulfport-Biloxi. Prerequisite: POL 222, 225, or
327. (Social Science) SUTHERLAND
3-336. International Relations of the Asian-Pacific Rim.
International politics in the Asian-Pacific region since World
War II. Considerations include the impact of big-power rivalries, political
revolution, economic development, and the globalization of capital. Prerequisite:
POL 242 or 243. (Social Science) HUANG
2-337. Comparative Government of China and Japan. Comparative
of contemporary China and Japan. Considerations include the synthesis
of indigenous traditions and imported institutions in each country and
the respective roles of China and Japan in world politics and the international
economy. Prerequisite: POL 242 or 243. (Social Science) HUANG
PSYCHOLOGY
4-356. Advanced Topics in Psychology: How We Know. The
name of this course is taken from the title of Tom Gilovich's popular
book "How We Know What Isn't So." The book is an exploration of faulty
reasoning and how it affects everyday decisions people make. The class
will read Gilovich's book and related works that examine decision making
and factors that may make it faulty. A consideration of research and theory
on fundamental cognitive processes will be an important part of the class.
Prerequisite: any 200-level Psychology course. (Social Science) ASTLEY
6-358. Advanced Topics in Psychology: Women and Mental
Health. This course will address issues such
as: why women experience various forms of psychological distress; how
mental health systems have sometimes served as a form of social control,
both in the past and the present; how social trends and historical factors
influence women's distress; and what types of interventions are most effective
for working with diverse groups of women. Readings will include classic
works on women and "madness," commentaries about the strengths and flaws
of diagnostic practices and treatments, and autobiographical and biographical
accounts of women's experiences with psychological distress. Prerequisite:
any 200-level Psychology course (Social Science) ENNS
7-370. Memory. Research and
theory about remembering and forgetting. Topics will include: models of
memory (including neural network approaches), brain processes in memory,
the role of images in memory, reconstructive processes in memory, memory
and development, and how to improve memory. Prerequisite: PSY 161 plus
any 200-level Psychology course (Social Science) ASTLEY
RELIGION
2-366. Topics: Theology and Passion.
Study of the role of emotion in theology, with special attention to the
works of Kierkegaard, Schleiermacher, and Levinas. This course will be
taught by Professor Joseph Pickle, Professor of Religion at Colorado College.
(Humanities) PICKLE
8-367. Topics: Neo-Darwinism, Sociobiology, and Religion.
This course will examine the relationship between recent developments
in evolutionary theory and in sociobiology (e.g., Wilson's Consilience)
as these developments seem to have implications for religious belief.
Dr. Keith Ward is Regius Professor of Divinity at the University of Oxford
and author of numerous books and articles on theology and on the relationship
between science and religion. Dr. Ward will be at Cornell as Templeton
Distinguished Visiting Professor of Science and Religion. (Humanities)
WARD
RUSSIAN
4-303. Readings from Contemporary Life.
Extensive practice in reading, writing, and speaking using a variety of
authentic materials from contemporary sources, including magazines and
newspapers. Readings will focus on topics such as society, culture, education,
work, and travel. Offered every other year. Prerequisite: RUS 205. IKACH
7-311. Introduction to 19th Century Russian Literature.
Introduction to Russian literature of the nineteenth century, with readings
of works by representative writers. Lectures, readings, and discussions
in Russian. Alternate years. Prerequisite: RUS 301 or 303. IKACH
312. Introduction to 20th Century Russian Literature.
Introduction to Russian literature of the twentieth century, with readings
of works by representative writers. Lectures, readings, and discussions
in Russian. Alternate years, beginning with 2000-2001. Prerequisite:
RUS 301 or 303. IKACH
SOCIOLOGY
6-358. Advanced Topics: Birth, Death, and the Life Cycle:
An Introduction to Social Demography. An
examination of the impact of social factors on the basic components of
the life cycle -- birth, the transition to adulthood, household formation,
marriage, aging, and death. It will also examine the social impact of
the age structure of a population and consider the concept of "generation"
(such as the Baby Boomers and Generation X). Prerequisite: SOC 101. (Social
Science) CARLSON
WOMEN'S STUDIES
2-275. Topics: Women of the American Theatre. This
course explores the rich heritage of women in the American theatre. It
seeks to define those forces that have inhibited and enhanced the contributions
of women to theatre in the United States. Through research, interviews
with theatre artists, and class discussion, students identify recurring
themes and images in the work of women and become acquainted with the
careers and contributions of designers, directors, playwrights, actors,
producers, and theatre visionaries. ASPENGREN
5-378. Advanced Topics: Women and the Law.
The relationship between women and "the law" is complex and ambiguous,
in theory and in practice. The legal system -- and its ideals of equality,
justice, and rights -- have sometimes been effectively used to fight and
to remedy oppression of women. Yet some feminist scholars argue that "the
law" and legal institutions are themselves oppressive, patriarchal structures,
defining women in heterosexist terms and perpetuating male power and domination
over women. This course will explore these tensions in the context of
practical areas of law with particular significance for women's lives
-- including family law, the law of sex discrimination and sexual harassment.
We will also consider legal responses to violence against women, the legal
regulation of women's reproduction, and the law as it applies to lesbian
relationships. Finally, we will consider the law through the perspectives
and experiences of women who participate in the legal system as lawyers
and judges. Prerequisite: WST 171. IHLAN
Cornell College
600 First Street West
Mt Vernon, IA 52314
(319) 895-4372
[email protected] |
2010 AUSTRALIAN DANCE AWARDS
Document Sample
2010 AUSTRALIAN DANCE AWARDS PLEASE NOTE: This is reminder list of some of the dance works presented in Australia between 1 January & 31 December 2009. This list is not exhaustive or exclusive. You may nominate a professional work, company or performer that is not on this list. Production Title Company or Individual Choreographer / Director Key performer/s Performance venue Premiere Nils Christe - Sync Y François Klaus - Chant d’Amour …with Attitude QLD Ballet QPAC Kim McCarthy - Nineteen (excerpt) Gareth Belling - Refraction Amanda Phillips, Alex Mitchell & Adelaide Fringe Fest, 3Xperimentia: Live Cut Amanda Phillips Damien West Mercury Cinema 5 Minute Holiday Legs on the Wall & ATYP Dean Walsh Sydney CBD streets Y A Volume Problem Presented by Malthouse Theatre; Choreo: Byron Perry Derrick Amanatidis, Sara Black, Tower Theatre, Malthouse Y Project Management: Moriarty’s Composer: Luke Smiles Danielle Canavan, Holly Durrant, Laura Project Levitus, Kathryn Newnham, Harriet Ritchie. An Adventure of Don Quixote Ballet Theatre of QLD (youth co.) Playhouse, QPAC Y Anamnesis Cormac Lally, David Corbet, Horse Bazaar, Melbourne Y Bagryana Popov and Simon Ellis. Kay Armstrong, Marnie Palomares, Y Annual Dance Performance ACPE students Cleveland St Theatre Jacqui Simmonds At the Beach Buzz Dance theatre King St Arts Centre Y Ballet @ the Quarry West Australian Ballet Quarry amphitheatre, Perth Y? Bedroom Dancing Restless Dance Theatre Queens Theatre Adelaide Y Melbourne Ballet Company, Project Simon Hoy, Sharon Fernandez and Y Believe Chapel Theatre Five Robert Kelly. Beneath the Ancestors NAISDA student company Riverside Theatre Parramatta Y international Choreos: Y Black Marrow Commissioned by Chunky Move Lighting Design: Niklas Pajanti Music composer: Ben Frost Producer: Marguerite Pepper N Blue Love Shaun Parker Shaun Parker & Lucia Mastrantone Productions Sofie Burgoyne, Sarah Fiddaman, Y Blur, The Tasdance Anton Floeur Alder, Joel Corpuz, Trisha Dunn Earl Arts Centre, Launceston & Malcolm McMillan Bodytorque 2.2 The Australian Ballet Various Y Performer/composer: Weizen Ho Y Borrowed Language, The De Quincey Co Video design: Pongpassakiorn Casula Powerhouse Kulthirathum (Kobie) 1 Sound design: Vic McEwan Dramaturg: Tess de Quincey Consultants: Barbara Campbell & Peggy Wallach Dir: Craig Ilott N Buddy - The Buddy Holly Live Theatre Productions Australia MD: Peter Laughton Scott Cameron Her Majesty’s Adelaide Story Choreo: Gasworks Theatre, Y Calling the Shots Phunktional Community & youth dance project Melbourne; Mildura Playground Contemporary Dance Kate Skully, Tess Appleby and Kate Skully, Tess Appleby and Y Capture Adelaide Fringe Festival Company Rhiannon Davi Rhiannon Davi Chant d’Amour Queensland Ballet François Klaus Y Kelly Power, Sarah Bakker and Chris N Chicago Choreographer: Dair, Caroline O’Connor, Sharon Brisbane Millerchip, Craig McLachlan Concord The Australian Ballet International choreos Y Concrete Solace Phantom Limbs James Welsby and Amy Macpherso James Welsby and Amy Macpherso Construct Sol Ulbrich (Producer) Tanja Liedtke Paul White, Christina Chan & national tour N Harakiri Didier Theron (France) Sue Peacock, Matthew Morris, Sete Tele, Claudia Alessi, Aimee Smith and Michael Whaites STRUT Counterpoint (with guest from West Australian His Majesty’s Theatre Y Jo Pollitt - Re-Render Chrissie Parrott Ballet) Cass Mortimer Eipper - Soul Cass Mortimer Eipper Searching Counting, The Presented by Malthouse Theatre; Choreo: Antony Hamilton & Rogue Derrick Amanatidis, Sara Black, Tower Theatre, Malthouse Y Project Management: Moriarty’s Sound: Pansonic Danielle Canavan, Holly Durrant, Laura Project Costume: Doyle Barrow Levitus, Kathryn Newnham, Harriet Ritchie. Cradle of the Spirits, The Tasdance Sthan Kabar-Louet Earl Arts Centre, Launceston Y Cross Currents WAAPA students Tim Harbour Geoff Gibbs Theatre, Perth Y Main Theatre (AC Arts) Light Y Crush, A Solo Liv Lorent Dan Daw Square Choreo: Sam Williams, Alice Hinde Y Dance Grad 09 QUT student performance Paul Zivkovich, Vanessa Mafé- QUT gardens Theatre Keane. Natalie Weir, Vanessa Mafe & Judith Wright Centre, Y Dance Makers, The Expressions Timothy Brown Brisbane 2 Julia Robinson, Steph Hutchison, Tim Dancehouse Open Season - Darbyshire, Gabby Rose and Caley Choreo: Tim Darbyshire, Steph O’Neill, Deanne Butterworth, Zoe Heimweh, White, Tuning In, Hutchison, Gabby Rose, Caley Scoglio, Sarah Aitken, Annabelle Buckets and Other Things, O’Neill, Carlee Mellow. Dancehouse Balharry, Rebecca Jensen, Madeleine Dancehouse Y Dual Reperage in Filmmaker: Christos Linou Krenek, Adriano Mantarro, Phillip Threes, Flex, Shapeshiftings, Composers: Felicity Mangan, Michael Pavlou, Rachel Perica, Emily Ranford, Without Pretence Munson, Paul Dornau Carlee Mellow and Jess Wasikowska. Dancing with the Orchestra The Australian Ballet QPAC Choreo: Jianna Georgiou, Lorcan Restless studios, Adelaide Y Hopper, Dana Nance, Andrew Pandos. Debut / 2 Restless Dance Theatre Mentors: Katrina Lazaroff, Glen McCurley, Sasha Zahra and Aidan Kane Munn Depth Charge Buzz Dance Theatre Playhouse, Perth Y Michelle Heaven with Brian Lucas Michelle Heaven with Brian Lucas N Disagreeable Object Chunky Move studios Set / lighting design by Ben Cobham. Do Avatars Dream of Human The Physical TV Company Choreo: Richard James Allen ? Sleep? A “Mixed Reality” Dance (Short Sweet + Dance) Elbow Room Lisa Wilson Collective Lisa Wilson Brisbane Powerhouse Y Endurance Tracks Darwin Festival Y Adelaide Fringe Fest, Facing Death Mary Walker Mercury Cinema Fire Bangarra Stephen Page touring N? Firebird Choreo: Graeme Murphy N Firebird and Other Legends The Australian Ballet Petrouchka Choreo: Mikhail Fokine Adelaide Les Sylphides Choreo: Mikhail Fokine Foreshore Cruisin’ AYDF Mandurah Terrace Y Mandurah Performing Arts Y Fragments l and ll AYDF Centre Shelley Lasica, Deanne Butterworth Y and Kyle Kremerskothen with guest Full Colour Shelley Lasica Choreo & direction: Shelley Lasica performances by Phillip Adams, Helen Malthouse, Vic Herbertson, Joanna Lloyd and Trevor Patrick. Future Memory Amanda Phillips Gala Moody & Lisa Griffiths Golden Grove Arts Centre Y G ADT Garry Stewart Dunstan Playhouse N Jambird Choreo: Chrissie Parrott Quindell Orton, Jonathan Mustard, Moores Bld Contemp Arts Y Garden, The Composer: Jonathon Mustard Leanne Mason, Rhiannon Newton, Gallery, Fremantle 3 Jacqui Claus, Tom Penney, Russell Leonard Garnished La La Parlour Judith Wright Centre for Arts N Genie(us) Buzz Dance Theatre Subiaco Arts Centre Y Ghost Quarters De Quincey Co Tess de Quincey Carriageworks Y Giselle WAB Rhys Martin, Chrissie Parrott and Y Global Nomads Link (WAAPA student company) Perth Olivia Millard. a David Atkins production N Hot Shoe Shuffle SA presented by Matt Byrne Media Huit a Huit Dancehouse & Russell Dumas Russell Dumas Dancehouse Y Choreo: Gabrielle Nankivell Y I left my shoes on warm Dancehouse Design: Benjamin Cisterne Danchouse concrete and stood in the rain Sound: Luke Smiles Identity Tasdance Francis Rings and Anton Launceston, Ulverstone & Y Hobart Imelda Short Sweet and Song 09 Directed and Choreographed by Matt Pilgrim Theatre Y Young Inert Simon Ellis & Shannon Bott Choreo: Shannon Bott, Simon Ellis Shannon Bott, David Corbet, Simon Arts House North Melbourne N Sound Design: David Corbett Ellis, Cormac Lally and Scott Mitchell. Environment: Scott Mitchell Video: Cormac Lally Into the Mouth of the Wolf Kate Harman & Elizabeth McDonnell Rehearsal Room, JWC Y It’s a Jungle Out There Martin del Amo Martin del Amo Campbelltown Arts Centre Y Fresh Bred Y Jack (Ausdance SA youth dance Carol Wellman-Kelly Main Theatre AC Arts ensemble) Juice Volcana Womens Circus Performance Space, JWC Y Art Dir: Ruth Osborne Y Just a Stage QL2 Youth Dance project Street Theatre Canberra Choreo: Dean Cross & Liz Lea Kelp Earl Arts Centre, Launceston Y Tasdance Gail Mabo Splintergroup N Choreography: Splintergroup Producer: Brisbane Powerhouse & Lawn Composer: Iain Grandage Dancenorth Designer: Zoe Atkinson Presenter: Mobile States Let’s Get it Strait Tasdance Beth Shelton King Island and Flinders Y Island Luke George, Kristy Ayre Y Sound: Luke Smiles Lifesize Presented by Dancehouse Luke George Dancehouse Video: Martyn Coutts Lighting: Banjamin Cisterne 4 Michaela Pegum Y Sound: Julia Mant Limina Michaela Pugum Arts House, Melbourne Viseo: Cheri Green Lighting: Jennifer Hector Little Night Music, A Opera Australia Sigrid Thornton Arts Centre, Melbourne Y Susanne Richter + Anmol Mishra Susanne Richter + Anmol Mishra Y Los Enamorades Seymour Centre Los Tres Rios (The Three Danza Viva Deanna Blacher DownStairs at the Maj, Perth N Rivers) Gasworks Theatre, Love Drunk Phunktional Melbourne Machaam (beauty spot) Paea Leach Kulcha WA Machine That Carries the Chafia Brooks, Nerida Matthaei and N Phluxus Dance Collective Street Theatre, Canberra Soul, The Skye Sewell Main Event, The Alison Currie & Solon Ulbrich Adelaide Centre for the Arts Y Leigh Warren and Dancers & Arts Venue: Flinders Medical Y Medico Manoeuvres II - Leigh Warren in Health Centre (Front Foyer) Gasworks Theatre, Melbourne Breaks Phunktional Melbourne Choreo: Jo Lloyd Y Melbourne Spawned a Costume: Tim Jomartz Luke George Dancehouse Monster Set: Robe McCredie Sound: Duane Morrison Mercury Sydney Dance Company Kenneth Kvarnstrom (not australian) Y State Theatre Company South Matthew Robinson Cameron Goodall, Nancye Hayes, Jude Metro Street Y Australia Choreo: Jo Stone Henshall, Debra Byrne Midsummer Nights Dream, A Queensland Ballet Francois Klaus QLD touring N MIlpirri Tracks Dance Co Lajamanu Community NT N? Mine Yours, Yours Mine and Main Theatre (AC Arts) Light Y AC Arts Dance, third year dancers, Ours Square Choreo and Direction: Phillip Adams Y Composers: David Chisholm and Luke George, Kyle Kremerskothen, Miracle BalletLab Myles Mumford Arts House Meat Market Clair Peters and Brooke Stamp Costume Design: Toni Matičevski Lighting Design: Bluebottle Moonwebs and Scorched Steps Youth Dance Company Director: Alice Lee Holland Playhouse theatre, WA Y Thongs Choreographers: Paul Zivkovich, Shannon Anderson, Sofie Burgoyne and Shannon Riggs. Presented by Artshouse (Dance N Morphia Series Helen Herbertson & Ben Cobham Helen Herbertson & Ben Cobham Arts House, Melbourne Massive) Mortal Engine Chunky Move & Malthouse Theatre Gideon Obarzanek with Frieder Weis Club Malthouse, Melbourne N 5 Laser and Sound Artist: Robin Fox Composer: Ben Frost Costume Designer: Paula Levis Movement: Gareth Hart Y Move me Closer Gareth Hart Sound: Jo Robinson Guildford Lane Gallery Costume: Loz Necessary Games Sophie Hyde, Kat Worth, Tuula Adelaide Film Festival, Y Roppola, Paul Zivkovich Picadillly Palace Moths: Co-direction & choreo. Paul Zivkovich Necessary Games (films) Restless with Sophie Hyde and Sixteen: Co-direction & choreo. Kat Restless Dance Co Adelaide Film Festival Bryan Mason of Closer Productions Worth Necessity: Co-direction & choreo. Tuula Roppola Nerve Ending (Film) Michelle Ryan Michelle Ryan Dancenorth Theatre, Y Dancenorth Townsville Choreo: Emily Amisano, Craig Barry, New Breed SDC & ADT Y Connor Dowling, Larissa McGowan Night of Solo Performance Andrew Morrish Woodward Theatre, QUT Y Nineteen Kim McCarthy Brisbane Festival, QPAC Y The Fondue Set N Lighting: Julie-Anne Long Presented by Artshouse Emma Saunders, Elizabeth Ryan & No Success Like Failure Design/Production: Neil Simpson Arts House, Melbourne Producer: Rosalind Richards Jane McKernan Collab Designer: Agatha Gothe- Snape Nowhere Fast Ross McCormack Dancenorth Theatre, Y Dancenorth Townsville Lucinda Dunn, Marilyn Jones, Robert N Nutcracker The Australian Ballet Choreographer: Graeme Murphy Curran, Paul Knobloch Nutcracker Youth Ballet WA Perth Concert Hall Nutcracker Australian Conservertoire of Ballet Christine Walsh The Arts Centre N Nyuntu Ngali (You We Two) - Y A post-apocalypse love story Writer/Director :Scott Rankin, Space Theatre - Adelaide Windmill Choreographer: Gina Rings Festival Centre Concept: Meryl Tankard Y Producer: Vicki Middleton Choreo: Meryl Tankard and Paul Creative Dev. Producers: Chris White Oracle, The Paul White SOH Latham & Rosalind Richards Set & Video design: Regis Lansac (Commissioned by SOH & Lighting: Damien Cooper & Matt Cox Malthouse Theatre) Sandra Parker Carlee Mellow, Clair Peters and Mia Y Out of Light Gasworks Theatre Projection Designer: Rhian Hinkley Hollingworth. 6 Composer: Steven Heather Lighting Designer: Jenny Hector Out of the Dark Jade Erlandsen Jade Erlandsen Adelaide Fringe Fest Y Overture Series Sydney Dance Company various Y Paris Match The Australian Ballet Performance Anxiety Brisbane Powerhouse Brian Lucas Y Curator: Lucy Guerin N Choreo: Fiona Bryant, Ben Hancock, Producer: Sarah Rodigari Pieces for small spaces Alisdair Macindoe, Luke Smiles and Lucy Guerin Inc Studios Production & Light: Bluebottle 3, Brooke Stamp Frog and Rose Created and directed by Lisa O’Neill Y with writer Peter Berkahn illustrator: XTN sound composer & designer: Guy Pipe Manager, The Lisa O’Neill Brisbane Powerhouse Webster dramaturg: Kathryn Kelly video production: Jaxzyn costume design: Glen Brown Poupee Trudy Radburn Trudy Radburn Sally Smith & Trudy Radburn Forty-five downstairs, Y Composer: Madeleine Flynn Melbourne Design: Emilt Barrie Lighting: Afterpi Soropos Powdermonkey Steps Youth Dance Kalgoorlie Y Perth Institute of Y Prime Cuts Strut various Contemporary Arts Derrick Amanatidis, Sara Black, Tower Theatre, Malthouse Y Presented by Malthouse Theatre; Choreo: Rogue Danielle Canavan, Holly Durrant, Laura Puck Project Management: Moriarty’s Costume: Doyle Barrow Levitus, Kathryn Newnham, Harriet Project Ritchie Questions without Notice Performing Lines Sue Peacock Playhouse Theatre, Perth Y Anandavalli & Ramli Ibrahim Y Rasa Unmasked Lingalayam Dance Company Sydney Composer: Alex Dea Refraction Gareth Belling Brisbane Festival, QPAC Y Remembered of Us Tasdance Frances Rings Earl Arts Centre, Launceston Y Restless Cadi McCarthy & Company Cadi McCarthy Courtyard Studio, CTC Y Link (WAAPA student dance Y Ripple Effect Melbourne company) Sally Richardson, Stefan Karlsson, Rites Performing Lines Danielle Micich Rock Show Gavin Webber with Regurgitator QPAC Y Run a performance engine De Quincey Co Tess de Quincey Carriageworks Y 7 Score Expressions Maggi Sietsma Judith Wright Centre, Y Brisbane Artistic Director: Ruth Osborne Y Select Option QL2 Centre for Youth Dance Commissioned choreographers: Canberra Theatre Centre Marko Panzic and Reed Luplau Seven LWD Leigh Warren touring N Collaboration between Kate Usher, Y Kate Usher, Liz Whelan, Natalie Shift F7 Producer: Kate Usher Liz Whelan, Natalie Phillips, Miranda Metro Arts Phillips, Miranda Zeller, Liesel Zink Zeller, Liesel Zink Chrissie Parrott, Sue Peacock, Paea Y Leach, Deborah Robertson, Brooke Short Cuts Strut Dance WAAPA Leeder, Jacob Lehere and David Corbet Tracey White, Travers Ross, Miranda Y Zeller S arah-Vyne Vassallo, Paulina Quinteros, Angela Hill , Chris Mayhew, Lorena Oates + Damien Grima, Ash Bee, Ela Ray Markstein Tamara Tossey, Alison Gunton, Jeni Sutton, Melissa Cooper, Richard James Allen, Emma + James twentypastfourproductions Batchelor, Martin Del Amo, Jodie McNeilly, Imogen Cranna, Victoria Short,Sweet+Dance Phluxus Dance Collective Chiu, Mariana Baltidano & William Seymour Centre Centurion, Elizabeth Whelan, Gabrielle Jade Lyon, Sean Marcs Phluxus Dance Collective with Brian Lucas, Cecilie Farrar, Jason Winters + Jacqui Howard, Natalie Abbott, Chelsea Funnell, Yolande Brown, Nerida Godfrey, Marnie Palomares & Kevin Privett, Katelyn Boshell, Catherine Hourihan, Bianca Gallifuoco, Cloe Fournier, Kathryn Sagar, Thomas Egan Sleeping Beauty, The The Australian Ballet N Sleeping Beauty, The Queensland Ballet Francois Klaus Qld Perf Arts Centre N fLiNG Physical Theatre Riverside Theatre, Y Sol’s Way Lee Pemberton (youth dance co) Parramatta Gasworks Theatre, Sound of Silence, The Phunktional Melbourne Lucy Guerin with Luke Smiles (Zero); Y? Spin WAAPA students WAAPA Natalie Weir (Proofsheet), 8 Stink Box Blabber Mouth AC Arts grad students Peter Sheedy AC Arts Y Amelia Waller, Keian Langdon, Alex ? Streetcar Named Desire, A Queensland Ballet Francois Klaus Playhouse, QPAC Wagner, Rachael Walsh Structure and Sadness Lucy Guerin Inc. Merlyn Theatre Vic. N Theatre Rehearsal Room, ? Stuffed JWC Swan Lake Queensland Ballet Francois Klaus Playhouse, QPAC Y Swan Lake Melbourne Dance Theatre Inc. Tales from a Small City Stompin (Youth Dance Co) Y Telstra Ballet in the Gardens Australian Ballet, The Brisbane River Stage Tenebrae lll The Song Company Shaun Parker Carriageworks, Sydney Y Teula Postcards Polytoxic Dance Company Tandanya Adelaide ? Director: Dein Perry Y The Next Step Choreographers: Jason and Kris Big Top, Luna Park Lewis Director: Kay Armstrong Y This Way Up (part of Dance youMove Choreos: Vicki Van Hout, Anton, Parramatta Riverside Theatre Bites 2009) Emma Saunders & Jody McNeilly Three to Tango Rosetta Cook St Bernard Studios Y Tighter You Squeeze, The Lina Limosani Lina Limosani ADT studios Y Tipping Point Dirty Feet Martin del Amo & Vicki Van Hout Cleveland St Theatre Y TranscenDANCE Aimee Smith (AD) Y Dianne Reid and Stephanie Dianne Reid and Stephanie Y Hutchison Grace Walpole and Shaun Hutchison Grace Walpole and Shaun Trio of Duets, A Dancehouse Dancehouse McLeod Ann-Maree Ellis and Nicola McLeod Ann-Maree Ellis and Nicola Edding Edding Lighting designs: Peter Thwaites & Y Dancehouse & Weave Movement Michelle Heaven, Kate Middleweek, Triplicity Oscar Seaburgs Dancehouse Theatre Gerard Van Dyck Costumes:Christina Logan-Bell True Stories N Bangarra Elma Kris & Frances Rings Her Majestys Theatre, Perth (Emeret Lu and X300) Tuning Fork Jondi Keane & James Cunningham SEAM symposium, The Drill Y Dance: Andrew de Lotbinière Y Un peu de vie dans ce monde Harwood, Jacob Lehrer & David mourant... A little life in this Jacob Lehrer & David Corbet Corbet Dancehouse Melbourne dying world Music: Barry Hill Video: Paula Zacharias Untrained Lucy Guerin Inc. Lucy Guerin Ross Coulter, Antony Hamilton, Simon Arts House Meat Market Y Obarzanek and Byron Perry Melbourne Vanquishing For Openings Deakin University student Sheridan Lang and Phoebe Robinson Deakin University Y production 9 Shelley Lasica N Music: Milo Kossowski, Morgan Deanne Butterworth, Jo Lloyd, Timothy McWaters Vianne Presented by Dancehouse Harvey, Lee Serle, Bonnie Paskas Dancehouse Set: Anne-Marie May Costume: Shelley Lasica, Kara Baker Lighting: Ben Cobham Stacey Carmichael, Julianna Garcia, Y Director: Lyndel Freeman Courthouse Youth Arts Cenre Violin room2move Tara Lynch, Kirsty Reilly and Rachel Playwright: Daniel Keene Geelong Sheehan Virus Aiden Kane Munn Aiden Kane Munn Adelaide Fringe Fest Y Voyeur, The Clare Dyson Clare Dyson Gardens Point Theatre, QUT Y We Unfold Sydney Dance Company Rafael Bonachela Y Weight of the thing left its Paul Romano, Sophia Cowen, Olivia Dancehouse & Shaun McCleod Shaun McCleod Y mark, The Millard and Luke Hickmott. Brown Council, Rosie Dennis, Brian Fuata, Agatha Gothe-Snape, Gabriella Mangano and Silvana What I Think About When I’m Mangano, and Rosemary Butcher Campbelltown Arts Centre Y Dancing and Cathy Lane with Jane McKernan, Tamara Tossey, Victoria Hunt, Michelle Outram and James Brown. When will I be famous Urbane Ignition Youth Dance Claire Marshall Brisbane Powerhouse Y Where Our Edges Meet Dancehouse Alice Cummins & Anita Hustas Dancehouse Y Choreo: Richard James Allen (The Y a Paul Greene Music Video Work Love Dance Trust Physical TV Company) Director: Jakub Jacko (Superduper) Larissa McGowan Y Zero-sum Larissa McGowan Rachel Fenwick, Larissa McGowan Womad Adelaide Music: Jethro Woodward Zilch WAAPA student works PICA Y 10 |
OBI Rebranding Services RFQ 062311.doc - OUS
Document Sample
Request for Quotations – Personal Services Oregon Business Institute (OBI) Rebranding Services Quotations due by: July 12, 2011, 5:00 P.M. Contact: Erika Foin Phone: 503-276-3635 Fax: 503-276-3626 Email: [email protected] Department: Oregon Business Institute Address: 200 SW Market St., Ste. L101, Portland, OR 97201 Submittal Instructions: Enter the requested information on the Request for Quotations form, print and sign it. Prepare your complete response, including the Request for Quotations form and any additional documents. Submit the complete response via email, facsimile or US mail to the department contact noted above. General Information: Quotations to provide personal services as described below in the Scope of Work, will be received by the State of Oregon, acting by and through the State Board of Higher Education, on behalf of the University of Oregon (“University”). Please use this form to submit your response pursuant to the submittal instructions by the date and time shown above. Additional documents may be included as part of the response. By providing a quote in response to this Request for Quotations, Contractor agrees to the terms and conditions contained in this Request for Quotations and further agrees to the attached Personal Services Contract Standard Contract Provisions (Attachment A). Any contract resulting from this Request for Quotations will be subject to Attachment A. Responses submitted on other than this form, after the due date and time, not signed or that contain any exceptions or modification to the terms and conditions contained in this Request for Quotations or Attachment A, may be deemed non-responsive by University in its sole discretion. If checked, this quotation is subject to additional University terms and conditions attached and titled: Attachment D - Personal Services Contract - Insurance Requirements Scope of Work: Oregon Executive MBA is rebranding as Oregon Business Institute (OBI), an umbrella organization which will include Oregon Executive MBA as one of its components. OBI is seeking a Rebranding Consultant to achieve the following over a six-month period: define OBI mission/vision/purpose; develop and apply OBI brand strategy; develop graphic identity of proposed brand; complete business plan and budget for proposed brand; frame and schedule a communication/media strategy; and implement initial event format, themes, pricing, marketing and schedule. UO will assemble a UO project task force to support and guide the OBI rebranding project. The rebranding consists of launching the brand for Oregon Business Institute; rebranding the OEMBA as both a UO program and a program under the umbrella of OBI; and developing a Policy Institute identity. All logo work and design work to be carried out by Lundquist College of Business' department of Communications. The contractor will undertake the following: 1. Facilitate the launch project (specifically, create a strategy for the entire launch project, including creating a draft business and marketing plan for further development, and do preliminary research that will define the boundaries of the launch and roll-out). 2. Design and carry out market and program research to support the project 3. Provide recommendations to and collaborate with UO project task force regarding all project elements. 4. Identify market opportunities for OBI in Portland, the region and internationally 5. Explore overlap and common ground with Extension/White Stag for programming 6. Create a pricing/launch strategy and schedule (for competitive tuition for OEMBA and for new tuition rates for short-courses and executive certificates) Qualifications: 1. Marketing and communications experience working with senior level executives (CEO, CFO, CIO) in an academic setting, including supervision of related staffs, art departments and outside vendors 2. Highly creative and entrepreneurial, while also collegial and a team player 3. Knowledge of local and regional executive/management education environment and market 4. Well-networked locally Submittals: Please include a current resumé/CV, a cover letter that clearly describes all of your applicable skills and experiences, and two references. Oregon Business Institute (OBI) Rebranding Services Quote for Requested Scope of Work to be Completed by Contractor Check all items applicable to this Request for Quotation: Response/Informal Proposal included with submittal addresses the following: [INSERT TYPE OF SUBMITTAL, IE. REFERENCES, QUALIFICATIONS] [INSERT TYPE OF SUBMITTAL, IE. REFERENCES, QUALIFICATIONS] Price Quote for Services: Fixed Fee: Variable Fee – Define Structure (ie. Rate per hour or per deliverable): Fee/Quote for Services Included with Submittal. Prices shall be firm for three months Contractor agrees to furnish the above according to University’s terms, conditions, and specifications. Contractor: Signature: Print Name: Date: Address: Email: Phone: Fax: No Quote. Date Contacted: Reason: ATTACHMENT A PERSONAL SERVICES CONTRACT STANDARD CONTRACT PROVISIONS 1. ACCESS TO RECORDS. Contractor will maintain records, sufficient to accurately document its performance of this Contract. University will have access to such records of Contractor for the purpose of determining compliance with this Contract. Contractor will retain all such records, for a minimum of six years following final payment under or termination of this Contract, or such longer period as may be required by applicable law or to conclude any audit, review, or controversy. 2. INDEMNITY FOR INFRINGEMENT CLAIMS. EXCEPT TO THE EXTENT ARISING FROM MATERIALS PROVIDED TO CONTRACTOR BY UNIVERSITY, WHICH MATERIALS ARE UTILIZED BY CONTRACTOR IN THEIR UNALTERED FORM AND WITHOUT LIMITING THE GENERALITY OF THE INDEMNIFICATION CLAUSE REFERENCED IN THE HOLD HARMELSS SECTION BELOW, CONTRACTOR EXPRESSLY AGREES TO INDEMNIFY AND HOLD HARMLESS UNIVERSITY AND ITS DIRECTORS, OFFICERS, EMPLOYEES, AND AGENTS FROM AND AGAINST ANY AND ALL CLAIMS, SUITS, ACTIONS, LOSSES, LIABILITIES, COSTS, EXPENSES,appeal. 3. HOLD HARMLESS. Contractor will be responsible for all damage to property, injury to persons, and loss, expense, inconvenience, and delay which may be caused by, or result from any act or omission of Contractor, its subcontractors, agents, or employees. Contractor will indemnify and hold harmless University and its governing board and their directors, officers, agents, employees, and members from all claims, suits, and actions of any nature resulting from or arising out of the acts or omissions of Contractor or its subcontractors, officers, agents, or employees. 4. INSURANCE. Contractor will secure insurance at Contractor’s expense and keep that insurance in effect during the term of this Contract as indicated on Attachment D, if attached.. Nothing in this Contract will be construed to create a partnership, joint venture, franchise, agency, or employment relationship between the Parties. 6. OWNERSHIP OF WORK PRODUCT. All work product of Contractor that results from this Contract (“Work Product”) is the exclusive property of University. University and Contractor intend that such Work Product be deemed "work made for hire" of which University will be deemed the author. If for any reason the Work Product is not deemed "work made for hire," Contractor by this Contract. 7. REPRESENTATIONS AND WARRANTIES.; (5) Contractor will, at all times during the term of this Contract, be qualified, professionally competent, and duly licensed to perform the work; and (6) Contractor’s name, as it appears in this Contract, is Contractor’s legal name, as it will appear in the Contractor’s W-9, and if Contractor is an entity rather than an individual that the entity named in this Contract is validly existing and in good standing. The warranties set forth in this Section are in addition to, and not in lieu of, any other warranties provided; 8. SUBCONTRACTS AND ASSIGNMENTS. Contractor will not subcontract, assign, or transfer any of its interest in this Contract without obtaining prior written approval. Any assignment or subcontract in contravention of this Section will be null and void. 9. TERMINATION. (a) This Contract may be terminated at any time by mutual written consent of both Parties. (b) University may at its sole discretion terminate this Contract in whole or in part upon thirty 30-days’ written notice to Contractor. (c) University may terminate this Contract effective upon delivery of written notice to Contractor, or at such later date as may be established. (d) University may terminate this Contract for default (including breach of contract) if (i) Contractor fails to provide services or deliverables called for by this Contract within the time specified in this Contract or any extension of this Contract; or (ii) Contractor fails to perform any of the other provisions of this Contract, or so fails to pursue the work as to endanger performance of this Contract in accordance with its terms, and after receipt of notice from University, fails to correct such failures within ten business days. (e) Contractor may terminate this Contract upon 30-days’ written notice to University if University fails to pay Contractor pursuant to the terms of this Contract and University does not cure such failure to pay within 30 business days after receipt of Contractor's written notice, or such longer period as Contractor may specify. 10. TERMINATION DUE TO NONAPPROPRIATION OF FUNDS. University may terminate this Contract upon written notice to Contractor if University has not: (a) Received from the Oregon Legislative Assembly appropriations, limitations or other expenditure authority, or (ii) Received allotments pursuant ORS Chapter 291 sufficient to allow University, in the exercise of its reasonable administrative discretion, to pay the amounts of this Contract. 11. REMEDIES. (a) In the event of termination pursuant to Section 9(b), 9(c)(i), or 10, Contractor's sole remedy will be a claim for the sum designated for accomplishing the work Attachment A: Personal Services Contract Standard Contract Provisions Page 5 of 9 REV. 03/21/2011 multiplied by the percentage of work completed and accepted by University, less previous amounts paid and any claim(s) which University has against Contractor. If previous amounts paid to Contractor exceed the amount due to Contractor under this subsection, Contractor will pay any excess to University upon demand. (b) In the event of termination pursuant to Sections 9(c)(ii) or (d), University will have any remedy available to it in law or equity. If it is determined for any reason that Contractor was not in default under these subsections, the rights and obligations of the Parties will be the same as if the Contract was terminated pursuant to Section 9 University had the Contract been completed. Upon University's request, Contractor will surrender to anyone University designates, all documents, research or objects or other tangible things needed to complete the work. 12.. 13. NON-RESIDENT FOREIGN CONTRACTORS. For non-resident foreign Contractors with U.S. sourced income, University will withhold Federal Tax at the applicable tax rate from Contractor's fee unless Contractor is eligible for tax treaty benefits, or qualifies for exemption under other areas of the tax code. University as evidenced by the US Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) I-94 stamped or attached to Contractor’s passport or this Contract is void. 14. LIMITATION OF LIABILITIES. EXCEPT FOR LIABILITY ARISING UNDER OR RELATED TO SECTIONS 7 OR 11(b), NEITHER PARTY WILL BE LIABLE FOR (i) ANY INDIRECT, INCIDENTAL, CONSEQUENTIAL, OR SPECIAL DAMAGES UNDER THIS CONTRACT, OR (ii) ANY DAMAGES OF ANY SORT ARISING SOLELY FROM THE TERMINATION OF THIS CONTRACT IN ACCORDANCE WITH ITS TERMS. 15. NOTICES. Except as otherwise expressly provided in this Contract, any communications between the Parties or notices to be given under this Contract will be given in writing by personal delivery, facsimile, or mailing the same, postage prepaid, to Contractor or University at the address or number set forth on the signature page of this Contract, or to such other addresses or numbers as the Parties may from time to time direct in writing. Any communication or notice so addressed and mailed will be deemed to be given five days after mailing. Any communication or notice delivered by facsimile will be deemed to be given when receipt of the transmission is generated by the transmitting machine. To be effective against University, such facsimile transmission must be confirmed by telephone notice to University's supervising representative. Any communication or notice by personal delivery will be deemed to be given when actually delivered. 16. CAPTIONS. The captions or headings in this Contract are for convenience only and in no way affect the meaning or interpretation of this Contract. 17. COMPLIANCE WITH APPLICABLE LAW. Contractor will comply with all applicable Attachment A: Personal Services Contract Standard Contract Provisions Page 6 of 9 REV. 03/21/2011 federal, state, county, and local laws, ordinances, and regulations. Contractor also agrees to comply with all applicable laws prohibiting discrimination on the basis of race, sex, national origin, religion, age, sexual orientation, status as a veteran, or handicap.. In no event will any part of this Contract be construed as a waiver by University of its sovereign and governmental immunities. BY EXECUTION OF THIS CONTRACT, CONTRACTOR CONSENTS TO IN PERSONAM JURISDICTION OF SUCH COURTS. 19. RECYCLED PRODUCTS. Unless expressly otherwise provided for in this Contract, all paper products will be sourced from mills using elemental chlorine-free processes and contain a minimum of 30% post-consumer waste. 20. HAZARD COMMUNICATION. Contractor will notify University prior to using products containing hazardous chemicals to which University employees may be exposed. Products containing hazardous chemicals are those products defined by Oregon Administrative Rules Chapter 437. 21. SURVIVAL. All provisions of this Contract that would reasonably be expected to survive the termination of this Contract will do so. 22.. 23. SUCCESSORS IN INTEREST. This Contract will be binding upon and will inure to the benefit of the Parties, and their respective successors and assigns. 24. ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITIES. Contractor will, when applicable, have made good faith efforts to work with or obtain materials to be used in performing the Contract from minority-owned, women-owned, and emerging small business enterprises. 25. OMB CIRCULAR A-110. If this Contract is federally funded in whole or in part, Contractor must comply with all applicable provisions of OMB Circular A-110.”; 26. EXCLUSIVITY. University is not bound by exclusivity provisions. 27. TAX COMPLIANCE CERTIFICATION. Contractor certifies, and expressly described in this Contract as intended beneficiaries. 30. TIME IS OF THE ESSENCE. Contractor agrees that time is of the essence under this Contract. 31. OVERDUE ACCOUNT CHARGES. Payment of overdue account charges by University will be subject to ORS 293.462. Attachment A: Personal Services Contract Standard Contract Provisions Page 7 of 9 REV. 03/21/2011 32. FOREIGN CONTRACTOR. If IN THIS CONTRACT REGARDING THIS CONTRACT. NO AMENDMENT, CONSENT, OR WAIVER OF TERMS OF THIS CONTRACT WILL BIND EITHER PARTY UNLESS IN WRITING AND SIGNED BY ALL PARTIES. ANY SUCH AMENDMENT, CONSENT, OR WAIVER WILL BE EFFECTIVE ONLY IN THE SPECIFIC INSTANCE AND FOR THE SPECIFIC PURPOSE GIVEN. CONTRACTOR, BY THE SIGNATURE TO THIS CONTRACT OF ITS AUTHORIZED REPRESENTATIVE, ACKNOWLEDGES HAVING READ AND UNDERSTOOD THE CONTRACT AND CONTRACTOR AGREES TO BE BOUND BY ITS TERMS AND CONDITIONS. 37. COMMUNICATIONS STANDARDS AND GRAMMAR AND STYLE GUIDELINES. Contractor will conform to all applicable University Communications Standards and University Grammar and Style Guidelines available at (). 38. Contract. At the request of a Party, the other Party will confirm facsimile or electronically transmitted signature page by delivering an original signature page to the requesting Party. Attachment A: Personal Services Contract Standard Contract Provisions Page 8 of 9 REV. 03/21/2011 ATTACHMENT D PERSONAL SERVICES CONTRACT INSURANCE REQUIREMENTS (Only complete when insurance is required) During the term of this Contract, Contractor shall maintain in full force at its own expense, from insurance company(ies) authorized to do business in the state of Oregon, the insurance noted below: 1. General Liability Insurance Required by University Not required by University Obtain either comprehensive general liability insurance with a broad form CGL endorsement or broad form commercial general liability insurance with a minimum combined single limit, or the equivalent, of not less than $1,000,000 for each occurrence and $2,000,000 aggregate or $2,000,000 for each occurrence and $5,000,000 aggregate for Bodily Injury and Property Damage, and will include personal and advertising injury liability and products.. It shall include contractual liability coverage for the indemnity provided under this Contract. It shall provide that the State of Oregon, University and officers and employees are Additional Insureds but only with respect to the Contractor's services to be provided under this Contract (See paragraph #4 of Attachment A). 2. Commercial Automobile Liability Insurance Required by University Not required by University Commercial Automobile Liability insurance with a minimum combined single limit of $1,000,000 for each accident and $2,000,000 aggregate for Bodily Injury and Property Damage, including coverage for owned, hired and non- owned vehicles, as applicable. 3. Professional Liability Insurance Required by University Not required by University Examples to consider: attorney, physician, dentist, counselor, architects, etc. Professional Liability insurance with a combined single limit, or the equivalent, of not less than $1,000,000 per occurrence and $2,000,000 aggregate or $2,000,000 and $5,000,000 aggregate for each claim, incident or occurrence. This is to cover damages caused by error, omission or negligent acts related to the professional services to be provided under this Contract. If this insurance is arranged on a “claims made” basis, “tail” coverage will be required at the completion of this Contract for a duration of 24 months. Only a certificate is required. If in the presence of minors: Required by University Not required by University In addition to the above Professional Liability insurance requirements, above, Contractor’s professional liability insurance policy will contain provisions for coverage of allegations of corporal punishment and sexual abuse and molestation. 4. Insurance; Certificates of Insurance and Endorsements. Insurance policies are to be issued by an insurance company authorized to do business in the State of Oregon with a minimum financial rating of an AM Best rating of A- or higher. All liability insurance, except for Professional Liability insurance, will be arranged on an “occurrence” basis. The Contractor shall be financially responsible for all pertinent deductibles, self-insured retentions and/or self-insurance. Before this Contract is executed by University, Contractor must provide to University a Certificate of Insurance from the insuring company evidencing insurance coverage by University, Contractor will provide to University an endorsement from the insuring company, naming (using the following exact language) “the State of Oregon, acting by and through the State Board of Higher Education, on behalf of the University of Oregon, their officers and employees” as additional insured. If requested, complete copies of insurance policies will be provided to the University. 5. Notice of cancellation or change. There shall be no cancellation, material change, reduction of limits or intent not to renew the insurance coverage(s) without thirty (30) days' written notice from the Contractor or its insurer(s) to th University, Contract Officer or designee at the following address: 720 E. 13 Avenue, Suite 302, Eugene, OR 974 |
Tuesday, January 3, 2012
Target Now Carrying New Pony Stuff
A.
Labels: Merchandise, News, Not-Fanfiction
111 comments:
Target, Y U no exist in Europe?
Hmm. Might have to keep my eyes peeled the next time I go to Target. Though on that note, I don't usually shop at Target since the closest one to me is a couple of miles away.
*out to run errands*
*last stop is Target*
*get home, check EqD out of habit*
*this*
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
Wake me when they're released in the UK. Which will probably be about October.
Why is there an iTunes sticker on that last Fluttershy toy?
I must own that Cheerilee!
Wow, finally a Celestia toy that's proportionally accurate. Now, if only they would take care of that pink issue...
Nah, the Fashion Fluttershy isn't a new toy. It's been around for some months now, I have one.
I haven't seen any of the glimmer wing pony toys yet at my local Target. Or the train or CMC set. I kinda want the CMC set though.
I must own that Cheerilee!
I just went to Target and saw the "Royal Castle Friends" set. However the Target near me seems to have severely reduced their pony offerings recently.
somebody tell me when they make them 100% show accurate and not creepy as fuck.
To bad it won't be at Target AU :(
@Senn555 Probably promoting their presence on iTunes. Or maybe a code for a free episode. That would be my best guesses.
Must. buy. Scootaloo!
Fluttershy itunes? What.
Well...I'll be checking out my local Target very soon then.
@ftfc
they're advertising that you can find it on The Hub AND iTunes.
They might of had both Fluttershies you can see have been there for a little. I got the Fashion Style Fluttershy as a gift on Christmas, and all the times i've given the pony part of Target a quick look and the scooter Fluttershy has been there for a while.
find the show, of course... <-<
My favorite happens to be the Ponyville series, like the ones that come in the blindbags
I thought those winged and gala dress ponies were old news. I got a winged rarity before xmas because it reminded me of her in the sonic rainboom episode
Y U no have stuffed ponies?
@wackypony Something tells me that for the foreseeable future, the task of show-accurate ponies is gonna fall on us.
None of the new My Little Pony... ANYTHING is available in the UK it seems, even on iTunes and the Hub website we can't get the episodes
fml
I want that cmc set
Now I know what I'm doing this weekend!
I actually got the train and butterfly wing Rarity for the holidays, and I think they came from Walmart a month or so ago.
CUTIE MARK CRUSADERS: INACCURATE TOY MODELS YAY!
Why. The. Butterflies.
Seriously, wtf.
W00T my news got posted, there was also something called "so soft sweetie bell" but we didn't have any so i couldn't get a photo.
@Flutterfan The Applebloom one is the creepiest...
Look! Accurately labeled CMC toys! Amazing!
I....think I'll just wait until some more accurate ones are released. Then there's always that hint of creepiness in these...
That CMC toy set looks pretty cool! If they ever arrive to Spain I'm so getting one to customize Applebloom and make her look all badass.
Also, that train set gives me ideas for an Unstoppable set XD
Will Celestia ever be white? Or is she doomed to forever
be stained pink?
no target in mexico ME SAD
Just like the previous generations of my little pony, this still has the toy brand tradition but more appeal to bronies especially since we all love the show!!! ^_^
Celestia has the chestpiece, and brushie hair but still pink:/
dude! i got a 20$ target gift card for christmas! YEEEESSS!!!
Hasbro, Y U MAKE CREEPY LOOKING TOYS?!?
All we want is a plushie. One without brushable hair.
Still not show-accurate. Let me know when that happens.
Wait, what the ... the first photo is so blurry, I can't make out the winged pony names. Rainbow Dash onna right, check. Rarity left, yep. Pl... No, wait. Bloomette? What?? Gah! What the lead brick!? Who is that pony!?
Train!.....that's it? That's the train set we were waiting for? An engine and a cart? Dude, the train they threw into the middle of Ponyville had, like, three cars and a caboose. A caboose! You could fit twenty ponies in there. The hell can I fit in this thing's little barrow? A bunny, that's what. And, by the way, who the hell made Pinkie a certified train engineer? Are you trying to kill us all?
Poor Applebloom, she doesn't really look like herself there. Her body should be a darker yellow. The other three ponies are clearly more accurate.
@wackypony
Tell me about it!!!
The dolls are adorable! but Hasbro, I would LOVE to have some plushies please! preferably a Fluttershy plushie please?
I will probably get the CMC one because I am a mad twitchy completionest.
Also my customized brushable ones look pretty decent, the cutie mark crusaders you say hasbro? Challenge accepted.
(The molded ones still look the best, I was really hoping for the rest of the characters.)
Now we can recreate that wonderful moment when Rarity acted like a complete jackass and nearly got herself and three of the Wonderbolts killed.
Also, good luck getting Sweetie Belle's hair to be show accurate.
And I still wonder why the CMC can't be referred to as the Cutie Mark Crusaders on the package. Unless... Can it be that they're afraid of offending someone by using the word Crusaders?
Honestly, I would like to see Hasbro just offer a collectables license for the show to some other company. It pained me to go into Hallmark over the holidays and see so many cartoons and properties with holiday themed ornaments, snow globes, figurines, plushies, bookends, etc.
I get that they don't want to cater their successful toy lines to older fans... Keep them mutated, pink and brush-able, that's fine. But give me a snowglobe with show-accurate characters that plays "Winter Wrap-up", or some statues depicting scenes from the show, or especially those 1980's era Hallmark store "Smurfs" hard plastic collectable figures (they made every kind of Smurf imaginable, all with unique molds/poses/accessories... not "blind bag" repaints. If they could do an unknown "painter smurf" with a beret, easel, paintbrush and palette, then why wouldn't they be able to do an Octavia with Cello for a pony collection, or any other background pony?)
Surely it benefits them to at least test the waters with some kind of collectable for older fans, and I know there must be some companies that would love to have the license.
Just bought the CMC + Cheerilee set a couple of days ago. It's great!
Where am I? Why can't I have one? Hold on let me rephrase that before I get a pink one too, why can't I have an accurate model of myself?
I have a Sweetie, but I MUST get that CMC+Cheerilee!!
Sweet CMC set! Although I already have a Cheerlie... Maybe I customize one into 80's Cheerlie. Thinking about it.
i like trains...
no but in all seriousness i want that train set didn't see it last time i went to target tho hmm will have to look harder
Old news, I got the CMC set a week ago. Me and my friends went to target last week and bought the set, we split up the set, I got Sweetie, my friend Rick got Applebloom and my other friend Jerry got Scootaloo and Cheerilee.
Rick also bought the Twilight, Princess Celestia and Spike set for himself (he plans to give Spike to his fiance.
In fact I went to different target on Monday and I saw the toys there as well.
I've been thinking about how you have been pretty slow with this.
they sell all the mane 6 molded ponies at toys'r'us. it is the collectible ponies set.
@RushingRoulette hey, at least you guys get blindbags, right?
I saw the Butterflies ponies, the CMC and Castle set and the Friendship train in a store called "Palacio de Hierro" here in Mexico, so, if any Mexican brony is interested on one of these toys, you can found it here
my target isnt carrying ANY of these or any pony for that matter all my pony buying is at K-mart and Walmart and Toys-r-us walmart had the train before xmas almost got it for Christmas. but needed twilight more.
I simply MUST have the CMC toys. I wonder when they will be available in Europe.
HASBRO
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)
Y U NO MAKE GOOD TOYS
I've seen them but I don't like the ones with real hair.
I picked up the CMC & Cheerilee at a Target in Federal Way, Washington — they had the train too.
I'm only interested in the school set. The summerwing ripoffs look weird. And Pinkie wouldn't be driving a train. She'd be the one robbing it.
@MasterContinuum
They're talking about the set with 3"-tall Twilight, AJ, and Pinkie Pie, a 5" tall pink Celestia, and a Spike. All of them have molded hair (minus Spike of course).
Hmmm...I got a Target gift card as a gift. I think I may buy a little something "for my kid"...
Pony School Pals re-release set with names right this time, yay!
Yay this is the week I'm going to Buffalo to raid Target too! I want the CMC! Although I finally saw the Applebloom/Sweetie set at Toys R Us here in Canada....
Well, Celestia is still pink, but it doesn't look as bad as before. Eh, despite her actually having the proper chest jewelry and Twilight coming with her Big-Crown-Thingy, doesn't quite look worth it. CMC set however... yay!
Yay this is the week I'm going to Buffalo to raid Target too! I want the CMC! Although I finally saw the Applebloom/Sweetie set at Toys R Us here in Canada....
Already found all these. I bought the School Pals set and redid the hair on them all. I got the castle friends for the Spike and Celestia. They're all very good.
Well, the North Kansas City Target does not have these in yet. I had to go there anyway, so I figured I might as well check.
Damn that CMC set...why do Applebloom and Cheerilee have to have that damn raised leg? Sure, easy enough to get a normal Cheerilee...but I've yet to see and Applebloom.
Wait, why does Rainbow Dash have butterfly wings?
Must not go to Target and spend all money on ponies...
Wish the Target stores in Australia carry new stock
Maybe it's time to go on a road trip trough Sweden in search for pony merchandise =/
@Harwick
I'd like to see them do some market research into this area. I would probably spend $100 or so on a large, awesomely posed, show-accurate, super high quality Celestia or Rainbow Dash.
Of course that might be a bit steep.
uhhh none of these are new D: ;;;;
I was at a local Target yesterday (Capitol/McKee in San Jose). They seemed to have rereleased a number of individual "regular" sized pony figures (with the little pet), but packaged with a mini-DVD. As far as I could tell they were all the SAME episode, Ticket Master.
I saw the "Glimmer Wings Rarity" at a Tampa Bay area Wal-Mart yesterday.
So after my husband and I saw this post, we went out to our local Target here in Tennessee and we had no luck finding the CMC & Cheerilee set. We did, however, come home with a really comfy & soft Twilight Sparkle/Celestia blanket, and they also had the winged ponies. We also checked 2 of our 5 Walmarts & the Toys R Us. No dice =( Another pony board had several other posters from TN, and they were having trouble finding the CMC/Cheerilee set too. So just a heads up for TN residents - might have trouble tracking down that set.
The winged ponies are a pass for me, might pick up Rarity if I ever find her in the UK...just cause of episode 16 Sonic Rainboom. :D
but I really would like the CMC and Cheerilee set...stupid UK not getting ponies. ;-;
Hasbro fails to capture the look of the characters on the show once again. These are just creeepy and so 3.5 gen-ish. To get the ponies right, they should start hiring the fans who actually work hard on their dolls and figuresto make the characters look good.
I love the toys...just style their manes. they look really good after! :)
@Pyrobug
I had been to Target just a few days ago. I bought a ton of the Canterlot playsets for 50% off. I finally have a second Shine Brite Princess Luna, and I DIDN'T have to pay $42 for her (that was really the old price, no joke). $20 was much better, and a fair price, for including a Shine Brite, regular, and a gem carriage in one box. I picked up a third Rarity's Carousel Boutique (spare to just screw around with, maybe take apart or mod). I already have one, and gave one (minus the tiny blind bag sized ponies) for Christmas. I got it half price then too. I also have stated picking up spares of all the Fashion Style Ponies. I'm hoping the Princess double pack is moved to clearance so I can get it cheaper, as it's $30 still. All I'm missing is a pair of Twilight Sparkles, and a spare Applejack (I have one so far). I hope to mod the spares with molded hair. I've considered modding a trio of the talking Celestia toys. I think their scale may be more correct compared to the Fashion Pony line, and the Fashion Style Princesses remind me of filly alicorns.
I'm glad to see them playing so heavily on the clearances, as that means they are making room for the new toys. They did this before right before introducing the Canterlot Exclusives, so I have high hopes.
As for the Glimmerwing ponies and the Train set, I bought these in early December from a nearby Walmart (south central MN). Fashion Style Rainbow Dash...
...
RAINBOW DASH ALWAYS DRESSES IN STYLE!!!
...
OK... I said it...
Dash was COMMON around here, but Fashion Style Fluttershy was impossible to find. I ended up ordering her off Kmart's online store... only to see her 2 days later in the Wallgreens 4 blocks from my house (facehoof). I bought her and a Pinkie, and decided at that moment that I wanted spares of the F.S. line for molded mane moding.
The Train... It's short, but you can add at least 2 known train cars to it. Sweetie Belle's Ice Cream Car, and Fluttershy's Nursery Car. I got the ice cream car online, but everywhere I looked, Fluttershy's car was sold out. I guess everypony felt that they needed it BAD if Pinkie was the engineer running the train! LOL!
One final note... My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic exists because it's toys are popular enough to support the continuation of the show. If the toys did not sell, the show would not be continued. If you want to support this show, do so in what ever way possible. Buy a toy, give it as a gift to a little girl in the family if you have no desire to keep it for yourself... Just support the show. I for one hate the brushable hair, but for every person who whined that the 5 piece gift set had a pink Celestia, that was one more giftpack that sat on the shelves. We have the neighsayers who endlessly whined about pink Celestia to point a hoof at for Hasbro saying there were not good sales... Now we have lost the LAST molded hair pony product that was still in the US (the Princess Celestia + Princess Luna double set appears in line to be replaced with this new set that has a brushable mane Celestia). She's still pink... No one who cared enough bought the product, and if you didn't buy the product, to both retailer and toy company, if you don't buy, you don't have a voice with them.
I choose to support Hasbro, even if they are not perfect. I have hopes they may learn to listen. The last thing we shoudl do is run them out of town like Trixie or Gilda... They'll take FiM with them, and nopony wants that!
And now, with my Scootaloo in hand, I lol at everybody who spent upwards of $20 on one single one that didn't even come with the rest of the Crusaders.
@Jordan
The bodies and head shapes of the G4 toys ARE surprisingly accurate to the 2D flash vectors. Some people just have trouble translating 2D to 3D. It's those awful brushable manes that don't work, and the fact that a certain pony keeps being made pink, or another always not having a hat (or a hat of the correct color) and minor details like that.
This isn't McFarlanne toys dude... And if they were as perfect as you wish they were, they'd probably cost $30-100 each. Try to step back into reality.
The PRIMARY issue I see in people's skewed perception of the toys is the manes. Brushable hair has a VERY hard time looking like the styled manes on the show. It also leaves most of the ponies looking very nearly bald, but with a mohawk of hair. This IS how ponies are, and it's even how ponies on the show are. Rarity and Pinkie Pie are the BEST examples of this on the show. look at the point where their forelock meets their forehead. It's a narrow point. The problem is that unlike real, full scale hair, the toy hair does not take this styling well, and you end up with the hair sticking up and you get an exposed, mohawk with baldness on either side. It's the baldness that throws people's brains for a loop. You expect a hair style, and when it's not there, your brain reacts the same way it would react if you went to work, or to school, and saw that everyone had buzzed themselves mohawks.
You would /)O_O(\
I've still heard some people compare the G4 toys with the old G3.5 stuff. Wait... REALLY??? I call SHENANIGANS on that! God, I actually read that somewhere just today. It made me cringe. At this point, I truly believe that it's a pathological bias in some people's minds. I get frustration over Pinklestia. I get the frustration with AJ being perpetually hatless. I get that the hair is insane. No one bought molded hair ponies, cause they were to busy whining like Rarity in a mineshaft about Pinklestia, that Hasbro just came to the conclusion that molded hair is not wanted.
Hasbro is NOT BRIGHT. They DON'T always get us. They have to be guided, hand in hand, dollar changing hands in the process, to even have a chance to understand anything.
Shoot... I'm downright flabbergasted that people are STILL using the "it's not show accurate argument"... Try the "I'm not MANLY enough to walk into the pink aisle" argument! LOLOLOL!!!
I routinely browse there man! I bet I've been in the pink aisle over 50 unique times in various stores in the past year since becoming a brony. I used to go to Target and Walmart 2 or 3 times a week, and every day when rumors of new product came out.
I'll go there again tomorrow, to see if all the clearances have made way for new product.
Also...
By the way, that Train is only $19.99, and considering it's contents, and the construction quality of the Train engine... I was impressed. THe train freewheels until the electric motor is engaged, then immediately locks the drive into the motor. THe turns on the track are absurdly tight, and I wish they had expanded track sets, but it functions well.
@Harwick
That's a bummer you didn't find anything...
I have my Pinkie Pie Christmas ornament, with a molded hair Pinkie holding a snowflake up in front of her face.
I'll admit, I'd like to see more. Hearth's Warming Eve versions of the mane 6 would be ROCKIN' AWESOME!!! For now, I'm happy they have released at least one Christmas ornament.
@Scootaloo
THAT's where I saw the Gen 3.5 comment. It was in the reply window, but I'd not reloaded my main window...
Hmmm... Nah!
Have you EVEN SEEN G3.5? ABOMINATIONS!!!
G4 toys are much closer tot eh 2D vectors than most people are willing to admit, and 90% of the uncanny valley factor comes from that stupid brushable hair making the ponies look like they have mohawks.
Have you SEEN the STANDARD 3 inch toy line modded with molded hair before. It's BEAUTIFUL!
If only Hasbro would learn...
Sadly, everypony whined about Pink Celestia instead of buying the molded mane 5 piece gift set, so Hasbro interpreted the low sales of the 5 piece gift set as "people don't like molded manes". Now we have no molded manes anymore, unless there are a few lingering old sets around of either the 5 piece or the Royal Pony Sisters set.
LOL...
Looking above at all that I typed...
I wish my "word wall" was in Skyrim.
I'd learn all the shouts from just a single location! LOL!!!
@Shiranai
Looking into it, Sideshow Collectibles makes statues and toys based on Hasbro properties like Transformers and GI Joe, so the giant toy company is apparently willing to let other companies make such products. Hopefully someone will snatch up a license to do some higher-end Pony stuff.
Of course, I wouldn't be surprised if any initial offerings would be very high priced based on limited runs... a lot of those statues go for $300 and more. But it would at least be a start.
@richfiles
I am jealous, as I probably would have snatched up the Pinkie ornament had I ever seen one in person. I did, however, find the molded hair pony toys in a closeout store for under $10, which was nice, so now I actually own some Pony merchandise.
I like ponies and trains. Now they are together sweat need to get me a new train set and the CMC set
I like ponies and trains. Now they are together sweat need to get me a new train set and the CMC set
@Harwick
Toys R Us has carried the Pinkie Ornament, so check there if you are in the US. It was available online for a short time, but online ordering didn't last long. I'm not sure what production numbers were for it, but it was only like $8 I think. Since Christmas has passed, it'll likely be on clearance, if you ever do see it again, but it also means it's not likely to see any new pieces either. They are already SELLING on ebay for $30-40 (actually being sold at those prices, and not just listed). It would seem post Christmas prices on them have actually gone up. Yikes! They were selling for $22-30 before Christmas. I did find an auction with an opening bid of $26.99 with no bids and 2 days left. If you want one, hit it.
I checked. They are not available for shipping from T-R-U, and you can't do a pickup in store either. All you can really do with them is call or visit a store and check if the item is in stock on site. Chances at this point are rather slim, sadly.
Most reviews for it describe it as the most show accurate version of Pinkie Pie to date... and I'd agree. Top it off with the snowflake, the adorable pose, and the blue scarf...
...
HHHNNNGGGGGGGGGG
...
...
...
So true...
I'm definitely picking up that CMC set. Not sure about the Celesria/Twilight?Spike one, though. On the one hand, Celestia looks much improved over her previous mold. On the other, I already have two Celestias, two Spikes and three Twilight Sparkles. Do I really need more, even if Twi comes with her Big Crown Thingy?
AAAAAARGH! Tell me what to do, pony fandom!
I hope the winged ponies, Celestia and the train will be available in my country.
Great another Celestia, so I HAVE to buy it. Gosh darn. One day I will have enough Celestias to take over. Maybe.
My daughter's birthday is coming up, I know she wants the Rarity playset, but I bet she'd want the Rarity with wings, the CMC set and the train if she knew they existed. :D
officially sucks that hasbro makes such lame toys.
I got to set these up at work, and I was overjoyed all night. It doesn't get much better than ponies at work (Well, maybe working on the actual MLP:FIM show)!
Not getting these because: They are not accurate, I really don't like their manes, and the new Sweetie Belle is just... Wrong. What's the deal, HasBro?
Remember when pink was considered a masculine color, because pink was associated with red and therefore associated with blood and therefore associated with violence? And purple was mostly associated with luxury and royalty?
Neither do I.
I miss those days, anyways.
FUUUUUUUUUUUU...
I *just* bought the Apple Bloom/Sweetie Bell set and the Cherilee school set for MiniDork for Christmas. So, of course, they release a set with Scootaloo.
I NEED CMC AND CHEERILEE SET OMG
Princess Celestia toy difference comparisons:!!!
A MOTORIZED TRAIN?! ME GUSTA!
I just posted a picture of my Target receipt for my purchase of the "Royal Castle Friends" and the "Pony School Pals & Cheerilee" play sets I bought.
The receipt that Target printed made me laugh so hard. Both the Royal Castle Friends and the Pony School Pals & Cheerilee sets were listed under the same descriptor in their system. This is what the receipt printed:
TOYS-SPORTING GOODS
086020285
FOREVER
2 @ $14.99 ea
T $29.98
Yes...
Target has the new My Little Pony play sets entered into their system as "FOREVER". No other descriptor other than item SKU number and department. Not MLP, not MYLITTLEPONY, not PONY, not PLAYSET, not PONYPLAYSET...
Just
FOREVER!!!
Hasbro's website said my local toys r us might have the cmc set, i might get it, but i really only want it for applebloom since she is my favorite of the cmc
but its only 15 us dollars so it shouldnt be to bad. (especially since the online prices for applebloom by herself are more the 15 dollars on average which is ridiculous)
my target wouldnt have it since they dont stock to many toys because they do not have alot of space for toys. oh well lol |
The Asiren shot forward to meet Lahar, thrusting forward with his sword in his right hand, He hadn't left himself entirely open leaving the sword his left hand behind the trust to block any attacks, Lahar had taught himself this style of sword fighting it was about ones own agility and matching it with the lethality of a blade, behind all that force, all that muscle Giaus was slow and putting all his energy into one attack was foolish. Lahar dodged the thrust and rolled around the Asiren's open right side and attacked, sending one sword up towards his opponents neck and one to the waist.
Lahar dodged around the side and went behind Gaius, thrusting his swords up into his waist and neck. Gaius anticipated this and thought to follow by example, diving forwards and rolling out of harms away, turning back to face Lahar. Gaius stood strong and awaited the Vaan's attack.
Gaius dived forwards avoiding his attack, the Asiren was quicker then expected, but he would still be slowed by his hulking size. He turned around to face Lahar after his roll, waiting for him to attack. Instead Lahar again adopted a defensive stance, he would learn what Gaius could do first, then take the offensive.
Gaius turned, waiting for the Vaan to strike. He didn't. In fact he merely waited for Gaius to attack. Lahar fought differently to Benjen and Dran, where as they eventually attacked first Lahar just stood there, waiting. Gaius figured he should just strike first, although he was sure Lahar had some form of counter attack in mind. Realising the height difference between himself and Lahar he stood low, just enough so his head was lower then Lahar's and he spread his legs to stay grounded. He attempted, just for now, to bat the swords away from him to break his defences. This would most likely be a more than difficult task as Gaius was fighting in Lahar's home territory, in terms of weaponry.
Rowan watched Belkin charge forward and take on the rebels like a mad man, urging the group to press on. Every bit of him wanted to help Belkin hold of the lunatics in animal masks, but Rowan knew that the mission was to get Antonius back to the ludus safely. Marrick would be none too pleased with injuries or delays. The sooner they got back in one piece, the better. If that meant leaving Belkin to fend for himself, Rowan resigned himself to doing just that. Besides, as far as he could tell, Belkin would be more than capable of holding his own. No doubt the Pingla preferred fighting in this fashion, perhaps he even enjoyed it.
Rowan kept his sword at the ready and ran out into the street, making his way to the alley. He moved and ducked to avoid the raining fire, and even had to engage a rebel head on to make it across the alley. The poor fellow charged Rowan with a spear, and Rowan responded by stepping to the side, allowing the spear wielding rebel to over charge him before slicing down his spine with his sword. Rowan spat on the body and continued forward, meeting up with the rest of the group.
Belkin had killed another mask wearer, his 10th or so, when he looked back at the alleyways. He saw the last of the group enter the alleyway, just as the rest of the mask wearers had started to converge on the lone Pingla. As much as the prospect to battle those foes tempted the Young man, he knew to keep with the group and save his journey to the Judge for later.
He looked around for another one of the mask wearers who had yet to throw their Fire bomb. He saw one hanging from the belt of a mask wearer who was on the opposite area from the alleyway, and still behind two other guys. Belkin ran towards him, throwing his sword towards one of the people in his way. The sword struck the man's chest, and as Belkin neared the other man, he pulled it out before blocking the other mans attack and stabbing him in the neck. The man with the firebomb saw that there was nothing between them now, and tried to really the firebomb to throw at Belkin. Belkin rushed the man, stunning him with his Shield before slicing off his hand so he couldn't retort in time to stop the lethal blow to his brain.
Belkin removed the shield from his arm, mask still attached to the underside, and threw it over the crowd of opponents into the waiting alleyway, picking up the still intact fire bomb with his now free hand. Belkin rushed through the crowd, a possible suicide tactic for many others, but for Belkin and the Pingla, something they were trained for. He emerged from the other side, covered in scars and his sword now nothing short of drenched with crimson blood. He entered the alleyway, throwing the firebomb into the entrance behind him, closing off any of the Masked men who dared try to follow.
He picked up his shield from the ground and reattached it to his arm before turning back to his colleges. He fell into the wall next to him, weak from fatigue, but steadied himself and slowly got back up. "Well, less gawping as to my survival, and more getting back home so we can ask about these less-than-capable warriors" Belkin replied, eager to just get home and rest.
Gaius briefly waited for Lahar to strike first, he lost his patience quickly though, charging at Lahar after a few moments. This time however Gaius ducked down during the charge and spread is legs outwards making it difficult for Lahar to uproot the large man with the sweep kick he had been planning to use to end the juggernauts charge. Instead he parried Gaius' attack, sending a jab to the abdomen to try and wind the hulking man and continue his counter attack.
Lahar parried the Asiren's attack and jabbed him in the abdomen. Asiren are taught from birth however to keep the body in a strong state, ready to take any and all punishments as Gaius's scars could show. He winced back and feigned pain, allowing the Vaan to continue his counter attack, waiting for the right opportunity.
It was with some effort that the party of warriors made their way back to the ludus. The residential districts of Ptolemy were all but deserted. The inhabitants were apparently either in the city centre hoping to take advantage of the chaos or barricaded in their homes waiting for it all to blow over. The small number of guards they had with them were rattled beyond reason from what they had seen and their captain knew it. He kept a tight watch on their reinforcements. His men may have been better equipped but their numbers had been diminished in the conflict and they were in no condition to fight.
When they did finally step through the gates of the ludus and into the sparring yard every gladiator there was slack jawed at the sight of the beaten and bloody party. The Executor's eyes never left them as he silently waved one of the slaves on their way. Benjen moved to bring them some water. "You should get to the medica, the lot of you." he tutted.
A few minutes later Marrick came storming out of his manor, his robes aflutter. into laughter at his own joke. "Owner of the Cauldron champion, if my father could see me now! Unchain this man." His slaves carried out his will as quickly as he could. "Captain I shall compensate you for your men, wait for me inside. As for the rest of you." The remains of the day is yours to do with as you please. Rest, see to your wounds, drink, eat, visit the women gladiators if you like I'm sure they'd enjoy the change of routine. Gods know I'm sure you all could. When was the last time you even saw a woman, Vokrash?" And with that Marrick was gone. A being of complete self satisfaction.
The gladiators were left in a state of silence for a time. It was finally broken by the Executor. He spoke to the wounded party more than anyone else. "You should sort yourselves out out. Then take advantage of the offers. If things are really that bad out there then there will be.
As Belkin finally made it back to the Ludus, he looked at the state of himself compared to the others. Everyone had scorched shields, a few cuts on their bodies, swords with blood on them and a feeling of tiredness. Belkin.....his skin was so covered in blood, you could have mistaken him for wearing a red tunic from afar, his sword looked less like steel and more like a weapon crafted from pure crimson, his shield was as black as the void into Zuul, and were it not for his will, he would have collapsed ages ago.
It had been a LONG time since he fought in crowds that think, not since the raid of Ga'rterren.
He didn't listen to what was going on, he was still trying to remain awake. There was a coin, a prize, a cauldron....or a col'tran...What would he be doing with a chieftains wife, he couldn't remember. The only word that he heard was "Wounds" from the Pig, and when he left and the executioner had said his piece, Belkin headed off for the Medicus.
He took three steps before dropping his sword and collapsing, letting the Judge take him to Plains.
As Marrick left, Vokrash decided it would be best to head over to the medica, as his age was beginning to get the better of him and he knew that some wounds that he would have been able to take in stride during his youth could slow him down considerably in his old age. As he started to head over to the medica he saw Belkin drop to the ground like a ragdoll. He sighed and lifted Belkin over his shoulder and started walking off to the medica. "Idiot! He'll die if he pulls something like that again just from the blood loss. Rowan, get your arse over to the medica. If you don't get it looked at, the shoulder won't heal right."
When Vokrash reached the medica, he plopped Belkin down next to him. "Make sure you clean him up well, when you're done with him, patch me up." Vokrash sat down on the ground and awaited treatment. 'Now that I think of it, I was to young to be a suitor in my village.'
Gaius awaited Lahar's attack. The Asiren made a stupid move however as it was obvious he wasn't injured. Before the Vaan could teach him this lesson though the party of gladiators and guards returned. There were less than before, though the gladiators all remained, in fact they gained one more in the appearance of a bloodied Antonius. But he was not the worse looking one, they were all bruised and battered but that "honour" would go to Belkin, who looked like he just swam in an ocean of blood. He was panting and out of breath, then again they all were. The only one who looked to stand upright was Vokrash. Marrick came out in a rush and exchanged a few words with the executor, none of them pleasant. It seemed even the free men in Marrick's employ were rebelled against him. This was a possible for Gaius's rebellion, but not a very likely one. Antonius was being praised, something which Gaius paid little attention too, until he heard the word "Champion". Gaius was certainly confused as he was sure Vorgis was the champion, yet here they were trying to find a new champion, and also proclaiming Antonius as champion. It made no sense.
Such things however were the least of his worries as Belkin slumped down and fell to the ground. Gaius was about to rush over and take him to the Medicus but Vokrash beat him to the punch, seemingly less worried than Gaius. He turned to Lahar and said "Please excuse me, I need to check something." With that he paced to the Medicus seeing Belkin unconscious and Vokrash sitting on the floor, both men looking like hell.
"What happened? Is he okay? And what was all of that about Antonius being a champion? What happened to the choice between me, him and Rowan?" Gaius felt the sudden need to speak in his home language in his confused and agitated, worried state.
"What happened? Is he okay? And what was all of that about Antonius being a champion? What happened to the choice between me, him and Rowan?" The questions were rattled off so quickly Vokrash could barely realize somebody was talking to him until they had finished. He turned around and saw a concerned Gaius. "This one here decided it would be a good idea to take around a dozen men alone and Rowan had a sword meant for Antonius thrown into his shoulder. If he has any sense he'll get it treated before it heals incorrectly."
He looked up at Gaius to meet him in the eye and quickly realized that Gaius might think that he would need to do something extremely foolish to prove his worth as well. And Vokrash was in no way ready to let all three hopefuls be injured in some way or another. " paused for a bit so his words could sink in for Gaius. After a few moments of silence Vokrash spoke up again. "Antonius is now the champion of the Cauldron. A place where people bet on fights that aren't spectacular enough for the sands. And what of you? What have you done while we were out having fun?"
The Rebels where everywhere, Belkin kept showing why the Pingla were feared. The way towards the ludus was hell, but they manged somehow. They eventually managed to make their way to the ludus. The other gladiators jaws dropped as they spotted them. Belkin was completely covered in blood, and they didn't look much better either. He wondered how Marrick would react to what had happened, he looked at his wounds to see that they had all closed. A few minutes passed then Marrick stormed out of his villa.
ed into laughter at his own joke. Laugh all you want Marrick, enjoy this moment. But don't think I will forget, that I was sent there to die. "Owner of the Cauldron champion, if my father could see me now! Unchain this man." His slaves carried out his will as quickly as he could.
The executor spoke to the wounded party members."You should sort yourselves out. Then take advantage of the offers. If things are really that bad out there then there will.
Belkin collapsed and he was helped by other gladiators. Antonius felt like he should do something, but then again they would find some way to twist it to make him look bad. Antonius had been sent to die since he didn't want to place nice with the other gladiators. But in securing a place as champion he knew he would be safe. Sure it was the lowest arena of them all, more a slaughter house then an arena but it was a start. Antonius had no choice but to life. He had to see his wife and son again, and for that purpose he would outshine them all. Antonius walked over to the doctor his wounds had closed, but they would surly be infected if they were left unattended. The only person he felt like talking to was Lahar, he wondered where he was.
As Antonius got closer to the doctor he heard 2 people talking. He paused and tried to make sense out of it. "Antonius is...champion.......people..fights...you?...have you done..?" Antonius had wanted to learn more languages, but at least he knew a few words in 2 languages. He sighed and then entered the doctor's office. He spotted Belkin, he then turned to the doctor. "Is he going to be alright?" Antonius sounded worried.
Rowan scowled inwardly at the praise Antonius received, though he did not let on to his dissatisfaction. His arm ached, and he took Vokrash's words to heart, heading straight for the medica without delay. Burning shut the wound had staunched much of the blood loss, but it was a crude and ineffective method of dealing with his wound in the long run. He took a seat on a small wooden stool and waited for one of the doctors to address his wound. Before the man could start to treat him, Rowan grabbed him by the arm and shook him lightly to gain his attention. The doctor froze, perhaps frightened by the Asieren's bluntness, but stopped and gave a gentle look regardless.
"Some drink to dull the pain, please." Rowan said before releasing the man. The doctor nodded and went off to a small table where he poured a concoction into a cup, and hurriedly returned. The doctor held the cup just over Rowan's mouth and tilted his head backwards, pouring the substance into his mouth carefully. It wasn't wine, but the stuff was strong enough to ease some of the pain in his arm. The doctor went on treating the wound, rubbing a salve on the burns and wrapping it in cloth. When he was satisfied, the doctor gave Rowan leave to go about his business. In the mood he was in, all Rowan wanted to do was sleep. Today had been a hellish failure.
"This one here decided it would be a good idea to take around a dozen men alone and Rowan had a sword meant for Antonius thrown into his shoulder. If he has any sense he'll get it treated before it heals incorrectly." Gaius scoffed at that, there was no point in needlessly endanger oneself. Then again, he had certainly done such things to himself in the past, in fact he had gone the extra mile and even considered suicide.
spoke to Gaius like a teacher to a student, ready to discipline but also eager to encourage. It was rather odd though, considering as far as Gaius could tell he was at least five or six years older than Rowan and Belkin, though it was hard to tell considering their builds. "Antonius is now the champion of the Cauldron. A place where people bet on fights that aren't spectacular enough for the sands." Gaius was rather relieved, though soon after Vokrash said that Antonius entered and spoke to the doctor, he sounded worried about Belkin. Gaius was just glad he couldn't understand him and Vokrash.
"And what of you? What have you done while we were out having fun?" Gaius looked down, trying to avoid eye contact, until he realised he was acting like a child-avoiding the gaze of the older warrior. He cocked his gaze back and said to Vokrash "I was trying to hone my skills in weaponry other than the battleaxe. Just now I have been training with dual swords with Vorgis and Lahar. I sparred with Benjen, at first with the battleaxe. The session got a little intense but I defeated him. He is a good man, and treated me with respect. Dran however..." Gaius paused, for some reason, and he couldn't quite put his finger on it, Vokrash reminded him of his grandfather. It made Gaius feel awkward but none the less he carried on, not wanting to disrespect Vokrash with silence. "Well I sparred with Dran trying out a new technique of spear and dagger, but when I got the upper hand he got very angry. Furious would probably be the best word. I put him down but I'm afraid I may have made an enemy within these walls."
"Well I sparred with Dran trying out a new technique of spear and dagger, but when I got the upper hand he got very angry. Furious Would be the best word. I put him down but I"m afraid I may have made an enemy within these walls." Vokrash let out a harsh laugh. Do not worry about him boy. Dran always likes to shoot off his mouth when he loses to someone he deems inferior. It is good that you are learning new weapons; it takes a long time for you to save up for your own pair. Mine took almost ten years!" Vokrash began laughing again but started taking a more serious tone after a few seconds.
"The more weapons and fighting styles you know the better. It allows you to anticipate what another will do and you can react before they do anything at all. For example, you can stab or slash with a sword, but you can only slash with an axe. If you know how to wield a sword you can anticipate their actions with the positioning of their body. For example, if somebody with a sword pulls his arm back into his body you know that he will be making a stabbing motion and depending on where his elbow is pointing you can anticipate where the stab will be. The same thing with an axe, if you pull your axe back and up then the only swing you can make would be an over the head if you don't want to lose any momentum. The more styles you know, the easier it will be to counter them."
Lahar was about teach Gaius about the folly of feigning injury when he clearly wasn't injured, but as he was about to do so he saw that the gladiators that were missing had returned, beaten and bloodies by the looks of things, none more so then Belkin. The ones that were most injured were whisked away to the medicus. Guius and Vokrash were busy chattering away in their tongue, making Lahar feel even more lonely in the ludus, the only gladiator he could've spoken to in Vaanic was dead, leaving only Artus and Lyria, he doubted would want to meet him again after what had happened earlier today.
He wandered over to Antonius who was also alone in the ludus.
"What happened?" He inquired.
Antonius had been listening in on Vokrash and Gaius, but, as they began to speak faster, he couldn't follow them anymore. Antonius headed outside and was happy to see the sun again. When he had been sent to the Cauldron, he was sure he would never see sunlight again. But he had managed to survive the Cauldron, just like he would survive here. He knew his son and wife were waiting for him outside, and he couldn't let them down. Someone talked out to Antonius, he looked up to see Lahar. "What happened?" Lahar asked.
Antonius was happy to see Lahar, he was the only gladiator he trusted. "Well quite a few things happen, Lahar, but it all started a few hours ago when I was sent to the Cauldron. I don't know if you have heard of the Cauldron, but it is the lowest arena there is. To be honest, it is more like a slaughter pit where people bet on the fighters. I think I was sent there with the purpose of either dying, or make a bit of gold for this ludus."
Antonius looked around, but saw no one listening in. He then continued his story, "Anyway when I arrived there I had to fight 2 other fighters, and got a random weapon to fight with. But what they hadn't expected was, that I killed both gladiators and remained almost unharmed. After that they sent another round, and then another. But no matter how many men they sent into the ring, I killed them all." Antonius sighed as he remembered the young fighter he had to kill.
"Then they sent the champion into the ring. He was fully armored and wearing beautiful armor. I, on the other hand, was wearing no protection and was using the weapons of the dead gladiators. The fight between me and the champion was fierce, but he made an mistake. He lifted his helmet, and didn't put it back down. I used that weak point to attack him, and after stabbing, cutting and hitting him time and time again he finally died." Antonius smiled.
"I was then made the new arena champion of the Cauldron. The crowd went wild, and I was escorted outside. A group of people began to follow me and cheer. But then the rebels attacked, and a fight between them and the guards erupted. The escort and I were caught in the middle but then suddenly Vokrash, Belkin and Rowman showed up. We fought our way through the street towards here, they fought ferociously." Antonius stopped a second to think about his own performance.
He then continued with "I wish I could say the same for myself, but my previous fights had tired me. Then someone threw a sword at me, and Rowan blocked it by jumping in front of it. The fighting was long, but eventually we managed to make our way here. So that is what happened just now. I was sent to die, and returned as a champion," Antonius grinned. He had to admit he was rather proud of that. "So what have you been doing Lahar?" Antonius asked in Vaanic. His accent was horrible, but it was clearly Vaanic.
Gaius listened to Vokrash, he laughed off the Dran incident and commending Gaius for learning new skills, making some comments about various weaponry. He remembered Vokrash sounding quite displeased or at least annoyed at Belkin and Rowan, prompting Gaius to ask "Off topic about weaponry, though I will take your comments on board, of the three of us who are you more likely to choose for the Eferus armor?"
"Off topic about weaponry, though I will take your comments on board, of the three of us who are you more likely to choose for the Eferus armor?" Vokrash was put off by the sudden question. And he answered with a certain agitation in his voice. "As I have said before, I will be judging you based on your performances in the sands. None of you are more likely to get the Efferus Armor as of right now."
Vokrash seemed annoyed by the sudden question, a bad call on Gaius's part. "Of course, I was just pondering the thought. Back on topic, which combination of weaponry is the most favourite for the crowd on the sands?"
The rest of the week passed without incident. Gladiators trained and slaves toiled away at their menial tasks. Marrick made sure to try and keep any talk of the riot out of his ludus but still there were those rumours that slipped through the cracks. For his own part the slave trader made sure to find out as much as he could about the matter. There was no doubt now that it was no mere riot. The chaos had been caused by rebels and dissidents in a terrorist attack. Imperial politics had always been a tangled and convoluted affair, one which had a habit of causing bout of violence in the populace but this group was different, they were organised, funded.
There were plenty of stories going around about what had happened during the fighting, but one that stood out above the rest was the story of the gladiators who heroically stormed into the fray to save the life of an imperial child who had been stranded in the middle of all the violence..... Marrick may have had some of his people alter some of the less appealing aspects of the story. Soon every common worker was talking about the band of noble gladiators. Their names were heard at every street corner.
Unfortunately Marrick had to deal with an irate senator Balus ranting on about how one of his gladiators had offended his honour and how he demanded justice. For his part Marrick just smiled and nodded. The military were putting on a week of lavish games to try and sate the masses and distract them from the political unrest, just as the Executor had predicted.
The Den of Hearts had suffered damage during the riots so every other arena in the capital was pulling double duty. One establishment that grabbed the moment to steal some prestige was "The blood grounds." A rough, medium sized arena set out like a square wrestling ring. The walls of the ring were set up like prison bars so other gladiators could watch while they were waiting for their match and it was no uncommon for some to reach through and interfere if the combatants got too close to the edge.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The crowd had had a good morning and the grounds had been given a generous watering of blood. Up in the higher seats Marrick watched on, with Senator Balus in the seat next to him.
"This should be amusing Marrick. My man's recently been given a pair of new toys to fight with. Expensive things, fine pieces of work from the northern deserts."
Marrick did his best to keep up a mask of mutual amusement. Lahar was standing out on the sands, looking like a little black ant in the sea of red and brown. He hadn't even gotten a decent introduction from the games master. It was pity, Lahar could have made a name for himself given time. But there was no time left for his lonely Vaan, this fight was a fixed as they came. Lahar only had light leather coving his arms and thighs, along with the black coat and clothes he'd brought back from Kedrin's estate. Though why he was wearing them he had no idea.
Out of the depths of the arena came his opponent. A giant of a man, with body twisted with a tapestry of scars and a fierce, cruel looking face. "Now, introducing the champion of House Balus!" Roared the games master. "The tamer of the sands, bane of the north! Bringer of pain, master of tears!" The crowd whooped and cheered and Balus beamed with pride, mouthing along with the list of titles.
"Slayer of Vaan! His enemies know him as Memnarch Baal! You and I call him.... The will! Of! Death!" And the crowd went wild.
This vicious looking gladiator was well equipped. His arms and legs were armoured and a bizarre pauldron covered the right side of his chest. His face was left bare as he roared back at his approving public. He held a sword in each hand and raised them for all to see. Balus was right they were interesting pieces of craftsmanship.
They were black as night. With hooks at their tips.
Gaius spent the rest of the week practising with various weaponry. His biggest weakness was his speed, and while he was somewhat faster than most Asiren it would not be enough to evade someone as quick as Lahar or Antonius. He kept his battleaxe at a distance, trying out the dagger and spear combination, along with dual swords and sword and shield, though he was not a big fan of the shield. It surely offered good protection, but his Tank like body was already fulfilling that role well. The day before they were sent to these "Blood Grounds" he spent a few hours brushing up on his skills with the smaller axes like most other Asier warriors, such as Rowan and Vokrash.
The Blood Grounds were extremely different to the last arena he fought in. The fights took place in one large cell. The only part Gaius liked about the concept of an arena was that it didn't seem like a cage, now that was out of the question. Lahar was sent to fight first against a beast of a man, holding up two gracious looking swords. Gaius grabbed a spear and dagger from the weapon rack, thin enough to fit between the bars and stab the ogre facing Lahar if he got too close.
As Gaius waited for the fight to begin, he found Antonius and thought it would be good to ask the former imperial what happened in the city. Gaius wasn't there and had little to no information as to what happened, other than a riot and gladiators supposedly saving a child. "Antonius!" he called to him, "What happened in the city, I never asked you before, but what was this about Rowan, Belkin and Vokrash saving an imperial child?"
Through the rest of the week, Vokrash prepared for yet another battle. The routine was the same as always; practice swords and shields, practice hand to hand, practice blocking techniques, and keeping his body familiar with the workings of an ax. This time they were going to the Blood Grounds, somewhere Vokrash had not been to in some time. The gladiators were walled in and some of the more rowdy ones could "assist" in the match itself by holding one of the fighting gladiators back against the wall. Vokrash put a mental note into his mind to remember and stay away from the walls.
Before his fight began, Vokrash decided it might be a good idea to go around and look for Vorgis. When he could not find him, he decided to head over and try to get close to the walls for the fights until he was called. As he went there he saw Gaius taking a spear and dagger from the weapons rack. He followed him to see where he would go, and saw that Gaius had found Antonius. ""What happened in the city, I never asked you before, but what was this about Rowan, Belkin and Vokrash saving an imperial child?" Vokrash walked up behind Gaius. "A bunch of hogwash that Marrick made to make him look like a good master. I tried to eat it but we couldn't light a damn fire." Vokrash turned his attention to Antonius and nodded towards him. "Never got around to saying it but congratulations for winning the Cauldron." Vokrash then whispered to Gaius "Why do you have those, it is not your turn to fight"
"A bunch of hogwash that Marrick made to make him look like a good master. I tried to eat it but we couldn't light a damn fire." Vokrash answered for Antonius as he came over and congratulated the man on his victory before whispering to Gaius "Why do you have those, it is not your turn to fight."
Gaius replied "Look at Lahar, he has no weapons and faces an ogre. He'll need all the help he can get if that so called "Man" gets close enough to the walls".
"Look at Lahar, he has no weapons and faces an ogre. He'll need all the help he can get if that so called "Man" gets close enough to the walls". Gaius replied very plainly. "I know that, this is a stacked match. The boy is meant to die, put away the weapons." Vokrash looked Gaius in the eye. "Do not make it so obvious eh? There will be quite the backlash if Lahar would survive due to a gladiator outside the walls stabbed the other with a spear." Vokrash turned back to Antonius. "Sorry for interrupting, keep up the good work lad." Vokrash walked off to find a good vantage point to watch the match. If he survives this...
""I know that, this is a stacked match. The boy is meant to die, put away the weapons. Do not make it so obvious eh? There will be quite the backlash if Lahar would survive due to a gladiator outside the walls stabbed the other with a spear." Vokrash didn't seemed concerned whatsoever of Lahar's fate. He wished Antonius well and was off. Frustrated Gaius followed him.
"Then I can at least pass some weapons through the bars for him can't I? I won't allow one of the few good men I know here to be thrown to the slaughter!"
Antonius spent the rest of the week training. But unlike before, when he had trained alone, this week he spend quite a lot of that time training with Lahar. He felt that he could learn a lot about sword fighting from him. The champion fight had left him with multiple smaller wounds but luckily for him they all healed within a week. One of them left a small scar on his back- a token from his battle. Antonius's spirits had been lifted during their week of 'rest'. Practicing with Lahar brought back good memories of the army. Antonius spend nearly all of his time training, he was rarely seen resting. He practiced with any weapon he could get his hands on, mostly axes, swords and spears. He had trained with all of them before, but he felt he needed to train his axe skills the most. He had never really been good with them.
Antonius spent the time before the arena fight practicing with a spear. He hoped he would get to choose his own weapons this time. The arena looked different than the other ones, Antonius recognized it from a fight he had once seen. His father in law had insisted though he had always thought that the fights were barbaric and unnecessary. He wondered if he would be there today, watching him fight, hoping he would die. Lahar was sent to fight first, the man he had to face looked like a real champion. Antonius wished him luck and told him that if he managed to get him close to the cell, he would help him. He then grabbed a spear and a large shield from the weapons rack.
"Antonius!" A voice shouted. He looked up and was surprised to see Gaius. "What happened in the city, I never asked you before, but what was this about Rowan, Belkin and Vokrash saving an imperial child?" Antonius was just about to answer, happy that he had spoken to him, but Vokrash answered first "A bunch of hogwash that Marrick made to make him look like a good master. I tried to eat it but we couldn't light a damn fire." Vokrash then turned to him and nodded. "Never got around to saying it but congratulations for winning the Cauldron." He smiled and replied, "Thank you." He was happy to see that Vokrash was nice to him as usual.
Vokrash and Gaius then started whispering, Antonius could barely make out Gaius saying. "Look..Lahar...weapons..faces....he.. need... help...man...close...walls." Antonius smiled, it seemed Gaius had the same plan as him. Vokrash seemed less pleased and said, "I...match....boy....die...away....weapons.....backlash...Lahar....survive...gladiator...walls...stabbed...spear." Vokrash turned back to him. "Sorry for interrupting, keep up the good work lad." Antonius didn't smile, he was unhappy to see that Vokrash didn't seem to want to help. Vokrash walked away but Gaius followed him. Antonius decided to follow him too."I....weapons.... bars....him....I....allow.....good....men...I....thrown...slaughter!" "While I don't speak much Asieren, I understood some of what you said. And I agree with Gaius, I won't allow Lahar to be killed here. Even if that means I will be in serious trouble," Antonius said. He looked determent and wasn't about to let his only gladiator friend die.
It took two days for Belkin to heal from the punishment he took, but when he was healed, he returned eager to continue training. While his body was busy with the mixture of training and recuperating, his mind was elsewhere. His thoughts went back to his Death run that he did, and what had occurred from it. Was it his lack of shield which caused his damage? Has he been so long from training for the tactic that he's forgotten some pieces? He didn't know, but he wanted to talk to the Executor and talk about sitting up a place for the Gladiators to learn to fight like the Pingla...and JUST the Gladiators!
When Belkin came to "The blood grounds", it reminded him of a classic duelling pit from his home...only with the bars wide enough for interference to occur. He has picked up a Sword and Shield, as was his training, and sat down to reminisce in his head. The pits from his home were places where two warriors could settle arguments, debates and, when the time called for it, battles to the death sometimes. There was a code of honour in the place: No stealing weapons from the opponent, no interference from the outside, no throwing of weapons, it was a place where the battles were fair.
So it disgusted Belkin when he saw Lahar, the Vaan, entering the arena with nothing but some native finery that he had, going up against an armed house champion from "Balus", probably another bloated Empire "KRUVH ORYHU" (Kruu-veh Oryhuu, one who....."Enjoys" horses), who had with him two Vaanic swords. Belkin just sat back however, he wouldn't interfere unless there was a valid reason, like someone else cheating to help the champion win. He had noticed Vokrash and Gaius talking to one another, with Antonus stalking closely behind. They were speaking in Asieren, so Belkin couldn't guess what they were saying, but he assumed it was about the match as well.
"Then I can at least pass some weapons through the bars for him can't I? I won't allow one of the few good men I know here to be thrown to the slaughter!" Gaius had decided to follow Vokrash, obviously not approving of Vokrash's response to Gaius and his weapons. "While I don't speak much Asieren, I understood some of what you said. And I agree with Gaius, I won't allow Lahar to be killed here. Even if that means I will be in serious trouble." Antonius too was jumping on the "let's save Lahar" bandwagon.
Vokrash turned around and looked at the two of them. "Then I shall speak in Imperial so you can understand just as well. Lahar is meant to die here. The fight is stacked against him. I never said not to help him, but having a spear and dagger is too obvious, at least before the fighting starts." Vokrash stopped for a moment and thought. "Not to mention that Lahar is Vaanic, and that most of the Vaanics who become gladiators were War Walkers. Warriors who only wielded weapons black as night, forged by their own hand. With a stacked match, against the champion of Balus who is a well known hater of Vaans, wielding two swords black as night, I would not be surprised if Balus had heard that two Vaans had been purchased by Marrick and gone off to buy any black swords that came on the market. Those two swords could very well be Lahar's, one more insult to add to the injury."
Vokrash stopped for a moment once again. "Now it looks like Lahar is going to die yes, and there is almost nothing that anybody can do to help him other than himself. This is his fight, on more than just survival." Vokrash started to walk off again hoping that the two would not follow him. "Plus a spear is a little too obvious, something more discreet might be better. Last time I checked daggers are quite small, and arms have squeezed through the walls in the past as well."
"So what have you been doing Lahar?" The accent was terrible and the pronunciation none to better, but it was Vaanic and it did something to lift Lahar's spirit out of the melancholic mood he been after the ill-fated meeting with Artus.
Holding back laughter from the poor attempt that Antonius had made at speaking Vaanic, he replied."Just some training with Gaius and meeting my 'patron'," His mood became more serious, "It did not go very well, for showing I was not just a dog who barks and bites at the beck and call of his master, I angered the senator who had asked me to speak and was ushered away quickly after that.
On my return I saw the chaos you had spoke about, flames roared from inside the city and so the screams of the people living there.
They call us savages, but I have not once seen the chaos that I saw today dwell within any of the tribes I visited with during my pilgrimage." He was falling back into the mood he was in before, so he decided not to dwell to much on the subject, "Anyway, it is best that we see how the others are, from your story, most of the others did not fare as well as you."
After the short conversation, Lahar headed back into the ludus with Antonius following him, stopping by the medicus to see how the others were doing. ____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
While the others gladiators recovered, Lahar spent the week training. Helping Gaius with his technique when wielding duel swords, while he picked up the basic quickly, his speed was still an issue. Lumbering about when Lahar would dance around his sluggish swipes and slashes. Lahar thought that his strength and brute force style might match better to either the battle axe Gaius was used to wielding (even thought he spent the week staying as far away from it as possible) or a large shield with a spear, prodding and poking the enemy, tiring them down until the fatal blow had to be struck or they surrendered, while staying behind a wall of defence.
When not helping Gaius, he spent his time training with Antonius, who seemed to fight with renewed vigour after being sent to die at the Cauldron and coming back not just alive, but as the new champion of that arena. He learned about fighting against others who wielded a multitude of weapons, from sword ans shield to axes and spears. Each combination he learned to parry and fight against, noting their weaknesses and strengths encase he had was brought up to against those who wielded them in the arena.
The few moments of spare time he had he spent meditating, he had decided that once he had got his blades back, he would try and get Typhon's weapon as well. It was only right that his weapon should be put to rest now that he had fallen.
He had been told about where he would be fighting next; it would be in the arena called the Blood Grounds. _____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Lahar had been pushed onto the sands of the new arena, for this fight he had been told to wear the clothes that Artus had given him-the black coat, trousers and shoes, but he didn't know what the importance was, the coat would get in the way and the shoes, loose as there were, would only fetter his movement. However this time he had not been given any weapons and all he had for protection were some strips of leather covering thighs and a pair of vambraces tucked beneath his coat.
"Now, introducing the champion of House Balus!" Roared the games master. "The tamer of the sands, bane of the north! Bringer of pain, master of tears!" The crowd went wild and the monster of a man that Lahar would have to face was revealed. "Slayer of Vaan! His enemies know him as Memnarch Baal! You and I call him.... The will! Of! Death!"
So this is what it meant to cross Balus, this was why Lyria had admonished him for how he he had spoke to the 'esteemed' senator. Unlike him, this gladiator was well armoured and well equipped, almost covered from head to toe in strangely crafted armour, there were weaknesses in the design, his left side was left exposed and so was his head. The glint of black steel caught Lahar's eye, he wasn't just any War Walkers weapon, he was using the twin blades Lahar had crafted, the ones with hocks at their tips.
Rage bubbled inside him, it was an insult for another to use a War Walker's blades, he quickly calmed himself and thought on how he might win this battle, no matter how high the odds were stacked against him, he wasn't just going to let himself be killed by Balus' ogre.
He took of the coat, the length of material that trailed behind him could be grabbed and used against him. He took of the boots to give himself the extra mobility he would need. It would've been better if he had a weapon, but he would make do.
It had been a while since he was forced to fight with his fists.
He did the last thing that people would've expected and charged at the brute, he would slide once the brute tried to slash at him with his blades, tripping him over.
The bigger they are the harder they fall.
Gaius was pleased to hear Antonius join him in wanting to save Lahar, however Vokrash raised a good point. The odds were stacked against Lahar and even if they held weapons there was little they could do. Still Gaius wasn't going to give up and let Lahar die, from what little he met of him he seemed a good man, and being killed with swords he crafted himself, that was a step too far. However Vokrash did leave them with some parting wisdom. "Last time I checked daggers are quite small, and arms have squeezed through the walls in the past as well."
Gaius nodded, knowing what he meant and put away his spear, instead picking up another dagger and handing it to Antonius, saying to him "You know what to do. Look!" Lahar suddenly charged forwards at the brute. Had he gone mad at the site of Vaan blades being wielded by an outsider?
Vokrash turned around and looked at them. "Then I shall speak in Imperial so you can understand just as well. Lahar is meant to die here. The fight is stacked against him....one more insult to add to the injury." Antonius looked at Lahar, he could see anger on his face. "Now it looks like Lahar is going to die yes, and there is almost nothing that anybody can do to help him other than himself. This is his fight, on more than just survival." Vokrash walked off, Antonius was unhappy to see that Vokrash didn't want to help.
"Plus a spear is a little too obvious, something more discreet might be better. Last time I checked daggers are quite small, and arms have squeezed through the walls in the past as well." Antonius smiled, he was happy that Vokrash did care about Lahar. Gaius handed him a dagger, which he accepted. He put away his other weapons. "You know what to do. Look!" Gaius said, Antonius looked at the fight, he prayed that Lahar would win. He looked at Gaius and whispered "How about you hold him, and I stab him?" Antonius held the dagger hidden from view.
"How about you hold him, and I stab him?" whispered Antonius as he held the dagger hidden from view. Gaius nodded in response as he put his own dagger on the floor by the bars as a safety precaution.
"In case something goes wrong pick up this one. Perhaps Lahar could even pick it up, we shouldn't look so suspicious." Gaius leaned against a wall, far from to cage wall but close enough that he could dash towards it and grab the freak. Gaius, Rowan and Vokrash were possibly the only people who could hold him in place. |
Crewcuts gingham cafe capris sz 12 (an adult option in 2 colors - use BONUS10 for 10% off)
Ann Taylor blouse (old), blazer from Lefties (altered), BR bag (old)
Ann Taylor blouse (old), blazer from Lefties (altered), BR bag (old)
Scarf and CL pumps from eBay, necklace c/o Stella & Dot
Just popping in to say a quick hello and to show these fun, preppy pants from Crewcuts. After being surprisingly pleased with their apple pants with a handy adjustable waist, I couldn't resist this pair in spearmint gingham for $25. I returned my Gap kids mint jeans from earlier this season because I knew they wouldn't get enough wear. These have been the perfect replacement - they're a favorite for studying at the office (comfy but not too casual), and also work-appropriate on "denim" Fridays.
I have been wearing this blazer a little too much, but the spring green color just brightens up any outfit. Last month, I started a new job and my new team is mostly men who don't care much about clothes...
...although I miss the fashionistas on my old team, I thoroughly enjoyed being able to wear favorite pieces repeatedly without receiving raised brows (my former colleague could not tolerate seeing my Gap nude blouses one more time ; ). That is, until this jacket got dubbed my "Masters jacket" while the team was streaming the tournament on their computers. It received so much acclaim, that I now have to reserve it for select wear...sigh!
Chanel tortoiseshell sunnies (similar), Essie "turquoise & caicos" polish
This outfit was made possible/enabled by shrewd Twitter friends. Thank you Jen E. for sharing that this blouse was on clearance for a mere $9 in my size. It was on the other side of the country, so I did pay $7.50 for shipping, but it has more than gotten it's worth in wear. At first, I was surprised that something retailing for $80 was made of 100% polyester, but it wears beautifully and is so wonderfully low-maintenance. And thank you again Val for doing research on these pants and getting all the measurements for us.
Now that I have several items from Crewcuts, I'd like to point out how inconsistent their sizing can be, even in the same styles. For the apple pants in the same "cafe capri" cut and same kids size 12 (see review), I had to tighten the adjustable waist band by about 3 notches on each side for it to fit. These, on the other hand, are very snug when zipped up with no room for adjustment. The hips feel a tiny bit tighter too, but the legs and length feel exactly the same. It's unfortunate that J.Crew has so much size inconsistency, especially since they often do final sale.
I bought this scarf a year ago after many of us fell in love with it on Cee (and for a mere $10!). It never got much wear, but I recently rediscovered it and have been throwing it around all of my purses. It looks great on satchels, a speedy, Chanel...even a longchamp, and just adds new dimension to an outfit. I kept seeing the look around town on older, polished-looking ladies, and don't know why I didn't try it more often!
Readers - Are you a fan of adorning handbags with scarves?
Beautiful outfit Jean!
You look amazing!
xoxo
~Natasha Fatah~
~Natasha Fatah~
I love the navy / green combo and also adding a scarf to a bag. I had a giant nude colored bag that looked so boring until I threw a colorful scarf on it to add some interest. The blues of the bag and the scarf look incredible together!
The scarf goes so well with your purse. I've always wanted to try tying scarves onto my bags, but I guess I haven't found the right scarf to match with my bags yet. I do attach fox tails to my bags. : )
what type of work are you doing now?? are you never moving to CA? =P
I adore this look, Jean!
You've taken the chaos of monochrome + print-on-print and made it super classy.
And thank you so much for boldly sharing the kids-section-shopping tip.
I owe you a ton in alterations bills! :)
Love,
Vera. (Being Vera Blog.)
The scarf is so classy and I love the slant pockets on these capris! I took advantage of that Jcrew tip you shared about returning multiple orders with one label. I ordered a ton of non-sale items to try and hope I can rebuy the winners during final sale.
Ohhh... I love LOVE that gingham pants!!! I almost bought one in that exact color on Asos.com but never came around to it! Looks great on you!!!
I need to try that scarf-tied-to-satchel look! Also, love the necklace you are wearing!
Hey you really look great in that blouse, looks like one I have...
Love this look and the perfect scarf bow on your bag. I've been tying various scarves on my brown work bag and those scarves make me fall in love with the bag all over again. :) love that little accents like a scarf can make a world of difference for an old flame.
You look amazing.
Love the color combo! And Stella & Dot is amazing. I have a big turquoise and gold ring from them that I adore! That necklace is fabulous.
Melanie
Style to Stage
What a great outfit and you look stunning! Very inspirational ;)
This comment has been removed by the author.
I am currently looking for one for my bright green bag
the color of your top and your purse look gorgeous! everything looks so effortless on you! love it!
awwww this colour scheme is so bold but cute!
such pretty colors!! i am loving these pants. i'm thinking about wearing them to work...or do you thinks it's too casual/fun?
never mind my question, they are out of sizes anyway... :(
This comment has been removed by the author.
I am kind of obsessed with green and navy right now (and this look is lovely on you!) I just put up two green + navy combos on my blog and have a third one coming. Might be time for me to try something else. :)
This post of yours makes me happy as I can put inspiration on it in wearing my capri's.Love the color blocking, very lovely to look at and the accessories you've match fits well.The blazer is adorable and so with the bag.:)
..opps and regarding your question,in some point it's lovely to look at those bag with scarves but in my opinion it depends on the bag and the size of scarf if they are well fit together.:)
absolutely gorgeous!! love this colour scheme.
Laura x
demure-porcelain.blogspot.com
Cute outfit. I love the color of the bag and it goes so well with the scarf. The scarf print is perfect for adorning bags. Great shoes too.
xoxo,
Style Cue by Suzie Q
Great outfit! Love all the blues and the pattern of your pants :)
Can you please let me know the name or style number for that AT shirt? Thanks, -Angela
Hi Angela - I no longer have the tag, but unfortunately it was from (3?) seasons ago ... it won't be in-stores anymore because when I bought it in Jan, it was already on final sale being moved out of their system. I do think there's a chance their Factory store might bring it back (they usually do that for popular items), or it might pop up on a place like eBay?
Thanks for your reply!
The blue and green look amazing together! I don't think I'd be able to pull off this look, but you look absolutely great :)
~ Kimberly
Very pretty outfit. The gingham is darling. Love this color combo.
You look amazing! I'm in total love with those pants.
LOVE this outfit!!! Especially the blouse and blazer!!
Jenn
A Petite Treat
Hi, I love the outfit! Where is the blue blouse from? It sounds like you got a great deal on it!
Ann taylor
Cute! You look great !!
LOVE the colors on you so much!!! Great combo! You look drop dead gorgeous Jean!
Corinna
Love the color combo and the scarves on handbags is a great idea!
I tried on a pair of cropped pants this wkd. convinced that it looks awful on me. but mb i haven't found the right one yet. you do look so good in yours.
great outfit. love the colorblocking :-)
glamDevils
Hi jean i randomly read your blog one day and just cant stop following your post!
nice & sharp colours for summer ;-)
Beautiful look, I love your pants!
Sweet outfit. rock it girl!
LOVE this outfit! Especially the blazer and the blouse. I've never tried wearing a scarf on my bag, but then again, I don't have any nice-enough bags to try it with. One day when I can splurge on a quality bag, I'll try the scarf accessory!
ive always loved the handbags with scarves, at least on other people. its like a little accessory for your accessory. doesnt seem necessary, but definitely adds a little something!
hi jean, GORGEOUS as always!!!
i had a question...how much do you usually spend on CLs on ebay. i am looking to buy a pair but im not sure what's "too cheap" to be considered counterfeit...thank you! i saw a pair of prives that were GORGEOUS for $400 (brand new with two impressions on sole) but that just seems so cheap for something new...so i wanted to ask you since you seem to really nail this stuff!
thank you!!
Hi there - I don't think there's a good "set" price to use as a standard, because it depends on the condition, the popularity of the style, the seller feedback ... etc. I think $400 is actually fairly high for pre-owned, but for a super classic style like prives in great shape, it is reasonable. I definitely don't think they are "too cheap" to be authentic. The ones I watch on eBay usually go for $300 or less, but they are not the true classic styles. Classic nude and black pumps do go for more.
Thank you Jean!!!
very fresh look and superb use of spring colours. thank you again for the inspiration as I am looking for ways to inject a little colour in my monochromatic wardrobe.;-)
I'm not a fan of printed pants. Somehow they don't look professional (for my age) to me. For your age though, I think they look good. I do love the pairing and the scarf on handbag.
Forgot to mention the necklace, it's beautiful. :)
Question: do you ever carry that bag (or similar bags) over the shoulder? I love how it looks on your arm, but with 2 kids I need something that leaves both hands free. I always think a large-ish bag like that would like odd over the shoulder, which defeats the purpose of that extra strap. Thoughts
PS, you look professional and cute at the same time.
Hi there - yes, definitely, I actually carry this bag mostly over the shoulder as as "book" bag. Look for bags that have pliable shape/slouchy silhouettes, versus structured, squarish bags, so that they don't look too large when worn over the shoulder.
Oh my goodness, you look amazing! I'm loving those capris and am considering getting myself a pair! Love the colors and the bag.. perfect!
xo, Yi-chia
wow wow wow. Now I need gingham pants. Perfect summer outfit!
Oh, and I do have a scarf on my handbag in the wintertime.
this outfit might be one of my favorite that you've posted! i love the color combination and the pants and jacket are just SO CHIC!
-Elissa
I love this outfit! So glad you used so much color.
Your Masters jacket! It totally looks like one!
I think handbags with scarves are cool. I don't use scarves that way but I have a Coach clutch that came with a scarf and I get a lot of compliments on it.
Helen
Those pants are adorable on you! I love how you toughened up the soft pastels with the navy blue.
What is the style/model number of your Chanel sunglasses?!
5182 - they are from many years ago, however Chanel does have a very similar brown tortoiseshell version out currently!
loving all the green
You look great in these colors!
I don't know how i felt about pairing scarves with purses...Maybe I just haven't found the right combo.
So glad your kept the blazer. If I remember correctly, you had considered returning it. The color looks fabulous on you, love the pants. I wish I could wear crewcuts :( But alas, although petite, I am a size 4/6 and could not even dream about fitting into those tiny pants. Love your blog, keep up the good work!
Love this color combo! I love how your nail polish almost blends in with your pants! It's like an exact minty match!
It is very unfortunate that JCrew's sizing is soo random that I refuse to buy things final sale online unless I've tried it on in store which is such a pain with so many online only items. But anywho Love scarves tied to handbags. Sometimes it can add a pop of color and print to an otherwise boring outfit for the office when going out right after work.I actually just showed a scarf on the handbag look on a recent post!
Gorgeous colors and those pants look so good on you!
I love this outfit so much. Blue and mint green is such a refreshing look - love the necklace as well!
What a pretty spring outfit Jean! I love putting scarves on handbags - I used to do it all the time but I've recently become extremely lazy LOL!
What a great outfit! I think that's about as much fun with color as you can have in an office environment; so much fun.
love your pants sooo much girl!!
I LOVE THIS LOOK! GORGEOUS!!
Jean, you look AWESOME!!!!!!!!! absolutely love the colors (: Unlike you, I wear scrubs to work...and on most of my days off, I'm at home. But I'm definitely trying to be more adventurous with the colors, jewelry, etc. It's too hot in Texas to layer anything right now (except maybe layering tank tops!). I have been so inspired to dress better when I go out. Thanks once again for the inspiration (:
A BIG ditto on j.crew sizing. I have their Cafe Capri in THREE different sizes because each pair fits differently. I purchased two last year - a dusty pink and a camel - and a green color this year. I wish they'd work in this, as I am always fearful of ordering from their final sale for this reason.
Very cute outfit, loving all the blues and greens. I have to agree crewcuts sizing is all over the place that it made me stop ordering from their final sale.
I use to like to put charms on my bags but now I keep it plain.. I think maybe because I'm getting older! lol.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Thank you for the shout out, Jean! I'm glad you love the blouse. My recommendation whenever ordering a sale item through Style Finder at Ann Taylor/LOFT is to order a small full price item with it (i.e., a tank top) and they will waive the shipping fee. This only works for card members though (free shipping on full price items). Then you can return the full price item if it doesn't work out for you. A kind SA gave me that recommendation when I placed a Style Finder order in-store - it's almost the same as adding free shipping fillers when you order online!
the necklace is amazing! love the outfit!
xoxo
Mady
thegirlfromthemirror.blogspot.com
Ack! (a good ack!) I love this outfit on you!! Everything is perfect! Matchy-match...but not the boring kind (like Elle has been recently discussing) The necklace is amazing.
So glad you got that AT blouse! I picked it up as well and love it. I would suggest a bralette underneath for a night out (if you decide to wear it solo). For me, I think it is too sheer to wear with a regular bra.
And the Banana bag with the scarf is gorgeous!
Love that your new teammates like golf! Thursday through Sunday that is what is on our tv...so much better than football, in my opinion! And listening to the commentators...golf terminology can sound so dirty...it is hilarious!
And the mint and navy are amazing together! Reminds me of the J. Crew bracelet I just picked up!
You have me all over the place and chatty tonight with your outfit! :p
love the outfit..u look amazing
Love the whole outfit. The colors are gorgeous together.
This is such an adorable outfit! I like the all blue palette.
Very cute outfit! Could you please tell us the style number of your Chanel sunglasses? They look amazing! It is really difficult for me to find frame that fit my face shape and your Chanel sunglasses look very nice!
Hi there - they are 5182 but they are from several years ago. I saw a very similar tortoiseshell version out currently, though! I suggest going into a store that has a wide selection of Chanel sunglasses and trying them on. I owned two pairs before this, including their signature solid frame with mother-of-pearl CC's on both sides, and they were so big on my face and kept slipping off my nose. These fit much better!
thanks for sharing! I picked these up along with the apple pair after seeing your first post on the crewcuts cafe capri. I was stumped on what top to pair with the gingham and this has definitely helped!
I have been so frustrated with crewcuts size differences. I got a 12 in the apple and 14 in the gingham! guess that's what you get with kids sizing!
I can't say that I love scarves on bags but I love bags...and scarves. lol. Loving this ensemble too! Oh how I wish BR made bags in the same quality they used too....
Hi , your blog is amazing i can not stop watching you previous post, you have great tips and not just for petite women i fall in love with your blog! answer to your questions of course that i love accesorize my look with an scarves on a handbag but to be honest i did not do it in a long time !!
thank you for the inspiration !!!
love the outfit you look great!
xx
morenafashion-gaby.blogspot.com
this is one of my favourite outfits you have put together. so unique!
You look so fab! I love the similar color story. I have to start wearing scarves on my bags!
Hi Jean, you look stunning as always! Btw, could you please share the link of the scarf from ebay? Or the store url? I vaguely remember a post of yours a while back on scarves from ebay but couldn't find it anymore. Thank you so much!
Hi Nina - unfortunately, that specific seller closed their store down. Try searching chain print scarf or horsebit scarf?
Absolutely adore this look lady! I saw those gingham pants last week... might need to go back lol
I have had my eye on that necklace...great look! And I love that they call it the masters jacket, lol!
Hi Jean, you look nice. You're wearing all my favorite colors! Thanks for posting & now I will look for a silky scarf with 'chain' or 'horsebit' print!
=o) Hi Jean. Thanks for sharing your style wisdom. I've been skulking around your blog for the past month or so. I'm not petite, but I love your blog. Thought of you today b/c of this:
Hi, Jean.
I stumbled on your blog a couple of weeks ago, and I just have to say I love your style! As a busy mother of two little girls, it feels like ages since I've gone shopping for myself. I'm so focused on my girls these days. But seeing your blog makes me realize how desperately I need to update my wardrobe. I've always found shopping for petite clothes such a pain, but you offer so many great reviews and tips. Thanks!
Your new fan,
A petite mom
i think your blazer and scarf are very cool. right now i'm into blues and greens.
you have such a great sense of style - this is just a perfect outfit that is classy and appropriate for so many occasions. the colours are amazing on you! xox P
I love the blazer and scarf! The colors are perfect for spring time. You look fabulous Jean!
Hi Jean!
I absolutely love your necklace! It's so beautiful!
Hey Jean, you wouldn't happen to have the style # of your Chanel sunglasses would you? Are they recent or an older style? Love love love them!
I absolutely love this color combo and the Serenity Necklace looks terrific. I also love pairing this necklace with yellow & must admit, I wear it ALL THE TIME! :)
OMG can't believe I missed this post before! The gingham pants are adorable on you. The necklace ties everything in amazingly!! Love it!
A Preponderance of Fashion
This comment has been removed by the author.
BEAUTIFUL BLAZER Jean! I bought a similar blazer from HM this past weekend. It was a bright turquoise blue. I found the color to really brighten the entire outfit. |
MCAS Alert September 2000
FairTest / CARE (Coalition
for Authentic Reform in Education)
MCAS: Making the Massachusetts
Dropout Crisis Worse
“I think a lot of people are going to
drop out if they fail this test. If they feel they’re not
going to make it to college, why bother trying?”
- Lacy Langevin, New Bedford High School, Class of 2003
“We’ll have a graduating class of
10.”
- Crissy Rodrigues, New Bedford High School, Class of 2003
A cloud hangs over many Massachusetts students.
Beginning with the Class of 2003, all students must pass the state’s
high stakes test - MCAS - in order to graduate. Based on patterns
emerging from other states, Massachusetts dropout rates - already
too high - are about to get worse. With 33% of the state’s
Latino students and 24% of the state’s African American students
entering ninth grade at risk for dropping out before graduation,
many schools and districts now face a crisis of growing proportions.
Massachusetts dropout patterns paint a picture of growing gaps
between the educational “haves” and “have nots.”
Those who face the greatest challenges in life are increasingly
at risk of leaving school with less formal schooling.
High-stakes testing betrays the most vulnerable
students in the Commonwealth. Far from fixing the problem of students
who graduate without skills, linking MCAS scores to graduation
threatens to push the most vulnerable students out of school altogether.
As MCAS policies narrow opportunity for individual students, they
also jeopardize the future welfare of students’ communities.
What do we know about the Massachusetts
dropout picture in the era of MCAS?
Higher dropout rates are a predictable consequence
of high stakes testing. African American, Latino, and urban students,
already dramatically over-represented among students who both
drop out and fail MCAS, bear the greatest cost of such testing.
As MCAS testing fuels higher grade retention rates, students
are already dropping out earlier in their high school years,
with dropout numbers rising in the middle grades.
While students already at risk are most endangered, many good
students who work hard, pass their courses, and aspire to post-secondary
education - but who fail MCAS - will join the ranks of school
dropouts.
As more students leave school with less education, and as fewer
reenroll in school, entire communities will need to address the
needs of a growing population of young adults whose levels of
educational attainments exclude them from many employment and
educational opportunities.
While MCAS drives more students out of school, lack of state
funding and the absence of leadership for dropout prevention
constitute an abandonment of the state’s most vulnerable
students and their schools.
When large numbers of students already conclude
that “school is not for me,” what are the chances that
the threat of withholding a diploma will bully similarly vulnerable
students into higher test scores and turn them into “graduates
with skills?”
Widening gaps, growing
vulnerability
In the 1998-99 school year, 9,188 Massachusetts
students dropped out of school. According to the Massachusetts
Department of Education’s annual reports, “Dropout Rates
in Massachusetts Public Schools,” this is the highest number
of students dropping out since 1993. Overall, the Department of
Education (DOE) projects that 14% of the Class of 2002 will drop
out before graduation.
Multi-year trends are clear: As those students most likely to
attend schools with fewest resources for learning encounter a
policy that requires particular MCAS scores for graduation, many
will turn away from school earlier in their high school careers.
Analysis of data available in DOE reports highlights a growing
problem for the state overall and particular districts.
African American and Latino students are dramatically
over-represented among dropouts in Massachusetts. Although only
17% of Massachusetts students in grades 9-12 are Latino or African
American, 40% of those dropping out of school are Latino or African
American. In 1998-99, Latino students made up 9% of all the state’s
students enrolled in grades 9-12 but
represented 24% of all dropouts. African American students made
up 8% of students enrolled in grades 9-12 but comprised 16% of
all dropouts.
Among students who drop out, the proportion of Latino and African
American students is growing. Although the population of Latino
and African American students in Massachusetts high schools has
consistently remained at 17% for four years, the percentage of
Latino and African American students represented in the dropout
population has increased. In 1995-96 and 1996-97, Latino and African
American students already comprised 34% of all dropouts. This
percentage rose to 36% in 1997-98. By 1999, 40% of the dropouts
were Latino and African American.
Among students who drop out, the proportion of students dropping
out with less than a 9th grade education is increasing. In 1995-96,
1996-97, and 1997-98, 23% of dropouts left school in 9th grade.
By 1999, 25% of the state’s dropouts came from the ninth
grade. The state does not include the number of students dropping
out before reaching high school in its official reports. However,
data obtained for particular high risk urban schools indicate
growing numbers of students are leaving school with less than
a ninth grade education.
The percentage of 9th grade dropouts who reenroll in school is
declining. Students who leave school in ninth grade are increasingly
out of school for good. In 1995-96, 21% of 9th grade dropouts
reenrolled in school; in 1996-97, 15% reenrolled; in 1997-98,
16% reenrolled. By 1999, only 14% of 9th graders who dropped out
reenrolled in school.
Students from urban districts comprise a disproportionate number
of the state’s high school dropouts, and the percentage of
dropouts from a small number of urban communities is growing.
Boston, Springfield, Worcester, New Bedford, Lowell, and Lawrence
together consistently enroll 15% of all the state’s high
schools students. In 1996-97, 32% of all dropouts came from these
districts; 1997-98, 35% of all dropouts from grades 9, 10, 11,
and 12 came from these districts. By 1999, 39% of all dropouts
came from these six districts. Of all the 1999 dropouts, 18.4%
came from Boston alone, up from 15% in 1996. Half (51%) of Massachusetts
dropouts now come from only 14 districts, mostly urban.
As thousands of students receive “Failing”
MCAS scores, the “holding power” schools offer the most
vulnerable students is stretched to the breaking point. In the
face of dwindling hope they will pass MCAS, fewer dropouts will
return to school. With no state resources available for dropout
prevention, entire communities inherit a set of social problems
that persist for years to come.
Faced with “Failing” MCAS scores, many good students
who play by the rules, pass their courses, and contribute to their
schools begin to doubt their academic identity and ability to
complete high school, let alone post-secondary education.
Allyson is 16, an energetic sports-lover
and B+ student at her local high school, with a special drive
to succeed in school. “My brother dropped out, and my sister,
too. I want to be the first person in my family to graduate from
high school,” she says.
By all accounts, Allyson will realize her
dream and graduate in 2002 with an admirable academic and extracurricular
record. Enrolled in her school’s “high level” classes
in English and History in her sophomore year, she earned “A”s
on specific assignments and maintained an overall “B+”
average. A passionate athlete, she is a disciplined runner. A
regular volunteer at her local shelter for homeless adults, she
also works at the local shopping mall every other weekend and
during the summer. She aims for a college degree and imagines
herself as an entrepreneur, managing her own day care center or
auto repair business.
Allyson has taken MCAS twice, in eighth
and tenth grades. Despite her record as a good student, she says,
“I thought about dropping out around the time we took MCAS
[in May 2000]. If the test counted for me to graduate, like it’s
going to this year, I probably would have. But I knew if I could
just get through those hours of testing, it would be over, and
I wouldn’t have to think about it again.”
Although her MCAS scores will not “count”
for graduation, Allyson takes MCAS very seriously. Three months
into her ninth grade, Allyson received her grade 8 scores: “Needs
Improvement” (230) in English, “Failing” (200)
in Math. That year, her school assigned her and others who had
“failed” in eighth grade to daily “MCAS classes”
where each quarter’s curriculum focused on a different section
of the MCAS. Allyson put a lot of faith in these classes: She
says, “I worked so hard for my MCAS classes, I spent a lot
of time in the library, hoping to do well on the test.” As
of September 2000, she has not yet received her scores, but she
says, “I’m fairly certain that I failed at least one
section.”
Allyson is thankful that her class is not
the first for whom MCAS scores will “count” toward graduation.
“A lot of students who don’t pass MCAS are going to
drop out next year,” she predicts. As for her classmates,
she says, “MCAS makes students think they are stupid.”
Do high stakes tests motivate
all students?
In a major report published by the American Educational Research
Association, researchers Thomas Kellaghan, George Madaus, and
Anastasia Raczek (1996) asked the questions: Do high-stakes tests
motivate all students? and What do tests motivate students to
do? They found that high-stakes testing can actually undermine
motivation, especially for students who already have a tenuous
hold on schooling. Even for motivated students, examinations may
not lead to the desirable outcomes - higher levels of achievement
and problem-solving, intrinsic moti- vation, general competence,
or self-determination - that are key to nurturing an informed
citizenry and a skilled workforce. Good students we interviewed
around the state say they value school. Eighth or ninth grade
was the “best year ever” for some. Still, many see MCAS
as a “mental block” that some believe will be difficult
to surmount. Some believe that MCAS is “a plan to stop city
kids from going to college.” Many see MCAS as a “set
up to tell you you’re stupid.”
Sylvie belongs to the Massachusetts Class
of 2003, the first class required to pass MCAS before
graduating. Friendly and reserved at the same time, Sylvie describes
herself as serious, hardworking, and creative, both in and outside
of school. She sings in her church chorus, attending rehearsals
faithfully, and she volunteers at her church convention.
Sylvie has consistently had a “B+”
grade average in school. She loves to read, and her favorite book
is the award-winning Push. In eighth grade, she won her school’s
award for good grades and behavior. In 9th grade, her grades improved
further. She cites her math skills as a particular strength, and
her report card shows “A”s in both Math and English.
Still, Sylvie was not overly confident about
MCAS, and in eighth grade, she regularly stayed after school to
attend the MCAS prep classes her favorite teacher offered. Despite
her effort, she scored “Needs Improvement” in English
and “low Fail” in Math. She now worries about how she
will fare when MCAS “counts.” Describing testing as
“horrible because it’s long and confusing,” she
says, “College students do well on these questions.”
In light of her MCAS scores, she believes her teachers now see
her in terms of what she does not know rather than what she does
know. “Teachers always liked me,” she says, “But
MCAS made us look stupid. Most of the things I learned weren’t
on the MCAS.” “I’m afraid that I won’t graduate,”
she adds. “I don’t know what you have to know to do
well. MCAS made me want to drop out.”
The MCAS dilemma: “Feel
stupid” or leave
Good students we interviewed understand
that the lack of a diploma is a disaster. Still, many who have
already failed MCAS once do not view the “opportunity”
to repeat that failure as a strong motivator for working harder.
Given the choice of retaking a test that makes
them “feel stupid” and the prospect of repeated humiliating
failures, many students are likely to dismiss the possibility
of passing “some day” and bow out of testing - and school
- altogether. Predicting the reactions of classmates who fail,
one tenth grader says, “Some [students] will stay, but one
day they’re going to give up.” Another reports, “A
lot of kids are going to get discouraged. Some will keep trying,
but a lot will struggle to get to school.” One says, “I’ll
go back to Barbados. I’ll get my diploma there.” Nor
do students we interviewed have much faith in retesting. Indeed,
testing conditions they have already encountered encourage neither
hope or effort: “Everyone’s in the cafeteria bunched
together on cold chairs. You can’t do your best that way,”
explain students from one Boston high school.
Policy makers have sold MCAS as a necessary
“stick” to get students to work hard and take school
seriously. But contrary to policy rhetoric, for a portion of students
who are already working hard, MCAS is as likely to drive them
away from school as to motivate them to work harder.
The predictable push-out
consequences of high-stakes testing
The Massachusetts dropout problem is no puzzle.
Reporting findings from a major national longitudinal database,
University of Wisconsin researchers Gary Wehlage and Robert Rutter
(1986) have emphasized, “The process of becoming a dropout
is complex because the act of rejecting an institution as fundamental
to the society as school must also be accompanied by the belief
that the institution has rejected the person.” Repeating
a grade, punitive attendance practices, school exclusion, and
labeling and placement in low-track classes are among the school
experiences that contribute to a student’s belief that “school
is not for me.”
High-stakes testing also sabotages schools’
“holding power,” especially in schools enrolling large
numbers of vulnerable students. Researchers from the National
Board for Educational Testing and Public Policy (Clarke, Haney,
& Madaus, 2000) summarize these correlations:
Nine of the ten states with the highest dropout rates in the country
tie test scores to decisions about graduation. In contrast, none
of the ten states with the lowest dropout rates have such a policy.
Data from the National Educational Longitudinal Survey (NELS:88)
indicates that high-stakes testing in grade 8 contributes to higher
dropout rates before tenth grade among students attending schools
with proportionately higher numbers of low-income students.
In Florida, a study of students’ tenth, eleventh, and twelfth
grade records found that the likelihood of dropping out increased
significantly among students with moderate grades (1.5-2.5 on
a 4-point scale) who failed the state’s graduation test.
Likewise, an exhaustive study of Texas enrollment
data over 20 years found that disparities in grade progression
and graduation were exacerbated just prior to and throughout the
years of testing for graduation in that state (Haney, 2000). Specifically:
During the first year of Texas graduation testing in 1991, the
proportion of students progressing from ninth grade to graduation
on time declined dramatically, a drop 50% greater for African
American and Latino students than for white students. Although
white students have recovered “normal” pre-testing progression
rates, African American and Latino students have not done so,
leaving wider gaps in educational attainment between white students
and African American and Latino students. Sixth graders in Texas
are now less likely to reach grade 12 than in the years prior
to high stakes testing; only 70% of African American and Latino
sixth graders do so.
Overall, research suggests that high-stakes
testing policies set the stage for higher dropout rates. Among
vulnerable students in particular, high-stakes testing may exert
a push-out effect so that students who would otherwise be expected
to complete school instead experience greater chances of leaving
without a diploma.
The coming “train wreck:”
Asleep at the switch
Despite foreseeable increases in dropout rates,
the Massachusetts DOE has failed to take even the most basic steps
to anticipate, monitor, and address the impact of MCAS on the
state’s dropout problem, especially in relation to the state’s
most vulnerable students.
State leadership is lacking to address the
coming “train wreck.” The Massachusetts Department
of Education has no staff person responsible for leading dropout
prevention efforts at the state level.
The Department of Education’s budget provides no funding
directed toward dropout prevention. Funding for “remediation”
is no substitute for support for reforms and programs designed
specifically to lower dropout rates.
The Massachusetts DOE’s dropout reports
are inadequate for monitoring the impact of MCAS on the state’s
most vulnerable students.
Massachusetts has not reported dropout data
for special education students since 1994-95.
Massachusetts does not report dropout rates for students learning
English as a second language and has never done so.
Massachusetts does not report dropout numbers for students who
drop out of school before reaching ninth grade. These students
are not counted in official dropout reports.
In the absence of dropout data disaggregated
for the most vulnerable groups, including students with disabilities,
students who are learning English as a second language, and students
who turn 16 in the middle grades, the legislature and community
cannot assess the impact of MCAS on dropout trends in Massachusetts.
In the era of high-stakes testing, the DOE
must assume responsibility for addressing, reporting, and monitoring
state and district dropout rates in a manner that fully accounts
for the dropout problem statewide and in individual communities.
Choosing equity
The state should immediately suspend the policy
of linking MCAS scores to high school graduation. States, districts,
and schools make choices regarding the policies and practices
they adopt. To choose current policy is to choose higher dropout
rates.
The state must renew its commitment to dropout
prevention. The state should ensure that leadership responsibility
is assigned within the Department of Education to develop an overall
dropout prevention strategy, allocate funds for programs and technical
assistance targeted to districts with weak holding power, and
improve state monitoring and reporting of dropout rates, focusing
on the impact of MCAS on the state’s most vulnerable students.
The state should begin immediately to work
with local districts and professional associations to design a
multi-faceted assessment system that will improve learning for
all students. Such a system should strengthen accountability by
monitoring students’ basic skills statewide and engage learning
by promoting local approaches grounded in real student work. (See
CARE’s proposal for an Authentic Accountability System at.)
References
Clarke, M., Haney, W., Madaus, G. (2000). High Stakes Testing
and High School Completion. NBETPP Statements 1(3). Chestnut Hill:
Boston College, Center for the Study of Testing.
Kellaghan, T., Madaus, G., and Raczek, A.
(1996). The Use of External Examinations to Improve Motivation.
Washington, DC: American Educational Research Assoc.
Haney, W. (2000). The Myth of the Texas Miracle
in Education. Education Policy Analysis Archives, Vol. 8, No.
4:.
Wehlage, G.G. and Rutter, R. (1986). Dropping
Out: How Much Do Schools Contribute to the Problem? Teachers College
Record 87 (3): Spring: 374-392.
- |
[Federal Register: March 26, 2003 (Volume 68, Number 58)]
[Proposed Rules]
[Page 14546-14558]
From the Federal Register Online via GPO Access
[wais.access.gpo.gov]
Submit comments online via Regulations.gov.
Proposed Rules
This section of the FEDERAL REGISTER contains notices to the public of the proposed issuance of rules and regulations. The purpose of these notices is to give interested persons an opportunity to participate in the rule making prior to the adoption of the final rules.
DEPARTMENT OF AGRICULTURE
Foreign Agricultural Service
7 CFR Part 1599
RIN 0551-AA64
McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program
AGENCY: Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
ACTION: Proposed rule.
SUMMARY: The Foreign Agricultural Service proposes to establish rules governing the foreign donation of resources, including agricultural commodities, to implement the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. This program would provide agricultural commodities and financial and technical assistance to carry out preschool and school food for education programs and maternal, infant, and child nutrition programs, in foreign countries
DATES: Submit comments on or before April 25, 2003.
ADDRESSES: Address all comments concerning this proposed rule to William S. Hawkins, Director, Program Administration Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, United States Department of Agriculture, 1400 Independence Ave., SW., Stop 1031, Washington, DC 20250-1031; telephone (202) 720-3241.
You may submit comments and data by sending electronic mail (E- mail) to: [email protected].
FOR FURTHER INFORMATION CONTACT: Lorie Jacobs, Branch Chief, Financial Analysis Branch, Program Administration Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, U.S. Department of Agriculture (USDA), Ag. Box 1034, Washington, DC 20250-1031; telephone (202) 720-2074; FAX (202) 690- 1595. The USDA prohibits discrimination in its programs on the basis of race, color, national origin, sex, religion, age, disability, political beliefs and marital or familial status. Persons with disabilities who require alternative means for communication of program information (Braille, large print, audiotape, etc.) should contact the USDA Office of Communications at (202) 820-5881 (voice) or (202) 720-7808 (TDD).
SUPPLEMENTARY INFORMATION:
Executive Order 12866
This proposed rule is issued in conformance with Executive Order 12866. It has been determined to be significant under Executive Order 12866 and has been reviewed by the Office of Management and Budget. A cost-benefit assessment has been completed and is available to the public by contacting Lorie Jacobs at (202) 720-2074.
Executive Order 12988
This proposed rule has been reviewed in accordance with Executive Order 12988, Civil Justice Reform. This proposed requires intergovernmental consultation with State and local officials (see the notice related to 7 CFR part 3015, subpart V, published at 48 FR 29115).
Regulatory Flexibility Act
It has been determined that the Regulatory Flexibility Act is not applicable to this proposed rule because FAS is not required by any other provision of law to publish a notice of proposed rulemaking with respect to the subject matter of this proposed rule.
Paperwork Reduction Act
This proposed rule would add new information collection requirements applicable to the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. In accordance with the Paperwork Reduction Act of 1995, the Foreign Agricultural Service (FAS) requests approval of a new information collection in support of the McGovern- Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program.
Title: McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program.
OMB Control Number: xxxx-xxxx.
Type of Request: Approval of an information collection.
Abstract: This information is needed to administer the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. The information will be gathered from applicants desiring to receive grants under the program to determine the viability of requests for resources to implement school feeding and maternal and child nutrition programs in foreign countries and other periodic reports during the course of implementing the activities.
Estimate of Burden: Public reporting burden for this collection of the additional information is estimated to average 74 hours per applicant.
Respondents: Private voluntary organizations, shipping agents, ship owners/brokers, and survey companies.
Estimated Number of Respondents: 156.
Estimated Number of Responses per Respondent: 7.
Estimated Total Annual Burden on Respondents: 11,607 hours. Copies of the information collection may be obtained from Kimberly Chisley, the Agency Information Collection Coordinator, at (202) 720- 2568.
Request for Comments:: William S. Hawkins, Director, Program Administration Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, United States Department of Agriculture, 1400 Independence Ave., SW., Stop 1031, Washington, DC 20250-1031; telephone (202) 720-3241.
All responses to this notice will be summarized. All comments will also become a matter of public record.
Government Paperwork Elimination Act
FAS is committed to compliance with the Government Paperwork Elimination Act, which requires Government agencies, in general, to provide the public the option of submitting information or transacting business electronically to the maximum extent possible.
Background
Section 3107 of the Farm Security and Rural Investment Act of 2002, Pub. L. 107-171, authorized the President to establish a program to be known as the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. This program would provide agricultural commodities and financial and technical assistance to carry out preschool and school food for education programs and maternal, infant, and child nutrition programs, in foreign countries. By Presidential Memorandum, March 11, 2003, the President delegated the responsibility for implementing this program to the Secretary of Agriculture and it has been further delegated, within the Department of Agriculture, to the Administrator, Foreign Agricultural Service. Congress directed that $100 million of Commodity Credit Corporation (CCC) funds be used for this program in fiscal year 2003. Thereafter, the program is subject to annual appropriations.
In comparison to the pilot Global Food for Education Initiative, there will be an increased emphasis on education and nutrition under the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. The Farm Security and Rural Investment Act of 2002 (Farm Act of 2002) indicates that funds should be used in part to improve literacy and primary education, particularly with respect to girls, and to put emphasis on identifying beneficiaries who are malnourished or undernourished. In addition, cooperating sponsors should attempt to coordinate supplementary feeding and nutrition programs with existing programs that provide health-needs interventions.
The McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program is implemented under the authorities of the Foreign Agricultural Service and, therefore, this new program will be subject to regulations that are separate from other foreign assistance commodity grant programs operated under the authority of the Commodity Credit Corporation (CCC), i.e., section 416(b) and Food for Progress. However, because there are many similarities between these programs and it would be advisable to retain the same procedures and rules to the extent practical, this proposed rule would adopt, and repeat in 7 CFR part 1599, most of the regulations currently in 7 CFR part 1499 that are applicable to the section 416(b) and Food for Progress programs. Sections 1599.7 and 1599.8, which cover procedures that apply to procuring ocean transportation, and arranging for entry and handling of commodities in the foreign country, are nearly identical to 7 CFR part 1499. Comments are encouraged regarding whether using this identical language could cause any unforeseen problems under the new program.
The legislation authorizing the new program would require certain additional information to support proposals for funding and authorizes certain expenditures not generally permitted under section 416(b) or Food for Progress. Also, certain department-wide grant regulations not presently applicable to CCC authorized grants would be applicable to the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. These department-wide regulations are referenced in the proposed rule. The applicability of these department-wide rules has necessitated certain deviations from the rules applicable to section 416(b) and Food for Progress grants. Of particular note are the provisions on advances, interest earned on advances, changes to Program Budgets, and audit requirements.
Under the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program, FAS may pay certain costs not permitted under the earlier pilot Global Food for Education Initiative operated under the authority of section 416(b). This includes costs for transportation, storage and handling within the recipient country in non-emergency situations when certain specified findings are met. FAS may also pay administrative expenses of nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsors and other costs of nongovernmental Cooperating sponsors that enhance the effectiveness of program activities. These costs, to the extent FAS agrees to pay them, would be detailed in the Program Operations Budget, which becomes part of the program agreement. The Farm Act of 2002 provides for participation by the Food and Nutrition Service (FNS) under the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program, wherein FNS may provide technical advice on the establishment and implementation of programs, including providing field expertise in recipient countries.
Costs that "enhance the effectiveness'' of activities is a vague concept. FAS is proposing to give priority coverage of these costs to those that would increase the likelihood of meeting the activities objectives. Examples of costs that may enhance the effectiveness of a school feeding program may be the purchase of text books, utensils and food trays, the provision of incentives to teachers, as well as the use of consultancies to provide technical assistance in the educational improvement area when conducting teacher training. While monetization proceeds could also be requested and used to cover any program costs that are necessary to have a successful activity to enhance the effectiveness of a program, organizations need to demonstrate that monetization offers more benefits than a direct cash outlay.
Another significant difference between the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program and the prior pilot program is that the new authority requires that Cooperating Sponsors demonstrate that the activities undertaken with program resources must be sustainable after FAS assistance ends. Consequently, FAS will require that proposals include sufficient information to allow the Associate Administrator to make a determination that this will be the case.
The development and implementation of the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program helps to meet the objective of supporting international economic development and trade capacity building set forth in the USDA Strategic Plan for FY 2002-2007. Under that objective USDA provides targeted foreign food assistance to developing countries to foster economic growth and development.
USDA uses an interagency process to review food aid policies and programs to ensure the necessary coordination and management of these programs, and will continue to use this process for the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. FAS will cooperate with USAID, FNS and other Federal Agencies in the development and implementation of the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program.
The Farm Act of 2002 stipulates that funds may be used to pay for the packaging, enrichment, preservation, and fortification of agricultural commodities under the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. This proposed rule contains that information in Section 1599.6 (a) Apportionment of Costs and Advances, in order to emphasize the intent of the Farm Act of 2002 to allow for coverage of these costs.
List of Subjects in 7 CFR Part 1599
Agricultural commodities, Exports, Foreign aid.
Accordingly, the Foreign Agricultural Service proposes that chapter XV of title 7 of the Code of Federal Regulations be amended by adding a new part 1599 to read as follows:
PART 1599--MCGOVERN-DOLE INTERNATIONAL FOOD FOR EDUCATION AND CHILD NUTRITION PROGRAM
1599.1 What special definitions apply?
1599.2 What is the general purpose and scope of the regulations?
1599.3 Are there eligibility requirements for Cooperating Sponsors?
1599.4 How do I apply?
1599.5 When is a usual marketing requirement included?
1599.6 How are costs and advances apportioned?
1599.7 What procedures apply to procuring ocean transportation?
1599.8 Who arranges for entry and handling in the foreign country?
1599.9 What are the restrictions on commodity use and distribution?
1599.10 Are there special requirements for agreements between Cooperating Sponsor and Recipient Agencies?
1599.11 What procedures apply to sales and barter of commodities provided and the use of proceeds?
1599.12 What procedures apply to the processing, packaging and labeling of commodities in the foreign country?
1599.13 How does the Cooperating Sponsor dispose of commodities unfit for authorized use?
1599.14 How is liability established for loss, damage, or improper distribution of commodities?
1599.15 Are there special record keeping and reporting requirements?
1599.16 What are the Cooperating Sponsor's audit requirements?
1599.17 When may FAS suspend a program?
1599.18 Are there sample documents and guidelines available for developing proposals and reports?
Authority: 7 U.S.C. 1736-1; Presidential Memorandum, March 11, 2003 (68 FR 12569).
Sec. 1599.1 What special definitions apply?
Activity--a Cooperating Sponsor's use of agricultural commodities and financial and technical assistance provided under Program Agreements.
Agricultural Counselor or Attache--the United States Foreign Agricultural Service representative stationed abroad, who has been assigned responsibilities with regard to the country into which the commodities provided are imported, or such representative's designee.
Associate Administrator--Associate Administrator, Foreign Agricultural Service.
CCC--the Commodity Credit Corporation.
Commodities--U.S. agricultural commodities or products.
Deputy Administrator--Deputy Administrator for Export Credits, Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
Director, CCC-OD--the Director, CCC Operations Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
Director, PAD--the Director, Program Administration Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
Director, PPDED--the Director, Program Planning, Development & Evaluation Division, Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
FAS--Foreign Agricultural Service, USDA.
Force Majeure--damage caused by perils of the sea or other waters; collisions; wrecks; stranding without the fault of the carrier; jettison; fire from any cause; Act of God; public enemies or pirates; arrest or restraint of princes, princesses, rulers of peoples without the fault of the carrier; wars; public disorders; captures; or detention by public authority in the interest of public safety.
KCCO--Kansas City Commodity Office, Farm Services Agency, USDA, P.O. Box 419205, Kansas City, Missouri, 64141-6205.
KCMO/DMD--Debt Management Division, Kansas City Management Office, Farm Services Agency, USDA, P.O. Box 419205, Kansas City, Missouri, 64141-6205.
Ocean freight differential--the amount, as determined by FAS, by which the cost of ocean transportation is higher than would otherwise be the case by reason of the requirement that the commodities be transported on U.S.-flag vessels.
Program Agreement--an agreement entered into by FAS and Cooperating Sponsors to implement the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program.
Program income--interest on sale proceeds and money received by the Cooperating Sponsor, other than sales proceeds, as a result of carrying out approved activities.
Recipient agency--an entity located in the importing country which receives commodities or commodity sale proceeds from a Cooperating Sponsor for the purpose of implementing activities.
Sale proceeds--money received by a Cooperating Sponsor from the sale of commodities.
USDA--the United States Department of Agriculture.
Sec. 1599.2 What is the general purpose and scope of the regulations?
(a) This part establishes the general terms and conditions governing the donation of commodities and financial and technical assistance to Cooperating Sponsors under the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program. This part does not apply to donations to intergovernmental agencies or organizations (such as the World Food Program) unless FAS and such intergovernmental agency or organization enter into an agreement incorporating this part. Cooperating Sponsors should also familiarize themselves with regulations at 7 CFR part 3019-Uniform Administrative Requirements for Grants and Agreements with Institutions of Higher Education, Hospitals and Other Non-Profit Organizations.
(b) In addition to the regulations in this part 1599, grants awarded to non-governmental Cooperating Sponsors by FAS are subject to 7 CFR 3015.205, 7 CFR part 3019 and 7 CFR part 3052.
Sec. 1599.3 Are there eligibility requirements for Cooperating Sponsors?
A Cooperating Sponsor may be either:
(a) A foreign government;
(b) An entity registered with the Agency for International Development (AID) in accordance with AID regulations; or
(c) An entity that demonstrates to FAS'' satisfaction:
(1) Organizational experience and resources available to implement and manage the type of program proposed, i.e., targeted food assistance, activities that improve the food security, health and nutrition of women and children, and economic development activities;
(2) Experience working in the targeted country; and
(3) Experience and knowledge on the part of personnel who will be responsible for implementing and managing the program. FAS may require that an entity submit a financial statement demonstrating that it has the financial means to implement an effective donation program.
Sec. 1599.4 How do I apply?
To apply for this program, a Cooperating Sponsor shall submit an SF-424, a Program Introduction, a Plan of Operation, and a Budget Proposal to the Director, PPDED and to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache responsible for the country where activities are to be implemented. Electronic submissions of these items are preferred, particularly through the FAS on-line system. If on-line submission is not available, e-mail or hard copy are acceptable.
(a) Submit an SF-424. (b) Program Introduction shall include the following:
(1) Information about the organization's past food aid activities with particular emphasis on school feeding, maternal child health or other relevant development activities, its experience within the country where the program is proposed, and any other relevant information to demonstrate its capability to implement the program in the country, with particular emphasis on the organizations ability to:
(i) Identify and assess the needs of beneficiaries, especially malnourished or undernourished mothers and their children who are 5 years of age or younger, and school-age children who are malnourished, undernourished, or do not regularly attend school;
(ii) In the case of preschool and school-age children, target low-income areas where children's enrollment and attendance in school is low or girls' enrollment and participation in preschool or school is low;
(iii) Incorporate developmental objectives for improving literacy and primary education (especially with girls); and,
(iv) In the case of maternal and child nutrition activities, coordinate supplementary feeding and nutrition programs with existing or newly established maternal, infant, and child programs that meet maternal, prenatal, postnatal, and newborns health needs;
(2) Reasons for the need for the food aid and in particular a school feeding program in the country. The organization shall include statistics on poverty, food deficits, and related items such as literacy rates for the target population; percentage of school age children attending schools, especially females; malnutrition rates; public expenditures on primary education; country's current school feeding operations, if they exists, along with current funding resources; any information regarding teacher training, community infrastructure (PTAs), health, nutrition, and water and sanitation information; and lastly, other potential donors;
(3) Verification that the national government is committed to or is working toward, through a national action plan, the goals of the World Declaration on Education for All convened in 1990 in Jomtien, Thailand, and the follow-up Dakar Framework for Action of the World Education Forum, convened in 2000;
(4) Steps to graduate the program from food aid and address sustainability, or sustainable program components, which will continue after the end of food aid donations. In addressing graduation or sustainability, address how the program will sustain the benefits of the education, enrollment, and attendance of children in schools in the targeted communities when the provision of commodities and assistance to a recipient country under FFE terminates; and estimate the time required until the recipient country or eligible organizations will be able to provide sufficient assistance without additional assistance under FFE; or in the absence of sustainability explain how the program will provide other long term benefits to targeted populations of the recipient country;
(5) Information on methods used to involve indigenous institutions as well as local communities and governments in the development and implementation of the programs and activities to foster local capacity building and leadership;
(6) An explanation of how each requested expenditure identified in Sec. 1599.6(b)(4)(i) would enhance the effectiveness of the activities implemented under this subpart. For purposes of this section, ``expenditures that would enhance the effectiveness of the activities implemented under this subpart'' are those expenditures which would increase the likelihood of meeting the objectives of the activities as stated in the Plan of Operation. Examples of costs that may enhance the effectiveness of a school feeding program may be the purchase of utensils and food trays, text books, and incentives for teachers, as well as the use of consultancies to provide technical assistance in the educational improvement area when conducting teacher training. These costs may include a limited amount to procure locally produced foods.
(7) If your proposal includes monetization or barter, demonstrate that monetization or bartering of commodities offers more benefits than a direct cash outlay.
(c) A Plan of Operation shall provide the following information:
(1) Country of donation.
(2) Kind, quantity and delivery schedule of commodities requested.
(3) Activity objectives. Briefly state what the goals to be accomplished for the program are.
(4) Program description shall include the following:
(i) Fully describe the steps involved in program implementation;
(ii) Method for choosing beneficiaries of activities;
(iii) Program administration, including a description of the Cooperating Sponsors plan to develop, implement, monitor, report on, and provide accountability for activities. The Cooperating Sponsor shall also include, as appropriate, plans for administering the distribution or sale of commodities and the expenditure of sale proceeds, and identification of the administrative or technical personnel who will implement the activities;
(iv) Activity budgets, including costs that will be borne by the Cooperating Sponsor, other organizations or local governments. If a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor requests FAS to fund costs identified in Sec. 1599.6 (b)(4)(i), the Cooperating Sponsor shall include a detailed description of:
(A) The costs for which funding is requested; and,
(B) The amount of funding requested for each cost;
(v) The recipient agency, if any, that will be involved in the program and a description of each recipient agency's capability to perform its responsibilities as stated in the Plan of Operation;
(vi) Governmental or nongovernmental entities involved in the program and the extent to which the program will strengthen or increase the capabilities of such entities to further economic development in the recipient country. The Cooperating Sponsor shall also include a description of the steps that the government of the host country is taking to improve the preschool and school systems in the country;
(vii) Method of educating consumers as to the source of the provided commodities and, where appropriate, preparation and use of the commodity; and
(viii) Criteria for measuring progress towards achieving the objectives of activities and evaluating program outcome, including health, nutrition and education.
(5) Use of funds or goods and services generated. If the activity involves the use of sale proceeds, the receipt of goods or services from the barter of commodities, or the use of program income, the cooperating sponsor shall provide the following information:
(i) The quantity and type of commodities to be sold or bartered;
(ii) Extent to which any sale or barter of the agricultural commodities provided would displace or interfere with any sales that may otherwise be made;
(iii) The amount of sale proceeds anticipated to be generated from the sale, the value of the goods or services anticipated to be generated from the barter of the agricultural commodities provided, or the amount of program income expected to be generated;
(iv) The steps taken to use, to the extent possible, the private sector in the process of selling commodities;
(v) The specific uses of sale proceeds or program income and a timetable for their expenditure; and
(vi) Procedures for assuring the receipt and deposit of sale proceeds and program income into a separate special account and procedures for the disbursement of the proceeds and program income from such special account.
(6) Distribution methods:
(i) A description of the transportation and storage system which will be used to move the agricultural commodities from the receiving port to the point at which distribution is made to the recipient;
(ii) A description of any reprocessing or repackaging of the commodities that will take place; and
(iii) A logistics plan that demonstrates the adequacy of port, transportation, storage, and warehouse facilities to handle the flow of commodities to recipients without undue spoilage or waste.
(7) Duty free entry: Documentation indicating that any commodities to be distributed to recipients, rather than sold, will be imported and distributed free from all customs, duties, tolls, and taxes.
(8) Economic impact: Information indicating that the commodities can be imported and distributed without a disruptive impact upon production, prices and marketing of the same or like products within the importing country.
(d) Budget Proposals shall include funds requested, from either cash or monetization resources, to fund administrative, ITSH, technical and financial assistance costs. Budget proposals shall be submitted in a spreadsheet format.
(e) After submission and approval by FAS, a Program Agreement will be developed. The Program Agreement, which will incorporate the terms and conditions set forth in this Part, the commodities provided by FAS, and any packaging, will meet the specifications set forth in such Program Agreement. A Program Agreement may contain special terms or conditions, in addition to or in lieu of, the terms and conditions set forth in the regulations in this part when FAS determines that such special terms or conditions are necessary to effectively carry out the particular Program Agreement. The Plan of Operation, Budget Proposal, and Commodity specifications will be incorporated into the Program Agreement as Attachments.
Sec. 1599.5 When is a usual marketing requirement included?
(a) A foreign government Cooperating Sponsor shall provide to the Director, PPDED, data showing commercial and non-commercial imports of the types of agricultural commodities requested during the prior five years, by country of origin, and an estimate of imports of such commodities during the current year.
(b) FAS may require that a Program Agreement with a foreign government include a "usual marketing requirement'' that establishes a specific level of imports for a specified period. The Program Agreement may also include a prohibition on the export of provided commodities, as well as of other similar commodities specified in the Program Agreement.
Sec. 1599.6 How are costs and advances apportioned?
(a) FAS will bear the costs of the packaging, enrichment, preservation, and fortification of agricultural commodities, and the processing, transportation, handling and other incidental charges incurred in delivering commodities to Cooperating Sponsors. FAS will deliver bulk grain shipments f.o.b. vessel, and shipments of all other commodities f.a.s. vessel or intermodal points. FAS will choose the point of delivery based on lowest cost to FAS.
(b) When the Associate Administrator approves in advance and in writing, FAS may agree to bear all or a portion of reasonable costs associated with:
(1) Transportation from U.S. ports to designated ports or points of entry abroad;
(2) Maritime survey costs;
(3) Transportation from designated ports or points of entry abroad to designated storage and distribution sites, and reasonable storage and distribution costs if the recipient country is a low income, net food-importing country that:
(i) Meets the poverty criteria established by the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development for Civil Works Preference; and
(ii) Has a national government that is committed to or is working toward, through a national action plan, the goals of the World Declaration on Education for All and the Dakar Framework for Action of the World Education Forum; and
(4) The costs of a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor:
(i) In the recipient country that enhance the effectiveness of the activities including packaging, enrichment, preservation and fortification of agricultural commodities; and
(ii) For administrative or monitoring expenses specified in the program agreement.
(5) The administrative expenses of any Federal agency implementing or assisting in the implementation of the McGovern-Dole International Food for Education and Child Nutrition Program, including the administrative costs of the Food and Nutrition Service to provide technical advice on the establishment and implementation of programs, including providing field expertise in recipient countries.
(c) FAS will not pay any costs incurred by the Cooperating Sponsor prior to the date of the Program Agreement.
(d) Except as provided in paragraph (b) of this section, the Cooperating Sponsor shall ordinarily bear all costs incurred subsequent to FAS' delivery of commodities at U.S. ports or intermodal points.
(e) A Cooperating Sponsor seeking agreement by FAS to bear the storage and distribution costs identified in paragraph (b)(3) or the costs identified in paragraph (b)(4) of this section shall submit to the Director, PPDED, a Program Operation Budget detailing such costs. If approved, the Program Operation Budget shall become part of the Program Agreement. The non-governmental Cooperating Sponsor may make adjustments between line items of an approved Program Operation Budget up to 10 percent of the total amount of the budget as last approved without any further approval. Adjustments beyond these limits must be specifically approved by the Director, PPDED.
(f) The Cooperating Sponsor may request advance of up to 100 percent of the amount of an approved Program Operating Budget if FAS determines that the Cooperating Sponsor's financial management system meets the requirements of 7 CFR 3019.21. However, FAS will not approve any request for an advance received earlier than 60 days after the date of a previous advance made in connection with the same Program Agreement.
(g) Funds advanced shall be deposited in an interest bearing account until expended. Interest earned on advance of funds must be returned to FAS.
(h) The Cooperating Sponsor shall return to FAS any funds not obligated as of the 180th day after being advanced, together with interest earned on such unexpended funds. Funds and interest shall be returned within 30 days of such date.
(i) The Cooperating Sponsor shall, not later than 10 days after the end of each calendar quarter, submit a financial statement to the Director, PPDED, accounting for all funds advanced and all interest earned.
(j) FAS will pay all other costs for which it is obligated under the Program Agreement by reimbursement. However, FAS will not pay any cost incurred after the final date specified in the Program Agreement.
(k) Program income may be used to further eligible activity objectives.
Sec. 1599.7 What procedures apply to procuring ocean transportation?
(a) Cargo preference. Shipments of commodities are subject to the requirements of sections 901(b) and 901b of the Merchant Marine Act, 1936, regarding carriage on U.S.-flag vessels. A Cooperating Sponsor shall comply with the instructions of FAS regarding the quantity of commodities that must be carried on U.S. flag vessels.
(b) Freight procurement requirements. When FAS is financing any portion of the ocean freight, whether on U.S. flag or non-U.S. flag vessels, and the Cooperating Sponsor arranges ocean transportation:
(1) The Cooperating Sponsor shall arrange ocean transportation through competitive bidding and shall obtain approval of all invitations for bids from the Director, CCC-OD.
(2) Invitations for bids shall be issued through the Transportation News Ticker (TNT), New York, and at least one other comparable means of trade communication.
(3) Freight invitations for bids shall include specified procedures for payment of freight, including the party responsible for the freight payments, and expressly require that:
(i) Offers include a contract canceling date no later than the last contract layday specified in the invitation for bids;
(ii) Offered rates be quoted in U.S. dollars per metric ton;
(iii) If destination bagging or transportation to a point beyond the discharge port is required, the offer separately state the total rate and the portion thereof attributable to the ocean segment of the movement;
(iv) Any non-liner U.S. flag vessel 15 years or older offer, in addition to any other offered rate, a one-way rate applicable in the event the vessel is scrapped or transferred to foreign flag registry prior to the end of the return voyage to the United States;
(v) In the case of packaged commodities, U.S. flag carriers specify whether delivery will be direct breakbulk shipment, container shipment, or breakbulk transshipment and identify whether transshipment (including container relays) will be via U.S. or foreign flag vessel;
(vi) Vessels offered subject to Maritime Administration approval will not be accepted; and
(vii) Offers be received by a specified closing time, which must be the same for both U.S. and non-U.S. flag vessels.
(4) In the case of shipments of bulk commodities and non-liner shipments of packaged commodities, the Cooperating Sponsor shall open offers in public in the United States at the time and place specified in the invitation for bids and consider only offers that are responsive to the invitation for bids without negotiation. Late offers shall not be considered or accepted.
(5) All responsive offers received for both U.S. flag and foreign flag service shall be presented to KCCO which will determine the extent to which U.S.-flag vessels will be used.
(6) The Cooperating Sponsor shall promptly furnish the Director, CCC-OD, or other official specified in the Program Agreement, copies of all offers received with the time of receipt indicated thereon. The Director, CCC-OD, or other official specified in the Program Agreement, will approve all vessel fixtures. The Cooperating Sponsor may fix vessels subject to the required approval; however, the Cooperating Sponsor shall not confirm a vessel fixture until advised of the required approval and the results of the Maritime Administration's guideline rate review. The Cooperating Sponsor shall not request guideline rate advice from the Maritime Administration. The Cooperating Sponsor will, promptly after receipt of vessel approval, issue a public notice of the fixture details on the TNT or other means of communication approved by the Director, CCC-OD.
(7) Non-Vessel Operating Common Carriers may not be employed to carry shipments on either U.S. or foreign-flag vessels.
(8) The Cooperating Sponsor shall promptly furnish the Director CCC-OD, a copy of the signed laytime statement and statement of facts at the discharge port.
(c) Shipping agents. (1) The Cooperating Sponsor may appoint a shipping agent to assist in the procurement of ocean transportation. The Cooperating Sponsor shall nominate the shipping agent in writing to the Deputy Administrator, Room 4077-S, Foreign Agricultural Service, U.S. Department of Agriculture, Washington, DC 20250-1031, and include a copy of the proposed agency agreement. The Cooperating Sponsor shall specify the time period of the nomination.
(2) The shipping agent so nominated shall submit the information and certifications required by 7 CFR 17.4 to the Deputy Administrator.
(3) A person may not act as a shipping agent for a Cooperating Sponsor unless the Deputy Administrator has notified the Cooperating Sponsor in writing that the nomination is accepted.
(d) Commissions. (1) When any portion of the ocean freight is paid by FAS, total commissions earned on U.S. and foreign flag bookings by all parties arranging vessel fixtures, shall not exceed 2-1/2 percent of the total freight costs.
(2) Address commissions are prohibited.
(e) Contract terms. When FAS is paying any portion of the ocean freight, charter parties and liner booking contracts must conform to the following requirements, as applicable:
(1) Packaged commodities on liner vessels shall be shipped on the basis of full berth terms with no demurrage or despatch;
(2) Shipments of bulk liquid commodities may be contracted in accordance with trade custom. Other bulk commodities, including shipments that require bagging or stacking for the account of the vessel, shall be shipped on the basis of vessel load, free out, with demurrage and despatch applicable at load and discharge ports; except that, if bulk commodities require further inland distribution, they shall be shipped on the basis of vessel load with demurrage and despatch at load and berth terms discharge, i.e., no demurrage, despatch, or detention at discharge. Demurrage and despatch shall be settled between the ocean carrier and commodity suppliers at load port and between the ocean carrier and charterers at discharge ports. FAS is not responsible for resolving disputes involving the calculation of laytime or the payment of demurrage or despatch.
(3) If the Program Agreement requires the Cooperating Sponsor to arrange an irrevocable letter of credit for ocean freight, the Cooperating Sponsor shall be liable for detention of the vessel for loading delays attributable solely to the decision of the ocean carrier not to commence loading because of the failure of the Cooperating Sponsor to establish such letter of credit. Charter parties and liner booking contracts may not contain a specified detention rate. The ocean carrier shall be entitled to reimbursement, as damages for detention charter party or liner booking contract, and upon notification of the vessel's readiness to load in accordance with the terms of the applicable charter party or liner booking contract. The period of such delay shall end at the time that operable irrevocable letters of credit have been established for ocean freight or the time the vessel begins loading, whichever is earlier. Time calculated as detention shall not count as laytime. Reimbursement for such detention shall be payable no later than upon the vessel's arrival at the first port of discharge.
(4) Charges including, but not limited to charges for inspection, fumigation, and carrying charges, attributable to the failure of the vessel to present before the canceling date will be for the account of the ocean carrier.
(5) Ocean freight is earned under a charter party when the vessel and cargo arrive at the first port of discharge, Provided, That if a force majeure prevents the vessel's arrival at the first port of discharge, 100% of the ocean freight is payable or, if the charter party provides for completing additional requirements after discharge such as bagging, stacking, or inland transportation, not more than 85% of the ocean freight is payable, at the time the Associate Administrator determines that such force majeure was the cause of nonarrival; and
(6) When the ocean carrier offers delivery to destination ports on U.S.-flag vessels, but foreign-flag vessels are used for any part of the voyage to the destination port without first obtaining the approval of the Cooperating Sponsor, KCCO, and any other approval that may be required by the Program Agreement, the ocean freight rate will be reduced to the lowest responsive foreign-flag vessel rate offered in response to the same invitation for bids and the carrier agrees to pay FAS the difference between the contracted ocean freight rate and the freight rate offered by such foreign-flag vessel.
(f) Coordination between FAS and the Cooperating Sponsor. When a Program Agreement specifies that the Cooperating Sponsor will arrange ocean transportation:
(1) FAS will provide that KCCO furnishes the Cooperating Sponsor, or its agent, a Notice of Commodity Availability (Form FAS-512) which will specify the receiving country, commodity, quantity, and date at U.S. port or intermodal delivery point.
(2) The Cooperating Sponsor shall complete the Form FAS-512 indicating name of steamship company, vessel name, vessel flag and estimated time of arrival at U.S. port; and shall sign and return the completed form to KCCO, with a copy to the Director, CCC-OD. If FAS agrees to pay any part of the ocean transportation for liner cargoes, the Cooperating Sponsor shall also indicate on the Form FAS-512 the applicable Federal Maritime Commission tariff rate, and tariff identification.
(3) FAS will arrange for KCCO to issue instructions to have the commodity delivered f.a.s. or f.o.b. vessel, U.S. port of export or intermodal delivery point, consigned to the Cooperating Sponsor.
(g) Documents required for payment of freight--(1) General rule. To receive payment for ocean freight, the Cooperating Sponsor shall submit the following documents to the Director, CCC-OD:
(i) One signed copy of completed Form FAS-512;
(ii) Four copies of the original on-board bills of lading indicating the freight rate and signed by the originating carrier;
(iii) For all non-containerized grain cargoes,
(A) One signed copy of the Federal Grain Inspection Service (FGIS) Official Stowage Examination Certificate (Vessel Hold Certificate);
(B) One signed copy of the National Cargo Bureau Certificate of Readiness (Vessel Hold Inspection Certificate); and
(C) One signed copy of the National Cargo Bureau Certificate of Loading;
(iv) For all containerized grain and grain product cargoes, one copy of the FGIS Container Condition Inspection Certificate;
(v) One signed copy of liner booking note or charter party covering ocean transportation of cargo;
(vi) For charter shipments, a signed notice of arrival at first discharge port submitted by the Cooperating Sponsor;
(vii) For all liner cargoes, a copy of the tariff page; (viii) Four copies of either:
(A) A request by the Cooperating Sponsor for reimbursement of ocean freight or ocean freight differential indicating the amount due, and accompanied by a certification from the ocean carrier that payment has been received from the Cooperating Sponsor; or
(B) A request for direct payment to the ocean carrier, indicating amount due; or
(C) A request for direct payment of ocean freight differential to the ocean carrier accompanied by a certification from the carrier that payment of the Cooperating Sponsor's portion of the ocean freight has been received.
(ix) Each request to FAS for payment must provide a document, on letterhead and signed by an official or agent of the requester, the name of the entity to receive payment, the bank ABA number to which payment is to be made; the account number for the deposit at the bank; the requester's taxpayer identification number; and the type of the account into which funds will be deposited.
(2) In cases of force majeure. To receive payment in cases where the Associate Administrator determines that circumstances of force majeure have prevented the vessel's arrival at the first port of discharge, the Cooperating Sponsor shall submit all documents required by paragraph (g)(1) of this section except for the notice of arrival required by paragraph (g)(1)(vi) of this section.
(h) FAS payment of ocean freight or ocean freight differential. (1) General rule. FAS will pay, not later than 30 days after receipt in good order of the required documentation, 100 percent of either the ocean freight or the ocean freight differential, whichever is specified in the Program Agreement.
(2) Additional requirements after discharge. Where the charter party or liner booking note provide for the completion of additional services after discharge, such as bagging, stacking or inland transportation, FAS will pay, not later than 30 days after receipt in good order of the required documentation, either not more than 85 percent of the total freight charges or 100 percent of the ocean freight differential, whichever is specified in the Program Agreement. FAS will pay the remaining balance, if any, of the freight charges not later than 30 days after receipt of notification from the Cooperating Sponsor that such additional services have been provided; except that FAS will not pay any remaining balance where the Associate Administrator determines that the vessel's arrival at first port of discharge was prevented by force majeure.
(3) No demurrage. FAS will not pay demurrage.
Sec. 1599.8 Who arranges for entry and handling in the foreign country?
(a) The Cooperating Sponsor shall make all necessary arrangements for receiving the commodities in the recipient country, including obtaining appropriate approvals for entry and transit. The Cooperating Sponsor shall store and maintain the commodities from time of delivery at port of entry or point of receipt from originating carrier in good condition until their distribution, sale or barter.
(b) When FAS has agreed to pay costs of transporting, storing, and distributing commodities from designated points of entry or ports of entry, the Cooperating Sponsor shall arrange for such services, by through bill of lading, or by contracting directly with suppliers of services, as FAS may approve. If the Cooperating Sponsor contracts directly with the suppliers of such services, the Cooperating Sponsor may seek reimbursement by submitting documentation to FAS indicating actual costs incurred. All supporting documentation must be sent to the Director, CCC-OD. FAS, at its option, will reimburse the Cooperating Sponsor for the cost of such services in U.S. dollars at the exchange rate in effect on the date of payment by FAS, or in foreign currency.
Sec. 1599.9 What are the restrictions on commodity use and distribution?
(a) The Cooperating Sponsor may use the commodities provided only in accordance with the terms of the Program Agreement.
(b) In the event that its participation in the program terminates, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor will safeguard any undistributed commodities and sales proceeds and dispose of such commodities and proceeds as directed by FAS.
Sec. 1599.10 Are there special requirements for agreements between Cooperating Sponsor and Recipient Agencies?
(a) The Cooperating Sponsor shall enter into a written agreement with a recipient agency prior to the transfer of any commodities, sale proceeds or program income to the recipient agency. Copies of such agreements shall be provided to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache, and the Director, PPDED. Such agreements shall require the recipient agency to pay the Cooperating Sponsor the value of any commodities, sale proceeds or program income that are used for purposes not expressly permitted under the Program Agreement, or that are lost, damaged, or misused as a result of the recipient agency's failure to exercise reasonable care;
(b) FAS may waive the requirements of paragraph (a) of this section where it determines that such an agreement is not feasible or appropriate.
Sec. 1599.11 What procedures apply to sales and barter of commodities provided and the use of proceeds?
(a) Commodities may be sold or bartered without the prior approval of FAS FAS) FAS; except that, a Cooperating Sponsor may use such sale proceeds or interest to pay for repairs or rehabilitation of a structure located on such real property to the extent necessary to avoid spoilage or loss of provided commodities but only if such structure is not used in whole or in part for any religious or sectarian purposes while the provided commodities are stored in such structure. When not approved in the Plan of Operation, such use may be approved by the Agricultural Counselor or Att Director, PPDED, an inventory of all assets acquired with sale proceeds or interest or program income. In the event that its participation in the program terminates, the Cooperating Sponsor shall dispose, at the direction of the Director, PPDED, of any property, real or personal, so acquired.
Sec. 1599.12 What procedures apply to the processing, packaging and labeling of commodities in the foreign country?
(a) Cooperating Sponsors may arrange for the processing of commodities provided under the Program Agreement, or for packaging or repackaging prior to distribution. When a third party provides such processing, packaging or repackaging, the Cooperating Sponsor shall enter into a written agreement requiring that the provider of such services maintain adequate records to account for all commodities delivered and submit periodic reports to the Cooperating Sponsor. The Cooperating Sponsor shall submit a copy of the executed agreement to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache.
(b) If, prior to distribution, the Cooperating Sponsor arranges for packaging or repackaging commodities, the packaging shall be plainly labeled in the language of the country in which the commodities are to be distributed with the name of the commodity and, except where the commodities are to be sold or bartered after processing, packaging or repackaging, to indicate that the commodity is furnished by the people of the United States of America and not to be sold or exchanged. If the commodities are not packaged, the Cooperating Sponsor shall, to the extent practicable, display banners, posters or other media containing the information prescribed in this paragraph.
(c) FAS will reimburse Cooperating Sponsors that are nonprofit private voluntary organizations or cooperatives for expenses incurred for repackaging if the packages of commodities are discharged from the vessel in damaged condition, and are repackaged to ensure that the commodities arrive at the distribution point in wholesome condition. No prior approval is required for such expenses equaling $500 or less. If such expense is estimated to exceed $500, the authority to repackage and incur such expense must be approved by the Agricultural Counselor or Attache in advance of repackaging.
Sec. 1599.13 How does the Cooperating Sponsor dispose of commodities unfit for authorized use?
(a) Prior to delivery to Cooperating Sponsor at discharge port or point of entry. If the commodity is damaged prior to delivery to a governmental Cooperating Sponsor at discharge port or point of entry overseas, the Agricultural Counselor or Attache will immediately arrange for inspection by a public health official or other competent authority. If the commodity is damaged prior to delivery to a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor at the discharge port or point of entry, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall arrange for such inspection. If inspection discloses the commodity to be unfit for the use authorized in the Program Agreement, the Agricultural Counselor or Attache or the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall dispose of the commodities in accordance with the priority set forth in paragraph (b) of this section. Expenses incidental to the handling and disposition of the damaged commodity will be paid by FAS from the sale proceeds or from an appropriate FAS account designated by FAS. The net proceeds of sales shall be deposited with the U.S. Disbursing Officer, American Embassy, in an account designated by FAS; however, if the commodities are provided for a sales program, the net sale proceeds, net of expenses incidental to handling and disposition of the damaged commodity, shall be deposited to the special account established for sale proceeds. The Cooperating Sponsor shall consult with FAS regarding the inspection and disposition of commodities and accounting for sale proceeds in the event the Cooperating Sponsor executed a sales agreement under which title passed to the purchaser prior to delivery to the Cooperating Sponsor.
(b) After delivery to Cooperating Sponsor. (1) If after arrival in a foreign country and after delivery to a Cooperating Sponsor, it appears that the commodity, or any part thereof, may be unfit for the use authorized in the Program Agreement, the Cooperating Sponsor shall immediately arrange for inspection of the commodity by a public health official or other competent authority approved by the Agricultural Counselor or Attache. If no competent local authority is available, the Agricultural Counselor or Attache may determine whether the commodities are unfit for the use authorized in the Program Agreement and, if so, may direct disposal in accordance with this paragraph. The Cooperating Sponsor shall arrange for the recovery of that portion of the commodities designated during the inspection as suitable for authorized use. If, upon inspection, the commodity (or any part thereof) is determined to be unfit for the authorized use, the Cooperating Sponsor shall notify the Agricultural Counselor or Attache of the circumstances pertaining to the loss or damage. With the concurrence of the Agricultural Counselor or Attache, the commodity determined to be unfit for authorized use shall be disposed of in the following order of priority:
(i) By transfer to an approved USDA sponsored program for use as livestock feed. FAS shall be advised promptly of any such transfer so that shipments from the United States to the livestock feeding program can be reduced by an equivalent amount;
(ii) Sale for the most appropriate use, i.e., animal feed, fertilizer, or industrial use, at the highest obtainable price. When the commodity is sold, all U.S. Government markings shall be obliterated or removed;
(iii) By donation to a governmental or charitable organization for use as animal feed or for other non-food use; or
(iv) If the commodity is unfit for any use or if disposal in accordance with paragraph (b)(1)(i), (ii) or (iii) of this section is not possible, the commodity shall be destroyed under the observation of a representative of the Agricultural Counselor or Attache, if practicable, in such manner as to prevent its use for any purpose.
(2) Actual expenses incurred, including third party costs, in effecting any sale may be deducted from the sale proceeds and, if the commodities were intended for direct distribution, the Cooperating Sponsor shall deposit the net proceeds with the U.S. Disbursing Officer, American Embassy, with instructions to credit the deposit to an account as designated by FAS. If the commodities were intended to be sold, the Cooperating Sponsor shall deposit the gross proceeds into the special interest bearing account and, after approved costs related to the handling and disposition of damaged commodities are paid, shall use the remaining funds for purposes of the approved program. The Cooperating Sponsor shall promptly furnish to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache a written report of all circumstances relating to the loss and damage on any commodity loss in excess of $5,000; quarterly reports shall be made on all other losses. If the commodity was inspected by a public health official or other competent authority, the report and any supplemental report shall include a certification by such public health official or other competent authority as to the condition of the commodity and the exact quantity of the damaged commodity disposed. Such certification shall be obtained as soon as possible after the discharge of the cargo. A report must also be provided to the Chief, Debt Management Division, KCMO/DMD, of action taken to dispose of commodities unfit for authorized use.
Sec. 1599.14 How is liability established for loss, damage, or improper distribution of commodities?
(a) Fault of Cooperating Sponsor prior to loading on ocean vessel. The Cooperating Sponsor shall immediately notify KCCO, Chief, Export Operations Division if the Cooperating Sponsor will not have a vessel for loading at the U.S. port of export in accordance with the agreed shipping schedule. FAS will determine whether the commodity will be: moved to another available outlet; stored at the port for delivery to the Cooperating Sponsor when a vessel is available for loading; or disposed of as FAS may deem proper. The Cooperating Sponsor shall take such action as directed by FAS and shall reimburse FAS for expenses incurred if FAS determines that the expenses were incurred because of the fault or negligence of the Cooperating Sponsor.
(b) Fault of others prior to loading on ocean vessel. The Cooperating Sponsor shall immediately notify the Chief, Debt Management Office, KCMO/DMD, when any damage or loss to the commodity occurs that is attributable to a warehouseman, carrier, or other person between the time title is transferred to a Cooperating Sponsor and the time the commodity is loaded on board vessel at the designated port of export. The Cooperating Sponsor shall promptly assign to CCC any rights to claims which may arise as a result of such loss or damage and shall promptly forward to CCC all documents pertaining thereto. CCC shall have the right to initiate claims, and retain the proceeds of all claims, for such loss or damage.
(c) Survey and outturn reports related to claims against ocean carriers. (1) If the Program Agreement provides that CCC will arrange for an independent cargo surveyor to attend the discharge of the cargo, CCC will require the surveyor to provide a copy of the report to the Cooperating Sponsor.
(2)(i) If the Cooperating Sponsor arranges for an independent cargo surveyor, the Cooperating Sponsor shall forward to the Chief, Debt Management Office, KCMO/DMD, any narrative chronology or other commentary it can provide to assist in the adjudication of ocean transportation claims and shall prepare such a narrative in any case where the loss is estimated to be in excess of $5,000.00. The Cooperating Sponsor may, at its option, also engage the independent surveyor to supervise clearance and delivery of the cargo from customs or port areas to the Cooperating Sponsor or its agent and to issue delivery survey reports thereon.
(ii) In the event of cargo loss and damage, the Cooperating Sponsor shall provide to the Chief, Debt Management Office, KCMO/DMD, the names and addresses of individuals who were present at the time of discharge and during survey and who can verify the quantity lost or damaged. For bulk grain shipments, in those cases where the Cooperating Sponsor is responsible for survey and outturn reports, the Cooperating Sponsor shall obtain the services of an independent surveyor to:
(A) Observe the discharge of the cargo;
(B) Report on discharging methods including scale type, calibrations and any other factor which may affect the accuracy of scale weights, and, if scales are not used, state the reason therefore and describe the actual method used to determine weights;
(C) Estimate the quantity of cargo, if any, lost during discharge through carrier negligence;
(D) Advise on the quality of sweepings;
(E) Obtain copies of port or vessel records, if possible, showing quantity discharged;
(F) Provide immediate notification to the Cooperating Sponsor if additional services are necessary to protect cargo interests or if the surveyor has reason to believe that the correct quantity was not discharged; and
(G) In the case of shipments arriving in container vans, as container vans are opened.
(iii) Cooperating Sponsors shall send copies to KCMO/DMD, Chief, Debt Management Office of all reports and documents pertaining to the discharge of commodities.
(iv) FAS will reimburse the Cooperating Sponsor for costs incurred upon receipt of the survey report and the surveyor's invoice or other documents that establish the survey cost. FAS will not reimburse a Cooperating Sponsor for the costs of a delivery survey unless the surveyor also prepares a discharge survey, or for any other survey not taken contemporaneously with the discharge of the vessel, unless FAS determines that such action was justified in the circumstances.
(3) Survey contracts shall be let on a competitive bid basis unless FAS determines that the use of competitive bids would not be practicable. FAS may preclude the use of certain surveyors because of conflicts of interest or lack of demonstrated capability to properly carry out surveying responsibilities.
(4) If practicable, all surveys shall be conducted jointly by the surveyor, the consignee, and the ocean carrier, and the survey report shall be signed by all parties.
(d) Ocean carrier loss and damage. (1) Notwithstanding transfer of title, CCC shall have the right to file, pursue, and retain the proceeds of collection from claims arising from ocean transportation cargo loss and damage arising out of shipments of commodities provided to governmental Cooperating Sponsors; however, when the Cooperating Sponsor pays the ocean freight or a portion thereof, it shall be entitled to pro rata reimbursement received from any claims related to ocean freight charged. FAS will pay general average contributions for all valid general average incidents which may arise from the movement of commodity to the destination ports. CCC shall receive and retain all allowances in general average.
(2) Nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsors shall: file notice with the ocean carrier immediately upon discovery of any cargo loss or damage, promptly initiate claims against the ocean carriers for such loss and damage, take all necessary action to obtain restitution for losses, and provide CCC copies of all such claims. Notwithstanding the preceding sentence, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor need not file a claim when the cargo loss is less than $100, or in any case when the loss is between $100 and $300 and the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor determines that the cost of filing and collecting the claim will exceed the amount of the claim. The nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall transmit to KCMO/DMD, Chief, Debt Management Office information and documentation on such lost or damaged shipments when no claim is to be filed. In the event of a declaration of General Average:
(i) The Cooperating sponsor shall assign all claim rights to CCC and shall provide CCC all documentation relating to the claim, if applicable;
(ii) CCC shall be responsible for settling general average and marine salvage claims;
(iii) FAS has sole authority to authorize any dispositions of commodities which have not commenced ocean transit or of which the ocean transit is interrupted;
(iv) FAS will receive and retain any monetary proceeds resulting from such disposition;
(v) CCC will initiate, prosecute, and retain all proceeds of cargo loss and damage against ocean carriers and any allowance in general average; and
(vi) FAS will pay any general average or marine salvage claims determined to be due.
(3) Amounts collected by nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsors on claims against ocean carriers which are less than $200 may be retained by the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor. On claims involving loss or damage of $200 or more, nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsors may retain from collections received by them, either $200 plus 10 percent of the difference between $200 and the total amount collected on the claim, up to a maximum of $500; or the actual administrative expenses incurred in collection of the claim, provided retention of such administrative expenses is approved by CCC. Allowable collection costs shall not include attorneys fees, fees of collection agencies, and similar costs. In no event will FAS pay collection costs in excess of the amount collected on the claim.
(4) A nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor also may retain from claim recoveries remaining after allowable deductions for administrative expenses of collection, the amount of any special charges, such as handling and packing costs, which the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor has incurred on the lost or damaged commodity and which are included in the claims and paid by the liable party.
(5) A nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor may redetermine claims on the basis of additional documentation or information not considered when the claims were originally filed when such documentation or information clearly changes the ocean carrier's liability. Approval of such changes by FAS is not required regardless of amount. However, copies of redetermined claims and supporting documentation or information shall be furnished to FAS.
(6) A nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor may negotiate compromise settlements of claims of any amount, provided that proposed compromise settlements of claims having a value of $5,000 or more shall require prior approval in writing by FAS. When a claim is compromised, a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor may retain from the amount collected, the amounts authorized in paragraph (d)(3) of this section, and in addition, an amount representing such percentage of the special charges described in paragraph (d)(4) of this section as compromised amount is to the full amount of the claim. When a claim is less than $600, a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor may terminate collection activity when it is determined that pursuit of such claims will not be economically sound. Approval for such termination by FAS is not required; however, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall notify KCMO/DMD, Chief, Debt Management Division when collection activity on a claim is terminated.
(7) All amounts collected in excess of the amounts authorized in this section to be retained shall be remitted to CCC. For the purpose of determining the amount to be retained by a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor from the proceeds of claims filed against ocean carriers, the word "claim'' shall refer to the loss and damage to commodities which are shipped on the same voyage of the same vessel to the same port destination, irrespective of the kinds of commodities shipped or the number of different bills of lading issued by the carrier.
(8) If a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor is unable to effect collection of a claim or negotiate an acceptable compromise settlement within the applicable period of limitation or any extension thereof granted in writing by the party alleged responsible for the damage, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall assign its rights to the claim to CCC in sufficient time to permit the filing of legal action prior to the expiration of the period of limitation or any extension thereof. Generally, a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor should assign claim rights to CCC no later than 60 days prior to the expiration of the period of limitation or any extension thereof. In all cases, a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall keep CCC informed of the progress of its collection efforts and shall promptly assign their claim rights to CCC upon request. Subsequently, if CCC collects on or settles the claim, CCC shall, except as indicated in this paragraph, pay to a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor the amount to which it would have been entitled had it collected on the claim. The additional 10 percent on amounts collected in excess of $200 will be payable, however, only if CCC determines that reasonable efforts were made to collect the claim prior to the assignment, or if payment is determined to be commensurate with the extra efforts exerted in further documenting the claim. If documentation requirements have not been fulfilled and the lack of such documentation has not been justified to the satisfaction of CCC, CCC will deny payment of all allowances to the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor.
(9) When a nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor permits a claim to become time-barred, or fails to take timely actions to insure the right of CCC to assert such claims, and CCC determines that the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor failed to properly exercise its responsibilities under the Agreement, the nongovernmental Cooperating Sponsor shall be liable to the United States for the cost and freight value of the commodities lost to the program.
(e) Fault of Cooperating Sponsor in country of distribution. If a commodity, sale proceeds or program income is used for a purpose not permitted by the Program Agreement, or if a Cooperating Sponsor causes loss or damage to a commodity, sale proceeds, or program income through any act or omission or failure to provide proper storage, care and handling, FAS may require the Cooperating Sponsor to pay to the United States the value of the commodities, sale proceeds or program income lost, damaged or misused, or undertake other remedies FAS deems appropriate. FAS will consider normal commercial practices in the country of distribution in determining whether there was a proper exercise of the Cooperating Sponsor's responsibility. Payment by the Cooperating Sponsor shall be made in accordance with paragraph (g) of this section.
(f) Fault of others in country of distribution and in intermediate country. (1) In addition to survey or outturn reports to determine ocean carrier loss and damage, the Cooperating Sponsor shall, in the case of landlocked countries, arrange for an independent survey at the point of entry into the recipient country and make a report as set forth in paragraph (c)(l) of this section. FAS will reimburse the Cooperating Sponsor for the costs of survey as set forth in paragraph (c)(2)(iv) of this section.
(2) Where any damage to or loss of the commodity or any loss of sale proceeds or program income is attributable to a warehouseman, carrier or other person, the Cooperating Sponsor shall make every reasonable effort to pursue collection of claims for such loss or damage. The Cooperating Sponsor shall furnish a copy of the claim and related documents to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache. Cooperating Sponsors who fail to file or pursue such claims shall be liable to FAS for the value of the commodities or sale proceeds or program income lost, damaged, or misused: Provided, however, that the Cooperating Sponsor may elect not to file a claim if the loss is less than $500. The Cooperating Sponsor may retain $150 of any amount collected on an individual claim. In addition, Cooperating Sponsors may, with the written approval of the Agricultural Counselor or Attache, retain amounts to cover special costs of collection such as legal fees, or pay such collection costs with sale proceeds or program income. Any proposed settlement for less than the full amount of the claim requires prior approval by the Agricultural Counselor or Attache. When the Cooperating Sponsor has exhausted all reasonable attempts to collect a claim, it shall request the Agricultural Counselor or Attache to provide further instructions.
(3) The Cooperating Sponsor shall pursue any claim by initial billings and at least three subsequent demands at not more than 30 day intervals. If these efforts fail to elicit a satisfactory response, the cooperating sponsor shall pursue legal action in the judicial system of country unless otherwise agreed by the Agricultural Counselor or Attache. The Cooperating Sponsors must inform the Agricultural Counselor or Attache in writing of the reasons for not pursuing legal action; and the Agricultural Counselor or Attache may require the Cooperating Sponsor to obtain the opinion of competent legal counsel to support its decision prior to granting approval. If the Agricultural Counselor or Attache approves a Cooperating Sponsor's decision not to take further action on the claim, the Cooperating Sponsor shall assign the claim to CCC and shall forward all documentation relating to the claim to CCC.
(4) As an alternative to legal action in the judicial system of the country with regard to claims against a public entity of the government of the cooperating country, the Cooperating Sponsor and the cooperating country may agree in writing to settle disputed claims by an appropriate administrative procedure or arbitration.
(g) Determination of value. The Cooperating Sponsor shall determine the value of commodities misused, lost or damaged on the basis of the domestic market price at the time and place the misuse, loss or damage occurred. When it is not feasible to determine such market price, the value shall be the f.o.b. or f.a.s. commercial export price of the commodity at the time and place of export, plus ocean freight charges and other costs incurred by the U.S. Government in making delivery to the Cooperating Sponsor. When the value is determined on a cost basis, the Cooperating Sponsor may add to the value any provable costs it has incurred prior to delivery by the ocean carrier. In preparing the claim statement, these costs shall be clearly segregated from costs incurred by the Government of the United States. With respect to claims other than ocean carrier loss or damage claims, the Cooperating Sponsor may request the Agricultural Counselor or Attache to approve a commercially reasonable alternative basis to value the claim.
(h) Reporting losses to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache or FAS designated representative. (1) The Cooperating Sponsor shall promptly notify the Agricultural Counselor or Attache or FAS designated representative, in writing, of the circumstances pertaining to any loss, damage, or misuse of commodities valued at $500 or more occurring within the country of distribution or intermediate country. The report shall be made as soon as the Cooperating Sponsor has adequately investigated the circumstances, but in no event more than ninety days from the date the loss became known to the Cooperating Sponsor. The report shall identify the party in possession of the commodities and the party responsible for the loss, damage or misuse; the kind and quantities of commodities; the size and type of containers; the time and place of misuse, loss, or damage; the current location of the commodity; the Program Agreement number, the procurement contract numbers, or if unknown, other identifying numbers printed on the commodity containers; the action taken by the Cooperating Sponsor with respect to recovery or disposal; and the estimated value of the commodity. The report shall explain why any of the above-required information can not be provided. The Cooperating Sponsor shall also report the details regarding any loss or misuse of sale proceeds or program income.
(2) The Cooperating Sponsor shall report quarterly to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache any loss, damage to or misuse of commodities resulting in loss of less than $500. The Cooperating Sponsor shall inform the Agricultural Counselor or Attache or FAS designated representative if it has reason to believe there is a pattern or trend in the loss, damage, or misuse of such commodities and submit a report as described in paragraph (h)(1) of this section, together with any other relevant information the Cooperating Sponsor has available to it. The Agricultural Counselor or Attache may require additional information about any commodities lost, damaged or misused.
(i) Handling claims proceeds. Claims against ocean carriers shall be collected in U.S. dollars (or in the currency in which freight is paid) and shall be remitted (less amounts authorized to be retained) by Cooperating Sponsors to CCC. Claims against Cooperating Sponsors shall be paid to CCC in U.S. dollars. With respect to commodities lost, damaged or misused, amounts paid by Cooperating Sponsors and third parties in the country of distribution shall be deposited with the U.S. Disbursing Officer, American Embassy, preferably in U.S. dollars with instructions to credit the deposit to an account as determined by FAS, or in local currency at the highest rate of exchange legally obtainable on the date of deposit with instructions to credit the deposit to an FAS account as determined by FAS. With respect to sale proceeds and program income, amounts recovered may be deposited in the same account as the sale proceeds and may be used for purposes of the program.
Sec. 1599.15 Are there special recordkeeping and reporting requirements?
(a) Records and reports--general requirements. The Cooperating Sponsor shall maintain records for a period of three (3) years from the final date specified in the program agreement. FAS may, at reasonable times, inspect the Cooperating Sponsor's records pertaining to the receipt and use of the commodities and proceeds realized from the sale of the commodities, and have access to the Cooperating Sponsor's commodity storage and distribution sites and to locations of activities supported with proceeds realized from the sale of the commodities.
(b) Evidence of export. The Cooperating Sponsor's freight forwarder shall, within thirty (30) days after export, submit evidence of export of the agricultural commodities to the Chief, Export Operations Division, KCCO. If export is by sea or air, the Cooperating Sponsor's freight forwarder shall submit five copies of the carrier's on board bill of lading or consignee's receipt authenticated by a representative of the U.S. Customs Service. The evidence of export must show the kind and quantity of agricultural commodities exported, the date of export, and the destination country.
(c) Reports. (1) The Cooperating Sponsor shall submit a semiannual logistics report to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache and to the Director, PPDED, FAS/USDA, Washington, DC 20250-1034, covering the receipt of commodities. Cooperating sponsors must submit reports on Form CCC-620 commodities have been distributed or sold and such distribution or sale reported to FAS. The report must contain the following data:
(i) Receipts of agricultural commodities including the name of each vessel, discharge port(s) or point(s) of entry, the date discharge was completed, the condition of the commodities on arrival, any significant loss or damage in transit; advice of any claim for, or recovery of, or reduction of freight charges due to loss or damage in transit on U.S. flag vessels;
(ii) Estimated commodity inventory at the end of the reporting period;
(iii) Quantity of commodity on order during the reporting period;
(iv) Status of claims for commodity losses both resolved and unresolved during the reporting period;
(v) Quantity of commodity damaged or declared unfit during the reporting period; and
(vi) Quantity and type of the commodity that has been directly distributed by the Cooperating Sponsor, distribution date, region of distribution, and estimated number of individuals benefitting from the distribution.
(2) Program Agreements will require Cooperating Sponsors to report periodically, against collected, established baseline indicators, on the number of meals served, enrollment levels, total attendance numbers, including female attendance levels, learning developments, nutrition and health progress of mothers and children, and progress towards sustaining the feeding program.
(3) If the Program Agreement authorizes the sale or barter of commodities by the Cooperating Sponsor, the Cooperating Sponsor shall also submit a semiannual monetization report to the Agricultural Counselor or Attache and to the Director, PPDED, FAS/USDA, Washington, DC 20250-1034, covering the deposits into and disbursements from the special account for the purposes specified in the Program Agreement. Cooperating Sponsors must submit reports on Form CCC-621 funds generated from commodity sales have been distributed and such distribution reported to FAS. The report must contain the following information and include both local currency amounts and U.S. dollar equivalents:
(i) Quantity and type of commodities sold;
(ii) Proceeds generated from the sale;
(iii) Proceeds deposited to the special account including the date of deposit;
(iv) Interest earned on the special account;
(v) Disbursements from the special account, including date, amount and purpose of the disbursement; and
(vi) Any balance carried forward in the special account from the previous reporting period.
(4) The Cooperating Sponsor shall furnish FAS such additional information and reports relating to this agreement as FAS may reasonably request.
Sec. 1599.16 What are the Cooperating Sponsor's audit requirements?
Non-governmental Cooperating Sponsors are subject to the audit requirements of OMB Circular A-133 as implemented in USDA by 7 CFR part 3052, "Audits of States, Local Governments, and Non-Profit Organizations.'' The Cooperating Sponsor is also responsible for auditing the activities of recipient agencies that receive more than $25,000 of provided commodities or sale proceeds. This responsibility may be satisfied by relying upon independent audits of the recipient agency or upon a review conducted by the Cooperating Sponsor.
Sec. 1599.17 When may FAS suspend a program?
All or any part of the assistance provided under a Program Agreement, including commodities in transit, may be suspended by FAS if:
(a) The Cooperating Sponsor fails to comply with the provisions of the Program Agreement or this part;
(b) FAS determines that the continuation of such assistance is no longer necessary or desirable; or
(c) FAS determines that storage facilities are inadequate to prevent spoilage or waste, or that distribution of commodities will result in substantial disincentive to, or interference with, domestic production or marketing in the recipient country.
Sec. 1599.18 Are there sample documents and guidelines available for developing proposals and reports?
FAS has developed guidelines to assist the Cooperating Sponsors with effective reporting on program logistics and commodity sales. Cooperating Sponsors may obtain these guidelines from the Director, PPDED.
Signed March 19th, 2003, in Washington, DC.
Kenneth J. Roberts,
Acting Administrator, Foreign Agricultural Service.
Submit comments online via Regulations.gov. |
Sheila Singletary
The Florida Bar,
650 Apalachee Pkwy.,
Tallahassee, FL 32399-2300
Positions Available
COUNTY OF Volusia, Assistant County Attorney. Salary: $37,500-$108,159. The Volusia County Attorney’s office has a current opening for an experienced civil trial lawyer. Beginning salary depends on experience and qualifications. This is a full time position. No outside practice is permitted. The applicant must be a member in good standing of The Florida Bar. This position may handle cases in any of the following areas: premises liability, motor vehicle accidents, law enforcement officer and corrections officer excessive force claims, Section 1983 claims in state and federal court, construction claims, contract disputes and adversarial administrative hearings. Florida local governmental law experience is a plus, but is not mandatory. This position will remain open until filled. Submit complete County of Volusia application and three references to: Personnel Division, 123 W. Indiana Ave., DeLand, FL 32720-4607. Applications available at: or call (386)736-5951. EOE/AA Veterans preference pursuant to state law.
OSCEOLA COUNTY, Assistant County Attorney. Osceola County currently seeks a litigation attorney to work in the County Attorney’s Office. The position will concentrate on litigation, but may handle a wide range of legal matters, including legal research, prep of legal memoranda, drafting of ordinances, legislation, resolutions and administrative regulations, reviews and or prep of contracts and other transaction documents. Five or more years of litigation experience preferred but not required. Also, local government experience preferred, but not required. The salary range is $58,161 to $87,218 annually, depending upon experience and expertise. This position will remain open until filled. If you are interested, to apply, submit a resume to: Osceola County Attorney’s Office, 1 Courthouse Square, Suite 4200, Kissimmee, FL 34741, as soon as possible.
EXPANDING PRACTICE in Stuart, Florida seeks motivated litigation associate with 0-3 years experience. Must have excellent knowledge of State and Federal practice and procedure and competent writing abilities. Substantial growth possibilities for the right individual. Congenial and relaxed office environment. Please fax resume with salary requirements to (772)223-9008.
BILINGUAL ASSOCIATE - Tampa plaintiffs’ personal injury law firm with special expertise in pharmaceutical and medical device cases seeks associate with 0-3 years experience for temporary to a potentially permanent position. Must speak and write in Spanish. Salary commensurate with experience. Applicants should contact Brenda S. Fulmer, Esquire, Alley & Ingram, P.O. Box 3127, Tampa, FL 33601, Telephone: (813)222-0977; Fax: (813)224-0373; email [email protected].
LITIGATION ASSOCIATE sought by AV Rated Sarasota firm. 3-5 years commercial/construction litigation experience preferred. High academic credentials required. Excellent salary and benefits with partnership opportunity. Contact Philip Hammersley at Norton, Hammersley, Lopez & Skokos, P.A., 1819 Main Street, Suite 610, Sarasota, FL 34236 or e-mail resume to [email protected].
MANAGEMENT LABOR Attorney, City of Lake Worth, Florida. Full-time in house position. Responsibilities include overseeing areas of Human Resource functions pertaining to the IAFF, PBA, IBEW, PMSA/PEU bargaining units. EEOC responses. Serves as Chief Negotiator. Represents City of Lake Worth in all labor matters and/or oversees outside counsel in employment litigation. Performs administrative work in personnel as well as those assigned by City Manager. PC proficiency. Graduation from accredited school of law, Florida Bar member. Federal certification a plus. Salary dependent upon qualifications and experience. Comprehensive benefits package offered. Send resume and salary requirements to: City Manager, City of Lake Worth, 7 North Dixie Highway, Lake Worth, FL 33460.
WORKERS’ COMPENSATION defense attorney for Sarasota firm. Exciting opportunity with growth potential. Dynamic firm, outstanding benefits package. High academics, minimum 2 years experience. Apply in confidence to Managing Shareholder, Brown, Clark, Christopher & DeMay, P.A., P.O. Drawer 49887, Sarasota, FL 34230-6887. Fax to (941)957-3888.
LARGE, STATEWIDE workers’ compensation, labor and employment law and insurance defense firm seeks associate with 3 years of workers’ compensation and/or general insurance and/or employment law litigation experience for branch offices in Jacksonville, Sarasota, Ocala, Fort Lauderdale and Gainesville. Excellent benefits. Salary commensurate with experience. Submit resume to Amy Montgomery, Human Resource Manager, P.O. Drawer 229, Tallahassee, FL 32302-0229, Fax (850)222-4359.
RISSMAN, WEISBERG, Barrett, Hurt, Donahue and McLain, an established and expanding AV Rated Central Florida law firm seeks attorneys with 2-10 years experience in SIU/Fraud emphasizing healthcare litigation for its office in Orlando. Additional opportunities also exist in commercial litigation, asset protection, estate and tax planning, and employment law for attorneys with 5 plus years of experience. Interested parties should reply to Jennings L. Hurt, III, 201 East Pine Street, PO Box 4940, Orlando, FL 32802-4940 or via e-mail to [email protected].
CHILD SUPPORT enforcement attorney for the Clerk of Circuit Court, Manatee County, Florida. Applicants must be a member of The Florida Bar. Prefer a minimum of two years family law experience or experience with a heavy caseload. Starting salary of $35,000. Excellent benefits. Send resume to Bonnie Clark, Director of Human Resources, P.O. Box 25400, Bradenton, FL 34206. We give priority to applicants who don’t use a tobacco product.
SOUTHWEST FLORIDA law firm looking for associate, zero to two years experience. Applicant should have excellent academic credentials and be interested in real property, environmental and land use law. Please send resume to News Box 225.
TEAM LEADER for small, 3 attorney Miami civil litigation department of mid-size, statewide firm. Litigation covers commercial (no collections), probate and general billing matters plus serious PI matters on a contingency basis. This is a unique opportunity for an experienced civil trial attorney with supervisory skills and a history of long term employment tenures to receive high compensation plus incentive pay without any pressure to be a rainmaker. This is an immediate opening. Fax resume with confidence to (305)567-2600.
BOCA RATON - Plaintiff Personal Injury. AV Rated firm seeks litigation associate with 1-5 years litigation experience. Salary commensurate with experience. Benefits. Fax resume and salary requirements to: Kogan & DiSalvo, (561)477-8592 or e-mail: [email protected].
GRANT, FRIDKIN, Pearson, Athan & Crown, P.A., a Naples AV Rated law firm, has an immediate opening for an attorney with current experience in transactional real estate, commercial leasing, condominium and planned development documents, and lending. Clientele are developers, commercial property owners and financial institutions. The position requires a candidate with analytical, communication, drafting and negotiating skills. The ideal candidate will have from 2 to 6 years of experience. Other relevant experience will be considered. In addition, the firm has an immediate opening for an attorney with current experience in commercial litigation. This position requires a candidate with analytical, drafting, trial and negotiating skills. The ideal candidate will have 5 to 8 years of experience. Compensation commensurate with experience, excellent benefits, 401(K). Send resume in confidence to Grant, Friedkin, Pearson, Athan & Crown, Attn: Judy Wright, 5551 Ridgewood Drive, Ste. 501, Naples, FL 34108, or fax to (239)514-0377.
ATTORNEY GROWING law firm, with offices nationwide, presently has a position in our Tampa office. Qualified candidates to possess: heavy trial experience; preparation and review of legal documents; and interviewing clients/witnesses/experts. In addition, applicants must be members of The Florida Bar, willing to travel, and have excellent academic credentials. Generous compensation/benefits package. Send resume and salary requirements to News Box 226. EOE/AA
ATTORNEY: BAY Area Legal Services seeks attorney to provide civil legal counseling and representation in general practice office. Spanish fluency strongly preferred. Florida Bar membership. Travel between Plant City, Wimauma and rural outreach sites required. Mail resume by 9/20/02 to Ronda Fuqua, Bay Area Legal Services, 829 W. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. Blvd., 2nd Floor, Tampa, FL 33603-3336, EOE/AA.
ASSOCIATE ATTORNEY for Port St. Lucie and West Palm Beach offices. Highly motivated only need apply. Civil litigation/family law, Southern District of Florida preferred. Send resume to: John A. Racin, P.A. & Associates, 10850 South U.S. Highway One, Port St. Lucie, FL 34952. Attn: John A. Racin, Esquire.
TAX ATTORNEY: Emmanuel, Sheppard & Condon, a prominent Pensacola law firm seeks an experienced tax attorney to join their growing commercial law practice. 1-3 years experience in estate planning, probate, tax planning and business transactions required. LL.M. preferred. Must be licensed to practice law in Florida. Reply in confidence to Administrator, P.O. Box 1271, Pensacola, FL 32591-1271 or [email protected] or fax to Firm Administrator at (850)434-5856.
ATTORNEY. PROGRESSIVE is seeking an experienced attorney to oversee the PIP litigation process throughout Florida. The preferred location for this position is in our Ft. Lauderdale office, but Tampa is also a possibility. Qualified candidates must possess a Juris Doctorate, minimum 2-5+ years legal experience or other litigation-related experience/training with expertise in PIP, outstanding work ethic, and strong communication and negotiation skills. The candidate should also be a good standing member of The Florida Bar. Please submit resume indicating Ad Code 007742 to: Progressive, Centralized Recruiting, Box W11, 6300 Wilson Mills Road, Mayfield Village, OH 44143; Fax: (440)446-5500; e-mail: [email protected] Web site: jobs.progressive.com Equal Opportunity Employer, M/F/D/V. Progressive.
MORRISON & MILLS, P.A., a small AV Rated Tampa business law firm seeks qualified individuals with 5+ years experience for the following positions: (1) business and banking transactions attorney; (2) commercial litigation and trial attorney; (3) creditors rights bankruptcy attorney. Candidates must be admitted to The Florida Bar and have an existing, portable client base for full-time position. Reply in confidence with resume to [email protected] or by fax to T. Morrison (813)258-3209.
ATTORNEY POSITIONS: Established AV regional defense litigation firm with offices in Texas, Louisiana and Florida has immediate openings in its Gulf Breeze, (Pensacola) Florida office for two attorneys: one attorney with 0-3 years of experience and one with 4 or more years of experience. Successful applicants will be licensed in Florida (or, in the case of a 2003 graduate, set to take The Florida Bar exam), with Alabama or Georgia Bar license a plus. The position requires a strong academic record, motivation, initiative, and excellent oral and written communication skills. Law Review, Moot Court, Mock Trial experience are all pluses. Please send your resume by mail or fax in confidence to: Managing Director, Galloway, Johnson, Tompkins, Burr & Smith, P.L.C., 1101 Gulf Breeze Parkway, Suite 2, Gulf Breeze, Florida 35261, Fax (850)934-3848.
AV RATED Lakeland firm seeks associate for position involving commercial real estate transaction (1 to 2 years experience). Lakeland residency required. Submit resumes via fax to (863)647-5012, Attn: Jennifer Brown or e-mail to [email protected].
CIVIL LITIGATION associate needed for busy east central Florida practice. Two to four years trial experience and Florida Bar membership required. Interested candidates should send their credentials and salary requirements to confidential News Box 230.
CLEARWATER AREA law firm seeks full-time associate attorney admitted to The Florida Bar, two or more years experience with regard to real estate, estate planning, probate, foreclosures, and general corporate law. Please reply to News Box 233.
CLEARWATER AREA law firm seeks a part-time associate attorney admitted to The Florida Bar, two or more years experience with regard to real estate, estate planning, probate, foreclosures and general corporate law. Please reply to News Box 234.
GROWING SARASOTA law firm seeking associate attorney with litigation emphasis. Clerking experience helpful. 1 to 3 years experience preferred. Salary commensurate with experience. Excellent opportunity. All inquiries confidential. Send resume to: Hiring Partner, Lobeck & Hanson, P.A., 2033 Main Street, Suite 403, Sarasota, FL 34237.
ASSOCIATE 1-3 years experience for Tampa insurance defense firm. Fax resume to Hiring Partner (813)282-0412.
2 SENIOR ATTORNEY positions - Tallahassee. Anticipated vacancy. Full-time. Primary duties are legal research. Positions are usually filled at or near minimum ($3,955.24/mo). Submit state application, resume and writing sample by September 30, 2002, to Kelly McDowell, Administrative Assistant II, Unemployment Appeals Commission, Suite 300, Webster Building, 2671 Executive Center Circle, West, Tallahassee, FL 32399-0681. Telephone (850)487-2685, ext. 155, Fax (850)488-2123.
SMALL TAMPA AV Rated litigation firm seeks an associate attorney with 1-4 years litigation experience. Position offers challenging practice in personal injury defense and complex business litigation. Applicants must have current or imminent Florida Bar membership, excellent academic credentials, outstanding writing and advocacy skills, and appropriate litigation experience. Position offers the opportunity for exceptional professional development and excellent compensation in a small office environment. Please respond by mail or fax to Murnaghan & Ferguson, P.A., 100 North Tampa St., Suite 2600, Tampa, FL 33602, Fax (813)222-0124.
AV RATED Orlando law firm seeks associate with commercial, construction, real estate, and/or government litigation experience; 4 to 10 years of Florida practice; competitive salary and benefits; excellent writing skills required. Fax resume in confidence to: Brown, Ward, Salzman & Weiss, P.A.; Attn: Joan Flowers, (407)425-9596 or e-mail in confidence to: [email protected].
EXPANDING ORLANDO AV Rated law firm with over 25 years of experience looking for an attorney with 2-4 years of civil litigation and trial experience. Excellent writing skills a must. Excellent benefits package. Please respond to Hiring Partner, P.O. Box 87, Orlando, Florida 32802-0087 or fax to (407)422-3445.
PRESTIGIOUS ORLANDO firm seeks 2+ years experienced attorney to service Legal Services Plan administered by the firm. Primarily telephone consultations; full-time status. Diverse legal background and Spanish speaking a plus. Please reply to P.O. Box 87, Orlando, FL 32802-0087 or fax to (407)992-3595.
ASSOCIATE NEEDED at busy plaintiff’s law firm. Civil trial experience required. Call Linda at (850)434-3333.
ORLANDO AV Rated medical malpractice/insurance defense firm seeking experienced associate (5+ years). Candidate’s experience in litigation should be current and active. Excellent opportunity including early partnership for the right candidate. Reply to News Box 227.
SARASOTA, TAMPA and St. Petersburg lawyers wanted for law firm with high quality clients with at least three to five years civil litigation experience for practice of commercial, business, real estate, employment, personal injury, medical malpractice and nursing home abuse. Salary from $30,000 to $50,000, profit sharing and benefits. Email resume to [email protected].
AV RATED medium size Orlando law firm seeks associate attorney with minimum 3 years civil litigation experience. Please fax resume in confidence to Hiring Partner (407)872-7997.
DAYTONA BEACH litigation attorney - Associate position available in insurance defense department of established, all purpose law firm. Must have good research and writing skills, willingness to do local travel and ability to handle full caseload. Salary commensurate with experience. Fax cover letter and resume to D. Kowalski at (386)257-1834.
DOWNTOWN TAMPA firm seeks new associate to work in bankruptcy, creditors rights, accounting malpractice defense and commercial and business litigation. Prefer recent graduate with strong academic background as well as research, writing and analytical skills. Accounting background or education preferred. Send resume and writing samples in confidence to John H. Mueller and Robert W. Clark, Smith Clark Delesie Bierley Mueller & Kadyk, 100 N. Tampa Street, Suite 2120, Tampa, FL 33602 or e-mail to [email protected] or [email protected].
WEST PALM Beach law firm seeking attorney with 1-2 years experience. Send resume and compensation requirements to News Box 232.
STATEWIDE INSURANCE defense firm seeks workers’ compensation attorney for its Pensacola office. One to three years workers’ compensation experience preferred. Excellent salary and benefits package. Please mail resume in confidence to Firm Administrator, 4811 Atlantic Blvd., Jacksonville, FL 32207, fax to (904)393-7996 or e-mail to [email protected].
ASSOCIATE ATTORNEY. Butler & Hosch, P.A., a regional law firm based in Orlando, specializing in mortgage defaults, is seeking associate attorneys for their Fort Lauderdale and Orlando offices. Minimum of two (2) years foreclosure experience required. Health and dental insurance, 401K. Fax resume with salary requirements to Human Resources (407)273-5931 or e-mail [email protected] EOE M/F
ATTORNEY POSITION open: Tallahassee workers’ compensation defense firm has position available for attorney with 0-4 years of experience. Litigation experience preferred but will train appropriate candidate. Willing to consider recent graduate awaiting bar exam results. Competitive salary/benefits package. Mail resume to: Hiring Partner, Attn: Sylvia, DuBois & Cruickshank, P.A., P.O. Drawer 1509, Tallahassee, FL 32302-1509, or send by fax to (850)422-2507. Visit our Web site at.
WORKERS’ COMPENSATION attorney - growing Daytona Beach area workers’ compensation and civil litigation firm seeking an associate. Please send resume to Selis & Associates, P.A., 475 South Nova Road, Ormond Beach, FL 32174.
CIVIL TRIAL attorney. Medium size AV Rated Tampa civil trial law firm seeks litigation attorney with 2 to 4 years experience for its expanding personal injury defense practice. Prior jury trial experience, strong advocacy and academic skills required. Competitive salary and comprehensive benefits package available. Send resume to Hiring Partner, 113 S. Armenia Avenue, Tampa, FL 33609 or fax to (813)262-2040.
POLK/BROWARD COUNTY. Large criminal defense firm seeks managing lawyer to head up new offices. Medical/401K and other benefits. Salary is a 40K base with monthly bonuses. Energetic personality with criminal experience preferred. Please mail resume to Kaufman, Englett & Lynd, PA, 733 W. Colonial Drive, Orlando, FL 32804.
ASSISTANT PUBLIC Defender, Seventh Judicial Circuit - Entry level. Must be current member of The Florida Bar. Fax resume to L. Phillips, (386)239-7702 or phone (386)239-7730. 251 N. Ridgewood Avenue, Daytona Beach, FL 32114. Equal Opportunity Employer.
BUSY TAMPA insurance defense firm seeks attorney with 0-2 years experience. Top 1/2 of class preferred. Send resume by fax to Lynda Foster, (813)651-1192.
DEFENSE ATTORNEY with a sense of humor and at least 1 year of experience in Special Investigative Unit representation for Orlando area office of Moriarty & Monroe. Although we also practice in general insurance defense, we specialize in automobile accident claims involving medical fraud and over-utilization. We also have the privilege of assisting special investigative units conduct fraud investigations involving staged accident and medical fraud rings involving health care providers and attorneys. Since we practice in an area with few rules, ability to think creatively and independently is a must. Although we have an intense learning curve and performance expectations are high, we offer world class benefits and a casual atmosphere conducive to true learning. If working for the good guys to fight insurance fraud with an amazing group of energetic lawyers and support staff sounds like the only way to spend the rest of your legal career, please fax your resume and cover letter to (407)647-4735.
TAMPA, CRIMINAL defense associate for busy law office. Applicant must be a member of The Florida Bar and have two years experience in criminal litigation. Bilingual (Spanish/English) preferred. Excellent compensation, including bonuses and profit sharing. Please submit resume and writing sample in confidence to: 2917 W. Kennedy Blvd., Tampa FL 33609.
NORTH MIAMI growing AV Rated workers’ compensation defense firm looking for experienced associates. Minimum 1-2 years experience. Fax resume to (561)624-7441, Attn: Keith Pallo at Pallo & Marks, P.A. Salary is negotiable. Opening immediately.
SMALL AV Rated law firm has opening for Englewood area resident attorney. Please submit resume to: R. Earl Warren, P.A., P.O. Box 1207, Englewood, FL 34295-1207.
ATTORNEY WITH Social Security disability claim experience. Mid-sized North Florida law firm. Salary plus commission. Benefit package including 401K; disability and health insurance. Send resume to confidential News Box 235.
BUSY BOCA Raton office seeks practicing attorney with 1-3 years experience in claimant’s workers’ compensation to handle claims in the Tri-County area. Personal injury and real estate helpful. Please fax resume to Gregory S. Gefen, P.A. @ (561)988-0066, Attn: Alana.
TAMPA - FAMILY Law. Associate with 1-3 years of experience. Fax resume to (813)639-3171.
DESTIN BASED law firm with offices from Pensacola to Jacksonville seeks motivated new attorney who recently passed bar exam. Great opportunity for an attorney just out of law school who needs to learn the ropes. Must be a fast learner with reliable car. You can live on the beach, make money, and get great hands-on experience. Fax resume to (850)650-9440.
GAINESVILLE: CRIMINAL defense firm seeks experienced trial attorney. 5+ years experience preferred. Salary negotiable. Fax resumes to (352)373-8400 or mail to: Attorneys, P.O. Box 65, Gainesville, FL 32602.
ASSOCIATE ATTORNEY with 2-5 years experience needed by Tallahassee firm. Excellent academics, strong work ethic and deposition, hearing, and brief writing experience in the practice areas of complex commercial, insurance, tort, and medical malpractice litigation and appellate work essential. Cover letter with resume and writing sample to: Bonnie Johnson, Administrator, 300 East Park Avenue, Tallahassee, FL 32301.
ATTORNEY FULL-TIME position available for attorney to represent sexual offender treatment facility in civil commitment hearings, annual reviews, and resident’s suits regarding confinement and conditions. Three years experience as a Florida public defender. preferred. Facility is located in the Fort Myers/Sarasota area. Offering competitive salary and benefits. For more information call John Iacobacci, Liberty Healthcare Corporation, at (800)331-7122. For immediate consideration fax resume to (610)668-7689 or e-mail to: [email protected]. EOE.
CONTRACT SPECIALIST wanted by investment company in Miami to negotiate with suppliers to draw-up procurement contracts. Must have BA in law, 2 years experience and ver. ref. Mail resumes to Camelo Oil Corporation, 2500 NW, 87th Avenue, Miami, FL 33172.
TAMPA AV Rated personal injury firm has an opening for Spanish bilingual attorney. This is a non-litigating position. Please call (813)251-2007 and fax resume to (813)251-5808.
TAMPA AV firm seeks litigation associate with 1-2 years experience for insurance and employment defense, commercial, marine and international practice. Strong academic background, writing and communication skills required. Competitive salary and benefits. Reply in confidence to Hiring Partner, P.O. Box 3373, Tampa, FL 33601 or fax (813)221-8558.
THE UNIVERSITY of West Florida seeks a tenure-track assistant or associate professor beginning August 2003. The candidate will teach in a BA program in Legal Studies (paralegal/pre-law) at the undergraduate level, provide professional and academic advising to students, conduct research leading to publications and provide service to the University of West Florida and Northwest Florida communities. Required: Juris Doctorate from an ABA-accredited institution and valid license to practice law. Applicant must have a valid Florida license to practice law before commencement of the contract. Experience as a practicing attorney. Demonstrated commitment to paralegal and pre-law education. College-level teaching experience. Ability to teach at least four of the following: contract law, business entities, probate and estate planning, real estate law, evidence, legal research, legal writing. Teach at our satellite campus (Ft. Walton Beach) at least once each academic year. Preferred: Experience working with or as a paralegal. College-level teaching experience. Computer literate. Ability to teach law office computer applications. Combined JD and PhD or demonstrated ability to do scholarly research and publication. Responsibilities include: Teaching: Develop and teach paralegal and pre-law courses. Advising: Provide academic and professional advising to students. Research: Perform and publish academic research. Service: Participate in community outreach. Participate as a team member of the division, college and university community. Salary Range: Nine month contract $38,000-$48,000 commensurate with rank and experience, with a possibility of teaching in the summer for additional compensation. Application: This is no application form for this position. No applications or recommendations will be accepted by electronic mail. Undergraduate and graduate transcripts will be required prior to any offer of employment. Minorities are strongly encouraged to apply. To apply for this position, submit (A) a letter of interest indicating how the applicant meets the required and preferred criterion, (B) a current curriculum vitae and (C) three (3) current letters of recommendation postmarked no later than Thursday, October 31, 2002 to: Susan W. Harrell, J.D., Search Committee Chair, Division of Criminal Justice and Legal Studies Program, University of West Florida, 11000 University Parkway, Pensacola, FL 32514-5751. UWF is an EEO/ACCESS/AA Employer.
IN-HOUSE ATTORNEY - HSN seeking lawyer for its in-house legal department. We desire at least 3 years of relevant experience at a major law firm or corporate legal department in the drafting of commercial transactions (network distribution experience preferred) and commercial litigation/litigation management. The successful candidate must possess a BA or BS degree from an accredited college or university, a JD degree from an accredited college or university (high academic standing required) and be admitted to a state bar (Florida Bar preferred). The successful candidate must also possess strong written, verbal and interpersonal skills and be able to exercise good business judgment in a fast-paced environment. Compensation commensurate with experience. Please send resume and salary requirements to: “Code: Legal Counsel” [email protected] EOE/Drug Free Workplace.
CORPORATE COUNSEL. Danka is seeking an attorney to assist in the communication, monitoring and administration of its corporate compliance, ethics and governance program. This position is based in St. Petersburg, Florida. Responsibilities include: Assist General Counsel/Corporate Compliance officer in the continued development, communication, monitoring, administration and management of corporate compliance, ethics program and related governance programs worldwide. Provide legal training to Danka employees. Act as a liaison with internal departments regarding compliance and governance issues. Conduct investigations and advise company on program changes, updates and pertinent issues and proper resolution of compliance issues. Prepare internal and external communications. Provide back-up support to other counsel in transactional, contract administration, document management and litigation management. Qualifications: Education: JD and Florida license required. Related Experience: Three to five years experience in corporate law, including corporate compliance and governance experience required. Local candidates preferred. Danka is an EOE M/F/D/V employer. Only applicants meeting minimum qualifications will be considered. Fax is (727)568-4918 or e-mail [email protected].
THE FLORIDA Department of Insurance has openings for two Senior Attorneys in the Tallahassee Office (position numbers 00676 and 01092). Primary duties will be representing the Department in insurance litigation against insurers and similar entities, including proceedings before the Division of Administrative Hearings. Minimum qualifications are admission to The Florida Bar and two years of professional experience in the practice of law, legal research, teaching law or in administrative or judicial hearings. Preference will be given to applicants with litigation or administrative law experience for position #00676, and Life and Health Insurance and HMO experience for position #01092. Submit a completed State of Florida Employment Application to Beverley DiGirolamo, Division of Legal Services, 200 East Gaines Street, Tallahassee, FL 32399-0333. For questions, call (850)413-4232.
WANTED: ASSOCIATE with 1-2 years experience in commercial/civil litigation for 2 partner AV Rated firm in West Palm Beach. Please fax resume (required) and salary requirements (optional) to (561)687-7892.
DOWNTOWN TAMPA civil litigation firm seeks minimum of two litigation attorneys for expanding insurance defense practice. Must have excellent work ethic, exceptional organization skills and Florida Bar admission. Salary commensurate with experience. Partnership opportunities for applicants with experience and their own client base. Must have sufficient experience for immediate court appearances. Wonderful opportunity for a motivated individual to join an established office with an excellent reputation. Send resume with references and legal writing samples to Hiring Partner, 201 E. Kennedy Blvd., Ste. 1111, Tampa, FL 33602 or fax to (813)224-9808.
ASSOCIATE ATTORNEY. Two associate attorneys needed for rapidly expanding Fort Walton Beach/Destin area firm to concentrate in the areas of child support enforcement, workers’ compensation and/or Social Security disability. Great benefits including health, dental, and 401K. Salary commensurate with experience. Please fax resume and salary requirements to (850)664-5200.
NEED ATTORNEY for small family law firm in Rockledge area. No experience necessary but Bar membership required. Send resume to Laura Castro at 975 Eyster Blvd.,Ste. 3, Rockledge, FL 32955.
HEALTH LAW Associate - 3 to 5 year attorney needed for young boutique health law firm in Orlando area. Must have outstanding credentials and writing skills. Litigation experience a plus. The Health Law Firm, 220 East Central Parkway, Suite 2030, Altamonte Springs, FL 32701. Fax: (407)331-3030.
AV RATED Sarasota surety, construction and commercial litigation firm seeks associate with 1-3 years experience in areas of practice. High academic credentials and successful employment history required. Construction, engineering and architectural undergraduate degree preferred. Position offers successful candidate top salary and benefits along with immediate client contact and case responsibility. Respond to [email protected].
ATTORNEY NEEDED for family law and domestic violence practice in Polk, Highlands & Hardee Counties. Please fax resume to Heart of Florida Legal Aid Society at (863)519-5674.
ASSOCIATE WITH 1-4 years commercial bankruptcy experience wanted for AV Rated firm in Jacksonville. Strong academic background, advocacy and writing skills required. Send resume to Jean Johnston, Smith Hulsey & Busey, P.O. Box 53315, Jacksonville, FL 32201-3315.
AV RATED insurance defense firm needs litigation associates for our Fort Lauderdale and North Palm Beach offices. PIP experience helpful. Great salary and benefits. Please fax resume (561)832-6860, Attn Marcy.
ACCEPTING APPLICATIONS for Senior Law Clerk on Central Staff, Second District Court of Appeal, Lakeland. EOE. Responsibilities: Assisting the court with motions, writs and appeals from summary denials of post conviction motions. Knowledge of appellate procedure and jurisdiction, word processing and computer research skills required. Minimum of 2 years experience in the practice of law subsequent to admission to The Florida Bar is a prerequisite. Based salary: $50,004.84. Send resume to Marshal, Box 327, Lakeland, FL 33802. Closing date: 9/27/02, 5:00 p.m.
GROWING SOUTHWEST Florida plaintiff personal injury and workers’ compensation law firm seeks workers’ compensation associate, must be licensed with 0-3 years experience. Send resume to: Berke & Lubell, P.A., 4506 Del Prado Blvd. S., Ste. B, Cape Coral, FL 33904 or fax to: (239)549-3331.
EXPANDING SOUTHWEST Florida firm of 16 attorneys with offices in Naples and Bonita Springs, seeks an estate planning attorney with a minimum of three years experience. CPA or LLM in tax or estate planning preferred. (Firm has 3 estate planning attorneys who are board certified.) Candidate must be self-motivated; able to assume client responsibility; and see matter to conclusion. We are an ADA/EEO employer, offering competitive salary and benefits. Please send resume to: William M. Burke, Bond, Schoeneck & King, PA, 4001 Tamiami Trail North, Suite 250, Naples, FL 34103; fax (239)262-6908; e-mail: [email protected].
ATTORNEY - NORTH Tampa. Established estate planner needs associate with 3 plus years of substantial experience in probate, trusts, and wills, to help maintain busy solo practice. Partnership potential. Send resume and cover letter to P.O. Box 47811, Tampa, FL 33647.
RESOURCE DIRECTOR - Statewide leadership position directing a team to expand financial and volunteer resources and in kind donations for delivery of legal assistance to the poor. Build law firm, lawyer and community support for legal aid services. Commitment to equal justice needed - lawyer preferred. Fax letter of interest and resume to Florida Legal Services (850)385-9998. EOE.
BANKRUPTCY/WORKOUT attorney: Lowndes, Drosdick, Doster, Kantor & Reed, P.A., an AV Rated law firm located in Orlando, Florida, seeks an attorney with five-seven years of Chapter 11 bankruptcy experience. Applicant must possess good academic credentials and excellent writing skills and have significant bankruptcy and workout experience. Compensation will be commensurate with experience. The law firm offers outstanding financial stability with steady practice growth, sophisticated clientele, outstanding credentials and excellent facilities. Send resume and writing sample in confidence to Michael V. Elsberry, Esq., P.O. Box 2809, Orlando, FL 32802.
STAFF ATTORNEY - with non-profit law firm in Cocoa. Ability to work effectively and creatively with low income clients on special education, consumer and housing. Florida Bar membership required; Spanish speaking desired. Excellent fringes. $31,800 (includes $4,800/year loan forgiveness plan) + DOE. Send resume, writing samples, and references to: B.J. Owens, Central Florida Legal Services, Inc., 803 N. Fiske Blvd., Cocoa, FL 32922-7323. EOE.
ATTORNEY POSITION. The Legal Aid Society of the Orange County Bar Association, Inc. is a non-profit law firm in Orlando, Florida. We have attorney positions available to represent abused and neglected children, domestic violence survivors, immigrants and other low-income families with civil legal problems. Experience preferred but not necessary. Must be licensed to practice in Florida. Please forward resume, references and cover letter to: Mandy Silvestris, Legal Aid Society of OCBA, Inc., 100 East Robinson Street, Orlando, FL 32801, (407)841-8310, Fax: (407)648-9240, E-mail: [email protected].
ORLANDO AREA - litigation associate with 2+ years experience sought by small AV Rated firm practicing in the area of community association law including construction defects litigation, covenant enforcement, lien foreclosures, contracts, opinions, etc. Competitive salary, benefits and excellent working environment. Send resume to Taylor & Carls, PA, 850 Concourse Parkway S. #105, Maitland, FL 32751.
TAMPA DOWNTOWN insurance defense firm has an immediate has an immediate opening for an associate with 3 to 6 years litigation experience. Competitive salary and benefits with excellent work environment. Send resume in confidence to: Hiring Partner, 633 N. Franklin Street, Suite 400, Tampa, FL 33602 or fax to (813)318-9127.
ATTORNEY NEEDED for rapidly growing bankruptcy law firm and credit counseling organization. No experience necessary. Spanish speaking a plus but not required. Nice work environment. Clearwater office. Please fax resume to (727)524-3850, Attn: Jay Weller.
CHANGE IN Career? Florida Lawyers Mutual Insurance Company is seeking an attorney with legal malpractice insurance defense for its Orlando office. Salary commensurate with experience. E-mail resume, including salary history, to [email protected].
PROBATE & ESTATE Planning attorney for Aventura law firm, 1-2 years experience, fax resume attention Joy (561)451-8223.
PARENT OF disabled student looking for attorney Northern District of Florida for IDEA, ADA, 504, 1983 and pendent state claims against LEA and SEA. Can pay for experts and out of pocket, but need attorney fees on contingency. Please call (850)668-9203 or send resume to [email protected].
COMMERCIAL REAL Estate Corporate Counsel Expanding entrepreneurial regional commercial real estate firm on Brickell has exciting opportunity. You should be an independent, take charge leader who can problem solve, is multi-tasked, have good interpersonal skills and an eye for details. You will conduct lease and contract negotiations and supervise outside counsel litigation for our multi-property retail portfolio. Submit resume w/salary history via fax to: (305)374-7529 or email [email protected].
LITIGATION ATTORNEYS Statewide Insurance Defense firm seeks associates with the following qualifications: • 2-5 years practicing personal injury protection experience -- Orlando • 4-7 years practicing medical malpractice/nursing home defense experience -- Broward • 1-5 years workers' compenstaion experience -- West Palm Beach • 5-10 years liability experience -- Broward. Excellent salary & benefits. Send resume to: Administrator, 3440 Hollywood Blvd., 2nd Floor, Hollywood, Florida 33021
CARING ATTORNEY Needed for “AV” Rated Broward Firm. Applicant must be admitted for 2 years and have general background to assist members of prepaid legal plan. Submit resume to [email protected] or fax (954)424-1206.
SENIOR ATTORNEY and attorney. The Florida Department of Children and Families is accepting applications for the positions of Senior Attorney and Attorney. Positions are available periodically throughout the state. All applicants must be a member of The Florida Bar. Senior Attorney applicants must have been admitted for at least two years. Prior trial experience in family, juvenile or criminal law is preferred. Salary ranges: Attorney ($35,931.00 to $81,681.36); Senior Attorney ($47,462.88 to $108,908.52). Apply by submitting a completed State of Florida application, resume, location preference and writing sample to the Office of the General Counsel, Building 2, 1317 Winewood Blvd., Tallahassee, FL 32399-0700. For further information, call (850) 488-2381 or visit.
THE STATE of Florida, Agency for Health Care Administration, is accepting applications for the following: Senior Attorney Multiple Positions. Salary: $1,825.49 to $4,188.79 Bi-weekly Location: Tallahassee Deadline Date: September 23, 2002 This is your chance to escape billable hours and build on your litigation experience! The Florida Agency for Health Care Administration seeks experienced litigators to represent the Florida Medicaid Program in civil and administrative forums concerning fraud and abuse, anti-kickback, and self-referral issues, among other related policy issues. The attorneys will review and assess matters raised by various detection tools and advise the Program on further handling. This position encompasses all aspects of the litigation process from inception to conclusion including informal dispute resolution and settlement negotiation. Knowledge of, and experience with, health care law, civil and administrative litigation, and rulemaking procedures under Chapter 120, Florida Statutes, is preferred. Salary range is between $47,462.74 through upper fifties, based on relevant experience. Minimum Qualifcations: Admission to The Florida Bar and two years professional experience in the practice of law, legal research, teaching law or in administrative or judicial hearings. The Agency for Health Care Administration champions accessible, affordable, quality health care for all Floridians. Apply and see if you can join our team and be part of this exciting effort! Please submit a State of Florida Employment application to: Valda Clark Christian, General Counsel 2727 Mahan Drive, Mail Stop #3 Bldg. 3, Room 3415
Tallahassee, Florida 32308 (850)922-5873; (850)922-6484 (Fax) If you need an accommodation because of a disability in order to participate in the application/selection process, please notify the hiring authority in advance.
THIRD CIRCUIT Public Defender seeks applicants for trial attorney position in Columbia, Suwannee and Taylor Counties. Preference given those who are Florida Bar members or who have taken The Florida Bar and have clinical experience. Salary dependent on experience. Send Resume to: C. Dennis Roberts Public Defender P.O. Drawer 1209 Lake City, FL 32056-1209 Fax: (386)758-0497 Email: [email protected]
SENIOR ATTORNEY Position. The Florida Department of Transportation, Office of the General Counsel, has a Senior Attorney position vacancy in its office in Tallahassee, Florida. Occupation Group: Legal; Occupation Level: Level 4 - Lawyers and Judges; Pay Band: 014; Position Number: 03169; Pay Band: $47,213.00 - $118,032.50. It is expected that this position will be filled at an annual salary between $55,000 and $65,000. Qualifications: Membership in The Florida Bar; Civil litigation and trial experience; good writing skills and intensity; jury trial and construction litigation experience are preferred. Duties: The attorney in this position is an experienced senior trial attorney who handles assignments in defense of the Department or in the prosecution of the Department’s rights. Must be prepared to litigate in federal, state, and county court jurisdictions. This attorney must use independent judgment; exhibit high level litigation and research skills in handling civil cases in areas such as inverse condemnation, construction claims, personal injury, and environmental litigation; and able to travel to assigned districts on a regular basis to conduct discovery, attend hearings, and try cases. This attorney is responsible for the preparation of legal opinions, the recommendation of potential legislation, the review of and comment on proposed legislation, the provision of legal advice and counsel to agency personnel on recommended conduct of agency business, and the provision of advice, assistance, and direction on legal strategies. Send Current State of Florida Application/Resume to: Steven S. Ferst Chief Counsel for the Civil Litigation Division Florida Department of Transportation Office of the General Counsel 605 Suwannee Street, MS-58 Tallahassee, Florida 32399-0458 (850)414-5265 Applications must be submitted by: Close of business, September 30, 2002, 5:00 p.m. EDT
If you need an accommodation because of a disability in order to participate in the application/selection process, please notify the appointing authority in advance. We hire only U.S. citizens and lawfully authorized alien workers. Position knowledge, skills, and abilities apply. Call contact person for requirements. EEO/AA/VP/DFWP
LAW OFFICES of Keith M. Hanenian, a staff counsel office of The Zenith Insurance Co., seeks an Associate Attorney experienced in workers’ compensation, for an immediate opening in Orlando office. Salary commensurate with experience; excellent benefits and growth potential. Fax resume in strict confidence to (407)206-8365.
SMALL AV Rated Fort Lauderdale law firm seeks motivated associate with 3-5 years experience in commercial litigation and/or transactions. Fast track possibility to partner. Reasonable hours, good salary and benefits, including 401K matching. Please fax resume to (954)767-8111.
ASSOCIATE. GROWING New York Insurance Fraud Law litigation firm opening Boca Raton office seeks associate with 1-2 years civil litigation experience. Must be law review or top 20% of class. Competitive salary and benefits offered. Must be willing to train in New York for up to 1 1/2 months. Fax resume and cover letter with salary requirements to Iris (212)532-7271.
VERNIS & BOWLING Attorneys at Law • Established 1970 An “AV” RATED statewide law firm seeks self-starting attorneys with federal and/or state court experience in employment law, commercial litigation, corporate transactional, personal injury, and workers’ compensation defense for its Hollywood, DeLand, Jacksonville, Ft. Myers, Clearwater, Pensacola, Florida Keys, N. Palm Beach and Miami offices. Exceptional opportunity and benefits. Fax resume to: (305)892-1260.
AV RATED, 5 lawyer Orlando defense firm seeks 1-2 experienced attorneys who have own client base and wish to join forces with an established law firm with excellent facilities and benefits. Compensation package negotiable. Partnership opportunites available for qualified candidates. Send resume in confidence to: BRB, Hilyard, Bogan & Palmer, P.A., P.O. Box 4973, Orlando, FL 32802. [email protected]
REAL ESTATE/Banking Associate Orlando Dean Mead, a multi-office law firm located in Central Florida, seeks an attorney for its Orlando office. Position requires 2-4 years experience in real estate, banking transactions and related work. Excellent academic backgorund. Reply in confidence to Director of Administration, Dean Mead, 800 N. Magnolia Avenue, Suite 1500, Orlando, FL 32803.
CIVIL LITIGATION Established medical malpractice and nursing home defense firm seeks aggressive, energetic, highly qualified associates (preferably with experience in the same field), for its Tampa, Orlando, Jacksonville and Miami offices. Unique Opportunity For Ambitious Trial Attorneys Fax resume to Managing Partner (813)287-1101.
LITIGATION ASSOCIATE sought by AV Rated specialty insurance defense firm in St. Petersburg. 3-5 years litigation experience. High academic credentials required. Salary and benefits commensurate with experience. Contact Bob Casagrande, Casagrande & Associates, P.A., 100 Second Ave., North, Ste. 240, St. Petersburg, FL 33701 or email resume to [email protected]
ASSISTANT PUBLIC Defender Positions Available Member Florida Bar Salary commensurate with experience Submit Resume To: Eleanor Gembecki Office of Public Defender P.O. Drawer 1980 Ft. Myers, FL 33902-1980 Telephone: (941)335-2974 Fax: (941)338-3220 Equal Opportunity Employer.
INSURANCE DEFENSE Attorneys Tired of having your bills audited by the insurance company? Take this opportunity to join a leading Southwest Florida plaintiff’s personal injury law firm. Send resume to: Associates & Bruce L. Scheiner Personal Injury Lawyers, P.A. P.O. Box 60049 Ft. Myers, FL 33906 Fax (239)939-7079
ATTORNEY. THE Candidate we seek will manage professional liability/medical malpractice claims for Corporate office of a highly successful NYSE healthcare company located in beautiful Naples, Florida. Ten years experience, some of which should be with a private law firm, including trial experience, is required. Salary commensurate with experience. Benefits include bonus and equity potential. Please submit resume to Leslie C. Price, Recruitment Manager, Health Management Associates, Inc., E-mail: [email protected] Fax: (239)598-2705. EOE
Recruit
Other Personnel_1<<
_3<<
ATLANTIC BONDING Company. Become A Notary Lowest Cost Available For New & Renewal Applications State Approved (954)941-6100 or 1 (800) 732-2245.
Expert Witness
_10<<!
_16<<_17<<
_20<<_21<<_22<<
[Revised: 05-17-2013] |
Freedom on the Net
Belarus
Belarus, often known as “Europe’s last dictatorship,” is run by the autocratic regime of President Alexander Lukashenka. There has been no separation of powers in Minsk since 1996, and Belarus regularly falls near the bottom of international rankings of media freedom. The authorities control the absolute majority of traditional mass media, including all broadcast outlets and daily newspapers, and approximately 70 percent of the economy remains in state hands. Due to this centralization, there is a high degree of government involvement in the electronic communications sector.
The BYnet, as Belarus’ internet sector is known, experienced a dramatic year in 2011. The country’s steady economic development and government’s robust investment over the past several years, as well as a relative liberalization during the 2008-10 period of dialogue with the European Union, led to steady growth in internet penetration and usage. Meanwhile, the regime’s control over traditional media pushed independent media outlets to be more creative and innovative online, where its websites have multiplied and consistently dominated those of the state in terms of quality and popularity. In 2011, web-based independent media played a much more visible role and attracted a larger audience than ever before. The expansion in internet penetration also led to the strong growth of Belarusians active on social-networking sites.
However, the country’s political crisis—which followed a flawed presidential election in December 2010—the resulting economic crisis that spanned 2011, as well as the Arab Spring events, have intensified the government’s fear of the internet and its determination to exert greater control over it. Among the targets of an unprecedented crackdown at the end of 2010 were independent media, especially internet outlets and journalists. This repression of online activists was expanded to include bloggers after social-networking sites were used to organize a series of mass protests in summer 2011.
As a result, President Lukashenka repeatedly called for tighter regulation of the internet, blaming it for the country’s unrest while praising China’s internet restrictions. In August 2011, for example, Lukashenka stated that access to destructive websites must be blocked[1] and that the internet should be controlled in educational institutions to rule out its use for purposes other than education. In September 2011, Prosecutor General Ryhor Vasilevich called for an international agreement that would introduce internet censorship, suggesting that such an agreement could be drawn up at the level of the United Nations.[2]
During 2011, new amendments stipulating financial penalties for violating an already restrictive internet law were introduced. Independent websites and personal blogs were blacklisted and regularly blocked. Online activists were harassed, threatened, persecuted, arrested and imprisoned. Nevertheless, further legal restrictions and harsh repression have failed to halt the growth and dynamism of the Belarusian internet.
Relatively strong economic growth in Belarus over the last half decade has led to a corresponding growth in internet and mobile phone usage. According to the International Telecommunications Union (ITU), Belarus had an internet penetration rate of 40 percent in 2011, up from 16 percent in 2006.[3] In addition, the country’s four mobile phone operators had a combined 10.7 million subscribers, for a total penetration rate of 113 percent in 2011.[4] All four mobile operators offer internet access and approximately 4,100 of the country’s 14,600 base stations are 3G capable, allowing faster internet and multimedia downloading.[5]
Internet use grew quickly in 2011 because and in spite of an economic and political crisis that followed the flawed December 2010 presidential election. An unprecedented crackdown against civil society, a series of public protests, a decline in citizens’ confidence in the state media, and a currency collapse led to an increased demand for alternative sources of information, especially via the internet. At the same time, the economic crisis did not increase internet costs, prompting many to start using the internet as a key source for news, entertainment, and as a tool for social interaction.
Approximately 76 percent of users in Belarus access the internet on a daily basis.[6] The key divide in levels of access is not so as much between rural and urban populations—since some 70 percent of Belarusians live in urban areas—as between the country’s capital and regions. Over 38 percent of all internet users live in Minsk and the Minsk region.[7] Another significant determinant of internet use is age: the majority of internet users in Belarus are young people and only 7 percent of users are aged 55 and above.[8] Almost 92 percent of all users regularly access the internet at home, and 31.8 percent do so at work. Internet cafes are the least popular point of access, with just 4.3 percent of users utilizing them frequently.[9]
In November 2011, more than 62 percent of users reported having broadband access, while 8.5 percent reported using dial-up, and 11.3 percent accessed via mobile phone connections. The cost of broadband access via DSL and cable is generally tied to volume, reflecting the pricing structure that Beltelecom—the state-owned telecommunications monopoly—uses when selling bandwidth to downstream internet service providers (ISPs). This makes it somewhat expensive to download large items like music or movies, but for common activities such as email and web browsing, the volume surcharges do not create a barrier for most users. Unlimited internet access service was launched by Beltelecom in 2007. Initially quite expensive, it has become more affordable, and prices in rubles (ranging from US$5-$35 per month, depending on the speed) remained unchanged in 2011, despite high inflation and several currency devaluations.
The rapid increase in internet penetration has also resulted in the growth of citizens’ activity on social-networking sites. Since November 2010, the number of Facebook users has increased by 2.5 times, reaching over 370,000 accounts by May 2012.[10] As of October 2011, there were 315,000 users in the popular local social network Vceti.by, over 632,000 Belarusian bloggers on LiveJournal, and about 1.2 million Belarusian users of the Russian social network, Odnoklassniki.ru.[11] The Russian VKontakte continues to be the most popular social network service, counting 2.5 million accounts registered in Belarus, and is the third most accessed site in the country.[12] While Belarus has two official languages—Belarusian and Russian—the majority of citizens use Russian in daily life. As a result, most online software is in Russian, although some popular software is also available in Belarusian, often translated by local enthusiasts.
There is no independent regulator overseeing ICTs in Belarus. Rather, the Ministry of Communications and Information Technology handles regulatory functions. In addition, the Presidential Administration’s Operational and Analytical Center (OAC) has the authority to oversee ISPs, conduct overseas online surveillance, and manage the country’s top-level domain (“.by”).[13] Created in 2008, it replaced the State Center for Information Security, which was part of the Committee for State Security (KGB). Other key bodies include the State Telecommunications Inspectorate, State Control Committee, and Prosecutor General’s Office.
Beltelecom and the National Center for Traffic Exchange, established by the government in 2011, remain the only entities with the right to handle connections with internet providers outside of Belarus. Plans to open up international connections to other operators, including private companies, were put on hold in January 2011 after the Ministry of Communications reported that no bids to compete for licenses were received.[14] Beltelecom also holds a monopoly over fixed-line communications and internet services inside Belarus. In July 2011, the government reiterated that it has no plans to privatize Beltelecom.[15] The Ministry of Communications has issued 180 licenses for secondary ISPs, though only 56 active secondary ISPs currently operate in Belarus. The Beltelecom subsidiary Belpak remains the largest ISP.
The controversial Decree No. 60, “On Measures to Improve the Use of the National Segment of the Internet,” which was enacted on February 1, 2010 and came into effect on July 1, 2010, has had a mixed impact. In terms of regulation, one requirement of the edict is that all legal entities operating in the “.by” domain must use Belarusian hosting services.[16] This provision does not apply to sites belonging to individuals. However, a personal site that is hosted on a national provider, including internet resources providing free hosting, is subject to compulsory registration by the ISP. Media rights advocates interpret this aspect of the edict as a means of ensuring greater government control over the internet.[17] By December 2011, there were 44,000 domains in the “.by” zone—17,000 were registered in 2011 alone. Some of this increase was due not only to the new decree but also the financial crisis, which made registering a “.by” domain four times cheaper in 2011.[18]
In November 2011, Article 22.12 on “The Violation of Demands on the Use of the National Segment of the Internet” was added to the Administrative Code. The new amendments, which established fines for violations of Decree No. 60, came into force on January 6, 2012. A legal entity or a sole entrepreneur may now be penalized with a modest fine for “selling goods or providing services” in Belarus with the help of websites not registered in Belarus. However, the OAC, which is in charge of enforcing the decree,[19] denied that the new law effectively prohibits Belarusian businesses from advertising and selling their goods or services abroad with the help of foreign-registered websites,[20] despite the language in the law that suggests this.
The new regulations also include a modest fine for internet cafes that fail to keep records of users’ personal data, time spent online, and internet traffic, as well as for ISPs that fail to keep similar records.[21] To date, the major impact of the edict has been on internet cafes, which are required to ask users to show identification before going online. This measure has proved to be unpopular with customers and, as a result, business has suffered and some cafes have closed. The new regulations have also threatened to increase costs for ISPs, who are required to install the necessary monitoring and filtering equipment. While heavily criticized by media rights activists, Decree No. 60 and its amendments have not, to date, limited the growth or the dynamism of the Belarusian internet.
Decree No. 60 introduced for the first time official mechanisms by which ISPs are required to block access to restricted information, such as pornography and material that incites violence, although by law the authorities are authorized to institute such blocking only in state institutions or when sought by individual users. In practice, however, the government has for a number of years engaged in ad hoc efforts to limit access to internet content deemed contrary to its interests,[22] though Beltelecom typically cited technical problems instead of admitting to blocking. The authorities have regularly blocked certain websites on election days, select holidays important to the democratic opposition, and during protests.
In June 2010, the Ministry of Telecommunications and the OAC issued a regulation that called for the creation of two lists cataloging the URLs of all websites that should be blocked; one list is open to the public, whereas the other list is accessible only by ISPs.[23] As of January 2012, the publicly accessible list did not contain any URLs,[24] while the number of URLs on the closed list remains unknown. The State Telecommunications Inspectorate claims that it has blacklisted 35 websites, most of which contain pornographic content.[25] But based on unofficial information leaked by an internet provider, the latter blacklist counts up to 60 websites[26] and includes two of the country’s most popular independent news and information websites, Charter97.org and Belaruspartisan.org, the website of the Viasna Human Rights Center, and the political blog of the popular independent commentator Yauhien Lipkovich.[27] The Prosecutor General’s Office confirmed that Charter97.org and Belaruspartisan.org are, indeed, on the restricted list.[28] State bodies authorized to add items to the blacklist include law enforcement agencies such as the Ministry of Internal Affairs, Prosecutor General’s Office, and KGB. To date, the blocking is said to be limited to state agencies, including cultural and educational institutions. However, independent sources suggest that, as of early 2012, the blocking was not being implemented and that a variety of opposition and independent sites, including those alleged to be on the blacklist, were still available at government offices and state universities.[29]
Under the November 2011 amendments—which stipulate fines for violating Decree No. 60—ISPs that provide customers with access to blacklisted websites will be required to pay a small fine. More generally and outside of the context of state institutions, ISPs seem to be quite inconsistent in their blocking practices; some have blocked access to blacklisted sites without users’ request, which is technically illegal under the decree, while others have ignored the blacklist.[30] In December 2011, Beltelecom selectively blocked certain websites in the Vitebsk region that did not change their domain name system (DNS) servers’ settings to comply with state recommendations. Consequently, Charter97.org and several other websites were temporarily unavailable in the Vitebsk region.[31]
Furthermore, access to Charter97.org, as well as Facebook, Vkontakte and Odnoklassniki, is blocked in the luxury hotel “Europe” in Minsk, based on a decision made by the hotel’s administration.[32] In January 2012, the BelCel mobile phone operator acknowledged that it occasionally blocked access to opposition websites without clients’ permission.[33] In order to limit access to information regarding the summer 2011 “silent protests” and prevent the organizing of new civic actions, one of the largest Vkontatke communities involved in calling for protests in Minsk with over 120,000 users was deleted from the website on July 2, 2011, under the pretext that this group was spreading spam.[34]
Local media rights groups have argued that the regulations adopted during the last two years reflect an alarming trend towards greater control of the internet and that many provisions remain vague and unclear. For example, the procedure of including sites in the blacklist is nontransparent. According to Andrey Bastunets, deputy chairman of the Belarusian Association of Journalists, the illegal methods used by the security services are a greater threat to the internet than legal restrictions, but both are being used in tandem to further limit internet freedom.[35]
The government is also employing direct and indirect economic pressure to undercut financial support for certain sites. A series of restrictive amendments to the Law on Public Associations and Criminal Code were passed secretly in October 2011 and came into force a month later. Of importance were provisions that made it a criminal offense for nongovernmental organizations (NGOs) to receive foreign funding. Since most online independent media outlets are run as NGOs, the new amendments constitute a grave threat to civil society, including free media, in Belarus.[36]
Most independent news and information websites are at an economic disadvantage because state and private companies are afraid to place commercial advertisements on them. Moreover, there is an unwritten rule advising that companies connected with the state should not advertise in the independent media, including internet publications. As a result, even the most popular independent or opposition websites, such as Charter97.org and NN.by, generate little or no advertising revenue. Since this ban on advertising exists only in the form of an oral recommendation, media and human rights groups have been unable to effectively oppose it.
Another result of state pressure is self-censorship, which has become a pervasive phenomenon for both traditional and web-based media, especially state and commercial outlets. Like their counterparts working for print outlets and television and radio stations, online commentators and administrators of web portals avoid posting content that might put them at odds with the authorities.
The largest Belarusian portal, TUT.BY, has refused to post banners advertising certain independent and opposition websites, and has tightened control over discussion forums by employing moderators to screen comments before they are posted.[37] In October 2011, a live broadcast with the popular independent singer Liavon Volski on TUT.BY-TV was interrupted. The portal’s editor explained the incident by saying that the performance contradicted TUT.BY’s editorial policy; the portal’s owner said that the program was halted after the singer began to openly mock government officials.[38]
The governing regime is attempting to counter the advances in quality, popularity, and trust made by independent civil society by increasing its own presence and influence online. For example, a special governmental program was launched in 2010 to assist regional and local state newspapers in creating and promoting their websites. The program includes the development of a website based on the Wordpress platform, a week-long training course on content management systems, SEO and audio/video editing basics for representatives of state media, and further technical support for optimizing a website. The program is implemented under the supervision of the Ministry of Information. In order to aggregate the content produced by local and regional state publications, a portal for their websites was created at Belsmi.by.
At the same time, the number of trolls and paid commentators, and their activities, has significantly increased on independent websites, the blogs of civic activists and commentators, and popular opposition communities on social networks. In 2011, the anonymous pro-government website “Traitors of Belarus” (Predateli.com) was created, which publishes a list of alleged “traitors of the state” and provides their personal data, including emails and mobile telephone numbers. The list includes the names, biographies, and contact information of opposition political leaders, civic activists, and independent journalists.
In 2011, traditional print and broadcast media continued to have a much stronger presence in society than new media and remained the main sources of news and information for most Belarusians. The internet is still viewed as more of a source of entertainment or as a place to explore contesting opinions. Nevertheless, in the run up to and aftermath of the 2010 presidential election, web-based independent media played a much more visible role and attracted a larger audience than ever before. While the gains in readership have not been uniform, independent news and information web sources continue to serve larger audiences than they did before December 19, 2010. Following the April 11, 2011 bomb blast in a Minsk subway station, hits on independent websites skyrocketed, indicating that citizens are relying less on state media.[39] According to the Belarusian ranking service Akavita.by, most of the Top 10 and a majority of the Top 50 news and information websites are run by independent or opposition groups, and the readership of the leading online independent media has increased on average by 2.5 times since November 2010.[40] The daily audience of Charter97.org, the most popular opposition website, has quadrupled to more than 100,000 unique visitors a day. Independent public opinion polls also indicated that, for the first time, Belarusians began trusting independent media more than the state media in 2011.
In Belarus, elections have had a strong impact on the development of ICTs. As the authorities moved to close down and restrict independent print newspapers before the 2006 presidential election, blogs, internet forums, online communities, and news websites became more prominent during and after the campaign. With the rapid rise of new media, independent online sources were able to compete with state-controlled newspapers, radio, and television during the 2010 campaign and the protests following the election. In addition to independent news and information websites, Facebook, Vkontakte, and Twitter played a significant role in educating citizens, turning out voters, and mobilizing those protesting electoral irregularities. In 2010, a crowd-sourcing platform was used for the first time to monitor election violations.[41]
After the December 2010 crackdown, a citizen solidarity campaign was launched by an activist’s emotional blog post that described the awful prison conditions of those detained and called her friends to help by donating cloths, money, transport, etc. Her post was republished by other bloggers and mainstream independent online media. Hundreds responded. To better coordinate the effort to help those arrested and their families, a special website was set up where people could identify what kind of assistance was needed and become a “guardian angel” to a detainee. More than US$50,000 was collected, and over 700 parcels were prepared and delivered to prisons. The same campaign was used to mobilize support for those detained during the summer 2011 protests.[42]
In summer 2011, social networks were also used as a major tool in organizing the “Stop Gasoline” strike, which caught the police and authorities by surprise. On June 7, 2011, hundreds of cars blocked Independence Avenue, a major thoroughfare in downtown Minsk, at rush hour in protest against increasing gasoline prices. The next day, the government backtracked and reduced prices.[43]
The success of the “Stop Gasoline” strike sparked a series of large-scale silent protests across the country. Weekly peaceful demonstrations were organized in June-July 2011 through a “Revolution through Social Networks” campaign, launched by pro-democratic communities on Facebook and Vkontakte. The campaign brought thousands of citizens, mostly young people, to the streets in most major Belarusian cities. Fearing that online campaigns would lead to mass street demonstrations, social-networking websites were temporarily blocked on the days of the protests.[44] One of the Vkontakte communities calling for the protests in Minsk and consisting of over 120,000 users was deleted from the website on July 2, 2011.[45] The “Revolution through Social Networks” initiative was not the only example of Belarusian self-organizing online. There are at least five other anti-government communities on Vkontakte, which number between two and 20,000 people.
Internet tools have also been used to further online petitions on important political issues. In November 2011, almost 62,000 people signed an online petition against the death penalty sentence given to two Belarusians convicted of a terrorist act in the Minsk metro.[46] In November and December 2011, over 1,700 people added their names to an online petition for the release of the prominent Belarusian human rights defender, Ales’ Bialiatski, who was sentenced to 4.5 years in prison on trumped up charges of tax evasion.[47]
Because Belarusian users have, until quite recently, had regular access to most online resources under ordinary circumstances, they generally have not employed proxy servers or other circumvention tools, leaving them vulnerable during politically sensitive periods when ad hoc disruptions occur. Most often, people are reminded about blocking, hacking, trolling and phishing only when it takes place.[48] The most popular circumvention tools are proxies and Tor, a software system that enables online anonymity.[49]
Civil rights, including the right to access information and freedom of expression, are guaranteed by the Belarusian constitution, although they remain severely restricted in practice. A 2008 law identified online news outlets as “mass media,” and Article 33 requires every such website to include the names of the publication, its founder(s), and its chief editors, as well as the full address of the editorial office and the registration number.[50] Formally, there are no laws assigning criminal penalties or civil liability specifically for online activities, but internet activities can be prosecuted under laws applicable to mass media—mainly for defamation—or under any relevant criminal law. In addition, government officials have stressed the need to hold site owners and service providers legally accountable for prohibited content and to provide them with the tools to block such content.[51]
Decree No. 60 requires ISPs to maintain records of the traffic of all internet protocol (IP) addresses, including those at home and at work, for one year. As a result, the state can request information about the internet use of any citizen. Since 2007, internet cafes are obliged to keep a 12-month history of the domain names accessed by users and inform law enforcement bodies of suspected legal violations.[52] Mobile phone companies are required to turn over similar data when asked by the government. Individuals are required to present their passports and register when they buy a SIM card and obtain a mobile phone number.
Following the December 19th protests, security services raided more than a dozen editorial offices and journalists’ private apartments, including those connected to popular online news and information sites. Over 114 pieces of professional media equipment were seized.[53] Scores of journalists were arrested and criminal proceedings were initiated against seven members of the Belarusian Association of Journalists; six were convicted and punished with sentences ranging from probation to four years in a maximum security prison for allegedly organizing and preparing actions that disturbed the public order, or for actively participating in such actions, violating Article 342 of the Criminal Code. After the December 19th demonstrations, mobile phone providers reportedly assisted authorities in tracking down protesters and opposition activists.[54]
Over the past year, more than 3,500 citizens were arrested. The majority of these arrests took place during the summer 2011 “silent protests” related to the country’s economic and political crisis. Of those arrested, no fewer than 95 were journalists. In 2011, more than 150 journalists were detained, 22 were tried, and 13 were sentenced for different alleged administrative infractions, including participating in unsanctioned mass protests, hooliganism, and slander.[55] As of early 2012, more than a dozen political prisoners remain behind bars, including three members of the Belarusian Association of Journalists.[56] Many of the journalists who were repressed in 2011 worked for independent websites or media outlets with an online presence.
In 2010, the authorities initiated several criminal cases against Charter97.org alleging the website’s liability for objectionable comments posted by its readers.[57] In the wake of the post-election crackdown, Charter97 editor Natallya Radzina was detained on December 20, 2010 by the KGB. She was released on January 28, 2011 and placed under house arrest, but was able to flee the country on March 31, 2011. She was granted political asylum in Lithuania, and the editorial office of Charter97.org now operates in exile.
In addition to legal and technical attacks on independent news sites, there were numerous cases of prosecution of individual media activists for their online activities in 2011. The most prominent case involved the April arrest of journalist Andrzej Poczobut. He was convicted of insulting the president of Belarus in a series of articles, including those posted on the online version of the Polish daily Gazeta Wyborcza, Belaruspartisan.org, and his LiveJournal blog; he received a three-year suspended sentence.
In June 2011, criminal proceedings were launched against the civic journalist and blogger, Yauhien Lipkovich, who was charged with defaming state symbols in his LiveJournal blog. In August 2011, two Homyel residents were jailed for five and three days, respectively, over internet postings linked to the summer protests. Another Homyel resident was fined for inviting his friends via Vkontakte to meet during a “silent protest” staged in the city. In September 2011, a young truck driver from Mazyr lost his job after being fined for online political postings.[58] In October 2011, a journalist in Mahilyow was questioned by the prosecutor’s office regarding comments made about a local judge, which were posted on Charter97.org.[59] In January 2012, a student of Belarusian State University sent an open letter to a leading Belarusian newspaper describing how he was called to the dean’s office and interrogated by unidentified KGB employees about his public sharing of opposition documentaries through an internal computer network in his dormitory.[60]
In October 2011, the government introduced and the parliament approved an “anti-revolutionary” package of amendments to laws on civic organizations and political parties, as well as to the Criminal Code. The amendments—which apply to internet-based media outlets—further criminalize protest actions, make receiving foreign funding a criminal offense, and extend the authority of the KGB. Under the amendments, the KGB is now freed from the oversight of other state bodies and has been given powers previously only granted during a state of emergency, including the right to break into the homes and offices of any citizen at any time without a court order.[61] Beginning in March 2012, a significant but unknown number of opposition political leaders, human rights defenders and independent journalists were banned from traveling abroad.[62] This violation of freedom of movement was a reaction to the extension of the European Union’s visa ban list of Belarusian officials involved in the 2010-11 repression.
It is difficult to gauge the extent to which Belarusian security services monitor internet and mobile phone communications, but the surveillance is believed to be far-reaching. On December 19, the day of the 2010 presidential election, the government blocked international connections to ports 443 and 465, thereby preventing users from securely sending emails and posting messages on social-networking sites. In the cases of several of those convicted for political reasons after December 19, personal Skype conversations and emails were used by the prosecution as evidence during the trials. These communications were also cited in articles published in the leading state-run newspaper. It is unclear whether the electronic documents were intercepted by the government or taken from confiscated computers.
Instances of extralegal intimidation and harassment for online activities have increased. During the course of 2011, there were reports of students being summoned by university administrators and interrogated by unidentified secret police agents about posts on their personal blogs and social networks. These students were threatened with expulsion and told that their parents would be fired from their jobs if they refused to cooperate with the authorities.
Instances of technical attacks against independent news sites and civil society have continued to grow. For example, the website of Radio Racyja, which is based in Poland and broadcasts independent news and information into Belarus, was hacked on November 26, 2011 and temporarily disabled.[63] At the end of December 2011, Charter97.org and the website of the opposition youth group “Young Front” (Mfront.net) experienced repeated distributed denial-of-service (DDoS) attacks. Nearly paralyzing the website, hackers deleted much of Charter97.org’s content and posted a false report about the former presidential candidate and political prisoner, Andrey Sannikaw, and his wife, the prominent independent journalist Iryna Khalip. The Young Front site did not function for several days.
A January 2012 inquiry conducted by Electroname.com, a website covering computer and electronics issues, determined that the computers of several opposition politicians, independent journalists, human rights defenders, and online activists had been infected with Trojan viruses that had stolen their passwords and other private information. Electroname.com determined that unidentified hackers had used the same viruses known to be distributed by the KGB. In the December 2011 attack on Charter97.org, for example, the hackers used RMS, a virus developed by Russia’s TeknotIT, which the KGB had attempted to use previously to infect an opposition activist’s computer in July 2011.[64]
The authorities also tried to shut down Prokopovi.ch, an economic website that was created during the peak of the 2011 currency crisis. Satirically named after the former president of the National Bank of Belarus who was among those responsible for the crisis, the site was designed to facilitate illegal currency exchanges. It soon became very popular and actually influenced exchange rates. On August 30, 2011, Prokopovi.ch experienced a massive DDoS attack and was down for one day. It resumed working the following day. The Prosecutor General’s Office attempted to track down the creators and moderators of the website but did not succeed.[65]
Amid widespread technical attacks in the aftermath of the 2010 election and 2011 economic crisis—some of which have been traced to the authorities—it is important to note that Belarusian criminal law prohibits such activity. Specifically, Article 351 of the Criminal Code, covering “computer sabotage,” stipulates that the premeditated destruction, blocking, or disabling of computer information, programs, or equipment is punishable by fines, professional sanctions, and up to five years in prison.[66] The government has stated its intention to accede to the Council of Europe’s Convention on Cybercrime, but it has made no moves to sign on to the Convention for the Protection of Individuals with regard to Automatic Processing of Personal Data.
[1] Dzmitry Ulasaw, “Lukashenka: Students access to destructive websites should be blocked,” Belapan, August 29, 2011,.
[2] Vyachaslaw Budkevich, “Prosecutor general calls for international agreement that could introduce Internet censorship,” Belapan, September 14, 2011,.
[3] International Telecommunication Union (ITU), “Percentage of individuals using the Internet, fixed (wired) Internet subscriptions, fixed (wired)-broadband subscriptions,” 2006 & 2011, accessed July 13, 2012,. A more recent study by the international agency “Gemius” in November 2011 suggests that there are four million internet users and a penetration rate of over 50 percent. See, Mikhail Doroshevich, “Internet in Belarus, November 2011,” E-Belarus.org, January 4, 2011,.
[4] Alyaksey Areshka, “Number of mobile subscribers in Belarus reached 10.7 million by January 1, communications ministry says,” Belapan, January 6, 2012,.
[6] Ibid; “Цифры ИТ – статистика в Беларуси” [IT figures - statistics for Belarus], IT.tut.by, accessed January 21, 2012,.
[8] Mikhail Doroshevich, “Internet in Belarus, November 2011,” E-Belarus.org, January 4, 2011,.
[10] “Belarus Facebook Statistics,” SocialBakers, accessed May 1, 2012,.
[11] Mikhail Doroshevich, “Internet in Belarus, October 2011,” E-Belarus.org,.
[12] Alexa, “Top Sites in Belarus,” accessed January 21, 2012,.
[13] See “Instructions on the procedure of domain names registration in the field of hierarchical names of the national segment of the Internet network” at.
[14] Alyaksey Areshka, “Communications ministry’s contract for wholesale broadband services attracts no bids,” Belapan, January 11, 2012,.
[15] Alyaksey Areshka, “There are no plans so far to reorganize Beltelecom into stock company, CEO says,” Belapan, July 6, 2011,.
[16] Decree of the Council of Ministers No. 644 of April 29, 2010, “On Some Questions of Improving Usage of the National Segment of the Global Internet Computer Network.”
[17] Volha Prudnikova, “Authorities use both legal and illegal methods to control internet, expert says,” Belapan, June 24, 2011,.
[18] The price for an initial year dropped from US$43 to $11. Mikhail Doroshevich, “45 thousand addresses registered in .by domain name zone in 2011,” E-Belarus, December 26, 2011,.
[19] Decree of the President of Belarus No. 60 of February 1, 2010, available in Russian at; “Decree on Internet Limitations Prepared in Belarus (Text of the Document),” Charter 97, December 14, 2009,.
[20] “Доступ к оппозиционным ресурсам пока не блокируется,” [Access to opposition resources is not being blocked yet], BelaPAN, January 6, 2012,.
[21] “Fines for breaking Internet filtering regulations introduced in Belarus on January 6,” Belarusian Association of Journalists, January 4, 2012,.
[22] Mikhail Doroshevich, “Internet Filtering in Belarus,” E-Belarus.org, March 20, 2006,.
[23] “БелГИЭ приступила к формированию "черного списка” [State Supervisory Body for Telecommunications Started Forming the “Black List”] Electroname, July 9, 2010,.
[24] “Списки ограниченного доступа” [Lists of Restricted Access], Ministry of Telecommunications, accessed on January 22, 2012,.
[25] “Limited access to 35 websites,” Belarusian Association of Journalists, November 10, 2011,.
[26] “Список запрещенных в Беларуси сайтов вырос до 60” [In Belarus list of blocked sites increased up to 60], Electroname.com, January 6, 2012,.
[27] Zmitsier Lukashuk, “Websites restricted for state institutions since November 28,” Euroradio, November 30, 2011,.
[28] Vyacheslaw Budkevich, “Government begins blocking access to opposition websites,” Belapan, April 11, 2011,.
[29] Alena Lawrentsyeva, “Access to opposition news sites still free at universities, government buildings, suggests Belapan’s survey,” January 6, 2011,.
[30] Volha Prudnikova, “Authorities use both legal and illegal methods to control internet, expert says,” Belapan, June 24, 2011,.
[31] “Beltelecom: If you don’t block Charter97, We’ll block Internet,” Euroradio, December 28, 2011,.
[32] “Social nets are banned in five-star hotel ‘Europe,’” Nasha Niva, December 29, 2011,.
[33] Maryna Nosava, “BelCel blocks access to opposition websites for clients without their permission, representative acknowledges,” Belapan, January 6, 2012,.
[34] ,.
[35] Volha Prudnikava, “Authorities use both legal and illegal methods to control Internet, experts say,” Belapan, January 11, 2012,.
[36] See: “Belarus: Open Joint NGO Letter to the Parliament of Belarus,” Human Rights Watch, October 20, 2011,.
[37] “Country Profiles: Belarus,” OpenNet Initiative, May 9, 2007,; Mikhail Doroshevich, “TUT.BY Premoderates Forums,” E-Belarus.org, January 22, 2009,.
[38] “Скандалам завяршыўся візыт Лявона Вольскага на TUT.by” [Liavon Volski’s visit to TUT.by ended with a scandal], Svaboda.org, October 25, 2011,.
[39] Iryna Vidanava, “Scenes from the battlefield,” Eurozine, July 1, 2011,.
[40] “Top ranker,” Akavita.by, accessed on January 22, 2012,.
[41] See report on Electby.org (in English) at.
[42] Galina Abakunchik, “«Анёлы-ахоўнікі» вярнуліся ў Менск” [“Angels guards’ return to Minsk], Svaboda.org, July 8, 2011,.
[43] “Пасля пратэсту аўтамабілістаў Лукашэнка загадаў знізіць кошты на бензін” [After the car owners’ protest Lukashenka ordered to reduce the gasoline price], Nasha Niva, June 8, 2011,.
[44] “В Беларуси заблокирован доступ к Вконтакте” [Access to Vkontakte is blocked in Belarus], Naviny.by, July 13, 2011,.
[45] ,.
[46] “Innocent until proven guilty,” Care2 Petition Site, accessed on January 23, 2012,.
[47] “Sign a petition for the release of Ales’ Bialiatski,” Freeales.spring96.org, accessed on January 23, 2012,.
[48] Yegor Martinovic, “Што рабіць, каб не падчапіць вірус у Інтэрнэце” [What to do in order not to catch a virus in Internet], Nasha Niva, January 15, 2012,; “ЖЖ заблокировано” [LJ is blocked], Community.livejournal.com/minsk_by, January 10, 2008,.
[49]“Как обойти блокировку сайта?” [How to circumvent a website blockade?], Charter 97, January 18, 2008,.
[50] Law of the Republic of Belarus No. 427 of July 7, 2008, “On the Facilities of Mass Information,” available in Russian at; “Экспертыза новага закона «Аб СМІ»” [Analysis of the New Law on mass media], Belarusian Association of Journalists, accessed on July 9, 2010,; “International expertise of the Belarusian draft law on information, informatization and information protection,” E-Belarus.org, March 2007,.
[51]“ Пролесковский знает, как зачистить интернет” [Proleskovsky knows how to clean up the internet], Belaruspartisan.org, June 4, 2008,.
[52] “Совет Министров Республики Беларусь Положения о порядке работы компьютерных клубов и Интернет-кафе” [Council of Ministers of the Republic of Belarus. Regulations on computer clubs and internet cafe functioning], Pravo.by, April 29, 2010,.
[53] Iryna Vidanava, “Scenes from the battlefield,” Eurozine, July 1, 2011,.
[54] “Ні дня бяз допытаў” [Not a single day without interrogation], Reporter.by, January 20, 2011,.
[55] “Violations of Journalists’ and Mass Media Rights in 2011: Brief Annual Review,” Mass Media Belarus E-Newsletter, Belarusian Association of Journalists,.
[56] Helle Whalberg, “A year of turmoil – but change is on its way,” International Media Support, December 20, 2011,.
[57] “Против сайта charter97.org возбуждено третье уголовное дело” [Criminal case brought against charter97.org website], Electroname, December 8, 2010,.
[58] Alena Hermanovich, “Young man in Homyel region loses job after being fined over political postings,” Belapan, September 7, 2011,.
[59] Uladzimir Laptsevich, “Journalist in Mahilyow questioned at prosecutor’s office over ‘abusive’ online posts about local judge,” BelaPAN, October 14, 2011,.
[60] “Можаце збірацца сваім пакоем і глядзець хоць некалькі раз у суткі” [You can gather in your room and watch them even several times a day], NN.by, January 19, 2012,.
[61] “Belarus has adopted ‘anti-revolutionary’ amendments to the legislation,” Human Rights House, October 20, 2011,
[62] For Belarusian Association of Journalists’ reaction to the restriction on journalists’ travel, see.
[63] “Radio Racyja website hacked,” Belarusian Association of Journalists, November 29, 2011,.
[64] “Кибероружие белорусского КГБ” [Cyberweapon of the Belarusian KGB], Electroname.com, January 9, 2012,.
[65] “Final solution to foreign currency problem: DDoS attack on prokopovi.ch,” Charter97.org, August, 30, 2011,.
[66] “«Белтелеком»: Возможно, независимые сайты блокировали другие организации” [Beltelecom: Independent websites could be blocked by other organizations], Charter 97, January 10, 2008,. |
20130076118 - Wire connecting method and converter station for ultra-high voltage direct current power transmission, and ultra-high voltage direct current power transmission system: Connection methods for UHVDC transmission at rectification side and at inversion side, UHV converter stations at rectification side and at inversion side, and an UHVDC transmission system are disclosed. The present invention employs a manner of multiple drop points to solve the problem of poor security stability of electric grid... Agent: State Grid Corporation Of China
20130076119 - Systems and methods to emulate high frequency electrical signatures: Some embodiments teach an electrical device configured to emulate a high frequency electrical noise signal on an electrical power line. The electrical device can include: (a) a monitoring module configured to detect usage of electrical power from an electrical power line by a first one of one or more electrical... Agent: Belkin International Inc.
20130076120 - Aircraft emergency power system: An emergency power system for use on an aircraft includes an emergency electrical generator coupled to a mechanical power source for generating emergency electrical power. An electrical power distribution network connects the emergency electrical generator to a plurality of electrical loads. A controller controls the electrical power distribution network to... Agent: Hamilton Sundstrand Corporation
20130076126 - Electric vehicle: An electric vehicle includes: an electric motor; an inverter that supplies electric power to the electric motor; and a cooling system that cools at least one of the electric motor and the inverter, the cooling system having: a main coolant passage configured to circulate a coolant through a radiator and... Agent:
20130076125 - Load control device: A load control device controls a load of a vehicle based on a signal inputted from a manipulation part manipulated by a user. The load control device includes a first command part that issues a first command to supply an electric power to the load based on the signal from... Agent: Omron Automotive Electronics Co., Ltd.
20130076127 - Power source apparatus and vehicle equipped with the power source apparatus: The power source apparatus is provided with a plurality of battery blocks 1 having high-voltage battery assemblies 2 with chargeable batteries 11 connected together, voltage detection circuitry 4 to detect voltage via detection lines 17 connected to the batteries 11 that make up the high-voltage battery assemblies 2, and central... Agent: Sanyo Electric Co., Ltd.
20130076122 - Power supply system, electric vehicle and charging adapter: There are provided a power supply system, an electric vehicle and a charging adapter. Electric power from a commercial power supply is distributed to electric lines by way of a distribution board and provided to electric apparatuses and an electric vehicle from the electric lines. When power consumption of electric... Agent: Fuji Jukogyo Kabushiki Kaisha
20130076124 - Power switching apparatus: A power switching apparatus, configured to switch a power supply source that is configured to supply an electric power to an air conditioner that is mounted on a vehicle that can receive a power supply from a plurality of power sources, includes: a selecting unit configured to select the power... Agent:
20130076121 - Proximity switch having lockout control for controlling movable panel: A vehicle proximity switch and method are provided having lockout control for controlling a movable panel on a vehicle. The switch includes a proximity sensor such, as a capacitive sensor, installed in a vehicle and providing a sense activation field. The proximity switch also includes control circuitry for processing the... Agent: Ford Global Technologies, LLC
20130076123 - Secure power source structure for startup of electric power supply device: A starting power securing structure of an electric power supply device includes a built-in battery that is mounted on the electric power supply device, an operation control portion that is mounted on the electric power supply device and controls the operation of the electric power invert portion, and a discharging... Agent:
20130076128 - Active switching frequency modulation: A method of controlling a variable frequency power converter disposed on a vehicle, and a machine with such a variable frequency power converter is disclosed. The method may comprise providing a power controller, the variable frequency power converter and an electrical energy storage repository disposed on the vehicle. The method... Agent: Caterpillar, Inc.
20130076129 - Automotive power source apparatus and vehicle equipped with the power source apparatus: The power source apparatus has high-voltage-side power supply circuitry 4 that supplies driving battery 1 power to the first measurement circuit 2 and the second measurement circuit 3, isolation circuitry 5 that isolates output from the first measurement circuit 2 and the second measurement circuit 3 and outputs it to... Agent: Sanyo Electric Co., Ltd.
20130076130 - Transformer control device and method based on three-dimensional zone diagram policy: Disclosed is a transformer control device and method based on a three-dimensional zone diagram policy. The method includes: setting transformers, including a transformer A and a transformer B; collecting three-phase voltage data and three-phase current data in a power system; rectifying the collected three-phase voltage data and the three-phase current... Agent:
20130076131 - Distributed power generation system and operation method thereof: A distributed power generation system (100) comprises a power generation unit (104) for generating DC power; a power converter (106) which converts the DC power from the power generation unit into AC power (first power) and outputs the first power to a power load; a power measuring device (108, 109)... Agent: Panasonic Corporation
20130076132 -
20130076133 - Apparatus including a gate drive circuit for selectively providing power to a powered device through multiple wire pairs: A gate drive circuit includes a first gate terminal, a second gate terminal, and a driver circuit including an input and including an output coupled to the first gate terminal. The driver circuit is configured to provide a drive signal to the first gate terminal to control a first switch... Agent:
20130076135 - High-power boost converter: A high-power boost converter including two or more inductors coupled to an input DC power source and to switches that can be modulated to control the output power of the high-power boost converter. The two or more inductors are further coupled to each other electrically, magnetically, or both electrically and... Agent: General Electric Company
20130076134 - Power converter islanding detection: A power converter including a detection apparatus and method for detecting an islanding condition based on measurements of one or more currents and voltages within the power converter provided to a current regulator to generate a signal that is provided in a positive feedback loop and is indicative of an... Agent: General Electric Company
20130076136 - Battery powered charger: A charger for recharging the batteries of a portable electronic device even when no external power source is available. A battery or cell is installed within the charger, and when no access is available to a fixed power source into which the charger can be plugged, the internal battery or... Agent: Techtium Ltd.
20130076137 - Intelligent battery system: A mobile workstation includes a first battery bracket for releasable attachment of a main battery, a second battery bracket for releasable attachment of a backup battery and a power control circuit. The power control circuit includes a first input for receiving and monitoring power from the main battery, a second... Agent: Anton/bauer, Inc.
20130076138 - Cell parallel device: The invention related in cell parallel device is a circuit of SCR S1 to S4, comprises: a first terminal connected T1 to positive voltage terminal of first cell E1; a second terminal T2 connected to positive voltage terminal of second cell E2; and a third terminal T3 connected to voltage... Agent:
20130076139 - Discharge apparatus for auxiliary power: A discharge apparatus for auxiliary power is applied to an alternating current power apparatus and a switching power supply. The switching power supply includes an auxiliary power unit. The auxiliary power unit will not discharge to the discharge apparatus for auxiliary power when the alternating current power apparatus supplies power... Agent: Delta Electronics (shanghai) Co., Ltd.
20130076140 - Systems and methods for microgrid power generation and management: Systems and methods for coordinating selective activation of a multiplicity of emergency power generation equipment over a predetermined geographic area for distribution and/or storage to supply a microgrid of electrical power for a substantially similar geographic area.... Agent:
20130076142 - Ac power supply apparatus and methods providing variable voltage waveforms for load transient conditions: Some embodiments of the inventive subject matter provide methods of operating an uninterruptible power supply (UPS) configured to provide power to a load from first and second power sources, e.g., from a utility source and a battery or other backup source. The methods include operating the UPS to momentarily provide... Agent:
20130076143 - Uninterruptible power system: The present invention provides an uninterruptible power system (UPS), the UPS comprising: a first converter having a first input terminal for receiving a first power source and a first output terminal for outputting a first voltage, wherein the first power source is a DC power or AC power and the... Agent: Delta Electronics (shanghai) Co., Ltd.
20130076141 - Unintteruptible power supply systems and methods employing on-demand energy storage: An uninterruptible power supply (UPS) system includes first and second busses, a first switching circuit configured to selectively couple an AC source to the first and second busses and a second switching circuit configured to selectively couple the first and second busses to a load. The system also includes a... Agent:
20130076145 - Capacitor circuit for arrays of power sources such as microbial fuel cells: An electronic circuit to increase voltages from one or more energy sources. The electronic circuit can include a first set of capacitors and a second set of capacitors, and a first set of switches associated with the first set of capacitors and a second set of switches associated with the... Agent: The Penn State Research Foundation
20130076144 - System and method for limiting photovoltaic string voltage: A system and method are provided for enabling a PV inverter to be connected to a string of series connected PV modules without exposing the inverter to elevated voltage stresses. The input voltage to the inverter is gradually built up by sequentially switching in more series PV modules. This system... Agent: General Electric Company
20130076148 - Battery device for uninterrupted power supply and electronic device with such a battery device: The embodiments described herein provide a battery solution for electronic devices that addresses one or more of the above discussed defects. More specifically, a battery device is provided and capable of uninterruptedly supplying power to an electronic device, even when the rechargeable battery in the electronic device is removed. The... Agent:
20130076147 - Multiple battery power path management system: Devices, systems and methods are provided for multiple battery power path management. The device may include a first battery port configured to couple to a first battery; a second battery port configured to couple to a second battery; an output voltage port configured to couple to a device to be... Agent: Fairchild Semiconductor Corporation
20130076146 - Systems and methods for detecting powered or powering device configuration via ethernet connection: Provided is a method for detecting a PoE (power over Ethernet) device comprising applying a positive polarity of a first current source to one of a first and second data pairs of an Ethernet connection to a powered device (PD) and a negative polarity of the first current source to... Agent: Broadcom Corporation
20130076149 - Power-on control circuit: An exemplary power-on control circuit includes power supplies and a control chip. Each power supply includes a power good pin to output a power good signal and an enable pin to receive an enable signal. When the enable pin of one power supply receives an enable signal, the one power... Agent: Hon Hai Precision Industry Co., Ltd.
20130076152 - 3-phase high power ups: According to one aspect, embodiments of the invention provide a UPS comprising a plurality of electrical buses, a first AC/DC converter coupled to the electrical buses and configured to convert a first input AC voltage to a plurality of DC voltages, a second AC/DC converter coupled to the electrical buses... Agent: American Power Conversion Corporation
20130076150 - Acoustic noise modification in power converters: A boost converter including two or more inductors coupled to an input DC power source and to switches that can each be modulated with a modulation signal to control the output power of the boost converter. Two or more of the modulation signals have a relative phase other than 360°... Agent: General Electric Company
20130076151 - Photovoltaic generation system using parallel inverter connected grid: A photovoltaic generation system using grid-connected parallel inverters comprises a plurality of photovoltaic generation devices connected in parallel with each other, and a transformer configured to transform and transfer output voltages of the photovoltaic generation devices to a grid, wherein the photovoltaic generation device includes: a photovoltaic module configured to... Agent:
20130076155 - Electronic device and power supplying method and wireless power supplying system thereof: An electronic device, and a power supplying method and a wireless power supplying system thereof. The electronic device includes a wired electric power receiving module, a wireless electric power receiving module and a switch. The wired electric power receiving module is connected to an external power supply by wired transmission.... Agent: Haier Industrial Park, No. 1 Haier Road
20130076156 - Inductive charging: There is provided a method including transmitting inductively a first signal, receiving inductively a second signal in response to the first signal, determining whether the inductively received signal includes a modulation, and adjusting a power of the transmitted signal on the basis of a modulation of the received signal.... Agent: Powerkiss Oy
20130076154 -... Agent: Access Business Group International LLC
20130076153 - Power receiving device, power transmitting device, wireless power transfer system, and wireless power transfer method: A power receiving unit includes a communication unit, a control unit, a detecting unit that performs metallic foreign matter detection, and a charge storage unit. The control unit is configured to control charging so electric power is stored in the charge storage unit for consumption by the detecting unit during... Agent: Sony Corporation
20130076157 - Device and method for enabling an orthopedic tool for parameter measurement: A system for enabling a medical device. The system includes a cradle having a magnet for generating a magnetic field. The cradle supports and aligns the medical device in a predetermined orientation. Medical device placed in the cradle exposes a magnetic sensitive switch to the magnetic field of the magnet... Agent: Orthosensor
20130069425 - Control apparatus for vehicle: A control apparatus for a vehicle, wherein a detection signal, indicating the connection state of an external power feeding device 100 to an external charging connection unit 5 of a vehicle 1, is supplied from a connection state detection signal generating unit 11 to a storage device management control unit... Agent: Honda Motor Co., Ltd
20130069424 - Onboard power line conditioning system for an electric or hybrid vehicle:... Agent: Gm Global Technology Operations LLC
20130069427 - Circuit arrangement and associated controller for a motor vehicle: The invention relates to a circuit arrangement (1) comprising an electrical and/or electronic circuit unit (10), which comprises a circuit carrier (14), on which at least one electrical and/or electronic component (12) is arranged, and at least one connection region (5) with at least one contact unit (14.2) for electrically... Agent: Robert Bosch Gmbh
20130069426 - Hybrid power and electricity system for electric vehicles: In a hybrid power and electricity system for an electric vehicle, the system provides two kinds of electricity sources for the electric vehicle to resolve conventional problems such as insufficient driving range and long charging time. The system includes a compressed gas power engine that uses compressed gas to generate... Agent:
20130069428 - Power system for actively maintaining operation: A power system... Agent:
20130069429 - Battery managing apparatus, battery pack, and energy storage system: An energy storage system having a number of trays with each tray having a number of battery cells in which power is controllably stored and discharged. A first Battery Management System (BMS) is electrically coupled to a tray contained in a rack of trays. A second BMS is electrically coupled... Agent: Samsung Sdi Co., Ltd.
20130069430 - Power-supply circuit for an electrical appliance having a battery and a dc-to-dc converter: A power supply circuit for a small electrical appliance is disclosed. The power supply circuit includes a battery; a first load with a relatively high power consumption; a controllable switch; at least a second load with a low power consumption; and a DC-to-DC converter. The first load is connected to... Agent: Braun Gmbh
20130069431 - Interchangeable intelligent accessories for mobile devices: Techniques for an interchangeable modular design for mobile device accessories by separating a mobile device accessory into two modules are disclosed herein. The power and data interfaces between a power module and an expansion adapter are predetermined as a standardized design. The power module includes a battery to supply electrical... Agent:
20130069432 - Parallel control and protection for ups: According to one aspect, embodiments of the invention provide a method of operating a UPS system having a first UPS and a second UPS coupled in parallel to provide output power to a load from a power source, each of the first UPS and the second UPS having an inverter... Agent: American Power Conversion Corporation
20130069433 -:
20130069436 - Apparatus and method for controlling power off in a mobile terminal: An apparatus configured to control power off in an apparatus includes a power unit, a battery detachment detector, an input unit, and a controller. The power unit supplies power from at least one of a battery and an auxiliary power unit. When detecting that the battery is separated from the... Agent: Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
20130069434 - Parallel control and protection for ups: According to one aspect, embodiments of the invention provide a method of operating a UPS system having a first UPS, the method comprising powering on the first UPS, detecting a first signal at a first I/O of the first UPS using a first detection circuit of the first UPS, detecting... Agent: American Power Conversion Corporation
20130069435 - Pre-stage boost device for ups: A pre-stage boost device, comprising: a selector switch (130); a power factor inductor (140), a common boost circuit (150), a rectifier circuit (160), and a filter circuit (170). The common boost circuit includes: connected in series a first switch (Q1), a second switch (Q2) and a third switch (Q3). The... Agent:
20130069437 - Method and apparatus for control of commodity distribution system: A system for automated reconfiguration of a commodity distribution system is provided. The system includes a plurality of nodes located in the distribution system and a plurality of node controllers. The node controllers control respective nodes in accordance with a first or second operating mode to affect system reconfiguration in... Agent:
20130069438 - System and method for maximizing power output of photovoltaic strings: A PV system includes a plurality of PV strings each having an optimal string voltage at which a string output power is maximized. The PV strings are connected to a DC link in a parallel arrangement such that each PV strings operates at a variable DC link voltage. A PV... Agent:
20130069439 - Transformerless cycloconverter: The invention relates to a transformerless cycloconverter for connecting a first three-conductor grid (50), in particular a three-phase grid, to a second three-conductor grid (51), in particular a three-phase grid, by means of bridge modules comprising electronic semiconductor circuits (5, 6, 7, 8), having the following characteristics: a) a first... Agent:
20130069443 - Aircraft tire pressure loop link: The aircraft tire pressure loop link is formed of first and second single metal loops connected by parallel spaced apart metal shafts, and provides for coupling a magnetic field between a wheel hub coil and a tire pressure sensor coil to provide electromagnetic communication between a control unit connect to... Agent: Eldec Corporation
20130069441 - Foreign object detection in wireless energy transfer systems: A wireless energy transfer system includes a foreign object debris detection system. The system includes at least one wireless energy transfer source configured to generate an oscillating magnetic field. The foreign object debris may be detected by at least one field gradiometer positioned in the oscillating magnetic field. The voltage... Agent: Witricity Corporation
20130069440 - Incoming circuit using magnetic resonant coupling: According to one embodiment, an incoming circuit using a magnetic resonant coupling includes an incoming coil which receives magnetic field energy transmitted from an outgoing coil under conditions of energy power transmission by the magnetic resonant coupling, and an incoming circuit which comprises a variable capacitor and a rectifier circuit... Agent: Kabushiki Kaisha Toshiba
20130069445 - Receiver coil: The invention relates to a planar receiver coil for use in a receiving device for receiving power from a transmitting device inductively, the receiver coil is intended to be coupled with a transmitter coil of said transmitting device, said receiver coil constituted by winding turns, wherein the winding turns at... Agent: Koninklijke Philips Electronics N.v.
20130069444 - Transmitter module for use in a modular power transmitting system: A modular power transmitting system comprises multiple transmitter modules being connected together for transmitting power inductively to a receiver. The transmitter module is connected with other transmitter modules for transmitting power inductively to the receiver, wherein the transmitter module (40) comprises at least one transmitter cell (30), each transmitter cell... Agent: Koninklijke Philips Electronics N.v.
20130069446 - Wireless electric power receiving device and wireless electric power transmission system: A wireless electric power receiving device and a wireless electric power transmission system are disclosed. The wireless electric power receiving device is coupled to a wireless electric power transmitting device, and comprises a receiving coil, a power supply circuit and an alarm unit. When the receiving coil is coupled, a... Agent: Haier Group Corporation
20130069442 - Wireless power transmission system: Provided is a device and method for wirelessly transmitting power, and a wireless power transmission device that may control an electrical connection between a power charger and a transmitter to charge a source resonator with power and transmit the charged power to a target resonator through mutual resonance.... Agent:
20130069447 - Power monitor and control apparatus and control apparatus of distributed powering system: If a failure has occurred on the backbone-power-transmission-network side, i.e., the electric-power system, and if the power supply to a power-distributing/transforming substation is stopped, a power-distributing feeder is cut off from the electric-power system. Moreover, a monitor/control apparatus transmits a single-operation-permitting permission signal to a distributed power-source system which is... Agent: Hitachi, Ltd.
20130069448 - Electronic apparatus and battery check method: The present invention provides an electronic apparatus which detects a remaining level of a battery used as a power supply, comprising a current detection unit configured to detect a current value flowing through a circuit of the electronic apparatus, a voltage detection unit configured to detect a voltage value of... Agent: Canon Kabushiki Kaisha
20130062937 - Busbar for a power distributor in vehicles and power distributor having such a busbar: A busbar is provided for a power distributor in vehicles. The busbar comprises at least one fastening region for fuses. The fastening region is separated by at least one slot which cuts through the busbar from the remaining part of the busbar to such an extent that the fastening region... Agent: Lisa Draexlmaier Gmbh
20130062936 - Load control device: A load control device controls a load of a vehicle based on a signal inputted from a manipulation part manipulated by a user. The load control device includes a first command part that issues a first command to supply electric power to the load based on the signal from the... Agent: Omron Automotive Electronics Co., Ltd.
20130062938 -: General Electric Company
20130062940 - On-board electrical system for a motor vehicle, motor vehicle and method for operating an on-board electrical system: To operate a safety load in a vehicle electric system and compensate for power surges, a vehicle electric system has a vehicle battery, an electric load, an energy storage device in form of double-layer capacitor, and a switching assembly. In a first switching state, the system can compensate for a... Agent: Audi Ag
20130062939 - Replaceable battery module for an electric vehicle: The present invention relates to a replaceable battery module for an electrically driven vehicle, with at least one bracket that can be detachably arranged on a bearing structure of the motor vehicle, and carries at least one battery unit.... Agent: Gm Global Technology Operations LLC
20130062941 - Electrically powered vehicle and method for controlling same: The SOC of a power storage device provided in an electrically powered vehicle is controlled not to fall out of a SOC control range. When a SOC estimate value reaches a control lower limit value during vehicle traveling, a power generating structure provided in the vehicle starts to charge the... Agent: Toyota Jidosha Kabushiki Kaisha
20130062942 - Solar inverter for an extended insolation range and operating method: An inverter system (1) for a photovoltaic solar installation for generating an AC voltage from a DC voltage of a solar generator (2) is provided which includes an additional energy storage device (38) which is arranged in an energy transfer path that can be activated when needed. A control arrangement... Agent:
20130062943 - Load shedding circuit for ram air turbines: A power generation/distribution system includes a RAM air turbine (RAT) generator and an emergency integrated control center (EICC) that selectively applies either primary power provided by a primary power source or emergency power developed by the RAT generator to an alternating current essential bus (AC ESS bus) for distribution to... Agent: Hamilton Sundstrand Corporation
20130062944 - Utility distribution control system: A utility distribution control system and method for performing distribution control of energy within a utility service network including an energy distribution network in communication with a plurality of energy resources. The energy distribution network includes a plurality of energy storage and generation devices which receive energy from at least... Agent: Green Charge Networks, LLC
20130062946 - Hierarchical balancing system: An example hierarchical balancing system is described that performs balancing amongst power packs comprising an arrangement of power cells, while the power packs separately perform cell-level balancing. A power pack impedance balancer may be implemented for power pack balancing using changes in impedance. An example apparatus may include a rail... Agent: Electronvault, Inc.
20130062947 - Independent field device for automation purposes with intrinsic safety barrier: An autarkic field device or an autarkic radio adapter for a field device, of automation technology fed with limited energy via an energy supply unit associated, or associable, with the field device or the radio adapter. Between the energy supply unit and an internal voltage source, whose voltage exceeds, or... Agent: Endress + Hauser Process Solutions Ag
20130062945 - System employing a thermoelectric device to power an electronic circuit from heat generated by semiconductor devices, and method of powering a system: A system includes a plurality of semiconductor devices; an electronic circuit operatively associated with the semiconductor devices; a thermoelectric device structured to provide power to power the electronic circuit from heat generated by the semiconductor devices; a power supply structured to provide power to power the electronic circuit; a number... Agent:
20130062948 - Multiple-input driving device: The present invention relates to a multiple-input driving device, which receives at least one electrical power that shows a voltage. The multiple-input driving device uses interaction among a voltage regulation module, a control module, and a conversion module to simultaneously the functions of voltage regulation, input through pushbutton switch, driving... Agent:
20130062950 - Device for supplying auxiliary power to an item of equipment on a current-limited power supply bus: The power supply circuit for powering equipment via a current-limited power supply bus at a nominal voltage (Vb) of the equipment includes an auxiliary power supply circuit comprising an energy storage member and a trigger member for triggering auxiliary power supply to the equipment from the storage member via a... Agent: Sagemcom Broadband Sas
20130062949 - Smooth switching device and method for double power supplies: A smooth switching device and method for double power supplies. The devices includes a main/backup power supply switching unit (1), a relay control unit (3), a charge management unit (2), a main power supply switching auxiliary unit (4) and a backup power supply switching auxiliary unit (5). The device and... Agent: Hytera Communications Corp., Ltd.
20130062951 - Battery-backed power interface transformer for low-power devices: A power interface enables a low-power device to be powered from an alternating current (AC) wall receptacle or light socket with automatic backup battery charging. The power interface of an embodiment comprises a transformer module that receives an input signal. The device includes a battery module coupled to the transformer... Agent:
20130062952 - Battery pack: The battery pack that recognizes operation voltage of a corresponding device according to a unique resistance of the connected device and sensed through a third external terminal of the battery pack, the battery pack having a plurality of cells that can be coupled in series or in parallel to be... Agent: Samsung Sdi Co., Ltd.
20130062953 - Reconfigurable power converters, systems and plants: Reconfigurable power systems, converters and plants are disclosed, along with operating methods therefor. Reconfigurable power systems may include a DC power source, an electrical energy storage device, an AC power grid connection, a first power converter, and a second power converter. The first power converter may be configured to selectively... Agent: Abb Research Ltd.
20130062954 - Two-input uninterruptible voltage converting device and method thereof: The invention relates to a two-input uninterruptible voltage converting device and a method thereof. The device comprises a first conversion circuit, a second conversion circuit, an energy storage unit, a fly-wheel switch tube and a control unit. The method comprises the following steps of: converting a PWM signal outputted by... Agent:
20130062955 - Electric power tool powered by battery pack and adapter therefor: An adapter is provided with a connecter portion configured to be detachably attached to the main body of the electric power tool and at least one battery receiving portion configured to be detachably attached to the battery pack. The battery pack attached to the battery receiving portion is electrically coupled... Agent: Makita Corporation
20130062956 - Cell-to-grid redundandt photovoltaic system: In an embodiment, a photovoltaic system includes multiple photovoltaic modules and a module-to-module bus. Each photovoltaic module defines a first end and a second end opposite the first end. Each photovoltaic module includes multiple photovoltaic cells and multiple converters. Energy generated by each photovoltaic cell has multiple paths through the... Agent: Tenksolar, Inc.
20130062958 - Low profile power conversion system for rooftop photovoltaic power systems: The disclosed embodiments and principles provide a way to integrate high-efficiency, low-profile power electronics with localized maximum power point tracking (MPPT) into a rooftop shingle-based photovoltaic power system. DC-DC power converters having a height, or profile, as low as ¼ inch for a 200 W power output, are able to... Agent:
20130062957 -: Eaton Corporation
20130062962 - Power transfer device: A power transfer device is provided. The power transfer device includes a circuit arrangement including a primary side having a primary coil; a secondary side having a secondary coil inductively coupled to the primary coil and a load transformation unit; wherein the load transformation unit includes an inductor and a... Agent: Agency For Science, Technology And Research
20130062966 - Reconfigurable control architectures and algorithms for electric vehicle wireless energy transfer systems: A control architecture for electric vehicle wireless power transmission systems that may be segmented so that certain essential and/or standardized control circuits, programs, algorithms, and the like, are permanent to the system and so that other non-essential and/or augmentable control circuits, programs, algorithms, and the like, may be reconfigurable and/or... Agent: Witricity Corporation
20130062960 - System and method for controlling the connection from a power supply to an inductive power outlet: A switching system configured to control a connection between a power supply and an inductive power outlet where the inductive power outlet includes at least one primary inductor configured to inductively couple with a secondary inductor associated with an inductive power receiver includes a circuit breaker configured to disconnect the... Agent: Powermat Technologies Ltd.
20130062959 - Systems and methods for detecting and identifying a wireless power device: Embodiments are directed to detecting and identifying a type of a wireless power device in a wireless power transfer field. According to one aspect, systems and methods are disclosed which describe limiting power transfer to non-compliant devices and detection of undesired power absorbers, such as metal objects, in a wireless... Agent: Qualcomm Incorporated
20130062967 - Tunable synchronous rectifier: A system for power transfer is provided. In one exemplary embodiment, the system includes an inductive power device, such as a device that transmits or receives power over an inductive coupling. For example, an adjustable impedance is coupled to the inductive power device, where the adjustable impedance is used for... Agent: TriuneIPLLC
20130062963 -... Agent: Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.,
20130062964 -65 -61 - Wireless power system and resonant frequency changing method thereof: This specification provides a wireless power system capable of changing a resonant frequency and a resonant frequency changing method thereof. To this end, a wireless power receiver according to one exemplary embodiment includes a power receiving unit having a receiving side resonant circuit provided with at least one inductor and... Agent:
20130062968 - Household appliance circuit arrangement: An electric household appliance has a low-voltage capacitive power means (10) connected to an electrical power network (3) and is designed to generate a low-voltage (S2,V2). The low-voltage capacitive power means (10) comprise a capacitive dividing circuit (28) comprising a first (30) and second input terminal (31) connected to a... Agent: Electrolux Home Products Corporation N.v.
20130062969 - Compact and voltage stable automatic change over switch:... Agent:
20130062970 - Switching device: A phase changeover switch selects that phase of a three-phase supply system which has the lowest loading for forwarding to a single-phase connection.... Agent:
20130062971 - Control circuit for motorized circuit breaker: A circuit breaker module includes an electrically controlled actuator, such as a DC motor, operable to move a breaker contact between open and closed positions. An actuator power supply circuit coupled to an AC power source is configured to selectively energize the actuator, responsive to an actuation input. A processing... Agent: Schneider Electric Usa, Inc.
20130057056 - Powered device classification in a wired data telecommunications network:... Agent: Cisco Technology, Inc.
20130057063 -: General Electric Company
20130057060 - Device for canceling undesirable magnetic field around on-line electric vehicle, method of manufacturing the same, and on-line electric vehicle capable of canceling undesirable magnetic field: A method, for manufacturing a device for canceling an undesirable magnetic field around an on-line electric vehicle, the method comprising, calculating a primary magnetic field generated by a current flowing through a power line, calculating a first undesirable magnetic field, calculating a second undesirable magnetic field, obtaining an entire undesirable... Agent: Korea Advanced Institute Of Science And Technology
20130057058 - Method and apparatus for supplying power to a portable electronic device in an aircraft: Provided is an apparatus. The apparatus includes a power conditioning module. The power conditioning module includes an input that is operable to receive a first power from an aircraft. The power conditioning module includes electronic circuitry that is operable to transform the first power to a second power. The second... Agent: Asig, LLC
20130057059 - Method and device for protecting an autotransformer for an aircraft: The invention relates to a method for protecting a multi-phase autotransformer for an aircraft, including the steps of receiving (100) values of current input into and output from (IA, IB, Ia, Ib) the first and second phases; determining (101), as a function of these received values, values of current representative... Agent: Airbus Operations (s.a.s.)
20130057061 - Power conversion apparatus: A power conversion apparatus is provided which includes a plurality of power conversion circuits which individually supply power to a plurality of in-vehicle auxiliary units, a common capacitor which is connected to input terminals of the plurality of power conversion circuits, an operation section which operates respective switching elements of... Agent: Denso Corporation
20130057057 - Power source system: In the case where the rotation speeds of respective magneto alternating current (AC) generators of a plurality of power source apparatuses (10, 20, and 30) are approximately the same rotation speed and the total electric power generation demand is the same as or smaller than the maximum total generated electric... Agent: Mitsubishi Electric Corporation
20130057062 - Wiring method and wiring system for structures: A unitized wiring portion (wiring unit) has a hard pipe member, a wire provided in the pipe member, and outside wiring connectors connected at each end of the wire. A plurality of wiring units are prepared in advance wherein wiring units are divided into multiple groups having different length of... Agent: Denso Corporation
20130057064 - Power supply system for air conditioner of car: A power supply system for an air conditioner of a car includes a battery, an alternator, a detection circuit to detect whether the alternator is operating and outputting a detection signal according to the detection result, a processing unit to output a control signal according to the detection signal, and... Agent: Hong Fu Jin Precision Industry (shenzhen) Co., Ltd
20130057065 - Engine control unit for driving an electric circuit and method: An engine control unit for driving an electric circuit, e.g., a starter in a vehicle, includes at least a first element for making a first signal, particularly an ignition signal, available, a second element for making a voltage available for the electric circuit, a third element for connecting the electric... Agent:
20130057066 - External module, electronic device and method for driving external module: An external module, an electronic device and a method for driving an electronic module are provided. The electronic device includes a host and multiple external modules. The external module adapted to be removably connected to the electronic device includes a body, a first connector, a moving assembly and a second... Agent: Acer Incorporated
20130057067 - Mobile micro-grid power system controller and method: Methods and control apparatus are presented for controlling supply of electrical power to a mobile micro-grid power system, in which a master controller automatically rebalances the micro-grid by activating and deactivating individual power supplies to preferentially activate non-fuel consuming power supplies and deactivate fuel consuming power supplies so as to... Agent: Hunter Defense Technologies, Inc.
20130057068 - Mobile backup power supply device with a hub's functions integrated: A mobile backup power supply device includes a Hub with not less than one input port connected to a computer's power supply or an external electric power source and not less than an output port connected to an electronic device, both of which fulfill data transmission & management by means... Agent: Sysgration Ltd.
20130057070 - Circuit device, electronic apparatus, and ic card: A circuit device includes: a first storage control unit which receives power from a power receiving unit which receives power by electromagnetic induction, to perform control of storing charge in a first charge storage unit; a second storage control unit which performs control of storing charge in a second charge... Agent: Seiko Epson Corporation
20130057069 - Maximum power point tracker: A method is provided for determining a value for an electrical output of a converter of renewable energy. The method comprises obtaining a signal representing the electrical output of the converter wherein that electrical output has an initial value. The method further comprises applying a pulse signal to the signal... Agent:
20130057071 - Fuel cell battery charge/discharge management system and method: According to an embodiment of the disclosure, a system for supplying power to a device includes a battery, a mobile recharging power supply, a battery output, and a controller. The battery output is configured to supply power to the device. The controller is configured to upon detecting that a current... Agent: Raytheon Company
20130057072 - Uninterrupted power supply apparatus and power-supplying method for the same: An uninterrupted power supply apparatus is applied to an alternating current power apparatus and a load. The uninterrupted power supply apparatus includes a power distribution unit, a power supply unit, and an uninterrupted power supply unit. The power distribution unit includes a plurality of slots. The power distribution unit is... Agent: Delta Electronics, Inc.
20130057073 - Methods and apparatus for providing uninterruptible power: Power supply systems and methods are provided. In one aspect, a power supply system includes a frame, a power input to receive input power from a power source, a power output to provide output power to a load, at least one battery module mounted in the frame and having a... Agent: American Power Conversion Corporation
20130057074 - Power storage device and power storage system: Provided is a power storage device including: a first chassis member; a second chassis member; a power inlet; one or plural power outlets; a battery module; a power conversion device; a housing; a lower lid; and an upper lid. The battery module is fixed closely to one surface of the... Agent: Sony Corporation
20130057075 - Apparatus and method for charging battery of electric device having motor: An apparatus for charging a battery of an electric device that has a motor by not charging the battery before the electric device is used and a method of charging a battery of an electric device that has a motor by using the apparatus. The apparatus includes a load, a... Agent: Samsung Sdi Co., Ltd.
20130057076 - Battery management system, method and battery: A battery management system includes a master control unit coupled to a plurality of batteries, at least one battery status unit providing data on the status the batteries and a power determination unit providing a measure of the power draw required from the batteries. The master control unit controls the... Agent: Pag Ltd.
20130057079 - Apparatus and method of controlling wireless power transmission: An apparatus for controlling wireless power transmission includes a near-field wireless communication antenna for receiving wireless power transmission control signals from a power transmitting device at a communication frequency, a near-field wireless communication Integrated Circuit (IC) for delivering wireless power transmission control messages based on the wireless power transmission control... Agent: Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd.
20130057081 - Contactless power solution for low power sensors in bioprocess environments: A method and apparatus for providing more reliable wireless communication and power to sensors in electrically challenging bioprocess environments is disclosed. An unconnected antenna is located within the bioprocess environment, preferably in the same plane as the primary powered antenna. This unconnected antenna, also referred to as reflective antenna, enhances... Agent: Emd Millipore Corporation
20130057082 - Non-contact power reception system and non-contact power transmission system: A non-contact power reception system comprising movable body equipment including a secondary-side coil for receiving, in a non-contact manner, electric power from a primary-side coil, which receives electric power from an AC power source, a rectifier, which rectifies electric power received by the secondary-side coil, and an electrical storage device,... Agent: Kabushiki Kaisha Toyota Jidoshokki
20130057077 - Transferring power to a mobile device: Embodiments of the disclosure may include a system for transferring power, the system having a donor mobile device. Such a donor mobile device may include processor(s) and a donor wireless power transfer mechanism coupled to the processor(s). In addition, the donor mobile device may include software application(s) that: (i) configure... Agent: Ariel Inventions LLC
20130057080 -:
20130057078 - Wireless power transmitter and wireless power transfer method thereof in many-to-one communication: A wireless power transmitter for transmitting power in a wireless manner by forming a wireless power signal and a wireless power transfer method thereof are capable of optimizing transmission efficiency for a plurality of wireless power receivers, by deciding an optimal transmission parameter (especially, a frequency corresponding to the wireless... Agent:
20130057083 - High-voltage switching device: A high voltage switching device includes a current interruption assembly having at least one vacuum chamber, a fixed contact assembly having a first fixed contact and a second fixed contact positioned inside the vacuum chamber, and first and second movable-contact assemblies including a first movable contact and a second movable... Agent: Abb Research Ltd.
20130057084 - Hall plate switching system: Disclosed herein is a hall plate switching system including: a hall plate that generates first hall voltage at both ends of a first node and a third node facing each other and generates second hall voltage at both ends of a second node and a fourth node facing each other;... Agent: Samsung Electro-mechanics Co., Ltd. |
Good with...
- Fable III Strategy Guide (Strategy Guides and Books)
Av. User Rating
- Release date 29/10/2010
- Fable III Collector's Edition Strategy Guide (Strategy Guides and Books)
Av. User Rating
- Release date 29/10/2010
Fable III Xbox 360
Xbox 360
Av. User Rating
1
It's been a long time since you last walked through the land of Albion and much has changed.… See more
Av. User Rating
1
Fable III Product Details
Released on 29/10/2010.
Over at Eurogamer, they're reporting some exciting news: Legendary British actor Sir Ben Kingsley has signed up to provide a voiceover for Fable III.
"I'm a voice in a new videogame shortly - Fable III," Sir Ben told CVG in a recent interview. "I'm a wonderful wizard character who is the king of Mist Peak."
And it sounds like Sir Ben, who first came to prominence as Ghandi in Richard Attenborough's 1982 film, has become quite excited about these new-fangled videogame things. videogames - and it is acting. It's very demanding."
Sir Ben's in good company too. The cast for Fable III already includes Steven Fry, John Cleese, and, um, Jonathan Ross.
The latest instalment in Lionhead's staggeringly brilliant action RPG series, Fable III sees you ascend to the throne of Albion, and then invites you to try your hand at ruling. An Xbox 360 exclusive, it should be out this Christmas.
Fable III to get Collector's Edition
Good news for all potential royalty out there: Microsoft's forthcoming king-'em-up, Fable III will be getting a Collector's Edition when it's released this Christmas.
According to Eurogamer, the limited edition box will be wrapped up and presented like a story book from Albion, the mystical world of Fable. Inside is a pack of Fable III playing cards, a Guild Seal coin you can use to help you decide when the quandaries you're faced with in the game get a little too challenging, and trinkets for the game itself.
These will be an exclusive Boxer breed of dog to take with you on your adventures, an Aurora set of clothes, a special quest with the Wolfsbane sword as its reward, and a new "family-oriented" location filled with treasure.
That all sounds rather tempting. Whichever version of the game you go for in the end, Fable III promises an epic fairy tale adventure as you avenge your wronged parent, take back the throne of Albion, and then struggle to rule its divided and wilful populace.
Fable III hits the Xbox 360 this Christmas. And if like us you can't wait, you can always hammer Fable II in the meantime.
Molyneux to reveal more about Fable III next week
Creative director of Microsoft Games Studios and industry legend Peter Molyneux will be treating attendees of next week's Develop conference to a UK-exclusive demonstration of the eagerly-awaited Fable III.
The third game in Lionhead Studios' beloved franchise is due to hit shelves later this year, and will form the basis for a presentation titled Fable III: Story, Cast and Simulation. Molyneux will discuss how he and the development team at Lionhead managed to weave together all three of these key strands to create a sequel that more than lives up to the series' impressive heritage. Thereafter, the game will be demonstrated before attendees to show how these ambitions have been realised.
Molyneux has already spoken openly about the high-profile names providing voice work for the game, which he describes as "the greatest cast that any computer game has ever had." Stephen Fry returns as the roguish Reaver, with John Cleese and Jonathan Ross recently joined by acting luminaries like Bernard Hill and Sir Ben Kingsley. With Simon Pegg and Michael Fassbender also lending their vocal chords to the project, Molyneux's claim might not be too far from the mark.
You can find out whether Fable III lives up to its creator's billing when it launches on October 26th this year.
Mark says The F Word. A lot..
The gift of the gab
FACT III: Fable III takes the template laid down by its forebear and runs with it; and, based on my play of the first three hours, Fable III it's a better game in every single way, shape and form.
Based on the first three hours, Fable III is a better game than Fable II in every single way, shape and form.
The first way in which Fable III ups the ante is a rather simple one; it gives the main character a voice. Where Fable II's speechless protagonist was something of a cipher for the player to imprint their personality upon, Fable III's Prince or Princess (I went for the Prince) – the youngest child of Fable II's hero – is able to convey a richer emotional range merely by opening their mouth to relate their concerns.
At Fable III's outset, that means talking to your Butler, Jasper (voiced by none other than John Cleese!), your childhood sweetheart Elise (or a male alternate if you play as a female lead) and the Palace's head guard, Sir Walter, about the increasingly dark machinations of Albion's King – your elder brother, Logan.
It's here that you'll get to sample Fable III's deeper, murkier and more impactful moral compass – not that your first choice alludes to it too much. With Albion's underprivileged underclass demonstrating loudly, but peacefully inside the castle grounds, you're asked whether or not to sign a petition to help improve their living conditions, to relatively little consequence either way.
Cause-and-effect
Mere minutes later, however, you're being forced by Logan to pick between killing the rowdy rabble's ringleaders, or letting Elise die. It's a world away from the relatively transparent black/white cause-and-effect of Fable II; there really is no right or wrong – though we were assured it's a choice which will have lasting repercussions later in the game.
After that brisk, eventful opening the big success of the next hour or so is the way in which Fable III teaches you the many facets of gameplay whilst at the same time setting out the wider quest which lies before you.
You'll get to dress up as a giant chicken on one of the funniest Fable quests ever.
For starters, you'll need to unlock your hero powers, which means a trip to the, err, trippy Road To Rule (hello again, Theresa!), where you unlock chests that give you spells and various stat bonuses. Then you'll need to acquire a weapon, which you do from perhaps gaming's most elaborate pause screen – an entire chamber named the Sanctuary, with different rooms for equipment, clothing, the newly-enhanced map and co-op (more on that later).
These weapons can actually grow WITH you, reflecting your actions and changing to look holier-than-thou or decidedly evil along with your character, depending on your actions throughout the game. The map, meanwhile, lets you fast-travel to different areas and see which properties you own without jumping between menu screens.
Do the funky chicken
Next up, you'll need to start gaining the following of Albion's inhabitants in order to overthrow Logan. So, off you go to the Dweller camp, where Walter throws you some gold and implores you to buy some Dweller clothes. Newly suited up in activist-baiting animal furs, you get to meet the Dweller Leader Sabine, who gives you three tasks to accomplish before he'll even think about trusting you; and so off you go into the merry town of Brightfall where you will, amongst other things, take a job making pies, and dress up as a giant chicken on one of the funniest Fable quests ever.
Doing all of that gives you enough cash to purchase some mercenary gear and infiltrate their camp to do battle with their leader. Once he's defeated, things all go a bit BioShock, giving you the choice of slaying or sparing him. There will be a knock-on effect either way; you can be sure of that.
Co-op has been overhauled for Fable III, allowing players to wander vast areas independently, share gold, and even get married.
That's about as far as I made it into Fable III, and it left me eager to play more. What I didn't get to see was the game's Big Hook, actually getting to become the king-ruler of Albion – which if my chats with various Lionhead staffers are to be believed, will happen half way through the game, between seven and ten hours in – the entire length of Fable II's story arc.
So yes, Fable III is bigger than Fable II. It's also more emotive, more compelling and more structured, in a similar way to how Assassin's Creed II improved on its original; fusing its many features much more tightly to the narrative, making for an altogether more enjoyable game.
Masterpiece
That refinement even extends to online co-op which has been overhauled considerably for Fable III, allowing players to wander vast areas independently (complete with their own dog), share gold, and even split their wares 50-50 by getting married, replete with an elaborate lakeside ceremony and Xbox Achievement.
In short, every criticism of Fable II has been addressed with Fable III; and as I mentioned at the outset, that was no bad game either. With Halo: Reach, Kinect and Molyneux's masterpiece all on the way, the last four month's of 2010 are going to be a bumper period for Xbox owners. And that, my friends, is a FACT.
Preview by: Mark 'Saved the Girl' Scott
Preview Published: 18.08.10
Published: 18/08/2010
It's storytime once more...
And so our story begins. Again. Clearly, Peter Molyneux likes stories and he likes games. That's why he keeps trying to make them better. For all his wide-eyed conceptual promises that haven't exactly panned out in the final product, there are dozens more ideas that he's crammed into the gaming sphere, changing it for the better every time.
For Fable III, he's continuing to refine and explore what gaming means in the 21st century. He's done away with health bars and the archaic notion of "lives". He's given you a pet dog and trail of optional breadcrumbs to make sure you don't get lost. This time, he's giving you...a butler?
Well, you are the king of Albion now, but a handy manservant (voiced by John Cleese, no less) is far from the only innovation you'll find. While Fable III looks almost identical to its predecessor on the surface, the underlying mechanics have been given a right going over.
Adapt and grow
The idea of "levelling up", for example. Part of the RPG fabric for decades, but in Molyneux's hands it's become more organic, more to do with the game adapting to how you play than you clawing your way up some arbitrary scale. If you have a favourite sword, the more you use it, the better it gets. The way you use it will affect the way it improves. The same is true of spells, guns and other items. You can then trade these unique items with other players online.
You can assign different spells to each of your hands, casting them together to create hybrid effects. You can charge up a sword strike with one button, and keep plugging away with a pistol using another. The dog can now sniff out specific objects or people, rather than occasionally ferreting around for random items. There are dozens of small, brilliant ideas, seamlessly woven into the game so that you hardly notice them until they're pointed out. Then, of course, you wonder why we ever did things any other way.
It's the pause menu that Molyneux is really proud of, though. Pause menus are boring, he declares, and instead gives you sanctuary ? a physical gamespace where John Cleese waits to comment on your performance, and different antechambers allow you to tinker with your clothing and inventory in peace. Your butler will even lay out costume suggestions, based on how you're doing or where in the game you are, but you're free to make your own ensembles, dye them as you see fit, and go into battle in a lime green frock coat with orange britches. Weapons are laid out in similar fashion, while spells can be studied and tweaked before trying them out for real in the game.
Living, breathing
Perhaps most impressive is what's happened to the map. Next to useless in Fable II, it's reinvented here as a living, breathing overview of the gameworld at any given moment. Set in the centre of your sanctuary, it looks for all the world like something out of Molyneux's earlier hits, Populous or Powermonger. Zoom in on the map and you can see who's walking around, fly over the roofs of every building in the game, and buy them there instead of traipsing up to the front door to carry out your landlord duties. You can even find new quests, and check in on events in progress. It's amazing to see, and addictive in its own right.
Typically for a Molyneux game, it's all too easy to fill the page just by listing the ideas, but since the story remains top secret, that's all we have to go on for now.
Yet even just by glimpsing these peripheral features, it's clear that Fable III will continue the mercurial developer's trend for pulling game design apart, throwing out the ideas that have outlived their usefulness, and putting it all back together as something both familiar and utterly surprising.
Fable III comes with DLC goodies
We can't wait to play Fable III. We can't wait to avenge bad things that happened to our mum, the old queen. We can't wait to follow our dog around as it sniffs out treasure. We can't wait to bust up Hollow Men and those werewolf things with a mixture of melee, magic, and musket combat.
With the game hitting shelves next week - it's out on 29th October - we've got a last-minute piece of good news. When you pick up your copy, you'll find a code inside which unlocks a range of goodies for your character.
So what do you get? How about this: a Raise Dead potion (sounds nasty), a Slow Time potion, a Scot Hero Outfit (sounds stylish), a Highlander Tattoo set, and a Red Setter Dog Skin.
That'll do nicely, Microsoft. Thanks!
In case you've missed all the hype, Fable III winds the clock forward on the fantasy world of Albion, taking it to the brink of Industrialisation. The old ruler's been done in, there's a baddie on the throne, and it's your job to knock him off it and then rule the land as best you see fit. As usual with Fable, there's hundreds of moral choices and tricky decisions to make, but there's also plenty of loot and monsters to bash in.
Fable III is hitting the Xbox 360 next Friday; a PC version is scheduled for December.
Fable III tops the UK charts
Do you believe in fairy tales? It seems that you do, as Lionhead's epic fairy tale adventure Fable III has gone straight into the UK all-formats charts right at the top.
The Xbox 360 exclusive - for the moment, at least, because the game's headed to the PC this Christmas - fought off stiff competition for the coveted number one spot, but other newcomers didn't do too badly, either, with Star Wars: The Force Unleashed II coming in fifth and WWE Smackdown vs Raw 2011 hitting seventh. Well done all round!
But really, it's Lionhead's week. Fable III is the long-awaited new instalment in the action RPG franchise. The new game sees you fighting to regain the throne of Albion from your wicked brother, and then goes on to chart your own struggles with leadership as you try to satisfy the needs of your people. If that sounds a bit complicated, all you need to know is that the action is as thick and fast as ever, with great melee, ranged, and magic combat, and weapons that morph depending on how you use them.
With Fable III getting such a great send-off, we can only hope Lionhead's already putting plans together for a sequel, eh?.
Bigger, better, more... Fable'er
FACT III: Fable III takes the template laid down by its forebear and runs with it; and, based on my play of the first three hours, Fable III it's a better game in every single way, shape and form...
Read the full Preview here!
Metroid 3DS on the way?
If you've already finished Metroid: Other M, the brilliant Wii-exclusive sci-fi action game, and you're itching for further adventures of intergalactic bounty hunted Samus Aran, help is potentially on the way. A very unlikely source has suggested that there's a new Metroid game planned for Nintendo's forthcoming 3DS handheld.
Eurogamer's reporting that the story started with TV legend Jonathan Ross, who was replying to a Twitter follower who said that he was hoping for a Metroid game to be announced at Nintendo's 3DS press conference that's scheduled for this Wednesday.
Ross, who's expected to host the event, said, "I think you're going to be pleased then..." Hmm. If there is a new game in the works, the smart money's on Metroid Dread, which is a project that's apparently been in development for a long time, with Advance Wars creators Intelligent Systems, and Metroid daddy Yoshio Sakamoto behind it.
You can count on us to bring you any news of Metroid - and all other 3DS reveals - following this Wednesday's big news splurge. In the meantime, though, it's worth remembering that Jonathan Ross has been right before. He is, after all, the man who accidentally announced the existence of Fable III on Twitter a while ago.
Peter Molyneux awarded the BAFTA Fellowship
It was announced this morning that popular British game designer Peter Molyneux is to receive the BAFTA Fellowship.
He is the third figure from the video game industry to be inducted into the illustrious list of fellows, joining Will Wright, Nolan Bushnell and, most recently, Shigeru Miyamoto. He becomes the second recipient of the honour this year, after it was bestowed upon Christopher Lee at this year's British Academy Film and Television Awards ceremony.
Molyneux is perhaps best known these days as creator of the Fable series, though arguably his most successful creative period came as head of Bullfrog Productions in the mid-Nineties, with a string of innovative and critically-acclaimed releases like Populous, Syndicate, Theme Park and Dungeon Keeper.
After founding Lionhead Studios, Molyneux designed the Fable and Black & White series, as well as being heavily involved in the development of PC title The Movies.
Molyneux said it was "humbling" to "be in the company of some of the greatest talents the entertainment industry has ever seen".
"I remember back in 1967 watching the first BAFTA awards on television with my family and seeing them being so excited about those accolades," he added. "Never in my wildest dreams did I ever think it would be possible for me to accept one of the greatest honours the entertainment industry has to offer."
Following the success of Fable III, there's no word yet on what Molyneux is currently working on, but given the designer's fondness for discussing his projects - often before he's supposed to - details of his future plans surely can't be too far away.
The real star of yesterday's BAFTA show was undoubtedly Peter Molyneux. The legendary designer, who's currently the boss of Lionhead, and who can count the likes of Populous, Syndicate, Black & White, Dungeon Keeper and Fable amongst the games he's helped shape, was awarded a BAFTA Fellowship - a prize that sees him joining Nintendo superstar Shigeru Miyamoto, and SimCity designer Will Wright.
"Every day I wake up and thank the stars that I'm still here now," said Molyneux in an emotional speech. "I love my job so much and I really feel like going home and working harder than I've ever done to prove that I deserve this award."
He also had a few words for the videogaming press, too. "I'd like to thank the press, by the way, for listening to my stuff,he laughed. orry - I've slightly over-promised on things on occasion. I could name at least 10 features in games that I've made up to stop journalists going to sleep and I really apologise to the team for that."
We'll forgive you for over-promising, Mister Molyneux - but we couldn't forgive you if you didn't get to work on Fable IIII straight
Ben Kingsley signs on to Fable III…
See more about ‘Ben Kingsley signs on to Fable III’
Fable III to get Collector's Edition…
See more about ‘Fable III to get Collector's Edition’
Molyneux to reveal more about Fable III next week…
See more about ‘Molyneux to reveal more about Fable I…’
- Fable III Preview (18/08/2010)
Mark says The F Word. A lot.
FACT I: Fable II was "rushed, messy and had big design flaws". That's according to the game's own …
See more about ‘Fable III Preview’
And so our story begins. Again. Clearly, Peter Molyneux likes stories and he likes games. That's why he keeps trying to make them better. For all his wide-eyed conceptual promises that haven't exactly…
See more about ‘Fable III Preview’
We can't wait to play Fable III. We can't wait to avenge bad things that happened to our mum, the old queen.…
See more about ‘Fable III comes with DLC goodies’
Do you believe in fairy tales? It seems that you do, as Lionhead's epic fairy tale adventure Fable III has gone straight into the UK all-formats charts right at the top…
See more about ‘Fable III tops the UK charts’
FACT I: Fable II was "rushed, messy and had big design flaws. That's according to the game's own lead designer; Lionhead boss Peter Molyneux.…
See more about ‘Gamescom 2010: Fable III Preview’
A very unlikely source has suggested that there's a new Metroid game planned for Nintendo's forthcoming 3DS handheld.…
See more about ‘Metroid 3DS on the way?’
It was announced this morning that popular British game designer Peter Molyneux is to receive the BAFTA Fellowship.…
See more about ‘Peter Molyneux awarded the BAFTA Fell…’
The real star of yesterday's BAFTA show was undoubtedly Peter Molyneux. The legendary designer was awarded a BAFTA Fellowship - a prize that sees him joining Nintendo superstar Shigeru Miyamoto, and S…
See more about ‘Peter Molyneux receives BAFTA Fellowship …’
>? |
A mineral binder composition having incorporated therein a carbon black product comprising a carbon black having attached an organic group containing an ionic or an ionizable group.
1. A mineral binder composition comprising a mineral binder and a carbon black product comprising a carbon black having attached an organic group containing an ionic or an ionizable group.
2. A composition of claim 1 wherein the carbon black product is a water dispersible carbon black product.
3. A composition of claim 2 wherein the carbon black product is dispersed in the mineral binder composition by means of low shear stirring or mixing.
4. A composition of claim 1 wherein the carbon black product is present in an amount of less than or equal to 5% by weight of the mineral binder.
5. A composition of claim 1 wherein the carbon black product is in pelletized form.
6. A composition of claim 1 wherein the mineral binder is concrete, cement, mortar, or plaster.
7. A composition of claim 1 wherein the ionic or the ionizable group is a carboxylic acid or a salt thereof.
8. A composition of claim 1 wherein the ionic or the ionizable group is a sulfonic acid or a salt thereof.
9. A composition of claim 1 wherein the organic group is a sulfophenyl group or a salt thereof.
10. A composition of claim 1 wherein the organic group is p-sulfophenyl or a salt thereof.
11. A composition of claim 1 wherein the organic group is a carboxyphenyl group or a salt thereof.
1. Field of the Invention
This invention relates to mineral binder systems which contain a carbon black product as a colorant.
2. Discussion of Related Art
Mineral binder systems used to form items such as concrete, cement, mortar and exterior plaster formulations are often colored to enhance their aesthetic appeal. Coloring can be accomplished either by applying a suitable coating to the exposed surfaces or by adding small amounts of one or more pigments to the mineral binder system to uniformly color the mix. Since surface coatings are subject to peeling, fading and weathering, the latter method of coloring is preferred. The pigment or pigments can be added either to the dry mineral mix, for example, in the case of concrete to the cement-sand mixture, or to the water used to set such a mix.
Pigments which are suitable for coloring mineral binder systems which are exposed to outdoor conditions must 1) be alkali-resistance, 2) be lightfast, 3) be resistant to industrial atmospheres, and 4) weather at a comparable rate with the body in which it is mixed so that the appearance of the surface does not change substantially with time.
In addition, for ease of application, the pigment should be relatively dust-free, and should easily disperse in the mix to attain its maximum coloring power.
Black pigments are desirable colorants for use in mineral binder systems because a large variety of colors and color shades can be obtained by their use, either alone or in combination with other pigments. Black iron oxides are the most preferred black pigment, but carbon blacks are also used to a limited extent.
While carbon blacks exhibit excellent coloring properties, alkali-resistance, lightfastness and chemical stability, they are not preferred in mineral binder systems exposed to outdoor weathering. Weathering studies show that the surface appearance of bodies containing carbon black undesirably changes as the weathering process progresses. When the system contains only carbon black as the coloring pigment, the surface fades. When the carbon black is used in combination with other colorants, the appearance of the other colorants become more pronounced. This change in carbon black-pigmented mineral systems has been attributed to the leaching out and washing away of the carbon black pigment particles, which are very small relative to the other ingredients. This has limited its use in systems exposed to outdoor weathering.
Additionally, depending on the physical form in which it is supplied, carbon black can be either very dusty or very difficult to disperse. The process used for incorporating the carbon black into a binder system depends on both the form in which the pigment is supplied and the processing equipment available to the user. As produced, carbon blacks are powdery materials with bulk densities ranging from about 0.02 to 0.1 g/cc and are termed fluffy blacks. Such blacks are very dusty. Because of their low densities and large surface areas, the fluffy products are cohesive, have very poor conveying properties and are therefore difficult to bulk handle. For this reason fluffy products have limited utility, and are generally supplied in bagged form. Fluffy blacks are, however, dispersible and can develop their full coloring potential by relatively simple grinding procedures.
To improve the bulk handling properties of carbon blacks and reduce their dustiness, fluffy blacks are typically densified by various pelletizing procedures to attain bulk densities ranging from about 0.2 to 0.7 g/cc. For a given grade of carbon black, handling properties tend to improve with increasing degrees of densification. Dispersibility, on the other hand, is progressively degraded as the extent of densification is increased. Thus there is a tradeoff between improvement in bulk handling properties and degradation in dispersibility. Because of the advantages of increased cleanliness, however, pelletized carbon blacks are often used for introducing carbon blacks into mineral binder systems. In such cases, however, the extent of grinding or milling required to form a uniform, intimate mix will be greater than that which is employed with the fluffy form of the product.
Carbon black has been added to mineral binder systems in a variety of ways. It can be milled into the dry sand-cement mixture, for example, and then the requisite amount of water necessary for setting the mix can be added. Alternately, an aqueous dispersion of the carbon black, in all or part of the requisite volume of water necessary for setting the mix, can be uniformly blended into the sand-cement mixture. In either case, for full and uniform color development, the carbon black agglomerates must be broken down to yield primarily individual aggregates (the smallest dispersible units of carbon black). This is accomplished either by milling the dry mix or by predispersing, by milling, the carbon black in the aqueous medium. Since carbon blacks tend to be hydrophobic, surface active agents are often used to promote wetting. In addition, the presence of such an agent in the aqueous medium can enhance the dispersion process and aid dispersion stabilization.
Attempts have been made to improve both the weathering and dispersing properties of carbon blacks used to pigment mineral binder systems. For example, U.S. Pat. No. 4,006,031 discloses that fluorine-containing wetting agents used with carbon blacks provides improved weathering properties to mineral binder systems. Others, as described in European Patent No. 50354, have used surface-active polymers which disperse the carbon black in the aqueous medium used to set the mineral binder system and then become inactive after drying. The benefits include better black dispersion, improved weathering resistance and decreased efflorescence. The disclosure of these patents is herein incorporated by reference.
Nevertheless, even in these prior art processes, the carbon black, whether in fluffy or pelletized form, must be milled attain the required degree of pigment dispersion. Thus, there remains a need for carbon blacks useful as colorants in mineral binder systems which can be used in pelletized form, yet easily disperse with low shear stirring and less readily wash out of the system during weathering.
The present invention relates to a mineral binder composition having incorporated therein carbon black products comprising a carbon black having attached an organic group containing an ionic or an ionizable group. The carbon black products, when incorporated in a mineral binder system, offer superior weathering properties relative to conventional carbon black products.
Suitable mineral binder systems include concrete, cement, mortar, and exterior plaster formulations. Other mineral binder systems are similarly useful herein. Any conventionally known additives for mineral binder systems may be incorporated in the mineral binder systems of the present invention.
The carbon black products may be prepared by reacting a carbon black with a diazonium salt in a liquid reaction medium to attach at least one organic group to the surface of the carbon black. The diazonium salt may contain the organic group to be attached to the carbon black. According to the invention, a diazonium salt is an organic compound having one or more diazonium groups. Preferred reaction media include water, any medium containing water, and any medium containing alcohol. Water is the most preferred medium. These carbon black products and various methods for their preparation are described in a U.S. patent application entitled "Reaction of Carbon Black with Diazonium Salts, Resultant Carbon Black Products and Their Uses," filed Dec. 15, 1994 and incorporated herein by reference.
To prepare the above carbon black products, the diazonium salt need only be sufficiently stable to allow reaction with the carbon black. Thus, that reaction.
The carbon black can be reacted with a diazonium salt when present as a dilute, easily stirred, aqueous slurry, or preferably in the presence of the proper amount of water for carbon black pellet formation.
A or a C.sub.1 -C.sub.12 alkyl or the alkyl group of the organic group is directly attached to the carbon black. The aromatic group may be further substituted or unsubstituted, for example, with alkyl groups. The C.sub.1 -C.sub.12 alkyl group may be branched or unbranched and is preferably ethyl. More preferably, the organic group is a phenyl or a naphthyl group and the acidic group is a sulfonic acid group, a sulfinic acid group, a phosphonic acid group, or a carboxylic acid group. Examples include --COOH, --SO.sub.3 H and --PO.sub.3 H.sub.2 and their salts, for example --COONa, --COOK, --COO.sup.- NR.sub.4.sup.+, --SO.sub.3 Na, --HPO.sub.3 Na, --SO.sub.3.sup.-NR.sub.4.sup.+, and PO.sub.3 Na.sub.2, where R is an alkyl or phenyl group. Particularly preferred ionizable substituents are --COOH and --SO.sub.3 H and their sodium and potassium salts.
Most preferably, the organic group is a substituted or unsubstituted sulfophenyl group or a salt thereof; a substituted or unsubstituted (polysulfo)phenyl group or a salt thereof; a substituted or unsubstituted sulfonaphyth are p-sulfophenyl, 4-hydroxy-3-sulfophenyl, and 2-sulfoethyl.
Quaternary ammonium groups (--NR.sub.3.sup.+ and quaternary phosphonium groups (--PR.sub.3.sup.+) represent examples of cationic groups and can be attached to the same organic groups as discussed above for the ionizable groups which form anions. quaternized aromatic amines, can also be used as the organic group. Thus, N-substituted pyridinium compounds, such as N-methyl-pyridyl, can be used in this regard.
An advantage of the carbon black products having an attached organic group substituted with an ionic or an ionizable group is that the carbon black products may have increased water dispersibility relative to the corresponding untreated carbon black. In general, water dispersibility of the carbon black products increases with the number of organic groups attached to the carbon black having an ionizable group or the number of ionizable groups attached to a given organic group. Thus, increasing the number of ionizable groups associated with the carbon black products should increase their water dispersibility and permits control of the water dispersibility to a desired level.
When water dispersible carbon black products of the present invention are prepared, it is preferred that the ionic or ionizable groups be ionized in the reaction medium. The resulting product solution or slurry may be used as is or diluted prior to use. The carbon black products may be pelletized, preferably by a conventional wet process, pin pelletizing operation.
The carbon black products may be dried by techniques used for conventional carbon blacks. These techniques include, but are not limited to, drying in ovens and rotary kilns. Overdrying, however, may cause a loss in the degree of water dispersibility. In the event that the carbon black products above do not disperse in the aqueous vehicle as readily as desired, the carbon black products may be dispersed using conventionally known techniques such as milling or grinding.
The carbon black products may be incorporated either in solid form or as a preformed liquid dispersion. The preferred addition of carbon black product is of an amount less than or equal to 5% by weight of the mineral binder. These mineral binder systems have improved weathering properties as shown in the Examples below.
Experimental
The carbon blacks used were characterized with respect to their structure using n-dibutyl phthalate absorption, DBP, using ASTM D 2414. Surface area was characterized by adsorption of cetyltrimethylammonium bromide, CTAB, using ASTM D 3765.
Pin Pelletizing
Pin Pelletizing was accomplished using both a pilot scale continuous and a laboratory scale batch pin pelletizer. The batch unit consisted of an 18-cm (7-inch) diameter by 17-cm long cylinder containing a central shaft fitted with a plurality of pins extending almost to the cylinder wall. The shaft was rotated at about 500 RPM during the pelletizing operation. The continuous unit consisted of a 25.5-cm (10-inch) diameter by 155-cm (61-inch) long cylindrical body fitted with a rotor running along its axis. The rotor, fitted with about 120 1.27-cm (0.5-inch) diameter pins extending almost to the walls of the unit, was rotated at a specified RPM to form pellets.
Measurement of Aqueous Residue
This procedure was used to obtain a measure of product dispersibility. The carbon black (5 g) was vigorously shaken with 45 g of water for 5 minutes. The resulting slurry was poured through a 325 mesh (44 micron) screen and rinsed with water until the washings were colorless. The dried weight of residue on the screen was determined and expressed as a percentage of the carbon black used in the test.
Product Dispersibility
A measure of product dispersibility was obtained by dispersing the various blacks in an aqueous medium having a pH of about 10 under low shear conditions by means of a magnetic stirrer for 30 minutes. For the control, unmodified blacks, cetyl trimethyl amonium bormide, a surfactant known to stabilize carbon black dispersions, was added to the medium. No surfactant was used in the case of the carbon black products. The slurry optical density, (OD).sub.low shear, was determined at a wavelength of 550 nm. Thereafter, the slurry was sonified (to reflect intense milling) and the slurry optical density, (OD).sub.sonified, determined. The percent change in optical density before and after sonification, Δ(OD)=100[(OD).sub.sonified -(OD).sub.low shear ]/(OD).sub.sonified was calculated. A large percent change in this value indicates poor low shear dispersibility for the dispersion conditions employed.
Colored Concrete Formulation
Concrete was colored with a mixture of carbon black and natural red iron oxide pigment. Two procedures were used to introduce the black into the concrete mix. All quantities cited are in parts by weight. In the first procedure, 90 parts of red iron oxide and 6 parts of carbon black or the carbon black product were thoroughly mixed in a pestle and mortar until additional mixing gave no change in color. 1.4 parts of the mixed color was then mixed with 60 parts of sand and 14 parts of cement by spatula. Thereafter, about 10 parts water was added and the mixture was worked by spatula to form a paste. The paste was cast into channels (8.5 cm long ambient conditions. In the second procedure, all quantities used to form the colored concrete were identical with those in the first procedure. In this case, however, the carbon black or carbon black product, 0.0875 parts, was added to the water used to set the concrete. None was added to the red iron oxide. In all cases the blacks were dispersed in the water under low shear dispersion conditions by stirring for 30 minutes using a magnetic stirrer.
The reflectance spectrum of the dry, colored concrete was determined. The reflectance values were used to compute the International Commision on Illumination CIE 1976 L* a* and b* values. L* represents the lightness coordinate running from 0 for a pure black to 100 for a pure white; a* represents the red-green coordinate with its value becoming larger as the degree of redness increases; b* represents the yellow-blue coordinate with its value becoming larger as the degree of yellowness increases.
Weathering
Weathering was simulated by contacting the concrete for 30 seconds with undiluted SURE CLEAN City, Kans. The product is a blend of organic and inorganic acids combined with wetting agents and is normally diluted with water and employed to clean new masonry. The concrete was then washed with copious amounts of distilled water, dried and then its surface reflectance redetermined. The neat, undiluted product vigorously attacks and alkaline concrete so that some of the surface layers are washed away. Changes in L*, a* and b* (ΔL*, Δa* and Δb*) before and after treatment give a measure of preferential leaching.
Example 1
This example illustrates the preparation of a carbon black product having an attached p-C.sub.6 H.sub.4 SO.sub.3.sup.- group. A fluffy carbon black (200 g) having a CTAB surface area of 350 m.sup.2 /g and a DBP of 120 cc/100 g carbon and 42.4 g sulfanilic acid were placed in the batch pin pelletizer. After mixing for 40 seconds by means of the rotor, a solution of 20.7 of sodium nitrite, NaNO.sub.2, in 150 g water was added to the pelletizer. 4-Sulfobenzene diazonium hydroxide inner salt is formed in situ which reacts with the carbon black. After mixing for 45 seconds by means of the rotor, the carbon black product was transformed into pellets. These were dried in an oven at 120 handling properties at least comparable to conventionally pelletized carbon blacks and was dispersible. Using the aqueous residue test, it has a 325 mesh residue of 0.6% compared to 97% for the untreated, fluffy black.
A sample of the product was subjected to Soxhlet extraction overnight with tetrahydrofuran. Analysis of the extracted sample showed that it contained 3.47% sulfur, compared to 0.5% sulfur for the untreated fluffy carbon black. Therefore, the carbon black product has 0.93 mmol/g of attached p-C.sub.6 H.sub.4 SO.sub.3.sup.- groups.
Example 2
This example illustrates the preparation of a carbon black product having an attached p-C.sub.6 H.sub.4 CO.sub.2.sup.- group. Stock solutions A and B were formed as follows:
Stock solution A: 19 g of concentrated hydrochloric acid (about 36% HCl) and 20 g water
Stock solution B: 8.0 g NaNO.sub.2 and 39.2 g water
The stock solutions were chilled to 5 solution A 1.58 g of anthranilic acid (o-amino benzoic acid) was added. Thereafter, 10.5 g of stock solution B was slowly added while ensuring that the temperature did not exceed 10 kept in an ice bath, was stirred for 15 minutes. It was then added to a slurry of 20 g of the fluffy black used in Example 1 in 350 ml water. The resulting slurry was stirred for 15 minutes and then filtered. The filter cake was washed twice with water and then dried in an oven at 110 C. While this product was not pelletized, the dried cake had a density which was comparable to that of the pelletized product and had much better handling properties that the fluffy precursor.
Dispersibility
The dispersibilities of the products of Examples 1 and 2 were evaluated using the optical density procedure. The controls employed were the untreated, fluffy black and its conventional dry drum pelletized counterpart. The percent change in optical density is presented in Table 1.
TABLE 1______________________________________Percent Change In Slurry Optical Densities On SonificationProduct Δ (OD), %______________________________________Example 1 26.8Example 2 91.4Fluffy Control 92.4Dry Drum Pelletized Control 100______________________________________
The Δ(OD) values in the table show that the products of Example 1 and Example 2 are more dispersible than the conventional dry drum pelletized product under low shear dispersion conditions. In spite of their much larger bulk densities, the dispersibility of the product of Example 2 is comparable to, and that of Example 1 substantially superior to, that of the undensified, fluffy black.
Evaluation of Concrete Colored with Carbon Black Samples
The products of Examples 1 and 2 as well as the fluffy and dry pelletized control blacks were used to form colored concrete using the pestle and mortar mixing process, Procedure I, and the low shear aqueous dispersion process, Procedure II. The L*, a* and b* valued found are given in Table 2.
TABLE 2______________________________________Color Values Attained In Concrete Procedure I Procedure IIProducts L* a* b* L* a* b*______________________________________Example 1 23.20 2.57 3.63 21.18 1.97 3.00Example 2 21.71 2.01 2.41 28.76 4.95 5.75Fluffy 27.53 2.99 3.54 40.85 1.86 2.69Dry Pelletized 27.47 3.67 4.22 31.82 3.90 3.68______________________________________
The results in Table 2 show that when the carbon products of this invention are incorporated into concrete by Procedure I, the pigmented concretes have darker colors, as shown by their smaller L* values, than the either dry pelletized or fluffy carbon blacks. With procedure II, where the blacks are dispersed under low shear conditions in water, the product of Example 1, being the most dispersible (see Table 1), gives the darkest color. The product of Example 2 forms the next darkest color. Surprisingly, the fluffy black, which is more dispersible than the dry drum pelletized product, gave a pigmented concrete with the lightest surface color. This is attributed to segregation of eh pigment away from the surface layers because, as will be shown, a much darker color is obtained when the surface is washed with the SURE CLEAN
Weathering of Colored Concrete Samples
Simulated weathering was conducted by washing the surfaces of the samples characterized in Table 2 with the SURE CLEAN The acidic detergent, in all cases, attacked the surfaces of the samples. The L*, a* and b* values of the washed surfaces are presented in Table 3. The aggressive washing procedure employed, in all cases, resulted in some change in the appearance of the surface. The change in the appearance, however, was lowest for the carbon products of the present invention.
TABLE 3______________________________________Color Values Of Washed Concrete Procedure I Procedure IIProducts L* a* b* L* a* b*______________________________________Example 1 22.10 3.06 6.21 21.00 2.46 5.58Example 2 20.69 2.52 5.24 25.49 5.22 8.11Fluffy 24.33 3.66 6.29 28.22 2.20 5.43Dry Pelletized 26.31 4.34 7.64 24.22 4.95 7.63______________________________________
The changes in color values on washing are shown in Table 4.
TABLE 4______________________________________Change In Color On WashingColor Values Attained In Concrete Procedure I Procedure IIProducts ΔL* Δa* Δb* ΔL* Δa* Δb*______________________________________Example 1 1.10 -0.49 -2.58 0.18 -0.49 -2.58Example 2 1.02 -0.51 -2.83 3.27 -0.27 -2.36Fluffy 3.20 -0.67 -2.75 12.63 -0.34 -2.74Dry Pelletized 1.16 -0.67 -3.42 7.60 -1.05 -3.95______________________________________
For each procedure used to form the concrete, the magnitude of the ΔL* value is smallest for the carbons products of the present invention. Apart from the sample formed with the fluffy black using Procedure II where some color segregation occurred and the change in ΔL* is very large, the magnitude of the Δa* values are smallest for the products of the present invention. Finally, the values of Δb* are reasonably comparable for all the samples. Accordingly, the present results show that the color changes are smallest with the black products of the present invention.
Example 3
The present example shows that the carbon black products can be formed in a continuous pelletizing operation. A fluffy carbon black having a surface area of 133 m.sup.2 /g and a DBP of 190 cc/100 g carbon was introduced into a continuously operating pin pelletizer at a rate of 100 parts by weight per hour. Simultaneously, a 30% solution of sodium nitrite and a suspension containing 5.43% concentrated nitric acid, 8.72% sulfanilic acid and 85.9% water were introduced into the pelletizer. The sodium nitrite solution and the suspension were introduced at rates of 16 and 112 parts by weight per hour, respectively. 4-Sulfobenzenediazonium hydroxide inner salt was generated in situ and reacted with the carbon black in the pelletizer. The material exiting the pelletizer is the treated black, in pelletized form, and was dried at 125 be used in the mineral binder systems to obtain superior weathering properties.
Additional embodiments of the invention will be apparent to those skilled in the at from consideration of the specification and practice of the invention disclosed herein. The specification and examples are intended to be exemplary only. |
Israeli writer-director Ari Folman made his filmmaking debut in 1996 with the live-action feature Saint Clara, which made it to festivals around the world, including the US. As well as directing a second feature, 2001's Made in Israel, Folman has written for Israeli television, most prominently for BeTipul (In Therapy), the series that was the basis for HBO's In Treatment. Now Folman is raking in awards, including the 2009 Golden Globe for Best Foreign Language Film, for Waltz with Bashir, a groundbreaking animated documentary feature. At San Francisco's Prescott Hotel, we discussed the film and his planned follow up, a science-fiction hybrid of live action and animation based on Stanislaw Lem's The Futurological Congress.
Groucho: Having innovated with this film, what, I guess, is the first animated documentary—is that right?
Ari Folman: This is what they say, you know.
G: I was sort of surprised to learn that, having done that, you had no particular interest in developing the form or doing something else, but I suppose this is sort of the ultimate expression for you of that form. Is that why?
AF: I think I was stupid to declare it was an animated documentary five years ago, because it gave me so many problems. And the film establishment is so narrow-minded. It is unbelievable. And sometimes they just—you know, I try to raise money, documentary funds—they told me it can’t be a documentary if it’s animated, you know? And then I went to animation funds and fiction funds—[they] said, "Okay, go back to documentary, because it’s a documentary." So I realized how they’re really not open to any new dimension of film. Today I don’t care if it’s declared a documentary or not—it’s up to you. For me it’s just a film. And this is it. It doesn’t matter if it’s the first one like this.
G: To tell this story in animation, it seemed to me when I was watching it that it was the right approach fit to the right story, that it was the only way to do it, in a way.
AF: That’s right.
G: Of course, that’s easy for us to see in hindsight, but it’s kind of a stroke of genius to figure that out at the outset.
AF: I don't know. It was natural for me because I couldn’t do it any way else, you know? It’s like, do it like that or don’t do it. And if you look at all the dimensions you have there, which were reality and dreams and subconscious and lost memories and stuff like that—hallucinations and war, which is probably the most real thing on earth: how can you do it in live action?
G: Yeah. And that, to me, was maybe another reason why you wouldn’t do another film in this vein, is that that’s the experience that is surreal enough to justify moving to that—
AF: I’m doing it, but not a documentary.
G: Well, right, yes—we’ll talk about that [The Futurological Congress] later. But another aspect of the visual scheme of the film that maybe animation helps to serve is this perspective, this depersonalized perspective—it’s discussed in the film—of seeing the world as if through a camera. And maybe animation also helps to give that distance, maybe.
AF: Yeah, I heard it, but it was not my intention. On the contrary, I was really obsessed in the beginning that the audience would be attached to the characters and not feel far away from them. This is why we put so much effort in doing it—the designs and the realistic way of drawing and with a lot of details in the faces and contours and shades, which of course makes the animation much more complicated.
G: Yeah. Well, I want to ask you about that as well. The subtlety and realism of the acting in the film is very striking—the acting through animation. And because it isn’t rotoscoped—
AF: No, no, no, no.
G: That seems all the more remarkable. So can you talk a little bit about the process of the animators, or you working with the animators to capture that—
AF: Well, in each character, I tried to mark and define before we started what I [thought was] the essential movement in the face and in the hands that expresses feelings. Because we couldn’t follow everything. Because we did it from scratch. We just saw it and did it. So for one guy—the guy who swam back home, it was the eyes. He was looking to run away with his eyes. For the guy in the Netherlands it was whenever he felt stressed, he moved his hands more. So we just picked out the essentials for building the characters. We worked really hard on those essentials. And although we had only eight animators, which is pretty incredible, some of them were more talented in the action sequences, shooting and that, and some of them were really gentle and they could catch just small movements and motions that express feelings. So I used it. I tried to use it.
G: Yeah, capitalize on the talent of each animator. I’m sure there were some who were—
AF: Yeah. See, this is the advantage that you don’t have two hundred animators. You can pick stuff. That's right, you get to use them.
G: Yeah. I think of that moment very late in the film where the breathing—you don’t think of that normally when you watch an animated film—the breathing of the character that becomes somewhat more stressed or labored shows what he’s feeling.
AF: Yeah.
G: There’s several types of animation as well—the 3-D, the flash, the classic animation. In the same way that you had capitalized on an animator’s talent, I sure you were making specific choices about which type of animation was best for that scene or moment. Can you talk a little bit about how those choices fell into place—about what types you used for different scenes?
AF: Well, the main animation, of course, is just simple Flash animation cut out, but to the extreme point you can take Flash software. Flash software is basically a home software for six hundred US dollars you can buy. You’re not supposed to make feature films out of it—just tiny bits and pieces for the internet. And of course, websites. The basic flash is that you cut to surfaces—each space. But we cut it I don’t know how many times more. We had like eight spaces in the face for surfaces, so we cut each one of them to another fifteen—so it’s like fifteen times eight. And then they have to move them separately. And then it takes time to see the movement, if it works. So it takes time. And then I realized that we had problems with slow movement. Big action scenes, we don’t have it, but with slow movement we have it. Lower part of the body was done—only the lower part—with classic animation, frame by frame. And we used 3-D animation just for spectacular shots: going up from the forest and the snow down to the boat, you know?
G: Yeah—or what would be a tracking shot in a live-action film.
AF: Yeah. All the track shots. Those are 3-D. I’m not fond of current 3-D animation too much. So it’s a matter of taste. But it’s good for—we needed this break in the film with some 3-D shots. So we tried to be eclectic.
G: Well, drama is, they say, the art of change. So if you change it up, you’re grabbing the audience in a new way—like the use of the video footage as well.
AF: Yeah, definitely.
G: I wanted to ask about David Polonsky. I admit to ignorance about his work, and so I wonder how did the two of you come to work together, and what is it in his style that appealed to you?
AF: Well, I think he’s a genius, personally. We worked on a previous documentary project, The Material That Love Is Made Of, and I tried there for the first time animated scenes, documentary [scenes]: scientists talking about scientific aspects of love. So he designed that, and it was really basic flash but I loved it. It’s something really fresh, and this way I knew the next project would be a full-length feature animation. I think David in many ways—okay, he’s very realistic. This is why he was good for the film. And he’s very Russian. He’s very strict. And he doesn’t allow himself really big freedom. The more free scenes in this movie, he didn’t draw them. The giant woman coming out of the water Tomer Hanuka did. But there’s something really exciting in the way he draws. I mean, it really affects you emotionally very, very strongly. And I saw it in a lot of kids’ books that he was illustrating. And I saw my kids referring to it. It’s something that really touches you. And I needed that because I knew that I wanted the film to be beautiful—that although it’s horror, it’s beautiful—and he’s the guy.
G: Yeah. That beauty that you’re talking about—it seems like it relates to those things you mentioned before: the subconscious and dreams and like a drug trip or whatever, that our brain kind of creates beauty even out of madness or confusion. It seems your career has always come around to these psychological levels. I wanted to ask about the nature of the mind—it’s flexibility and it’s capacity to protect itself—all those things are kind of themes that come out in the film. Can you address how the film to you is an expression of the psyche?
AF: I think it's life—it’s not the film. I mean, life is a constant use of imagination. I met a very respectable psychiatrist, before I flew here, for my next project. And he told me something that I found so amazing because [the new film, The Futurological Congress] will deal a lot with drugs. And in the next project, it’s a Stanislaw Lem story. And the world is controlled by free manufacturers of psychopharmacology drugs. And they control all your feelings. Love, betrayal, guilt—anything you want, they can fix it. So I try—now I'm writing—and I’m trying to build a world that will make sense according to what we have. And he has this theory—he’s a big professor, and he’s now healing post-traumatized soldiers, with ecstasy. He got a—the government gave him—
G: A grant?
AF: Yeah. License to do it.
G: Oh right, yeah.
AF: And he got some probably very good stuff from here. And so he does it. And he thinks that the only breakthrough in psychiatric drugs will be when they start using drugs. But they ignore this world of drugs because they can’t license it...you know? This is their problem.
G: Right. It’s like a producer not wanting to fund an animated documentary.
AF: Yeah.
G: It’s outside of their frame of reference.
AF: No, no. But its [in] terms of money. Because if they—I may take use of ecstasy, and it’s good, it works, Pfizer does it, next time Fisher does it. Because they can’t list it as their thing, you know. It’s not like Viagra, you know what I mean?
G: Yeah, right.
AF: So this is the main problem. Otherwise they would have used it. And there would be a huge breakthrough in this world. So he said something strange, he said, "Listen, you think that if people use drugs, a lot of things from their subconscious will be out and it will be a great thing to draw. But most people are so shallow that it doesn’t matter what they would take, nothing will get out." And that was astonishing. I couldn’t understand why he said it. But I think that in my everyday life and most—the border between reality and hallucinations and fantasies is very narrow. And I walk on that border, because I think it’s the most interesting. And all filmmakers really big, you know: Fellini—
G: Sure.
AF: Lynch!
G: Yeah, yeah.
AF: Lynch: it's a different scale of time in Lynch. It’s not measured in the time we’re used to in many films.
G: Right. And it is. It’s very fluid from reality to—
AF: Easy. Easy-go.
G: Yeah. To hallucination to vision to—
AF: Yeah, but now he’s meditating, right?
G: Yeah.
AF: That’s what he does.
G: Right. Exactly. Yeah, he’s promoting that. I want to talk a little bit more on this same subject of psychology. I think some might be surprised looking at your body of work that you’re actually skeptical of—
AF: Psychotherapy.
G: Psychotherapy. Why is that? And why is it that you think that the Israeli reserve said, "We’ll release you, but first the therapy." What was their reasoning behind that?
AF: They were making an experiment.
G: Of you?
AF: Not me.
G: Of everyone.
AF: Yeah. They had this—they said, "Okay, now, in the next six months, we’re going to interview people and see what they remember. I don't know what they were thinking. But I was nothing special. Probably, they were using us for some experiment or something.
G: And had they not been on that whim, you might not have gotten your release.
AF: Definitely. They wouldn’t have given it to me. Only if I faked and pretended to be lunatic. You know, I didn’t want to do that. It’s cheap.
G: It’s a lucky break, I suppose.
AF: Yeah, yeah, it was great.
G: But, by the same token, you found it not useful for you, I take it.
AF: Psychotherapy, no. I think it’s a religious cult. And if you’re a believer, fine. It will work. But if you in a way don’t believe, you’re not there. It won’t help you if you don’t believe in this kind of relationship between therapist and [patient]. Making films is much more therapeutic. A thousand times more. Any kind of arts, I think. I went through therapy, of course, a few sessions in life—a period of time. I just—I can’t eat it anymore.
G: I want to talk a little bit too about working with actors. I know that, for you, that’s not really your cup of tea, I guess—
AF: No! No!
G: To work with actors.
AF: I did. I did. I had films. I did.
G: Right, right. But I read something you said somewhere about—what was it? "I don’t have any passion for actors."
AF: Not now. Not now. The next film will have an actor. I will put an actress.
G: Yeah, an actress, right.
AF: But uhhhhhh—
G: Is it—you find them high maintainance, or why is that?
AF: No, no, no! I just say "Some of my best friends—". No, no. Listen, I’m now hooked to the magic of animation. I think adult animation is something that I just can’t understand why it’s not being done.
G: Yeah.
AF: It is like so obvious to do it. And because my mind is running really fast, I feel that I can do it there. That’s for me. But I'll be back with actors, and you know, the next film’s gonna be with an actress, and she’s going to act. I mean, because the first twenty minutes are going to be—
G: Live action.
AF: Live action. Then we will jump to the future, and she will be animated.
G: Mm-hm. And you’ve used a similar technique of shooting—
AF: We want to adapt it. We want to do something real.
G: But you would still base the animation on live reference? Or not?
AF: Yeah. Yes, because what we did here [in Waltz with Bashir]—that going backwards in time with the characters—we will do there [in Futurological Congress] going to future time. So we will have to predict how she will look when she’s sixty.
G: Right. Right.
AF: It makes sense that if the world in the future is controlled by drug manufacturers, [animation is] strong. It’s obvious.
G: Yeah. In going back to friends in developing Waltz with Bashir, what were some of the most surprising or moving revelations that you discovered about your friends, by discussing these times with them?
AF: First, my best friends from childhood ran away. They got cold feet, and they didn’t participate in the film. All we had to bring actors to replace them. I live in a community mainly of filmmakers. We studied there together the same year in film school. And I learned that—I mean, we have a very intimate relationship. Our kids grew up together, did things together. It’s like living in a small community. But we never discussed the armed service, because it’s not very cool to be a filmmaker and a left-wing liberal extremist and then, you know, Friday night say, [adopts gruff voice] "I remember we were going out to capture this village, there's shooting here and there"—you don’t do that. You talk about Japanese mafia movies from the '70s, Kinji Fukasaku, and if Suzuki was better when he started in Japan—you’re not talking about your war experience. First time I heard what they did was after this film was released.
G: In one of the interviews that you did, I read that you said, "When you about this stuff, once it’s out, you have to deal with it."
AF: Yeah.
G: And for you, the years that you spent making the film were a process of dealing with it. Do you have a sense of how the others that you interviewed dealt with it after these things came up?
AF: Very different between one to another. I think the most tough experience was going over [with] Dayag, the guy who swam back home. He felt a lot of guilt because he stayed alive and everyone around him died, which is a common feeling that we diagnosed through the research from a lot of ex-soldiers. He took it hard from the very beginning, from the premiere—he couldn’t be there, he ran away. And the others, I mean, Ron Ben-Yishai, it's just another show for him, for the journalist. And [for most] it’s very personal.
G: Yeah. It seems to me that modern ground warriors share a common experience of what it’s like to live through that kind of warfare. Do you find that that’s true, that you hear from people who see the film or from other people who you’ve talked to who’ve been in different wars that it’s roughly the same even though the details were different of the conflict?
AF: Yes, definitely. I think it’s a very universal story. It could have been told by any ex-soldier. Someone who woke up and realized "What the fuck am I doing here. It has nothing to do with my life. This place here is a different country, different place. It has nothing to do—I’m not defending my sisters here," you know? And we went to the war, it was [adopts a gruff voice] "You gotta defend your little sisters there." You wake up in Beirut and say, "It’s a capital city somewhere." People sit and they eat in restaurants, you know, and you walk like stupid dung with forty kilos of armors, and why? You know? "I’m defending my sisters here." So think of how many soldiers are asking that question right now: "Why [are we] here in Iraq?" I heard Bush yesterday. I saw it. Did you see that?
G: Yeah.
AF: Isn’t it incredible?!
G: It’s embarrassing.
AF: [As Bush:] "Well, maybe we made a mistake. We were not ready for that. I didn’t plan that." [To Bush:] "What did you think?!"
G: Yeah, he’s able to be very disconnected and casual about it, isn’t he? I know we’re out of time here, but I want to ask one more question. I read that in developing this film, you did the video interviews and all, but you also did a ninety-page script right at the outset. How did that fit into the process?
AF: After the research, having read all the hundred interviews, I had to write a storyline. So basically what I did in the script, I predicted what the people would answer according to the research.
G: Sure.
AF: Some of them were really exact, and some of them, of course, gave completely different answers, but it was like a plan.
G: Right. Yeah, a scenario.
AF: More a plan than a script.
G: Very interesting. All right. Thank you so much. It was great.
AF: Thank you. |
Steve Sailer reports that Michelle Obama failed the July 1988 Illinois bar exam.
The bar exam is extremely easy. I just passed the New York bar exam again this summer, despite having not studied any law for more than a decade. So I’ve taken three bar exams, and passed all three of them.
This information indicates that Michelle Obama was either (1) woefully underqualified to be admitted to Harvard Law School (no doubt being black helped); or (2) exceptionally lazy; or (3) both. It should be pointed out that she had a job lined up at Sidley Austin (BIGLAW), and those jobs don’t start until after the summer bar exam, so she had the opportunity to study full-time for the bar exam and thus she has no excuse for failing it.
This type of stuff really pisses me off because I was clearly more qualified than Michelle Obama to work at a firm like Sidley Austin, but she got the prestigious high-paying job and not me because of her blackness.
Sigma,
Do you see why I like qualification testing in various fields?
Its not fair or right or just in any sense of the word to give someone an advantage just because they graduated from Harvard or Yale. Alot of kids enjoy themselves in high school man. They chase girls or boys, go to parties, play sports, and enjoy being young in general. Alot of these same kids dont buckle down until they are in college. Many of these kids are the genetically gifted amongst us. Some almost despicably so as they will be large, nice-looking, happy, and smart all in the same package.
Some nerd who studies his butt off from the time he is 13 might do better on the SAT at 16 years of age, but he might have already reached much of his potential by that time. That nerd deserves to get into Harvard, but it does not mean that nerd does not get "passed up" in college by that secretely smart jock who was dating cheerleaders during the early years. A good standardized test for various professions and trade schools can seperate the wheat and the chaff. Just imagine the deliciousness of seeing all those critical theorists, sociology, psychology, and art history majors fall on their ass when they take it----letting them know in no uncertain terms that "yes, you are kinda dumb as compared to others". I'd enjoy knowing that they were MADE to know this as I still resent having to sit through some of those lefty-professors classes all those years ago. I think that people's scores on these occupational-exams should be made public, so that everyone knows if you are really a dumbass despite your degree. It would bring so many lefties down six or eight notches, that it would be worth it no matter the cost.
At our company we have a few folks from some prestigious places and a few from some very unprestigious places and a handful from some podunk colleges nobody has ever heard of. Guess what? There really is not much of a difference in them at all, and the all time screw up that I can think of came from Vanderbilt (he's fired), and a couple of our very best came from directional schools (ever heard of Eastern Kentucky University? me either for the longest).
Once one throws in racial-scholarships in this mix.............it equates with the Ivy league not meaning what the name implies anymore.
Posted by: miles | February 23, 2008 at 04:14 PM
You were also born with brainy Jew genes and she wasn't. In what way is that fair??
Anybody that thinks black people got dealt the unfair upperhand in the life lottery is crazy.
Posted by: Rain And | February 23, 2008 at 04:14 PM
Actually, Sailer was speculating re whether Michelle Obama failed the bar exam because she was admitted to the bar in May 1989, but graduated law school in May 1988. There are many reasons why her admission date may appear "late" -- she may have submitted her bar application late or signed up for one of the swearing-in ceremonies late. One cannot reasonably infer that she failed the bar the first time (i.e., in July 1988), without actual proof of that fact.
Posted by: Republican Patriot | February 23, 2008 at 04:16 PM
"Illinois bar exam"
Half Sigma...I'm pretty sure you know different states have different difficulty levels for their bar exams correct?
Did you pass the "Illinois bar exam" without studying?
What is the pass rate difference between NY, CT, NJ, and IL?
Have you looked? Are you being "lazy"?
Where you equally as outraged and upset when JFK JR kept failing his law exam...I believe 4 or 5 times? I doubt it.
Posted by: Dragon Horse | February 23, 2008 at 04:57 PM
"This type of stuff really pisses me off because I was clearly more qualified than Michelle Obama to work at a firm like Sidley Austin, but she got the prestigious high-paying job and not me because of her blackness."
If you feel that way then why don't you take advantage of your "Jewishness" and go to Hollywood and become a entertainment lawyer or agent. I've been to L.A. a couple of times and I can't count the Goldbergs, Steins, etc that are out there.
Don't pretend like they don't have internal affirmative action either, I know better. I have a cousin in the music industry who is a record producer and he has seen it over and over and over again...
I guess Jewish old boy networks are fine, as long as the government is not involved though right?
Posted by: Dragon Horse | February 23, 2008 at 05:01 PM
"Where you equally as outraged and upset when JFK JR kept failing his law exam...I believe 4 or 5 times? I doubt it."
No, HS is only outraged when blacks get a head up.
Posted by: Zeek | February 23, 2008 at 05:03 PM
81.4% of applicants passed the July 1988 Illinois bar exam, so that was not a difficult bar exam.
JFK, Jr. never pretended to be a great legal scholar. He got a job at the DA's office, not BIGLAW. Everyone knew he was a lazy rich kid.
Everyone in the legal community knows that New York has one of the more difficult exams.
And finally, there's no such thing as a Jewish old-boy network. Jews have no loyalty to other Jews.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 23, 2008 at 05:05 PM
Everything I've read about Michelle Obama convinces me she was an affirmative action admit to college and law school. My guess: had she gone to Stuyversant or Bronx Science in NY, she would have been intellectually humilated.
Posted by: Independent Accountant | February 23, 2008 at 05:15 PM
"And finally, there's no such thing as a Jewish old-boy network. Jews have no loyalty to other Jews."
That's a lie. I know better. You don't have loyalty to other Jews, but I know Jews with plenty of loyalty and solidarity on key issues even if they argue about what it is to be "Jewish" among themselves.
Michelle Obama said she was a legal scholar?
She should have turned down a good paying job? LOL Your a working class girl from the Southside and someone offers you 6 figures in the late 80's...uhm...what would you do..."oh I don't deserve this position because I failed the bar once (if she did)"??
Yeah George W. Bush deserved to go to Harvard Business School with his "C" average and Kerry deserved to go to Law School with is "C" average right?
Did that upset you? Did you feel cheated?
Posted by: Dragon Horse | February 23, 2008 at 05:16 PM
"I know Jews with plenty of loyalty and solidarity on key issues"
Jews vote the same on certain issues, but they have no loyalty to other Jews when making hiring decisions.
Your buying into conspiracy mumbo-jumbo, assuming that because Jews are successful, they must be helping each other. They are not.
I wish it were true, then I would have gotten a good job because I was Jewish.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 23, 2008 at 05:22 PM
Truth is Michelle Obama is the wife of the candidate. She is not running for anything. She doesn't want to be co-president like Hillary did.
What is Cindy McCain's education level?
"Cindy Lou Hensley grew up in affluent circumstances[4] in Phoenix, Arizona,[1] the daughter and only child[5] of James and Marguerite Hensley,[6] who founded Hensley & Company in 1955.[3] She attended Madison Meadows Elementary and was a rodeo queen in 1968.[7] She went to Central High School[5] in Phoenix. She graduated from the latter in 1972,[8] having been a cheerleader there.[9]
Hensley received her undergraduate degree in education[10] and a masters in special education from the University of Southern California.[11]S"
She grew up rich and that is the best she could do?
Yep...typical blond. Gonna post about that Sigma?
I also would like to see an article on the Affirmative Action George W. Bush and John Kerry got, because they definitely got some from someone. Michelle Obama's grades (at Princeton) according to her professor were quite good.
If you bothered to read the Newsweek article on her and not the Steve Sailer guessing game.
Michelle got into Princeton, not due to racial AA but due to being a legacy candidate due to her brother...
."
Posted by: Dragon Horse | February 23, 2008 at 05:22 PM
"Your buying into conspiracy mumbo-jumbo, assuming that because Jews are successful, they must be helping each other. They are not.
I wish it were true, then I would have gotten a good job because I was Jewish."
Nope, no conspiracy theories. I have Jewish friends. I have all my life and I have heard their parents talk.
I will admit the ones I've heard talk this way were very liberal and were often the type who say "Never Again" and complain about antisemitism and send money to the Anti-defamation League...but I have seen this more than once, and my cousin I has definitely seen it.
Reality is there is no way there would be such a high concentration of Jews in the Entertainment industry in 2008, with the lack of antisemitism (which initially drove many of them their) if someone was not looking out for someone.
If the entertainment industry was disproportionately Italian-American to the point ever 4 people had an Italian name no one would even question what was going on.
The fact Jews may be innately more intelligent does not explain the concentration in one industry to such an extent.
Posted by: Dragon Horse | February 23, 2008 at 05:27 PM
Dragon Horse,
Careful - while being a race realist is welcome here, being a Jewish realist will get you tarred and feathered. While Hispanics and Blacks and WASPs engage in ethnic nepotism, Jews are atomistic and don't engage in such behavior. And if you don't think Israel should get billions a year in US aid, you are an anti-semite.
See how it works?
Posted by: hugh go naught | February 23, 2008 at 05:58 PM
HS - I agree with 90%+ of your material, but disagree with your assertion that Jews have not loyalty to each other. What about Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz?
Posted by: SirTallRem | February 23, 2008 at 06:02 PM
"What about Wachtell, Lipton, Rosen & Katz?"
In 1965, the old firms discriminated against Jews, which is why four Jewish guys had to start their own firm.
This is not an example of a Jewish old boys network, but rather an example of how the gentile old boys network kept the Jews out.
There's absolutely no evidence that their current associates are any more Jewish than any other NYC BIGLAW firm.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 23, 2008 at 06:18 PM
HS,
Next time you ride the subway look at the ads for personal injury lawyers. You'll see plenty of them. With the notable exception of Fitzgerald & Fitzgerald ("We fight for brain damaged kids!") they're basically a collection of Jewish names.
Posted by: Peter | February 23, 2008 at 06:45 PM
Peter, PI is the slimy end of law, for people who couldn't get BIGLAW jobs.
I'm not sure how it proves a Jewish conspiracy if there is an over-concentration of Jews in the least desirable area of law.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 23, 2008 at 06:54 PM
This type of stuff really pisses me off because I was clearly more qualified than Michelle Obama to work at a firm like Sidley Austin, but she got the prestigious high-paying job and not me because of her blackness.
And she's resentful, in spite of all the breaks she's had, to boot.
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 07:01 PM
Anybody that thinks black people got dealt the unfair upperhand in the life lottery is crazy.
Who is suggesting that? I hear some arguing that maybe Michelle Obama got the upperhand in the life lottery, not blacks generally.
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 07:06 PM
re: ""Michelle recalls things differently. A campaign spokeswoman says she had an edge getting into Princeton not because of affirmative action, but because her older brother was there as a scholar athlete. She was a "legacy," just like any other applicant with family ties to Princeton."
Legacy admissions at the IVYs for white males has been suspect in my experience since the mid 1960s. A good friend of mine at that time had a Grand father who had been the Head of the Rockefeller Institute went to Yale as did his father and Uncle, both of whom were full professors at an IVY ( not Yale ). He had brothers and cousins who went to Yale as did he. One day we met and my friend was visibly in an emotionally depressed state. His younger brother had been turned down by Yale. The boys SATs were circa 1350 ( if I remember correctly ) which gives an IQ estimate of circa 140. All of the legacy grease did not help him get in. This was over 40 years ago. Over the ensuing years I have seen similar fates meted out to legacy connected bright white boys ( some Jews at that ) who did not get in to their parent's IVY.
However, it may work for girls. My wife's breast surgeon, a Yale College graduate not Yale Medical School, just had her daughter accepted to Yale. I did not ask the surgeon what the SAT scores of her daughter had been but asked her what major is she taking as a surrogate for the SATs. The answer: Drama! The surgeon has two boys neither one got into Yale although they tried.
Dan Kurt
Posted by: Dan Kurt | February 23, 2008 at 07:21 PM
"This type of stuff really pisses me off because I was clearly more qualified than Michelle Obama to work at a firm like Sidley Austin, but she got the prestigious high-paying job and not me because of her blackness.").
A SINGLE AA hire can not explain why you did not get that job. It can't even explain 0.1% of why you didn't get that job!.
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 07:46 PM
."
Half Siggy just likes to whine. He went to ASU Law School (and basically wasted 3 years) and is bitter about it.
What I don't understand is why he didn't get a good job out of college (he did get an bachelors degree from Wharton). I guess HS is proof that a high IQ is not a ticket for success.
Posted by: Zeek | February 23, 2008 at 08:01 PM
Envy is not a useful emotion.
Posted by: Gannon | February 23, 2008 at 08:05 PM
I made it through the Michelle Obama thesis. She sounds really angry, but the poll results are interesting if I read them correctly (appendix).
One finding was that when blacks went to college, their intellectual comfort level with whites dropped by two-thirds, and never recovered. Social comfort with whites dropped by 90%. Political comfort with whites dropped by half. General comfort with whites dropped by 93% after attending Princeton.
Her conclusions section did not touch these findings.
Posted by: Bill | February 23, 2008 at 08:22 PM
My second problem with this line of thinking is he wants to blame a black woman because white people like to give black women jobs. Why don't you go find the Jews and Whites that like to give black women jobs and highlight them. Name and shame them. By all means, go right ahead.
If I get offered money, I'm going to take it! In a capitalist society, how exactly is Michelle wrong to take a job offered to her? Why are you criticizing her and mentioning her by name (seems unfair to me) for doing what any other American would do ie taking a prestigious job if offered?
Or do black people secretly control the hiring at majority white and Jewish firms?
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 08:22 PM
"Or do black people secretly control the hiring at majority white and Jewish firms?"
According to white supremist sites, Jews are the enforcers of political correctness and multiculturalism.
I wonder how HS feels about this? He never seems to comment on how exactly black people have all this power to control affrimative action and political correctness, despite being a "low IQ" minority (to paraphrase his thinking).
Posted by: Zeek | February 23, 2008 at 08:35 PM).
Yes, because Michelle Obama is, after all, the only person to have ever benefited from racial preferences. In any event, Miss "Thank-You" almost certainly got a job at the expense of someone in the United States who was more qualified than her. But such obvious injustices have never bothered liberals in quite the same way many nebulous claims of "institutional racism" have.
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 08:36 PM
You were also born with brainy Jew genes and she wasn't. In what way is that fair??
Anybody that thinks black people got dealt the unfair upperhand in the life lottery is crazy.
But the brainy Jew thing isnt an end unto itself. The hot job is the goal. HS is pointing out a clear case where someone less qualified than himself (and I dont know anything about his qualifications so lets assume its true) got what might be a 'plum' position.
I dont think her failing the bar exam has anything to do with her being First Lady, but why shouldn't HS be entitled to feel some resentment that he has spent a career having to use a tiny monitor instead of getting a Sidley Austin job just because of his skin color.
Posted by: Turambar | February 23, 2008 at 08:38 PM
tommy:
"Yes, because Michelle Obama is, after all, the only person to have ever benefited from racial preferences."
He named her in particular.
"In any event, Miss "Thank-You" almost certainly got a job at the expense of someone in the United States who was more qualified than her."
This is unproven. If she really was such a crappy hire then she couldn't have possibly done the work of a 'real' lawyer. Therefore, it is logical to think they actually hired a real lawyer to pick up the slack. So basically her whole paycheck might have just been some cash they were willing to throw away on public relations. If they didn't hire blacks for PR reasons, there perhaps would have been no job. White people can't fill the job of "token black woman" so that job would just be lost to the ether.
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 08:53 PM
You were also born with brainy Jew genes and she wasn't. In what way is that fair??
Yes, Rawls Jr., better we compound the injustice by (a) denying a better qualified person the job on grounds unrelated to ability and (b) reducing the quality of lawyers the rest of society can select from.
You see, the question can easily be reversed: why shouldn't the brainy, studious Jew get the job because he was born with the right genes? And why should the rest of society to have to suffer along with him to make way for an incompetent?
Rawls should have dubbed his theory "Collective Injustice as Fairness."
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 08:57 PM
This is unproven.
Hardly, unless you seriously want to argue that someone would not have been hired at all for the positions she got. Otherwise, there is exactly a 100% likelihood that someone else didn't get the job that Michelle Obama got.
If she really was such a crappy hire then she couldn't have possibly done the work of a 'real' lawyer.
That's ridiculous. It's like arguing that if she was really such a crappy student then she couldn't have possibly been admitted to Princeton. What's to stop her from doing the same mediocre work, aided by her skin color, that got her through college? As any employer knows, the choice isn't always between having a terrific employee or an incompetent who must be fired immediately.
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 09:06 PM
If they didn't hire blacks for PR reasons, there perhaps would have been no job. White people can't fill the job of "token black woman" so that job would just be lost to the ether.
Yes, and I'm sure the money they paid her would have just disappeared into the ether along with her. Good God, you can't be serious?
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 09:16 PM
Another thing that occurs to me is: Does HS really want to be saying he's competing with the AA hires for jobs? He is basically saying he is worse than EVERY white who managed to get a job which is pretty sad.
tommy:
"Yes, and I'm sure the money they paid her would have just disappeared into the ether along with her."
Maybe they would have put it to advertising to achieve the same goal, maybe put a picture of a black guy smiling and hugging his Jewish lawyer. You know the ads I mean. ;)
"Good God, you can't be serious?"
Haha. NO. Not as serious as you. This kind of complaining comes from a bunch of guys that claim that black people should stop complaining and just accept their bottom rung in society like it was nothing. However, they think not getting a single job is a huge personal wounding. It's amusing to me.. At least in this version, we have less chance of race wars.
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 09:35 PM
From Catalyst Award. ....
Sidley partners are required to, among other things, annually account for their personal efforts to improve the diversity of the firm. This accountability—along with a strong, inclusive culture, leadership, and innovative programs and policies—ensures that the firm’s diversity efforts are sustained.
On the other hand, their New York offices were in the world trade center so, HS's life would have been in danger if he had gotten the job.
Posted by: Turambar | February 23, 2008 at 09:56 PM
Rain And and others pretend that:
Anybody that thinks black people got dealt the unfair upperhand in the life lottery is crazy.
The reality is that blacks are perfectly selected (well, except for the introgression of white genes here in the US) for a life in sub-Saharan Africa.
In that sense, they did get an upperhand in the life lottery, just not for competing in these complex societies that white people have created here in the US and in most of Europe nor those created by East Asians in certain corners of the world.
Posted by: Tiger Woods (I am mostly Thai and Chinese, Damn it!) | February 23, 2008 at 10:03 PM.
The compelling reason is competence. As I mentioned earlier, there is no reason why everyone should have to suffer so that a single token incompetent of any race can get ahead. Even blacks not named Michelle Obama don't benefit from inferior legal representation in this country.
At least in this version, we have less chance of race wars.
We need affirmative action to prevent race wars? Good grief! I guess I need to hang out at Stormfront.org and VNN more frequently to find out what's really going on. ;-)
Posted by: tommy | February 23, 2008 at 10:29 PM
Heh, tommy, in dispatches from China it seems that White power is so great that it has managed to get the Chinese (practically every one of them) discriminating against people of color, well, NAMs at at least.
Posted by: YellowFeverDude | February 23, 2008 at 10:34 PM
At the risk of pissing off some of you black-apologists, here's a link to stroy about a black woman who graduated from Harvard, was given a great job, and basically "F"'d it up by being an "angry black woman", sort of like Michelle Obama:
Judge Rejects Race Bias Suit Against DLA Piper
I do believe that it provides a good example of what HS was hinting at in this post.
Posted by: slwerner | February 23, 2008 at 10:48 PM
"We need affirmative action to prevent race wars?"
Hyperbole my friend. I have a weakness for rhetorical flourish! I was more thinking the French style riots of late. Culturally distinct people who have no social mobility tend to revolt over time. I also think interethnic crime is more vicious in relation to the extent of social isolation. I think if you are going to get robbed by someone from the lower class, you would hope that they would just take your watch and leave because all they want is money. What you probably don't want is for them to have so much seething resentment that they get something out of tying you up and torturing you for three days before killing you. I think increasing numbers of the second sorts of incidents are the price we pay for dehumanizing the poor and reducing open dialogue and connection between classes.
YellowFeverDude:
China is definitely not a democracy. Saying what is done in China is what 'the Chinese' want is a bit much. It's what the unaccountable ruling class wants.
Besides everybody wants to manufacture products in China. Very few non-Chinese want to live in China. Neither the Taiwanese, the Tibetans nor the Uighurs want to live in China.
But more importantly, the Chinese don't claim to aspire to racial harmony while the US rides around the world on a perpetual high horse raving about how commited they are to it. It is completely valid to critique the US on its stated ideals.
Finally, your argument is an argument to pay more attention to racism in China not to reduce attention paid to racism in America.
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 10:50 PM
slwerner:
There is nothing for which to apologize. From the 'race realist' perspective people of low IQ are driven to crime by forces out of their control. Yes?
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 10:59 PM
Thus spake vim:
China is definitely not a democracy. Saying what is done in China is what 'the Chinese' want is a bit much. It's what the unaccountable ruling class wants.
I think you missed my sarcasm. There seems to be plenty of NAMs who think that their treatment in China is all whitey's fault.
Don't get that job they want because it went to someone white, it must be discrimination.
Posted by: YellowFeverDude | February 23, 2008 at 11:07 PM
YellowFeverDude: Oh I see. My apologies. Sounds like an interesting phenomena.
Posted by: Vim | February 23, 2008 at 11:29 PM
"There is nothing for which to apologize. From the 'race realist' perspective people of low IQ are driven to crime by forces out of their control. Yes?"
Vim,
I take it from your off-subject reply that you didn't bother to read the article.
What I was hoping that the article would elucidate is the way in which some people (and I certainly limit it to any specific group) become convinced that they are entitled to not only getting a good job, but also entitled to be made to feel that they are doing a good job and to remain free from any criticism.
As with the example of Charlene Morisseau, I believe that what we are seeing with Michelle Obama is a deep seated resentment of whites - the "angry black woman" complex. With Morisseau, it seems that she didn't believe that she should "accountable" to the whites in positions of authority, nor that it should be required of her to actually perform her job functions. She didn't feel gratitude towards them for being given a chance to an associate.
If you'd have bothered to read the items that I provided you links to a couple of ays ago, you'd have learned that Ms. Obama has a similar deep-seated resentment towards whites because she felt as though they were entirely responsible for making her feel inferior. Now, today, she still bears a grudge for not being made to feel as though she was only at Princeton as an AA/Legacy.
She has been given a great opportunity in life beyond her natural ability, yet she has no gratitude to those who provided her that opportunity nor to the nation which gave rise to her being extended such privilege in life.
It has no bearing on her ability to be a candidates wife, nor even a first lady; but it does show the low-quality person that she is.
I say the same thing to rich-privileged white Ivy legacy entrants who are just as inclined to be handed great positions due to family connections, and who proceed to do a half-assed job, yet demand that people treat them with great respect and deference for regarding their poor efforts. Chelsea Clinton and JFK, Jr. pop quickly to mind.
Posted by: slwerner | February 23, 2008 at 11:38 PM
Thus spake slwerner:
She didn't feel gratitude towards them for being given a chance to an associate.
You know, where I work I don't feel gratitude for being given a chance to work their either.
However, you can bet I work hard and am constantly looking for ways to add value and justify my existence.
This is because I early a lot and have shares in the company, but also because I know we have let whites go who did not perform, we have let Chinese go who did not perform and we have let Indians go who did not perform. What we have left is people from four groups and these people all perform.
No one had a sense of entitlement where I work.
Posted by: YellowFeverDude | February 23, 2008 at 11:57 PM
Jews have no loyalty to other Jews.
Sure they do. Jewish scientists are 40% more likely than non-Jews to cite papers with Jewish authors.
Posted by: Rain And | February 24, 2008 at 12:10 AM
Getting cited is important for tenure decisions:
Posted by: Rain And | February 24, 2008 at 12:13 AM
slwerner:
Why be so hard on Michelle? At least she doesn't have a blog where she complains about white people stealing jobs from black people and advocates policies like reducing white immigration. Even if she did, do you think that would make her a racist? Maybe she's just a 'race realist' and she knows whites and blacks just can't get along. Wouldn't it be great to have a 'race realist' in the white house?
Posted by: Vim | February 24, 2008 at 12:16 AM
"Why be so hard on Michelle?"
Vim,
I gone on the record (on this forum) as pulling for Obama to be president. I've also pointed out that I am fully aware that he is certainly a race realist.
My point is merely that Michelle Obama represents a personality type which I have had the misfortune to have had to deal with in my own life - the angry black woman. She the woman who blames whites for anything and everything.
In every day life, blacks are far more frequently quite obvious in expression of their resentment and hatred of whites than is seen in the reverse.
For the record, I don't buy whites "crying" about how the system has "cheated" them. I'm quite certain that I've lost out to lesser qualified persons at times. It's something that one must find the character to move beyond.
I feel the same way to black "whiners".
As for Michelle, if see was of any "quality" at all, she'd simply come right out and name some of the obvious things that she could be proud of her country for, rather than have her PR folks awkwardly and ineffectively trying to finesse her statements. Her actions and attitudes scream, "I hate this country because it full of white people, who I hate".
I'm still pulling for Obama though. I'm counting on the Great Black Messiah being a Carteresque failure in office - swooning bimbo admirers notwithstanding.
Posted by: slwerner | February 24, 2008 at 12:37 AM
re: "Jews have no loyalty to other Jews."
This is IMHO unlikely to be true. Jews are boosters of Jews as much as ROTARIANS boost ROTARIANS and Masons boost Masons. ( Note: the RAISON D’ÊTRE of ROTARY and MASONRY is boosting each member! ) Below I will give a true story as an example.
I am 2nd Generation German both sides and Catholic to boot. Talk about a background where no helping hands can be expected.
While in college my father, an industrial engineer, was fired as he was just completing the construction of a new manufacturing plant. Years later the company begged him to return and fix the plant which had been screwed up by incompetent managers ( not engineers ) hired as a cost saving ploy after my father departed. My father declined the offer. My father who had built two plants and revised a number of other older plants vowed never to work for a company again. He decided to find an equity position instead. What he did was after many months of searching take a 50% stake in a company and attempt to rescue the company from bankruptcy. It was touch and go but he succeeded and eventually sold his 50% ownership for enough money to have a comfortable retirement. His co-owners were Jews and the banker involved in the rescue and other businessmen involved were all Jews. My father has only good stories of his dealings with Jews even with him being a Goy.
Well the son of the Jewish co-owner at some point after my father joined the business graduated from high school. He wanted to be an engineer. His SATs and high school transcript were not of high order expected for admission to a first rank engineering school. The next door neighbor of the Jewish co-owner was a professor of engineering at a high ranked engineering school. This professor managed to get him admitted and shepherded the boy through 4 years of Engineering to the point where the boy graduated, at or near the bottom of his class, but did graduate with a BS in Mechanical Engineering. My dad's business associate bragged to my father that his neighbor, the professor, made possible his son making it through with a degree being awarded.
Goys in my experience don't do this for other Goys. I am using the term Goy as meaning a non Jewish white.
Well how did the boy do? He was given a job by G.E. in Cincinnati, OH and managed to keep the job for 3 or 4 years at which time he was let go. Currently, according to my father who still is in contact with his ex-business associate the boy, now a man, is doing well selling antiques.
Dan Kurt
Posted by: Dan Kurt | February 24, 2008 at 04:38 AM
The thing you guys are missing is that ethnic favoritism works through social networks like any other kind of favoritism. So, yeah, there's a Jewish social network just like there's an Italian social network, a WASP social network, etc. Being a member of the appropriate group is a necessary but not sufficient condition for entry, particularly if the group in question is dominant in the area; i.e., you might get a job from the only other Jew in Plano, but good luck using your Jewishness alone to get a job in Hollywood. For that you have to be the director's cousin, etc. HS probably wasn't tied into the Jewish social network (maybe he wasn't too popular in Hebrew school; who knows?), so for his purposes, it might as well not exist.
Posted by: SFG | February 24, 2008 at 07:43 AM
Half Siggy just likes to whine. He went to ASU Law School (and basically wasted 3 years) and is bitter about it.
He's entitled to some complaining. It's not as if he went to some obscure law school. Arizona State is a well-known, perfectly legitimate university. One would think than an ASU Law School diploma would be more than (very) expensive toilet paper. Apparently not.
Posted by: Peter | February 24, 2008 at 10:42 AM
"For the record, I don't buy whites "crying" about how the system has "cheated" them. I'm quite certain that I've lost out to lesser qualified persons at times. It's something that one must find the character to move beyond."
I'm somewhat ambivalent about AA for this reason and because I think that it may be the best a heterogenous, democratic society can do under the circumstances. However, I see absolutely no reason to exacerbate the policy with a stupid immigration policy- but that is another issue.
Half could have overcome his ASU law experience if he wanted to. He would have probably had to become creative and initially work harder than the minority candidate, but his IQ would have shown through in the end. I have read enough of the WSJ blog on law to see how people took unconventional routes to become established in law (joined JAG, got an LLD like Half is doing now, joined a government firm first...). I think a big reason he didn't do law is because he realized how uninterested he was in the career. He should just admit the obvious.
But, how can I not be suspicious of a Black or Latino candidate with even top tier credentials given the disparity in national, standardized test scores and anecdotal stories like this? Vim is probably a good test taker and AA unfairly stigmatizes people like him and Thomas Sowell. Sowell has written about this issue extensively, in fact. There is an absolute cost to AA- even for minority candidates. This isn't discussed much by anyone here. If a minority candidate wants to impress me academically, I really want to clearly see his/her scores on the standardized exams, more than his/her degrees from whatever institution.
Posted by: retard | February 24, 2008 at 11:35 AM
Affirmative Action is the law! Any employer can be arbitrarily hauled into court and assessed big fines if even suspected of not complying with AA.
No wonder US firms are outsourcing overseas! If all the world had to abide by US regulations, the US would be creaming the lot of them, by Jove.
Posted by: Zim | February 24, 2008 at 12:25 PM
Dan Kurt, the idea that the only people who ever do favors for other people are Jews doing favors for Jews is the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard.
If Jews are doing favors for other Jews, it's because they are kept out of the WASP country club where WASPs do favors for other WASPs.
***
Retard, law is a profession in which if you don't get on the right career track when you graduate, no one gives a crap how smart you are or how hard you are willing to work.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 24, 2008 at 12:31 PM
HS:
"Retard, law is a profession in which if you don't get on the right career track when you graduate, no one gives a crap how smart you are or how hard you are willing to work."
Then WHY is it so hard for you to understand what racism is or that it still exists in America? It's not that you couldn't work hard and overcome it but other factors come into play psychological and practical ... but I am sure you know what I'm saying ...
Anyway, so now you are admitting that intelligence and hardwork aren't as important as having the right degree. So lets look at Michelle's qualifications:
1. Intelligence - Low (according to HS)
2. Work ethic - No idea but lets say Low
3. Right degree - Yes!
So she has the number one qualification for the job! So it's not because she's black that she got the job over you. It's because she had the right degree from the right place. Please feel free to mention the other tens of thousands of white folks who got jobs that you didn't get because they did law at an Ivy league school.
Anyway, Ivy league degree isn't a ticket to a perfect life. You know that since you have one. You still have to work it.
Posted by: Vim | February 24, 2008 at 01:53 PM
Vim: "Then WHY is it so hard for you to understand what racism is or that it still exists in America?"
Huh? My post made it clear that I understand that society is racist against whites. And it's even more racist against Asians, the most discriminated-against race in America.
Posted by: Half Sigma | February 24, 2008 at 02:03 PM
"Then WHY is it so hard for you to understand what racism is or that it still exists in America?"
Vim,
I'm not clear if you're referring to the (largely imagined) conspiracy of whites to keep blacks out of the good-paying jobs (you know, like those nefarious souls who've kept those multi-million dollar NFL and NBA jobs ALL to whites); or to the hate and vitriol of blacks who despise white people for each and every time that their black skin color didn't get them everything they wanted?
Posted by: slwerner | February 24, 2008 at 02:07 PM
For what it's worth, Hillary Clinton failed the Washington, D.C. bar exam, but passed the Arkansas bar. Of course, she began her private legal career at the Rose Law Firm in Arkansas.
Posted by: DAJ | February 24, 2008 at 02:34 PM
Few people would care about M. Obama if she weren't she wasn't constantly out stumping for Obama and if he hadn't referred to her as his closest adviser.
No one cares about Mrs. McCain because all she has said on the campaign trail is that she is proud of her country.
Posted by: Roy | February 24, 2008 at 02:57 PM
Retard, law is a profession in which if you don't get on the right career track when you graduate, no one gives a crap how smart you are or how hard you are willing to work.
That's because law is a grossly overcrowded field, which in turn is because law school is easy (no math, no science, no computers). There's no need for such worry about "proper career tracks" in fields like electrical engineering and pharmacy, because those offer opportunities for everyone. Of course it takes a lot more brainpower to qualify in those fields.
Posted by: Peter | February 24, 2008 at 03:14 PM
HS:
"Huh? My post made it clear that I understand that society is racist against whites."
That's cool man. Don't let logic mess up your thing. :) You haven't responded to my pointing out that you are basically saying you were in competition for worst lawyer at every important firm to which you applied. If not so, then there is no way an AA hire would be taking your job. *Bottom* whites lose out to AA hires.
slwerner:
You read this website same as me. QED.
DAJ:
No. no. She's white.
Posted by: Vim | February 24, 2008 at 06:25 PM
AA hires take jobs of more qualified non-AA applicants. Happens everywhere, everyday. Meritocracy takes a holiday. Competence lost.
Posted by: Zim | February 24, 2008 at 08:16 PM
Anyone who has read that abortion she claimed for a senior thesis knows she was unqualified to go to Harvard Law. She was unqualified to go to Princeton also.
Michelle Obama's crowning academic acheivement has been released. Read it here:
Groundbreaking stuff...
Posted by: | February 25, 2008 at 11:07 AM
”You haven't responded to my pointing out that you are basically saying you were in competition for worst lawyer at every important firm to which you applied.”
Vim,
I may be miss-reading HS's point in making this post, but as I see it, it really isn’t so much about him complaining that Michelle Obama has cheated him out of an opportunity, but rather to point out that he, not she is the person who has a right to complain about the “unfairness” of the system.
It’s kind of a “common sense” understanding that in order to have the “right” to complain, one must have been the one aggrieved. In the example of Michelle Obama, she has not been aggrieved in the least, but HS can at least make a case that he might have been.
If we were to consider the case of a white person, who based on merit alone (grades, test scores – not legacy) made it into an Ivy League school, and ended up in a prestigious position afterward, we would surely dismiss any claims that such a person might then make about how unfair the system had been to them. We would right demand, “WTF!?!?”.
This would hold even more true if a rich-privileged legacy Ivy grad were to make such claims of unfairness against them. And, the same holds true for AA-privileged individuals who whine about the system having been unfair towards them (when the obvious reality is that it has been unfair towards others for their own personal benefit). This is where Michelle Obama comes in.
And, there’s more to this story…
In general, anyone who has spent any time in the adult worlds has no doubt encountered the angry black racist woman. It’s easy to dismiss the non-achievers who loudly grouse about the government (aka predominantly white taxpayers) not providing them a Mercedes to drive and a big-screen HD TV to watch while waiting for their welfare checks as the clowns that they are. We pretty much come to expect such ridiculous behaviors of under-class blacks.
However, when one encounters an educated, well-paid angry black racist, it quite another thing. As we all think of them, let me ask you directly, just what is it that they have to complain about? They’ve been privileged beyond their innate abilities, provided opportunities that other equally qualified people can only dream of, and enjoy protections afforded to them by virtue of their skin color that their working peers will never have. They ought to be overjoyed, but they prefer to bitch.
As one who has never enjoyed the benefits of the fantasy of “white privilege”, I’ve had to work my butt off to get where I am. I know the score. There are compelling reasons why those of “protected” minority classes will be advantaged above me. Life is simply unfair. The institutionalized racism of Affirmative Action is inherently unfair. But, one must move on, and not dwell in the past perceived grievances if one is to succeed. We white men are mostly just happy to live in a country that provides us the chance to get ahead on our merits. We know we have much to be proud of in out country. WTF is Michelle problem?
Posted by: slwerner | February 25, 2008 at 11:26 AM
Jewish medical students and resident get most ethnic favoritism on east coast. There were jewish residents who got all kind of award and honor in my program, who could not find job after training. In real life, the private practitioners know how to detect bullshit.
Talking about unfairness!
Posted by: MD | February 25, 2008 at 11:29 AM
Michelle Obama's problem is that she is a professional blacktivist. Her entire being revolves around herself as a Black Person. It doesn't matter that she went to Princeton and Harvard(notice she didn't tell those White Devils to get bent and enroll at historically black college though). If she didn't get in she'd be whining about racism(although, we'd never hear it except if we had to deal with her at the DMV, at diversity training for work, etc...) I think deep down she knows that she, like the vast majority of black people who went/go to elite schools, are in reality "charity" cases. They are a people that can't really do for themselves and will always be wards of the state and always have their hands out for more, more, more! If it isn't AA for school/jobs it is welfare or easier loans that they can't pay back, etc... Same thing really.
Posted by: | February 25, 2008 at 11:57 AM
slwerner:
The idea that Michelle benefitted from AA is pure speculation. It's something about which you have no idea. We don't have the admissions information. This is just pure stereotypical speculation. It's grasping at straws to defame a successful black person solely because she is black.
If you can be white, in a white dominated country and manage never to benefit from the fact then I am sure she can manage to never have benefitted from AA. Some black people actually don't put their race on admissions papers on principle for instance.
"In general, anyone who has spent any time in the adult worlds has no doubt encountered the angry black racist woman."
In your many travels, have you ever encountered the angry white loser? You know they type? (If not, go to stromfront.) As I mentioned previously, affirmative action can't explain even 0.1% of the reason why HS isn't at a top law firm.
"We white men are mostly just happy to live in a country that provides us the chance to get ahead on our merits."
"We pretty much come to expect such ridiculous behaviors of under-class blacks."
Yes, only the white men have the right attitude about life ... are you even reading what you are writing? Yes, Michelle is the racist ...
Posted by: Vim | February 25, 2008 at 12:12 PM
In general, anyone who has spent any time in the adult worlds has no doubt encountered the angry black racist woman.
That type certainly exists, but other than her more-than-20-years-old college thesis there's no real evidence that Michelle Obama is among its ranks. She might be one of the many people whose personalities and outlooks change after college.
Posted by: Peter | February 25, 2008 at 12:27 PM
"It's grasping at straws to defame a successful black person solely because she is black."
Vim,
Where have I defamed Michelle Obama? I've simply pointed out that she has no right to complain because she HAS been given advatages over others. Even if she did get into Princeton on merit (highly dubious, given the information already relaesed), she has still enjoyed a privileged life. SHE HAS NO REASON TO BE WHINING ABOUT THIS COUNTRY! She should be greatful to this nation for the good life she's enjoyed. If she cannot be gracious enough to be greatful, she should at least shut the "F" up!
Black "loser" types should come to recognize that most of their problems and failures are of their own making, and quit whining about others "holding them down". Same goes for white "loser" types as well.
Posted by: slwerner | February 25, 2008 at 12:29 PM
So successful people can't complain because they are successful. Unsuccessful people can't complain because they deserve whatever they get.
But it makes sense to you that HS, who is, as we speak, wealthy enough to be spending tens of thousands of dollars on a degree when he already has a good job should complain. Interesting.
Posted by: Vim | February 25, 2008 at 12:48 PM
"...there's no real evidence that Michelle Obama is among its ranks."
Peter,
While her remarks about not being proud of this country may not represent "real evidence" of her racially resentful persona, there's also nothing to suggest that she isn't just the angry black racist that her remarks make her sound like.
Cindy McCain has clearly laid down a challenge to Michelle in proclaiming that she, for one, is proud of her country. If Michelle is not the angry racist black woman that she now appears to be, why does she not come right out and say so?
Since her faux paux, she has been very guarded in her speech. Her PR people are trying to spin her comments into meaning that she was only referring to the “politics” of this country. But she says nothing of it. How hard would it be for her to rattle off a few achievements in this country since 1980 that she can point to with some measure of pride?
Despite Vim’s claim that I’ve defamed her, I have no reason to suspect that she is incompetent – she did graduate from both Princeton and Harvard, and one can assume she’d been doing a good job through her years of employment. I have no gripes with her regarding her professional success. Other than her racial resentments (which I believe are deep-seated within most blacks in this country), I’d give her high marks as wife, mother, and woman. She’s taken good advantage of opportunities extended to her to make something of herself. Good for her! (I can think of any number of people give great opportunities who “F”’d them up.)
And, perhaps I am projecting onto her the persona I’ve seen reflected by a number of well-paid blacks who clearly benefit from their skin color (even if the only benefit they enjoy is the race-based protection from criticism/dismissal, it is still a benefit NOT enjoyed by whites), who don’t even try to conceal their contempt of whites. Even though they have no “real evidence”, they still insist they are victims of discrimination. Even though they’ve personally flourished in this country and in this society, they still decry it because it is “white dominated” – as if that’s something bad or undeserved. Outside of white/western societies is there an example one might provide where those not of the dominant group have the kind of opportunities to rise and to succeed?
If I am projecting and undeserved persona onto Michelle Obama, I will gladly acknowledge that I have so – once some evidence emerges to show that she isn’t what she appears to me to be.
Posted by: slwerner | February 25, 2008 at 01:13 PM
"So successful people can't complain because they are successful. Unsuccessful people can't complain because they deserve whatever they get."
Vim,
In as much as this is a deliberate misreading of my words, good job!
Just to be clear, what I've said is that those who've enjoyed success should be suspect when they complain that the "deck was stacked" against them. Those who've made it on merit should not complain that it was "too hard", and those who've had either race or wealth privileges are fools when they complain that a "rigged system" has denied them their due.
Further, I've suggested that those who are not successful need to look at themselves as the source of their failures rather than seek to blame others. Plenty of blacks succeeded in times of over racism and discrimination. For people who will make no efforts to better themselves, nor even make an effort to find gainful employment, it is ludicrous to make claims of “the man” holding them down and invoke the excuse of a “legacy of slavery”.
Likewise, whites who blame their failures on minorities (I’ve never actually visited Stormfront, nor do I intend to; so I’m assuming this is what they do there) are lying idiots. This nation is full of opportunities for anyone willing to make an effort. There are plenty of examples of people who weren’t handed plum positions at prestigious firms right out of school who never-the-less managed to make something of themselves through hard work (there’s this guy named Gates; Bill, I think it is).
Frankly, Vim, I’m pretty much just tired of the whining from all corners about how oppressed and cheated they perceive themselves to have been. I’m not meaning to single out blacks alone. The world isn’t “fair”. It’s never going to be. Deal with it! Hate with get one nowhere – it’s as true for blacks as it is for whites.
Posted by: slwerner | February 25, 2008 at 01:30 PM
HS,
Michelle Obama has plenty of excuses for failing the bar(as well as courageously speaking truth to power about how horrible life has been for her, etc...). She's black, and probably many of the questions were unfair because they referenced white people's stuff like regattas, cotillions etc... You know, culturally biased and not taking into account the legacy of slavery, etc... She didn't get a pre-Bar exam orientation like she did before she went to Princeton so that she could make friends with other oppressed minorities who ended up thrown into the bigoted plantation that is the Ivy League. This undoubtedly caused low self-esteem. I wouldn't also doubt that those who scored the bar exam were closet racists(and sexists) who took the first chance they got to fail a black woman. It was a racist set up, clear and simple. I bet the white men who oversee the bar exam are regular posters on Stormfront as well. And as Vim can tell us, racism is everywhere in America.
Posted by: ? | February 25, 2008 at 01:52 PM
SlowLearner said:
There are plenty of examples of people who weren’t handed plum positions at prestigious firms right out of school who never-the-less managed to make something of themselves through hard work (there’s this guy named Gates; Bill, I think it is).
I suspect that Bill is a poor example of what you are saying. The other guy, the one from Oracle, Larry or something, is probably a better example.
Posted by: Slim Dusty | February 25, 2008 at 02:44 PM
re: "
re: "
Dear Jerry and Vim:
My nephew did not get into Harvard as well although he did get on the waiting list. He currently is in his second year at Colgate after turning down Yale, Cornell and Penn. Now why did he not get into Harvard? He had the following qualifications: (1) since 7th Grade has been followed by the Johns Hopkins IQ study with his IQ of over 160; (2) SATs of 800 math, 800 verbal and A+ essay, (3) Nearly perfect GPA in high school ( A half white half Japanese boy had a slightly higher GPA and he did not get in to Harvard either but is now at Stanford. ), and (4) was Editor of his high school newspaper as a junior ( as well as a senior ) because the editorship was the reward for the highest score in a competitive exam given to candidates. ( He is also 6' 1" , a good golfer, has travelled the world, at least Europe and Asia many times, and has a winning personality, that is, is not a NERD. ) That he did not get into Harvard is insane if Harvard is a meritocracy. Given this, Harvard sure does not appear to be a meritocracy.
Now who got into Harvard? One girl in his high school got in with SATs more than 175 points below my nephew and a B on the Essay. Also, two Blacks got also in to Harvard who were from high schools near my nephew's high school. These two blacks had SATs circa 1200 combined according to his guidance counselor. Harvard is playing dice with its future. The future of its reputation of being the best is doomed to decline if it does not admit the best.
The so called by Vim "bottom of the white/asian pile" has no reality in actuality. No, the pile is not ranked top to bottom but is a stacked deck designed to break the future of high potential ( especially white ) males. These males who have been passed over ( unless they understand how they have been gamed ) will forever have doubts as to their worth. They will remember that they have been turned down by Harvard--as if, a mark of Cain.
Dan Kurt
Posted by: Dan Kurt | February 25, 2008 at 11:52 PM
These males who have been passed over ( unless they understand how they have been gamed ) will forever have doubts as to their worth. They will remember that they have been turned down by Harvard--as if, a mark of Cain.
So what? Back when I was applying to colleges I got rejected by Amherst. If that has created everlasting doubts as to my self-worth, it's news to me.* And it's no "mark of Cain."
There's something else. Getting rejected from Harvard is not like getting turned down when applying for a job. If you don't get the job you're still unemployed. In contrast, anyone who was a strong enough candidate so that a rejection from Harvard came as a surprise almost certainly will have been accepted at other very good universities.
* = of course I have enormous doubts about my self-worth, but that's because I don't worship The Most Important Sport in the World.
Posted by: Peter | February 26, 2008 at 09:29 AM
Wow you must have gotten really "pissed off" when you found out Hillary failed her bar exam also.
You can't catch a break anywhere, can you?
First Michelle Obama gets your job at Sidley Austin and now Hillary might steal your job as the president.
Posted by: SayWhat | February 28, 2008 at 07:40 PM
They haven't proved Michelle failed anything. This is just a guess based on taking the test late and being black.
We do know it's a fact that Hillary failed the bar the first time around. Personally, failing a test means nothing to me. Passing says something about your ability but it's tough to prove a negative and failing an exam definitely can't prove you are not a smart person.
However, just out of fairness, it is also confirmed that McCain finished almost last in his year in military school.
Finally, Michelle Obama is not running for president. She doesn't deserve to have her credentials attacked unless you think she's not qualified enough to stand next to Barack and wave when he becomes president.
Posted by: Vim | February 28, 2008 at 10:17 PM
"That nerd deserves to get into Harvard, but it does not mean that nerd does not get "passed up" in college by that secretely smart jock who was dating cheerleaders during the early years"
I am agree with you and am like you, I went to "University of Phoenix", and am way more smarter than those ivy league schools.
Posted by: anonymous | July 29, 2008 at 04:43 PM
Because I am a Jock, I'm a Jock-
Come On
(Cool Jock-Really, Really Cool)
You Know I am a Jock, I'm a Jock-
You Know It
And The Whole World Has To
Answer Right Now
Just To Tell You Once Again,
Who's a Jock...
Posted by: anonymous | July 29, 2008 at 04:53 PM
In addition to sounding highly uneducated and extremely bitter, your comments are highly presumptuous considering you are basing your conclusion, that Michelle Obama failed the Illinois bar exam, on the fact that she was admitted to the bar in 1989, rather than in 1988. There could be a number of explanations as to why this is so and I am not even going to bother list the plethora of possible reasons (use your imagination, since you seem to have a very vivid one). First of all, you are highly naive if you think that Harvard is in the business of admitting students that are not highly qualified–black, white, brown, yellow. And who cares that you passed three bar exams; so did I (including New York), big deal. You think that that alone makes you more qualified than the next to work at “Sidley Austin (BIGLAW)”.
Why didn't you land a Big-firm job? I mean, there are only a small percentage of African-Americans hired at large law firms--the majority of summer associates being white. You may want to consider the real reason(s) why “BIGLAW” didn’t want you. You are either: (1) woefully under qualified to work in a large law firm (especially since being white wasn't even enough to help you get the job); or (2) exceptionally lazy; or (3) incapable of applying basic legal principles of logical and reason; or (4) so shockingly ignorant and racist that you’re essentially unemployable; or (5) all of the above.
Food for thought.
P.S. Hillary Clinton, a Yale Law School graduate, failed the D.C. bar exam her first try. I guess this information must indicate that she was either (1) woefully under qualified to be admitted to Yale Law School (no doubt being white helped); or (2) exceptionally lazy; or (3) both. I am sure you were clearly more qualified than Hillary Clinton as well.
Posted by: Smarter than Sailer | July 30, 2008 at 04:47 PM |
PREAMBLE
THE GEAR
50+ HEADPHONES COMPARED
TL;DR & CHARTS (spoiler alert)
The review itself involved several hundreds of hours of critical listening. The basic method of comparison involved a considerable amount of flipping back and forth between headphones / amps / songs while writing shorthand opinions as I listened. I have lived with the majority of the headphones listed for a year or more. Some of them, I have lived with for multiple years or even a decade +. A few of these headphones have only been in my possession for a few months, but I have made sure to allow for a minimum of 50 hours of critical listening time before formulating any final opinions.
The majority of the headphones included in this review are flagship models or were considered a flagship model at some point. I did not include any headphone which was not in my personal collection because I wanted to avoid all biases related to listening-time and possible favoritism. I was hesitant to include in-ear-monitors (IEMs) in the ranking as I have a preference for
full-size headphones which not everyone necessarily shares. However, ultimately I decided to include IEMs in the ranking as they constitute a sizeable portion of my collection and listening time.
The headphones are ranked on performance alone. Each headphone included in this ranking will have its own spotlighted review. The review will begin with some personal thoughts about the headphone or perhaps a brief retrospective. Following these opening thoughts will be two sections labeled "STRENGTHS" & "WEAKNESSES" respectively. These two sections will focus on the positive and negative aspects of the headphone's performance and construction. I have attempted to discuss numerous aspects of the headphone and I have listed each aspect in approximate order of significance to me. Each bulleted description will begin with a keyword (or keywords) in order to appeal to those who do not wish to read the entire description, but who still want to understand my basic impression of the headphone.
I have refrained from using a number system to grade different aspects of the headphones for the simple reason that I feel it may be misleading in this case. Most of these headphones are so outstanding in their performance that the number system may not ultimately reflect my opinion quite so accurately.
Furthermore, some of the things which I consider to be a "strength" may not be a strength for everyone. For example, your listening preferences may differ from my own or you may have a different opinion regarding design. Conversely, some of things which I label as a weakness may not at all be what you consider to be a "weakness."
Following the "STRENGTHS" & "WEAKNESSES" section is a section I have titled "ON THE FENCE." This section discusses aspects of the headphone's performance that I felt was good in some ways, but in need of improvement in other ways.
The "FOR THE PRICE" section is where the headphone is graded on its price-to-performance ratio. I did not use this grade as a factor in the ranking of the headphone's performance. Headphones with a grade of an A- or better are ones that I consider to be an exceptional value. Headphones with a grade of B- to B+ are a good value although there may be better options for the same price. Headphones with a grade of C- to C+ are headphones that I feel do not constitute their asking price based on the competition. Headphones with a grade of D or lower are headphones that I feel are priced disproportionately to their performance level. A low grade does not mean that I dislike the performance of the headphone. What it does mean however is that for a fraction of the price, one can get close-to or better performance from an alternative headphone.
"QUICK CHECK" is the final section. This section is merely a quick run-through of the headphones' specs, design, status, etc. The following key may help provide better insight into my shorthand designations:
- DESIGN refers to whether the headphone is full-size, on-ear or in-ear.
- DRIVER refers to the type of transducer employed.
- IMPEDANCE refers to the nominal impedance rating of the headphone measured at 1Khz
ISOLATION refers to the headphone's ability to passively eliminate outside noise and prevent sound from leaking out of the headphone. I did not examine any active noise canceling headphones in constructing this review.
- AMPLIFICATION refers to whether or not the headphone benefits from, requires or does not need an amplifier for operation.
- MY PREFERRED AMP/S refers to the amp/s which I found to be most synergetic with the headphone in question.
- SOUNDS BEST WITH refers to the genre/s of music which I feel the headphone excels with.
- CABLES USED refers to the cable/s which I used in evaluating the headphone's performance. The designation "stock" refers to the original unmodified cable that shipped with the headphone.
- REVISIONS KNOWN refers to whether or not the manufacturer made specific design changes to the headphone during the course of its production.
- FLAGSHIP STATUS refers to whether or not the headphone in question ever held the designation of "flagship." Most of the headphones listed were at one time the flagship of their respective manufacturer's product line. If a headphone is currently the flagship of its respective manufacturer, I designate this with "Currently Is." If a headphone was once a flagship, but has been superseded, I designate this with "Once Was." If a headphone was once a flagship, but was produced in extremely limited quantities, I designate this with "Limited Production Flagship." If a headphone is / was the flagship of a specific product-line, I specify this with the designation "Specific To Product Line." And finally, if the headphone was never intended as a flagship from the manufacturer, then I specify this with the designation "Not Applicable."
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012 refers to whether or not the headphone is still currently in production.
- COST refers to the approximate price which the headphone sells for at the time that I write this review. All amounts are shown as USD.
In my early teens, I began a lifelong fascination with headphones. I immediately identified with the intimate sonic presentation that headphones provided and I recognized the amount of detail that I was able to hear from them. While working at a high-end audio store, I began to explore the functionality of the mixing console. Eventually, the recording and mixing process became an integral part of my life. I completed a degree in sound engineering from the Institute of Audio Research in 2001. In the years following, I worked both as an audio engineer and as a session musician for hire. During this time, I had the opportunity to work with many musicians and industry professionals who I admired and would ultimately learn from.
In 2007, I joined the Head-Fi community. I had never been a part of an online community prior to joining Head-Fi, and thus the concept of a message board or forum was foreign to me at the time. I had already been frequenting the site as a visitor for close to a year, but it was my eagerness to ask specific questions regarding the construction of custom-molded in-ear-monitors which served as the motivation I needed to proceed with registration.
Of course, many of you know that I am currently the "headphone guru" at headphones.com. For the tremendous role that the Head-Fi community played in my acquisition of this job, I am eternally grateful. I see this review partially as a thank you to the whole of the community which has enriched my life in a very personal way.
Lastly, I will talk a bit about my listening preferences and personal music taste. I don't have just one type of sound that I look for from headphones. I can enjoy a fun-sounding headphone as much as a more neutral/analytical headphone. A lot depends on which music I am listening to, but I usually tend to value transparency over all other aspects of sound.
My music tastes are pretty far-reaching. The core of my vast collection (approximately 12,000 CDs) of music can be divided into three genres: Classical / Jazz / Rock. Regarding classical music, I am a huge fan of Mahler (hence my user name), Brahms, Mozart, Sibelius, Shostakovich, Dvorak, Bartok, Ravel, Debussy, Bach, Beethoven, Schubert, Schumann, Chopin…the list can go on for pages. Regarding jazz, I am a huge fan of Keith Jarrett, Chick Corea, Charlie Parker, Charles Mingus, Herbie Nichols, Louis Armstrong, Miles Davis, Wayne Shorter, Branford Marsalis, Dave Holland, Pat Metheny, Duke Ellington, Thelonious Monk...and again the list can go on for pages. Regarding rock music, I am a huge fan of The Beatles, Joni Mitchell, Elliott Smith, Genesis, Steely Dan, Neil Young, Radiohead, Jeff Buckley, Nirvana, Led Zeppelin, Bob Dylan and many others.
For a complete listing of the CDs used in this headphone evaluation please see MUSIC: CDs Used For The Evaluation
I am far from the first headphone hobbyist to join the headphone industry professionally, but I wanted to say a few words about my experience in the field thus far. Initially, I had a fear that witnessing the industry from the inside out would corrupt my enjoyment of this hobby. I am happy to express that after being at headphones.com, my intrigue and appreciation for the hobby has only increased. Getting to know several manufacturers face to face has improved my understanding of their product lines. Furthermore, the people who I work with are a rare bunch who really understand, appreciate and respect our hobby. Walking into the office feels sometimes like entering my home. It's a good feeling!
I love getting calls from someone who says "oh by the way, I'm from Head-Fi." It's the best part of the day for me. For those who may not know, I am always reachable via email both at [email protected] or via PM me here on Head-Fi. If you write me, I will respond to your email. No question is too silly / no comment is too insignificant! :)
I began writing this review before I started at headphones.com - yes it has taken well over a year to complete! This review is a largely-expanded version of the "20 Headphones Compared" thread which I did in 2010. Initially, it was my intent to update that original review, but as my collection continued to grow and my opinions began to reshape as a result, I felt that it would be more serviceable to expand it into an entirely new project.
I used to obsess over which component in the system was most important to the overall fidelity of the sound. Ultimately, I found that with every upgrade that I made to a single component in my system, my perception of every other component was affected (not always for the better). I personally don't feel that it is necessary for one to use more than a singular source in their audio rig; one exceptional digital-to-analog-converter (aka DAC) or turntable setup is truly all that is needed. However, if one has multiple headphones with different power needs and/or tonal balances, then one may wish to have multiple amplifiers accessible.
The following is a list of the gear used in compiling this review:
SOURCEMSB TECHNOLOGY: Diamond DAC IV with the following upgrades:
- Femtosecond Galaxy Clock
- Diamond Power Base
- Universal Media Transport
- Pro I2S Input
AMPLIFIERS
- HEADAMP: Aristaeus
- HEADAMP: Blue Hawaii Special Edition
- HEADROOM: Balanced Ultra Desktop Amp
- LAROCCO: PRII MkII
- MANLEY LABS: Neo Classic 300B
- MEIER AUDIO: Corda Move
- RAY SAMUELS AUDIO: Hornet
- RAY SAMUELS AUDIO: Tomahawk
- SPL: Phonitor
- TTVJ / MILLETT: 307A
- WOO AUDIO: Woo Audio 5
ODDS & ENDS
- SPEAKERS: Mackie HR-824 (Pair)
- POWER CONDITIONER: Monster Pro 3500 Surge
- SWITCH BOX: Gold Point SW2X-O
- INTERCONNECTS: A Pure Sound & ALO Audio
MSB TECHNOLOGY: Diamond DAC IV
I lived with the MSB Platinum DAC III for a number of years. In that time, it became the most trusted component in my system. The sound of the DAC III was the most lifelike I had ever heard from a DAC. There was no question in my mind that, if and when I would upgrade, I would stick with MSB.
Turn the page a few years and enter the Diamond DAC IV. The sound of this DAC is so effortless; so
natural; so invisible - that the old cliché "there are simply no words..." is perhaps the most honest thing I can say. I suspect that the most impressive thing I can say about this DAC is that since becoming an owner, I have been going to concerts far less frequently - It is truly that good!
MSB offers an expensive state-of-the-art upgrade for their entire DAC line: the Femtosecond Galaxy Clock. With a jitter measurement of 77 femtoseconds, the Femtosecond Galaxy Clock is presently the most accurate clock in digital audio. Just for clarification purposes, a femtosecond equals one millionth of one billionth of a second. In this way, MSB Technology is truly on the cutting edge of digital audio. If you are serious about state-of-the-art sound and are looking for a no-holds-barred top-end DAC, then the MSB line deserves your highest consideration.
COST:
- DIAMOND DAC: $21995 (starting price pre-upgrades)
- FEMTOSECOND GALAXY CLOCK: $9950
- DIAMOND POWER BASE $4495
- UNIVERSAL MEDIA TRANSPORT: $3995
- PRO I2S Input: $995
TOTAL: $41430
HEADAMP: Aristaeus
Sennheiser's HE90 Orpheus headphone is one of very few headphones which shipped with its own amplifier. This amplifier, known as the HEV90, was an electrostatic design, specifically intended by the manufacturer to be paired with the HE90. It was a gorgeous-looking vacuum tube amp with a built-in DAC module. Consequently, the title "Orpheus" is often synonymous with Sennheiser's complete flagship audio system, rather than just the headphone alone.
The Aristaeus is a vacuum tube headphone amplifier designed by Kevin Gilmore (in partnership with HeadAmp Audio Electronics) to be extremely similar to the HEV90's amp section; the Aristaeus does not feature a DAC component. According to its maker, the Aristaeus's amplifier design is nearly identical to HEV90, although the power supply is improved upon. Another notable difference between the Aristaeus and the HEV90 is that the Aristaeus offers a Stax compatible headphone output in addition to the HE90 headphone output, whereas the HEV90 featured two outputs, both intended for the HE90 headphone.
While the Aristaeus will work with a variety of electrostatic headphones, I use it almost exclusively to power my HE90 (Orpheus) - the headphone for which it was primarily intended. The only other headphone with which I regularly pair the Aristaeus is the HE Audio Jade. My Aristaeus was built with a DACT stepped attenuator for volume control.
TUBES USED: 12AX7/ECC83 (JJ Electronics: Stock)
COST: $4495
HEADAMP: Blue Hawaii Special Edition (BHSE)
Like the Aristaeus, the Blue Hawaii Special Edition was designed by Kevin Gilmore. The BHSE is a hybrid solid state / vacuum tube electrostatic headphone amplifier. With an output voltage of 1600 peak-to peak, it is capable of driving even the most demanding Stax headphones, such as the Omega 2. My BHSE, in particular, exhibits a silver finish, and was installed with an Alps RK50 attenuator. I think it is among the best looking amplifiers in my rig. This amp's performance is breathtaking. However, the amp does run quite hot. In order to facilitate this, I have carved out a ventilation chamber which rests above the amplifier. Unfortunately, one cannot see this in the photographs.
TUBES USED: Mullard EL34 Quad (Stock)
COST:
- AMP: $4995
- Alps RK50: $1000
TOTAL: $5995
HEADROOM: BALANCED ULTRA DESKTOP AMPLIFIER (BUDA)
The BUDA is a solid state balanced amplifier which offers a single pair of balanced headphone outputs and two pairs of single-ended headphone outputs. It also offers a pair of preamp outputs. The front panel features a gain switch as well as a crossfeed switch. While I use the upgraded Desktop Power Supply, it may be a superfluous addition since the amp's stock power supply seems perfectly acceptable.
COST:
- AMP: $1599
- POWER SUPPLY: $549
LAROCCO: PRII MkII
The PRII MkII is a portable solid-state amp that has been long out of production. It was designed by Phil Larocco to serve as a reference-grade battery-operated headphone amplifier. One of its most impressive features is its bass contour control. Much of the design here has been implemented into Triad Audio's L3, also designed by Phil Larocco.
COST: $500 (estimated)
MANLEY LABS: NEO CLASSIC 300B
The Neo Classic 300B is a beautiful sounding amplifier. While it offers a variety of single-ended outputs, I primarily use this amp for headphones. This is my go-to amp for the Sennheiser HD800 and Beyerdynamic T1. The amp features a switch for the option to bypass the transformers when using the main line-out. However when in headphone-listening mode, you must use the transformers. The sound of this amp is slightly slow and lush, yet romantic and beautiful; it is the best classic tube sound that I have yet heard.
TUBES USED:
- 300B Pair (Sophia Electric Princess: Upgrade)
- 6SL7GT Pair (Electro-Harmonix: Stock)
- 5U4GBEH Pair (Electro-Harmonix: Stock)
- OD3 Pair (NOS JAN USA: Stock)
COST:
- $5850 (Base Price)
- $450 (Upgrade Tubes)
TOTAL: $6300
MEIER AUDIO: Corda Move
The Corda Move is a discontinued portable headphone amp designed by Jan Meier. The model which I own dates from 2008; it is the original production model. I consider it to be a good value, originally having discovered it in Skylab's magnificent portable amp roundup thread. The Corda Move has since been superseded by Meier's Corda 2Stepdance.
COST: $150 (estimated)
RAY SAMUELS AUDIO: Hornet & Tomahawk
The Tomahawk was my first venture into the world of portable amps, and my acquisition of the Hornet followed soon thereafter. I appreciate the functionality and rugged construction of Ray Samuel's amplifiers. Not only was I a fan of these two amplifiers, but I was also impressed that I was always able to reach Ray very easily. My business experience with Ray Samuels Audio led me to several other RSA purchases, including the HR-2, Raptor, P-51 Mustang, and SR-71A. I have since parted with these four amps, but I still think highly of each one of them. Ray was also kind enough to allow me the chance to spend some time with the B-52; I enjoyed it very much. I have a great respect for Ray as an amp designer and businessman.
COST:
- Hornet: $370
- Tomahawk: $295
SPL: Phonitor (Black)
The Phonitor is the best sounding solid-state amplifier that I have used. It is a very neutral sounding amp and it powers a variety of headphones exceptionally well. The SPL Auditor features the same basic design as the Phonitor, but without the added crossfeed, centering and channel-soloing features. For those on a more limited budget, the Auditor is a great choice. On a side note, I enjoy summing the channels to mono and then putting one of the channels out of phase. hehe:)
COST: $1934
TTVJ / MILLETT: 307A
Of all the headphone amplifiers that I own, the 307A is probably the one that I use most. It has a very neutral and natural sound. In my opinion, Pete Millett is one of the pioneers of the field. Only 12 units of the 307A were made before it was discontinued. However, Pete Millett and Todd The Vinyl Junkie have teamed up once again to produce an amp that is quite similar in design: The Pinnacle. I had the opportunity to review the Pinnacle. It is a wonderful amp. The most significant differences between the 307A and the Pinnacle are fourfold. Firstly, the transformers used in the Pinnacle's design are more expensive and, according to the amp builder himself, far superior. Secondly, in order to achieve a lower noise-floor, the power supply is separated from the amplifier section. Thirdly, the Pinnacle uses the PX4 as its output tube in place of the 307A tube. Fourthly, the Pinnacle has built-in preamp functionality while the 307A does not. Minus these differences the 307A and the Pinnacle are virtually the same amp design. Both offer balanced and single-ended inputs and outputs; both are exceptionally neutral with a slight tube-y roundness. I highly recommend both the 307A and the Pinnacle!
TUBES USED:
- 307A Pair (Sylvania)
- 7N7 (Westinghouse: Stock)
- 5V4GA (Tung Sol: Stock)
WOO AUDIO: Woo Audio 5
As with the Manley Labs Classic Neo 300B, the Woo Audio 5 employs the 300B as its output tube. Also, like the Manley Labs Classic Neo 300B, the Woo Audio 5 exhibits a wonderfully fluid midrange. However, the decay of the Woo Audio 5's sound is not as slow as the Manley's. Consequently, the Woo is not as lush or romantic as the Manley, but instead, more accurate and even-tempered. The Woo Audio 5's standard headphone output features a high/low impedance option in order to better accommodate each individual headphone's power needs.
One of the most significant features of the Woo Audio 5 is its K1K output, which was designed specifically in order to meet the power demands of AKG's K1000 headphone. This output pumps 8 watts per channel into 140 ohms impedance. However, since the release of this amp, other headphones have been introduced which are equally (if not more) demanding than the K1000, i.e., the HE-6 by HifiMan. The Woo Audio 5 powers the HE-6 brilliantly; it is presently the only amp with which I pair the HE-6. This is one of my favorite pairings. Lastly, the Woo Audio 5 can also function as a speaker amp, as it features speaker outputs in the rear panel.
*Woo Audio also offers the Woo Audio 5 without the K1K and speaker outputs. This version is known as the Woo Audio 5 LE.
TUBES USED:
- 300B Pair (Sophia Electric Princess: Upgrade)
- 6SN7GTB Pair (RCA: Stock)
- 5U4G Pair (Sovtek: Stock)
COST:
- $3150 (Base Price)
- $150 (Teflon Tube Socket Upgrade)
- $450 (with Upgrade 300B Tubes)
SINGLE POWER AUDIO: SDS-XLR
I've crossed this amplifier out on purpose. I own this amp. But one would never know it. It's not in my home. Not long before Single Power Audio was put out of business (as a result of fraudulent activity) the owner hand-delivered the amp to my residence - Yes hand-delivered! About a week into ownership, one of the channels started to short. I promptly shipped it back to the manufacturer for a repair. After the manufacturer diagnosed that the problem was a blown capacitor, I expected that the fix would be quick and easy. Unfortunately, my amp was never returned and I would never hear back from the company again. I was never able to track down the owner, and as such, I was never able to retrieve the money I paid.
MACKIE: HR824 Mk2 (pair)
The HR824 are powered monitors designed primarily for studio application. I've owned the pair for nearly a decade. I usually bring them to studios when I am unfamiliar with the provided in-house monitors. The HR824 isn't the best sounding pair around, but I know their sound signature quite well and I feel comfortable using them in just about any room. As you can plainly see from the photos, I don't have these monitors at an optimal height for listening. I don't use them in my home for anything more than listening to music while laying in bed.
COST: $1399.95 (estimated)
MONSTER: Pro 3500 Surge
The Pro 3500 is a simple yet effective power conditioner, which I use to keep my power clean and to protect my gear from a power surge.
COST: $300
GOLD POINT: SW2X-O
For convenience, I purchased the SW2X-O, a high-quality switchbox. I use it because neither the TTVJ Millett 307A nor the Head Room BUDA offer a through-output and therefore it is impossible to daisy-chain the two amps. The SW2X-O is a reference-quality passive switchbox which allows me to distribute the output signal to these two amplifiers, one at a time.
COST: $572
Interconnects by A PURE SOUND & ALO AUDIO
The majority of the interconnects used in my system (including all the balanced ones) are manufactured by A Pure Sound. I have always been extremely happy with the quality of A Pure Sound cables; I feel they have an exceptional price-to-performance ratio. In addition, I use two ALO Audio interconnects; the quality of these interconnects is exceptional as well.
COST: $2500 (estimated)
Now on to the core of this evaluation...
There are not too many headphones listed here that I truly dislike. I happen to enjoy most of the headphones included, and I can usually find at least one redeeming quality in a headphone, even should I feel it misses the mark. Unfortunately, the only truly redeeming quality that I can find in the ATH-W5000 is that it is one of the best looking headphones ever made. I find its sound quality to be bordering on awful.
I purchased a pair of the ATH-W5000 in 2007. I was completely shocked by how poorly it performed. Today, it remains the only headphone that I have ever returned. A couple of years later, I was informed by a respected member of the community that he had encountered two different pairs of the ATH-W5000. According to him, the earlier one sounded defective, while the later one sounded a bit better. After I was given this information, I contacted the manufacturer to see if there was any record of changes made with regard to the production of the W5000. According to the manufacturer, there was no record of a production change and there were no documented defects.
However, I was convinced that the pair I had initially purchased was defective since so many people seemed to like the sound of the W5000. In 2010, I purchased the ATH-W5000 for a second time. It sounded about as bad as I remembered. The only way that I can even begin to appreciate its sonic presentation is at an exceptionally low volume level.
STRENGTHS
ATTRACTIVE: I still think this is the most beautiful looking headphone that Audio-Technica has ever made. Its striped ebony wood finish is even prettier to my eye than the cherry wood finish of the ATH-W3000ANV (Audio-Technica's newer and far greater flagship).
COMFORT: Audio-Technica's leather earpads are very soft. While I'm not a fan of the self-adjusting headband design, the ergonomic fit of the headphone allows the earpads to loosely encompass the ears, which is rather comfortable. I have a larger-than-average-size head. It is possible that one with a smaller head may find that the W5000 wears a bit too loosely.
STORAGE: The W5000 ships with a really wonderful carrying case. It looks like a hard plastic suitcase specifically designed for your headphones. The case features a wonderfully silky interior as well.
ISOLATION: The ATH-W5000 is one of a small handful of full-size closed-back headphones on my list. Because of its closed-back design, it offers some attenuation of outside ambient noise.
WEAKNESSES
SOUND: Normally, I would evaluate several distinct attributes of the sound in order to determine which are successful and which are in need improvement. In this case, I find that the sound is simply poor all around. It is a nasal, congested, non-transparent, bass-less, unnatural tone.
HEADBAND CONSTRUCTION: I'm not a fan of Audio-Technica's self-adjusting headband design. I think it is flimsy and easily breakable. While many of Audio-Technica's full-size flagships incorporate this headband design, I do wish this design was something they would abandon.
ON THE FENCE
LOW LEVEL LISTENING: The W5000 sounds drastically improved at lower volume levels. No, I'm not trying to be funny by saying "the closer I get to not hearing it, the better" :). At exceptionally low listening levels, the sound broadens and becomes more natural.
POWERING: Audio-Technica produced an amp specifically designed to power the W5000. It is known as the HA-5000. I am told by some owners of this pairing that the sonic results are stunning. I have never heard this pairing, so I do not know. In my experience, I have found that the W5000 never loses its nasal, unnatural character despite which amp I choose to pair it with. Of the amps I've used, I have found that it sounds best with the TTVJ Millett 307a, but it still does not sound particularly good.
CABLE: The W5000's cable is of a fairly high quality. However, I always prefer easily detachable cables. The W5000's cable is hardwired.
FOR THE PRICEFOR THE PRICE
F
I won't be giving out too many F's in this evaluation. Unfortunately, the ATH-W5000 is just insufferably nasal sounding to my ears. The drivers sound as though they are being restrained. Perhaps if it were an open-back design, the sound would improve quite a bit. At its price, I feel that every other full-size headphone I have heard outperforms it by leaps and bounds.
QUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: Full-Size
- DRIVERS: Dynamic
- IMPEDANCE: 40 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Some
- AMPLIFICATION: Recommended
- MY PREFERRED AMP: TTVJ Millett 307A
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Low level listening
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Once Was
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: In Production
- COST: $650-$1000 (estimated)
The 2X-S is a custom in-ear-monitor that incorporates two balanced armature drivers per ear in a single passive crossover design. It was the second pair of custom-fit IEMs that I ever purchased. I bought them almost immediately after I acquired the Ultimate Ears UE10 Pro. I had read several positive reviews about it, including that it offered the best noise cancellation and comfort of any customized in-ear. The shell of the 2X-S is made completely out of soft silicone material. Just that description alone sounded promising to me. The 2X-S is a solid offering in several ways. It is able to block out a tremendous amount of ambient noise and it is quite comfortable to wear for extended periods of time. However, when removing the earpieces from my ears, the flexible material actually manages to cause my ears discomfort. Finally, the 2X-S is just average with regard to sound quality.
STRENGTHS
AMAZING ISOLATION: Between the 2X-S and the Westone ES, I'm not sure which offers better passive noise reduction. These two in-ears are the best I have ever tried with regard to passive noise isolation. The 2-XS is truly astonishing with regard to the amount of ambient noise it is capable of attenuating.
FIT: Let me specify that by the word "fit" I do not mean comfort. The reason I state this is that the fit itself is essentially perfect. However, when I remove the earpieces from my ear, the silicone bends, causing my inner ear great discomfort.
SUPER PORTABLE: With regard to portability, nothing even comes close to IEMs. You can fit the 2X-S inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with an MDR-R10.
EASY TO DRIVE: Most IEMs are easy to drive. On the rare occasion that I use the 2X-S, I do not use an amplifier. I have used the 2X-S primarily with just my iPod.
SERIALIZED: As any customized item should be, the 2X-S is serialized.
WEAKNESSESWEAKNESSES
NOT TRANSPARENT: I find the sound signature of the 2X-S to be extremely unnatural. Sadly, the sound is stained by a shrill metallic quality throughout the entire frequency spectrum..
TONALITY: I've found that throughout the frequency response here, there are odd peaks and dips. The bass is most definitely lacking in impact. The treble sounds slightly rolled off and brittle. The midrange presentation has its moments, however, the upper-mids sound odd and unnatural.
CABLE: Today, I believe that Sensaphonics offers a replaceable cable option. However, back when I ordered the 2X-S, I am pretty sure that the cable was only offered in a hardwired configuration. The cable on my 2X-S appears to be quite flimsy.
RESELL VALUE: When I first joined Head-Fi, I remember someone putting up a thread in the "For Sale" section in which they announced the sale of their custom-molded earphones. This thread turned out to be a joke. Reselling a custom-molded product was almost unheard of at the time. Today however, there are many companies which offer a refitting process that makes reselling custom-molded earphones an option. Still, be prepared to take a major hit should you resell them.
ON THE FENCE
IMAGING: All criticism aside, the 2X-S is actually decent at imaging. The instrument separation is enhanced by a rather smooth decay.
STORAGE: My 2X-S shipped with a hard plastic case and a vinyl zipper carrying pouch.
FOR THE PRICE
DI feel that the 2X-S is extremely overpriced. The silicone material is quite effective at attenuating outside noise, but ultimately I find that every other in-ear-monitor listed in this evaluation is more natural sounding. Coming off the heels of my favorable UE10 purchase, I was greatly disappointed with the 2X-S when I first heard it. Five years later, I still have not yet warmed up to its sound signature.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Balanced Armature
- IMPEDANCE: 27 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Extreme
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary
- MY PREFERRED AMP: AMP: n/a (iPod without amp)
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: N/A
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: At least 1 known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Once Was
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: In Production
- COST: $750 + Audiologist
*The IE 8 was later offered with an optional Apple remote. The version that I own is the original (without the Apple remote).
STRENGTHSSTRENGTHS
IMAGING: As far as in-ear-monitors are concerned, the IE 8 has wonderful imaging abilities. While it doesn't quite compete with full-size headphones in this regard, it is certainly near the top of the class with regard to in-ears.
EASY TO DRIVE: Like most IEMs, the IE 8 is not difficult to drive. I typically use my iPod with the IE 8. Because the iPod's bass output is inherently rolled off, the bass contour control is sometimes fun to play around with.
SUPER PORTABLE: With regard to portability, nothing even comes close to IEMs. You can fit the IE 8 inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with an HD800.
BASS CONTROL: The IE 8 features a little dial on the faceplate of each earpiece which allows you to tailor the bass response to your preference. In order to turn the dial, you need to use a little tool (included by Sennheiser) which functions like a flathead screwdriver. One small issue I have with the way the bass feature is implemented here is that the dial is not stepped. This means that you have to match the left and right channel's bass output by trusting your eyes and ears only.
SILICONE GUIDES: While I never use them, the silicone ear loops are intended to add reinforcement to the cable so that it stays behind your ear when wearing the earphones.
WEAKNESSES
LACKS TRANSPARENCY: I find that the IE 8 is demonstrative of a grainy midrange presentation. In contrast, the Shure, Audéo and Westone universal in-ear models below offer a far more fluid midrange to my ears.
MIDS: The mids sound grainy and unnatural. Sometimes it also seems as though the midrange gets swallowed up by the bass. on this matter, but I stand by my assertion.
STORAGE: I find that the IE 8's carrying case really detracts from the portability of an IEM. It is excessively large (bigger than an iPod) and cannot easily fit in one's pocket. It forces the user to wrap the cable up around an internal guide. This is not my preference. I never use this carrying case.
COMFORT: The ergonomic design here feels awkward to me. I also can never manage to achieve an optimal seal from the supplied silicone or foam tips. I believe the reason may be as simple as the larger-than-average size of the earpieces.
ON THE FENCE
SOUNDSTAGE: Of all the in-ears included in this review, I feel that the IE 8's soundstage presentation is most similar to that of a full-size headphone. I don't generally like the soundstage presentation of IEMs. The IE 8 actually succeeds here in many ways. The soundstage is wider than average for an IEM and has surprising depth as well.
TONAL BALANCE: The IE 8 has a warm tonality. Many people (particularly bass-lovers) will enjoy this. However, in my opinion the tonality is awkward due to a grainy upper-midrange.
TREBLE: The IE 8's treble presentation is non-sibilant. I appreciate this. Conversely however, there is an awkward quality about the treble; it is slightly rolled-off yet can sound abrasive at times.
ISOLATION: Due to the ergonomic fit (or lack of), I am never able to get an optimal seal with the IE 8. The isolation ability is subpar for an IEM.
NO SWEET SPOT: I have never really figured out what music the IE 8 sounds good with. It doesn't strike me as the perfect earphone for any genre. However it doesn't sound particularly horrendous with anything.
FOR THE PRICE
D
I'll say it here: Sennheiser is probably my favorite headphone manufacturer of all time. In terms of value, I find that the IE 8 is the weakest offering I've come across from them. It's not even that it's a bad earphone. It was simply overpriced based on the sound quality it offered.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Dynamic
- IMPEDANCE: 16 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Some
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary
- MY PREFERRED AMP: AMP: n/a (iPod without amp)
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: N/A
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Once Was Product Line Specific
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: Out Of Production
- COST: $350 (estimated)
I owned the MDR-EX700LP for several years. This was Sony's flagship in-ear model until the release of the MDR-EX1000. While I liked certain aspects of the EX700LP's sound (particularly the bass presentation), I was never thrilled by neither the earphone's overall sound quality nor its ergonomic design. It was because of my lack of enthusiasm for the EX700LP that I never ventured to try the EX1000.
In 2012, Sony introduced their very first in-ear product-line to utilize balanced armature drivers. This product-line is known as the XBA line. While they released several different XBA models at different price-points, it was the quad-driver model, which was to be the most highly anticipated within the audiophile community.
The XBA-4 is Sony's newest flagship in-ear model. To my knowledge, it is the one of only two quad-driver universal-fit IEM currently available; the other being the Westone 4. However, unlike the Westone 4, which incorporates dual bass drivers, the XBA-4 has a single bass driver and a single driver dedicated to sub-bass frequencies. I pre-ordered the XBA-4, but shortly after it arrived, Sony sent headphones.com a sample of the entire XBA-line. When I had the chance to spend time with each of the earphones, I discovered that I actually found that the XBA-3 sounded better to me. The XBA-4 is brighter and a bit sharper. It seems to me that the XBA-4's sound signature is more revealing than that of the XBA-3, but at the same time the XBA-3 sounds more natural and balanced. If I had known that I was going to be given the opportunity to review the entire series, I probably would have gone with the XBA-3 instead.
*The XBA-4 is offered in two different versions. One comes with an Apple Remote and is known as the XBA-4iP, while the other comes without this feature and is known simply as the XBA-4.
STRENGTHS
DETAILED: The XBA-4 offers a highly detailed sound signature. This type of sound signature is very desirable for classical-music-listening.
IMAGING: The XBA-4 exhibits exceptional imaging abilities. As far as IEMs are concerned, the XBA-4's ability to separate instruments and provide a real sense of roominess is far above average.
CLASSICAL MASTER: The XBA-4 can sound a bit sharp with most popular music, but it excels with classical music. In addition, the XBA-4 tends to sound good with very well-balanced (non bright) recordings.
ISOLATION: The simple fact is that in-ear-monitors are inherently designed with the ability to offer the user superb isolation from outside noise. That said, the XBA-4's enclosures are rather large and cumbersome. It is not entirely easy to get a seal with the XBA-4. However, once the user manages to get a seal, the isolation achieved is very good. Sony offers silicone and foam/silicone hybrid eartips to facilitate the user with this task.
SUPER PORTABLE: With regard to portability, nothing even comes close to IEMs. You can fit the XBA-4 inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with an MDR-R10.
EASY TO DRIVE: Like most other IEMs, the XBA-4 is designed with the portable user in mind. An amplifier is not necessary to drive the XBA-4, but I have found that they sound particularly good when paired with my Ray Samuels Audio Hornet connected to my 5th generation iPod Classic. The Hornet gives it a tad more impact than going through the iPod headphone output directly. Part of this has to do with the fact that the iPod's headphone output rolls off the sub-bass frequencies.
STORAGE: The XBA-4 comes with a hard-shell carrying pouch that locks via magnet. This is a massive improvement over the very awkward carrying case that shipped with the EX700LP. This magnet-locking design is especially considerate of the fast-paced user who may accidentally damage the cable while zipping the pouch.
WEAKNESSES
NOT TRANSPARENT: I find that the XBA-4 lacks a sense of smoothness. Ultimately, I find that it does not showcase an extremely transparent sound signature.
MIDS: The midrange here sounds a bit metallic and lacking in transparency. Voices do not always sound natural to my ears. here, but I stand by my assertion.
IEM SOUNDSTAGE: To my ears, the soundstage presentation that IEMs portray is lacking in realism. As I've stated previously, a lot of people happen to like the inside-the-head feeling, but for me, it is not competitive with a full-size headphone's outside-the-head ability.
SIBILANT: The XBA-4 is not overtly sibilant. However there are moments when I find that the earphones can border on problematically-sibilant.
CONSTRUCTION: I do not like the ergonomic design of any of the Sony in-ears that I've tried. I find that the earpieces do not sit particularly snug in the ear. It is especially difficult to get a seal with the XBA-4 due to the fact that the earpieces are quite large. Furthermore, I detest when manufacturers design their earphones with the cable worn straight down (as is the case here), rather than behind the ear. By wearing the cable straight down, the cable is guaranteed to be microphonic.
CABLE: Sony really misses the mark when it comes to cable design. If you're an audio purist like me, you will prefer using the earphones without the Apple remote (especially should you have the intention of using it with a dedicated headphone amplifier). However, should you opt for the XBA-4 without Apple remote you may end up regretting your decision (as I have). The reason for my regret is that the XBA-4 (without remote) features an extremely awkward cable design, where the left and right earpieces are connected to one another unevenly. The XBA-4iP features the more common (and much less awkward) Y-split cable design. I do not like the uneven-cable-split at all. Lastly, my final complaint is that all of the models within the XBA series feature non-detachable cables.
ON THE FENCE
TONAL BALANCE: The XBA-4 exhibits a neutral-ish tonality but it doesn't quite hit the mark of neutrality. It is a little bass deficient, particularly if you find getting a seal with it to be as much of a task as I do. Furthermore, the midrange is not entirely natural-sounding. All in all, the tonal balance is very good, but not outstanding.
BASS: The XBA-4's bass extends rather deep. When one is able to get a proper seal with the XBA-4, the bass is quite impactful; if not, the bass presentation sounds a bit lean. I actually found the XBA-3's bass presentation to be a bit more impactful, particularly in the mid-bass region. Part of the reason for this difference may be due to the fact that I found that the XBA-3 was easier to fit inside my ear.
TREBLE: The XBA-4's treble presentation is wonderfully extended, however it exhibits moments of grain and edginess.
FOR THE PRICE
CApart from this review, I evaluated the XBA-4 not too long ago. In this previous review, I gave the XBA-4 a value rating of 8.5 out of 10. This differs significantly from the C rating which I am awarding it here. The reason for this notable difference is due entirely to the fact that in this review I am comparing it against all types of headphones; not just in-ears. Although the XBA-4 shows itself to be an improvement over the EX700LP, I still feel that Sony has yet to address the awkwardness of their ergonomic in-ear designs. While the XBA-4 does not perform poorly, I can't help but suggest that the XBA-3 will be preferable to a large amount of listeners. It is for this reason that I cannot give it a value grade any higher than a C. Had the XBA-3 been included in this evaluation, I would have awarded it a grade of B or B- with regards to its price-to-performance ratio.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Balanced Armature
- IMPEDANCE: 8 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Extreme
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary but Worth Considering
- MY PREFERRED AMP: AMP: Ray Samuels Audio Hornet
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Classical Music / Well-Recorded Music
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: : Currently Is Specific To Product-Line
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: In Production
- COST: $349.99 (without Apple Remote) 369.99 (with Apple Remote)
Of all the headphones that I own, the HFI-700 is the only one which is regularly not in my home. I keep it at the small space where my band rehearses. When we are recording, I like to use this headphone specifically for monitoring drums. Much of this has less to do with the sound quality and more to do with the fact that my HFI-700 is roughed-up after years of use.
The HFI-700 was my introduction to Ultrasone. At the time which I purchased it (I think around 2005), I really enjoyed its sonic presentation. In many ways, I still think it provides an exceptionally fun listen. The HFI-650 happened to be an earlier model, but I am told that it is sonically identical to the HFI-700. Today, Ultrasone continues their HFI series, with the HFI-780 being the HFI-700's distant relative.
STRENGTHS
FUN TONALITY: I have always enjoyed the HFI-700's sound for casual listening. It offers a tremendous mid-bass hump, as well as a recessed upper mid presentation. Perhaps the most problematic area of the frequency response is the loose bass. In fact, out of all the headphones in my collection, the HFI-700 probably resembles the typical hip-hop headphone of today. However, unlike most of these consumer-grade headphones, the HFI-700 offers tremendous treble extension. I am not convinced that any particular region of the frequency response here is exemplary, yet the overall tonality is very enjoyable to me.
HIP HOP & R&B MASTER: I love listening to hip hop, modern r&b and classic soul with the HFI-700. It has a visceral sound due to a looser bass response. I find that this bass presentation has a tendency to clutter up the mix when listening to rock, jazz and especially classical music.
ISOLATION: One of my favorite aspects of the HFI-700 is its ability to seal really well. Of course, it does happen to showcase a closed-back design (closed-back headphones typically provide isolation). However, even when compared with most other closed-back headphones, it ends up in a high place on the totem pole of isolation.
WEAKNESSES
LACKS TRANSPARENCY: The HFI-700 lacks a sense of realism when compared against higher-end headphones. However, when compared with similarly-priced closed-back headphones, the HFI-700 actually fares quite well in the transparency department.
NOT NEUTRAL: The HFI-700 has an extremely colored/fun tonality. In my opinion, it is not suited for critical listening.
MIDS: The HFI-700's midrange showcases some unnatural peaks and dips. Sometimes it is easy to overlook this flaw because it is not so extreme. However once one listens to a headphone that offers an extremely pure sounding midrange, the HFI-700 can sound odd.
COMFORT: Very early on, the HFI-700's faux leather earpads began to harden and crack. As the earpads continued to harden, I found that the HFI-700 went from being fairly comfortable to physically fatiguing.
CABLE: The HFI-700 features a one-sided hardwired cable. This style is not my preference. I prefer a Y-split detachable cable design because it allows the headphone to be easily re-cabled for balanced application.
ON THE FENCE
BASS: Of all the headphones listed in this evaluation, I might suggest that the HFI-700's bass presentation is the least tight. However, the actual feel of the bass is very full and enjoyable for certain types of music.
SOUNDSTAGE: As far as closed-back headphones are concerned, the HFI-700's soundstage is impressive. It is wider than I typically expect from a closed-back headphone. However, it still possesses the closed-in feeling which seems to be an inherent side-effect of closed-back headphone design.
TREBLE: I appreciate how forward the treble is here. It helps the sonic presentation remain uncluttered despite the loose bass response. On the other hand, the treble here is not particularly grain-free.
AMPING: In truth, the HFI-700 is not a difficult headphone to drive. Yet I think the sound is greatly improved when paired with a neutral solid-state amp. When I pair it with the SPL Phonitor for instance, the soundstage opens up quite a bit and the bass feels slightly more controlled.
FOR THE PRICE
C
If you had asked me in 2005 (when the HFI-700 was still new to me) what I thought of it, I would have most certainly given it a B or B+. I thought a lot of this headphone at the time. Of course I had much fewer headphones to compare it with. Over time my allegiance towards it has faded. However, it does carry the designation of being the headphone for which I've held on to the longest besides the Denon AH-D950. As far as closed-back headphones are concerned, I think the HFI-700 was a solid offering in its time. I do however wish that the earpads were made of a more supple/durable material.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: Full-Size
- DRIVERS: Dynamic
- IMPEDANCE: 75 Ohms
- AMPLIFICATION: Recommended
- ISOLATION: EXTREME
- MY PREFERRED AMP: SPL Phonitor
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Hip Hop / R&B / Soul
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Never Was
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: Out Of Production
- COST: $150 (estimated)
In the early 2000's, Shure introduced the world's very first one-size-fits-all triple-driver balanced armature in-ear-monitor. It was known as the E5. Shortly thereafter, Shure debuted the E500 (also a triple-driver). Upon its release, the E500 was the most expensive universal-fit IEM ever made. It included a device known as the Push-To-Hear module, a small microphone which enabled the user hear outside sounds without having to remove the earpieces from his/her ear. For the most part, the E500 received fantastic reviews. In the mid 2000's, Shure re-branded the E500 as the SE530. To my disappointment, Shure abandoned the Push-To-Hear component with the release of the SE530. However, the SE530's sound signature remained identical to the E500.
Like many longtime headphone companies, Shure Inc. began as a manufacturer of radio parts and microphones. In the late 90's, Shure entered the listening device market, specializing exclusively in earphones and personal monitoring components. As far as I am aware, Shure is the only manufacturer thus far to have started out as a maker of earphones, only to add full-size headphones to their product-line later. Usually it is the other way around.
For a long time now, I have considered the SE530's sonic character to be demonstrative of what a forward midrange presentation sounds like. Ironically, the SE530's midrange presentation may be its greatest asset to some and its most bothersome liability to others. I personally hold the SE530's sound in fairly high regard even though I feel that there are several IEMs which fare better overall.
I should mention here that Shure's newer triple driver model, the SE535, is viritually identical to the SE530. As a result, the SE530s have been discontinued. I have decided to review the two models separately since there are some very slight, yet distinct differences between them. However, if you already own the SE530, I do not feel it is worth the cost of upgrading to the SE535.
STRENGTHSSTRENGTHS
MIDS: I truly adore the SE530's midrange presentation. It's so smooth and grain-free. For a time, it was this midrange presentation which made the SE530 my favorite universal-fit IEM.
MALE VOCALS: I've found that the SE530's lush midrange enhances the sound of the male voice. Here, male vocals sound thick and come forward with great presence and depth.
COMFORT: In the mid-2000's, Shure introduced a foam ear-tip that resembled the shape of an olive. The SE530 came pre-installed with these tips already on the nozzle. This ear-tip manages to provide a good seal and is relatively comfortable. Although Shure generously included an assortment of silicone and foam ear-tips in addition, I have found that most users prefer the "olive tips."
ISOLATION: Once the ear-tip is properly sealed in the ear canal, the SE530 is able to block out quite a bit of ambient noise. It is not quite as impressive in this regard as Westone's universal-fit IEMs. The Westone models are designed to utilize Comply foam tips. Of course, Comply makes foam tips which are compatible with the SE530 (as shown in the photo above). However, I have often found that the SE530's sonic presentation is affected negatively by the Comply tips. The Comply tips seem to exaggerate the SE530's rolled-off high-end.
JAZZ MASTER: Jazz sounds sultry and smooth with the SE530, particularly the old bop records which exhibit an excess of analog hiss and record pops.
EASY TO DRIVE: As is the case with most IEMs, the SE530530 inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with an SRH1840.
FORGIVING: The SE530 is one of the most forgiving of all the headphones/earphones reviewed in this evaluation. This is most certainly a pleasant side-effect of the rolled off treble response.
STORAGE: I think Shure did an extremely good job at packaging the SE530. Much like Apple's lauded packaging displays, the SE530 was packaged in a compact yet succinct manner. Thankfully, the SE535 continues this tradition. Perhaps, the most important accessory included with the SE530/5 is the protective zippered carrying pouch. I like this case very much. I have used it to store several of my other earphones in addition to the SE530.
WEAKNESSES
TREBLE: The SE530's treble presentation is enormously rolled-off. At times, this causes the sonic presentation to sound congested and muddy. When I first heard the SE530, I was taken aback by the absence of treble. While the earphones have a very smooth sound, I cannot help but wish for more treble presence and greater extension.
LACKS DETAIL: If I attempt to listen to classical music with the SE530, I feel as though my ears are squinting to hear the upper harmonics. Simply put, the SE530 that the SE530's sonic presentation is squeezed toward the center. Perhaps, because of the absence of upper-harmonics, the sound feels slightly smeared and cluttered.
CABLE: The most distinct difference between the SE530 and SE535 is that the SE530's cable is hardwired while the SE535 features a user-detachable cable. The latter is clearly the more durable design. I know several SE530 owners (including myself) who have had the misfortune of the cable tearing at precisely where the cable connects to the earpiece. It was a terribly fragile design. Shure was wise to address this issue when designing the SE535.
ON THE FENCEON THE FENCE
TONAL BALANCE: I feel ambivalent about the SE530's tonal balance. I really do think the SE530's mid-centric tone enhances the sound of jazz music. At the same time, when it comes to classical music, the missing upper-harmonics makes the music sound as though it is submerged.
BASS: The bass response here is well-extended and fairly flat. Unfortunately however, I find that it is not as impactful as I would prefer.
FOR THE PRICE
C
The SE530 is the only headphone/earphone in this entire evaluation to have been superseded by a virtually identical replacement: the SE535. For this reason, I would only recommend purchasing the SE530 at an extremely attractive price. The SE535 is a better purchase because it addresses the cable issue discussed above. Either way, the SE530 serves as phenomenal earphone for one who loves a lush forward midrange.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Balanced Armature
- IMPEDANCE: 36 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Little to None
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary but Worth Considering
- MY PREFERRED AMP: SPL Phonitor / Ray Samuels Audio Hornet
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Male Vocals / Jazz
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: At least one known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Once Was
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: Out Of Production
- COST: $300-$500 (estimated)
In 2011, Shure discontinued the SE530, replacing it with the SE535. The two earphones are almost identical with regard to their overall sonic presentations. However, there is a very slight difference with regard to how the two models handle treble; the SE535 offers just a hint more. Yet it is not really this difference which compels me to favor the SE535. The main reason that I prefer the SE535 is due to the detachable cable design. I owned an SE530 which became unusable after the cable began to experience problems. Upon sending my faltering SE530 to Shure for repair, they replaced it with the SE535. Because of the fact that the SE535 has a detachable cable, using it is a far less worrisome experience than using the SE530. The SE535 is offered in two finishes: clear and metallic bronze. I really like the appearance of the bronze finish.
In the nature that SE535 was the direct replacement of the SE530, I should mention here that my review of the SE535 will read quite similarly to my review of the SE530 (directly above).
STRENGTHS
MIDS: I truly adore the SE535's midrange presentation. It is so smooth and grain-free. For a time, it was this midrange presentation which made the SE535 my favorite universal-fit IEM.
MALE VOCALS: I've found that the SE535's lush midrange enhances the sound of the male voice. Here, male vocals sound thick and come forward with great presence and depth.
COMFORT: In the mid-2000's, Shure introduced a foam ear-tip that resembled the shape of an olive. The SE535 comes pre-installed with these tips already on the nozzle. This ear-tip manages to provide a good seal and is fairly comfortable. While Shure generously includes a variety of silicone and foam ear-tips in addition, I have found that most users prefer the "olive tips."
ISOLATION: Once the ear-tip is properly sealed in the ear canal, the SE535 is capable of blocking out quite a bit of ambient noise. It is not quite as impressive in this regard as Westone's universal-fit IEMs. The Westone models are designed to utilize Comply foam tips. Of course, Comply makes foam tips which are compatible with the SE535. However, I do find that the SE535's sonic presentation is affected negatively by the Comply ear-tips. The Comply foam seems to exaggerate the SE535's rolled-off treble.
JAZZ MASTER: Jazz sounds sultry and smooth with the SE535, particularly the old bop records which exhibit an excess of analog hiss and record pops.
EASY TO DRIVE: As is the case with most IEMs, the SE535535 inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with a SRH1840.
FORGIVING: The SE535 is one of the most forgiving of all the headphones/earphones reviewed in this evaluation. This is most certainly a pleasant side-effect of the rolled off treble response.
STORAGE: I think Shure did an excellent job in packaging the SE535. Resembling Apple's highly-praised packaging displays, the SE535 is packaged in a compact yet succinct manner. Perhaps, the most important accessory included with the SE535 is the oval-shaped protective zippered carrying pouch, which zips up to stay closed. I like this case very much. I have used it to store several of my other earphones in addition to the SE535.
CABLE: The biggest difference between the SE530 and SE535 is that the former has a hardwired cable (susceptible to tearing) while the latter has a much more durable user-detachable cable. According to Shure, that is the most distinct difference between the SE530 and SE535.I know several SE530 owners (including myself) who have had the misfortune of the cable tearing at precisely where the cable connects to the earpiece. It was a terribly fragile design. Shure was smart to address this issue when designing the SE535.
WEAKNESSES
TREBLE: A lot of people claim that the SE535's treble response is improved over the SE530's. The manufacturer claims that the SE535's driver construction is identical to that of the SE530. Therefore, any discernible changes regarding the SE535's treble presentation must be an aftereffect of its slightly different ergonomic fit. With the SE535, I have confirmed that the treble is brought forward to a nearly imperceptible degree. I still find the SE535's treble to be significantly rolled off. At times, this causes the sonic presentation to sound congested and muddy.
LACKS DETAIL: If I attempt to listen to classical music with the SE535, I feel as though my ears are squinting to hear the upper harmonics. Simply put, the SE535 my claim here, the SE535's sonic presentation to be squeezed toward the center, meaning in this case that is lacks a bit of left/right dimension. Perhaps, because of the absence of upper-harmonics, the sound feels slightly smeared and cluttered.
ON THE FENCE
TONAL BALANCE: I have mixed feelings regarding the SE535's tonal balance. I really do think the SE535's mid-centric tone enhances the sound of jazz music. At the same time, when it comes to classical music, the absence of upper-harmonics causes the music to sound as though it is submerged.
BASS: The SE535's bass response is well-extended and fairly flat. Unfortunately however, I find that it is not as impactful as I would prefer. For those who wish to get more bass from their SE535, try using Compy foam ear-tips in place of the included Shure foam tips. However, I found that an unfortunate consequence of using these ear-tips is that the treble presence is slightly diminished.
FOR THE PRICE
C
The SE535 is a fantastic choice for fans of older recordings that wish to screen out some of the analog hiss. From a sonic perspective, the SE535 is virtually identical to the SE530. In addition, the SE530 was sonically identical to the E500. In essence, one can say that the sound signature of the SE535 has been around for many years. During this time, it has remained favored by many who prefer a forgiving sound presentation. Fortunately for everyone, Shure addressed the SE530's fragile cable problem when they designed the SE535.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Balanced Armature
- IMPEDANCE: 36 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Little to None
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary but Worth Considering
- MY PREFERRED AMP: SPL Phonitor / Ray Samuels Audio Hornet
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Male Vocals / Jazz
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Currently Is Specific To Product-Line
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: In Production
- COST: $499.99
Westone started out as a pioneer in the field of hearing care. Later they would become one of the key figures in the evolution of in-ear-monitors during the 1990's. Westone served as an OEM (original equipment manufacturer) for Shure and worked alongside Ultimate Ears in the development of the world’s first custom-fit in-ear headphone.
Introduced in 2008, the Westone 3 was the very first two-way crossover universal-fit IEM. Essentially, what this means is that there are three balanced armature drivers in the earpiece, each targeted at a different frequency region (lows, mid, highs). Other triple-driver IEMs which preceded the Westone 3 (such as the SE530 and Ultimate Ears' Triple Fi 10 Pro) featured dual drivers for lower frequencies and a single driver for the highs. When I heard the Westone 3 for the first time, I was struck by how full the sound was. In my opinion, it offers a significantly improved sound over their dual-driver model, the UM2. Shortly after acquiring the Westone 3, I began to prefer them to the SE530.
STRENGTHSSTRENGTHS
TONALITY: The Westone 3 offers a fun tonality that features an impactful mid-bass response and decent treble extension. In contrast to the SE535's bloomy midrange, the Westone 3's mids are slightly recessed.
BASS: The Westone 3 demonstrates a rather noticeable mid-bass hump that adds quite a bit of depth to bass guitar and drums. I find that its bass presentation is ideally suited for rock and metal music.
COMFORT: For me, the ergonomic design of Westone's universal-fit IEMs is the most comfortable of all universal-fit in-ears. The angle of the nozzle allows the user to achieve a more comfortable seal. In addition, Westone ships their universal-fit IEMs with Comply brand foam ear-tips. These tips are extraordinarily comfortable and easily provide the best seal of all the ear-tips that I have used.
ISOLATION: While Westone ships the Westone 3 with a generous assortment of eartips, I suggest using the longer Comply ear-tips in order to achieve the best seal. Once the foam tips are sealed in the ear, they manage to provide an extreme amount of isolation. Only custom-fitted IEMs do better in this regard.
ROCK MASTER: The Westone 3 offers a genuinely fat sound with great impact. I really enjoy listening to rock (particularly modern rock) with the Westone 3.
SUPER PORTABLE: With regard to portability, nothing even comes close to IEMs. You can fit the Westone 3 inside a small shirt pocket. Try doing that with an MDR-R10.
EASY TO DRIVE: I have found that the Westone 3 really doesn't benefit much from amplification. It sounds almost the same out of an iPod as it does out of a high-end rig.
STORAGE: When Westone began shipping the Westone 3, they supplied a round hard zippered carrying case, which resembled Shure's carrying case. However, more recently Westone has switched to a longer, more rectangular zippered carrying case. Both of the carrying cases offered are extremely effective with regard to fitting in the pocket and protecting the IEMs from damage.
WEAKNESSES
IEM'S this claim,.
NOT NEUTRAL: The Westone 3 is not a neutral-sounding earphone by any means. I would not suggest it as a choice for anyone looking to monitor a live mix. I would opt for the UM3X or Westone 4 in this scenario.
IMAGING: The Westone 3 is not particularly impressive with regard to imaging. Even though I enjoy the bass presentation, sometimes I feel as though the extra bass emphasis gets in the way of pinpointing the placement of instruments.
SIBILANT: The Westone 3 has the tendency to emphasize the sharpness of the letter "s" and other percussion instruments such as a hi-hat which fall into that same frequency region.
ON THE FENCEON THE FENCE
TRANSPARENT?: I feel as though the Westone 3's sound-signature is on the cusp of transparency, but it doesn't quite make it.
MIDS: I would prefer a slightly more forward midrange. However, the mids here are still quite natural-sounding. Overall, the midrange presentation is ideal for those who enjoy a slightly raised bass/treble EQ curve.
TREBLE: When I heard the Westone 3 for the first time, the first thing I thought was that its treble presentation was a drastic improvement over the SE530's. It is certainly more forward. However, I still wish at times that the treble was more smoothly integrated with the midrange.
CABLE: Westone's braided cable design is the best I have seen in the in-ear market. It is rugged, light and avoids tangling. I only wish the Westone 3's cable was detachable from the earpiece. Westone would later offer this as an optional feature with their UM-series models and the Westone 4.
FOR THE PRICEFOR THE PRICE
B-
Upon its debut, the Westone 3 was probably the best sounding universal-fit IEM I had ever heard. Today it has been surpassed by a few models - namely by Westone themselves and Audéo. I still prefer the sound of the Westone 3 to any of Sony's XBA series IEMs. For rock fans, I think the Westone 3 may still be the one to own.
QUICK CHECKQUICK CHECK
- DESIGN: In-Ear
- DRIVERS: Balanced Armature
- IMPEDANCE: 30 Ohms
- ISOLATION: Extreme
- AMPLIFICATION: Not Necessary but Worth Considering
- MY PREFERRED AMP: n/a (iPod without amp)
- SOUNDS BEST WITH: Rock
- CABLES USED: Stock
- REVISIONS KNOWN: None known to me
- FLAGSHIP STATUS: Once Was
- PRODUCTION STATUS AS OF 2012: In Production
- COST: $349
Edited by DavidMahler - 4/14/13 at 11:01am |
- , L1H 7K4, Canada.
Abstract
There.
1. Introduction
Serious games are designed to have an impact on the target audience, which is beyond the pure entertainment aspect [1, 2]. One of the most important application domains is in the field of education given the acknowledged potential of serious games to meet the current need for educational enhancement [3, 4]. 2 presents a literature review regarding the educational effectiveness of serious games. Section 3 discusses how to assess a serious game’s learning impact. Section 4 reviews methods for competence and skill assessment, and Section 5 focuses on in-process assessment, which appears to be well suited for games. Concluding remarks and suggested directions for future research are given in Section 6.
2. General Context
Despite the a widespread consensus about the educational potential of video games, there is a shortage of studies that have methodically examined (assessed) learning via gameplay whether considering “entertainment” games or serious games, prompting some to challenge the usefulness of game-based learning (e.g., [5, 6]).
A number of studies have questioned the effectiveness of game-based learning (e.g., [7–9]). However, many of those reviews were conducted several years ago, and even in the last 10 years, there has been unprecedented development within the videogame field in general and educational games in particular. In contrast, more recently, Blunt [10] gathered evidence from three studies that had unquestionably achieved significantly better test results with students that had learned using games, compared to control groups who received typical instruction.
Furthermore, one cannot ignore the fact that simulations and serious games are a promising means for safely and cost-effectively acquiring skills and attitudes which are hard to get by rote learning [1] and that learning via gameplay may be longer lasting [11]. In addition, there are many examples of studies that have demonstrated that properly designed “learning games”—some examples are provided hereinafter—do produce learning, while engaging players [12].
One of the foundational reviews of the effectiveness of gaming was performed by Livingston et al. [13], when they evaluated seven years of research and over 150 studies to examine the effectiveness of gaming. Their results were later on mirrored by Chin et al. [14], and they concluded that “simulation games” are able to teach factual information although they are not necessarily more effective than other methods of instruction [13, 14]. However, it was observed that students preferred games and simulations over other classroom activities and participation in such “gamed simulations” can lead to changes in their the attitudes including attitudes toward education, career, marriage, and children although these effects could be short lived [13, 14].
More recently, Connolly et al. [15] have made an extensive literature study on computer games and serious games, identifying 129 papers reporting empirical evidence about the impacts and outcomes of games with respect to a variety of learning goals, including a critique of those cases where the research methods were not adequate. The findings revealed, however, that playing computer games is linked to a range of perceptual, cognitive, behavioural, affective, and motivational impacts and outcomes. The most frequently occurring outcomes and impacts were knowledge acquisition/content understanding and affective and motivational outcomes. Despite the diffused perception that games might be especially useful in promoting higher-order thinking and soft and social skills, the literature review provides limited evidence for this, also given the lack of adequate measurement tools for such skills. [11]. An experiment with Re-Mission (a video game developed for adolescents and young adults with cancer) showed that the video-game intervention significantly improved treatment adherence and indicators of cancer-related self-efficacy and knowledge in adolescents and young adults who were undergoing cancer therapy [16]. More recently, Cole et al. [17] showed that activation of brain circuits involved in positive motivation during Re-Mission gameplay appears to be a key ingredient in influencing positive health behavior. Regarding behavioural change, the serious game The Matrix, developed to enhance self-esteem, was subject to rigorous scientific evaluation and was shown to increase self-esteem through classical conditioning [18].
Bellotti et al. [19] discuss the results of a lab user test aimed at verifying knowledge acquisition through minigames dedicated to cultural heritage. The implemented minigames were particularly suited for supporting image studying, which can be explained by the visual nature of games. Compared to text reading, the games seem to more strongly force the player to focus on problems, which favors knowledge acquisition and retention.
The aforementioned results show that serious games can be an effective tool to complement the educational instruments available to teachers, in particular for spurring user motivation [20] and for achieving learning goals at the lower levels in the Bloom’s taxonomy [15]. The next section is dedicated to analyzing methods for assessing a serious game’s learning impact.
3. Assessing a Serious Game’s Effectiveness
Learning with serious games remains a goal-directed process aimed at clearly defined and measurable achievements and, therefore, must implement assessments to provide an indication of the learning progress and outcomes to both the learner and instructor [21] or as Michael and Chen [22] state “Serious games like every other tool of education must be able to show that the necessary learning has occurred.” For serious games to be considered a viable educational tool, they must provide some means of testing and progress tracking and the testing must be recognizable within the context of the education or training they are attempting to impart.
Assessment describes the process of using data to demonstrate that stated learning goals and objectives are actually being met [14]. Assessment is a complement to purpose, and it is commonly employed by learning institutions, regardless the teaching methods used, whether or not their students actually learn [7]. However, learning is a complex construct making it difficult to measure, and determining whether a simulation or serious game is effective at achieving the intended learning goals is a complex, time consuming, expensive, and difficult process [8, 23]. Part of this difficulty stems from the open-ended nature inherent in video games making it difficult to collect data [14]. In other words, how do you show that students are learning what they should learn and how do you know what you are measuring is what you think you are measuring? [21].
Generally speaking, assessment can be described as either (i) summative whereby it is conducted at the end of a learning process and tests the overall achievements, and (ii) formative whereby it is implemented and present throughout the entire learning process and continuously monitors progress and failures [24]. With respect to serious games, it has been suggested that formative assessment is particularly useful and should be used particularly given that such assessments can be incorporated into the serious game becoming part of the experience [6], in particular through appropriate user feedback.
Considering the specific serious game domain, Michael and Chen [22] describe three primary types of assessment: (i) completion assessment, (ii) in-process assessment, and (iii) teacher assessment. The first two correspond to summative and formative assessments, respectively. Completion assessment is concerned with whether the player successfully completes the game. In a traditional teaching environment, this is equivalent to asking, “Did the student get the right answer?” and a simple criterion such as this could be the first indicator that the student sufficiently understands the subject taught albeit there are many problems using this measure alone. For instance, players could cheat and it is hard to determine whether the player actually learned the material or learned to complete the game [22]. Moreover, the game level upgrade barriers and score (as, in general, all the mechanics) must be designed so as to guarantee a proper balance between entertainment, motivation, and learning [25]. In-process assessment (we deal with it in detail in Section 5) examines how, when, and why a player made their choices and can be analogous to observations of the student by the educator as the student performs the task or takes the test in a traditional teaching environment. Teacher assessment focuses on the instructor’s observations and judgments of the student “in action” (while they are playing the game) and typically aims at evaluating those factors that the functionalities/logic of the game are not able to capture.
Although various methods and techniques have been used to assess learning in serious games [26] and simulations in general, summative assessment is commonly accomplished with the use of pre- and posttesting, a common approach in educational research [27]. The pre- and posttest design is one of the most widely used experimental designs and is particularly popular in educational studies that aim to measure changes in educational outcomes after modifications to the learning process such as testing the effect of a new teaching method [28]. Within this design, participants are randomly allocated to either a “treatment” group (playing the serious game) or a “control” group (relying on other instructional techniques). Upon completion of the experiment, both groups complete a posttest, and significant differences across the test scores are attributed to the “treatment” (the serious game) [27]. The main problem with the pre- and posttest experimental design is that it is impossible to determine whether the act of pretesting has influenced any of the results. Another problem relates to the fact that it is almost impossible to completely isolate all of the participants (e.g., if two groups of child participants attend the same school, they will probably interact outside of lessons potentially influencing the results while if the child participants are taken from different schools to prevent this, then randomization is not possible) [29]. [6]. This method was used by Allen et al. [30] in the form of questionnaires before and after playing their game, Infiniteams Island game (TPLD). The goal of the game was for the players to learn about their team working abilities, and they were able to show through the questionnaires of 240 students that the players gained self-awareness about their skills through the game. ICURA is another example in which pre- and posttesting assessment was used to evaluate the knowledge learned through the game. Specifically, a role-playing game was used whereby students/players learned about Japanese culture in a role playing format. After playing the game, students completed a test to provide confirmation that they did indeed learn the intended material. The information learned about Japanese culture is more factual than for TPLD, so the measure of the person’s performance through a test is a more objective assessment of) [27].
3.1. Indirect Measures of Learning
In addition to direct measures of learning achievable through targeted assessment, there are also other factors that can indirectly lead to learning. More specifically, serious games captivate and engage players/learners for a specific purpose such as to develop new knowledge or skills [31], and with respect to students, strong engagement has been associated with academic achievement [6], and thus the level of engagement may also be potentially used as an indicator to the learning a serious game is capable of imparting.
Various tools have been developed to provide a measure of engagement including the Game Engagement Questionnaire [32] and the Game Experience Questionnaire [33]. [34]. Incorporating the concept of flow in computer games as a model for evaluating player enjoyment has been a focus of interesting studies [35, 36] and forms the basis of EGameFlow, a scale that was specifically developed to measure a learner’s enjoyment of e-learning games [37]. EGameFlow is a questionnaire that contains 42 items allocated into eight dimensions: (i) concentration, (ii) goal clarity, (iii) feedback, (iv) challenge, (v) control, (vi) immersion, (vii) social interaction, and (viii) knowledge improvement.
In addition to subjective assessment, a growing area of assessment includes a branch of neuroscience that is investigating the correlation between user psychological states and the value of physiological signals. Several studies have shown that these measures can provide an indication of player engagement (see [38–41]) and flow [42]. Common physiological measures include the following [41, 43].(i)Facial electromyography (EMG) for measuring muscle activity through the detecting of electrical impulses generated by the muscles of the face when they contract. Such muscle contractions can provide an indication of emotional state and mood and can assess positive and negative emotional valence [40].(ii)Cardiovascular measures such as the interbeat interval (the time between heart beats) and heart rate. Cardiac activity has been interpreted as an index to valence, arousal, and attention, cognitive effort, stress, and orientation reflex while viewing various media [40]. Although cardiac measures have been successfully used in a number of game studies, interpreting as described by Kivikangas et al. [40], interpreting the relevance of the resulting measurements within a game context is difficult and challenging.(iii)Galvanic skin response (GSR), for measuring the electrical conductance of the skin, which varies with its moisture (sweat) level and since the sweat glands are controlled by the sympathetic nervous system skin can provide an indication of psychological or physiological(emotional) arousal.(iv [44] describe a study where the EEG of players plays a video game that involved them steering a monkey into a goal while collecting bananas for extra points while avoiding falling off the edge of the game board. They observed that each of the three events evoked differential EEG oscillatory changes leading the authors to suggest that EEG is a valuable tool when examining psychological responses to video game events. That being said, EEG is not widely used due of its complex analysis procedure [41].
Although there have been a large number of studies investigating the use of physiological responses within a game setting, plenty of work remains in providing a meaningful interpretation of the resulting data to facilitate design decisions for developers of serious games and e-learning application [43]. That being said, the area of physiological measurement within a game context is a promising field, and although a complete overview of the field is not provided here, excellent reviews are provided by Kivikangas et al. [40] and Nacke [41].
3.2. Audio/Visual Technologies to Support Assessment [23, 25, 45].
3.3. Assessing Entertainment
As mentioned in Section 1, a serious game has a twofold aim of entertainment and education, both of which must be considered in the assessment.
With respect to measuring fun and enjoyment, there are two possible directions: (i) quantitative approaches, and (ii) qualitative approaches [46]. Qualitative approaches for modeling player enjoyment (e.g., the “entertainment” component) rely primarily on psychological observation, where a comprehensive review of the literature leads to the identification of two major lines: Malone’s principles of intrinsic qualitative factors for engaging gameplay [47]—namely, challenge, curiosity, and fantasy—and the theory of flow, based on Csikszentmihalyi’s foundational concepts [34]. Incorporating flow in computer games as a model for evaluating player enjoyment has been proposed and investigated in significant subsequent studies [35, 36].
In contrast, quantitative approaches attempt to formulate entertainment using mathematical models, which yield reliable numerical values for fun, entertainment, or excitement. However, such approaches are usually limited in their scope. For instance, Iida et al. [48] focus on variants of chess games, while Yannakakis and Hallam [46] focus on the player-opponent interaction, which they assume to be the most important entertainment feature in a computer game.
Therefore, there are different dimensions on which the player’s experiences can be measured. A recent study has investigated the definition of these dimensions based on the actual players’ experience [49]. That work exploited the Repertory Grid Technique (RGT) methodology [50], which includes qualitative and quantitative aspects. Within those studies, players were asked to use their own criteria in describing similarities and differences among video games. Analyzing the players’ personal constructs, 23 major dimensions for game assessment were identified, among which the most relevant were (i) ability demand, (ii) dynamism, (iii) style, (iv) engagement, (v) emotional affect, and (vi) likelihood.
4. Techniques and Tools for Student Performance Assessment [51]. Web-based assessments are useful because they decrease class time used for assessment and because multimedia can be integrated into the testing procedure. However, the deployment of such tools requires careful preparation, and the administrator/educator may lose control of the environment in which the test is taken.
Flynn et al. [52] recommend that pedagogic consideration should be given to the choice, variety, and level of difficulty of e-Assessments offered to students. Hewson [53] provides preliminary support for the validity of online assessment methods. Guzmán et al. [54] conducted empirical studies in a university setting demonstrating reliability for student knowledge diagnosis of a set of tools for constructing and administering adaptive tests via the Internet. In general, most of these tools are answering the growing needs for larger-scale education management. However, this approach also raises serious concerns about the quality of the outcomes.
Table 1 summarizes some tools for e-Assessment, which we describe hereinafter. [55]. The system compiles a test based on specified entered characteristics as determined by teachers so that students’ learning outcomes can be maximized and students can better understand their progress [56, 57]. e-asTTle allows instructors to create tests that are aligned to the teacher’s and the classroom’s requirements. It allows measuring student progress over time and provides rich interpretations and specific feedback that relate to student performance. e-asTTle presents the results in visual ways making it easier for teachers to discuss performance. [58] and has been shown to be a successful learning and assessment tool [59, 60].
Assess By Computer (ABC) is also designed for flexible computer-based assessment using a variety of question formats [61]. It allows the administrator to design a test via an interactive user interface and then have the student take the test on a stand-alone computer or within a web browser. ABC has been designed to deliver and stimulate feedback through the mechanisms of formative assessment in a way that encourages self-regulated learning. The designers of ABC promote it as improving the appropriateness, effectiveness, and consistency of assessments [62].
Short Answer Marking Engine (SAME) is a software system that can automatically mark short answers in a free text form [63]. Short answers are responses to questions in the test takers’ own words and therefore better reflect how well they understand the material since they have to provide their own response instead of choosing the most plausible of the alternatives, as with multiple choice questions [64]. Noorbehbahani and Kardan [65] have modified the BLEU algorithm so that it is suitable for assessing free text answers. To perform an assessment, it is necessary to establish a repository of reference answers written by course instructors or related experts. The system calculates a similarity score with respect to several reference answers for each question. As a commercial product, Intelligent Assessment Technologies provide technology to deploy online tests, assessments, and examinations. The technological suite also includes a module for automatically assessing short answers written in natural language.
A classroom response system (CRS) allows two-way communication between an instructor and their students using the instructor’s computer and students’ input devices [66]. CRS has been increasingly accepted in educational environments from K12 to higher education and also in informal learning environments [67]. Using CRS, the instructor poses questions and polls students’ answers during the class enabling real-time two-way communications to occur. The system is also used to take class attendance, pace the lecture, provide formative and formal assessment, to enhance peer instruction, allow for just-in-time-teaching, and increase class interactivity [68]. Real-time interaction between students and instructors results in students paying greater attention and provides instructors with instant feedback on the students understanding of the tested subjects. Commercially available systems include the CPS Student Response Systems from e-Instruction, SMART Response interactive response systems from SMART Technologies, i>clicker, and 2Know! from Renaissance Learning, as well as the Audience Response System from Qwizdom, and Beyond Question from Smartroom Learning Solutions. [69]. Specifically, it has a well-documented format for storing quiz and test items, allowing a wide range of systems to call on one bank of items, and reports results in a consistent format. It is marketed as a way for creating a large bank of questions and answers that will be able to be used with different systems, now and in the future, and a method for information to be easily shared within and across institutions [70]. Applications can be created using XML (extensible markup language) or higher level development tools including virtual learning environments (e.g., Blackboard, JLE ESSI, and Oracle iLearning), commercial assessment tools (e.g., Can Studios, Calypso from Experient e-Learning Technologies, e-Test 3 from RIVA Technologies Inc, QuestionMark Perception, and QuizAuthor by Niall Barr), and R&D assessment tools (e.g., Ultimate Assessment Engine at Strathclyde University and E3AN). [71]. They sell their services to companies to test potential recruit’s software skills and assess current employees. International Knowledge Measurement (IKM) is another web-based service that produces an objective and comprehensive profile of knowledge and skill of candidates and employees [72]. Both these services and others (Kenexa Prove It!, eSkill Corporation, etc.) have arisen in response to the desire to efficiently find employees that have desired skills for specific jobs. These methods could be adapted and used for testing before, inside, and after a serious game.
5. In-Game Assessment
Assessment of learning and training requires a systematic approach to determine a person’s achievements and areas of difficulty. Standardized assessment methods often take less time and are easier to administer, and their results are readily interpretable [73]. However, there are limitations to such approaches including ineffective measurement of complex problem solving, communication, and reasoning skills [74, 75]. There is also a concern regarding whether the practice of “teaching to the test” has the potential to decrease a student’s interest in learning and life-long learning [76, 77]. Furthermore, standardized tests lack the flexibility necessary to adjust or modify materials for certain groups, such as very high- or low-performing groups, and therefore may lead to loss of sensitivity for certain groups [77]. Although some standardized tests have added sections that move away from the concerning “fill-in the bubble approach”, this decreases the efficiency of standardized tests.
Recent studies have explored how play-based assessment can provide more detailed and reliable assessment and emerging interests reflect the needs for an alternative or supplemental assessment tool to overcome limitations in the standardized approach [78, 79]. Play-based, or in-game, assessment can provide more detailed and reliable information, and the emerging interest in this field reflects the need for alternative and/or supplemental assessment tools to overcome limitations in the standard approaches [78, 79]. Traditionally, play-based assessment refers to analyzing how a person plays in order to assess their cognitive development, but here we focus on how play with supporting technology can be used as a vehicle to assess cognitive skills, or competences involved in the game, but not to assess the play itself. In particular, digital games have the advantage in this type of assessment that they can easily keep track of every move and decision a player makes [22].
As pointed out by Becker and Parker [27], serious games (and games in general) can and generally do contain in-game tests of effectiveness. More specifically, as players progress through the game, they accumulate points and experience, which enables facing new topics and higher difficulties in the next stages and levels. This is a very ecological and effective approach, since it integrates pedagogy and games, thus allowing provision of immediate feedback to the player and implementing user adaptivity [80, 81].
Incorporating in-game assessments takes us away from the predominant, classic form of assessment comprised of questionnaires, questions and answers, and so forth that usually interrupts and negatively affects the learning process [21] and is not very suited to verify knowledge transfer. Designing proper in-game assessment is a challenging and time-consuming activity. However, it should be a distinctive feature of any well-designed serious game, where all the mechanics (e.g., score, levels, leaderboards, bonuses, performance indicators, etc.) should be consistent with and inspired by the set pedagogical targets. The work of [21] provides a detailed survey and analysis of serious games, their components, and the related design techniques.
Still, “many educational games do not properly translate knowledge, facts, and lessons into the language of games. This results in games that are often neither engaging nor educational” [82]. The authors suggest that design should combine “the fantasy elements and game play conventions of the real-time strategy (RTS) genre with numbers, resources and situations based on research about a real-world topic”, such as energy and agriculture. In this way, the player should be able to learn simply by trying to overcome the game’s challenges.
In addition, in-game assessment provides the opportunity to take advantage of the medium itself and employ alternative, less intrusive, and less obvious forms of assessment which could (and should) become a game element itself [21]. Integrating the assessment such that the player is unaware of it forms the basis of what Shute et al. [6] describe as stealth assessment. In this way, the player can concentrate solely on the game [83]. This type of assessment incorporates the assessment in to the process of the game by designing it so that knowledge from previous sections will be necessary to move on in the game and the knowledge is not directly measured using a quiz or questionnaire [84]. [84]. In the game, the player must perform tasks such as training macrophages to identify allies versus enemies, identify if a blood vessel is infected, and countering increasingly more difficult attacks from bacteria [84].
CancerSpace is a game format that incorporates aspects of e-learning, adult-learning theory, and behaviorism theory in order to support learning, promote knowledge retention, and encourage behavior change [85]. CancerSpace’s design encourages self-directed learning by presenting the players with real-world situations about which they must make decisions similar to those they would make in clinics. The targeted users are professionals working in community health centers. The gameplay is based on role-playing: the user has to help the clinical staff evaluate the clinical literature, integrate the evidence into their clinical decision-making, plan changes to cancer-screening delivery, and accrue points correlating to increased cancer-screening rates. The user takes decisions and observes whether the chosen course of action improves the cancer screening rates, which is the main indicator of performance. The game includes a small number of patient-provider interactions in which the decider must talk with a patient reluctant to get screened. The player’s conversation choices are evaluated in preprogrammed decision trees, leading to success (the patient decides to get screened) or failure. Within this educational context, chance is considered an important entertainment and variability feature, which is implemented through wildcard events. To stimulate gameplay, CancerSpace has adapted an award system that motivates players to increase screening rates. The CancerSpace scenarios in which the decider guides the virtual clinical staff are based on research-tested interventions and best practices. Users receive points on the basis of their performance. At each game’s conclusion, a summary screen indicates which decisions the player implemented and their effect on the clinic’s screening rate.
In a Living World ad hoc designed for cultural training in Afghanistan [86], the main objective for a player is to successfully interpret the environment and achieve the desired attitude towards him by Nonplayer Characters (NPCs) that represent the local population. The entire living-world game space is fueled by the knowledge-engineering process that translates the essential elements of the culture into programmable behaviors and artifacts. For instance, “In Afghan culture, older men have great influence over younger men, women, and children through local traditions and Islamic law” or “Ideologically, the guiding principles of Afghan culture are a sense of familial and tribal honor, gender segregation, and indirect communication”. All the NPCs in the game are modeled accordingly. Winning in the game “simply” requires successfully navigating cultural moves in the game space, thus achieving a good overall attitude of the village toward the player. Another key aspect is seriousness about assessment. The underlying 3D Asymmetric Domain Analysis and Training (3D ADAT) model, an ad hoc developed recursive platform for the realization and visualization of dynamic sociocultural models, specifically supports analysis of the cultural behavior exhibited by the player in the game. Conversations and interactions between the NPCs and the player are recorded through a text log to provide game performance analysis. The assessment tool lists all the possible choices for player behavior and conversation, highlighting both the player’s choice and the most culturally appropriate response. The tool provides scores on the opinion of the player at the NPC, faction, and village level. Additional comments can be provided that highlight the player’s weaknesses, explaining why a particular response is most appropriate. Feedback is thus provided to improve future performance.
Business games, also known as business simulations, are another well-established category of serious games that are being used for many decades (originally in nondigital form—thus, they were not called serious games) in business schools [87, 88]. In SimVenture, the target of the player is to manage a company, dealing with four major types of issues: production, organization, sales and market, and finance. The player has a number of choices to perform in these domains. Their performance is expressed in terms of a parameter called “company value.” But, as in the real world, the player has to maintain a number of factors, such as profit and loss, a balance sheet, and cash flow. Several other performance figures are also reported in the performance report. Each game session has a simulated time limit, expressed in months. The goal of the game—it can be fixed by the teacher or by the players themselves—can be the maximization of the profit or of cash flow (or any other parameter). Of course, players have to avoid bankruptcy within their time limit. Several predefined scenarios are available and can be loaded by players and classes, so that they can face some common critical cases (e.g., start up a company, managing growth, facing cashflow issues, etc.) at various levels of difficulty. Messages are displayed to the player, at the end of each month’s simulation, highlighting the major issues encountered and to be faced. When defining a new game session, there is the possibility of introducing chance events. In the absence of chance events, the game session is deterministic, thus allowing a straightforward comparison of the performance of various players. SimVenture also includes complementary material for teachers and learners..
6. Conclusions and Directions for Future Research
For serious games to be considered a viable educational tool, they must provide some means of testing and progress-tracking and the testing must be recognizable within the context of the education or training they are attempting to impart [22]. Various methods and techniques have been used to assess effectiveness of serious games, and various comprehensive reviews have been conducted to examine the overall validity of game-based learning. Results of these reviews seem to suggest that game-based learning is effective for motivating and for achieving learning goals at the lower levels in Bloom’s taxonomy [15]., “[Serious games] will not grow as an industry unless the learning experience is definable, quantifiable and measurable. Assessment is the future of serious games” [89]. This requires still a lot of research work. We see in particular two major research directions: characterization of the player’s activity and better integration of assessment in games.
Characterization of the player’s activities involves both task characterization (e.g., in terms of content, difficulty level, type of supported learning style, etc.) and user profiling [90]. It is necessary to identify the dimensions, relevant to learning, along which the users and the tasks are modeled. Then, the matching rules and modalities between users and tasks should be defined. The user profile should be portable across different games and even applications, particularly in the education field. Here, it is particularly important to consider also misconceptions and mistakes. In user profiling, analysis of neurophysiological signals is particularly promising, as it allows a continuous, in-depth, and quantitative monitoring of the user activity and state. Finally, proper user profiling is a key to enable adaptability and personalization. [20]. A strictly related topic concerns provision of feedback, which is a consequence of assessment and should be properly integrated in the game, in order not to distract the player while favoring performance enhancement.
Conflict of Interests
The authors hereby declare that they have no conflict of interests with the companies/commercial products cited in this paper.
Acknowledgments Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council of Canada (SSHRC) in support of the IMMERSE project that B. Kapralos is part of is gratefully acknowledged.
References
- J. P. Gee, What Video Games Have to Teach Us about Learning and Literacy, Palgrave MacMillan, New York, NY, USA, 2007.
-
- F. De Grove, P. Mechant, and J. Van Looy, “Uncharted waters? Exploring experts' opinions on the opportunities and limitations of serious games for foreign language learning,” in Proceedings of the 3rd International Conference on Fun and Games, pp. 107–115, Leuven, Belgium, September 2010. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- R. van Eck, “Digital game-based learning: it's not just the digital natives who are restless,” EDUCAUSE Review, vol. 41, no. 2, pp. 16–30, 2006.
- J. Cannon-Bowers, “The state of gaming and simulation,” in Proceedings of the Training Conference and Expo, Orlando, Fla, USA, March 2006.
-., pp. 295–321, Routledge, Taylor and Francis, Mahwah, NJ, USA, 2009.
- J. Gosen and J. Washbush, “A review of scholarship on assessing experiential learning effectiveness,” Simulation & Gaming, vol. 35, no. 2, pp. 270–293, 2004. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- R. T. Hays, “The effectiveness of instructional games: a literature review and discussion,” Tech. Rep. 2005-004, Naval Air Warfare Center, Training Systems Division, 2005.
- A. A. Kulik, “School mathematics and science programs benefit from instructional technology,” United States National Science Foundation (NSF), National Center for Science and Engineering Statistics (NCSES), InfroBrief NSF-03-301, November 2002,.
- R. Blunt, “Do serious games work? Results from three studies,” eLearn Magazine, vol. 2009, no. 12, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar
- B. Bergeron, Developing Serious Games, Thomson Delmar Learning, Hingham, Mass, USA, 2006.
- M. Prensky, Don't Bother Me Mom—I'm Learning!, Paragon House, 2006.
- S. Livingston, G. Fennessey, J. Coleman, K. Edwards, and S. Kidder, “The Hopkins games program: final report on seven years of research,” Report No. 155, Johns Hopkins University, Center for Social Organization of Schools, Baltimore, Md, USA, 1973.
- J. Chin, R. Dukes, and W. Gamson, “Assessment in simulation and gaming: a review of the last 40 years,” Simulation & Gaming, vol. 40, no. 4, pp. 553–568, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- T. M. Connolly, E. A. Boyle, E. MacArthur, T. Hainey, and J. M. Boyle, “A systematic literature review of the empirical evidence on computer games and serious games,” Computers and Education, vol. 59, no. 2, pp. 661–686, 2012.
- P. M. Kato, S. W. Cole, A. S. Bradlyn, and B. H. Pollock, “A video game improves behavioral outcomes in adolescents and young adults with cancer: a randomized trial,” Pediatrics, vol. 122, no. 2, pp. e305–e317, 2008. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- S. W. Cole, D. J. Yoo, and B. Knutson, “Interactivity and reward-related neural activation during a serious videogame,” PLoS ONE, vol. 7, no. 3, Article ID e33909, 2012. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar
- S. D. Dandeneau and M. W. Baldwin, “The inhibition of socially rejecting information among people with high versus low self-esteem: the role of attentional bias and the effects of bias reduction training,” Journal of Social and Clinical Psychology, vol. 23, no. 4, pp. 584–602, 2004. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- F. Bellotti, R. Berta, A. De Gloria, A. D'Ursi, and V. Fiore, “A serious game model for cultural heritage,” Journal on Computing and Cultural Heritage, vol. 5, no. 4, pp. 1–27, 2012.
- F. Bellotti, R. Berta, and A. De Gloria, “Designing effective serious games: opportunities and challenges for research,” International Journal of Emerging Technologies in Learning, vol. 5, pp. 22–35, 2010.
- G. Bente and J. Breuer, “Making the implicit explicit: embedded measurement in serious games,” in Serious Games: Mechanisms and Effects, U. Ritterfield, M. J. Cody, and P. Vorderer, Eds., pp. 322–343, Routledge, New York, NY, USA, 2009.
- D. Michael and S. Chen, “Proof of learning: assessment in serious games,” October 2005,.
- J. Enfield, R. D. Myers, M. Lara, and T. W. Frick, “Innovation diffusion: assessment of strategies within the diffusion simulation game,” Simulation & Gaming, vol. 43, no. 2, pp. 188–214, 2012. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar
- C. Boston, “The concept of formative assessment,” Practical Assessment, Research & Evaluation, vol. 8, no. 9, 2002.
- P. Moreno-Ger, D. Burgos, and J. Torrente, “Digital games in eLearning environments: current uses and emerging trends,” Simulation & Gaming, vol. 40, no. 5, pp. 669–687, 2009.
- C. Sebastian, A. Anantachai, J. H. Byun, and J. Lenox, “Assessing what players learned in serious games: in-situ data collection, information trails, and quantitative analysis,” in Proceedings of the 10th International Conference on Computer Games: AI, Animation, Mobile, Educational and Serious Games, pp. 10–19, 2007.
- K. Becker and J. R. Parker, The Guide to Computer Simulations and Games, John Wiley & Sons, Indianapolis, Ind, USA, 2011.
- P. Dugard and J. Todman, “Analysis of pre-test-post-test control group designs in educational research,” Educational Psychology, vol. 15, no. 2, pp. 181–198, 1995.
- National Center for Technology Innovation (NCTI), “Experimental Study Design,” 2012,.
- L. Allen, M. Seeney, L. Boyle, and F. Hancock, “The implementation of team based assessment in serious games,” in Proceedings of the 1st Conference in Games and Virtual Worlds for Serious Applications (VS-GAMES '09), pp. 28–35, Coventry, UK, March 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- K. Corti, Game-Based Learning: A Serious Business Application, PIXELearning, Coventry, UK, 2006.
- J. H. Brockmyer, C. M. Fox, K. A. Curtiss, E. McBroom, K. M. Burkhart, and J. N. Pidruzny, “The development of the Game Engagement Questionnaire: a measure of engagement in video game-playing,” Journal of Experimental Social Psychology, vol. 45, no. 4, pp. 624–634, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- W. A. IJsselsteijn, W. van de Hoogen, C. Klimmt et al., “Measuring the experience of digital game enjoyment,” in Proceedings of Measuring Behavior, pp. 88–89, Maastricht, The Netherlands, August 2008.
- M. Csikszentmihalyi, Flow: The Psychology of Optimal Experience, Harper & Row, New York, NY, USA, 1990.
- B. Cowley, D. Charles, M. Black, and R. Hickey, “Toward an understanding of flow in video games,” Computers in Entertainment, vol. 6, no. 2, pp. 1–28, 2008. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- P. Sweetser and P. Wyeth, “GameFlow: a model for evaluating player enjoyment in games,” ACM Computers in Entertainment, vol. 3, no. 3, pp. 1–24, 2005.
- F. L. Fu, R. C. Su, and S. C. Yu, “EGameFlow: a scale to measure learners' enjoyment of e-learning games,” Computers and Education, vol. 52, no. 1, pp. 101–112, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- S. H. Janicke and A. Ellis, “Psychological and physiological differences between the 3D and 2D gaming experience,” in Proceedings of the 3D Entertainment Summit, Hollywood, Calif, USA, September, 2011.
- H. F. Jelinek, K. August, H. Imam, A. H. Khandoker, A. Koenig, and R. Riener, “Heart rate asymmetry and emotional response to robot assist task challenges in stroke patients,” in Proceedings of the Computing in Cardiology Conference, Hangzhou, China, September 2011.
- J. M. Kivikangas, G. Chanel, B. Cowley et al., “A review of the use of psychophysiological methods in game research,” Journal of Gaming & Virtual Worlds, vol. 3, no. 3, pp. 181–199, 2011.
- L. E. Nacke, Affective ludology: scientific measurement of user experience in interactive entertainment [Ph.D. thesis], Blekinge Institute of Technology, Karlskrona, Sweden, 2009.
- A. Plotnikov, N. Stakheika, A. De Gloria et al., “Exploiting real-time EEG analysis for assessing flow in games,” in Workshop: “Game Based Learning for 21st Century Transferable Skills”, at iCalt 2012, Rome, Italy, June 2012.
- L. E. Nacke, “Physiological game interaction and psychophysiological evaluation in research and industry,” Gamasutra Article, June 2011,.
- M. Salminen and N. Ravaja, “Oscillatory brain responses evoked by video game events: the case of super monkey ball 2,” Cyberpsychology & Behavior, vol. 10, no. 3, pp. 330–338, 2007. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- C. Loh, “Designing online games assessment as information trails,” in Games and Simulations in Online Learning: Research and Development Frameworks, D. Gibson, C. Aldrich, and M. Prensky, Eds., pp. 323–348, Information Science Publishing, Hershey, Pa, USA, 2007.
- G. N. Yannakakis and J. Hallam, “Evolving opponents for interesting interactive computer games,” in Proceedings of the International Conference on Computer Games: Artificial Intelligence, Design and Education, 2004.
- T. W. Malone, “Toward a theory of intrinsically motivating instruction,” Cognitive Science, vol. 5, no. 4, pp. 333–369, 1981. View at Scopus
- H. Iida, N. Takeshita, and J. Yoshimura, “A metric for entertainment of boardgames: its implication for evolution of chess variants,” in Proceeding of: Entertainment Computing: Technologies and Applications, IFIP First International Workshop on Entertainment Computing (IWEC '02), R. Nakatsu and J. Hoshino, Eds., pp. 65–72, Kluwer Academic, Boston, Mass, USA, 2003.
- F. Bellotti, R. Berta, A. De Gloria, and L. Primavera, “Enhancing the educational value of video games,” Computers in Entertainment, vol. 7, no. 2, pp. 23–41, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- M. Hassenzahl and R. Wessler, “Capturing design space from a user perspective: the repertory grid technique revisited,” International Journal of Human-Computer Interaction, vol. 12, no. 3-4, pp. 441–459, 2000. View at Scopus
- N. Zoanetti, “Software for online testing and quizzes,” 2011,.
- A. Flynn, F. Concannon, and M. Campbell, “An evaluation of undergraduate students' online assessment performances,” Advanced Technology for Learning, vol. 3, no. 1, pp. 15–51, 2006.
- C. Hewson, “Can online course-based assessment methods be fair and equitable? Relationships between students' preferences and performance within online and offline assessments,” Journal of Computer Assisted Learning, vol. 28, no. 5, pp. 488–498, 2001. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar
- E. Guzmán, R. Conejo, and J. L. Pérez-de-la-Cruz, “Improving student performance using self-assessment tests,” IEEE Intelligent Systems, vol. 22, no. 4, pp. 46–52, 2007. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- J. Hattie and D. Masters, “asTTle—Assessment Tools for Teaching and Learning,” HEFCE JISC, 2006,.
- J. Hattie, G. Brown, P. Keegan et al., “Validation evidence of asTTle reading assessment results: norms and criteria,” Asttle Tech. Rep. 22, University of Auckland/Ministry of Education, November 2003.
- J. Hattie, “Large-scale assessment of student competencies,” in Symposium: Working in Today's World of Testing and Measurement: Required Knowledge and Skills (Joint ITC/CPTA Symposium); the 26th International Congress of Applied Psychology, Athens, Greece, July 2006.
- Questionmark Corporation, “Questionmark Perception Measure Knowledge, Skills and Attitudes Securely for Certification, Regulatory Compliance and successful Learning Outcomes,” 2012.
- J. Bull and D. Stephens, “The use of question mark software for formative and summative assessment in two universities,” Innovations in Education and Teaching International, vol. 36, no. 2, pp. 128–135, 1999. View at Scopus
- G. M. Velan, R. K. Kumar, M. Dziegielewski, and D. Wakefield, “Web-based self-assessments in pathology with Questionmark Perception,” Pathology, vol. 34, no. 3, pp. 282–284, 2002. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- HEFCE JISC, “Case study 5: making the most of a computer-assisted assessment system University of Manchester,” 2010,.
- M. Wood, Human Computer Collaborative Assessment—Access by Computer (ABC)—University of Manchester, HEFCE JISC, 2009.
- HEFCE JISC, “Short answer marking engines,” 2009,.
- S. Jordan and T. Mitchell, “e-Assessment for learning? The potential of short-answer free-text questions with tailored feedback,” British Journal of Educational Technology, vol. 40, no. 2, pp. 371–385, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- F. Noorbehbahani and A. A. Kardan, “The automatic assessment of free text answers using a modified BLEU algorithm,” Computers & Education, vol. 56, no. 2, pp. 337–345, 2011. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- I. D. Beatty and W. J. Gerace, “Technology-enhanced formative assessment: a research-based pedagogy for teaching science with classroom response technology,” Journal of Science Education and Technology, vol. 18, no. 2, pp. 146–162, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- C. Fies and J. Marshall, “Classroom response systems: a review of the literature,” Journal of Science Education and Technology, vol. 15, no. 1, pp. 101–109, 2006. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- C. Fies and J. Marshall, “The C3 framework: evaluating classroom response system interactions in university classrooms,” Journal of Science Education and Technology, vol. 17, no. 5, pp. 483–499, 2008. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- IMS Global Learning Consortium, “IMS Question & Test Interoperability Specification (QTI),” 2012,.
- C. Smythe and P. Roberts, An Overview of the IMS Question & Test Interoperability Specification, Computer Aided Assessment, Leicestershire, UK, 2000.
- Codility Ltd., “Codility: WE TEST CODERS,” 2009,.
- About IKM, “Overview,” 2011,.
- M. M. Clarke, G. F. Madaus, C. L. Horn, and M. A. Ramos, “Retrospective on educational testing and assessment in the 20th century,” Journal of Curriculum Studies, vol. 32, no. 2, pp. 159–181, 2000. View at Scopus
- L. B. Resnick and D. P. Resnick, Assessing the Thinking Curriculum: New Tools for Educational Reform, Learning Research and Development Center: University of Pittsburgh and Carnegie Mellon University, Pittsburgh, Pa, USA, 1989.
- M. Lipman, “Some thoughts on the formation of reflective education,” in Teaching-Thinking Skills: Theory and Practice, J. B. Baron and R. J. Sternberg, Eds., pp. 151–161, W. H. Freeman, New York, NY, USA, 1987.
- C. Tribune, “Standardized testing will limit students' future,” April 2010,.
- Fairtest, “What's Wrong with Standardized Tests?” May 2012,.
- E. J. Short, M. Noeder, S. Gorovoy, M. J. Manos, and B. Lewis, “The importance of play in both the assessment and treatment of young children,” in An Evidence-Based Approach to Play in Intervention and Prevention: Integrating Developmental and Clinical Science, S. Russ and L. Niec, Eds., Guilford, London, UK.
- A. S. Kaugars and S. W. Russ, “Assessing preschool children's pretend play: preliminary validation of the affect in play scale-preschool version,” Early Education and Development, vol. 20, no. 5, pp. 733–755, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- F. Bellotti, R. Berta, A. De Gloria, and L. Primavera, “Adaptive experience engine for serious games,” IEEE Transactions on Computational Intelligence and AI in Games, vol. 1, no. 4, pp. 264–280, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- C. H. Tan, K. C. Tan, and A. Tay, “Dynamic game difficulty scaling using adaptive behavior-based AI,” IEEE Transactions on Computational Intelligence and AI in Games, vol. 3, no. 4, pp. 289–301, 2011. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar
- L. Doucet and V. Srinivasany, “Designing entertaining educational games using procedural rhetoric: a case study,” in Proceedings of the 5th ACM SIGGRAPH Symposium on Video Games, pp. 5–10, Los Angeles, Calif, USA, July 2010. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- J. Froschauer, I. Seidel, M. Gärtner, H. Berger, and D. Merkl, “Design and evaluation of a serious game for immersive cultural training,” in Proceedings of the 16th International Conference on Virtual Systems and Multimedia (VSMM '10), pp. 253–260, IEEE CS Press, Seoul, Republic of Korea, October 2010. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- H. Kelly, K. Howell, E. Glinert et al., “How to build serious games,” Communications of the ACM, vol. 50, no. 7, pp. 44–49, 2007. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- J. Swarz, A. Ousley, A. Magro et al., “CancerSpace: a simulation-based game for improving cancer-screening rates,” IEEE Computer Graphics and Applications, vol. 30, no. 1, pp. 90–94, 2010. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- M. A. Zielke, M. J. Evans, F. Dufour et al., “Serious games for immersive cultural training: creating a living world,” IEEE Computer Graphics and Applications, vol. 29, no. 2, pp. 49–60, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- M. King and R. Newman, “Evaluating business simulation software: approach, tools and pedagogy,” On the Horizon, vol. 17, no. 4, pp. 368–377, 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- A. J. Stainton, J. E. Johnson, and E. P. Borodzicz, “Educational validity of business gaming simulation: a research methodology framework,” Simulation & Gaming, vol. 41, no. 5, pp. 705–723, 2010. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus
- U. Ritterfeld, M. Cody, and P. Vorderer, Eds., Serious Games: Mechanisms and Effects, Routledge, New York, NY, USA, 2009.
- F. Bellotti, R. Berta, A. De Gloria, and L. Primavera, “A task annotation model for SandBox Serious Games,” in Proceedings of IEEE Symposium on Computational Intelligence and Games (CIG '09), pp. 233–240, Milano, Italy, September 2009. View at Publisher · View at Google Scholar · View at Scopus |
Saturday, July 28, 2007
Why Am I A Vegan?
Let"
Dear Vaishali,
I just love your favourite quote. I was looking for a good one to add to my facebook page. I just started taking the 30 day vegan easy challenge ... hope to stick with it more than 30 days!
Good luck, Erika!
I loved reading your reasoning for becoming a vegan. I just started down this path based on a bet with my 12 year old daughter. Then to keep motivated I started to research. It's startling to face the realities that these animals face before they are sacrificed for food. I live in the south, born and raised, and never thought I would give up fried chicken. Until I started seeing documentaries about chicken factories. My husband disagrees and thinks that the Bible supports why we should eat meat. Hmm, I just feel a lot better by going down the non-violent, happy, kind path.
I had given up non-veg many many years back. Then recently I learned about vegan lifestyle on and it appeled me so much to turn myself to Vegan. And I must say I am happy about it
I feel Plants do not have nerves system like animals , so it'sdifferent than eating animals and birds.
Thank you for such a clear, thoughtful description. It makes me consider my own life slightly differently because I too love animals.
Dear Vaishali,
I should probably be sleeping right now since it's almost 1 AM over here in the US. But I stumbled upon your unique recipes on my search to make basmati rice for the first time! I love how simple your recipes are, using easily accessible ingredients! I agree with you in the cooking area... after being vegan, I have become such an aware individual, and I am eating all sorts of delicious foods that I would never have eaten if I had not become vegan... being vegan is much easier than most people make out to be... it just takes a bit of effort but it is completely worth it! Thank you for your wonderful blog!
Hello Vaishali. Its nice to read your views. I am a born vegetarian, but my hubby can only be described as carnivourous!! I usually have no arguments when it comes to 'killing plants'. Now thanks to your post I have some ammunition :-)
I started baking recently and, to be honest, I actually felt bad for yeast!!
I find being a vegetarian difficult enough while travelling or dining out with friends...but vegan seems even tougher! I also cant imagine my life without diary! My morning coffe, no ghee on my rice, no butter, no milk, no curd..and ya no cheese too!!! Phew!
Will follow your blog and see if I can try vegan for a week! It will surely improve my health!
Wow Vaishali, Well said! I was born vegetarian, with a dad who used to feed ants,(outdoors, of course), was an amateur bird watcher, and who shunned white sugar way before the world started going the vegan way. Despite all this, I convinced myself egg was vegetarian since it was unfertilized, because I loved cakes, but living for 5 years in Hong Kong really woke me up. Buying my groceries in the local markets instead of supermarkets, for more variety, I could not ignore the seafood shops where I saw the life of fish snuffed out with the blow of a flattened knife, the meat shops with their red lighting to enhance the redness of the meat and the insides of animals hanging from hooks, the lifeless barbecued geese and piglets, and turning around at some noise, to find a huge pig, split wide open and disemboweled, just 1 foot from me. I guess you could say that the visit to the market was like visiting the abattoir. The anger at such senseless killing, my pride at not being a meat-eater, also made me take a good look at myself and my hypocrisy. I have given up eggs, gelatin, rennet, bone whitened sugar, silks produced by killing the worms, and leather. Makes me feel better. And glad to have company, after all these years of being given funny looks.
Harekrishnaji, Cristie, Dennis the Menace, Thanks, all, for your kind words.
Dibs, I too loved milk in my tea and coffee, but I find soy milk makes a great substitute and is actually an improvement. And there are some wonderful vegan butters, yogurts and cheeses now available.
I'm glad to hear you want to try going vegan at least for a week- good luck with it, and feel free to write if you need any advise or help.
Chai, Thanks for your comment, and kudos to your dad! It's always wonderful to hear about the few among us who saw the light, so to say, early on. I only wish there were more like him.
Kudos to you too for choosing a cruelty-free lifestyle. Your description of the market made me shudder- I can only imagine what a horrific sight that would have been.
Thought I should share with you! Just bought my first vegan milk. I don't love soy, and to my delight I found brown rice milk. Its really yummy just as is. Must try tea and coffee and see!
I enjoyed reading this, and appreciate your ethical reasons for foregoing meat, leather, and all animal products :-)
I am glad to see a fellow desi vegan. Despite being a land of gazillion vegetarians, veganism is not hot in India at all. Your conversion and concern are all the more commendable for you were a meat eater. Two thumbs up!!
Dear Vaishali,
Stumbled upon your cabbage kootu recipe while "googling" for it! Then i went on to read your post on Veganism.
Great writing! I have been a vegetarian all my life. I cannot call myself a vegan since i take milk and relish cakes (my weakness!)
A couple of years back, i had a health checkup at my office and though i was a little on the "healthier" side, i was told by the physician that i was still very healthy since i led a vegetarian life.
My colleague on the other hand had not so good news. We were sharing an apartment at that time. When we came home, i told about my results and she went off on tirade about how us vegetarians and vegans seem to think that eating meat is the most horrible thing to do. Her counter argument was that we are even more cruel and horrible since we eat plants who don't even have a way of expressing their pain when they are uprooted from the ground.
That was then....and recently, i came across an article on the internet that was written on how plants can feel just like us.
I am not being a Devil's Advocate here and nor will i eat meat becuase of this..but just to think...is it really that we are more cruel in killing plants...?
PBlog, Thanks for your thoughtful message. Here's what I think:.
Second, and more important, there is no evidence that plants have a nervous system. So the argument that plants feel pain is completely without basis, and in my experience the only one that every meat-eater has in their arsenal to challenge vegetarians (and it's a tired old argument by now).
Hope that helps :)
Hi Vaishali,
I always try the recipes posted on various blogs, but never comment. But I HAVE to comment here coz otherwise you would never know and I want you to know that "I AM YOUR FAN!" :) Thank You very much for having this blog up!
Vaishali, what a cool site!
Mridula, Anonymous: Thanks!
Hello Vaishali, Thank you for you article it's really an inspiration. Just under two years ago I became lacto-Vegetarian, but recently decided to go Vegan, because of how cruel the Dairy industry is. I was not born Hindu, but I have eventually came to identify myself with the Shakti path of Hinduism. I have been finding it really difficult to say that cows are sacred, yet support the Dairy industry. It's a shame that I can no longer eat prasadam that is either not fruit or I didn't create myself.
Hi Ryan, Thanks, and glad you decided to go vegan. You're right-- we Hindus revere the cow and treat dairy products as a gift of the cow, even as we turn a blind eye to the cruel practices of the dairy industry. I loved dairy products including milk, cheese and yogurt, but when I saw pictures of what cows go through so we can have them, I was permanently turned off. I don't miss them at all now.
This is a wonderful site, Vaishali! I was born a vegetarian and am a deep animal lover myself. I find it hard to comprehend the wastefulness of modern meat packaging. Irrational maybe but sometimes I see these neat stacks of packed chicken dated some months back and I think that these chicken could've been alive and running around instead of stashed in some deep freezer for months together. It seems cruel and unnecessary.
Thanks for visiting my blog because I now got to know yours.
I was very impressed with your blog. I appreciate its upbeat nature and your writing style. I have been a vegetarian for many years, and have my husband eating vegetarian for half of his meals now. I am in the process of turning vegan and am discovering new ways to bake without eggs and dairy. I found your information to be very helpful.
In my opinion being vegan is too extreme in many ways. Taking out cow milk, butter, ghee from diet is like living tastelessly. Its not good for health as well. Farming is developed so that human labor can benefit animal existence and in turn humans can derive some food out of it without harming animal. Variety is spice of life and these basic animal products are source of it. I am a proud lacto-vegetarian and it make more sense to me.
Anonymous, thanks for sharing your view and I'd really appreciate a name next time.
Since you identify yourself as a lacto-vegetarian, I can see why you think it would be difficult to adjust to a vegan diet. I ate meat, so by your own argument I had greater variety in my diet than you do, so arguably I should be feeling more deprived. But as I say in this post, after going vegan, I did not miss the meat one bit-- in fact it repulses me now. What's more, so do dairy products which I once thought would be difficult to cut out of my diet.
My blog has hundreds of recipes for food that's delicious, and having been an ominvore at one time, I can testify to the fact that each one of these tastes as good as, if not better than, what I ate in my days as a meat-eater. If you go through Holy Cow! and many other wonderful vegan recipe blogs out there, you will certainly see that vegan food is not tasteless at all. Vegans are more prone to exploring unusual foods and we have much more variety in our diet than a lacto-vegetarian does. What's more, there are all sorts of dairy substitutes available now that are just as good for the real thing, but far more compassionate, for those vegans who miss dairy products. Vegans also tend to me smarter-- there are studies out that show this :)-- and most are very knowledgeable and careful about planning their diets so they are healthy. Soy, for instance, is a much higher quality protein, and healthier, than milk.
I am also guessing you are likely an Indian, since lacto-veetarianism is a proud tradition in India. If so, I'd like to remind you that the Hindu belief that milk is a cow's gift is sadly misplaced. Dairy cows are among the worst-abused animals in the animal-food industry, and very often die premature deaths-- or are killed for meat prematurely-- making it far from a gift and more of an evil.
Hi Vaishali, this is a great blog. I am a lacto-ovo-vegetarian and I am trying to become vegan. We recently moved from US to India. I find that there are very few vegan dairy substitutes in India. In US supermarkets were flooded with Rice milk, Brown rice milk, soya based yogurt, vegan cheeses or even vegan hot dogs and burgers and vegan meat substitutes. Whereas in India you get only soya milk and tofu which are expensive and not very fresh. So it gets harder to be a vegan in India. Its lot more easier for lacto-vegetarian than vegan over here. I just wish more vegan products like miso, tempeh etc were available in India too.
Also, is it safe for small kids to be vegan, will they get enough nutrition by being vegan.
Hi MunMun: Thanks for stopping by and kudos for considering a vegan diet. I hear you: we certainly have more options here than one does in India. That said, I hardly ever cook with meat substitutes because I'm not a big fan of tempeh or seitan. In fact, tofu and soymilk and, to some extent, textured vegetable protein (similar to the soy nuggets you find in India) are the only substitutes I use.
I know of many vegans here who raise their children as vegans, and they are perfectly healthy, but before one puts a child on a vegan diet, one should consult with a nutritionist or doctor to make sure he/she gets the right balance of nutrients through the foods chosen.
There's often a myth that vegans are unhealthy, but I always ace my blood tests and health checkups. When I first started seeing my current doctor, he was trying to convince me to eat some animal protein. Now even he no longer does. :)
A useful source of information direct from the medical profession on the healthful qualities of a vegan diet, including for children, is the Web site of the Physicians Committed to Responsible Medicine Web site: pcrm.org. It's one of my favorite reads.
Vaishali,
Love your blog. We eat mostly vegan food due to allergies in the family. It's always a treat to see flavours form all over the world on your blog. I am hoping you will be able to help me with this one: I need doggie vegan recipes for Bodhi, the latest addition to our family. Any ideas would be appreciated.
Hi Ambica, thanks for your message and kind words about the blog. Bodhi sounds really cute :) I love the name.
Of my three dogs, I find Opie and Freddie readily eat foods that are meat-free -- rice, boiled veggies, nuts... but I don't really cook whole meals for them because their vet says its hard to balance homemade doggie diets. But I do make them peanut butter treats sometimes which all of them, including Lucy, love. It's just peanut butter and whole-wheat flour and some soy milk to add enough moisture to bind the dough. I haven't made them in a while now and am at a bit of a loss for the proportions, but let me try it again and I'll post the recipe right here on the blog. Please keep in mind that some dogs are allergic to wheat.
If you want to put Bodhi on a vegetarian diet, there are some doggie foods available off the shelf which are meat-free. I know Whole Foods has a couple of brands, and I've also seen something in PetSmart, I'm sure. I can't vouch for how good they are. My dogs are not on a vegan diet-- they eat canned dog food and kibble that contains meat. I ate meat when I first adopted them, and Desi thought it would be wrong to suddenly switch them to a vegan diet since they had no say in the decision. Lucy, especially, would also be tough to convert.
Sorry I am not much help. But feel free to write in if you have any other questions. :)
I love this post..its simple and honest. I am a vegetarian, but going without silk, wool and leather is admirable! I loved meat too...but gave it up as I cldnt be a hypocrite too. So Kudos on this post! I am following your recipes really closely from now on :)
Hi Vaishali, Greetings from Bangalore.... I love your blog. I "discovered" your blog a few days back and have read your recent posts and some older ones too. I adore the way you mix your recipes with food for thought for the soul! A part of me feels proud and calmed in the awareness that there are compassionate people like you who are breathing the same air just now!! I relate to your journey of becoming a vegan as I have just begun on one. I have been a vegetarian for the last 19 years (born in a non-veg eating family) and now my calling wants to take me further. My body is responding to the pulling off of non-vegan items like a dream.
I am a great tea lover. And since the past few weeks I have been having black tea. I won't say I "miss" milk tea but just wanted to find out from you whether you know of a vegan milk replacer available in India. I have tried soy milk but I wouldn't like to repeat it :) Will wait for your opinion. Good to be able to write to you!
One clarification :) I like and in fact have started to love soy milk as a drink but soy milk in tea is something I don't look forward to.
Preeti, Thanks very much, and kudos to you too for giving up meat. May our tribe increase! :)
Ambrosia, I love the line "My body is responding to the pulling off of non-vegan items like a dream." Very rightly and very well said :)
Thanks for your kind words about the blog. I am a tea-drinker too, and hate black tea, but luckily for me I do like soymilk in my tea. I use the vanilla-flavored one which tastes great.
As for non-soymilk options, I am not sure what is available now in India. But here are a couple of suggestions. Can you find powdered creamer? Some tend to be non-dairy, like Nestle Carnation Coffeemate which is available here in the U.S. Another option might be almond milk. I usually buy it in a carton, but you might try soaking about a dozen almonds in hot water for an hour or two, blending them, then straining, for almond milk? Add more or less almonds if you find it too thin or thick. I have never tried almond milk in tea, but I use it for sweets as a milk replacer and it works great and tastes wonderful.
Hope that helps a little. Congratulations on taking the step toward a vegan lifestyle, and feel free to ask any other questions :)
Hi Vaishali, thanks a ton for the important tips and for the lovely words and for visiting my space too :) I have increasingly felt with every grey hair on my head that all one needs is the WILL to go for it, and all of our bodies will actually respond like a dream then. If people decide even before beginning that they "cannot do it" or live in suspicion and fear while at it that they will "never make it", they actually never will! :) I think changing one's food habits to include less and less "violence" on one's plate can only be a progression of one's being, never a regression. In that I really really like something that you said here - "Feeding plants to animals then eating the animals is like filtering water through a sewer then drinking it"!
Since you say you like soy milk in tea, it has got me thinking - maybe I did not mix the milk with the water at the right time - I put it in boiling water!! Maybe soy milk in tea would taste differently and better if I make tea the English way. Let me try :) I will be on the lookout for a non-dairy creamer however. I had been using a dairy creamer actually before I went vegan coz liquid cow's milk I never quite liked right from childhood.
And I never knew that almond milk is actually made and so many things can be done with it! I am currently on the lookout for vegan cookies as I love cookies. And will you believe it, there is not a single one stop store in this city for vegan items! It is challenging but an exciting and deeply educative challenge nevertheless :)
Hi Vaishali,
I have to say I really enjoyed reading your post and all the comments. I became vegetarian about 7 1/2 years back, when I was ten, because of a discussion in class that supported hunting. I remember you also mentioning somewhere that you had always loved animals but never wanted to think about the fact that meat came from them. So it was with me until 5th grade. I becamse very hardcore about it too, until I realized over the years that you can't hope to convert anyone by being orthodox and forcing your beliefs on others, no matter how noble you feel them to be. So for a while, I actually gave up believing that veganism/vegartianism is the natural human diet (thanks to beyondveg.com and other arugments about human paleontology that are hard to beat). Nevertheless, I am still a convinced veggie. But I am glad to read your posts and feel a sense of support that it really does make practical sense in many ways to lead a vegan lifestyle. I should definitely try going vegan again.
There is one thing that caught my attention. You mentioned how hard it is to be a vegan in India. This may be true if you are used to vegan food containing a lot of the dairy substitutes we get here in the US. But there is still quite a selection of dairy-free fare in Indian cuisine. My parents are from India, and most of our typical "odia khaanaa" does not have any milk products whatsoever. Or even foods from the south. Maybe if you're just talking about sweets, but I'm sure there a few sweets that can easily be made with oil instead of ghee, like jalebis for example. I'm trying to imagine, if I ever did live in India, if it really would be all that hard to eat vegan, since there is a wealth of plant-based dishes there anyway.I guess I was just a bit surprised to see other testimonies.
Anyway, I loved your site and will check back often!
Another beautiful post! Your decision to go vegan is just like mine; I loved the taste of meat, just not the suffering behind it! To be a compassionate human being you must be vegan! Loving your blog...
Rashmi, Lovely to hear from you, and I agree that it is fairly easy to get great vegan choices in traditional Indian cuisine. Thanks for sharing your story, and kudos to you for living your beliefs!
Voracious Vegan, Welcome. It's great to hear from a fellow food-lover who shares my views on ethical veganism. Thanks for your kind words.
I suppose I'm about to join the legion of people who are just flat out stoked to find your blog! I am yet another "born" vegetarian, born and raised by a fantastic omni mom. I have been vegan for the last 5 years, after about a decade of failed attempts (cheese was always my downfall).
At any rate, I'm looking forward to reading your updates and I'm really looking forward to trying your dosa recipe this week. I have some great South Indian restaurants here in the bay area that are vegan friendly, but I'm excited to have a chance to make a giant veggie masala dosa at home!
have a great weekend!
Casey, Thanks, and welcome! I have a few dosa recipes on the blog, but for a masala dosa I'd recommend these:. If you try it, do let me know how it turns out!
Hi Vaishali,
Turning vegan is difficult for me when it comes to milk in tea and milk based sweets... Also eating out becomes extremely difficult..
Perfumes, cosmetics are something which I quit using long back after reading about animal testing...Leather, last i used was in school .. shoes.. tell me what would you substitute wool with?
For now, i'll try to become a vegan...
Uma, Kudos for trying! Turning vegan may seem like a challenge, but it is much easier than it seems. Milk substitutes are easy to find almost anywhere in the world now, and it is possible to make even Indian sweets with these substitutes that taste just as good. You can find a few recipes for vegan sweets here,, and in my roundup of the Sweet Vegan event here:
Eating out is not much of a challenge either. I don't know where you are based, but here in the United States it is really easy to find vegan options at restaurants and there are some great, exclusively vegan restaurants in almost every city. Chefs will often make small adjustments if you ask for them. And in India, there is a plethora of choices with all the vegetarian restaurants.
I can tell you for a fact that I've been eating much better since I turned vegan :)
About wool, it is possibly the easiest of all non-vegan fabrics to substitute: sweaters made with acrylic or nylon fibers and other non-animal wool substitutes can be easily found anywhere, and are as comfortable. I wear them and stay warm even in Washington's really cold winters. Even vegan coats are easy to find online and are quite reasonably priced.
The idea that wool does not harm the sheep is just as full of holes as the idea that milk does not harm cows. Investigations by animal rights groups have found that sheep used for wool are horribly abused-- the wool is torn off their bodies in large patches and chunks of flesh from their rumps are torn off without giving them any sedatives or pain relievers. I have seen videos of sheep whose legs are being chopped off even as the sheep is still alive-- if everyone saw that, no one would want to go near wool again.
Vaishali,
Thanks for replying back..
I have one more query.. if all humans turn vegan, will there be a negative effect on the ecological balance..to be precise will the cow population will increase or overgrazing will happen?.. am still reading about this..
waiting for your reply..
Uma, on the contrary. Most of the cows on earth today were bred specifically for food. These cows-- called livestock-- eat about 70 percent of the grain produced in the United States today.
Were we to give up meat, there would be no need to breed cows in large numbers, and the cow population would drop dramatically. What's more, most of the forest land cleared to produce grain for the cows could be reforested because we'd need far less land to grow food for humans who eat much less than cows do. And we could conquer world hunger--you have to feed a cow 16 pounds of grain for each pound of beef you get from it after it's slaughtered. A pound of beef might feed two or three people at a single meal, but think of how many people 16 pounds of grain would feed, and for how many days?
Going vegan is a win-win for us, the environment, and for the cows :)
Thanks Vaishali!
Dear Vaishali
I never get bored even if I read your posts n number of times. I do take soy milk in my tea and coffee but soy milk curdles. Any suggestion?
Thanks
Hi Anonymous,
Thank you -- you are very kind! I am happy you've enjoyed reading the posts because I really love writing them. :)
About soymilk in tea, are you by any chance heating it on the stovetop? I put the soymilk in a mug and first zap it in the microwave for about 15 seconds and then pour the tea or coffee over it.
I am wondering if curdling might be a problem with some brands. I use Kirkland's vanilla soymilk which I buy from Costco. It doesn't curdle when I add it to tea or coffee.
Lastly, and I am sure you're already doing this, but do make sure that you refrigerate the opened pack of soymilk immediately because it does spoil just as milk does if left out at room temperature too long.
Hope that helps :)
Dear Vaishali
Thank you for the reply. I usually combine milk, water; microwave it and then add coffee powder. You are right, for tea I combine everything in a vessel and heat it on a stove top. Unfortunately I do not have Costco nearby my home. I faced the same problem with different brands that I tried. But not I will try your method.
Thanks again
Vaishali
I tried your method and the Soy Milk did not curdle rather my coffee had a frothy texture that a regular cow's milk would give.
Hi Vaishali,
I am absolutely thrilled at finding your website. I am a vegetarian and a die hard animal lover. I have mostly found myself alone when defending animals and their rights, where I would finally end up in tears. It is very reassuring to see an outspoken anti-cruelty supporter. Organic yogurt and cheese were the only vegetarian things that I was hanging on to, but you blog has inspired me to go completely vegan.
Regards,
Sharmila
Hi Sharmila, Welcome! It seems obvious to us animal lovers that animals should have rights, but unfortunately we are still in a minority. Hopefully, that will change one day-- as they say, never underestimate the power of one. :)
Kudos to you for making the decision to give up dairy-- I for one felt much better after I did, and I've never missed it. And I thought I couldn't live without cheese!
Hi Vaishali,
Its so cool to see a fellow-desi vegan! I turned vegan about 3 months ago and am loving it. I feel as if I am reading my own words as I read your reasons for being vegan. As someone mentioned, its quite easy to be vegan in the US. I love almond milk and soy milk. I am hoping to make the almond milk kheer soon for Tamil New Year. Love your blog and keep up the good work!
Hi Srividya, welcome, and it is good to hear from a fellow desi vegan. Early wishes for a happy new year, and hope you enjoy the kheer :)
Great effort Vaishali, both being vegan and this amazing blog! I hopped on here from Madhuram's blog and have been reading your blog for quite sometime now :) Thanks for sharing all these wonderful recipes. I am going to bake the mango cupcakes today for my new neighbours!
I baked the cupcakes. They turned out amazing! Thanks for this, I am definitely baking this more often :) Please check
I love your recipes and was happy to read your reasons for being vegan.
I was a vegetarian for 6 years. Started as a teenager. Then, after some travels I started eating meat again for about 5 years. However, it all disgusted me so much that I decided to become vegan recently and am so happy.
I like your response to the plant question, as my husband recently said the same thing.
I try too avoid too many soy products, too, so I like that a lot of your recipes don't have highly processed soy products.
Shankari, glad you liked the cupcakes :) Thanks for the feedback.
Amanda, Thanks, and welcome to Holy Cow! Always great to meet a fellow vegan :)
Dear Vaishali,
Your replies to the comments are as enlightening at the original post itself. When I read your blog the 1st time, it shook me hard...it took me a couple of days and lots of consolidation from my FB friends with whom I shared pieces of these facts. Right now, the only thing I am doing is creating more awareness by word of mouth.
I also have a Q: My 21 month is having Almond Milk, because he has been diagnosed allergic to casein. He does not like rice or coconut milk and I have heard Soy is no longer the best alternative, since its highly processed, due to it being produces in such large volumes (due to its increasing demand)and it also interferes with hormones in humans that young. That leaves me with almond which does not have any calcium. Are tums / calcium tablets the only alternative I have to replenish his calcium needs? Or are you aware of any other sources?
Deepti
Hi Deepti, sorry for the delay in replying. Thanks for your kind words about the blog. I am no expert in child nutrition, but is your son eating any veggies and beans yet? Vegetables from the cruciferous family, like broccoli, kale, cauliflower are great sources of calcium. So is spinach and lots of other veggies. Beans are also a good source of calcium. I just looked up the Almond Breeze website and their almond milk is fortified with 30 percent of the RDA of calcium-- as much as you'd get from a glass of milk.
You've probably already done so, but it would be a good idea to get your pediatrician's opinion on foods you can give your son to ensure his calcium needs are met.
hello Vaishali, just want to thank you and want to leave congratulations to you and your site!! i´m vegan since a few weeks and landed here by looking for new inspirations, and its very inspiring, what i found here! looking forward trying many of your recepts, yumyum. many warm greetings from a now autumnly, sunny germany, lake constance. Anja
i find your site very touchy. i am glad that some are seriously concern to live their lives with true kindness not only for humans but for all the things around them. i feel the same way, for i love to keep my dwelling place (earth), and everything around me beautiful, peaceful and good.
as for the killing of plants, plants needs pruning, they grow and produce more when prune. you don't stop life in them. plants are the intended food for human, this is their purpose for existence. when you kill an animal they no longer can produce.
Anja, Thanks, and good luck!
Anonymous, Welcome!
i just discovered this blog today, and i think its great! thank you! keep up the good work!
Hi Vaishali,
My name is Patrick and I am running a website, VegTomato,, dedicated to advocate veganism/vegetarianism among Chinese/Taiwanese community. Just found your blog and read your story which is so inspiring. I am wondering if I can have your permission to transalte it into Chinese and post in my website to inspire more people go vegan/veggie. I will link back and credit it to you.
Patrick, thanks, and yes, you can translate the post as long as you link back.
Vaishali,
Thank you so much for the permission, and defenitely, I will back to you for the credit.
Thanks for your support!!
Best,
Patrick
I want to answer questions about non-dairy alternatives to tea and coffee, or my fav chai! Here in the U.S., aside from soy, there is almond, rice, oat, multi-grain mylks, and now Hemp and Coconut! Coconut and Hemp are both thicker mylks and lovely in teas!
I'm not sure what you'd find in India, but perhaps because fresh coconut is so available there, you could make your own. I do not have a recipe, but perhaps Google one?
I an new to this site today, and I am happy I have found it. Unfortunately I am also gluten-free so I will try and make substitutes to your gluten grains.
Blessings...
Hi Vaishali, my name is Savanah. I am 13 and have been a vegetarian for about 6 years now :) recently i have been wanting to go vegan because i learned the reason people do go vegan :) I use to think you would go vegan just to be more healthy, but now i know the real reason and how dairy cows aren't exactly treated the best. Same with chickens. Well my question is, how do you go vegan when the rest if your family doesn't want to? (My Dad and oldest brother are vegetarian, but my Mom and my other brother are not vegetarian or vegan.) I really want to, but it just seems it would be harder if your surrounded by people who do eat milk and eggs and honey and all that stuff :) how did you make the change? did you just stop eating one thing at a time? or all at once? If you could answer that would be great :D I'm sorry if i spelled stuff wrong, I'm a horrible speller. Thanks again. :)
~Savanah~
Hi Savanah, you sound remarkable-- I wish I'd had the foresight to go vegan when I was 13.
I understand your dilemma-- it can be hard to go vegan in a home when you are not making the primary decisions about the cooking and nutrition. The reason your family may be uncomfortable with the idea of you becoming a vegan is likely just that they worry about your health and whether you will get the right nutrients from plant-based foods. You might want to encourage them to read more about the benefits of vegan nutrition on great websites like, and about well-known people who have seen health benefits from adopting a vegan diet, like Bill Clinton. If you cook, you could try making some simple, healthy and delicious dishes to share with your family.
In my case, I made the transition in steps. I stopped buying clothes, shoes etc. made with animal products first, then became a lacto-ovo-vegetarian, and finally a vegan. I too live with an omnivore (my husband Desi does eat fish and chicken when he eats outside) but I think after worrying about me for a while he saw that veganism has lots of health benefits. I usually ace my health checkups, he -- not always. :) Over the years he's come to agree with me more and more that a vegan diet is a good thing.
Thank you so much! :) and for replying so quickly too :) I will try to write again if i am successful :) Also, If there are any really good Vegan recipe web sites you know of, that would be great if you could tell me :) Thank you again,
~Savanah~
Savanah, There are some great vegan blogs in my Blogroll that you might find useful. Also, have you browsed through my recipe list (click the "recipes" tab at the top of the page)?
that it's so great
compassion is the word of the future, there'll be no place for cruel people
Vegan Indian food...awesomesauce. I stumbled upon your blog looking for a vegan halwa recipe (since going vegan, worried that I couldn't enjoy Indian sweets...pretty much the only food I can't veganize, since most of the food I grew up with IS vegan...just don't put ghee on the rotli).
Question: what's your fav recipe on your site? It doesn't have to be healthy...I eat enough healthy food =)
TS, Welcome. That's an easy question for me to answer-- my favorite recipe on this blog has got to be My Dad's "Not Mutton" Mushroom Curry, for many different reasons. One is that the dish always brings back great memories of my dad. The other is that it shows that a vegan version of a meaty dish can be just as tasty and not at all hard to come up with. :)
I totally agree with you ... and I'll add another reason to "go vegan" ... you touched on it briefly. Meatless meals are Eco-friendly. Producing one pound of meat takes many more natural resources than one pound of plant-based food ... more land, water, etc. Many of our natural resources, like water, are not renewable and once used, they are gone for good. So, using less natural resources is good for the planet. Good for us, good for animals and good for the environment ... sounds like a total win-win-win to me!
Small Footprints, that's a great point to reiterate. Vegan diets are indeed all-round winners.
Hej Vaishali!
I have been reading your blog ans I thinks it´s so great that you share your recipes, thank you very much! there is so many things I want to start trying (starting with the mango cheesecake!)
I wanted to ask you something, since I am starting with vegan life style (I haven´t eaten dairy,egg or chicken for 3 months and hamm and some meat for a month, no leather, no wool nor silk in my garderob) How can I deal with my husband´s family? or friends? I mean, in family meetings and birthdays and stuff? They will surely won´t understand, I have experienced some awkwards moments when I had to start avoiding dairy and eggs due to my baby has milk protein and egg allergy (that´s how it all began) so I am sure it won´t be easy when I reveal that after nursing period I will continue with my vegan diet. What should I do in birthdays for example? should I take with me my own dessert? like a cake? I would love to hear your opinion.
Thanks in advance!
Hi Bek, welcome! It can be hard to explain a vegan lifestyle to people who are either new to it or unsympathetic, but there are so many great reasons you can give them as to why it is the right choice for anyone who has the ability to think: a vegan diet is better for the animals, better for the planet, and better for your health. Animals raised for food live and die in deplorable conditions, and it is possible to eat deliciously and healthily without having to kill. Vegans also have a smaller environmental footprint because it takes far less grain to feed humans than it takes to feed animals who are then slaughtered for their meat. And very important, vegans are healthier-- they typically have lower cholesterol and blood sugar than meat-eaters, they are often skinnier, and studies show they are likely to live longer.
And yes, you should definitely cook and bring food with you when it is possible, so people who turn up their noses at the idea of vegan food can find out for themselves how delicious it is. Vegan cakes and cupcakes are usually better than those made with eggs and butter, and you don't have to deal with that nasty, eggy smell. Eventually even non-believers will come around. :)
Good luck with your vegan diet!
Hi Vaishali! I am a fitness professional, a yoga teacher & nutrition consultant.In my experience, a Vegan lifestyle is absolutely rewarding! Also, a question asked by Priya , which I have faced by people too, regarding 'killing' plants for our food being equally cruel to killing animals- Plants do not have a nervous system & so they would not feel the pain that animals would. Besides, its our biological design to eat plant based foods ( We do not have claws or Sharp teeth like carnivores do. Our intestine is much longer, our body Ph is alkaline & not acidic.SEVERAL more obvious factors reveal that we are not meant to eat animal based products) Glad to see your page. Here is my web address-
Regards, Mukta
Mukta, well put. These are all great reasons to eat a plant-based diet. Thanks for sharing.
Hi Vaishali! I love love LOVE your blog... for the past few months most of the meals my family has eaten have come from your recipes. I've been vegetarian for fourteen years but became vegan about a year ago when I was pregnant with my daughter. What really tipped the scales for me was reading about how calves are permanently separated from their mothers 24 hours or less after their birth. It is well-documented by farmers themselves that these mothers will wail for hours and break their necks trying to get to their children. In my opinion, separating mammalian mothers and their offspring is one of the cruelest things we can do. This really struck me as a mother but I think even someone without (human) children can appreciate it - think of how attached we are to our dogs!
I'm sure you already knew this but I rarely hear other vegans mention this specific argument and I didn't see it in the comments here so I just thought I'd contribute another good reason to go vegan!
Ashley, thanks for your encouraging words -- I'm thrilled you and your family have enjoyed the recipes! Thanks also for sharing that heartbreaking information about the inhumane separation of calves from their mothers. Cows are the gentlest creatures and it is appalling just how much cruelty we humans subject them to. Brings tears to my eyes just to think of it, and it gives all of us another great reason to adopt a plant-based diet.
Wayfaringteacher, I couldn't agree more. Good luck with your blog-- it's great!
Reading your post made me happy that there are people who care about other species. Im vegetarian currently, I was raised to be vegetarian from the day I was born. I always try to avoid eating dairy products and eggs etc. But sometimes I do.
I think it is important to at least acknowledge where the food on your plate comes from. A lot of people don't give it a thought.
I don't understand how society let the meat industry get to this point. Far too many animals die every day, just to be put into packaging and on a shelf for people to buy as "food". I don't think that it is fair for one species to have its only purpose in life to be to serve another species even against it's own will.
Your recipes are great though. I love cooking nice food. Not only for myself but for my boyfriend, my housemates, my friends. It makes me happy to see my friends (who are meat eaters) enjoy cruelty free food.
Ruby, you are wonderful for trying-- being conscious about the food we eat is most of the battle won.
Wonderful Vaishali! Thanks for supporting veganism in all the ways (food, clothes, etc) :)
Sanatana Dharma is also against eating meat/eggs.
beautifully written X and exactly where I am coming from too - thank you :) |
位置：
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane靠近滨河公园、斯波坎竞技场和冈萨加大学。附近还有斯波坎会议中心和INB 表演艺术中心。
酒店特色：
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane提供室内游泳池、滑水道和SPA 浴酒吧/酒礼宾接待处。住客可享受免费（应要求提供）往返机场班：
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane的 400和三层波炉、夜床服。
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane的餐厅提供早餐、午餐和晚餐。
提供限时客房服水.查看斯波坎的所有酒店
"No complaints"
We needed to be close to downtown so this place fit the bill. Easy walk across the river - very convenient. Clean rooms, nice beds, quiet. Will stay here again.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Disappointed"
Our room smelled and bathroom floor was not clean. Hair and old food on floor. They knew it smelled because all windows were open when we checked in at 7 pm. We have stayed in this hotel before and have never had trouble. The second day we had to request the room be cleaned and air freshener. The house keepers smelled it when they came in. Asked to […] talk to manager but was told they were in a meeting. Did not seemed to be concerned at all with our disappointment. Will not stay here again even though we have an annual conference which is held here. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 First of all, thank you very much for taking the time to submit a review of our hotel. We're very sorry to hear that the room's condition was not up to our high standards for cleanliness and comfort. We strive to please every guest that stays with us, and your satisfaction is very important to our management team. I'll pass along your specific concerns to our Director of Housekeeping and we hope you'll give us another chance in the future to accommodate you! Best Regards.
the room was not clean, this made it very hard to relax. we all got athletes foot after staying there and showering.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 We're very sorry to hear that the room wasn't clean, and that you had difficulties relaxing. It's our goal to ensure a comfortable stay for all our guests, and I've forwarded your concerns to our housekeeping team so they can address them. In the future, please feel free to contact the Front Desk if your room has any deficiency whatsoever so we can act quickly to resolve it. Thanks very much for submitting this review. Best Regards, Zachary L.
此住客未发表评论。Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Hotel is ok a bit run down and looking tired. Staff friendly. Eating areas did not inspire me to eat stay; no isss to Riverfront Park and Gonzaga U."
Clean, comfortable hotel in a convenient location. The gym was spacious and clean with an adequate number of exercise machines. The hotel staff had great customer service!Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Awesome lounge"
Overall it was okay, few maintenance issues, they charge for parking if you are staying there. They do offer free lower speed wifi which is nice when you are just checking email. The lounge was awesome though! It had lots of TV's with a variety of sports on, lots of seating, great food and very friendly staff! This was defiantly my favorite that great"
This hotel leaves a lot to be desired. First of all there is a $12 per night chargte for parking for hotel guests that bok through hotels.com. The hotel has plenty of parking spaces that sit empty so I don't know why they need to charge for it. Secondly we booked and paid for a deluxe room because of how many people were staying the night. We paid extra […] and the room was too small. I went to the front desk to request a larger room and they said it was the biggest. There were two queen beds in it but the room was so small that one of the beds was all the way against the wall and there was very little room on the wall side of the other bed. According to the web site 5-6 people should have fit in the room but there was no way that was going to happen unless you like being packe in a room like sardines. Thirdly, the breakfast was a joke. The people that checked in ahead of us got free breakfast buffet and we were told that it costs $10 per person. The selection is like a typical continental breakfast and totaly not worth the $10. It was a nice hotel close to the Spokane Arena where we attended a concert and the beds were soft. But overall I do not think I will ever book a stay there again. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Perfect Location"
Good, but need to remember not to leave card keys in room when leaving need card key to exit parking!Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Fine - may or may not stay again."
The hotel is lovely. Just a couple annoyances but otherwise was fine. We had no bath towels in our room and had to phone housekeeping - asked for 3 - got 2. At check in asked for wine glasses to be sent to room - did not come - had to call again. No lounge chairs in room - only a desk and wobbly office chair so it was quite uncomfortable to have a glass […] of wine and snacks. Sitting on the bed for appetizers is not my idea of comfortable. The bed and pillows were wonderful. The buffet breakfast was good. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Housekeepers need to clean under beds"
Pros- Conveinantly close to our destination Cons- Under both of our beds were trash & a toddler sippy cup, bathroom floor corners were lined with filthHotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Thank you for bringing the issues you had during your stay to our attention. I have forwarded the cleanliness of under the beds to our Director of Housekeeping. We hope to welcome you back in the near future. Regards, Brent A.
"Perfect location"
My husband and I had a wonderful stay!! Walking distance to everything, great front desk people, friendly and efficient. Great room, very comfortable bed. Lounge was nice, dinner was good. We would definately stay
"Walking distance to downtown shops & restaurants"
It was ok. room wasn't very big in size. However, location on riverfront park downtown is convenient & beautiful!Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Meh"
So many kids in the pool park and downtown"
It was great. had a really great time. enjoyed your food at the restaurant. very kid friendlyHotels.com 真实住客点评
"Great Place"
Wish parking was free but other than that it's a great location if your going to an event at The Spokane Arena- it's literally a 6-8 minute walk. Also great if your wanting to just shop on Division and North Town Mall. Small room but it was nicely updated- appreciated the fridge & microwave. Sorry- didn't use pool or restuarants so cannot comment on […] that although price wise it was a little higher than your average breakfast place. We got it on sale and then booked using our phone (extra 5 bucks off- mobile exclusive) and paid 75 & tax so it was a good deal. Don't know if Id pay the usual $99 plus $9 parking and tax. ALSO they didn't say anything about the price of parking, I had called prior to find out. So if I hadn't called I wouldn't have known there was a charge. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Red Lion Hotel at the Park"
We had another nice stay at this hotel. The front desk people were very welcoming. Our concierge helped up get a shuttle, as quick as he could. The breakfast menu was nice and children ate free, which was a wonderful perk from the hotel, as we had our grandson with us. One night was a little noisy , as some parents let their children run up and down […] the hallway untill 11:30 . I am sure the front desk would have handled it, had I given them a call . All in all a well maitained and well run facility . We will be back ! 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Hidden cost"
I have stayed at other motels in the Spokane area and had better services and larger rooms at lower cost. Plus the hidden parking fee not included in the posted price of the stay.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Thank you so very much for providing us with your review of our property. I apologize that our rooms and service weren't up to your standards. We do have many different sized rooms including suites. We also have packages in which include parking as well. We hope that you return to our hotel soon. Warm Regards, Brent A.
"Had a great stay!"
The hotel was very clean but the room was a bit small. Everyone was very nice and the service in the cafe/bar was great! I would stay there againHotels.com 真实住客点评
"Old Hotel/Poor Service"
First off the bedspread was dirty or stained and so was the shower curtain. There were cobwebs in the corners of the main room, the fridge worked but was broken and falling apart, plus there was no bathroom fan. The room was freezing cold and the thermostat was broken. The batteries in the remote were dead. When we went down to the front desk to ask […] for new ones it took the girl over 25 minutes to find out that the maintenance guys were "gone home", that she didn't know where to get batteries from and that we "could purchase some in the vending machine"! Speaking of vending machines, the chips we purchased were best before March, 2012. And to top it all off, housekeeping woke us up at 9am. All in all, this was a pretty shabby old hotel with poor service and a hefty pricetag. There are many hotels in Spokane with lower stars that are way nicer than this hotel. We will not stay here again and will not recommend this hotel to anyone. 阅读更多信息Expedia 真实住客点评
For a 3.5 star hotel I expected better. There was a newer and older pset to the hotel. Unfortunately we were in the older part. I was disappointed. The room was old and we had this awkward bar as soon as you walked in. Will not stay here again.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Disappointed"
Price far exceeded the service. Towels were frayed, room was hot. Gated parking would not let me exit. Overall, just a room to stay in nothing more.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"You may want to check other options."
No problem with the Hotel, have stayed there several times, but they have recently added "Pay Parking" and it is a big pain. Must go through a metered gate coming and going. This hotel also has No Breakfast, so $9.00 for parking plus no breakfast makes other hotels more appealing!Expedia 真实住客点评
"Decent Hotel at a great price!"
The hotel is a great place to stay in when visiting Spokane. I did enjoy my stay, however, some things did disappoint me. The blinds of my room were broken and dirty and stained, the shower area wasn't the cleanest, but it was ok. The price of the room was very good, given that the location was downtown and I had a great view. The parking was $8 per […] night, a little much but I felt like my car was safe during my stay. I would probably stay at the hotel again. 阅读更多信息Expedia 真实住客点评
"Road trip and mediocre room"
the front desk staff were incredible. some of the other staff seemed a little grumpy. I don't know if it was because we were younger or what, but some of staff weren't rude, but didn't seem too friendly either. My hotel room was good with the except of the bathroom. the toilet wasn't flushing, my buddy popped the top and fixed it. and the shower in […] our room had leaky spout and water pressure wasn't the greatest. the heater in the room was super noisy. i couldn't sleep well because of it. I was only there for 2day, had it been longer i would've had to complain. The best thing about stay here was that we were downtown and everything was very close. the price was good, but now i kind of know why, this wasn't the best room in the hotel, not even close bit pricey for what you get"
They like to nickel and dime you to death. Charges for everything or every service. $9 per day parking is a bit much. Room service is pricey too.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Thank you so much for choosing to stay with us. We do offer great rates that include parking and breakfast. we also have rates that just include one or the other as well. We look forward on welcoming you back. Regards, Brent A.
My stay was great.But upon check in was not informed about having to pay for parking,a $9.00 charge was on my visa when i checked out.I dont mind paying for parking but i think i should of been told upon arrival.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
"Great Value"
Great value, beautiful scenic hotel in the heart of Spokane on the river. Staff was very friendly and helpful. Clean, comfortable rooms. Definitely recommend this hotel.Expedia 真实住客点评
"nice place to stay"
polite friendly staff, courtesy shuttle to and from event we were attending. close to restaraunts and downtown. would definitely stay there again.Expedia 真实住客点评
"Quiet, Clean, Convenient"
Very pleasant and beautiful. Staff very pleasant, friendly and helpful. Great room overlooking the pool and river staff great, restaurant staff needs help..."
The overall stay was great. The waiter for dinner in the restaurant was not prompt with seating, menus and the overall dining experience. The hostess in the morning for the continental breakfast was rude and very condesending. The front desk staff were all very efficient and friendly and could give their customer service as training to the restaurant […] staff. Overall hotel wise, a pleasant hotel. 阅读更多信息Expedia 真实住客点评
"Nice Hotel"
Nice hotel. They accepted our small pet with no problem. Gave us a room with a view. Bed was very comfortable...The only thing that I was disappointed in was that they charge for parking and that they charge for breakfast buffet...Talk about nickel and diming! But overall I would stay here again.Expedia 真实住客点评
The staff was excellent, the room was clean, everything fine. Only thing was the room configuration was a bit strange. We reserved a king sized bed and when we arrived in the room, we discovered it was a combo sitting room/bedroom and the TV was located in the sitting area. Bit incovenient for people who like to watch TV from bed.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Jan- Thank you so very much for taking the time to rate us on Hotels.com. We are happy you enjoyed your stay. We look forward on to welcoming you back in the near future. Warm Regards, Brent A.
"Very clean and comfy room"
First let me stay I am very picky about hotels and cleanliness. While we were only at the hotel for 12 hours the room and bathroom were very clean, the bed very comfortable and lots of comfy pillows. We did not take advantage of the breakfast buffet @ $9.95 but was impressed with the price compared to going out and finding another option. We did not […] enjoy the pool but when we walked by it looked very inviting and had a hot tub. It was a good value and would stay here again. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Than you so much for your comments. We take pride in the level of cleanliness of our property. We look forward to your next stay with us so that we may exceed your expectations. Thank you for staying with us! Warm Regards, Brent A.
"Disappointing"
The service at the front desk was less than satisfactory and we had to pay an additional fee for parking. Shouldn't parking be included? It was poor customer service and extremely frustrating that at no time while I was booking was I told about this ridiculous parking fee. The heat in the room had been running for a while prior to our arrival so the […] room was uncomfortably hot when we arrived, it never came down to a comfortable temperature even after turning the heat off and opening the windows (it was 30 degrees outside and snowing). The room was also very small, the beds and appliances were very nice but felt very crammed into a tiny space. The furniture looks new and modern but you can still tell it is an older building; features in the bathroom were aged and falling apart. The bathroom appeared clean but the bathtub was full of long black hairs that did not belong to me or my guest. There were also only a few outlets to plug things into (i.e. phone chargers) and they were difficult to find or access. Overall I was disappointed. I paid half the price for a hotel the night before and the room had been twice the size, the parking free, breakfast included and the customer service far superior. If I have the choice again I will not be staying at this hotel. 阅读更多信息Hotels.com 真实住客点评
It was a not a good expirence. No one mentioned we would be charged a $9.00 parking fee charged on my card later. The shower curtain had a mildew smell and their was gum stuck on the carpet between the beds. Other than than it served our needs and was close to the Spokane Arena. Certainly not what I expected from that hotel.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
Red Lion Hotel at the Park - Spokane 的回复 Kenddra- Thank you for taking the time to review us on Hotels.com. I truly apologize that the $9.00 parking charge wasn't brought to your attention before or prior to you checking out. I have also forwarded your cleanliness issue with your room to my Director of Housekeeping so that she may follow up. I hope that you would choose Red Lion foryour destination of choice in the near future.We look forward to welcome you back. Warm Regards, Brent A.-comfortable"
We enjoyed our stay at the Red Lion, will definetely stay again! Our only complaint would be the chilly draft from an older sliding glass door.Hotels.com 真实住客点评
The sheets on the bed there was Sour hair the bathroom tab on the wall the first room we check into there were sour food in the refrigeratorHotels.com 真实住客点评
"Great place"
The kids loved the pool. It was open early in the morning until late in the evening. Rooms were clean, beds very comfortable。 |
Stylist
Hold up, buddy.
Disaster Averted
Okay, believe it or not, I have to tell a quick real-life story: as you may have garnered, I try to sort of tell a cohesive story when I write these Sims guides. As I finished the last section, I was trying to figure out how to change their careers to cover the rest of the guide… do I start giving them kids? Do I switch back to the original Schultzes, with Samson’s cousin Dannie?
Then… I was hit with Save Error 12 (check the Bugs Q&A section for details), and wouldn’t you know it? I lost IGN Guide Town!!! My last backup is from six months ago, so I’ve had to come to a tough decision… we’re going to let the Schultzes rest in peace, only to live on in pictures and downloads from the official Sims 3 site.
Instead, we’re going to move to New IGN Guide Town, in the new Twinbrook neighborhood. Our NEW stars (hopefully for the rest of the guide series) are a trio of Sims, and we’ll meet them one at a time. First up, is Destiny Carwin…!
Getting Started
Destiny, clearly, is not your typical Sim who wants a conventional career. She wants to paint the world—or at least the neighborhood—using other Sims’ bodies as her canvas. She calls a taxi and heads over to Drea’s Salon, which is already placed because this is the Twinbrook template. She signs up for the job with no problem.
As with other interactive jobs, there are three responsibilities for Destiny to pay attention to in order to get promoted. However, unlike the other careers, being a stylist does not require any job skills. Destiny gets promoted by successfully fulfilling styling requests, by earning tips as a result of those requests, and by building her portfolio of successes. That third one is probably the one that’s not self-explanatory, so we’ll get to that one eventually.
Styling hours are Tuesday through Saturday, and it’s currently Sunday morning, so it’s going to be awhile. That’s fine, though: this is a new family, which means I need to get their cooking and so on developed, and put her two roommates into part-time jobs for now. And I’m sure none of you need to see any of that.
Ah, Destiny automatically gets a contract to do a styling job. By clicking the button, Destiny hops in a taxi and heads down to the salon. There, she meets the client, as well as a little mini storyline behind the contract. Turns out that Pattina Knack wants some new threads for her athletic outfit because she wants to look her best for a gym opening. Not the most prestigious order in the world, but it has to start somewhere.
Destiny heads over to one of the makeover stations, which looks like this…
The two cabinets, the mirror, and the platform in front of the mirror collectively is a makeover station. Destiny interacts with the platform in front of the mirror, but can interact with any of the four objects to start the process. She picks the “Offer Makeover To…” command, then selects Pattina from the selection box that pops up. While she can offer a makeover to anyone on the lot, until she builds up some trust, random strangers might refuse her. Because Pattina has offered a contract, Pattina will guarantee to accept the offer. By the way, a copy of the contract as it were is on the left side of the screen, just in case Destiny forgets who contracted her or what the contracted Sim wants. (Destiny is a blond, after all!)
Making Over a Sim
We come to a modified Create-A-Sim screen. Destiny can actually affect everything here: hair, clothes, and makeup; everything except facial structure. However, because Destiny is contracted only to do an athletic outfit, that’s what we need to concentrate on now.
There is a lot of freedom here: Sims typically don’t care what they look like, oddly enough. There is no reason you can’t give all your clients the same outfits, or a butt-ugly outfit, or an outfit that is completely hideous to look at. Destiny decides, what the heck, let’s give this elder something that will attract the eyes…
Oh yeah: that will turn some heads!
Destiny hits the check mark, and… uh… it didn’t turn out so well. Hm… perhaps giving her an outfit that can cause video epilepsy may not have been the best choice? Destiny makes the offer again for a makeover… Ah, I see the problem. See, Pattina wanted a new athletic outfit, and what I did was recolored her outfit. Here’s the magic button you need to click…
That’s the “add an outfit” button, and remember that any given category of clothing can have up to three outfits. You probably won’t come to that limit when dealing with Townies, but your own Sims might get up there if you switch up their clothes often enough.
Now, remember that Destiny is just giving a random makeover here: she only gets one chance per contract, and she already failed once. However, she goes ahead and makes a new outfit for Pattina anyway, something a bit more conservative. Because this is a freelance makeover, Destiny earns a tip.
Or rather, she would have, but according to a message that pops up, Pattina refuses to pay. Sims have a 24-hour cooldown when they get made over, which means that Pattina won’t pay again for a makeover for one more day. The makeover “takes” in the sense that Pattina now has a new athletic outfit, but Destiny doesn’t have anything to show for it. This is to keep you from abusing the system, so to speak, by making over only one Sim a million times per day.
No matter. Destiny starts offering her services to anyone on the lot, giving quick hairstyle changes and color changes to existing outfits. Each one earns her a little cash, plus job experience. The cash she earns from styling far outweighs her weekly stipend: she gets about $100 per makeover and makes a measly $178 weekly, meaning she earns more with just two makeovers than from a whole week of doing nothing. (Elementary math FTW!) Clearly, Destiny is on her way.
All is not perfect: because she is a poor stylist (level 1 remember), she has a rather strong chance of failing a freelance makeover. Failing one basically randomizes the client’s makeup and possibly their clothes, making them look like something out of a horror movie, or perhaps a Marten Jansen painting.
The next day, Destiny gets a new contract, and vows not to mess it up. Her client, Penny Pincher (seriously?!), wants a new hair color. Well, there is no option to “add a hair color” like there is to add an outfit, so just recoloring Penny’s hair should do. Naturally, nothing can possibly go wrong with this.
Ugh. Well, Penny likes it, which is all that really matters. With a successful contract completed, a popup box insists that Penny gets her picture taken. You don’t even have a choice here: the game kicks you to picture taking interface. Your Z and X buttons change the zoom, and your C key takes the shot. For some reason, you can’t pause the game, and Penny keeps dancing around in various poses just to annoy me. Oh well… I get a half-decent shot, and the picture goes into Destiny’s portfolio.
This is a good time to talk about the portfolio, actually. As soon as Destiny got her job here, she got a PDA, which went right into her inventory. Destiny can check it out through her inventory, and view all the pictures she’s taken. Now, the way the portfolio works is that there are different contracts needed to fill it up. For example, Destiny’s first picture here is “New Hair Color.” If she encounters another Sim who wants their hair redone, Destiny will still earn the job experience and the cash for doing so, but her portfolio will not get better. However, the next time Destiny gets a new contact type, her portfolio will grow.
When you open the PDA, you can pull pictures out of it, and the picture becomes a standard item. That means you can hang the picture on the wall or put it on a desk, or even sell it (though they always sell for $0). This doesn’t really help you out at all, and in fact for Destiny, it would be counterproductive: she wants pictures in her portfolio to help with her job progress and experience, and removing the pics removes the progress of the portfolio. Still, she can unload the pictures if, for some reason, she wants to change careers.
On her third day, Destiny gets a pretty large contract: she is to give Jenni Jones-Brown a new everyday outfit, two new sleepwear outfits, two new formalwear outfits, and a new swimwear outfit. This one will take awhile…
Once Destiny finishes, she sadly doesn’t get paid in scale to the task; in fact, she’s only paid a measly $60, despite making six new outfits. She does however get a new entry to her portfolio and some job experience, both of which are arguably better than petty cash.
Working From Home
After finishing with that client, Destiny gets a bit hungry for lunch, and she decides to go home… and is still on the clock! That’s right, Destiny can work from home, except for contracts. At the moment, she’s made over everyone else at the salon, so she decides to just go home for now and have lunch.
While she’s there, Destiny decides to make a quick purchase. She drops $750 on a drafting table, which can be found in the Hobbies & Skills subsort of the Study sort, plus a bit more for a special stool, which you can buy from the same subsort. Her room gets a bit cramped, but they can’t afford much more at the moment…
Man, this is the whole reason why I kept the Schultzes around is so I wouldn’t run into money problems like this for the sake of the guide. Bah. Well, I promise, when The Sims 3: Late Night comes out, the Carwins will be ready to roll. Oh sure, I could throw in a “rosebud” or two, but heck, what fun is that? And you get to see how my poor Sims can claw their way to the top!
AAANNNYYYway… The whole point of the drafting table is to give Destiny a way to flesh out her skills. By interacting with the drafting table, she can increase her painting skill, as well as new fashion concepts or architectural designs. Hm… Valerie might want to steal the drafting table for her purposes, so Destiny decides to just lock her door. Hey, they may be sisters, and they may love each other, but Destiny has never liked sharing. I heard once that as a toddler, she beat Valerie with the arm of her own teddy bear.
As with all skills, a progress bar fills as she works on the drafting table. Regardless of what she picks, Destiny is gaining experience toward her painting skill. However, there is a key difference among the various options. Because Destiny is employed as a Stylist, every moment she is studying fashion concepts, she is gaining job experience! This makes learning the actual painting skill a bit slower, but it helps get her promoted up the ladder a heck of a lot faster.
Destiny hits Level 2 of the Stylist career track before the end of the week. On her fifth workday, she is not alerted when it’s time to go to work… yet there is a contract waiting for her. This goes to show you that the message alerts for contracts don’t show up once your Stylist gets past being a newbie. There is a hint here: if Destiny goes to her job panel, she sees the phrase “On the clock” in red rather than the usual dark navy. When “On the clock” is red, that means a contract is waiting for her, and she needs to leave the house. When “On the clock” is navy, she can stay home and just work on her drafting table.
No problem though: she drives over to the salon, takes her contract, and gets some job experience. Note that this is a new contract type, one that includes the client getting a new hairstyle and a new accessory in addition to a new outfit. “Accessory” can be anything from new earrings to a pair of glasses or even socks: just something new.
Freestylin'
Starting the next week, Destiny is at Level 3 in her Stylist career track. At that point, she’s allowed to give “freestyle makeovers,” which really is a fancy way of saying that she gets to go to other people’s homes to do the makeovers rather than the salon. I still need to open her job panel and, if “On the clock” is red, I need to click the “Go To Work” button that’s there. Rather than going to the salon, Destiny takes the taxi to the client’s home. This time, it’s Phoenix Prudence, who just wants a new hair color. I click him, and we see this…
“Imply client looks like a llama”? Ouch! Well, Destiny is a nice girl and wants to climb up the ranks of being a Stylist, not smack away clients. ‘Twould be fun for a Sim with the Evil trait, I’m sure, but not for our pink-tipped hottie. Destiny goes ahead and fulfills the contract, then heads home to work on her sketches some more.
Once Destiny hits Level 4, things get a lot more active. Now, she’s getting multiple contract offers per day. She gets three contract offers immediately, and takes them in turn, as she’s not on a time limit to get them done, other than the 7pm deadline of her work hours. This allows her to gain job experience rapidly, not to mention the increased cash from the promotions, and manages to cram in even more once she’s free to work on her drafting board.
Destiny eventually hits Level 6. In her job description, one line reads: “Keep your portfolio overflowing with the latest looks, and weed out images of yesterday’s trends.” Despite what that might imply, the game doesn’t care about what your portfolio has in it: all that matters is the portfolio being as full as humanly possible at all times. You might want to remove photos of Sims who are dead if you use the PDA to solicit your styling services, but otherwise, you may as well keep them in.
The final Stylist milestone is at Level 9; though technically you can do it anytime before then, it seems to gain some effectiveness if you wait, and besides, she wasn’t able to afford it before now. Destiny purchases her own salon stuff, which is located in the Hobbies & Skills subsort of the Entertainment sort of Buy Mode. Note that she can buy a makeover station (the two cabinets and a mirror with a platform), as well as her selection of tattoo chairs. She can only afford one due to purchasing a brand new beautiful hot pink car, so she goes for the makeover station.
She can’t invite any Sims directly with the makeover station, but now, whenever she invites friends over, she can immediately force them to have a makeover for some additional money. Again, this is a good excuse to have a makeover party, sort of like those crazy Mary Kay and Avon saleswomen that all you ladies out there know about.
By the way, one advantage to having her own car is that Destiny can now interact with it and use a special “Perform Job: [Whatever]” command to go to a lot and do a freestyle makeover, just in case you accidentally close out the message center window and are too lazy to go into Map View.
It’s pretty much the same routine from here on out: Destiny does contracts when she’s got them, and works on her drafting board when she doesn’t. At this point, her Painting skill is maxed out, so her sketches are fetching over $300 each, making her an additional $750 or more daily in addition to her weekly stipend and her styling fees. She’ll definitely be carrying the family for a bit… at least until we get to the next subsection of the guide, anyway!
Stylist Q&A
Do Sims care about what they look like?
Not really. Unless a Sim has a specific request (which will be listed in their contract on the popup box on the left side of the screen), you can do whatever you want when you makeover a Sim. You can make clashing colors, Mohawks for elders, or any texture for any surface you want. The game basically detects that you did something, leaving the actual makeover’s quality in the eye of you, the gamer.
Gaining promotions seems to take forever, especially because there are no required skills for being a stylist! Any tips?
A simply routine will net you tons of experience points for the Stylist career. Basically, the routine is a simple if/then statement loop: if you have a contract waiting, then go do it at the salon. If you don’t have a contract waiting, every second you’re on the clock, stay home and do the “Research Fashion Designs” command at a drafting table. Your job experience will rocket upward, and you’ll find that you get far more experience and progress just sitting on your butt than actually working. It’s just like being at the IGN offices!
That’s not to say you should only practice your research while you’re on the clock. You’ll gain job experience every so often as long as you’re working on the drafting table (provided you’ve chosen “Research Fashion Designs”) regardless of whether you’re on the clock or not.
Right, good guess! Just head to Map View, filter the tags by “Jobs and Opportunities,” and you’ll see where all your potential clients are located.
How many possible pictures are there for the portfolio?
Forty. Every picture adds 2.5% completion to the portfolio, though it’s rounded down when you check the reports. Simple math tells us that there are 40 different contract types that you can take.
Okay, speaking of the portfolio, does it have any other use other than a picture collection device?
“Picture collection device”? You mean a “camera”? Man, I thought I was the only one who used awkward phrases under the guise of a more sophisticated vocabulary. Anyway, one thing the portfolio does is guarantee you customers. Say you makeover Pete Falkon and take his picture for the portfolio. Now, any time Pete is on the same lot as your stylist, you can use a special command from the PDA called “Solicit Styling Services…” This lets you basically force a previous customer—Pete in this case—to pay you to make him over again. He still won’t pay if you try this more than once per 24 hours, but once you make over the town, you could throw a party some day and solicit your talents on all your party guests for some serious cash.
I took a contract that says I need to give my client new shoes. Which outfit do I apply that to?
It doesn’t really matter, but I always apply new shoes to the client’s every day outfit. Same deal with new hair styles, new hair colors, new makeup, or anything else: I just do it for the everyday outfit by default, but it doesn’t matter. The important thing is doing the new shoes (or whatever) and not doing anything else.
My client wants three new outfits, but she already has one, and I can’t add a fourth! What do I do?
Remember that if it says “new outfit,” it means you can change their current outfit, you just can’t merely recolor it. Recoloring an outfit counts as not giving them anything at all, strangely enough, so you’ll want to change up the top and bottom of an outfit to get your contract fulfilled.
Why is my client yelling at me when I’m visiting him?
You go to clients’ houses to work, not to socialize. Doing literally anything that isn’t related to making over the client).
Top Wiki Contributors
Need assistance with editing this wiki? Check out these resources:
You must be logged in to post a comment.blog comments powered by Disqus |
媒体报道
IMAX is J.J. Abrams' 'favorite headache' in 'Star Trek'
By By Brian Truitt 上 五月月 p...
阅读全文
Marvel’s 'Iron Man 3' to Get IMAX Release
By Etan Vlessing 上 一月. 阅读全文
IMAX to convert Smithsonian to laser projection
By Associated Press 上 一月 obsolet...
阅读全文
'Les Miserables' will open in select IMAX theaters Christmas Day
By Solvej Schou 上 十二月 04, 2012
>>IMAGE. 阅读全 upgr...
阅读全文
The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey IMAX 12:01 Participating Theatres
By IMAX 上 十一月 28, 2012
>>IMAGE 1... 阅读全文
High Frame Rate Theatres playing The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey
By IMAX 上 十一月 07, 2012 09, 2012
... 阅读全文
'Paranormal Activity 4' set for IMAX
By Andrew Stewart 上 十月 09, 2012
. 阅读全文
IMAX: Regal Entertainment Expand Joint Venture Theater Deal
By Etan Vlessing 上 十月 阅读全文
'Cloud Atlas' Getting IMAX Release
By Brent Lang 上 九...
阅读全文
‘Frankenweenie’ in IMAX: See it early, free, with Martin Landau
By The LA Times Hero Complex Staff 上 九...
阅读全文
'Cloud Atlas' Sails into IMAX Theaters October 26
By Etan Vlessing 上 九...
阅读全文
‘Dhoom 3’ To Be First Indian Film To Hit IMAX Theatres
By IB Times Staff Reporter 上 九 阅读全文
Frankenweenie (Animated)
By Justin Chang 上 九...
阅读全月...
阅读全文
Frankenweenie IMAX 12:01 Participating Theatres
By IMAX 上 九月 20, 2012
R... 阅读全文
INTERVIEW: IMAX Sees No Slowdown in China, Seeks More Local Films
By Aaron Back 上 九月-...
阅读全文
IMAX Expands Second-Screen Concept in Quebec With Three-Theater Deal
By Etan Vlessing 上 九 ...
阅读全文
IMAX to Re-Master More Films for China’s Huayi Bros.Variety
By Georg Szalai 上 九月 remai...
阅读全文
Controlling My Own Destiny
By Richard Gelfond 上 九月 08, 2012
, 阅读全文
How IMAX Fits the Larger Than Life Fun of 'Raiders of the Lost Ark'
By Brian Salisbury 上 九月 04, 2012
阅读全文
'The Dark Knight Rises' Crosses $100 Million Box Office Milestone on IMAX Screens
By Etan Vlessing 上 九月 04, 2012
... 阅读全文
IMAX Projects Bigscreen Dreams for Europe
By Robert Mitchell 上 九月 01, 2012
? A... 阅读全文
IMAX Finds China
By Heng Shao 上 八月 28, 2012
c...月 15, 2012
y... 阅读全文
That’s a Big Boulder, Indy: Steven Spielberg on the IMAX Rerelease of ‘Raiders of the Lost Ark’
By Dave Itzkoff 上 八月 14, 2012
... 阅读全文
Canada's IMAX Adds to India Footprint With PVR Cinemas Deal
By Etan Vlessing 上 八 Marc...
阅读全文
How IMAX Became the Hottest Brand in Movies
By Brent Lang 上 八月 05, 2012
... 阅读全文
Strong B.O. boosts IMAX profits: Net profit surges to $11.1 million
By Jill Goldsmith 上 七...
阅读全文
‘Dark Knight Rises' Breaking Blighty records
By Robert Mitchell 上 七月 18, 2012
>>IMAGE... 阅读全文
BEST KNIGHT OF YOUR LIFE
By Lou Lumenick 上 七月 18, 2012
... 阅读全文
The Dark Knight Rises' to Beat BFI IMAX Record
By Stuart Kemp 上 七月 18, 2012
阅读全文
How the Dark Knight Rose in IMAX
By Stephen Kelly 上 七月 17, 2012
阅读全文
The IMAX Difference, Blockbuster Size
By MEKADO MURPHY 上 七月 16, 2012
involvin... 阅读全文
The Dark Knight Rises: Film Review
By Todd McCarthy 上 七月 15, 2012
lack... 阅读全文
Christian Bale: 'Dark Knight Rises' Goes Full Circle
By Bruce Kirkland 上 七月 13, 2012
windo... 阅读全文
Exclusive: 'The Dark Knight Rises' IMAX 12:01 Poster Premiere!
By John Halecky 上 七月 10, 2012
阅读全文
The Dark Knight Rises 12:01 IMAX Giveaway
By IMAX 上 七月 10, 2012
ame...
. 阅读全文
Canada's Empire Theaters Takes IMAX Screens to Alberta, Ontario Multiplexes
By Etan Vlessing 上 六月 12, 2012
阅读全文
Prometheus 12:01 IMAX Giveaway
By IMAX 上 六月 01, 2012
in... 阅读全文
Cinemas Guzzo first multiplex to add second IMAX screen
By Andreas Wiseman 上 六月 01, 2012
. 阅读全文
'Men in Black 3' Posts Record Memorial Day Opening Weekend for IMAX
By Etan Vlessing 上 六月 01, 2012
6-Minute Spider-Man Preview in IMAX This Weekend
By Marvel 上 五月 23, 2012
Fans who head out to see "Men in Black III" in IMAX 3D starting this Friday, May 25 will get a special sneak peak at "The Amazing Spider-Man" in theaters and IMAX 3D July 3! Read more on Marvel.com 阅读全文
'Men in Black 3' to Open in 474 IMAX Theaters Worldwide
By Etan Vlessing 上 五月 22, 2012
阅读全文
Take an inside look at the new IMAX Theatre at Celebration! Crossroads in Portage (video)
By John Liberty 上 五月 16, 2012
righ... 阅读全文
IMAX Corporation Reports First Quarter 2012 Financial Results
By IMAX 上 四月 26, 2012
,... 阅读全文
A Polar Bear and Her Cubs are the Stars of 'To the Arctic'
By IMAX 上 四月 20, 2012
t... 阅读全文
The Hunger Games Returns To Select IMAX® Theatres For A One Week Engagement
By IMAX 上 四月 20, 2012
... 阅读全文
LIONSGATE’S THE HUNGER GAMES BREAKS OPENING WEEKEND RECORDS IN IMAX® THEATRES
By IMAX 上 三月 28, 2012
th... 阅读全文
Titanic in 3D to Set Sail for a Limited Engagement in Select IMAX® Theatres on April 4
By IMAX 上 三月 13, 2012
... 阅读全文
Prometheus to be Released in IMAX® 3D on June 8
By IMAX 上 三月 08, 2012
Theron.... 阅读全文
Tim Burton's Frankenweenie to be Released in IMAX® 3D on October 5
By IMAX 上 三月 06, 2012
direct... 阅读全文
UNIVERSAL PICTURES AND ILLUMINATION ENTERTAINMENT’S DR. SEUSS' THE LORAX COMES TO LIFE IN IMAX® THEATRES
By IMAX 上 二月... 阅读全文
Albert R. Broccoli's EON Productions, Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer Studios, and Sony Pictures Entertainment to Release the James Bond Film SKYFALL in IMAX® Theatres
By IMAX 上 二月 a... 阅读全文
The Hunger Games to be Released in IMAX for One Week
By IMAX 上 二月 01, 2012
... 阅读全文
Marvel's The Avengers To Be Released In IMAX 3D on May 4, 2012
By IMAX 上 一月 31, 2012
thir... 阅读全文
OSCAR® WINNER MERYL STREEP TO NARRATE NEW IMAX® 3D ADVENTURE DOCUMENTARY TO THE ARCTIC
By IMAX 上 一月 23, 2012
... 阅读全文
Paramount's Mission Impossible - Ghost Protocol Generates More Than $46 Million in IMAX Theatres Globally Since Early IMAX Previews Film to Arrive in IMAX Theatres Across China in January
By IMAX 上 一月 03, 2012
worldwi... 阅读全文
IMAX® POSTS RECORD DECEMBER OPENING BOX OFFICE RESULTS WITH MISSION: IMPOSSIBLE - GHOST PROTOCOL
By IMAX 上 十二月 20, 2011
addition... 阅读全文
Reviews for Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol
By IMAX 上 十二月 16, 2011
阅读全文
The Dark Knight Rises Prologue
By IMAX 上 十二月 06, 2011
The Dark Knight Rises prologue will play before Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol EXCLUSIVELY in select 15/70mm IMAX® film theatres beginning December 16th. Find a list of locations here. 阅读全文
Director Andrew Stanton introduces the new John Carter trailer
By IMAX 上 十二月 05, 2011
John Carter director Andrew Stanton greets IMAX fans in an introduction to the new trailer! 阅读全文
Happy Feet Two and the voices of Pink, Sofia Vergara in IMAX 3D
By Anissa Ford 上 十一月 18, 2011
mo... 阅读全文
Tom Cruise To Visit India for 'MI4: Ghost Protocol' Premiere
By Nyay Bhushan 上 十一月 10, 2011
... 阅读全文
Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol Footage Reviews
By IMAX 上 十一月 01, 2011
." Read More ComingSoon.netNew Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol Trailer & Footage Screened! (by Ryan Turek)"...hair-raising stuff, folks, let me tell you." Read More Cinem... 阅读全文
Reviews for The Adventures of Tintin: The Secret of the Unicorn
By IMAX 上 十月 19, 2011
." 阅读全文
Review: Rocky Mountain Express
By Jaye Stone 上 十月 03, 2011
. 阅读全文
IMAX Corporation and MacGillivray Freeman Films Plan Long-Term Content Alliance
By IMAX 上 九月 26, 2011
... 阅读全文
Sony Pictures Entertainment to Release Men in Black(TM) 3 in IMAX(R) 3D
By IMAX 上 九月 13, 2011
LOS ANGELES, Sept. 12, 2011 (GLOBE NEWSWIRE) -- IMAX Corporation (NYSE:IMAX) (TSX:IMX) and Sony Pictures Entertainment today announced that the action comedy Men in Black(TM) 3 will be released to IMAX(R) theatres simultaneously with the film's worldwide release on May 25, 2012. Directed by Barry Sonnenfeld, Men in Black 3 is the first in the franchise to be released in IMAX. Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones are back in black in Men in Black 3. Directed byBarry Sonnenfeld from a screenplay written by Etan Cohen, based on the Malibu Comic by Lowell Cunningham, the film is produced Walter F. Parkes and LaurieMacDonald and executive produced by Steven Spielberg and G... 阅读全文
"Men in Black 3" to be releasedin IMAX 3D
By Joshua L. Weinstein 上 九月 13, 2011
LOS ANGELES (TheWrap.com) -. Read more on reuters.com... 阅读全文
IMAX Corporation Expands Kinomax Partnership In Russia
By IMAX 上 九月 09, 2011
Mos ... 阅读全文
Viral times: 'Contagion' makes pandemic feel real
By David Germain 上 九月 06, 2011
-re... 阅读全文
At Venice, is 'Contagion' following 'The Town's' awards playbook?
By Nicole Sperling 上 九月 01, 2011
p... 阅读全文
IMAX reached a second multiple-theater deal in 2011 with Jiangsu Eudemonia Blue Ocean Cinema for eastern China.
By Etan Vlessing 上 八月 26, 2011
. 阅读全文
Inside the world of IMAX 3D projectionists
By Rob Boffard 上 八月 23, 2011
pa... 阅读全文
Paramount Pictures' 3-D Movie Transformers: Dark of the Moon Launches Back Into IMAX(R) Theatres for Extended Two-Week Run; Film Grosses $1,095 Billion to Date
By IMAX 上 八月 23, 2011
... 阅读全文
‘Rescue 3D’ Makes Spectacular Use of IMAX
By Patrick McD 上 八月 22, 2011
... 阅读全文
Tornado chasers' truck shoots IMAX from inside storms
By James Martin 上 八月 22, 2011
.) 阅读全文
Watch: Trailer For Tsui Hark’s IMAX Sized ‘Flying Swords of Dragon Gate’ With Jet Li
By Kevin Jagernauth 上 八月 22, 2011
While. 阅读全文
IMAX to Super-Size First Chinese Language 3D Movie
By Etan Vlessing 上 八月 18, 2011
TORONTO -- Imax Corp. on Wednesday said it will super-size the $35 million epic Flying Swords of Dragon Gate from China’s Bona Film Group, ahead of a Christmas release. Flying Swords comes from director Tsui Hark, with Jet Li in the lead. IMAX will digitally re-master the 3D martial arts movie into its own 3D format, for release to IMAX theatres in China day-and-date in December 2011. Flying Swords will be the first Chinese-language project to be released in Imax 3D, and the third Chinese language movie released by IMAX. 阅读全文
Sneak peek: 'Happy Feet Two in 3D'
By Scott Bowles 上 八月 18, 2011
. 阅读全文
Tom Cruise in overdrive
By Michael Rechtshaffen 上 八月 17, 2011
HOLLYWOOD - It's full speed ahead for Tom Cruise. Looking to reactivate his career with the Dec. 21 release of Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol, Cruise has been keeping busy these days, what with his big-screen singing debut in the rock musical, Rock of Ages, currently shooting and due out next summer. Then he'll be returning to action mode with One Shot, a crime drama in the A Few Good Men mode in which he'd play an ex-military cop investigating a homicide case that's expected to start shooting this fall. Read More on Torontosun.com...... 阅读全文
3net - the 24/7 3D Network From Sony, Discovery and IMAX - and Red Bull Media House North America Bring Red Bull's Iconic Sports and Entertainment Events to 3D Television for the First Time Ever
By 3Net 上 八月 17, 2011
. 阅读全文
3-D movie sales on rise
By Herald News Services 上 八月 16, 2011
. 阅读全文
Harry Potter 7 Pt. 2 and Transformers 3 Lead IMAX B.O. to $120 million Quarter-to-Date through Aug. 14
By IMAX 上 八月 15, 2011
. 阅读全文
IMAX Posts $5.5 million Global Box Office Weekend
By IMAX 上 八月 15, 2011
ac... 阅读全文
SECTOR 7 in IMAX® 3D Posts Strong Opening
By IMAX 上 八月 10, 2011
... 阅读全文
'Dark Knight Rises:' Catwoman Wrecks IMAX Camera on Set
By Lindsay Powers 上 八月 09, 2011
The first casualty of The Dark Knight Rises set? An expensive IMAX camera. Anne Hathaway's stunt double smashed a camera on the Pittsburgh set Monday. Read More on HollywoodReporter.com 阅读全文
Cruise Initiates 'Ghost Protocol'
By David Weiner 上 八月 09, 2011
阅读全文
Disney's 'John Carter' to Debut in IMAX 3D
By Joshua L. Weinstein 上 八月 阅读全文
'Final Destination 5' Set for Day-and-Date Release on Imax 3D Screens
By Etan Vlessing 上 八月 04, 2011
. Read More on HollywoodReporter.com 阅读全文
3net - the 24/7 3D Network from Discovery, Sony and IMAX - Extends Discovery Channel's Iconic 'Shark Week' Telecast with a 'SHARKS 3D' 24-hour Marathon Event
By IMAX 上 八月 01, 2011
s... 阅读全文
Potter of Gold: 'Deathly Hallows, Part 2' Passes $1B
By Daniel Frankel 上 八月 Sund... 阅读全文
Sony's 'Amazing Spider-Man' Gets the IMAX Treatment
By Brent Lang 上 七月... 阅读全文
The Hero Complex Screening Series – Presented by IMAX
By IMAX 上 七月. 阅读全文
Transformers: Dark of the Moon Sets IMAX Record in China
By IMAX 上 七月 25, 2011
. 阅读全文
The first trailer for The Dark Knight Rises has surfaced!
By IMAX.com 上 七月 19, 2011
The Dark Knight Rises is in IMAX July 20, 2012. Read more on IMAX.com... 阅读全文
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 2 Opens to Record $23.2 Million in IMAX
By IMAX 上 七月 19, 2011
. 阅读全文
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Finale Is 3-D Done Right
By Hugh Hart 上 七月 15, 2011
. ... 阅读全文
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 2 Sets Midnight Box Office Record
By Christina Warren 上 七月. 阅读全文
“Cowboys and Aliens” coming to IMAX in international territories
By Sean O'Connell 上 七月.” <... 阅读全文
.'Transformers 3': 5 Things You Didn't Know About Its Sound
By Carolyn Giardina 上 七月 01, 2011
. 阅读全文
Check out the new Mission Impossible: Ghost Protocol trailer on IMAX.com
By IMAX 上 六. 阅读全文
'Transformers: Dark of the Moon' aims to revive 3-D movies
By Scott Bowles 上 六月 29, 2011
oth... 阅读全文
Review: 'Transformers: Dark Of The Moon' wraps up with the best of the franchise
By Drew McWeeny 上 六月 28, 2011
Let's start with this: for the first time since "Avatar," I am going to recommend that you find the biggest and best 3D theater you can find and buy yourself a ticket, because "Transformers: Dark Of The Moon," especially seen in IMAX 3D, is an overwhelming sensory experience.." 阅读全文
Cars 2 Opens to $3 Million in IMAX Global Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 28, 2011
Cars 2: An IMAX 3D Experience opened on June 24th and generated $3 million in global box office in its opening weekend. The film grossed $2 million domestically and $1 million internationally. 阅读全文
Kung Fu Panda 2 Generates ~$8 Million in IMAX International Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 27, 2011
Kung Fu Panda 2: An IMAX 3D Experience has generated approximately $8 million in international gross box office to date. 阅读全文
Super 8 Reaches $10 Million in IMAX Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 27, 2011
Super 8: The IMAX Experience has generated approximately $10 million in worldwide gross box office to date. The film has grossed ~$9 million in domestic IMAX theatres and ~$1 million in approximately 35 international IMAX theatres to date. 阅读全文
Pirates of the Caribbean Reaches $40 Million Worldwide IMAX Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 24, 2011
Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides: An IMAX 3D Experience has reached $40 million in worldwide gross box office. The film has generated approximately $22 million in international theatres and $18 million in domestic theatres. 阅读全文
New technology revs up Pixar's 'Cars 2'
By Daniel Terdiman 上 六月 21, 2011
th... 阅读全文
'Transformers: Dark of the Moon' to Debut Day Early in Select 3D, Imax Theaters
By THR Staff 上 六月 21, 2011
.” Read More On Hollywo... 阅读全文
Exclusive: 'Transformers: Dark of the Moon' IMAX 3D Poster Premiere!
By John Halecky 上 六月 15, 2011
Just in time for today's lunar eclipse, the kind folks over at IMAX/Paramount have given us the exclusive IMAX 3D poster premiere for the latest Transformers installment, Transformers: Dark of the Moon An IMAX 3D Experience, opening June 29th. In the poster, Optimus Prime does not look too happy. The third movie in the franchise brings back Shia LaBeouf alongside newcomer and Victoria's Secret supermodel Rosie Huntington-Whiteley as his love interest. Lucky Shia! Read More on Fandango.com... 阅读全文
China's Revival gets IMAX boost
By Patrick Frater 上 六月 15, 2011
, w... 阅读全文
JJ Abrams Says ‘Mission: Impossible – Ghost Protocol’ IMAX footage “is looking INSANE”!
By Peter Sciretta 上 六月 14, 2011
ush... 阅读全文
How can this end well? Find out in IMAX 3D on July 15th!
By Kate Ward 上 六月 14, 2011
The. 阅读全文
'Super 8' In IMAX: Will you be seeing J.J. Abrams' retro sci-fi opus on the big screen or REALLY BIG screen?
By Jeff Jensen 上 六月 10, 2011
Super 8 — which has become something of an obsession here at EW.com, as our recent bevy of posts on the film can attest — opens throughout the day on 325 screens in North America as part of a sneak preview push organized by Paramount Pictures and Twitter. The slate of showings is also a big deal for IMAX, which is hosting the majority of these previews: Never before has the exhibitor effectively opened a movie on this many of its locations. “We have been talking for some time the notion about having a release window this early,” says Greg Foster, chairman and president of Filmed Entertainment at IMAX. “This is new territory for us. We have opened a couple movi... 阅读全文
J.J. Abrams Talks SUPER 8, the Viral Campaign, Amblin, Easter Eggs, STAR TREK 2, and Reveals Leonard Nimoy is in SUPER 8
By Steve 'Frosty' Weintraub 上 六月 07, 2011
fil... 阅读全文
Thor Strikes $17 million in Worldwide IMAX Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 02, 2011
Thor: An IMAX 3D Experience has generated $11.4 million in domestic gross box office and $6.0 million internationally through June 1, 2011, for a worldwide cume of $17.4 million. 阅读全文
Fast Five Generates $12 million in Global IMAX Box Office
By IMAX 上 六月 02, 2011
Fast Five: The IMAX Experience has grossed $12 million in IMAX theatres worldwide, $11 million domestically and $1 million overseas, through June 1, 2011. 阅读全文
Christopher Nolan utilizing IMAX® cameras in “The Dark Knight Rises”
By Warner Bros. Pictures 上 五月 19, 2011
PRODUCTION BEGINS ON “THE DARK KNIGHT RISES” Filming will take place on three continents, with an all-star cast working under the direction of Christopher Nolan. ... 阅读全文
Hero Complex Thor Screening and Filmmaker Q&A’
By IMAX 上 五月 13, 2011
The Hero Complex Screening- Presented by IMAX kicked off last week with a screening of Thor in IMAX 3D, followed by a Q&A with Kenneth Branagh and Chris Hemsworth. Didn't catch the screening? You can watch a video of Geoff Boucher moderating the Q&A over at Hero Complex! 阅读全文
Reviews: Thor an IMAX 3D Experience
By IMAX 上 五月els... 阅读全文
Los Angeles Times’ Hero Complex And IMAX Collaborate For New Screening Series
By IMAX 上 五月 03,. 阅读全文
New One-Sheet for Transformers: Dark of the Moon
By IMAX 上 五月 02, 2011
Check out the new one-sheet for the third Transformers movie, Dark of the Moon, over at Yahoo! Movies. 阅读全文
Fast Five Opens to $8.3 million Gross in Domestic IMAX Theatres
By IMAX 上 五月 02, 2011
Universal's Fast Five: The IMAX Experience grossed $8.3 million in domestic box office in its opening weekend. 阅读全文
Reviews: Fast Five in IMAX
By IMAX 上 四月 29, 2011
See what critics are saying about Fast Five: the IMAX Experience!Twists, turns come at a furious pace in 'Fast Five' USA Today- Claudia Puig Fast Five New York Daily News- Elizabeth Weitzman 阅读全文
New Trailer: Transformers: Dark of the Moon
By IMAX 上 四月 28, 2011
The new trailer for Transformers: Dark of the Moon is now online! Check it out over here and experience it in IMAX July 1st! 阅读全文
New Harry Potter Trailer Debuts
By IMAX 上 四月 27, 2011
On July 15, only one can live. Watch the new HARRY POTTER AND THE DEATHLY HALLOWS - PART 2 trailer on Apple, and then see the final chapter in IMAX 3D July 15th! 阅读全文
New Pirates 4 Poster
By IMAX 上 四月 16, 2011
Check out the new IMAX-exclusive poster for Pirates of the Caribbean: On Stranger Tides in our Movies section! 阅读全文
Reviews: Born to be Wild 3D
By IMAX 上 四月 08, 2011
The critics are raving about Born to be Wild 3D:A Nature Film in Another Dimension The New York Times- Neil GenzlingerOrphans in the Animal Kingdom The Washington Post- Stephanie Merry阅读全文
New Harry Potter 7: Part 2 Poster
By IMAX 上 四月 07, 2011
Check out the new poster for Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows- Part 2 in our Movies section! 阅读全文
Sucker Punch: The IMAX Experience Generates Approximately $7.0 Million in Worldwide Box Office
By IMAX 上 四月 03, 2011
Sucker Punch has generated approximately $6 million in domestic IMAX box office and approximately $1 million in international IMAX box office through Sunday, April 3. 阅读全文
Exclusive Thor IMAX Poster
By IMAX 上 三月 29, 2011
Check out the exclusive new poster for Thor: An IMAX 3D Experience in our Movies section! 阅读全文
Sucker Punch Packs IMAX Wallop
By Scott Hettrick 上 三月 25, 2011
I... 阅读全文
Imax to Open 75 New Theaters in China
By NewYorkTimes.com 上 三 th... 阅读全文
TRON: Legacy: An IMAX 3D Experience Reaches $60 Million in Global Box Office.
By IMAX 上 三月 12, 2011
The Green Hornet: An IMAX 3D Experience Surpasses $10.5 Million in Worldwide IMAX Box Office. I Am Number Four: The IMAX Experience Nearing $9 Million in Global IMAX Box Office. 阅读全文
Dreamworks Animation and IMAX Pact For Two Films In 2011
By IMAX 上 三. Way before Puss ever met Shrek, our suave and furry fe... 阅读全文
Wally wins Oscar for Inception!
By Yahoo! 上 二月 nominatio... 阅读全文
IMAX Rings the Opening Bell at the NYSE!
By IMAX 上 二月 11, 2011
Watch Rich Gelfond & members of the Executive team ring the Opening Bell at the New York Stock Exchange! Today IMAX lists on the New York Stock Exchange. The Company will trade under the ticker symbol “IMAX”. Watch Video 阅读全文
Squirmingly Visceral Thriller!: Sanctum Film Review
By Variety 上 二月 03, 2011
-movi... 阅读全文
TRON: Legacy Coming To France For Exclusive 4-Day Run In IMAX
By IMAX 上 二月 03, 2011
... 阅读全文
IMAX to Launch Facebook® Deals in Canada
By IMAX 上 一月 o... 阅读全文
From Davos: IMAX CEO on New Movie Lineup
By Fox Business News 上 一! 阅读全文
Imax's Widescreen Profit Performance
By Businessweek.com 上 一月 bene... 阅读全文
CNN's Richard Quest Interviews IMAX CEO Rich Gelfond at Davos
By CNN.com 上 一月 26, 2011
IMAX sees explosive growth.CNN's Richard Quest Interview IMAX CEO from the World Economic Forum in Davos. IMAX CEO Richard Gelfond explains how his company doubled its revenue during a recession year. Watch Interview 阅读全文
5 Oscar nominated films were in IMAX!
By Variety.com 上 一月 25, 2011
Inception - 8 Nominations Toy Story 3 - 5 Nominations Alice in Wonderland - 3 Nominations Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows Part 1 - 2 Nominations How to Train Your Dragon - 2 Nominations. Read Article 阅读全文
Imax To Launch First Digital Theatre In Egypt
By HollywoodReporter.com 上 一. Read Article 阅读全文
TRON: Legacy: An IMAX 3D Experience approaching $40 million in global box office
By IMAX 上 一月. 阅读全文
IMAX Annual DMR Gross Box Office Doubles to $546 Million in 2010, Versus $271 Million in 2009
By IMAX 上 一月 03, 2011
IMAX. 阅读全文
Attendance Rising at Warren IMAX
By The Wichita Eagle 上 十二月 阅读全文
IMAX keeps getting bigger. Tron Legacy arrives.
By Boot Camp Radio 上 十二月 17, 2010
Imax keeps getting bigger. I'm Fred Fishkin with technology BootCamp, a report on gadgets and gear. As Tron Legacy arrives as the latest movie available on Imax screens and 3D...the number of Imax theatres continues to grow. There are about 200 in the U.S. now....and Imax CEO Rich Gelfond is looking to more than double that number. Theatre chains are looking to Imax to give consumers ...who have big HD screens at home...and gradually 3D as well....a reason to go out to the movies..."We build every aspect of the Imax experience to be kind of awe inspiring and mind blowing. The field of vision, meaning where you sit relative to the screen, gives you the f... 阅读全文
From Executive Producer James Cameron Comes The 3D Underwater Adventure Sanctum, Diving Into Digital Imax® 3D Theatres This Winter
By IMAX 上 十二月 阅读全文
Regular Snickers
By Hollywood-Elsewhere.com 上 十二月 13, 2010
"Tron:."阅读全文
Sony/Discovery/IMAX 3D TV Network Adds To Programming Slate
By Deadline.com 上 十二月 阅读全文
P. Diddy Shows IMAX the Love
By WallStreetJournal.com 上 十二月. 阅读全文
Olivia Wilde and Hollywood Blvd. Get 'Tronified'
By ETonline.com 上 十二月. 阅读全文
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part I approaching $40 million in IMAX box office worldwide
By IMAX 上 十二月. 阅读全文
IMAX projectionist one of a rare breed (video)
By KXAN - Austin News 上 十二月. 阅读全文
Disney And Dreamworks To Release ‘I Am Number Four’ And ‘Real Steel’ In IMAX
By IMAX 上 十二月 07, 2010
Disney, DreamWorks and IMAX announced today that two of DreamWorks’ 2011 Touchstone Pictures releases, I Am Number Four and Real Steel, will open day-and-date in digital IMAX® theatres around the world. Both films are produced by DreamWorks and will be released under Disney’s Touchstone banner. Helmed by D.J. Caruso, I Am Number Four is an action-packed thriller about an extraordinary teen hunted by ruthless enemies. Settling in a small Ohio town, he discovers powerful new abilities as well as a connection to the others who share his destiny. The film has a US release date of February 18, 2011. Set in a world of next-generation boxing, Real Steel is a gritty act... 阅读全文
TRON: Lebowski
By Gothamist 上 十二月 06, 2010
Watch The Dude on the Grid in this TRON-Big Lebowski smash up video! More at Gothamist here. 阅读全文
Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part I has generated $36 million in IMAX worldwide box office to date
By IMAX 上 十二月. 阅读全文
IMAX to Open New Theatres in Spain and Italy!
By IMAX 上 十一月 23, 2010
IMAX Corporation and ODEON & UCI Cinemas Group, Europe's largest exhibitor, today announced an agreement to install two new digital IMAX(R) theatre systems under joint venture agreements in Mallorca and Milan. t... 阅读全文
Imax CEO on the Growth of Imax Theaters: First On Interview
By Fox Business News 上 十一月 22, 2010
Fox Business News interviews Rich Gelfond, IMAX CEO, on the success of "Harry Potter" and why the IMAX experience draws theater-goers even though the film tickets cost moreWatch the video here. 阅读全文
‘Harry Potter’ Has $330 Million Debut Weekend
By NewYorkTimes 上 十一月 阅读全文
IMAX's "Potter" Play: Squawk Box Interview
By CNBC 上 十一月 19, 2010
CNBC Video, Squawk Box Interview with Rich Gelfond, IMAX CEO. "Potter" is set to open in a record 365 IMAX Theatres, with Rich Gelfond, IMAX CEO. Watch the Video here. 阅读全文
ODEON IMAX celebrates Harry Potter
By moviescopemag.com 上 十一月 seate... 阅读全文
Morgan Freeman to Narrate New IMAX 3D® Documentary Adventure "Born to Be Wild"
By IMAX 上 十一月 18, 2010
Journey ... 阅读全文
Audiences get very 'Paranormal' at Box Office!
By Hollywood.com 上 十月 29, 2010
"'Paranormal 2' exceeded all expectations with 3,111 theatres and an IMAX experience that gave the film a $2.5 million boost (an amazing feat considering that IMAX was a last minute addition to the release)…"Read more about Paranormal 2's early success 阅读全文
Amy Poehler and Adam Scott from NBC’s hit show Parks and Recreation get excited about IMAX 3D!!!
By NYMag.com 上 十月 28, 2010
"What would it be like if the next season of Parks and Recreation was in IMAX 3D??? Find out here…"Read more about what it would be like to have Parks and Recreation in IMAX 3D 阅读全文
BREAKING NEWS: James Cameron's Next Films Are 'Avatar 2' & '3' For Fox; May Shoot Them Back-To-Back For 2014 & 2015
By Deadline.com 上 十月 27, 2010
…"Read more about James Cameron's Big Announcement 阅读全文
Christopher Nolan reveals title of third Batman film and that ‘it won’t be the Riddler’
By LosAngelesTimes.com 上 十月 阅读全文
IMAX Tunes up Theatre Boom Boxes with New Technology
By HollywoodReporter.com 上 十月 阅读全文
$41.5 Mil 'Paranormal' Scares 'Jackass' From No. 1 at Weekend Box Office
By HollywoodReporter.com 上 十月 24, 2010
"The outsize bow by Paranormal 2 -- including $2.5 million from 151 high-grossing IMAX specialty venues…"Read more about IMAX's big week 阅读全文
The 3-D Evangelist
By Forbes.com 上 十月 阅读全文
Interview with James Cameron on ‘Avatar,’ ‘Titanic,’ 'Cleopatra' and the Future of 3-D
By NewYorkTimes.com 上 十月 阅读全文
Discovery, Sony, Imax 3D cabler unveils slate
By Variety.com 上 十月 18, 2010
New channel will feature original series, exclusive premieres.Nature and wildlife docu series and theatrical features are on the programming slate for the 3D cable backed by Discovery, Sony Corp. and Imax that is skedded to bow next year… 阅读全文
IMAX Signs First Joint Venture Agreement in Germany with Cinemax
By IMAX CORPORATION 上 十月 13, 2010
IMAX Network Growth Momentum Continues to Build in EuropeNew t... 阅读全文
|
Anti-Authoritarian Revolution and Law Reform in Egypt: A Jadaliyya E-Roundtable
> discussion and debate about these issues in our e-pages and beyond.
Since the Mubarak presidency ended on February 11, 2011, the debate has shifted from how—or if—to amend the existing Egyptian constitution to how to replace/rewrite it. What, in your opinion, are the consequences of the suspension of the constitution to consolidating the gains and advancing the protesters’ aspirations for a post-authoritarian political order in Egypt?
TAMIR MOUSTAFA: Replacing the constitution was one of the central demands of pro-democracy activists. On the one hand, this suspension facilitates political reforms outside of the narrow procedures that were set out in the constitution. But this route forward also places the military outside of any legal framework. Amendments to the constitution are dependent on the military’s good will – something that we cannot take for granted. And even if Egypt proceeds towards free and fair elections, the military’s direct entry into political life will likely haunt the Egyptian political system for years to come. A similar tension between political expediency and democratic representation casts a shadow on the constitutional reform committee that was established by the Supreme Council of the Armed Forces. This committee is staffed mostly by jurists with legal expertise, but makes almost no attempt to represent various political trends. This is obviously objectionable from the standpoint of democratic representation, and it clearly undermines the legitimacy of the process. The only potential benefit of this route forward is the possibility that amendments to the constitution can be adopted more swiftly than they would if the whole constitution were rewritten. But meaningful amendments are dependent on the military’s willingness to make a genuine break from the past – and this is anything but certain at this point.
ASLI BALI: I agree with Tamir that the consequences of suspension depend entirely on the process that is put in place. But I disagree that the Egyptian constitution can be fixed by amending it. While it has some liberal elements, they have been badly distorted by numerous amendments and suspensions under emergency decrees. In his February 2 speech, Mubarak himself promised amendments to Articles 76 and 77, which would revise the terms of eligibility for presidential candidacy and introduce term limits. Such modest reforms would not be nearly expansive enough to address the repressive elements that have been introduced since the adoption of this constitution in 1971, and particularly the introduction of a deeply repressive package of amendments by the Mubarak regime in 2007. Further, the existing constitution has long been associated with the consolidation of executive power, weakening of the judicial branch and the rights deprivations of the Mubarak era, which makes it an intrinsically defective instrument from which to initiate regime transformation. Reports have emerged that a limited amendments package of five or six provisions is now being undertaken. Whatever additional provisions are included, such a limited package of incremental amendment will not be sufficient to entrench the goals of the revolution. Egypt needs a new constitution, one that shifts the balance between the branches of government away from the executive, introduces (or reinstates) institutional guarantees of judicial independence, lifts the emergency decrees and restores civilian judicial jurisdiction over most matters, strengthens individual rights protections and repeals emergency-based limitations, and establishes the basis for a pluralist party system. In other words, the constitutional architecture needs to be radically altered to excise the “legalities” of authoritarianism.
The replacement of the current constitution with one that better reflects the aspirations of the protesters and lays the foundation for the liberalization of the political order is probably the best avenue. But a number of institutional conditions would have to be met to make this alternative feasible (rather than creating a pretext for a military junta to draft a new constitution at its own discretion). In my view, the best approach would be to undertake extra-constitutional measures to convene a caretaker national unity government with proper institutional protections (e.g., those who serve in the caretaker government would not be permitted to run for presidency). This caretaker government should represent a broad swath of the non-National Democratic Party (NDP) organized political spectrum and the leadership of the protest-based opposition. It should also include elements of the military who do not reflect the political chain of command under Mubarak, but a lower level of the military’s professional bureaucracy. This caretaker government would essentially pursue a technocratic governance model designed to put in place the mechanisms of institutional transformation, including introducing a liberalized political party system and convening new legislative elections within 6-9 months of liberalization once parties have had a chance to form, and presiding over a constitution-drafting process that is turned over to the new parliament as a constituent assembly. This caretaker government should eventually oversee a transition to a new executive (whether presidential or parliamentary). Ideally, there will be a provisional arrangement to create the institutional infrastructure in order to convene new legislative elections in a truly competitive multi-party electoral environment. A freely elected legitimate parliament would then be able to serve as a sort of constituent assembly to preside over the drafting of a new constitution (with an initial draft produced by an independent commission of jurists with a representative composition drawn from legal academics, jurists and constitutional experts reflecting Egypt’s political diversity), its vetting through the assembly and ultimately a constitutional referendum.
TAMIR MOUSTAFA: I agree entirely with Asli on the illiberal aspects of the constitution. But it is important to note that out of its 211 articles, only about a dozen are fundamentally illiberal and each of these is easily identified. These articles can and must be amended. But the pro-democracy movement should not lose sight of the fact that the current constitution contains most of the liberties and protections that they currently seek. I also want to point out that there are significant risks in scrapping the constitution entirely and starting from scratch. As Asli notes, this route forward would take up to a year to complete in the best case scenario. In the meantime, a number of divisive issues would almost certainly come to the fore. For example, should a new constitution declare that “Islam is the religion of the state” and that “Islamic jurisprudence is the principle source of legislation” as the current constitution does? And what should a new constitution say about the nature of the economy? These fault lines would inevitably emerge if a constitution was rewritten from the ground up and you can bet that the cooperation we have seen among pro-democracy activists would come under significant strain as a result. I am not suggesting that these are not important debates to be had – they most certainly are, and genuine debate on these issues is long overdue. I only suggest that such debate at this juncture would further imperil an already difficult democratic transition. Rather than demanding a completely new constitution, pro-democracy activists may be wise to make targeted demands for constitutional amendments and to mobilize all their energy to force those targeted amendments through. After the most crucial constitutional amendments are in place and free and fair elections are held, a fully representative People’s Assembly could, of course, propose additional amendments, or bring an entirely new constitution to a national referendum. The number one goal right now should be to remove the most egregious roadblocks that are entrenched in the constitution, not to open divisive can of worms through a complete rewrite of the constitution.
SAMERA ESMEIR: The Egyptian revolution constituted a state of exception—that is, a suspension of the grounds of legitimacy of both the Egyptian state and its constitution. Notwithstanding its many “progressive” articles, as Tamir notes, this constitution enabled, and was enabled by, a lingering state of emergency and a normalized state security apparatus. The Egyptian revolution interrupted this illusionary state of emergency and introduced instead a new temporality shattering the continuity of the previous emergency/security. By so doing, the revolution shifted the definition of the exception from the grounds of normalized security-driven legalities, which were the Egyptian state’s technologies of rule, to the self-organized plural groups working collectively “on the ground” and laying claim to the present and the future of Egypt. It might have been necessary to suspend the previous constitution if one were to remain true to the new political temporality of the revolution. But as Asli points out, the constitution was suspended so that some of its articles could be amended. In criticizing this approach, Asli argues that the “constitutional architecture needs to be radically altered to excise the ‘legalities’ of authoritarianism.” Her critical point is crucial to guaranteeing genuine regime change. Yet it seems to me that the political praxes of the Egyptian revolution, like other popular revolutionary movements, surpass the demand to transition to a new regime that will join the universal family of liberal democracies.
Historically speaking, wars, social movements and reform movements were all vehicles to regime change. The ongoing Egyptian revolution has an additional aspect: It has been claiming new grounds of legitimacy, while engendering collective political practices that defy the order of legality/security. A new revolutionary constitution, whether reformed or newly drafted, must inscribe in its articles this practice of disobedience and collective organization/mobilization; it must allow for the ongoing revolution to persist in making political claims. If the new/reformed constitution is to follow the footsteps of the revolution, it should not be merely a text constituting yet another vehicle for transition from authoritarianism to liberal democracy with a renewed security paradigm. Rather, it should provide a vehicle for revolutionary political praxis. The challenge, of course, is that such a revolutionary constitution will cease to be a constitution. And this perhaps indicates that constitutional reform may even occasionally contradict this revolutionary moment.
Is constitutional reform one of the most pressing issues at this point, or is this secondary to other kinds of legal and political reforms? Why?
TAMIR MOUSTAFA: Constitutional amendments are a crucial first step in laying the groundwork for political reform. One of the most insidious tactics of the Mubarak regime was to build illiberal constitutional amendments right into the constitution itself, so that they could not be challenged even in the courts. As Asli notes, the 2005 and 2007 constitutional amendments entrenched aspects of the emergency law directly into the constitution (article 179), robbed the judiciary of its role in monitoring elections (article 88), and made it virtually impossible to have meaningful contestation in presidential elections (article 76). But the legal conundrums that Egypt faces are far deeper than the constitution alone. The regime has spun out illiberal legislation for decades, undermining the constitutional guarantees on fundamental rights that are already specified in the constitution. Laws regulating the press, political parties, police powers, elections, trade unions, non-governmental organizations, and just about every other area of political and social life are designed to strengthen the hand of the executive. Even if the constitution is successfully amended, a deeper web of illiberal legislation will remain on the books until it is revised by an empowered and representative People’s Assembly.
ASLI BALI: Constitutional reform is a pressing priority because the constitution has been an instrument for the consolidation of authoritarian control. Without addressing the centralization of power in the hands of the (unaccountable) executive power, Egypt would continue to have Mubarak-style governance without Mubarak. Constitutional reform is an essential first step for redressing the distribution of power between the branches of Egyptian government, among other crucial goals, though as Tamir points out, constitutional reform alone will not be sufficient.
SAMERA ESMEIR: Constitutional reform is a pressing issue because it is underway. One of the first texts that will constitute the post-Mubarak era will be the constitution. We may recall, however, that the revolutionaries in Egypt did not posit constitutional reform as the most important priority, just as they refused to swap Omar Suleiman with Hosni Mubarak. The Egyptian revolutionary movement articulated a set of linked political demands; constitutional reform was only one of them. The unifying slogan of the revolution was: “al-sha'b yorid isqat al-nitham," or, in English, "the people want to topple the regime.” This concise slogan captures complex political aspirations that the singular demands, on their own, fail to articulate. Situating the constitutional question next to other demands reveals an appreciation, on the part of the revolutionaries, of the hollowness of a legal text that lacks institutions to enforce it. The constitutional text itself, as constitutive as it may claim to be, is destined to remain abstract and general, and thus open to different, competing interpretations. This ambiguity of legal language, indeed any language, is not necessarily negative. But this ambiguity is a reminder of the obvious point that any constitution is a site of battles and conflicts that are never resolved apriori and is not a recipe for redemption. Further, most legal/regulatory action takes place not in the constitutional text, but in other numerous laws, statutes, regulations and security practices that ultimately constitute the world of the law. Often times these other legalities neither validate nor violate the constitution, while being the most constitutive of social and political life. Because they lived under an intrusive security state, the revolutionaries seem to have understood this proliferation of security legalities in many domains of social life and therefore did not restrict their demands to constitutional reform. The challenges for the revolutionary movement are therefore much more complex than replacing an “illiberal” constitution with a “liberal” one. One of these challenge is to overcome the security state, whether liberal or authoritarian.
HUSSEIN AGRAMA: I find myself largely in agreement with what Tamir, Asli and Samera have said. This protest movement cannot be framed as a referendum on constitutional reform, even though such reform is, and has been, one of its demands. But, as Samera has pointed out, we need to view all of the protestors’ demands together in order to see the full extent of their political aspirations. The animating principles of the protest movement can also be discerned by the manner in which it developed over its 18-day span. Here are two of the principles that I saw being articulated by the movement as a whole. The first is that no one – no one person, group of people, social or economic class, religious or ideological political orientation—should have a monopoly on power. It is worth noting that during the protests, no one person or group emerged as the leader. Even those people who were hailed for having sparked the movement (like Wael Ghonim) rejected any such leadership or symbolic role. All efforts were deliberately collaborative, and this ethos only grew as the days went by. The second principle is that the national security paradigm, which has gripped Egypt for so long and has become intensified under its “war on terror,” must be completely dismantled. It should be remembered that much of the animus of the protestors was directed at against the Ministry of the Interior, a hub of the massive security apparatus that had come to define the state.
It is precisely these two principles that constitutional reform is ill-equipped to defend. To take just one example: it was the rise and entrenchment of the state security apparatus that led to the distortion and erosion of constitutional protections, and not the other way around. And, as Tamir has rightly noted, it takes only a few articles to distort the entire thing. If this happened before, despite constitutional guarantees, what is to prevent it from happening again? That is why I think that overemphasizing constitutional reform would represent a serious setback for the overall aspirations of the protest movement. From within the oft-made political distinction between constituting and constituted power, a constitution falls decidedly on the side of the latter. When a constitution loses its links to the powers that ostensibly established it, then its text becomes open to the widest interpretive distortions of legal and judicial thought. From the vantage point of the tradition of democratic legitimacy, what we saw in Egypt was a historic assertion of unbridled popular sovereignty – self-organized, sustained, focused and resolute. As a manifestation of constituting power, it sweeps away what came before and is itself the source of the legitimacy of what comes after. The question, then, is not so much how to amend or reform particular articles of the constitution, but rather, how to maintain the links to this democratic constituting power – a question that cannot be resolved on constitutional grounds. To put this another way, we have long been suffering under the illusion that it is a constitution that guarantees and protects our rights. But the truth is that it is constitutions themselves that need be protected and guaranteed. The question of how to do that cannot be resolved on constitutional grounds, but in the case of Egypt, it cannot be resolved solely on domestic grounds either. This is a point I will say more about below.
Beyond the constitution, which laws must be addressed (and how) in order to advance the goal of anti-authoritarianism and a democratic political system in Egypt?
ASLI BALI: The panoply of repressive legislation passed by the Mubarak regime since the 1980s affects press freedoms, restrictions on the right of peaceful assembly, draconian regulation of non-governmental organizations (Egypt’s odious NGO law became a model for the Palestinian Authority), procedural protections, civilian court jurisdiction, establishment of extraordinary security courts, rights of collective bargaining, political party formation, the convening of elections, and the broad expansion of police powers. All of this legislation emanating from the state of emergency imposed in October 1981 would have to be repealed and dismantled, but the permissive condition for this legislation has been a constitution that does not protect against such far-reaching assertions of police powers and which, since 2007, has constitutionalized the infrastructure for normalizing the emergency decrees through new counterterrorism laws. The constitutional infrastructure has to be dismantled and new guarantees put in place before the legislative measures to repeal emergency provisions would represent a durable anti-authoritarian reform.
What role, if any, can/should political parties, movements, and activists play in influencing the process of post-Mubarak legal reform in Egypt? How will protesters/opposition movements influence the pursuit and legitimacy of ongoing reforms?
SAMERA ESMEIR: One difficulty in Egypt is that the revolutionary movement did not result in a revolutionary council taking over the work of governance during the so-called transitional period. Instead, there was a realignment of forces within the regime, and some hope that this realignment may engender a rupture with the past. Absent such a revolutionary council, the process is being orchestrated by figures that were either previous actors in the Mubarak regime or are now “neutral” actors. Further, after the fall of Mubarak’s regime, Egyptians are still in the process of articulating political programs, backed up by specific political movements, to implement the demands of the revolution and to resist the new security state. The result is that these demands remain, in part, attached to idealized slogans of unity and love. The politicization of these demands entails relocating them to the field of the political, of conflict, and of disagreement with the military. The rhetoric of love, unity, neutrality and technocracy risks depoliticizing the revolution—which is a political event par excellence—by disconnecting it from the political process, now fashioning itself as technocratic and neutral, despite its being orchestrated by the military. I agree with Tamir that “the military’s direct entry into political life may haunt the Egyptian political system for years to come.” The Supreme Council of the Armed Forces has particular political and economic connections that are far from neutral. There are many signs, however, indicating resistance to depoliticization. This resistance points to the political influence that the revolutionaries are attempting to effect beyond the legal reform process.
TAMIR MOUSTAFA: I agree with Samera that if meaningful legal reform is to materialize in Egypt, it will be the result of sustained mobilization of the Egyptian public, both inside and outside of formal political institutions. There are important and specific roles for political parties, rights groups, trade unions, professional syndicates (especially the lawyers syndicate), and other formal political groupings. These formal organizations have the ability to articulate specific and targeted demands for legal and institutional reforms and they can play an instrumental role in coordinating political engagement. But the last three decades and the last three weeks of Mubarak’s rule underline the fact that these formal organizations cannot bring about change by themselves. It is “everyday Egyptians” who have proven their ability to force change in Egypt. The most crucial developments to nurture in the months and years to come are therefore the organic links between political parties, civil society organizations, and the Egyptian masses. These are precisely the organic links that the Mubarak regime severed so successfully through three decades of authoritarian rule.
HUSSEIN AGRAMA: Again, I fully agree with Tamir, Asli and Samera that some kind of revolutionary council or (non-NDP) care-taker civilian unity government should take over from the Supreme Council of the Armed Forces. I also agree that that ongoing political mobilization from within formal and informal institutions is an absolute necessity if the protest movement is to achieve its goals. This is one of the ways to maintain the links to the constituting power that I mentioned above. But I am afraid that even this will not be enough.
Tamir notes that it was everyday Egyptians who were able to force change. I want to consider the distinct possibility that it was not everyday Egyptians that forced change, but that their protests were used by the army as a pretext to effect a realignment of political forces within the regime. (This is not to devalue any of the achievements of the protest movement.) Had the army taken a different stance toward the protesters, things might have turned out quite differently. But the army seems to want to put back in place, albeit in a somewhat restructured form, existing institutions of the regime – including the state security forces. But one of the animating principles of the protest movement was the dismantling of the national security paradigm which has reigned in the country for so long, and confounded all democratic possibilities. Will the army let go of this paradigm?
The army, at least the highest echelons, is a moneyed and propertied class whose interests coincide with the foreign policy imperatives that sustain it rather than the overall dispositions of Egyptian people. So there is a broader, regional dimension to the question constitutional and legal reform. Many of the strategic regional arrangements with the army, particularly between it, Israel and the United States, will not be accepted by a genuine civilian government. But it is precisely these arrangements that sustain the army. What this means, given the current situation, is that the protest movement, if it is to move forward, must at some point clash politically with the army. It means that the army will have to be restructured, so that it can no longer be the moneyed, propertied, rentier class that it is. The army must become subject to a different set of regional political and economic incentives. And this depends on broader regional transformations – particularly the future of Palestinian rights. In this sense, the future of the protest movement in Egypt is linked to the fate of Palestine. That future, in turn, is interwoven with that of the entire region. No discussion of genuine legal and constitutional reform can ignore the question of the army within this broader, regional dimension.
What is the relationship between constitution drafting and revolutions? What are the grounds of legitimacy of each event, how do they overlap or diverge from each other in the case of Egypt?
ASLI BALI: Revolution is typically an extra-constitutional or irregular transition in power within a given society producing regime change as a result of popular bottom-up demands or vanguard-led top-down overthrow. Either way, a revolution represents a break in ordinary legality and constitutes an extra-constitutional moment. To establish the bases for the legitimacy (and claims to authority) of the new regime, a revolution will typically be followed by a constitutional exercise. The legitimacy of that exercise derives from the consent it is able to command from either the popular constituency of the revolution, or in the case of a revolution without a social base from the acquiescence and tacit consent the new system enjoys. In a case like Egypt, the revolution has been the result of a popular uprising and the source of the legitimacy of the new constitution will have to be the participation and consent of the social constituency of the revolution, meaning the representatives of the opposition protesters. The measure of a legitimate constitution will be (1) the participation of representatives of the revolution’s constituents in the drafting process; and (2) the relationship between the substantive protections afforded by the constitution and the anti-authoritarian demands of the uprising.
SAMERA ESMEIR: A revolution is not constitutional reform. The first exceeds the latter and may also contradict it. Revolutions disrupt the taken for granted association between legality and legitimacy, introducing new grounds of legitimacy beyond state law. As Asli writes, revolutions are “extra-constitutional.” And I would add, revolutions are “extra-legal.” Modern law is incapable of sanctioning a revolution. Revolutions, however, maintain an aspiration to constitute a new legal order. Ironically, this order for the most part institutes new relationships of obedience between the law and the citizenry, making it illegal to wage another revolution, or to introduce the political praxis cultivated among the members of the revolutionary movement.
This paradoxical relationship between law and revolution is evident in contemporary debates about legal reform. Specifically, because the revolutionary movement in Egypt is yet to accomplish its declared objectives, the focus on legal reform, and the institution of a new legal order, becomes one way to secure some objectives. But this focus may jeopardize the ongoing revolution in two ways. First, this focus risks confining the sphere of political action and political opposition to the realm of the juridical, and therefore ignoring a much more difficult challenge to the security institutions of the state, including the military. If such narrow focus is to become dominant, Egypt's democratic practice will be mainly centered on the law, like many Western democracies, sidelining other alternatives for democratic politics—ones that do not necessarily pursue politics through the law. Second, this focus also risks translating the revolutionary practice of collective self-organization to the practices of law-drafting that lack the collective, self-organizing element. The experience of the revolutionary movement in Egypt, however, has taught us, as Hussein points out, that collective self-organization is in itself an important political practice and the challenge therefore is not only how to translate collective demands into the law, but how to maintain collective action as a form of political practice.
How did the 18-day revolutionary act get equated, in some circles, with a constitutional crisis, and what does this “rhetoric of crisis” reveal about the relationship between legality, revolutions and the possibilities for democratic politics?
ASLI BALI: The rhetoric of constitutional crisis, constitutionalism and legality was cynically deployed (at least in some circles) as an argument for enabling the Mubarak regime to set the terms of a transition, thereby undercutting the very demand of the protesters – an end to the Mubarak regime – by enabling the regime itself to control and manage the process by which it would be replaced. This amounts to a ploy for regime maintenance under a different leadership (i.e., a managed succession plan in the name of legality) rather than regime change. To demand that regime transition be undertaken in accordance with the constitutional rules of the ancien regime is to assert the legitimacy of the very system protesters were seeking to remove. This logic is apparent in the cries of those who would have extended Mubarak’s term in office to enable him to issue decrees that would provide putative legitimacy to the process by which he would be removed. To suggest that continuation of Mubarak’s presence in his office was required in order to manage his removal is nonsensical without a claim that there is some legitimacy associated with a process dictated by rules written by the regime to consolidate power in the hands of Mubarak. But to concede such legitimacy is to deny the basic claims of the protesters that such consolidation of power (represented by the terms of the constitution, inter alia) is intrinsically illegitimate¸ precisely why the demand was that Mubarak had to go.
In none of the celebrated moments of transitional justice around the world in the 1990s was there a suggestion that erstwhile authoritarians were in a position to dictate the terms of the transition. Romanians did not apply Ceausescu’s rules to depose Ceausescu. Arguments from legality that proposed the current Egyptian constitution’s rules around executive control as the appropriate benchmark for determining what rule of law would require were naïve at best and disingenuous at worst. Human rights advocates look to international norms to assess the legality of transitional measures; democratic politics looks to the legitimacy of popular consent. The order created by Mubarak’s distortion of constitutionality could not satisfy either benchmark and should not be deemed an appropriate yardstick for managing a transition away from authoritarianism.
SAMERA ESMEIR: The rhetoric of constitutional crisis accomplished three tasks. First, this rhetoric equated the revolutionary movement with the generation of crises, hence depicting the older regime as orderly. Second, this rhetoric was also anti-revolutionary in that it argued for the necessity of a quick transition away from the “crisis”--that is, from the revolution. Third, the focus on crisis also prioritized the old constitution over the revolutionary movement and its modalities of political practice. Legal experts began to focus on the risk of a constitutional vacuum, forgetting that when there was no such vacuum, and even prior to 2007 when the more draconian articles were introduced, the constitution was incapable of safeguarding Egyptians. Crucially, then, this rhetoric intensified the power of the constitution by circularly justifying its existence on its own grounds; the constitution is necessary as a constitution. Meanwhile, the revolutionary movement was understood in limited instrumental terms—achieving certain objectives—as opposed to more constitutive terms—a reservoir of political practices guiding the future of politics in Egypt (and elsewhere). Ironically, then, even though there is less reference to the vocabulary of crisis during these post-Mubarak days, its logic persists: Constitution drafting is assumed to put an end to the state of emergency and to deliver Egypt to a new era. But what escapes critical analysis is that the work of the contemporary security state needs not rely on the state of emergency. Rather, the state of emergency could be abolished and new normal legalities could be introduced to strengthen the security state. Recently, we heard that the State Security Police would not abolished, but reformed. This reform, like constitution drafting, does not necessarily mean weakening security forces, but often times it also means perfecting their operations. To combat these operations, the constitution is not the most central tool. Necessary are the political practices that the revolutionary movement initiated in January 2011 as they undergo further politicization while struggling with the new rulers of Egypt.
5 comments for "Anti-Authoritarian Revolution and Law Reform in Egypt: A Jadaliyya E-Roundtable "
Thank you to all those responsible for this wonderful e-roundtable. It was quite informative, exemplifying the best of blogging on contemporary issues/topics in the socio-political blogosphere. I look forward to more such roundtables at Jadaliyya.
All good wishes, Patrick
your silence on deadly decades of US domination is complicity with the world's #1 destroyer, now starring soft power strategic non-violence, preparing the ground for more hard power, in the name of 'humanitarian aid', 'human rights', and 'freedom'.
Kudos to Jadaliyya for organizing this outstanding roundtable. Two points to be emphasized: the constitution is supposed to protect the citizenry, but who wil protect the constitution? Second, there is need to provide space for political and civil society groups as a channel for articulating and pursuing the protesters' demands. This will not be achieved so long as the security state is in existence, even in a modified form. Needless to say, Egypt's revolution is just starting.
Great discussion. I had a short op-ed published on this topic echoing many of the concerns in this discussion. It can be read at AOL news at
Thanks for this.
If you prefer, email your comments to [email protected].
Hot on Facebook
best time to write a new constitution is YESTERDAY. Any delay gives the defunct regime, of Mubarak and Co (they are still there the Shafiq (of Egypt Air reputation) fake transition cabinet, to play a funny game of hide and grab with the revolution. Patching up the tattered document called “current Constitution “ is simply garbage and trickery. If the Army high command is serious they should 1. Abolish the emergency law (قانون الطوارئ ) NOW (not after things cool down. They can rule by fiat as they are doing now but with a supervisory “presidium” composed of 5 members selected initially by the youth revolutionaries and approved in an imperfect but reasonably representative social media referendum. Main point: this is no time for perfectly legal tight legislation. Let us do it and work on the long term at the same time.
Mohamed El-Hodiri Professor of Economics University of Kansas 359 Snow Hall, Lawrence KS 66045 |
Modern Mix by Jessica Levittfor Stash Books
Modern Mix
16 Sewing Projects that Combine Designer Prints & Solid Fabrics
I was a fan of Jessica & her work from afar until she joined the Philadelphia Modern Quilt Guild. We quickly became friends and I was lucky enough to get to work with her last fabric line as it was being released for spring market. Once she revealed that she had completed a book I was SUPER excited for her & glad that I didn't have to keep it a secret for long!
Kindom Fabric Collection by Jessica Levitt for Windham
Carnival Quilt Pattern by me!
I did a Q&A with Jessica so you could learn a bit more about her... and so I could get some answers I wanted to know!
Julie:
If I came over to stay at your house what would I find recorded on your dvr?
Jessica:
Oh goodness. A better question would be what you wouldn't find. I record a lot of TV. Some of my favs are Glee and Amazing Race (which I love to watch with the kids). And so far I'm digging Revenge and Pan Am. The only ones we keep and don't erase are Glee and So You Think You Can Dance (no Dancing with the Stars for me...).
Julie:
We really do like a bunch of the same shows. Glee, Amazing Race, SYTYCD are also on my DVR.... but so is Dancing with the Stars!
Julie:
You know I just moved... If you moved into a new house what is the first room you would want to decorate?
Jessica:
This is actually a real possibility. We were looking at houses this past weekend. We want to stay in the area but our needs are a little different. But I don't relish the thought of moving. It sucks. And I know I would be living out of boxes for a long time. I would say it would be the kids' rooms I would decorate first. I have enough "stuff" that the living room wouldn't really get decorated per se, but just made to feel like ours. But, I like to go all out on the kids' rooms because they're small enough to be a do-able project. I know what room it wouldn't be: my bedroom. We've lived in this house over 6 years and I still haven't gotten farther than paint on the walls and furniture.
Julie:
Wow I didn't know you were considering moving! I hope you find the perfect house.... but the kids rooms?? That wasn't the answer I was hoping for... as I don't have kids rooms to decorate. I secretly was hoping you'd tell me where to start with this house! PS- I do love it out here but I miss you Jess!! Please come visit & decorate my home. :-)
Julie:
I love your new book... Is it possible for you to pick a favorite project?
Jessica:
It's difficult for sure. I guess I would go with the cover quilt, called Pebble Road. It was really where it all began. It was the first project I made for the book. The idea actually came from the "pebble" quilting I wanted on the solid background. And then the stripe of vibrant circles was added to take it to another level. I'm really pleased with the color combination and thrilled that it's such an achievable King size quilt. A close second is the Twin String Quilts. It's an traditional pattern but I love the monochromatic look with the pops of contrast. I love how tons of different prints in the same color family creates such a deep texture. And I really like the idea of two coordinating but not matching quilts on side-by-side twin beds.
Julie:
I love the Twin String Quilts too. It is probably my favorite quilt pattern in the book. My favorite pattern overall is the Gradations Bag. In general I love making bags, but something about this bag just makes it feel special & I can't wait to make it!
So do you want to win a copy of Modern Mix??
The lovely folks @ Stash have offered a copy for me to giveaway.
--
the rules
leave ONE comment to enter.
Answer the same question I asked Jessica.
leave ONE comment to enter.
Answer the same question I asked Jessica.
You know I just moved... If you moved into a new house what is the first room you would want to decorate?
Winner will be selected by True Random Number Generator
Giveaway now closed.
Winner announced soon.
© Blog post written by Julie Herman
For more information visit
338 comments:«Oldest ‹Older 1 – 200 of 338 Newer› Newest»
If I moved into a new house I would decorate the living room first--I spend the most time there and that is what people see when they come over.
I do the bedroom first as you have to sleep there and I would like it to be homey right away!
My bedroom. My solace. My place. And ironically the room that is most not-decorated in my current house.
I would redecorate the kitchen first because that is my happy place!
If I moved into a new house, I would decorate the living room first. Its where we live 90% of the time that we are home. Its the heart of our home!
I think I would decorate the bedroom first so I would have a calm place to rest after the stress of moving
My living room first because that's the room I'm in most of the time! Thanks for the chance to win this.
Oh, I love the string quilts!
I'm also moving! Soon, hopefully...when I move into my new home I would probably also concentrate my efforts on the livingroom first, followed by my bedroom.
Thanks for the chance at the giveaway. The books sounds fantastic!
sjohn3663(at)aol(dot)com
definitely the bedroom! i like to have my safe haven all set up first :)
I would have to decorate the living room first. We are in desperate need of new couches and I think moving to a new house would actually make us do it! Then I could make cute little throw pillows to put on it =D
Kitchen first for sure! There is just so much to organize in the kitchen; i'd feel like I accomplished so much getting that out of the way!
I'm embarrassed to say that we moved into a new house three years ago and still haven't properly decorated (we're holding off due to a huge renovation which will hopefully come next year). The first room that I plan on decorating after the reno is the living room because it's where we spend the most time.
I'd decorate the kitchen first. Of course, by "decorating" I pretty much mean just unpacking and organizing. I'm not much of a decorator!
I'd start with the living room. It's where I spend the most time, and visitors will definitely see it.
I'd do the living room first, then the kid's room. Bedroom last. The book looks absolutely stunning, will have to check when it is available on amazon.com and give a hint to santa...
I tend to decorate the kitchen first... makes me feel more at home to see familiar prints on the walls.
I think I need this book! are the awesome red pillows on the cover in the book too? love those!
the first room I would decorate is my kitchen because I spend alot of time in there and it is often the hub of activity for our family.
My bedroom cause I spend time in there at night reading, surfing the new, texting, watching movies (don't own a TV) so I want it to be a room I want to go to.
I am now converted to living room. I want a warm color Quilted
garnish. Thanks for playing. Please select a random number generator me,
Well we moved in six years ago and I am still awaiting the redecorating! Many other things have to take priority! But in my house I would LOVE it to be the kitchen!!
It would be the living room. I think the place my family spends time together is the most important.
thanks for this opportunity. This book looks wonderful!!
I would have my kitchen done first! It's where we congregate most and is most important. Second, sewing room...
Hi Julie, when we moved here 8 years ago the first two rooms we did were the kitchen and our bedroom. The kitchen because I needed that to be clean and the bedroom because it was somewhere lovely to go to at the end of a busy day decorating the rest of the house....and no, even after 8 years we still haven't done every room and the kitchen and bedroom have been done again!!
I also would decorate first my living room and the kitchen. These are the rooms where we spend the most time as a family!Thanks for the give away!
Probably whateve box of decor I came to first!
I would have to say my living room.
robyn(dot)geddes(at)gmail(dot)com
I moved into a new house last year, and though I am ashamed to say...my sewing room was the first one that felt "finished."
I'm a terrible decorator. I prefer having nothing on the walls...but the front entryway is my first place to make it look like it's home!
I would decorate the living room first as that is where everyone is always doing something, visiting, watching tv, reading a book, entertaining etc.
I would decorate my living room because that is where we spend most of our time.
I will hopefully be moving into a new house soon! And most important is my piano studio :)
I would decorate the living room because it is where most people see first.
The first room I would decorate is the family room - we spend most of our time there!
thank you for the chance to win!
blueberryblues5(at)gmail
We are hoping to move into a new house at some point. I think I would like to decorate the kitchen/dining area first. But secretly, the sewing room, just not practical though.
In a new house I would decorate my bedroom first; my respite place.
We just moved into a new place a few months ago. The first room we did was the kitchen--instantly made it feel like our home!
my living room/sewing area has been the first to be decorated after my recent move.
I would have to go with the family room first..my family spends so much time there...and since I work from home I use my recliner and a laptop desk for my work area. Such a cool book, would love to win! Lisa in Texas
The bedroom; I like it to be peaceful and romantic.
;-)
new house- i would want to do the living room first..i think its the most used space in any house and it would be fun to start from scratch and make it all cozy and pretty! [email protected]
I think my bedroom would have to be first! It's my quiet place.
It would probably be my kids rooms. Thanks for the opportunity to win!
I'm not much of a decorator, but maybe when I get to build my dream house in a few years I would decorate my living room first probably.
My kid's room. So that they feel at home throughout the chaos of moving!
The first room I would redo is a tie between the office (my husband has to study all the time for school so that's important) or the living room. A home feels like home to me once the living room is complete.
Good luck decorating your new house! =)
My sewing room! I spend most of my time in there as I am a longarm quilter and have a business, so once that is in place, I feel the rest is just putting it all together, room by room!
I would decorate the kitchen first. I have to have an organized, clean kitchen even if the rest of the house is a disaster.
Great post! It would be my bedroom - it's the last thing you see at night and the first thing you see in the morning. I was in my house two days before I started painting the walls in my bedroom -it was awful!
Definitely the living room, the first room everyone sees when they walk in and where we spend the most time!
The main living space (and the guest bath) would be first for me...it's the room that welcomes everyone into the house. The boys' rooms would be next since we would want them to feel as comfortable as possible in their new space. I figure I can always just shut my bedroom door ;) Good luck decorating your new home! Smiles~Beth P.S. it's great to have you back!!
The kid's room - sorry! ;) We moved 2.5 years ago and his is still the only room that's decorated. I don't even have frames for half the pictures I want to put up in the living room.
It would have to be my bedroom and this time I would decorate in the colors I like. Sick to death of all white, yuck! (It was hard not to choose my sewing studio). LOL
I would definitely decorate the living room first. It is the room the family and friends spend most of the time in and I would need to have it just right. Speaking of which, it is the only room in my current house that is decorated to my liking. :)
Probably my bedroom. But I got married and moved into my husband's house over 2 years ago, and it is still not done. So I guess it would be the first to be decorated when I move :) Thanks.
I think the first room would be the master bedroom. So there's someplace relaxing to run and hide from all the moving boxes!
Definitely the first room I would want set up is my quilting room. I think the first room I would decorate is the dining room. I have lived in my house for 5 years and the dining room is horrible. All the other rooms desperately needed to be done first, so it got left to the end. I think we are going to do it this fall.
I'd love to win a copy. We move often and I usually decorate my daughters' room first. We have lots of fun art from friends and family for them so it is always the funnest and most whimsical room. Plus it helps them transition faster to the new environment.
The first room to set up must be the one you spend the most time in - different for everyone. I would create my leisure space first, while chomping at the bit to establish my sewing room. DH must be established before I can run off and play in my room - makes us both happy. Love these blog reviews and thank you for the opportunity to win. Judy C
I'd start in the room you spend the most time in. It's your home, start with the room that speaks to you the most. Whether that's the kitchen/living room/bedroom or sewing room. ;) Make that room comfortable and work from there.
I always decorate my computer room first. Yes I know it sounds dorky but I live in front of my computer. Thanks for the great fun giveaway. I am LOVING those scrappy string twin quilts!
I would decorate the bedroom first!
I think the kitchen needs to be organized first, as I spend a lot of time in it. It takes a bit of work to get it organized, too, so when it is done, the rest seems a piece of cake...!!
I would decorate the family room first. In most modern homes that and the kitchen are where people spend the most time! And since they are often one big open space you get double bang for your buck....and time and energy!
First off, Julie, I just want to say I am soooo excited to have you back..I have missed your blogging. I too have just moved so I completely understand the transitional period. I had no internet for 6 weeks! OUCH!
The first room I decorated..my sewing room! I am happy!
Have fun in your new adventure. Your home from what you have shown looks absolutely beautiful!
We are about to move, and I have big plans for my sewing room. I've never had the privilege of having my own space just for sewing, where I can close the door and keep the kids from piling junk on my sewing table :) so it's going to be the most complete decorating project. I also have paint for our bedroom, but no huge plans for that yet. (Ooh, and I love that bag!)
This book looks great! I am in the process of purchasing a home right now! It has been a long process, over a year, and may be a little bit longer. I am excited to decorate the entire house and have colors picked out for certain rooms. I think I will start with the kitchen. I want a red cherries theme!
The first room I would decorate would be the bathroom. I like to think that I could figure out how to decorate a small space :)
[email protected]
The bedroom. Last time we moved it was the first room to actually be all assembled and put together as we had to wait for our new sofa for quite a long time. We basically lived in it and it was good to have this comfort space be all ours whilst the rest was still in boxes/waiting to be be finished. :)
My office - I spend a ton of time in there, and that's where I display my valued collection of dragon statues!
I would do the kitchen/dining area first. Why? Because you have to eat, and you have to be organized to cook and as long as you are organizing a room, you may as well decorate it. And an eating area is essential since most people don't like to eat standing up holding their plates. :)
It would probably be a kitchen if it's a big one (I live in London, space is scarce) if not then it would have to be living room which would double as my sewing area too. It would be any space that we are likely to spend most of the time.
dzelzyte (at) yahoo (dot) com
My first room to decorate is the kitchen/great room; that is where all my quests congregate and enjoy each other's company and food.
Living room/den - where ever the most people congregate
If I moved into a new house, the first room I would decorate would be the master bedroom. A well decorated and peaceful room would inspire peace and harmony throughout the rest of the home.
My living/family room would be the first room I decorated. Book looks great, thanks for a chance to win a copy.
I would probably go with the living room first! I say "probably" but I really mean "definitely" because I move pretty often and this is usually how I start off! I like to get the public areas of my home in order first so that people can come over and have something to sit on other than boxes :)
The kitchen is the first room unpacked. The quilt room is the first room decorated! Need my place to get away from all the mess.
It would definitely be the living room. We still have a 1980s plaid couch! Pillows are not enough to save this room.
The kitchen would be first for me. That seems to be the room where people gather. Plus if you can make a nice meal in a nice atmosphere it can improve your whole day.
Well, I decorated my downstairs family room first, however if we had furniture for upstairs at the time we moved in, I would have probably started decorating there first.
The kitchen, for sure! If my kitchen is a mess, I'm not going in there. And yes, I'd love to win the book, beautiful projects!
It would have to be my bedroom...it is the sadest thing ever...no quilt either...can you believe it!!! So pathetic!! Thanks for sharing.
I would decorate the master bedroom first because it is the room I have the clearest vision for - other rooms of the house are in flux and I am still nailing down exactly how i want them to look. ~ Karen H
I would decorate my bedroom first! It's the first thing you see in the morning when you wake up, so why not start your day out in a place that you love?
Thanks for the chance to win!
Tracy
my bedroom - i always feel better when my bedroom is in order
The living room -- I'm not one much for keeping up appearances, but its nice to have a place for guests to feel comfortable. That said, I should probably finish decorating my living room. We moved in 2 1/2 years ago!
I would decorate the living room first, that is where you have guests! You can always close the other doors! LOL
I would start with my family room, it's where we spend the most time :)
ourbusylittlebunch(at)hotmail(dot)com
Oh, I must get a copy of this book! I love the pics you've shared. I would decorate the family room first because it's where we spend most of our time. Thanks for the giveaway! Please, please, please pick me! :)
We moved into our home 6 months ago and the first room to get done was the bedroom.
It always is.
I NEED a calm place to escape all the chaos, stubbed toes and boxes that overwhelm me!
The first room I would decorate would be my daughter's room. nlundeen at catt dot com
I would do the bedroom first, that way after a day of unpacking you have a place to escape to that is organized and feels like home.
In years past I have always decorated my children's rooms first, but now that they are grown and gone I would decorate my kitchen first. The kitchen is the heart of my home!
i always do the master bedroom first, so that at the end of the day, i can relax in a calm, beautiful environment! a peaceful and happy mama makes a peaceful and happy family!
Now, I would do the kitchen first...since I spend a great deal of time there! When my children were younger, it would have been the family room!
I would decorate my bedroom. We have lived in our house for a long time and our room still look horrible! I don't do much there except sleep and get dressed, but still the color is life-sucking beige. Did I mention that it was horrible? I want to just take everything out, toss most of it, repaint, get new fresh furniture, new blinds or shades or something and have it look gorgeous and restful. I need help!
I would do the family room, as that's where we spend most of our time. I would make sure to have a comfy spot for reading and/or watching tv. Best of luck to you!
I would get the craft/sewing area all set up, then decorate the living room!
I'd have to organize the kitchen first, but I think I'd decorate the bedroom first because it could be done faster and there'd be a relaxing place you could enjoy while you tackled the rest
I would decorate the kitchen first as it is one of the rooms that I spend the most time (and for practicality reasons)...but a second choice would probably be my living room as I spend time crafting (sewing, card making etc) and watching TV there. Thanks for the giveaway.
I would decorate the family room first as that is where our family spends the majority of the time. I would want my bedroom also finished and then my quilt room!
The craft room! or creative space s the first thing I'd get going on because then I feel like I have a creative haven amidst the chaos.
Thanks for the giveaway!
allisonbright{at}gmail{dot}com
I'd start with the kitchen - the most important room in any home!
I love baking so I'd decorate the kitchen first. A house isn't a home until it has cake batter splatted on the kitchen wall! That's my idea of decorating. Thanks for the giveaway opportunity.
I would decorate my kitchen first. I spend a lot if time there and feel it's the heart of my home.
I'd pick the room that needed the least work and get that done first.
I would want to decorate my bedroom first - sanctuary.
I moved not too long ago and the first room I decorated was the living room. It's the first thing that is seen when people come in, and it's nice to have it look like a welcoming home. (Even if the rest of the house is a disaster)
Jessica's book looks delectable. The first room that I like to decorate when I move is the dining room because this is where I like to hang out the most. Drinking coffee and chatting or reading the newspaper.
Decorate or make functional? ... probably the living room so I could get out my books. Functional order has always been bedroom, bathroom, kitchen, livingroom, office :)
Kat (wtrstone at aol dot com)
If I moved into a new house, the first room I would decorate would be the room my family and guests would use the most, the great room or the family room.
I'd want to decorate the living room.
The kitchen. With 4 kids, I spend most of my time there so it has to be functional for the family and pretty for me to enjoy being in it.
The baby's room. Eva always gets the first and best in our house! :)
i would go right to the room i'd make my craft room and 'do' this room up first! very important room!
I would decorate the bedroom first. It helps to wake up in a beautiful room every morning.
I think I would start with the living room, because that's where we end up most of the time. Good luck getting your home decorated and feeling like home!
After making sure the kitchen and bathroom are functional, I would jump in and decorate the living room. Concentrate on the part of the room that makes me feel good (for me it is an easy chair with a good view of the TV and a table / lamp beside it so can handsew). After that, I decorate for company.
Have fun - it doesn't have to be done all at once. Thanks for the giveaway.
I think I would decorate the main living area first. The place you'll be hanging out in :). I LOVE te quilt on the cover of this book!!
Kploquilts.blogspot.com
I think my living/family room would be first! That's probably where we spend the most awake hours and I need it to put me in a relaxed & happy mood. And I DVR DWTS, too!
I'd decorate the living room first since then guests would think I'd done the whole house. :D
Thanks for the chance to win!
I would put the kitchen together first but hen decorate the family room. Thanks for the giveaway.
i would want to decorate my living room first. then there would be a nice room to invite people over to! they don't need to be in the other rooms.
Definitely the living room because that is where guests hang out most!
arbitraryaardvark(at)gmail(dot)com
Well, that is hard to answer, the living room would make sense since it's usually where I do most of my living but since my quilting studio is currently half my house I'm going to have to say my studio just for the sanity of it!
we just moved last summer, so i very clearly remember asking myself this question. because i have three kids (5, 3, and 2 months at the time), i wanted a functional kitchen. so i unpacked that first. but once i unpacked, i wanted my family room to look presentable. so that's the first room i'd decorate and fully furnish. of course, i give that advice and yet 15 months after moving in, our family room still needs some personality! thanks for the chance to win this awesome book.
briawna(dot)hugh(at)gmail(dot)com
Living room first!
When I moved out of my ex's place into my own with barely anything, that was the space that frustrated me the most, due to barely having a stick of furniture to go in it, or anything else to personalize the space.
While the kitchen is certainly often the heart of every home, the living room is often the center. And it's nice to have a place that you can come together with others, and sit and talk or watch some TV and such.
wow that is a beautiful bag and fun apron! We just moved into our dream home we built (even designed with an architect) a year ago and the first room was our living/dining room to decorate and that's what it would be in the next house too. it's where we spend the majority of our time. thanks for the chance to win!
If I were to move I would decorate my room first because I would need a place to retreat to that was completely done- and most bedrooms are a reasonable size to do quickly. I'd love a copy of this book.
I would want to decorate my living room first because we spend alot of time there in the evenings and it would be the largest space in the house. [email protected]
The bedroom! Having a peaceful oasis when moving into a new home is so important.
From what I've seen of this book so far, I want to make every project!
After living in our home for two years now I still have not decorated our home. I just can not casue I want to tear out the walls and replace them and alot of other things in this house too. But the rooms we set up first were the kids rooms, then our room and finally the kitchen. Living room still looks like a frat house. :(
gablehousesewing.com
[email protected]
I moved into my house 19 years ago. It had the original 1940 bathroom - peach/cranberry tile everywhere. Tub was oh, so, pitted and ugly. I remodeled all the other rooms and finally...three years ago, gutted the bathroom. Love it. I'm sorry I didn't do it first.
Patty C. from Cincinnati
Living room so I could have people over. Plus, I do almost everything there so if I don't get it organized, there no hope for the rest!
Thanks for the chance...
I'd probably decorate the living room first, since we spend so much time there!
I am living this now. A month in house with no furniture. Only 12 more days and then boxes will be everywhere. I can't wait to get family room ready for us to relax and enjoy! Thank goodness for my little sewing machine to help with sanity. My sewing room would be next!
Jan
The bedroom. (Of course curtains go on all the windows immediately, no matter what room!)
the kitchen. that room is used most in my house. books looks amazing, thanks for a ll the sneak peeks!
The 1st space would have to be the living room -- I'm also not one much for keeping up appearances, but its nice to have a place for everyone to feel comfortable when they walk into my space. :D
I'm with Jessica on this one: the kid's room!
My bedroom--I need to make my nest comfy! A new quilt works wonders...
I've moved 5 times in 12 years (finally in a house I want to stay in!), and the first room I decorate is always my home office. I'm self-employed and that's where I spend the most time. Having a pleasant workspace is so important!
I think it would be the living space, either family room or living room, depending on the layout. Sewing room would be a close second. Really like this book and would love to win!
We have been in our new apartment in So.Cal. for about 6 weeks and I want to update the living area, tiny though it may be. We are lucky in that there was a red accent wall already here, since we can't paint ourselves.
If I was you, the room I would decorate first is the room where you spend the most time. I'm guessing that is your sewing room.
Definitely the living room - that is where we spend the most time. I'm kind of hypocritical in saying that, though, because we moved back in April and our living room is not NEARLY where I want it to be. But I think it's good to live in a place for a bit before making more purchases so you don't regret them later and can't return them. Thanks for the chance to win!
Hmmm. I hate moving because I have too much crap. First, I would try to get rid of all that stuff I don't need. THen I would probably go after the family room/living room, which is where I relax and talk to people. I would put several quilts in it, none of which are considered crap.
we moved into our home this year last year and we decorated our bedrooms first. And i think i'd do that again.
My bedroom! Then the kitchen. Then the sewing room if I had one :)
I've been moving a lot over the past couple of years and we generally set up the living first - couch, end tables, a chair or two and the television. Tada!
Kitchen! It is where I spend most of my time in my house :)
I would decorate the tv/living room first. That's usually where I spend the most time, either sewing, watching movies, or playing board games. I collect artwork from every place I travel to, so I have lots to play around with :)
gustafson dot jenna @ gmail dot com
It would depend on what needed it most - in our current house we had to do our room first as it was wallpaper that had been painted an awful pale pink with a frieze of pink roses - I couldn't sleep in it! But if it were just choosing for the sheer pleasure of it then the living room would be first, we spend a lot of time there.
I would probably want to decorate one of the public areas first-living room or kitchen.
I would decorate the livingroom first, but unpack the kitchen first because the kitchen is the most important room to me. Then my sewing room.
My kids room, they are the most fun :)
thanks,
annabelle
My bedroom, it definately needs updating!
Ahhh... well for me it would be the kitchen/dining room... we spend alot of time there (I'm not a big fan of TV)... I do my sewing there, cook, hang out.... The projects in the book are beautiful... thanks for sharing.
the kitchen!
thanks for the fun interview and giveaway!
The family room - it's where we are all the time!
I think I'd have to decorate the living room first as it's the room everyone sees, that you spend most time in and that you can change to make it feel YOUR home.
Wonderful giveaway, thank you!
We moved into our new home 2 months ago after almost 30 years in our 'old' house. The first room I decorated was our bedroom. The furniture in that room is a 'given' - bed, chests of drawers and we now have a walk in closet. So, the bed got a new duvet cover, bought new pillows, and we bought new nightstands and the rest I figured out from what we already owned eg: pictures for the walls. I kept it really simple but I did totally organized the walk in closet and told my dh that he can no longer store shotguns and rifles under our bed!
for me, the sleeping room is most important since I don't spend a lot of my time at home... I basically work, get back home to take a shower and get some sleep and then I'm off to work again... so: the bedroom.
addictedtoc64 (at) googlemail (d0t) com
That pebbling on the cover quilt makes my heart race. I have tried, unsuccessfully, to do some pebbling but it always looks like a 2 year old did it! The bag is amazing too. I like that it is quite wide but not too deep. Anyway, the question. I would decorate the living room first as it is the most used room in my house, especially if the TV is in it! Thanks for the opportunity to win this beautiful book.
Living room ASAP, so that the house looks presentable. I love, love LOVE the quilts!! Thanks for the giveaway!
We moved 4 years ago after living in the same home for 33 years. I was traumatized by the building experience so it took me awhile to decorate my first room which was the living room that also adjoins the dining room and the kitchen. My daughter recently quilted me a beautiful quilt for the couch and it brought the entire room together.
The guest bathroom. I always love a sparkly clean and well decorated bathroom. And that means changing the theme to go with the seasons.
For me it would be the living room, so I can close the doors and forget the boxes and mess in the rest of the house!
When the hubs and I bought our first home 2 years ago, the first room we decorated was the living room. It's the heart of the house. We decided to do all the family rooms first before starting on bedrooms and bathrooms. In 2 years, we have completed the living room, kitchen, dining, and just finished the guest room. Now we're too tired of decorating to fool with the rest. :) My sewing room was a big one for me. It has yet to be painted, but I have shelving, thread racks, and my design wall up, so there isn't much "builder's flat beige" showing through, so I can live with it.
I'd do all the bathrooms first - I'm not a decorator, so I'd start small, get a finish & have a sense of accomplishement!
Bathroom, hands down. why? It's a smal space, so little changes, and projects can have big impacts. But mostly, because that's where I start and endy my day - If it's a place I enjoy to look at, I feel like the day starts and ends on a better foot. Good luck with all of the unpacking
I love sleep so the first room I'd decorate would be the bedroom. P.S. That gradation's bag is super cute!
When I move into a new house, the first thing is decorate and put in order the room I will use most, which is usually the living room and entrance way. I want it nice when people start to visit!
The kitchen would be first. All heck can be breaking loose around the house, but as long as I can enjoy a cup of coffee in the kitchen all is well in my world.
I would decorate the family room since we spend most of our time there. Actually, I hate decorating, so hopefully, my DDL would do.
What a beautiful book! I'd love to win it =)
I'll be moving in a few days and the first room I'll decorate will be the living room. So the largest room will already be done and the smaller rooms are done more quickly.
I would decorate my living room first so we can rest and feel comfortable during the settling in period. Kitchen has always been "my spot" in the house, though. I would give myself more time to decorate my kitchen as I already have many plans for my "dream kitchen" :)
Thanks for the chance to win this awesome book! :)
Would love to decorate a room with a Longarm in it that I don't own yet :)...thanks for the chance!
I'd say the family room. I have so many fun collections and quilts to show off that I rotate the look every season. How fun to have a new room and an excuse to buy more collections and make more quilts.
I would definitely decorate the living room first - its where everyone hangs out together and the room that company sits in.
Thanks for the chance to win - it looks like a lovely book!
I unpack and decorate everything within a week and a half of moving, kitchen always is first to be "put away" and decorating would have to be the living room first.
Congrats to Jessica!
I would decorate my bedroom first -- I left that to last in my current place and it still is not complete!
I would decorate the Living Room first, as it is a room we all share, and spend a lot of time in, also if someone were to come over, they would be seeing this room and I wouldn't want it to look poorly.
The front room, so I at least have one room for guests to come into that's finished.
The bedroom so I would have sanctuary from the mess. Plus, it's like cleaning, I always start in the places that no one sees, so it forces me to finish where company might see. Glad to see you back Julie.
I would decorate my living room first. Since we would be spendin the most time in there.
Hard to say because I have to live in the house before I get a feel for how it would be decorated. I guess it would be the family room. It's the most used room in the house so I would get a feel for how i want to decorate it fast. Master bedroom is always last!
Thank you!
My first room would have to be my bedroom followed closely by the kitchen since these are the most rooms are both a necessity. I am so glad you are back on and enjoy your new home. And would love to have this book. Thanks.
Well, I moved recently (in with my fiancee), and the room I first decorated was, of course, "my room"! We took everything out of the guest room, and I repainted everything, removed the sliding closet doors, and set it up as guest room/sewing studio/wonderful escape place! It's still in need of a few things (aka picture hanging), and I'm about to completely redo how I store my fabric, but it's great to have the place where you want to relax in great shape! Thanks for the chance to win this book - I'm a huge fan of both of your design aesthetics! Dance Party and Kingdom = awesome!
My bedroom would be the first place to be done.
Happy days.
Bev,xoxo
Ohhhh, if it were only me it would be my sewing studio, but with a fantastic husband I would do the living room first. It's where we spend so much time together,(which is, actually, desperate for help! lol).
I LOVE the Pebble Road quilt and that great bag!
Thanks for the opportunity to win this great book!
It is the living room, then the bedrooms. We recently moved and that's how it went.
I think we would do the kids bedroom first, then kitchen ... Thanks for the giveaway.
The main bathroom!
dvdenter (at) gci (dot) net
I would decorate the kitchen first. It is a gathering place in our home - the first room we enter when we come home, the last room we leave when we go out, and the room where so many conversations take place over the preparation and eating of meals, dishes, opening mail, recycling, doing homework, and so on. In fact, I've painted my kitchen 3 times in the 7.5 years I've lived in my house. It is important for my kitchen to be homey and comfortable. Good luck decorating! We want to see photos, you know!
Probably my bedroom. This house was built in the 80s and it still has the builder grade paint in the master bedroom. I'd love to have a restful retreat.
Living room. :)
Our new house will have a playroom and i think that would be so much fun to decorate!
My bedroom... :) |
POPES, THE:(Redirected from ALEXANDER VII., POPE.)
The Roman Church does not claim any jurisdiction over persons who have not been baptized; therefore the relations of the popes, as the heads of the Church, to the Jews have been limited to rules regarding the political, commercial, and social conditions under which Jews might reside in Christian states. As sovereigns of the Papal States the popes further had the right to legislate on the status of their Jewish subjects. Finally, voluntary action was occasionally taken by the popes on behalf of the Jews who invoked their aid in times of persecution, seeking their mediation as the highest ecclesiastical authorities. The general principles governing the popes in their treatment of the Jews are practically identical with those laid down in the Justinian Code: (1) to separate them from social intercourse with Christians as far as possible; (2) to prevent them from exercising any authority over Christians, either in a public (as officials) or a private capacity (as masters or employers); (3) to arrange that the exercise of the Jewish religion should not assume the character of a public function. On the other hand, however, the popes have always condemned, theoretically at least, (1) acts of violence against the Jews, and (2) forcible baptism.
The history of the relations between the popes and the Jews begins with Gregory I. (590-604), who may be called the first pope, inasmuch as his authority was recognized by the whole Western Church. The fact that from the invasion of the Lombards (568) and the withdrawal of the Byzantine troops the Roman population was without a visible head of government made the Bishop of Rome, the highest ecclesiastical dignitary who happened to be at the same time a Roman noble, the natural protector of the Roman population, to which the Jews also belonged. Still, even before this time, Pope Gelasius is mentioned as having recommended a Jew, Telesinus, to one of his relatives as a very reliable man, and as having given a decision in the case of a Jew against a slave who claimed to have been a Christian and to have been circumcised by his master against his will (Mansi, "Concilia," viii. 131; Migne, "Patrologia Græco Latina," lix. 146; Vogelstein and Rieger, "Gesch. der Juden in Rom," i. 127-128). In the former instance the pope acted merely as a private citizen; in the latter he was most likely called upon as an ecclesiastical expert to give a decision in a local affair. The legend may also be quoted which makes of the apostle Peter an enthusiastic Jew who merely pretended zeal for Christianity in order to assist his persecuted coreligionists (Jellinck, "B. H." v. 60-62, vi. 9-10; Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 165-168; "Allg. Zeit. des Jud." 1903).Gregory the Great.
Nevertheless, the history proper of the popes in their relation to the Jews begins, as said above, with Gregory I. He often protected the Jews against violence and unjust treatment on the part of officials, and condemned forced baptism, but he advised at the same time the winning of the Jews over to Christianity by offering material advantages. Very often he condemned the holding of Christian slaves by Jews (Grätz, "Gesch." v. 43; Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 132-135). A very obscure order is contained in a letter of Pope Nicholas I. to Bishop Arsenius of Orta, to whom he prohibits the use of Jewish garments. Leo VII. answered the Archbishop of Mayence, who asked whether it was right to force the Jews to accept baptism, that he might give them the alternative of accepting Christianity or of emigrating (Aronius, "Regesten"; comp. Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 139). Anacletus II. (antipope), whose claim to the papal throne was always contested, was of Jewish descent, and this fact was used by his opponents in their attacks upon him. Benedict VIII. had a number of Jews put to death on the ground of an alleged blasphemy against Jesus which was supposed to have been the cause of a destructive cyclone and earthquake (c. 1020; Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 213).
In the bitter fight between Gregory VII. and the German emperor Henry IV. the pope charged the emperor with favoritism to the Jews, and at a synod held at Rome in 1078 he renewed the canonical laws which prohibited giving Jews power over Christians; this necessarily meant that Jews might not be employed as tax-farmers or mint-masters. Calixtus II. (1119-24) issued a bull in which he strongly condemned forced baptism, acts of violence against the lives and the property of the Jews, and the desecration of their synagogues and cemeteries (c. 1120). In spite of the strict canonical prohibition against the employment of Jews in public capacities, some popes engaged their services as financiers and physicians. Thus Pope Alexander III. employed Jehiel, a descendant of Nathan ben Jehiel, as his secretary of treasury (Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 225).Innocent III.
The extreme in the hostile enactments of the popes against the Jews was reached under Innocent III. (1198-1216), who was the most powerful of the medieval popes, and who convened the Fourth Lateran Council (1215); this council renewed the old canonical prohibitions against trusting the Jews with public offices and introduced the law demanding that Jews should wear a distinctive sign on their garments (see Badge). The theological principle of the pope was that the Jews should, as though so many Cains, be held up as warning examples to Christians. Nevertheless he protected them against the fury of the French Crusaders (Grätz, l.c. vii. 5; Vogelstein and Rieger, l.c. i. 228-230). Gregory IX., who in various official documents insisted on the strict execution of the canonical laws against the Jews, was humane enough to issue the bull. "Etsi Judæorum" (1233; repeated in 1235), in which he demanded that the Jews in Christian countries should be treated with the same humanity as that with which Christians desire to be treated in heathen lands. His successor, Innocent IV., ordered the burning of the Talmud in Paris (1244); but Jewish history preserves a grateful memory of him on account of his bull declaring the Jews innocent of the charge of using Christian blood for ritual purposes (see Blood Accusation). This bull was evidently the result of the affair of Fulda (1238), concerning which Emperor Frederick II. also issued a warning. The defense of the Jews against the same charge was undertaken by Gregory X., in his bull "Sicut Judæis" (Oct. 7, 1272; Stern, "Urkundliche Beiträge," i. 5).
The relations of the popes to the Jews in the subsequent two centuries present a rather monotonous aspect. They issued occasional warnings against violence, threatened the princes who allowed the Jews to disregard the canonical laws concerning badges or concerning the employment of Christian servants, but conferred minor favors on certain Jews. As a typical instance, it may be noted that Boniface VIII., when the Jews did him homage, insulted them by returning behind his back the copy of the Torah presented to him, after making the oft-repeated remark about reverence for the Law but condemnation of its misrepresentation.Martin V.
The excitement of the Church during the Hussite movement rendered the Jews apprehensive, and through Emperor Sigismund, who was heavily indebted to them, they obtained from Pope Martin V. (1417-31; elected by the Council of Constance after the Great Schism) various bulls (1418 and 1422) in which their former privileges were confirmed and in which he exhorted the friars to use moderate language. In the last years of his pontificate, however, he repealed several of his ordinances, charging that they had been obtained under false pretenses (Stern, l.c. i. 21-43). Eugene IV. and Nicholas V. returned to the policy of moderation, especially in advising the friars against inciting mobs to acts of violence. Sixtus IV., while sanctioning the Spanish Inquisition, repeatedly endeavored (1482 and 1483) to check its fanatic zeal and prohibited the worship of the child Simon of Trent, whom the Jews of Trent were falsely accused of having murdered (1474). He also employed several Jews as his physicians.
Alexander VI. (Borgia), known in history as the most profligate of all the popes, was rather favorably inclined toward the Jews. It is especially noteworthy that he allowed the exiles from Spain to settle in his states, and that he fined the Jewish community of Rome for its objection to the settlement in its midst of these unfortunates. Occasionally, however, he ordered the imprisonment of Maranos; and on the whole it seems that the pope's leniency was prompted by his greed. Leo X. also, the humanist on the throne of St. Peter, was in general favorably inclined toward the Jews, whom he employed not only as physicians, but also as artists and in other positions at his court. The beginning of the Reformation influenced his action in the controversy between Reuchlin and Pfefferkorn, which he settled in such a way as not to give any encouragement to those who demanded reforms in the Church.
Clement VII. (1523-34) is known in Jewish history for the interest which he took in the case of the Messianicpretender David Reubeni, and for the protection which he granted to Solomon Molko, who, as an apostate, had forfeited his life to the Inquisition. He also issued an order to protect the Maranos in Portugal against the Inquisition (1533 and 1534).The Reformation.
The Reformation and the consequent strictness in enforcing the censorship of books reacted on the condition of the Jews in so far as converts from Judaism eagerly displayed their zeal for their new faith by denouncing rabbinical literature, and especially the Talmud, as hostile to Christianity. Consequently Pope Julius III. issued an edict which demanded the burning of the Talmud (1553) and prohibited the printing of it by Christians. In Rome a great many copies were publicly burned (Sept. 9, 1553). The worst was yet to come. Paul IV. (1555-59), in his bull "Cum nimis absurdum" (July 12, 1555), not only renewed all canonical restrictions against the Jews—as those prohibiting their practising medicine among Christians, employing Christian servants, and the like—but he also restricted them in their commercial activity, forbade them to have more than one synagogue in any city, enforced the wearing of the yellow hat, refused to permit a Jew to be addressed as "signor," and finally decreed that they should live in a ghetto. The last measure was carried out in Rome with unrelenting cruelty.Pius V.
After a short period of respite under Paul IV.'s successor, Pius IV. (1559-66), who introduced some alleviations in his predecessor's legal enactments, Pius V. (1566-72) repealed all the concessions of his predecessor, and not only renewed the laws of Paul IV., but added some new restrictions, as the prohibition to serve Jews by kindling their fires on the Sabbath; he excluded them from a great number of commercial pursuits, and went so far in his display of hatred that he would not permit them to do homage, although that ceremony was rather a humiliation than a distinction (1566). Three years later (Feb. 26, 1569). (1572-85), who, while he showed an occasional leniency, introduced a large number of severe restrictions. Thus, the Jews were prohibited from driving through the streets of the city, and they were obliged to send every week at least 150 of their number to listen to the sermons of a conversionist preacher (1584). The terrible custom of keeping Jews in prison for a certain time each year, and of fattening them and forcing them, for the amusement of the mob, to race during the carnival, when mud was thrown at them, is mentioned (1574) as "an old custom" for the first time during Gregory's pontificate.
Sixtus V. (1585-90), again, was more favorable to the Jews. Aside from some measures of relief in individual instances, he allowed the printing of the Talmud after it had been subjected to censorship (1586). The policy of succeeding popes continued to vary. Clement VIII. (1592-1604) again issued an edict of expulsion (1593), which was subsequently repealed, and in the same year prohibited the printing of the Talmud. Under Clement X. (1670-76) a papal order suspended the Inquisition in Portugal (1674); but an attempt to interest the pope in the lot of the Jews of Vienna, who were expelled in 1670, failed. The worst feature of the numerous disabilities of the Jews under papal dominion was the closing of the gates of the Roman ghetto during the night. Severe penalties awaited a Jew leaving the ghetto after dark, or a Christian entering it.Pius VI.
Pius VI. (1775-1800) issued an edict which renewed all the restrictions enacted from the thirteenth century. The censorship of books was strictly enforced; Jews were not permitted any tombstones in their graveyards; they were forbidden to remodel or enlarge their synagogues; Jews might not have any intercourse with converts to Christianity; they were required to wear the yellow badge on their hats both within and without the ghetto; they were not permitted to have shops outside the ghetto, or engage Christian nurses for their infants; they might not drive through the city of Rome; and their attendance at conversionist sermons was enforced. When under Pius VI.'s successors the pressure of other matters caused the authorities to become negligent in the fulfilment of their duties, these rules were often reenforced with extreme rigor; such was the case under Leo XII. (1826).
Pius IX. (1846-78), during the first two years of his pontificate, was evidently inclined to adopt a liberal attitude, but after his return from exile he adopted with regard to the Jews the same policy as he pursued in general. He condemned as abominable laws all measures which gave political freedom to them, and in the case of the abduction of the child Mortara (1858), whom a servant-girl pretended to have baptized, as well as in the similar case of the boy Fortunato Coën (1864),; he refused to interfere in behalf of Captain Dreyfus or to issue a statement against the blood accusation. In an official document he denounced Jews, freemasons, and anarchists as the enemies of the Church.
Pius X. (elected 1903) is not sufficiently known to permit a judgment in regard to his attitude toward the Jews. He received Herzl and some other Jews in audience, but in his diocese of Mantua, before he became pope, he had prohibited the celebration of a solemn mass on the king's birthday because the city council which asked for it had attended a celebration in the synagogue.
- Berliner, Gesch. der Juden in Rom, Frankfort-on-the-Main, 1893;
- Vogelstein and Rieger, Gesch. derJuden in Rom, Berlin, 1895;
- Stern. Urkundliche Beiträge über die Stellung der Päpste zu den Juden, Kiel, 1893-95;
- Pastor, Gesch. der Päpste;
- Mansi, Concilia, Bullarium Magnum.
The following is a partial account of the more important bulls issued by popes with reference to the Jews up to the middle of the eighteenth century:
- 1120. Calixtus II. issues bull beginning "Sicut Judæis non" and enumerating privileges of the Jews (Vogelstein and Rieger, "Gesch. der Juden in Rom," i. 219 [hereafter cited as V. R.]).
- 1145. Eugenius III., ordering Jews to remit interest on debts of Crusaders while absent (Baronius, "Annales").
- 1191. Clement III. confirms the bull "Sicut Judæis non" (Rios, "Hist." ii. 469 [hereafter cited as Rios]).
- 1199 (Sept. 15). Innocent III. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1207 (Jan.). Innocent III., ordering Jews of Spain to pay tithes on possessions obtained from Christians (Rios, i. 360).
- 1216 (Nov. 6). Honorius III. in favor of German Jews, confirming the "Sicut Judæis non" of Clement III. (V. R. i. 9).
- 1219. Honorius III., permitting the King of Castile to suspend the wearing of the badge (Aronius, "Regesten," i. 362).
- 1228 (Oct. 21). Gregory IX., remitting interest on Crusaders' debts to Jews and granting a "moratorium" for repayment (V. R. i. 233).
- 1233 (April 6). Gregory IX. issues the bull "Etsi Judæorum," demanding same treatment for Jews in Christian lands as Christians receive in heathen lands (V. R. i. 234).
- 1233. Gregory IX., in bull "Sufficere debuerat," forbids Christians to dispute on matters of faith with Jews ("Bullarium Romanum," iii. 479).
- 1234 (June 5). Gregory IX. to Thibaut of Navarre, enforcing the badge (Jacobs, "Sources," Nos. 1227, 1388).
- 1235. Gregory IX. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1239 (June 20). Gregory IX., confiscating all copies of Talmud (V. R. i. 237).
- 1240. Gregory IX., ordering all Jewish books in Castile to be seized on first Saturday in Lent while Jews were in synagogue (Rios, i. 363).
- 1244 (March 9). Bull "Impia gens" of Innocent IV., ordering Talmud to be burned (Zunz, "S. P." p. 30).
- 1246 (Oct. 21). Innocent IV. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1247 (May 28). Innocent IV. issues the "Divina justitia nequaquam," against blood accusation.
- 1247 (July 5). Innocent IV. issues the "Lacrymabilem Judæorum Alemaniæ," against blood accusation (Baronius, "Annales," 1247, No. 84; Stobbe, "Die Juden in Deutschland," p. 185; Aronius, "Regesten," No. 243).
- 1250 (April 15). Innocent IV., refusing permission to Jews of Cordova to build a new synagogue (Aronius, "Regesten," p. 369).
- 1253 (July 23). Innocent IV., expelling Jews from Vienne (Raynaldus. "Annales"; V. R. i. 239).
- 1253 (Sept. 25). Innocent IV. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1267 (July 26). Clement IV. issues the "Turbato corde" calling upon Inquisition to deal not only with renegades, but also with the Jews who seduce them from the faith ("Bullarium Romanum," iii. 786; V. R. i. 243).
- 1272. Gregory X. confirms the "Sicut Judæis non" (V. R. i. 245, with edition of a denial of blood accusation: Stern, "Urkundliche Beiträge über die Stellung der Päpste zu den Juden," p. 5).
- 1272 (July 7). Gregory X., against blood accusation (Scherer, "Rechtsverhältnisse der Juden," p. 431).
- 1274. Gregory X. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1278 (Aug. 4). Nicholas III. issues the "Vineam sorce," ordering conversion sermons to Jews ("Bullarium Romanum," iv. 45).
- 1286 (Nov. 30). Bull of Honorius IV. to Archbishop of York and of Canterbury, against Talmud (Raynaldus, "Annales"; Scherer, "Rechtsverhältnisse," p. 48).
- 1291 (Jan. 30). Nicholas IV. issues the "Orat mater ecclesia" to protect the Roman Jews from oppression (Theiner, "Codex Diplomaticus," i. 315; V. R. i. 252).
- 1299 (June 13). Boniface VIII. issues bull "Exhibita nobis," declaring Jews to be included among powerful persons who might be denounced to the Inquisition without the name of the accuser being revealed (V. R. i. 251).
- 1317. John XXII. orders Jews to wear badge on breast, and issues bull against ex-Jews (Zunz, "S. P." p. 37).
- 1320 (June 28). John XXII., ordering that converts shall retain their property ("Bullarium Romanum," III., ii. 181; Ersch and Gruber, "Encyc." section ii., part 27, p. 149; V. R. i. 305).
- 1320 (Sept. 4). John XXII. issues to French bishops bull against Talmud.
- 1337 (Aug. 29). Benedict XII. issues the bull "Ex zelo fidei," promising inquiry into host-tragedy of Pulka (Raynaldus, "Annales"; Scherer, "Rechtsverhältnisse," p. 368).
- 1345 (July 5). Clement VI., against forcible baptism.
- 1348 (July 4). Clement VI. confirms "Sicut Judäis non."
- 1348 (Sept. 26). Clement VI., ordering that Jews be not forced into baptism; that their Sabbaths, festivals, synagogues, and cemeteries be respected; that no new exactions be imposed (Aronius, "Regesten," ii. 200; V. R. i. 313; Raynaldus, "Annales," 1348. No. 33; Grätz, "Gesch." viii. 351).
- 1365 (July 7). Urban V. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1389 (July 2). Boniface IX. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1390 (July 17). John of Portugal orders bull of Boniface IX. of July 2, 1389, to be published in all Portuguese towns (Kayserling, "Gesch. der Juden in Portugal," p. 39).
- 1397 (April 6). Boniface IX. confirms by bull grant of Roman citizenship to the Jewish physician Manuele and his son Angelo (V. R. i. 317).
- 1402 (April 15). Boniface IX., granting special privileges to Roman Jews—reducing their taxes, ordering their Sabbath to be protected, placing them under the jurisdiction of the Curia, protecting them from oppression by officials; all Jews and Jewesses dwelling in the city to be regarded and treated as Roman citizens (V. R. i. 318-319).
- 1415 (May 11). Benedict XIII., "Etsi doctoribus gentium," against Talmud or any other Jewish book attacking Christianity (Rios, ii. 626-653; see years 1434 and 1442, below).
- 1417. Bull against Talmud (Jost. "Gesch. der Israeliten," vii. 60).
- 1418 (Jan. 31). Martin V., forbidding the forcible baptism of Jews or the disturbance of their synagogues (Raynaldus, "Annales"; V. R. i. 4).
- 1420 (Nov. 25). Martin V. issues to German Jews bull "Concessum Judaæis," confirming their privileges (V. R. i. 5). No Jew under twelve to be baptized without his own and his parents' consent (Scherer, "Rechtsverhältnisse," p. 414).
- 1420 (Dec. 23). Martin V. issues "Licet Judæorum omnium," in favor of Austrian Jews.
- 1421 (Feb. 23). Martin V., in favor of Jews and against anti-Jewish sermons; permits Jewish physicians to practise (V. R. i. 5).
- 1422 (Feb. 20). Martin V. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1423 (June 3). Martin V. issues bull "Sedes apostolica," renewing the law regarding badge (V. R. i. 8).
- 1426 (Feb. 14). Martin V. issues bull against Jews (Zunz, "S. P." p. 48).
- 1429 (Feb. 15). Martin V. issues the "Quamquam Judæi," which places Roman Jews under the general civic law, protects them from forcible baptism, and permits them to teach in the school (Rodocachi," Il Ghetto Romano," p. 147; V. R. i. 8).
- 1432 (Feb. 8). Eugenius IV. issues a bull of protection for Jews, renewing ordinances against forcible baptism and disturbance of synagogues and graveyards (V. R. i. 10).
- 1434 (Feb. 20). Eugenius IV., prohibiting anti-Jewish sermons V. R. i. 11).
- 1442. Bull of Benedict XIII. published at Toledo (Rios, iii. 44).
- 1442 (Aug. 8). Eugenius IV. issues a bull against Talmud (shortly after withdrawn; Zunz, "S. P." p. 49). The Jews were ordered to confine their reading of Scripture to the Pentateuch; handwork was forbidden to them; no Jews were permitted to be judges (Rieger, 11).
- 1447 (Nov. 2). Nicholas V. confirms "Sicut Judæis non."
- 1451 (Feb. 25). Bull of Nicholas V. prohibiting social intercourse with Jews and Saracens ("Vita Nicolai," v. 91; V. R. i. 496).
- 1451 (May 28). Bull of Nicholas V., similar to that of Aug. 8, 1442, to extend to Spain and Italy; the proceeds to be devoted to the Turkish war (V. R. i. 16).
- 1451 (Sept. 21). Nicholas V. issues the "Romanus pontifex," relieving the dukes of Austria from ecclesiastical censure for permitting Jews to dwell there (Scherer, "Rechtsverhältnisse," pp. 423-425).
- 1472 (Feb. 21). Sixtus IV., ordering taxation of Roman Jews at a tithe during the Turkish war, a twentieth otherwise (compounded for 1,000 gulden in 1488), and a carnival tax of 1,100 gulden (V. R. i. 126).
- 1481 (April 3). Sixtus IV., ordering all Christian princes to restore all fugitives to Inquisition of Spain (Rios, iii. 379; V. R. i. 21).
- 1481 (Oct. 17). Bull of Sixtus IV. appointing Tomas de Torquemada inquisitor-general of Avignon, Valencia, and Catalonia (Rios, iii. 256).
- 1500 (June 1). Alexander VI., demanding for three years for the Turkish war one-twentieth (see 1472) of Jewish property throughout the world (V. R. i. 28, 126).
- 1524 (April 7). Clement VII. issues bull in favor of Maranos (V. R. i. 59).
- 1531 (Dec. 17). Bull introducing Inquisition into Portugal at Evora, Coimbra, and Lisbon (Grätz, "Gesch." ii. 266).
- 1540. Paul III., granting Neo-Christians family property except that gained by usury, also municipal rights, but must not marry among themselves or be buried among Jews (V. R. i. 63).
- 1540 (May 12). Paul III. issues "Licet Judæi," against blood accusation.
- 1554 (Aug. 31). Julius III., in bull "Pastoris æterni vices," imposes tax of ten gold ducats on two out of the 115 synagogues in the Papal States (Rodocachi, "II Ghetto Romano," p. 228; V. R. i. 145).
- 1555 (March 23). Paul IV., claiming ten ducats for each synagogue destroyed under bull of July 12, 1555 (V. R. i. 155).
- 1555 (July 12). Paul IV. issues the "Cum nimis absurdum" for Jews of Rome, which renews most of the Church laws, including the order to wear the yellow hat and veil, not to hold any real property (to be sold within six months), not to trade except in second-hand clothing, not to count fragments of month in reckoning interest; to sell pledges only eighteen months after loan and to repay surplus, to keep business books in Italian in Latin script, to live only in specified quarters with only two gates, not to be called "Signor," to maintain only one synagogue (V. R. i. 152-153).
- 1555 (Aug. 8). Bull of Paul IV.: Jews may dispense with yellow hat on journeys; dwell outside ghettos when the latter are crowded; acquire property outside ghettos to extent of 1,500 gold ducats; Jews of Rome are released from unpaid taxes on payment of 1,500 scuti; Jews may have shops outside ghetto; rents in ghettos may not be raised (V. R. i. 161-162).
- 1567 (Jan. 19). Bull of Pius V., "Cum nos nuper," orders Jews to sell all property in Papal States (V. R. i. 164).
- 1569 (Feb. 26). Bull of Pius V., "Hebræorum gens," expels Jews from the Papal States, except Rome and Ancona, in punishment for their crimes and "magic" (V. R. i. 168).
- 1581 (March 30). Bull "Multos adhuc ex Christianis" renews Church law against Jewish physicians (V. R. i. 174).
- 1581 (June 1). Gregory XIII. issues the "Antiqua Judæorum improbitas," giving jurisdiction over Jews of Rome to Inquisition in cases of blasphemy, protection of heretics, possession of forbidden works, employment of Christian servants (V. R. i. 174).
- 1584 (Sept. 1). Bull "Sancta mater ecclesia" orders 150 Jews (100 Jews, 50 Jewesses) to attend weekly conversionist sermons (Zunz, "S. P." p. 339; Jost, "Gesch. der Israeliten," iii. 210; V. R. i. 173).
- 1586 (Oct. 22). Bull of Sixtus V., favorable to Jews (Grätz, "Gesch." ix. 482).
- 1587 (June 4). Sixtus V., granting Magino di Gabriel of Venice the monopoly of silk-manufacture in Papal States for sixty years, and ordering five mulberry-trees to be planted in every rubbio of land (V. R. i. 181).
- 1592 (Feb. 28). Bull of Clement VIII., "Cum sæpe accidere," forbidding Jews to deal in new commodities (V. R. i. 184).
- 1593 (March 8). Bull of Clement VIII., in favor of Turkish Jews (Grätz, "Gesch." ix. 486).
- 1604 (Aug. 23). Bull of Clement VIII., in favor of Portuguese Maranos (Grätz. "Gesch." ix. 500).
- 1610 (Aug. 7). Paul V., "Exponi nobis nuper fecistis," regulates dowries of Roman Jews (V. R. i. 196).
- 1658 (Nov. 15). Alexander VII., in bull "Ad ea per quæ," orders Roman Jews to pay rent even for unoccupied houses in ghetto, because Jews would not hire houses from which Jews had been evicted (V. R. i. 215).
- 1674 (Oct. 3). Clement X., suspending operations of Portuguese Inquisition against Maranos (Grätz, "Gesch." x. 276; V. R. i. 223).
- 1679 (May 27). Innocent XI. suspends grand inquisitor of Portugal on account of his treatment of Maranos (Grätz, "Gesch." x. 279).
- 1747 (Feb. 28). Bull "Postremo mense superioris anni" of Benedict XIV. confirms decision of Roman Curia of Oct. 22, 1597, that a Jewish child, once baptized, even against canonical law, must be brought up under Christian influences (V. R. i. 242-245; Jost, "Gesch." xi. 256 n.). |
Wednesday, August 27, 2008
Mutual Fund
But for the past couple of months, I am glad that it is going up. It is still below the amount that we bought (meaning we're still losing) but I am optimistic, it can only go up. I just have this gut feel. LOLz.
To those who haven't heard about MF, here's Wikipedia's description: "A mutual fund is a professionally managed firm of collective investments that collects money from many investors and puts it in stocks, bonds, short-term money market instruments, and/or other securities. The fund manager, also known as portfolio manager, invests and trades the fund's underlying securities, realizing capital gains or losses and passing any proceeds to the individual investors."
We bought our shares last August 2007. We've invested it for a 5-year term. We can still withdraw the money anytime, but we'd have to pay a lot of fees if we decide to withdraw our investment before the term expires. This is what we have chosen so won't be tempted to take the money anytime we want. We have actually set aside this money for EJ's college fund.
Now that I have somewhat understood how this works, I am not sure anymore if investing it in a 5-year term is such a good idea. Maybe we should have invested it in a year's term only. But then again, we might have been tempted to use the money for something else.
I can only pray and hope that our MF's Net Asset Value goes up through the years. It goes without saying, I'll be praying for a better economy for the Philippines.
Monday, August 25, 2008
Weigh in #1
Fancy Faucets
So anyway, while looking over at the bathrom fixtures, I saw these lovely faucets. I love the bronze-colored faucet. Not too flashy. It goes with the current bathroom theme we have in mind.
Image from: Moen faucets
Hopefully we'll be able to finally furnish our condo next year. We're missing on the opportunity already.
There shall be light
But then again, this is not my house so I'll make do with what's available =)
My bests
SHOPPING
~best mall: Pavilion Mall (not too crowded)
~best shop: GAP (I can fit into their sizes)
~best bookstore: Borders (my baby and I can hang out there)
FOOD
~best bread: Auntie Ann's parmesan cheese (my weight loss bane)
~best seafood carbonara: Dome Cafe
~best pasta bolognese: Pizza Hut
~best casual dining: Chicken Rice Shop
BEAUTY
~best facial moisturiser: Olay
~best acne treatment: Just make sure the face is clean all the time
~best lip gloss: Nivea's lip gloss (strawberry flavor)
Saturday, August 23, 2008
Rainy birthday
As previously mentioned in my posts, I felt nothing extraordinary. I felt it was just a usual day. I didn't have any big plans. I would have wanted a long massage but I knew that it would all depend on my baby's schedule. As it turned out, I didn't have my massage.
I had a birthday lunch at Dome cafe with hubby and EJ. It was just a usual lunch. I didn't feel like it was a birthday lunch. LOLz. Just kidding of course.
In the afternoon, Grace came over and gave me a marble chocolate cake. I was so touched. Thank you so much, girl. You brightened my day. I just feel bad you had to brave the rain going home with your little princess. I should have offered for you to stay and wait until the rain subsided. I think I lost my manners...tsk...Thank you again for the company, for the cake and for drinking wine with me. Let's do that again on your birthday? Hehehe.
We almost didn't go out for dinner because it rained. But hubby wanted to eat at Pizza Hut! I asked him "I should decide, who's birthday is it anyway?" Hehe. But I was just kidding of course. I was craving for their pasta bolognese so I gave in. We went to Pavilion while it was still drizzling.
Secretly, I wished hubby had something for me that's why he insisted on going to Pavilion. But it turned out, he was just craving for Pizza Hut's spicy wings. Hahaha!
In fairness, hubby asked me if I wanted to shop for myself as a gift. But I declined. I didn't want anything in particular. I have everything I want and more. It's true.
My only wish is good health for my family and loved ones.
PS. Actually I need a flash drive. Anybody want to give me one, as a present? =)
Hari Raya coming up
If that's true (Hubby needs to check it first with their HR) then I need to plan another holiday. It's either we go to Manila again (we have unfinished business there) or we go to Bangkok. We've been meaning to go there. But somehow, we're either out of budget or out of time.
I am sure I would love it there, what with the cheap SPA's and food (according to friends who have been there). I am not sure though, if it is a good idea to go there with a toddler. If my baby can talk, I'm sure he'd object. LOLz.
But we're going to make it up to him. We're planning to go to Hongkong Disneyland next year with some family and friends. If we have more money, I'd probably book the Orlando vacations, which include visits to Walt Disney World and Universal Orlando. EJ would have a fabulous time, I'd bet.
So yeah, we're probably going to travel again next month if indeed there's a weeklong public holiday.
Friday, August 22, 2008
Best is yet to come
I wanted to start my day by going to the gym, you know starting it right? I woke up before the alarm alright. But before I can change into my gym outfit, I curled up in the sofa and slept again. I woke up when hubby put a blanket on my body. It was 8:30AM already. There goes my early morning.
A cousin suggested that I do something special for my birthday. But I am lost what to do. Being a tightwad that I am, I don't wanna splurge just for the sake of splurging. So I am thinking, I can probably just have a Spa treat for myself later this evening (after the customary birthday dinner, of course). Intending to google the best Spa here in KL, I logged in. But guess what I am browsing just now? I am looking at this office furniture. I am so funny :)
So yeah, a Spa treatment later. But I am not really in the mood.
I am so happy and touched that a new friend here in KL is coming over this afternoon with a self-baked cake.She's such a sweetie. I've prepared my wine, just in case we'd love to sip. Only a sip because she's coming over with her baby in tow. Baka malasing pa kami pareho, hahaha!
Aside from that, I really have no more plans. I would have liked to welcome my thirty-hood with style, but I am so lazy and unimaginative. I will probably go to sleep, just like the normal days.
What am I doing here? I am just blabbing. I should just stop and make myself some coffee. I am still sleepy I guess.
Happy 20th birthday to me!!! (err...30. But they say 30 is the new 20, so...) I know that best is yet to come. Cheers!
Thursday, August 21, 2008
Best physical feature
LAYER ONE:
– Name: Josiet
– Birth date: August 22
– Birthplace: Surigao City
– Current Location: Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
– Eye Color: Brown
– Hair Color: Black
– Righty or Lefty: Righty
LAYER TWO:
– Your heritage: Filipino
– The shoes you wore today: I seldom wear shoes now, mostly it's flipflops
– Your weakness: Auntie Ann's parmesan cheese!
– Your fears: Height, and losing my loved ones
– Your perfect pizza: Nothing really, I'm not a pizza girl
– Goal you’d like to achieve in life: Financially independent and happy family life
LAYER THREE:
– Your most overused phrase on YM: Oist
– Your first waking thoughts: It depends..
– Your best physical feature: My teeth (my killer smile, nyehehehe)
– Your most missed memory: Life in the province
LAYER FOUR:
– Pepsi or Coke: Coke
– McDonald’s or Burger King: McDonald’s
– Single or group dates: Single Dates
– Adidas or Nike: Nike
– Lipton Ice Tea or Nestea: Nestea
– Chocolate or vanilla: Chocolate
– Cappuccino or coffee: Cappuccino
LAYER FIVE
– A famous person, dead or alive, would you interview: Oprah
– Movie can you watch and say the lines along with the actors: Jerry Maguire
– Name two of your passions in life : My family and my family
– Least favorite time of day: Early evening, while waiting for hubby to come home
LAYER SIX
– Use hairspray or gel: No
– Your favorite meal: Sinigang na Bangus
– Color of the inside of your head when you close your eyes: White
– Listen to classical music: No
– Ever said LOL in real life without thinking about it: No
Wednesday, August 20, 2008
Is it time to say goodbye?
My brother has a Macbook for sale. He got it second-hand and he's selling it to me for Php35K. He said he even got an extra Mac memory, and he's giving it for free. Quite a catch. But what will I do with my laptop? Sell it?
Hmm..I don't know. I would love to own a Macbook but I don't think it is wise to buy another laptop for now even if it is cheap. We've spent considerable amount when we were on vacation in Manila last week. I think we'll have to tame our expenses for now.
I'll think I'll just wear gloves when I am typing? LOLz
Monday, August 18, 2008
We will be Billionaires!
While browsing today, a new post caught my eye - Are you a Millionaire in the making? According to the author, these questions below will help you begin to find out if you?
8).
Even if I am a SAHM, I think I still qualify to answer. Whatever my husband is earning is mine too, right? hehehehe. Seriously, I do the budgeting in the household. Out of the first nine questions, I only answered "no" on number 9. Since our baby is still a toddler we still haven't spent anything yet on education. What we have done is set aside some money for his education. But I feel it is not enough yet.
Since I answered 8 "yes" to the first nine questions and we are working on the question number 9, I guess we are still on our way to becoming a billionaire? Maybe!:)
Check it our if you are interested to know how you will fare.
It's my birthday and I want to party....not
Not that I don't want to celebrate my birthday. I am actually looking forward to turning thirty. I heard that thirty is the new twenty but with more money. Who doesn't want that, right?
But with all the packing and unpacking these past weeks, I lost count of the days and even my whereabouts. Funny! I am glad, I checked the calendar. I can now plan what I want for my birthday :)
I think I'd have a long massage, followed by dinner and a coffee afterwards. That's it. It would be a bonus if my baby will behave so we all have a relaxing time.
Friday, August 15, 2008
Still cheaper here
My usual answer is "KL is almost the same as Manila". And it is. I feel like I am just in Makati or Ortigas. The Malays look like Filipinos too (we are often mistaken as Malays). But of course there are differences too.
They do have a nice transportation system making it easy to commute. And I feel like the traffic here in Manila is horrendous compared to KL. Having said that, I still love Manila,lol.
It is still cheaper to live here. Supermarkets are bigger. I can find everything I want in one supermarket. What I absolutely miss when I am in KL are the promotional products available in supermarkets. I am a sucker for that, lol. In SM alone, you'd get a lot of that.
We're going back to KL on Sunday. And I am missing Manila already. Sigh. I hope more budget airlines will sprout so that airfares go down and we can go home every week, hahaha!
Thursday, August 14, 2008
Gap on Shangrila Mall
Yay! I don’t need to go to Makati or Trinoma Mall to check out the Gap stores. The sales clerk told me they just opened last May.
Anyway, I went inside immediately. I was so happy to see their 20% off sign sale. I went to the Gap kids first. I checked the price. Again I was surprised to see that it’s cheaper compared to Malaysia. It was only P550+ for a baby shirt and it was not even on sale (I didn’t notice I was on the new arrival area..hehehe).
I bought a pair of pants and a jeans for me. When I tried on the size 10, it was a little snug. Goodness, I’ve only been here for a few days and I’ve gained weight already? Grrr…So anyway, I bought the size 12.
But when I put it on back at the hotel, size 12 was a little big. Hahahaha! I was confused. Hubby recommended I keep the size 12. He thinks I might gain some more pounds. LOL. I hope not.
~~~
Check out these Festina watches. I want one of them. If only I didn’t shop too much already I might be able to buy one. Oh well, maybe next time :)
Vacation homes
Wednesday, August 13, 2008
E-Ticket
It’s not my first time to book a ticket online but this is the first time I was asked to reconfirm our ticket by also giving our credit card. What’s the credit card for? We paid the e-ticket already. Hmmm…
I’ll definitely give them a call tomorrow. I might as well check if I bought the travel insurance when I made the booking. I cannot find it on our ticket itinerary.
Honesty is not always the best policy
The moment my brother saw me he immediately said “you’re as big as an elephant”. Isn’t that infuriating? I mean I know I am fat but I just don’t like people telling me how fat I am. Telling me how fat I am is just tantamount to saying, “hey ugly, go stuff yourself with "weight loss pills”. I know ugly and fat are two different things but reality bites. In a world we live in right now thin equals beautiful.
Though I should really take things lightly and shouldn't take offense too. I don't think my family meant to say I am ugly, right?:)
I was once a pimply-face
There was a time (I was still working in Maldives then) when my face was infested with pimples. I even thought it was acne. My friends in the resort were even worried for me.
When I started to work in Maldives, I only had the occasional pimple but at some point those pimples spread out and never left my face for several months. It was agonizing. Imagine facing the guests with a lot of pimples on my face. I don’t know how I survived those months. The guests must have been embarrassed for me..hehehe.
I tried a lot of things just to get rid of my pimples. I tried putting on some creams but it made the pimple worse. I tried eating a lot of ampalaya (bittergourd) and drinking its juice because I heard it healing powers but it was not effective on me. I even tried rubbing on some alcohol (only 70% isopropyl) because my other sister swears by it but it just inflamed my face.
Funnily the moment I stopped being obsessed about my pimples, it also stopped growing on my face. Eventually, my face cleared. I don’t know what really healed my pimples. But starting then, I just wash my face twice a day.
Now and then, I dab some Olay cream. It makes my skin glow. But other than that, I don’t abuse my face with a lot of chemicals anymore.
Van Business
Of food and magazines
So here’s what I put in our pushcarts:
~chippy
~nova
~dried mango
~macapuno
~corn bits
And of course, I didn’t forget to get a copy of Yes! Magazine. I am not really a fan of Pinoy Showbiz. But everytime I’m in Manila, I just can’t help but get a copy. Somehow, a visit to Manila is not complete without a dose of Pinoy Showbiz.
I was just disappointed that nothing controversial was on this month’s issue. LOL. The issue was all about Daboy’s life as an actor. Well, since I am not a fan of his, I found it boring.
Gelli and Ariel’s newly renovated home was also featured. I think this is the only topic I read from start to finish. I found out Ariel is a golf enthusiast. He even posed with his golf clubs on the pic (I wonder though if it were Callaway golf clubs?).
I am still looking for a copy of Hello magazine with Brad and Angie on the cover. They seem to be out of the racks. I need to ask the attendant next time.
Monday, August 11, 2008
My achy feet.
Lucky girl
~~~
After the visit in Bacoor Cavite we went to MOA. The mall was jam-packed! We just went there to buy EJ's shirt and jeans for his birthday the following day. We also managed to squeeze in a visit to a Lacoste store and I bought hubby a shirt (from my blog earnings!)
~~~
After that we went to Dampa along Macapagal Avenue and had dinner with my family. It was such a nice feeling being able to pay the bill from my own money. I just wish that there's a way I can transfer my paypal money direct into my Checking Account. It would be easier that way.
~~~
We went home around 9PM and I was so exhausted. I am not used anymore to a hectic schedule. Now if only I can get somebody to look after EJ so I can head to the nearest SPA. That would be really wonderful!
Saturday, August 9, 2008
I keep coming back
I didn't grow up here but Manila is home to me (though of course I still am a probinsyana at heart). I gained my independence when I went to a university. I was 16 and alone and Manila was my oyster. It was such an exhilarating feeling. New friendships and memories were formed. That's why I always feel at home in Manila.
Now that were here on a short vacation, I suddenly miss everything. Even the horrendous traffic, hahahaha! Seriously, I just love being back home.
We'll be busy the whole time were here and I will definitely enjoy every moment of it.
~~~
While having breakfast this morning at the hotel, we saw a guy being interviewed. It brought back funny memories when I was still on job search. I had a lot of silly adventures and misadventures then. But that's for another post. :)
Friday, August 8, 2008
Blessing
The more one worries, the older one gets; the more one laughs, the younger one feels. ~ Chinese Proverb
Thursday, August 7, 2008
Is that me?
LIFE
Wednesday, August 6, 2008
What tomorrow brings
I was browsing some cruise itineraries (not that we are going on one anytime soon..i can only wish hehehe) particularly Mediterranean cruises and I learned that it goes on the above cities. Wow!
Among other things I've always dreamed of going on a romantic gondola ride on the Grand Canal of Venice. I guess a trip to Europe or Venice for that matter will not be complete without the above itinerary.
Europe's always been for the dreamy and the romantic. Since I am one, I sure hope to visit one day.
For now these dreams are just dreams. But some dreams do come true, right?
The world has seen
I went to my favorite Border's bookstore yesterday to look for the Hello Magazine where Brangelina's twins are featured. I totally forgot that half of Border's is on renovation. But I still went ahead. The second floor might have a stash of magazine. But when I went there, only local magazines were on sale. I asked the staff if they have Hello Magazine or People magazine. He said their subscription is temporarily on hold while they are partly on renovation. Oh, ok.
So now I don't know where to get my mag! I want to see the babies, and the whole family. I've become a fan of all the kids. The girls Shiloh and Zahara are so pretty and the boys are just too cute and funky.
I might check out Sungei Wang later. If not, then I'll just get the copy in Manila. We're flying on Friday na!! Yipee!!! Hopefully it won't run out of stocks.
~~~
Meanwhile if you're in the hunt for some classy and beautiful furnitures, do check out importadvantage.com. They do have a great selection, especially of tv furniture. I would love to have one if only our condo has been furnished already.
Tuesday, August 5, 2008
Spare Money
The question is, should I buy it for myself only or should I share it?
My first instinct actually was to go and visit an LV store in Manila. But I may need a blood pressure monitor if I go inside the store. Why? Because I might have a heart attack looking at the prices. Hahahaha!!
Seriously, I want to share my very first "blog earnings" with my dearest hubby. It's just right.
I'd like to buy a pair of watches for us. And maybe go to a spa and then buy EJ a train set if there's more.
But I don't think I'd be able to afford all that. Maybe just the watches?
Now I am stressed just thinking about it. Hehehe. So maybe we'll just pamper ourselves at the SPA.
Monday, August 4, 2008
Shopping spree
But last month was different.
We were RM1,000 below the budget. Wow! I couldn't believe it. I guess we managed to shy away from buying EJ lots of toys and I have been a very dutiful wife cooking dinner almost every night (well, except weekends of course).
So what do we do with the extra RM1,000? Shopping of course!
We decided to treat ourselves. And last weekend, we went to Pavilion mall with the money we saved.
We started by having lunch at Carl's Jr. Their burgers are so big but I decided to finish it off anyway. Saturday is my off day at dieting. Hehehe.
Then after lunch, we immediately went shopping. Even EJ was excited that day. He usually naps at 2pm. But he wast still hyper even at past 2pm. He even danced inside the store. He didn't mind the people watching him. Hahaha! Unfortunately I didn't see it. Only hubby did because I was busy :)
But after three hours of shopping, EJ finally slept and hubby complained he was tired already. While I was still full of energy! I didn't even notice three hours have passed by. Come to think of it, I've walked for three hours. Meaning I've exercised for three hours without me getting bored. Yay! Now I know why the fashionistas are skinny. It's because of the time they spend shopping. Shopping is even better than diet pills! Hahaha.
What did we buy?
Hubby bought 2 shirts, 1 polo shirt and 3 cargo shorts (he's addicted to cargo shorts lately!). I bought 2 blouses, 1 sleeveless, 1 jacket and 2 bangles. EJ had 1 shorts and some toys.
What a happy weekend it was!
Sunday, August 3, 2008
Movies and Popcorn
And speaking of movies, this makes me crave for a popcorn!! Do you notice how cinemas smell of popcorn? Well, I love that smell. Watching a movie is not a complete experience without a popcorn in my hand. But if I am watching a really serious movie, then I don't bring a popcorn inside.
Since I am on a mission right now, I don't think I'd be bringing in a boxful of popcorn when I go inside the moviehouse. Unless there is a diet popcorn available. Hahaha!!!
Seriously though, I'd love to have one of 'em popcorn machines in our house. If only to get a constant whiff of its smell. Seriously. Hahaha, kidding.
I've digressed.
So here is the list of movies I want to watch in Manila:
Mama Mia!
Hancock
Dark Knight
I hope we have time to watch all of these. I haven't been to a cinema in six months! And for me that feels like a century already. Hahaha!!
Friday, August 1, 2008
Things to look forward to
As always, I am excited. As if we haven't been home for a while. But there's nothing like being home with family and friends.
For this trip, I am looking forward to the following:
1) EJ's second birthday. He's been practising how to blow a candle. And he's very enthusiastic about it. Last night, hubby got tired lighting the candle because after blowing it off, EJ would demand it be lighted again. Let's see if he can properly blow the candles on his birthday.
2) After six months of chemotherapy, my mother will have her last session on this month. Thanks God.
3) "Budbod" - a local delicacy. Sort of a cassava cake with a sweetened young coconut as filling and wrapped in a banana leaf. I'm drooling now, just thinking about it. My mother said they'll make it the day before they fly for Manila.
4) Seafood trip at Dampa. Whenever we're in Manila, we always go to Dampa Libis or Ortigas. Hopefully, I won't be tempted to over eat. Or else I might just bring with me a generic Phentermine to curb my appetite.
5) A new baby into the family. Our youngest sister is giving birth to their first born child. Hopefully she gives birth while we are still there so we can still see the baby.
6) Watch a movie. I'm sure somebody will be willing to look after EJ so hubby and I can go out. I miss watching a movie in a movie theater!
7) Of course, reunion with family and friends.
I am so excited!!!!
|
Man tied to ATF's stolen ammunition gets six years in prison
A
But the sentence – deemed “long” by U.S. District Judge Lynn Adelman – had more to do with charges stemming from what happened while the 25-year-old man was in the Ozaukee County Jail, Adelman said.
According to an addendum to his plea agreement filed Friday, Markeevin Wilder agreed to pay someone to kill a witness in his case.
Wilder didn’t know the hit man and didn’t have money to pay him, so it was unlikely the plot would come to fruition, Wilder’s attorney and Adelman noted.
But Wilder wasn’t joking, Adelman said.
“The defendant seemed to be serious about it. That’s what’s really disturbing,” Adelman said before sentencing Wilder to 75 months behind bars.
Wilder read a letter to the court before his sentencing saying he doesn’t blame anyone else for the “bad choices” he has made in his life.
“I was not thinking at the time,” he said of the call he made from jail attempting to arrange the hit. “Nor was I thinking when that ATF car got broken into.”
Wilder is not charged in the theft from the vehicle but was charged with being a felon in possession of ammunition. He was convicted of an armed robbery in 2006 and is forbidden from handling guns and ammuition.
An ATF agent’s car was broken into in September and boxes of ammunition as well as three guns, including a fully automatic machine gun, were stolen. The machine gun has not been recovered. No one has been charged in the theft.
A Journal Sentinel investigation has exposed the break-in was tied to a botched undercover ATF sting in Milwaukee's Riverwest neighborhood where agents set up a fake storefront to nab criminals selling guns and drugs. Another man, Maquise Jones, sold agents at the storefront one of the guns that was stolen from the agent's SUV. Wilder provided Jones with the gun, according to a letter to the court from Wilder’s attorney, Joanna Perini.
Jones plead guilty to possessing a stolen gun and was sentenced to 18 months in prison earlier this month. According to documents filed in Jones’ case, Wilder called Jones and asked him to sell the gun - a Sig Sauer .40 caliber pistol- for him.
Wilder told Jones he wanted $300 to $350 and Jones could keep the rest. The following day, hoping to make a quick profit, Jones contacted someone he knew as "Mike," who was actually an undercover ATF agent, the documents state.
The federal sting, dubbed “Operation Fearless,” was marred by litany of problems aside from the guns being stolen.
After losing their guns, the.
In addition, agents hired a brain-damaged man with a low IQ to promote the store, encouraging him to set up gun and drug deals and then turned around and arrested him on federal charges.
The Journal Sentinel reported Friday that agents also let go a felon who had come into their store with a gun and said he needed to shoot someone.
Lawyer convicted of '09 felony given green light to practice again
Stephen Compton, a Hartland man convicted of felony heroin possession in 2009 can practice law again, the Wisconsin Supreme Court said Friday.
The reinstatement of Compton, whose license was suspended for two years retroactive to March 2010, came over the objections of two Walworth County Sheriff’s deputies who were involved in his 2009 arrest and prosecution.
“Both Deputy Sgt. (Jeff) Patek and Deputy Sheriff (Daniel) Long recognize Attorney Compton’s successful rehabilitation to date, but both men believe the period of Attorney Compton’s suspension has not been sufficient, given the seriousness of his criminal conduct,” the court wrote in its order.
Police reports prepared after Compton was arrested quote the lawyer as saying he began using illegal drugs in 2006 and that “he admitted being ‘coked up’ while handling legal cases in court,” according the Supreme Court’s opinion. During Compton’s reinstatement hearing, Patek testified that “Compton’s conduct before his arrest included possession and delivery of both heroin and cocaine.”
Compton was sentenced to one year in prison for the possession of narcotic drugs, though the prison time was stayed. He was also sentenced to one year of extended supervision and three years of probation.
The Supreme Court order said the justices agreed with the recommendation of James Winiarski — the referee who investigated and conducted a hearing on Compton’s motion to be reinstated. Winiarski noted that Compton, who has been working as a landscaper, has been drug free and actively participating in rehabilitation programs.
The court noted that an expert testified in Compton’s hearing that a person who is drug and alcohol free for five years has a 14% chance of a relapse. “…the referee said when it comes to trusting a lawyer to serve the public and the legal profession; a 14% relapse rate still needs to be addressed.” So the court ordered that as a condition of his reinstatement, Compton continue to participate in the state Bar’s Wisconsin Lawyers Assistance Program for two years.
Compton’s 2010 suspension was the third disciplinary action taken against him by the court. In 2002 he was reprimanded by the court for falsely recording his time in a contingency fee case. He was suspended for 60 days in 2008 for falsely billing the state public defender’s office for work that was actually done by an inmate. Compton, 48, was first admitted to the state Bar in 1992.
Tags: lawyer
Permalink | Email This Blog
Tex.
Police.
Permalink | Email This Blog
Ho-Chunk tribe betting their poker games are legal
The Ho-Chunk Nation is standing firm behind its belief that the computerized poker games it offers at its Madison casino are legal, the tribe said in a statement issued today.
The statement is in response to an suit filed Tuesday by the state Attorney General’s office asking the federal court to issue an injunction ordering the tribe to stop offering the games The state contends that according to its compact agreement with the tribe, it's the Ho-Chunk Gaming Madison casino (formerly Dejope Bingo & Entertainment) is not permitted to offer Las Vegas casino game in its Madison facility. The games, known as Class III games, are only allowed at its flagship casino near Wisconsin Dells and two others.
The tribe argues their poker games are off-limits to state regulators because the house does not bank the games. In other words, the gamblers play against each other and not against the house. Therefore, the tribe argues the games fall into the Class II category — a section of the law that covers bingo, pull tabs and similar games.
“The games are legal. They are in line with the (National Indian Gaming Commission) policies and regulatory authority and with our internal Gaming Commission, agents, inspectors and auditors,” Ho-Chunk Nation President Jon Greendeer said in a statement. “The regulatory authority of Class II non-banked poker resides with the federal government and the tribe, not the state.”
Last year and arbitrator ruled that the electronic poker games were Class III Vegas-style games, which would make them illegal in the Madison gambling hall. That decision, however, was later dismissed in federal court.
“The Ho-Chunk Nation welcomes an opportunity to have this issue resolved once and for all,” Greendeer’s statement said..
.
Tags: casino; ho-chunk
Permalink | Email This Blog
Foley lawyer joins chorus of IRS critics
Add the law firm of Foley & Lardner to the list of folks attacking the IRS in the growing scandal over the agency's targeting of conservative groups seeking tax exempt status.
Cleta Mitchell, a partner in Foley's Washington D.C. office, is quoted in the Washington Post as basically calling IRS officials liars when they said the targeting of conservative groups was done by a group of low-level employees in Ohio. Mitchell represents True the Vote, a conservative group whose application for tax exempt status was delayed.
Foley is the largest law firm based in Wisconsin. It has offices throughout the country and in Asia and Europe.
Tags: IRS
Permalink | Email This Blog
For-profit dialysis centers used more of expensive, dangerous drugs
An analysis of for-profit kidney dialysis centers showed they used more of an expensive and dangerous class of drugs known as erythropoiesis-stimulation agents (ESAs) than nonprofit facilities.
The controversial drugs, such as Amgen's Epogen, help raise levels of hemoglobin, a protein in red blood cells that carries oxygen. However, concern about the drugs has grown over the years because they have been overused and increase blood clots and the risk of heart attacks, stroke heart failure and death.
Conflicts of interest involving doctors and guidelines issued by the National Kidney Foundation also have been linked to increased use of the drugs.
In a report published Monday in JAMA Internal Medicine researchers found that for-profit dialysis centers used much higher doses of the drugs than nonprofit centers.
The use continued even after the Food and Drug Administration issued a black box warning for the drugs.
Patients who switched from a nonprofit center to a for-profit had an average increase in drug dose of 55%, compared with an average decline in dose of 51% among those who switched from a for-profit to a nonprofit facility.
"Financial considerations may have played a role in ESA dosing in for-profit facilities," the authors wrote.
Tags: conflicts of interest : Epogen
Permalink | Email This Blog.
Federal sentencing guidelines called for Hampton to receive 37 to 46 months in prison, calculated off the seriousness of the crime and Hampton’s criminal history.
Assistant U.S. Attorney William Lipscomb recommended 36 months. U.S. District Judge J.P Stadtmueller gave Hampton 32 months, saying the offense was serious but his criminal history was relatively minor.
Hampton was previously convicted of marijuana possession and carrying a concealed gun, according to court records. He also received municipal tickets for theft, disorderly conduct and driving offenses, including drunken driving, records show.
Stadtmueller said a prison sentence was needed to send a message.
“The community is deeply concerned about the escalation of violence that has so affected and infected the near north side and south side of Milwaukee,” the judge said.
Last year, federal agents set up a fake storefront in Riverwest called Fearless Distributing in an effort to nab violent drug dealers and felons selling guns. Most of the roughly 30 defendants, however, do not have violent records.
Nine defendants have been sentenced in state and federal court. Besides Hampton and a man who earlier received 10 years in prison, the defendants have gotten sentences between 6 and 18 months. Two received deferred prosecutions. The rest are open and a few of those face long person terms, based on their criminal records.
The ATF sting, dubbed “Operation Fearless,” resulted in the seizure of 145 guns, officials said. Some firearms, however, came directly from stores such as Gander Mountain. Defendants were able to turn a quick profit because of the high prices paid by agents. Prosecutors and the ATF have not said how many guns came from stores.
The operation was plagued by problems and questionable practices, revealed in a Journal Sentinel investigation.
Agents hired a brain-damaged man with a low IQ to promote the store, encouraging him to set up gun and drug deals, and then turned around and arrested him on federal charges.
An agent’s guns, including a machine gun, were stolen from his vehicle. ATF has not recovered the machine gun. The sting.
A bipartisan group of powerful congressional members has demanded answers and the ATF launched an internal investigation.
Tags: ATF : Backfire : guns : diedrich : federal court : federal : Fearless
Permalink | Email This Blog
Journal Sentinel series on child abuse used for reporter training
The Journal Sentinel's "Fatal Care" series is part of a new training module produced by the Journalism Center on Children and Families at the University of Maryland. "Fatal Care," published in 2009, detailed the death of Christopher Thomas and other Milwaukee County children who died despite clear warning signs to child welfare officials that they were at risk.
The web-based training module, designed to help reporters who cover children's deaths, also includes video interviews with journalists from the Dallas Morning News, Washington Post and National Public radio.
Risk of opioid dependence wider than many think, editorial says
An online editorial Thursday in JAMA questions the belief that pain patients with a history of substance abuse are the only ones to worry about when prescribing narcotic painkillers for chronic, non cancer pain.
The paper takes issue with the long-held concept that only tiny percentage of opioid users develop dependence, noting that some research indicates it might be as high as one-third of patients.
Even low-risk patients given large enough doses are at high risk of having an overdose, writes Deborah Dowell, a physician with the New York City Department of Health and Mental Hygiene.
"Some physicians may think that only a small fraction of their patients are put at risk by taking high doses of opioids," Dowell wrote. "However, the risk of opioids stems primarily from these drugs, not from patients."
Tags: opioids : side effects
Permalink | Email This Blog
Indianapolis police settle civil rights suit in police brutality case
The Indianapolis Metropolitan Police Department has settled a federal civil rights case with the mother of a teen-age boy beaten by officers in 2010, the Indianapolis Star reports.
The settlement amount was not disclosed in the case filed by the mother of Brandon Johnson. The incident brought the Indianapolis police the same sort of unwanted attention that of the beating of Frank Jude, Jr. brought the Milwaukee police.
In both cases, photos of the victims' injuries outraged the community.
In the Indianapolis case, no officers were fired.
Jude's lawsuit against the city and the Milwaukee Police Department as a result of his beating outside a Bay View party in 2004 was settled for $2 million. Seven Milwaukee officers were criminally convicted in federal court.
Milwaukee crime kingpin Michael Lock loses appeal in prostitution case
Milwaukee crime boss Michael Lock, who ran a ruthless enterprise for more than a decade, on Wednesday lost his appeal to overturn his conviction on running a prostitution ring -- the latest blow in his bid to reserve several convictions.
A state appeals court rejected Lock's arguments that in the prostitution case the judge and prosecutor made mistakes, he endured a trial delay and the charges were overlapping,
Last year, Lock lost an appeal to overturn his conviction on homicide, kidnapping and drug dealing charges.
Lock was convicted in 2008 of killing two rival dealers and of kidnapping and torturing a different dealer, for which he was sentenced to life in prison. He later was convicted of running a prostitution ring, pimping women, including his future wife. In federal court, he was convicted of running a mortgage fraud scheme.
Lock's organization, called the "Body Snatchers," sold drugs, kidnapped, tortured and killed other dealers, prostituted women across the Midwest and ran a mortgage fraud scheme. Lock expanded his illicit operations even as he worked as an informant for the FBI, twisting the criminal justice system to his advantage, a Journal Sentinel investigation found.
The murders followed a style used by the Body Snatchers: Lock would begin by developing a drug-buying relationship with a targeted dealer, increasing his purchases. Meanwhile, other members of his organization would do surveillance on the target. Lock would use his flock of prostitutes to entertain the targeted dealer, dulling his sense of suspicion.
Once Lock felt as.
A member of Lock's crew said Lock paid scores of Milwaukee police officers to help in his criminal enterprise. Two officers were later indicted on charges of assisting drug dealers, but prosecutors never said whether they worked for Lock. No one else was charged.
Lock and his uncle became informants for the FBI after they were arrested for drug dealing. Lock used that role as informants to set up his competitors, continuing to expand his illicit operations in the meantime.
Lock is serving life in prison.
Investigators think there are bodies buried by Lock's operation, likely under concrete, somewhere in Milwaukee. They are looking for at least four such bodies, according to a court document.
Tags: Preacher's Mob : Michael Lock : homicide : diedrich
Permalink | Email This Blog
Lax oversight of foster care agencies allows child abuse to continue
A story in the Los Angeles Times over the weekend revealed that a troubled foster care provider had stayed in business despite a scathing report a decade ago. More children entrusted to the agency had been harmed, and officials continued to raise questions about its financial practices.
Things aren’t so different here in Milwaukee. Four years ago, the Journal Sentinel’s Fatal Care series revealed deadly mistakes with the foster care system. Our investigation showed that 22 Milwaukee County Children died from 2004 to 2008 despite clear warning signs to the Bureau of Milwaukee Child Welfare that they were at risk.
Despite reforms, those problems continue, as evidenced by the case of Angelica Belen earlier this month. Three of her children died in a fire when she locked them in a room, alone, and went to work. The bureau had received at least seven earlier reports about potential harm to her children, yet she was allowed to keep custody of them.
Judge report.
Tags: rutledge : diedrich : child porn : district attorney : child welfare : child care
Permalink | Email This Blog
Ald.."
Permalink | Email This Blog.
Between 2007 and 2012, more than 58% of gun dealers were not inspected, the review found. Meanwhile, from 2004 and 2011, the number of violations found by inspectors increased by 276%. The review also found that gun dealers lost track of nearly 175,000 guns between 2004 and 2011.
The inspector general’s report on ATF, the largest examination of gun dealer licensing since 2004, noted the ATF didn’t have enough inspectors to keep up with inspections. Gun dealers increased by 16 percent to about 124,000 in fiscal year 2011. The figure is now about 132,000, according to ATF’s web site.
ATF has tried to focus on “high-risk” FFLs but the auditors said the agency was not tracking well enough whether that strategy was working, the review found.
The report also found the ATF’s revocation process can drag on for years – and gun dealers are allowed to sell firearms in the meantime. The number of revocations by ATF dropped from 125 in 2004 to 71 in 2011.
A Journal Sentinel investigation on gun shop regulation, “Wiped Clean,” in 2010 found that the ATF rarely revokes gun dealer licenses across the country, and the process can drag on in the courts for years.
The agency typically wins such cases, but gun stores can easily beat the ATF’s harshest action by having a relative, friend or employee pull a fresh license, the investigation found. The move wipes away the earlier violations.
The Journal Sentinel found more than 50 cases across the country, including in Wisconsin, in which the person whose license was revoked remains close to the gun-selling operation.
ATF officials said they were aware of the loophole, coined “phoenix from the ashes,” but they need firm proof to deny a license. Congress has limited ATF's authority to gather such evidence.
A West Milwaukee gun store was an example of the loophole. Badger Guns and its predecessor, Badger Outdoors, were top sellers of crime guns recovered by Milwaukee police for more than a decade. Over two years, six Milwaukee police officers were wounded with guns sold by Badger Guns or Badger Outdoors.
In 2006, ATF investigators recommended revoking Badger Outdoors' license, but there was no revocation. That license was surrendered, and co-owner Mick Beatovic retired.
The other owner, Wally Allan, went to work for his son, Adam Allan, who pulled a new license and changed the name to Badger Guns. Beatovic moved to Arizona but remained.
Badger Guns owner Adam Allan subsequently had his license revoked in 2011 after inspectors founds numerous serious violations.
Allan’s brother, Mike Allan, then opened Brew City Shooter's Supply. The store uses a model where customers had to be members to buy guns from the operation.
The new inspector general’s report on gun dealer regulation comes weeks after the Justice Department’s inspector general issue a report critical of certain aspects of the ATF’s regulation of explosives.
The inspector general is considering an independent review of an undercover gun-buying sting by ATF in Milwaukee beset by foul-ups and failures, uncovered the Journal Sentinel’s “Backfire” investigation.
Tags: Wiped Clean : ATF : Backfire : diedrich : guns : federal : federal court
Permalink | Email This Blog
Medical conflicts of interest better eliminated than exposed
Donald Light, a fellow at Harvard University, offered an interesting take on the concept that drug companies and doctors should be required to publicy state their financial connections: Doing so doesn't eliminate the conflict of the interest.
Light, who researches institutional corruption in the development of prescription drugs, was quoted in a blog on Kaiser Health News. The item detailed how the Affordable Care Act will require drug and medical device companies to disclose payments to doctors beginning in 2014 on a new web site of by the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services.
Light said a better solution would be to simply outlaw such payments. As an example he cited Kaiser Permanete, which does not allow the doctors it employs to receive gifts or free drug samples.
“If we agree that the goal of medicine is to help patients become healthier, then these payments corrupt our goal,” Light said.
Tags: conflicts of interest
Permalink | Email This Blog.
The briefing was with high-ranking members of the ATF, although Acting Director, B. Todd Jones, did not attend, they said.
A letter from Jones answering the more than two dozen questions legislators posed earlier this year is still forthcoming, they said. No date was provided.
ATF officials did not dispute any of the Journal Sentinel’s key findings exposing flaws and foul-ups in the undercover sting aimed at snaring criminals selling guns and drugs, the sources said.
The Department of Justice Inspector General is considering an independent investigation in the wake of the newspaper’s findings. Still no word on when he will make a decision.
Tags: ATF : Backfire : Milwaukee : Fearless : Sting : rutledge : diedrich : federal : federal court : guns
Permalink | Email This Blog.
In addition, agents used a man with a mental disability to set up gun and drug deals and later referred him for criminal charges. They paid him in cigarettes, merchandise from the storefront and cash.
A spokesman for U.S. Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner (R-Wis.) said Thursday – a day after the deadline legislators set for the agency to respond – that ATF officials agreed to meet on the Hill on Monday to discuss the operation.
ATF officials declined to comment Thursday on the upcoming meeting.
Editor's note: The headline and text of this blog item were changed to make clear ATF officials are scheduled to meet with congressional staff, not with members of Congress.
Tags: ATF : Backfire : guns : federal : federal court : rutledge
Permalink | Email This Blog
Formal Flynn reopened the internal inquiry after a Jounal Sentinel investigation prompted the medical examiner’s office to change its ruling on the manner of Williams’ death from natural to homicide. After both internal reviews, the department’s Professional Performance Division concluded the officers did nothing wrong, despite apparent violation of three department rules. One requires officers to remain aware of the condition of prisoners. Another requires police to call for help immediately “if medical treatment becomes necessary.” A third requires them to write accurate and thorough reports.
Milwaukee County District Attorney John Chisholm also reopened his investigation, which yielded the same result as Flynn’s. John Franke, named special prosecutor by Chisholm, convened an inquest. But despite the inquest jury’s recommendation that he do so, Franke did not issue misdemeanor charges against three officers involved in Williams' arrest. Richard Ticcioni put a knee across Williams’ back while applying handcuffs. Jeffrey Cline and Jason Bleichwehl each spent time in the front of a squad car while Williams struggled to breathe in the back. All three refused to testify at the inquest, citing their Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination. arrest should be charged with federal crimes; and the other into whether the Police Department has committed a series of civil rights abuses, possibly including Williams’ death in custody.
The
Tobin said last week he planned to wait for the outcome of the federal review before taking further action.
Reached Tuesday, he said he had just received Rose’s complaint and planned to review it.
Tags: Derek Williams
Permalink | Email This Blog
Tags: Backfire; Watchdog; Fearless
Permalink | Email This Blog |
K9 - Development History
1.28
- Added support for customization of K9 resources (i.e. partial alternate language support). See Customizing K9
- Fixed a problem where if you kept the Escape key held down while attempting to open a message K9 would crash.
- Fixed a problem when canceling out of resetting statistics would reset the date/time shown at the column head.
- Added "View Folder" button to Statistics tab to open up a Windows Explorer window on the K9 database directory.
- Added date display to the email reader window.
- Modified system tray tooltip for Win9x systems since it seems those OS'es don't support line breaks in the text.
- Added/updated the following keyboard accelerator keys:
CTRL-G = Good.0
RC3
RC2
RC1
Beta 21
Beta 20
Beta 19
Beta 18
Beta 17
Beta 16
Beta 15
Beta 14
Beta 13
Beta 12
Beta 11
Beta 10
Beta 9
Beta 8
Beta 7
Beta 6
Beta 5
Beta 4
Beta 3
Beta 2
Beta 1
Alpha Build 14
Alpha Build 13
Alpha Build 12
Alpha Build 11
Alpha Build 9, 10
Alpha Build 8
Alpha Build 7
Alpha Build 6
Alpha Build 5
Alpha Build 4
Alpha Build 3
Alpha Build 2
Alpha Build 1
- Copy to clipboard right-click menu option wasn't working in the Storage Area or Server Check sections.
- Debug log windows are now limited to the last 512 K of text to help reduce memory usage.
- Modified update behavior on the Advanced page when editing or creating a new account.
- Added Advanced page option to reduce CPU priority when K9 is minimized.
- Added option to always score emails after the Storage Area emails have loaded.
- Increased maximum line length for filter lists from 256 to 1024 characters.
- DNSBL lookups are disabled for the remainder of a session if they are taking too long (cached values are still used).
- Changed statistics percentage values to show 2 decimal places.
- Server Check log results are now shown in a similar format to the Proxy log.
- Added Recent Emails "new", "good" and "spam" counts to system tray icon tooltip.
- Improved ability to detect message size for use with "Don't filter messages larger than..." option.
1.26
-.
1.25
-.
1.24
- Added detailed communications debug logging option to Configuration page.
- If a sound has been set to play upon Good email arriving, it won't be played again unless at least 30 seconds have elapsed since it was last played.
1.23
- Added color selection customizer for list windows.
- Added a "K9 Website" item to system tray menu.
- Added simple session statistics logging to the file "sessions.txt" in the K9 directory.
- Increased "From" line to 80 characters from 40 in the whitelist/blacklist right-click menu.
- Changed default DNSBL server again, this time to sbl-xbl.spamhaus.org.
- K9 no longer monitors for changes in the filter list files if the options are not selected on the Configuration page.
- Found a problem in the whitelist/blacklist code that may have prevented certain matches being made.
- Fixed a minor memory leak when using regular expressions.
- DNSBL cache wasn't properly expiring entries.
- Wasn't creating the Emails directory on first installation on Windows 9x systems.
1.22
- K9 now saves a copy of the existing good.dat and spam.dat database files whenever these are saved to disk. The backup files will have a ".old" file extension.
- Changed default DNSBL server from cbl.abuseat.org to xbl.spamhaus.org (which now incorporates cbl.abuseat.org). Note that this is only for new installations - your existing server will not be changed.
- Hopefully fixed a problem when running on Windows 9x/Me systems that would cause K9 to become confused as to the location of the Emails directory.
1.21
- Implemented right-click list menu "Organize" functionality for the Storage Area and Server Check pages. The menu item was present in version 1.20 but not functional.
- The whitelist and blacklist files are now monitored for changes so there's no need to hit the "Reload" buttons after making manual changes and thus the buttons have been removed.
1.20
-.
- Added "Change data storage location..." button to the statistics page. This will move any existing data (emails, databases etc.) and cause K9 to use this directory to store all future data.
1.19
- Fixed bug in APOP handling.
- Added more information to the statistics page.
- Added support for regular expressions to the whitelist/blacklist. Go here for details.
- Added regular expression tester to the Advanced page.
- Added "Header" and "Body" whitelist/blacklist options to the right-click list menu.
1.18
- Wasn't saving window size/position under certain circumstances.
- Wasn't properly determining the Content-Type of certain emails lacking whitespace after the ":".
- Fixed bug in APOP handling.
- Properly handles emails with improperly formed line ending characters (e.g. lines with missing carriage-returns).
- DNSBL IP addresses are now aged individually as opposed to the entire cache.
- Fixed hang on "PASS" bug.
- Added new keyword "[MultiBlank]" to flag the presence of multiple blank lines within an email.
- Updated online documentation for Advanced and Statistics pages.
1.17
- Added DNSBL support.
- Fixed problem decoding MIME headers with some emails.
- Enhanced the right-click filter context menu.
- Rules added from right-click context menu are checked for duplicates before being added to lists.
- Shows overall accuracy statistic in the status bar.
1.16
-.
1.15
- Corrected display of time/date on Statistics and Logs page.
- Improved handling on POP3 authentication failure on Server Check page..
- Recent Emails display scores weren't properly refreshing after pressing the Refresh button..
- Prevented unnecessary loading of Good Emails list when performing background cleanup tasks..
- Fixed bug in code used to identify non-existent HTML tags..
- Fixed memory corruption bug in whitelist/blacklist handling code..
- After editing the Advanced page email account settings sometimes the values weren't saved.
1.14
- Reduced memory usage when using the "Close" window button to minimize to a system tray icon.
- Fixed toolbar button not being re-enabled if keyboard shortcut was used.
- Added option to enable or disable the tray icon flashing when email is being processed.
- K9 no longer writes the database files out to disk on exit. This was redundant since it was done after each email session.
- If Explorer crashes and the task bar disappears K9 should now restore the tray icon when the taskbar is recreated.
- Fixed situation where K9 would report a huge number of email accounts that could be configured on first startup.
1.13
- Fixed problem with reclassifying emails when Advanced option "Only add reclassified emails..." was selected.
- Fixed POP3 authentication problem when multiple unsupported methods were tried.
- Added option to "encrypt" emails stored on disk.
1.12
- Fixed a problem with decoding Base 64 encoded "encoded words" (e.g. "=?...?=")
- Minor changes to reclassification code.
1.11
- Made showing "Good" tray icon when "good" email arrives an option.
- "Good" tray icon reverts to normal icon after 5 minutes (in addition to when K9 is opened or closed).
- Proxy has better support for Norton Antivirus format usernames.
- If the Advanced option for only adding reclassified emails to the DB is selected, words are not removed from the opposite DBs when reclassified since they would never have been placed there in the first instance.
- Fixed graphics glitch where Recent Emails window sometimes appeared greyed out.
- Minor GUI changes to better support Windows XP manifests.
1.10
- Word parsing now includes ASCII characters 192 - 255 as valid word characters.
- Words are not removed from the opposite database and stats are not updated if the email being reclassified is already of the desired state.
- Added option for only adding words to DB when reclassifying.
- Improved saving of column widths.
- Fixed problem with manual scoring of emails when "...only score new emails" Advanced option was selected.
- Added ability to specify "[Spam]" tag text.
- Spam percentage can now also be added to the custom header when marking as spam.
- Added buttons on the Advanced page for configuring and restoring email program account settings.
- Tray icon changes when Good email has arrived.
- Definable location for "Good" email sound file.
- The program now interprets "encoded" header items (e.g. =?iso-2022-jp?q?=96=A2=8F=B3?=).
1.09
- Invalid HTML tags are now removed before scoring and a new keyword tag added if they are found.
- New re-classification process removes words from wrong database before adding to correct database.
- Added option to only score new (bold) email when new email arrives.
- Copying stats to the clipboard now also copies the dates.
1.08
- Added option to allow spam emails retrieved with a fake "TOP" to be added to the word database.
- Added option to allow spam emails retrieved with a fake "TOP" to be added to the Recent Emails window.
- Added option to prevent whitelisted emails from being added to the database.
- Added extra "hours" field for Configuration page Cleanup section.
- Added ability to add subject and recipient to the whitelist/blacklist from the right-click context menu.
- Improved handling of malformed date headers.
- Date and time formats should now properly adhere to Control Panel regional settings.
- Corrected placement of "(No subject)" and spam percentage as per configuration settings when no subject line is present.
- Possible fix for problems with large emails when using the "Don't filter messages larger than" option.
- Email reader window can now be dismissed from all sub-windows by hitting the Escape key.
1.07
- Added APOP support (basic MD5 - RFC 1939).
- Fixed communications problems when using the "Don't filter messages larger than" option.
- Removed "Apply" buttons from Configuration and Advanced tabs. All fields are now updated "live".
- Fixed large fonts 125% problems.
- Added new date format option (long or short system format) and fixed(?) date display problems.
- New system tray icon.
1.06
- Fixed updating of word database statistics after a rebuild.
- If no filter list is selected to be used, K9 will not load it at startup.
- Adds CRLF at end of filter lists if none present.
- Translating "TOP" commands to "RETR" shouldn't have been adding messages to Recent Emails list.
- Added installer option to open to check for latest version.
- Added option to play a sound ("good.wav" in the same directory as k9.exe) when Good email has arrived.
1.05
- Created a new "Advanced" tab and moved some configuration options over to it.
- Added checkbox option to allow/prevent statistics updating.
- Added checkbox option for adding spam percentage to Subject line.
- Added simple detection of single character "words" (e.g. "S P A M") and created a keyword "[SingleWords]" for it.
- Added experimental faked "TOP" processing option to accommodate some unconventional email applications.
- Fixed parsing of attachment name when there was a space before/after the '=' character and the attachment name.
- Fixed bug in status window display of percentage complete when scoring.
- Provided option to not filter messages larger than a given size.
1.04
- Added "Bcc" keyword to filter list rules.
- Fixed problem with dates without a "seconds" field.
- Fixed problem with Storage Area refresh showing items from wrong folder.
- Modified Statistics tab to show date/time of last reset.
1.03
- Re-classifying an item that was a whitelist/blacklist hit will not affect the statistics.
- Fixed thread handle leak.
- Added "Cc" keyword to filter list rules.
- New toolbar icons courtesy of Lim Chee Aun from Phoenity
- Various small bug fixes.
1.02
- Proxy now correctly ignores some Winsock 10035 (blocking) errors when reading data due to certain email clients and A/V proxies.
- Date parsing uses file creation time when unable to get it from email.
- Fixed Delete key being interpreted to delete emails when editing Quick Find text.
1.01
- Raised the maximum Server Check account password length to 63.
- Fixed date parsing on "folded" header lines.
- Fixed problem handling remote POP3 server error conditions when first connecting (e.g. an "-ERR" as the very first response).
1.0
- K9 now delays loading Good folder contents until first viewing for faster startup time.
- Added option to prompt or not when deleting emails.
- Auto-configures Outlook/Outlook Express accounts on first run.
- Server Check now deletes "header only" emails from disk as well as from the viewable list.
- Improved "nonsense" word detection and rejection.
- Addressed issues with timeouts, large emails and potentially missed emails when sending emails back to the client.
- Updated the web site.
RC3
- Added "Properties" item to right-click menu.
- Added ability to limit the Good and/or Spam folders to a given maximum number of messages.
- Added Organize button to Inbox section.
- Added Quick Find to Storage Area.
- Added Refresh button to Server Check and Recent Emails.
- Changed Date list entries to be based on first "Received" header item rather than "Received: from" headers since some emails may not have the latter.
- Fixed bug on some systems where under certain circumstances a single character would go missing from emails passing through the proxy.
- Fixed problem with emails showing in email application but missing from K9's lists.
- New Statistics list display when reading emails.
- Removed Recent Emails and Inbox folders from the Storage Area.
- Swapped descriptions of false positive/negative on Statistics page.
RC2
- Fixed inability to alter statistics by re-classifying messages.
- Fixed display problems with Statistics tab in Large Fonts mode.
- Added "Not" keyword to b/w filter syntax to negate the action of the rule.
- Added percentage complete indicator when loading list of email messages.
- Added some word database statistics to the Statistics page.
- Moved "Rebuild databases" button to the statistics page.
RC1
- Server Check: All "header only" messages in the list are removed prior to checking the server.
- The registry string value "ProxyListenIP" can be set to enable the proxy to listen on IPs other than 127.0.0.1 (restricted to RFC 1918 addresses).
- Added "To" field to all list views.
- Trimmed email "From" and "To" fields to only show first name.
- Fixed "feature" where proxy would use previous successful IP address if a POP3 server hostname failed to resolve.
- Fixed bug in string search function that may have caused some false filter matches.
- Re-classifying emails now only affects the statistics when performed in the Recent Emails window.
Beta 21
- Changed email parser to accommodate some malformed emails.
- Better parsing of malformed HTML when viewing emails with the HTML removal button selected.
- Made alternate lines in listviews slightly different colors to aid view-ability.
- Added right-click context menu for "Add sender to Whitelist/Blacklist"
- Added new statistics page.
- Added "quick search" edit box to Recent Emails.
Beta 20
- Fixed a bug in the display of scored email when the list ended up empty after deleting emails.
Beta 19
- Fixed a bug in the multipart MIME parser.
- Possible fix for client-side proxy timeout.
Beta 18
- Wasn't loading the whitelist correctly.
- Fixed saving maximize state of main window on exit.
Beta 17
- Reduced memory usage when K9 is "minimized" by the "Close" button.
- Fixed Date parsing problem and added support for all RFC date timezones.
- Fixed problem with emails containing invalid characters that caused the proxy to eventually timeout.
- Fixed bug with K9 not seeing an attachment under certain circumstances.
- Re-architected the whitelist/blacklist processing with new keyword syntax.
- Fixed several bugs in the Server Check area. Headers are now properly scored without having downloaded the email body.
- Fixed problem with proxy timeout values.
- Server Check email deletion wasn't using the port number specified in the configuration.
- Fixed problem with email spam tag scores being different from scores shown in other parts of the application.
- Stats window (when reading an email) shows the reason a whitelist/blacklist filter matched.
- Added basic "nonsense" word detector.
- Fixed showing incorrect database word counts in Stats section.
- Now shows percentage completeness when scoring the list.
- Fixed not properly saving window size and placement on exit.
Beta 16
- Added option for always restoring the window to the Recent Emails tab or not.
- Minor changes to internal word extraction routines resulting in slightly better spam/good differentiation and reduced word DB file size.
- Enables/disables whitelist and blacklist controls when their checkboxes are enabled or disabled and auto-Apply's their settings.
- Changed the whitelist/blacklist keyword syntax to accommodate case-insensitive matching.
- All filter list entries must now have an associated keyword. The default (matching any location in a message) must now have the "Any:" (or "=Any") keyword specified.
- Changes made in the Storage Area will be automatically reflected in the Recent Emails and Server Check windows.
Beta 15
- Added option to use the system date/time format.
- Fixed infinite loop problem when re-classifying emails identified using the whitelist/blacklist.
- Brings up warning message if you try to re-classify an email that was identified using the whitelist/blacklist.
- Ignores blank whitelist/blacklist rules.
Beta 14
- Fixed remembering the state of the window being maximized or not when minimized to the tray.
- Added sending "keep-alive" fake headers back to the email app when retrieving emails takes a long time.
- Added Whitelist and Blacklist support.
Beta 13
- Added checkbox to enable/disable saving proxy log to file.
- Fixed bad date display.
Beta 12
- All shown dates are now taken from the first "Received: from" header line instead of the "Date:" header.
- Fixed enabling/disabling of "Mark emails as spam by..." edit box in the Configuration window.
- Server Check "Get" wasn't using the port number specified in the Configuration settings for each account.
- Server Check was attempting to download messages from all accounts even if they were disabled.
Beta 11
- Fixed timeout problem!
Beta 10
- Removed Email Classification configuration values from the Configuration area.
- Added configurable Proxy and POP3 Server Check connection timeout values.
- Hopefully fixed occasional bug when reading emails through the proxy when the Recent Emails cleanup timer kicked in at the same time.
- Added spam percentage to the Subject/header line indicator (e.g. "[Spam][96.2%]").
- Renamed the "Training Area" tab to "Storage Area".
- Rename "Process" buttons to "Organize".
Beta 9
- Removed redundant debug messages from the Proxy Log window.
- Added "[Amps]" pseudo keyword for HTML emails containing large numbers of encoded characters used to disguise words.
Beta 8
- Added "Size" column to all views.
- Added "Process" button to Recent Emails tab.
- Improved the POP3 Server Accounts interface section of the Configuration window and fixed saving and restoring of account details.
- Increased max POP3 Server Check accounts from 8 to 16.
- Fixed Server Check accounts not being saved to the registry on WinMe machines.
- Added ability to automatically "Process" Recent Emails when they reach a certain age.
- Recent Emails are only un-highlighted if it has been at least 5 minutes since the previous session.
- Fixed bug with tray icon not flashing if a certain state was produced with more than 1 account being active in the proxy server.
Beta 7
- More adjustments to the flashing system tray icon code.
- Added code to disconnect sessions after an inactivity timeout period (not normally a problem but some 3rd party proxies were seen to not disconnect after a QUIT).
- Fixed Cleanup "Days" field being inaccessible in the Configuration window.
- Added "[Comments]" pseudo keyword for HTML emails containing large numbers of comment tags used to disguise words.
Beta 6
- Added multiple account support to POP3 Server Check. You can manage accounts in the Configuration area.
- Fixed problem with shortcut keys not being applied when certain windows were in focus.
- Fixed "AUTH" POP3 command problem. K9 now properly rejects the AUTH command to force the email app to use USER/PASS authentication.
- Fixed problem with Server Check not obeying the port number specified.
- Fixed problem with Server Check when used with Hotmail Popper.
- Fixed problems with some POP3 server configuration settings not being saved/restored.
- Fixed problems with animated tray icons.
Beta 5
- Restored missing main program icon.
- Fixed problem with some emails marked as Spam but not being seen by email app (long Subject lines and Unicode character sets).
- Added animated tray icon at program startup when loading DB.
- Proxy now doesn't start listening until DB is loaded.
- Added animated tray icon when proxy is processing messages.
- Shortcut keys for make Good and make Spam are now F5 and F6 respectively.
Beta 4
- Added "Delete" keyboard shortcut for deleting emails.
- Added "CTRL-S" and "CTRL-Q" keyboard shortcuts for "Make Spam" and "Make Good".
- Fixed bug with emails and missing Subject lines.
Beta 3
- Added ability to add "[Spam]" to start of subject line.
- Disabled interpretation of "&" characters in the listviews that would result in the next character being underlined.
- Added "CTRL-A" support to select all items in a list.
- Saves and restores list column sizes in all windows.
Beta 2
- Improved handling and error reporting of incorrect proxy requests.
- Fixed un-highlighting of messages during multi-session retrieval (again!).
Beta 1
- Fix for POP3 usernames greater than 32 characters in length. Limit is now 64.
- Fix for always showing today's date in all lists.
- Fix for un-highlighting new emails received via the proxy when more than one session was in operation.
Alpha Build 14
- Fix for emails marked as spam but not being filtered by email app. (bug in Subject header parsing)
- Fix for Unable to retrieve header for email x error in Server Check.
Alpha Build 13
- Fixed bug in proxy when unexpected input was received.
- Added proxy support for Hotmail Popper
- Added button to main window (Recent Emails) to take you to this page.
Alpha Build 12
- Changed font for log windows.
- Added session number to each entry line in the logs.
- Internal optimizations.
Alpha Build 11
- Added buttons to log display to clear the window contents.
- Fixed log window displays to always display next line at end of window as opposed to the current caret position.
- Fixed bug in proxy. It was issuing the USER command before receiving the initial banner reply line.
- Updated proxy in an attempt to support multiple concurrent sessions.
- Rearranged Configuration window.
Alpha Build 9, 10
- Not released.
Alpha Build 8
- Preliminary attempt at supporting parallel POP3 server requests.
Alpha Build 7
- Changed proxy configuration to use "server/port/user" instead of "user/server/port".
Alpha Build 6
- Fixed email classifying bug in the email reader window when viewing emails from the Server Check window.
- Prior to checking email in the Server Check area, all emails that hadn't been downloaded are removed from the list.
- When an email session passes through the proxy all emails that hadn't been downloaded are removed from the Server Check list.
- Proxy now supports multiple accounts via username encoding of user/server/port.
- Tweaked some internal numbers in the classification algorithm.
Alpha Build 5
- Fixed "Good" and "Bad" right-click menu problems.
- Added "Good" and "Bad" classify buttons to email reader window.
- Added "Good" and "Bad" classify buttons to Server Check tab window.
- Added Score display to email reader window.
- When restoring the window from the tray icon (double-clicking) K9 will always display the "Recent" tab.
Alpha Build 4
- Fixed handling of emails with invalid content (bytes with value zero present in message body)
- Possible fix for "unexpectedly terminated the connection" problem in OE
- Better handling of email reader window toolbar when reading from POP3 server
Alpha Build 3
- Fixed truncated toolbars in Large Fonts mode
- Fixed missing header string in the Configuration section
- If more than one instance of K9 is attempted to run it simply makes the original copy visible
- Minor change to processing of certain HTML tags
Alpha Build 2
- Added automatic removal of Recent emails after a configurable number of days age.
- If minimized to system tray, double-clicking toggles restoring/minimizing and the icon stays in place.
- Auto saves databases after each proxy email session.
- Proxy log is saved to file ProxyLog.txt in Emails\DB.
- Fixed crash bug when POP3 Server Check password was above a certain size.
Alpha Build 1
- Initial limited public release. |
(quick post. I’m doing the write fast thing to get me back in the blogging habit.)
I had some wonderful teachers in high school. One of them, my English teacher, used the acronym MEGO to stand for My Eyes Glaze Over. MEGO applies to something so technical that most people don’t care. But it’s my blog, so if you don’t want some MEGO, go elsewhere.
The hardest part of getting technical feedback from folks outside Google is deciding which stuff to dig into; there’s only 24 hours in a day. Plus you also don’t want to burn cred by bugging someone only to find out that it’s a non-issue. An SEO that I would trust (well, not trust exactly.
listen to, maybe
) complained about something, so I took it to the crawl team, and they dug into it enough to produce the raw docs as they were fetched by Googlebot, and it looked like Google was doing the right thing. I mentioned that to the SEO, who dug into it more on their side. It turns out that the SEO was looking for Googlebot’s old user-agent string instead of the newer user-agent string, so it was on the SEO’s side. Not an issue on Google’s side, and the SEO knows who they are.
Another example that happened this week was when I read Graywolf’s post about Google showing content from domain A on domain B. Graywolf gave three examples of sites getting confounded, with screenshots (always a helpful idea), but every example was from the same IP address. Now if you’re an experienced search person, two sites on the same IP getting confounded makes you think of one explanation: the webhost configured virtual hosting wrong. Right? Can I get a “w00t” from the back there? Cool, thanks.
So I was all set to dismiss this. But then I noticed that the confounding happened over a long period of time (usually virtual hosting errors don’t last long, because people notice and complain to the webhost), and none of Yahoo!/MSN/Ask were showing confounded domains for the example Graywolf. That wasn’t good, so I reported it to the crawl/index team.
Have I mentioned how much I respect our crawl/index team? They do a lot of heavy lifting everyday and they do it so well that few people notice how much is getting done. So that team checked it out and they were able to reproduce a bug on the webserver using only telnet. That means it wasn’t Google’s fault, but last I saw in the discussion, people were talking about ways to make Googlebot even smarter to work around that bug when they can tell the webserver might be affected.
Ah, heavy MEGO. Why didn’t Y/M/A see confounded domains? Well, Googlebot is pretty smart. It can utilize something called persistent connections to a webserver via a Keep-Alive header. If mattcutts.com and shadyseo.com are both on the same IP address, Googlebot can open up a connection and request a page from mattcutts.com, then on the same connection ask for a page from shadyseo.com. That’s more polite on the webserver because you don’t have to break down and set up a whole new connection for every page. As the Apache docs mention, “These long-lived HTTP sessions allow multiple requests to be send over the same TCP connection, and in some cases have been shown to result in an almost 50% speedup in latency times … .” As far as I can tell, bots from other engines probably open and close a connection for every page; that’s why they didn’t see this particular behavior in the webserver.
Interestingly enough, this bug was first mentioned in 1997: ” When using keepalives and name-based virtual hosts, requests on a keptalive connection can get a response from the wrong virtual host.” I guess that there’s some pretty old webservers out there; like I said, the crawl team was last seen talking about workarounds for ancient servers that have this bug.
So that’s two examples in the last week where I asked someone to dig deeper and it was an issue outside of Google. That said, it’s essential to keep reading feedback from forums and the blogosphere. For example, we’ve been refreshing some of our supplemental results, and the feedback that we’ve gotten has helped us find a couple different ways that we could make the site: operator more accurate with the newer supplemental results. GoogleGuy put out a call for feedback about that particular issue on WebmasterWorld, and someone on my team has been reviewing the feedback to find any other issues to pass on.
{ 59 comments… read them below or add one }
Hi Matt,
The ‘confounded domains’ issue that you resolved on Graywolf’s blog also solved an identical issue I had recently emailed to Brian. The issue I emailed to Brian was actually the same diagnosis.
I’ve emailed the hosting company with your advice.
>>Can I get a “w00t” from the back there?
Here’s a “w00t”s from down under, Sydney Australia
Nice post. Props to Graywolf
Matt,
Thanks for the feedback. It is encouraging to know that you guys are digging into feedback from the community. I have read a lot of accusations and guesses recently on message boards about Google, and it is reassuring to know that you guys take the problems us little guys are having seriously. Keep fighting the good fight, and I hope you get to the bottom of any actual bugs in the recent rollout.
But those two examples each came from one observation from one person. The page dropping issue is being noticed by tons of people. I would think this is when you should really start bugging someone – when something is noticeably widespread. Just a thought.
I had someone complain about this too.
His website, was shown in these two searches as well.
I directed him to ask his host about this (probably some vhost screw-up, or some weird 301 redirects), and i am 99% sure that G is out of the question.
Everybody’s pissed on the indexed pages thing Matt, too.
Can the same team give us some answers on this issue, yet ?
Dazzlindonna,
My take on the non-mention of all of the chatter from people saying that 99% of their site has been de-indexed, is that it was intended that way, and the new algo is working as they had hoped. I doubt we will get confirmation on that as its really not in google’s interest to comment on particular sites or pages and their position or even existance in the index.
GoogleGuys’s comments on WMW also mirror this response. They completly ignore the comments on page losses and only address the crawling issues.
I believe we are hearing the company line, and like I said earlier we can now take from it that if your site lost pages, those pages need to be fixed some how, more unique content, better content, less of something, more of another, yada yada…
Google dropped millions of pages last year and took a couple of months to recrawl everything and rebuild the index. While we may be seeing an extensive lack of URLs this year, at least the SERPs are not flooded with bare URLs. People were screaming about lack of titles and descriptive snippets more than they seem to be screaming about the dropped pages.
The effect was virtually the same thing. A bare URL in the SERPs means Google doesn’t have any data on the URL, except that it exists. It sounds to me like Big Daddy just doesn’t list all the known-but-uncrawled-URLs.
Matt, is that the case?
Me going to spend more time obsessing over all that Vanessa Fox and the sitemaps team are sayin’. All this talk of spam is just not my thing, I do not spam, I bitch and whine but I do not spam.
Do a search in the sitemaps group for “no crawl stats” and see all the people complaining that it is broken, if you folks there spent more time doing searches in “groups” you could find and fix all kind of things before you get webmasters like me bitchin’ at you!
If people are searching or posting using a common phrase often it either means. 1.) There could be a flaw 2.) The people are flawed and you need to educate them.
And yes, observe that 99.9 percent of the time it is in fact not Google’s fault but I would start searching your groups today, I warned you about canonical issues in 2003 but I just couldn’t describe what it was back then because I do not speak MEGO-OGLE.
Good morning Matt
And welcome back to Matt Cutt’s blog
Very nice informative post naswering few important questions. Thanks.
I recall GoogelGuy mentioning last year on WMW that summer months are good months for the folks at the plex to look at and resolve issues. Can you tell us what the friends at the plex have in mind to do this summer?
Have a great day.
Dazzlindonna, believe me, lots of different people at Google have been reading that feedback. The Sitemaps team was reading it to make sure that Sitemaps has nothing to do with the issue. The crawl/index team checked into several reports and each time came up with other reasons why the site wouldn’t be crawled as much (e.g. the ‘next page’ url on one site wasn’t short; it was a total hairball with like 200 chars of params), and some supplemental results folks have been through the raw emails, which is how one of the site: changes was noticed.. But don’t get me wrong; we’re still going through the feedback to see if there’s anything else to be identified and improved.
Michael Martinez, this lately round of feedback is (I’m pretty sure) nothing to do with Bigdaddy. Bigdaddy was live 100% weeks (months?) ago. In BD, we still return url references where we saw the url but haven’t crawled it.
Aaron Pratt, very few people speak MEGO, but we keep our eyes peeled for trends in both MEGO-speak and regular English.
Harith, it’s true that summer is a great time to work on new infrastructure.
Hi Matt,
Please explain more on this
>>so a site that had more pages indexed by the earlier Googlebot won’t necessarily have as many pages indexed in the future
>>
Ecommerce companies that employ both organic and campaign methods might not like to hear that.
Just a thought…
Thanks
I’ve missed your blogs – nice to have you back.
One question re supplemental pages – why doesn’t GG simply delete ‘obsolete’ pages when requested by the webmaster using the ‘removal tool’ – instead of only removing them for 6 months or so?
Just had to remove a whole batch of resurrected supplemental pages from old domains that caused a massive duplicate pages penalty back in Autumn 2004 – only thought to look for them – using site:wwwmydomain – when I noticed I was slowly losing postion again.
cheers
Matt,
Great MEGO post – keep those coming – some of us love the technical nitty-gritty. How ’bout a Matt Cutts/Google MEGO perspective on the (in)famous V7ndotcom Elursrebmem SEO contest that wraps up this Monday? Holy outa-control back-links Batman going on over there!
alek
P.S. Repeating an earlier minor nit for the Vanessa/Sitemaps folks (who probably missed it since it was buried 50 comments down), but they still have copyright 2005 at the bottom of their blog. Also recommend they consider turning on commenting to compliment the Google Groups stuff.
Um, considering the bug was only in Apache 1.2b10 and was fixed in 1.2b11, and that there have been a number of security fixes and many new versions in the meantime, why is anyone running 1.2b10 any more?
As for the fix, I assume you can just simply disable persistent connections on Apache 1.2b10, or am I missing something?
Ok so on Graywolf’s blog you say they have it with Apache 1.3.7 – could you please post to let us know which versions have this bug and which ones don’t? Otherwise, even if you fix it, if another search engine implements persistent connections they may also end up with this bug.
>>.
I don’t know how many times it can be mentioned without somebody hearing it: This is not a crawling issue. Our 7000 missing pages, for example, are crawled regularly, they are just not making it into the index (unless linked to from our Home page).
Of the various theories I have read about the cause of the problem, my current favorite is that it is a Backlink/PR issue. It looks like our backlinks, as reported by the flaky “site:” search, reflect the state of our Backlinks around August 2005 (i.e. when the BD index was seeded). Maybe the internal/real Backlinks just need to be refreshed. Missing backlinks = lower PR = less deep indexing = 95% of a sites pages dropped.
Also, if some of these sites have “spam penalties”:
1. Can a spam penalty cause a site to lose 95% of it’s pages? Previously we’ve been told that any kind of ban will result in 100% page loss. So has this changed?
2. Shouldn’t these sites with a spam penalty be contacted? Isn’t it very possible, likely even, that these Spam penalties are part of the missing pages bug? Why would a “spammer” be dumb enough to send an email to Google complaining about missing spammy pages?
Matt. what was the reason for:
massive amounts of pages being dropped from indexes
pages that do show in the index are years old and non-existent
there has seen to be massive fluctuations in the last couple of weeks
I have 2 pages left from over 400
traffic before:
google 35%
msn 25%
yahoo 25%
traffic now
msn 30%
yahoo 30%
google 20% and dropping
It’s frustrating because I advertise Google all over my pages: search google on every page, adwords, adsense, analytics, sitemap, gmail etc.
Why should I continue pushing Google when most of traffic is starting to come from MSN and Yahoo?
sorry to whine… I will stop now
Hi Matt,
many thanks first of all for yours trouble.
You wrote “several sites have spam penalties”.
It is possible to get an exact feedback about my domain (posted in the form)?
We suspect that our domain have a spam penalty. We implemented
here numerous measures to correspond to the Google Guidelines. We
did already a reinclusion request with lots of informations. We think that
our pages does not violate the Google guidelines and ist one of the consumer and shopping portals with the highest quality (unique content!) in Germany!
None of our direct competitors has got approaching problems like us with almost identical page techniques.
Should our pages are not confirm to the Google Guidlines for any reason anyway, I ask for an exact notification. We would immediately remove this unintentional fault.
Many thanks!
A buddy and me have a old site that once held 100′s of duplicate articles (people submit articles to many places, doh!) that is only showing 6 indexed pages, it is the spammiest thing I have ever done and it is very obvious why the site has only 6 pages currently indexed. What’s in your wallet?
Matt. Do you still want feedback about sites that are having their pages dropped? It’s still happening, and for no apparent reason – and it’s a very big problem.
It sounds like you didn’t get many example sites, and it also sounds like there were good reasons to account for most of them, but it’s not typical of what’s happening. I don’t believe it’s about crawling. Sites are having the number of pages in the index drop on a daily basis, and we all know that Google takes a very long time to drop pages that no longer exist. People report that the crawling is fine, but their pages are being dropped daily.
I have such a site myself if you are still interested (not the one from last year) – down from an unrealistic 50-60 thousand pages in the index to 155 pages in the index yesterday (today it may have turned the corner, but time will tell). I didn’t use the published email address because, like most people, I didn’t see it, and I only noticed it happening a week ago.?
Insightful as ever Aaron. I guess your one example proves something really significant…I just can’t think what that might be. How did your spammy site fair before Big Daddy?
If it’s the spammiest thing you’ve ever done. How are your less spammy, but spammy none-the-less, sites doing?
One more site:domain.com search thing that has changed very recently.
A site that has shown “1 to 100 of about 150″ and then “101 to 120 of about 150″ pages on a site:domain.com search for a very long time, with the snippet showing different text for every page (taken from the meta description), now shows just “1 to 2 of about 150″ in that search (and the second result is a Word doc).
When you click the “repeat this search with the omitted results included” link (can we abbreviate that to “RTSWTORI” here in the blog?
) you can see that the Google snippet is identical for every page, as it is now ignoring the meta description and just taking the first 20 words of the on-page content (from the nav-bar in this case) instead. These are all normal results. Nothing is Supplemental here.
The site:domain search is (errr, *was*) a great way to sanity check a site for duplicated title tags and/or meta description information, but no longer is any help in going that… and that is a shame.
hi matt, everyone,
since traffic on my sites dropped massively, i have to make the decision to discontinue the site or not. maybe you (or someone else) could give me some infos/thoughts of what to expect for my site in the near future.
here is what i get from the different dcs for a ‘site:’ search:
64.233.183.147 -> #found: 217, one page (index) is up-to-date w/ recent cache, the rest are supplemental result (new and really old pages)
64.233.185.104 -> #found: 24, one page (page) has recent cache but shows title, description from dmoz, the the rest are supplemental result (just really old pages)
72.14.207.99 -> #found: 1, the page has recent cache and shows the sites title and description
can anyone make any sense from these infos? will my site recover?
thx in advance.
cu
frank
Nice explanation. In Germany we have an expression along the lines of, “do good things, and talk about them.”
Hi Matt,
My site has the pages dropping problem and I was told I was penalised, indicating buying/selling text links.
I dont do that, but asked for a reinclusion request mentioning a few things that might have looked that way.
My question is IF the request fails and I truely have not been buying or selling links – what is the next step for me?
Is there some way I can get someone to manually help me?
Thanks
Pete
Matt, I am getting plenty of crawling….but loads of the crawled pages never make it into the index…please help!
Google knows there’s a problem, but they’re putting a spin on things.
Spam free sites losing pages, and some unique content pages turning supplemental is happening to many sites. And if you haven’t lost pages yet, don’t get bigheaded and think it wont happen. One of my sites which was fine until three days ago, has lost 40 pages and then another 100 yesterday.
Matt,
I don’t want to reopen the “confounded domain” issue, however I do have a question.
When keepalive is used the location that resolved the request is returned by server
This uri has two valid forms absolute and relative, the relative form requires that the client (in the case the bot) keep request state to determine the correct absolute uri.
The problem may or may not be on the part of the server.
I have seen “confounded domains” in the past and tried to get the party with the problem to contact you folks. They opted instead to obtain a dedicated ip addresses for the affected sites that they had control of.
Others have mentioned that their traffic and serp positions improved aftwr going to dedicated ip addresses.
Forgot the question.
Do you have any particular versions of servers that cause problems in this regard?
I’m still part of the group that gets crawled, but 90% of the pages that are crawled never make the index. I setup sitemaps as suggested, and there is no penalty listed there.
Can you ask the crawl/index team why this would happen? I guess it could be an issue with 301′s, but I see it on regular pages to.
I use to use url’s like “/foo/1/” and now I use “/foo/bar.html”. It seems like the old url’s are supplemental and maybe they are getting a duplicate content penalty, even though the old url’s all Redirect to the new ones. I even see Google bot visit the old one, and immediatly hit the new one.
64.233.183.147 is what I have called BigDaddy “B” over at WMW. These seem to be older results, have lots of old Supplemental Results going back to 2004 January, show lots of pages for each site, but the index is very slow to update with changes. I suspect this one will be phased out.
64.233.185.104 and 72.14.207.99 seem to be the cleaned up version of the “experiment” that I have been talking about for weeks. These DCs seems to have thrown away most (all?) Supplemental pages before 2005 June. These DCs seem to be quick to update the changes that occur on existing sites, but most sites have less pages indexed in these DCs than in other DCs. I don’t see any major differences betwwen these two DCs at the moment.
There are two other “versions” of the Google Index out there if you look around a bit more.
I noticed this same issue this week with two sites, which are hosted on the same dedicated server. Google’s cache of the first site is the content of the second site. Very strange. I have contacted my hosting company, but so far no results. My first thought was DNS issue, but now I am not so sure.Thanks for bringing this up.:)
Hi Matt,
Great post, and glad to see you back to blogging. I just wanted to comment on the crawl/index issue since I’m pretty confident we’re the ones with the ‘hairball’ URLs…
First, let me say I’m glad to see you guys dig into the issue even though 99.9999% of the issues reported to you probably are not issues on your end. And I’m sure lots of the problems can be explained away with stupid things like ‘hairball’ URLs.
However, I still think there is a real issue somewhere. My site went from 400,000+ pages indexed, to just a few hundred, back up to 30,000, back down to 900, and then this weekend, back up to 35,000. All the while, 10,000s of pages were being crawled daily. (btw, all stats are from across multiple datacenters)
What else could explain the extreme variability in results?
And this really is a scary statement:
>>a site that had more pages indexed by the earlier Googlebot won’t necessarily have as many pages indexed in the future
Why would you index fewer pages? I understand the crawl priorities, and it makes sense from a business perspective, but in the long run, shouldn’t the new index include all of the (legitimate) pages in the old index?
–Jarid
P.S. I can confirm the behavior that g1smd is seeing. When clicking the RTSWTORI link, all of the results show the same snippet (which is the text from my navigation). Granted, the search term is only in the page title, but I would expect to see the text from the meta description tag then.
Note that when you really do have two identical sites on the same IP address under different domains, Google will often canonicalize those to only domain. Site and cache searches on the second domain will return references to the first domain in the SERPs.?
I think that Schmidt was just defending the amount of spending they did on new computers. I also think that if you put together everything that we have heard from Matt that you get a pretty good idea of why pages are disappearing from Google. My take is at
How about some cold hard facts (for a change):
1. It is impossible for Google to know for certain that they have not introduced some serious bugs that are causing the problems that lots of sites are seeing (e.g. 95% of their site suddenly being thrown out of the Google index – for “suddenly” read “post Big Daddy”).
2. Google’s intense secrecy means that only a very small handful of Google employees have any kind of reasonable understanding of exactly what changes were introduced with Big Daddy. It is more than likely that no one individual has the entire picture.
3. Some of us out here in Web-land are in a position to know for certain that one of the following two statements are true:
a: Google have introduced some serious bugs that, unbeknownst to them, are causing the gradual disintetgration of their index. High-quality, non-spam, sites are being de-indexed by the thousands due to one or more of these bugs.
or
b: Google have lost the plot, and are now deliberately de-indexing high-quality, non-spam websites by the thousands.
At the moment, Matt, you seem to be suggesting that Google are gunning for option (c). Namely, that all of the websites having problems are having problems of their own making. Presumably it is mere coincidence that these problems only appeared with the introduction of Big Daddy, and that they do not reveal themselves on any other search engine.
Matt,
you mention spam penalties. What does that mean to Google? Is the site banned, as in no results from site:www.–.com, or just demoted severely in the rankings? I know that one can ask for an reinclusion, but is there such a thing for demotions?
Can you please clarify.
thanks
To add: for some reason Googlebot is visiting me a lot more lately, and pages are being added every day, so whatever changes you guys made worked, at least for my site.
Hello Matt
Why did you remove my earlier comment that politley posited the theory that the current missing pages problems were due to an out-of-date or buggy Backlink index?
Missing/Faulty Backlinks => Artificially Low PRs => Shallower Indexing => Loads of Missing/Removed Pages
I’ll be very interested to see if you now remove this one as well. I don’t mind if you remove it, but could you please at least pass on the suggestion to someone? From what I can see, the current backlink index dates back to mid 2005. This alone could explain why some sites have been devasted while others have not.
Oops. Sorry…just spotted the original comment above…sorry.
I guess watching my life’s work go down the toilet for reasons beyond my control is finally getting to me.
Hi Matt
A few days ago I sent also an issue about Googlebot’s use of persistent connection to Google. If you use mod_diffprivs for Apache, a security module that can run each VirtualHost under a different user, Google often gets 503s. I contacted the current developer and he made some suggestions which I forwarded to Google. All I got after a few days was that standard email reply…
Andy
I think people need to cut Matt some slack. This is his personal blog and he has stated that unless otherwise noted in a post, anything he says here is a personal communication and not necessarily a formal response from Google.
Furthermore, given the size of Google’s organization and operation, it’s not always possible for subtle technical flaws to show themselves immediately. While I agree there appears to be something wrong, it could be that what is wrong is more our frame of reference — based on Google’s past behavior — than anything specifically going on under the hood. It may just mean we have to wait a little longer than we have gotten used to.
And keep in mind that Matt isn’t always at liberty to disclose everything he knows. Most technical companies do have pretty strict guidelines about disclosing details of their latest technology.
I’d love to know more, but I’m only seeing sporadic problems with my own sites. Some directories on my principal domain have been partially indexed (after being fully indexed prior to Big Daddy) and other directories are completely indexed. I’m getting strong referral traffic from Google, almost as good as I’ve ever gotten from them.
I cannot speak for anyone else, but I find it hard to complain about a few dozen missing URLs when I know I’m still getting almost 20,000 referrals a month. But it just looks weird. This is very different from pre-Big Daddy. And my gut instinct tells me something needs fixing, but it may not be easy to find.
Matt thanks for the explanation and the info.
Now not to sound like an ungrateful putz, but I’m of the opinion that a more effiecient crawl that gets tripped up by improperly configured hosts and causes “problems” and “issues” like this might not be the right solution. I bet there are lots of other hosts out there who have similar mistakes and even more web publishers who are not able to figure out the problem or who have access to helpful people like yourself to set them on the right course.
Just my 2 drachmas.
Hallo Armi, das Problem haben wir auch vielleicht kannst Du dich ja mal melden …. Grüsse aus Germany
URL ist gepostet
thanks a lot Matt. your veryvery long post got all the information I need for the day.
weary, the url removal tool was always intended to give a few months so that a webmaster could clear things up on their own site. If we get around to redoing that tool in the next few months, I’ll mention that though.
Ian, certainly upgrading would have fixed this, but turning off persistent connections would have worked too.
I intend to circle back around to this thread soon, but it’s after 1 a.m. and I gotta get some sleep.
Surely persistent connections, if they are done right, are a good thing, no? It would be better not to turn them off if upgrading would work. The Apache changelog is pretty hard to read to find out what versions this affects – if the guys there have an idea, would you mind poking them to let us know?
Absolutely right, Ian. I’d recommend upgrading Apache 10 times before turning off persistent connections. I was under the impression that the Apache in question was 1.3.7, but I’m not sure.
Wow… Pretty amazing stuff. Sounds like GoogleBot has got crawling ethics figured out. Would be nice if the other engines would ‘step it up’
Yes Googlebot is the smartest of them all. I don’t think any of the other search engines will ever win the market
Thanks for posting, Matt
There is _still_ no formal, offical, and supported method of reporting bugs to Google.
I have found four replicable bugs in Google software and there is no reporting mechanism for me to share them and have them fixed.
This would be expected if Google was two college kids in a garage, but this behavior from a major multinational public company which is supposed to know something about IT it is a complete embarassment.
Hi Matt and happy new year
I got the same problem than reported in Graywolf’s post for web sites I manage – won’t say the names to respect comment policy
The differences are:
1 – they don’t have the same ip address (but they share the same ip net range and are in the same physical servers even with same root).
2 – they run on IIS
I don’t ask you to look at my particular problem but if you could answer some of my questions – that may be interesting for other people – would be really appreciated:
1 – you said in your post that your crawl/index team was able to reproduce the bug using only telnet: could you post the command used so we can repro?
2 – is this kind of problem could have a negative impact on our sites SERPs or even worse could lead to a spam penalty?
Thanks for your blog
Jerome
The Fonz, I wa affected with the same unability to report those bugs! They are not a bunch of kids anymore, but looks like habit is just habit!
Thanks for the post.
I’ll need to keep that in mind when I switch to new host (which shouldn’t be too much of a problem).
Thanks for a great post. Very intersting to know which command they used to reproduce the bug usin telnet?
Telnet was one of the first methods devised to allow system administrators to remotely monitor their networks and my favoriteI read this blog article and about bug and I am wonder are there any your recomendation about the webservers, and which kind of webservers should we avoid ?
I’m pleased to see that the term MEGO is being recycled for the computer age. In the distant, non-technical past, MEGO was used by print editors
as a shorthand way to tell reporters “This writing is sleep-inducing”. |
Ford's last public appearance in his erstwhile home was on August 18, when he addressed an audience at Davis-Kidd Booksellers and signed copies of his book. On that occasion Ford told his attentive audience that his political days were not over — though presumably they will have to continue in New York, both as candidate (earlier this year, Ford briefly considered a run for the Senate there) and as voter.
Ford was until this week a registered voter in both Tennessee, where for some time in 2008-9 he considered a run for governor, and the Empire State, where Ford now lives with his wife and which he considers his residence.
The circumstance of dual registration had been brought to the attention of Tennessee Secretary of State Tre Hargett by a complainant, with the result that Ford will likely be purged from the ranks of Tennessee voters. Or so Blake Fontenay, a spokesperson for Hargett, has indicated.
The status of Harold Ford Sr., also a former Memphis congressman, had been questioned as well but is regarded differently. Ford Sr., who like his son maintains a Memphis address, has apparently not registered to vote in Florida; therefore, his Tennessee registration is still good.
Permalink | Post Comments (5).
Permalink | Post Comments (6)
V.”
Permalink | Post Comments
Even as candidates and advocates and party organizations start ratcheting up for the races and issues to be disposed of on the forthcoming November ballot, the August 5th election refuses to go away.
Last week the Shelby County Election Commission formally certified the August 5th election and issued a report chalking up a now infamous election-day glitch to “human error” without effect on any final outcome. But this week the number of litigants seeking to overturn that election has swelled from two to ten, as the entire slate of Democratic candidates defeated in races for countywide positions has joined in a revamped lawsuit which contends that the election results are “incurably uncertain.”
The suit, filed in Chancery Court Tuesday, will probably be combined with an earlier one which sought injunctive relief on behalf of two litigants, Regina Morrison Newman, the incumbent Trustee who had sought reelection, and Minerva Johnican, candidate for Criminal Court clerk. Or so said Newman, who is functioning as a lawyer for herself and other litigants, at a Wednesday morning press conference outside the Shelby County courthouse. ( Not present was the litigants’ other attorney, Van Turner, who is chairman of the Shelby County Democratic Party.)
A handout issued at the press conference to media representatives itemized 12 different lapses or suspicious circumstances in the election. One of them involved the well-publicized fact, acknowledged in the Election Commission’s report, that early-voting data from the May countywide primary election was incorrectly entered into the electronic poll books (EPBs) used for August 5th voting — an error potentially affecting 5390 voters, many of whom were in fact originally told they had already voted and could not do so again on August 5.
Newman, who was flanked at the press conference by such other litigants as Sheriff’s candidate Randy Wade, Johnican, and Juvenile Court clerk candidate Shep Wilbun, suggested that the number of voters affected by the data-base error could have been even larger, citing accounts of voters who said they were held back from voting who had not early-voted in May.
In that regard, the handout made reference to alleged obstacles experienced by Bev Harris and Susan Pynchon, consultants from the advocacy group BlackBoxVoting: “Candidate inspection teams have thus far been denied sufficient data or documentation to even verify that …SCEC used the May 2010 early voter database rather than a larger early voter database which would have affected more voters, as some voter statements would indicate.”
Numerous other problems were listed as having been uncovered by the litigants and their consultants in a post-election investigation. Allegedly, for example, there was a discrepancy between the “Participating Voters List” of 176,119 voters and the SCEC’s “Certified Statement of Votes Cast,” showing 182,921 votes — a difference of “6,802 more votes…cast than individuals who participated.”
Also referred to in the handout were problems in the handling of provisional ballots for those voters who were turned away and who asked for such ballots; improperly discarded poll tapes; inconsistencies in poll-by-poll turnout reports; improperly sealed or unsecured “voting machines, tabulators, memory cards, and other voting apparatuses;” and even a “ghost race,” i.e., a voting-machine category hidden to voters but capable of being “used to transfer, delete, or temporarily store votes.”
And there was the issue of a “manual override” function in the Diebold Corporation machines, one which Election Commission officials acknowledge was used during the election period and which the litigants allege can be used to change vote totals — something which has been explicitly denied by Election Commission chairman Bill Giannini.
Wilbun, who, until earlier this year, when he began his candidacy, was a Democratic member of the Election Commission, said the very existence of such a function had not previously been disclosed.
Newman, who had once been quoted as saying her aim in pursuing the post-election challenge was not meant as a dispute of the results per se, said on Wednesday that her perspective and that of the other litigants had been changed by the volume of irregularities discovered and by legal requirements for moving forward with the amended lawsuit.
An extended section of the handout speaks further to the purposes of the litigants:
“This lawsuit is intended to assure that the.”
Permalink | Post Comments (2)
Any.
Permalink | Post Comments (3) yet another inquiry,.
Goins had responded to a call for a state investigation made last week by State Representative G.A. Hardaway of Memphis.
Finally, representatives of the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation, virtually unnoticed, have been conducting a systematic investigation at the Operations Center and other relevant sites, and the TBI’s report could also come relatively soon, Giannini said. The TBI had been invited in by District Attorney Bill Gibbons, who had been asked to investigate by the Election Commission.
And the chief litigants in a pending lawsuit in Chancery Court — Trustee Regina Morrison Newman and Minerva Johnican, the defeated Democratic candidate for Criminal Court Clerk — are preparing to file an amended version of the suit seeking the overturn of the election. The filing will occur on or before Tuesday, five days after certification, thereby meeting the statutory deadline for the filing of such a challenge.
Van Turner, chairman of the Shelby County Democratic Party and attorney for the litigants, said that others of the defeated candidates in the August 5th election might join the suit. “We’re waging two contests — one in the courtroom and another in the court of public opinion,” he said.
Investigators who have been looking into the circumstances of the election at the behest of the litigants will resume their activity at the Operations Center site on Monday, Turner said.
Permalink | Post Comments (3)
It may not be the final chapter in the “glitch” election of August 2010, but four members of the Shelby County Election Commission — two Democrats and two Republicans — formally underwrote and presented to the media on Wednesday their conclusion as to the cause of that glitch: human error, not political conspiracy or machine malfunction.
The report seemed to clear the way for formal certification of the August 5 election results on Thursday.
Present at the press conference at the commission’s Operations Center at Shelby Farms were Democratic commissioners Myra Stiles and James Johnson and Republicans Robert Meyers and chairman Bill Giannini. Absent was Republican commissioner Brian Stephens..
Boyce had been asked to investigate the circumstances of complaints the commission had received from voters in several precincts that they were wrongly recorded as having participated during July’s early-voting period.
What happened, says the report, was that, in the crush of having only a weekend after the conclusion of early voting on July 31 to ready the EPM for election day, Boyce failed to alter the code for early-voting data that had been used prior to final voting in the May 4 countywide primary and inadvertently “left the election data file identification number for the May election, 921, in the script.”
The error “potentially affected” 5,390 voters who had early-voted before the May election but not before the August election. Of those, the report says that 1.952 were allowed to cast regular ballots via the Diebold voting machines after signing “fail-safe” affidavits asserting their right to do so. Another 210 cast “provisional ballots,” of which 136 were later deemed valid.
Doing the math would indicate that the outcome of no election race could have been affected even if all the remaining voters, some 3000-odd, had been prevented from voting but would have voted unanimously for a losing candidate. But in fact, the commissioners agreed, the likelihood was that a substantial number of those unaccounted-for voters had not presented themselves at a polling place on election day.
Chairman Giannini accepted responsibility for the error and for the fact that no system of “checks and balances” was in place to prevent or detect an error of the sort committed by Boyce, who was identified in the report as “an employee with an exemplary record.” Giannini estimated that Boyce’s service at the Election Commission dated back at least nine years — which meant that he was hired during a period of Democratic control of the commission.
But, said Giannini, he did not know what Boyce’s personal politics were, nor was it “any concern’ of his or the commission.
As for preventing such an error from being repeated in the future, the report contained four recommendations.: mandating that a second employee verify that the correct sets of data are loaded into the election-day EPBs, exploring the possibility of “automating this process;” evolving the commission’s existing “Logic and Accuracy” (L&A) testing “to encompass testing for this issue;” further training election officials “on the use of failsafe voting and the use of provisional ballots;” and further educating the voting public on the use of such alternative voting means.
Giannini ruled out the possibility that innate defects in the Diebold machines used for the election might have been a factor, saying that the glitch that happened preceded the use of the machines on election day and could have affected any vote-counting system, even the opti-scan system touted by advocates of voting-machine reform and currently scheduled to be employed in Tennessee in the 2012 election cycle.
(An irony of the post-election crisis is that the issue of proprietary software — often cited by Election Commission spokespersons to explain their reluctance to part with certain requested data — relates not to the Diebold Corporation, original suppliers of the voting machinery and software used by Shelby County, but to ESS, which in 2006, when the machines and software were purchased, was a rival company engaged in intense competition with Diebold for the county’s business. As it happens, ESS has since acquired from Diebold the ownership of record for the kinds of technology in use in Shelby County — a fact complicating the proprietary issue.)
Representatives of the state Election Coordinator's office will be at the Operations Center on Friday to conduct a separate audit.
Another of several indications that the post-election controversy is far from over, regardless of Wednesday’s report or Thursday’s pending certification, was a press conference called Wednesday by the local chapter of the National Action Network, an organization presided over nationally by noted activist Al Sharpton.
At the press conference, held on the steps outside the Election Commission’s downtown offices, Greg Grant, president of the Memphis chapter, announced that Sharpton had been invited to Memphis to intervene in the case “in support of the Federal Voting Rights Act of 1965.”
The invitation was not coordinated with the plaintiffs in the case, said Grant, who indicated he expected to receive a reply from Sharpton “within 24 hours.”
Included in materials passed out by Grant was a lengthy list of "records we have been unable to obtain," including several items relating specifically to the functioning of the Diebold machinery and software.
Still to be accounted for in any official explanation is the functioning of a "manual override" capability in the Diebold software -- one which Giannini has conceded was employed for adjustment purposes during the August 4 election process, but not, he insists, to alter voting results.
And a statement from a spokesperson for District Attorney Bill Gibbons served as a reminder that further inquiries into possible election irregularities remain to be completed:
Regarding the announcement Wednesday by the Shelby County Election Commission, the District Attorney wanted to clarify that the TBI criminal investigation into the problems at the polls on election day has not concluded and is ongoing. The DA has not made a determination on whether there was criminal intent in this case. That determination will be made after the TBI has finished the investigation.
Permalink | Post Comments (7)
That much principals representing both sides in the post-election dispute agree on.
But spokespersons for the Shelby County Election Commission present Settle’s action in the context of the inspectors’ breaching of an agreement not to videotape Commission employees at work. And from the litigants’ side comes a different explanation: That they voluntarily acquiesced in a six-day’ suspension to permit Election Commission employees to prepare for Thursday’s planned certification of election results, so long as files they were interested in were downloaded and made available to them.
Both sides agree in the aftermath that Election Commission employees needed to have unimpeded access to their workspace between now and Thursday’s certification — and that Friday needed to be set aside for an audit by a team from the state Election Coordinator’s office.
But Election Commission chairman Bill Giannini, who has kept his silence to this point on attorneys’ advice, said he was empowered to speak on this issue, and he said unequivocally that activities of the inspection team had caused several kinds of disruptions, prompting Danny Presley of the Commission’s legal team to appeal to Settle to temporarily suspend the inspection.
Elaborating, both Giannini and John Ryder, another Commission lawyer, said that videotaping of Election Commission personnel had gone on in breach of an agreement between the two sides. County trustee Regina Newman, a litigant who is doubling as a lawyer for her side, said inspection team members had not videotaped employees since agreeing not to at the beginning of the week but had videotaped some of the voting machines and other paraphernalia.
“We were not ‘thrown out,’” Newman said. “Well, they certainly didn’t want to have to stop,” said Giannini.
The Flyer has learned meanwhile that speculation has focused in on Dennis Boyce, the Election Commission’s IT director, as the employee responsible for the election-day glitch that caused the post-election squabble.
Boyce, a civil servant hired by a previous Democratic management team at the Election Commission, apparently oversaw the feeding of early-voting data into the August 5 electronic voting roll. It is believed that a list of early voters from this May’s countywide preferential primary was fed into the records instead of the July early-voting list, a circumstance that presented obstacles a number of would-be election-day voters.
“But we’re not even certain if that was the main problem,” said Newman. She said there were other irregularities, including the fact that for two hours last Thursday, when members of the litigants’ inspection team first arrived at the Commission’s Shelby Farms Operations Center, “they kept us outside for two hours while the poster logs were altered eight times.”
The “poster logs,” she explained, were records of machine activity, specifically of “manual overrides” conducted on them. She said it was her understanding that such overrides could possibly include “alternation of a vote total for a candidate.”
Giannini hotly denied that any alterations of voting results had occurred and said that reality would be attested to by successive audits of the machines in the next few days, by two local firms regularly engaged by the Commission, by the state Election Coordinator, and conceivably by the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation and the U.S. Department of Justice.
In any case, the litigants’ direct inspection of Commission facilities has been halted until Monday by order of Settle, who was named acting special Chancellor for the case on Monday by Chancellor Walter Evans.
At a previous hearing in Chancellor Evans’ courtroom, the litigants and representatives of the Election Commission reached voluntary agreement about the need for sharing information about the actual voting results.
But disagreements arose early on when a group representing the litigants, joined by consultants from BlackBoxVoting, an advocacy group, arrived to download election data last Thursday at the Commission’s Operations Center. Commission officials charged the inspectors with disruption and were charged in turn with stonewalling.
Monday’s hearing, which resulted in Settle’s appointment, represented an effort to get beyond the stalemate — based in part on what Ryder said were proprietary matters involving the Diebold Corporation, makers of the voting machines in use in the county. “We have already provided them with more material than the law requires,” Ryder said.
Indeed, some of the material in dispute has been handed over, though Newman is disturbed that parts of it have been redacted. And of the voters potentially disadvantaged by the election-day glitch — some 5300, by her reckoning — she said, ““Based on our analysis of those numbers, there’s a disproportionate number of African Americans and ‘others’ in that number.”
Given the fact that questions were raised about vote-counting in the 2006 county election, in which several Democrats were narrowly defeated, there are bound to be lingering questions about the authenticity of this year’s outcome, even after all the evidence is sifted.
Ryder and Giannini concede that the persistence of conspiracy theories is inevitable, if unwarranted, and that asking for a temporary cessation of on-site inspection might provide additional fuel. “But we had no choice if we were to make the certification deadline,” Giannini said.
The litigants will have an opportunity to challenge the results for a period of five days following the certification procedure.
UPDATE: According to a report on WMC-TV Wednesday morning, activist Al Sharpton will appear with plaintiffs in the voting dispute at an 11 a.m. press conference at Election Commission headquarters.
More details as they are known.
Permalink | Post Comments (4)
Even the most naïve advocates of city/county counsolidation are aware that sentiment for the changeover in the part of Shelby County outside the City of Memphis is minimal to non-existent. What is not so well known is that the outlook for a favorable vote in Memphis itself is also dimming.
A sign of this was a largely unnoticed vote taken in the last month by the steering committee of the Shelby County Democratic Party to oppose the Charter resolution. While this vote is by no means reflective of the opinion of city residents as a whole, it does represent — by definition — the conviction of the leadership corps of the political party which has most traction in Memphis’ inner city.
The steering committee’s vote was taken to the membership at large of the party’s executive committee last Thursday night at a meeting which otherwise was dominated by post mortems of the just-concluded countywide election and by the continuing controversy over the consequences of an election-day voting-machine glitch.
As much because of the time and energy devoted to these other matters as for any reason, the executive committee voted to postpone any final action on repudiating the Metro Charter until its next monthly meeting when all the members will have been presented detailed copies of the Charter proposal to consider.
During a brief discussion of the Charter proposal, members of the party’s steering committee explained that one of their chief objections to accepting the consolidation resolution was a sense that it keeps the local governments of other county municipalities intact — with their mayors and legislative bodies continuing — while dissolving the existing structure of Memphis city government.
Permalink | Post Comments (17)
At this point, it is nigh on to impossible to imagine what happens next in the saga of the famous FUBAR election of August 2010.
Officials at the Election Commission are still trying to maintain, with all the inflexibility and certitude and desperate determination of single-bullet theorists, that what happened Thursday of last week was a simple minor-league glitch that inconvenienced at most a few hundred potential voters, few if any of them permanently, and was quickly corrected.
And they hold in reserve a trump card which I’m about to reveal: The perpetrator of the presumed offense — that of dumping the wrong set of early-voting data (from May of this year, allegedly) into the electronic voting book for the August 5 election — was a Democratic hire from years back, a civil servant type, as it were.
That revelation, which is just around the corner, will, the EC officials hope, have two ancillary consequences — absolving Republicans per se of any culpability in a hypothetical vote-suppression plot; and simultaneously insulating the current management from charges of inexperience and incompetence.
Meanwhile, an ad hoc confederation of Democratic activists, done-wrong candidates, consultants, conspiracy theorists, public service lobbyists, and pro bono legal helpers has descended upon the Election Commission’s places of operation determined to ferret out the secrets of this misadventure, even as the EC’s own personnel and attorneys have responded with maddening delaying tactics that may be designed to safeguard proprieties but look more like stalling or stonewalling to the seekers.
The army of the avengers has been buttressed on-site at various times by out-of-town newcomers such as Bev Harris of Seattle and Floridian Susan Pynchon, both consultants with BlackBoxVoting a consumer organization, and Mary Mancini of Nashville, the newly named head of Tennessee Citizen Action (TNCA). There has also come into being a new Facebook site entitled “I want a New Shelby County Election on Paper Ballots.”
And in the background the Tennessee Bureau of Investigation is supposedly concluding its preliminary inquiry into the election mess while the Department of Justice in Washington is presumably mulling over 9th District congressman Steve Cohen’s request for a formal federal investigation.
As the indefatigable Regina Newman, as of now still the Trustee and a plaintiff in the case, has explained via Twitter, a group including herself, Cardell Orrin, Del Gill, George Monger, Shep Wilbun, Harris, Pynchon, and ad hoc attorney David Cocke spent hours at the Election Commission’s Mullins Station Operations Center on Thursday.
This group kept trying to access the election-day files they thought they were free to inspect as a result of the compact reached earlier in the week between Shelby County Democratic chairman Van Turner and the GOP’s John Ryder, lawyer in this case for the EC.
Turner and Ryder had done their deal in the courtroom of Chancellor Walter Evans, who had seen no need to make any further ruling. Problem was: For various reasons, neither Turner nor Ryder were available for consultation at Mullins Station on Thursday afternoon. (Turner, who presided over a meeting of the local Democratic executive committee that night, would turn up later.)
So Cocke, subbing for Turner, was left to deal with Gene Gaerig, the assistant county attorney subbing for Ryder, at EC East. EC director Rich Holden was in the building but taking no part in the negotiations and mainly just staying out of the way and standing ready if needed. Also present was Dewun Settle, Chancery Court clerk and master, prepared to authorize and oversee whatever actions ended up being taken.
Gaerig, while being personally agreeable up to a point, came up pit bull-hard against any suggestion that the group of Democrats and their supporters should access the facility’s central computer or any of the stored files or voting consoles that pertained to the case.
The machines and their data were “intellectual property” and subject to a contract between the county and the Diebold Corporation, said Gaerig, and, without a release of some sort from the latter, were not to be tampered with.
Harris and Pynchon were sure this was stalling and nothing but and insisted that Diebold had long since sold its interests to a successor organization and that, in any case, only Microsoft files were at stake. No matter. The stalemate went on for hours until Cocke suggested, and got approved, a compromise whereby the plaintiffs’ group would be able to download a list of relevant files contained on the voting machines and/or the central computer.
While all of this was going on, Turner was conducting a balls-out meeting of the Democratic Executive Committee at the AFSCME/MLK Center on Beale that, impressively enough, concerned itself less with accusations that the election had been stolen and more with some serious probing into how and why it may have been lost honestly.
All of the prevalent theories — the Herenton-Cohen fizzle, turnout from the GOP gubernatorial whiz-bang, etc. — were considered, along with one or two striking new ones: e.g., that the Democrats had signally failed to engage the interest and participation of Generation X-ers.
Turner, whose conduct of the party during election season had been challenged by Commercial Appeal opinion editor Otis Sanford, got an informal vote of confidence and something of a standing-O, and those speakers (like State Rep. G.A. Hardaway) who defiantly rejected published suggestions that the Democratic slate of candidates had been sub-standard were not refuted by anyone.
Meanwhile, back at Election Commission East, right up ‘til the approach of midnight, the petitioners, assisted by Orrin’s IT know-how, were going through the time-consuming process of downloading the file list. (At some point, according to Newman, Gaerig apparently objected to the “Yankee rudeness” of one of the visiting consultants, who were kept at bay both then and on Friday.).
On Friday the action shifted back and forth between the EC’s Operations Center East and the EC’s downtown office as the petitioners continued to request downloads from servers at both locations, the process interrupted by long delays due to continued legal sparring.
Tweet from EC apropos one of the standoffs: “Our silence is us protecting your votes & voting rights while following strong advice from attorneys.”
It is somewhat unclear exactly what data was finally downloaded, though three identical copies were supposedly made of it — one disc each for the petitioners, the Election Commission, and the Court. More information will undoubtedly be sought.
At some near point all the participating parties will presumably prepare analyses of what they have. When and how the rest of us become acquainted with it — whether through monitored legal process or some other means — remains to be seen.
Meanwhile, the second called meeting of Democrats and others interested in challenging the August 5 election outcome was convened at the AFSCME/MLK Center on Friday afternoon but was essentially only a rump session, quickly adjourned, in light of the simultaneous activities going on in the Election Commission’s spheres.
All of this, you may be sure, will be continued in the new week.
Permalink | Post Comments (21)
All of that made good campaign sense. The primary season is over, and McWherter, who had no opponent on the August 5 Democratic primary ballot and was, as he acknowledges, less than omnipresent in these parts, now faces a general election contest with well-heeled Republican nominee Bill Haslam.
That fact should bring McWherter around more often, and, as the Jackson businessman pointed out, his home is a short driving distance from Memphis, which will also facilitate the frequency of his presence here. But there is yet another compelling reason for him to spend more time in Shelby County, beginning with yesterday’s visit.
McWherter has a son, Walker, who is entering Rhodes College this fall and one major reason his candidate father was in town on Thursday was to help Walker get settled into his dorm. And as McWherter has explained several times of late, home football games in Memphis are sure to bring both himself and wife Mary Jane around.
McWherter was asked about the increasingly obvious fact that Democrats running for office in Tennessee don’t tend to feature the word “Democrat” much or at all in their advertising and other campaign materials. His own first series of ads, which present him as a problem-solver and stay clear of ideological matters, don’t use the label.
Nor are the words “Democrat” or “Democratic” likely to be seen coupled with his name in future campaign presentations, he acknowledged, in a way reminiscent of the vow of U.S. Senate candidate Harold Ford Jr. in 2006 not to “go yelling ‘Democrat, Democrat, Democrat!”
“Well, I’m running now in a general election, and I’m hoping to get the votes of Democrats, Republicans, and independents,” McWherter said by way of accounting for the absence of the party signifier.
That doesn’t necessarily mean he buys into the prevalent notion that Tennessee, once upon a time a reliable part of the old Democratic Solid South and in more recent years a bellwether state, shifting back and forth from Democratic to Republican control, is now permanently Republican — a Red State, in the current lexicon.
He recalls that in the early ‘70s Tennessee seemed to be trending Republican but in the elections of 1974 and 1976 voted Democrats into the governorship and the state’s two U.S. Senate seats, where Republicans had been before.
And there was another case — 1986, when there was a governor’s race, featuring former Republican governor Winfield Dunn, who was favored, versus a vanilla-wafer-eating Democrat who was Speaker of the state House of Representatives at the time.
The Democrat — one Ned Ray McWherter, Mike’s father — won, of course, and, after serving two terms in office, became something of a state institution in his own right. As Mike McWherter, widely regarded as a serious underdog in the 2010 race for governor, recalls, “The networks were calling that an upset,” and he suggests that another one may be in the offing this year.
Permalink | Post Comments (12)
UPDATE.
Permalink | Post Comments (19)
See)
Permalink | Post Comments (9)
See)
Permalink | Post Comments (33)
Permalink | Post Comments (2) |
Metal News for January 14, 2010
Last updated on May 17, 2013 at 8:30 PM ET
We post metal news every day, throughout the day, covering thousands of metal bands including underground and unsigned bands. You are currently browsing the news archive, but you can also find news by band.
34 news articles posted on this day.
Cancer Bats To Tour Canada w/ Billy Talent
Cancer Bats will be joining Billy Talent, Alexisonfire, and Against Me! on their Canadian tour. Here are the latest tour dates:
03.03.10 - Victoria, BC, CAN @ Save On Foods Centre
03.05.10 - Penticton, BC, CAN @ South Okanagan Events Centre
03.06.10 - Kamloops, BC, CAN @ Interior Savings Centre
03.08.10 - Prince George, BC, CAN @ CN Centre
03.09.10 - Dawson Creek, BC, CAN @ EnCana Events Centre
03.11.10 - Red Deer, AB, CAN @ Enmax Centrium
03.12.10 - Medicine Hat, AB, CAN @ Medicine Hat Arena
03.13.10 - Lethbridge, AB, CAN @ Enmax Centre
03.15.10 - Edmonton, AB, CAN @ Rexall Place
03.16.10 - Calgary, AB, CAN @ Pengrowth Saddledome
03.18.10 - Regina, SK, CAN @ Brandt Centre
03.19.10 - Saskatoon, SK, CAN @ Credit Union Centre
03.20.10 - Winnipeg, MB, CAN @ MTS Centre
03.22.10 - Sault Ste. Marie, ON, CAN @ Essar Centre
03.23.10 - Sudbury, ON, CAN @ Sudbury Arena
03.24.10 - Montreal, QC, CAN @ Bell Centre
03.26.10 - Ottawa, ON, CAN @ Scotiabank Place
03.27.10 - London, ON, CAN @ John Labatt Centre
03.28.10 - Toronto, ON, CAN @ Air Canada Centre
Varg Streaming New Song Online
German viking metallers Varg are currently streaming a new song online from their upcoming album "Blutaar." The track "Sieg Oder Niedergang," along with the previously uploaded titled track, can be heard via Varg's MySpace page. "Blutaar" is set to be released on January 29th, 2010.
The Red Chord Announces Headlining Tour
Boston metallers The Red Chord have announced they will be embarking on a headlining U.S. tour in support of their latest album "Fed Through The Teeth Machine." Support on the tour will come from Mychildren Mybride, Chelsea Grin, and Those Who Lie Beneath. The currently confirmed dates are as follows:
02/11 Douglasville, GA The 7 Venue's Pizza
02/26 Modesto, CA Modesto Virtual
02/28 Palmdale, CA The Crossing
03/01 Flagstaff, AZ The Joint
03/02 Albuqurque,
Kraanium Enters The Studio
Norwegian death metallers Kraanium have issued the following statement about entering the recording studio:
"Yesterday we hit the studio once again, and stared to record some new stuff. Five new slamming songs Kraanium style is in da works! Will probably be on a split with Condemned Remains and Intracranial Butchery if everything goes as plan, looking forward to this shit! Stay tuned for more slamtastic news from Norways (only) slammasters!"
Samples of Kraanium's music can be found at their official MySpace page.
Nightrage Updates Tour Schedule
Greek metallers Nightrage have changed several venues and dates on their upcoming Greek and Mexican tour dates. The currently announced dates are as follows:
2/12 2010 Greek tour 2010 Patra, @Lithografeio Theater
2/13 2010 Greek tour 2010 Ioannina, TBA
2/14 2010 Greek tour 2010 Agrinio, @ Dewars Club
2/15 2010 Greek tour 2010 Irakleio, @ Support 81
2/16 2010 Greek tour 2010 Chania, @ 4 Seasons Bar
2/18 2010 Greek tour 2010 Lamia, @ Secrets Live Stage
2/19 2010 Greek tour 2010 Larisa, Stage Club
2/20 2010 Greek Tour 2010 Thessaloniki, Eightbal Club
2/21 2010 Greek Tour 2010 Athens, @ On Stage Club
2/27 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Mexico City, MULTIFORO TLALPAN., México
2/28 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Cuernavaca Mor, Foro de PIT
3/5 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Guadalajara Jal, Auditorio FEU
3/6 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Morelia Mich, Bar Fuxion
3/7 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Durango. Dgo, FORO ALTERNATIVO LA CUCHILLA
3/12 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 CD. Obregon Son, Salon Chaparral
3/13 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Hermosillo Son, Foro Celaya
3/14 2010 Mexican Tour 2010 Toluca, Edo Mex. Venue: Lando Music
Opeth Confirmed For Sweden Rock Festival
Swedish progressive death metallers Opeth have announced they will perform at the Sweden Rock Festival, which is set to take place from June 9th - 12th, 2010 in Solvesborg. More information on the festival can be found at this location. Opeth also have the following upcoming tour dates:
3/30 2010 Cirkus Stockholm
4/1 2010 Lichtburg Essen
4/3 2010 Bataclan (SOLD OUT) Paris
4/5 2010 Royal Albert Hall London
4/7 2010 Terminal 5 New York, New York
4/9 2010 The Wiltern Los Angeles, California
Dark Tranquillity Posts Another New Song Online
Dark Tranquillity has posted another new song, "At the Point of Ignition," on their MySpace page. Listen to it at
The track comes off the new album, "We Are the Void," which to 2007’s “Fiction” was recorded at (bassist) Daniel Antonsson's Gothenburg Rock Studios and (keyboardist) Martin Brändström's Rogue Music and mixed and mastered by Tue Madsen at Antfarm Studio in Denmark.
Dark Tranquillity will kick off the touring cycle for the new album in February 2010 with a US tour with Killswitch Engage and The Devil Wears Prada. Here are the dates: More...
Read more... | 7 Comments - Discuss
H.I.M. Announces North American Tour
H.I.M. has announced dates for the upcoming North American tour this spring in support of their seventh full-length album, "Screamworks: Love in Theory and Practice," which is set for a February release.. 23 Los Angeles, CA - The Wiltern LG
Apr. 24 Las Vegas, NV - House of Blues
Apr. 25 San Diego, CA -
Pantheon I Posts Live Video Clip
Norway's Pantheon I has posted live footage online of their performance of the song "The Last Stand," which can be viewed below. The video clip was recorded on December 5th 2009.
Priestess Announces European Tour
Canada's Priestess has announced they will be embarking on a string of European tour dates alongside Bigelf. The currently confirmed dates are as follows:
2/01 – Hamburg, Gemany @ Logo
2/02 – Berlin, Gemany @ White Trash
2/03 – Munich, Gemany @ 59 to 1
2/04 – Cologne, Gemany @ Luxor
2/06 – Strasbourg, Franve @ La Laiterie
2/07 – Amsterdam, Holland @ Melkweg
2/08 – Antwerp, Belgium @ Trix
2/09 – Paris, France @ La Maroquinerie
2/11 – Pratteln, Switzerland @ Z7
2/12 – Treviso, Italy @ New Age
2/13 – Milan, Italy @ Tunnel
2/15 – Barcelona, Spain @ Salamandra
2/16 – Madrid, Spain @ Sala Ramdall
2/20 – Oxford, England @ Academy
2/22 – Glasgow, Scotland @ Cathouse
2/23 – Manchester, England @ Club Academy
2/24 – Wolverhampton, England @ Little Civic
2/25 – London, England @ Underworld
Solstafir Confirmed For Roskilde Festival
Icelandic metallers Sólstafir have announced they will perform at Denmark's Roskilde Festival, which will take place the first weekend of July, 2010. More information on the festival can be found at this location. Sólstafir have the following upcoming tour dates:
4/30 2010 Ragnarök Festival Rieden/Kreuth
7/1 2010 Roskilde Festival Roskilde, Sjælland
8/5 2010 Wacken Open Air Wacken
8/19 2010 Summer Breeze Open Air Dinkelsbuehl."
Theatre Of Tragedy Issues Band Update
Theatre of Tragedy has issued the following update about live shows and releasing a new version of their latest album with a bonus EP:
"Happy new year to all of you out there! Things are starting to stir up in the ToT camp. We have compiled all the songs we will play for the upcoming shows and have started rehearsals. 2010 will mark some major changes for ToT. Be sure to catch any upcoming shows close (or afar) from you. There will be about 4 more shows on the European tour announced shortly. Hope to see many of you at the shows. We will be hanging in the bar. We are also working on a South American tour for June and some Norwegian shows in Sept/October.
"In connection with the tour we will issue a limited edition tour version of 'Forever is the World.' This will include a new EP called 'ADDENDA EP' and will feature 10 tracks of b-sides, rarities, remakes, remixes and stuff. So all of you that still didn't get your copy of the 'FITW' CD, here's your chance. It will be released early march. For you that already own the album, AFM Records have promised us that when the limited version is sold out the EP will be sold separately. More...
Read more... | 1 Comment - Discuss
Sabaton Posts New Studio Footage
Sweden's Sabaton has posted a second video report of their time in the Abyss studios recording their upcoming album "Coat of Arms." The video clip can be viewed below.
Kittie Unveils New Music Video
KITTIE has posted a new music video for their song "Sorrow I Know." The song is off KITTIE's latest album, "In The Black" which was released back in September of 2009. More...
Read more... | 1 Comment - Discuss
Tools Of Torture Cancels Upcoming Tour
Italy's Tools of Torture has issued the following statement about canceling their upcoming tour with Exhumer:
"Tools Of Torture is really sad to let you know that we canceled our presence at the February European Tour with Exhumer because of some sudden employments of Tamoth in his job. We tried to find a solution looking for a session drummer but we received negative replies so now we're forced to cancel our tour. You never know how much sadness and frustration bring us this decision, after also all the precious work done to book the gigs and organize the tour at the best, but we can't do it any other way.
"We apologize with Exhumer (wishing them all the best for the tour!), all the gig organizers, all the clubs and all our fans in Greece, Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary, Austria, Germany and Switzerland. Hope to meet you all in future and make up what we miss."
Artisian To Release New Album In 2010
ARTISIAN has announced that it will be releasing a new album sometime in 2010. An approximate release date has yet to be announced, but the band has posted a new track that will be featured on the album. "Orion" can be streamed on the band's Myspace page.
Municipal Waste Gear Up For European Tour
Virginian MUNICIPAL WASTE have finished the North American leg
of their "Waste the World" headlining tour in December, and are now
preparing for the start of their European leg.
MUNICIPAL WASTE will head out to Europe next week in support of their
critically acclaimed new album, MASSIVE AGGRESSIVE, which debuted at number
10 on the Billboard Heatseekers chart. Joining MUNICIPAL WASTE will be
VICTIMS and REPROACH.
MUNICIPAL WASTE frontman TONY FORESTA comments:
"I'm really pumped that we're coming back over to do a proper Massive
Aggressive tour in Europe. I'm also very excited to be bringing a band like
Victims with us. We've been trying to tour with them for a while and it's
great that it worked out for this run. From the shows we have played
together with them in the past, I feel that the Waste and Victims are a
pretty lethal combination. Expect a lot of new songs in the set as well as
a heap of old surprises. Looking forward to this one. See you soon!" More...
Read more... | 0 Comments - Discuss
Den Saakaldte Cancels Upcoming Tour Dates
Norwegian metallers Den Saakaldte, who recently recruited Carpathian Forest drummer Anders Kobro, have announced that they are canceling all of their previously announced dates booked through TPE Booking. Their other dates remain unchanged. Den Saakaldte's currently confirmed tour dates are as follows:
3/19 2010 Pitch Black - Niederkrüchten, DE Niederkrüchten
3/20 2010 Roermond-Azienfabriek, NL Roermond
4/9 2010 Helsinki, Dante’s Highlight, FI Helsinki
4/10 2010 KINGS OF BLACK METAL FESTIVAL 2010, DE Hessen
8/20 2010 BARTHER OPEN AIR FESTIVAL 2010, DE Barther, Berlin
Vreid To Headline Jotunheim Festival
Norway's Vreid has issued the following statement about performing at the Jotunheim Festival:
"Vreid to headline Festival in Croatia. Vreid will be one of the headliners at the Jotunheim Festival at Mocvara in Zagreb, Croatia on Saturday June the 19th. The venue was packed with dedicated fans when we played there with Moonspell & Enslaved 5 years ago, and we hope for another great show this summer night in June. More info at this location."
Samples of Vreid's music can be found at their MySpace page.
Dio Gives Health Update
Wendy Dio has issued the following health update about Ronnie James Dio, who was recently diagnosed with stomach cancer:
. More...
Read more... | 28 Comments - Discuss
Abigail Williams Drops Off Nile Tour
Abigail Williams has issued the following statement about canceling their upcoming tour dates alongside Nile:
"Due to a recent injury to drummer Ken Meyers, Abigail Williams are forced to cancel their upcoming tour with Nile that was scheduled to start January 15 in Baltimore, Maryland. The tour was planned to support the recent release of a deluxe version of the band’s latest album, In the Shadow of a Thousand Suns (released this week featuring five bonus songs, a CD-ROM video track and all new artwork) and the vinyl pressing of the popular record originally released late 2008."
Abigail Williams have also announced that they will soon begin writing and recording their second full-length album which is tentatively set for release by the end of 2010.
Deadlock to Support Lacuna Coil On German Dates
After a successful year 2009 including shows in Japan, Russia and all over Europe, DEADLOCK will support LACUNA COIL on their German tour dates. This tour marks a perfect finish for the "Manifesto" album cycle, just to start focusing on the next album after returning home from the trek.
Here are the Deadlock tour dates currently confirmed for 2010. More dates are to be announced.
19.02. LÖRRACH / Altes Wasserwerk (w. Fear My Thoughts)
20.02. BERLIN / Columbiaclub (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
21.02. HAMBURG / Knust (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
22.02. ASCHAFFENBURG / Colos Saal (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
24.02. KÖLN / Essigfabrik (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
25.02. KARLSRUHE / Substage (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
26.02. MÜNCHEN / Backstage Halle (w. Lacuna Coil & Dommin)
27.03. ERFURT / Unikum (w. Anima)
25.-27.06. DESSEL (B) / Graspop Metal Meeting
Dark Hound Debuts.
Sanctuary Reissues Classic Albums On Single CD
Ironbird via Cherry Red Records will reissue SANCTUARY's first two albums, 1987's "Refuge Denied," produced by Dave Mustaine of MEGADETH; and 1990's "Into The Mirror Black," produced by Howard Benson, on a single CD on March 8. Singer Warrel Dane and bassist Jim Sheppard went on to extend SANCTUARY's ambition and songwriting into NEVERMORE.
Mystic Prophecy Issues Stratovarius Tour Update
German metal band MYSTIC PROPHECY mainman R.D. Liapakis has issued an update from their tour with STRATOVARIUS from Paris. The tour update is as follows:
“As it turns out the chemistry between STRATOVARIUS and MYSTIC PROPHECY is great. Every night is a great party with lots of fans coming into the shows. More the 1000 people came in to our show in Paris giving us the most energizing feedback any artist can hope for. It definitely is a great tour so far and we can’t wait for the rest of the dates. So see you soon in a town near you. Until then stay heavy!”
Godless Truth Begins Recording New Material
Czech Republic's technical brutal death metal band Godless Truth has issued the following update:
"Godless Truth are now recording a brand new promo in famous HERTZ studio - POLAND. Working with Wojtek and Slawek Wieslawski who are known for their great work they did for DECAPITATED, VADER, BEHEMOTH etc albums!"
"In other news, we just recently started to jam with profi bass player ULF GJERDINGEN from Sweden! So finally our line up is complete!"
Expect some studio reports as well as a new track sample in following days!
The."
Caliban Posts US Tour Video Update
German metal band Caliban has announced episode 8 of Caliban TV. The episode features the second part of their USA tour with Suffocate, Born Of Osiris, After The Burial, and All Shall Perish. Watch the video below
Upcoming Caliban tour dates are as follows:
25.02.2010 - Close-Up Baten - Stockholm, Swe
20.03.2010 - Expo, Coruna
25.03.2010 - Hannover, Musikzentrum
26.03.2010 - Chemnitz, AJZ Talschock (+ Neaera)
27.03.2010 - Kliffrock Festival 2010
19.06.2010 - Summerblast Festival 2010
04.07.2010 - With Full Force Festival 2010
05.08.2010 - Wacken Open Air 2010 More...
Read more... | 0 Comments - Discuss)
Dawn of Retaliation Completes Recording New Songs
Noregian metal band Dawn of Retaliation has issued the following studio update:
"We have just recorded two songs and they are currently being mixed and mastered as we speak.
In a few weeks we will publish one of the songs as a promo here on MySpace with a brand new profile layout and new photos with the new members. Check back now and then and look forward to the new shit. Its gonna kick your ass for sure!"
Navigate forward or backward through each day of news below: |
De..
December 2, 2004
Vsyo pad kontrolem
Nothing to report on the baby front. Watched pots and all... So we try to go about our days.
We read the paper over breakfast. (Jenn is fascinated and repelled by Vladimir Putin, always taking special interest in news of his friends or foes. Sometimes, between spoonfuls of cereal, I will hear my wife chuckling ruefully, "Khodorkovsky, my friend, bad move. Bad move." or "Watch your back Yushchenko, the next time the poison will take."
We plan on naming a dog Putin someday.)
We putter about and run errands.
I do work.
And act like everything is totally normal.
I'm done with making predictions and will let the biology take it's own mysterious course without prognosticating and getting everyone all riled up. Jenn is enjoying a nice bath.
Perhaps tomorrow.
--
p.s. does anyone else find it odd that if you google "Russian Phrases" the first thing that comes up is a page from a dating site with phrases like "I liked your photo and message very much" and "I dream to meet a woman to share my life with." I especially like this sequence "You are so soft. You are so gentle. You are so delightful. You are so supernatural!"
December 4, 2004
quiet day
Jenn had a pre-labor contractions, but nothing major... and these pre-labor contractions can last for days...
--
I've discovered our ice cream maker can double as a poor man's slurpee machine. Yum.
December 4, 2004
december
We have a humidifier in our bedroom that makes water sounds. Combine that with a tangled pair of long johns, free floating anxiety about the upcoming birth, and a baby kicking me in the back through my wife's belly and it all combines into one monster of a bad dream. The short version is that I'm in a straight jacket mid-ocean trying to stay afloat and get my wife to the hospital on time.
--
We've largely stopped being worrying about "when" and are instead just focusing on staying ready. In the meantime we've made the mental shift from thinking about a Thanksgiving baby to a December one. I'm not sure why this makes a difference but it does. Our current worry is that our daughter will crowd her aunt Becky's birthday. The Yuns take birthdays seriously and we want to give Becks plenty of space to revel and be appreciated.
But these are idle thoughts. Most of all we just want this girl to be healthy and loved. We, like all parents, have a million other hopes and fears... that she will avoid some of the mistakes we have made, that she won't be as difficult as we were, that she will see us as friends... ultimately that she will be better than us. But of course she must fail to learn and must sometimes hate us in order to grow. We know all this.
I've been computerizing our family tree of late. We are an unlikely mix of Gutierrez' and Yuns, Mudges' and Paeks, Perez', and Townes. A hundred years ago our ancestors lived on 3 continents and probably would have killed each other on site. I'm sure this child will have a bit of the best and worst of us all.
--
_1<<
De.
December 7, 2004
at St. Lukes...
Jenn's labor began at around 4:00am while she was asleep. At 6 it woke her up and by 10 we were in the hospital. It's 3:35PM now and she's finally been able to take a nap... So far everything is normal. I'll write an update if I happen to find another wireless connection... It's been intense. I might need a nap as well.
December 7, 2004
5:01PM
Still laboring...
December 7, 2004
12/7/04 11:17 PM
10 seconds after birth.
December 8, 2004
Jenn's Labor
4am Dec 7
Jenn's labor began quietly enough... Tuesday morning at around 4 am I heard her moaning in her sleep every couple of minutes. The thought "Oh she's in labor" crossed my mind, and I fell back asleep, a weird reaction considering all the anticipation building up to the labor. We had just passed the 41 week mark and people were starting to worry. The OB was ordering lots of new tests and exams, I was worried about Jenn's discomfort. Our families were antsy. But perhaps I knew I had to get my rest too, so I slept.
5:57 Jenn woke up thinking she was having cramps. The day before she had been examined and a midwife in our OB practice. The midwife did something called "stripping the membrane: in which she used her finger to slough off some of the outer membranes of the placenta by reaching through the cervix. Painful? God, I can only imagine. This is supposed to stimulate labor and perhaps it did, but Jenn didn't recognize it as labor. She was upset because she was in a kind of pain that she hadn't experienced the entire pregnancy and was cramping. In retrospect those cramps might have been the uterus getting warmed up.
So Jenn woke up and headed to the bathroom with a bout of intense nausea. My wife can dislocate her shoulder without a wimper, but she doesn't do well with nausea. She began shaking like a leaf. I felt a pang of panic, but we were fairly well prepared. I already called our doula, made sure the bags were in order, made sure I had cash, phone, phone numbers, etc. The contractions were coming about every 5 minutes and were a minute long... in other words everything seemed normal. But within a few minutes the intensity increased and Jenn wasn't getting the sensation of release in-between. The release is what is supposed to make labor bearable, but it wasn't happening. This scared both of us.
The doula, Terry Richmond, arrived promptly and went right into trying a number of positions to ease the pain. Some were working, but the nausea and the shaking were getting worse. Also the contractions were speeding up. We tried the tub for a while which helped, but again there was no sense of release. By 9:15 we were headed to the hospital.
I had been dreading the drive to the hospital thinking that I would be so stressed that I wouldn't be able to focus, but I felt oddly relaxed and in control. Rush hour traffic was not that bad and more importantly the ride seemed to settle my wife a bit. The pain felt bearable she said.
9:45
Arriving at the hospital we found it easier to walk upstairs than to use a wheelchair. We were brought into a triage/examination area outside labor & delivery. The place was busy. 6 babies had already been born that day and it was early still. Jenn was put behind a curtain with an external monitor. A few minutes later our doctor came in did an internal exam and everyone was surprised to learn that Jenn was still at 4cm. This was the same dilation she had in the days before labor. Babies are generally delivered at 9 or 10 cms so this was disheartening. Also a second bit of bad news. The baby was very high, it hadn't even begun to descend. Our doctor, Dr Paka, a good natured MD from Hyderabad with a habit of calling my wife by the wrong name, shook her head and clucked, "I think this baby is very big." Then she went away to attend to other deliveries. An IV drip was inserted into Jenn's wrist and a saline drip was started. She was dehydrated and quickly absorbed 2 full bags of saline.
Privately a resident told me he had expected Jenn to be at 8cm based on the strength of her contractions and her general demeanor. This resident kept filling out forms with lots of repetitive questions. I thought it odd that he kept asking Jenn the questions as opposed to me, but I know they have procedure to follow. At this point we had a choice, get an epidural to ease the shaking and the pain, or go down to the birth center to try to deliver totally naturally.
Our plan had been to use the birth center. It's rooms are bigger, quieter, just in general nicer (relatively speaking). The birth center at St. Lukes Roosevelt has the feel of a two star hotel while the hospital rooms are, well, hospital rooms. The birth center has very different set of procedures than in Labor & Delivery. There is much less monitoring, fewer contraptions, no epidurals, and etc. It's an approach that trusts the woman's body to do the right thing. The idea is to put couples comfortable room with a whirlpool where the woman can get into any position that works for her without too much medical intervention. By most accounts with normal deliveries, and with women who are prepared for birth without an epidural, the birth center is one of the best bets in New York City for a satisfying birth experience with the safety net of being near a hospital. Also after the birth, the couple and child are pretty much guaranteed a private room. In Labor and Delivery you must ask for a private room and they are doled out as available. Husbands aren't allowed to spend the night in shared rooms. So the decision was upon us, birth center or labor and delivery (and epidural)? The decision was easy: labor wasn't progressing normally, and we all felt Jenn's shaking and nausea were side effects of the pain. She was laboring with high pitched non-productive squeaks as opposed to the productive deep moans we were looking for, and she was throwing up. So we decided on the epidural in the hopes it would relax her and allow labor to progress. My concern as that she would feel upset, because she had invested so much in the idea of a totally natural childbirth, but at this point she was just looking for relief. But even after we put in the request we had to wait... All the anesthesiologists were tied up.
The triage area was extremely noisy with other laboring women and people coming and going, there were 2 people ahead of us for a delivery room... so we waited. This probably was the most agonizing part of the entire day. We spent almost 90 minutes in the holding area but it seemed like an eternity. I kept re-assuring Jenn that a room was coming, but kept getting word that the room wasn't ready. Annoyed by the noise and clatter, I said, "It will be quiet, you'll get some relief and you can rest". Jenn, much to the amusement of the doula, the resident and myself, said, "oh it's nice and quiet in here..." She was going internal.
12:00
We were wheeled to a room in labor and delivery. The room was small a phalanx of machines. Despite 2 broken chairs, and a large wall clock stuck at 12:05 the room was comfortable. Outside we had a fairly decent view of the city. An anesthesiologist, the head resident arrived at 12:50. He had a firm calming manner (and he was wearing the cleanest chucks I've ever seen) and went to work. The epidural procedure which involves a needle in the spine was performed with merciful speed.
Within 20 minutes Jenn started becoming her normal self again, even cracking a few jokes. Now we just had to wait. The plan was for her to try to get some sleep and see if contractions would start again, if not Pitocin, an artificial form of Oxytocin to stimulate contractions would be delivered. Despite the reprieve from the pain, Jenn was upset. This was exactly what we had been trying to avoid, she said she felt like she had failed. I did my best to let her know how proud I was of her and how I thought this was the right decision given the slow progression of labor, but she was having none of it. Pitocin was delivered via IV and the contractions, which had been calmed by the the anesthesia started again on charts. Finally she simply slept.
I took a break for lunch.
1:20
Dr. Paka examined Jennifer. No progress, so she decided to break the bag of water. I wasn't in the room for this, but apparently the procedure was painless.
On the way back from lunch, I ran into the doctor. She had told me she thought the baby was big and might need a c-section. I tried to make her promise that as long as there was progress she would hold off. While she wouldn't promise, I think she heard me...
In the meantime Jenn's sister Becky arrived. In typical Becky fashion she bopped into the room in good spirits, took a flash picture of Jenn and then held the camera out and took a picture of herself. "So will the baby be here soon?" she asked. She was unaware of the drama of the morning.
Dr. Paka returned. "Let's see how Judy is doing."
"Jennifer," I said.
"Let's see how Jennifer is doing."
The results of the exam were disheartening. 5cm. But it was progress. The doula and I kept emphasizing the point. Dr. Paka looked worried and said she would be back soon. Also a fever had started. Fevers after epidurals are common, so antibiotics were added to the saline drip.
Hours passed without much progress. Outside, the scene was a chaotic with babies being delivered every hour. Q nervous Pakistani man, a tough looking man with a scar from the Bronx, and an Orthodox man and assorted soon-to-be grandparents paced the hall.. The respective wives were making incredibly varied noises from sing-songy sounds, wolf howls, to something that sounded like a yodeler being strangled. None of this was particularly calming. The noise bothered Jenn and I had to keep closing the door. I admit I also kept closing the doors to the other room. By 6pm, twelve babies were born. The clock on the wall still stuck at noon was beginning to really bug me. Luckily Jenn couldn't see it.
And inside our room, Jenn's epidural started wearing off. She began to feel everything again. The shakes returned and the nausea.
5:40
The epidural was "topped off" and Jenn instantly began to feel better again.And the second epidural had kicked up the fever. At 6:00 it was 101.9. More antibiotics were ordered as well as two internal monitors. One for the baby, one for the mom. The baby monitor involves inserting a long thin tube with a tiny wire inside. This wire is actually screwed into the baby's head. At this point Jenn had these monitors, a catheter in her elbow for saline/pitocin/antibiotics, the epidural in her back, another tube connected to the sphygmomanometer on her arm... All this was scary for me, but for Jenn it was disheartening. Again we had invested so much in doing all this naturally that she kept saying that she felt like she had failed. I'll admit hearing her say this got me choked up because I was so darned proud of her. She had been working so hard, and had been so calm. At one point we kicked everyone out of the room and just talked it out. I don't know if I said anything helpful, but afterwards she was more focused and calm.
8:30
The epidural was wearing off again. Again Jenn was feeling everything.An anesthesiologist was called in. She performed a series of simple tests. "Do you feel something sharp on this leg? How about this leg? What about here?" Her conclusion was the epidural was in properly but that for whatever reason the nerves to the pelvis were not being saturated and that the only possible solution was to remove the current epidural and insert a new one. She left the room to call in another doctor. A second doctor confirmed the analysis of the first. A new epidural would be required.
A new labor nurse was on call, Jaye. Jaye is super cool, with lots of arm ink. She told us not to worry.
And at this point a small miracle: as pain increased, Jenn began letting out low sonorous sounds with the contractions... she started laboring productively, ie the baby started moving. We could see it on the chart. With every group of contractions, an inverse blip on the baby's chart, let that let us know the kid was on the move. It was obvious to everyone that the pain was shattering but Jenn was working with it. Later she would say the feeling of the baby moving meant everything in the world. She was dealing... all the while letting out long operatic moans that seemed to come from the base of her soul. The anesthesiologist showed up to redo the epidural. Amazingly she turned him down saying simply, "don't worry, I can deal." All the while, the encouraging blips showing were showing the baby moving. We each one we let her know what was going on. At one point Jenn actually smiled between contractions. During all of this, our doctor had been called away to attend an emergency delivery which gave us about an hour... Jenn told the labor nurse she was feeling the urge to push and the delivery nurse paged in a doctor for an evaluation. As Dr. Paka was busy, another OB came in and did a quick exam. She was at 8cm, almost through transition to the pushing stage. This was an intense time. Jenn's mom was in the room praying. I was letting Jenn know what was going on with the contractions based on the charts, and Terry was providing comfort by cooling Jenn's head, giving us all water and generally keeping things on track.
required.
10:30
Dr. Paka was paged. She seemed shocked find Jenn fully dilated, as she had been preparing for a c-section and had already ordered a us a room. The news kicked everyone into action. Dr. Paka was still worried about the babies size. As a precaution she brought in a full team of residents and nurses. There were 8 or 9 people in the room in addition to the doula and myself. The bed was broken so the doctor could have better access. I was given the job of holding one of Jenn's feet. The pushing part of labor is athletic and extremely focused. Jenn did not need any help here. She was pushing beautifully. The thought I kept having was that if anyone ever doubted the power of women they needed to witness a this. When the head appeared Jenn was told to push as hard as she could. With one great concentrated effort an arm appeared. One of the nurses shouted that he was coming out hands up. I did not know it at the time, but this was a small gracenote because with one arm up the shoulders are narrower and the baby can move through the birth canal easier. With large babies the danger is that they get stuck and the doctors are forced to break their shoulders to remove them. The doctor would later call our situation her worst nightmare. Hence the large team, hence all the worry. So with the hand, the entire room visibly relaxed.
11:17
A second or two later the rest of the body slipped right out. Dr. Paka stood their holding the baby for a moment clipping the umbilical cord. The baby lay there eyes blinking, covered in blood hands up in the air. "This is a very big child," she said softly and quickly handed the child to a pediatrician so that meconium could be suctioned from the babies mouth. I think it was a delivery nurse who said, "It's a boy." Dr. Paka I don't think had noticed as she was so focused on just getting the baby out and on dealing with the umbilical cord. I think everyone in the room repeated "A boy?" to themselves at least once. I ran over to the warmer as the boy was cleaned and checked. He let out sharp cries as he was poked and prodded but was otherwise quiet and alert.
I was literally speechless. Jenn was calm, a bit stunned, but looking surprisingly relaxed given that she was still in the middle of delivering placenta. "A boy?" she kept repeating. Then the weight was announced. 10 pounds 10 ounces. Even the doctor seemed flabbergasted. Later Jenn would say she was also shocked by the number of people in the room. She hadn't been aware of anyone other than myself, the doctor, the nurse, and the doula.
I stood by the warmer holding the boy's hand with my finger and snapping pictures. I was checking to make sure everything was in the right place. 10 toes. 10 fingers etc. It was all there.
Soon Raul Andres' eyes were open and calm. I was anxious to get him to his mother. After a few mintues which stretched like an eternity he was on Jenn's breast for a first feeding. Jenn's mom came in. She had been peeking into the birth and was, I'm afraid a bit traumatized. The baby calmed her. I called my parents and Becky. All were at bedside within thirty minutes.
The family stayed around for about an hour. The whole time, the Raul Andres was calm and alert. Jenn was feeling as well as could be expected. Everyone was happy, a bit dazed, full of emotion,but quiet. Surprisingly no tears were shed. We also exhausted. Soon was time for everyone to go. Jenn was wheeled to her recovery room. The baby was wheeled over to the nursery for some tests.
No private rooms were available so we had to share with a girl who kept the TV on seemingly all day long. After about an hour the baby was returned to us (everything normal) and Jenn and baby finally went to sleep. I was kicked out at around 3:30am. As I walked out of the hospital onto the quiet rainy streets of New York City I certainly didn't feel like a dad yet, but the tug on my heart was strong, and it took everything I had not to try to go up and sneak back into the room with my wife and child. The streets were empty. I didn't have an umbrella but I didn't care. I walked all the way over to my parents place on 5th and 60th full of wordless emotion.
December 8, 2004
Unmistakably...
a boy... a 10 pound 10 ounce, BOY!
.
December 8, 2004
day #1
After yesterday's shock and awe. Sleep and eat. Sleep and eat.
December 9, 2004
home from the hospital
I'm preparing a long post with the gritty details...
In the meantime more parent-into-his kid pix:
Answers to 5 frequently asked questions.
Question: What is the name? (alternately do you have a Korean name yet?)
Answer: Raul Andres Min Gutierrez
Re Min: Korean names generally have 1 to 3 syllables (most commonly 2). Each syllable stands for a Chinese character. Most brothers and sisters have the same first syllable... family of Korean kids might have names like Ji-hyon, Ji-ho, Ji-moon. As we had reserved Min-Ok when we thought the baby was a girl, we decided to stick with with Min theme. We played around with several second characters, but liked Min on it's own. It's unusual to have a one character name, but it works for us... sort of like he's the leader of the rest of the Mins to come. There are a couple of characters for Min. We will use the one that means 'clever' over the one that means 'democratic"... not knocking democracy, but we prefer cleverness....
Question: Does the fact that he is a boy when you were told the baby was a girl freak you out or make you sad?
Answer: No. Not at all. It was love at first site. Practically speaking it's a drag to have a closet full of girl stuff and gifts, but we'll save those for our future girl... or they will eventually be re-gifted! We did put lots of thought into a future little girl (just scroll down this blog to read some of the yammering), but we originally thought this kid was a boy and went through the reverse sensation when we were told it was a girl. Also always in the back of my head I thought this was a possibility. In fact just 2 nights ago at a deli a woman told me not to say the baby was a girl with such confidence....
Question: How is Jenn?
Answer: She's doing great... physically she's back on her feet and recovering nicely. Emotionally, she made the transition to momhood seemingly instantly. Practically she's amazing, (how does she know how to do all this baby stuff that vexes me so...)
Question: What are his eyes like?
Answer: In most of the pictures here, his eyes are shut and he looks quite Asian. But when he opens them his eyes are large and with a fold, so they are much more western looking. So he's a real mix. Hard to pin down.
Question: Are you tired?
yes. I'm hanging up now.
December 11, 2004
world of poop
There is an funny dichotomy in the congrats emails from our friends who are parents vs those who aren't... The non-parents tend to say things like "isn't it wonderful" or "are you so happy" whereas virtually all the parents say things like "hang in there" or "pace yourself...it will get easier in a few days".
Well for us it's been both, exhilarating and darned taxing and all the emails have been great. Sorry for the lack of phone calls, we'll need a few days to streamline the operation here...
I'm still working on that blow by blow report of the labor. As a new dad I don't think there are enough nitty gritty labor stories around on the web to refer to to really get a sense of what labor really looks like from the dad's perspective. Thank goodness we took classes at Realbirth. I had a pretty good grasp of the medical realities of birth, but only in a textbook sort of way. The classes did a good job of going through all the various stages as they are actually played out both emotionally and physically. In a way I think that the classes are more helpful for the dads than the moms. The moms are so in their bodies that in the moment of labor they often have the urge to do the right thing somewhat naturally. But as the dad dealing with the doctors/hospitals/etc who sometimes push the moms in directions they don't want to go, it was important to know what was going on, what was normal, and what the options were. In our case knowing those options I believe helped us prevent a c-section.
Believe it or not I don't have a picture today. Must change a diaper. More tomorrow._20<<
December 12, 2004
Kid learns the stinkeye
December 14, 2004
Geminids
Things are finally quieting down around here. The relatives are gone, and we're figuring out a routine. It's just the three of us now. The last week has been intense and things are just now starting to feel normal.
Managing family has been interesting. Jenn's old-school Korean mother for example left a few days ago to return to Philadelphia. Yesterday, I saw her number on caller id.
"Rara," she said, "I have groceries. Are you near 8th Avenue?"
"You're here in New York?" I answered somewhat confused.
"Yeah. No problem. Jenny need meat. So I brought meat. Also she doesn't eat enough soup, so I make her eat seaweed soup. Koreans are weak and must eat lotta soup."
Half an hour later Jenn's mom and 2 aunts showed up, cooked up a storm of Korean dishes, filled our refrigerator to the brim, and then hovered over Jenn watching her eat under pressure. They left as quickly as they came, but I expect they'll be back regularly.
--
Tonight was the Geminid meteor shower...with the family asleep downstairs I snuck up un the roof for a bit to catch the show. I got a lucky break in the clouds and was immediately rewarded with several displays over the rooftops of Brooklyn before the obscuring clouds sent me back downstairs. Good stuff. If you are out tonight or tomorrow you should see clusters of shooting stars a few hours before and after midnight. Bundle up, it's cold out there._24<<
15, 2004
two moods
The one week mark passed uneventfully...
December 17, 2004
quiet days, noisy nights
December 20, 2004
first snow
The first snow of the year just started falling (and is falling hard). All our fireplaces are going. The baby is asleep. Things are good.
December 20, 2004
gallic woodsman
I looked at this picture of the baby on the changing table and realized, "We've become what we hate." We're dressing up the kid in bizarre outfits, just like our parents did to us. Hard to believe the little guy has been on this side of the womb for less than 2 weeks.
Jenn's family is set to descend on our house Christmas day. They will be horrified by our Christmas tree. The older Korean family members are strict artificial tree kind of people. A live tree is considered extravagant, wasteful, perhaps even foolish. Last year I told Jenn's mom I was going to buy a live tree for her house like it or not. The modest tree eventually ended up in grandfather's house. All the aunts came around, took a good look, and concluded that plastic trees were more practical and less messy. This tree was huge they said (it was about 5 feet). They tend to prefer tabletop models. At least their plastic trees are green. My grandparents in Mexico always had a silver tree made of hammered tin. It was lit by a little light in the shape of a fan with a rotating red, green, blue and yellow filter...
It was always hot down in Mexico and we would have to pretend it was cold, wearing sweaters until the sweat made the charade unbearable. My brothers favored Christmas music which they played in agonizing loops not seeming to recognize the dissonance of Johnny Mathis singing about Frosty the Snowman when everyone was in shorts barbecuing carne asada out back. Christmases in Texas were not much better, although at least it was often overcast and rainy (we would turn up the air conditioning and light the fireplace). I always dreamed of Christmases... well, like this. Bracingly cold weather. A nice Vermont pine inside. Warm fire. Perhaps as a consequence of all those Christmases, you will rarely hear me complain about cold weather, and I don't think I've ever said a bad word about snow. I wonder if the boy, who will have "real" winters weaved into his life, will get that small rush when looking out into the night to the sight of snowflakes falling through the pool of a street lamp or if he will grumble about the cold and pass the window without notice.
December 23, 2004
Little giant
At his two week checkup today we found the boy has grown over an inch and is now 11 pounds and a couple of ounces. While the doctors keep reassuring us that his current size will have nothing to do with his eventual height, they always seem to chuckle a bit when telling us the news. Also when we ask how his size compares to other kids the answer is always "off the charts"... and again that chuckle. So our fear has been that we have bred a giant. Anecdotal tales have not been helpful. For example today I was talking to a woman from Minnesota. "All our babies our big up there", she said, "I had an 11 pounder myself... but then again, he's 6 foot 5 now."
December 24, 2004
night out
December 25, 2004
silent night
Just the three of us here on a quiet Christmas Eve. All's well. Merry Christmas everyone.
De.
---.
December 27, 2004
snowy monday
Over an inch fell last night. This morning we wake to the sound of snow shovels all across the neighborhood...
December 28, 2004
a year ago today...
...we had just landed in Rome...
exhausted and disheveled from the long flight, but happy as pie...
De."
December 30, 2004
crying babies
Several of my friends had babies within a month of us... and it seems that right now we are all dealing with a period of newborn development that happens between 2 and 6 weeks called the adaptive stage in which they fuss often, cry loudly, and are hard to put to sleep. The only thing that soothes the child is his mom. So what to do. In our case we have been going through a small library of books and asking friends with older kids for advice. But frustratingly the books (and our friends) have a range of suggestions often contrary to one another. On one end of the spectrum you have those who say that you should stop jumping ever time the baby cries, establish a routine stick to it, and let the baby cry it out; at the other end you have those who say the baby wants what it wants and for now your job is to fulfill those needs as much as possible. Particularly troublesome for us and most of our friends is the child's tendency to snack... ie to have small feeds and fall asleep at the boob only to wake and appear to be hungry 45 minutes later only to have another tiny snack. The snacking seems to leave the baby more gassy than when he has a big spaced out feeds (and of course the gas leads to more crying). This is particularly hard on the wives who barely have a moment for themselves.
These are the general solutions suggested both by friends and in the books:
Method 1: Don't "reward" the baby for crying by running to him each time he gets hysterical. Establish a fairly strict routine of sleep and feeding with at least 3 hours between feeds. Hold and comfort the baby only when he is not crying, and otherwise let him cry it out. Train the baby, don't let him train you.
Method 2: Map your babies habits fairly rigorously and establish a flexible routine based on his needs. Try to space out feedings as much as possible but don't let the boy get to the shrieking level. The baby is probably using the boob for comfort because he is over-stimulated. A good portion of his crying is not because he's hungry, but because he's tired. Try to get him to sleep much more than you are doing by limiting stimuli, putting him in a darkened room with some white noise. Also limit visitors and trips out. Try wrapping him tightly and allowing him to calm down before the crying gets into the crazy phase. Try having him sleep in a bassinet. Also make sure to put him down before he starts fussing and try soothing him to sleep in the crib (as opposed to in your arms rocking and stimulating him). The more he sleeps the less he will cry and more time you will have between feedings.
Method 3. The baby is in the 4th trimester. It's not even really human yet and in survival mode. It's brain is only 20% functional and what you need to do is simulate the womb environment where he is rocked, fed, warm and comfortable all the time. If he wants the boob, give him the boob. If he wants to feed for 10 minutes let him feed for 10 minutes. The child doesn't understand cause and effect yet. Comfort him by simulating the womb with gentle rocking, by swaddling tightly, and by using white noise. Just know that this phase will end in about 6 weeks and then you can start establishing routines.
#1 doesn't work for us. Neither of us has the ability to just let the kid cry. Also from what I understand about newborn development they don't understand causality so any Pavlovian training you might achieve might also leave the kid with a sense that world isn't secure... I understand why this technique might work later but for newborns...well, not for ours.
Method #2 makes the most sense to me, and I do believe newborns are generally overstimulated (all those new nerve endings are firing at once). Jenn tends towards Method #3 and that's generally what we've been doing, but we're being flexible in trying to figure things out. Ultimately #3 does work for us. The baby does calm down when he feeds and does sleep in Jenn's arms. But the burden is all on Jenn. Other than taking the baby out for stroller rides (which put him right to sleep), method 3 is very mom-centric.
In the meantime. I've created this handy chart for tracking sleep/wake/diaper. In the sleep column I just X out the blocks where he's asleep and use a A for agitated. C for crying. Q for quiet. L for Alert. G for hysterical. In the Feed column I draw boobs with numbers in them for the number of minutes on each. You can probably figure out the diaper column on your own. The chart really helps you get a sense of what's going on and where you might be able to tweak things. For example yesterday we realized the baby had gone almost 7 hours without a decent sleep. That's bad news for a newborn.
---
Update on the previous post.
Peter's body was not identified, but might have been one of the ones found and quickly buried on Wednesday (there were few foreigners in Kahawa). Peter's wife Alva is apparently on a flight scheduled for later this week and is staying with friends near Colombo. The house was seriously damaged and later looted. Alva is considering leaving Sri Lanka permanently. I have heard all this 2nd hand, so I can't vouch for the accuracy of the information. The family will probably set up some sort of of charity based fund in Peter's name. I'll admit I've been thinking about this all day...
December 30, 2004
our boy and his good friends washer and dryer
Whatever works right?
De. |
About Rick D: A.N.T.I.'s experiences (and others)
#51
Posted 23 July 2004 - 12:39 AM
#52
Posted 23 July 2004 - 01:00 AM
RLD
Lyrics & Music Writer of the Year 2004/2005
Most Likely To Succeed 2005/2007
Song of the Year 2005/2008/2009
Grissom: "Pupa, stage three." Crime Scene Montage 2
Pop/Rock Tunes
Surf Music
Crystal's Story
#53 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 23 July 2004 - 10:08 AM
Can't resist a wise saying here:
SILENCE IS CONSENT!
Also ANTI - could you ask Rick D to come to the Muse to explain to us too on this thread. It would be good if you could. We have participated in this story therefore we have become involved. The questions concerning his behavior have been public as posted on the Muse forum, so it would be good if he has the public space (HERE THIS THREAD) to put his side of the story/explanation.
#54
Posted 23 July 2004 - 10:41 AM
EDIT: There I go, defending...
#55
Posted 23 July 2004 - 12:16 PM
#56
Posted 23 July 2004 - 02:17 PM
I mean it must have been one hell of an explaination. I am willing to give Rick the benifit of the doubt, however, with the enourmity and extent of all this I just hope Rick understands and appreciates what he has done here. If the stories all through this thread are true, and I have no reason to doubt any of it, it seems the task of putting things straight is HUGE. I for one havent heard anything from any of the guys yet, but then technically, due to our agreement, I ended up not paying monies anyway so maybe I dont qualify for this replenishment, tho I would like to at least hear my songs..lol
Russ, just be real shrude from now on mate, ask for proof of everything, Im sure the guys will understand, after all it would be ludicrous NOT to understand that you want reassurance at every step of the way from now on.
Good Luck Bud
m
#57 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 28 July 2004 - 02:45 PM
I'm starting to think Rick may have been placating and satisfying one of his victims, with a view to keeping the others off his back. Union breaking tactics!
Come out RICK - your audience is waiting.
#58
Posted 02 August 2004 - 03:20 AM
I haven't been able to get back to these boards in a long time, and when I read the posting about Rick my stomach hit the floor. I mentioned to John many months ago, that I knew him. I have never been in the business of bad-mouthing anyone without proof, so I kept my personal dealings and that of my clients to myself.
If you recall there was a posting asking for information on a song shark company in Nashville, and I danced my way around saying "Stay Away" by pointing out that anytime anyone asks you for money in regard to your music, run.
Anyway, several people I represent have stated that they had been ripped off by Rick in the past. However, he is some-what well known, and a small company like myself cannot stay in business by making unfounded allegations.
I want to point out "unfounded", most of the time you will get an oral contract or a very loose open-ended contract which in the end promises you nothing.
I cannot say strongly enough - Get an attorney, preferably an entertainment attorney who will be familliar with most scams, and knows how to read the fine print.
Most importantly you should never pay to have a producer, artist or publisher demo your songs. Further be very careful about contests where you send in lyrics and they send you a contract in which you pay to have music written for your song. Most of the time the music is the same for several hundred people, and they will own 1/2 the copyright on your dime.
I have met Rick at various functions, but I do not know him personally, so I cannot speak to his guilt or innoncence - simply that I have been told by my clients that he ripped them off. My clients came to me shortly after they claim they were ripped off.
In this case the only thing it cost you was your time and hope, but if you ask me that can be more precious than any dollar amount. I'm so sorry to hear about what happened to you.
Sorry to hear about all of this,
Sandra Bonadonna
BOND Music Publishing
#59
Posted 02 August 2004 - 03:34 PM
Quote
Sandra, this confuses me, as I have always understood that some companies provide a demo service, bona fide, that is to say they take your songs and produce a pitchable demo for a fee, are you saying never to use these services either? I mean even the Guild of International Songwriters & Composers offers such services and these are the very kind of groups thats are set up to guide and assist us people. I use/used a production services, are you saying it may be unscrupulous?
Can you give a very brief ( and free, sorry) description of what rights if any a producer has over your work if he/she creates a full production of a song, please? pretty please?
Preciate it
marty
#60
Posted 02 August 2004 - 05:29 PM
I would assume the Sandra was not talking about paying someone to produce a demo. I think she was probably talking about someone who acts as a publisher or producer and promises you big things if you pay them $x. What it comes down to is if you sign some contract that gives the publisher or producer an interest in your work down the road, THEY should be paying for the demos or whatever. I think that is what she was trying to get at. But of course, she can come in and correct me if I misunderstood.
Having a demo studio record a demo for you is fine and maybe necessary. In fact some smaller, yet reputable, publishing companies will insist that you give them a pitchable demo as they can't afford to do demos on everything they pitch. Works out the same in the end (assuming your song makes any money) because the publisher generally recoups the demo cost anyway
#61
Posted 03 August 2004 - 01:35 AM
I only offer a bit of advice, I've heard terrible stories about unscrupulous people taking advantage of creative people. We all want the next big hit, or to become the next big star, and the truth is there is simply no easy road to get there, and if someone tries to sell you the easy road, look twice - better yet let an attorney do the looking for you.
Sandra
#62
Posted 03 August 2004 - 11:53 AM
Quote
Preciate it
Thatll be a NO then? lol
#63
Posted 03 August 2004 - 08:47 PM
Marty g, on Aug 3 2004, 11:53 AM, said:
Quote
Preciate it
Thatll be a NO then? lol
I'm not sure I understand the question, but did you sign any rights over? If you haven't, then you retain all rights to your creative works. Clarify the question a bit, and I will do my best to answer.
Sorry, I only check in here every know and then - I have been very busy lately. I will do my best to answer any questions you have though.
Sandra Bonadonna
#64
Posted 04 August 2004 - 10:10 PM
OK?I told you guys I was going to do a little research. I have found out something. I contacted the manager of an artist that has been working with Rick (Russ knows who she is). I will give you the full text of the response except for changing the names. Russ knows Rick was working with this artist as well, so I think between the two of us we can vouch for the source?
Quote
This is Buck Rodgers, BDBDBD?s dad & Manager. The CD is done and will be released soon. The Web Site is down but will be up & running within 5-7 days. Also, a video will be completed in the months ahead when BDBDBD has time, she will be going to college in the fall. We have had a very good working relationship with Rick and he has put a lot of time & money into BDBDBD's project and has not ask us for any money. We feel he is a man of his word! My daughter co-wrote 5 of the songs on the new album and pick all the songs that will be on the album. Rick is a very talented individual. Sorry you feel the way you do and we do not believe he would screw anyone unless there was a very good reason. His ex-partner was the one who was not handling things right and Rick is no longer associated with him. There are always two sides to a story and before people start judging one another they shound make sure they have all the true facts.
Larry
Now?don?t hate me because I post the results of what I am finding
I also was able to talk to Rick this evening. I won?t get into all the reasons given for what happened, but suffice it to say he took the blame for people not getting what they were promised as it was ultimately his responsibility. He also assured me that he would contact the people who were affected by this and make things right. I will let him hash out the terms of ?making it right? with the individuals, but it sounded fair to me.
I am not a shill for Rick, but I ultimately like to be fair. How about this? There are 4 or 5 people here (including me) who are involved in this. If you are one of these folks and Rick comes through for you, why don?t we post that here in this thread as well? This is kind of a public record and in all fairness, I think we should let people know if amends are made. If they aren?t, then the record will stand.
Whaddaya think?
#65
Posted 04 August 2004 - 10:39 PM
But I would very much like to know if Rick does contact the folks here who think they've been done wrong by.
Ultimately, this whole deal annoys the hell outta me. I feel responsible for promoting someone I thought was legitimate - only to have people dissatisfied. That reflects badly on me and this site, and I don't like it. Not one bit.
If Rick would like to log in and defend himself, this is the thread for it. I'm certainly willing to listen. But I really hope he's planning on making ammends. A.N.T.I. certainly didn't deserve to be treated like that.
--Jodi
Jodi Krangle - Proprietress of The Muse's Muse
Songwriting Resource @
To find out more about the free monthly e-zine:
----------------------------------------------------------------
#66
Posted 05 August 2004 - 03:59 PM
John Scott, on Jul 15 2004, 06:30 PM, said:
It is a possibility that he had done similar things on another songwriting board a couple years back. I am in the process of contacting a few people that I know there to get more information. I will share that here when I get it. Until I get more info, however, I will not discuss any details. However, I will say, it doesn?t smell good so far.
Apparently, Rick is using my name as a reference of some sort. Russ said he mentioned my name to him somewhere in this process and I was contacted by another member here who he had given my name to who, unfortunately, I recommended Rick before the poo hit the fan. I feel terrible about that and have apologized and we have made our peace (he sent money and got nothing back as well).
Ok, so I'm that guy, the one that (I think) contacted John about Rick to begin with, and I can't believe I missed this thread (thanks John for letting me know).
My story sounds pretty much like anyone else's here: he claimed to know such and such person and contacted me asking about a song of mine for a project he was about to produce for a Sony new artist. On that same call he let me know about the demos. After some days of e-mails and working out the details with him and Robert I sent the money. Rick even sent me a rough track of the first of my songs that actually sounded pretty good. In March 20 something he left me a message saying he had got my e-mails but his account was messed up so he couldn't asnwer. That was the last thing I heard form him. I then talked to John about it, as well as other people that had worked with him. Again, no one had nothng bad to say about him.
I also did my research before working with him. Jamie Beaver was the name that convinced me since she's from my wife's hometown, I've seen her CD's on stores, I've seen her perform and know she's the real deal. I thought "if she's worked with Rick, he must be the readl deal too".
For a while I didn't know what to do. On one hand I wanted to come here and let everyone know about it but as far as I knew he coulda been run by a car or get sick or whatever and I didn't want to rant when I didn't know what was going on. Besides, I got the feeling that he was an honest person and that somethng wrogn had happened to him. I guess he fooled us all.
Then I tried to contact him sending him certified letters and stuff like that. When that didn't work I asked a lawyer friend of mine what I can do about it. Rick must be a lucky man because my friend just got a baby so he had to put this thing on hold for a while. That was a couple of weeks ago. Now that I read about Rick wanting to fix this, I'm willing to let it go as long as he sends me my money back. So rick, if you're reading this, you know my address (if you don't, send me an e-mail and I'll give it to you). Send me a nice money order for $550 and I'll forget about it. I don't even care for apoligies or even the demos (it's funny that yesterday I got the demo of the same song I was planning to do with him from some other studio), just send me my money back.
Russ, I'm sorry to hear your heartbreaking story, it must have sucked big time. I hope you get over it soon. I'm also sorry for the other guys. To me it hasn't been that bad, though I get pissed every time I think about the money.
So far he hasn't contacted me and I'll keep you updated if he does. I like to be fair and I'll eventually have a not too bad opinion of him if he gives me my money back.
Juan
#67
Posted 06 August 2004 - 11:12 AM
Now my story is a little different as due to a the mail between here and Canada failing in some way, no money ever changed hands in my case, I sent it to another member here as part payment but it never arrived and the cheque wasnt cashed. Therefore I have lost no money, but I did (apparently) have a demo completed according to Robert P, which he promised to mail me but never did. Now as i didnt pay in the end, I dont expect the demo, but I would like to know what became of it, was it actually completed and if so can it be destroyed, or I would buy it from rick if I was satisfied with the result, cant say fairer than that. Its just the thought of a piece of my work being produced and dissapearing that saddens me.
I want to believe that this is all a big mistake but bits of the stories like Russ's experience with the false calls to/from Sony etc just dont make sense, I cant see how that was a mistake, it still appears as a diliberate intention to decieve to me. I dunno, i want Ricks name put right, the part demo i got for "Couldve Been Right" which was never completed IMO was very good, I loved it so Ricks talent certainly isnt in question here.
So Rick, dont worry about settling things with me, I expect nothing exept info on wether the demos of mine do exist or not, just for peace of mind, my songs are important to me. If you do get in contact, I wont bite sir.
M
#68 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 12:08 PM
#69
Posted 06 August 2004 - 01:20 PM
I get very mad everytime I think about this and all I want is to get my money back and move on. I don't like to be mad.
Juan
#70 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 01:24 PM
#71
Posted 06 August 2004 - 02:36 PM
First, thank you Marty for your trust. That means an enormous amount to me. I have put myself in a bit of a precarious position here, I think, in my quest for the truth. Let me just clarify my position based on your comments above.
I would not say I am convinced. I am however seeing a great dichotomy between views. I have talked to people who have only good things to say about Rick. I have talked to others who have had problems. Most of the stories I cannot independently verify. I am relying on someone?s word. There are some things I DO know. Here is the only ?Fact? I possess?
1. There is no doubt there were problems here at Muse?s Muse. I pretty much know who & how much.
That's it for facts...It gets a tad confusing for this simple mind
I mentioned this to Jodi too. I will be honest. I WANT Rick to come through. I?m pulling for him. As I have mentioned in the past, I started to consider him a friend as we started to work more together some months ago. I don?t want someone who I consider a friend to be dragged down (by their own doing or someone else?s). I also would like them to be honorable and reflect well on me (as I want to reflect well on my friends and family). I think Rick knows from our phone conversation that I don?t like what happened here. According to him, he doesn?t either and he wants to make it right. This will be easy enough to verify in the end. I am pulling for him, but not blindly.
#72
Posted 06 August 2004 - 02:42 PM
I am also a victim to Rick's "fiasco". I also sent money for his services and never got a complete product. I only got little rough workings on it.
At this point, I don't expect my money back and I really don't know what to believe about Rick. I agree with John, he may have people who recommend him, but he hurt people here on the Muse. And people who were affected, now have a negative view on him, including me. Even if he does pull through and deliver the demo's he promised, how do I know that he's not just doing it to regain confidence from people in order to scam more people later?
I will definetely post here if Rick contacts me and will keep you all informed.
#73
Posted 06 August 2004 - 02:57 PM
As far as I know, you weren't directly involved in this. Why you throw chip?
As far as I know, no one is in a financial mess over this. Juan is by far the one who has the most money at risk at least as far as I know. If I am wrong, someone please correct me. Marty and Russ are not out any money by their own statements. Other than Juan, that leaves myself and one other individual who has not chimed in out any cash and my understaning is that together we are not out as much as Juan. The biggest problem I see, so far, is that Russ had his hopes built up and they were dashed. That is a big deal. Perhaps Russ is in the hole for some travel or something? That's possible. I don't know that.
You assume very much as fact in your post which I would not be comfortable calling fact.
Juan should take care of his business as he sees fit, as should Russ, as should Marty, as should I, as should others directly involved. Can't we just let it go at that for now? I'm not sure what your agenda is with this since you were not involved and to my knowledge, know even less about the situation than I do. We will know soon enough if things were handled fairly from the very mouths of those who were involved. Let them decide what fair is.
Isn't that, ultimately, fair & factual?
This is going to be my last post on this matter (other than presenting other facts that come to light as this plays out). I am not Rick's defense attorney, nor do I want to be. If he doesn't live up to his promises, I will report that. If he does, I will report that as well. Let's just see where this ride takes us in the end. Shall we?
#74
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:01 PM
it just keeps getting worse...how many more are out there?
How anyone would consider working with him after this is beyond me.
Hope you guys get your money back, but I doubt it will happen...
RLD
Lyrics & Music Writer of the Year 2004/2005
Most Likely To Succeed 2005/2007
Song of the Year 2005/2008/2009
Grissom: "Pupa, stage three." Crime Scene Montage 2
Pop/Rock Tunes
Surf Music
Crystal's Story
#75 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:21 PM.
And PS John - knowledge is power - if people helped each other out and shared information instead of isolating themselves in some false individualism then this sort of RD problem would be nipped in the bud.
#76
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:29 PM
#77
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:35 PM
Please don't take things to places this issue doesn't need to go. And please, don't tell people how they have to feel about this ("I feel you are being far too forgiving Juan. Your $550 dollars may be no big deal to you and the messing about hasn't broken your heart, but what about all the people who have ended up in a financial mess and are depressed by what he's done").
Juan
PS- I'm not democrat nor republican, just in case you wonder
#78
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:41 PM
Lyrics & Music Writer of the Year 2004/2005
Most Likely To Succeed 2005/2007
Song of the Year 2005/2008/2009
Grissom: "Pupa, stage three." Crime Scene Montage 2
Pop/Rock Tunes
Surf Music
Crystal's Story
#79 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:44 PM
Re John telling me I had nothing to do with it. If someone takes a shot at me I feel free to answer back just as boldly!
#80
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:45 PM
landofsong, on Aug 6 2004, 03:21 PM, said:.
Fact is, I was on this with Russ before (or at least simultaneously) you encouraged him to come out with it. Fact is, I did a fair amount of research before Russ made his post. Fact is, I'm doing a lot of leg work to get as close to the bottom of this as I possibly can. Fact is, I am taking it on myself to try to get the folks here at Muse's Muse what they were promised. In other words, it would have come out anyway.
You are going around making assumptions & telling people how they ought to deal with a situation without being directly involved. Why not let them decide what they need. Why not let this play out and see what happens. What do you want Juan and everyone else to do? Shall we march up and lynch him?
And yes...I dare to say it...it's an open board after all.
Unionization...what a crock...it just sounds to me like you like to stir the pot.
Now pull your undies out of that bunch they just got in and have a nice remainder of the day.
(If you can't tell, I'm having a bit of fun with you. I found your post quite humorous).
John (Dr. Death) Scott
#81
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:46 PM
#82 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:50 PM
As to you reporting Rick, John. Who to? The fair trading people? The business malpractice people? By the time they get round to sifting through the story a lot more people could have a lot more problems with this guy.
#83 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 06 August 2004 - 03:57 PM
And then there is the Musicians Union. They have a body of knowledge to draw on. Equity, Writers Guild etc.
#84
Posted 06 August 2004 - 04:25 PM
RLD, on Aug 6 2004, 03:41 PM, said:
Roger,
I realize that I have put myself in a precarious position. What I mean by not living up to his promise is the "making it right" process here at the Muse. I do understand he has not lived up to his obligation previously. I lost contact with Rick about the same time everyone else did until two nights ago. I asked someone else he has been working with (from my research) to ask him to give me a call and he did. So at this point I am not working with him other than this current process we are all going through.
I am under no delusions here. Yes, I would like to see him make amends, both for his sake and the sake of the people who have been wronged. I also have not recommended that anyone work with him and understand how people here (including myself) have doubts about how this will end up. I just think we have a pretty good vehicle to judge if he does right for this community in the end by the results of this little excercise to see if he comes through. That doesn't mean people still shouldn't be wary after all that has happened. They should and that is understandable.
The damage has already been done in this community. I'm sure he will get no more demo work from the Muse's Muse. The real question is will he at least try to do the right thing in the end. Perhaps you are right. Perhaps he is only doing this because it got brought up in a public forum. Maybe not. I guess I don't know the answer to that question. But making it right and aplogizing to those harmed at least points things back in the right direction.
I have no business dealings or financial ties to Rick (other than a song that ended up being a co-write). The only thing that will really be hurt substantially here, for me personally, in the end, are my feelings if he doesn't come through. I am looking at myself as a mostly independent participant in this mess that is rooting for him to do the right thing. I was forthcoming early on about how I viewed Rick before all this happened to be fair to you guys. I am not naive or blind though. The chips will fall where they will fall and we can all go on from there.
Yes, I am probably slightly biased. I also am hurt that all this happened. I want to see what is right be done in end. No matter what the result ends up being. Just trying to be as fair as I can to all involved.
Did that help at all Roger? It does matter to me what you and other Muse's think of me. I value my reputation and do not want it besmearched.
I will keep you all posted on any info I get as I get it.
#85
Posted 06 August 2004 - 04:28 PM
landofsong, on Aug 6 2004, 03:50 PM, said:
As to you reporting Rick, John. Who to? The fair trading people? The business malpractice people? By the time they get round to sifting through the story a lot more people could have a lot more problems with this guy.
No, it would have come out right here. I wast communicating with Russ and some other folks when this story "broke". I was just trying to get some evidence (circumstantial as it may be) behind me before I made a comment.
#86
Posted 06 August 2004 - 04:33 PM
I hope everyone gets their wrongs righted. :)
#87
Posted 06 August 2004 - 04:34 PM
Juan_M, on Aug 6 2004, 03:29 PM, said:
Hi Juan,
I got your message last night. Chances are you have the same phone number as I do. If you want to PM me or email me I will confirm that for you. I also had trouble getting a hold of him at that number for a long time. But he was there the other night. If that's not the one, I will certainly ask him if it's OK if I give it to you. I don't think it's appropriate to give out someone's # without permission. I wouldn't give out yours or anyone elses and I expect others wouldn't give out mine either. However, if you already have it anyway...
#88
Posted 06 August 2004 - 04:40 PM
FunkDaddy, on Aug 6 2004, 04:33 PM, said:
I hope everyone gets their wrongs righted.
Maybe so. Like I said, the damage has already been done here.
If I keep this up, I'll be up to 1000 posts in no time!!!
#89
Posted 06 August 2004 - 05:40 PM
Quote
Some might say you bought an illegal copy...
you can't copy software and sell it to people...that's illegal...
This just gets better and better...
RLD
Lyrics & Music Writer of the Year 2004/2005
Most Likely To Succeed 2005/2007
Song of the Year 2005/2008/2009
Grissom: "Pupa, stage three." Crime Scene Montage 2
Pop/Rock Tunes
Surf Music
Crystal's Story
#90
Posted 07 August 2004 - 02:50.
#91
Posted 07 August 2004 - 03:52 AM
M
#92
Posted 07 August 2004 - 03:59 AM
Helicon1, on Aug 7 2004, 02:50 AM,.
Was going to say the same thing lol. Mystery post. :)
#93
Posted 07 August 2004 - 05:32 AM
Marty
#94 Guest_landofsong_*
Posted 07 August 2004 - 07:04 AM
John Scott you owe me an apology. It is completely out of order to bring my knickers into such a serious conversation.
#95
Posted 07 August 2004 - 07:52 AM
Please stop, guys.
Discuss what this thread is about and leave it at that. Agree to disagree.
Thank you.
--Jodi
Jodi Krangle - Proprietress of The Muse's Muse
Songwriting Resource @
To find out more about the free monthly e-zine:
----------------------------------------------------------------
#96
Posted 07 August 2004 - 09:23 AM
the person is obviously embarrassed that they paid $150 for an illegal copy of Cakewalk software,
So the post was deleted...
the plot thickens...
RLD
Lyrics & Music Writer of the Year 2004/2005
Most Likely To Succeed 2005/2007
Song of the Year 2005/2008/2009
Grissom: "Pupa, stage three." Crime Scene Montage 2
Pop/Rock Tunes
Surf Music
Crystal's Story
#97
Posted 07 August 2004 - 01:51 PM
To me the most important thing is that he told me that next week he would send me my money and that he would do the 3 songs we agreed for free. I told him he didn't really need to but he insisted so I guess he'll end up doing something for me anyway.
As I said, to me the important thing is he sends me the money and it seems like he is going to do that. Besides, I have to admit it must've been hard to pick up the phone and call everybody so I guess I'll give the guy a second chance.
Juan
#98
Posted 07 August 2004 - 02:44 PM
#99
Posted 07 August 2004 - 05:40 PM
He's always sent me an e-mail with some more explanations about the issue. I think he's trying hard to fix things and it looks like the guy could use another chance.
Juan
#100
Posted 07 August 2004 - 05:42 PM |
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands 2 Challenges and Opportunities Although data management is often viewed as the least glamorous aspect of science, access to well-managed data is critical to the work of many environmental researchers, as well as to an expanding pool of commercial and nontechnical users (NRC, 2001). This chapter reviews technological approaches for data management and storage that could improve the ability of users to search, query, subset, and access data. Consideration and implementation of these approaches have already begun at some data centers but are not yet pervasive. The committee based this chapter on the working group reports presented at the workshop (Appendix D), subsequent discussions, and background information provided to the committee. The committee’s expertise and deliberations form the basis of the conclusions and recommendations. CHALLENGES IN DATA AVAILABILITY AND ACCESS Data ingest into the major data centers appears to be well planned and well executed. The process of acquiring environmental data for research or commercial use, however, continues to be difficult. Users must first seek out the data they need, which can be time consuming and difficult because there is no comprehensive list of or universal access point to all government data holdings. Although multiple means exist to find data, the chance of missing key datasets is high. In addition,
OCR for page 16
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands knowing specifically what to ask for in a data search is not straightforward when query terms and procedures vary from center to center. For users who are less knowledgeable about the datasets they want, searches frequently require help from the centers’ customer service representatives. However, NOAA’s report to Congress, The Nation’s Environmental Data: Treasures at Risk, notes that, although requests for NOAA’s data increased from about 95,000 in 1979 to over 4 million in 1999, staffing levels decreased from 582 to 321 (NOAA, 2001). Another challenge for data centers is to deliver only the data that the user needs and requests, neither more nor less. Subsetting is the process of extracting portions of data, such as time slices or spatially defined sections. Subsetting is especially important in large datasets, such as those generated by remote sensing. However, despite consistent user demand, there continues to be a dearth of subsetting tools. Scientific products from the data are also available, but their coverage and diversity are sparse. Once users have found what they need, they face the challenge of obtaining the data, which can require complex skills. Although frequent users typically become adept at manipulating the infrastructure, access and retrieval methods differ from center to center, so even skilled users may be familiar with only one center’s approach. Inexperienced users and investigators using many different data sources require a substantial investment of time to acquire data. Almost without exception, data centers offer multiple methods of retrieving data in their holdings (e.g., file transfer protocol (FTP), which permits users to copy files stored on data center computers, and media order, in which centers copy the data of interest onto compact disk or tape). This provides flexibility but complicates the retrieval process. Even with the appropriate query term, knowledge of the best access methods, and available subsetting tools, access to data still depends upon the ability of the centers to store data on media that can be retrieved and manipulated easily. Data centers rely too heavily on off-line or near-line (e.g., tape robots) storage. The consequences of this are that retrieval can be slow and that searching and subsetting can be difficult. For interdisciplinary users, the real challenge arises with integrating disparate datasets, usually obtained from different data centers. Data interoperability remains difficult because standards, formats, and metadata were chosen to optimize the usefulness of a particular dataset, rather than a collection of diverse data. The growth of on-line distributed data archives has prompted many environmental research programs to address their own interoperability needs through data formats and metadata conventions (e.g., Federal Geographic Data Committee, 1998).
OCR for page 17
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands However, data exchange between even the most advanced of these communities remains complex and unwieldy. As more precise means of measuring and monitoring are developed, the number and volume of the resulting data products increase, and the management of metadata, or data about data, becomes increasingly important (Sidebar 2.1). Proper metadata management is essential for government data centers to achieve their missions. Metadata must be stored, queried, communicated, and maintained just like the data they describe. Increasingly, metadata will be a key enabling element for use by communities (e.g., interdisciplinary and nontechnical user groups) that did not originally collect the data. SIDEBAR 2.1 Metadata Metadata describe data and data products, allowing users to find, understand, process, and reuse data and data products. Although metadata can require increased storage capacities, they are essential for establishing confidence in the data products by providing information about the history, or lineage, of the data. Metadata in government data centers should include the following types of information: data formats (how information is stored within data files); data describing how, when, and where raw data were collected; descriptions of how raw data were normalized, calibrated, validated, integrated, cleaned, checked for errors, and processed; statistics of value distributions, etc., needed for efficient database storage and access of data; descriptions of data use, such as how frequently a dataset is used, whether it is subsetted, etc.; and data specifically designed to enhance use by interdisciplinary scientists and/or nontechnical users. In the following sections, the committee describes some steps that would improve data availability and access, including improved application of standard translatable formats;
OCR for page 18
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands greater on-line data storage and network access; more sophisticated database technologies; expanded metadata management and lineage tracking; and greater reliance on easily available, nonspecialized hardware and software solutions. STANDARD TRANSLATABLE FORMATS Typically, standards for data and metadata management are created by the individuals and organizations collecting the data; community organizations such as professional societies, data centers, and sponsoring government agencies; and international organizations. Formats evolve over time, with new formats introduced and others abandoned as community preferences emerge. This constant evolution results in a bewildering array of standards. Although it is not possible to create a single standard that meets the needs of every dataset and user group, greater uniformity and transparency would make it easier for users to query, search, subset, access, and integrate data. Formats that can incorporate metadata provide added benefits. Until the early 1990s, data from remote-sensing instruments were stored primarily in binary data files, each unique to a particular sensor. Because of the lack of alternatives and the efficiency of sequential binary data storage, the data had to be stored in files on disk or tape. Metadata, if stored at all, were placed in an accompanying text file. However, in the past decade, computer scientists have devised many self-describing formats for storage of scientific data. These data formats maintain efficient binary storage but allow nonexperts to understand the layout of the data. Two popular formats currently used are netCDF and HDF (network common data form and hierarchical data format, respectively); a version of the latter is a standard used by NASA’s Earth Observing System Data and Information System (EOSDIS). In essence, self-describing scientific data formats provide some level of metadata encapsulation with the data. Databases are intimately tied to metadata as a means of allowing users to search for data products of interest. Most databases are constructed specifically for their applications; custom software is written to extract metadata from multiple sources, including data files, into these databases. As an example, the database behind EOSDIS was fashioned over many years, with new datasets processed and specific metadata entered using custom software. This process is complicated and time consuming, but it leads to providing a mechanism for searching remotely
OCR for page 19
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands sensed data. Moving toward standardized data and metadata formats would simplify the search process. The next step is to generate databases automatically from the metadata. It is possible to use XML Schema to generate database tables automatically from the structure and content of the metadata, as well as to create Web-based forms for database queries. Such query interfaces allow users to formulate restrictions on the data of interest, which are then translated into selection conditions in a query language, such as SQL or XQUERY. This does not relieve sensor operators from generating appropriate metadata for their data, but it eases the search through databases. Recommendation: With their user communities, data centers should accelerate work toward standardizing and making formats more transparent for data and metadata and thereby improve distribution and interoperability between data centers, between data centers and users, and between users. Metadata formatted in XML would assure that recipients would be able to parse data automatically and feed them directly to their applications. NETWORK AND ON-LINE RANDOM ACCESS Providing network file system access would ease obtaining and distributing data. Such a network would allow datasets to be used without the current formal process of copying the data across a network or sending the data physically by tape. The data become available immediately to as many users as want them. This approach can increase distribution efficiency when subsetting tools are also made available: users can treat datasets as local files and use subsetting tools to extract only the portions they need or only a transformation of the data, reducing the network bandwidth needed for the acquisition. Furthermore, once the data have been distributed, authenticity can still be guaranteed by digital signatures supplied by the national data centers. Protocols to compress and expand data automatically when they are transmitted would assist with effective network use. Network bandwidth1 is already widely available for retrieval of large volumes of data. However, the dependence on network bandwidth as a solution to the data delivery problem requires the implementation of 1 Network bandwidth—capacity to move large data files electronically.
OCR for page 20
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands suitable database management and subsetting tools at the data centers. Few users will want gigabyte-sized datasets. In addition, network-based solutions rely extensively on the ability to access data randomly. The off-line and near on-line storage techniques (e.g., tape robots) used by many data centers can hinder these solutions. The transfer rates of modern tape systems are on the order of a few megabytes per second; common network transfer rates are 100 times faster. While disk storage capacities continue to increase dramatically, tape capacities and transfer speeds have barely increased during the past five years. In addition, without random access to on-line data, subsetting through a network is unworkable, as users cannot capture slices of the linearly stored datasets. Data that are kept off-line or near on-line cannot be used in database systems. Even databases that direct users to off-line data products must create well-defined delivery timelines. Tape systems at data centers can time-out on user requests, thus requiring a technician to process orders manually. In 1994 computing experts forecasted that disk storage would become cheap and efficient enough to eliminate the need for off-line storage (Davis et al., 1994). However, in some cases this transition to disk will require that software for data ingest, data processing, and data access be rewritten. As a result, data centers keep most data off-line, thereby reducing the ability of users to search through and retrieve data rapidly. Data centers are moving toward increasing the availability of on-line data; however, only 3 terabytes of NOAA’s 76-terabyte digital data archive are on-line (NOAA, 2001), despite the fact that disks to accommodate this amount of data would cost about $100,000 at current prices. Over the past decade, disk storage and access have had a greater increase in performance for a given price than any other part of the computing industry, and other technologies for dense storage of information are the subject of much research activity in both industry and academia. Price per unit storage has decreased during the past 10 years. Satellite missions of the next decade will generate about 1 petabyte of information per year. As recently as 1995, NASA estimated that today’s cost to store a petabyte off-line would approach $100 million, but it is now possible to obtain 1 petabyte of disks for on-line storage for less than $2 million, a very small fraction of the cost of the missions that generate the raw information. Disk storage is now competitive with tape for long-term, archival-class storage. Recommendation: Data centers and their sponsoring agencies should shift the primary storage medium from tape to disk. In addition,
OCR for page 21
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands data centers and their sponsoring agencies should enable direct random on-line access through networks and provide support for remote queries on databases. DATABASE TECHNOLOGIES Files are a reasonable way to organize data when the physical storage medium is tape; however, disk storage permits data to be organized in much more flexible databases. Database techniques structure sets of parameters for the application of efficient processing algorithms. Traditionally, a database is composed of a number of interrelated tables containing sets of parameters such as number or text strings. The power of database techniques lies in the ability to relate parameters from one dataset to another, thereby reducing the processing and storage requirements. For example, using a numeric parameter, such as a zip code, to refer to a name, such as a city, makes it easier to store and search the information. Complex databases can have many layers of such associations. In the early 1990s, the Structured Query Language (SQL) was formalized and is used by most database software. The language provides a standard for the following: defining data structures; defining indices; formulating content-based queries; and maintaining data through inserts, deletes, and updates. Most database software (e.g., Oracle, MySQL, SQL Server) uses SQL as a core language for database interaction. Each has a unique method of optimizing the storage of data on disk or in memory. Capabilities for formulating spatial and temporal database queries are part of the most recent database query languages (e.g., SQL3), and support for indexing data on its spatial and temporal attributes enables efficient query execution. The complexity of the SQL query relates directly to the complexity of the database. Contemporary database technology permits random access to subsets of data stored on disk. In addition, object-relational databases are now capable of handling large, structured data, such as aerial photographs of the entire United States. For example, since its launch in June of 1998, TerraServer has delivered 108 terabytes of U.S. Geological Survey imagery to 63 million visitors (T. Barclay, Microsoft, personal
OCR for page 22
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands communication, 2002). Concurrent requests from multiple users to read data can be supported efficiently without the waiting time typically incurred when many applications are writing to a database simultaneously. However, since database tables are constantly being accessed, they must be stored on-line rather than on tape. Although databases are commonly used by data centers for metadata management, they are not in widespread use for environmental data. However, application of database technology to environmental data is possible and may be useful for some environmental datasets. For example, Sky Server utilizes database technology to provide public access to Sloan Digital Sky Survey data (Szalay et al., 2001). Recommendation: Data centers and their sponsoring agencies should implement database technologies. When applicable, these technologies can improve data search and query, access and acquisition, interoperability, and retrieval from storage. METADATA MANAGEMENT Data centers have spent considerable effort preserving metadata by routinely documenting information on data lineage, such as the source data, transformation processes, and quality assurance information of their datasets. Open access to summaries of the dataset assembly processes and lineage has contributed significantly to ensuring user confidence in data product quality. For example, in most cases, users interested in data from a particular center can find information on the available data on the center’s Web site. In the past it was sufficient for data producers simply to develop good local data conventions and exercise the discipline necessary to generate the data and metadata in accordance to those conventions. However, the lack of a definitive universal system for lineage metadata can result in incomplete or missing data lineage information. In most cases, it is not possible to re-create data assembly information after the fact; in others it is costly and prone to error. Formatting data and creating metadata robust enough to be discovered and ingested by the emerging national and international data interchange networks would ensure that the data are as useful as possible, especially to other user communities. The practice of retaining complete data lineage information as metadata should be incorporated into the large volumes of scientific data being produced today. This will only be effective if accomplished with the participation and acceptance by the user communities.
OCR for page 23
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands Authenticity is another important aspect of data archival. Users often obtain data from the easiest source, some of which may be three or four steps removed from the data centers. At each step, the data may have been processed or reformatted to suit one user’s particular purposes. Through neglect or, less likely, malicious intent, data products may become contaminated or altered, endangering their value and use. Consequently, information on authenticity should be included in the metadata. A related issue, specific to the research community rather than to data centers, involves citing data products in the peer-reviewed literature. The scientific practice of citing past research and methods, necessary for independent verification, has been neglected when citing data supporting an investigation’s findings. While this has been discussed for more than 10 years, the various publishing groups have not reached consensus on an accepted universal method for citing data products, their origin, or the processing that has been applied to them or on how to deal with the inherent challenges (e.g., numerous investigators for very large datasets). Most centers and even some scientific journals (e.g., American Geophysical Union journals) have a preferred mode of citation, but dataset citation remains uncommon. Dataset citation helps both data centers and data providers learn what data are being used and how. Routine documentation of the original data sources and the subsequent transformation and fusion steps used to develop a processed dataset would be most efficiently carried out by automated tools. Many practices in the software engineering field, such as testing, configuration management, and bug tracking, matured only after automated tools were developed to handle the complicated bookkeeping in a systematic manner. Moreover, the generation of structured lineage metadata suitable for ingest into other software presumes the existence of automated documentation tools. However, neither such tools nor recognized semantics to describe data lineage currently exist. Fortunately, database technology and standard formats can be as useful for metadata management as they are for data management. The self-describing approach adopted in the definition of extensible languages such as XML Schema is an important step in realizing technologies to support metadata management in government data centers. This self-describing approach would allow tools developed for data management to be applied to metadata. The data centers have worked to document data lineage, both by compliance with rich metadata standards (e.g., U.S. Geological Survey, 1995) and by the use of automated metadata tools such as the Science Data Production (SDP) toolkit (National Aeronautics and Space
OCR for page 24
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands Administration, 2002b), both of which encourage detailed lineage information. However, a large body of scientific data generated outside of the data centers still lack sufficient metadata information to establish the data’s lineage and context. Examples of this are the Cooperative Ocean/Atmosphere Research Data Service (COARDS) and the recent climate and forecast metadata conventions, which use only a single broad “history” attribute to document the dataset’s lineage. Recommendation: To ensure that the greatest use is made of environmental data, (1) data producers should include data lineage and authenticity information in the metadata; (2) data centers should improve management of and access to metadata through standard formats and database technologies; and (3) users should routinely cite the data products they use in their investigations, using agreed upon dataset identifiers. To the greatest extent possible, data centers and data producers should rely on automatic tools for creating and managing metadata. HARDWARE AND SOFTWARE Because development and support costs for widely used products are lower, more and more data solutions are likely to be adapted from market-driven and market-proven technologies in an environment of constrained resources. The on-line database, entertainment, and gaming communities are all driving advances in large-scale data management, delivery, and visualization. Many researchers have learned how to construct plain-language database queries using Web search engines (e.g., Google). The data centers should be prepared to embark on collaborations with industry to apply such proven technologies and thereby reduce expensive custom development. The problems of managing large datasets have begun to receive the attention of the commercial sector, with the result that innovative, easy-to-use methods and tools for data search, retrieval, and analysis are widespread. For example, Google manages billions of individual records, yet searches return nearly instantaneously; digiMine, Inc. processes nearly a terabyte of data nightly (B. Nayfeh, digiMine, Inc., personal communication, 2002); and together America Online and Microsoft’s Hotmail handle the email accounts of more than 150 million people (Caslon Analytics, 2002). The challenges facing the data centers are small compared to the load experienced by any of the above enterprises.
OCR for page 25
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands Large computational problems can be solved in small pieces by harnessing the power of desktop computing. For example, SETI@home and climateprediction.net use the processing power of millions of desktop computers to solve computationally intensive problems. The Center of Excellence in Space Data and Information Sciences (CESDIS) has constructed computing farms (commonly referred to as Beowulf clusters) to handle and process large datasets (Scyld Computing Company, 1998). Commodity hardware can also be used for data ingest, storage, and distribution. These computers generally have far smaller capabilities than the scientific computing hardware currently in the data centers. To be useful for scientific applications, the data segments, or granules, have to be broken into smaller units that can be ingested, processed, stored, and served with larger numbers of small processors. Current proprietary operating systems, such as SGi or Sun, to open-source platforms, such as Linux or FreeBSD Commodity solutions, could ease recompiling software on new computing architectures. In addition, the open-source movement2 has created the potential for data centers to meet future needs without enormous resource expenditures. Unrelated open-source projects (e.g., the Gnutella project, the XML standard) provide software tools at no cost that in some cases are better than unique proprietary solutions. Forms of authentication and lineage tracking common in the open-source communities should be adopted for improving metadata management. For example, one common practice in the open-source community is to publish an MD5—message-digest algorithm 5—listing the 32-character signature of the files with any piece of software or data that is distributed. The authoritative source publishes the digest, so that users can check the authenticity of their copies, regardless of where they got them. In summary, the commercial sector and the open-source movements have created robust software that meets many needs of the data centers. Usage and adaptation of these codes minimizes the need for expensive custom development. Since each is generally funded by a single agency and deals with a relatively narrow range of scientific disciplines (Table 1.1), data centers tend to be managed as centralized organizations. However, a federation of distributed systems, in which data centers remain the sources of 2 Open-source movement—software with its source code made available without any restrictions.
OCR for page 26
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands authenticated environmental science data but not the only sources capable of distributing data, could help reduce infrastructure and management costs (NRC, 1995). Widely distributed data sources and grid infrastructures reduce resource contention at the data centers and provide a natural backup of earth science data. For example, Napster provided a global directory of on-line music. Users searching for particular music were redirected to numerous locations where search matches were encountered. Users then chose (based on bandwidth availability between their computers and the source, the authenticity of the source, and the exact characteristics of the music being searched for) where to download the music. The process is more complex for environmental science data than it was for Napster. In the environmental science community, the analogy would be to identify (by whatever means) a desired dataset and then request the dataset by name (not parameters) from a Napster analog. This approach would formalize current user practices of obtaining data from colleagues and data projects instead of from data centers. It would strengthen the data centers’ partnership with science by increasing the incidence of development of scientifically sound, useful products, reduce data transmission needs, and improve effectiveness and efficiency of the whole system. Multiple copies of products would be available from various sources; the data centers would become authenticators of data and the final archive and would implement production of new scientific products once a design is in hand; and users would have multiple options for retrieving data. Three current projects are attempting to implement this: MODster, NEpster, and the Distributed Oceanographic Data System (Sidebar 2.2). Recommendation: Data centers should adopt commodity hardware and commercial and open-source software solutions to the widest extent possible and concentrate their own efforts on problems that are unique to environmental data management. In addition, data centers and user communities should take advantage of federated distributed systems for making data available. IMPLEMENTATION On the one hand, new “bleeding edge” technical approaches offer ways to reduce costs and significantly improve data center performance. However, it is important to recognize that some new technical approaches may not prove successful and that even those that are
OCR for page 27
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands successful may cause disruptions to center operations when implemented. Therefore, the data centers need to be able to test, prioritize, and develop the most promising new approaches at a smaller scale. SIDEBAR 2.2 Distributed Solutions Several ongoing environmental science projects are already be-nefiting from easily available nonspecialized solutions. Selected examples are described below. MODster Moderate Resolution Imaging Spectroradiometer (MODIS) provides global datasets with data on surface temperature, concentration of chlorophyll, fire occurrence, cloud cover, and others. Instruments on-board several NASA missions gather datasets covering a swath 2,330 kilometers wide, capturing 36 spectral bands of data at three resolution levels every two days for six-year periods. Due to their number and complexity, searching for a specific dataset is not a trivial task. To combat this, the Federation of Earth Science Information Partners is supporting the development of MODster to support the decentralization and distribution of MODIS data and services and to promote sharing of remote-sensing standard products. Organizations within the federation can retrieve standard MODIS data granules (the smallest increment of processed MODIS data that can be ordered, containing data for an area of 2,330 by 2,330 kilometers). The retrieval of these granules will be implemented by the Hypertext Transfer Protocol (HTTP) from a simple inventory server. The system will allow clients to reference MODIS granules by name alone. SOURCES: National Aeronautics and Space Administration (2002c); Federation of Earth Science Information Partners (2002). NEpster The Earth Science Technology Office (ESTO) and the National Polar-Orbiting Operational Environmental Satellite System (NPOESS) Preparatory Project (NPP) support the development of the NPP-ESTO Portal for Science, Technology and Environmental Research (Nepster) to serve the remote-sensing community better. The peer-to-peer architecture of the data archive system is based on the
OCR for page 28
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands Napster model, a system developed for sharing music files. In NEpster, several additional features have been added to facilitate the handling of remotely sensed data, specifically (1) a temporary data storage area for sites that do not allow continual access to their servers; (2) an intelligent broker that controls data access in accordance with the distribution policies of each data source; and (3) a comprehensive geographically based query interface to expedite data searches. The NEpster system is made up of two major components: the data notification and entry subsystem, and the query engine. The first phase of NEpster development will focus on accessing and managing real-time data, and the second phase will focus on access to the MODIS Direct Broadcast data archives through the Goddard Space Flight Center DAAC. SOURCE: National Aeronautics and Space Administration (2002d). DODS The Distributed Oceanographic Data System (DODS) is a highly distributed software framework for requesting and transporting data across the Internet, which allows users to control both how their data are distributed and how they can access remote data. As data users prefer to work with software with which they are most familiar, DODS servers make data available regardless of local storage formats. In addition, DODS applications allow users to transform existing data analysis and visualization applications into those able to access remote DODS data. Because DODS data are distributed by the same scientists who develop the data, the DODS protocol and software rely on the user community to use, improve, and extend the system. The current DODS Data Access Protocol (DAP) frames requests and responses using hypertext transfer protocol (HTTP). This data model has already developed a transport protocol, software framework, C++ and Java implementations of the data model and transport protocol, and a set of DODS servers and clients. Users are allowed to access any data on a DODS server via the Internet regardless of native format, without disrupting local functions and access. Although DODS was originally developed for sharing oceanographic data, the design can be applied to other user communities. SOURCE: University Consortium for Atmospheric Research (2002). One way to accomplish this is to create independent demonstration data centers, each of which would build small functional prototypes with
OCR for page 29
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands small efficient teams that would distribute data from a few substantial datasets that are well documented (such as those from NASA and NOAA). This would be similar to the smaller-scale Sky Server project (Szalay et al., 2001). The costs of implementing demonstration data centers can be minimized by building on work that is already in progress (e.g., Sidebar 2.2). Finally, the demonstration centers would also help the data centers and communities adapt to serving and interacting with a wider range of users. One possible choice for testing new technologies is Moderate Resolution Imaging Spectroradiometer (MODIS) data. In this example the goals of the demonstration data center could include the following: Define an XML Schema with the standard format definitions for the datasets. Show how the standard format definitions can be used to formulate queries on the data collection. Allow multiple avenues of network access to data already available. Specifically, provide real-time access to all data. Example access protocols include: FTP browse via a hierarchical tree (sorted by data/time and location). Network File System (NFS) access via read-only network drives. Implementation similar to NEpster/MODster (Sidebar 2.2), where multiple sites maintain subsets of the entire MODIS dataset. The participating data center could solicit participation of the MODIS science team and the other sites that have MODIS downlink systems, which have some (if not all) of the data. This might entail acquiring read-only access to datasets at non-data-center locations. The goal would be to leverage the work of researchers seeking to make science data community property. FTP subscription service, if it is not already provided. Enhance and publish XML-based metadata related to the datasets. This entails adding certain metadata to that already captured by EOSDIS, such as an MD5 signature for authentication. The metadata schema describing the layout of the demonstration data center and a method of providing direct SQL access of the database to users should also be published. The enhanced metadata will allow varied researchers the opportunity to explore the dataset in innovative ways. Utilize database technologies for user queries and searches. Identify and provide limited subsetting tools that run on the host computers. At a minimum, allow users to subset simple spatial grids and temporal intervals. Users would not need direct access to the data storage
OCR for page 30
Government Data Centers: Meeting Increasing Demands computers;.
Representative terms from entire chapter:
metadata management |
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report 3 The Impact of Hubble: Past and Future OVERVIEW The Hubble Space Telescope (HST) is arguably the most powerful single optical astronomical facility ever built. Hubble provides wavelength coverage and capabilities that are unmatched by any other optical telescope currently operating or planned, and there is nothing on the horizon to replace it. Hubble is a uniquely successful NASA science program and is a national asset well worth maintaining in operation. The Hubble telescope provides four key advantages over most other optical astronomical facilities: unprecedented angular resolution over a large field, spectral coverage from the near infrared to the far ultraviolet, an extremely dark sky, and highly stable images that enable precision photometry. Hubble’s imaging fields of view are also considerable, permitting mapping of extended objects and significant regions of sky. Unlike standard ground-based telescopes,1 whose view is blurred by the atmosphere and wholly impeded in the ultraviolet and large portions of the near infrared, Hubble can see sharply and clearly at all wavelengths from the far ultraviolet to the near infrared (Figure 3.1). Hubble images are 5 to 20 times sharper than those obtained from the ground, in effect bringing the universe that much “closer” (Figure 3.2). Image sharpness and the extremely dark sky help Hubble to see objects 10 times fainter than those that can be observed with even the largest ground-based telescopes. Moreover, Hubble’s images are extremely stable, in contrast to those of standard ground-based telescopes, which are subject to changing atmospheric clarity and turbulence that continually distort the view. Singly, each of these advantages would represent a significant advance for science. Coupled together they have resulted in the most powerful astronomical facility in history. Hubble is a general-purpose national observatory that enables unique contributions to and insights regarding most of the astronomical problems of greatest current interest. 1 Ground-based telescopes equipped with adaptive optics are discussed in “Comparison of Hubble with Other Planned Facilities” below in this chapter.
OCR for page 17
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.1 An example of the Hubble Space Telescope’s superior resolution compared with that of a standard ground-based telescope: (left) a distant, peculiar interacting galaxy imaged with the Subaru telescope on Mauna Kea; (right) the same object imaged with Hubble. Subaru (8 m) telescope image courtesy of National Astronomical Observatory of Japan; Hubble (2.4 m) image courtesy of STScI/NASA. FIGURE 3.2 Two Hubble Space Telescope images illustrate the value of observing at different wavelengths. (left) An image obtained at near-infrared wavelengths, which penetrate the dust, reveals hundreds of stars in the region, as well as a large complex of newly forming stars deep within the dusty column itself. (right) An image obtained at visible wavelengths shows a column of obscuring dust and gas in the famous Eagle nebula (M16). The sculpting away of the dust by an intense rain of radiation from nearby hot stars (off image to top) reveals denser globules of gas inside the column that are seen as protuberances on the surface of the cloud. These protuberances are likely sites of star formation. Each wavelength imaged by Hubble provides unique information about the sources studied. Images courtesy of STScI/NASA.
OCR for page 18
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report TABLE 3.1 Principal Hubble Science Instruments Instrument Wavelength Range (micron) Pixel Size (arc sec) Field of View (arc sec) Existing: ACS/Wide field 0.35–1.05 0.045 205 × 205 ACS/High-resolution 0.20–1.05 0.026 26 × 26 NICMOS/NIC1 0.8–1.8 0.043 11 × 11 NICMOS/NIC2 0.8–2.5 0.075 19 × 19 NICMOS/NIC3 0.8–2.5 0.20 51 × 51 WFPC2/Wide field 0.12–1.05 0.1 3 × 75 × 75 WFPC2/Planetary 0.12–1.05 0.046 35 × 35 Planned for SM-4: WFC3/UV Visible 0.20–1.05 0.04 160 × 160 Near IR 0.80–1.70 0.13 135 × 135 Cosmic Origin Spectrograph 0.12–0.32 Of course, Hubble cannot do everything. It is not sensitive to very-high-energy radiation like x rays and gamma rays, or to low-energy radiation in the mid- and far-infrared or radio regions. It cannot collect the sheer quantity of light available to larger ground-based telescopes, a capability that is vital for obtaining high-resolution spectra. To fill these important gaps, Hubble must work synergistically with other telescopes to complete the portraits of celestial objects at all wavelengths. FINDING: The Hubble Space Telescope is a uniquely powerful observing platform in terms of its high angular optical resolution, broad wavelength coverage from the ultraviolet to the near infrared, low sky background, stable images, exquisite precision in flux determination, and significant field of view. The Hubble telescope is currently equipped with a selection of cameras operating at different wavelengths, as summarized in Table 3.1. The Space Telescope Imaging Spectrograph (STIS) failed in 2004, but several of its ultraviolet modes would be replaced with the installation of the Cosmic Origins Spectrograph (COS) during a servicing mission. A flexible mix of wavelengths, spectral resolutions, and field-of-view sizes is a key element of Hubble’s power. OBSERVING WITH HUBBLE Hubble observing is open to the worldwide astronomical community, and astronomers compete fiercely to win time on the telescope via their scientific proposals. Independent peer review of the proposals is the basis for selection by the Space Telescope Science Institute (STScI), and chosen programs cover the entire range of astrophysics. Requested time typically exceeds that available by a factor of about seven. This rate of oversubscription has remained essentially constant over the lifetime of the telescope and is about twice that of large U.S. ground-based telescopes.
OCR for page 19
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report Selection among the wealth of excellent proposed programs is done by panels of astronomers with significant international representation. In the most recent cycle, some 100 scientists participated in the review process. Two hundred proposals were selected, authored by 955 U.S. astronomers and 358 astronomers from 13 other countries. Many of the successful proposers were graduate students and postdoctoral fellows, making Hubble one of the most important astronomical training resources in the world. Roughly 60 percent of the grant funding in a typical proposal cycle (e.g., Cycle 12) goes to postdoctoral associates, fellows, and graduate students. Observations are scheduled by the STScI based on detailed instructions from the proposers. The data acquired can be held by the investigators for a 12-month period, after which they become publicly available in the HST archive. Hubble has led the way in making astronomical data archives accessible, and the archived data are nearly as popular for analyses as are new data, given that each Hubble observation can be reused many times by new investigators for new projects. The archive currently boasts 1500 registered users and 19 terabytes of data. Its value continues to grow as new data arrive, and its total impact has increased the productivity of the telescope greatly. The data archive will be one of the most enduring elements of the HST’s legacy. For successful U.S. proposers, an award of Hubble observing time carries with it a monetary grant to support the scientific research. This money pays for the salaries of researchers, stipends for students and postdoctoral fellows, computers, and publication costs. The annual HST grants program in Cycle 13 (the current cycle) is approximately $20 million, an appreciable fraction of the entire budget (approximately $31.5 million) for university grant programs and fellowships in all disciplines and wavelengths in the Astronomical Sciences Division at the National Science Foundation. SCIENCE HIGHLIGHTS The Space Telescope Science Institute has studied the scientific impact of Hubble observations using two metrics: the number of citations in the professional astronomical literature and references to Hubble discoveries in the popular media. Table 3.2 lists the top 10 Hubble contributions based on astronomical citations, and the following text expands on 5 representative examples from the list. Ultradeep Images of the Universe—Galaxies in Formation Hubble looks so far out into space that it observes objects whose light has taken many billions of years to reach us. Astronomers therefore see these objects as they were at some distant time in the past; in effect, Hubble provides a “time machine” that can show us how the universe evolved. The Hubble Ultradeep Field penetrates back more than 12 billion years to within 1 billion years of the Big Bang (Figure 3.3). Infant galaxies can be seen in the process of forming, harbingers of a great wave of star formation that soon afterward bathed the universe in the light of 10 billion trillion stars, and the major stages in the history of galaxy formation are accessible to direct observation. Measurement of the Hubble Constant, the Distance Scale of the Universe Knowledge of the size and age of the universe had long been uncertain by a factor of two, a level of uncertainty that was a major obstacle to the testing of cosmological theories. Hubble measured the apparent brightness of so-called Cepheid variable stars in nearby galaxies and used them to estimate the distances to those galaxies. This approach provided an accurate value for H0, the Hubble constant, thereby calibrating the distance scale and size of the universe.
OCR for page 20
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report TABLE 3.2 Top Ten Hubble Contributions Observation or Result Significance Ultradeep images of the distant universe Shows the formation of galaxies and confirms that the universe evolves. Tells the story of how our Milky Way was born. Accurate measurement of the Hubble constant, H0 Establishes the size and age of the universe. Discovery of giant black holes at the centers of galaxies Confirms longstanding theory of the “central engines” of quasars. Confirmation of accelerated expansion of the universe Requires the existence of “dark energy.” Discovery of spectral lines in active galaxies Reveals that black holes can trigger massive star formation. Expansion of the census of the intergalactic medium Establishes existence of a web of invisible matter filaments linking galaxies over hundreds of millions of light-years and controlling the matter-energy budget of the universe. Importance of chemistry of the interstellar medium Probes the formation and distribution of the chemical elements and reveals the physical state of the gas in interstellar space. Identification of gamma-ray bursts with distant galaxies Confirms that sources of gamma-ray bursts lie at cosmological distances and that gamma-ray bursts (during their brief flashes) are the brightest objects in the universe. Resolved images of protoplanetary disks Reveals flattened, rotating disks of dust and gas that almost certainly resemble our own solar system in its infancy. Studies of extrasolar planets Offers a sensitive method for finding planets around other stars, based on partial eclipses when a planet passes in front of a distant star. Giant Black Holes at the Centers of Galaxies Hubble’s high angular resolution allows astronomers to peer into the hearts of galaxies to measure the orbital speeds of gas and stars close to their centers. The speeds of stars reach 1000 km/s in many objects, thereby indicating the presence of intense gravitational fields caused by massive black holes of up to a billion solar masses. Though mostly invisible today, these black holes shone brilliantly in the past as quasars, fueled by the infall of then-abundant interstellar gas. Key data found by the Hubble telescope reveal a correlation between black hole mass and galaxy properties that may provide crucial clues to how and why these holes formed. Accelerated Expansion of the Universe—Dark Energy Einstein’s theory of general relativity says that gravity should slow the expansion of the universe.
OCR for page 21
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.3 The Hubble Ultradeep Field, the deepest image of the universe yet taken. Deep images like this one look back in time as well as out in space, revealing the universe as it was billions of years ago. Representative galaxies are shown at the right, along with their ages after the Big Bang (Gyr, 1 billion years). The bottom image in the column is of one of the most distant galaxies yet seen, taking us to within 1 billion years (0.8 Gyr) of the beginning of our universe. Distant galaxies are seen as progressively smaller and dimmer compared with nearby galaxies. Astronomers are using look-back Hubble images like these to chart the course of galaxy evolution. Images courtesy of STScI/NASA. Hubble data, when coupled with those from other telescopes, show to the contrary that the expansion is accelerating and that galaxies move apart ever faster with time. This observation can be reconciled with general relativity only by invoking a new kind of energy density that remains constant despite the dilution expected from expansion. This so-called dark energy is unlike ordinary matter or energy in that it generates a repulsive gravity that is literally blowing the universe apart. Discovery of this fundamentally new cosmic entity is considered by many physicists to be the most important milestone in physics since the advent of general relativity and quantum mechanics in the early 1900s.
OCR for page 22
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.4 The Orion nebula, one of the regions of intense star formation nearest to Earth, is a cloud of glowing interstellar gas that has been ionized by the intense ultraviolet radiation coming from five hot, massive stars (the Trapezium) near the center. In this montage of Hubble images, these five very luminous stars can be seen near the center of the main mosaic and in the enlarged image at the bottom left. Energy input from these and other young stars stirs up the gas, giving rise to a network of delicate striations. Despite the chaotic environment, dozens of smaller stars are forming by condensing out of the cloud under their own self-gravity. Some of these stars are surrounded by opaque, dusty disks (“proplyds”) that are forming proto-solar systems much like our own. A few young stars are expelling jets of matter perpendicular to their proto-solar system disks (lower right). Fine details of star birth such as these are visible only at the resolution possible with Hubble. Images courtesy of STScI/NASA. Protoplanetary Disks—Planetary Systems in Formation Many luminous nebulas are dense regions of interstellar gas lit up by ultraviolet radiation from newly born massive stars. In the nearest such nebulas in our galaxy, Hubble’s high resolving power has uncovered a cornucopia of proto-solar systems seen as dark, flattened disks silhouetted against the glowing background of nebular gas (Figure 3.4). At the centers of such disks, young suns can be seen in the process of formation. Powerful jets of plasma and magnetic fields are spewed out from some of these disks by a magnetic propulsion mechanism not yet fully understood. The discovery of proto-solar systems and energetic phenomena in nearby glowing nebulas has turned them into gold mines for studying the formation of stars and planets—including, by analogy, that of our own solar system.
OCR for page 23
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.5 (left) The number of refereed scientific papers produced annually based on work enabled by major leading telescopes. (right) The number of citations in the scientific literature annually to papers produced from work enabled by major leading telescopes. The criteria used to assign papers to a telescope are parallel for all the telescopes shown here. HUBBLE IN THE SCIENTIFIC AND POPULAR PRESS Nearly 5000 scientific papers have been published based on Hubble observations, and the publication rate in refereed journals is currently about 500 per year. Except possibly for the Chandra X-ray Observatory, which rivaled Hubble in terms of papers published in 2003, Hubble outstrips all other telescopes by more than a factor of two in both the quantity of papers published and the rates at which they are cited (Figure 3.5). The importance of Hubble science is clear to all—one need not be a trained scientist to know that unveiling the birth of stars and galaxies, finding billion-solar-mass black holes, and helping to discover an entirely new form of energy in the cosmos are ground-breaking milestones in the history of science. But progress in fundamental science is not the only way to judge Hubble’s achievements. To the list of science highlights can be added an even longer list of spectacular images that, though not necessarily in the top 10 scientifically, have had extraordinary public impact by virtue of their sheer beauty or arresting novelty (Figure 3.6). Among these one might list the big “black eye” left by comet Shoemaker-Levy’s direct hit on Jupiter, an image that alerted the public to the dangers of asteroids and comets hitting Earth; a panoply of jewel-like planetary nebulas that illustrate the ultimate death of our Sun; portraits of planets in our solar system, including auroras on Jupiter and Saturn; and, of course, the spectacular “pillars of dust” in the Eagle nebula that appeared on nearly every front page in America and became iconic for Hubble itself. Intense public interest in Hubble is borne out by many media studies of its impact; an example of the results of such an assessment is shown in Figure 3.7. Having garnered sustained public attention over its entire lifetime, the Hubble Space Telescope is clearly one of NASA’s most noticed science projects. In effect, Hubble has become a model that shows how NASA can combine its own unique expertise with that of scientists to educate the public about the natural world.
OCR for page 24
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.6 Montage of famous Hubble Space Telescope images. From upper left: (1) Eagle nebula (M16), (2) Lagoon nebula (M8), (3) Cat’s Eye planetary nebula, (4) M2-9 planetary nebula, (5) gravitational lens arcs in the Abell 2218 galaxy cluster, (6) colliding galaxies NGC 4038-9 (the Antennae), (7) Eta Carina, (8) “light-echo” ring around Supernova 1987a in the Large Magellanic Cloud, (9) the Hubble Deep Field, (10) auroras on Saturn, (11) Mars, and (12) the black-hole galaxy NGC 4261. Images courtesy of STScI/NASA.
OCR for page 25
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.7 The cumulative impact of various NASA space science programs as indicated by media coverage. “Discovery points” reflect the number and importance of news stories appearing annually in “Science News.” Courtesy of STScI/NASA. FINDING: Astronomical discoveries with Hubble from the solar system to the edge of the universe are among the most significant intellectual achievements of the space science program. SCIENCE IMPACT OF HUBBLE SERVICING MISSIONS Hubble today is not the same telescope that was launched in 1990. A series of servicing missions, summarized in Table 2.1, has repaired many key components, added new observing modes, and increased existing capabilities, typically by factors of 10 to 100. As a result, Hubble now produces much more data per unit time than it did originally. If the total data rate summed over all instruments can be taken as a rough measure of spacecraft productivity, Figure 3.8 shows how science data volume and thus productivity increased as a result of each of the three servicing missions that added science instruments. The total rate of calibrated data has grown by a factor of 33 since launch. A further increase is expected with the installation of Wide-field Camera 3 (WFC3) and COS, each of which would provide more than a 10-fold improvement in scientific efficiency and sensitivity with respect to previous instruments. FINDING: The scientific power of Hubble has grown enormously as a result of previous servicing missions.
OCR for page 26
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.8 Growth as a function of time in the volume of data returned by the Hubble Space Telescope, 1990 to 2003, based on the rate of return just after launch. The rate tends to jump after each servicing mission (SM), due mainly to the installation of larger and more efficient detectors. Shown at the right is the volume of data projected as a result of the addition of two new instruments, the Wide-field camera 3 (WFC3) and the Cosmic Origins Spectrograph (COS) in a fifth servicing mission, SM-4. The efficiency of a science instrument is a measure of the time needed to make a given observation; doubling the efficiency, for example, halves the time. Efficiency on Hubble has risen by orders of magnitude with increases in the size of the detectors and improvements in total optical throughput, and would increase further with the installation of the two new instruments planned for servicing mission 4 (SM-4). WFC3 is an imager with two separate arms operating in the ultraviolet (UV)-visible and the near infrared. With more sensitive detectors and larger fields of view, it affords a gain of 10 in efficiency at 0.17 to 0.30 micron, and a gain of 50 at 0.80 to 1.7 microns. These numbers are huge for astronomy: for example, doubling the diameter of a ground-based telescope gives an efficiency gain of only 4, yet even this much improvement is highly sought after. Science programs that would be able to exploit the gain to be provided by WFC3 are indicated in Figure 3.9. The second instrument planned for installation by SM-4 is COS. COS is a moderate-resolution ultraviolet spectrograph that achieves large efficiency gains of 10 or more over STIS by virtue of a more sensitive, larger detector, a reduction in background noise, and an improved optical design with much higher throughput. This last feature is possible because COS is optimized for a small but very important group of cosmological problems (see below). Installation of COS is even more important if STIS, the
OCR for page 29
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report TABLE 3.3 Deteriorating Capabilities of Hubble Systems That Affect Scientific Operations System Current Status and Planned Fix Science Impact STIS Side A electronics failed in 2002; Side B electronics failed in August 2004; feasibility of Side B repair under study. With loss of redundancy, Hubble now has no moderate-resolution spectrograph. Batteries Charge capacity is decreasing; SM-4 would replace. All science operations will cease when batteries fail. Gyroscopes Reduction to two functioning gyros likely by early 2006, one gyro by mid-2007; new gyros to be installed during SM-4. Nominal operations require three gyros. Two-gyro mode will degrade highest-resolution images slightly and reduce target visibility; no proven workaround for one-gyro mode. Fine-guidance sensors Some degradation in two of the three currently available FGSs; one is predicted to fail between 2007 and 2009, leaving two without redundancy. Two-FGS mode will reduce target visibility and scheduling efficiency; no proven workaround for one-FGS mode. ACS Charge-transfer efficiency is gradually degrading, and “hot” pixels are increasing; no plan to service during SM-4. Degradation significant but not expected to be serious until after 2011. NICMOS Cooling unit is non-redundant mechanically; no plan to service during SM-4. NIC3 becomes backup when WFC3 is installed. High-resolution NIC1 and NIC2 modes will be lost if cooler fails. WFPC2 Charge-transfer efficiency is degrading; to be replaced by WFC3 during SM-4. Degradation not important if WFPC2 is replaced by WFC3. ACS, which is a workhorse camera with the largest field of view, would continue to operate. For this reason, early servicing is desirable to minimize the accumulating radiation damage. No servicing of ACS or NICMOS is planned for SM-4. Two other systems potentially affect the thermal health of HST’s science instruments. These are the Aft Shroud Cooling System and the New Outer Blanket Layer, an outer insulation layer. Both of these are included in the shuttle version of SM-4 but not in the baseline robotic mission. These systems are discussed in Chapter 4, which indicates that they are desirable but not essential for instrument functioning. To summarize, with the exception of STIS, all important items needed to keep Hubble functioning well through 2011 are included in the shuttle SM-4 servicing plan. Replacement of batteries and gyros and one FGS is deemed essential. Any spacecraft is subject to unanticipated failures, but if the repairs envisioned for SM-4 are carried out promptly, there is every prospect that Hubble can operate effectively for another 4 to 5 years after servicing.
OCR for page 30
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report THE PROMISE OF FUTURE DISCOVERIES What important science programs would be enabled if Hubble’s life were extended? This essential question is examined here, starting with programs that could be done with the existing instruments and proceeding to those depending on the two new instruments, WFC3 and COS. It is important to note that typically only about half of all major discoveries made with new astronomical facilities are foreseen, while the other half are serendipitous. Hubble has been no exception in this regard—only five of the contributions listed in Table 3.2 were anticipated. Space here also permits listing only a small faction of the science projects likely to be undertaken. For both reasons, the following list provides a lower limit to the future discovery potential of Hubble. One of the most active and exciting frontiers in astronomy in coming decades will be the discovery and study of planets in solar systems beyond our own. Finding planets, especially down to Earth-like size, has become an official goal of NASA. More than 100 extrasolar planetary systems have been discovered (by ground-based telescopes), and they are very different from those in our own solar system. Planets similar in mass to Jupiter have been found, but they are very close to their parent stars and often in highly elliptical orbits—not at all like the giant planets Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, and Neptune that all orbit far from the Sun in nearly circular orbits. Given an example of exactly one solar system—ours—theorists had invented tidy theories that predicted that its structure was inevitable. The new discoveries have overturned these ideas, and the field of solar-system formation is now in ferment. A rapidly developing technique for finding planets detects them as they transit across the face of their parent star and block a small part of the light. The great advantage of Hubble for transit photometry is its extraordinary photometric stability, which allows it to detect much smaller decreases in light than can be measured through Earth’s fluctuating atmosphere. This is evident in Figure 3.10, which shows a scatter in the measurements of only 0.02 percent, some 50 times smaller than is possible with typical ground-based photometry. This scatter is only a factor of two larger than the dip caused by Earth as it passes in front of the Sun, as seen by a hypothetical distant observer. HST’s high accuracy is important to this effort in three ways. The first is illustrated in Figure 3.10, where HST actually resolves the time needed for ingress and egress. This is the only known way to measure planet radii. The second is that Hubble can provide rapid confirmation for NASA’s Kepler mission,2 which is planned for launch in late 2007 and is specifically designed to search for transiting extrasolar planets, including Earth-like planets. The Kepler technique will produce many false positives that will have to be screened out by other methods. Kepler can do much of this itself, but the process will take years for Earth-size candidates; high-resolution Hubble photometry could provide much more rapid feedback and possible optimization of further Kepler observations. For maximum benefit, Hubble operations should overlap the Kepler mission from 2008 to beyond 2010. Finally, Hubble can take exceptionally accurate spectra of planetary systems during eclipse, yielding measurements of water and other species in jovian-sized planetary atmospheres.3 Photometry with the James Webb Space Telescope (JWST) will also have higher accuracy than that possible from ground-based telescopes and will also play an important role in planet detection. However, JWST’s system is not as well understood at this time, and its launch is still several years away. 2 For additional information see. 3 David Charbonneau, “Hubble’s View of Transiting Planets,” in From Planets to Cosmology: Essential Science in Hubble’s Final Years, STScI 2004 May Symposium, Space Telescope Science Institute, Baltimore, Md., in press.
OCR for page 31
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.10 The presence of an otherwise invisible planet can be detected by the small drop in light caused as the planet travels in front of its parent star. The “light curve” of such a transit is shown here, with the drop in light at slightly more than 1.5 percent, as would occur with a giant Jupiter-like planet passing in front of the Sun. However, the scatter in the Hubble measurements is so small that even smaller planets could be detected. Hubble has begun to monitor rich star fields like that shown in the background, which is a region near the center of the Milky Way Galaxy. In this manner, several hundred thousand stars can be searched for Jupiter-size and smaller planets in roughly 1 week of Hubble Space Telescope observing time. Courtesy of STScI/NASA. Similarly, most of the stars targeted by the Kepler mission are too faint for effective imaging with ground-based adaptive optics systems. For proven high accuracy and overlap/coordination with the Kepler mission, Hubble is preferred. Besides detection of extrasolar planets, a great variety of other important work will be able to continue if Hubble remains operational. A large number of new supernovas could be found for the study of dark energy, reducing uncertainties in its properties by a factor of two. A wealth of data would be taken to explore the nature of stars in the Milky Way Galaxy and in neighboring galaxies. Hubble is just beginning to image objects being found by sister NASA missions such as the Chandra X-ray Observatory, GALEX (an ultraviolet imager), and Spitzer (an infrared imager and spectrograph), which are currently in orbit. These satellites are relatively wide-field survey telescopes, one of whose expressed purposes is to detect objects for Hubble follow-up observations. The chance for these follow-ups would be severely limited if Hubble’s life were curtailed, because the areas of the sky surveyed by Hubble for any one observation are much smaller than those observed at other wavelengths, and thus it requires more time to cover a field.
OCR for page 32
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report In the closing years of the Hubble telescope’s active life, emphasis is turning toward the gathering of large, homogeneous data sets—including spectral libraries and imaging surveys of large areas within the Milky Way, nearby galaxies, and the distant universe. These data sets, called Treasury Programs, will go into the data archive; they are Hubble’s lay-away plan for the future. These programs are extremely important because there are no plans in the foreseeable future to replace Hubble with a telescope of comparable size and wavelength coverage. The servicing mission SM-4 is needed to allow an orderly completion of this important aspect of Hubble’s mission. Forefront programs would be enabled by the two new instruments to be installed by SM-4—starting with the near-infrared arm of WFC3. Long-wavelength imaging has been a popular mode on Hubble, but the relatively small field of view of the NICMOS camera has been a serious handicap. Important new vistas would be opened by the near-IR arm of WFC3. A major goal is observing the most distant galaxies, whose light is highly red-shifted by the expansion of the universe. Light from the most distant galaxies detectable by Hubble is red-shifted so much that it is “too red” for ACS, whose sensitivity ends at about 1 micron. Critical spectral features needed to measure age and distance are red-shifted entirely out of ACS’s range. WFC3 will reach these objects and enable Hubble at last to see the full distance to which its mirror is capable of giving access. The deepest image taken yet with Hubble is its Ultradeep Field, in which a handful of objects have been identified beyond a redshift of 6 (see Figure 3.3). The age of the universe at this redshift is already 1 billion years; WFC3 images of the same field should reach back to redshift 10, nearly twice as close to the Big Bang. This capability is critical because the universe evolved rapidly at these epochs, and even a small increase in look-back time can reveal new phenomena. This is the era of the first galaxies, when stars began shining and black holes began to evolve toward quasars, when the featureless cosmic void began to condense and lay the foundations for planets and life. WFC3 looks through a window that will shed light on our own distant past. How and when galaxies form stars is another great astronomical mystery. Much of the early star formation seems to have occurred in bursts triggered by collisions of massive galaxies. Such bursts are hidden within dark clouds of gas and dust and cannot be seen at visible wavelengths. WFC3’s near-infrared detector can penetrate the dust to reveal underlying properties of the starburst (see Figure 3.11). In this quest, WFC3 would work synergistically with the Spitzer infrared satellite, which will detect dust-enshrouded starbursts in great numbers but will rely on Hubble for high-resolution follow-up work. A third important task of WFC3 is to pursue and extend the supernova discovery program. These objects have provided the best evidence that the universe is expanding faster with time, requiring dark energy to drive the acceleration. WFC3 could establish whether the amount of dark energy is evolving with time or has remained constant—potentially an extremely important question for fundamental physics. Even without WFC3, Hubble would make progress by likely discovering some 30 new supernovas in 4 years. WFC3 would increase this detection rate by a factor of 2.5, and should also detect some extremely important supernovas at much larger distances. Such distant supernovas are invisible now but should be detected in significant numbers by WFC3. The result would be much tighter constraints on the properties of dark matter. Other programs for the WFC3-IR camera include a hunt for water-bearing rocks on Mars and ices on outer satellites in the solar system. In each case, capabilities provided by Hubble will be unique among existing astronomical facilities. Because Earth’s atmosphere is opaque to wavelengths of less than 0.30 micron, the Hubble telescope offers unique opportunities at ultraviolet wavelengths. This potential has been only partly realized to date, because of the difficulty of making space-qualified ultraviolet detectors. High UV efficiency will be achieved on Hubble for the first time when both WFC3 and COS are installed. WFC3’s short-
OCR for page 33
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.11 An illustration of the power of near-infrared light to penetrate dust clouds and reveal embedded, newly formed stars. (left) A Wide-field Planetary Camera 2 (WFPC2) view of the center of the Orion nebula with the five Trapezium stars. (right) The same region imaged in the near infrared with the NICMOS camera, which makes many previously hidden stars visible. This pair of images illustrates why observing at many different wavelengths is required. Wide-field Camera 3 will be 50 times more efficient than NICMOS for this work. Courtesy of STScI/NASA. wavelength detector would provide sensitive ultraviolet imaging below 0.30 micron. Stellar populations redden as they age, as hot, blue, massive stars die away. Slicing the spectrum into colors thus slices the stellar population into age cohorts, with the youngest, most recently formed stars visible in the ultraviolet. It will be exciting to turn WFC3’s UV capability onto distant galaxies, whose star-formation histories can be captured at previous epochs and merged to synthesize the history of cosmic star formation. While detecting radiation is usually the goal, sometimes not detecting it is even more important. Imaging at ultraviolet wavelengths can reveal the presence of distant proto-galaxies because light at wavelengths below 0.12 micron is absorbed by intervening clouds of intergalactic hydrogen gas, thereby creating a “hole” in the spectrum where it appears black. In distant objects, this hole is redshifted to longer wavelengths, so that objects disappear or “drop out” in certain colors. WFC3’s greater UV sensitivity will allow it to discover UV dropouts nearly 10 times fainter than those currently known, deepening our knowledge of distant galaxies beyond the brightest ones currently known. The other gap in instrumentation in the ultraviolet—spectroscopy—will be significantly filled by the Cosmic Origins Spectrograph. COS is an instrument optimized for a number of highly important programs in cosmology. The first of these is study of the “cosmic web” consisting of diffuse matter not yet coalesced into galaxies (Figure 3.12). The cosmic web forms a huge network in space around our galaxy but is largely invisible because no stars or galaxies have yet formed in it. It contains many vital
OCR for page 34
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report FIGURE 3.12 Theoretical models of galaxy formation predict that the universe is threaded by filaments of matter between the galaxies. It is at the intersection points of this so-called cosmic web that galaxies, and then clusters of galaxies, form. Because it contains only dark matter and gas that has not yet condensed into stars, the web is invisible. However, gas inside it is capable of absorbing light that passes through it on the way to Earth from background objects. Evidence of this absorption can be seen in the spectrum of a background object, which has dips where light is removed by web-gas atoms. A sample spectrum is shown at the lower right. The much higher efficiency of the Cosmic Origins Spectrograph would enable it to take spectra of many more background quasars, creating a dense network of sight lines with which to probe the cosmic web. clues to cosmogenesis. The density and geometry of the web reflect the original density ripples in the universe that gave rise to all the structure seen today. Galaxies form at “nodes” in the web, where filaments intersect and grow via the pull of gravity, which drags matter along web-lines into the nodes. How and when does this happen, and how do galaxies “turn on”? If it were visible to the eye, the web would reveal the distribution of matter that has not yet fallen into galaxies—which is most of the matter in the universe! The web is thus the dominant player in the cosmic-matter energy budget. With COS it would be possible to study the cosmic web in detail for the first time. Though not radiating much by itself, the web absorbs light from bright, background sources such as quasars, leaving
OCR for page 35
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report dips at particular wavelengths in the spectrum. Each quasar line-of-sight is thus a “core-drilling” through space that reveals pieces of the cosmic web. The big advantage of COS is higher sensitivity, some 10 to 30 times that of STIS. As a consequence, many more faint quasars can be studied, making a much denser pattern of core-drillings through space. The dense coverage should reveal the geometry of the web and its evolution with time. The total observing program of COS would be rich because the same spectral features that delineate the web are also found in interstellar gas and in stellar atmospheres. The tracer elements involved include nitrogen, silicon, aluminum, oxygen, carbon, and iron—elements basic to the formation of Earth and life. COS spectra can be used to explore the chemical evolution of galaxies and the intergalactic medium via nucleosynthesis of these elements. Velocities of gas clouds can be measured to show how hot stars and quasars feed back their energy into surrounding gas, driving massive “winds” from galaxies. These UV spectral features are also important for studying the chemistry and physics of planetary atmospheres in the solar system. In total, the large efficiency gains enabled by COS would open for the first time a wide window for UV spectroscopy. Of the two instruments slated for SM-4, WFC3 is the more powerful because of its wide wavelength range and its sensitivity in the near infrared, which is particularly important for studying the highly redshifted distant universe. WFC3 is thus essential for any servicing mission, and the installation of COS is highly desirable. FINDING: A minimum scientifically acceptable servicing mission would install batteries, gyroscopes, WFC3, and one FGS. The installation of COS is highly desirable. FUTURE SCIENCE POTENTIAL RELATIVE TO PAST ACHIEVEMENTS Hubble’s oversubscription by a factor of about 7 indicates that scientific productivity with the present instruments is already high; the new instruments WFC3 and COS would extend the power of the observatory significantly further. In an attempt to quantify this statement, selected objectives from the above list of future science programs have been identified that, in the opinion of the committee, are comparable in importance to the top 10 Hubble contributions listed in Table 3.2. The result is five objectives listed in Table 3.4. Allowing for the overwhelming likelihood of important unforeseen discoveries in addition to those listed in Table 3.4, the committee concludes that the promise for future Hubble discoveries following a servicing mission is comparable to the telescope’s promise when first launched. The programs listed in Table 3.4 are also very well aligned with the list of key problems highlighted by the most recent decadal survey report for astronomy and astrophysics, Astronomy and Astrophysics in the New Millennium.4 COMPARISON OF HUBBLE WITH OTHER PLANNED FACILITIES The unique advantage of HST with respect to other astronomical tools is its exquisite angular resolution extending from the ultraviolet to the near infrared. Observations in the ultraviolet and part of the near IR (IR) are impossible from the ground at any resolution. Even at wavelengths accessible from the ground, HST still has a big advantage for imaging and low-resolution spectroscopy because of its 4 National Research Council, 2001, Astronomy and Astrophysics in the New Millennium, National Academy Press, Washington, D.C.
OCR for page 36
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report TABLE 3.4 Foreseeable Major Contributions Made Possible with Hubble Likely Discovery Hubble Instrument Importance Large number of extrasolar planets ACS Possibly detecting Earth-like planets and measuring their radii. The first galaxies WFC3 Obtaining key data concerning formation of the first stars and black holes. Evolution of dark energy WFC3, ACS Understanding the fundamental nature of dark energy. The cosmic web COS Mapping the total distribution of matter in the universe. The effects of quasars and stars on galaxies growth. COS Understanding how galaxies limit their own high spatial resolution and dark sky, which more than compensate for its relatively modest mirror size. In contrast, high-resolution spectroscopy requires a lot of light, so that large-aperture ground-based telescopes are often better, but only if the wavelength is visible from the ground and high spatial resolution is not needed. If either of these conditions is not met, multiple-orbit exposures with Hubble can be successful—indeed have been, for example, in the discovery of black holes at galactic centers. It has been suggested that a new technique, called adaptive optics (AO), may enable ground-based telescopes to achieve and even surpass Hubble’s resolution, at lower cost. The AO method corrects for atmospheric blurring by constantly monitoring the bending of light rays by the atmosphere over the telescope. This information is transmitted several hundreds of times a second to a flexible mirror whose surface is deformed in order to “re-aim” the rays to their original trajectories, restoring above-atmosphere image sharpness. AO is quite new and is still in the development phase. The technique works well in the near IR (around 2 microns), where ground-based telescopes with AO can actually take sharper images than Hubble does. However, it becomes much more difficult at shorter wavelengths in proportion to the inverse fifth power of the wavelength. Thus, an AO system working at 0.5 micron would be approximately 1000 times more difficult to achieve (and perhaps approximately 1000 times more costly) than a 2-micron system; an AO system in the ultraviolet is out of the question. AO systems also have inherently narrow fields of view compared with those of Hubble; these fields of view can be enlarged, but not without considerable further work and cost. AO images are inherently much less stable than Hubble images because the atmosphere and the quality of the correction are constantly fluctuating. AO therefore does not lend itself to the precision measurements that Hubble makes routinely. Finally, even if ground-based AO telescopes can sometimes approach Hubble in image quality at long wavelengths and over small fields of view, Hubble still has a big edge in sensitivity beyond 0.8 micron because of its much darker sky. To summarize, adaptive optics is currently useful for certain kinds of measurements in small fields of view at wavelengths beyond 1.6 microns. Field size and the quality of atmospheric correction will improve in coming years, but Hubble will still be superior for nearly all applications through its planned lifetime, even in the near IR. With time, ground-based telescopes will become more competitive,
OCR for page 37
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report starting with imaging at longer wavelengths and with spectroscopy (which benefits from the light-gathering capacities of large mirrors). However, for all work requiring high spatial resolution, wavelengths below 1 micron will remain the province of space telescopes for the foreseeable future. To equip a 3-meter ground-based telescope today with a system approaching Hubble’s image quality at 0.8 micron is technically exceedingly difficult, and such a system would be much less stable than Hubble; such a system operating at 0.5 micron is not feasible at present. Thus, Hubble will remain the instrument of choice for virtually all high-resolution observations over its wavelength range during its entire lifetime. FINDING: Ground-based adaptive optics systems will not achieve Hubble’s high degree of image stability or angular resolution at visible wavelengths for the foreseeable future. The satellites GALEX and FUSE have UV capabilities that are different from those of Hubble and therefore are in no sense a replacement for it. GALEX makes low-resolution images but covers a much wider field of view; its main role relative to Hubble is to find interesting objects for detailed Hubble follow-up. FUSE observes in the far UV at wavelengths beyond Hubble’s limit. The missions of GALEX and FUSE are relatively short, with GALEX likely ceasing operation in early 2007 and FUSE in 2010. For efficient follow-up of GALEX discoveries, it is desirable that Hubble operate for 3 years beyond GALEX, implying a mission lifetime out to 2010. New facilities under construction or consideration that relate to Hubble’s capabilities include the James Webb Space Telescope. JWST will operate mostly at longer wavelengths than Hubble, out to 27 microns, but the two overlap between 0.6 and 2.5 microns; JWST does not operate in the short-wavelength visible or ultraviolet. The launch date of JWST is currently slated for 2011 but could slip to 2013, given the history of missions of comparable difficulty. With image quality comparable to or better than Hubble’s beyond 1 micron and a mirror diameter 2.5 times larger, a successful JWST will super-sede Hubble in the infrared. Nevertheless there are three important reasons for maintaining Hubble in operation through at least 2010: to reduce the gap in time between Hubble and JWST during which there is no high-resolution space imaging; to permit Hubble to carry out observations shortward of 0.6 micron where JWST cannot reach; and to protect against schedule slips and/or failure in the JWST mission, which is planned for a distant orbit and without any options for repair. SNAP (a possible joint Dark Energy Mission concept) was envisioned as a project of NASA and the Department of Energy. Plans called for a 2-meter mirror with a wide field of view (0.34 deg2); it would provide somewhat poorer quality images than Hubble. Its stated goal is to find and study distant, highly red-shifted supernovas for the study of dark energy. Its wide-field optical and near-IR imaging could make it attractive for many other programs, as well. However, it is not yet an approved project, and a start for SNAP is not foreseen until 2015-2016. Moreover SNAP would not serve as a substitute for Hubble because its pixels would be twice the size of Hubble’s, it would have no capability for high-resolution spectroscopy, and it would not operate in the UV. Even if SNAP is completed on an optimistic schedule, Hubble will be able to return a wealth of information about distant supernovas before SNAP is operational. Indeed, the design of SNAP may benefit significantly from these yet-to-be-made Hubble observations. To summarize, no telescope currently operating or planned covers the wide range of wavelengths and capabilities offered by Hubble, especially in the ultraviolet. JWST offers exciting capabilities in the near infrared, but JWST has significant development risk and no plans for on-orbit repair. The committee believes that it makes sense to exploit Hubble’s proven capabilities for a further 4 to 5 years with one more servicing mission.
OCR for page 38
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report COORDINATION WITH OTHER FACILITIES The last several decades have seen an increasing emphasis on multi-wavelength astronomy, in which a panoply of telescopes operating from gamma-ray to radio wavelengths is brought to bear on an object to paint its total “cosmic portrait.” For example, x-ray regions are uniquely able to show hot gas, active black holes, and gas ejected in explosions of supernovas; the UV through the near IR is the realm of stars, from hot to cool; the deep infrared reveals young stars forming within dark dust clouds; and the radio region shows hydrogen gas and energetic plasma ejected from black holes. Each wavelength has its own story to tell. Among the best examples of synergistic cooperation between different telescopes are recent results using the Chandra, HST, Very Large Telescope (VLT), Keck, and Spitzer telescopes. The Chandra X-ray Observatory has obtained some of the most sensitive x-ray observations ever made of distant galaxies, in both the Northern and Southern hemispheres. Ground-based telescopes (Keck and VLT) have obtained spectra for redshifts and distances; Hubble has surveyed both fields and provided much-needed high-resolution imaging. The combined result is the detection of hundreds of active galaxies containing super-massive black holes, the integrated flux of which is now known to make up the x-ray background. In fields where Keck, VLT, and Hubble could not identify a candidate object, the infrared capabilities of Spitzer were able to identify a quasar of very unusual characteristics. These projects are revolutionizing our understanding of the epoch of galaxy and black hole formation and evolution. It is important that such measurements be carried out almost simultaneously, because high-energy phenomena are highly time variable and archival information is not relevant. Most of the x-ray emitters in Chandra deep-field pictures are variable on time scales from days to years. Gamma-ray bursts have even shorter time scales, seconds to days. Much will therefore be lost if the Hubble telescope is not available over the working lifetime of Chandra. Successors to these facilities may not be flown for two decades or more. This possibility argues for continuing the Hubble mission at least through the lifetime of Chandra (5 years from now), and also for servicing early, to maximize the period of simultaneous operations. Furthermore, the continuation of Hubble surveys, even with the current complement of instruments, is essential to match the requirement of multi-wavelength surveys. Many of the instruments in the x-ray, UV, and infrared regions have wider fields of view than Hubble. This means that Hubble has to create a mosaic from many exposures to cover the same fields of view as, say, Chandra. Additional time is therefore needed to observe these fields with Hubble and thus ensure a much richer sample of cosmic objects to study. THE TIMING OF A SERVICING MISSION A number of strategic considerations indicate that any servicing mission should be flown as early as reasonably possible. Several such considerations are presented above in this chapter, and more are discussed in Chapter 4. They are collected here for convenience. First, the detector in the workhorse ACS camera is steadily accumulating radiation damage, with significantly degraded performance expected around 2010. Second, gyroscope failure is expected to place the Hubble telescope in a one-gyro mode near fall 2007 (see Chapter 4), at which point efficient science operations cannot be guaranteed at present. An interruption in operation will ensue, with the telescope sitting idle on orbit waiting for repair. Such a gap interrupts the normal flow of planning, observation, and analysis, and valuable overlap time with SIRTF and Chandra would also be reduced. Third, battery failure is the one event that can irreparably damage the telescope structure by allowing it
OCR for page 39
Assessment of Options for Extending the Life of the Hubble Space Telescope: Final Report to get too cold. Batteries are not predicted to fail until mid 2011 (Chapter 4), but the battery model involves considerable uncertainty, and Hubble’s batteries could fail sooner. Fourth, the failure model for Hubble’s avionics (Chapter 4) predicts an increasing number of component failures with time. A robotic servicing mission lacks the flexibility to deal with these. A shuttle mission has the required flexibility but might not have the capacity to deal with the added number of problems that a servicing delay might give rise to. Finally, it is a fact that all predictions for spacecraft longevity are just that, predictions. Components might start degrading sooner than expected, or the telescope could be hit by space debris, or some other unexpected event might occur. For all these reasons, it is prudent to get the maximum science out of the telescope in the shortest time possible, which points to servicing as soon as can reasonably be managed. FINDING: Servicing Hubble expeditiously is highly desirable. REHOSTING A number of studies are underway to examine the possibility of rehosting WFC3 and/or COS on a new spacecraft(s). The alternatives being studied range from a full Hubble replacement, including a lighter mirror but with the same aperture and diffraction-limited performance in the UV and optical domain, to a smaller single-purpose spacecraft to carry one or the other of these two instruments. There was not time to explore the various possible options thoroughly, and most of them are still undefined in any case. The conclusions here are therefore very general. It is possible that these studies, when completed, may result in a mission design that essentially replaces Hubble with a new spacecraft and a new mirror of equal performance to be launched as a replacement. The committee notes, however, that this approach would require a mirror that is at least 2.4 meters in diameter with diffraction-limited performance down to the ultraviolet, along with a very accurate pointing and guiding system consistent with HST’s capabilities. If all this could be done at a cost competitive with that of a servicing mission, still taking into account provisions for Hubble reentry, it would be scientifically attractive. However, preliminary cost information provided to the committee suggested that the savings would not be large. Moreover, all options for rehosting take time to evaluate, select, and develop, and all options carry the risk that a new spacecraft may ultimately fail to operate to specifications. By contrast, Hubble is a proven platform on orbit now, to which several successful servicing missions have already been sent.
Representative terms from entire chapter:
hubble space |
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies 5 Trends in the Timing of First Marriage Among Men and Women in the Developing World Barbara S. Mensch, Susheela Singh, and John B. Casterline For many demographers age at first union is worthy of attention because of the close link between marriage and the onset of childbearing. Thus a number of studies over the years have documented the contribution of changes in the timing of marriage to fertility transitions, both historically in developed countries and currently in developing countries (e.g., Casterline, 1994; Coale and Treadway, 1986; Rosero-Bixby, 1996). It has been argued, however, that “weaknesses in the field of nuptiality research stem from its heavy focus on the fertility implications of nuptiality patterns” (Smith, 1983, p. 510). In charging his fellow demographers to think more broadly about the subject of marriage, van de Walle (1993, p. 118) asserts that we should care about marriage patterns “in their own right” because understanding “nuptiality change could further the understanding of other social change.” Indeed, for those interested in family formation, the timing of first union merits investigation not only because it signals the initiation of reproductive life, but also because the marriage process reflects the way family life is organized and functions in a particular culture and because when, who, and how one marries all have implications for gender relations within society (Malhotra, 1997). in the developing world. If, for example, men are now postponing marriage because of greater expectations about job status and employment stability and the material possessions needed to form a household, and
OCR for page 119
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies women. While focus on marriage prior to age 18, the internationally established age of adulthood, has gained prominence, research has yet to establish the 1 There are also several studies that predate van de Walle’s call for further research. Fricke, Syed, and Smith’s (1986) analysis of marriage timing strategies in Pakistan is noteworthy as is Lesthaeghe, Kaufman, and Meekers (1989) investigation of nuptiality regimes in sub-Saharan Africa, where the timing of marriage and the practice of polygyny were explored in great depth. This latter study was path breaking in linking ethnographic data (including measures of dependence on subsistence agriculture, lineage systems, inheritance, and presence of various types of chiefs) to demographic data. Malhotra and Tsui’s (1996) study of the effect of norms about marriage—including the importance of setting up an independent household, the desire to work before marriage, and expectations about arranged marriage—on marriage timing in Sri Lanka is also an important contribution to the literature. To the best of our knowledge, it is the only analysis of marriage that uses panel data; however, while the attitudinal variables included in the event history models are measured prior to marriage, they are still likely to be endogenous to marriage timing.
OCR for page 120
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies causal links between early marriage and poor outcomes among women. Is it early marriage in and of itself that is the problem or is it the characteristics of those who marry early? In contrast to the extensive documentation of female age at marriage, the literature on men is quite sparse (Malhotra, 1997). In part this limited attention to men is because demographic surveys, up until the last decade or so, have been restricted to women. But it is also due to the fact that across a wide spectrum of countries and cultures, relatively few men marry during the teenage years, and it is early marriage that is considered problematic and thus worthy of consideration. In this chapter we will examine trends in the timing of first marriage or union for men and women. We define marriage broadly to include all socially recognized unions, including legal marriage as well as any other type of union that is recognized and reported in particular countries. The principal focus is on documenting trends in the age at marriage for the major regions of the developing world; however, the chapter also addresses a few subthemes: the current extent of early marriage, differences between men and women in trends in age at marriage, and the association between age at marriage and sociodemographic characteristics, specifically education and rural-urban residence. To the extent that changing patterns of behavior are revealed, we will try to identify to what such transformations might be attributed and draw on the demographic literature to provide insights. UNDERSTANDING MARRIAGE TIMING A number of scholars have conducted research on marriage timing. We begin with a brief review of the contributions of various social science disciplines to an understanding of age at marriage. Historical Demography Historical demographers have done an admirable job of documenting marriage patterns throughout Europe over the last few hundred years; however, they have fared less well in identifying a particular set of factors that explains trends across cultures. Hajnal (1965) first observed what he called a “European” pattern with late age at marriage and high proportions unmarried. In describing this distinctive pattern that existed from at least as early as the eighteenth century, he hypothesized that an association existed between marriage and household formation, arguing that when marriage involved the establishment of a new household, as it did in much of Western and Northern Europe, resource and skill acquisition were determining factors in the decision to wed. Wrigley and colleagues (1997, p. 122), in
OCR for page 121
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies their history of English population from the end of the sixteenth century to the beginning of the nineteenth century, supported this view, concluding not only that “the pattern that Hajnal identified was of long standing in England,” but also that the decision to marry hinged on the ability to set up an independent household. While many have noted its “tremendous influence in the historical study of European marriage” (Ehmer, 2002, p. 306), Hajnal’s theory of the links between age at marriage and economic self-sufficiency is not without its critics. Watkins (1986, p. 325), in her investigation of marriage in Europe between 1870 and 1960, reveals the inadequacy of Hajnal’s explanation, at least in understanding change at the level of geographic aggregates. Examination of provincial data from the late nineteenth century reveals that nuptiality patterns were similar in neighboring provinces, but not necessarily within regions of a particular country. She argues that these contiguous regions shared a common culture and language and not necessarily common occupational structures, suggesting that societal conventions with regard to the timing of marriage existed independent of particular economic conditions. Other studies also suggest that the decision about when to marry may be rooted as much in societal norms as in economic realities. Lynch (1991), examining the experience in cities in Northwest Europe, observed that the pattern of late age at marriage and high rates of celibacy that characterized village society also described more urbanized areas in the nineteenth century. Although she presents herself as an adherent of Hajnal, her argument that the European Marriage Pattern prevailed even as Malthusian constraints weakened with the rise of fertility control is not consistent with a theory that connects age at marriage to economic resources. She claims that late age at marriage represents a set of cultural values, albeit values that emanated, in part, from economic realities of times past. Individual country studies also reveal the inadequacy of an explanation linking household structure, the economic environment, and age at marriage. For example, an analysis of data from an agricultural region of north-central Italy in the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries revealed that women married quite late, on average around 24 to 25, despite the fact that multiple-family households were common and patrilocal residence was the norm. Moreover, marriage age did not decline throughout “a period of dramatic social and economic changes,” when wage labor supplanted share-cropping (Kertzer and Hogan, 1991, p. 34). In Ireland, even as incomes began to rise in the late nineteenth century, celibacy and late age of marriage continued to prevail (Guinnane, 1991). Proto-industrialization, which provided wage-earning opportunities for young men and women, did not always lead to reduced age at marriage, as Gutmann and Leboutte (1984) demonstrate for Eastern Belgium. They argue that land ownership patterns, the speed with which industrial development takes place, and the nature of
OCR for page 122
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies that industry all play a role in the timing of marriage. Furthermore, case studies from other areas in Europe do not show a strong association between occupational groups and age at marriage (Kertzer and Hogan, 1991). These demographic studies of historical Europe are useful for those investigating marriage in the developing world if only to emphasize that nuptiality trends defy easy explanation; while age at marriage is likely to be sensitive to the economic environment, the roots of particular marriage patterns would appear to lie in the distinctiveness of individual family systems.2 Social Anthropology For social anthropologists, kinship systems—which include marriage rules and residential arrangements—have traditionally been a focal, if not the focal subject of ethnographic inquiry. While much effort has gone into documenting spouse selection patterns, living arrangements after marriage, and inheritance systems, the subject of age at marriage has been incidental to the larger goal of describing the way in which the overall kinship system and marriage rules function to maintain social order. The structural-functionalist approach to kinship dominated cultural anthropology throughout much of the twentieth century. Although this paradigm is now considered overly “static” and even “obsolete” (Das Gupta, 1997, p. 36), many anthropologists are still interested in kinship patterns. However, the focus is no longer on delineating complicated marriage rules. Rather, kinship is explored within its broader political and economic context with a view toward understanding social change. Ahearn’s (2001) ethnographic study of the way in which increased literacy and exposure to Hindi soap operas has led to a shift away from arranged and capture marriages toward love marriages in a Nepalese village is an example of this new type of kinship research. Yet she pays no attention to whether this transformation in the marriage process has had an effect on the timing of marriage. As was true of earlier kinship studies, no discussion of age at marriage is provided. A collaborative study between anthropologists and demographers, also conducted in a Nepalese village, does focus explicitly on age at marriage. In the introduction to their chapter, Dahal, Fricke, and Thornton (1993, p. 305) explain why anthropologists should not ignore marriage timing: 2 We thank George Alter for educating us on recent scholarship in historical demography as well as emphasizing the uniqueness of individual family systems and pointing out the danger in generalizing from Europe to the rest of the world (G. Alter, personal communication, April 23, 2004).
OCR for page 123
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies If particular marriage forms are evidence of wider strategies of social reproduction … then the timing of marriage should itself be seen as a part of that process. Thus marriage timing is no less the proper study of anthropology than any other element of marriage behavior. At the same time, marriage timing should be seen to have implications beyond the merely demographic. They are critical of even the “most anthropologically informed demographers” who ignore family context in explaining age of marriage, and include only individual factors, such as education, to elucidate behavior change. Indeed, the explanatory variables used in this examination of Nepal set the research apart from conventional survey analyses. In addition to asking the standard demographic questions, information was collected on marriage characteristics of the parental generation, including measures of kin status of parents (cross-cousin or not), the nature of material exchange at their marriage, and the relative land holding of their families. Data were also collected on mothers’ characteristics, including the inheritance at marriage and whether Nepali is spoken as well as the local language, all measures that reflect social status. Family context, namely “access to kin and marriage partner networks, intergenerational control and the prestige of natal groups,” is found to be significant in explaining marriage timing (Dahal, Fricker, and Thornton, 1993, p. 319). Sociology Family sociologists, in contrast to social anthropologists, have not generally considered marriage patterns in developing countries to be within their purview. Goode’s classic volume, World Revolution and Family Patterns, which is one of the standard textbooks of modernization theory, is the exception. Goode emphasizes the “fit” between the conjugal family and modern industrial society with its need for a geographically and socially mobile population. According to Goode, the ideal type of conjugal family excludes relatives from everyday decision making, establishes a new household at the time of marriage, and because the young person selects his or her own partner, is based on mutual attraction between spouses rather than on an alliance between families.3 Writing in 1963, Goode (1963, p. 8) noted that in the West, the age of marriage for both men and women dropped during the twentieth century, leading him to conclude that predicting trends in age at marriage as a function of other secular changes in society is problematic: 3 By conjugal, Goode does not mean nuclear. For him a nuclear family system is one where there is no interaction between relatives.
OCR for page 124
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies When such a [conjugal] system begins to emerge in a society, the age at marriage is likely to change because the goals of marriage change, but whether it will rise or fall cannot be predicted from the characteristics mentioned so far. In a conjugal system, the youngsters must now be old enough to take care of themselves, i.e., they must be as old as the economic system forces them to be in order to be independent at marriage. Goode does not argue that industrialization and urbanization “caused” a change in family patterns in the West; rather, he observes that the family has had an independent effect on the development of industrialization in the West. He claims that “no one has yet succeeded in stating the determinate relations between family systems and economic or technological systems” (Goode, 1963, p. 22). Although Goode was writing 40 years ago, we would argue that success still eludes us. With the exception of the work) research on South Asia (see footnote 1), few demographic studies explore the timing and process of marriage in developing countries in any depth. In part this is a function of the limited breadth of the typical demographic survey. In contrast, the Asian Marriage Surveys, which were used by Malhotra (1991, 1997) and Fricke, Syed, and Smith (1986), collected extensive data on the marriage process. However, these surveys have limited utility for analyses of marriage timing because of a restriction to those who are married. Economics Economists have been less concerned than other social scientists with explaining marital behavior in the developing world. To the extent that they have been interested in marriage, the focus has been on modeling assortative mating (Montgomery and Sulak, 1989) and the increase in dowry payments in South Asia (Rao, 1993a, 1993b). Absent Gary Becker’s (1973) seminal article on the theory of marriage, economists have paid much less attention to age at marriage. According to Becker, marriage is yet another manifestation of utility-maximizing behavior; people wed when the utility of being married exceeds that of being single. At the core of his argument is the notion that men and women bring different attributes to marriage and have different roles, such that there is “positive assortative mating of complementary traits” (Boulier and Rosenzweig, 1984, p. 714). As the wage differential between men and women narrows and presumably as women and men begin to substitute for one another, women’s incentive to marry decreases. Since publication of Becker’s theory, few economists
OCR for page 125
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies have produced empirical analyses of marriage in the developing world. Using data from the early 1970s in the Philippines, Boulier and Rosenzweig (1984) provide confirmation of Becker’s theory of marriage; they demonstrate that while the effect of education on age of marriage is exaggerated in models that treat education as exogenous, additional schooling does lead women to marry later. Brien and Lillard (1994) show that controlling for the effect of delayed marriage on education, that is, for the potential endogeneity of education, later age at marriage among women in Malaysia is explained in large part by increased enrollment and attainment. As Becker would predict, with increased schooling, the opportunity cost of marriage rises for women. However, no explanation is given for the continued significance of ethnicity in models of marriage timing. With the exception of Becker’s work, we have few theories that explicitly address age at marriage, even fewer studies that economists would consider acceptable in addressing the endogeneity problems that arise in studies of the determinants of marriage timing, and still fewer studies that collect the appropriate data to adequately explain when people marry. That said, a considerable literature on the correlates of age at marriage exists, as does speculation about determinants and trends, particularly about reasons for the increase in age of marriage among women. In the next section, we will analyze data on age at marriage from 83 developing countries. We will then return to the demographic literature to help us shed light on the trends we observe. DATA SOURCES Data on the age at first marriage are obtained from two sources: (1) a database compiled by the United Nations (UN) Population Division that draws in part from population censuses, and (2) nationally representative DHS. The UN database provides the percentage of the population married in 5-year age groups for most developing countries (United Nations Population Division, 2000). For this analysis, we consider all countries in Africa, Asia, and Latin America with the exception of those identified by the World Bank as “high income” and those with a population of less than 140,0004 (World Bank, 2002).5 Given the chapter’s focus on trends, we have identi- 4 If a country had fewer than 140,000 in population, the UN did not provide data. 5 Income data for all countries but East Timor were obtained from the World Bank’s 2002 World Development Indicators. For East Timor, the income data were obtained from the World Bank website.
OCR for page 126
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies fied 746 countries of the 1177 that meet our criteria for which recent data, that is, data collected in 1990 or later, are available and for which information exists from two censuses or surveys at least 10 years apart. For analyses based on this database, we excluded countries for which a census or survey was not available for both sexes; moreover, we used the same data set for both men and women even if a more recent census or survey was available for women because we wanted to have fully comparable data for both sexes. There are 1.4 billion young people ages 10 to 24 in these 117 countries; 87 percent or 1.2 billion are resident in the 73 countries for which data on trends in proportions married are available. Coverage varies considerably by region. These data represent approximately 90 percent or more of the population in East and Southern Africa, South Central and Southeast Asia, East Asia, South America and the Caribbean, and Central America, but only 63 percent of the population in the Middle East, 31 percent in West and Middle Africa, and 38 percent in the former Soviet Asia. Note that results for the subregion of East Asia consist entirely of China, as data are unavailable for the two other countries, Mongolia and North Korea. Populous countries for which data are unavailable from the UN database include Afghanistan, Algeria, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Ghana, Iraq, Nigeria, Saudi Arabia, Uzbekistan, and Vietnam. Survey data come from the DHS carried out by Macro International Inc.8 The data on age at marriage are obtained in personal interviews with nationally representative samples of individual respondents of reproductive age and are part of an extensive questionnaire covering a full range of sexual and reproductive behaviors. Surveys of women (typically ages 15 to 49) were available for 51 countries in South and Southeast Asia, North 6 Data are not available for 15- to 19-year-olds for Argentina and data are not available for 20- to 29-year-olds for Bahrain due to nonstandard age groups. However, for other age groups, the data for these countries are included. 7 According to the United Nations (2003), there are a total of 152 countries in Asia, Africa, and Latin America. Thirteen of these contain fewer than 140,000 in population, 16 are listed by the World Bank as high income, and 5 have no World Bank income data. Note that updates of country income groupings on the World Bank website () as of September 30, 2002, led the panel to make a few adjustments to these country groupings including shifting South Korea into the high-income group and therefore out of the developing country group. 8 The DHS is limited to the household population. Ordinarily they do not survey persons residing in institutions, which may include military personnel and perhaps even students in boarding schools and university dormitories, although this varies by country. The data are also subject to nonresponse error. As compared to rates for surveys in high-income countries, nonresponse rates in the DHS are low. However, the rate can be assumed to be higher for unmarried young adults, especially young adult males, than for older adults.
OCR for page 127
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Africa and the Middle East, sub-Saharan Africa, and Latin America and the Caribbean; surveys of men (ages 15 to 59, in most cases) were available for 32 countries, 29 in sub-Saharan Africa, Latin America, and the Caribbean.9 Note that unmarried women were not included in the survey of individual women for a number of surveys in Asia and the Middle East. However, unmarried women are listed in the household survey and information on their age, education, and rural-urban location is obtained for these countries, with some exceptions noted in the relevant tables. Using weights provided as part of the microdata files, we adjust for the missing unmarried women by age, place of residence, and education, so that the denominators for the proportion married correctly include all women in the respective subgroups. The country-specific data are aggregated into averages for subregions (using United Nations geographic groupings10), weighting countries according to their population size. For both sets of data, weighted averages are calculated, where the weights are the country’s percentage of the region’s population or income grouping’s population ages 10 to 24 based on UN estimates in 2000.11 There are a few countries for which DHS data are available but UN data are not. For example, while there is a DHS for Nigeria, the most populous country in sub-Saharan Africa, the UN does not provide data for the two time periods required for both men and women. Table 5-1 provides a list of the individual countries from each source. Census data, which are the main source for the database compiled by the UN Population Division, are generally reported by the head of the household, not by individual household members themselves. By comparison, the DHS data on marital status and age at marriage are obtained by personal interviews with the individual respondents themselves with the exception of unmarried women in some Asian and Middle Eastern countries, as mentioned above. As noted earlier, in this chapter we apply the broad definition of marriage generally used by cross-country comparative studies, that is, marriage is defined to include all of the different forms of socially recognized unions: cohabitation, consensual unions, “free unions,” and marriage that is legiti- 9 As we indicated, the analyses based on UN data only include countries where data for both men and women are available. Given that the vast majority of countries have data for both sexes, this restriction is not at all onerous. However, for analyses based on DHS data, we did not limit ourselves to countries where data were available for both sexes because we would be left with too few countries. 10 The individual country data are available from the authors. 11 Note that the weights are each country’s percentage of the 2000 population ages 10-24 for all countries included in our sample for that region and not for all countries in the region (United Nations Population Division, Department of Economic and Social Affairs, 2001).
OCR for page 128
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies TABLE 5-1 Country Lists by Region United Nations Database on Marriage Country Regiona Census/Survey Year 1 Census/Survey Year 2 Belize Carib/CA 1980 1991 Dominican Republic Carib/CA 1981 1996 El Salvador Carib/CA 1971 1992 Guatemala Carib/CA 1973 1990 Haiti Carib/CA 1989 2000 Mexico Carib/CA 1980 1990 Nicaragua Carib/CA 1971 1998 Panama Carib/CA 1980 1990 Puerto Rico Carib/CA 1980 1990 Trinidad and Tobago Carib/CA 1980 1990 Botswana E/S Africa 1981 1991 Burundi E/S Africa 1979 1990 Comoros E/S Africa 1980 1996 Ethiopia E/S Africa 1984 2000 Kenya E/S Africa 1969 1998 Malawi E/S Africa 1987 2000 Mauritius E/S Africa 1972 1990 Mozambique E/S Africa 1980 1997 Namibia E/S Africa 1960 1991 Rwanda E/S Africa 1978 1996 South Africa E/S Africa 1985 1996 Tanzania E/S Africa 1978 1996 Uganda E/S Africa 1969 1995 Zambia E/S Africa 1980 1999 Zimbabwe E/S Africa 1982 1999 China EA 1987 1999 Bahrain ME 1981 1991 Egypt ME 1986 1996 Jordan ME 1979 1994 Morocco ME 1982 1994 Occup. Palestinian Territory ME 1967 1997 Sudan ME 1983 1993 Tunisia ME 1984 1994 Turkey ME 1980 1990 Argentina SA 1980 1991 Bolivia SA 1988 1998 Brazil SA 1980 1996 Chile SA 1982 1992 Colombia SA 1973 1993 Ecuador SA 1974 1990 Guyana SA 1980 1991 Paraguay SA 1982 1992 Peru SA 1981 1996
OCR for page 161
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies More fundamentally, a transformation in the nature of the household economy is said to have occurred., p. 5). In countries as diverse as Sri Lanka and Nigeria, researchers have observed that economic considerations apparently factor much more into the decision about the timing of a man’s marriage than they did earlier. In Sri Lanka, with increasing industrialization, a man’s job status, which was not considered important in the past—particularly where subsistence agriculture was the dominant form of economic life—is now said to be critical in determining when he marries (De Silva, 1997). In Nigeria, where a consid- FIGURE 5-5 Association between change in percentage of 20- to 24-year-old men married and change in percentage of population living in urban areas, 1960-2001. NOTE: Bahrain excluded; nonstandard age grouping. SOURCE: United Nations Population Division data, 72 countries, 1960-2001. See Table 5-1 for list of countries.
OCR for page 162
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies erable decline has taken place in early marriage among men, the oil boom in the 1970s fueled a change in brides’ expectations of what purchases grooms needed to marry (National Research Council, 1993). In Egypt, where housing, furniture, and appliances are considered essential for marriage and “the bulk of financial obligation … are still borne … by the groom and his family,” the cost of marriage is estimated to have increased dramatically in the last 30 years (Singerman and Ibrahim, 2003, p. 97), although it may be the quantity and quality of items that one is expected to acquire that has increased rather than the cost of basic household necessities. A rigorous analysis linking the expense of setting up a household to the timing of marriage in Egypt does not exist. However, the proportion of individuals in the census marriage registration category, katb al-kitaab, where the marriage was registered but the couple had yet to establish a marital residence, increased four-fold between 1986 and 1996, while the annual rate of marriage barely changed, indirect evidence that rising costs have led to a delay in the ceremony (Singerman and Ibrahim, 2003). This piece of evidence does not firmly establish a link between the rise in the age of marriage and the costs of marriage. The question is whether the rising cost of establishing a household in Egypt and elsewhere affects the timing of marriage across all segments of society or whether the poorest members have lower expectations, are less constrained financially, and paradoxically have seen less of a delay in age at marriage. As with women, one also wonders whether some global changes have emerged that are influencing the timing of marriage among men. Increasing exposure to Western media may affect consumer norms and raise expectations such that young men in many societies increasingly feel obligated to postpone marriage until they have acquired the resources that are now expected for the establishment of a household. Given the current size of youth cohorts in the developing world and the difficulty of ensuring adequate employment opportunities for such vast numbers of young people, postponement of marriage among men by several years, possibly until their 30s or beyond may become increasingly common in many societies. CONSEQUENCES OF CHANGING AGE AT MARRIAGE Although we have documented and offered explanations for the trends in age of marriage, we have not examined the impact of changing age at marriage on the lives of young people largely because, while speculation abounds, the number of rigorous studies on this topic is extremely limited. Nonetheless, the subject is worth considering, if only to stimulate more research in this area. While separating selection effects from consequences has proven difficult, the assumption is that marriage during the teen years is deleterious for women: Schooling may be curtailed, autonomy limited—because young
OCR for page 163
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies brides tend to marry older men—and sexual relations uninformed and perhaps even coercive or dangerous to women’s health (Clark, 2004; Jejeebhoy, 1995; Mensch, Bruce, and Greene, 1998; Singh and Samara, 1996; UNICEF, 2001). Other than increasing the risk of a premarital pregnancy, delaying marriage into the 20s is generally believed to benefit women.27 As for men, although studies are also lacking, it seems reasonable that postponement of marriage, beyond a certain point, may not be considered universally positive, even if rising expectations and not declining economic circumstances are driving the delay. Indeed, a late age of marriage, if it arises from limited resources, may not be viewed as desirable by young men—it may be a source of frustration, particularly where premarital sex is not condoned. Qualitative research would be valuable on the negative psychosocial effects of delaying marriage, particularly in regions, such as the Middle East, where interaction between unmarried men and women is restricted. Age at Marriage and HIV Risk In a discussion of consequences of age at marriage, the HIV epidemic brings some new factors into consideration. Given the over-riding importance of reducing HIV, we focus on examining what is known, as well as, plausible hypotheses, about the association between women’s age at marriage, the age-gap between partners, and HIV risk. Delaying age at marriage for women, if it delays sex, should reduce the age-specific rate of HIV among young women. In 13 of the 24 sub-Saharan countries where the probability of marrying by age 18 has declined in the last 20 years, the overall proportion of women having sex by age 18 also declined significantly (Mensch et al., 2005). Further, there is evidence that unmarried sexually active adolescents have lower rates of HIV than their married counterparts in sub-Saharan Africa (Clark, 2004). Analysis of DHS data indicates that compared to the unmarried, married adolescents have a higher frequency of sex, are less likely to use condoms, and have older sexual partners, namely their husbands, who are more likely to be HIV positive (Clark, 2004). Thus even if later marriage does not lead to a delay in sexual debut, the argument is that the nature of sexual activity among married women puts them at higher risk of HIV than their unmarried counterparts. 27 In societies where women traditionally marry early and where women’s autonomy is severely limited, a delay in age at marriage may have no impact on the lives of young women. Those who marry later may be equally constrained in terms of mobility, household decision making and employment. This observation was made by Nan Astone at a March 2003 meeting of the NRC/IOM panel on Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries.
OCR for page 164
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies These findings warrant at least four caveats, however. First, the assertion that the level of infection is higher among the married compared to the single is based on prevalence rather than incidence data. Prevalence data obscure the possibility that young married girls may have become infected when single and infected adolescent girls may be more likely to select into early marriage. Second, even if early marriage elevates HIV risk for adolescent girls, in the long run marriage may prove to be more protective than remaining single and sexually active. Data from Rakai, Uganda, indicate that on average across all age groups HIV incidence is higher among the never married than among the currently married and highest among those previously married (Gray et al., 2004). To determine how marital status affects HIV risk it is necessary to conduct epidemiological studies using longitudinal data. Third, the risk of contracting HIV depends not only on one’s sexual partner’s sero-status, but also, if positive, when the partner became infected. A woman may be more likely to contract HIV if she has sex with a newly infected partner because viral loads, which are estimated to be strongly predictive of the risk of transmission (see Quinn et al., 2000; Gray et al., 2001), are high at the time of infection (see Anderson, 1996). Although infectivity is likely to vary systematically by age of the man, we do not have data on the infectivity rate of partners of married and unmarried adolescent girls to determine which group’s partners put them at greater risk of acquiring HIV. Sexually active, never married women are more likely to change partners than currently married women (Alan Guttmacher Institute, 1998; Ferry et al., 2001), which raises the risk of encountering an infected partner. Moreover, the male partners of unmarried women are more apt to be single and, in turn, are more likely to have multiple sexual partners than are men in monogamous unions (Alan Guttmacher Institute, 2003). However, if those in polygamous unions are included, married men may be more likely to have a greater number of sexual partners than single men, as is observed in Rakai (Gray et al., 2004).28 With the data currently at hand, definitive statements about the effect of marriage delay on HIV risk canot be made; moreover, the association probably varies by social setting. While later marriage delay may lead to later onset, it may also result in higher lifetime rates of HIV infection. An additional concern is women’s HIV status when bearing children. One consequence of delayed marriage may be that women are more likely to be infected during pregnancy, although one study found no evidence to support this speculation (Clark, 2004). 28 This analysis of the consequences of delayed marriage for HIV risk among women also draws on discussions that took place at a November 10, 2004, Population Council workshop on Marriage and HIV/AIDS. For a more detailed discussion of some of these issues see Bongaarts (2005).
OCR for page 165
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies As is the case for women, the health consequences of delayed marriage are unknown for men. Although marriage does not impose sexual exclusivity on men, in countries where premarital sex is prevalent, a delay in marriage may increase exposure to HIV and other STDs because, as noted above, compared to married men, a greater percentage of the unmarried have multiple sexual partners (see Appendix Table 3, Alan Guttmacher Institute, 2003). Alternatively, in countries where postpartum abstinence taboos are still present and men marry early, they may be more likely to engage in intercourse with other partners including commercial sex workers during the post-partum period. Clearly more research is needed on the linkages between changing age at marriage, sexual behavior, condom use, and HIV risk among both men and women. CONCLUSIONS During the last 30 years, for most developing country regions, substantial declines have occurred in the proportion of young men and women married; the clear exceptions are South America for men and women, and, for men only, South and Southeast Asia. Given differentials in male and female marriage ages by years of schooling and residence, we assessed whether the decline in the percentage of young people married is related to increases in educational attainment and urbanization. Expansion of schooling for women has had some impact, but there is still a considerable fraction of the increase not explained by changes in education. We asserted that a proper investigation of the association between education and age at marriage would look beyond such factors as years of schooling to what goes on within the school itself, as well as changes in the value of education, which is likely to vary across settings. In suggesting other factors that might account for some of the increase in age of marriage among women, we reviewed a considerable number of demographic studies. Contributory factors examined in the literature and considered here include the decline in arranged marriages, the deficit of available older men with increasing cohort size and the concomitant rise in the cost of dowries in South Asia, changes in the legal age of marriage, and a transformation in global norms about the desirability of early marriage of women. We noted that there is a much smaller literature on age of marriage of men. While increasing educational attainment of men is also believed to contribute to a delay, we found no evidence of this in sub-Saharan Africa. We suggested that increasing costs of establishing a household may lead men to postpone marriage. This data analysis and review of the literature revealed that there is much that we do not know about changes in the timing of marriage for men and women and the consequences of these changes for health and other out-
OCR for page 166
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies comes. To better understand the dynamics of union formation, demographic surveys need to collect information on the social, cultural, and economic factors that affect life decisions among young people, including the contextual factors that reflect the opportunity structures available. Greater attention to the shift in the marriage process including the apparent decline in arranged marriages and the increase in marriages based on mutual attraction would also be useful as both have implications for partner communication and decision-making processes regarding family building. In so doing a more nuanced understanding of marriage, one of the key transitions in the pathway from adolescence to adulthood, can be developed. REFERENCES Abbasi, M.J., Mehryar, A., Jones, G., and McDonald, P. (2002). Revolution, war, and modernization: Population policy and fertility change in Iran. Journal of Population Research, 19(1), 25-46. Ahearn, L.M. (2001). Invitations to love: Literacy, love letters, and social change in Nepal. Ann Arbor: University of Michigan Press. Alan Guttmacher Institute. (1998). Into a new world: Young women’s sexual and reproductive lives. New York: Author. Alan Guttmacher Institute. (2003). In their own right: Addressing the sexual and reproductive health needs of men worldwide. New York: Author Amin, S. (2000). Gender, governance, and the making of a new population policy in Bangladesh. Paper presented at panel discussion on Globalization and Some Aspects of Recent Social Changes in Rural Bangladesh at the annual meeting of the American Rural Sociological Society, August 14, Washington, DC. Amin, S., and Cain, M. (1997). The rise of dowry in Bangladesh. In G.W. Jones, R.M. Douglas, J.C. Caldwell, and R.M. D’Souza (Eds.), The continuing demographic transition (pp. 290-306). Oxford, England: Clarendon Press. Amin, S., Mahmud, S., and Huq, L. (2002). Marriage. In Baseline survey report on rural adolescents in Bangladesh: Kishori Abhijan Project. Dhaka, Bangladesh: UNICEF and Department of Women’s Affairs, Ministry of Women and Children Affairs. Anderson, R.M. (1996). The spread of HIV and sexual mixing patterns. In J. Mann and D. Tarantola (Eds.), AIDS in the world (vol. II, pp. 71-86). New York: Oxford University Press. Anderson, S. (2003). Why dowry payments declined with modernization in Europe but are rising in India. Journal of Political Economy, 111(2), 269-310. Assaad, R., and Zouari, S. (2002). The timing of marriage, fertility, and female labor force participation in urban Morocco. Paper presented at the ERF 9th Annual Conference, October 26-28, Sharjah, United Arab Emirates. Becker, G. (1973). A theory of marriage. In T.W. Schultz (Ed.), Economics of the family: Marriage, children, and human capital (pp. 299-344). Chicago, IL: The University of Chicago for the National Bureau of Economic Research. Bhat, P.N.M., and Halli, S.S. (1999). Demography of brideprice and dowry: Causes and consequences of the Indian marriage squeeze. Population Studies, 53(2), 129-148. Billig, M.S. (1992). The marriage squeeze and the rise of groomprice in India’s Kerala State. Journal of Comparative Family Studies, 23(2), 197-216.
OCR for page 167
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Blanc, A.K., and Rutenberg, N. (1990). Assessment of the quality of data on age at first sexual intercourse, age at first marriage, and age at first birth in the Demographic and Health Surveys. In An assessment of DHS-I data quality (pp. 41-79). Columbia, MD: Institute of Resource Development/Macro Systems. Bongaarts, J. (2005). Marriage, sexual behavior, and HIV epidemics in sub-Saharan Africa. Unpublished document. Population Council, New York. Boulier, B.L., and Rosenzweig, M.R. (1984). Schooling, search, and spouse selection: Testing economic theories of marriage and household behavior. Journal of Political Economy, 92(4), 712-732. Boye, A.K., Hill, K., Isaacs, S., and Gordis, D. (1991). Marriage law and practice in the Sahel. Studies in Family Planning, 22(6), 343-349. Brien, M.J., and Lillard, L.A. (1994). Education, marriage, and first conception in Malaysia. Journal of Human Resources, 34(4), 1167-1204. Caldwell, J., Reddy, P.H., and Caldwell, P. (1983). The causes of marriage change in South India. Population Studies, 37(3), 343-361. Casterline, J.B. (1994). Fertility transition in Asia. In T. Locoh and V. Hertrich (Eds.), The onset of fertility transition in sub-Saharan Africa (pp. 69-86). Liège, Belgium: Derouaux Ordina Editions. Center for Reproductive Law and Policy. (1999). Adolescent reproductive rights: Laws and policies to improve their health and lives. New York: Author. Choe, M.K., Thapa, S., and Achmad, S. (2001). Early marriage and childbearing in Indonesia and Nepal. (East-West Center Working Papers, Population Series No. 108-115.) Honolulu, HI: East-West Center. Choe, M.K., Westley, S.B., and Retherford, R.D. (2002). Tradition and change in marriage and family life: The future of population in Asia. Honolulu, HI: East-West Center. Clark, S. (2004). Early marriage and HIV risks in sub-Saharan Africa. Studies in Family Planning, 35(3), 149-160. Coale, A.J., and Treadway, R. (1986). A summary of the changing distribution of overall fertility, marital fertility, and the proportion married in the provinces of Europe. In A.J. Coale and S.C. Watkins (Eds.), The decline of fertility in Europe: The revised proceedings of a conference on the Princeton European Fertility Project (pp. 31-181). Princeton, NJ: Princeton University Press. Dahal, D.R., Fricke, T., and Thornton, A. (1993). The family contexts of marriage timing in Nepal. Ethnology, 32(4), 305-323. Das Gupta, M. (1997). Kinship systems and demographic regimes. In D.I. Kertzer and T. Fricke (Eds.), Anthropological demography: Toward a new synthesis (pp. 36-52). Chicago, IL: University of Chicago Press. De Silva, W.I. (1997). The Ireland of Asia: Trends in marriage timing in Sri Lanka. Asia-Pacific Population Journal, 12(2), 3-24. Deolalikar, A.B., and Rao, V. (1998). The demand for dowries and bride characteristics in marriage: Empirical estimates for rural South-Central India. In M. Krishnaraj, R. Sudarshan, and A. Shariff (Eds.), Gender, population, and development (pp. 122-140). Oxford, England: Oxford University Press. Ehmer, J. (2002). Marriage. In D.I. Kertzer and M. Barbagli (Eds.), Family life in the long nineteenth century 1789-1913, volume two: The history of the European family (pp. 282-321). New Haven, CT: Yale University Press. (Study Group on Heterogeneity of HIV Epidemics in African Cities). AIDS, 15(suppl 4), S41-S50. Fricke, T.E., Syed, S.H., and Smith, P.C. (1986). Rural Punjabi social organization and marriage timing strategies in Pakistan. Demography, 23(4), 489-508.
OCR for page 168
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Gage, A.J., and Meekers, D. (1995). The changing dynamics of family formation: Women’s status and nuptiality in Togo. In P. Makinwa-Adebusoye and A.-M. Jensen (Eds.), Women and demographic change in sub-Saharan Africa (pp. 15-38). Liège, Belgium: International Union for the Scientific Study of Population. Goode, W.J. (1963). World revolution and family patterns. New York: Free Press. Gray, R.H., Nalugoda, F., Serwadda, D., and Wawer, M. (2004). Marriage and HIV risk: Data from Rakai, Uganda. Paper presented at Workshop on Marriage and HIV/AIDS, November 10, New York. Gray, R.H., Wawer, M.J., Brookmeyer, R., Sewankambo, N.K., Serwadda, D., Wabwire-Mangen, F., Lutalo, T., Li, X., vanCott, T., and Quinn, T.C. (2001). Probability of HIV-1 transmission per coital act in monogamous, heterosexual, HIV-1-discordant couples in Rakai, Uganda. Lancet, 357(9263), 1149-1153. Guinnane, T. (1991). Re-thinking the Western European marriage pattern: The decision to marry in Ireland at the turn of the twentieth century. Journal of Family History, 16(1), 47-64. Gutmann, M.P., and Leboutte, R. (1984). Rethinking protoindustrialization and the family. Journal of Interdisciplinary History, 14(3), 587-607. Hajnal, J. (1965). European marriage patterns in perspective. In D.V. Glass and D.E.C. Eversley (Eds.), Population in history: Essays in historical demography (pp. 101-143). London, England: Edward Arnold. Heaton, T.B., Forste, R., and Otterstrom, S.M. (2002). Family transitions in Latin America: First intercourse, first union, and first birth. International Journal of Population Geography, 8, 1-15. Hertrich, V. (2002). Nuptiality and gender relationships in Africa: An overview of first marriage trends over the past 50 years. Paper presented at the annual meeting of the Population Association of America, May 9-11, Atlanta, GA. Hull, T.H. (2002). The marriage revolution in Indonesia. Paper presented at the annual meeting of the Population Association of America, May 9-11, Atlanta, GA. International Center for Research on Women. (2004). Too young to wed: Child marriage in their own words. Available: [accessed August 2004]. International Planned Parenthood Federation and International Women’s Rights Action Watch. (1990). Reproductive rights. Suffolk, England: Lavenham Press. International Planned Parenthood Federation and International Women’s Rights Action Watch. (2000). Reproductive rights 2000. London, England: Terracotta Press. Islam, M.N., and Ahmed, A.U. (1998). Age at first marriage and its determinants in Bangladesh. Asia-Pacific Population Journal, 13(2), 73-92. Jejeebhoy, S. (1995). Education and women’s age at marriage. In S. Jejeebhoy (Ed.), Women’s education, autonomy, and reproductive behaviour: Experience from developing countries (pp. 60-77). Oxford, England: Clarendon Press. Jejeebhoy, S.J., and Halli, S.S. (2002). Marriage patterns in rural India: Influence of sociocultural context. Unpublished document, Population Council, New Delhi, India. Kertzer, D.I., and Hogan, D.P. (1991). Reflections on the European marriage pattern: Share-cropping and proletarianization in Casalecchio, Italy, 1861-1921. Journal of Family History , 16(1), 31-45. Kishor, S. (2003). Uses and limitations of DHS data on age and characteristics of first marriages. Paper presented at UNICEF Global Consultation on Indicators: Female Genital Mutilation/Cutting and Early Marriage, November 11-13, New York. LeGrand, T.K., and Barbieri, M. (2002). The possible effects of child survival on women’s ages at first union and childbirth in sub-Saharan Africa. European Journal of Population, 18, 361-386.
OCR for page 169
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Lesthaeghe, R.J., Kaufman, G., and Meekers, D. (1989). The nuptiality regimes in sub-Saharan Africa. In R.J. Lesthaeghe (Ed.), Reproduction and social organization in sub-Saharan Africa (pp. 238-333). Berkeley: University of California Press. Lindstrom, D.P., and Brambila Paz, C. (2001). Alternative theories of the relationship of schooling and work to family formation: Evidence from Mexico. Social Biology, 48(3-4), 278-297. Lloyd, C.B., and Mensch, B. (1999). Implications of formal schooling for girls’ transitions to adulthood in developing countries. In National Research Council, Committee on Population, C.H. Bledsoe, J.B. Casterline, J.A. Johnson-Kuhn, and J.G. Haaga (Eds.), Critical perspectives on schooling and fertility in the developing world (pp. 80-104). Washington, DC: National Academy Press. Lynch, K.A. (1991). The European marriage pattern in the cities: Variations on a theme by Hajnal. Journal of Family History, 16(1), 79-96. Malhotra, A. (1991). Gender and changing generational relations: Spouse choice in Indonesia. Demography, 28(4), 549-570. Malhotra, A. (1997). Gender and the timing of marriage: Rural-urban differences in Java. Journal of Marriage and the Family, 59(2), 434-450. Malhotra, A., and Tsui, A.O. (1996). Marriage timing in Sri Lanka: The role of modern norms and ideas. Journal of Marriage and the Family, 58(2), 476-490. Mensch, B.S. (2003). Trends in the timing of first marriage. Presentation at the WHO, UNFPA, Population Council Technical Consultation on Married Adolescents, December 9, Geneva, Switzerland. Mensch, B.S., Bruce, J., and Greene, M.E. (1998). The uncharted passage: Girls’ adolescence in the developing world. New York: Population Council. Mensch, B.S., Ibrahim, B.L., Lee, S.M., and El-Gibaly, O. (2003). Gender role attitudes among Egyptian adolescents. Studies in Family Planning, 34(1), 8-18. Mensch, B.S., Grant, M.J., and Blanc, A.K. (2005). The changing context of sexual initiation in sub-Saharan Africa. Paper presented at XXV IUSSP International Population Conference, July 18-23, Tours, France. Montgomery, M.R., and Sulak, D.B. (1989). Female first marriage in East and Southeast-Asia: A Kiefer-Neumann Model. Journal of Development Economics, 30(2), 225-240. National Research Council. (1993). Marriage: New forms, new ambiguities. In Committee on Population, C.H. Bledsoe and B. Cohen (Eds.), Social dynamics of adolescent fertility in sub-Saharan Africa (pp. 37-68). Washington, DC: National Academy Press. National Research Council and Institute of Medicine. (2005). Schooling. In Committee on Population, Panel on Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries, C.B. Lloyd (Ed.), Growing up global: The changing transitions to adulthood in developing countries (pp. 67-167). Washington, DC: The National Academies Press. Population Council. (2002). Unpublished document prepared for Working Group on Girls, United Nations Special Session on Children, May 10, New York. Preston, S.H., Heuveline, P., and Guillot, M. (2001). Demography: Measuring and modeling population processes. Malden, MA: Blackwell. Quinn, T.C., Wawer, M.J., Sewenkambo, N., Serwadda, D., Li, C., Wabwire-Mangen, F., Meehan, M.O., Lutalo, T., and Gray, R.H. (2000). Viral load and heterosexual transmission of human immunodeficiency virus type 1. New England Journal of Medicine, 342(13), 921-929. Rao, V. (1993a). Dowry “inflation” in rural India: A statistical investigation. Population Studies, 47, 283-293. Rao, V. (1993b). The rising price of husbands: A hedonic analysis of dowry increases in rural India. Journal of Political Economy, 101(4), 666-677.
OCR for page 170
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Rash.
OCR for page 171
The Changing Transitions to Adulthood in Developing Countries: Selected Studies Westoff, C.F. (2003). Trends in marriage and early childbearing in developing countries. (DHS Comparative Reports No. 5.) Calverton, MD: ORC Macro. Westoff, C.F., and Bankole, A. (2002). Reproductive preferences in developing countries at the turn of the century. (DHS Comparative Reports No. 2.) Calverton, MD: ORC Macro. Williams, L., and Guest, M.P. (2002). Why marry? Attitudes of urban middle-class respondents in Vietnam, Thailand, and the Philippines. (Population and Development Program Working Paper Series No. 01.01.) Ithaca, NY: Cornell University, Department of Rural Sociology. World Bank. (2002). Development indicators 2002. Washington, DC: World Bank. Wrigley, E.A., Davies, R.S., Oeppen, J.E., and Schofield, R.S. (1997). English population history from family reconstitution 1580-1837. Cambridge, England: Cambridge University Press. Yabiku, S.T. (2003). Neighbors or neighborhoods? Effects on marriage timing in Nepal. Paper presented at the annual meeting of the Population Association of America, May 1-3, Minneapolis, MN. Yabiku, S.T., Axinn, W.G., Ghimire, D.J., and Robinson, K.D. (2002). School characteristics and marriage timing. Paper presented at the annual meeting of the Population Association of America, May 9-11, Atlanta, GA.
Representative terms from entire chapter:
susheela singh |
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application References Adler, R. F., A. J. Negri, P. R. Keehn, and I. M. Hakkarinen. 1992. Estimation of monthly rainfall over Japan and surrounding waters from a combination of low-orbit microwave and geosynchronous IR data. Journal of Applied Meteorology 32:335-356. Adler, R. F., G. J. Huffman, D. T. Bolvin, S. Curtis, and E. J. Nelkin. 2000. Tropical rainfall distributions determined using TRMM combined with other satellite and rain gauge information. Journal of Applied Meteorology 39(12):2007-2023. Adler, R. F., C. Kummerow, D. Bolvin, S. Curtis, and C. Kidd. 2003. Status of TRMM monthly estimates of tropical precipitation. In Symposium on Cloud Systems, Hurricanes and TRMM, W.-K. Tao and R. Adler, eds. Meteorological Monographs 29(51):223-234. Adler, R., A. Hou, J. Halverson, E. Stocker, and V. Moran. 2005. NASA Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission Senior Review Proposal. Greenbelt, MD: NASA Goddard Space Flight Center. Anagnostou, E. N., C. A. Morales, and T. Dinku. 2001. The use of TRMM precipitation radar observations in determining ground radar calibration biases. Journal of Atmospheric and Oceanic Technology 18(4):616-628. Andersson, E., P. Bauer, A. Beljaars, F. Chevallier, E. Holm, M. Janiskova, P. Kallberg, G. Kelly, P. Lopez, A. McNally, E. Moreau, A. J. Simmons, J. N. Thepaut, and A. M. Tompkins. 2005. Assimilation and modeling of the atmospheric hydrological cycle in the ECMWF forecasting system. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 86:387-402. Arkin, P. A. 1979. The relationship between fractional coverage of high cloud and rainfall accumulations during GATE over the B-scale array. Monthly Weather Review 32:1382-1387. Arkin, P. A., and B. N. Meisner. 1987. The relationship between large-scale convective rainfall and cold cloud over the western hemisphere during 1982-1984. Monthly Weather Review 115: 51-74. Ba, M. B., and A. Gruber. 2001. GOES multispectral rainfall algorithm (GMSRA). Journal of Applied Meteorology 40:1500-1514. Barrett, E. C., and M. J. Beaumont. 1994. Satellite rainfall monitoring: An overview. Remote Sensing Reviews 11:23-48. Bauer, P. 2005. International Perspective on Future Precipitation Measuring Missions. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washing-ton, D.C., October 19, 2005.
OCR for page 102
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Bauer, P., P. Lopez, A. Benedetti, D. Salmond, and E. Moreau. 2006a. Implementation of 1D+4D-Var assimilation of precipitation-affected microwave radiances at ECMWF, Part I: 1D-Var. ECMWF Technical Memorandum No. 487. Reading, UK: European Centre for Medium-range Weather Forecasts (ECMWF). Bauer, P., P. Lopez, A. Benedetti, D. Salmond, S. Saarinen, and M. Bonazzola. 2006b. Implementation of 1D+4D-Var assimilation of precipitation-affected microwave radiances at ECMWF, Part II: 4D-Var. ECMWF Technical Memorandum No. 488. Reading, UK: European Centre for Medium-range Weather Forecasts (ECMWF). Benedetti, A., P. Lopez, P. Bauer, and E. Moreau. 2005. Experimental use of TRMM precipitation radar observations in 1D+4D-Var assimilation. Quarterly Journal of the Royal Meteorological Society 131:2473-2495. Bennartz, R., and R. Ferraro, eds. 2005. Report on the IPWG/GPM/GRP Workshop on Global Microwave Modeling and Retrieval of Snowfall. October 11-13, 2005. University of Wisconsin, Madison, WI. Available at. Accessed June 11, 2006. Berg, W., T. L’Ecuyer, and C. Kummerow. 2006. Rainfall climate regimes: The relationship of regional TRMM rainfall biases to the environment. Journal of Applied Meteorology 45:434-454. Bidwell, S. W., J. F. Durning, D. F. Everett, M. R. Schwaller, E. A. Smith, and D. B. Wolff. 2004. Preparations for Global Precipitation Measurement (GPM) Ground Validation. Presented at International Geoscience and Remote Sensing Symposium (IGARSS), Anchorage, Alaska, September 20-24. Bringi, V. N., and V. Chandrasekar. 2001. Polarimetric Doppler Weather Radar: Principles and Applications. Cambridge, UK: Cambridge University Press. Chandrasekar, V., S. M. Bolen, and E. Gorgucci. 2003a. Microphysical cross validation of spaceborne radar and ground polarimetric radar. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 41(10):2153-2165. Chandrasekar, V., R. Meneghini, and I. Zawadzki. 2003b. Global and local precipitation measurements by radar. Meteorological Monographs (AMS) 30(52):215. Chandrasekar, V., W. Li, and B. Zafar. 2005. Estimation of raindrop size distribution from space borne radar observations. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 43(5):1078-1086. Crow, W. T., R. Bindlish, and T. J. Jackson. 2005. The added value of spaceborne passive microwave soil moisture retrievals for forecasting rainfall-runoff partitioning. Geophysical Research Letters 32:L18401.. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 86(7):961-982. Dittberner, G. 2005. The Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions: Context and Sponsor Remarks. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005. Dittberner, G. 2006. GPM Transition to Operations. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Irvine, CA, February 28, 2006. Drusch, M., E. F. Wood, and H. Gao. 2005. Observation operators for the direct assimilation of TRMM microwave imager retrieved soil moisture. Geophysical Research Letters 32:L15403. Ferraro, R. 2006. Operational Uses for Global Precipitation Measurement (GPM) Data at NOAA. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Irvine, CA, February 28, 2006. Ferraro, R., P. Pellegrino, M. Turk, W. Chen, S. Qiu, R. Kuligowski, S. Kusselson, A. Irving, S. Kidder, and J. Knaff. 2005. The Tropical Rainfall Potential. Part 2: Validation. Weather and Forecasting 20:465-475.
OCR for page 103
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Flaming, G. M. 2004. Measurement of Global Precipitation. Presented at International Geoscience and Remote Sensing Symposium (IGARSS), Anchorage, Alaska, September 20-24, 2004. Gaiser, P. W., K. M. St. Germain, E. M. Twarog, G. A. Poe, W. Purdy, D. Richardson, W. Grossman, W. L. Jones, D. Spencer, G. Golba, J. Cleveland, L. Choy, R. M. Bevilacqua, and P. S. Chang. 2004. The WindSat spaceborne polarimetric microwave radiometer: Sensor description and early orbit performance. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 42:2347-2361. Goldberg, M. 2005. A Concept and Strategy for a Global Space-based Inter-calibration System (GSICS). Geneva: World Meteorological Organization Space Programme Office. Greenwald, T., R. Bennartz, C. O’Dell, and A. Heidinger. 2005. Fast computation of microwave radiances for data assimilation using the “successive order of scattering” method. Journal of Applied Meteorology 44:960-966. Haddad, Z. S., E. A. Smith, C. D. Kummerow, T. Iguchi, M. R. Farrar, S. L. Durden, M. Alves, and W. S. Olson. 1997. The TRMM ‘day-1’ radar/radiometer combined rain-profiling algorithm. Journal of the Meteorological Society of Japan 75:799-809. Hawkins, J. D., T. F. Lee, K. Richardson, C. Sampson, F. J. Turk, and J. E. Kent. 2001. Satellite multi-sensor tropical cyclone structure monitoring. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 82(4):567-578. Hoffman, C. 2006. National Polar-orbiting Operational Environmental Satellite System (NPOESS) Program Status. Presented at the 86th American Meteorological Society Annual Meeting. Second Symposium: Toward a Global Earth Observation System of Systems—Future National Operational Environmental Satellite Systems. Atlanta, GA, January 31, 2006. Hollinger, J. 1989. DMSP Special Sensor Microwave/Imager Calibration/Validation. Final Report, Vol. 1. Washington, D.C.: Naval Research Laboratory, 153 pp. Hong, Y., K. L. Hsu, S. Sorooshian, and X. G. Gao. 2005. Improved representation of diurnal variability of rainfall retrieved from the Tropical Rainfall Measurement Mission Microwave Imager adjusted Precipitation Estimation from Remotely Sensed Information Using Artificial Neural Networks (PERSIANN) system. Journal of Geophysical Research—Atmospheres 110:D06102. Hossain, F., and N. Katiyar. 2006. Improving flood forecasting in international river basins. Eos 87(5):49-50. Hou, A. Y. 2005. Update on the Global Precipitation Measurement (GPM) Mission. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005. Huffman, G. J. 2005. Satellite-based estimation of precipitation using microwave sensors. Pp. 965-980 in: Encyclopedia of Hydrologic Sciences, Volume 2, M. G. Anderson, Editor-in-Chief. New York: John Wiley & Sons, Ltd.:36-50. Huffman, G. J., R. F. Adler, E. F. Stocker, D. T. Bolvin, and E. J. Nelkin. 2003. Analysis of TRMM 3-hourly Multi-satellite Precipitation Estimates Computed in Both Real and Post-time. Presented at 12th AMS Conference on Satellite Meteorology and Oceanography, Long Beach, CA, February 9-13, 2003. Huffman, G. J., R. F. Adler, S. Curtis, D. T. Bolvin, and E. J. Nelkin. 2005. Global Rainfall Analyses at Monthly and 3-Hr Time Scales. Chapter 4 in: Measuring Precipitation from Space: EURAINSAT and the Future. V. Levizzani, P. Bauer, and J. Turk, eds. Dordrecht, The Netherlands: Springer Verlag. Iguchi, T. 2006. Possible algorithms for the Dual-Frequency Precipitation Radar (DPR) on the GPM core satellite. Proceedings of the 32nd AMS Conference on Radar Meteorology, Albuquerque, NM, October 23-29.
OCR for page 104
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Iguchi, T., T. Kozu, R. Meneghini, J. Awaka, and K. Okamoto. 2000. Rain-profiling algorithm for the TRMM precipitation radar. Journal of Applied Meteorology 39:2038-2052. IPWG (International Precipitation Working Group). 2006. International Precipitation Working Group. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. Janowiak, J., and V. Kousky. 2005. The Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Phase II: A Climate Perspective. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005. JCSDA (Joint Center for Satellite Data Assimilation). 2006. Joint Center for Satellite Data Assimilation: Organization. Available at. Accessed May 30, 2006. Jiang, H., and E. J. Zipser. 2006. Retrieval of hydrometeor profiles in tropical cyclones and convection from combined radar and radiometer observations. Journal of Applied Meteorology 45(8):1096-1115. Jiang, H., J. B. Halverson, and J. Simpson. 2006. Difference of Rainfall Distribution for Tropical Cyclones Over Land and Ocean and Rainfall Potential Derived from Satellite Observations and Its Implication on Hurricane Landfall Flooding Prediction. Preprints, 27th Conference on Hurricanes and Tropical Meteorology, Monterey, CA, American Meteorology Society, 11 pp. JMA (Japan Meteorological Agency). 2006. Outline of the Operational Forecast and Analysis System of the Japan Meteorological Agency. JMA Forecast Department, Numerical Prediction Division. March 2006. Available at. Accessed June 1, 2006. Joyce, R. J., J. E. Janowiak, P. A. Arkin, and P. Xie. 2004. CMORPH: A method that produces global precipitation estimates from passive microwave and infrared data at high spatial and temporal resolution. Journal of Hydrometeorology 5:487-503. Kamiguchi, K., A. Kitoh, and M. Hosaka. 2005. Intercomparison among TRMM, GPCP1DD and Radar-AMeDAS. Presented at the AMS Forum: Living with a Limited Water Supply, 16th Conference on Planned and Inadvertent Weather Modification, 85th American Meteorological Society Annual Meeting, San Diego, CA, January 15, 2005. Kelley, O., J. Stout, and J. Halverson. 2004. Tall precipitation cells in tropical cyclone eyewalls are associated with tropical cyclone intensification. Geophysical Research Letters 31:L24112. Kidder, S., J. Knaff, S. Kusselson, R. Ferraro, R. Kuligowski, and M. Turk. 2005. The Tropical Rainfall Potential. Part 1: Description and examples. Weather and Forecasting 20:456-464. Kondragunta, C. 2005. OHD/NWS/NOAA Perspectives on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005. Kummerow, C. 2006. Some thoughts on post-GPM rainfall missions. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Irvine, CA, February 28, 2006., and K. Nakamura. 2000. The Status of the Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission (TRMM) after two years in orbit. Journal of Applied Meteorology 39(12):1965-1982. Kummerow, C., Y. Hong, W. S. Olson, S. Yang, R. F. Adler, J. McCollum, R. Ferraro, G. Petty, D. B. Shin, T. T. Wilheit. 2001. The evolution of the Goddard profiling algorithm (GPROF) for rainfall estimation from passive microwave sensors. Journal of Applied Meteorology 40:1801-1820. Kuo, K. S., E. A. Smith, Z. Haddad, E. Im, T. Iguchi, and A. Mugnai. 2004. Mathematical-physical framework for retrieval of rain DSD properties from dual-frequency Ku-Ka-band satellite radar. Journal of the Atmospheric Sciences 61:2349-2369.
OCR for page 105
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Lautenbacher, C. 2006. The Global Earth Observing System of Systems (GEOSS): Implementation Update. Presented at the American Meteorological Society Annual Meeting, Atlanta, GA, January 29-February 2, 2006. Lee, T. F., J .D. Hawkins, F. J. Turk, K. Richardson, C. Sampson, and J. Kent. 1999. Tropical cyclone images now can be viewed “Live” on the web. Eos 50:612-614. Lee, T. F., F. J. Turk, J. D. Hawkins, and K. A. Richardson. 2002. Interpretation of TRMM TMI images of tropical cyclones. Earth Interactions E-Journal 6:3. Lonfat, M., F. D. Marks, Jr., and S. S. Chen. 2004. Precipitation distribution in tropical cyclones using the Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission (TRMM) microwave imager: a global perspective. Monthly Weather Review 132:1645-1660. Lord, S. J. 2004. Operational Use and Impacts of TRMM Instruments at NCEP. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of the Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission, November 8, 2004. Maddox, R. A., J. Zhang, J. J. Gourley, and K. W. Howard. 2002. Weather Radar Coverage over the Contiguous United States. Weather and Forecasting 17(4):927-934. Marecal, V., and J. F. Mahfouf. 2000. Variational retrieval of temperature and humidity profiles from TRMM precipitation data. Monthly Weather Review 128(11):3853-3866. Marecal, V., and J. F. Mahfouf. 2002. Four-dimensional variational assimilation of total column water vapor in rainy areas. Monthly Weather Review 130(1):43-58. Marzoug, M., and P. Amayenc. 1991. Improved range-profiling algorithm of rainfall rate from a spaceborne radar with path-integrated attenuation constraint. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 29:584-592. Meneghini, R., T. Kozu, H. Kumagai, and W. C. Boncyk. 1992. A Study of Rain Estimation Methods from Space Using Dual-Wavelength Radar Measurements at Near-Nadir Incidence over Ocean. Journal of Atmospheric and Oceanic Technology 9:364-382. Miller, S., P. Arkin, and R. Joyce. 2001. A combined microwave/infrared rain rate algorithm. International Journal of Remote Sensing 22:3285-3307. Mitchell, K. E. 2004. The multi-institutional North American Land Data Assimilation system utilizing multiple GCIP products and partners in a continental distributed modeling system. Journal of Geophysical Research 109:D07S90. Moradkhani, H., K. Hsu, Y. Hong, and S. Sorooshian. 2006. Investigating the impact of remotely sensed precipitation and hydrologic model uncertainties on the ensemble streamflow forecasting. Geophysical Research Letters 33(12):L12107. Moreau, E., P. Lopez, P. Bauer, A. M. Tompkins, M. Janiskova, and F. Chevallier. 2004. Variational retrieval of temperature and humidity profiles using rain rates versus microwave brightness temperatures. Quarterly Journal of the Royal Meteorological Society 130(598):827-852. NASA (National Aeronautics and Space Administration). 1988. TRMM; A satellite mission to measure tropical rainfall. Report of the Science Steering Group. J. Simpson, ed. 94 pp. NASA. 1995. Memorandum of Understanding between the National Aeronautics and Space Administration of the United States of America and the National Space Development Agency of Japan For Joint Development of the Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission. NASA Historical Reference Collection, NASA History Office, NASA Headquarters, Washington, D.C. NASA. 2006a. Global Precipitation Measurement GPM Microwave Imager (GMI). Available at. Accessed October 11, 2006. NASA. 2006b. Tropical Rain Measurement Mission (TRMM) Gridded Rainfall Data. Available at. Accessed May 30, 2006. NCDC (National Climatic Data Center). 2006. About NCDC. Available at. Accessed May 30, 2006. Neeck, S. D. 2005. NASA Management Perspective: GPM, TRMM, Partnerships with NOAA and International Agencies. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005.
OCR for page 106
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Nesbitt, S. W., and E. J. Zipser. 2003. The diurnal cycle of rainfall and convective intensity according to three years of TRMM measurements. Journal of Climate 16(10):1456-1475. Nesbitt, S. W., E. J. Zipser, and D. J. Cecil. 2000. A Census of precipitation features in the tropics using TRMM: Radar, ice scattering, and lightning observations. Journal of Climate 13(23): 4087-4106. Nesbitt, S. W., E. J. Zipser, and C. D. Kummerow. 2004. An examination of Version-5 rainfall estimates from the TRMM Microwave Imager, Precipitation Radar, and rain gauges on global, regional, and storm scales. Journal of Applied Meteorology 43:1016-1036. NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration). 2002. Requirements for Global Precipitation Data. Workshop Report. Silver Spring, MD: National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. Available at. Accessed June 11, 2006. NOAA. 2004. NOAA’s Goals and Priorities. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. NOAA. 2006. NOAA Hydrometeorological Testbed (HMT) Program. Available at. noaa.gov. Accessed May 30, 2006. NRC (National Research Council). 2000. Issues in the Integration of Research and Operational Satellite Systems for Climate Research. II: Implementation. Washington, D.C.: National Academy Press. NRC. 2003. Satellite Observations of the Earth’s Environment: Accelerating the Transition of Research to Operations. Washington, D.C.: The National Academies Press. NRC. 2004. Assessment of the Benefits of Extending the Tropical Rainfall Measuring Mission: A Perspective from the Research and Operations Communities. Washington, D.C.: The National Academies Press. NRC. 2005. Earth Science and Applications from Space: Urgent Needs and Opportunities to Serve the Nation. Washington, D.C.: National Academies Press. NRC. 2006. Preliminary Principles and Guidelines for Archiving Environmental and Geospatial Data at NOAA: Interim Report. Washington, D.C.: The National Academies Press. NSTC (National Science and Technology Council). 2005. Strategic Plan for the U.S. Integrated Earth Observation System. NSTC Committee on Environment and Natural Resources. Available online:. Accessed Feb. 23, 2006. NWS (National Weather Service). 2006a. Automated Surface Observing System. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. NWS. 2006b. Hydrometeorological Automated Data System. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. NWS. 2006c. AFWS Rainfall Graphics. NOAA/NWS IFLOWS Program. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. NWS. 2006d. Radar Operations Center: NEXRAD WSR-88D. Available at. Accessed May 31, 2006. Olson, W. S., C. D. Kummerow, Y. Hong, and W.-K. Tao. 1999. Atmospheric latent heating distributions in the tropics derived from satellite passive microwave radiometer measurements. Journal of Applied Meteorology 38(6):633-664. Petty, G. W. 1994. Physical retrievals of over-ocean rain rate from multichannel microwave imager. Part I: Theoretical characteristics of normalized polarization and scattering indices. Meteorology and Atmospheric Physics 54:79-99. Ralph, F. M., R. M. Rauber, B. F. Jewett, D. E. Kingsmill, P. Pisano, P. Pugner, R. M. Rasmussen, D. W. Reynolds, T. W. Schlatter, R. E. Stewart, S. Tracton, and J. S. Waldstreicher. 2005. Improving short-term (0-48 h) cool-season quantitative precipitation forecasting: Recommendations from a USWRP workshop. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 86(11): 1619-1632.
OCR for page 107
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Reichle, R. H., and R. D. Koster. 2005. Global assimilation of satellite surface soil moisture retrievals into the NASA catchment land surface model. Geophysical Research Letters 32:L02404. Reichle, R. H., D. B. McLaughlin, and D. Entekhabi. 2001. Variational data assimilation of microwave radiobrightness observations for land surface hydrology applications. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 39:1708-1718. Rizvi, S. R. H., R. Kamineni, and U. C. Mohantly. 2002. Impact of MSMR data on NCMRWF Global Data Assimilation System. Meteorology and Atmospheric Physics 81:257-272. Rodell, M., et al. (13 other authors). 2004. The Global Land Data Assimilation System. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 85:381-394. Rosenfeld, D. 1999. TRMM observed first direct evidence of smoke from forest fires inhibiting rainfall. Geophysical Research Letters 28(20):3105-3108. Rosenfeld, D. 2000. Suppression of rain and snow by urban and industrial air pollution. Science 287(5459):1793-1796. Ryzhkov, A. V., T. J. Schuur, D. W. Burgess, P. L. Heinselman, S. E. Giangrande, and D. S. Zrnic. 2005. The Joint Polarization Experiment: Polarimetric Rainfall Measurements and Hydrometeor Classification. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 86(6):809-824. Sato, Y., Y. Takeuchi, and T. Tauchi. 2004. Use of TMI and SSM/I data in JMA Operational Meso-Analysis. Presented at the 20th Conference on Weather Analysis and Forecasting/16th Conference on Numerical Weather Prediction, 84th American Meteorological Society Annual Meeting, Seattle, WA, January 2004. Schumacher, C., and R. A. Houze, Jr. 2003. Stratiform rain in the tropics as seen by the TRMM precipitation radar. Journal of Climate 16:1739-1756. Schumacher, C., R. Houze, Jr., and I. Kraucunas. 2004. The tropical dynamical response to latent heating derived from the TRMM precipitation radar. Journal of the Atmospheric Sciences 61(12):1341-1358. Sevruk, B., ed. 1989. Precipitation measurement. Proceedings of the International Workshop on Precipitation Measurement, St. Moritz, Switzerland, 3-7 December, 1989. WMO/TD-No. 32. Zurich: Institute of Geography, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology, 589 pp. Simpson, R. 2003. Hurricane! Coping with Disaster: Progress and Challenges since Galveston 1900. Washington D.C.: American Geophysical Union, 360 pp. Smith,, M. Shepherd, E. Stocker, J. Testud, and E. Wood. 2004. International Global Precipitation Measurement (GPM) Program and Mission: An overview. In: Measuring Precipitation from Space: EURAINSAT and the Future, V. Levizzani and F. J. Turk, eds. Dordrecht, The Netherlands: Kluwer Publishers. Sorooshian, S., K. Hsu, X. Gao, H. V. Gupta, B. Imam, and D. Braithwaite. 2000. Evaluation of PERSIANN system satellite-based estimates of tropical rainfall. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 81:2035-2046. Sorooshian, S., X. Gao, K. Hsu, R. A. Maddox, Y. Hong, B. Imam, and H.V. Gupta. 2002. Diurnal variability of tropical rainfall retrieved from combined GOES and TRMM satellite information. Journal of Climate 15:983-1001. Spencer, R. W. 1986. A satellite passive 37-GHz scattering-based method for measuring oceanic rain rates. Journal of Applied Meteorology 25:754-766. Steiner, M. J., J. A. Smith, S. J. Burges, C. V. Alonso, and R. W. Darden. 1999. Effect of bias adjustment and rain gage data quality control on radar rainfall estimation. Water Resources Research 35:2487-2503.
OCR for page 108
Noaa's Role in Space-Based Global Precipitation Estimation and Application Tao, W.-K., S. Lang, W. Olson, S. Satoh, S. Shige, Y. Takayabu, and S. Yang. 2004. Heating structure derived from TRMM. Pp. 18-40 in: The Latent Heating Algorithms Developed from TRMM PR Data. Chofu, Tokyo: Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency, Earth Observation Research and Application Center. Todd, M. C., C. Kidd, T. J. Bellerby, and D. R. Kniveton. 2001. A combined satellite infrared and passive microwave technique for estimation of small-scale rainfall. Journal of Atmospheric and Oceanic Technology 18:742-755. Turk, F. J., and P. Bauer. 2005a. Proceedings of the 2nd International Precipitation Working Group, Monterey, California, October 25-28, 2004. 355 pp. Available at. Accessed May 16, 2006. Turk, F. J., and P. Bauer. 2005b. The International Precipitation Working Group and its role in the improvement of quantitative precipitation measurements. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 87(5), in press. Turk, F. J., and S. D. Miller. 2005. Toward improving estimates of remotely-sensed precipitation with MODIS/AMSR-E blended data techniques. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 43:1059-1069. Vincente, G. A., R. A. Scofield, W. P. Menzel. 1998. The operational GOES—infrared rainfall estimation technique. Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society 79(9):1883-1898. Walker, J. P., P. R. Houser, and R. H. Reichle. 2003. New technologies require advances in hydrologic data assimilation. Eos 84:545-551. WCRP (World Climate Research Program). 1986. Report of the Workshop on Global Large-Scale Precipitation Data Sets for the World Climate Research Programme. WMO/TD-No. 94. Geneva: World Meteorological Organization, 50 pp. Weng, F. Z., Q. H. Liu. 2003. Satellite data assimilation in numerical weather prediction models. Part I: Forward radiative transfer and Jacobian modeling in cloudy atmospheres. Journal of the Atmospheric Sciences 60:2633-2646. Weng, F., L. Zhao, R. R. Ferraro, G. Poe, X. Li, and N. C. Grody. 2003. Advanced microwave sounding unit cloud and precipitation algorithms. Radio Science 38(4):8068-8081. Wentz, F., and K. Hilburn. 2006. Challenges to Deriving Climate Time Series from Satellite Observations. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Irvine, CA, February 28, 2006. Wessel, J., J. Cornelius, R. W. Farley, A. Fote, J. Haferman, B. Gardiner, Y. Hong, D. B. Kunkee, G. Poe, S. D. Swadley, D. J. Tesmer, B. H. Thomas, E. Uliana, and D. Boucher. 2004. First observations from DMSP SSMIS. Presented at the AMS 13th Conference on Satellite Meteorology and Oceanography, Norfolk, VA, September 20-23, 2004. White, G. 2005. Weather Forecasting and the Global Precipitation Mission. Presented to the National Academies Committee on the Future of Rainfall Measuring Missions, Washington, D.C., October 18, 2005. Wilheit, T. T., A. T. C. Chang, and L. S. Chiu. 1991. Retrieval of monthly rainfall indices from microwave radiometric measurements using probability-distribution functions. Journal of Atmospheric and Oceanic Technology 8:118-136. Wilheit, T., C. D. Kummerow, and R. Ferraro. 2003. Rainfall algorithms for AMSR-E. IEEE Transactions on Geoscience and Remote Sensing 41(2):204-214. WMO (World Meteorological Organization). 2006. Towards an Operational Satellite Inter-Calibration System. WMO Infonote 25. Geneva: World Meteorological Organization. Xie, P., and P. A. Arkin. 1996. Analysis of global monthly precipitation using gauge observations, satellite estimates, and numerical model predictions. Journal of Climate 9:840-858. Yilmaz, K. K., T. S. Hogue, K. Hsu, S. Sorooshian, H. V. Gupta, and T. Wagener. 2005. Intercomparison of rain gauge, radar, and satellite-based precipitation estimates on hydrologic forecasting. Journal of Hydrometeorology 6(4):497-517.
Representative terms from entire chapter:
operational precipitation |
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force H Areas of Research in Modeling and Simulation Bernard Zeigler, University of Arizona The text discusses research areas in three categories: (1) modeling theory, (2) modeling methodology, and (3) tools and environments. This appendix provides examples of research in each of these categories. The items shown are illustrative only, the point being to demonstrate something of the diversity of issues needing research. MODELING THEORY Simulation-based Design Research Manufacturing control is traditionally approached with analytic/Markov methods for the creation of analytic models. However, using discrete event models to represent the machines, material handling, and input devices frees the modeler for experimentation with new and unique control methods. Users can make decisions by observing simulations using realistic “scenarios” of the manufacturing process and examine the implications of change (Zeigler, 1990; Cho and Zeigler, 1997). Because of the modularity of the approach, a wide variety of on-line control elements —including not only classic control mechanisms, but also neural networks, fuzzy logic, or expert systems—can be installed for performance analysis. While model-based control is intuitive and can represent some of the deep knowledge employed of a human expert charged with directing a process, the approach of applying discrete event simulation and the requisite large-scale computing for automation is still in its infancy. Further research is needed to bring it to the point where it can support manufacturing styles such as flexible or agile
OCR for page 217
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force paradigms. DOD has many manufacturing processes and similar processes, such as logistics repair, that could significantly benefit from agile or flexible design based on discrete event simulation. Dynamic Structure Modeling and Simulation In many important physical and military systems, the system “structure” changes in the course of time. For example, biological systems such as growing plants, and social systems such as self-organizing organizations (one model for highly dispersed ground forces in the future), change structures over time. So also does a military organization that suffers attrition and reorganizes with a new command structure or a military organization that reorganizes and replans because of events making the original concept of operations obsolete. Although significant research has been done on such simulations, current simulation languages do not support them. To represent such changes, they must be recast into parameter changes, and this leads to convoluted code that is difficult to verify and inefficient to run. Augmenting or replacing current simulation languages to support dynamic structure modeling would greatly increase the power of simulations to study complex structurally variable systems to gain true insight and predictability. This technology has been the subject of numerous investigations, but only recently has a first theoretical framework even been proposed and implemented. Thus, research that can contribute to a coherent usable methodology is at an early phase. 1 Inductive Modeling Inductive modeling attempts to infer a system's internal structure from data representing its behavior. Given that data collected from all kinds of systems are abundant, realizing a comprehensive inductive modeling methodology will be of significant importance to the M&S community at large. Within the military domain, it may be possible to generate rich databases from exercises and training activities mediated by distributed interactive simulations. Despite a large body of research in inductive modeling, there is little agreement on any recognized inductive modeling paradigm. Several software implementations exist, including one developed based on a well-defined framework for inductive modeling, and implemented in a Artificial Intelligence Truth Maintenance system supporting nonmonotonic reasoning (Sarjoughian, 1995). This type of reasoning is needed to support flexible assertion and retraction of abstractions and assumptions in model building. However, this work has only tackled 1 One example of work in this domain involves support to DOD's business reengineering, which must reflect the self-organizing formation of teams in business structures.
OCR for page 218
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force “toy problems,” and it is imperative to apply it to some real application areas. Fundamental research effort is needed to bring about a useful and mature methodology to support a multitude of DOD present and future activities within the next couple of years The present and future mission of the DOD provides real-world problems for applying and validating an inductive modeling framework. Potential applications span all of the M&S activities of interest to DOD with significant implications for model characterization from behavior and model abstraction techniques. Examples are Advanced Imagery Exploitation and Defense Automated Warning Systems, as well as many other areas requiring nonmonotonic reasoning about abstraction and assumptions. An inductive modeling technology would help DOD to address problems where conventional M&S is inadequate because of an abundance of data together with a lack of a well-developed scientific knowledge base and the M&S know-how to make sense of it. MODELING METHODOLOGY Experimental Frame Methodology Experimental frames enable simulationists to translate the objectives and issues to be addressed into conditions under which a model or real system will be experimented with (Zeigler, 1976). As a major part of the initial requirements specification, experimental frames are critical to appropriate choices (e.g., level of resolution and accuracy) throughout the subsequent modeling and simulation effort. Experimental frames map into modules that actually do the experimentation (input generation, output summarization, and so on) when models/systems are operable. While the concept of experimental frames has been around for some time, it is only recently that full support for their specification, manipulation, and management has been attempted. Experiment plans are supported in a Bomb Damage Assessment environment (Simard, 1996). However, such plans are formulated after model development, rather prior to it, as in true experimental frames. Some current environments support experimental frame construction as executable components but do not support the more abstract specification needed for symbolic manipulations. DOD M&S efforts often are overly costly owing to their inability to make critical choices such as scope of representation and resolution level that should be driven by issues-oriented experimental frames specified in advance of model building. Moreover, archiving experimental frames and then matching them with existing models would enable a high level of model reuse.
OCR for page 219
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force Automatic Model Verification Automatic model verification (AMV) differs from the conventional model verification methods in which verification is based on manually executed simulation runs. AMV aims toward automation of discrete event models verification. One promising approach is based on dual specification (Hong and Kim, 1996). The approach employs two specifications for a discrete event model: an operational specification for the behavior of a model and an assertional specification for its temporal properties. A model's verification is based on a language acceptance checking mechanism for which the assertional model constitutes a language grammar and the operational model acts as string generators. Promising research in AMV has been performed. Although no software tool for AMV based on the dual specification approach has yet been developed, a prototype has successfully demonstrated the approach. Further research and development is needed to reduce the approach to usable tools. Model Simplification Through Change in Formalism Continuous systems are traditionally modeled with differential equation models. However, recent research has suggested that discrete event models may afford advantages for simulating continuous as well as hybrid systems (Zeigler, 1989). Several approaches exist for faithfully mapping differential equation systems into discrete event models such as analytic expression of transitions, application of algebraic solvers, and fuzzy representations. A discrete event model, which meets certain steady state conditions, has been shown to be equivalent to a Markovian process. When analytic solutions are available for such processes, they can be solved in much less time than simulation requires. Markov lumped models can also replace their base model counterparts within the original simulation model, leading to more efficient simulation. Analytic expression of transitions has been shown to provide some 100 to 1,000 speedup over conventional time-stepped numerical integration (Moon, 1996). However, in many situations analytic (local) solution may not be possible. Therefore further research is needed to test general methods that do not rely on analytic solutions. Simulations including both continuous and discrete event model components are common in DOD applications. For example, airplane motion is described with differential equations, while decisions of an intelligent autopilot are discrete. In such simulations, the speedups obtainable with a complete discrete event representation, with or without further Markov reduction, would enable simulations that are currently not feasible to be conducted. For example, it would be possible to simulate terrain models using digital elevation data from geographic information systems representing large areas in high enough resolution for realistic tests of sensor systems.
OCR for page 220
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force TOOLS AND ENVIRONMENTS Environment for Simulation and Implementation of Discrete Event Control Systems Discrete event system models have had a major impact on control system design for modern automation and real-time decision-making systems (Ho, 1989). The design of discrete event control systems usually employs discrete event simulation to verify functional requirements as well as to evaluate performance. Such simulation can be performed in discrete event simulation languages. Once simulation is done, the implementation of the designed discrete event system may proceed using a programming language, such as C or C++, which can be executed in real time. Since source code implementation totally differs from that of the simulation model, this approach to design cannot reuse the simulation model code in implementation. An ideal environment supports a close relation between simulation model and implementation code. In such an environment, a set of operating system-like system functions supports execution of a simulation model in real time. Thus, the same model analyzed in simulation can later be converted to real-time execution in a near-seamless manner. Database Support for Simulation Model Reuse Large-scale, complex-systems modeling often requires management of simulation models in an organized library or database (Zeigler, 1984, 1990). One major advantage is the potential for reuse of component models at different subsystem levels. Such model management can be effectively supported by employing object-oriented database technology. In this technology, a system can manage not only model structure in the form of coupling relations between component models, but also model behavior in the form of source codes or compiled codes. Such coupling relations and/or behavioral codes can be reused later on as building blocks to build larger models. This technology area has already successfully been applied in the development of intelligent simulation environments. However, much research has to be done in order to apply the technology in the real world. For example, we need to develop a method for generating simulation models residing in an object-oriented database from modeling requirements and objectives. Insertion of this technology would provide great benefits to DOD in large-scale, complex systems modeling, simulation, and analysis. It significantly reduces model development time by an efficient reuse of existing simulation models as building blocks.
OCR for page 221
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force SIMULATION-BASED OPTIMIZATION ON HIGH-PERFORMANCE PLATFORMS Simulation-based optimization can be employed in most aspects of system modeling and design, as well as in higher-level decision-making processes. A wide variety of classic search and optimizing methods are available. In addition, there is now emerging a considerable literature on applications using nontraditional methods, which have both advantages and disadvantages. As examples here, evolutionary global optimization methods (Fogel, 1994), such as genetic algorithms (GAs) (Miachalewicz, 1992; Goldberg, 1992), were developed to apply the adaptive process of natural systems to search problems, and to develop artificial systems that mimic the adaptive mechanisms of natural systems. GAs encode a potential solution to a specific problem on a simple chromosome-like data structure and apply such operators as selection, recombination (or cross-over), and mutation to the structure in the hopes of getting closer to the solution. Although regarded as merely “trendy” by some, GAs have been applied to a wide variety of search and optimization problems by many researchers. For example, a class of parallel GAs (Gorges-Schleuter, 1989; Pettey et al., 1987) for simulation-based optimization was applied to fuzzy system design, optical interconnection network design (Louri et al., 1995), parameter tuning, and model abstraction of a large-scale ecosystem model (Moon, 1996). However, system design problems typically require optimization of models having a large number of parameters, each requiring high precision. These parameters increase the complexity of the problem, and working with all the parameters at the same time often causes GAs (or any other optimization algorithms) to stagnate at local minima. Existing approaches cannot exploit information about performance impacts to search parameter subspaces in relation to their criticality. To address these problems, a multi-resolution search strategy in a distributed, high-performance simulation environment was developed (Kim and Zeigler, 1996). 2 High-performance Parallel Discrete Event Simulation Mapping large-scale discrete event models onto massively parallel architectures (Almasi and Gottlieb, 1989) requires the support of a higher level of abstraction in parallel simulation environments (Fujimoto, 1990). Recent approaches have employed object orientation to encapsulate the internode communication mechanism providing a user with a higher level of control (Zeigler et al., 1997). Mapping of models is also supported by its portability across platforms. Large-scale parallel and distributed discrete event simulation environments demonstrate the 2 For further discussion of some of these issues, see also the last portion of Appendix B .
OCR for page 222
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force capability to address very complex and time-consuming simulation problems while providing a high-level interface. High-performance simulation environments have been tested on several models, including a spatial watershed and a large cluster of ATM switch models. The simulation can help analyze the complex interactions in models consisting of up to 10 million components (e.g., landscape cells or ATM switch elements). Speedups of the order of 200 times have been obtained so that simulations that require several days to run in conventional platforms can be completed in under an hour. There are numerous large simulations that could benefit from this technology, for example, air traffic control and multimedia communication design problems. Distributed Simulation of Heterogeneous Models Although distributed interactive simulation (DIS) protocols do not provide for strict global time preservation among federated models, the high-level architecture (DMSO, 1996c) includes a more controllable runtime interface. There are still many issues that must be dealt with in HLA (Morgeson, 1996). This motivates the development of a methodology for distributed simulation of models written in different simulation languages/environments that preserves strict time correspondence. Formalisms for discrete event models can be used as a common communication means. A software bus and an associated protocol based on such formalisms can provide an interface among legacy models in such languages as SIMSCRIPT, MODSIM, and SLAM. Proposed also are protocol converters, which support communication standards for such models. The methodology can be implemented using a network programming language such as JAVA. Insertion of this technology would provide great benefits to DOD in network-based distributed simulation of a large-scale system in which models of subsystems are developed in different languages/environments. It significantly reduces model development by reuse of existing heterogeneous models. ADVANCED M&S ENVIRONMENTS FOR INTELLIGENT/COGNITIVE SYSTEMS Building models of intelligence, perception, and human performance has proved to be difficult due in part to the uncertainty in the psycho-physiological theories proposed to explain behavioral phenomena. Modern software engineering approaches such as spiral development suggest intelligent and cognitive model development using an incremental refinement approach (Young, 1992). They also provide the ability to develop multi-resolution models, although the underlying understanding of phenomenology is often the limiting factor. Recent developments in neuroscience have enabled us to envision behavior as the synergistic result of biological cells-neurons. Dynamic neural ensembles (DNEs) (Vahie
OCR for page 223
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force and Jouppi, 1996) provide a dynamic environment and the components necessary for the development of highly complex cognitive models aggregating cellular behavior to represent intelligence and learning. DNEs are compositions of interconnected dynamic neurons. At a more abstract level, “holon” hierarchy models are being developed. Simulation environments supporting such models use object-oriented programming techniques to provide ease of parameter modification and specialization of both behavior and structure. Applications of DNEs to real-time learning, control, and decision making are currently being pursued. DOD systems and component designs for the 21st century will have to increasingly address the issue of human operability and performance. The development of autonomous systems capable of functioning in dynamic environments is also an issue of interest. The first issue, operability and performance, requires an approach that needs to be seamlessly integrated into design. The successive approximation provides a methodology for integration of cognition and intelligence into the systems design. New forms of neural and cognitive models, capable of dynamic behavioral modification, need to be explored to adequately capture flexible behavior. Visualization and Significant-Event Detection in Discrete-Event Simulation Any large-scale simulation is by definition complex owing to the size and diversity of the data. Events (in discrete-event simulations) represent a set of states (in one or more models) that are capable of influencing the states of other models in the environment. Therefore, an event may be determined as significant based on the values of specific state variables (in one or more models). Significant events are thus said to occur in a time period when a predefined set of conditions is met by a subset of the variables in the simulation. The user defines what he considers to be significant events using primitives and model parameters, before simulation. At run-time, event detectors sift through the data looking for significant events. This enables the user/model developer to effectively pursue his goal (conceptual or analytical). In essence, significant event detection allows any large-scale simulation to be viewed at various levels of abstraction, where the level of abstraction is determined by the significance of the event. Due to the size and/or complexity of most DOD simulations, this technology would impact virtually all application areas where M&S is used. Being genetic in nature, the concept could be modularized as an independent entity in diverse discrete event simulations. In battle simulations where planning, resource and personnel deployment, and communication are independent entities, there are too many data to track. The same model can be used by commanders in charge of each of the battle spaces where a significant event for one may or may not be a significant event for another, radically reducing their output data set.
OCR for page 224
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force Graphical Description of Discrete Event Model Behavior Many good graphical tools are in place for discrete event systems modeling. Such tools use icons to represent predefined models, most of which support users to add a new model definition and an associated icon to the existing library. However, little has been done in graphical notation for behavioral description of discrete event models. An excellent example for such notation in discrete event modeling is a stochastic Petri Nets graph. In spite of its generality in modeling stochastic systems, Petri Nets is limited to modeling a certain class of discrete event systems. Thus, graphical notation based on a sound semantics, which is easy to use and understand, needs to be developed for the rapid and accurate modeling of discrete event systems. The graphical notation should include such information as state transition function, output function, and sojourn time function for a basic component of a discrete event process. Of course, the graphical notation should generate executable simulation codes. Anytime/Anyplace Concurrent, Collaborative Support of M&S Life Cycle DOD decision makers are faced with the challenge of declining budgets for manpower and material, and for demands for flexible, cost-effective operations to meet the challenges of the post-Cold War world. M& S is being applied not only at technical and engineering levels to meet such challenges, but also at higher levels such as work-flow automation and business reengineering, where many stakeholders are affected. To undertake effective M&S throughout its life cycle requires the active involvement of the various groups involved with model development, simulation analysis, and implementation. Unfortunately, tools and methodologies currently available from commercial vendors and consultants are primarily single-user tools that provide inadequate support for the collaborative team-based environment that characterizes modern organizations. Moreover, this support is virtually nonexistent for distributed work involving groups that are geographically dispersed. Group support systems research has developed a network-based set of flexible software tools that incorporate basic problem-solving techniques such as brainstorming, idea organization, voting, issue analyzing, policy formation, prioritizing, and stakeholder identification. Electronic communications allow all group members, whether distributed or co-located, to make contributions to the group's task both simultaneously and asynchronously. Such technology increases organizational productivity by decreasing manpower requirements and cycle times in projects. The scope of projects can also be expanded to include participants from several hierarchical levels, thus improving organizational communication while facilitating approval for decisions. In a competitive environment
OCR for page 225
Technology for the United States Navy and Marine Corps, 2000-2035: Becoming a 21st-Century Force where success is dependent on teams working together, collaborative software will increase the productivity and effectiveness of these teams. Research is needed to extend advanced M&S capabilities by embedding them in the distributed group support tools environments, to enable distributed groups to construct, analyze, and implement model-based designs in concurrent engineering fashion.
Representative terms from entire chapter:
inductive modeling |
I'm not so sure about that, though. What the suspension means to me is that both teams are going to have to rely on their pitching depth more than they would have had last night's game been played in its entirety. And as I argued yesterday, the Tigers' rotation depth is their biggest advantage over the Yankees.
I suppose we'll find out soon enough, as Doug Fister and Ivan Nova take over for Verlander and CC Sabathia. The forecast is once again iffy, so it could be another long night in the Bronx...
AL DIVISION SERIES - GAME 1 (cont.)
DETROIT TIGERS at NEW YORK YANKEES
Where: Yankee Stadium
Gametime: 8:37 p.m.
TV: TBS
Radio: WTEM (980 AM), WWXT (92.7 FM), WWXX (94.3 FM), XM 178
Weather: Chance of rain, 60 degrees, Wind 9 mph out to RF
STARTING LINEUPS
TIGERS
CF Austin Jackson
RF Magglio Ordonez
LF Delmon Young
1B Miguel Cabrera
DH Victor Martinez
C Alex Avila
2B Ryan Raburn
SS Jhonny Peralta
3B Brandon Inge
(P Doug Fister) Ivan Nova)
46 comments:
What stinks for the Tigers is that Leyland had his lineup set up to face a LHP, now that same line-up has to be on the field to face a RHP. Rayburn, Inge wouldn't have been on the field. Seeing that Verlander & Fister are both RHP, doesn't matter to Girardi. Course there is a reason the Yankees have the best record in the league, Dang it.
Cute son, Mark!
Awwww, that's adorable! Thanks, Mark. (I felt the same way, kid, and I only stayed up through the end of the Rays/Rangers game.)
(Also: daggone Yankees.)
Brian's picture is precious.
That is one cute baby!
Nice pic Mark!
Joe S. said...
I'll agree with Anonymous@4:28. Flores, Lannan and Marrero for a legit leadoff guy or a strong #3 pitcher would be a good move, if any other team will bite.
For once, we have quality quantity to trade for quality quality.
October 1, 2011 4:35 PM
_______________________________
To name names as a trade like that is just bush league.
Nyjer is a legit leadoff hitter, you want to trade Flores, Lannan and Marrero for him?
Please don't play armchair GM with ridiculous stuff like that.
Do you realize how valuable a mid-3.80's ERA lefty pitcher with 2 years of team control is worth? Yah, John Lannan by himself is very valuable if Rizzo was going to dangle him out there.
Josh Willingham was a legit 100 RBI guy based on 162 games, a player most teams would covet and his negatives were his health and his minus defense. The Nats got 2 players in return. An oft injured and slumping Minor League OF and a relief pitcher with no options.
The A's made it known they need a middle of the order bat. Should the Nats have received Dallas Braden, Landon Powell and Brandon Allen instead? Those 3 names were the A's 2010 equivalent to Flores, Lannan and Marrero.
Since I brought up Willingham, here is where Rizzo screwed up again. Willingham is a Type A Free Agent. The A's got 1 year of Willingham and now can let him walk and receive 2 Comp picks for Willingham.
I will play some armchair GM. I don't see a good trade Rizzo made since the last off-season. His best move was walking away from trading Drew Storen. I still believe Rizzo would have traded Storen straight up for Denard Span.
Who saw the play in the Texas game where BJ Upton was caught stealing 3rd base? It brought back visions of Nyjer, bad jump in a critical situation. Of course the batter ends up hitting a single after that.
Cool picture, Mark. How is he sleeping? That is a key variable right now, IMO.
Did NatsJack ever follow up on his Instructional League post? I saw one against the baby Braves a few posts ago, with a 'more-to-come' sign off, but can't find the later ones. Any help pointing me in the right direction would be much appreciated.
Speaking of the bubeleh, I just happened to notice that a few nice items are still available on his Amazon baby registry (which, as y'all may recall, is in his mom Rachel's name). I'm just saying... :-)
Gonat, in hindsight that Willinghan trade was not good for the Nats. At the time was there doubt of Willinghans health. That's the only reason to make that trade as a dump and run.
It has been mentioned before that since StanK left, Rizzo has embarked on a path of trade desperation. His proposed trade for Greinke would have decimated the Nats if that trade went through.
If Rizzo would propose a ridiculous trade like the Greinke, he may be capable of another outlandish trade like Nyjer for Lannan, Flores and Marrero.
A great segue into Top GMs according to Buster Olney.
Bright minds are next undervalued asset
Anon8, I saw it. Also saw him saying, um, "dang" or some such after it occurred.
Good article about FP in the Post today.
natsfan1a--I didn't know about that registry. Thanks for the tip!
You're welcome, Outsider.
Oldguy, I saw that as well. Don't know if something may have hit the cutting room floor, but I found it interesting that FP talked about how much he'd learned this season but didn't mention his (experienced) partner. Hope to see both Bob and FP in the booth next year.
Gonat, I'm a different "Joe S" then you took issue with, but I don't agree with you about the Willingham trade being a poor one, at least not yet. Yes Josh had a good stats year with Oakland, but keep in mind that he plays AL with the DH and he wasn't facing the pitching staffs of the Phillies and Braves for 36 games. Also while Cory Brown was injured in spring training, and again when he got called up, he did come on strong late in the minors. Coaches had dicked around with his stance and swing, he slumped, then threw all of it out and went back to his approach that he had used successfully in the past.Lo and behold, he he went back to being a very good hitter, and thus the call up. Coaches should leave hitters that hit alone, at least until they don't hit. He's also been a very good OF before his ST injury. Will he mature into a ML player? We'll see. As to HRod, again we'll see, but I won't throw a raw kid with a 101plus fastball under the bus after what little we've seen of him. This kid came in late in the spring due to visa problems, has had very little time with the team's coaching staff. He has control issues, but also seems to have self confidence issues. Steve and Davey apparently made noticeable progress on both fronts. My point is that Rizzo traded Josh Willingham, for two prospects. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss either prospect after one season. Also, though Michael Morse will probably never be a gold glove OF, Willingham gets very lousy jumps and then runs terrible routes to the ball. Rizzo's emphasis was on improving defense and getting rid of Josh was a big start.
OTOH, Willingham did strongly imply in interviews after the trade that he couldn't get out oh here fast enough. And there is no guarantee he'd have done here what he did there. And then there's the whole Morse thing.
Still, they could have used that bat, and Morse mughr have gotten in at first base anyway.
Also from a Post item, and reading between the lines, a tip o' the curmudgeonly cap to D'back's hitting coach Don Byalor, who is back with the team after a health scare (I'm having fun imagining in what manner he may have "requested" to be released from the hospital). Wishing him no further health scares, even if I'm not rooting for his team (excerpt of piece below).
In other news, is it just me, or does that Brewers beast mode gesture seem a bit much? Of course, I wasn't a fan of the Rangers antler/claw thing either back in the day.
Baylor fainted after eating breakfast in the clubhouse, and one of the team’s trainers caught him as he fell. Baylor hadn’t shown any signs that he was feeling ill, either at a team dinner on Thursday night or Friday morning.
“I remember having breakfast. That’s it,” Baylor said.
Baylor was taken by ambulance to the hospital, where he spent Friday night for observation, and doctors released him when he requested to be let go at 8 a.m. He doesn’t anticipate any other problems with the medication because he’s not planning on taking it again.
“I threw it in the garbage,” Baylor said.
The excerpt, of course, starting after my Brewers-related comment.
I prefer my Seabiscuit to be in schnitzel form (and, of course, well pounded), but that's just me. ;-)
Joe, I didn't mind trading him for a deal that made sense. My problem was the bounty he got back. It was like Rizzo trading Nyjer as if he were in a hurry.
Rizzo was in such a hurry to get rid of Willingham that I too thought he was "broken". Seeing that Willingham was healthy and would trend back to career numbers made the deal a good one for Oakland. Now they get 2 top Comp picks that the Nats could have used for the farm system.
For Seabiscuit, of course Josh felt that way after treated like yesterday's trash. Josh is an absolute gentleman, he has feelings though.
Bottomline, I just think Rizzo on his own hasn't been a good trader.
Wally.... had too much going on yesterday with all the playoff games and college football plus some company in town.
However.... I've now seen the Nats FIL team twice and either the Nats organization is really, really good or the Braves are really really bad because in the two games, I've seen 12 innings of baseball and the Nats are winning 17 - 0 cumulatively. Monday I'll see the Nats against the Tigers at Disney and then I'll get to see two games against the Astros later in the week.
But back to Friday..... Matt Purke seems to be still gaining arm strength because he only broke 90 once in the 1 2/3 innings and was mostly in the 88 mph range. His command was all over the place as he walked 2 and hit a guy while striking out 2 and giving up a double for the only hit against him.
His secondary pitches appear to be major league ready as he showed a solid slider at about 84 and a curve at 77 - 79 mph with a real good change up at 82. He will probably finish out the FIL season next week and then go to Arizona and join the rest of the guys that left Friday.
I'd say Sammy Solis is that full season ahead of Purke as of now but if Purke gets back to the 94 - 95 range, he may actually warrant that roster spot they gave him for signing.
All in all he finished with 34 total pitches, 17 strikes and 17 balls.
Blake Monar followed Purke and actually looked better. Another lefthander with shoulder injury history, drafted in the 12th round out of Indiana Monar went 3 an 1/3 innings giving up 1 hit and striking out 1 with no walks. He threw 36 pitches with 26 strikes and 10 balls. Like Purke, he hung around the 88 - 90 range with better sink,a quality breaking pitch around 80 to go with a pretty good straight change.
He'll probably start next season at Hagerstown but could start at Potomac.
Last year about this time I saw a righthander throw 2 innings of relief that impressed me named Ryan Mattheus and this year we have the equivalent in a guy named Christian Garcia.
Drafted in the third round by the NY Yankees in 2004 he was originally touted as a top arm in their organization ranked right along Phil Hughes . This past spring after 6 years and TWO TJ surgeries, the Yankees got tired of watching him rehab and released him.
Folks, if this guy is finally healthy the Nats have found another guy with terrific stuff wit a major League slider at 86 and a fastball at 95.
I would expect, if he stays healthy, that they start him at Harrisburg as he just turned 26.
The one guy that keeps squaring up everything thrown at him (at least in the 7 AB's I've seen) is Mike Taylor. This kid may be the "organization guy" Rizzo referenced earlier this year as a future center fielder and lead off guy.
His minor league numbers to date do not indicate a typical lead off hitter but that's what Instructional League baseball is all about and the Nats are working him hard towards that end.
The kid is 20 yo, 6'2" and about 190 with a ton of natural ability. I've seen him take pitches to RF for doubles and turn on a Tommy Hanson slider for a 400' shot to left field. He seems to get good break on balls hit his way but I haven't seen his arm tested yet. I'm looking forward to seeing him three times this week.
As to the Yankees and Tigers, I don't think that I've ever seen a team benefit from a rain delay/postponement as much as the Yankees did by not having to face Verlander and from switching from LH CC to RH Nova against the batting order that Leyland had, as Dawn said earlier.".
NatsJack, thanks for the update. That is great insight. Purke is the guy to watch and I think you are correct that he is ramping up. The reason the Nats paid so much was to get a hard throwing lefty.
I think it is great that other players there like Christian Garcia are catching your eye.
Taylor's numbers didn't impress me although I have heard he has "tools".
NatsJack in Florida said...".
October 2, 2011 12:14 PM
______________________________
That's where you are wrong. I am not bashing Rizzo. When he made the trade I thought he knew Willingham couldn't return to form.
I am not a hindsight guy. I think he needed to trade Willingham. He just didn't get a good enough package in return.
This is a CAUTIONARY TALE to everyone here who proposes crazy ideas which sent me off on a tangent.
Yah, lets trade LANNAN, FLORES and MARRERO for 1 player.
I actually think Lannan will improve further in 2012.
Sorry Gonat...I don't mean to place you in that category but there are others that continually bash Rizzo for almost any reason. As for what we got "at the time", others have pointed out that both Brown and Hrod were considered prospects at the time and I'm pretty sure any compensatory picks we would have received this year (had he stayed and had similar #'s)would cost considerably more in bonus signing than what those two cost and would be developmentally further away..
NatsJack in Florida said....
October 2, 2011 1:07 PM
____________________________
Its my pet peeve that ticks me off. They name Lannan like he is a throw-away like they did on July 31st with Ian Desmond..
1a will remember from another post I made why they are not trading Desi, namely: "Emilio Bonifacio."
Guys mature at different rates. Desi's mind was not totally in the game until after the baby was born--and later I heard about Willie Harris' having a baby stillborn, so you can understand that. Desi cleaned up his D a lot, and in September his O got better. You got a dynamite DP combo with him and Espi, and watching Desi leap for balls is a pleasure. If LaRoche can come back at anything near full strength, the infield is set and you armchair GM's can worry about other stuf...
I don't do arm-chair GM speculation but seeing as how I was mentioned specifically, duly noted re. Desi. ;-)
oh, I don't know it is fun to play GM when we have no Nats games to watch.
Anyways, one more guy I am interested in through trade is Sanchez from Giants. His only glitch is # of walks I believe.
Thanks Mark for the pic.
NatsLady said....
October 2, 2011 1:19 PM
______________________________
I don't think anyone thought he could score on that hit. It would have been 1st and 3rd with 1 out though.
It was possibly the negative turning point in the game for the Rays.
Its laughable. "I am willing to trade Lannan with Flores and Marrero for a lead-off hitter". I won't tell you who I want back in return. I am just willing to give up 1 starting pitcher and a catcher who can be a starter on many teams and a Rookie 1st baseman.
Doesn't everybody who comments on this blog play at being arm-chair GM's? There is no harm in speculating (we do not have any power anyway), we do it because it's fun, doesn't cost a thing, etc. Belittling someone's opinion is "bush league", and frankly un-American, free-speech and all that.
NatsJack - thanks for the updates from Fla. It will be pretty interesting to watch Purke go through his progressions. From what Rizzo said when they signed him, I was hoping that Purke was showing a little more velocity, but time will tell. I had heard good things on Taylor, and nice to hear that he continues to show improvement. Have you seen Meyer or Rendon play?
I appreciate the first hand accounts, and look forward to more.
Dawn, if you're referring to my comment, I wasn't belittling anyone's opinion. I don't do the armchair GM thing myself, but I would not try to tell anyone else whether or not they should do so (which is not to say that I always read such speculation, because I might just scroll through any given comment in that vein, particularly if it's quite lengthy). NatsLady mentioned me specifically as regards a trade discussion, and as I don't do the armchair GM thing, I wanted to clarify that I've not commented as which player should be traded or not. As I've said before, whatever it takes to get (the collective, not the specific) you through the season.
(or rather, through the offseason)
Dawn, sure you can do it, just give both sides of the trade.
Then again, maybe Dawn was responding to NatsJack's comment. In which case, never mind, 'cause he can handle his own bidness. :-)
new post - but with no cute baby picture
Yay! :-) Wait, booo! :-(
Natsfan1a, I was referring to GoNat's comment, it seemed a bit harsh to me. Tend to scroll through arm-chair GM stuff, there is so much that goes on behind the scenes that we don't know.
Thanks, Dawn. I didn't read the whole thread the first time. Agree re. behind the scenes stuff. |
It'll be Edwin Jackson against Madison Bumgarner, so the Nationals counter with a right-handed-heavy lineup that includes Tyler Moore at first base and Mark DeRosa in right field.
Hope everyone enjoys a fun and safe Independence Day, whether here at the ballpark or at home with friends and family. Plenty of updates to come, so please check back...
SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS at WASHINGTON NATIONALS
Where: Nationals Park
Gametime: 11:05 a.m. EDT
TV: MASN, MLB.tv, MLB Network (outside D.C. market)
Radio: WJFK (106.7 FM), WFED (1500 AM), XM 188
Weather: Partly cloudy, 89 degrees, Wind 8 mph LF to RF
NATIONALS (46-32)
2B Danny Espinosa
CF Bryce Harper
3B Ryan Zimmerman
LF Michael Morse
SS Ian Desmond
1B Tyler Moore
RF Mark DeRosa
C Jhonatan Solano
RHP Edwin Jackson
GIANTS (45-36)
CF Gregor Blanco
2B Emmanuel Burriss
LF Melky Cabrera
C Buster Posey
3B Pablo Sandoval
1B Brandon Belt
RF Nate Schierholtz
SS Brandon Crawford
LHP Madison Bumgarner
UMPIRES
HP Jerry Meals, 1B Gary Darling (cc), 2B Paul Emmel, 3B Scott Barry
11:08 a.m. -- And we are underway. The crowd is still filing in, perhaps struggling to get here so early. But it looks like it could be a full house, or very close to one.
11:25 a.m. -- Edwin Jackson started this one off by walking Gregor Blanco on five pitches. And it only went downhill from there. Melky Cabrera singled to right, with Mark DeRosa making a terrible decision to fire a throw from right field through the cutoff man and all the way to third base, even though he had no chance to throw out Blanco. In the end, that didn't really make a difference, though, because after Buster Posey drove one run home on a slow roller, Pablo Sandoval crushed a meatball of a pitch from Jackson into the center-field bleachers to give the Giants a 3-0 lead. Jackson has now surrendered 17 earned runs in 16 first innings this year, which equates to a 9.56 ERA. That's not good.
11:42 a.m. -- Jackson wasn't entirely sharp in the top of the second, either, but he was better and avoided giving up a run. He didn't get any help from DeRosa, who looked awful trying to track down Brandon Crawford's drive to right. Hasn't been a good start to this game for the veteran utilityman. Still 3-0 Giants heading to the bottom of the second.
11:56 a.m. -- As has often been the case this season, Jackson is getting better with each passing inning. He retired the side in the third, never letting the ball leave the infield, and he's retired five in a row now. His teammates, however, have yet to record a hit off Madison Bumgarner through two innings.
12:14 p.m. -- If you're an opposing pitcher, is there anything you want to see less right now than Ian Desmond at the plate with the bases loaded? The All-Star shortstop does it again, roping a two-out, two-run single up the middle in the bottom of the third. That came a few minutes after Ryan Zimmerman came within inches of a three-run homer, settling instead for an RBI double off the top of the wall. Put them together, and this is now a 3-3 game heading to the fourth. Desmond, meanwhile, now has 47 RBI in Game 79 of the season. I'm not sure even the most optimistic of Desmond fans could have foreseen that.
12:23 p.m. -- By the way, 25 of Desmond's 47 RBI this season have come with two outs. That seems like a lot to me.
12:35 p.m. -- Ladies and gentlemen: The Onion strikes again! Jhonatan Solano with an opposite-field homer to put the Nats up 4-3 in the fourth. He's now hitting .385 with two homers and six RBI in extremely limited playing time. This is the Nats' FIFTH-string catcher, remember.
12:48 p.m. -- It's pretty remarkable how Jackson is able to so consistently bounce back from bad first innings. He's now retired 12 of the last 14 he's faced and is through the fifth having allowed only those three early runs.
1:01 p.m. -- Barkeep, another round of ... well, you get the idea by now. Zim does it again, mashing a two-run homer to right-center to continue his torrid run at the plate. And then seconds later, Morse drills a solo shot into the right-field bullpen. These guys are just hammering the ball to the opposite field today. It's 7-3 Nats after five.
1:20 p.m. -- Well, Jackson is finally done, unable to complete the sixth inning. Not that it was entirely his fault. The Mark DeRosa Right Field Clinic continues, and it's not pretty as the veteran misplays Sandoval's drive into an RBI double. At 7-4, Davey Johnson decided to pull his starter and brought in Tom Gorzelanny to get out of the sixth. All things considered, Jackson did a nice job to salvage a decent start out of what looked terrible after the first inning.
1:36 p.m. -- Hey, DeRosa caught a ball! Seventh-inning stretch, still 7-4.
1:44 p.m. -- We head to the eighth, and here is Sean Burnett trying to protect a 3-run lead. He's been very good at that this year.
2:00 p.m. -- Rick Ankiel gets into the act with a two-run shot in the eighth. That's the fourth home run hit by the Nationals to right field today. It's 9-4 now.
2:21 p.m. -- That'll do it. The Nats win 9-4 to improve to 47-32. At 15 games over .500, they've matched their highwater mark of the season.
217 comments:«Oldest ‹Older 1 – 200 of 217 Newer› Newest»
I am ready, coffee in hand. How about you? Go Nats!!!!!
I'm with you baseballswami! Coffee in one hand cigar in the other! :-)
GYFNG!!!!
I'll be watching MASN on TV today. Let's get'em again boys!!! GYFNG!!!
TyMo!!!!
Hot dogs for breakfast!! At the park with friends!! No better way to celebrate the 4th!
GYFNG!!!
I was a bit surprised when the Giants pulled Messrs. Cabrera, Sandoval, and Posey so early last night, effectively throwing in the towel on game one in the fifth inning (if memory serves) to -- presumably -- focus on games two and three. Given that both teams had an off-day on Monday and that we're still only at the season's half-way point, that struck me as premature (even given the Nats' big lead).
And apparently the Giants came here a day early to adjust.
MEMO TO: E. JACKSON
FROM: D. JOHNSON
FYI, THE ALTITUDE OF NATIONALS STADIUM IS 16 FEET ABOVE SEA LEVEL. HAVE A GOOD DAY.
Eugene, time will tell. Davey went with his starters into the bottom of the 9th after the long rain delay. Bochy was too early and Davey waited too long. Niche conceded the game in the 6th.
Meant bottom of the 8th
Sandy Leon is officially off the DL and back w/ Harrisburg. Glad he is healthy again, he was the emergency call up since Solano was on Syracuse's DL when Ramos tore his ACL.
Great to see all this catching depth, even after the departure of Norris.
Norris BTW is doing well during his first 2 weeks up:
.333/.375/.533 with 2 HRs & 6 RBIs in 8 games & 30 ABs
NCNatsie....That means Edwin needs to keep his pitches at no more than 18' above sea level because it was the elevation of his pitches that killed him in Denver.
Ejax is due to have a good game . We need a strong run up to the break. Miami for 4 after the break in their place.
anyone catch Reid's editorial:
Reid
I know there are some who would like to land Greinke, even as a rental for the rest of the season and others who strongly oppose. I fall into the latter category, what I don't understand from Reid is why he didn't offer any specific scenarios. Instead, he was very general in what the team should offer for Greinke.
There really are only a handful of sports jockeys and columnist who know the Nats. I wish writers / DJs like Reid would not feel obligated to cover the Nats and just leave it to the experts.
Wow!I like this starting time!finally I can follows the Nats in the afternoon(it's 5p.m. here)!Go Nats!!!!
Is it me or does beer taste different at 11:00 AM?
CN, completely agree with you on Reid and Greinke. Going into the postseason with Gio, JZimm, EJax, and Det would be a rotation most teams would kill for.
5 pitch walk
CN,
I don't have a problem with Jason Reid not offering specific scenarios (in terms of whom the Nats might have to give up to get Zack Greinke). But the real question is whether the Nats would be getting a three-month 'rental' or whether the deal included a longer-term contract (or contract extension). And I assume that a longer-term deal would mean that Edwin Jackson would be moving on after this year (or even earlier, perhaps?). One point where I agree with Mr. Reid is that acquiring Mr. Greinke would deny him to the Braves (or Phillies), which would be an added advantage of such a move. I'm not quite ready to advocate for such a trade, but I don't see it as far-fetched either.
Are we worried yet? Watching Bryce go after that ball in the outfield- he has very long strides, gets there quickly and looks smooth out there. Good news as we may need it today.
Now we're worried. Come on, offense!
Leadoff walks will kill you. That has nothing to do with altitude.
Why can't EJax get out of the first inning without giving up runs? Any opinions?
11 millions of "why??"... -.-"
I'm guessing Bryce may have problems with this lefty.
I have no say in it, I think Greinke is too inconsistent and won't fit into the clubhouse here. That's my 2 cents.
Go after Dempster if he comes back healthy or Wandy.
Gonat.....If Greinke wasn't a good clubhouse guy, Rizzo would never have gone after him last Winter.
NatsJack, don't be so sure.
Zim drilled one, unfortunately, Bum did his best goalie impression and prevented it from going into CF for an RBI single. instead, it's a 1-3 groundout...
Absent specific evidence to the contrary, I'm with NatsJack on that one. Rizzo has been really consistent, and successful, on that point.
Zim runs like a catcher now.
DeRosa is actually making me miss Michael Morse in RF...
Eugene,
I find it hard to believe that the Nats are going to offer the $140M it may take to tie down Greinke long-term.
As I type that, Giants get a one-out double roped over DeRosa's head in RF.
m20832: One would think something related to his pre-game prep. Not looking at(or digesting)film, scouting reports would be one guess. Just doesn't seem ready to go.
Or, maybe just good old-fashioned nerves.
Wow, that was a catchable ball by Crawford over DeRosa.
Kind of funny to read the comments about Bochy cashing it in last night after reading the story about the minor league coach who was suspended for a year for throwing a game in the 17th inning because he didn't want to risk injury to position players who had to pitch. Double standard anyone?
Sofa,
Morse has made plenty of plays using every bit of his 6'5+ frame. Morse might very well have had that it his glove.
Have I mentioned that I like this Solano kid?
Greinke hasnt had issues the Brewers. He supposedly did with the Royals. Still, he is inconsistent and not good on the road.
Hopefully this is where EJax begins to settle down, since this will be his 2nd time thru the lineup. He gets out of a jam there, time for the bottom half of the lineup to generate some offense in the 2nd.
Double standard anyone?
Well, not really the same. Teams have come back with their bench in the game. There was that Cubs game earlier in the season, where they blew a big lead. Ask the Brewers. As I understand it, the manager in that minor league game told his position player, who was pitching, to deliberately balk in the winning run. I see a qualitative difference there.
Wow, that's a bad AB. Struck out AND got picked off.
Morse has made plenty of plays using every bit of his 6'5+ frame. Morse might very well have had that it his glove.
Maybe. The trouble there was the lack of a jump, and a bad route, neither of which is Morse's strong suit.
And another really forgettable AB, 3U on a check swing "whoopsie." Man, I hope he gets back on track soon.
Gonat,
You don't have to worry about it. The Nats don't have the pieces it takes to get Greinke who is just about the best pitcher in the NL (with the possible exception of Dickey).
Why does the home team look tired? Disappointed EJax didn't come out firing. He got home early last night. He shouldn't be tired.
Derosa is the Matt Stairs of 2012... Rizzo must dig really deep into the dumpster to find these turkeys.
Really mind-boggling how effective EJax is after the first time thru the lineup. Night & Day. They should have him pitch batting practice to the opposing team to get rid of the yips...
JD, don't quote me WAR.
OK, let's go get something!
GYFNG
Gonat,
OK, what do you want to use ? W/L - check. ERA - check. K/BB - check, HR per 9 innings - check.
let me guess; the eye test.
Nothing new with Ejax. His past performance shows a very high era in the first. Just takes him a while to get the feel. You just hope he doen't give up too much and hope your offense can overcome it. We need some hits..
JD.....I'm with you on Greinke but you have to admit, the home/road splits are pretty strange.
btw Gonat. why not WAR?
Nats are going for the record of least pitches thrown by opposing pitcher.
Teams have come back with their bench in the game.... I see a qualitative difference there.
Well, obviously there's a difference. But Bochy thought it was better to protect and rest his players by essentially giving up on the game. It was clear what he was doing and everyone thinks its fine. Heck, NL thinks that Davey tosses in the towel regularly when he uses the back end of our bullpen. Yet, this poor guy who thought it was better to protect his young, minor league players by giving up on the game, gets banned from the dugout for a year. Whatever difference there is doesn't merit such a draconian sanction.
maybe not. two, two-out singles by Espi and Harper for Zimm.
Derosa is the Matt Stairs of 2012... Rizzo must dig really deep into the dumpster to find these turkeys.
But but but, didn't you see that good hit last night??
I thought that was a no-doubter by Zim.
Steve, so did Zim.
surprised harper did not score from first. good to see we got one back, let's keep going.
Nats making Bumgarner work in this inning.
DESI does it again with 2 outs and a runner on 3rd. That is the definition of clutch.
Desi for President!!!!
Way to pick them up, Dessie!! No harm done on the missed HR by Zim. That's 5 straight runners reaching w/ 2 outs!
there is no such thing as clutch hitting in baseball. :P
anyways, good to see our number four pitcher is keeping up with their #2 pitcher.
Nice 2 out rally against a good pitcher.
FP with some great intel. He just said that Bumgarner woke up this morning at 7:30AM and he did the same yesterday to get used to time zone and early start.
The heat and long inning got to him.
TyMo seems different to me since he got picked off last week. Anyone else think so?
New game!
I won't be greedy but TyMo had him on the ropes.
Is it my imagination or have the Nats been really clutch with 2 outs this year?
Desi now batting .326 with 2 outs and RISP. That is clutch. I don't have the stats on whether or not that leads the Majors. Is ELIAS listening?
Sweet clutch hitting from Desmond. Wow. Zim misses a 3 run bomb by inches, but Desi comes through.
I just feel like Jackson works a little slow.
Nice to see the bats still alive.
Solano is pretty good. Nice DP!!!
Steve, I just quoted you on Twitter. I see the Nats Twitter also did. Coincidence?
Ejax missed his spot inside by laying one over the plate. No matter, it's a 4-6-3 inning ending DP on a great scoop on a hard it ball.
EJax is miraculously at 16 pitches/inning thru 4 after a horrific first.
Now that the Nats have gotten back in the game, those posters that only come out when they are losing can go back to lurking.
I didn't know Solano before, I am starting to now. I want to see him more. I see him as a possible 1A. Expect 3 catchers on the Nats roster in September.
NatsJack, don't stir them up. Most of them don't have power.
Actually, there has only been one of those posters today.
Ghost......2004 here in Central Florida convinced me to invest in a whole house generator.
Solano!!!!!!!
The Nats also like Leon a lot, but he needs more seasoning. That said, the Onion puts the Nats on top!!!!
Did I mention I like this Solano kid?
Wow!!! Ejax takes a huge swing. Would've been something if he went back to back w/ Solano.
Funny that most of us were wondering about what the Nats would do after trading Norris. C is still well-stocked, the backstop is in good hands, my friends.
Solano should get more playing time. He is a better hitter than Flores.
NatsJack, I learned that living in the Pacific. Generators are our friends. Even when you have power, somebody else doesn't.
So he is only 5 ' 9 ". Tons of energy. I have talked a lo about the three rookie position players, but we have 4 really good ones. That is just amazing!
No need to trade fo a veteran backup catcher. Solano is great @ calling the game and protecting the ball from going to the backstop. He's got a great bat too..
Cooling rooms by Section 202 are a godsend.
Yogi Berra was only 5'7'".
NatsJack in Florida said...
Ghost......2004 here in Central Florida convinced me to invest in a whole house generator.
July 04, 2012 12:31 PM
I have a portable generator at my main residence and it has multiple outlets. One goes to DirecTV, one to my TV, one to my fridge.
On the road, I use cell service to power my MLB.TV and a technology called Slingbox which allows me to watch MASN on my laptop.
phil,
Solano has had 27 PA's. Maybe too soon to declare him a better hitter than Flores.
Morse has an uncanny ability to get to the ball. He's a lumbering mofo out there, but he seems to make the play more often than not, even with a bad hammy.
NatsJack in Florida said....
July 04, 2012 12:38 PM
I like his comfort level with the pitchers. Its a confidence. That's what I really like about Ramos. The HR was a bonus.
Solano has looked better than I had anticipated but before you know he's the real deal you have to see what happens after the league has seen him for 2 to 3 months. This is why it's still early to conclude on TyMo; he's still a work in progress.
Ghost,
Good observations re Solano.
Ghost ......mine provides 400 amp service and is on an auromatic transfer switch.
When you work as the construction guy for an Architect that specializes in Police, Fire, and Emergency Ops Centers, you have an advantage in getting stuff.
If EJax could start inning #1 like his middle innings, he would look like an Ace.
Nice, through mid-5 with the lead!
So about the catchers/ pitchers. I was watching last night and it appears that JZim has started calling his own game. I have seen our pitchers just throw whatever the catcher puts down, the game goes pretty quickly then. Does anyone know if our pitchers generally do/do not call their own games? Or if they only do it with Solano and let Flo call their games? My observation has been that Strasburg and Jordan are the only ones consistently calling their own game with both catchers at this point. Anyone know anything about that ?
Edwin is pitching really well now. He has a 1st inning problem in that it takes him an inning to get a feel for his pitches but he usually bounces back if the damage isn't too bad.
I was hoping for 7 innings from him today but it looks more like 6 now.
Happy 4th everyone !!!
NJ, Ghost, and everyone else who enjoys insulting negative commenters whenever the Nats play well -- lay off. You're boring. At most, the Nats will win 60% of their games, and our hitters will succeed 3 out of 10 times. You'll be "proven" wrong just as often as they will. I like a difference of opinion here, not just a cheering section.
JD said...
Ghost,
Good observations re Solano.
July 04, 2012 12:42 PM
Its truly amazing for a Rookie thrust into this. I want to see him 2 days a week. Just 2. Let's see how he does.
Gonat......I've come to expect the 1st inning stuff from EJax....3 is about as bad as I can handle and I consider 1 a good first inning.
Bryce Harper is the Rookie I really like. Bryce must think its Sunday. 2 hits in another day game.
NatsJack in Florida said...
Gonat......I've come to expect the 1st inning stuff from EJax....3 is about as bad as I can handle and I consider 1 a good first inning.
July 04, 2012 12:49 PM
JZim was once that way. The Cat had him throw a simulated 1st inning. It certainly cuts your day shorter but it has to be worth trying something different.
EJax's Ace game against the Orioles was due to getting thru the 1st quickly and 1-2-3.
ZIMMY!!!
Sound the horn!!!! Holiday time for Zim!!!!
Wow, I thought that was dbl in the gap, instead, it's a line drive homer over the RF scoreboard!!!!
This is a beast of a pitching staff our guys are facing too, mind you!
That makes it official.....Zim is back.....and I mean ALL the way back.
Zim is getting locked in.
Good news for Nats nation !!
Is this really Bum? LOL we are HOT as the weather right now.
These guys are hittin'.... ( captain obvious )
Back 2 Back!!!
BEAST MODE!!!! Bumgarner's road ERA is taking a beating & his regular ERA is toast.
GORSE Hacking!
Murderer's row...Harper, Zimmerman, Morse
Back to back fireworks!!!!
The Beast!!!!
Holy crap, these guys are scary!
Too bad this team is so dependent on pitching....If only they could hit.
early fireworks!!
NatsJack, yeah, Rizzo is running this team into the ground by not benching Zim & Espi. Morse is clearly showing the effects of missing the first 2 months of the season too.
Trust me, I get disappointed when our team doesn't produce. Fact of the matter is, this team is competing and the team is filled with a roster full of guys 27 & under, which gives us a lot of hope.
You'd swear we were in the Phillies position by reading some of the posts on here.
NatsJack in Florida said...Too bad this team is so dependent on pitching....If only they could hit.
Well, everyone knows their batting coach is teh sux.
Just wish TyMo can find that stroke. Not good that he is struggling. It was bound to happen. Not getting regular starts.
My head is spinning. Who would have thought we'd beat up both Lincecum and Bumgarner? Matt Cain, you're next! This lineup is on fire. And what a great time for the bats to come alive. E-Jax and JZnn, both hard luck starters so far this year, must be pinching themselves.
Now take DeRosa out of this lineup and insert Werth; platoon Brown with TyMo and have Lombo spell Espi, Desi and Zim.
No need to trade for any more bats; just 1 more pitcher to take the SS slot and we have a shot to go far.
Cain is much more experienced and has been a better pitcher this season than Bum and Timmy. Having said that our offense has been on fire since that trip to Coors and that cortisone shot for Zim. Wish he had done that sooner.
Bumgarner's ERA from 2.79 at the bottom of the 2nd to 3.27 at the bottom of the 5th.
EJax with a leadoff walk can't make Davey happy.
No need to start putting people on , Edwin. This game is far from out of reach for a good hitting , first place team like the Giants. Hold it together.
Faraz, don't we all. What a difference.
JD. I agree that Solano has only had limited at bats. However, he has a nice, aggressive swing with good results. He does not swing at bad pitches. I think it is prudent off of what we have seen to play him more than once or twice a week.
Firm, I don't know exactly what you said and it doesn't matter. I am laughing.
Firm Possession, My Gorsehacken Sofa said...some tendentious hotel will post a long exegesis...
Two questions:
1) Is that the first time ever that those two words have appeared in a baseball blog post...?
2) Is that something I have to hit you for?
phil, some teams may not even have a scouting report on Solano. Keep that in mind. Get excited about his defense and you won't be disappointed. The offense is a bonus.
Traveling solo, I once stayed in a tendentious hotel in Jackson, Mississippi. I will never do that again.
Time for DeRosa to take a seat once the Giants bring in the RH pitcher.
Rough game for DeRosa. I'm still sticking to my guns that Morse would've made those two tough plays out there b/c of his length.
What do they say about lead-off walks?
I don't know, but wouldn't Tendentious Hotel make a good name for a rock band?
Go ahead and hit me if you like, I'll take my base and steal another one.
Man, DeRosa is killing EJax out there. Another very catchable ball. Pretty sure Morse would have gotten to that.
Harper would have caught that ball in RF.
I love that Geico possum commercial.
Love having a plethora of lefties in the 'pen for just games like this.
phil dunton said...
Harper would have caught that ball in RF.
Harper would have caught that ball even if he'd been playing LEFT field.
Two lead-off walks lead to two runs by the Giants. EJax otherwise showed great control in the game. Two bad he couldn't go six and be PH for in the bottom of the inning.
phil dunton said...
Harper would have caught that ball in RF.
July 04, 2012 1:12 PM
Still a tough play although DeRosa was playing plenty deep.
Harper would have caught that ball in RF.
So would Morse. So would Bernadina. Lucky for us, DeRosa made the last out in the last inning, so he can be doubleswitched.
Wow, "tendentious hotel" is a thing. Go figure. Just don't click on any of the links if you google it.
somebody tell me we got a guy in derosa who cant hit or catch. Horrible effort. this aint over. This aint little league not everyone has to play.
Tendentious.
Exegesis.
Plethora.
A very erudite group here today.
Firm Possession, My Gorsehacken Sofa said...
Wow, "tendentious hotel" is a thing. Go figure. Just don't click on any of the links if you google it.
If those aren't spam traps, there's no such animal.
I'm not a Gorzo hater by any means, but I was holding my breath on a 3 run homer... Good work Gorzo.
A very erudite group here today.
Well-educated, too.
In a similar vein, I actually hold out hope for Henry, and last night was a great way to slowly break him in, but keep him away from the mound today!
Gorzo!!! Bochy with his first managerial mistake.
No consistencey from this umpire. That miss catch by Dagrossnis changed momentum. gotta get it back here.
Ghost, It isn't like Flores is a hitting machine. His offense is marginal at best. I am nonly saying Solano should get more playing time because he has produced. If he fades, then we go back to playing him once a week.
And Sofa covers the gamut from exegesis to pulling a hotel move on somebody. Gotta love it.
Pretty sure I've mentioned it already. Like this Cebolla kid.
Solano again! Nice stolen base!
I'm gettin in the mood to listen to Lefty and Pancho...
Onion Ambush!
Man, this is good stuff.
Wait, that's not duct tape on Solano's wrist, is it?
Davey went for the knockout punch with Espi instead of busting. Nothing to show for that.
Onion powder, uh I mean power.
Pancho and Lefty
Here ya go! Kind of a downer song, though.
DeRosa made that play! Nice 1-2-3
To DeRosa:
"Just when I think you couldn't sink any lower, you do something... and totally redeem yourself!"
-Lloyd Christmas
DeRosa is starting to get the hang of it, maybe?
Did I mention I like this, too?
Not much of a segue from Townes Van Zant, but it's eclectic in here. Must be the heat.
Gonat said...
Davey went for the knockout punch with Espi instead of busting. Nothing to show for that.
July 04, 2012 1:31 PM
Its the calculated risk in this game. Bunt them and let Bryce do his thing with men on 2nd and 3rd or play for the big inning.
The risk of Espi hitting into a DP was a small risk and it happened.
Oh well, get 'em in the 7th.
Can Cliff Lee get his 1st win today? Hate to pull for the Philthies but I will today against the Mets. 0-0 into the bottom of their 3rd.
Davey with the athletic outfield. Glad to see that! Burnie and Bernie in the game!
The Phils can beat the Mets' bullpen, Ghost. Works for me.
If Burnie could teach Gio that slider, Gio would be the best lefty starter in the Majors.
No love for Solano on MLB's front page. I mean he also homered off of Bum. Should mention his name also.
Sofa-Lefty & Pancho/Pancho & Lefty...my Spanish ain't so good.
Downer you're right and I love Booker T much better to boot. Donald Duck Dunn just passed I believe. Love that Stax sound. Did you ever youtube that Norway show with Booker T and the MGs as the band backing Otis, and Arthur Conley, and Sam & Dave? Same & Dave dance incredibly through a 7 minute+ version of Hold On.
Hitting for the cycle here...
Nice 8th by the Nats. Burnett doing his thing.
Did I mention Chris Young with a Perfect Game in the 4th. The Philthies really do look like a last place team.
Chris Young's Perfect Game and no hitter just ended.
Let's make this a non-save situation.
Good jinx on Chris Young.
Ank the Tank!!!!
And that's almost exactly what I meant.
If only the Nats had a bench.
Lefty & Pancho/Pancho & Lefty...my Spanish ain't so good.
Maybe, but you're encendido! That's funny.
As is Rick Ankiel!
Surface! Surface!
ANK!!! JUST AMAZED BY THE OFFENSE!
NatsJack, you wrote exactly what I was thinking. Bernadina w/ a single. Ankiel with a HR. Solano with a great game. OK, TyMo has struggled. JayB can complain about that.
Oh, and he will.
OK, TyMo has struggled. JayB can complain about that.
That's what 222 was talking about, wasn't it?
Clay Hensley won't be available tomorrow. Threw 21 pitches. Giants using up a lot of relievers and didn't have to pitch the 9th last night and probably won't have to today.
My next event of the day is watching the continuing implosion that is taking place in the Marlins locker room. Can't wait to watch the Fish/Brew Crew game today. |
As the rest of the sporting world worries about Stephen Strasburg's impending shutdown and the supposedly crushing effect it will have on the Nationals' championship aspirations, other members of the majors' best rotation simply take the mound and do their part to carry this team to new heights.
The national discussion about the Nationals' rotation has been focused on Strasburg, with perhaps a little bit of love sprinkled in for Jordan Zimmermann and Gio Gonzalez. All the while, Edwin Jackson has quietly gone about his business, churning out innings and getting stronger and more effective as the regular season reaches its final month.
"People keep talking about Stras. You know, Edwin Jackson is a heck of a pitcher," Jayson Werth said following Thursday night's 8-1 triumph over the Cardinals. "He's a big-game pitcher. He won big games last year, late in the year, in the postseason. Take Stras out and put Edwin in. I like it."
What's not to like? With eight dominant innings Thursday night against the NL's most productive lineup, Jackson continued his late-August surge and carried the Nationals to a rousing victory in the opener of an 11-game homestand.
Read more
137 comments:
GREAT WIN!!! Let's do another one tomorrow.
You know it will be a good night when EJax makes it through the 1st with "good stuff".
The Jayson Werth that I always remembered owning us is the one who sprinkled doubles and triples all over the field. I think that guy is back and will be more fun than the power, HR guy some people think he needs to be.
Interesting comments from Jackson specifically on "Pitch to contact"
K's just happen!
Off topic but Kilgore says Stras stayed late at Marlins Park after getting shelled by the Marlins. He analyzed his performance with Suzuki and Randy Knorr. No mention of McCatty. Hmmmm . . .
Knorr controls running game both offensively and defensive
ly according to either Charles or Dave.
Rizzo, thanks for saving Stras arm for the Yankee years. If we dont win these year is ok , since Rizzo never expect to happen , and dont prepare for this. After we spend all that money going to the games in the bad years, Rizzo telling us to keep waiting .
NatsNut, give me the Jayson Werth who is getting on-base at a .400 clip in the lead-off.
The way he sees lots of pitches and frustrates the pitchers will play into the hands of Bryce Harper who is getting hot again.
Jimmy Rollins was pulled again last night after not running out a popup. Charlie Manual pulled no punches after the game.
Manny Acta had the same issue with his catcher Santana.
Food for thought.... If Nats win tonight it is win number 80.
This would be 80 wins, at least 5 and a half up going into Sept 1... who would have thunk it, lol
Gonat... looking at the standings, it is not far fetched to see the Phillies catching fire, passing both Pirates and Cards for a Wild Card. The problem with my scenario is Nats play Phillies 6 more times which means they, the Phillies would probably have to win both sseries.
And now John Lannan is channeling his inner "Tom Glavine" and is chomping at the bit to return to the Nats rotation.
NatsJack...I think what Lannan has done in both starts for Nats can not be under estimated... looking forward to seeing John in September
five out of ten series for phillies against serious contenders, braves, reds, and nats.
astros on the other hand, are likely to be the first team since 2003 Tigers to win less than 50 games in a season. They are at 40 wins right now and will have to win at least ten or more (which they have done twice this season but won exactly eight games in last two months) to get past 50.
mick....just cheked the Wild Card standings and thr Phillies have a near impossible task.
Last year the Rays snuck in after being 9 games out on Sept. first but all they needed was the monumental collapse of 1 team, the Red Sox.
For the Phillies to sneak in, they will need 3 of the following to collapse like the Red Sox,the Braves, Cardinals, Dodgers and Pirates. Pretty tough.
NatsJack... your probably right and I never thought about how many had to collapse
Faraz Shaikh interesting
That's right NatsJack. both Rays and Cards were top wild card contenders.
OK gang, what time tomorrow are the rosters expanded, is it all 15 over night or over a few days? maybe peric can best answer this one and of course.... other than Lannan and Brown, what other players are joining us?
Fast Eddie,
Per Amanda's Article, McCatty was with them.
here is the Link:
Stras after loss
Davey is on record as saying he only needs another middle infielder, back-up catcher and pinch-runner. The rest of the call-ups will join an extended Goon Squad and get little to no playing time.
Add either Solano or Leon and watch for a 40 man move to get Christian Garcia to go along with Brown and Lannan and possibly Eury Perez.
In spite of what others may tell you, Davey wants to maintain focus on the guys that got us here.
that makes sense.... does Garcia and Perez get any playing time?
Eury Perez is raking
Sept. 1 begins at midnight. You probably won't see players brought up before their minor league season ends after this weekend, for whomever is coming.
I want to thank the Nats for losing almost all of their games while I was away on vacation so I wasn't tempted to spend my time reading all the commentary here. And for playing so well last night as I returned so I was hardly tempted at all to switch over to the RNC. I'll be back at NatsPark tonight, hoping that the newly revived offense is for real because Wainwright is a really good pitcher (Garcia really isn't).
I did spend some time in airports reading the comments about the game two nights ago and wanted to point out something about the Harper ejection that didn't seem to get much notice. At least on the replay on the little screen on my iPhone, it appeared that the helmet bounced and almost hit CB Buckner. In fact, as some noted, he didn't really see the helmet being thrown at all. But he certainly noticed it as it rebounded very close to his feet.
In light of that, I'm not surprised Harper was tossed and I don't have a problem with the call at all. It's one thing to punish your equipment in frustration (maybe they shouldn't but lots of players do it and don't get tossed), it's quite another to punish it and endanger others. Not that a bouncing helmet is much of a danger, but a splintering bat sure is and Harper probably should have been tossed for that too. Let's hope this ejection finally scares Harper straight on these silly outbursts.
Ok, I'm back in the swing of things. Can't wait for tonight.
Perez definitely pinch runs and Garcia would situational relieve.
Hard to see Eury like I said a month ago being any more than a pinch runner and a pinch bunter.
222....a clear shot from the side shows the helmet passed 5' + or - in front of Bucknor.
ha, I just came back from tracking down the Comak report on the battery's staying after class, but I see that Michele beat me to it. Well done.
Nice win last night, and Edwin looked great. Reminded me of that complete game of his earlier in the season. Was great to see the shout-out for Lannan on the broadcast as well. Wish I could get out there sooner than Monday but I don't know that I can talk my hubby into picking up another weekend game. :-)
222.....and for the record, just about all of us were in favor of Bryce getting tossed.
We're just glad it happened in the 9th inning of a blowout win in August instead of the 1st inning of a play off game. It should count as a fairly inexpensive lesson for the kid.
Jimmy Rollins back to being the center of anger in Philly. I hope he once again calls them frontrunners.
I saw him Livo to 1st on the popup. Supposedly third time he has done it and this time the popup was dropped.
Dysfunction in Philly, who would have thunk it.
PSA:
If you don't have tickets for tonight or Sunday, there's a promotion for half-off the cheap seats. Type "CAPDEAL" into the promo code box for
$9 - Upper Infield Gallery
$15 - LF/RF Mezzanine
$18 - LF/RF Corner
Tickets on sale until 4:30pm Friday (Aug 31 game) and 10:30am Sunday (Sept 2 game)
Michele:
Thanks for setting the record straight on McCatty being in the Stras post-game analysis session. Kilgore didn't mention him in his article.
Probably Maya too for low-leverage innings, since they're paying him anyway.
82 wins would be the Nats record, but it would take 96 for the franchise one. I think that's possible, perhaps even likely. 17-15 would be a lackluster finish for this squad. But the goal would be the division, then the best NL record, obviously.
Nats biggest need on September 1st is bullpen arms. The big story is what happens to HenRod.
It was so great being there last night! One thing we noticed that hasn't popped up anywhere was when Bryce walked back to the dugout after being called out on first, he kicked the dirt on the warning track some. It made our whole chunk of fans go, "aw!" And EJax was in a ZONE!
It's so nice to wake up and there's still baseball, and they are still playing well. You walk in the park, and that flag is still at the top of the pole, where it's been almost all season.
They have a web service in the regular seats now, where you can order food and drink to come to you. Problem is, as we all know: NO GETTING ONLINE! You can read twitter, and you can text, but posting to NI is impossible these days, and I never got the "seat service" site to load. Just wondered if anyone here had the same experience? I will say that once I get to my seat, I don't leave unless it's an emergency. ANyway....go NATS!
Ken Rosenthal with another Boras-hate article today on Stras.
The hate runneth over.
222.....and for the record, just about all of us were in favor of Bryce getting tossed.
At the time, I too thought the helmet bouncing past startled Bucknor, and that's why he reacted. Just my impression. Oh, and that look Bryce gets in his eyes sometimes--I remembered last night where I've seen it before. Mike Tyson.
Hate on the guy like a slimy defense attorney, but Boras is really good at his job.
That's the thing about defense, everybody hates it until it's you he's defending.
Yeah, JaneB, I know what you mean. They're playing so well, I barely have to drink at all to get through a game.
where is KenR's article? I couldn't find it at msn.
NJ, yeah, I saw that most were in favor. Not all though, and a few commenters were unnecessarily harsh on Buckner, comparing him to Angel, JoeW, LazD etc. for wanting to make the game about him. In this instance he simply didn't deserve the criticism.
Kind of sad the Nats need to serve up all these ticket deals for a weekend series vs. the playoff contending Cards. Must be the holiday or something.
Faraz, I think it's this one.
C'mon, we're complaining now about getting half-price tix?
JaneB, re. the flags: to think that early in the season, I had my husband take a pic of it because "you don't know how long it will be up there." heh.
Re. communications at the park: my not-so-smart phone is good mainly for texting at the ballpark, and I don't do it all that much - mainly to check in with baseball buddies I'm meeting or to send my player of the game vote. That's okay because trying to watch the game and keep score is about all I can handle at once. :-)
Thanks to sec3 for the tix discount info, although it's more about the time commitment for the hubster.
NatsJack. Rosenthal is going to catch hell for that article.
Faraz......Fox Sports.com.
I just tweeted Rosenthall and told him how disappointed I was in the article. I told him it showed a total lack of understanding.
He tweeted back "of what?". I tweeted " the developemental process of a young arm. The Nats shut down Alex Meyer this season at 130 innings as part of the organizational approach to developement." No word back yet.
Jack, FWIW, I thought it read like a cheap shot, myself.
Although, cheap shots at powerful people should usually get a pass, I think. So there's that.
Well, imho, this part in particular is hogwash:
"With that, there would have been no story, nothing to distract from the Nationals’ brilliant season"
Because they would have just found something else to stir the pot about. Well, this pot is refusing to be stirred, so there! Yawn. :-)
thanks guys. reading it right now.
nice response on that tweet NatsJack.
eh, one can make a point without taking a cheap shot, regardless of whether the target is powerful. Cheap shots say more about the shooter than the shootee, as it were. imho.
NatsJack..Don't think your reply went back to Ken.
Michele....I sent it as a text.
Just resent it as a tweet.
great feedback on the rosters
Sec.3, My Sofa said...
Faraz, I think it's this one.
August 31, 2012 9:54 AM
That's the one. I'm glad you all are pissed after reading it. The guy is a hater because he is an insider with all the agents but Boras. The 2 have a history together and basically you don't cross Boras but unfortunately Kenny has the power of the pen and is sticking it to the Nats and Stras because of Boras.
Of course Kenny acts like he is being objective. Yah, whatever.
I think one of the things that is funny about all the National media blowing this out of proportion with Stras is that they get hammered by Nats fans and it dies down. ESPN has tried to get fans to take the bait and everyone backs Rizzo.
So in a way, our resonable responses and defense of Rizzo is a major buzz kill for the Media. I like that.
Gonna be hard to keep the best record in MLB for the next few days... (We actually got it back .608 to the Reds' .606). Reds get the Stros (who may not win another game this season).
Their schedule is Astros, Fils, Astros (again);
Other than the Astros, their schedule is rsimilar to ours, Cubs, Brewers, Marlins, Dodgers, and final series against the Cards.
They also have six against the Pirates (home and away). If the Pirates can hang in there, I'd say we have a good shot at finishing with the better record. Can't believe I'm scoreboard watching like this!!!
Good point, Michele.
So in a way, our resonable responses and defense of Rizzo is a major buzz kill for the Media. I like that.
"Oh, and that look Bryce gets in his eyes sometimes--I remembered last night where I've seen it before. Mike Tyson."
Heh, heh. I love that attitude, the new Natitude. Contrast his body language with Rollins. I know Harp will mature and mellow, but I hope he takes his time about it. The vets don't want to look bad dogging it when a 19-year-old rookie is going all out, all the time.
My favorite part of last night's game was Harp's AB in the 6th, with runners on 1st and 3rd. The Cards saw what he can do with a FB in the 1st inning, so their reliever throws him a junk change-up on the outside of the zone. Harp did not ry to kill it, this time. He just dialed it back and took a well-timed swing to poke a soft liner over the SS's head into left center for an RBI single.
If he keeps hitting like that, he will bat over .300 the rest of the way. He has reprogrammed his approach at the plate. In a later AB, he took another outside pitch and hit a liner to deep left. It was caught for an out, but he is putting balls in play, now, on pitches that he used to swing at, wildly, and miss.
The Cyborg is back. At just the right time.
Is it me, or do the Nats hurlers (excepting GIO) alway seem to do better with JFlo calling the game? Last night, Flo and EJax were dominating the Cards - 10 Ks.
Danny Rouhier on 106.7 spent his first 1/2 hour on nothing but Nats. This is great. I think the rest of the show will be mostly Redskins but its progress.
He starts the show by describing the play where Bryce is playing shallow against a Cards player (couldn't remember his name) who is like the Little League kid who wears blue jeans to the game instead of baseball pants and the outfielders all play him shallow and further describes the Cards player as the girl in a co-ed softball game that everyone plays shallow.
Then the player gets hold of one and Harper gets back on it to catch the ball.
That's exactly how I would say it Paul Blair style - except when he did it against Cliff Lee he (and the team) got burned.
I would rather see him playing a little more conservative. There is more chance of getting burned than stealing away a single in my opinion but I have to say, I enjoyed Danny Rouhier starting his radio show discussing that play.
Speaking only for myself, I don't care all that much about maintaining the best record in MLB. I care more about maintaining a lead in the division (and, of course, the p-p-pl, uh, yeah, that).
JaneB, I have a wifi card I bring with me to games. That way I can be online if I want, but I rarely do as my attention is more focused on the game than NI or Twitter. Don't laugh..
Laddie, Harp's RBI single is exactly how he won a game with a walk-off single earlier in the season..
Ghost, doesn't Werth like to play shallow? (He's gotten burned a couple of times since coming back and I wondered if he shouldn't player deeper until his legs are completely "under him"). I would guess Bryce is taking his cues from Jayson.
Hey everybody! How about 2 straight games with no stolen bases against us, huh!? Of course limited base runners and a left handed starter on Wednesday help but I'll takei it.
Emotionally, I want the Nats to have the best record in the NL. But logically, maybe being the number 2 isn't bad.
The way the divisions stand today, as the number one the Nats would get either the Cards or the Braves, while the Reds play the Giants. I know that either team that wins the wild card play-in would be a bit depleted, but the Cards and the Braves are both pretty formidable.
On the other hand, if the Nats were the 2 seed, they'd be playing the Giants more likely than not. That's been a better match-up for the Nationals this season.
I never thought I'd be considering all these kinds of things! It's pretty awesome.
JaneB -- we should have dropped by last night! Lynn and I were in ASG half price seats near our usual in 135.
Re the mobile ordering, two things. One is that friends elsewhere in the Park last night used it and said the food came really quickly but there was an unmentioned 15% service charge on top of the already steep ballpark prices. Caveat emptor.
Second, if you want to try it, you might try the MLB "At the Ballpark" app, which has a function for "Order Food and Drink". I assume but don't know for sure that that's the same function as the Mobile Ordering website.
I've had the same cellphone Internet access issues as everyone else, but maybe using that MLB app would work at your seats. I've gotten more reliable wifi access via "Guest" on the 1st level concessions concourse -- which of course defeats the benefits of mobile ordering.
Read the article. Complete drek. And a day after he wrote an insightful one about the O's.
Bottom line is, I don't care how much influence Boras has with Rizzo and vice-versa. The Nats are in FIRST PLACE, and a lot of the credit is probably due to both of them, Boras for sending his clients here and Rizzo for signing them. Rosenthal is obviously on the outside looking in, and doesn't like it, so stirs up trouble whenever he can.
."
True, but that then leaves them open to the kind of deep liner he hit to left later in the game. They can counter one possibility, but not both. I have a very good feeling the kid is about to go on a tear. He probably won't catch Conigliaro, but he could very well pass Ott, and almost certainly will out-HR Junior.
Nats only need to worry about continuing to win as winning the Division is the goal. The Wild Card is not how you want to get in. If the Nats end up with the best record, great. If not, they can't control what the Reds are doing.
Keep your eye on the prize (win the Division).
NatsJack,
AT the end of the day, who gives a s*** what Ken Rosenthal or for that matter anyone else thinks?
I listened to David Cone on the Steven A Smith show last week and he was actually furious at Rizzo for shutting down Stras basically saying that the Nats have no proof that extended use will harm him.
Firstly of all I don't understand his agenda here. If the Nats fans are behind Rizzo on this why does every one else feel so invested in this?
Secondly, who the heck do all these guys think they are elevating themselves to experts? have any of the talking heads studied historical data? have they spoken with Dr. Mathews, Dr Yochum? have they looked at MRI's?
I bet you dollars to doughnuts that Rizzo has done his homework here. Allowing Stras to continue would have been the easy way out for him. Heck the managers and GM's who ruined Prior's career are still working.
Good points about the seeding, Melissa.
On Harper, I liked FP's story about the kid sitting next to him on the plane and observing that he'd passed the Mick. Also, Tater Trot update for sec 222 and other interested parties. Harper beat his personal best time last night.
"Hey everybody! How about 2 straight games with no stolen bases against us, huh!?"
Tough to steal 2nd base after you've just struck out. Only 2 walks and only 4 measly hits, plus they were several runs behind almost from the start, and they are not a running team, anyway.
Give EJax some credit for holding them on, but the game situation made it unlikely for them to try and steal, especially since they don't have many guys who are good at it.
#ShowIWon'tListenTo:
MLB Network Radio @MLBNetworkRadio
Join #InsidePitch @ 3:30pmET/11:30am PT for Roundtable Discussion on Shutdown of Stephen Strasburg.@TommyLasorda, Lidge, Riggleman,and more!.
As locked in as Harp is, hoping for that Oppo Taco!
NatsLady beat me to it.
Anyone that has MLB Radio, PLEASE listen and let us know what the discussion is.
There seem to be a few Nats fans (a decided minority) who are "against" the shutdown. Other than those people, who are invested and presumably buying tickets, I don't give a pin for "opinions."
Rosenthal's article makes no sense at all. How is he delving into Rizzo's psyche to determine Rizzo wants to be "off the hook." If you've watched Rizzo at all, you've seen that he puts himself ON the hook to shield players and Davey. For example, when JZ hit Hamels in retribution for Hamels hitting Bryce, Rizzo went all "macho man" and look who didn't get suspended--Jordan Zimmermann.
And I really don't get the vitriol from non-Nats fans. What is it, exactly, that Rizzo is depriving them of?
MicheleS, I have nothing against Lasorda but can't imagine Riggleman and Lidge have anything to contribute to the discussion except sour grapes....
"I bet you dollars to doughnuts that Rizzo has done his homework here. Allowing Stras to continue would have been the easy way out for him. Heck the managers and GM's who ruined Prior's career are still working."
Well-stated, with the added virtue of being true. Give all the credit in the world to Rizzo for putting the interests of his player and the team ahead of avoiding the flak coming his way from commentators with no skin in the game, and no career to lose.
Cardinals will go the rest of the series and possibly the season without Furcal. Yadier Molina still seems to have lingering issues from the blow to the head against the Pirates.
Ghost of Steve M has it exactly right at 10:46 a.m.; you don't want to be in the 'play-in' game -- I just can't call it the playoffs -- but you can't really control whether you're the first, second, or third seed. And given that teams often are on hot streaks heading into the playoffs (viz. last year's Cardinals, the Rockies of a few years back), even the team coming out of the play-in game may be a team you don't want to face until you really have to. There's just no way of predicting that. Focus on winning the division, avoid distractions (e.g., the Strasburg saga), stay healthy, and GYFNG!
I'm also in the "don't give a pin for opinions" category but, fwiw, a recent Bog item had Riggleman backing the shutdown.
The great thing about MLB Network also televising your team is their technology and different perspective.
They showed EJax's slider in freeze frames just falling off of the table. The batters were reacting as a fastball and couldn't adjust their swing as the bottom fell out.
Contrast JZim's tight slider with late break that induces grounders and poor contact and a few swing and misses.
Another great time for the Nats to shine on National TV.
(er, speaking of Prior)
NatsLady said...
Read the article. Complete drek. And a day after he wrote an insightful one about the O's.
Rosenthal got his start as an O's beat writer for the Baltimore Sun. Which means that he not only has an anti-Nationals bias, he has an anti-Washington bias since he had to compete with the Washington Post who were also covering the O's at the time as "their team."
Ghost
."
You are undoubtedly right about that. Harp has been waiting for those FBs, and has demonstrated, conclusively, why it is really, really dumb to give him one to hit. His performance last night and in Miami, where he hit with authority to LF, has given me cause to believe he is finally adjusting to the slow, outside breaking stuff.
He has only been at it for a few games. I think we are just seeing the beginning of what he will do with those pitches, in the future. I am optimistic about how that eventually will play out. He certainly has enough pop to reach the LF seats, with any pitch, if he can square it up. Making good contact is a very promising start.
It is going to be fun watching that kid as he realizes all that potential.
BTW.. Avery is on MLB Radio and would be curious as to what he and Lidge have to say. Riggleman has already stated his in in Rizzo's camp.
I love watching the Kid.
I've winced at some of his antics -- bashing his eyebrow on the recoil, smashing his bat at the plate and throwing his helmet -- but I'm 50 and I realize he's still 19 years old.
By all accounts he's a decent felliow from a fine family. His mistakes are on the field -- not off of the field -- and they come from a good place, a burning desire to win.
Through Davey, Zim and Werth Bryce will learn to temper his passionate displays. Meanwhile, we can enjoy his great talent and what it promises for the future.
It's thrilling, isn't it?
Thanks Eugene. I just think you can only control what is in front of you. The Nats don't play the Reds or Giants any more in the regular season.
The best situation is the Nats and Reds with the 2 best records and having a showdown in the NLCS.
No offense to the Reds and their fans but outside of Cueto the Reds don't have the arms the Nats do and their reliance on Aroldis Chapman at some point will disappoint as his arm racks up the innings (just ask the Barves). Last year Aroldis threw 50 innings and now he is at 64 innings and counting - not a good recipe in my opinion. They are a good offensive team that has been on a roll.
Good pitching beats good hitting.
MicheleS said...
BTW.. Avery is on MLB Radio and would be curious as to what he and Lidge have to say. Riggleman has already stated his in in Rizzo's camp.
August 31, 2012 11:14 AM
Avery is the one you want to hear. No clue what Lidge will say. Riggleman went thru Kerry Wood and never wants anyone to live the guilt he has felt about that for the last 14 years.
did you guys know Rudy Giuliani commented on shutdown during Meet the Press? and Terry Bradshaw and troy Aikman as well? I did not know. This is getting ridiculous.
FWIW, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell supports Rizzo in the StrasNoMas.
No clue what Lidge will say.
Lidge is on record saying that a big reason for his flameout and ultimate DFA this season is that he came back too soon from his injury. So it would seem he'd be in favor of an approach that puts doctor's recommendations and consideration of a player's health above the "win at all cost" mentality.
Faraz, I think everyone wants to get in on it. I'm waiting for Romney or Obama to comment on it for a good laugh.
pRAA, good perspective on that. It seems the only ones on the other side of the arguement are looking for "shock jock" value like the idiot Dibble and Kenny is just doing it to poke Boras. Aikman and Bradshaw? Do they even know who Strasburg is?
I bet one of the presidential debates will be strasburg shutdown, even if he is shutdown by that time.
Ghost.... I think Latos could pitch for the Nats but beyond him and Cuetos, I agree.
And NatsJack made another excellent point. The Nats shut down Meyer after 130 innings. This is how the Nats operate; it's consistent and it's based on doing everything possible to maximize a pitcher's health.
NatsJack, I would take Latos circa 2011 although he's looking better now with all that run support!
Is Ryan Mattheus not the biggest goof? Love the guy and have to think he would make a great mime after baseball.
New Post
Can somebody explain to me why Rizzo did not found a way for Stras to finish the season? The way it look we are going to lose our # 1 with almost 3 weeks left in the season and no division won yet . If Stras developed any issue during the season and have to go to the disable list that was the end? Even in May, June, and July? Because he can miss a start? Rizzo position is incredible, and I can see everybody here is ok with it, because of the dream that we are going to be better next year .Keep drinking the kool aid .......
why do you think we won't be as good next season as this season?
Wait, what?? Strasburg is going to be shut down?!! Why has no one been discussing this?
And while we're at it, can somebody please explain why they haven't found a way to get Wilson Ramos healthy and ready to play? It's been months, where's the proof he can't play? And the Time-Machine Willie Mays...why hasn't Rizzo found a way to get the Time Machine Willie Mays here?
Taino in DC-- I don't think everyone is OK with it expecting to win the WS next year. I think people respect putting the player's health before an all-out killer drive to win THIS year, which might not happen anyway. I'm not saying the Nats are as good without Stras as with him, but the Nats are pretty d*** good with the rest of the rotation and the offense, so it's not as if we are trashing our chances for this year by shutting Stras down. So let's talk about this year.
The Nats are 99% to go to the playoffs. No guarantee, of course, but they would have to fold massively not to get to even the WC. It's hard to imagine that John Lannan making 2 or 3 starts in September--John Lannan who is fresh and VERY MOTIVATED--is going to reduce the chances by that much over a tired and still-rehabbing Strasburg.
SO then you are left with the issue of the playoffs. Stras is already at 150 innings. If he makes 2 or 3 more starts that takes him up to 170-180, which is max for the shutdown. It doesn't matter if he skips a start, the innings he would pitch IN SEPTEMBER brings him to the max, and so he will not pitch in the playoffs, period.
Now, if you want to argue Rizzo & Co. should have done something different from the start, OK, but that is a lot of hindsight. If they had put Stras in the bullpen like Medlen, the Nats might be in Atlanta's position, scrambling to grab a WC spot. Let's say Stras is 15-6 now, but he came out of the bullpen and went 10-3. Those five games could easily be the difference, and who is to say he would have been effective out of the bullpen, he's never been a reliever in his life.
So, Taino, I respect your opinion as a fellow Nats fan, but I disagree with it.
Count Taino in DC as another one that doesn't understand how pitching develpoement works.
Forget Time Machine players, it's cyborgs or nothing for me.
And it had better be pennant mode, too, or I'm not playing. humph!
Count Taino in DC as another one that doesn't understand how pitching development works.
It's not just that--nobody is born knowing this stuff. It's that it's been explained and explained sixteen different ways, daily, since early May, and people still ask the same questions as if they were rhetorical.
GOOGLE, people. Google.
And is Count Taino related to Count Damoney?
NatsLady said....
Wow. Didn't you forget the raft with the inflatable life vests?
I don't even own half that stuff. God bless you, NL, you must keep the U-Haul business in the black.
Sunshine--right, forgot.
--umbrella :)
What, no water? :-)
I like to take a poncho rather than an umbrella (less bulky and lighter).
Here's the thing, NJ and Sec 3. Not everybody has been here since Day 1 on Stras, and when you google, you get a mess. Yes, I'm tired of going over and over the issues, but if Taino is a Nats fan and just "discovering" this site, or an infrequent entrant, then why shouldn't we run over the arguments again? I'd like every Nats fans to understand where Rizzo is coming from--even if in the end, they don't agree.
As regards the "kook-aid", that doesn't apply to next year--that came from the disbelief, and gradual BELIEF that the Nats could be a contending team THIS YEAR. No one's drinking Kool-Aid about next year, when haven't finished this year's pitcher-full (sorry, couldn't resist).
We don't know what the team will look like next year. We can guess--a lot of the guys are young or under long-term contracts. But who foresaw we were getting Gio or EJax? Who knew Desi would be an All-Star and Ramos would sit out most of the year?
All we know at this point is that the best medical opinion recommends not pushing Stras and to follow the JZ programme. There is no new medical information at this point. So, Rizzo is sticking with the plan despite the "new" information that the Nats are in the playoff hunt.
1a--water I buy on 1/2 street, so yes, water. But not food, my one indulgence is the ballpark food.
The umbrella doubles as a parasol.
NL, I love your preparation. On that, we're in the same boat. I'm cooking chicken outside right now for club sandwiches tonight. I'm bringing my own frozen water. I refuse to give the Lerners -- or more likely, Stubhub -- anything but the ticket price.
WAYYYYYYYYYYYYY off-topic, but it's a blue moon tonight. To find out what that means (two full moons in a month), here's the definitive word. And, no, the moon will not appear blue -- just the Cardinals batters.
From the article: Harper "...he [Werth] really fires me up and gets me going."
Yes, because as we all know, without Werth there to light a fire under his lazy butt, Harper would be mailing it in, not running out popups, Livo-ing down to first on grounders, and so on.
So the phone rings this am and it's Cunegonde calling from work.
"Hey, I have an idea what we can do tonight."
"What's that?" I ask, bracing myself for a suggestion that we go see the remake of "Steel Magnolias" or somesuch.
"Why don't we go to the ball game? I checked StubHub and there are tickets in our usual area for reasonable prices."
Two years ago, the woman couldn't have picked out Stephen Strasburg in a lineup that consisted of Strasburg and three ham sandwiches.
Section 219, row E.
Should still be good seats on that promo, Candide. Of course, it's still 94 degrees. That'll roast your onions.
NatsLady, normally I'd agree. Like I said, nobody is born knowing this stuff. But I've seen that screen name in here more than a few times. I don't mind not knowing, it's lazy and negative that get on my nerves.
NL, I splurge on ballpark food, too. Good call on the umbrella/parasol.
@Candide: That's my dream woman. I'm taking The Lovely Wife, but she's not that enthusiastic. But she's coming off a root canal, so some of the novocaine but still be in effect by the time she eyes Clint.
It's when that 'caine starts wearing off, there's going to be a emotional price extracted.
Sec.3, those seats will be nicely in the shade well before first pitch. Cunegonde insists; she buys SPF 3000 sunscreen by the truckload, else the only way you'd be able to distinguish her from a steamed lobster is by her lack of claws.
Okay, and lack of an exoskeleton.
And antennae.
And six legs.
And a tail.
And inability to live long under water.
But apart from that...
Sunshine_Bobby, you need to get her to watch the games on TV a little more. Last night, we were watching (toggling to the Republican convention during commercials - for some reason our picture-in-picture doesn't work...) Camera briefly catches Detwiler in the dugout. Cunegonde says, "He's kinda cute..." and Det immediately begins picking his nose.
When they notice that some of the players are good-looking, you've won half the battle. Have your wife watching whenever Zimm comes to bat; every woman I know thinks he's a dreamboat.
NatsLady. Keep preaching because we are going to keep hearing about StrasNoMas until Opening Day next year.
MicheleS said...NatsLady. Keep preaching because we are going to keep hearing about StrasNoMas until Opening Day next year.
Just because the ignoramuses (ignorami?) keep talking doesn't mean we have to listen.
Every now and then, during a lengthy (weeks, months, even years) argument, you sometimes realize that you've heard all the arguments you're going to hear from both sides. You realize that you've heard not a single argument combining both facts and logic that has changed your mind from whatever your position may be, and that since you are probably not going to live forever, there's no point in listening to those arguments again. It doesn't mean you're close-minded - indeed, you've thought about the issue at hand at some length. But why should you waste your life arguing the same point over and over and over again?
So when you hear someone complain that Strasburg shouldn't be shut down, that the Nats can stretch him out by skipping starts or pitching every 6th day or working out of the bull pen or being put into cryogenic suspended animation four days a week*, you're perfectly justified in ignoring it. As the saying goes, "I'm not deaf - I'm just ignoring you."
*(Okay, I haven't heard THAT argument...)
Excellent advice, Candide. Will do.
If I'm in divorce court by Monday noon, will not hold anyone liable.
Candide, good points and I tend to apply them whether or not I've heard a given argument (armchair GM or otherwise) a number of times. It's not likely that either person will change the other's mind and imho it's a waste of energy to try. It can also indicate a lack of respect for the other person's capacity to form and hold an opinion of their own. That said, I think some folks just like to debate. :-)
(Oh, and I like to look at the coaches and managers. They're more my demographic these days. :-)) |
Eurozone slides back into recession
Friday, November 16, 2012
LONDON (AP) —.
spelchek 6 months ago
And this is what the donks want to mold themselves after.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
The conservatives have been preaching austerity as the answer to our ecnomic problems. You can see already that it doesn't work.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Wrong. We tried it in 1937, when the president and congress got more concerned about the deficit than about the economy. The US went backwards into renewed economic shrinkage for a couple years while Europe continued to recover. Now while the US economy is still recovering slowly, Europe tries austerity and is surprised when it leads to recession.
Do we want to try it as well? The math doesn't change.
connor 6 months ago
Oh My Tonto has been browsing the Cleftwing political sites this afternoon. FDR's progressive spending did nothing but prolong the Great (Now Second Greatest) Depression. The 37 spending cuts were a mere 600 million and followed tax increases from 36 that obviously didn't work although they did reduce the deficit by 2.1 billion the depression continued. Why? Because the increased taxes hurt even more. Also it was FDR's Treasury secretary that pushed for austerity the most.
Cleftwing political sites will lead to brain damage and reduced historical perspective one should avoid them at all cost if they don't have the previous experience to resist the revisionist propaganda.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
ME: Graduate studies in economics. YOU:?
connor 6 months ago
BA's in Sociology and History. MA in American History.
Oh and your so called 37 austerity is a joke anyway because other than amounting to less than 36's spending 1937 spent more than all the other years of the depression. Something Liberals and especially Liberal indoctrinated economist seem to forget. A reduction in increase is not a decrease.
Paroquet 6 months ago
Graceful? SBSA: Move. There are lots of other countries.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Do you secessionist folks really want to face the national guard, the police dogs, and the fire hoses armed with your placards, your torches, and your pitchforks?
JCLifer 6 months ago
Oh, we will be armed a whole lot better than that. However arms wont be needed if the divorce is peaceful. There is no need to get ugly.
connor 6 months ago
Who needs arms or even riots for that matter. Who needs factories, call centers or corporate headquarters?
All of rural America is RED except for a bewildering few counties along the upper Mississippi and some Indian reservations.
There are no Blue states only a few urban blue enclaves.
All we rural dwellers have to do is stop producing and let nature take it's course.
asb 5 months, 4 weeks ago
Oh secessionist dreams. Peaceful. All the corporate farms will shut down to force the helpless entitled to give up their votes. All the corporate factories will shut down to deny the evil left their magic boxes. Oh, wait, you'll need government services . . . you could get red volunteers, or charitable donations for you road crews and army. You surely wouldn't use taxes, would you? Your starving will happily volunteer to go till the fields until oil magically appeard in enough dry Texas wells to offset that lost at the Blue American ports. Your teachers, on their days off of course 'cause they can't stop teaching creation science or alternate physics, will be glad to build new housing for your immigrant volunteer labor (white naturally). All you need for this wet dream to come true now is a state wishing to become a nation, free from the Union, free from the rule of law, free from knowledge, free from taxes, free from Islam, free from everything that's seething under your bed and in your delusions. Please secede, please! Peaceful? Like the Murrah bldg in Ok City? Where will you fools go? Where? WHO WILL PICK YOUR FREAKIN' COTTON!?
connor 6 months ago
I would suggest the Libs look around at the State they live in. Boone county looks awful lonely surrounded by all that red. The four...Yes count em FOUR little counties that went Obama in Missouri might think about relocating to a Blue state. I hear Kalifornia needs people these days. Even if you go to Illinois you only got like 8 counties to hide in.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Did you notice there is construction going on in Boone County? Did you notice there are lots more amenities in Boone County? Never mind, I am wasting my time. Sorry to bother you.
connor 6 months ago
Take away the MU students and faculty and Boone would be RED as well. So your point means nothing.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Sorry. It's the backwards-looking red areas like Cole County that are dying. What would you take away from the St. Louis area, which is growing as well? How about Kansas City?
JCLifer 6 months ago
The democrat st. Louis city is withering for years. The republican suburbs are where the growth is. Ask Jim Talent.
connor 6 months ago
OH yes St. Louis is a wonderful growing place and KC drains Mo. Money to put in amusements for Kansas citizens while Columbia (Not all of Boone county) sucks up all that education money. They are wonderful places. You should move to one of them.
RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 4 weeks ago
Boone Co, 165,627 Population, 33,000 students at MU, 37,343 Voted Romney, 39,782 voted Obama, nothing special about that vote. St Louis, KC and the Bootheel on the eastern side voted blue, you take away that Farm subsidy, and you will see which way those Farmers go! Rob
connor 6 months ago
I been wondering since several of the Liberal Conglomerate members on here like to ask if someone has adopted a baby when they speak out against abortion. Are Paroquet, Saskqoia and the others going to adopt an out of work union hostess worker now? I mean that union ruined Hostess and there is gonna be 18,000 plus out of jobs now.
Time for them to put their money where their mouths are and bite the ding dong so to speak.
connor 6 months ago
Ya I saw that. The Libs actually put a petition on the same site the secession petitions were put up on at the whitehouse.gov site to federalize Hostess. LOL
Paroquet 6 months ago
Um, I have one adoptee, one fostern slated to adopt.
I'm still waiting for you "conservatives" to come back with your answers.
And the union didn't ruin Hostess. Did you look at the raises the execs gave themselves when they saw the light in the fiscal tunnel was an oncoming train?
Oh, and I have room for two boarders. Three, if they help me finish the basement. So that'd be...yeah, we can accomodate up to five unfortunates. And ample storage for personals--furniture could get iffy. Even got space they can grow their own food. And under existing city ordinances, we could put some cows, sheep, and goats into the mix (we already got chickens).
Um yep. We're pretty styling in the morals department. And we wouldn't put our heads into other's life issues so long as they kept the noise down after nine.
I mean, it's not lavish, but it'd beat a cardboard box. And would we open our doors? Yep.
connor 6 months ago
Last count I now have 10...count em 10 stray cats that have shown up out here. All of them were housecats btw with a few still wearing their collars and only two having been previously fixed. Three of em have managed to become housecats here while the others have claimed the various outbuildings as their own. I went from zero pets in 2007 to 12 now because I also have two stray dogs that have moved in. Vet bills and pet food costs have now taken a huge chunk out of my budget.
All due to Liberal community reinvestment handouts and government enforced easy loans crashing the housing market.
I think you should take those out of work union bakers in as pets not boarders and share some of the stray burden.
eileen10 6 months ago
You and your wife are good people Paroquet. Not everyone is willing or wants to adopt or take in foster children. It's sad really because there are many children who need a good home. I'm going to check into fostering. I don't know if I'd qualify but it can't hurt to ask.
RobHunterJohnson 6 months ago
Conner, the company bought Hostess in 2009 to close out the on going bankruptzy from 04 to 09. Hostess brand file bankruptzy once again in 1/2012? In a statement the company said it " is not competitive, primarily due to legacy pension and medical benefit obligations and restrictive work rules." I have to ask did not Driscoll and his investors not know this going into the purchase? The Hostess executives paid themselves raises of up to 80%? The investors and Execuitives pulled another BAIN. My opinion is they will liquidate, someone will sn_ a_ tch it up, then reopen NON UNION. Whom ever gets control of Hostess will have accomplished what the others could not since 2004, the only losers will be the workers, who lost their pensions, and benefits! I took note that you have experienced great health, and that is good! You need to keep those checkups up to date, all of our health is very important! Keep getting that Tea Party rhetoric out about unions, MAY I SUGGEST THAT YOU NEED TO READ A LITTLE DEEPER ON SUBJECTS? I really thought your choice for President would win, see what happens when the people put the time in to DISAVOW the Tea Parties and Conners Rhetoric! Rob
connor 6 months ago
So basically your saying that the legacy pensions and benefits didn't drive Hostess into the ground? Well they did and yes the real losers will be the workers for not seeing the light of day but the original share holders took a scalping too btw. The company that bought Hostess knew that if the union wouldn't deal they could make their money back selling it off and I certainly can't blame em for that.
However who enabled these finance companies to have that kind of money to play with? UHH HUH the Obama print, spend and bailout industry that's who. I was reading in depth about this again last night. The money that Obama is having them pump into the investment sectors to keep the public pensions from going completely belly up is also allowing these companies to liquidate with little to no risk. This type of thing will continue as long as the Fed continues to print and the interest rates are kept at zero. They are playing with free money, little risk and no interest. Certainly they are keeping the money from trickling down and causing massive inflation for the moment but it is playing havoc at the top.
Cause and effect Robishunting. Cause and effect. Something you Union and Liberal types just can't figure out.
And it shows....
eileen10 6 months ago
The worst thing about this is no twinkies for the twinkie addicts!
connor 6 months ago
And Woody will have to look for a different snack food item in "Zombieland II"
eileen10 6 months ago
LOL!
RobHunterJohnson 6 months ago
Conner, what was the interest rate in early 2009, or really as the deal was made 2008? It was the Bush adminstration once again Conner not Obama. It was about the time Budwieser was a done deal as well? That was the only moment in time that Budwieser could have bought! I admire you for you rescue operation, after having had a few animals over the years myself, Doc Fuch, would say "oh your a kennel man too Rob!" Parquet I like to commend both you, and your Wife for adoption, and fostership! Rob
eileen10 6 months ago
For the workers who are or will be out of jobs and if the company is sold do you think the former workers will have first dibs with the new company or are they more or less sc##wed?
connor 6 months ago
My bet is the brand names will be sold off and the equipment worth anything as well. Plants and property in non-union states may open back up under competitor names or even new smaller companies while the ones in union states will be dismantled. Those old employees who will take a pay and benefit cut will have a job I would bet eventually.
After a short while of being a non-union employee out in the real world those who are not a member of one of the permanent victim groups will see the light and be staunch Conservatives.
eileen10 6 months ago
connor my friend do you ever think of anything other than politics? All I wanted to know is if the workers might get their jobs back. How annoying but I had to laugh because I guess the answer is ya you pretty much live and breathe politics.
connor 6 months ago
Actually my degrees are in American History and Sociology. Not much a White boy is gonna do with those these days. Especially one who won't tow the Feminist party line and go into teaching I originally got my secondary teaching certificate as well but haven't kept it up to date. Luckily I had paid off all my property debts so I don't need a high paying job and can afford to take frequent employment breaks and still bring in some farming revenue. That and I am not greedy.
Politics is fun because the information is constantly changing and always has something new to offer. I do have other interests but not alot of articles that pertain to them on the NT website and the Winter months are kinda slow on everything else as well. Not to mention I let some things pile up this time of year trying to be polite to the deer hunters.
Oh and I need to amend my prediction for ex-hostess employees. I doubt many new businesses will open from the carcass. Not a good time for new business endeavors.
eileen10 6 months ago
Okay. I no longer see you with a flag in one hand and a mallet in the other. Unless a person asks questions they don't know squat. A friend of a friend lost her job in Jeff at the Wonder bread store so she's applying for unemployment. She.s in her early 30s with 3 or 4 children, severe health problems and thankfully her husband has a job. Lots of folks having a hard time and please don't! I know what your thinking. I just feel bad for those who struggle so hard. Having to worry how to pay the bills, keep food on the table, maybe no birthday or Christmas presents for the kids. That was my first thought when I read that the company went bankrupt. Times are hard but at least we are fortunate that bombs are'nt falling on us like in Afghanistan and we don't have to eat rocks or sand and eventually things will get better. May take a long time though.
connor 6 months ago
They bought it in 09 after bailouts that were designed by Obama not Bush BTW but they can sell it outright with a huge margin in 2012 due to continued bailouts and monetary easing.
It just gets worse from here.
eileen10 6 months ago
Oh my aching arse. See post above. Boing! Boing! Watch me bounce off the walls. Wham! Ugh! OUCH! Mama mia that hurts!
RobHunterJohnson 6 months ago
Conner it was in the tank and up for grab s starting in 2004, BUSH 2! Rob
asb 5 months, 4 weeks ago
So you are looking forward to chaos, and will take advantage of it? What kind of thing are you?
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Legacy pensions, hence the name, would have been factored into the purchase price. Hostess suffered from a doomed merger, a buying spree in which it bought a bunch of smaller bakey companies, and from a leveraged buyout that left it swimming in debt. The unions did not kill Hostess. The company committed suicide, and management gave themselves bonuses for their brilliant strategy.
connor 6 months ago
The Union called the strike Hostess management didn't. They were told if you strike the company goes belly up and they chose to play poker. Guess what they lost.
As a matter of fact the company that bought Hostess in 09 saved those 18K jobs for three years. Even the teamsters union tried to stop the bakers from striking and implored them to allow the individual union members to make the final decision because they knew it was a mistake and over reach.
Trumka's spin announcement from Friday is pure Union propaganda but I am sure he is glad you are waving the union flag.
tonto_goldberg 6 months ago
Hostess quit making their contractual benefit and retirement program payments a year ago. The Hostess company "needed" the additional set of union concessions so they could continue paying interest on over $1 billion in debt. That was management's choice. The teamsters were in but the bakers bailed. The baker's union was no longer willing to bet on Hostess as a viable employer. That was their choice.
The debt holders will lose most of their money while the brands, the bakeries, and most of the workers will get picked up by better managed companies. Check out Gruppo Bimbo. There's a reason they are the largest baking company in the USA.
connor 6 months ago
Everything you said proves my point. The Bakers decided to end their employment because after bankruptcy no management could afford their salaries. The teamsters begged them not to but they basically quit. They shouldn't even get unemployment honestly.
Interestingly enough the average salary for a Hostess employee was almost 55K a year. That is a payroll of almost a Billion a year (990,000,000 if my math is right). I have an idea why don't the employees buy out Hostess and then see how well they manage negotiating with themselves.
tonto_goldberg 5 months, 4 weeks ago
They paid $19 an hour, tops. To get to $55k a worker would need to put in 2895 hours per year. Not impossible but improbable.
eileen10 6 months ago
What is your problem Graceful. Are you this negative about everything? Do you ever say a kind word to anyone? Do you treat people who don't believe the way you do like dogs? Do you ever experience happiness? Joy? Would you kick a puppy because it was in your way?
eileen10 6 months ago
You just answered the questions.
eileen10 6 months ago
Your right. I did fashion my own answer and I do believe I was wrong but if your saying I don't like you that's not true. What I know of you is what you've posted and you come across as being hateful and full of anger and your attacks on people can be vicious.Your not the only one that does that but Graceful you are right up there at the top and because of that your seen as a kook and what you have to say isn't taken seriously. Only you can change that if you want to. How a person interacts with others is very important. It determines how your seen and how others react to you. For all I know you cry at movies or your the one that would put the baby bird back in its nest after it fell out. I know your passionate about where this country is at, how bad things are and yes it is pretty bad. We all can agree to that. We have a President you and a lot of others don't like. That's fine. You don't have to like him. But when someone else does ...I think you see where this is going. Kind of like if you have a child you love and a neighbor calls your child an ugly , nasty no good brat. How would you react? Okay. Maybe the kid is a brat but wording it differently can make all the difference. Get the point across but without the nastiness. Such as "Emily hit my Bobby over the head with a stick. A rather big stick. I know children play but I think we need to curb the behavior of both children before someone gets hurt." They learn how to play together and that's carried over. We can all play together nicely and in doing so get a lot more accomplished. Not solved of course and some kids just won't play nicely but if the majority do it's those kids that will do the most good.None of us are perfect. All of us will slip and hit the pavement and even though we see things differently I feel that as a country and as American citizens we should at least be bound together by what we see as a great country that will falter to some degree but we can at least look at the good as well as the bad. I'm not going to tell you how to live your life That's up to you. I just gave you my point of view which you may disagree with and that's okay. I'm not going to stomp you into the ground if you don't see things my way. I'll respect your right to feel and think anyway you want.
eileen10 6 months ago
LOL! Okay. I guess your right. We are a bunch of kooks. What I have to say is my opinion. To me vicious is putting someone down, name calling, or sweeping them aside like their a nobody and it is done quite a bit. To others it may mean something else. You haven't gone so far that someone would sick some goons on you. No one has really gone that far and if you have fun then you go girl! But do keep in mind that when you sling you get it slung at you which I think you already know.Oh. If you want an example you posted above and the post starts with austerity. If that's how you see it I can't say your wrong but I really don't think you'd win a miss congeniality award. If you don't care what people think or how they see you then okay. Do your thing. No two people are alike but my feeling are that respect isn't bad. talking without gouging isn't bad. Being considerate isn't bad.
RobHunterJohnson 5 months, 4 weeks ago
Handing out ropes, and collecting them in the morning, now that is vicious! Rob
connor 6 months ago
Ya know it's funny that you mention negativity eileen. Right after I had to leave the Army (Thanks again Clinton) I took a job working as an installation manager for a software company that put computer systems in hotels and restaurants all over the world.
Anyway the owner/CEO was one of these up beat always think positive guys. We would get a shipment of whatever doodad or equipment in and I would make the comment that I was sure X would be wrong. Sure enough nine times out of ten x was wrong and needed fixing yet he always said it was because I was so negative.
I never understood why preparing for the worst was viewed as negative but then I was never a big corporate cheerleader type either. Luckily I found a job with less travel requirements soon after that.
eileen10 6 months ago
I feel to be prepared for the worst is fine. Theres nothing wrong with that. But to dwell on it or think about it all the time may not be real healthy and your not like that. You seem to have a healthy balance which I think most people do. Prepare for the worst but hope for the best as the saying goes. The owner you spoke of sounds a bit overboard. Too much "sunshine" can burn. Especially in the case you spoke of but that's how I see it. Others may have a different outlook and that's fine. I guess if everyone thought alike things would be pretty boring.
connor 6 months ago
Not if they all thought like me :)
eileen10 6 months ago
LOL!! Your hopeless you man you.
RobHunterJohnson 6 months ago
"The hardest arithmetic to master is that which enables us to count our Blessings" Eric Hoffer Rob
connor 6 months ago
"Democracy is when the indigent, and not the men of property, are the rulers." - Aristotle.
eileen10 6 months ago
"Dont smoke your cigarette from the lit end" - Eileen
3633 5 months, 4 weeks ago
Wow, what has happened to America and all the strong people, the way things are now have happened before and America came back. I can't believe the talking points of some Jeff City people. I will not crawl in a hole. I will stand and do the right thing and tell the truth, and not bicker over things I have no control over. C'mon folks, we all are still here, alive and well let's get on with living and more positive thinking.
Commenting has been disabled for this item. |
RB Trent Richardson says he played most of his rookie season with broken ribs
Browns running back Trent Richardson revealed today that he played most of his rookie season with broken ribs and still can’t lie on his right side or his back because it’s too painful.
Richardson was hurt Oct. 14 against the Cincinnati Bengals, but he and the Browns said he suffered a rib cartilage injury. With the season wrapped up, Richardson admitted two or three of his ribs were broken.
“Sometimes it’s hard to shift positions, twist, catch balls on my shoulder,” said Richardson, the third overall pick in the 2012 draft. “It was real tough because it limits you from a lot. You can’t really cut like you want to or you can’t really make the body movement like you want to. You can’t squeeze through the hole like you want to. You can’t really get full burst ‘cause your feet hitting the ground, it’s impacting all of that. It hurts a lot, especially when you get punched and you get hit in that side. Some guys on the ground want to do other stuff, want to come in and land on your ribs, which really hurts. It impacts a lot.”
The injury affects him off the field, too. He props himself up to sleep.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns owner Jimmy Haslam, CEO Joe Banner
Browns owner Jimmy Haslam and CEO Joe Banner met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
Jimmy Haslam
(Opening statement)- “Good morning and thanks for coming. I think everybody has read the press release and is well aware of why we’re here today. Joe (Banner) and I did meet with Pat (Shurmur) and Tom (Heckert) this morning and had what I would describe as a very professional meeting, as you would expect, with the both of them. We told them that we were going to make a change in both of their positions. As I said, we had very professional conversations and both of them are now ready to move on and, candidly, we’re ready to move on. I know there’s going to be a million questions about this person and that person and let me just make a few remarks. Let me start by saying we want to thank both Pat and Tom for their service to the organization. They’re people who, particularly in my case Pat, I’ve gotten to know well over the last few months and think a tremendous amount of him as a person. I think that both of them left the organization better than when they came. We just felt like it was necessary - to get to a championship level - to make these changes, but we do want to thank them. We certainly wish them and their families the very best going forward. Joe and I are going to begin, very quickly, to look for a new head coach first and then a GM/player personnel-type second. There will be a million rumors out as I’ve said before, it’s Joe and I’s job to find the right coach and the right GM and bring stability long term for the organization. That’s our role and we take it very responsibly, very seriously. We’ve researched a lot of people and we’ll be talking to some of those people here. I just want to reiterate again, I don’t think it does any value or good to either the Cleveland Browns organization or those people to comment on any names so we’re not going to. As soon as we sign up somebody to be our head coach, you all will be notified and we’ll have them in this room. You’ll get the chance to talk to them and ask them a lot of question and the same with the GM/player personnel guy. I think before we answer any questions, Joe wants to make a few comments, particularly about Pat and Tom and his relationship with them and we’ll let Joe do that now.”
Joe BannerTo read more or comment...
Browns fire coach Pat Shurmur, GM Tom Heckert; will hire new head coach before personnel.To read more or comment...
Browns have sixth overall pick in 2013 NFL Draft after finishing with record of 5-11
The Browns have the sixth overall pick in the 2013 NFL Draft after finishing the season with a record of 5-11.
The Kansas City (2-14, No. 1 overall), Jacksonville Jaguars (2-14, No. 2), Oakland Raiders (4-12, No. 3), Philadelphia Eagles (4-12, No. 4), Detroit Lions (4-12, No. 5) are slotted ahead of the Browns in the draft order. The Arizona Cardinals (5-11, No. 7), Buffalo Bills (6-10, No. 8), New York Jets (6-10, No. 9) and Tennessee Titans (6-10, No. 10) round out the top 10.
The Browns don’t have a second-round pick next year because they gave it up to select wide receiver Josh Gordon on July 12 in the supplemental draft.To read more or comment...
Game day blog: Browns at Pittsburgh Steelers (Week 17)
Final: Steelers 24, Browns 10 (game story; Marla Ridenour's column; notebook; thumbs up/thumbs down; box score)
Inactives: Browns – quarterbacks Brandon Weeden and Colt McCoy (right shoulders), cornerback Sheldon Brown (concussion), running back Trent Richardson (left ankle), linebacker Adrian Moten, guard Jarrod Shaw and tight end Jordan Cameron (concussion). Steelers – quarterback Byron Leftwich, wide receiver David Gilreath, cornerback Justin King, linebacker Marshall McFadden, defensive end Al Woods, defensive lineman Hebron Fangupo and nose tackle Alameda Ta’amu.
Lineup changes: Browns – Thaddeus Lewis will start at quarterback in place of Weeden. Montario Hardesty will start at running back in place of Richardson. Buster Skrine will start at cornerback in place of Sheldon Brown. Eric Hagg will start at strong safety and Tashaun Gipson at free safety with Usama Young and T.J. Ward on injured reserve. Steelers – Kelvin Beachum will start at right tackle in place of Mike Adams, who was placed on injured reserve. Emmanuel Sanders will start at wide receiver in place of Mike Wallace, who was placed on injured reserve.
Storylines by Stephanie Storm: 1. With former owner Randy Lerner and former president Mike Holmgren already gone and replaced by new owner Jimmy Haslam III and CEO Joe Banner, today’s game is likely.To read more or comment...
Browns hire Brent Stehlik as their executive vice president -- chief revenue officer
The.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today after practice. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “I really don’t have anything to add other than that I’m going to rule out Brandon Weeden, Trent Richardson, Colt McCoy, Jordan Cameron and Sheldon Brown. I’m going to rule them out. That being said, Thad Lewis will start and Josh Johnson will back him up. At the other positions the guys will just slide up.”
(On how Lewis has done this week)- “He’s done great. He’s had a good week of practice. He’s been preparing himself to play all year even though he wasn’t on the active roster. We anticipate and what we expect is that he goes out and plays winning football.”
(On if he has to pare the game plan for Lewis and Johnson)- “Thad’s going to go out and execute our plays. If Josh has to go in and play, I’m certain he’s going to execute the plays well that we call for him.”To read more or comment...
Friday's Browns-Steelers injury report
Injury report for Dec. 28
Browns – Out: CB Sheldon Brown (concussion/foot), TE Jordan Cameron (concussion), QB Colt McCoy (right shoulder), RB Trent Richardson (left ankle) and QB Brandon Weeden (right shoulder). Questionable: DT Ishmaa’ily Kitchen (calf). Probable: WR Josh Cribbs (knee), FS Tashaun Gipson (foot), LG John Greco (thumb), DT John Hughes (back), DE Juqua Parker (knee), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hamstring), TE Alex Smith (illness) and OT Joe Thomas (back).
Steelers – Out: OT Mike Adams (ankle), CB Curtis Brown (ankle), LB Marshall McFadden (abdomen) and WR Mike Wallace (hip). Probable: G David DeCastro (hamstring), CB Keenan Lewis (knee) and S Troy Polamalu (not injury related).To read more or comment...
QB Thaddeus Lewis, RB Montario Hardesty to start Sunday for Browns; CB Sheldon Brown's streak to end
Third-string quarterback Thaddeus Lewis and backup running back Montario Hardesty will start Sunday when the Browns (5-10) visit the Pittsburgh Steelers (7-8) and their No. 1-ranked defense, coach Pat Shurmur said today after practice.
“Part of my childhood dream was to be a starter one day in the NFL,” said Lewis, who will become the Browns' 18th starting quarterback since their expansion era began in 1999. “Who it was against, I didn't have as visual of that. But it's a challenge, and if you don't like challenges, then you're in the wrong sport. It's a great challenge for this football team to go out there, for this offense to go against the No. 1 defense and try to be successful."
Shurmur officially ruled out quarterbacks Brandon Weeden (sprained right shoulder) and Colt McCoy (right shoulder), running back Trent Richardson (left ankle), cornerback Sheldon Brown (concussion) and tight end Jordan Cameron (concussion). practiced this week.
Hardesty has compiled 51 carries for 234 yards (4.6 average) and a touchdown. He will start for the first time this season.To read more or comment...
Brandon Weeden, Colt McCoy, Trent Richardson among Browns players still idle, likely to be ruled out
Third-string quarterback Thaddeus Lewis and backup running back Montario Hardesty are expected to start Sunday when the Browns (5-10) visit the Pittsburgh Steelers (7-8) and their No. 1-ranked defense.
Quarterbacks Brandon Weeden (sprained right shoulder) and Colt McCoy (right shoulder), running back Trent Richardson (left ankle), cornerback Sheldon Brown (concussion) and tight end Jordan Cameron (concussion) didn’t practice today. has practiced this week, and coach Pat Shurmur will likely rule them out this afternoon. He is scheduled to meet with reporters at 12:30 p.m. today.
In addition to Lewis and Hardesty probably entering the starting lineup, second-year cornerback Buster Skrine is expected to start in place of Brown. Rookie Trevin Wade, a seventh-round draft pick, would then serve as the nickel cornerback:
(On what the defense has accomplished this year and how does that apply to next year)- “I’m not sure I totally understand the question, but I think we’ve talked a lot of times that the defense now is significantly deeper up front with good players. We’ll be able to play in waves. That should service well as time passes. The injuries to the linebacker corps really depleted them. It allowed for some younger players to get a lot of playing experience and that should bode well for the future also. It’s kind of the same thing that has happened in the secondary, really depleted, and a lot of guys have played. I think that should help also as we move forward. The bad news is not nearly as many wins as obviously you want to have in a season. I guess the good news is it’s a young team that’s got some talented players. We should just get better.”
(On if it would be difficult to go back to a 3-4 defense)- “I don’t know. I hadn’t ever really thought about that. I think that our tackles certainly could play the nose. Some of them could play defensive end. Certainly, Billy Winn could play defensive end easily I think in a 3-4 scheme. He’s a talented player, can play either tackle or defensive end. Jabaal’s (Sheard) a player. I don’t know. I don’t know if it would be difficult or not. I’d have to think about it some more, but some good players.”
(On if Sheard is too big to play outside linebacker)- “I would never put anything past Jabaal. Jabaal is really a good player and a very good athlete. I suspect that he probably could.”
(On if he can explain what happened the last two games)- “No, things happen on the field and you’ve got to play with the players that you have, and then you’ve got to perform. I’ve got to do a better job of getting them ready and making better calls, get them in better positions to make plays.”To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening statement)- “I’m sure it’s on the tip of your tongue so Colt (McCoy), Trent (Richardson), Brandon (Weeden) and Sheldon (Brown) are same status as yesterday. It will be easy for you guys to type out.”
(On if he is still not ruling out any of those players)- “No, I’m not going to rule anybody out yet. We’ll just have to see. Everybody comes back from these things, some quicker than others so we’ll just see. But as we get closer, of course, if they can’t play I’m not going to try to hold it to game time.”
(On Phil Dawson being named to the Pro Bowl)- “I probably should have led off with that. I’m extremely pleased that he’s been recognized. I have a huge appreciation for him, of course. In the last two years, he’s one of the outstanding kickers and he does it - we would all agree - in a climate at times that’s less than ideal for kickers. He’s kicked at a high level for a very long time. I’m extremely thrilled that he was recognized by his peers, the coaches and the fans. I think that’s good much like Joe Thomas. Again, a very steady player. In order to be an offensive lineman you have to play at a high level and be very steady and Joe has done that. I’m happy for those two guys that they were recognized.”To read more or comment...
Thursday's Browns-Steelers injury report
Injury report for Dec.), DT Ishmaa’ily Kitchen (calf), DE Juqua Parker (knee), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hamstring) and OT Joe Thomas (back). Full participation in practice: FS Tashaun Gipson (foot), LG John Greco (thumb), DT John Hughes (back) and TE Alex Smith (illness).
Steelers – Did not participate in practice: OT Mike Adams (ankle), CB Curtis Brown (ankle), CB Keenan Lewis (knee), S Troy Polamalu (not injury related) and WR Mike Wallace (hip). Limited participation in practice: LB Marshall McFadden (abdomen). Full participation in practice: G David DeCastro (hamstring).
Browns notes: QB Thaddeus Lewis, backup RB Montario Hardesty still preparing to start vs. Steelers
Third-string quarterback Thaddeus Lewis and backup running back Montario Hardesty are one step closer to starting Sunday when the Browns (5-10) visit the Pittsburgh Steelers (7-8).
Quarterbacks Brandon Weeden (sprained right shoulder) and Colt McCoy (right shoulder), running back Trent Richardson (left ankle) and cornerback Sheldon Brown (concussion) won’t practice today but still haven’t been ruled out for Sunday, coach Pat Shurmur said this morning during a news conference.
Shurmur said he won’t wait until game time to rule any of them out if they cannot play. In other words, Shurmur will likely rule them out Friday if they’re going to sit out.
Of course, if Weeden and McCoy are out, Lewis would play in an NFL regular-season game for the first time. If that becomes the case, Josh Johnson would serve as Lewis’ backup.To read more or comment...
Browns kicker Phil Dawson, left tackle Joe Thomas named to Pro Bowl
Browns kicker Phil Dawson has made the Pro Bowl for the first time in his 14-year NFL career, and Browns offensive left tackle Joe Thomas has been selected to the Pro Bowl for the sixth time in as many seasons.
“I was happy that Phil and Joe were recognized for having Pro Bowl seasons,” Browns coach Pat Shurmur said in a statement. “Phil has been one of the most consistent kickers in the NFL throughout his career, and this year he was near-perfect, including many long-range field goals. I believe it is very appropriate that he is getting his due credit after 14 years in the league. Joe has established himself as one of the top left tackles in the game, and he has played at a very high level once again this year. He was a big part of the improvement that I felt we made as an offense.”
Dawson has made 28-of-29 field-goal attempts this season, and the only miss was blocked. He has made six field goals of 50 yards or longer, which ties him for first in the AFC and third in the NFL in that category. His career field-goal percentage of 84.2 is the highest in Browns history and seventh-best in NFL history. His field-goal percentage of 96.6 this season leads the AFC and is second in the NFL.
Thomas, the third overall pick in the 2007 draft, has played all 95 games and hasn’t missed an offensive snap since joining the Browns. Thirteen of the 15 players who have made the Pro Bowl in each of their first six seasons have been inducted into the Pro Football Hall of Fame.To read more or comment...
Browns LT Joe Thomas makes 6th consecutive Pro Bowl; Josh Cribbs voted first alternate
Browns left offensive tackle Joe Thomas has been selected to represent the AFC in the Pro Bowl for the sixth time in as many seasons, his agent, Peter Schaffer, announced on Twitter.
Browns veteran Josh Cribbs, meanwhile, is a first alternate as a kick returner and special teamer, a league source said. Cribbs won the fan vote – players and coaches also vote -- as an AFC special teamer. Cribbs made the Pro Bowl in 2007 and 2009.
The full Pro Bowl squads will be announced at 7 p.m. today on NFL Network. The 2013 Pro Bowl will be played at 7 p.m. Jan. 27 at Aloha Stadium in Honolulu and will be televised on NBC.
Thomas, the third overall pick in the 2007 draft, has played all 95 games and hasn’t missed an offensive snap since joining the Browns.To read more or comment...
Wednesday's Browns-Steelers injury report
Injury report for Dec.), FS Tashaun Gipson (foot), DT Ishmaa’ily Kitchen (calf), DE Juqua Parker (knee), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hamstring) and OT Joe Thomas (back). Full participation in practice: LG John Greco (thumb), DT John Hughes (back and TE Alex Smith (illness).
Steelers – Did not participate in practice: CB Curtis Brown (ankle), CB Keenan Lewis (knee), S Troy Polamalu (not injury related) and WR Mike Wallace (hip). Limited participation in practice: T Mike Adams (ankle). Full participation in practice: G David DeCastro (hamstring).To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening statement)- “First off, our fourth captain this week will be Jabaal Sheard. I think it’s a good choice. He’s been playing good ball here for two years and he’s going back to Pittsburgh, a place that he played. I think that’s a good choice. A couple of roster moves we made, you saw the one that’s out there, we put Mo (Mohamed Massaquoi) on IR and then, of course, we just put Usama Young on IR as well with the thumb. He’s going to likely have surgery. A couple other roster moves, we moved Thad Lewis up to the active roster and we also signed Josh Johnson to the active roster. Then, Jordan Mabin, a safety from Northwestern, we brought on the practice. I’m sure you’ve got a lot of interest about the health of a couple guys. I’ll just tell you, Brandon Weeden and Trent Richardson were injured in the game and their injuries will not require surgery. They’ll be healthy soon. They won’t practice today, but I will not rule them out for this weekend. We’ll see as the week goes on. Colt McCoy also will not practice today. He’s got a sore shoulder from the game. That being the case, Thad Lewis will take the first team reps and Josh Johnson, who’s our new quarterback, will run the scout team. Sheldon Brown, as you know, is coming back from the concussion so time will tell there.”
.”To read more or comment...
Browns 3rd-string QB Thaddeus Lewis practicing with starters because Brandon Weeden, Colt McCoy hurt
Brown.To read more or comment...
Browns elevate QB Thaddeus Lewis to active roster, place WR Mohamed Massaquoi on injured reserve
Browns coach Pat Shurmur has not ruled out rookie quarterback Brandon Weeden for the season finale Sunday against the Pittsburgh Steelers. Weeden sprained his right shoulder Sunday in the third quarter of the Browns' 34-12 loss to the Denver Broncos, Shurmur said today during a news conference.
The Browns, though, elevated third-string quarterback Thaddeus Lewis from their practice squad to their active roster. He would serve as Colt McCoy’s backup if Weeden sits out against the Steelers.
To make room for Lewis on the 53-man roster, the Browns placed wide receiver Mohamed Massaquoi on injured reserve. Massaquoi, a second-round draft pick in 2009, appeared on the injury report last week with an injured knee and was inactive Sunday.
Massaquoi’s contract expires in March, meaning his career with the Browns might be over. He compiled 17 catches for 254 yards and started five of the nine games in which he appeared this season.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “Going back on the game, of course, that was a disappointing loss. I’m not discouraged. It was disappointing. It was 14-3 at halftime. We knew we had to score touchdowns to keep up with them, because they’ve got a ball control offense and they score lots of points. It was 14-3 at half, we came out took the first drive the second half, went 14-6. However we got to that point, we were within one score. After that of course, it got stretched out on us. I’ll go back to it; we’ve got to learn how to finish. We played an outstanding football team. I think that’s pretty obvious watching them play. They played extremely well. They threw one interception, and then they exposed themselves to a couple turnovers on muffed punts. Other than that, they took care of the football pretty well. They ball controlled it and got points. When we did turn it over on the muffed punt ourselves, then they got points. We got beat by a good football team, had even more young guys out there playing, which I’m sure we can talk about. It was a good opportunity for a lot of young players to be out there battling, and you can see we’ve got a long way to go.”
(On the status of Trent Richardson and Brandon Weeden)- “We’re evaluating. We got banged up a little bit, just see where that goes.”
(On if he would rule them out for Sunday)- “Either one of them no. I wouldn’t rule them out yet.”To read more or comment...
Browns coach Pat Shurmur hasn't ruled out Brandon Weeden, Trent Richardson for Sunday vs. Steelers
Brown.To read more or comment...
Game day blog: Browns at Denver Broncos (Week 16)
Final score: Broncos 34, Browns 12 (game story -- Trent Richardson and Brandon Weeden hurt in blowout loss; notebook -- Josh Cribbs lashes out at fans on Twitter after lopsided loss; thumbs up/thumbs down; box score)
Inactives: Browns – wide receiver Mohamed Massaquoi (knee), running back Brandon Jackson, free safety Tashaun Gipson (foot), linebacker Adrian Moten, defensive tackle Ishmaa’ily Kitchen (calf), guard Jarrod Shaw and tight end Jordan Cameron (head). Notes: Massaquoi, Gipson and Cameron were ruled out Friday. Defensive end Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hip) and tight end Alex Smith (illness/knee) were listed as questionable heading into today, but both of them are active. Broncos – quarterback Caleb Hanie, wide receiver Andre Caldwell, cornerback Tony Carter, fullback Chris Gronkowski (hamstring), guard Chris Kuper (ankle), tight end Julius Thomas and defensive tackle Sealver Siliga.
Lineup changes: Browns – Eric Hagg will start at free safety in place of Gipson, who was hurt Thursday during practice. Usama Young will start at strong safety in place of T.J. Ward, who was put on injured reserve Tuesday with a bone bruise on his knee. Broncos – Manny Ramirez will start at right guard in place of Kuper.
Storylines to watch by Stephanie Storm: 1. Peyton Manning was supposed to be finished. Four neck surgeries will do that to a quarterback. But Manning has proved again that he has never been an ordinary player, taking over in Denver after Indianapolis opted to rebuild with Andrew Luck. Meanwhile, all the supposedly washed-up Manning has done is add to his future hall of fame resume with another MVP-caliber season — leading the Broncos to an 11-3 mark with 31 touchdowns to 10 interceptions. While Manning has lost some of his arm strength and has resorted to shorter passes, his trademark accuracy is as deadly as it’s ever been. 2. The Broncos have won nine consecutive games and have already clinched the AFC West Division title, but don’t expect them to take it easy on the visiting Browns. There’s more work to do. Denver is still looking to lock up the No. 2 playoff seed in the AFC and the first-round bye that accompanies it. 3. The Browns lost strong safety T.J. Ward (bruised knee) and rookie strongside linebacker James-Michael Johnson (groin) during last week’s game, each landing on injured reserve Tuesday. That means Usama Young will start as strong safety in place of Ward and rookie Eric Hagg will move into Young’s role as free safety. Meanwhile, rookie Craig Robertson will continue to play linebacker alongside veteran D’Qwell Jackson in the nickel package. Rookie Tank Carder is likely to receive playing time in the base defense in place of Johnson. Because the Browns cut veteran Dimiti Patterson on Monday, second-year player Buster Skrine will become the cornerback in the nickel package. 4. Last week’s embarrassing loss to the Washington Redskins dashed any hopes that the Browns could sneak into the playoffs. But there’s still plenty for the young team to play for today against Denver and next week at Pittsburgh. Players old and young are looking to finish strong. The last two weeks of the season are akin to final auditions in front of the new regime of owner Jimmy Haslam and CEO Joe Banner. 5. Connections abound in this game, beginning with Broncos safety Mike Adams, who played for the Browns for five seasons (2007-11). … Broncos kicker Matt Prater is a Mayfield Heights native. … Broncos tackle Orlando Franklin and Browns receiver Travis Benjamin were teammates at the University of Miami for three seasons (2008-10). Browns quarterbacks coach Mark Whipple was the Hurricanes offensive coordinator for two of those years (2009-10). … Broncos defensive tackle Mitch Unrein spent the 2008 and ’09 seasons with Browns defensive back Tashaun Gibson at Wyoming. … Broncos receiver Andre Caldwell and Browns defensive back Joe Haden were teammates at Florida in 2007. … Broncos defensive end Robert Ayers and punter Britton Colquitt played with Browns running back Montario Hardesty for four seasons (2005-08) at Tennessee.To read more or comment...
Friday's Browns-Broncos injury report
Injury report for Dec. 21
Browns – Out: TE Jordan Cameron (head), FS Tashaun Gipson (foot) and WR Mohamed Massaquoi (knee). Questionable: DT Ishmaa’ily Kitchen (calf), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hip) and TE Alex Smith (illness/knee). Probable: WR Travis Benjamin (finger), OT Oniel Cousins (shin), WR Josh Cribbs (knee), RB Montario Hardesty (knee), RG Shawn Lauvao (head/foot), OT Ryan Miller (not injury related), DE Juqua Parker (knee), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger), DT Phil Taylor (knee/calf) and OT Joe Thomas (back).
Broncos – Doubtful: G Chris Kuper (ankle). Questionable: Willis (knee) and LB Wesley Woodyard (ankle).
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “(Tashaun) Gipson, (Mohamed) Massaquoi and (Jordan) Cameron, I’m going to rule them out at this point. They won’t even make the trip with us so I’ll save you the searching on that.”
(On if Gipson got hurt yesterday in practice)- “He did.”
(On what Eric Hagg learned from his starts early this season)- “I think he’s learned that he can play in this league. He did a good job while he was in there. He does a good job in coverage. Anytime you play for a while and then you don’t play, it gives you a little better view of it while you’re watching it. I’m sure he’s learned something as he’s prepared.”To read more or comment...
Browns coach Pat Shurmur rules out FS Tashaun Gipson, WR Mohamed Massaquoi, TE Jordan Cameron
Coach Pat Shurmur ruled out free safety Tashaun Gipson (foot), wide receiver Mohamed Massaquoi (knee) and tight end Jordan Cameron (head) for Sunday, when the Browns (5-9) will visit the Denver Broncos (11-3).
None of the aforementioned players will travel with the team, Shurmur said.
Eric Hagg will start in place of Gipson, who was hurt in practice Thursday. Hagg started the first two games this season.
“It’s another opportunity for me to prove myself to the coaches,” Hagg said.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns offensive coordinator Brad Childress
Browns offensive coordinator Brad Childress met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(On what happened on Brandon Weeden’s interception early in the second half against the Redskins)- “It was a deep crossing route, if my memory serves, to Greg Little. I just don’t think he put enough air on top of the ball. I don’t think he saw the guy, obviously, or he wouldn’t have thrown it quite the way he threw it, but he didn’t give it enough air to put over the top.”
(On what Weeden needs to do after he throws an interception like the one early in the second half against Washington)- “He needs to get back and look. He gets on the sideline, he looks at the pictures. I don’t know if you’re asking directly what happens after that.”
(On how he moves forward from throwing interceptions)- “Just like he’s done all year long, we’ve got to keep shooting. You can’t go into a shell and be afraid to throw it up out there, obviously with merit. You need to see those kinds of things, but once that happens to you one time you’re a little bit more diplomatic with your next throw. Without holding on to it and being conservative with it.”To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns defensive coordinator Dick Jauron
Browns defensive coordinator Dick Jauron met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
blizing.”To read more or comment...
Thursday's Browns-Broncos injury report
Injury report for Dec. 20
Browns – Did not participate in practice: TE Jordan Cameron (head), WR Mohamed Massaquoi (knee) and DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hip). Limited participation in practice: WR Josh Cribbs (knee), FS Tashaun Gipson (foot), DE Juqua Parker (knee), DT Phil Taylor (knee/calf) and OT Joe Thomas (back). Full participation in practice: WR Travis Benjamin (finger), OT Oniel Cousins (shin), RB Montario Hardesty (knee), RG Shawn Lauvao (head/foot), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger) and TE Alex Smith (knee).
Broncos – Did not participate in practice: G Chris Kuper (ankle). Limited participation in practice: FB Chris Gronkowski (hamstring) and DT Kevin Vickerson (groin). Full participation in practice: S Mike Adams (knee),.”To read more or comment...
Browns notes: Josh Cribbs finishes first among AFC special teamers in Pro Bowl fan voting
Browns veteran Josh Cribbs finished first among AFC special teamers in Pro Bowl fan voting. He received 127,848 online votes.
The AFC and NFC Pro Bowl rosters are formed with the consensus votes of fans, players and coaches. Each group’s vote counts one-third toward determining the 43-man rosters, which will be announced at 7 p.m. Dec. 26 on NFL Network. Players and coaches will cast their votes today and Friday.
Cribbs, a two-time Pro Bowl selection, also finished second among AFC kick returners with 135,101 votes. Although Phil Dawson did not crack the list of the top-five AFC kickers after the first week of fan voting, he rallied and finished second with 120,620 votes. D’Qwell Jackson finished second among AFC inside linebackers with 150,442 votes.
The Baltimore Ravens’ Jacoby Jones (143,047 votes) finished first among AFC kick returners. The Oakland Raiders’ Sebastian Janikowski (138,068 votes) took first among AFC kickers. And the New England Patriots’ Jerod Mayo (143,047 votes) finished first among AFC inside linebackers.To read more or comment...
Wednesday's Browns-Broncos injury report
Injury report on Dec. 19
Browns – Did not participate in practice: TE Jordan Cameron (head) and DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hip). Limited participation in practice: WR Josh Cribbs (knee), RG Shawn Lauvao (head/foot), WR Mohamed Massaquoi (knee), DE Juqua Parker (knee), DT Phil Taylor (knee) and OT Joe Thomas (back). Full participation in practice: WR Travis Benjamin (finger), OT Oniel Cousins (shin), RB Montario Hardesty (knee), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger) and TE Alex Smith (knee).
Broncos – Did not participate in practice: CB Champ Bailey (not injury related), FB Chris Gronkowski (hamstring) and G Chris Kuper (ankle). Limited participation in practice: S Mike Adams (knee) and DT Kevin Vickerson (groin). Full participation in practice:.”To read more or comment...
DE Frostee Rucker, TE Jordan Cameron sit out practice, plus other Browns notes
Starting right defensive end Frostee Rucker (shoulder/hip) and tight end Jordan Cameron (head) did not practice today.
Rucker said he expects to play Sunday when the Browns (5-9) visit the Denver Broncos (11-3). Cameron was not in the locker room today.
Rucker suffered his injury this past weekend in the second half of the Browns’ 38-21 loss to the Washington Redskins.
Wide receiver Jordan Norwood practiced today for the first time since he injured his left foot Oct. 7 against the New York Giants. Norwood is on injured reserve but designated for return.To read more or comment...
Browns place SS T.J. Ward, LB James-Michael Johnson on IR, add 3 players to active roster
The Browns placed strong safety T.J. Ward and rookie strongside linebacker James-Michael Johnson on injured reserve with knee injuries that won’t require surgery, the team announced this evening. A league source told the Beacon Journal this afternoon Ward was headed for IR with a bone bruise on his knee that he suffered in the third quarter of the Browns’ 38-21 loss to the Washington Redskins.
The Browns also signed defensive back Prince Miller and linebacker Adrian Moten to their 53-man roster. The team also elevated defensive lineman Hall Davis from the practice squad to the active roster.
Miller has appeared in four career games and has totaled three tackles. He spent three weeks on the practice squad of the Jacksonville Jaguars this season.
Moten has appeared in 13 career games and has three tackles on defense and one special teams fumble recovery. He appeared in one game with the Philadelphia Eagles this season before being waived on Oct. 9.
Davis has appeared in one regular-season game in his career. He spent the past seven weeks on the Browns’ practice squad.To read more or comment...
Browns name Alec Scheiner new president; will oversee day-to-day business operations
The Browns have named Alec Scheiner their new president, a role in which he will oversee all aspect of the organization’s day-to-day business operations, the team announced today.
Scheiner spent the past eight years with the Dallas Cowboys and served as their senior vice president and general counsel for the last five. Scheiner will start working for the Browns on Jan. 7. His responsibilities will include overseeing in-game stadium enhancements and local TV and radio broadcasting.
The Browns also announced Bryan Wiedmeier will transition from his role as executive vice president of business operations into a new role in which he will work closely with CEO Joe Banner, focusing on long-term strategic planning for the organization, including stadium projects and other capital endeavors.
The addition of Scheiner will presumably free up Banner to deal more with the football side of the organization. Browns owner Jimmy Haslam has said football operations will report to Banner, who developed a reputation as a noted businessman, salary-cap guru and contract negotiator during his 12-year reign as president of the Philadelphia Eagles.
Scheiner, a native of Lower Merion, Pa., and Banner will be available on a conference call at 6:15 p.m. today.To read more or comment...
Browns SS T.J. Ward heading to injured reserve after hurting knee
Strong safety T.J. Ward is headed for injured reserve after suffering a bone bruise on his knee Sunday in the third quarter of the Browns’ 38-21 loss to the Washington Redskins, a league source confirmed this afternoon for the Beacon Journal.
The Browns are expected to announce some roster moves this evening.
Ward, a second-round pick in the 2010 draft, started all 14 games this season and compiled 68 tackles, including a sack, three forced fumbles, one interception and four passes defensed. His 2011 season was also cut short after he sprained his right foot in Week 8 and missed the final eight games.
The 5-foot-10, 200-pound Ward set up the Browns’ first touchdown against the Redskins when he intercepted a pass tipped by cornerback Sheldon Brown and returned it 37 yards to Washington’s 6-yard line. Rookie running back Trent Richardson rushed for a 6-yard touchdown on the following play.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
Brandon Weeden and if his big picture view will change) – “I evaluate him based on every throw..”
(On if he thinks Weeden is still the right guy long term) – “I’m looking forward to him having a better game this week against Denver. I think that’s where the focus needs to be.”To read more or comment...
Browns waive CB Dimitri Patterson after signing him to 3-year, $16 million contract in March
The.To read more or comment...
Browns coach Pat Shurmur says he talked to RB Trent Richardson about his postgame criticism
Coach.To read more or comment...
Game day blog: Browns vs. Washington Redskins (Week 15); Browns lose 38-21
Final score: Redskins 38, Browns 21 (game story; notebook; thumbs up/thumbs down; Marla Ridenour's column; Browns fail to adjust to Kirk Cousins)
End 4Q: Redskins 38, Browns 21—The Browns’ three game winning streak came to an end on Sunday. Evan Royster put Washington up 31-14 early in the quarter with a 4-yard touchdown run. Weeden then hit Travis Benjamin on a fly route for a 69-yard touchdown just over a minute later to remain within striking distance at 31-21. The Redskins and backup quarterback Kirk Cousins then drove down the field and put the game out of reach on Morris’ 8-yard touchdown run with just over five minutes to play. Ward did not return with a knee injury, and Frostee Rucker left the game with an injured groin. Weeden finished the day 21-35 passing for 244 yards, one touchdown and two interceptions. Richardson ended up with only 28 yards rushing, though he did score two touchdowns. Cousins, on the other hand, was 26-37 passing for 329 yards, two touchdowns and one interceptions.
End 3Q: Redskins 24, Browns 14—The Redskins offense looked comfortable moving the ball in the third quarter, and Weeden looked equally uncomfortable. Weeden threw two interceptions, and had a couple others batted down. The Redskins turned the first pick into an Alfred Morris touchdown run that gave Washington a 17-14 lead. Using the play-action pass, Cousins orchestrated a second scoring drive that was capped by a two-yard pass to Hankerson. Safety T.J. Ward left the field with a couple of minutes left in the quarter and walked to the locker room as the quarter ended. His return is questionable with a knee injury.
End 2Q: Browns 14, Redskins 10—The Redskins took the lead on a 44-yard field goal by Kai Forbath with 5:46 left in the half. Brandon Weeden answered by hitting Josh Gordon on back-to-back first-down passes, and he then found Greg Little for 30 yards on a crossing pattern. Josh Cribbs lined up in the Wild Cat and carried the ball to the 7-yard line for a 16-yard gain, setting up a Trent Richardson 1-yard touchdown run, his second score of the day. Richardson appeared to score on the play before from the 3-yard line, but the play was reversed after a booth challenge. Brandon Weeden is 13-20 for 88 yards. Richardson has 28 yards and two touchdowns on nine carries.To read more or comment...
Browns seemingly catch huge break with rookie QB Kirk Cousins set to start for RG3
The Browns seem to have caught a huge break because the Washington Redskins announced tonight that standout quarterback Robert Griffin III is expected to be replaced in the starting lineup Sunday by fellow rookie Kirk Cousins.
“The decision was not my own,” Griffin wrote on Twitter. “But I will be there for my team!!! In every way I possibly can.”
The Browns (5-8) will host the Redskins (7-6) at 1 p.m. Sunday. Cleveland is hoping to capitalize on the switch at quarterback as it seeks a fourth consecutive victory.
Griffin, the second overall pick in this year’s draft, mildly sprained the lateral collateral ligament in his right knee Dec. 9 in the fourth quarter against the Baltimore Ravens when he absorbed a hit from defensive tackle Haloti Ngata. Cousins, a fourth round pick, then came to the rescue by throwing a touchdown pass and running for a two-point conversion to force overtime in the Redskins’ 31-28 triumph.To read more or comment...
Friday's Browns-Redskins injury report
Injury report Dec. 14
Browns – Probable: WR Travis Benjamin (finger), WR Josh Cribbs (knee), RB Montario Hardesty (knee), LB James-Michael Johnson (thigh/finger), RG Shawn Lauvao (foot), DE Juqua Parker (knee), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger/illness), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder) and OT Joe Thomas (back).
Redskins – Questionable: LB London Fletcher (ankle), QB Robert Griffin III (knee) and OT Trent Williams (thigh). Probable: DT Chris Baker (wrist), CB Richard Crawford (knee), WR Pierre Garcon (foot), LB Ryan Kerrigan (ankle), RB Alfred Morris (illness) and CB Josh Wilson (shoulder).To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “I really don’t have much more to add from the week, but I’m sure you have a few questions so I’ll try to answer them for you.”
(On if there are a lot of similarities between London Fletcher and D’Qwell Jackson)- “I don’t know. I never really worked with London, but I will say this, I think watching them both work, it appears to me like those two guys do the same things for their team. I know how mature and how much of a leader D’Qwell is. It’s obvious to me that by watching them that London Fletcher does the same thing for their team.”
(On the job Tom Heckert has done putting this roster together)- “I just know that our team looks a lot different now than it did when I came here a couple years ago. We’re a lot better. Our roster is younger. We’ve added some explosive players on both sides of the football. Time will tell how good these young players are. Then it’s mixed in with some veteran guys that have been around here quite a while that have helped show leadership. As a coach looking at it, I feel much better about our team now than I did two years ago.”To read more or comment...
Browns LG Jason Pinkston hopes to play football again, has new outlook after health scare
Brown."To read more or comment...
Browns GM Tom Heckert discusses his uncertain future with franchise
With owner Jimmy Haslam and CEO Joe Banner in charge of the Browns, the future of General Manager Tom Heckert and other key members of the organization is uncertain.
Heckert met with reporters today to discuss his situation. Here are some of the highlights from the chat:
*Heckert said he believes he’ll learn his fate right after the season, but he insisted he doesn’t know what decision Haslam and Banner will make.
“I don't think I'd be surprised [if I'm back next year], but I really don't have an idea,” Heckert said. … “If things don't work out, I'm pretty confident I'll get a shot somewhere else.:
.”To read more or comment...
Thursday's Browns-Redskins injury report
Injury report for Dec. 13 -- Limited participation in practice: LB London Fletcher (ankle),...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening statement)- “I’ve got nothing really to add from yesterday other than the fact I’m glad the weather is reasonable. In the middle of December to be able to go outside, it’s been good. I think it’s always best for the players to be outside if, obviously, weather and temperatures permit.”
(On if he sees a growing sense of confidence in the young team)- .”
(On if the team has yet to play their best game)- “I hope we continue to play better each week. As a coach, that’s what you want. Yeah, I’m hopeful.”To read more or comment...
Wednesday's Browns-Redskins injury report
Injury report for Dec. 12 -- Did not participate in practice: LB London Fletcher (ankle). Limited participation in practice:...
Browns' defense preparing as if it will face Redskins QB Robert Griffin III
Instead of getting caught up in a guessing game, the Browns are preparing as if they’re going to face standout rookie quarterback Robert Griffin III on Sunday when the Washington Redskins come to town.
Griffin, the second overall pick in this year's draft, tested his mildly sprained right knee in practice today, but his status for Sunday is not clear. If he doesn’t play, fellow rookie Kirk Cousins will start at quarterback for the Redskins.
“We truly are preparing as if [Griffin is] playing,” rookie free safety Tashaun Gipson said this afternoon following practice. “That’s the report out of this camp. [The injury] looked a lot worse than what the camp is saying. But you’ve got to respect what they’re saying. They’re saying he’s going to play. So definitely right now our main focus is preparing as if we’re going to see No. 10 [Griffin] out there.”
Gipson acknowledged it’s difficult to simulate Griffin’s skills in practice. Browns backup quarterback Colt McCoy is playing the role of Griffin in practice this week.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening statement)- “You saw the news this morning, the AFC Player of the Week for special teams was Travis Benjamin. That’s a tremendous honor. I’m sure he’s happy to receive that as well as be a part of a winning effort. The fourth captain this week will be Josh Cribbs. I’ve talked about it numerous times, but I really appreciate Josh for his toughness. In a sport like football, a guy that’s tough, that’s the highest honor. He’ll be our fourth captain. Otherwise, we’re getting ready to play the Redskins. I could probably answer one of your questions. As we prepare to play the Redskins, who plays quarterback will not affect our preparation as we move forward.ahan’s have always been known for. That’s what we have to prepare for as we move forward.”
(On who will simulate the opposing quarterback this week)- “Colt’s going to play the quarterback position for us. That’s who will do it. Let me just say this, I’m not sure we have that kind of speed on our team to simulate a player as talented as RGIII (Robert Griffin III) in terms of his just flat speed.”
(On if not having that type of speed on the team is a problem because you don’t see it until gameday)- “No, I think it’s what you go through any time you prepare for a tremendous player like RGIII.”To read more or comment...
Browns rookie Travis Benjamin named AFC Special Teams Player of Week, plus other notes
Brown.To read more or comment...
Browns LB Scott Fujita cleared in Saints' bounty case
Former NFL Commissioner Paul Tagliabue vacated all player discipline in the New Orleans Saints’ bounty scandal and exonerated Browns linebacker Scott Fujita.
Fujita, who’s on injured reserve with a potential career-ending neck injury, maintained his innocence all along. He said he paid teammates for making big plays, including sacks and interceptions, but never contributed to a pool that allegedly paid his former teammates for intentionally injuring opponents. NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell accused Fujita of contributing funds to a pay-for-injury program when he gave him a three-game suspension in May.
The suspension was later reduced to one game, but Fujita wasn’t entirely cleared until Tagliabue issued his ruling today.
Tagliabue concluded it’s "undisputed" that Fujita only took part in a "non-injury" pay-for-performance pool. “I find his actions here were not conduct detrimental and vacate his suspension,” Tagliabue wrote in his decision.To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
.”To read more or comment...
Browns sign TE/FB Brad Smelley to active roster, waive DT Ronnie Cameron
The.To read more or comment...
Game day blog: Browns vs. Kansas City Chiefs (Week 14); Browns win 30-7
Final score: Browns 30, Chiefs 7 (game story; thumbs up/thumbs down; notebook; Marla Ridenour's column; Travis Benjamin's 93-yard punt return proved to be turning point)
End 4Q: Browns 30, Chiefs 7—The Browns put this one out of reach early in the fourth quarter. Trent Richardson punched in his second one-yard touchdown of the game to put the Browns up 27-7. Phil Dawson later added a 34-yard field goal to go up 30-7. Richardson finished the game with 42 yards and two touchdowns. Weeden was 17-30 passing for 217 yards. Josh Gordon had eight catches for 86 yards. It’s the Browns’ largest margin of victory since a 44-6 thrashing of the Cardinals in 2003.
End 3Q: Browns 20, Chiefs 7—The Browns marched down the field on their first drive of the second half, led by a couple of Weeden passes and capped with a 1-yard Richarson touchdown in which he launched himself like a missile into the end zone. Tashaun Gipson then picked off Brady Quinn on a pass tipped by Sheldon Brown for his first interception of his career. The Browns had two touchdown plays called back on the penalties, the first an illegal motion call on Watson and Little and the second a pass interference call on Richardson. The Browns settled for a 24-yard field goal by Dawson to go up 20-7. At the end of the quarter. Weeden made a nice play by scrambling and finding Watson and third and long. Greg Little then lined up as a running back and carried the ball 17 yards to the 1-yard line.
End 2Q: Browns 10, Chiefs 7—After the Chiefs scored on the first play of the first quarter, the Browns scored on the first play of the second quarter. Just before a Chiefs punt, Josh Cribbs, who lined up deep, and Travis Benjamin switched places at the last second. Benjamin then took the punt at the 7-yard line, charged up the middle and then down the Browns sideline for a 93-yard punt return for a touchdown to put the Browns up 10-7. It’s the longest punt return in Browns history, eclipsing Eric Metcalf’s 92-yarder against the Bengals in 1994. For the Chiefs, Jamaal Charles and Dwayne Bowe each left the game with rib injuries. Charles would return late in the half, but Bowe did not and his return is questionable. On a 3-yard run, Richardson pushed the pile and was then tackled by Shaun Smith, who then got into a scuffle with a few players from each side.To read more or comment...
Saturday's Browns-Chiefs injury report
Injury report for Dec. 8 – Out:...
Friday's Browns-Chiefs injury report
Injury report for Dec. 7 – Doubtful:...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “You guys have the release, Reggie Hodges, is our Ed Block Courage Award winner. Coming back from that Achilles, he’s done a nice job for us this Joshua Cribbs returning a kickoff from nine yards deep)- “I think what happens is they get very few opportunities to come out and they are playmakers. You see it across the league now where guys are trying to advance the football from almost near the back of the end line. You can’t score a touchdown if you don’t give it a shot. I would say if you get tackled inside the 20, that’s not good. Those guys that are returning those kicks need to use good judgment.”To read more or comment...
Thursday's Browns-Chiefs injury report
Injury report for Dec. 6
Browns – Limited participation in practice: WR Josh Cribbs (shoulder/chest) and OT Ryan Miller (forearm). Full participation in practice: TE Jordan Cameron (groin), CB Dimitri Patterson (ankle), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger), DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/finger), S Ray Ventrone (calf) and FS Usama Young (concussion).
Chiefs – Did not participate in practice: S Eric Berry (hand), S Abram Elam (quad), CB Brandon Flowers (hamstring), LB Derrick Johnson (hamstring) and C/G Ryan Lilja (knee). Limited participation in practice: OT Branden Albert (back), LB Tamba Hali (knee) and S Kendrick Lewis (shoulder). Full participation in practice: G Jeff Allen (illness).To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns offensive coordinator Brad Childress
Browns offensive coordinator Brad Childress met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(On if he is finally starting to tap into Josh Gordon’s potential) – “Are we starting to tap into it? Yeah, I would hope it’s the tip of the iceberg. I just see him getting more comfortable every week with what we’re doing. Not having to think, letting his God-given athletic ability kind of show itself.”
.”To read more or comment...
Peyton Hillis responds to Browns Pro Bowler Joe Thomas, likening him to 'crazy ex-girlfriend'
Kansas City Chiefs running back Peyton Hillis, who played in Cleveland from 2010-11, responded to the comments made by Browns Pro Bowl left tackle Joe Thomas on Wednesday. Thomas accused Hillis of creating a “terrible distraction” last season by “going through a contract dispute and basically refusing to play.”
Hillis and the Chiefs (2-10) will visit the Browns (4-8) on Sunday.
Here’s what Hillis told the Kansas City Star in response to Thomas:
On Thomas’ comments: “It’s kind of like a crazy ex-girlfriend. It's been over a year. Get over it. I guess when you get paid over 100 million dollars by one team, it's kind of easy to point the finger at other guys and try to hate on them for trying to get another contract.’’To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns defensive coordinator Dick Jauron
Browns defensive coordinator Dick Jauron met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
.”To read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
.”To read more or comment...
Wednesday's Browns-Chiefs injury report
Injury report for Dec. 5
Browns – Limited participation in practice: WR Josh Cribbs (shoulder/chest), S Ray Ventrone (calf) and FS Usama Young (concussion). Full participation in practice: TE Jordan Cameron (groin), CB Dimitri Patterson (ankle), RB Trent Richardson (chest/rib/finger) and DE Frostee Rucker (shoulder/finger).
Chiefs – Did not participate in practice: G Jeff Allen (illness), DL Allen Bailey (ankle), S Abram Elam (quad), CB Brandon Flowers (hamstring), LB Derrick Johnson (hamstring) and C/G Ryan Lilja (knee). Limited participation in practice: OT Branden Albert (back), S Eric Berry (hand), LB Tamba Hali (knee) and S Kendrick Lewis (shoulder).To read more or comment...
Browns LT Joe Thomas rips former teammate Peyton Hillis, calls him 'terrible distraction'
Browns Pro Bowl left tackle Joe Thomas vented his frustration this afternoon when talking to reporters about his former teammate Peyton Hillis, who will visit Cleveland on Sunday as a member of the Kansas City Chiefs.
Hillis had a breakout season with the Browns in 2010 and then a dramatic one in 2011 that was plagued by injury, off-the-field distractions and a contract dispute.
Here's some of what Thomas had to say about Hillis:
On Hillis being a distraction last season: "It was a terrible distraction. Crippled our offense because we ended up signing Obie off the street in the middle of the year and he ended up getting hurt. We were struggling to find anybody who could carry the ball after all the injuries we had. To have Peyton going through a contract dispute and basically refusing to play, it was a big distraction, but more than anything, because sometimes I think distractions are overrated, read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening.”To read more or comment...
Browns FS Usama Young returns to practice after sitting out vs. Raiders with concussion
Brown.To read more or comment...
Transcript from conference call with Chiefs coach Romeo Crennel
Former Browns coach Romeo Crennel, now directing the Kansas City Chiefs, spoke to members of the local media Wednesday. Many of the questions dealt with Saturday's tragedy in which linebacker Javon Belcher murdered his girlfiend Kasandra Perkins, the mother of their 3-month-old daughter Zoey, then committed suicide in front of Crennel, GM Scott Pioli and defensive coordinator Gary Gibbs in the parking lot at Arrowhead Stadium.
Q: Hey, what’s going on?
A: I’m doing good, guys. You know what, it’s a tough situation to have to work through and go through, but we’re trying to work through it and move forward as best we can..
Q: What did you draw from to get you through this personally?To read more or comment...
Transcript from conference call with Chiefs QB Brady Quinn
Kansas City Chiefs quarterback Brady Quinn discussed his team’s effort to cope with the recent murder-suicide involving linebacker Jovan Belcher during a conference call this morning with local media. The Chiefs (2-10) will visit the Browns (4-8) on Sunday. Here is a transcript from the conference call with Quinn, a first-round draft pick of the Browns in 2007:
How are you?: “Hanging in there.”
How difficult was past week?: “It was extremely difficult. Really shocking at first, then there’s a lot of sadness for the entire situation. We lost a friend, a teammate, a family member to us. There was a tragedy that takes place where a mother is gone now and there’s a little girl who’s without two parents. When you in some way try to put it in perspective, it’s hard to really get a grasp of the gravity of the situation.”
What has coach Romeo Crennel’s leadership meant?: “It was huge. He was that steady rock in the midst of everything. He was witnessing it, so he knew he had to put it on himself to be the guy to mentally communicate what had happened to us, but also at the same time lead us because there was going be so many emotions involved and a lot of guys searching and looking around to see how they should respond.”To read more or comment...
Highlights from premiere of 'NFL Road Tested: The Cleveland Browns'
A documentary series featuring the Browns premiered tonight on Travel Channel. Below are some highlights from the first episode of NFL Road Tested: The Cleveland Browns, so stop reading if you’ve set your DVR and don’t want to know what happens.
What stood out?: Early in the episode, new Browns owner Jimmy Haslam is introduced to the audience. He met with Cleveland fans outside MetLife Stadium before the Browns faced the New York Giants on Oct. 7 and talked to Hall of Fame running back Jim Brown before the Browns hosted the San Diego Chargers on Oct. 28. After the Browns defeated the Chargers 7-6, coach Pat Shurmur said, “We’ve got a new owner. Jimmy Haslam, this one’s for you.” Shurmur then tossed Haslam a game ball, and the Tennessee billionaire leaned over to catch the pass. It was the Browns' first win since NFL owners unanimously approved Haslam's purchase of the team on Oct. 16. … Rookie quarterback Brandon Weeden and rookie running back Trent Richardson attended the Cavaliers’ season opener on Oct. 30. They chatted with Cavs owner Dan Gilbert, who assured the first-round draft picks that they would love Cleveland sports fans. “They’re loyal, they’re hard working, they’re great people,” Gilbert said. “I mean you couldn’t ask for anything better.” … Former Browns quarterback Bernie Kosar presented a signed photo of deceased soldier Cory Endlich to the latter’s parents during a halftime ceremony when the Browns hosted the Baltimore Ravens on Nov. 4. The Endlichs, die-hard Browns fans, were overwhelmed with emotion.
What did we learn?: Mike Thatcher, a 66-year-old retired salesman, is an equipment assistant for the Browns. His other claim to fame is his role in a classic film, The Shawshank Redemption. He played a prison guard. … Kicker Phil Dawson said he takes about six pairs of kicking shoes and “a ton” of plant shoes to each game. … Each NFL team brings its own footballs to games, 12 for the quarterback and 12 for the kicker, which are specially treated to the liking of Weeden and Dawson. … While out to dinner with backup quarterback Colt McCoy and his wife, Rachel, Dawson and his wife, Shannon, revealed that they use hand signals to communicate during games when he’s on the field and she’s in the stands.
Quotable: “He’s not bashful. He has a mind of his own, but he can also listen. So that’s not a bad combination.” – Hall of Fame running back Jim Brown on Browns owner Jimmy HaslamTo read more or comment...
Transcript from news conference with Browns coach Pat Shurmur
Browns coach Pat Shurmur met with reporters today. Here is a transcript from the news conference:
(Opening Statement)- “Going back on the game yesterday, I think for the second week in a row, we found a way to win a game that was hard fought. Each game, you find a way to either win the game or lose the game. I’m happy for our guys. There were some significant things that happened. I’ll start on defense first. I thought we were opportunistic on defense. I thought for the most part we controlled the running game, which was important. They went into a kind of no-huddle phase where they kind of picked away at us a little bit, but then you saw there at the end of the game Sheldon Brown had an interception. I think that helped spark us to finish the game, which was outstanding. Sheldon, for the most part, I thought played extremely well. For the most part on defense, when you limit scoring like we did, forget yardage, forget all that stuff, when you limit scoring in the meat of the game there, I think that’s the most important thing and we got turnovers. I thought we did a nice job with penalties. We only had two penalties. We had a holding call and then of course we had the one on special teams when Buster (Skrine) ran into the returner. It was an aggressive play. I thought that was good. On special teams we wanted to be perfect in field goals. That’s no longer there for us. We got a little bit of a push there. We were kicking in a sloppy area and there’s no excuse for any of it, but they got a little push, we couldn’t dig in quite as well as we’re used to doing and they made a play. They made a play on us. There’s not much there other than that. In terms of the offense, I think we had the most yards we’ve had in a long time. The two interceptions, of course you’d like to have those back. We got good production from eight receivers, which was good. [There were] no drops to speak of which was good. I thought Trent Richardson had a steady game as a runner and then we saw the little spark that (Montario) Hardesty gave us by bringing him in the football game. We had guys doing things that were good. Then of course, a lot of conversation about the last 94-yard drive, which was great. In that drive Brandon (Weeden) was five for six. We ran the ball effectively. At the end of the game there, by putting the ball in the end zone it creates a two-score game, which just absolutely changes it for the opponent. I think that was important. Had we kicked a field goal, we all know the numbers, it would have been six. Then all our hearts would have been going like this (hits chest). I think that’s an important thing. That’s a lot. That’s usually more than I say, but I’m happy that our guys found a way to win. I’m proud of our coaches and players for understanding the opportunity to go out there and win a second game in a row, do it on the road against a tough opponent in my opinion. I think you’ve got to quit looking at records when you talk about who’s good and who’s bad. Anybody can win each weekend in the NFL. Now the challenge will be to get back into the process and get ready to play the Chiefs.”
(On what he hopes the 94-yard drive does for the offense’s confidence)- .”
(On if he thinks this team has turned the corner in the last couple.”To read more or comment...
Game day blog: Browns at Oakland Raiders (Week 13)
Final score: Browns 20, Raiders 17 (game story; notebook; thumbs up/thumbs down; box score)
Inactives: Browns – cornerback Dimitri Patterson (ankle), free safety Usama Young (concussion), running back Brandon Jackson, special-teams ace Ray Ventrone (calf), defensive tackle Ronnie Cameron, guard Jarrod Shaw and wide receiver Josh Cooper. Notes: Patterson will miss his seventh consecutive game since suffering a high-ankle sprain and torn ligament Oct. 7 against the New York Giants. Young is out after suffering a concussion last week against the Pittsburgh Steelers. Ventrone has missed three games in a row after hurting his calf in practice. Nov. 15. Cooper is a healthy scratch for the second week in a row. Raiders – running backs Darren McFadden and Mike Goodson (ankles), linebacker Rolando McClain (suspended), guard Lucas Nix, offensive tackle Willie Smith, defensive end Jack Crawford (toe) and defensive tackle Richard Seymour (knee/hamstring). Notes: McFadden and Goodson are out for the fourth consecutive game with high-ankle sprains. Seymour is sidelined for the fourth game in a row.
Lineup changes: Browns – rookie Tashaun Gipson will start at free safety in place of Young. Raiders – Marcel Reece will start at running back in place of McFadden. Owen Schmitt will start at fullback in place of Reece. Desmond Bryant will start at defensive tackle in place of Seymour. Omar Gaither will start at middle linebacker in place of McClain, whom the Raiders suspended for two games for conduct detrimental to the team.
Storylines by George Thomas: 1...To read more or comment...
Browns employee commits suicide at team facility
A Browns employee commited suicide Saturday, the team confirmed this morning.
The employee, who was a member of the grounds crew, hanged himself inside a storage shed at the team's facility on Saturday in Berea, the Cuyahoga County coroner confirmed to WEWS Newschannel 5 in Cleveland.
Fox Sports’ Jay Glazer first reported the incident on Fox’s NFL Sunday pregame show. Glazer said the incident occurred Saturday, right around the same time Kansas City Chiefs linebacker Jovan Belcher shot his girlfriend at a residence and then himself at the Chiefs’ facility.
The Browns issued a statement via email.
"This is a terrible tragedy and our heartfelt condolences go out to [his] family. [He] was a good friend and colleague, and an outstanding employee. He will be missed by everyone in the Cleveland Browns organization.”To read more or comment...
Saturday's Browns-Raiders injury report
Injury report for Dec. 1), QB Brandon Weeden (concussion) and WR Greg Little (knee)....
- 2013 (313)
- 2012 (670)
- 2011 (686)
- 2010 (823)
- 2009 (497)
- 2008 (100)
- 2007 (54) |
Authors: 266
Books: 3,236
Poems & Short Stories: 4,271
Forum Members: 70,634
Forum Posts: 1,033,546
And over 2 million unique readers monthly!.
Again, those terribly dull evenings in some un known town! Do you know anything more wretched than the approach of. dusk on such an occasion? One goes about as if almost in a dream, looking at faces that one never has seen before and never will see again; listening to people talking about matters which are quite indifferent to you in a language that perhaps you do not understand. You have a terrible feeling, almost as if you were lost, and you continue to walk on so as not to be obliged to return to the hotel, where you would feel more lost still because you are at home, in a home which belongs to anyone who can pay for it; and at last you sink into a chair of some well-lighted cafe, whose gilding and lights oppress you a thousand times more than the shadows in the streets. Then you feel so abominably lonely sitting in front of the glass of flat bock beer that a kind of madness seizes you, the longing to go somewhere or other, no matter where, as long as you need not remain in front of that marble table amid those dazzling lights.
And then, suddenly, you are aware that you are really alone in the world, always and everywhere, and that in places which we know, the familiar jostlings give us the illusion only of human fraternity. At such moments of self-abandonment and sombre isolation in distant cities one thinks broadly, clearly and profoundly. Then one suddenly sees the whole of life outside the vision of eternal hope, apart from the deceptions of our innate habits, and of our expectations of happiness, which we indulge in dreams never to be realized.
It is only by going a long distance from home that we can fully understand how short-lived and empty everything near at hand is; by searching for the unknown, we perceive how commonplace and evanescent everything is; only by wandering over the face of the earth can we understand how small the world is, and how very much alike it is everywhere.
How well I know, and how I hate and almost fear, those haphazard walks through unknown streets; and this was the reason why, as nothing would induce me to undertake a tour in Italy by myself, I made up my mind to accompany my friend Paul Pavilly.
You know Paul, and how he idealizes women. To him the earth is habitable only because they are there; the sun gives light and is warm because it shines upon them; the air is soft and balmy because it blows upon their skin and ruffles the soft hair on their temples; and the moon is charming because it makes them dream and imparts a languorous charm to love. Every act and action of Paul's has woman for its motive; all his thoughts, all his efforts and hopes are centered in them.
When I mentioned Italy to Paul he at first absolutely refused to leave Paris. I, however, began to tell him of the adventures I had on my travels. I assured him that all Italian women are charming, and I made him hope for the most refined pleasures at Naples, thanks to certain letters of introduction which I had; and so at last he allowed himself to be persuaded.
II
We took the express one Thursday evening, Paul and I. Hardly anyone goes south at that time of the year, so that we had the carriages to ourselves, and both of us were in a bad temper on leaving Paris, sorry for having yielded to the temptation of this journey, and regretting Marly, the Seine, and our lazy boating excursions, and all those pleasures in and near Paris which are so dear to every true Parisian.
As soon as the train started Paul stuck himself in his corner, and said, "It is most idiotic to go all that distance," and as it was too late for him to change his mind then, I said, "Well, you should not have come."
He made no answer, and I felt very much inclined to laugh when I saw how furious he looked. He is certainly always rather like a squirrel, but then every one of us has retained the type of some animal or other as the mark of his primitive origin. How many people have jaws like a bulldog, or heads like goats, rabbits, foxes, horses, or oxen. Paul is a squirrel turned into a man. He has its bright, quick eyes, its hair, its pointed nose, its small, fine, supple, active body, and a certain mysterious resemblance in his general bearing; in fact, a similarity of movement, of gesture, and of bearing which might almost be taken for a recollection.
At last we both went to sleep with that uncomfortable slumber of the railway carriage, which is interrupted by horrible cramps in the arms and neck, and by the sudden stoppages of the train.
We woke up as we were passing along the Rhone. Soon the continued noise of crickets came in through the windows, that cry which seems to be the voice of the warm earth, the song of Provence; and seemed to instill into our looks, our breasts, and our souls the light and happy feeling of the south, that odor of the parched earth, of the stony and light soil of the olive with its gray-green foliage.
When the train stopped again a railway guard ran along the train calling out "Valence" in a sonorous voice, with an accent that again gave us a taste of that Provence which the shrill note of the crickets had already imparted to us.
Nothing fresh happened till we got to Marseilles, where we alighted for breakfast, but when we returned to our carriage we found a woman installed there.
Paul, with a delighted glance at me, gave his short mustache a mechanical twirl, and passed his fingers through his, hair, which. had become slightly out of order with the night's journey. Then he sat down opposite the newcomer.
Whenever I happen to see a striking new face, either in travelling or in society, I always have the strongest inclination to find out what character, mind, and intellectual capacities are hidden beneath those features.
She was a young and pretty woman, certainly a native of the south of France, with splendid eyes, beautiful wavy black hair, which was so thick and long that it seemed almost too heavy for her head. She was dressed with a certain southern bad taste which made her look a little vulgar. Her regular features had none of the grace and finish of the refined races, of that slight delicacy which members of the aristocracy inherit from their birth, and which is the hereditary mark of thinner blood.
Her bracelets were too big to be of gold; she wore earrings with large white stones that were certainly not diamonds, and she belonged unmistakably to the People. One surmised that she would talk too loud, and shout on every occasion with exaggerated gestures.
When the train started she remained motionless in her place, in the attitude of a woman who was indignant, without even looking at us.
Paul began to talk to me, evidently with an eye to effect, trying to attract her attention, as shopkeepers expose their choice wares to catch the notice of passersby.
She, however, did not appear to be paying the least attention.
"Toulon! Ten minutes to wait! Refreshment room!" the porters shouted.
Paul motioned to me to get out, and as soon as we had done so, he said:
"I wonder who on earth she can be?"
I began to laugh. "I am sure I don't know, and I don't in the least care."
He was quite excited.
"She is an uncommonly fresh and pretty girl. What eyes she has, and how cross she looks. She must have been dreadfully worried, for she takes no notice of anything."
"You will have all your trouble for nothing," I growled.
He began to lose his temper.
"I am not taking any trouble, my dear fellow. I think her an extremely pretty woman, that is all. If one could only speak to her! But I don't know how to begin. Cannot you give me an idea? Can't you guess who she is?"
"Upon my word, I cannot. However, I should rather think she is some strolling actress who is going to rejoin her company after a love adventure."
He seemed quite upset, as if I had said something insulting.
"What makes you think that? On the contrary, I think she looks most respectable."
"Just look at her bracelets," I said, "her earrings and her whole dress. I should not be the least surprised if she were a dancer or a circus rider, but most likely a dancer. Her whole style smacks very much of the theatre."
He evidently did not like the idea.
"She is much too young, I am sure; why, she is hardly twenty."
"Well," I replied, "there are many things which one can do before one is twenty; dancing and elocution are among them."
"Take your seats for Nice, Vintimiglia," the guards and porters called.
We got in; our fellow passenger was eating an orange, and certainly she did not do it elegantly. She had spread her pocket-handkerchief on her knees, and the way in which she tore off the peel and opened her mouth to put in the pieces, and then spat the pips out of the window, showed that her training had been decidedly vulgar.
She seemed, also, more put out than ever, and swallowed the fruit with an exceedingly comic air of rage.
Paul devoured her with his eyes, and tried to attract her attention and excite her curiosity; but in spite of his talk, and of the manner in which he brought in well-known names, she did not pay the least attention to him.
After passing Frejus and St. Raphael, the train passed through a veritable garden, a paradise of roses, and groves of oranges and lemons covered with fruits and flowers at the same time. That delightful coast from Marseilles to Genoa is a kingdom of perfumes in a home of flowers.
June is the time to see it in all its beauty, when in every narrow valley and on every slope, the most exquisite flowers are growing luxuriantly. And the roses! fields, hedges, groves of roses. They climb up the walls, blossom on the roofs, hang from the trees, peep out from among the bushes; they are white, red, yellow, large and small, single, with a simple self-colored dress, or full and heavy in brilliant toilettes.
Their breath makes the air heavy and relaxing, and the still more penetrating odor of the orange blossoms sweetens the atmosphere till it might almost be called the refinement of odor.
The shore, with its brown rocks, was bathed by the motionless Mediterranean. The hot summer sun stretched like a fiery cloth over the mountains, over the long expanses of sand, and over the motionless, apparently solid blue sea. The train went on through the tunnels, along the slopes, above the water, on straight, wall-like viaducts, and a soft, vague, saltish smell, a smell of drying seaweed, mingled at times with the strong, heavy perfume of the flowers.
But Paul neither saw, looked at, nor smelled anything, for our fellow traveller engrossed all his attention.
When we reached Cannes, as he wished to speak to me he signed to me to get out, and as soon as I did so, he took me by the arm.
"Do you know, she is really charming. Just look at her eyes; and I never saw anything like her hair."
"Don't excite yourself," I replied, "or else address her, if you have any intentions that way. She does not look unapproachable; I fancy, although she appear to be a little bit grumpy."
"Why don't you speak to her?" he said.
"I don't know what to say, for I am always terribly stupid at first; I can never make advances to a woman in the street. I follow them, go round and round them, and quite close to them, but never know what to say at first. I only once tried to enter into conversation with a woman in that way. As I clearly saw that she was waiting for me to make overtures, and as I felt bound to say something, I stammered out, 'I hope you are quite well, madame?' She laughed in my face, and I made my escape."
I promised Paul to do all I could to bring about a conversation, and when we had taken our places again, I politely asked our neighbor:
"Have you any objection to the smell of tobacco, madame?"
She merely replied, "Non capisco."
So she was an Italian! I felt an absurd inclination to laugh. As Paul did not understand a word of that language, I was obliged to act as his interpreter, so I said in Italian:
"I asked you, madame, whether you had any objection to tobacco smoke?"
With an angry look she replied, "Che mi fa!"
She had neither turned her head nor looked at me, and I really did not know whether to take this "What do I care" for an authorization, a refusal, a real sign of indifference, or for a mere "Let me alone."
"Madame," I replied, "if you mind the smell of tobacco in the least--"
She again said, "Mica," in a tone which seemed to mean, "I wish to goodness you would leave me alone!" It was, however, a kind of permission, so I said to Paul:
"You may smoke."
He looked at me in that curious sort of way that people have when they try to understand others who are talking in a strange language before them, and asked me:
"What did you say to her?"
"I asked whether we might smoke, and she said we might do whatever we liked."
Whereupon I lighted my cigar.
"Did she say anything more?"
"If you had counted her words you would have noticed that she used exactly six, two of which gave me to understand that she knew no French, so four remained, and much can be said in four words."
Paul seemed quite unhappy, disappointed, and at sea, so to speak.
But suddenly the Italian asked me, in that tone of discontent which seemed habitual to her, "Do you know at what time we shall get to Genoa?"
"At eleven o'clock," I replied. Then after a moment I went on:
"My friend and I are also going to Genoa, and if we can be of any service to you, we shall be very happy, as you are quite alone." But she interrupted with such a "Mica!" that I did not venture on another word.
"What did she say?" Paul asked.
"She said she thought you were charming."
But he was in no humor for joking, and begged me dryly not to make fun of him; so I translated her question and my polite offer, which had been so rudely rejected.
Then he really became as restless as a caged squirrel.
"If we only knew," he said, "what hotel she was going to, we would go to the same. Try to find out so as to have another opportunity to make her talk."
It was not particularly easy, and I did not know what pretext to invent, desirous as I was to make the acquaintance of this unapproachable person.
We passed Nice, Monaco, Mentone, and the train stopped at the frontier for the examination of luggage.
Although I hate those ill-bred people who breakfast and dine in railway- carriages, I went and bought a quantity of good things to make one last attack on her by their means. I felt sure that this girl must, ordinarily, be by no means inaccessible. Something had put her out and made her irritable, but very little would suffice, a mere word or some agreeable offer, to decide her and vanquish her.
We started again, and we three were still alone. I spread my eatables on the seat. I cut up the fowl, put the slices of ham neatly on a piece of paper, and then carefully laid out our dessert, strawberries, plums, cherries and cakes, close to the girl.
When she saw that we were about to eat she took a piece of chocolate and two little crisp cakes out of her pocket and began to munch them.
"Ask her to have some of ours," Paul said in a whisper.
"That is exactly what I wish to do, but it is rather a difficult matter."
As she, however, glanced from time to time at our provisions, I felt sure that she would still be hungry when she had finished what she had with her; so, as soon as her frugal meal was over, I said to her:
"It would be very kind of you if you would take some of this fruit."
Again she said "Mica!" but less crossly than before.
"Well, then," I said, "may I offer you a little wine? I see you have not drunk anything. It is Italian wine, and as we are now in your own country, we should be very pleased to see such a pretty Italian mouth accept the offer of its French neighbors."
She shook her head slightly, evidently wishing to refuse, but very desirous of accepting, and her mica this time was almost polite. I took the flask, which was covered with straw in the Italian fashion, and filling the glass, I offered it to her.
"Please drink it," I said, "to bid us welcome to your country."
She took the glass with her usual look, and emptied it at a draught, like a woman consumed with thirst, and then gave it back to me without even saying "Thank you."
I then offered her the cherries. "Please take some," I said; "we shall be so glad if you will."
Out of her corner she looked at all the fruit spread out beside her, and said so rapidly that I could scarcely follow her: "A me non piacciono ne le ciriegie ne le susine; amo soltano le fragole."
"What does she say?" Paul asked.
"That she does riot care for cherries or plums, but only for strawberries."
I put a newspaper full of wild strawberries on her lap, and she ate them quickly, tossing them into her mouth from some distance in a coquettish and charming manner.
When she had finished the little red heap, which soon disappeared under the rapid action of her hands, I asked her:
"What may I offer you now?"
"I will take a little chicken," she replied.
She certainly devoured half of it, tearing it to pieces with the rapid movements of her jaws like some carnivorous animal. Then she made up her mind to have some cherries, which she "did not like," and then some plums, then some little cakes. Then she said, "I have had enough," and sat back in her corner.
I was much amused, and tried to make her eat more, insisting, in fact, till she suddenly flew into a rage, and flung such a furious mica at me, that I would no longer run the risk of spoiling her digestion.
I turned to my friend. "My poor Paul," I said, "I am afraid we have had our trouble for nothing."
The night came on, one of those hot summer nights which extend their warm shade over the burning and exhausted earth. Here and there, in the distance, by the sea, on capes and promontories, bright stars, which I was, at times, almost inclined to confound with lighthouses, began to shine on the dark horizon:
The scent of the orange trees became more penetrating, and we breathed with delight, distending our lungs to inhale it more deeply. The balmy air was soft, delicious, almost divine.
Suddenly I noticed something like a shower of stars under the dense shade of the trees along the line, where it was quite dark. It might have been taken for drops of light, leaping, flying, playing and running among the leaves, or for small stars fallen from the skies in order to have an excursion on the earth; but they were only fireflies dancing a strange fiery ballet in the perfumed air.
One of them happened to come into our carriage, and shed its intermittent light, which seemed to be extinguished one moment and to be burning the next. I covered the carriage-lamp with its blue shade and watched the strange fly careering about in its fiery flight. Suddenly it settled on the dark hair of our neighbor, who was half dozing after dinner. Paul seemed delighted, with his eyes fixed on the bright, sparkling spot, which looked like a living jewel on the forehead of the sleeping woman.
The Italian woke up about eleven o'clock, with the bright insect still in her hair. When I saw her move, I said: "We are just getting to Genoa, madame," and she murmured, without answering me, as if possessed by some obstinate and embarrassing thought:
"What am I going to do, I wonder?"
And then she suddenly asked:
"Would you like me to come with you?"
I was so taken aback that I really did not understand her.
"With us? How do you mean?"
She repeated, looking more and more furious:
"Would you like me to be your guide now, as soon as we get out of the train?"
"I am quite willing; but where do you want to go.
She shrugged her shoulders with an air of supreme indifference.
"Wherever you like; what does it matter to me?" She repeated her "Che mi fa" twice.
"But we are going to the hotel."
"Very well, let us all go to the hotel," she said, in a contemptuous voice.
I turned to Paul, and said:
"She wishes to know whether we should like her to come with us."
My friend's utter surprise restored my self-possession. He stammered:
"With us? Where to? What for? How?"
"I don't know, but she made this strange proposal to me in a most irritated voice. I told her that we were going to the hotel, and she said: 'Very well, let us all go there!' I suppose she is without a penny. She certainly has a very strange way of making acquaintances."
Paul, who 'was very much excited, exclaimed:
"I am quite agreeable. Tell her that we will go wherever she likes." Then, after a moment's hesitation, he said uneasily:
"We must know, however, with whom she wishes to go--with you or with me?"
I turned to the Italian, who did not even seem to be listening to us, and said:
"We shall be very happy to have you with us, but my friend wishes to know whether you will take my arm or his?"
She opened her black eyes wide with vague surprise, and said, "Che ni fa?"
I was obliged to explain myself. "In Italy, I believe, when a man looks after a woman, fulfils all her wishes, and satisfies all her caprices, he is called a patito. Which of us two will you take for your patito?"
Without the slightest hesitation she replied:
"You!"
I turned to Paul. "You see, my friend, she chooses me; you have no chance."
"All the better for you," he replied in a rage. Then, after thinking for a few moments, he went on:
"Do you really care about taking this creature with you? She will spoil our journey. What are we to do with this woman, who looks like I don't know what? They will not take us in at any decent hotel."
I, however, just began to find the Italian much nicer than I had thought her at first, and I was now very desirous to take her with us. The idea delighted me.
I replied, "My dear fellow, we have accepted, and it is too late to recede. You were the first to advise me to say 'Yes.'"
"It is very stupid," he growled, "but do as you please."
The train whistled, slackened speed, and we ran into the station.
I got out of the carriage, and offered my new companion my hand. She jumped out lightly, and I gave her my arm, which she took with an air of seeming repugnance. As soon as we had claimed our luggage we set off into the town, Paul walking in utter silence.
"To what hotel shall we go?" I asked him. "It may be difficult to get into the City of Paris with a woman, especially with this Italian."
Paul interrupted me. "Yes, with an Italian who looks more like a dancer than a duchess. However, that is no business of mine. Do just as you please."
I was in a state of perplexity. I had written to the City of Paris to retain our rooms, and now I did not know what to do.
Two commissionaires followed us with our luggage. I continued: "You might as well go on first, and say that we are coming; and give the landlord to understand that I have a--a friend with me and that we should like rooms quite by themselves for us three, so as not to be brought in contact with other travellers. He will understand, and we will decide according to his answer."
But Paul growled, "Thank you, such commissions and such parts do not suit me, by any means. I did not come here to select your apartments or to minister to your pleasures."
But I was urgent: "Look here, don't be angry. It is surely far better to go to a good hotel than to a bad one, and it is not difficult to ask the landlord for three separate bedrooms and a dining-room."
I put a stress on three, and that decided him.
He went on first, and I saw him go into a large hotel while I remained on the other side of the street, with my fair Italian, who did not say a word, and followed the porters with the luggage.
Paul came back at last, looking as dissatisfied as my companion.
"That is settled," he said, "and they will take us in; but here are only two bedrooms. You must settle it as you can."
I followed him, rather ashamed of going in with such a strange companion.
There were two bedrooms separated by a small sitting-room. I ordered a cold supper, and then I turned to the Italian with a perplexed look.
"We have only been able to get two rooms, so you must choose which you like."
She replied with her eternal "Che mi fa!" I thereupon took up her little black wooden trunk, such as servants use, and took it into the room on the right, which I had chosen for her. A bit of paper was fastened to the box, on which was written, Mademoiselle Francesca Rondoli, Genoa.
"Your name is Francesca?" I asked, and she nodded her head, without replying.
"We shall have supper directly," I continued. "Meanwhile, I dare say you would like to arrange your toilette a little?"
She answered with a 'mica', a word which she employed just as frequently as 'Che me fa', but I went on: "It is always pleasant after a journey."
Then I suddenly remembered that she had not, perhaps, the necessary requisites, for she appeared to me in a very singular position, as if she had just escaped from some disagreeable adventure, and I brought her my dressing-case.
I put out all the little instruments for cleanliness and comfort which it contained: a nail-brush, a new toothbrush--I always carry a selection of them about with me--my nail-scissors, a nail-file, and sponges. I uncorked a bottle of eau de cologne, one of lavender-water, and a little bottle of new-mown hay, so that she might have a choice. Then I opened my powder-box, and put out the powder-puff, placed my fine towels over the water-jug, and a piece of new soap near the basin.
She watched my movements with a look of annoyance in her wide-open eyes, without appearing either astonished or pleased at my forethought.
"Here is all that you require," I then said; "I will tell you when supper is ready."
When I returned to the sitting-room I found that Paul had shut himself in the other room, so I sat down to wait.
A waiter went to and fro, bringing plates and glasses. He laid the table slowly, then put a cold chicken on it, and told me that all was ready.
I knocked gently at Mademoiselle Rondoli's door. "Come in," she said, and when I did so I was struck by a strong, heavy smell of perfumes, as if I were in a hairdresser's shop.
The Italian was sitting on her trunk in an attitude either of thoughtful discontent or absent-mindedness. The towel was still folded over the waterjug that was full of water, and the soap, untouched and dry, was lying beside the empty basin; but one would have thought that the young woman had used half the contents of the bottles of perfume. The eau de cologne, however, had been spared, as only about a third of it had gone; but to make up for that she had used a surprising amount of lavender- water and new-mown hay. A cloud of violet powder, a vague white mist, seemed still to be floating in the air, from the effects of her over- powdering her face and neck. It seemed to cover her eyelashes, eyebrows, and the hair on her temples like snow, while her cheeks were plastered with it, and layers of it covered her nostrils, the corners of her eyes, and her chin.
When she got up she exhaled such a strong odor of perfume that it almost made me feel faint.
When we sat down to supper, I found that Paul was in a most execrable temper, and I could get nothing out of him but blame, irritable words, and disagreeable remarks.
Mademoiselle Francesca ate like an ogre, and as soon as she had finished her meal she threw herself upon the sofa in the sitting-room. Sitting down beside her, I said gallantly, kissing her hand:
"Shall I have the bed prepared, or will you sleep on the couch?"
"It is all the same to me. 'Che mi fa'!"
Her indifference vexed me.
"Should you like to retire at once?"
"Yes; I am very sleepy."
She got up, yawned, gave her hand to Paul, who took it with a furious look, and I lighted her into the bedroom. A disquieting feeling haunted me. "Here is all you want," I said again.
The next morning she got up early, like a woman who is accustomed to work. She woke me by doing so, and I watched her through my half-closed eyelids.
She came and went without hurrying herself, as if she were astonished at having nothing to do. At length she went to the dressing-table, and in a moment emptied all my bottles of perfume. She certainly also used some water, but very little.
When she was quite dressed, she sat down on her trunk again, and clasping one knee between her hands, she seemed to be thinking.
At that moment I pretended to first notice her, and said:
"Good-morning, Francesca."
Without seeming in at all a better temper than the previous night, she murmured, "Good-morning!"
When I asked her whether she had slept well, she nodded her head, and jumping out of bed, I went and kissed her.
She turned her face toward me like a child who is being kissed against its will; but I took her tenderly in my arms, and gently pressed my lips on her eyelids, which she closed with evident distaste under my kisses on her fresh cheek and full lips, which she turned away.
"You don't seem to like being kissed," I said to her.
"Mica!" was her only answer.
I sat down on the trunk by her side, and passing my arm through hers, I said: "Mica! mica! mica! in reply to everything. I shall call you Mademoiselle Mica, I think."
For the first time I fancied that I saw the shadow of a smile on her lips, but it passed by so quickly that I may have been mistaken.
"But if you never say anything but Mica, I shall not know what to do to please you. Let me see; what shall we do to-day?"
She hesitated a moment, as if some fancy had flitted through her head, and then she said carelessly: "It is all the same to me; whatever you like."
"Very well, Mademoiselle Mica, we will have a carriage and go for a drive."
"As you please," she said.
Paul was waiting for us in the dining-room, looking as bored as third parties usually do in love affairs. I assumed a delighted air, and shook hands with him with triumphant energy.
"What are you thinking of doing?" he asked.
"First of all, we will go and see a little of the town, and then we might get a carriage and take a drive in the neighborhood."
We breakfasted almost in silence, and then set out. I dragged Francesca from palace to palace, and she either looked at nothing or merely glanced carelessly at the various masterpieces. Paul followed us, growling all sorts of disagreeable things. Then we all three took a drive in silence into the country and returned to dinner.
The next day it was the same thing and the next day again; and on the third Paul said to me: "Look here, I am going to leave you; I am not going to stop here for three weeks watching you make love to this creature."
I was perplexed and annoyed, for to my great surprise I had become singularly attached to Francesca. A man is but weak and foolish, carried away by the merest trifle, and a coward every time that his senses are excited or mastered. I clung to this unknown girl, silent and dissatisfied as she always was. I liked her somewhat ill-tempered face, the dissatisfied droop of her mouth, the weariness of her look; I liked her fatigued movements, the contemptuous way in which she let me kiss her, the very indifference of her caresses. A secret bond, that mysterious bond of physical love, which does not satisfy, bound me to her. I told Paul so, quite frankly. He treated me as if I were a fool, and then said:
"Very well, take her with you."
But she obstinately refused to leave Genoa, without giving any reason. I besought, I reasoned, I promised, but all was of no avail, and so I stayed on.
Paul declared that he would go by himself, and went so far as to pack up his portmanteau; but he remained all the same.
Thus a fortnight passed. Francesca was always silent and irritable, lived beside me rather than with me, responded to all my requirements and all my propositions with her perpetual Che mi fa, or with her no less perpetual Mica.
My friend became more and more furious, but my only answer was, "You can go if you are tired of staying. I am not detaining you."
Then he called me names, overwhelmed me with reproaches, and exclaimed: "Where do you think I can go now? We had three weeks at our disposal, and here is a fortnight gone! I cannot continue my journey now; and, in any case, I am not going to Venice, Florence and Rome all by myself. But you will pay for it, and more dearly than you think, most likely. You are not going to bring a man all the way from Paris in order to shut him up at a hotel in Genoa with an Italian adventuress."
When I told him, very calmly, to return to Paris, he exclaimed that he intended to do so the very next day; but the next day he was still there, still in a rage and swearing.
By this time we began to be known in the streets through which we wandered from morning till night. Sometimes French people would turn round astonished at meeting their fellow-countrymen in the company of this girl with her striking costume, who looked singularly out of place, not to say compromising, beside us.
She used to walk along, leaning on my arm, without looking at anything. Why did she remain with me, with us, who seemed to do so little to amuse her? Who was she? Where did she come from? What was she doing? Had she any plan or idea? Where did she live? As an adventuress, or by chance meetings? I tried in vain to find out and to explain it. The better I knew her the more enigmatical she became. She seemed to be a girl of poor family who had been taken away, and then cast aside and lost. What did she think would become of her, or whom was she waiting for? She certainly did not appear to be trying to make a conquest of me, or to make any real profit out of me.
I tried to question her, to speak to her of her childhood and family; but she never gave me an answer. I stayed with her, my heart unfettered and my senses enchained, never wearied of holding her in my arms, that proud and quarrelsome woman, captivated by my senses, or rather carried away, overcome by a youthful, healthy, powerful charm, which emanated from her fragrant person and from the well-molded lines of her body.
Another week passed, and the term of my journey was drawing on, for I had to be back in Paris by the eleventh of July. By this time Paul had come to take his part in the adventure, though still grumbling at me, while I invented pleasures, distractions and excursions to amuse Francesca and my friend; and in order to do this I gave myself a great amount of trouble.
One day I proposed an excursion to Sta Margarita, that charming little town in the midst of gardens, hidden at the foot of a slope which stretches far into the sea up to the village of Portofino. We three walked along the excellent road which goes along the foot of the mountain. Suddenly Francesca said to me: "I shall not be able to go with you to-morrow; I must go and see some of my relatives."
That was all; I did not ask her any questions, as I was quite sure she would not answer me.
The next morning she got up very early. When she spoke to me it was in a constrained and hesitating voice:
"If I do not come back again, shall you come and fetch me?"
"Most certainly I shall," was my reply. "Where shall I go to find you?"
Then she explained: "You must go into the Street Victor-Emmanuel, down the Falcone road and the side street San-Rafael and into the furniture shop in the building at the right at the end of a court, and there you must ask for Madame Rondoli. That is the place."
And so she went away, leaving me rather astonished.
When Paul saw that I was alone, he stammered out: "Where; is Francesca?" And when I told him what had happened, he exclaimed:
"My dear fellow, let us make use of our opportunity, and bolt; as it is, our time is up. Two days, more or less, make no difference. Let us go at once; go and pack up your things. Off we go!"
But I refused. I could not, as I told him, leave the girl in that manner after such companionship for nearly three weeks. At any rate, I ought to say good-by to her, and make her accept a present; I certainly had no intention of behaving badly to her.
But he would not listen; he pressed and worried me, but I would not give way.
I remained indoors for several hours, expecting Francesca's return, but she did not come, and at last, at dinner, Paul said with a triumphant air:
"She has flown, my dear fellow; it is certainly very strange."
I must acknowledge that I was surprised and rather vexed. He laughed in my face, and made fun of me.
"It is not exactly a bad way of getting rid of you, though rather primitive. 'Just wait for me, I shall be back in a moment,' they often say. How long are you going to wait? I should not wonder if you were foolish enough to go and look for her at the address she gave you. 'Does Madame Rondoli live here, please?' 'No, monsieur.' I'll bet that you are longing to go there."
"Not in the least," I protested, "and I assure you that if she does not come back to-morrow morning I shall leave by the express at eight o'clock. I shall have waited twenty-four hours, and that is enough; my conscience will be quite clear."
I spent an uneasy and unpleasant evening, for I really had at heart a very tender feeling for her. I went to bed at twelve o'clock, and hardly slept at all. I got up at six, called Paul, packed up my things, and two hours later we set out for France together.
III
The next year, at just about the same period, I was seized as one is with a periodical fever, with a new desire to go to Italy, and I immediately made up my mind to carry it into effect. There is no doubt that every really well-educated man ought to see Florence, Venice and Rome. This travel has, also, the additional advantage of providing many subjects of conversation in society, and of giving one an opportunity for bringing forward artistic generalities which appear profound.
This time I went alone, and I arrived at Genoa at the same time as the year before, but without any adventure on the road. I went to the same hotel, and actually happened to have the same room.
I was hardly in bed when the recollection of Francesca which, since the evening before, had been floating vaguely through my mind, haunted me with strange persistency. I thought of her nearly the whole night, and by degrees the wish to see her again seized me, a confused desire at first, which gradually grew stronger and more intense. At last I made up my mind to spend the next day in Genoa to try to find her, and if I should not succeed, to take the evening train.
Early in the morning I set out on my search. I remembered the directions she had given me when she left me, perfectly--Victor-Emmanuel Street, house of the furniture-dealer, at the bottom of the yard on the right.
I found it without the least difficulty, and I knocked at the door of a somewhat dilapidated-looking dwelling. It was opened by a stout woman, who must have been very handsome, but who actually was only very dirty. Although she had too much embonpoint, she still bore the lines of majestic beauty; her untidy hair fell over her forehead and shoulders, and one fancied one could see her floating about in an enormous dressing- gown covered with spots of dirt and grease. Round her neck she wore a great gilt necklace, and on her wrists were splendid bracelets of Genoa filigree work.
In rather a hostile manner she asked me what I wanted, and I replied by requesting her to tell me whether Francesca Rondoli lived there.
"What do you want with her?" she asked.
"I had the pleasure of meeting her last year, and I should like to see her again."
The old woman looked at me suspiciously.
"Where did you meet her?" she asked.
"Why, here in Genoa itself."
"What is your name?"
I hesitated a moment, and then I told her. I had hardly done so when the Italian put out her arms as if to embrace me. "Oh! you are the Frenchman how glad I am to see you! But what grief you caused the poor child! She waited for you a month; yes, a whole month. At first she thought you would come to fetch her. She wanted to see whether you loved her. If you only knew how she cried when she saw that you were not coming! She cried till she seemed to have no tears left. Then she went to the hotel, but you had gone. She thought that most likely you were travelling in Italy, and that you would return by Genoa to fetch her, as she would not go with you. And she waited more than a month, monsieur; and she was so unhappy; so unhappy. I am her mother."
I really felt a little disconcerted, but I regained my self-possession, and asked:
"Where is she now?"
"She has gone to Paris with a painter, a delightful man, who loves her very much, and who gives her everything that she wants. Just look at what she sent me; they are very pretty, are they not?"
And she showed me, with quite southern animation, her heavy bracelets and necklace. "I have also," she continued, "earrings with stones in them, a silk dress, and some rings; but I only wear them on grand occasions. Oh! she is very happy, monsieur, very happy. She will be so pleased when I tell her you have been here. But pray come in and sit down. You will take something or other, surely?"
But I refused, as I now wished to get away by the first train; but she took me by the arm and pulled me in, saying:
"Please, come in; I must tell her that you have been in here."
I found myself in a small, rather dark room, furnished with only a table and a few chairs.
She continued: "Oh, she is very happy now, very happy. When you met her in the train she was very miserable; she had had an unfortunate love affair in Marseilles, and she was coming home, poor child. But she liked you at once, though she was still rather sad, you understand. Now she has all she wants, and she writes and tells me everything that she does. His name is Bellemin, and they say he is a great painter in your country. He fell in love with her at first sight. But you will take a glass of sirup?-it is very good. Are you quite alone, this year?"
"Yes," I said, "quite alone."
I felt an increasing inclination to laugh, as my first disappointment was dispelled by what Mother Rondoli said. I was obliged; however, to drink a glass of her sirup.
"So you are quite alone?" she continued. "How sorry I am that Francesca is not here now; she would have been company for you all the time you stayed. It is not very amusing to go about all by oneself, and she will be very sorry also."
Then, as I was getting up to go, she exclaimed:
"But would you not like Carlotta to go with you? She knows all the walks very well. She is my second daughter, monsieur."
No doubt she took my look of surprise for consent, for she opened the inner door and called out up the dark stairs which I could not see:
"Carlotta! Carlotta! make haste down, my dear child."
I tried to protest, but she would not listen.
"No; she will be very glad to go with you; she is very nice, and much more cheerful than her sister, and she is a good girl, a very good girl, whom I love very much."
In a few moments a tall, slender, dark girl appeared, her hair hanging down, and her youthful figure showing unmistakably beneath an old dress of her mother's.
The latter at once told her how matters stood.
"This is Francesca's Frenchman, you know, the one whom she knew last year. He is quite alone, and has come to look for her, poor fellow; so I told him that you would go with him to keep him company."
The girl looked at me with her handsome dark eyes, and said, smiling:
"I have no objection, if he wishes it"
I could not possibly refuse, and merely said:
"Of course, I shall be very glad of your company."
Her mother pushed her out. "Go and get dressed directly; put on your blue dress and your hat with the flowers, and make haste."
As soon as she had left the room the old woman explained herself: "I have two others, but they are much younger. It costs a lot of money to bring up four children. Luckily the eldest is off my hands at present."
Then she told all about herself, about her husband, who had been an employee on the railway, but who was dead, and she expatiated on the good qualities of Carlotta, her second girl, who soon returned, dressed, as her sister had been, in a striking, peculiar manner.
Her mother examined her from head to foot, and, after finding everything right, she said:
"Now, my children, you can go." Then turning to the girl, she said: "Be sure you are back by ten o'clock to-night; you know the door is locked then." The answer was:
"All right, mamma; don't alarm yourself."
She took my arm and we went wandering about the streets, just as I had wandered the previous year with her sister.
We returned to the hotel for lunch, and then I took my new friend to Santa Margarita, just as I had taken her sister the year previously.
During the whole fortnight which I had at my disposal, I took Carlotta to all the places of interest in and about Genoa. She gave me no cause to regret her sister.
She cried when I left her, and the morning of my departure I gave her four bracelets for her mother, besides a substantial token of my affection for herself.
One of these days I intend to return to Italy, and I cannot help remembering with a certain amount of uneasiness, mingled with hope, that Madame Rondoli has two more daughters. |
Blog Feed: Come check out our week-to-week martial arts and Taekwondo training sessions. The blog highlights techniques and drills..
Taekwondo Won-Hyo Scoop Block
Published on 2012-09-30 07:15:00,' [..]
Getting the Most from Traditional Taekwondo Techniques Blog
Published on 2012-09-27 23:10:00
I never thought I needed to play tour guide on this blog. But hey, we've got more than 450 posts here! Of course many were written and fired from the hip - but that's what you get from going non-commercial (and beside the point)!!! I joke, of course.However, if you want more from this blog, we'll need your participation and most importantly, feedback. For instance, look through the image below. 1 post for Choong-moo and 5 for Choong-gun. Now, who's fault is that? (A. Yours) If you want me to kee [..]
Simultaneous Attacks
Published on 2012-09-26 00:24:00
The one steps I talked about in Had Enough of that Traditional One Step Nonsense typically refers to counters or go no sen type tactics. Meaning you see an opponent's move, you block/cover/parry and return the strike. That's how many of the one steps I learned early on were taught; they were a way to introduce basic techniques and to build skills to help distancing and timing.I wanted to take the opportunity to discuss simultaneous attacks or sen no sen tactics. What I mean by this is you see th [..]
Perspective on Punching with Vertical Fist v Horizontal Fist
Published on 2012-09-23 21:19:00
This is a rehash of an old post on here titled
Had Enough of That Traditional One Step Nonsense
Published on 2012-09-19 21:08:00
... so said the MMA Warrior to all who cared.Last.Photo One: Colin wearing standard battle orderWhat we wanted to do with this exercise was discus [..]
Colin's Taekwondo v Taekwondo's Colin
Published on 2012-08-08 10:35:00
I had an enjoyable
Browned Out
Published on 2012-07-30 00:54:00
We were working on an arm throw last Sunday inspired by Chulgi hyung.The br [..]
Locks and Throws Workshop July 2012
Published on 2012-07-17 01:34:00
Over the weekend we had the Locks and Throws Workshop as part of our continuing series to welcome
Women Self Defence - Developing a World Class Offering
Published on 2012-07-13 20:14:00
I started researching material for women self defence classes from 1991 as part of my black belt program whilst training in the US. The following year I was invited by a friend in Asia to provide a 2 day training course through Association for Women for Action and Research. The course I delivered however only started on its quantum leap when I embarked on a rigorous commercialisation process from 2001 onwards. Below I will present some of my insights on how I developed a world class offering whi [..]
Axe Kick - A Risky Taekwondo Sparring Technique
Published on 2012-06-26 20:17:00
I don't like the use of the axe kick in sportive Taekwondo sparring.Videos referenced from Taekwondo AnimalsT [..]
Choi: The Beginning
Published on 2012-06-19 23:43:00
I read Yoshikawa's Musashi a number of years ago, and have pondered the ever-shrinking lines of distinction between the real 16th Century polymath Miyamoto Musashi and Yoshikawa's fictionalised account of the sword saint.One of my favourite martial arts books, Musashi is an important novel in the present-day cult worship of the 16th Century swordsmanMusashi is a long epic, detailing the journey of the Miyamoto Musashi beginning just after the Battle of Sekigahara, the insight he gained leading t [..]
Choong-gun: Double Punch
Published on 2012-06-03 09:49:00
Yama Tsuki - Twin Fist Punch ... would you really ever do something like this?A status update on FaceBook just recently had me writing that someone should put the above technique interpretation out of its misery. If ever there was an advantage for throwing multiple strikes at the same time, we'd be punching with both hands and throwing in a kick for good measure.No, I don't like the idea of throwing two simultaneous strikes, unless somehow it was sandwiching something of the opponent between you [..]
A Story about Saving a Little Girl
Published on 2012-05-31 00:58:00
Maritime Museum at Fremantle Black Belt Obstacle CourseThis is a story about how I saved a little girl.I refrain from using the word 'heroically' in the title just because there was no time to think about heroics, nor about ability, nor about the consequences of failure. As I often think about my role as an instructor, I was but the 'lens'.A beautiful sunny day in Fremantle several years ago found my children and several friends at the Maritime Museum. It's got amazing architecture and beautiful [..]
Blogging Carnival at Bunkai Jutsu
Published on 2012-05-28 22:02:00
Following the recent Anti-Bully Blogging Carnival hosted here, I am pleased to announce that Charlie Wildish from Bunkai Jutsu is hosting the next carnival on Women's Self Defence on July 14th 2012. The blogging carnival is a way to get martial art bloggers to work together on specific themes, and for such themes to bring value to both the martial arts world and the local community. If you have a martial art blog, a website, or even a similarly themed FaceBook page, and if you'd like to get invo [..]
Knife Defence by Hanshi Tim White
Published on 2012-05-23 02:16:00
Check & Stun Knife Defence Program by Hanshi Tim WhiteSeveral years ago I had the honour of training in Hanshi Tim White's Check & Stun Knife Defense Program that he designed and uses for the police defence tactics training he offers professionaly. It was immediately clear to me that I should have brought a much larger knife to this session. The tactics he used were hard-hitting, effective and no-nonsense. I was battered and bruised.The moves were simple in order for an untrained defender to ini [..]
Overwhelm the Opponent
Published on 2012-05-20 22:32:00
What a pretty technique. It's effortless. Uke would probably catch some air.Over the weekend I was honoured by an invitation from
Taekwondo Won-hyo: Over-the-shoulder throw
Published on 2012-05-17 22:12:00
This is a revisit of an old post
The Way, the Zone, Stress Testing and the hope for a better person
Published on 2012-05-15 07:11:00
Dojo - The place you practice the WayIn recent weeks, I've come across people who are preparing themselves for academic tests and exams.However they're preparing themselves for their tests, few of them prepare themselves for the stress of the situation.In my previous life as an Assistant National Coach, much of what we do is to prepare the sportsman for the rigors of competition. What we do is a mix of physical ritual and mental visualisation. We do this in the hope to bring the relaxedness foun [..]
Chulgi: Punching Across the Body
Published on 2012-05-11 08:34:00
App 1: Chulgi's 'double punch' applied as a blow to the back or side of the opponent's neckApp 2: Chulgi's 'punch-across-body' applied as a blow to the side of the opponent's neck.When does your arm travel across the body in Taekwondo? Well, below black belt you've got the ol' Tea Cup Saucer position in Won-hyo, the tension press open palm 'block' and double augmented block in Yul-gok, the punch-across-the-body in Joon-gun, and the punch into the fist and the side punches-across-the-body in Hwa- [..]
My Work as Curator of a Taekwondo System
Published on 2012-05-07 21:32:00
World Organizer of Martial Arts (WOMA) Instructor Training Day 28/29 April, Perry Lakes, W. Australia. Author of Traditional Taekwondo Techniques Colin Wee is standing at the far right.It's fast coming to the end of my 20th year in Taekwondo.While I still lead a small Traditional Taekwondo practice, I find myself reaching many more people with this blog and my online network, my FaceBook presence, articles submitted to Stuart Anslow's Totally Taekwondo magazine, the workshop series I started up [..]
Toi-gye: 'W' Mountain Block
Published on 2012-05-03 22:00:00
A page out from my personal journal showing Toi-gye applicationToi-gye Step 12 - 18 is typically represented as 'W' blocks (in Karate that would be yama uke or 'mountain block'), requiring you to perform them with a hard snap of the arm and a big 'stomp' with the foot. There are a few applications that I actually like which bring more combat value to this technique beyond the swinging of the arms and the stomping down hard.Taekwondo 'W' block - as it is performed in the form Toi-gye step 13The s [..]
Taekwondo is the SAME as Karate
Published on 2012-04-30 21:26:00
In an informal discussion over the weekend an ITF guy (of all people) said, "Taekwondo is the same as Karate." It was his unspoken idea that Taekwondo began with instructors that were trained in Shotokan, amongst other things, 'repackaged' Karate and started on a major rebranding exercise.But listen, Karate as practiced in Tokyo in the 1920s was very different to how karate is practiced nowadays. Master Funakoshi, Father of Modern Karate, was highly opposed to jiyu kumite or free sparring, and e [..]
Pragmatic Self Defence Images
Published on 2012-04-27 10:40:00
Yul-gok Step 24Toi-gye Step 20-21Yul-gok Step 31Yul-guk Step 16Choong-gun Step 21-22Dan-gun Step1-2Dan-gun Step 9What I wanted to do was to just search for self defence images on the internet and pair them up to tactics or sequences within Taekwondo patterns - as I teach them. The process isn't difficult - this is what we've been busy doing in Joong Do Kwan Tae Kwon Do over the last dozen years. What I found however were a lot of silly photos - self defence scenarios that show women holding on t [..]
Double Augmented Forearm Blocks
Published on 2012-04-24 04:24:00
There's little on the Morote Chudan Uchi Uke or Taekwondo's Double Augmented Forearm Blocks on the internet. Most of what I've seen - even from sources I usually respect, show ludicrous explanations of this technique. Mostly [..]
Grabbing the Opponent and using him as a Shield
Published on 2012-04-19 23:21:00
In Do-san we apply the open palm block / spearhand, and turn as a neck grab from behind and a choke over the hip. The opponent is lying on your hip, facing upward. Yeah, really contrived, but patience ... I've not got to the punch line yet. In Won-hyo, we use Step 7 'Teacup Saucer' to grab the opponent's neck from the front, and then continue to crank their neck, rotate them around, and perform a sidekick as takedown to the opponent's knee. The 'Teacup Saucer' can be seen in Step 7a and 7b of He [..]
Anti-Bullying Blogging Carnival
Published on 2012-04-14 11:30:00
Anti-Bullying Blogging CarnivalWelcome to the first-ever Anti-Bullying Blogging Carnival hosted by Colin's Traditional Taekwondo Techniques Blog [..]
The 18th Precept of Sensei Gichin Funakoshi by Mireille Clark
Published on 2012-04-13 07:46:00
Sensei Gichin Funakoshi said:18. interpret [..]
There was this bully ...
Published on 2012-04-12 22:02:00
I remember I was in grade 4, and this monster of a boy was in grade 6. Everything about him made him stick out, he was large - at least a head taller than I was, in the 'normal' stream (read 'slow'), always had a grubby uniform, and was always pushing and shoving everyone. Literally, all of us were terrified of him. Him and that permanent scowl he had on his face.I nicked this image off the net, and this guy's a little fatter than I remember 'my'bully, but the look is about there. :-)
Tae Kwon Do Techniques: Tae Kwon Do Forearm Block
Published on 2012-04-12 10:11:00
I decided to go to youtube to see what a search for Taekwondo Techniques would yield. One of the first things that popped up was a video of a
Anyone in Singapore Interested in Workshops or Seminars end April?
Published on 2012-04-10 21:12:00
I'm headed to Singapore end of this month - let me know if you're interested in coordinating a seminar/workshop so I can defray travel expenses. I can cover a wide range of discussions, and can weave in my information with your own curriculum or training objectives. Cheers, Colin--Colin WeeJoong Do Kwan Chung Sah Nim[Traditional Taekwondo Blog | Subscribe | FAQs | Sitemap | FaceBook] And help us rank on Google by clicking the '+1' icon, why don't you? How much do you know of Taekwondo? Come [..]
Making the Taekwondo Upset Punch less Upsetting
Published on 2012-04-07 06:00:00
Why would an upset punch would be called 'upset' and when calling it an uppercut seems so much more natural? Maybe because it's upsetting when someone does something like this in a less than desirable manner bett [..]
You're Invited to Participate in the Anti-Bully Blogging Carnival
Published on 2012-04-05 09:49:00
Martial Art Bloggers and Website Owners are invited to participate in the Anti-Bullying Blogging Carnival scheduled to go live on this blog April 15 2012. More information is at Anti-Bullying Blogging Carnival Proposal.The idea is to get bloggers together to develop and promote anti-bullying articles through our respective blogs and social network pages. Where I know some bloggers draw thousands of views a month, together, I am confident that we can pull ten times that amount in a relatively sho [..]
Historical Lessons Beyond Historical Facts
Published on 2012-04-04 16:30:00
Totally Taekwondo Issue 38I fabricated the truth. Cooked up details. Repurposed Yul-gok's philosophical debate, attributing it to someone else. And then I even used an aged photo of myself for an article I submitted to Stuart Anslow's highly respected Totally Taekwondo. I did!There were many ideas that were floating in my mind when I thought about what I needed to write. But the main issue that kept popping up for me was, and has always been - as it is for even a majority of practitioners, to lo [..]
I fear for my students
Published on 2012-04-03 20:54:00
It started many years ago when I was developing my women self defence program. The realisation hit me all at once - that after a short course I was sending these participants back into the world armed with what? A few techniques, new awareness of the risks they faced, and some words of wisdom.What are you waiting for?It's more intimate for my martial arts program. I see their strengths, but I also see many of their weaknesses. No, I'm not talking about the crap internet warriors spew about taekw [..]
Yul-gok Taekwondo Pattern Step 36 as Take Down
Published on 2012-04-01 09:23:00
This. A really strong lift is important - as is [..]
Choong-gun Mid-reverse Knife Hand Block
Published on 2012-03-30 02:32:00
That's like our Mid-Reverse Knife Hand Block in Choong-gun - just with a little more girthDuring the Smash with Your Foot Workshop Feb 2012, I wanted to show what we would do if and when our leg gets caught by an opponent. The move requires you to drop to the ground and take out the front leg of the person who's 'caught' your leg. After my turn, I then had one of my students kick me so I could talk about what each partner had to do.As the roundhouse kick speeds toward me, I push my cover slightl [..]
Never Let an Analogy Get the Better of You
Published on 2012-03-27 01:47:00
Water is fluid, soft, and yielding.But water will wear away rockwhich is rigid and cannot yield.As a rule, whatever is fluid, soft, and yieldingwill wri [..]
Karate v Taekwondo
Published on 2012-03-20 20:48:00
I practice Traditional Taekwondo. And it looks like Karate.Over in this corner, it's Taekwondotaken from. W [..]
Vaughan Jackson takes Martial Arts to Avoid an Abusive Parent
Published on 2012-03-19 00:52:00
Vaughan is a recent internet martial arts acquaintance of mine, referred by Charlie from Bunkai Jutsu because of my interest in starting up an anti-bullying carnival amongst martial arts bloggers. Vaughan tells me of his early experiences and how that has pushed him into martial arts - to become a stonger person and to become a positive role model. Very admirable traits. Please help me welcome Vaughan to Joong Do Kwan.Starting on the Path by Vaughan Jackson, Jujutsu, ShodanWhat would it take for [..]
Taekwondo Spear Hand
Published on 2012-03-12 20:30:00
Do-san Step 6 is an open palm block and spearhand - which we talked about previously vis a vis opponent height. I'd like to take a step back and talk about the weapon itself.Just the other day I was showing a bunch of 7th kyu students how to form the hand. In order to demonstrate exactly what I could do with it, I proceeded to use the spearhand to strike their chest region. They were shoved backwards, some grunting was in evidence, and they started covering and guarding against further strikes. [..]
Martial Arts Parables
Published on 2012-03-12 06:04:00
Story-telling is a powerful skill and has been used by many cultures to share knowledge and culture with both young and old. Stories allow us to reflect on difficult issues, help us draw our own conclusions, and give us a sense of comfort knowing that others before us have used those same stories.The Tea Master and The Ronin Some advantages of including the use of the parable in martial arts training:The parable allows us to transmit k [..]
1967 Choi Hong Hi meets up with Mas Oyama
Published on 2012-03-07 23:20:00
In 1967 Choi Hong Hi meets up with fellow Korean and Karate Master Mas Oyama. By this time, Master Oyama had already opened his own Karate dojo in Tokyo and was already working on expansion plans for what is now known as one of the toughest karate systems ever. The story from what I have read online is that Choi had requested for Master Oyama to return to Korea to help his fellow Koreans, and to invite him to support Taekwondo's establishment as a new martial art. Master Oyama declined politely, [..]
Biting the Hand that Feeds You
Published on 2012-03-06 19:51:00
If you've got a dog you might know how unpleasant it is. You are offering some food and snap - it all happened so quick - you get a nip on your fingers. Of course the mutt didn't 'mean it.' It's just your fingers got in the way and I suppose teeth can be pretty sharp. You nurse your hand for the rest of the day cursing under your breath.As beginners to Taekwondo we are typically challenged with landing strikes - both punches and kicks - on the opponent's body or head. The targets are large, stan [..]
Striking with the Top of Foot and the Ball of Foot
Published on 2012-03-06 07:18:00
The Smash with Your Foot Workshop (I come up with the best names) was a smashing success, and it was fun to host other practitioners at our school. One question that was posed early on was from my Goju Ryu instructor friend - who was very interested that I was kicking my target with the ball of the foot during a short range roundhouse exercise. He might have seen more top of foot strikes if this was any other Taekwondo school.Kicking with the top of the foot applies impact stress perpendicularly [..]
The Striking Post
Published on 2012-02-29 09:37:00
The makiwara is a traditional martial arts striking post which allows you to practice your techniques with good focus, posture and breathing. Beginners to the martial arts might look at an expert practitioner and marvel at calloused knuckles and gape at their powerful strikes. And then some might associate the pain of training with the ultimate prize of attaining the secrets of this lethal 'killing blow'. Do people think that the idea is to disfigure your hand, to create deadened nerve endings, [..]
Smash with Your Foot Workshop Feb 2012
Published on 2012-02-26 22:49:00
Kicks have literally run away with themselves. You've got yourself up against how Hollywood represents kicks, the association of kicks with fitness and flexibility, and then your own poor aching hamstrings and inner thigh muscles.I held a workshop this past weekend to talk core concepts of basic to advance kicks - to look at parameters of movement, basic power generation ideas, tactical pros/cons, and strategic usage of kicks. The idea wasn't to change stylistic approach for the guests participa [..]
First Know Yourself by Mireille Clark
Published on 2012-01-07 17:31:00
The Fourth Precept of Sensei Gichin Funakoshi is "First know yourself before attempting to know others."This may sound like a simple plan, but it is deceptive. Many of us believe that we know "who" we are, but in honesty, we wear so many masks, take on so many different roles, and convince ourselves that we are who we are not. My husband once told me "No one wants to be the bad guy. Everyone wants to wear the white hat." This is so true, and can be seen in the dojo over and over again. We ca [..]
Our Super Power
Published on 2011-11-20 23:10:00
My Super Power - ability to destress through weekly training!There are way too many instructors, schools, and clubs in this industry who brag about how good they are, oftentimes with very little to back them up. How many times have I heard: "Our style is the best." "Our black belt gradings are so tough." "Our syllabus is so complete." "Our instructor is so awesome." Yawn.Several years ago, against this grain, a very accomplished martial artist friend of mine posted that he has even more of a rea [..]
Allowing Rank to Simplify Our World
Published on 2011-10-24 20:46:00
Nice belt, Dude.A beginner feels anxiety going for a grading to win his next rank.A senior student feels like he needs to put the brakes on because he's 'ranking' too fast. A shodan feels unworthy of his rank. A black belt young in the arts feel the weight of expectations to get his next rank. Qualifying instructors compare the 'quality' of their rank against their peers and others in the arts. Teachers suddenly become aware that they're climbing the rank structure and start to look around for p [..]
Taekwondo One Step Sparring
Published on 2011-10-12 01:55:00won [..]
Basic Taekwondo Kick a Misnomer
Published on 2011-10-11 07:23:00 'compresses' the body, generating power because the upper body and the lower body come closer together. The roundhouse kick does the same but rotated 90 degrees.The long range version of these [..]
I see Hwa-rang on the Lawn
Published on 2011-10-08 10:48:00
A couple of senior belts and I met to go over requirements and specifically trained in Hwa-rang on the lawn at College Park today.I n [..]
The JDK Sparring Program
Published on 2011-10-03 01:47:00
One of the few things I wanted to accomplish for the Joong Do Kwan was to introduce a sparring 'program' in which students, especially beginners, would learn sparring skills and would steadily improve in their abilities. Last week, we had a few friends visit our kwan, and we took the opportunity to look at the beginner to intermediate stages of our program.The main problem when it comes to sparring? Sparring should only be part of your entire bag of exercises. Everyone however equates great spar [..]
Taekwondo History
Published on 2011-10-02 22:12:00
GM Choi Hong Hi was requested in 1952 to train the entire army in the martial arts. In 1955, 'Taekwondo' was accepted as the name to unify the kwans in Korea. --Colin WeeChung Sah Nim (Principal), Joong Do Kwan Tae Kwon DoSchool of the Middle Way - the point between old Okinawan predecessors and modern Korean innovations. Started as HRGB April 2000, reborn as JDK Sept 2011.Traditional Taekwondo Techniques, Patterns, and Applications at the Traditional Taekwondo Blog. [Subscribe using email or RS [..]
How to Improve Reaction Time
Published on 2011-09-27 20:59:00
I assume because of the V neck uniform these guys are doing WTF Taekwondo - specialists in kicks (that's why they're not using their hands). The How to Improve Reaction Time video discusses a few solid ideas that can be applied even by traditional practitioners. Improving Taekwondo Reaction TimeI really don't like the use of this term. Many people have a set reaction speed, and no matter how much training will not really significantly improve their ability to react to a specific external stimuli [..]
Toi-gye Jams the Leg and Throws the Opponent
Published on 2011-09-27 00:35:00
Taekwondo Toi-gye Step 29 and 30 - jump into a low X-block in cross stance and then execute a high double augmented forearm block. We do this predominantly as a side drop ala Aikido's Sokomen Uchi. The following video will show you what I mean. Taekwondo practitioners however don't move like Aiki practitioners and thus the tenkan or the turn may not be accessible from our kit bag. What we do have however is this 'jump into X stance' - which means rather than slipping past and turning the opponen [..]
Lower Block Beginner Drill
Published on 2011-06-13 10:01:00
I thought I should use a photo which doesn't look like those pretty kata photos you see in many martial arts books. Here you see me doing a down block on top of my attacker's arm. Of course if I was doing it in the air and keeping still, I might stil
Now on Twitter
Published on 2011-05-21 06:57:00
Looking forward to chatting with everyone at@taekwondo_auColin-- Colin Wee Traditional Taekwondo Techniques, Patterns, and Applications at the Traditional Taekwondo Blog. [Subscribe using email or RSS feeds] [Tkd Sitemap]. Colin is a martial art inst
Ten Ways to Improve Your Front Kick
Published on 2011-05-16 23:09:00
The front kick we learn is introduced in the third Taekwondo pattern Do San.These are my ideas on how to make your front kick more effective:Strike with your hands! Learning to land a strike with your hands teaches principles of timing, distancing, a
Why Yet Another Set of Side Kicks?
Published on 2011-05-10 22:27:00
In Taekwondo Pattern Won-hyo, you have the first introduction of a defensive (stepping backwards) and offensive (stepping forward) side kick.There is the inclusion of the side kick yet again in the following Taekwondo patterns:Yul-guk can be to highl
Traditional Taekwondo Perspective on The Chambered Fist
Published on 2011-05-05 21:21:00
We chamber the fist on the ribs.You find this level at a tug of war - pulling that rope back, you don't hold it above your shoulder or at your hip. You hold it somewhere at your ribs so that your lats can apply as much pull on the rope as possible.Bu
My Perspective on 'Taekwondo Sucks?'
Published on 2011-04-30 00:55:00
I typed in 'Problems with Taekwondo' and the first post I see is 'Taekwondo Sucks?' by an online friend Bob Paterson from Striking Thoughts. His post presents a fairly even debate, so I don't think I've got to rehash the dialog much. What I'd like to
Common Strategy
Published on 2011-04-13 21:24:00
I don't see fight strategy being discussed in books or magazines much. With martial arts, discussions always seem to dwell on the most powerful kick or how good Bruce Lee was. So I decided to highlight long standing fight strategy, and state them in
Taekwondo Pattern Yul-guk Close Quarter Drill
Published on 2011-04-10 22:42:00
This.Th
The Art of the Head On Collision
Published on 2011-04-08 01:54:00
One of my instructors told me once that hard style martial arts were concerned with one thing. And that one thing is in the way your centre of gravity moves in relation to your opponent. The goal he said, was to ensure that your centre of gravity tak
I've Broken My Finger and Have Lost the Will to Fight
Published on 2011-03-15 21:06:00
Ta
Taekwondo Sparring Past and Present Guest Post by Craig Lightner
Published on 2011-03-05 09:00:00
It was nice to meet Craig Lightner and to visit his very respectable website Martial Art Book. I thought to invite him to do a guest post on Traditional Taekwondo Blog as a way to help promote his site. Please help me welcome him to this Blog. Taekwo
Searching out the hidden secrets of Martial Arts by Mireille Clark
Published on 2011-02-17 17:37:00
The Tenth precept of Sensei Gichin Funakoshi states:"10. Put your everyday living into karate (put karate into everything you do) and you will find "myo" (the subtle secrets, the ideal state of existence, exquisite beauty)."How many fervent Martial A
Do-san: Taekwondo's Short Range Front Kick
Published on 2011-02-14 07:39:00
Why would anyone want to throw a short range *kick* when it is so much easier throwing a long range kick keeping the opponent at bay? Well, short range kicks allow you to keep balance, engage the opponent with your hands, deliver deceptively powerful
Taekwondo Back Kick is Risky but Lucrative
Published on 2011-02-10 19:22:00
I hesitate talking about flashy techniques because it's too easy to identify Taekwondo with flash ... and getting older, phrases with flash in them like 'flash in the pan' just doesn't do it for me. Know what I mean?Just lifting up the leg and firing
Grandmaster Slips Up and Smiles
Published on 2011-02-04 06:21:00
I was at a martial arts expo today here in Perth, and was honoured to see Grandmaster William Cheung partake in a demonstration with four of his senior instructors.In a part of the demonstration where he's showing techniques against multiple opponent
Taekwondo Doesn't Have Orange Belts
Published on 2011-01-25 03:57:00
"Taekwondo doesn't have orange belts!"That's what a student of mine got from talking to a friend who is a Taekwondo black belt, and who was adamant that Taekwondo didn't have Orange belts. Instead the kyu or gup range had other colours plus lots of '
What Good is a Taekwondo Kick?
Published on 2011-01-21 02:37:00
What h
Eyes Wide with Shooting Pain Shows Me You Understand
Published on 2010-12-27 02:08:00
I had a fighter come to my school a while back.He shared with me an overview of his experience and his exposure to several fighting arts.I insisted to show him Taekwondo's basic blocks. Chukyo marki, yop marki, hardan marki - Taekwondo's staple techn
Amateur Hour
Published on 2010-12-18 07:58:00
Move aside instructors, it's amateur hour.Call for a front kick. Amateurs think of only the foot and putting as much power into the leg as it strikes the bag.Think about a jab. The amateurs again only focus on their fist and flip it out. Their elbows
Taekwondo Yul-guk: Side Kick and Cover
Published on 2010-12-12 08:57:00
I could talk about the side kick from Won-hyo, but I won't.The side kick from Won-hyo is introduced as either a proactive attack-based kick or a defensive kick.What I wanted to talk about was of a side kick that gets you to attack an opponent and att
Front Kick as Hard as a Side Kick
Published on 2010-12-09 19:54:00
If the front kick were 'leg only,' you'll only be able to hit as hard as the proportionate size of the muscle.A teacher told me once that the side kick is the most difficult, non-gimmicky kick to do correctly. It is also the most powerful. It can be
Martial Arts Effectiveness and Religion
Published on 2010-11-30 19:34:00
I'm talking through my hat when I say there are many instructors who extend their martial art practices to include not only spiritual growth, but religious thinking.Much of good martial arts training focuses on combat effectiveness but also covers an
The first precept of Sensei Gichin Funakoshi by Mireille Clark
Published on 2010-09-26 09:58:00
" Karate begins with courtesy and ends with courtesy."Trash talk is common in many sports. Verbal insults, swear words, and threats are sent towards one's opponents in order to "psych out" or intimidate their opponents. It is done to unnerve, distra
Taekwondo's Fighting Stance
Published on 2010-09-21 21:04:00
We yo
Jumping Side Kick
Published on 2010-09-12 21:45:00
One of the kicking Jumping Side Kick drills I wanted my green and blue belts to practise on Sunday's practise was what my old master would call a 'split' side kick. Essentially a small jump, folding both legs close to the body, and landing both suppo |
Cake geeks
We all know computer geeks. Tom from Poke, our dedicated web designers, introduced me yesterday to some of their bread-and-butter: google analytics. This offers the ultimate pleasure to anyone with a website and loads of time to spare. You can find absolutely anything there: who visited your site, when, where are they there from (in our case, UK, USA and Australia are in the lead), how long they bothered to stay tuned, what browser they used etc. etc. etc.
Talking to Tom it dawned on me that I am also a geek, a cake geek. The amount of time I can spend waffling about cakes is unlimited; I am sure I can rival any IT buff.
And I am not alone. Once a week Sarit, Helen and I meet to do just that. In our regular pastry tastings we spend long hours analysing the minutest and most bizarre and far-fetched elements of a cake, comparing textures and flavours, scrutinizing methods, suggesting alternative components, shapes, moulds, going over recent trends, what’s a must and what’s lost its sparkle, who’s the master of brownies and what makes the ideal cupcake. And we also stuff ourselves with cakes, which is fun and (try to believe me!) an agony.
Hi
we are looking for cupcakes like we had in your Notting Hill shop (the ones with the strayberry icing on top) for our wedding in Sydney. Do you know of anywhere in Sydney that makes cupcakes like these?
Cheers
Tom
Hi Tom,
I have been asking around and couldn't find an answer to your request... sorry (even us cake geeks have our limitations). I am sure, though, that you will be able to find something quite spectacular in Sydney.
Tom,
I would try Yellow in Potts Point. Lorraine Godsmark is a sugar witch. Talk to her.
Corinne
57-59 Macleay Street
Potts Point, 2011
tel: [02] 9357 3400
Thanks Corinne. I will pass on to Tom.
Try Cupcakes Ahoy:.
They delivered an enormous box of different flavours to my brother in law for his birthday. Amazingly friendly people to deal with and delivery by mercedes!
Delicious too and spectacularly decorated (crushed jaffas, shaved chocolate etc).
Hi Yotam,
My daughter baked your Clementine & Almond Syrup Cake (Guardian Christmas supplement) for my birthday after Christmas, as we both looked at the beautiful illustration, and couldn't wait to try it. We were not disappointed - it is absolutely stonkingly fabulous! I shall bake another for my work colleagues later on, when the Christmas goodies there have disappeared. I know they will want the recipe too. We also cooked the Pumpkin Wedges and the soup from that supplement too, and thoroughly enjoyed them. Thank you very much. Jackie.
Thanks Jackie!
Yes, this is one of my favourite cakes of all times.
Happy new year.
Yotam
Hi Yotam
like Jackie above, I have now made the Clementine & Almond Syrup cake on three occasions, and each time it has been a real success.
Do you have any similar type recipes? I have a dinner party coming up where the guests have already had a taste (and thoroughly enjoyed) the C&A cake, and thought I would be cheeky and ask for any direction you may be able to give to an alternative.
I so enjoy making your treats (the fish cakes went down a treat as a Christmas morning nibble with friends before we all went off to our Christmas feasts with families), and am gradually working my way through your book. So look forward to the next edition!
Happy New Year - and many thanks for your inspirations.
Jill
Jill,
Below is a recipe for a cake that I published in Waitrose Food Monthly last year. It is delicious and not dissimilar to the clementine cake. You can easily do without the rose petals.
Good luck with it!
Yotam
Pistachio and rosewater semolina cake
Serves 8
Cake
3 cardamom pods
150g pistachios nuts, shelled, plus a little extra to garnish
100g ground almonds
170g semolina
1¼ tsp baking powder
¼ tsp salt
300g unsalted butter, at room temperature
330g caster sugar
4 medium eggs
Grated zest of 1 lemon
1 tbsp lemon juice
2 tbsp rosewater
½ tsp vanilla essence
Syrup
120ml lemon juice
100ml rosewater
120g caster sugar
Cream
200g Greek yoghurt
200g Crème fraiche
1 tbsp icing sugar
1 tbsp rosewater
Optional garnish
40 pesticide-free red rose petals
1 egg white
150g caster sugar
Start with the cake. Grease a 22cm loose-base cake tin and cover the bottom and sides with greaseproof paper. Heat up the oven to 160C.
Take the cardamom pods, crush lightly and remove the seeds to a food processor bowl. Discard the pods. Add the pistachios to the seeds and grind to a semi-fine powder. Add the ground almonds, semolina, baking powder and salt to the ground pistachios and stir to mix.
Put the butter and sugar in a mixer bowl and use a beater to mix until they combine fully. Do not work much so that you don’t incorporate a lot of air into the mixture. Break the eggs and beat lightly, then add to the creaming butter and sugar in small additions, making sure each is fully incorporated before adding more. Scrape the sides of the bowl occasionally.
Once all the egg is fully incorporated, add the dry ingredients and fold in by hand. Do not over mix. Now fold in the lemon zest, juice, rosewater and vanilla.
Transfer the cake batter to the lined tin, level with a palette knife and put in the pre-heated oven. Bake for roughly 1 hour. Check if the cake is ready by inserting a skewer inside. It should come out dry (but oily).
While the cake is in the oven make the syrup. Put all the ingredients in a small saucepan and place on medium heat. Bring to the boil, making sure the sugar fully dissolves, and remove from the heat.
Once the cake is out of the oven brush it with most of the syrup (both the syrup and the cake need to be very hot), leaving about 4 tablespoons of syrup for later. Place the cake and reserved syrup on the side until they come to room temperature.
To serve the cake, cut it into wedges and lay them on serving plates. Whisk together all the cream ingredients and spoon a generous dollop on top of each slice. Drizzle with some of the remaining syrup, finely chop the reserved pistachios and sprinkle on top.
If you wish to add sugared rose petals to your garnish, you’d need to prepare these in advance. Turn down the oven temperature to 70C once the cake is out. Dip the petals gently in egg white, shake off any excess, and scatter just enough sugar to cover the leaves without creating lumps. Transfer to an oven tray lined with grease-proof paper and place in the oven. Leave there to dry for 30-45 minutes or until the petals are totally crisp. Place in a sealed dry container and scatter over the cake just before serving.
Hi Yotam,
I just wanted to tell you how brilliant your cookbook is. My boyfriend got it for me for Christmas, and I made your chocolate fudge cake this weekend - we've already eaten half of it, and I've brought some in for my colleagues who are also raving about it!
I don't live in London but when I'm next in town I'm definitely popping in.
I'm going to try some of your other cake recipes with wheat-free flour - wish me luck!
Nicole
Good luck Nicole! ...and yes, do pop in when in London for sweets and all the rest.
Hi Yotam,
Firstly, can i say how much i have enjoyed your recipes from your cookbook. I am having a wonderful time slowly cooking through it recipe by recipe! I was lucky enough to visit two of your stores over christmas when i was visiting the UK and throughly enjoyed both experiences. Your staff do an amazing job.
While i was there i had one of your raspberry cupcakes which was heavenly. I have made both cupcake recipes from the book which were delicious but was wondering if you had a recipe which excluded nuts? My brother is allergic to them and feels deprived every time i make a batch!
Thanks again for all your delicious creations Yotam!
Karina
Thank you Karina! Yes, I am rather proud of my staff.
Here's a nutless cupcake recipe I haven't tried but Sarit, head pastry chef, says it's good. Hope it works for you.
185g unsalted butter
280g caster sugar
150g white chocolate
250ml milk
230g plain flour
2 tsp baking powder
2 eggs
Melt butter and sugar till warm. Add white chocolate and stir until it melts. Mix in remaining ingredients and fill up the cases.
I cooked yoru Clementine & almond cake yesterday for chinese new year, and it was the most amazingly perfect cake I've ever made, thanks so much for helping me build up my cake rep!
wow! thank you. we are celebrating a belated chinese new year on saturday. can't wait.
wow. I think I must be in an alternate universe. an entire page of cake conversation. I'm in the US so I cannot, sadly, pop over to one of your shops, Yotam, but I sooooooooooo would like to. Instead, I'm going to try to find your Clementine and Almond cake recipe and make myself one!! then I plan to try the recipe I see here today...for I, too, am a cake geek.
Eileen
Always nice to find your lost twin souls.
Just to make your life easier, here is the clementine cake recipe (sorry it's in metric). it is wonderful!
Good luck, Yotam
Clementine and almond cake
Serves 8-10
200g unsalted butter
380g caster sugar
Grated zest and juice of 4 clementines
Grated zest and juice of 1 lemon
280g ground almonds
5 medium free-range eggs, beaten
100g plain flour, sifted
1/8 tsp of salt
Long trips of orange zest to garnish
Chocolate icing (optional)
90g unsalted butter, diced
150g dark chocolate, broken up
¾ tbsp honey
½ tbsp cognac
Preheat the oven to 160ºC.
Lightly grease a 24cm spring form tin and line the sides and base with baking parchment.
Place the butter, 300g of sugar (leave 80g for the syrup!) and citrus zest in a mixer bowl and use a paddle attachment to combine everything well. Do not work the mix too much or incorporate much air. Add half the amount of ground almonds and continue mixing to fold through.
Add the eggs gradually, scraping the bottom and sides of the bowl a couple of time as you go.
Add the remaining ground almonds, flour and salt and work them until the mix is completely smooth.
Spread the cake batter inside the cake tin and level it out with a palette knife.
Place the cake in the oven and bake it for 50-60 minutes. Check that it’s ready by inserting a skewer inside. It should come out a little bit moist.
When the cake is almost cooked through boil together in a small saucepan the remaining sugar and the citrus juices (the juices should add up to approximately 120ml – remove some if needed). When it comes to the boil remove the syrup from the heat.
As soon as the cake comes out of the oven brush it with the boiling syrup, making sure all the syrup is soaked through.
Leave the cake to cool down completely. You can then serve it as it is, garnished with orange strips, or store for up to three days in an air-tight container.
To make the icing, put the butter, chocolate and honey in a heat proof bowl and place over a saucepan with simmering water. Stir until all is melted, remove at once from the heat and fold in the cognac. Pour the icing over the cool cake, allowing it to dribble naturally around the sides without covering the cake completely. Let the icing set and then garnish with strips of orange zest at the centre of the cake.
Thank you so much for the recipe, Yotam! Not to worry about the metric, I will translate to American...I CANNOT wait to try it out and eat it up. Possibly (no promises) I will share it with the significant other.
Eileen
Hi
This is the first time i've visited your site and have spent much much longer on here than i planned to! I just wated to say how impressive i think it is that you take the time to respond to comments and to answer questions.
I'll be popping in soon to your notting hill shop!
Anna,
I enjoy the online contact. Hope to see you soon in real life.
Hi there,
After reading your story in Gourmet magazine, I was fortunate to have a delicious lunch at the store in Notting Hill. (I live in the United States.) I bought your cookbook and am so enjoying it but wonder if you could provide the recipe for the little rectangular cake with citrus glaze and chopped pistachio nuts? A perfect cake!
Kind regards,
Polly
Polly, I am afraid some great things must remain a mystery. This is one of them. Sorry
Hello Yotam
I just tried your chocolate brownie recipe and for some mysterious reason some disaster seemed to have happened - despite following every step in the cookbook the mixture doesn't look like a 'normal' brownie mixture - there's some liquid (or is it oil?) on top when I pour the mixture into the tray, then some liquid keeps bubbling away while it was in the oven. According to your recipe the surface must be 'totally dry' before I take it out, so I waited and waited and waited.... 40 minutes went by and it's still wet on top! I took it out nonetheless and - as you would expect - it's all dry inside already. Any idea why this is the case? did something split (not sure what!) along the way?
Also this recipe seems to produce a very thick mixture - is this correct?
Thanks!!!
So sorry to hear about your brownie ordeal.
Brownies are highly sensitive and it also happens to us often that they don't come out just right.
I am not sure what went wrong in this case. It may have to do with the particular ingredients you have been using. I can only suggest reducing the butter by 10% and increasing the flour by 10%. I hope this does the trick.
Good luck!
hey yotam,
just wanted to say thanks so much for devoting all those pages to sweet things in your cookbook. Unlike alot of contemporary cookbooks where there are a few sad little pages of uninspiring puddings at the end, sweet things are definately not a token thing in your world! blueberry and lemon teacakes are my favourites so far - cooked them successfully in a muffin tin (no bundt moulds in the cupboard) and that produced a generously size individual cake - moist, fragrant and zesty; lush!
i also love the design aesthetics of 'ottolenghi' - the shiny bright white and tomato red that offset the bursting freshness of your food.
please open a branch in greenwich soon!
kate
Hi Yotam
I visit your shop in Islington very regularly, (at least once a week be it for cake, lunch, dinner or take away) Obviously I love the food!
However my wife and I love your hazelnut ganache tart which you seem to serve very irregularly. please could you make this more of a regular feature.
Thanks
Oliver
Oliver,
Sure. We will try and make those more often. Seems like everyone has a different favourite. If only the counter was bigger!
Best wishes
I love all the cakes I buy in the shop but have not yet used the cookbook to make any.
I do however want to make the lovely blueberry and vanilla cupcakes - can I use the above recipe and add blueberries and then use the hazlenut cupcake icing and add vanilla?
Hi, i am a fan. I lived in Notting Hill at the time of the opening of your shop and have had many wonderful bites at the store. I also have the book and love trying the recipes. I wanted to ask you what the logic behind chilling a greased cup cake is.thank you.
@ Lizzie, this should do the trick. I suggest also adding some lemon zest to the cupcake mix. When adding the blueberries make sure you stir gently so they don't break. Good luck.
@ Valentina, chilling tins allows the butter to stick better. When pouring in the cake mix the butter doesn't smear.
Hello,
I am a big fan of Ottolenghi and have been going for years (Ledbury Road).
You used to do a lemon drizzle teacake (the cone shaped one with a hole in the middle) which was superb. I hadn't seen it for some time so assumed that it was seasonal but it seems to have now been replaced with a pollenta lemon cake.
Is there any chance that you could either start doing it again or provide a recipe, please?!
I keep bragging about how good it is to friends and taking them for lunch only to find that you no longer do it.
Charles, I have asked Sarit, our head of pastry, to see if we can make it. Trouble is, the lemon polenta cake is so popular but still quite similar to the one you mention so we can't so both or a regular basis.
Thanks for the comment!
Thanks for the response to the 'magic' behind the chilling greased tin. i am going to reproduce your strawberry friand today. had it at the notting hill store last week..and boy it was delicious.
This strawberry cake is fantastic, I must agree. Good luck with it.
I think I must be obsessed - I am desperately trying to find the proper tea cake tins for your recipes.
I ordered a Nordic ware tin (Garland), which is beautiful, however, it's just too small - eight moulds within the tin. As far as I can gather, your cakes need a tin with 10cm diameter at the base. I tried your suggestion of uktv food, with no luck. I really would love a good strong tin, like the Nordic ware one - do you have any other suggestions please?
And... thanks for being so inspiring.
Hi. First i wanted to thank you for the book. I lived in London for a while and would stop by your store every saturday!!! Now i´m back in Portugal and it´s nice to be able to cook the food at home (not as good of course!!)
I know some recipes should be kept a secret, but i´ve been CRAVING for the past couple of years you choclate flourless cake (mini). It´s the best cake i´ve ever had, and no recipe comes close!!! So if your heart feels kind, please (pretty please) share the recipe ;)
Thanks for the tasty work!!!
Hi,
It is hard but I must refuse, Mafalda.
I get plenty of requests for recipes every week and I have to make sure that not all our secrets are revealed.
Through our book and other publications we already share many of our unique ideas but some items must remain exclusively ours.
I hope you understand.
Hi Yotam,
I first saw your quesedella in a copy of the Gaurdian I bought by chance because I was on the train to London to visit my daughter and needed something to read. I made it on the Sunday I returned home, and since then have cooked many of the vegetarian recipes from your book, and am a convert to the Guardian on a Saturday. As a vegetarian (I know you and your food is not) you have given me more inspiration than any vegetarian cookery or book I have ever bought - so thanks enormously for that. I came up to London ( a year later) this weekend with my wife to see our daughter (at 23 and impoverished ex pattern design student) and took her to Islington on Friday night. It was the 1st time for myself, my wife and my daughter to sample your food in your own restaurant and I have to say it was fantastic. Apart from the usual psycophantic stuff you must get all the time I am writing this because we bought some Anzac biscuits for my mother in law - she had them as we got off the train in Bridgend S.Wales (where we live). She has just been on the phone crying out for the recipe - which I dissapointed her in saying was not in the book. I have always been surprised at how generous you are in publishing your recipes and see from your last blog that you do however hold on to some of your greatest secrets, so I fear that you may not oblige in granting my wish to share this one - be great to know for sure though.
Thanks
John Williams (Bridgend)
Myra, try Kitchen Ideas on Westbourne Grove in London (020 7221 2777). You can call them and ask. They don't have the Nordic tins but have something similar. Talk to Bob and ask him about the moulds to recreate the tea cakes from the Ottolenghi cookbook. He should know.
John, having read your note I find it extremely hard to say no, especially to such a big fan.
Still, as you correctly noted, some Ottolenghi recipes are kept discreet for pure business instincts.
I hope you buy many more anzac biscuits!
Hi Yotam,
We were in London last week and visited your notting hill restaurant after reading your amazing new book and had to say the food tasted as good as it looked in the book!
I have tried making the sour cherry and walnut loaf but I find on the second rise it kind of flattens down a bit once in the oven, I couldn't get sour cherries so I used cranberries instead, would this be the problem?
Also, we saw your excellent muffins in the shop and loved the shape, are they a special mould you use or can you purchase them somewhere?
Thanks
michael
@ Michael, the walnut loaf is quite delicate so it can be that it was over-proofed or possibly didn't get enough kneading. It wouldn't be the cranberries though.
The muffin moulds we use are just deep moulds we get from the states. I haven't seen them in the UK I am afraid.
Thanks Yotam,
I think it may have been the over proving on the second rise, does it need a good bit kneading after the first rise? I was quite careful with it, rolled it into shape then wrapped it in clingy to rise. It rose quite well but once it went in the oven it kinda flattened out, i'll give it a bit of a pummeling the next time.
The muffin moulds in the book have a kind of cutout in them and look well used :-) I'll have a search for them, any pointers on what to look for in terms of size or name? I did a quick google and there are absolutely millions of option, the shape you get them looks amazing and the muffin pan we have are so close together they would stick to each other.
I wish you all well and the book is tremendous, what would you recommend as the next thing to try?
Oh yes the polenta cake was the best thing I tasted that weekend!
@ Michael, muffin moulds should be about 6cm wide and about the same in depth. You fill them almost to the brim.
I'd recommend making the apple and olive oil cake next. It's wonderful.
Hi Yotam - greetings from Krakow!
I have been exceedingly irritated by your book because ever since cooking my first recipe from it (roast butternut with burnt aubergine and pomegranate molasses) I have not wanted to waste time cooking anything else - it's that good. It's a tough commitment though as butternuts are not available here so I have to bring them over in my hand luggage or persuade my friends to and/or grow it. However, today I finally broke the spell and made the the sweet tarlets - fruit with marscapone cream, dark chocolate, white chocolate & raspberry, and lemon meringue. Of course they didn't look nearly as neat as the ones in your photos but they tasted amazing. Thank you. The only major problem I had though was with the dark chocolate ganache - it went grainy and looked like curdled sponge. Sifting cocoa over it didn't help disguise that something was really not quite right. Can you give me any idea of what I did wrong? Or what I could have done to rescue it (if anything - I tried mixing in another egg yolk but it didn't help)?
Thank you
Ewa
Hi Ewa,
Instead of butternut you can also use other pumpkins, or even sweet potato. try it.
About the tarts, I believe the melted chocolate and butter may have been too hot and caused the yolk and sugar mix to cook straight away. If you dare try this again, allow the chocolate mix to cool down substantially before folding in the yolk.
Regards to Krakow. I am planning to go there before the end of the year.
Hi Yotam!
I fell in love with your cookbook after trying the polenta-orange cake recipe in Gourmet. I have some technical questions I hope you can help me with. I tried the cake the first time with regular polenta and it was moist, but had a rugged texture. Second time I used the recommended instant polenta and it was like my bubbe's Passover cake....soooo dry. Any ideas what went wrong? Would an extra yolk help?
Reading this blog I want to fly to the UK for breakfast in the morning! May you open a branch on this side of the pond soon!
Nathalie
Nathalie, sorry about the unfortunate incidents with the cake. It should really work with the instant polenta.
To combat dryness reduce the dry ingredients (almonds and polenta) by a fraction and make sure you don't over-bake.
American Ottolenghi - maybe one day. There's more and more reasons to come to America now.
Greetings and salutations Yotam!
The rosewater and pistachio meringues which I baked to your recipe were heaven. :-)
I tried twisting the recipe by omitting the rosewater and mixing in passion fruit and, in others, crushed raspberries. Though they tasted fantastic and looked good they were a nightmare to get off the baking paper. Most of the meringues became a mush. Any suggestions?
Also do you have any advice for combining chocolate into meringues?
Many thanks
Tor from Stratford on Avon - the town in need of cake geeks - a lovely location on the river avon for your next restaurant
Tor, I will make sure to stop at Stratford on Avon one of these days to add a bit of geekiness.
About meringues, the problem is adding moisture. Rosewater is concentrated so a little goes a long way. You will need to reduce the passion fruit juice or add less raspberries (or freeze-dried fruit, now available in many places) so the mixture doesn't turn too wet.
Also, make sure you brush the baking paper with vegetable oil before you shape the meringues.
Instead of chocolate, fold in some cocoa powder to your meringues. Chocolate doesn't like the temperatures meringues are cooked at. Alternatively, you can brush your cooked meringues with some melted chocolate but that's a totally different story.
much luck!
Hi there,
I was in Ottolenghi this week and loved the blueberry and almond mini bundt cakes with lemon drizzle. I am an avid baker and want to try out the cakes at home. Would i be able to find the recipe in your book? Where do i get mini bundt cake pans or if the recipe were to be used for a normal size bundt cake how would i need to change the measurements?
Thanks
Tanya, the recipe is available in our cookbook and is easy to follow.
I know you can get mini bundt pans at Kitchen Ideas on Westbourne Grove, Bayswater. Also, similar shapes are sometimes available from Divertimenti.
I wouldn't use a normal size tin. It's quite a heavy cake so might not hold its shape.
Much luck!
Yotam,
A while ago you published a recipe in the Guardian for a chocolate and madarin cake... i made it once, and thought it was fabulous. Unfortunately I've lost my copy. Could you remind me of the recipe.
Gary
Gary,
Hi Yotam,
I am one of Helen's sister, Lily. I can't wait to visit Ottolenghi when I visit Helen in September and get to see all the fabulous food at Ottolenghi and hope to meet you all then too!!
Lily
hello yotam,
I'm from catalonia and we've been at your shops several times, each time we go to london. once in notting hill, we've taste an incredible bread and butter with cherries, as you can imagine is not an habitual thing we have in spain, I know is simple but I've tried several recipes from internet but the result was not de same, could you please explain me something about that?
thanks and fins aviat!!!
Hi Jordi,
We use our own croissant or pain au chocolat, which are the best in town, and add dried soured cherries. We then soak them with a mixture of cream, egg and sugar and bake.
Hope that helps.
please could you tell me where i could buy the muffin tins you use for your muffins?
many thanks
Hello Yotam,
My wife and l both love your book and especially the meringue recipes but how do you make the raspberry glaze on the one's pictured in the book we currently are trying a syrup coloured with red food colouring is this the right way,
Cheers Barry and Lucy
Jude, I am afraid you can only get them in America. These tall tins are available in many cookery stores there but I have never come across them in the UK.
@ Barry,
I am afraid this is something we choose to keep a secret. There's no colouring though, just natural fruit puree.
Good luck!
Hi, to all who have been looking for the 10cm bundt used to make the teacakes, i have just bought 6 from amazon £2.25 each.
I have also found a website called silvernutmeg.com who sell the muffin trays called: chicago metallic crown muffin pan, these produce the deep muffins with the crown or mushroom top.
Hope this info is useful
jude
Hi there,
I too am a huge Ottolenghi fan. I work around the corner from the Kensington shop, and gaze longingly in the window most mornings!
I also love baking, and have made your Fig tart (from the Guardian a few months ago) and the poached pear and cranberry upside down cake, which was a triumph!
But after reading the comments on this site, I'm desperate to try the Clementine and Almond cake. Obviously clementines are out of season now, so is there another citrus fruit which would work equally well? And would it be OK to use a 23cm springform tin, as I don't have a 24cm? Any advice gratefully recieved! Julia
Hi Yotam,
I bought your book and have tried several recipes, they are all so delicious and come out really well. Congratulations on your drive, good taste, your absolutely amazing cooking and thank you for sharing such good food and so many recipes.
I have a request?!? Is your recipe of the passion fruit tart that I so often have at the Nottinghill shop somewhere? if not, is it possible to share it?
I hope to be able to attend one of your cooking classes, but I'm waiting for a desserts cookery class and fit it in with another class - any idea when you'll have another go at desserts??
Many thanks and keep cooking from your heart.
Maria Teresa
Julia, thanks! 23cm would be fine, just a bit taller. Use oranges, mandarins or clementines. They all work. Good luck and many sweet moments.
Maria Teresa,
It's great to hear the book is so useful. About passion fruit tarts, I am afraid this one we keep a secret, which gives you another good reason to come to Ottolenghi. The lemon tarts in the book are pretty similar though.
I might do a dessert class next year. We should publish the next set of classes in September.
Hi Yotam,
Just to say - I found perfectly good clementines, and used my 23cm tin. The cake looked amazing, and tasted even better!
Thanks so much for the inspiration!
Julia
Hi Yotam...mainly I wanted to say THANKS to you so, so much for writing this brilliant book and bringing both excellent baking and innovative savouries to the general public! I have run a small wholesale artisan bakery (The Blue Angel Bakery) for over 5 years now (no competition to you guys, I just supply local coffee shops, restaurants etc)and work completely alone,with just Radio 4 for company. Your restaurants and now book have provided so much inspiration in developing my own original recipes....American & Middle Eastern baking are my major influences. I really wanted to thank you for providing a macaroon recipe that is straightforward and works ever time, no matter what. I have been searching for so long! Other recipes always add a 'mystique' to what should be a simple process (leaving piped mixture to form a 'skin' for example) and never work satisfactorily to give that bubbled base & beautiful crisp top that is the hallmark of a good macaroon.Even with years of experience, I never tire of learning and gaining new skills! I have great fun thinking up new varieties now that I know they will work.I am a frequent visitor to your Islington branch, and will continue to come and marvel at the beautiful displays! Very best wishes from a fellow Cake Geek extraordinaire x
Rachel,
Thank you. Thank you.
Dear Yotam,
Thank you for your fabulous cakes.
My partner and I always buy a couple of slices of apple and cinnamon cake whenever we go by.
Trouble is, it is sooooo delicious that neither of us want to be the first to finish eating. So,
a) we put off eating it for a long as possible (i.e. 2 minutes)
b) then we eat it very, very slowly
c) one of us stops eating half way through to make some more tea or pop out to the shops
d) the other simply has to stop eating too or they'll have to face the torture of looking down at an empty plate while the other eats theirs.
e) we co-ordinate a clean-plate finish down to the last forkful, so that we don't have any cake lying around for either of us to fight over.
At time of writing, we are at step C - and have been for some time....
In conclusion, my advice is to eat this cake covertly, decadently, on your own, without any distractions.
Wow, what a process!
Hello there!
Wow! I am really impressed by your website and blog, they both have a really lovely personal touch to them which makes me feel very welcome. Also, I am also ashamed to admit that I skipped through your colume in the guardian everytime until a certain mango rice salad (which was so simple to make yet absolutely delicious) caught my eyes, even then I didn't know about the restaurant and book (all sound amazing!) until today, sorry! But I have to say I am now VERY intrigued and am planning to pop over to one of your place before catching a flight home to Hong Kong in about 2 weeks time (one reason for convincing myself to take a train from edinburgh instead of flying), so don't be alarm if your staff see someone staying for lunch, afternoon tea and dinner because I want to try as much food from the shop as i could!
Thank you in advance for making my trip home something to look forward to, lol.
Vian
I hope it is as good as it seems and worth this extra journey. I will keep my eyes peeled for you. Thanks!
Hi Yotam
Like you, cakes are a passion of mine. I was cooking with my grandmother form the age of 3!
I am now 47!
I started a deli with my wife 27 months ago but did not really make many cakes (the occasional fruit cake and a cooked cheesecake (granies recipe). Then last year we were on our way out of business and had to do something. So I started making cakes and wow I have not looked back since.
I so relate in your book to the comment about the waiters saying they are the best brownies ever. I have also had those comments on my brownies and carrot cake. I know that feeling!
I am striving to get those comments on my other cakes and like you trying to get the best possible result.
When I get upto town again I have to pop into one of your stores but wonder which is the best for cakes?
Regards
Quinn
I hsve a deli in Bexhill
Hi Yotam
A friend's baby, Kolo, is coming up to his first birthday and has an allergy to eggs. She would like him to have a good old fashioned birthday cake for his first. Do you have an suggestions for good egg less cakes? It can still contain all other dairy products like butter and milk.
Thanks
Lou
Quinn, now you know how satisfying it is to get all these compliments every day. Makes you feel you're in heaven.
Good luck with all those cakes!
Lou, try this link:
I haven't tried it but it seems good.
Wish you well.
Hello.
I am in Wales and the lavender here is still blooming. I made your honey and lavender tea cakes in london with FRESH lavender and with fantastic dark, strong Corsican honey that someone had brought back for us as a gift. Actually, I also used Greek yog rather than soured cream. I didn't have the right tins and so I just used ordinary muffin trays and paper cases and slightly less drizzly glaze, and they were great! But my recipe book is at home in London, and I can't remember the measurements. Is there any chance that you could post the recipe so that I can take advantage of the lavender? Thank you.
Kate
Here it is Kate, uneditted:
Lavender and honey
Makes about 6
Melted butter for greasing the tins
225g butter
115g caster sugar
115g lavender honey (or plain if you can’t get it)
3 eggs
245g flour
1 tsp baking powder
½ tsp baking soda
½ tsp salt
½ tsp cinnamon
110g sour cream
½ tsp chopped dried lavender
Icing
20g lemon juice
10g honey
125g icing sugar
Dried lavender for decoration
Preheat the oven to 160C.
Place the butter, sugar and honey in a mixing bowl of an electric mixer and use a beater to cream them together until light and fluffy (using your hands will add a challenge and take longer). Break the eggs, beat them lightly with a fork and add to the creaming butter gradually, allowing each addition to incorporate fully before the next one.
Sift together the flour, baking powder, baking soda, salt and cinnamon. Add the lavender to them. Either manually, or while the machine is running on low speed, fold in the flour mixture and sour cream into the batter in 3 additions, alternating between the two.
Spoon the batter into the buttered teacake tins, clearing 1.5cm away from the edge. Level out the mix and clean the edges of the tins.
Bake in the preheated oven for 25-30 minutes or until a skewer comes out clean when inserted inside. Remove from the oven and leave the cakes in their tins for about 10 minutes. Turn out while still warm and leave to cool.
To make the icing, mix the lemon juice and honey in a small bowl. Whisk in icing sugar to make a thick enough glaze to drizzle over the cakes (you might need to adjust the amount of icing sugar). Use a pastry brush or a spoon to coat the top of the cakes, allowing the icing to drip down the sides. After glazing, sprinkle with a little bit of the dried lavender.
Just wanted to say thank you, Yotam - I just cooked your rosewater semolina cake for our office bake-off, and it won against scores of other cakes. So thanks to your recipe, I now have a fantastic wooden spoon trophy. I will now try the lavender and clementine cake recipes....
May you win many more spoons!
Finally I have found an establishment as passionate as I am about food. I was beginning to think that I was the only Chef left who opted for the 'make everything' route.
I run a small bespoke Catering business in Dorset and like to let my food do the talking, my business is growing in a remarkable way, people definately know real food.
I am about to embark on a Local food store and Cafe sourcing all my meats and produce from Dorset, can't wait to get my hands all the fantastic produce we have here on a daily basis.Any tips on getting it right?
Have just bought your book- truly fantastic and inspirational.
Dear All, We have just been for a short break in London and we discovered your shop in Notting Hill by accident. We simply had to stop for a cake each which we ate outside in the warm sunshine. They were so utterly divine that we walked back the following day and had lunch. The food is absolutely outstanding and we are both distraught that now we're back in York we're unable to visit the shop. I have bought the cook book and am very much looking forward to trying the recipes. We're back in London in November and will be definately visiting again with our 18 year old Son in yet another attempt to encourage him to eat healthily! We can't wait. Many thanks xx
@ Margot,
It sounds like you are on the right track and don't need us. I wish you loads of luck and keep us posted.
@ Suzanne,
Good luck with the conversion of your son. Please come again and keep on eating our cakes.
What a fab website!
I've been a fan of the Kensington store (every time I'm in London!) and your cookbook for some time now, and my husband and I are faithfully working our way through your recipes - all of which have been amazing so far. Just today we're eating the plum, marzipan and cinnamon muffins for tea :) Delish!
I was wondering whether you could share the recipe for the amazing savoury muffins that I always get when I come to the shop - I think they have pine nuts, basil, sun-dried tomatoes and mozzarella in? I could die happy if I didn't have to wait for the next trip to London to have these again...
Keep up the amazingly good work! You bring a lot of happiness to very many people.
Hi Yotam,
My best friend has just moved to Islington, and on Saturday we had to go visit "the giant meringue shop" (on account of the meringue mountain in the window) with some friends - only once we had bought and stuffed ourselves with cake in a local park did I realise that it was you from the Guardian column.
Excellent cakes. Well done. The salads looked awesome too. We will be back :D
All the Best,
Anna
hi a freind of mine bought me a lemon and mascapone tart back from you resterant i have to say it was fantastic could you tell me the recipe for the pasty as we both agree it was the best pasty ever thanks oli
@ Marchelle, @ Oli,
Thanks. As much as I would like to give away more recipes I am afraid that some we have to keep to ourselves. Still, you can always come to Ottolenghi for a muffin or a lemon tart.
Anna,
Yes, it's the same one that feed you salads and cakes.
Hello Yotam, I eat regularly in the Islington restaurant and have become obsessed with your fruit slices (plum, apricot, pear). I have tried making them myself by adapting a classic French recipe, but have had limited success. I heard a rumour from some of your staff that you might be publishing a second Ottolenghi cook-book before Christmas. Might this include the recipe for the fruit tart? I ask because I am holding off buying the current cookbook in the hope that the new one will include the recipe for this marvellous treat. Kind regards Helena.
Hi Yotam
I am not happy at all with your shops - they are all in London! When will Winchester beckon to you? It will be easier for us to get to when we cannot curb our craving for your fabulous food!
Your cakes are so divine and though I am also a cake geek, I will not try baking them....I will just pop into your shop and indulge! And your salads, I can just happily become a vegetarian eating them!
For now, I shall just dream on until our next visit to London....
Best wishes
Leda
@ Helena, I am afraid the fruit slice recipe is not about to be published. Sorry.
Still, next year, in April, I will publish a new book of vegetarian recipes (no cakes I am afraid) that is now in the making and is looking great!
@ Leda, London's waiting for you!
Hi Yotam,
Greetings from Dublin!I visited London last month and choose to stay in Islington just so I could easily pop in and out of your Islington branch. I literally tried breakfast, dinner and tea there and was not disappointed!Complements on your passion fruit mer.tart-SOOOOooooo good!!!I also loved the Choc&hazelnut brownies and have tried to recreate them at home using the brownie recipie in your cookbook.It worked out well but was hoping you'd share a tip with me-how do you create the chocolate-chunk effect in them? Such a nice surprise when you don't expect it!
Many thanks,
Sofia
Help! I want to make your Apple & Olive Oil Cake but where we live we can't get Bramley apples - here in Trinidad we can get Red, Gala, Granny Smith and Golden Delicious though. Which is the best to use as an alternative? I was thinking Granny Smith or Golden Delicious.
Thanks a million!
Antonia
@ Antonia, Granny Smith, definitely. Good luck with it!
@ Sofia, what you can do is dot the brownie with large chunks of hazelnut milk chocolate. Delicious.
Hi Yotam!
Thanks for the reply re the Granny Smith apples - made the cake and it was a huge success! Just as your book says it gets better with time.... my other half took some into work and they wanted him to come back with more the next day to check it still tasted as good ;)
Next time think I'll cut the apple chunks a tiny bit bigger so that they can stand up to the raisins/sultanas which plumped up wonderfully.
Thanks again! A
Hi Yotam,
I'm getting married in January and would absolutely love to have a yummy chocolate cake made by Ottelenghi as our wedding cake! However, I asked at the Islington branch and found that the one occasion cake you do isn't big enough for the number of guests we have and any layering would be a no no as it is so delicate.
We're so keen to have an Ottolenghi cake that I thought I'd take a chance and ask whether you have any suggestions for creating something bespoke for our big day??
Thank you!
Doy
Doy,
I am afraid I must disappoint you. Our cakes don't work well in giant sizes and wedding cakes aren't our expertise.
Good luck with it,
Yotam
Hi Yotam,
I was in London last July and my aunt introduced me to your wonderful shop in Kensington, and sent me home (to Sydney) with a copy of your cookbook which I am absolutely loving. I've made several meals for friends who have all been overwhelmingly impressed - the flavours are just wonderful!
Two questions, though. I made the apple and olive oil cake a few weeks ago (it looked great, and the comments on this blog were an added recommendation!) and it came out a bit dry. I left out the sultanas as neither I nor my husband like them, so I'm wondering whether that might have done it and whether I should have added some extra liquid to compensate? Or perhaps the oven was just a bit hot?
On a non-cake-related note, I am absolutely stunned by the goodness of pork belly with the plum and rhubarb relish - these are just coming into season over here in Australia so I've finally had a chance to try it! But I noticed both the relishes have summer fruits in them, and the last thing you want on a hot summer's day in Sydney is to have the oven on for over 3 hours! Any chance of a relish recipe to go with the pork that has winter fruits in it, so I can enjoy it when the weather cools down again?
My parents will be in London in March, and I will be sending them straight to your shop.
With many thanks, and greetings from hot sunny Australia!
Katrina
Hi Yotam,
I am having a few friends (all big Ottolenghi fans) by for a casual dinner and was thinking of making the turkey meatballs from the cookbook. What would you suggest for side dishes? I'm happy to cook any recipe in the book (especially the desserts).
Thanks!
@ Annie, try making the carrot and peas on page 66 and the burnt aubergine on page 27. Good luck.
@ Katrina, if you don't like sultanas try increasing the amount of apple. But don't increase by too mush or the cake will be too wet.
For a wintery pork relish, replace the plum with pear and leave out the rhubabrb if you can't get any. You'd need to reduce the amount of sugar!
Have fun!
Hi Yotam,
Love the book. Made the peach and raspberry teacakes. Used some silicone kugelhopf dishes. Made 8 instead of 6 but looked just like the picture and taste divine. Will try the others. Will visit shop when in town.
Thanks for the great book again and loved your story at front
love Jean
Yotam
I regularly visit the cafe on Ledbury Rd for both savoury dishes and boxes full of cakes! It is almost impossible for either my partner or I to step out of the house (on Westbourne Grove) without passing by to pick up cakes. In fact, we know exactly what we want, no messing around, just military-style operation to pick the cakes up and run home!
I should be very grateful if you were able to pass on the recipe for the moist chocolate bar cake.
Many thanks
S
Hi Yotam,
we have an office bake off in a couple of weeks time - I can't decide between the Sticky Chocolate Loaf or Clementine and Almond cake. I might just cook both and decide for myself, but if you have any thoughts on which one might bag me the prize I would be grateful!
There may be extra "brownie" points if the recipe could be made flourless, don't want to loose the quality, but if you have any suggestions for ammending either recipe, it would be much appreciated!
Many thanks,
Bonnie.
@ S, I am afraid this one is not to be disclosed. There are plenty of other great ones in the book.
@ Bonnie, the clementine cake will definately make you the winner. Chocolate fudge cake in the book is flourless and delicious. But go for the clementine, despite the flour.
Hello Yotam
Thank you for publishing so many amazing recipes, every single one I've tried has turned out a success. Somehow I lost the last page of last year's An Ottolenghi Christmas, I'm absolutely devastated as the Amaretti were one of the best things I've ever baked. Is there anywhere I'd be able to find this recipe again?
Also sometimes when I make macaroons they come out with cracks - do you know what causes this?
And one last question, when I made the caramel and macadamia cheesecake - I struggled a bit with the caramel sauce, I tried the same thing 4 times and had 4 different and incorrect results, I had to go with the last one seemed okay but when cold was more like a chewy toffee. What is the correct consistency of the sauce?
Thank you so much!
x amy
I'm also a cake geek (more of the sampling than baking variety most of the time though) I just wish it wasn't such a calorific hobby!
Although not strictly cakes I've baked the macaroons from the book a few times and they always tend to be a bit misshapen - are there any tried and tested rules for getting the right shape when putting them on the baking sheet?
@ Ellie, I am afraid in this case practice makes perfect, nothing else. Lucky, though, that even the misshapen ones still taste delicious.
@ Amy,here is the link to the Amaretti biscuits:
Macarrons crack when the mix is dry. Try reducing the dry ingredients by a fraction.
The caramel sauce needs to be runny but still set when cooled. It all depends on how much you cook your sugar. It will set harder if you cook it longer and darker.
Hi, Yotam we've been again at notting hill and islington and we enjoy a lot as always with your mezze and of course with your pastry, I would like to know if there's any relationship between the chocolate fudge cake and your chocolate flourless teacake I like very much this one and I would like to do it.
thanks you so much
Jordi, I am afraid they are totally different.
Hi Otto,
My wife Pamela is a big fan of your book (I'm a big fan of the cakes she's made from it), and she's coming up for a significant but unmentionable birthday in March. She writes about food in Delhi (eatanddust)and has an obsession with high tea parties. I'd like to send her to one of your pastry and cakes classes. do you have any planned in the new year?
with best wishes,
Dean
Dean, I am afraid no pastry class is scheduled for next year. I will publish as soon as we plan one.
I'm so excited!! I didn't realise you had such a great blog going on here. Such handy tips!!
I purchased your book while I was on an overseas trip earlier this year. (I only realised that it was sold in Australia for some time and alot of my friends had it already!)
An absolute fan of your stores I can't say enough how much of a legend you and your team are. Such gorgeous and unique recipes and the fact you response to questions is even more of a bonus!.
Hope to have you out on a cooking demo to Australia soon!!!
Cheers
Amanda
Hi Yotam
Quick question in relation to the sweet pastry recipe in the cookbook:-
If I make the pastry ahead and decide to freeze it, what do I need to do to it before I can use it again (defrost to room temperature or just put in fridge etc)?
Many thanks
Sarah
@ Amanda, what can i say, thank you!
@ Sarah, best is to leave it in the fridge overnight and then roll out cold the next day.
To speed up the process you can also leave it at room temperature for a few hours until completely defrosted, but then chill again for at least 30 minutes. The pastry needs to be cold when you work with it.
Have fun.
Hi Yotam!
I love Ottolenghi and just a few days ago, got my mom hooked on it too and we started going to the one on Ledbury road every day! She was only here for a week and now she keeps calling me claiming how she misses the potato salad and the various cakes we've tried!
I'm a big fan of the almond croissant and I always have to have one when I grab coffee there...I was wondering if it has any marzipan instead or if it's just crushed almonds?
Thank you :)
Anna
Many years ago, I was lucky enough to work on Ledbury Road when you opened your first shop (indeed, your arrival made my day so much brighter), and despite no longer working in the area, I still make it a priority to go to your branch in Islington as often as I can.
I was in there earlier and was lucky enough to finally catch the blueberry & vanilla cupcakes and they are every bit as good as I imagined (the icing in particular is probably the best I've eaten thus far) and I was wondering if there was a recipe for them anywhere online as having consulted my Ottolenghi cookbook, it's not there (I'd definitely have made them if it was!)
Many thanks
Sophia x
PS. I'm going to be in Islington next Thursday 14th Jan. so if it's possible, it would be ace if there are some blueberry & vanilla cupcakes!
@ Anna, the almond croissants have almond cream inside (grounds almonds, butter, sugar, egg). Keep one enjoying!
@ Sophia, I am afraid there isn't a recipe for the blueberry muffins around. But you can adapt the hazelnut muffin from the book by adding blueberries. The icing is similar.
Hurrah! I have just managed to book dinner with you guys tomorrow night. Somehow at such late noticed I have been lucky enough to be squeezed in at 7pm and although we need to vacate by 8:15 and we may be forced to straddle a table leg or two, I am already salivating over the crusted tuna slices and passionfruit tarts that are bound to end up on our table!
Now I must say that having had your cookbook for over a year I have been inspired to ensure that my pantry is stocked with new and wonderful ingredients that allow me to whip up at short notice mouth watering masterpieces. What really gets me is that in each bite I know that someone who really is passionate about food and inspired by flavour has created that recipe and I can’t help but want to surround myself with that. Have you ever thought about running culinary courses?
Jilska, I hope you'll enjoy dinner.
Where have you been all this time? Here are some class options:
Hope you can get a seat!
I recently visited your Islington Store and indulged myself on your truly amazing chocolate chip cookies. Can you share the recipe with me?
Thanks Yotam
Mark
Hi Yotam,
I was in London on Friday and being an avid fan of your food via the cookbook and The Guardian, I sought out your shop in Ledbury Road (round the corner from where I used to live in the Nineties - why ever did I move?).
Your shop is truly amazing. Great design, really helpful staff and fantastic food. I sampled a chocolate and almond cake, which was out of this world. Sadly, I think this is one of your recipes which must remain secret - but I just wanted to check whether you've changed your mind and want to share it?
Also, there was a gorgeous pie, made with smoked bacon, caramalised onion, egg and lots of other delicious stuff. I checked the cookbook and the web to see if you've published this recipe but sadly to no avail. Just wondering if there's any chance of you releasing this one or if it too falls into the 'must remain secret vault'?
Fingers crossed and thank you for all the fantastic food, recipes and blog work (and for introducing me to the world of sumac and zatar).
Best wishes
Catherine
@ Mark, @ Catherine,
I hate to say no but I have to refuse your requests. You can imagine, we need to leave ideas for the next Ottolenghi book.
Thanks for the compliments.
Hi Yotam
Im a huge fan of Ottolenghi and always visit the nottinghill store when im in london. I live in Dubai now and have just tried making the rosewater meringues but folded through a touch of cocoa at the end of the whisking instead. Ive done this before and it worked brilliantly. This time the meringues refused to harden in the oven they felt almost rubbery. They appear not cooked in the middle and are very chewy to eat. Can you help, i cant think what i have done wrong or differently to last time.
Thanks so much in advance for your help.
Anna, meringues tend to be quite capricious (due to different quality of egg whites). If this worked for you before I suggest to try again. Adding too much cocoa tends to stop the meringues from firming up. The eggs shouldn't be cold. Good luck next time.
Hi Yotam,
I wanted to make the marbled chocolate meringues and in your book. You had suggested to fold in some chocolate powder to someone else but I noticed there isn't a basic meringue recipe. I had a look at the ingredients for the other two listed in the book but if I eliminiate some of the ingredients I'm sure it won't work. Any suggestions here for what I need to do?
Thanks
Amanda
Hi Yotam
I have been a huge fan of your shop since the Notting Hill branch opened.
Now having moved away from the area, I make sure to go at least weekly to your islington branch. I have sampled nearly everyone of your cakes and salads. My flat has fallen in love with the lemon (is it marscapone cream) tart. I would love to be able to make a full size tart. Is there any chance you could give me the recipe.
Thank you in advance for your help.
Hi Yotam,
I have to say that your cupcakes are the absolute best in London - and I mean by a country mile. Every other place I've been to seems to use a sack of sugar for the icing. How is it you achieve such a mousse-like texture? Cheese?
oh and I recently picked up a slice of a ricotta-based, chocolate-chipped and hazelnut cake from your Islington shop. I forget what it was called, exactly, but am wondering if it's going to be a regular....?
Regards,
Paul
@ Amanda, use double the amount of sugar to egg whites and then fold in some (not much!) cocoa powder and you should be fine.
@ Michelle, I am afraid this is one of our best kept secrets. Sorry.
@ Paul, if you have our cookbook look at the cupcake icing recipe on page 214. This is the general principal. The ricotta and hazelnut cake is gaining popularity so you should be seeing it more and more.
Hi Yotam,
I just wanted to say that Ottolenghi is absolutely one of my favourite places in the entire world. I first came across your food haven in Kensington when I was shopping with my mother about 2 years ago. I drooled at the cakes in the window and went inside to discover a range of delicious-looking salads. I have been hooked ever since! My only complaint is that the food is so irresistable, I struggle not to buy anything, and I spend a lot of time walking past your shop in Notting Hill!!! :)
I have always had a very sweet tooth. This has somewhat diminished in recent years, however, I still thoroughly appreciate a good cake. I am a big fan of cooking, especially baking, and I often make cakes for my family and friends as it fills me with great pleasure to put smiles on their faces. My favourites from Ottolenghi have to be the strawberry and vanilla financier, the flourless chocolate and orange cake and last, but most certainly not least, the rose and vanilla cupcakes. I recently bought your cookbook and have been making salads for lunches to take to work during the week. I am yet to try out your cake recipes, but I noticed that my favourites are absent from your book. Is there any way you could share the recipe for any of these three? I would most like to hear the cupcake recipe, not because I am a cupcake fan as such, but because I have a love for any dessert that is flavoured with rose. I understand some things must remain guarded but I ask on the off chance that this is not one of those :)
Thank you for providing so much joy in my life! I look forward to many new delights at Ottolenghi in the future.
With great appreciation,
Frances
P.S. On a side note, you are one of only two places I have found that makes a good mince pie. Actually, your mince pies are the BEST I have found. Congratulations!
Hi Yotam,
Can you tell me a good brand for rose water? I have tried a few in the past and the quality was very variable. Alternatively, is it easy to make?
Thanks,
Frances
@Frances, what can I say? You praises make me blush, quite literally. The recipes in the book represent our range when we worked on the book, about 3 years ago. So, obviously, many recipes aren’t there. I am afraid I must disappoint and say we will probably not publish these recipes in the near future. However, try the cupcake recipes from the book and add some rosewater to the icing. A good brand is the Lebanese Cortas. You can find it in many Arab shops.
Thanks Yotam, you're a star!
Hi Yotam
I love your food although can only visit rarely as I live in Bristol! Last time, I had a delicious small blueberry cake with a particularly luscious and dense texture - I woulod love to experiment with reproducing it and wondered if you would share the recipe - or give me a little hint as to the origin of the magic! Thank you so much for all your inspiration!
Warm wishes
Mark
Mark,
I am not quite sure which cake you mean. Was it an individual lemon and blueberry cake or a cupcake? What was the finish like?
Hi Yotam,
I love your beautiful cakes but am sometimes limited by my wheat intolerance, do you have any recipes for a super delicious wheat-free cake?
Thanks,
Amelia.
Hi Yotam -
Could you please tell me if you've ever used agave syrup (from a plant) instead of sugar?
What was your opinion of it and would I be able to replace sugar with this for some of your recipes?
As a diabetic I'm trying to find sugar alternatives that are not harsh chemicals.
Thanks very much!
@Amelia, let me refer you to the Ottolenghi Cookbook. The orange polenta cake can be done without flour if you substitute the flour for more polenta and reduce the butter by about 10 percent.
The chocolate fudge cake is flourless and the cheesecake can be done without the base.
I would also try the lemon and blueberry teacakes, substituting the flour with more ground almonds and reducing the amount of butter. You'd need to experiment.
@Joanne, I like agave syrup but I haven't tried using it in cakes. I suggest that if you replace the sugar with syrup you should try to reduce the liquid content. Good luck!
Hello Yotam,
A few years ago I found the recipe of your carrot and walnut cake in a magazine. I tore the page and kept it loose in one of my cookbooks. I must have made the cake at least 15 times.... we just adore it. Unfortunately I lost the recipe during one of my visits back home in France, where your cake is hugely popular with my friends and sweet-toothed family. I haven't been able to find the recipe on the internet. Is there anywhere I can find it? I have made the cake plenty of times but my memory isn't good enough to remember the exact proportions. Thanks in advance. Marianne.
Hi Marianne, I just posted the carrot cake recipe on my blog, especially for you.
Hi Yotam,
My husband bought a chocolate cake from your store for my birthday and it was the best cake I have EVERRRRRR had. Thanks so much. I just finished the last few crumbs today. Your cake made me happy.
Do you have eggless cakes too? My mother in law is coming over and I would love to bake a cake for her, but she doesnt eat eggs.
I am surely coming to your store, having spent so much time on your website, I cant wait to eat in the restaurant.
Thanks, Taruna
Taruna, I am afraid you haven't come to the right people. We always use eggs! Can you not convince the mother-in-law to have some?
Hi Yotam,
Many thanks for your reply.
I wish I could ask my mother in-law to eat eggs, but she doesn't as she is a vegetarian. I have found recipes that advise to add greek yogurt, some even cola, but nothing that works well. It would be so nice if in the future you come up with a recipe for vegetarians :) That will be a my wish :)
I wish you a happy weekend ahead!
Taruna
Fabulous cookbook. Amazing recipes. The chocolate fudge cake is fab. I made it with a mixture of Meunier chocolate and Lidl Madagascar. Wow!
Ran into trouble with the Apple and Olive oil cake. It was light and moist but a touch too wet (dare I say rubbery?). 3 Braeburn apples could be any weight? Mine weighed 835g unpeeled and 550g once cut up. I left out 85g and it still looked like too much apple? Help!
Charlotte, yes, you did use quite big apples. The total weight of the apples going into the mix is 360g. However, the main problem, I suspect, is the kind of apple you used. Bramley or Granny Smith are the ones suitable here. Good luck!
Thanks. I used Bramley (can't think why I wrote Braeburn?!). So what are we after here? Both apples are sour but the Bramley collapses and the Granny Smith stays firm. I like the idea of the sourness of the apple contrasting with the sweetness of the cake.
I am guessing the type of Maple syrup you use will make a big difference to the flavour of the icing? Can you suggest a brand? I bought a medium strength from Waitrose but maybe a stronger one would be more suitable?
Beautiful food, thank you for so much inspiration! My partner is a new zealander and so quite fond of meringues and I've been making him the brown sugar meringues from your book, simply gorgeous...but I have noticed that the odd time their surfaces remain a wee bit sticky while the bottoms are dry. Any suggestions? It has been a humid summer here, could that be it? Or am I not cooking the whites enough?
Thankyou.
ps. Am eagerly anticipating the arrival of my pre-ordered copy of Plenty and am hopeful to someday be ordering a patisserie book?
@Charlotte, both Granny Smith and Bramley are sour and low on water content and that's what we are after. The fact that Bramley disintegrates doesn't matter that much as you are still going to get bursts of flavour in places. As to the maple, it isn't a make or break issue as long as you use a good, flavoursome pure maple syrup, such as the one you mention.
@Sarah, the moisture in the oven is exactly the reason. Try to make smaller batches so the meringues create less steam inside. Also, open the oven door a few times during the cooking to allow some of the steam out.
Hi Yotam, As a family, we are obsessed with everything in your store, especially the chocolate chip, pecan cookies (the moist, chewy ones). We are moving back to NYC and wanted to taste my "last" Ottolenghi cookie and your Kensington store told me that they just ran out of them.
Your cookbook has the recipe for the crunchy chocolate chip cookie but I am OBSESSED with the chewy ones. Would you be able to share the recipe for the chocolate chip & pecan cookies so that I can make it for my self and kids when we are back in NYC? They are the BEST cookies I have ever had!! THANKS a lot, Abbie
Abbie, I am so sorry I have to say no to your sweet request. This is one of our best kept recipes. However, let's float the question out here and see if anyone can recommend a really good chewy chocolate chip cookie in NYC. I am sure there's so many.
Hi Yotam,
Firstly I would like to add to the constant stream of admiration I see above, and express how much I LOVE Ottolenghi, I am completely obsessed with every single aspect of your food; and frequent your shops as much as possible.
I have recently been going through the cookbook, making a number of different recipes a day. I absolutely love baking and yesterday I had a lot of fun with the macadamia nut and caramel cheescake. However, I don't feel I have quite perfected the recipe. My main problem is that my version seems to have quite an eggy taste. This has happened before when i have tried to make a cheesecake. Do you have any tips on avoiding egginess?! Also is the caramel on top meant to completely solidify when cooled? If so, how do you cut through it?
I thank you on behalf of most people I know for introducing London to such a delicious and inspirational culinary experience!
Calypso
I was just reading the last post from Abbie on Choc Chip Cookies. Funnily enough, I was doing some research on the same and just found an article yesterday on chewy choc chip cookies on the New York Times site (July 9, 2008).
Quite interesting — talks a lot about the method, refrigerating the dough, and sprinkling with sea salt at the end (I love this idea). Also about who's baking the best ones in NYC.
You can read the article here and try the recipe here
Hope this might help with the cravings!
Thanks, Jane. Fascinating
Thanks for sharing this Jane!
Hi Yotam,
Hope you are doing great. I just bought your cookbook and am loving the simple instructions and beautiful pictures.
I just made the Apple and Olive Oil cake. I wanted to bake a small cake so I reduced all the ingredients by half. I skipped the sultanas entirely. I read above that 360g of Bramley apples are enough, so I used 180g of them.
I am a little unsure about the baking time. I initially kept it on Gas 3 for 45 minutes, but it wasn't done, so I kept increasing the time a little at a time. Finally I kept it for the same 1.5 hours, the cake had a crisp wafer like layer on top, but on the inside was nice and gooey. I worry that I kept it on too long, I haven't had it at your restaurant so I don't quite know how it should have turned out.
How long do you think I should have baked it for?
Thanks so much for the lovely recipe. I baked after so long (nearly one year) and it felt really nice.
Thanks,
Taruna
@Calypso, I am not sure about the egginess. The amount of egg is normally the deciding factor. The recipe shouldn't yield and eggy result. As to the caramel sauce, it should be runny.
@Taruna, I think the cake was baked for too long. The top should be dry and soft but not crispy. It may be that your tin was too deep. Is your oven properly set?
I have just tried to make your cinnamon and hazelnut meringues. I simmered the egg whites and sugar over water but now i cannot get the meringue mixture to whip up to a meringue consistency. I think that the problem is that i heated the mixture too hot as i can see condensation on the roof of my magimix. Do you think that is the reason and that i will have to start again?
Many thanks
Kind regards
Jane
Jane, The egg whites and sugar can get quite hot and the recipes should still work. What worries me is the word "magimix". Are you whipping up the meringue in a food processor?
Hi,
My fiancee has a severe nut allergy which includes all nuts, sesame and pinenuts. It makes life tricky as she (and I!) also love cakes and many things normally containing ingredients such as tahini (hummus etc).
Do you have any suggestions for good substitute ingredients to use in cakes requiring almond meal, or other nut meal? Also if you have some suggestions for substitutes for tahini or pistachios in middle eastern food that would be great too!
Many thanks,
Tal.
Tal, I am sorry but I really don't know much about this subject. You would probably need to consult a specialist book.
Hi Yotam
love Ottolenghi (Islington) and have introduced lots of friends to it over the last few years who all love it too. I bought some cakes on Friday for my family including the cherry bakewell tart and something similar to a sponge cake with strawberries in it that the waitress said was a financier. Both were absolutely delicious - any chance of the recipe for the financier? My mum was very impressed with it but she's not a londoner no regular Ottlenghi fix for her...Is it in Plenty?(which I will be buying asap!)
Also, my friend and I once had a blueberry and chocolate bread and butter pudding at Ottolenghi - it may have been 2 years ago. But we never forgot it. Keep looking out for it but haven't seen it since - will it be making a reappearance anytime?
best wishes
aliya
Aliya, thank you. I am afraid these recipes are not available. They are still kept secret. Possibly in future books...
Hi Yotam,
Greetings from New Jersey!
I'm making your Apple & Olive Oil Cake with Maple Icing for my father-in-law this weekend to celebrate Father's Day.
What type of olive oil do you recommend for best results? Would extra-virgin olive oil be too strong to use in this cake? EVOO is what I normally have in my pantry.
Hope to make it to London soon to finally eat at one of your locations!
Kind regards,
Phyllis
Phyllis, extra virgin is what you want. It works! Hope to see you here soon.
In response to the NYC chocolate chip cookie question, I would highly recommend City Bakery on 18th Street. They also have amazing pretzel croissants.
Love the new cookbook. Especially the green pancakes. But the two recipes I was desperately holding out for aren't in there! Can you help? I make your sublime caramel and macadamia nut cheesecake all the time (one of my godchildren even now calls me Cheesecake Anna!), but was hoping for a recipe for the delicious roasted strawberry and lime one you serve in the restaurants.
Also, the sublime cornbread with chilli and cheese, which I adore!
Pretty please. My cooking arsenal just isn't complete without these two worldbeater recipes.
hi,
im trying the 2nd time the chocolate fudge, first time it broke up and it was to buttery, even using the right amount as on the recipe. any idea what happened? 2nd time just in the oven, but it is this time not a nice runny chocolate mix, it has some sugar clots. any tips regarding the right amount of ingredients and mixing would be appreciated.
thanks
Hi Yotam - Ive recently bought both your books and loving all the recipes! Im catering a friends 50th birthday BBQ and plan to make several of your wonderful salads, and also various of your sweet tarts. Im wondering which tart cases you use? .. I have used some muffin tins today to make your mascapone tarts today but they seem smaller than the tarts in your pictures .. any advise would be great - thanks!
@Anna, those are top secret I am afraid...
@Nana, I am not quite sure what went wrong. The muscavado sugar must not be too lumpy or day. Use fresh. Did you wait for the chocolate mix to cool down well?
@Marian, small muffin tins are the ones we are using. They are available from all cook shops. I hope you find them and happy birthday to friend!
how do we find out about the bookings for sydney 2010
I recently visited a Cupcake shop in Buenos Aires that made the most delicious cupcakes. Once which was particularly good was a passion fruit frosting. I often find that the frosting on cupcakes is way too sweet, but this wasn't and they managed to pile it high (about 4cms high). I have tried to recreate this using cream cheese, a little butter and passion fruit juice, but it just ends up a little sloppy. The consistency was not overly buttery when they made it, just smooth, not glossy, but help a real concentration of flavour.
Is there anything you can recommend? A mix of passion fruit jelly crystals to stabilise...???
Hi
I happened to pass the Holland Road shop yesterday and tried one of your delightful almond and cherry cakes - it was divine, light pastry, scrummy jam and beautifully moist almond sponge. Next time I am in London i will be back and bringing my friend with me.
@Jenny, try here and looking forward to seeing you:
@Lorna, you may want to consider making some passion fruit curd the same way you make lemon curd and then folding it together with some whipped up mascarpone cheese and a little whipping cream.
@Julia, thanks. Do come back!
Hi Yotam,
I just ordered both cookbooks and LOVE THEM! I have a question about flour. For the Italian Loaf you use both Italian 00 flour and strong white flour- why both? How is the Italian 00 different from strong white? Is there a substitute for the Italian 00 if I can't find it?
Thank you,
Sara
Sarah, thanks. The 00 is very strong and therefore essential for this king of light-textured bread. Substituting all for normal strong white flour should work but will be denser.
Hi Yotam,
Thanks for the clementine and almond cake recipe - I made it over the weekend and it was a great success.
Any plans for a cake book (...please!)
Lucy, no plan but it is a definite possibility for the future.
Hi Yotam
After following your recipes in the Guardina magazine I finally made it to buy some cakes from your Islington restaurant at the weekend - the praline cheesecake and strawberry cupcake were fabulous. They tasted just as good as they looked - maybe even better!
I am wondering which cakes you would recommend to make a day or 2 in advance of a large party?
Many thanks and I look forward to returning soon. Fran
Otto your receipe books are wonderful. I have a little wholesale business in New Zealand which makes lovely little cakes, pies and brioche and I am always looking for new ideas. At the moment I am trying to work out how you colour the meringues!
In New Zealand we have a very strong cafe culture and wonderful way of making coffee. your food really suits our way of life.
Thank you so much and if you are ever in NZ come and see us.
Regards
Maggie
@Fran, cheesecakes, un-iced, keep well chilled for 3-4 days. Have you got the Ottolenghi cookbook? Try the one there. Also, the carrot and apple cakes both keep really well and even improve over the first day or two.
@Maggie, thanks!
Hi Yotam,
This isn't cake related but I just wanted to make a comment. My father is Israeli and he taught me how to cook, so middle eastern food is what I grew up eating, it's my favourite. Saying that, I love food in general and love to try flavours from around the world.
Being vegetarian, I'm really enjoying your recipes in The Guardian. So many big, sunny, fresh flavours! I made the mejadra yesterday and it was soooo good! My partner has already asked me twice about when I'm going to make it again!
You make lots of suggestions that are new to me - about the combining of flavours. It was a while ago now but I believe you suggested putting tahini with cauliflower?.. That's become a bit of a staple in my house now.
Keep sharing the love!
Thank you,
Rhona
Thanks Rhona, will do and you keep combining cauliflower and tahini. It's heaven.
I live in New York (a suburb in Long Island to be exact) and I will be attending The French Culinary Institute in Feb. 2011 to become a pastry chef. I adore baking and I am always looking for new and interesting recipes to try when I came across this page looking for a raspberry lemon cupcake recipe. I saw all the beautiful pastries and I saw your raspberry lemon cupcakes. I bought your book hoping the recipe would be in there. I'm enjoying the book very much but I am disappointed that I did not find the recipe. Could you please share the recipe for those beautiful raspberry lemon cupcakes and the recipe for the icing I would greatly appreciate it.
Thank You,
Jacqueline.
@Jacqueline, I am sorry to disappoint you but I am afraid we choose to keep some of our recipes under wraps, the one you're after included. However, check out some of these great baking recipes that I published recently:
Awww :( Thank you for answering though I tried my own version last week and my family and I enjoyed them. Still a work in progress as I am a perfectionist when it comes to baking. Thank you for the link also I can't wait to see what recipes I'll want to try.
Jacqueline.
Hi Yotam,
I'm going to be brave and try and bake a big batch of macaroons in different flavours for a tea party...before I get up to my elbows in macaroons can I check - are they freezable?
As in, bake the shells, freeze in a tupperware with paper between layers, defrost and fill the day before the party?
If not I'll do more teacakes!
Many Thanks,
Eve
@Eve, they freeze very well. Make sure you freeze them soon after baking and defrost on the day you stick them together.
Hi Yotam,
I was a student at Leiths 3 years ago and very much enjoyed your lecture, your food, and more recently your books and restuarants.
I have a client who loves Lemon Polenta Cake. Can I use the orange polenta cake recipe and subistitute in the lemons?
Really appreciate any pointers.
Sarah
Sarah
Hi Yotam,
I came across your cookbook at a friends and i think i am in love with you. I love hosting large dinner parties and your book has given me several ideas that no other book has. And what i like most is that i am not talking recipes here but combinations and flavours that i am dying to explore. i havent made anything yet but i know it would be spectacular. thanks so much in advance.
Alia
DElhi
@Sarah, in principal you can. I would probably increase the sugar a little. Good luck.
@Alia, wow! Thanks. Looking forward to hear how the actual cooking went. Hope you stay in love after it.
Hi Yotam,
I used to work on Lonsdale road and regularly (at least 4 times a week) pop in to your Ledbury branch for some yummy food.
I've been back in Thailand for 10months now and I'm really craving your lemon and mascapone tarts. Please please can you post the recipe on here for me and I promise I'll bring back something yummy for you from Bangkok :)
Many thanks
Premjit
Hi Yotam
I am a big fan of your teacakes and having found a silicone version of the bundt tins I have made all three in your cookbook several times.
Do you have any suggesions for another flavour. ( I was thinking christmas/seasonal version or chocolate/ground almond)
@Premjit, I like your style. But I am afraid not this time... ;)
@Catherine, this one looks good:
Try spreading roasted cranberries on top.
Hi Yotam,
I am a HUGE fan of Ottoleghi and regularly visit with family and friends.
I always get the Lemon Pistachio & Polenta cake to go as it is my mother's favourite cake in the whole world!
Her 60th birthday is fast approaching and I was wondering if you would be so kind and to let me know the recipe for the cake (as I cannot find it in your cook books - which I have at home) or online.
Please help! She would be overjoyed!!
Many thanks
@Patricia, I would have loved to make your mom happy but I am afraid this is one of those recipes we just can't give away. Sorry...
Dear Yotam and Sammi
I just wanted to let you know that your recipes are being made and loved in San Diego California.
A girlfriend sent me both your books and we have been in heaven trying out your different recipes
from the salads to the meringues - fantastic!!!
Thanks , I am really enjoying them both.
I look forward to coming into your stores on a visit to London one day.
Any chance of you coming to La Jolla, please contact me, I am a huge fan and would be happy to show you around.
Thanks, Beryl
Hi, I know this isn't a cake related question but please help!
I love your aubergines with tomato, goats cheese and hazelnuts.
The aubergine slices literally fall apart they are so tender.. How can I cook my aubergines to achieve the same level of tenderness?
Thanks.
Hello
Thank you for posting such lovely recipes.
We recently tried your Pear and Cranberry Upside Down cake which tasted amazing but we had trouble with the caramel topping. We followed the instructions but the sugar and butter just separated as well as hardening very quickly. We still used it though...
Can you please let me know what we did wrong?
thank you
Amelia
Love the food, love the recipes, love the enthusiasm of your followers on the site.
Completely understand your reaons for not revealing your "secret" recipes but am worried about the succession issues... You need to reassure your readers that these recipes are being documented & preserved for posterity - somewhere, somehow - and that paranoia about alimentary espionage is under control.
@Beryl, no plans as off yet but will let you know. By the way, Plenty is getting an American edition. Our very soon!
@Lexa, brushed with lots of oil then cooked on high temperature in a fan oven. When we cook them, the oven is full so they sort of steam each other.
@Amelia, you need to continuously mix the sugar and butter, without stopping. They will come together in the end. Try again.
@Helen, all is under control! Thanks
Dear Yotam and Sammi,
I, like many others love Ottolenghi!! Every time I walk past your window in Motcombe street I am in ore of the beautiful display.
I recently bought your cook book and was planning on making the toffee and banana brownies. However, I was slightly confused by the recipe, to whether I just add 140g of bananas mashed or I make a banana jam and if so what the recipe is for a banana jam.
I also have to add that I adore your butter bean hummus!! and dream about your white chocolate cheesecake with a brownie bottom!! they are incredible!
Thank you,
Iona
@Iona, thanks for the love! You'd need banana jam, apricot jam or raspberry jam. Banana jam is hard to get. To make it you need to cook 400g of bananas with 30ml of lemon juice and 200g of sugar mixed with 10g of fruit pectin. Whisk the whole time as you cook everything on the stove. It needs to bubble for a few minutes before you remove from the heat and allow to cool down.
Hello,
I have been making lots of delicious things from your cookbooks! I LOVE them, and have given the books to friends as gifts.
I also ADORE the lemon polenta cakes in your shop. I have even tried to recreate them at home. Not as good as yours, though! I just wondered if you have some advice on how your chopped pistachios are so lovely and green? I bought some pistachios from the supermarket, but when I chopped them up they were an ugly golden brown and green mixed together. Needless to say, my Ottolenghi "wannabee" cakes were not very pretty.
Thanks for your amazing food!
Louise
@Louise, first, thanks for all the kind words. It is all about the pistachio variety. If you go to a Middle-eastern grocer you are likely to find some of our amazingly green pistacios.
Dear Yotam,
There aren't good enough words to express what a wonderful thing it is to live close by your Islington shop/restaurant and to have your two cookbooks at home.
I have a question. My boyfriend's birthday is coming up in two weeks and I want to get him a really nice birthday cake. Do you do birthday cakes that can be taken home? If not, do you have any recommendations?
Thanks so much (for everything, not just this).
Luisa.
@Louisa, there are plenty of options. Best thing is to contact the restaurant and they will be able to help. You are welcome (for everything)
Yotam
Just wanted to say a huge thanks to you and Lucy at your Islington restaurant for helping to arrange our forthcoming 75th Birthday. Thanks for taking the time to sign our present. Lucy has been a complete star.
I made the raspberry and peach cakes from your book this afternoon and they are fantastic - light, fruity and just scrummy.
We're looking forward to our party at Islington this week - thanks for all of the splendi recipes.
Go for the cake book - it would be a service to humanity.
@Paul, it was a real pleasure. And yes, Lucy is a star, I agree. Hurray to cake!
Dear Yotam
I feel almost that I have stolen from you so great is the combination of pleasure and guilt.
I have made your clementine and almond cake four times now to such great acclaim and flattery that I really need to give you what's rightly yours and pass some of it on.
The recipe is very easy to follow and the cake is simple to make but the results... ah the results. Wow! Not only in the eating, but also in the admiration of the diners. The ratio of effort to admiration was very much skewed to the admiration side. A recipe so simple give a lot of pleasure.
Thank you, Andrew
Dear Yotam,
Since my last visit to your Islington shop at the weekend, I have been dreaming about Ottolenghi's every night. My word, those cupcakes are delicious.
Strawberry Cupcake: divine.
Passionfruit Meringue Cupcake: glorious.
Rhubarb Cheesecake: sumptuous.
The mouthwatering list of delectable delights goes on and on. The best cakes bar none. Any chance I could have a stint in your kitchen for some insight into your secret recipes? (Don't answer that).
Now to go out and buy the recipe books. I need to check which one has the most cake recipes.
CAKE, CAKE, CAKE, CAKE, CAKE.
Yotam
I so enjoyed imagining trying out your salted almond meringues as published in Vogue May 2011. I spotted the recipe at the hairdresser's and thought I would be able to get the recipe online. Alas it does not seem to be available anywhere else! Any chance you could post it here? I will be sure to try them out for upcoming charity event and if all goes well I am sure they will become one of my staples. Thank you so much for oodles of foodie inspiration!
@Andrew, lovely and very generous of you to let me know. I am happy for you to keep on baking and receiving ALL the fame.
@Claudia, Claudia, Claudia - there are only cakes in the Ottolenghi cookbook (none in Plenty) so go out, buy it and have fun.
@Gaby, here's you meringue:
Salted almond meringues
Makes 6 medium size meringues
50g whole skinned almonds
¼ tsp malden sea salt
½ tbsp water
170g caster sugar
3 free-range egg whites (about 90g)
½ tsp white wine vinegar
½ tsp cornflour
A few drops of essential orange oil or almond essence
1 tsp flaked almonds
Heat the oven to 180C and cook for another 50 minutes. When ready, the meringues should be nice and dry underneath and still a little soft in the centre.
Hello Yotam
Living on the North York Moors, it is a rare treat to visit London and have the time to visit one of your restaurants. I had this pleasure earlier in May when I was treated by a friend at the Islington restaurant. We both finished our meal with the most scrummy blackberry financier. I have both your recipe books, but it's not in either. I have also scoured the net, but to no avail. Please might you share this wonderful secret?
With kind regards
Sharon
@Sharon, these friands are quite similar:
Hope it goes well!
Dear Yotam,
A dear friend has asked me to make her wedding cake in September.... I will be using your carrot cake recipe for one layer and your apple olive oil cake for another, I've made them both several times, they are perfection. However, the couple have asked for a coffee cake for the third layer, and in addition have requested no chocolate or nuts. I am stuck and was wondering if you have any suggestions up your culinary sleeve!
(The cake is not going to be stacked, so the weight of the coffee cake does not matter.)
Many thanks,
Naomi
@Naomi, I am honoured. I am afraid I don't have a good recipe without nuts. The good ones always seem to have walnuts in them. Good luck!
Dear Yotam,
I have recently been trying out recipes from your tremendous book, 'Ottolenghi, and everything I have made has turned out great. Well almost...
Brownies - something went wrong. I followed the instructions explicitly (I think!) but after I had added the flour it was apparent that the mixture was very dense, and oily. In the oven the butter appeared to separate and gather at the top. Strange, eh?
Any suggestions on what I might have done wrong would be greatly appreciated. (Incidentally, I removed the chocolate/butter mixture from the heat before it had a chance to crystallise. Maybe it needed to cool down more before going into the sugar/eggs mixture?).
All the best,
Bill
i visited the upper street shop last week and had the chocolate and hazelnut ricotta cake, its by far the best cake ive ever had, cooked a few things from your book before and wud loved to know of a reciepe for this or something similar, the texture of it was not what i was expecting and def goin bak for more next time im in london
May I say Ottolenghi, Notting Hill, was paradise for a five month pregnant lady who was craving for cake this lunchtime. A bag of small sponge cakes, a raspberry meringue and the lemon polenta and pistachio cake did the job! Once I returned home and my 4 year old daughter got her hands on the last few sponge cakes we are both now addicted. Thank you!!!!
Where did you source the mini ball tin for the sponge cakes - they are a perfect size?
Shall be back very soon!
@Bill, that may be the reason. Also, the chocolate shouldn't be too high in percentage. About 60% cocoa solids max.
@Rob, I am afraid you'll need to come back. This one's a secret.
@Vanessa, those are widely available in silicon. Try Kitchen Ideas on Westbourne Grove.
we are from barcelona and we enjoy a lot at ottolenghi each time we visit london, this last time we were at upper street and it was even better than ever. It doesn't matter if it's salty or sweet is always spectacular, congratulations for you and your team.
This summer we are going 4 days to stockholm, I don't know if you could sugest me any adress of deli, take away or restaurant.
thanks so much.
Hi Yotam,
I recently was travelling in london with a friend from Australia on a foodie trip and we were lucky enough to go to all your Ottolenghi Stores at least once (Islington three times, breakfast, lunch and dinner!), dinner at Nopi AND had a fabulous class with Becky Harrymen at Divertimenti. Yes, we like your food a little bit :). I just wanted say a big thank you and congratulate you. Your cafes and restaurants are wonderful and we had consistently fantastic experiences at all of them. We spotted you there but didn't want to interrupt you but i wanted to say thank you. Also Becky gave such a great demo and it was such a pleasure to be there. We would love to see you in melbourne next time you visit Australia!
Thank you,
Karina
just to let you know that you can buy a really fantastic bundt muffin style tin frm a website called bakery bits - quite pricey but very good quality and gives the same shape as the ones in the Ottolenghi cookbook.
It is citrus season here and I have been making the amaretti biscuits using orange zest - divine. Normally these turn out perfectly, time after time. But the last few times I've made them, they have fallen flat rather than staying in little balls like in your photographs. I've tried adding more ground almonds but they still don't keep their shape. Any idea of what could be going wrong? Something to do with the egg whites, beating them too much/not enough?
Any help greatly appreciated!
@Jordi, thank you so much. I am afraid last time I was in Stockholm was 20 years ago so can't really help you. I hope you enjoy the Swedes and eat Jansson's temptation - one of my favourite dishes ever.
@Karina, thank you thank you!
@Rebecca, will have a look.
@Sarah, not quite sure what it could be. I suggest that you chill the mix before shaping. Also, try a different honey. Good luck!
Hi Yotam,
Today was the first time I heard of your shop (sorry). I am a cake geek but didnt know about you. I heard of you and went to your shop in Islington. I just wanted to tell you that it was so beautiful. I am on a diet, but I had to put that on hold and have a savory muffin (some sort of pesto and goat cheese muffin) and a cake. AMAZING! Just wanted to tell you that!
Hope you continue to do well...and make lots more cakes! I see some of your recipies here and I am going to try one. No doubt I will be back in your shop soon...that muffin was soooo good!
Ishara
Yotam,
I have both your cook books and my family love the unique and different recipes.The books stay on my kitchen bench so that I can cook delicious meals that are loved by my family. Next week I am doing an Ottolenghi dinner party and then sharing the recipe source.
We will be in London in January and will be visiting your store on a regular basis.We are foodies from Melbourne, Australia.
Regards
Kris.
@Ishara, thank you.
@Kris, See you soon and love to my beloved Melbourne.
Hi Yotam
i had a two hour stopover in London this week and I sprinted to your fabulous Belgravia store to stock up on goodies! what a treat,i must have bought one of everything! i would love to be able to buy your preserves and spices online,or a hamper, they would make a brilliant present for a friend of mine, is this something that would be available in future?
thanks Edwina xx
p.s Please please open a store north of the border!
@Edwina, We may be selling online in the future but haven't got specific plans. North of the border? It's way too far...
I saw you do a demo at Harvest this weekend. I don't watch much TV so (sorry but) you were a new name to me! I had a raspberry and white chocolate tart from the Chef's kitchen which was so good I actually yelped when I bit into it..
This never happens. Nor does the desire (knowing my pastry fear) to make the recipe over and over and over again until I can make something that approximates what I tried.
Is the recipe in a book somewhere? Please point me in the right direction...
Thank you from me and my jaded, spoilt tastebuds....
Hi Yotam,
I've made your apple and olive oil cake a few times and intend making it for my daughter's 1st birthday. I want to double the quantity and use a 26cm tin. Can you recommend how long I should cook it for? Should I change the oven temperature and would the larger tin suit the volume of batter?
One day I'll make it to London (a bit far from Melbourne)!
Cheers,
Morgana
@Josie, thanks for the compliment! The recipe is in the Ottolenghi cookbook:
@Morgana, I can't tell you exactly how much longer it will take to bake the cake, probably another 20-30 minutes. Just check often with the skewer so not to over-bake it. The quantity to tin size sounds about right and there's no need to change temperature. See you (one day) in London
Thank you Yotam - had best go shopping and cooking!
Hello, we will be in london next month with my girlfriend. She loves your pastry as well as me, but she is allergic to gluten, we know that some of yours are gluten free as the flourless chocolate teacake and others, but we don't now really if the lemon polenta cake has gluten or not and the chocolate fude cake? thank you very much.
@Jordi, both the lemon polenta and the fudge cake are gluten free. Come soon.
I would like to bake your cakes for my celiac friend. Have already done the polenta cake which he loved, and now wonder about replacing polenta for the flour in some of your others? like the pistachio and rosewater semolina? or the clementine and almond? or is this just a bad idea? Thanks!
Hi,
I lived in London for a year, and visited Ottolenghi many times for your fabulous food and, very importantly, cakes.
When I moved back to Denmark, I took your cookbook with me, and now do the cakes myself, with great pleasure. However, I cannot find my Ottolenghi favorite in the book, the chocolate cake with Baileys cream. Is it possible to find the recipe somewhere?
Thank you very much,
Trine.
I am looking for cakes with mint - anything considered but it needs to have mint and/or chocolate for about 10 hungry ice skaters. Can you help?
@Elizabeth, in theory, such alterations can work. Cakes are very temperamental though, so a good dose of experimenting is required.
@Trine, I am afraid this one is a recipe we must week to ourselves. Truly sorry. Try the chocolate cupcakes from the Ottolenghi cookbook. They are similar in a way.
@Richard, no ideas on this front I am afraid. Sorry.
As your neighbour I am just so much in love with your white chocolate cheese cakes. Is there any chance you could post the recipe for the filling as I have both your books but unfortuantely it's not in there? I would love to make them for my family back home in Austria at christmas...
I now live in the south of France but when in London always go to Ottolenghi. My absolute favourite is the little oval cake with fruit in it (there is sometimes a fig and a couple of weekends ago blackberries- made with very little flour or none? and almonds ... with the marscapone on the top. I bought both the cookbooks to be able to find this recipe and I just can't find them in the cookbooks to get my fix! :(( Am I missing something?
Rachel
@Veronika, those are a best-kept secret... Sorry.
@Rachel, not exactly the same but in the same spitrit:
The chocolate fudge cake recipe requires 70% and 52% cocoa solids chocolate
It is easy to get 70% but I can't find 52% anywhere. Even Bournville is only 35-39%.
Do you have any suggestions where I could buy some, or if not, do you have any suggestions of a substitute for the 52% chocolate. What would the effect be if I used a reduced amount of Bournville but increased the quantity of 70%?
Any help would be most appreciated
@Liz, you can use a higher grade like 60% but otherwise a mix of the two will be fine. Happy baking!
I am also a cake geek, but more at the eating end than the making end. I was wondering if you do any baking lessons as I'd love to learn from an expert, I have a tendency to experiment slightly too much whilst cooking which works quite well for other food but not for cake!
Having lived in london for the past 5 years, I had the opportunity to experience the wonderful culinary creations of 0ttolenghi. I recently returned to Canada with both cookbooks, however, I am missing the delicious savory muffins. I was wondering if this recipe is available? Thanks, can't wait for my next return trip!
@Tavi, all our cooking classes are based on savoury at the moment but sounds like I should consider doing baking too!
@Kim, unfortunately the savoury muffins are one that we are keeping secret, sorry.
I am fascinated by the idea of Turkish Spinach cake, the sweet variety. But I dont want it to taste like an eggy sweet spinach omlette. Do you have a recipe for this cake or any suggestions of ingredients that would enhance it? Thankyou for your wonderful passion for cooking. I just received your book for christmas! Thanks.
@Kim, I am not sure what you mean exactly but I don't have a sweet spinach cake recipe. Here is a link to a savoury spinach pie... Hope it helps!
Yotam,
May I just say, how delighted I was when I first discovered your shop in Notting Hill. Since, I am addicted to your cakes!-;)
Now, hopefully I can book myself in one of your cookery classes this year.
That would be fantastic!
@Nora, Thank you! More classes to be announced later this year.
Your chocolate chip cookies? Amazing.
Any chance you could share that recipe?
@lauren, the cookies are one of those recipes that we are keeping secret sorry.
Hello! Tried and make the apple and olive oil cake with maple icing... Cake was beautiful, but icing was a bit 'sad', quite different from the fluffy, gorgeous one you find at your shops
my icing came out just too liquid and not fluffy: what could have gone wrong!
thanks a lot for your help!
bakefanatic
@Giancarlo, I'm sorry to hear it didn't work. There could be a few reasons for this. If the butter was too soft it wouldnt combine and become light and airy with the sugar. Have it at room temperature but not melted. The cream cheese should be full fat, if it is light then it has a higher water content. Try it again and let me know how it goes.
Not sure if I posted this question correctly but hoping to try again. There is an amazing nz company producing freeze dried herbs/fruits, and i'v been thinking of a way to use the passionfruit powder. Wondering about making the amaretti biscuits, but substituting desiccated (or shredded?!) coconut for the ground almonds and adding some passionfruit powder instead of almond essence. From one cake geek to another, what do you think, would it work? Have had great success with them adding different flavors such as cocoa powder or rosewater, etc.
Hi Yotam! re-tried and it worked! i started working with the butter as soon as it reached 10 degrees, which made a huge difference... last question: i have quite a few friends that dont like cinnamon, do you think this cake would also work without it? i think so, but wanted to check the master's view! thanks again!
@Giancarlo, That's great news! Try using ground clove or allspice, but only half the quantity.
@Sarah, it sounds like a great idea. I have some of the dried apple here, it's great. Let me know how your experiments go!
Dear Yotam
I have just cooked your sweet potato wedges with the wonderful dip with lime, lemon grass and ginger in it. I served them on the side and used your baked aubergine with pomegranet recipe on a bed of quinoa. It was one of the best meals ever!! I was so inspired I looked on line to see if there was a way of contacting you to say how much I love your Plenty recipe book. We had the green pancakes the other week and they were sooo good! I married my vegetarian husband in February after being with him for five years - I became veggie three years ago. Your cookbook is perfect for us. So I wanted to say thank you.
best wishes Caroline
@Caroline, Thats great news. I am happy to share these recipes and its great to hear they are enjoyed. Thanks
As an avid cook and a 'cake geek' I am a huge fan of your work. I would also go as far as saying that your books are two of the best I have in my ridiculously large collection. I refer to them constantly. Your approach to food is so refreshing, I just love it!!!
So when can I add a third Yotam?? Have you one in the pipeline?
Thank you, Kell
@Kelly, I have good news for you, there is a third book coming out in September. It's called Jerusalem, a modern take on the wonderful flavours and traditional dishes of the vibrant city.
Dear Yotam,
I live in Australia but was lucky enough to stay with friends in Islington last year who live directly across the road from your shop! My mum and I are gluten intolerant and for her birthday on Monday I was hoping to make her your 'Lemon, Polenta and pistachio cake'. (simply amazing)
I do have one of your books but could not find the recipe in there. Is there anywhere I could get this recipe? is it published in your other books?
Wish I was closer to your delicious food.
Thanks
Katie
@Katie, The Lemon, polenta and pistachio cake is one of those we have chosen not to publish sorry. What did you decide to cook instead?
Dear Yotam,
I will have to come back to England to get my fix! Thank you for your response anyway.
I made my Mum your carrot and walnut cake. It was delicious. The whole family loved it so thank you!
Katie
Your clementine and almond cake is one of my favorites, thank you for sharing the recipe! Just wondering if I can substitute the flour with rice, corn or potato flour to make it gluten free for a friend? Any advice would be appreciated!
Cheers, sarah
Hiya.
I have to provide a pudding for 14 people in November, and I have to make it the day before the dinner party...
Every winter I rediscover your Christmas 2008 Guardian supplement - I love it!
Should I make the Almond and Clementine Syrup Cake (which I saw in a Sept 2012 supplement too ;-) or the Dark Chocolate Mousse with Baileys Cream? (I've wanted to try both for nearly four years now... :-) Which will be 'freshest' 24 hours after making?
Or do you have another suggestion?
I'd appreciate any advice!
Nell.
@Nell, they are both great choices for the following day. The chocolate mousse is silky smooth and a real treat but you will need to make a double recipe. Same for the cake, you will need 2 for 14 guests and this will leave you left overs which you can enjoy for days after. Enjoy!
@Sarah, I think any of them could work to replace the flour as it isn't a large quantity, but I haven't tried it myself. Do a test run, and let me know how it goes!
Hi just to say a massive thanks to yotam for the clementine and almond syrup cake and spiced cookies recipes . I have a stall at the farmers market in Lincoln once a month and both these items were so well received at today's market . I made sure you were mentioned many times , thanks again . Eileen
Hi Yotam
I was watching your programme on Morocco and saw you make the easy version of Warakyou made in the riad. Would it be possible to have the proportions of water, flour, oil and salt as I would love to have a try.
Many thanks
Fatemah
Hi just to say my sister and I had lunch at your Islington branch yesterday and were in food heaven for the duration. We have been enjoying cooking and eating our way through your recipes since your first book came out!
We took some of your delicious cakes home to share with our family, the white chocolate cheesecake with raspberries was a stand out and I will be making that myself very soon!! We also took a hazelnut, chocolate and ricotta cake which was divine and reminded me of a cake my Oma used to make, is it possible to get the recipe for this cake as it does not appear in any of your book :-(
Keep up the amazing work and keep the recipes coming! We will be back soon!
Thanks
Zaina
Hi there, I've just bought the Ottolenghi - The Cookbook and it's tremendous (as I'm sure you know!). I've been in the cooking doldrums a little of late and this has reignited my enthusiasm! I tried the Chocolate Fudge Cake recipe yesterday and it came out really wet despite keep giving it longer and longer in the oven (the crusty bits around the edges are delicious though!).
Things that could have of affected it are:-
- didn't use a springform cake tin. I used one with a loose bottom and the sides were fairly high (9cm)
- when I stirred in the egg yolks to the melted chocolate mixture it then seemed to look a little grainy, not sure whether this indicated the mixture was too warm and the egg had scrambled slightly?
- I wasn't sure whether I'd overdone the meringue (I'm a bit of a meringue novice, I love them but avoid making them as it would seem like a dangerous path to type 2 diabetes). The meringue was very firm I thought and it took some stirring in.
I'm keen to give the recipe another go and came across this thread when doing a bit of googling so thought I'd add a comment - your thoughts would be appreciated.
Regards
Denise
Hi Yotam,
At christmas I had the pleasure of eating one of your flourless lemon and pistachio cakes. Ever since then it's been on my mind, and now that I'm back in Australia, your store is just TOO FAR AWAY!!
Does this recipe feature in any of your books?
Thanks for bringing so many delicious things into this world!
Lani
@Eileen, thank you!
@Fatemah, sadly I didn't get the recipe! I can only say it is a pancake consistency.
@Zaina, @Lani, not great news I'm afraid, neither of these recipes have been published.
@Denise, this is a hard one. The tin, egg (yes, chocolate was too warm) and/or meringue shouldn't affect it. It is quite a moist cake when in the oven and will set more once out. If it doesn't I would normally say leave it in the oven for longer, but you tried this... Did you cook it in the two stages?
After cooking and cooling put in the fridge to help it set. It is meant to be soft and fudgey so bring it back to room temp before serving. Good luck!
Hi Yotam
I was wondering if you could help me. I am charged with making a friend's wedding cake in August and she wants sweet tarts - but I have to somehow make these in advance and transport them from London to the south of France before filling them with only basic kitchen equipment the day before the wedding.
If I make sweet pastry and blind bake it in advance, maybe shaving 5 mins off the cooking time, could I freeze it cooked and then defrost and reheat (not in a tin) the day before the wedding? Or do I have to freeze it unbaked in the tin/in a ball and then panic the day before?
I was also thinking of using your white chocolate and raspberry recipe but substituting passion fruit jam/coulis instead of raspberry, or would that be a bit sweet? She wants passion fruit/tropical flavours.
Thank you for any help in advance and happy Easter,
Laura
Hello Yotam
I was in London a few weeks ago and had a great lunch at your Islington restaurant, everything was absolutely and without reservation fantastically and inspiringly good, but the cake, the CAKE, the Orange & Almond cake at the end was without a doubt the most delicately yet at the same time robustly flavoured and exquisitely textured and wizardly concatenation of deliciousness that I have ever put in my mouth. What is more, the experience almost passed me by, as the cake I think looks quite modest and unprepossessing and certainly does not stand out amongst the other much more baroque creations displayed in your shop window (and also sounded quite dry, both literally and figuratively, on the basis of your charming employee’s description). But my friend (with whom I was sharing dessert) insisited on a flourless creation, so the Orange & Almond cakelet it was. I was utterly transported, my taste-buds zinging and singing odes of joy, and immediately felt the need to try to reproduce this supreme empress amongst cakes. I looked through all of your recipe-books and found nothing comparable, but then came across a Christmas recipe in the Guardian for a Clementine & Almond cake which sounded like it could be related to the Orange & Almond cake I so enjoyed. The Guardian Clementine & Almond cake was however a large cake (baked in a cake-tin), whereas the Orange & Almond cake I had in your shop had been baked in a cup-cake/muffin tin. So I am therefore writing with a few questions: (1) Could I indeed bake the Orange & Almond cakes (in their smaller incarnation) on the basis of the Christmas recipe for a Clementine & Almond cake from the Guardian (and, if so, how long would they need cooking (15-20 minutes?)); (2) if the Clementine & Almond cake from the Guardian would require some tweaking to produce the smaller Orange & Almond cakes, would you have any quick tips on how to effect such tweaks?; and (3) please, please, please could you put the recipe for those smaller Orange & Almond cakes in your next recipe-book? Many thanks for that amazing cake and for any answer you may have the time to give me. Best regards, Martin Burns
@Martin, that's great to hear! You can definitely use the Clementine and almond recipe for individual cakes. Bake them at 160C for about 40 minutes, checking they dont get too dark. reduce the oven to 150C if they start to. Enjoy!
@Laura, It is such a wonderful honour to make a friends wedding cake, congratulations! I am 99% sure the tart cases will be fine if cooked, transported, defrosted and filled - without the process of reheating. The best way to be sure is to do a test run. Also think about how you are getting them to France. They will be very delicate.
Passion fruit and white chocolate will be delicious, just dont use too much sugar in the passion fruit jam/coulis. Good luck!
Hi Yotam,
I came down to London after having developed a pretty strong obsession with your cookbooks and recipes for quite some time.. And ended up going to Notting hill and Nopi within 24 hours! I was like a kid in a toy store. They are both outstanding... I loved seeing the vibrancy and diversity of the beautiful ingredients so much that they are like spalshes of paint on a white canvas and are all the decoration the store requires! One of the things I tried that i can still taste in my mind daily is the apricot sponge tart (you make them in a variety of flavours), the fruit so tender but still with a bite, the sponge so moist and base so crispy was amazing!! However I can't seem to find the recipe anywhere and I have 15 people this Friday night and am desperate to make it... Can you help??
Thanks so much and just to add I think it's lovely you have such a personal touch on this site with your fans.
@Gemma, I haven't published this recipe but this is the basis of it. You will need to test it a few times to get it right, probably not the best idea to test it on 15 friends!
Make a plain crumble base, compress in a cake tin. Spread over a generous layer of almond cream, and top with fruit. Bake 200C until cooked in the centre and golden on top. Glaze with apricot jam. Leave to cool, then enjoy! |
iOS 6.0.1 coming in weeks, brings improvements and bug fixes
0. phoneArena posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:17
According to a new rumor, Apple is currently testing the first update to iOS 6, which will be iOS 6.0.1. The good news is that the relatively minor update is expected to become available in a few weeks...
This is a discussion for a news. To read the whole news, click here
1. android_hitman posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:25 6 17
nice to have the most advanced operating system in the world
4. Dilmah posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:29 24 5
most advanced? rofl you cant even send files via bluetooth ^^
19. PhenomFaz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 11:43 6 4
what update? its going to look the same anyway :)
and what new features? when ios6 came out thepeople couldn't name 20 new features whereas Apple claimed it had 200 new features!
moreover i thought this os was perfect...so why the bug fixes Apple people :)
22. Mxyzptlk posted on 22 Oct 2012, 11:53 2 4
Don't be evil
47. PhenomFaz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:35 0 0
oh c'mon, its not being evil its called having light fun!
what does it matter? Neither you nor I own iOS or android buddy..i just saw a good chance of havin fun makin a comment so I took it.
Evil's a strong word...this is a forum...watch what you call others...this is advice :)
26. SleepingOz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 12:39 3 0
It is perfect actually!
iSsues are the new features!
And more coming with iOS 6.0.1
46. PhenomFaz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:33 0 0
Nice!
39. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:55 2 4
Do u use iOS? If not then y does it matter enough for u to even comment?
71. PhenomFaz posted on 23 Oct 2012, 09:49 1 1
i follow technology trends and I have the freedom to voice my opinion regardless of whther I use iOS or not...I haven't practically dealt with all matters of importance to mankind on Earth but I do have opinions on them based on learning which we humans do to evolve.
And yes I do have an iPad and I am quite bored with it now...and there are a few other iDevices in my household belonging to my familia...hope that answers your question mate...So now do I have the permission to voice my opinion?
57. mandkeee posted on 22 Oct 2012, 19:24 2 1
i can tell this.....
in this website most of users hate IOS.....
the only one reason???
because IOS is way much better than android...
but they dont wanna believe this fact....
58. PapaSmurf posted on 22 Oct 2012, 20:33 2 1
Statement only holds true for version 2.0 and before. Sorry.
iOS is playing catch up to Gingerbread, and is no where near Jellybean.
72. PhenomFaz posted on 23 Oct 2012, 09:52 0 1
Oh dont play victim here!
People have opinions and they voice it...android users dont single out iOS users and bash them or something, yes you find most of the public opinion on this site in favor of android because android has a much larger customer base so its natural that statisticallly most of the people on the site are using android and therefore are in favor of it
Fuuny how you say iOS users are being singled out on this website...I for one got banned because I said something against iOS usage...I was thinking this is iPhoneArena instead of PhoneArena but hey its the site moderator's choice to do what they see fit according to the rules...
Hey mods I actually love the site and respect your reporting of tech news...but dont BAN me again :)
73. sithvenger (banned) posted on 24 Oct 2012, 17:05 0 0
Please ban him
74. chaoticrazor posted on 24 Oct 2012, 17:15 0 0
Why because he doesn't agree with you, he shouldn't be banned just for making you look stupid
75. PhenomFaz posted on 25 Oct 2012, 03:39 0 0
hey i wont get banned just because you desire it iFan! however I haven't reported you for trolling cause if i did your a$$ woud have surely been banned!
56. mandkeee posted on 22 Oct 2012, 19:21 2 1
yes it is most advanced......are you kidding me.....
android one of worst OS ever had
8. PowTheBowl posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:53 8 3
and no widgets!
11. Droid_X_Doug posted on 22 Oct 2012, 10:20 5 5
Who needs stinking widgets? They just suck up CPU cycles.... ;-)
36. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:38 0 0
Droid x since when did u degenerate into uselessly insulting apple bro? I remember reading posts of yours regarding apple, and iOS that made me really respect your opinion. Now u seem to have sunk into the crowd, instead of being the usual intellectual u normally are. SMDH!!!
68. Droid_X_Doug posted on 22 Oct 2012, 23:34 0 0
Didn't you see the wink at the end of the post? I am not insulting iOS. I could have gone real hard on iOS. Instead, I used a facetious comment to play off Pow's post. As an aside, it seems that the iP5 is at the top of the benchmarks at the moment. Apple does have an out-dated UI. Conversely, they have a very robust security model (probably the most robust in the mobile industry at the moment).
How is that for objective assessment?
70. sithvenger (banned) posted on 23 Oct 2012, 05:49 0 0
I gotcha bro
23. Dilmah posted on 22 Oct 2012, 11:57 5 1
blabla, if ios also would have widgets then apple fans wouldnt say that widgets su*ks and it is battery killer.... I remember when apple fans were shouting that 3.5" is the best screen size and bigger screen is only for noobs... After apple introduced iphone with 4" screen, apple fans started to claim that bigger screen is a nice feature.... /facepalm
30. gallitoking posted on 22 Oct 2012, 13:33 2 4
is call evolution.. dude.. years ago I thought my Droid X was not only the biggest mada^% phone on the planet.. and now i am in iOS.. again evolution
34. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:30 0 5
Galitto why even bother aguing with these folks? They wake up every morning to prowl for apple/iOS/iPhone articles, just to sit there and post insults to make each other laugh out loud, and give thumb ups. Dude just enjoy iOS like I do, and let the ones who hate on apple do just that. U cannot win this pointless battle, jus let em hate, insult, and call us iOS users all the names they want. Is apple losing sleep over this? No. Am I losing sleep over this? No are u losing sleep over this???
63. TROLL posted on 22 Oct 2012, 22:10 0 0
Well said and the truth. All ios haters are on the net trolling on them. A red from me.®©
61. Nadr1212 posted on 22 Oct 2012, 20:47 0 0
NEXT YEAR!!!! whats that suppose to mean?!?!?! The world might end THIS year, according to the movie, 2012. :(
2. Mxyzptlk posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:28 5 17
The most advanced mobile operating system in the world.
18. chaoticrazor posted on 22 Oct 2012, 11:43 6 3
Lmao ohhh funny.......wait you actually believe that? A dead OS like symbian is more advanced
24. chaoticrazor posted on 22 Oct 2012, 12:00 5 2
Lack of support,development,apps and the fact Nokia dropped it. Point been Nokia killed an OS that was more advanced then iOS so your comment is BS on a high level
iOS isn't the most advanced you talk crap there. Its a glorified app launcher with too many restrictions.how can a locked down app launcher be the most advanced?
64. TROLL posted on 22 Oct 2012, 22:13 0 1
Chaoticrazar well and wizely said. You totally shut and dissed him. +1 from me.®©
35. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:34 2 4
Mxyzptlk. Dude why even bother arguing? iOS rocks, we iOS users know what we like and want n an OS. I love the new features of iOS 6, look forward to the next update. My iPhone 5 has no issues that I can speak of, and if I did or develops some then oh well, a software update will fix it.
37. chaoticrazor posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:39 1 2
We ain't talking about what works for you. He arrogantly stated it was the most advanced so I want to know how he can even think that
38. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:46 1 1
Well if that's what he feels, that's what he feels. I read your posts, and u arrogantly dis and insult apple, and iOS users n almost every post. How can u even think that?
40. chaoticrazor posted on 22 Oct 2012, 16:56 1 2
Haha no mate I call the arrogant apple Trolls on there bs. You cant announce that iOS Is the most advanced and not back it up. And dont try acting the voice of reason, many apple trolls dis every other os and person.
Notice i say apple trolls and not users , uses are fine but its the trolls that ruin this site with there blind loyalty. Like that gallitking guy darkkjedi and him. above.
And i doubt you read my comments as i didnt dis iOS i stated facts of what it is
41. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 17:11 1 0
Ok if u say so, but I can't speak for gallito or darkkedi. I jus go off what I read, and u seem (seem) that is to really hate apple and insult its users. One of which I am. Oh, and I'm not the voice of reason, I jus feel apples users have the rite to rep their OS of choice like anyone else
48. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:37 0 0
Do u see this OS debacle starting to spill over into real life, and not just the Internet? This level of prejudice from android and iOS users is crazy. Tension like this is usually reserved for race, or religion. I've been reading over a lot of people's posts, and I'm shocked at the level of direspect, prejudice, and threats that I see. I hope I don't start seeing people assaulted, or physically harassed due to carrying an iPhone, or gs3. What r your thoughts on this issue?
49. CRICKETownz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:40 2 2
defending software that's dead (Symbian) as more advanced, yet no one wants it...is not very credible on your part. the number of arrogant, narrow-minded android fans that litter this site vastly out number those who are fans of iOS. if you have valid reasons for liking iOS...then you get termed a "troll" for speaking out about why you don't care for android. you show me five single derogatory comments made on this site from an iOS fan against android & i'll show you 20 different articles related to Apple that android fans who can't help themselves from sharing their negative opinions. there's constructive criticism & there is being an asshole. unfortunately, most of the android community on this forum falls under assholes. you don't like iOS, i get it...shut the hell up & move on.
51. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:54 0 0
Wowwwww! Now that's a good friggin post dude. Honest as honest can b. I applaud u I really do.
69. chaoticrazor posted on 23 Oct 2012, 05:38 1 1
No one wants it, your generalising as many would want symbian and to have it continue. Not credible, this is a tech site and although symbian has been announced dead its still around and still an extremely functional OS but you think as im not praising iOS im a hater.
No he is a troll, and he didnt speak with any Common sense h stated it was the most advanced and i wanted his reasons then you pretend peacemakers come in acting like its a big attack on apple. And worse you class attack the android users as again you class anyone that aint praising apple as a fandroid how simple minded are you
Ohh and dont worry you will have you apple troll cheerleaders supporting you on your arrogant little quest as you make it Look like all iOS users are victims on this site when fact is if the stopped talking absolute bs then they wouldnt be called on it.
Ohh and i wont shut up, but suggest you and your apple trolls do as you add nothing to the site
65. TROLL posted on 22 Oct 2012, 22:17 0 1
So what. Whats the big idear. Or big deal.®©
62. Nadr1212 posted on 22 Oct 2012, 20:49 0 0
ur right, we're talking about wat works for me cuz im more important than yall anyways!!!
43. matrix_neo posted on 22 Oct 2012, 17:14 0 1
can you please explain to us how and why it is the most advanced mobile os in the world? if you can't do that it means you just copy paste those words in apple website. if it is advanced why is it some of it's features and functionality are also being used in android for a long time now. advanced means they created something that other competitors still hasn't created it. that's my thoughts after reading your comment.
44. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 17:26 3 1
No innovate means they created something no one else is using. Advanced means to further their platform, which they've done. Apples OS approach isn't better, or worse than android, windows etc. it's just different. Their marketing model is to the mainstream user not specifically to the techie crowd. Think Corvette and Camry, both r great cars but they cater to totally different markets. One does more, but requires a lot more to keep it running smoothly. One does a little less ei widgets live wall papers, but requires less to keep it running smoothly. Both r top notch os's though to their users. I love both to b honest, but iOS is my Camry (my daily driver). I guess I'm a blind stupid ish##% now right?
50. CRICKETownz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:45 1 1
thumbs up...but they still won't get the analogy. you have to type the words "android is the best" for them to accept what you have to say.
53. sithvenger (banned) posted on 22 Oct 2012, 18:56 0 0
Thumbs up to u to bro
76. chaoticrazor posted on 25 Oct 2012, 05:59 0 0
Get over yourself, you really have a stick up your ass. So again all apple fans play the whinny victim when someone disagrees and worse they put everyone else as android users.
People don't hate iOS they hate you lot the apple trolls that talk crap and then high five each other ......so sad
5. RaKithAPeiRiZ posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:32 3 0
Bugfix my a*s
6. sudbury78 posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:40 5 3
Yay! Just makes my incredible iPhone better than it is!
27. SleepingOz posted on 22 Oct 2012, 12:41 1 0
not much then..
7. PAPINYC posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:45 10 1
Noooooo, say it aint so!!!
I don't want my purple fotos to go away; I want to keep the horizontal lines on my keyboard; I want to be lost with Apple Maps and I want to keep blaming a bad connection on iWiFi problems.
9. PowTheBowl posted on 22 Oct 2012, 09:54 1 0
I don't want the horizontal guide lines on my keyboard to go away :(
12. Droid_X_Doug posted on 22 Oct 2012, 10:23 3 1
You forget the part about how getting lost helps you meet new people as you are forced to ask for directions.....
I bet you never knew you needed to make new acquaintances.
66. TROLL posted on 22 Oct 2012, 22:27 0 1
Honestly PAPINYC that was really so funny and taking the piss and diss on ios users and fans. I really enjoy reading your posts. I wish i could give u loads a thumbs up.+1 from me bro. ®©
10. toiletcleaner posted on 22 Oct 2012, 10:19 5 0
they will introduce the new ilost map.
and they will take ( one more time ) some features from Google.
Apple Now.
iHome widgets
iStreet view
for those who buy the iPhone5. they will include a pair of iGlasses
13. Droid_X_Doug posted on 22 Oct 2012, 10:28 3 0
Ummm. I believe you are referring to renowlutionary iNow product? Please call it by its proper name. It should not be confused with the un-washed masses of iNferior products.
14. ZEUS.the.thunder.god posted on 22 Oct 2012, 10:29 0 0
keeping the problems with new iphone and ios6 in mind, I was expecting apple to release ios 6.1 lol |
Amazingly,.
For those who would still insist on the infallibility or perfection of the Bible, consider a simple, and glaring deception in the very titles of the books. The four Gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John have been presented and widely understood as the words of the four disciples of the same names. But it is now widely acknowledged, by even the most conservative scholars, that those four books were not written by Matthew, Mark, Luke, or John. Little to nothing is known about their authors except that they were not eye witnesses, they were not the apostles, and they were writing down stories that were retellings of retellings of retellings. They were given those names to foster the illusion of legitimacy and authenticity and the deception was propagated for centuries.
In a flimsy attempt to explain away this lie with “context” the believer may argue that Matthew wasn’t written by Matthew, but nevertheless, that gospel still tells the story of the apostle Matthew as it was later relayed to the author. But in fact, Matthew was cribbed for the most part, from the Gospel of Mark, so this attempt to explain away the glaring error in the perfect, error free text collapses too.
Far from being some sort of divinely guarded perfect record, the Bible is full of serious mistakes and deceptions. Not even the titles of the books can be trusted. It couldn't pass the rules concerning accuracy and plagiarism for a Freshman Composition class.
Thursday, February 19, 2009
The Perfect Word of God
Amazingly,.
57 comments:
This Christian does not believe the biblical text to be inerrant.
There are flaws and contradictions.
To be expected.
It was written by men. I do believe they were inspired by God, but they were still human.
I do believe that the overarching message of the bible is true.
The bible shows us our need of a Savior and it shows us the savior we need...in Christ Jesus.
God uses imperfect tools for accomplish His perfect will.
The bread and wine of communion, the water of baptism, the imperfect words in the bible, and Jesus Himself...who was fully man.
There are no human rational explanations for this. It's taken on faith. The faith that God gives us throught the hearing of the gospel (Christ died for your sins and forgives you) and in the sacraments of Baptism and Holy Communion.
No strong arm tactics here.
One either believes it...or not.
The universe does not revolve the belief or unbelief of any particular person.
I would not be a believer if God hadn't made me one. No one can believe this of their own volition.
Whats wrong with the bible?
Most Americans Believe in Higher Power, Poll Finds
wow 92 percent I guess the only irrational people around here is the insane atheist blogger...it takes more than name calling to refute all these peoples belief MR. atheist
Nothing is wrong with the Bible.
Every jot and tittle is not perfect, errorless, direct from Heaven wrapped up with a bow on it.
It's fully a product of God AND man.
God uses imperfect man to do what He wills.
The all powerful creator of the universe and everything in it uses an imperfect tool (humans) to create an imperfect book (the bible) that if misunderstood by the reader results in punishment for all eternity?
And you want me to believe this tripe?
Carbon Based,
And you want me to believe this tripe?
I don't give a rat's ass if you believe it or not.
Anonymous,
That's an argument ad populum fallacy. Whether there is a "higher power" or not isn't dependent upon the number of people who believe it.
Sure, we can all "believe" in something, but that doesn't make it true. Sometimes it's just wishful thinking. Seriously, just look at politics. That's more than enough evidence to show that people will believe anything, in large numbers.
"I don't give a rat's ass if you believe it or not."
Well how very christian of you.
Carbon Based,
As a Christian, I can tell you to go fuck yourself if I wanted to.
Christianity isn't about my behavior or goodness (maybe somebody's fed you that line of horse manure but it's patently false).
Back to the original point.
If you read my original comment on this post, you would realize that I REALLY DO NOT CARE if you believe or not.
Ciao, Carbon
"If you read my original comment on this post, you would realize that I REALLY DO NOT CARE if you believe or not."
Just like "god", huh?
Sure, I could not send you to eternal punishment for merely believing in the *wrong* religion such as Islam or Hinduism, but that wouldn't be...
it wouldn't be...
you know, what do you think heaven would be like if we let in all good people?
Teleprompter,
What God wants to do with you or I is His business.
Who knows, the time may come when you and I are "up there" sitting around sharing a beer.
Who knows? I don't...that's for sure.
Anybody that says that they do know, for sure, is a bit arrogant.
I successfully converted two of my friends to Atheism some time ago. I wasn't trying to be a missionary, but they couldn't ignore the logic.
However, I think basic psychology has something to do with belief states. So, many (but not all) so called conversion processes have something to do with that.
Charisma is a factor in all of our lives, especially combined with good arguments and non-emotional reasoning.
Why should I believe the Bible over the Koran? Or the Odyssey?
On a side note, the universe did not come from nothing - that doesn't make sense - a singularity is a mathematical failure of correspondence to physical reality. At best it (a singularity) shows an unknown position of physicality.
Then what is the "physical"?
Well God definitely plays no part.
The Bible tells me less good information for knowledge then the vast majority of other books. Why? It should be simple to point out the inconsistencies of the Bible in comparison to even moderately good scientific and literature based books of the 18th century, which are much richer even though crude my later standards - which show why I should give the Bible a passing glance of ridiculous iron age reasoning in comparison.
"And you want me to believe this tripe?"
choose wisely..
uh tele its no fallacy dude you need to go and understand more carefully what was posted...like the fact that this atheist blogger is hell bent on labeling people who disagree with him "irrational" or "credulous".
there was no argument made saying X is correct because populus Y says so....
yo there mr. jon why would you use the scientific method to disprove the bible? isnt the bible a religious text...
your friends couldnt deny the logic so they converted atheism? how about all those logicans? they all atheist? any of them a believer and still logical? oh wait wasnt godel a believer? how about einstien and other scientists?
it gets pretty old hearing atheist resort to the "believers are irrational" mantra...isnt that ad hominem???
"Far from being some sort of divinely guarded perfect record, the Bible is full of serious mistakes and deceptions. Not even the titles of the books can be trusted. It couldn't pass the rules concerning accuracy and plagiarism for a Freshman Composition class"
funny its taught on college campuses across the nation. I bet your bottom tier college has courses on that freshman level book...
Good point Matt. I think the facts surrounding the Bible are coming to the surface as common knowledge (thank you History channel! lol), but I have never thought about linking the inherent deception behind the titles to the deception throughout the content.
For some examples of the hilarious outakes of the Bible, a fellow Xangan blogger gives you
A Walkthrough
To Anon:
Godel may have been good at one kind of logic and terrible at another. Picasso may have been good at certain forms of art and terrible at other forms.
Therefore, I am being specific and not miss-generalizing various forms of abilities.
Einstein was great at most physics, but was wrong at certain specifics.
It goes for all of us, eh?
So therefore, no ad-hominem.
"If you read my original comment on this post, you would realize that I REALLY DO NOT CARE if you believe or not."
If you really don't care what I or anyone else believes why are you here? Your self-contradicting. (I guess that's what you get for believing in the contradicting nonsense that is the christian cult)
If you truly did not care you wouldn't be here trying to explain your wacky believe system to a bunch of atheists and skeptics, you'd be some where else being more productive.
Anonymous:
The Bhagavad-Gita is also taught in colleges, but you don't believe that, do you?
Einstein didn't believe in a personal god...double check your information; not that it matters, though. It's just anecdotal evidence anyway. Lots of brilliant people believed in Christianity...but that doesn't verify it. Newton was a Biblical literalist...but does that verify
Biblical literalism?
And yes, you did commit a fallacy: you said 92 percent of people believed in a higher power, therefore the author of this post must be "insane".
Carbon Based,
Good question!
I'll tell you why I'm here.
1) to dispell false notions of what it means to be a believer.
2) it's my job, as a believer, to speak of the One who has died for the sins of the world and forgives each and every one of us...that whoever HEARS IT (really hears it) might have faith and believe.
It's not my job to convert anyone. I couldn't do it if I wanted to.
When I say that I really don't care what you believe in, or don't believe in...I mean it. I don't care.
There was a time when I did. But I think I am growing in my faith of Jesus and I am leaving all the hard stuff to Him.
so jon you still were saying that believers are non logical...so was godel and einstein being illogical in their beliefs of a higher power?
sorry tele but you have misunderstood what ad populum fallacy is...there was no arg saying X is right becasue populus Y thinks so try wikipedia or somethin plz and stop being a impotent college student crying fallacies where none appear...
what the heck is your point about hinduism being taught as well? i feel like you have trouble reading peoples post correctly...
If einstien believed in a non personal god verses a personal god, how does this negate the position that einstien isnt still illogical? C'mon atheist lets see you defend your tenuous beliefs for once without name calling...
"1) to dispell(sic) false notions of what it means to be a believer."
"I don't give a rat's ass if you believe it or not."
"If you read my original comment on this post, you would realize that I REALLY DO NOT CARE if you believe or not."
"2) it's my job, as a believer, to speak of the One who has died for the sins of the world and forgives each and every one of us...that whoever HEARS IT (really hears it) might have faith and believe."
Dude are your really that thick? Do you not see the irrationality of your statements/thinking. What is keeping you head from exploding from the massive cognitive dissonance?
So which is it you care what I and other people believe or you don't?
Carbon Based,
I'm starting to think that you are "thick".
That you don't believe in God is not my problem (it's yours). I do not care if you don't belivee because I cannot do anything about it. Are you with me?
But your misconceptions about what Christianity IS...I can do something about...like correct you.
Is that so hard to understand?
Not that Einstein's personal beliefs have anything to do with the existence (or lack there of) of a deity, can we at least let him speak for himself?
“I am a deeply religious nonbeliever.… This is a somewhat new kind of religion.”
Albert Einstein, in a letter to Hans Muehsam, March 30, 1954
"C'mon atheist lets see you defend your tenuous beliefs for once without name calling..."
OK Anon, I'll take that challenge. Let's hypothetically say for a moment that Einstein was a deeply devoted Christian (contrary to a vast body of evidence). Could he hold that empirically untenable belief and still be a brilliant physicist?
Yes, it is called compartmentalization. That is where an individual uses one set standards to judge the validity of most claims they are faced with everyday but, when certain topics are addressed they change the criteria of acceptance. It is quite common among the human species. In fact I'd venture to say it is universal.
And as long as the belief to which they give the free pass to isn't overly harmful, they can live quite successful and rational lives.
Newton for instance was quite a fan alchemy. Had he applied the same standards of evidence to alchemy he did to physics, he would have abandoned it. But other than wasting some time and money his irrational belief in alchemy did not harm him enough for his overall behavior to be judged irrational. He was just irrational in this one particular instance.
Anon,
My comment above applies equally to 92% of Americans you cite in your previous post. And to that I would like to add some other things that millions of Americans believe:
Roughly 50% believe that humans were created in their current form less than 10,000 ya.
One in five Americans believe the sun revolves around the earth.
Roughly 50% believe in ESP.
About 25% believe in Astrology.
More than 30% believe in clairvoyance.
So, do I believe millions and millions of people can hold irrational beliefs without being considered irrational overall? You bet I do. But that doesn't change the fact that I believe they are being irrational with respect to certain things that they believe.
My personal favorite example of compartmentalization.
Historian and theologian Mark Roberts is asked , winder what percentage of the world's population believe that life came from 'no life'.
Or that 'it just happened'?
Head in the Sand wrote:
"I winder what percentage of the world's population believe that life came from 'no life'. Or that 'it just happened'?"
Suppose instead the question were: "I wonder what percentage of the world's population believe that snowflakes came from 'no snowflakes'. Or that 'it just happened'?"
Why do you expect such a different answer to the first of these questions than the second? Is it simply a matter of the DEGREE of complexity? Is it something else?
Anon,
You keep bringing up Godel as if he's the epitome of rational thought and discourse. The guy was insane. I mean literally. He starved himself to death after his wife passed away and was no longer around to tell him that no one was poisoning his food. He hated hospitals and continued to deteriorate till his death after hospitalization.
He was also a Platonic realist and believed mathematical entities had an actually real existence. Should we also agree this ontological claim is true simply because Godel believed it? That'd be moronic and the worst kind of inference.
Guess what? I can also make a logical black box that will make true whatever you want to believe. It only depends on propositional logic (though I can make a first-order set theoretical or first-order predicate version). It goes like this
{A,¬A}╞ ■
What does that say? It means the set of propositions A and not A prove wtf-ever you want. Replace the black box by "God is real" or "The moon is made of cheese" and it comes as true because every proof has an associated implication of the form
╞ {A,¬A} → ■
Which anyone with a basic understanding of logic should know that an implication is true whenever its antecedent is false. The antecedent is a contradiction and therefore always false. Therefore, whatever you want to fill the black box with is always true. This is a move used in many mathematical proofs (e.g., the empty set proves many cases of a theorem vacuously).
So is that what you want to grasp at? Empty logical claims simply because they're logical? Simply because some system of logic will have models that satisfy notions of God? This is a worse move, I would say, than the naturalistic fallacy in ethics. You basically take something abstract and apply it to reality to make ontological claims with complete disregard for qualifying that move. You ignore the giant chasm that stands between the abstract and the ontological like someone ignoring the fact that statements about what is are not immediately isomorphic (if at all) to valuational or normative statements. How the hell do you just say "logic says X, therefore reality says it too." Logic can be used to prove whatever you want. Get real.
But is that how you want God to exist? Vacuously through some empty notion of logic? You have to realize, logic is syntactical and denotative. We supply the connotations, the semantics and meaning. That black box model I presented will prove anything in propositional logic, albeit, vacuously. But it does so without even having anything to fill the variables yet. We have no idea what the box or the A state. We match it to things that are ontological and model them after the relations of reality. Yet, you haven't qualified how that move is done at all. In fact, you think it sounds true without even stating anything in reality! Even if we can make a logical deductive inference about God in some system of logic, even if we can find a model to satisfy that statement, it will never have to say anything about reality or the natural world.
Like abstract Platonic entities, God might exist as such a thing, but it certainly wouldn't have anything to do with reality, no more than the supposedly existing object 2. If God exists, I will assert, then so does infinity, the infinite set of numbers as individual objects in the world, and so do all the functions that would solve the statement f(x)=5. Unfortunately, they're probably hanging out in a bar somewhere that all those elves and unicorns are, too, because I can just never find those damn guys.
Well Head in the Sand,
I don’t know for sure. In fact I don’t even know if such a study has ever been done. But I would imagine it is about the same percentage as those who have read and understood articles like this one (subscription required). A few excerpts:
"Now is a good time to be doing this research, because the prospects for success are greater than they have ever been," says John Sutherland, a chemist at the University of Manchester in the United Kingdom. He and others are addressing each of the steps involved in the transition to life: where the raw materials came from, how complex organic molecules such as RNA formed, and how the first cells arose. In doing so, they are inching their way toward making life from scratch.
Over the past few years, they have documented almost an entire route from prebiotic molecules to RNA and are preparing to publish even more details of their success. Discovering these new reactions makes Sutherland suspect it wouldn't have been that hard for RNA to emerge directly from an organic soup. "We've got the molecules in our sights," he says.
Tracey Lincoln and Gerald Joyce of the Scripps Research Institute in San Diego, California, have shown how [spontaneous self-replication] might have been possible. They designed a pair of RNA molecules that join together and assemble loose nucleotides to match their partner. Once the replication is complete, old and new RNA molecules separate and join with new partners to form new RNA. In 30 hours, Lincoln and Joyce found, a population of RNA molecules could grow 100 million times bigger.
Now [Jack] Szostak is running experiments to bring his protocells closer to life. He is developing new forms of RNA that may be able to replicate longer molecules faster. For him, the true test of his experiments will be whether his protocells not only grow and reproduce, but evolve.
"To me, the origin of life and the origin of Darwinian evolution are essentially the same thing," says Szostak. And if Darwin was alive today, he might well be willing to write a lot more about how life began.
I must be confused or more then likely it is my limited education. As I understand it the christian god is perfect. I have never understood how something can be perfect if its main creation is imperfect. The way I understand perfect, anything done by someone or something that is perfect should be perfect. If it isn't then the creator isn't perfect.
With this in mind then either man and the bible is a perfect creation or the christian god isn't what people believe it to be.
Please explain this to me since I have read enough of the bible to know it isn't perfect as we define perfect.
M. Tulley,
"To me, the origin of life and the origin of Darwinian evolution are essentially the same thing," says Szostak.
I believe it takes way more 'faith' to believe that life evolved out of nothing.
Amazingly, the view that the Bible is somehow inerrant, or the perfect word of God, still has widespread subscription. Anyone who’s made an effort to read it with any sort of objectivity finds the claim laughable. ... laughable and amazing … yes indeed.
Perhaps even more surprising when the worlds’ largest Church does not hold that view – don’t the literalists ask why not?
I guess there is a place for those who are attracted by absolutes. Unfortunately, from my theist perspective, once the limitations of absolutes of the literalistic interpretation are recognised what often follows is atheism. When they realise that God is not in their literalistic interpretation they seem to accept there is no God rather than that God is not the literalistic God but different.
I suppose that it is small wonder that people of that mind set would rather label all religion as wrong than have to plot a course of understanding through theology.
Sala kahle - peace
Baconsbud, perhaps I can help, yopu say I have never understood how something can be perfect if its main creation is imperfect.
Firstly on a superficial level there is a circular irrationality about your argument.
You and I might judge creation to be imperfect. Since we are imperfect (by your definition as products of the imperfect creation) so why would value our opinion over that of the perfect (by your definition) creator.
But more importantly, a lack of perfection gives rise to many benefits, and it could be argued that perfection in a physical world is either an illusion or undesirable – in fact is itself an imperfection … consider
… we need to be inventive to adapt to what you consider the imperfections of this world; in a perfect world we would not need to be creative (e.g harness energy to keep us warm). So to achieve perfection (a perfect world) you need to destroy perfection by denying us the opportunity/ability to be creative.
… so is a creative human being more aligned to perfection than a dumb one ... or
Sala kahle - peace
Head in the Sand,
None of the scientists in that article say anything to imply that "that life evolved out of nothing." What they are saying is that it's chemistry. Just normal chemistry. And although it is difficult to recreate the exact conditions from 3.5 billion years ago, it never the less requires no magic. Life came from normal molecules going through normal chemical reactions.
And they are getting very close to creating the environment for those reactions to occur in the laboratory.
Yes, Godel's belief does not follow from his specialty.
Tully,
there are fake quotes going around the net about einstein. I believe you found them. Here is the wiki article that addresses the mans belief...
Wow byran you went on a tangent that had nothing to do with what I posted...simply that godel was a believer - thats it!
Tully,
"My comment above applies equally to 92% of Americans you cite in your previous post. And to that I would like to add some other things that millions of Americans believe:"
My point was to show that there is some serious blanket statements made here about believers just being irrational, which is a poor analysis.
Anon
If my post was a tangent, then there was absolutely nothing substantiating your appeal to Godel's belief. But that would be inconsistent with the fact you appealed to Godel's specialty as a logician and brilliant rational mind when it came to mathematics. I dispelled that relation and left you with nothing. Now you try to say you weren't grasping at anything. In any case, you have nothing to support your fallacious appeal. But my argument was far from tangential.
akakiwibear said... But more importantly, a lack of perfection gives rise to many benefits, and it could be argued that perfection in a physical world is either an illusion or undesirable – in fact is itself an imperfection … consider
Is it really a benefit to be imperfect? Of course I will admit there is no such thing as complete perfection. If there was then there would be no needs or wants. Everything we would need would be there for us and nothing we did would affect anyone or anything in an imperfect way. Why would I need a means of staying warm when I am perfect.
My point with the perfect thing is there is no such thing and when people try to define some being as perfect they are mistaken. While we sometimes do things in a perfect way. Nothing can be absolutely perfect.
The only real problem I have with how christians define their friend in the sky, is they apply words but change the meaning when shown it is incorrect.
Take the words of I Believe that I can't Believe, God uses imperfect tools for accomplish His perfect will. If god has perfect will then why does he need tools? I just see people using the word perfect to try and claim that we are inferior to something that has to be there but is afraid to show itself.
The bible is nothing more to me then a record of the fears and desires of people. People want there to be something out there that is directing their lives and it has to be perfect for it to do that.
Anon,
"Tully,
there are fake quotes going around the net about einstein. I believe you found them."
No doubt there are, but the ones I cite are not two of them.
Citation: Einstein Archive 59-215 and 38-434; from Alice Calaprice, ed., The Expanded Quotable Einstein, Princeton, New Jersey: Princeton University Press, 2000, p. 216 - 218.
I Believe that I can't Believe, said:
it's my job, as a believer, to speak of the One who has died for the sins of the world and forgives each and every one of us...that whoever HEARS IT (really hears it) might have faith and believe.
Did you see him die for the sins?
... And what the **** do you mean by 'forgives each and everyone of us'
There are millions of suffering people in this world in form of beggars, lepors, disabled children etc etc whom "you BELIEVERS" call as sinners, are they forgiven?
Or do you mean to say, "hey, no dude, I mean the child rapists, gangsters, smugglers, cheats and terrorists, these people only deserve to be forgiven"
Don't you even have the common sense to know what sounds real?
Is it the fantasy stories abt God or the practical world around you?
Its so obvious that believers are more comfortable believing in just words of imagination. They really enjoy reading it more and more NO MATTER WHAT, and really DONT CARE to know if it could be true or false. I really don't see any difference between a child reading some fairy tale book and a believer reading a spiritual book. (HONESTLY!!!)
First of all I think the prime reason to all this is the fear to think against a man-made term 'God'.
How STUPID is it to think if I doubt on God I will not get the ticket to heaven? So that means no matter how good you are, you will be sent to hell just for ONE REASON, NOT BELIEVING IN GOD???
And on the other hand do all the f**k you want, go around raping children, and praise the name of God so you get a rewarded with a 'flying ferrari' all the way to heaven?
Does that sound god-like? Come on tell me?
I really feel pitty for such believers who clearly lack even a trace of common sense.
I have tried so much to explain things to my parents who are in deep sleep dreaming about things in religious books. They don't want to WAKE UP no matter how much I try. I gave up my hope of trying to explain a 'simple' thing that only needs common sense to understand. The problem with most believers is that they ignore to 'think' even for a moment. Their mind is already smoked up with fantasy stories from relegious fairy tale books. They call this 'faith' (LOL...)
I now feel its better to let these ignorant people continue with it as long as they don't cause harm to others. I am happy atleast to see there are some believers who are educated enough that they don't try to take AK47 and hunt down innocents, thinking this is a shortcut to God's residence(heaven)
I read this somewhere in this atheism blog. Let me try to put it in my own words:
If the evil in the world is intended by God, then God can not be good. If the evil can violate God's intentions, then God is not almighty. God can't be both almighty and good. If only God can create, then he must have created evil. If somebody else (the devil) created evil, how can one know that God, and not the Devil created the universe?
To me these are "GOLDEN LINES"..
Words of meaning, words that make sense, words of truth......
I love to read them again and again.
How about you believers? Not interested? Ok go sleep with your spiritual books and "NEVER WAKE UP"
I feel like spitting on you believers' face when you say: "The lepers and disabled children on streets are sinners."
It shows that you believers are cowards to the core!! Are you not ashamed to point fingers at these poor people who can not hit back at you, instead of pointing fingers at the REAL SINNERS commiting sins in front of your eyes raping kids and killing innocent people?
Now what, you think they will suffer in next birth?? Holy crap !!!!
So you believe in wild imagination?
Is there any sensible believer out there with the heart to answer my question?
(Matt McCormick, thanks a lot for your blog posts... I am really sorry I dont have enough words to thank you. You are one great humanbeing that can think STRAIGHT and
Wow... Will you look at all the hostility? It makes me sad.
Basically, the way I see it, there are two types of christians. "Cart pushers" and "Cart Riders".
The first type helps push the cart. He actually cares enough about Christianity and God that it affects his life, and he is a real Christian.
Secondly, there is the ones looking for a free ride away from hell, and I'm not sure that these people really get it.
Basically, you can't just be in it for the reward. |
Can someone please give me a list of every single reason that they don't believe in a god/ gods. I want to understand atheist arguments against theism and having them all on one page would be great. I know this could be a rather long list, so please condense each of your points into a sentence or two. Multiple users are welcome to post.
Change is inevitable, except from a vending machine.
Reason itself
Commonsense
Empirical evidence
A healthy amount of skepticism, about any claim of any kind, means I automatically don't believe anything that doesn't meet the above criteria
Why do you think that empirical evidence leads to the conclusion that a god/ gods don't exist? Because you think that science makes miracles impossible?
Science is just the way of explaining the natural world around us, with the greatest degree of accuracy possible
Science doesn't make miracles impossible
I don't believe in miracles, for the same reasons you don't believe in the flying spaghetti monster
"Science doesn't makes miracles impossible"
Exactly my point, it is therefore possible to believe in science and be theistic. So therefore science does not lead us to the conclusion that no god exists (correct me if I'm wrong.)
BTW, slightly irrelevant- was pastafarianism started as a protest or a genuine religion? I'm not sure....
It was started as a parody and to show the absurdness of Intelligent design, because if you want to say a supernatural god entity created the universe, then why not include this absurd idea of the flying spaghetti monster.
However my reasons for my atheism
Logic, reason, the lack of evidence to show that any religious god, deity etc, etc, etc, exists.
Not to say that a god like being cannot exist....but the descriptions give to us by religion and others from the theistic community has such a low percentage for existence that it is practically impossible. However no evidence of any god has ever been shown to exist at all, not one little itty bitty evidence outside of faith and delusion has ever been presented to me, as such I do not believe in the existence of any god/deity/supernatural (which to me is meaningless term to being with).
The first and primary reason I do not believe in God, in the passive sense of lack of belief, is obvious. There is no evidence. Here it is important to distinguish between two senses of atheism.
/* argumentum ad ignoratium or the argument from ignorance, is surely the most oft-abused and most poorly understood fallacy in the whole of debate, which is most odd, considering it is extremely simple.
The fallacy is double edged:
X is true because it has not been proved false
X is false because it has not been proved true
The misuse of the argument from ignorance is indicated heavily when one argues regarding atheism. Many people do not understand that atheism is inherently dichotomous, meaning there are two schools of thought. The first is mutually compatible with agnosticism, hence called agnostic or weak atheism. The position:
-There is no evidence for God. This absence of evidence does not mean that God does not exists. However, it does mean that there is no reason to suppose God exists, and the default position is simply to not believe it is true (versus to believe it is not true) It is an admission of not knowing, but retaining that there is no reason to suppose the existence of the entity in question (God). This is different from agnosticism, however, since the latter is an epistemological position which argues that knowledge on the matter is impossible.
This is different from the strong atheist position:
-God does not exist. I am quite certain of this. I can disprove God. And many strong atheists have indeed formulated arguments against God.
So, beyond the simple "there is no evidence" position of weak atheism, it is possible to construct arguments against God, which is what strong atheism was. For a long time, I was very preoccupied with this. Stripped to its bare essentials, but supported by a lengthy thesis, the list of arguments I put together looks like this:
1. Supervenience (the necessity of certain beings and properties to generate higher-order beings and properties and the associated relationship, such as that, for example, atoms can exist without human society, but not human society without atoms). The conclusion which I still retain, to this day, is that such principles necessarily eviscerate the concept of a conscious, intelligent being with control over the physical world yet without constituting a physical being itself).
2. Monism (The concept in philosophy of mind and neuroscience that the mind, the source of a conscious, intelligent being, does not have a component of a non-physical ontology, so eviscerating the assertion that such a being could be intelligent)
3. Ex Nihilo (the coherency of the theistic suggestion that an eternally existing being is ontologically separate from the physical universe, such that because it was the entity that created the universe in the first place). My eventual resolution was that the theistic assertion pertaining to the creation of a separate ontology of physical beings and things, of which this being is not of the same substance with, is an impossible contradiction, and is an assertion that requires the propagation of ex nihilo creation by God, which is impossible. I also used this suggestion to propagate the idea within ontology that existence of some form, bare-order properties of being, are uncaused.
4. Infinity (the coherency or lack thereof of suggesting the actual infinite nature of this being while at the same time maintaining that it was an entity and being unto itself, with providence and control, hence ontologically discrete from other discrete beings such as the physical universe) (the conclusion which I still retain in this matter is that there is an internal contradiction between the two)
5. Bare-order property (the question of what substance or property describes a discrete conscious being and agent if it is asserted that such a being has no physical body, and what bundles of properties constituted this being). I eventually resolved that no description was being given, and that the theistic assertion was not giving any ontological properties describing precisely of what this entity is comprised, hence the theistic school of thought is overly vague regarding the assertion that some "intelligent agent" exists, and this is not acceptable in proper philosophical discourse. During this process, I also argued for the philosophical school called Reism, which I still hold to.
6. Universe of discourse (The necessity of descriptors of property of an ontology, ie, that the theistic assertion regarding "supernaturalism" was/is untenable because it is ruled from a universe of discourse, and is defined solely by virtue of negation to the physical. If I can prove this (and I did) it strengthens the idea of #5. My resolution is that I still hold to this today.
7. Causality (The coherency of arguing that God is an immutable, unchanging being with the suggestion that it is a conscious agent with a mind with thoughts that acts upon whims and has causal powers over the physical universe). I worked on this one for quite some time. I eventually argued there was an internal contradiction present in the doctrine.
8. Termination (Self-refuting arguments that rely on special pleading fallacies to bolster the thesis that existence of God is valid by the assignation of ad hoc special characteristics that refute the premise of the argument that establishes them. The Cosmological Argument is especially guilty). My current stand on this is that there is an internal contradiction present in arguments that operate in a similar fashion.
Of course, the strong atheist arguments I put together are merely for my own philosophical amusement. For practical purposes, such raciocintation is overkill. It's enough to simply fall back on weak atheism and point out the lack of evidence. As far as I recall, the primary reason I started putting together the aforementioned arguments was because I was bored, although it was a while ago (I started writing the first ones at 16) so I don't really remember. It doesn't really matter
So therefore science does not lead us to the conclusion that no god exists
Depends which god you're talking about specifically, although science hasn't conclusively proved that thor the Nordic god of thunder doesn't exist, there is a perfectly reasonable scientific explanation for why thunder happens, that doesn't involve a supernatural god getting angry and slamming his hammer in Valhalla
Science doesn't disprove negatives
Ie science cannot disprove that an invisible supernatural teapot isn't spinning round your head, this is where commonsense, and reason kick in
I was never a theist, and after reading the new and old testaments, I still cant find any good evidence for a god. Remember by default everyone is an atheist, know one is born with theism per-programed into their brains.
Thank you for those arguments, they were most enlightening. Would anyone else like to present additional arguments against the existence of god/ gods? I am already familiar with Antony Flew's argument that those who claim that something exists should have to provide the evidence, not the other way around. I am more interested in the arguments from the "strong atheistic" position, that go out and enthusiastically attack the idea of the existence of a god or gods.
P.S. deludedgod may I suggest that you read Antony Flew's latest book? He recently converted from atheism to deism, because he thought that the evidence pointed to the existence of a higher power (I am sure you will have heard of his conversion already.) His book is called "There Is A God" and it outlines the evidence he saw for the existence of a deity. If you like intellectual exercises, you will read this.
P.S. deludedgod may I suggest that you read Antony Flew's latest book?
Yes, but his principle argument is more design/teleological in nature. His assertion regarding the origin of life and the associated arguments are simply not tenable, and his principle argument does rest (badly) on abiogenesis. I have run into similar arguments, one of which I refuted here, if you read my response to the OP. As you can tell, it is not philosophy which is my profession, but biology. Which is interesting, since Flew's argument was biological in nature, yet he is not a professional biologist, whilst mine is philosophical in nature, and I am not a professional philosopher. Anyway, this is the link:
Probability that life arose by random chance.
At any rate, I should not be insulting Flew, since he did not write the book of which you speak. The book was written by Christian apologists under his name. It would be impossible for the book to be written by Flew. It has far too many scientific errors with respect to understanding of biological evolution. It would be impossible for Flew to make such errors since he has written extensively on the matter of biological evolution and is well versed in it.
I am more interested in the arguments from the "strong atheistic" position, that go out and enthusiastically attack the idea of the existence of a god or gods.
By default if I don't have any evidence for something, i assume it doesn't exist..
Can someone please give me a list of every single reason that they don't believe in a god/ gods.
It's really just no reason to believe for me. Evidence would be a reason for me to believe. I'm on the "probably no supernatural" side of the fence, if that helps.
Saint Will: no gyration without funkstification.
fabulae! nil satis firmi video quam ob rem accipere hunc mi expediat metum. - Terence
I see. Let me just ask: if you were to witness a miracle, would that cause you to believe in a god or would you brush it off as a strange scientific phenomenon? I don't mean to be antagonistic in any way, I am simply curious..
The argument from design has been destroyed by theists and atheists, at the Dover trail.
The cosmological argument- what would this be
The argument from morality isn't a scientific argument
Do all of my argument need to be scientific? I wasn't aware that was one of the forum rules. Sorry. implies that there must be an infinite number of causes, which cannot be.
Also, by definition, God is uncaused.
This explanation of the cosmological argument is unashamedly copied from If you need more explanation about it, I suggest that you use Google or Wik.
I am not just arguing from the Christian perspective here, but also from the theistic point of view in general.
Because only some religions believe in an omni-present, all loving God, it is possible to believe in a god who isn't all loving and omnipresent, but who created the world. This is the deist position. Therefore the argument against the idea of a god because of pain and suffering doesn't apply to all theism.
Quote: Now this is a response to thinktank. So as to avoid double posting, I will put forward three arguments which I think are the basis of Christian apologetics. They are all easy targets. The first was refuted in great detail in the link I gave you, but in terms of biology alone, it can be refuted multiple times without much effort. The same is true in astronomy, cosmology and other associated fields. Although the argument is usually associated with biology. But the notion of "appears designed" is nonsense to the point of being irritating chauvanism on part of the way that we create complex structures.
As a biologist, I can testify that it is impossible to quantify the magnitude of the problem which Darwin, Huxley, Wallace and Kettlewell solved in a single stroke. Such was the coherent simplicity and elegance of their theory that jigsaw pieces fell into places immediately, and those that did not were worked out by future generations of molecular geneticists, proteomicists, ecologists and evolutionary developmental biologists.We shall start with the most basic principles by which we need to understand evolution. Firstly, life as a system is immensely complex, intricate and beautiful, and none are in a better position to testify this than those who study it (as I). It is tempting to attribute this complex intricacy to design, to a loving creator who assembles and fashions the parts like a watchmaker a la Paley. It is thusly tempting to compare the intricacy of life to the intricacy of systems that we humans assemble, such as watches, or perhaps (in today’s world) complex electronics. However, not only are these anologies false, but the argument which underlies them phenomenally bad. That we know that such devices as I have listed are designed is for an obvious reason, namely- we designed them, does not allow us to conclude that biological systems must undergo the same criterion, because biological systems by definition have a very special set of attributes which allows them to generate complex intricacies from simple origins. In other words, when examining an object, our question should not depend on the criterion of the complexity of the object in question, perhaps measured by the primitive notion of how many “parts” it has or how they fit together, but rather, can it come about through natural process? With our devices, the answer is no. But for biological engines, the answer is yes. This is where the insurmountable problems solved by the 19th century Victorian naturalists aboard the Beagle in a single stroke, comes into play. Being that we have the intrinsic oddity of comparing biological engines to our own devices, it logically follows, being that we were the designers of the objects in question to which we are comparing biological engines, that we set up this false dichotomy whereby if the object in question was not designed, than the only alternative by which it may have come about is chance. By chance we simply mean a process of randomness which simply appears to have no governing law, whose system dynamics are simply chaotic and random, and that the complex structures of biology in question could have coalesced through such a process is absurd, hence we are left with the alternative of design. Yet this alternative is, I would say, equally phenomenally bad as an explanation, because of the argumentum ad ignoratium it pose. The concomitant vapid idea is that complexity is somehow a measure of a meaningless quality upon which we can judge whether or not "design" occured. In reality, complex and non-random natural processes have just as much capacity to create such structures. The geneticist James Watson stated it plainly: "Evolution is smarter than you are". The fact that we are creatures which design structures based on a concomitant approach of planning gives us the rather chauvanstic view that all things must come into being in this manner lest they be solely the product of chance. This is sheer idiocy. Only the third one has any meaningful connection with the notion of the "Christian God". As Voltaire pointed out, it is a complete non sequitur to draw a line from notions such as design and cosmology to lead to the Christian God. At best it could only support concomitant propositions with the deistic God. But Lewis's argument is a non sequitur at best. Especially considering it is obscelent in a modern scientific era where biology, psychology, even mathematics, economics, and neuroscience, are combining to give a crisp and cogent account of the "moral sense". I spent a long time attacking the notion of the Cosmological Argument wholly from a physics standpoint (invoking such things as the Lindeian Boundary Condition and the Hawking-Hartele model) but then I realized that this was unnecessary. Even a mere acceptance of the premises leads to a sort of doublethink.
Now this is a response to thinktank. So as to avoid double posting, I will put forward three arguments which I think are the basis of Christian apologetics.
The argument is simple of course. All things need a cause, infinite regress is impossible, a first cause is necessary. Seems pretty solid at first blush, but in reality the situation is anything but simple, and genuine understanding of the validity or lack thereof requires a great deal of knowledge in Newtonian mechanics, field equations, Relativity, Quantum mechanics, cosmology and physical causality. The issue is anything but simple, indeed, we find the argument relies on a slew of intuitive understandings of physics that date back to issues with Zeno, which cannot be trusted, and certainly cannot be trusted to provide us with proof of God. To understand this whole argument, we really need to first understand the notion of causality. When we speak of cause we are speaking of a correlation between two events A and B where there is temporal sequence between such events that A may “cause” B. It is postulated that the observation of cause leads to an infinite regress, and this is paradoxical, hence the God solution being postulated, the primum movens. I shall come to the paradox of infinite regress in a moment, but first I want to point out that the Cosmological Argument and its many variants invariably set up a very, very insurmountable paradox in and of themselves. Therefore, to say it is coherent is only in the sense of “which paradox is less insurmountable” which is hardly a measure of coherency at all Those who have read Joseph Heller’s famous novel will know of what we call in logic a Catch-22. The idea behind it has been understood for quite some time, simply put: C=>(A^B) (A =>~B) (B =>~A) This is basic logic notation. Preconditions A and B are both necessary for outcome C, but if A, then B cannot occur, and conversely, if B, then A cannot occur, hence, C can never occur. In Joseph Heller’s book, the Catch-22 was that to leave the air force, you had to be insane and you had to request to leave. But if you are genuinely insane, there is no way you can request to leave, conversely, if you request to leave, there is no way you can be genuinely insane. So, you are stuck. It’s also known as a no-win situation. We have a similar situation here. There are two necessary preconditions that make God a necessary and coherent postulate that the Cosmological Argument may work. A: Cause requires time (which there cannot be an infinite regress of) B: The universe (of which time is a physical component) was caused C: The Universe was caused by an entity outside of time The a posteriori observation for the argument comes from the necessity of time for cause, such that infinite regress is impossible, the other postulation is that the universe was caused under the proposition that all things need a cause. This is a Catch-22. If causality requires time, then it is impossible that time was caused. If time was caused, then it we cannot speak of causality requiring time, therefore the Universe being caused by something outside of time cannot occur, because A cannot occur if B and nor can B occur if A. C (the outcome) cannot occur since it necessarily postulates that there cannot be an infinite regress of cause because cause requires time, without that proposition we could not speak of the necessity of the God being, because these are the grounds on which the Cosmological Argument is being propagated! We cannot reference regress without referencing time, ergo, we cannot reference regress of cause without referencing regress of time. Yet postulation B specifically states that it is necessary to postulate the Prime Mover on grounds that the universe of which time is a component was…caused. If this proposition were not true, the Primum Movens would not be a sensible proposition. But it cannot occur if A occurs, since A postulates the opposite and A cannot occur if it occurs, but both of these postulations are necessary for C (the outcome), being the universe being caused by an entity outside of time. The paradox here is “cause of cause”. Cause, per se, requires time as a substrate (the idea of the “cause of time” is insurmountable, like “north of the north pole”. When we speak of cause we are speaking of a correlation between two events A and B where there is temporal sequence between such events that A may “cause” B. Hence, what precisely does it mean to say that an entity outside of time could be the cause of such an event as what is essentially the beginning of cause itself? Surely, we have set up a greatly insurmountable paradox. We cannot reference causality without referring to time, and hence the notion of an atemporal being as the cause of cause is inherently absurd. An atemporal being, by definition, cannot cause anything or indeed execute any action since both notions necessarily refer to the substrate of time in which they may occur. Furthermore, the notion is essentially appealing to “cause of cause” which is inherently absurd. How do we intend to reference causality by the invocation of an atemporal entity?’ Since this is philosophical raciocintation, I have a more scientific critique on hand. Be assured that I did not conjure it up ex ignorantium. I am trained in physics and cosmology.
This is different, significantly different from not believing
Attempts to introduce sharia law, in my country
Genetic research, opposed and successfully restricted, by the religious community
9/11, the assassination of doctors at abortion clinics
The list is virtually endless
This is wrong, now I could try to oppose every, mad ridiculous idiotic scheme that religious fanatics come up with, because there ancient texts instruct them to do these things
Or I could fight the cause, of the madness
I choose to actively fight the cause,
I have no problem with anybody believing anything they want, up to the point where it becomes organized, and adversely affects my life, and the lives of others in my community
Please define what a miracle is, and explain how we could know that it is a supernatural event versus simply an unlikely natural event.
Simply by asking 'if you were to witness a miracle' presumes that we would already know it is a miracle. If we already know it's a miracle why would we call it anything else? I'm not being antagonistic, I am simply curious.
Here's my answer to 'what would make me believe in God': I don't know, but surely an omniscient God would know what evidence would be sufficient for me to believe, AND an omnipotent God would have the power to present this evidence to me, AND an omnibenevolent God would want to present this evidence to me. Since I've not seen convincing evidence, I conclude that such a God cannot exist.
But even better, I have a more concrete example for you. I would accept theistic belief if I was provided, out of thin air, with a book, addressed to me by name, which details things from my past experience which only I could know, and which predicts specific things which will happen in my upcoming life which never fail to come true. It doesn't have to be a complete life history, just a book full of my life's events. And having it appear before me out of thin air would pretty much seal the deal.
There, now this hypothetical God knows what would convince me, and I think it's a pretty reasonable request, since he allegedly did something similar for Muhammed. It wouldn't even require omniscience or omnipotence, only enough knowledge to know what's on the internet and incomplete but accurate predictions of the future, and enough power to materialize a book out of thin air. If such a god exists and cares whether I believe in him or not, then surely he could create this will present one more argument for the existence of God, but because I started this thread in order to hear your arguments against the existence of God, I will not spend much more time on my own arguments or refuting refutations for that matter.
If God exists, then he is defined as that of which no higher can be thought. This definition is accepted by both atheists and theists. If I may use a little analogy myself here, every ladder has to have the top rung. Because we have just defined God as "the top rung" the logical conclusion is that God exists.
By all means, refute this argument and present me with your own ones. I want to get more people presenting me with their points of view.
That argument is called the argument from degree. It is completey meaningless. It's simply a bland assertion, the notion that there is some sort of necessary of "universal degree measure" against which all things are compared. The argument is literally a non sequitur the way the phrase is used in humour, no better than saying:
P: All ladders have a top rung
C: Therefore, God exists.
The claim is completely meaningless and utterly inarticulable. It's also impossible to maintain because to fill such a requsite would entail that such a being be the maxima of certain properties that it does not have but against which we do employ different judgements of degree, such as with physical properties. If it did not have such properties, it could be referred to as the supposed maxima in any sense. We judge different things relative to other things in context-relative judgments and situations. The leap from this notion to a universal degree indicator is complete gibberish.We use relative comparisons in context relative judgement senses. If a ship was the size of an island, it would be extremely large relative to other ships. If a planet was the size of an island, it would be extremely small relative to other planets. The notion of a universal maxima for properties against which we judge degree makes no sense because judgements of degree are context relative. To propogate the argument would require you hold two contradictory notions simultaneously. You'd have to assert that this being constitutes the maxima for all context-relative judgements, which would be meaningless as you'd basically have infinity contradictory notions. But if you tried to argue that it still constituted a maxima of degree without trying to argue that it is the perfect measure for all context-relative judgements (such as the largest ship, the smallest plane, the best athlete, the worst eyesight, etc ad infinitum) then you'd be undermining your own premise that a universal measure of all things is necessary, let alone coherent, because you are admitting that measurements of degree of any kind are context-relative judgements. For this reason, the "argument from degree" for God is meaningless.
If God exists, then he is defined as that of which no higher can be thought.
So, God is just a thought? I can easily think of a human that is greater than all other humans. For instance, this human I'm thinking of is 30 feet tall, has an IQ of 10,000, can run 600 mph, can fly, can hold his breath underwater for 300 years, etc.
Does that mean that this human exists? Just because I can think of him?
Now, certainly the *thought* of this human exists, first in my mind, and now in your mind. But that's just a thought, not an actual human. Are you saying that God is just one of these thoughts? Because actually.... I would completely agree. That is exactly what God is.
Why do you think that empirical evidence leads to the conclusion that a god/ gods don't exist?
Scientific thought really deals in probability. It's improbable that there is a supernatural world. Gods would be of the improbable supernatural world, as would many other immaterial things like unicorns, leprechans, or the number foozwazzle.
Because you think that science makes miracles impossible?
No, because the natural order of things continues. A miracle would be an interruption of that natural order. New evidence of the world working differently would change that, but that's not exactly a guaranteed eventuality.
There's nothing antagonistic about the question. If I were to witness a miracle (that being an interruption of the natural order), I would think a new explanation incorporating what I had just witnessed was in order. The repeatablility of the miracle would be required, however, as I'm pretty sure I could be fooled equally by a really good magic trick.
That wouldn't immediately jump to a god, though, no. Just because something I thought was supernatural might actually happen, that just means the one supernatural thing happens, it doesn't open the door for a world of fantasy creatures.
This is just sort of a statement with a built-in conclusion that doesn't follow. "If Zeus exists, then he is defined as that of which no higher can be thought."
It's not really an argument for Zeus. In fact, it's not really an argument. You don't follow it up. Let's try something else.
Besides, if God is the highest thing, then is God some unit of measurement? I'm sure that's not where you're going with that, it's just that it's confusing as a statement.
The argument from design.The cosmological argument.The argument from morality.I am sure you are already familiar with all three arguments, can you please point out the flaws? I consider these evidence for the existence of the Christian God.
Considering an argument "evidence" isn't really a good start for seperating fact from fiction. The argument from design is a presupposition at best, the cosmological argument is weak at several levels (most notably the convenient definition of God), and the argument from morality assumes a fundamental human anarchy that has never existed.
They're kind of weak arguments, and they're not really evidence. Evidence would really make the difference in my beliefs (it always has).
Can you please give me a list of why you don't believe in Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, the Easter Bunny, faeries, unicorns, etc? If you can provide the details of why you don't "believe" in these entities, cross out the aforementioned names, replace them with "god" and you will have the answer to your question.
Because there is no empirical evidence that conclusively demonstrates that any god exists.
I also do not actively believe in the nonexistence of god/gods, because there is no empirical evidence that conclusively demonstrates that gods do not exist.
"You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... morons." - The Waco Kid
Do you also refrain from actively believing in the nonexistence of flying walruses?
So why believe in a god that created the world/universe and just went on his merry way, not giving two shits about what happens to us? That's really just a step removed from atheism. We believe there is no god controlling anything. You believe there is a god not controlling anything.
The reason I don't believe in God is because of the very contradiction you speak of. If God did create the world/universe, and wanted to be worshipped by us, why is he allowing humanity to be so fractured in its religious beliefs and practices - to the point of outright contradiction? I'm not just talking about the differences between Christian and non-Christian faiths, I'm talking about huge differences of opinion and practice amongst just the Christian faiths. If you've got one Christian faith saying gay people are evil sinners (Catholics, for example) and one faith saying that gay people are fine (Presbyterians are in this camp for the most part, I think), one of those faiths is wrong. There's no inbetween. God must have an opinion on the matter, if he exists. So why doesn't he make it clear? I could go on, but I'm trying to keep my answer short per your request.
Nobody I know was brainwashed into being an atheist.
Why Believe?
BMcD wrote:I also do not actively believe in the nonexistence of god/gods, because there is no empirical evidence that conclusively demonstrates that gods do not exist.Do you also refrain from actively believing in the nonexistence of flying walruses?
Indeed I do, Will. I believe that I exist. Everything else might be bullshit. I interact with the world I perceive around me, but make no assumptions or assertions that my perceptions might not be wrong.
Cosmological ArgumentThings.
Or the flying spaghetti monster, or pink invisible unicorns, or à la or a combination of them all, that which has not been caused does not exist
What started this universe is unknown, at the present time, one can fill this unknown with any number of magical creatures, and come up with any number of magical stories as to why they started the universe
Personally I just call it what it is, unknown
To do otherwise, doom's you to a life of ignorance, ie it's not unknown, magical dwarfs made the universe, so there's no need, to investigate the cause
This is also true, of all the unknowns in this universe?
Many have already been covered but they include empirical evidence, common sense, skepticism, the reading and study of the Bible and Christianity. As an ex-Christian I determined that Christianity and other religions are based primarily on myths and legends. I grew to question every bit of it as well as all religions. Now I do not accept god beliefs at all as they are as silly as belief in Santa.
____________________________________________________________
uraishel wrote:I see. Let me just ask: if you were to witness a miracle, would that cause you to believe in a god or would you brush it off as a strange scientific phenomenon? I don't mean to be antagonistic in any way, I am simply.
Well, let's see here, reason, common sense, skepticism, the lack of evidence for the existence of god(s), and the swiss cheese nature -smelly and full of holes- of all philosophical arguments I've ever heard of for it. All of which have been elaborated by many here so I don't see the point to deepening further on them.
That's just on one hand, on the other, the ever growing evidence that suggest god is more an evolutionary tool, byproduct or psychological coping mechanism than anything else. Also, we have the other scientifical findings that are slowly but surely chipping away at every supernatural notion, leaving god less and less places to cover: neuro-psychological experiments that recreate out-of-body experiences, visions and so on; on the field of genetics, the findings on the god gene; on psychology and sociology, the effects of peer pressure and suggestion on the adoption of a belief and the occurrences of "miracle" healings; the many prayer experiments which proves that particular pleading for divine intervention useless, and so on.
And then, there's the more personal reasons I don't believe, which mostly can be summed up to one thing: pragmatism. I have no use for a god(s) belief nor for faith. To me this things are completely pointless and downright wasteful and harmful. The only use I could derive from them is perhaps amusement, or entertainment, and my dog, my books and plastiline modeling give me that and much more.
This might stretch the OP request, but another argument for me not believing lies in that same line of pragmatism but under a social point of view: if we were to make a comparison between the benefits and the harms caused by the god belief in todays society, it would be painfully obvious the god belief as it stands today (of which religion is but an exponent) is detrimental to society and runs counter to our interest of survival as a species.
Lenore, The Cute Little Dead Girl. Twice as good as Jesus.
Right, now I assume that you have covered everything that you mean to (although by all means add more comments if you wish) I will make a bullet point list of everything you have said and attempt to respond to it over the next couple of months. I don't intend to cover each point in a day, it will take some time debating and dare I say it, probably refining my own opinions.
Sorry I haven't posted a while, my non-forum life came a-calling.
By the way, I don't think your arguments about the existence of faeries, etc have any relevance to my arguments. I am not claiming that the world was caused by Santa Claus, and the cosmological argument has nothing to do with unicorns, spaghetti monsters or any other sort of nonsense. There is a great deal more evidence for the existence of a Creator than there is for the existence of these creatures. As I have said, I will present this evidence in other threads. I will also mention this site to a theistic biologist friend of mine. He should raise some sparks in here.
Right, now I assume that you have covered everything that you mean to
As if that's possible.
There is a great deal more evidence for the existence of a Creator than there is for the existence of these creatures.
There's not and if I gave you the phrase..." there's a great deal more zero than zero", it probably wouldn't mean much would it ?
As I have said, I will present this evidence in other threads.
What are the odds that this will be something "new" and that hasn't already been refuted to death somewhere else on this site ?
I'm just kidding. Theistic evidence presentation never gets old...it's like "magic" every time.
"In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary act."
George Orwell
Sorry I'm jumping in abit late here. I've tried to answer the orignal three arguments in a easy to understand way. I copied these from another project I'm working on, so they might not precisly adress the questions, but should give an idea.
1.??
How can you be moral without god?
Premises: It is impossible to be moral wothout somehow, and illiteracy. Why if christians are so much better?
1.. certainly hope he is better than the "geologist" who was unfamiliar with logarithms or decay rates, the "doctor" who did not know that the phrase "biological evolution" meant "a change in gene frequencies in a population due to selective pressure", the "physicist" who did not know how to calculate Free Energy Change from entropy, or chemical equilibria from free energy, or especially that other "doctor" who couldn't tell me the difference between autocrine and panacrine signalling.
I certainly hope he is better than the "geologist" who was unfamiliar with logarithms or decay rates, [...]
That's a sad list. Especially when those are all things you could look up on the internet and pretend to know.
I want a biologist to come on and make the case that Jesus was a dinosaur. Y'know, a fresh perspective.
And lo, when Jesus was among the Hettanites, he did proclaim, "RAAAAARRRAGHARAGHARRAAAAAAAH!"
Right, now I assume that you have covered everything that you mean to...
Not really I'm sure we can come up with some more.
I am not claiming that the world was caused by Santa Claus,
That's too bad I really had a good argument that Santa had nothing at all to do with creation.
and the cosmological argument has nothing to do with unicorns,
I had really hoped to show that unicorns were essentially relevant to the argument against a god.
I will also mention this site to a theistic biologist friend of mine. He should raise some sparks in here.
I can see where this is going. It appears analogies are not being understood.
I want a biologist to come on and make the case that Jesus was a dinosaur. Y'know, a fresh perspective.And lo, when Jesus was among the Hettanites, he did proclaim, "RAAAAARRRAGHARAGHARRAAAAAAAH!"
I can easily refute that as Jesus was clearly a Neanderthal. Since they did not believe on him they all became extinct.
I think the most important question, and one that really hasn't been addressed by biologists:
was Jesus high in fibre?
Perhaps the dinosaurs (and, indeed neanderthals) should have had more Jesus in their diet. At least we finally have a good, solid explanation for their extinction.
Anyway, bring the biologist. I'm sure we'll all have fun, since ... I'm actually a dinosaur. I have no evidence; that's how I prove that. QED.
Let me point out a couple of things about your assertion, above:
There are exactly two possibilities:
1 - That a God that Created, or is Creating the Universe exists
or,
2 - That a God that Created, or is Creating the Universe does not exist.
In EITHER case, the Universe remains THE SAME. So, you cannot logically conclude that the absence of violations of the physical laws of the Universe (miracles) supports your notion that there is no God.
Also, consider that a God that Created the Universe COULD exist and simply not care whether, or not, you believe in it. And, any being capable of Creating the Universe would have well-thought out reasons for everything being the way it is - reasons that trump any desire for evidence of His existence on your part.
Furthermore, even if a being came to you and did as you suggest (He then proceeds to remove AIDS and all cancer from the earth and they are never seen again), that is still not conclusive evidence that that being is God, Creator of the Universe. He could simply be an extremely advanced being with technology beyond our comprehension - and, a LIAR by stating that He is "God, Creator of the Universe."
I only point these things out to you so that you might reconsider your criteria for the acceptance of the existence of a God that has Created, or IS Creating the Universe. I'm not trying to "sell" you on God - I'm only trying to get you to reconsider your notions of what would constitute evidence of such a being.
Ultimately, this implies that belief in God will ALWAYS be a simple choice, and not based on empirical evidence. It is merely a chosen perspective and dependent on the tenability of the definition of God you are employing. And, for ANY God to be tenable, its characteristics MUST NECESSARILY be entirely consistent with the way things really are. After all, we ARE talking about God, Creator of the Universe, here.
I don't believe in a god because there is absolutely no reason to believe.
All of the gods and all of the creation theories in all of the religions are equally absurd.
The arguments from design, cosmology and morality have all been given lots of time on other posts. All are flawed and don't prove anything.
This is not even logic!!!!
"Also, by definition, God is uncaused."
By whose definition? By the escape clause definition? Is uncaused even a word? Where did god come from?
I just need to read a small part of the bible to know that christianity is not true.
A miracle would not convince me, it has been done too many times in sci-fi, all it would show is that we don't know how the "miracle" was done. Most of the technology we use today would have seemed miraculous 100 years ago.
Zen-atheist wielding Occam's katana.
Jesus said, "Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division." - Luke 12:51
BMcD wrote:Indeed I do, Will. I believe that I exist. Everything else might be bullshit. I interact with the world I perceive around me, but make no assumptions or assertions that my perceptions might not be wrong?
I mean that, to take your example, while I expect the key will unlock the car, if it has appeared to do so in the past, I cannot assert knowledge that it will. I'd be surprised if it didn't work, but I can't know that such won't happen.
Do I consider the 'weird claims' all simultaneously equally likely? Of course not. I interact with the universe that I perceive. I can't interact with anything else, after all... and just like things like 'I could die in the next moment'... I could have a heart attack, I could get hit by a car, a plane could crash on me... like all of these things are possible, I acknowledge the possibility that all that I know could be wrong... but I continue to interact with the universe that I perceive, on the basis of what I perceive. To do otherwise... that way lies madness. But ultimately, I'm forced to admit: I simply don't know. Are there magical creatures? I don't expect them to be found, but in the end, I don't know.
On a side note, since you referenced the Long Count scenario... on December 21, 2012, the 'end of the world' according to the Long Count doomsdayers, a friend of mine turns 43. I have been poking at him over this, saying things like 'Oh, fine, you get done being 42, the Ultimate Answer of Life, the Universe, and Everything... and the world ends' and '43... Number of the Bush!'. And it amuses me greatly.
I get ya wise BMcD , but this a question of what ya put your bet on,
And so I say, this, now, is Gawed , seems most obvious to me. God is not a question for me.
Oh, the OP meant as a separate god thingy ..... but how can anything be separate ? I won't play this silly god game .... oh but shit, so I must. So how do I place my bet ? I don't understand this god game ? If it about the likes of God of abe , or like ideas ? .... you must be kidding, no? okay, so I bet my life on fuck no ..... nothing is separate is all of the why ....
{ man you all is fast typer thinkers, I can't keep up, I was going to be #31 post, geezz I AM slow ..... ummm , Time is messing with my head, I must stop time What good is it ? ..... wait , go , backup , up , down , I don't get any of this shit ? .... How does someone pray to this god thing ????
{ that took like 10 edits , damn me ..... I AM not drunk enough ......
BTW , OP Kuraishel I AM sorry, I will try to be of more help when I can get myself GOD serious ..... but that ain't easy when you are GOD ..... hang in there , lol from me god .....
Atheism Books. |
Why Israel Is A Threat To World Peace
Brother Nathanael Productions, BroVids
Why Israel Is A Threat To World Peace
Support The Brother Nathanael Foundation!
Or Send Your Contribution To:
The Brother Nathanael Foundation; PO Box 1242; Frisco CO 80443
__________________________________
For More See: Jewish Imperialism & The US Military Click Here
And: Dangers Of A ‘Jewish’ State Click Here
And: All BroTube Videos Click Here
CLICK: Brother Nathanael! Street Evangelist!
Support Brother Nathanael!
Please Send Your Donation To:
Brother Nathanael Kapner; PO Box 1242; Frisco CO 80443
Brother Nathanael @ June 26, 2012
Dear Real Jew News Family,
How do you like Foxman saying that 30% of Americans are “infected” by anti-Semitism” … as if this is a “disease” rather than a RESPONSE to Jewish evil?
It’s really the other way around isn’t it?
And that is that JEWRY has INFECTED America and the Western World with CONTINUAL wars, CHAOS, and ANTI-CHRIST corruption.
You see, I NAME it. I don’t beat around the “illuminati”/”globalist” bush like Alex Jones and friends.
Perhaps this is why I get so few numbers of donations and have to struggle at the end of every month to make ends meet.
I just lost a major, regular contributor and this has got me down in the dumps. This is what happens when I am dependent on just a FEW to keep me going.
I wonder why it is that so few donate to me? Everyone writes to me telling me how much they love the articles and videos but don’t give me a dime.
With all of this “love” I’m simply going broke..
Text –Text– Text
Why Israel Is A Threat To World Peace
By Brother Nathanael Kapner
It was Gunther Grass, Nobel prize winner of Germany, who recently said that Israel was a greater threat to world peace than Iran.
Why is this so? I grew up as a Jew and I will tell you why.
You see, I was indoctrinated from childhood with the belief that I belonged to a persecuted people and that every Gentile was a potential enemy.
Thus, I was to be wary of Gentiles, who, as Abe Foxman puts it, are “infected” with anti-Semitism.
[Clip: “I want talk about some of the specifics of this report. Abraham Foxman is the national director with the Anti-Defamation League. He is in our studio in New York.
Hey there Abe! Let’s dig a little deeper into this report. What do you think are the most important take-aways?”
“I remember when we started doing the surveys in the ’60s approximately 30% of the American people were infected with serious anti-Semitism.”]
Now transfer this “fear of contagion” to Israel—armed to the teeth with nuclear weapons—and you have a nation ready to wage war against the entire world.
You see, Israel maintains a state of perpetual hostility with its neighbors and an expansionist policy of a “Greater Israel” extending from Morocco to Afghanistan and beyond.
Syria is next on Israel’s hit list to split it into competing Islamic militias so that it poses no obstacle to Jewry’s quest for global dominance.
The victims will be Syrian Christians of whom Israel and its puppet state, godless Amerika, have no scruples in seeing them murdered into extinction.
And with Israel being recognized as a legitimate “state,” with diplomatic residencies throughout the world, it pursues through local Jewish Lobbies a political agenda that is destructive both to national stability and world peace.
For on the one hand you have the affirmation by the Western world—insisted upon by global Jewry—of a “Jewish” state, which means nothing less than an anti-Christ entity with diplomatic credentials.
But on the other hand you have the surrender by the Western world—manipulated by world Jewry—of their sovereign right to shape their own national interests and identities.?
And ever since, an International ruling class has emerged with Jerusalem as its center…which the Biblical book of The Revelation calls “spiritual Egypt” and “Sodom and Gomorrah.”
“The Lord rained fire down upon Sodom and Gomorrah,” the Bible tells us.
And as it now appears, the only way the beast of global Zionism can be destroyed is by a second fire.
I hear you speak a lot about Czar Nicholas II, and the great Eastern Orthodox monarchy.
My question is would you like to see monarchies come back in full swing?
Would you like to see the U.S. become a monarchy? I think many of us would like to know the answer.
Few donate because many people are insincere leaches.
They fake compliments and fake friendships. They waste your time and bandwidth on purpose. The Zionists always use treachery. They will spend years faking friendships. The compliments are sincere from those that donate and insincere of those that do not.
Folk like Alex Jones control the opposition more then you realize. He is very wealthy yet you put out more truth then he does. Funny how that works.
There is almost no real opposition on the Internet. It’s a bunch of Zionists/sadists faking friendships and wasting people’s time. China is probably taking up most of your bandwidth followed by Israel. There is software that can block entire countries. It’s worth buying.
Those that really are anti-Zionist are not allowed to make money. That is how severe the corruption is. So called Christians won’t help for the most part. True Christians will help but they are hard to find.
I would make donations mandatory for those who comment. Watch how many people leave. Watch how many people stop wasting your time once you do that. Make the videos for those that donate.
There is probably not one person that reads your website that cannot afford a few bucks.
I do believe +BN is right, Zionism will indeed be destroyed by a second fire, this time permanently. I found the following article that explains why.
———-
Many think that the State of Israel is a fulfilment of prophesy of the return of Israel to the promised land. In a way it is, but not in the way most think.
A hundred year ago it was believed that the Jews would have to repent before returning to the old land.
Paul’s says in Romans 11.
Now revealing this prophesy is.
8 And it will be as when a hungry man dreams—and behold, he is eating; but when he awakens, his hunger is not satisfied, or as when a thirsty man dreams—and behold, he is drinking, but w hen he awakens, behold, he is faint, and his thirst is not quenched. Thus the multitude of all the nations shall be, who wage war against Mount Zion..
————-
Muzza.au
From the same author another aspect about Jerulalem:
———–
Some people may say “how could God allow Jerusalem therefore the temple to be destroyed?” The traditions of men say that the old city of Jerusalem must be the Jerusalem of Bible prophecy, that the old city must be restored and become the Capital of the Kingdom of God at the second coming of Christ.
Along with this comes the parallel tradition that the old temple must be rebuilt upon the old site. Many Christians think it will become Jesus’ home on earth and the place of an earthly throne. Jews have someone else in mind, of course.
But when we study the history of this and see how the law never prophesied that the glory would remain in any particular place, we are able to lay aside that tradition of men and see that God was preparing a better temple in a better city where He would dwell.
The glory of God was first located at Shiloh (Joshua 18:1) in the tribe of Ephraim. When the priesthood corrupted that place, God delivered the Ark of the Covenant into the hands of the Philistines (1 Sam. 4:11).
They also destroyed the town of Shiloh itself and killed many of the priests (Ps. 78:64). The priestly center moved to the town of Nob (1 Sam. 22:11), though the Ark was not there.
Finally, in the reign of David, he conquered Jebus and renamed it according to its original name when built by Shem (Melchizedek), the City of Salem, or Jeru-Salem. He then brought the Ark of the Covenant to Jerusalem and housed it in a tent called the Tabernacle of David.
In this manner, God took the glory away from Ephraim and gave it Judah for a time, as we read in Psalm 78:67, 68:
“(67) Moreover He refused the tabernacle of Joseph and chose not the tribe of Ephraim; (68) But chose the tribe of Judah, the mount Zion which he loved.”
David’s son, Solomon, later built a temple to house the Ark. But soon Jerusalem and its temple became as corrupted as the priesthood in Shiloh had been. Finally, God raised up Jeremiah to say in 7:11 and 12:
“.”
A den of robbers is a hideout for thieves, where they can feel safe in their lawlessness. Jeremiah then compares Jerusalem to Shiloh:
” .”
When God forsook and destroyed Shiloh, His presence never returned to that city. Instead, it moved to a new place–to Jerusalem. But now, Jeremiah says, God is going to forsake Jerusalem like He did Shiloh–and for the same reasons.
In other words, once His glory departed, He would never return to that location again to dwell.
Ezekiel 10 and 11 records his departure as far as the Mount of Olives (Ez. 11:23). One has to go to Acts 1:9-12 to see the final stage of departure where the glory of God (in Christ) departed from the Mount of Olives and returned to heaven.
When the glory returned ten days later at Pentecost, it did not come to reside in the temple, but in a better temple. Know ye not that ye are the temple of God?
It is not difficult for men to conceive of our bodies being God’s temples. It is more difficult, however, for men to fully let go of the idea that God dwells in physical buildings.
———-
Muzza.au
As far as the Jews are concerned, if you ain’t with ‘em your agin ‘em.
So an indifference to Israel is in itself anti-semitism. Foxman should have been asked, “What did the Jewish people do that made so many people hate them?”
It would be interesting to hear his response. Because it would have to cover a lot of different cultures over a long, long time period.
Dear Br. Nathanael and brothers,
Great video on the sad state of affairs Israel has brought America and the world in, for people are too brainwashed and helpless, they are deceived, thanks to the Rothschild’s school system, Holocaustianity, the Jesuit Vatican ll, the mainstream evangelicals, and the 501c3 government churches.
Most people have fallen for the Great Deception either in blind and idiotic support for Israel or in their silence, idleness of activism against Israel, and only the few will see Truth and prevail through the Great Tribulation, and at this point in time, it looks like it’s staying that way.
People are looking for a political solution to a spiritual problem, and the result is the foolish and desperate acceptance of the Antichrist and his system.
Man cannot stop the wrath of Satan’s children and their Babylonian occupied Jerusalem, for we must wait for the return of Our Lord God Jesus Christ to finally clean house.
NEW VIDEO FOR BR. NATHANAEL:
BR. NATHANAEL: A LEADER IN THESE FUNKY TIMES
@ youtube.com/watch?v=0iEck7yoNyo
Everything I read on this site was great including almost all of the comments.
1 or 2 comments seem to have hate in their hearts against Christians. Pray for them. They fear TRUTH.
GOD bless all of you and Precious Br. NATHANAEL.
I would like to subscribe but do not see any way to.
Dear +BN,
Well done. It just doesn’t get any cleaner and clearer than how you’ve put it all together in this video as to just “why Israel is a threat to world peace.”
People in Europe are getting fed up with Israel. The Power Jews are feeling their feet getting closer to the fire.
Anyone have any info on most recent opinion polls here in the Americas?
The latest whine from the Simon Wiesenthal Center:
EUROPE AND THE JEWS 2012: DRAMATIC RISE IN ANTI-JEWISH, ANTI-ISRAEL PREJUDICE
A Simon Wiesenthal Center Special Report by Dr. Harold Brackman:
God bless you, dear brother in Christ, and I hope and pray your prayerful isolation bore some spiritual refreshment and fruit.
IC XC
NI KA
PS to Dan:
Welcome to RJN family. All you need to do to subscribe, I believe, is to ask +BN to put you on his mailing list.
Prime Minister Binyamin Netanyahu called upon Jewish youths visiting Auschwitz-Birkenau to be “proud that the Jewish people rose from the dead.”
He termed the voices calling Israel a threat to world peace – “chutzpah.”
In his speech also there is this detectable threat that Israel is now capable of defending itself.
So, who is the danger to world peace? Judge it for yourself:
And finally please watch this video below;
Hi BroNat,
I am curious what you make of Vladimir Putin’s recent visit to Israel, and his remarks there pandering to Zionist Jewry and Holocaustianity.
I have tried telling myself that it’s “just politics,” but ultimately find it hard to excuse his statements. While Putin is certainly better than any other European leader*, it looks like he just isn’t the hero we all want him to be.
*I don’t know as much about him, but I don’t think Belarusian president Alexander Lukashenko has ever paid homage in Israel (which Putin has, twice) and was even condemned as “anti-Semitic” by the Israeli government. Sounds like a good guy.
I generally go by the rule that anybody the “Western” Jewish media hates, must be doing something right.
Here’s the thing: In 1948 the Jews pretty much confiscated a predominantly Muslim land, a Muslim land surrounded by other Muslim countries.
How were they expecting this to turn out well? So for the past 64 years it has been their aim to maintain military hegemony over the entire region, demonizing their neighboring Muslim countries as being a threat to peace. Most Jews today have no ancestral ties to Palestine and have no right to be there.
If Palestine was allowed to remain as Palestine, any Jew could live there if they wanted, as many Jews did peacefully coexist with Muslims and Christians in Palestine pre-1948. Zionists contend they need their own country, because everyone wants to kill them.
Well how about looking in the mirror and reviewing their past deeds to find out why this is so? But Zionists aren’t interested in being liked.
They are interested in being at the top of the heap, and using misguided Christians to help them achieve their aims. The misinformation the Zionist media spreads about Iran is truly appalling. Fact is, Iran has never violated a nuclear non-proliferation treaty, whereas Israel has never signed one.
With Iran having political backing from Russia and China, any provocation by Israel will explode into a fullscale world war. I hope Netanyahu is not stupid enough to start this war.
I went to the link Deer’s Mountain posted above of Bibi Netanyahu’s speech, and noticed in the right margin of the website a link for Jonah, a Jewish non-profit helping Jews struggling with unwanted same-sex attraction.
The website says that traditional Jewish teaching says same-sex relationships should be strongly discouraged. Now here’s my question: Since Americans live in such a Jew-dominated culture, why then is homosexuality glorified and celebrated?
Just this morning, I saw a headline on TV that the Pentagon was hosting some Gay Pride event! So it’s really true, homosexuality, public schools and tattoos are for goyim only!
@Ricky
Putin was certainly NOT “pandering” to the Jews in his visit to Israel.
He was showing Amerika that it is NO LONGER the only player in the Midlle East equation.
Putin WARNED Netanyahu against attacking Syria and Iran and then paid a DIPLOMATIC official visit to Abbas encouraging him to pursue Palestinian statehood. +BN
When the wicked Jews plot together, the good men too must plot together, else they will be cut down, man, woman and child, a ghastly sacrifice to nature’s most contemptible spawn.
American friends, REMEMBER.
Swindler’s list - rabbis gone wild!
@Ricky June 27, 2012 @ 12:22 am
Nobody can look into a man’s mind, and not rarely in the history of mankind it has happened that somebody was believed to stand for one thing and then, by surprise, it turned out that he aimed at completely different targets.
Therefore, nobody who is in possession of all his senses could, without second thought, sweep aside your remark: “… I am curious what you make of Vladimir Putin’s recent visit to Israel, and his remarks there pandering to Zionist Jewry and Holocaustianity…”.
The first thought that came to my mind was that action speaks louder than words and Putin’s actions are plentiful.
1) Stopping the plundering of Russia by coming down on the Oligarchs like a ton of bricks, with one of the main culprits ending up in prison, the other one publishing comments from London that Putin is not a democrat, the Russians are yearning for democracy and therefore Putin must be removed from power (all, by now, well known Jew talk), whilst yet other opponents have fled, you might guess it, to the US and Israel.
2) Putin`s extraordinary support for the Russian Orthodox Church and his publicly shown humility vis a vis high ranking Church leaders.
It should be known that the most vengeful haters of Christianity are the Jews with their positions having been declared in writing with these words: Jesus should be burning in hell for all eternity being submerged in his own semen and excrements.
3) The Jew-Attempt to involve Russia in WWIII via Georgia. The plan was to make Georgia a NATO-Member weeks before a Georgian attack on Russian populated areas with special international status.
I remember Russian jets shooting down an Israeli drone and I remember that in order to neutralise further Israeli-instigated military attacks from Georgia on the territories concerned it was necessary for the Russians to partly invade Georgian territory. Had the Jewish plan succeeded this would have been the beginning of WWIII.
It was foiled because the Russians knew of the plan in advance and agreed with several non-Jewish Western leaders to prevent Georgia becoming a NATO member.
4) The Bismarck-like policy of reassurance Putin follows with China in the Far East.
5) The containment of Jewish plans in Syria and Iran by way of a contrary policy on the part of Putin.
6) The banning of homosexual and lesbian street parades in Russia.
7) Putin’s pronouncement after the last elections in Russia in front of hundreds of thousands of Russians:”…nobody, repeat nobody from abroad will tell Russia what to do…”
Besides, if Putin wants to negotiate regarding the situation in the Middle East should he go to the puppet Obongo or would he be better advised to go to the lions den and speak to those who are really taking the decisions?
If Putin has made verbal concessions on the hollow-fraud this may be practical politics in order to confuse the Israelis and play up to certain sections of Russian society, since in Russia, unlike USA and Europe, the votes are counted out straight!
I would add though that this is my personal interpretation and I would concede that there are quite a few people who want to see that in a different light.
However, my guiding thought, when I try to assess the position of Putin in current world politics is, as already stated above “actions speak louder than words.”
As concerns your interpretation of Alexander Lukashenko I share your opinion without reservation whatsover.
Just listened again to this brief but famous ‘What if’ speech of Ron Paul. During the speech, he mentions Special Interests, Israel, Christianity and Peace and War Racket.
I had heard this speech before but today I was wearing my tin-foil hat and it dawned on me that perhaps there was that ’subliminal message’ people talk about.
Having known directly some important politicians, I found food for thought as I know most “Democratic” politicians find it necessary to “beat around the bushes” (equivalent to failing “The Litmus Test”).
Ron Paul’s What If Speech (3 minutes, 45 seconds):
References
@25 seconds - Israel: “What if propping up repressive regimes in the Middle East endangers both the United States and Israel?”
( youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=V36MT5lAMrc#t=25s )
@118 seconds - Special Interests: “What if the American people woke up and understood that the official reasons for going to war are almost always based on lies and promoted by war propaganda in order to serve Special Interests?”
( youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=V36MT5lAMrc#t=118s )
@162 seconds - “War Is A Racket”: “What if war and preparation for war is a racket serving special interests?”
( youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=V36MT5lAMrc#t=162s)
@176 seconds - Christianity & Peace: “What if Christianity actually teaches peace and not preventive wars of aggression?”
( youtube.com/watch?v=V36MT5lAMrc&feature=player_detailpage#t=176s )
*Footnote
“War is a Racket” is phrase attributed to Smedley Butler - who exposed in 1934 the attempt by the oligarchs to militarily overthrow FDR (YouTube has a handful of videos on this).
However, I found a 1934 documentary that uses the same term in the title:
‘Dealers in Death: The Story of The War Racket’
A true martyr, welsh journalist Gareth Jones!
Let’s face a naked truth on what may be behind the lack of donations.
It is not that every reader has to little money to sponsor someone who faces and brings big truths unveiling the frustrating fantasy in which the Zionists has degenerated the entire human species.
The bad consequences of Zionism are countless, but I remark on two: permanent fear and world wide spread dissolution of the Christians of modern Christianity. Permanent fear about what?
Totally everything and everybody: starting very close here the web authorities monitoring and controlling peoples words, bankers controlling your internet service provider payments and every single dime you spend for living and beyond.
And politics ruling you against yourself empowered by yourself with your own vote every time you vote, judges judging like gods in the skies deciding who dies, who lives and who is to be jailed.
And teachers corrupting based on both their ignorance and their concience, doctors and nurses playing dirty businesses with your peace of mind and deepest concerns traficking legal drugs of the health treatments industry.
And journalists all volunteered to the massive cheating arts, armies, guns and the almighty satanic weaponry commerce and industry, rushed and greedy speculators.
Everybody, if you really have eyes to see it means everybody.
Even ourselves the Pink Floyd’s comfortably numb. Like the Bible once said: there will come the time when everybody will be against everybody, sons to parents, brothers to sisters, everybody, everywhere is the greed and enviousness Zionism and Zionists oriented.
My second observation is a disgusting dissolution of lifes and values, and families, and working teams, and neighborhoods, and classmates all pursuing the Zionist Hollywood-style life perversion. It is no easy subject for regular people.
USA was named by the left a nation of cowards, an empire when hearing the far left, and an axis of evil by radicals and extremists. What is it that has to be done to prove them wrong? Simply do the “not with me” ignoring position?
Let’s try at least to sponsor one man, just one man that has not only a really brave heart but also a strong, clear and over all a free spirit to keep him revealing the arts behind the fraud.
I am writing to point out an error in your article, “Why Israel is a threat to world peace”
I think for something to be a threat, the object must exist.
There is no world peace, so Israel is not a threat, it is a cause of why there is no world peace!
Bro. Nathanael,
Nuff said. We need another Alzheimer president that will tell Netanyahu to “TEAR DOWN THAT WALL!!!” around Israel.
Susie
No Jesus No Peace, Know Jesus, Know Peace.
POPES, ROMAN CATHOLIC re: the Jews
====================================================
SYLVESTER I. Condemned Jewish anti-Christian activity..
PIUS VII. Known generally as an ‘anti.
IsraHELL is a threat to world peace because the Jews are the Devil’s minions.
Russia is a holy Orthodox nation and NOT a threat to peace just a threat to the Jews and their satanic agenda. Yet I hear all of Fox News (and that Zionist heretic Glenn Beck on his radio show) speak as if they are afraid of Holy Mother Russia.
They are only afraid of Russia unloading a can of whoop ass on IsraHELL as part of Putin’s foreign policy to protect Orthodox Christians world wide.
@Alice
It is because they (the Jews) want to make us (the “Goyim”) look like animals.
They are making fools of us by promoting this filth.
They want to corrupt us as much as possible while giving themselves the illusion that they are “sacred” and/or “chosen.”
We all know full well they are quite the opposite. The Synagogue of Satan seems like a nice description for them.
Gareth Jones’ nemesis - Walter Duranty:
Duranty was a NY Times journalist whose rapturous propagandizing for the Soviet Union under the guise of objective journalism enabled him to receive a Pulitzer Prize.
Duranty denied there was a horrible famine in the Ukraine - the Holodomor in which an estimated 6,000,000 Ukrainians starved to death - and called Gareth Jones, who’d been reporting that there was a famine, a liar.
Years later it’s become evident that it was Duranty who was lying - through both sides of his mouth.
There were calls for the NY Times to rescind his Pulitzer Prize. This has not been done and it is unlikely it will ever be done. Duranty was one of them and spoke in a language the people at the Times understand and agree with.
Thanks for that 0808 post, Bubba. My how things have changed in the Catholic Church!
But I’m reading a book now by Fr. Paul Kramer, The Mystery of Iniquity, who actually uses the “J” word when referring to the elitists that are leading us down the road to Armageddon.
It’s common today to hear it said, “He/she’s gone home to be with the Lord!” But have they really? How does the speaker know?
We do know that many today, especially liberals, are on the interstate to the inferno, but are they the only ones?
There will come a day, when all the lies will collapse under their own weight, and truth will again triumph.
?”
The following important load of information was brought to my attention via the website of the venerable incogman.
It is a companion piece to the astute statement above by Brother Nathanael. There very well could be some mistakes and errors here, but it is extremely difficult to be 100% correct when compiling mass quantities of information such as this.
Demonic Jewish Bolshevism 101:
I agree that punishment for the Zio-masonic satanists and Nicolatians is called for but we need a way of keeping innocent people out of harm’s way as much as possible.
Also another problem is the criminals are not just in Israel, but in most of the world and in most governments, so removing the problem while causing the least harm to non-enemy personel will be a challenge. A police action against offenders and their allies would seem appropriate.
All this Jew skullduggery gets to be depressing. After a while one needs a good laugh. “Antisemitic stereotype….” LOL!
“Jewish Bolshevism, Judeo-Bolshevism, and known as Żydokomuna in Poland, is an antisemitic stereotype based on the claim that Jews have been the driving force behind or are disproportionately involved in the modern Communist movement, or sometimes more specifically Russian Bolshevism….”
What? No way!
Jesus is the Prince of Peace, and His saving gospel of the Fatherhood of God and the Brotherhood of Man is the Kingdom of Heaven that the Jews rejected in His day and our’s.
For a so-called ‘Nation’ to reject the Son of God is an act of War in Heaven. Peace has been rejected, Jesus has been rejected, God has been denied.
No peace will come out of the jugglings of sovereignty. So long as the “State of Israel” claims the right of unlimited national sovereignty and self-determination, there will be no peace.
So long as the Jews rejected Our Sovereign Jesus Christ, there will be wars, disaster, international unsettledness, all led by the blind few who claim to be God’s chosen. The real disease is caused by the twin viruses of the delusive belief in an unlimited national sovereignty and self-determinism.
You simply cannot have peace on earth unless there is goodwill among all men. And there will be no good will among men if they refuse to treat each other as brothers and sisters in the Kingdom of Heaven, as taught by Jesus.
@Citizenfitz 11:04 post:
Very sobering read at your site! (Few are chosen.) I am very thankful for the reminder.!
Its NOT just Israel that is a threat to world peace–
It is the International Jewish Rothschild Banking Empire (headquartered in the CITY of London, UK) that is at the heart of all threats to world peace. The empire is, in fact, the pinnacle source of all evil on Earth today.
The International Jewish Rothschild Banking Cartel sponsors wars of aggression worldwide (through the US military, primarily)–which they own, with the intent to control the global geopolitical chessboard and to advance a pro-death global eugenics agenda to exterminate the “goyim” (non-Jew) into oblivion.
The recent “failure” of the Rio+20 Earth Summit in Brazil at the end of June 2012, reveals that the International Rothschild Empire has NO interest in a global carbon emissions treaty or an international sustainable development agreement, since BOTH of these arrangements would threaten their pro-death depopulation eugenics policies to bring down world population numbers to “manageable’ levels.
The agenda is DEATH and DESTRUCTION for the International Jew, plain and simple. The little terrorist/bastard nation of Israhell is sure to play a pivotal scriptural role in the end time unveiling of the BEAST system taking the reigns of planned world JEW government power, ruled over by a coming “christ” figure (the Anti-christ).
If Israel and the International Jew represent DEATH, then all who oppose their world must, by default, stand for LIFE.
Let us therefore ALL stand with the force of LIFE, or the light side of the “force”… for this is a WAR for the future of all Life on Earth.
-Jedi Command
Israel and most of its inhabitants are evil. There is no doubt about it.
It is Israel who has threatened Europe (Samson Option),
It is Israel who murders, destroys, and beats innocent people.
It is Israel who has no sanctions because the politicans in USA have no balls.
1) Tel Aviv is a nest of evil.
@Jedi Command
You are correct. I already mentioned one city. Here are three more: New York (Jew York), London, and Paris.
2) New York has financed many conflicts. Especially Bolshevik Revolution and the direct deaths of 65 million people in Eastern Europe and another 70 million deaths in WWII.
It has the 2nd highest Jew population in the world.
It is the financial center of JewSA and banking in North America.
3) London like New York has financed many conflicts. Perhaps even more than New York. It is the home of the Rothschilds family and other scum.
4) Paris similar to London.
There are another few extra cities that I am not listing.
These are all important financial centers. They have large populations, LOTS of Third World immigrants (multicultarism is forced everywhere except Israel), larger crime rates, smaller Christian/White populations, etc.
I just don’t see any way out of this except for the destruction of these cities and/or the determined routing of the traitors (Rothschilds, Rockfellers, etc, etc,). Of course they have the money to sway the masses and police in their favor.
Sigh. This battle seems impossible.
Anti-Communism blog
Anti Communist Home
Dedicated to Religious Persecution of all kinds, committed by the Bolsheviks and Communist regimes that have plagued mankind for decades, since the time of Karl Marx.
Researching and exposing the massacres and mass human exploitation in the name of Communism.
=======================================================
Good blog if you haven’t seen it yet.
Of course Communism = 99.9 % Jew…
Lots of good information ,I am surfing through it …… suggest you send to the brainwashed skeptics you know.
As we speak, webpages containing important information are being blocked, taken down, etc. I wonder: should people copy webpages that contain important info?
Here is one that seems worth copying as PDF and stand-alone webpage:
Regarding Burnt Offering - Sacrifice:
Perhaps Citizenfitz and other have other suggestions?
Putin praised the Red Army’s destruction of Germany and the rescue of the Jews while at the same time saying that we should never deny the Holocaust.
Sorry, but my mind has been changed.
@ Wotan,
I do agree with you. Actions speak louder than words.
Putin went first to the Church of the Holy Sepulcher where he knelt at the Anointing Stone and then into the chapel where the Holy Fire comes on Easter and then to the Calvary and to the cave where the Holy Cross was found.
Only after, he went to the Wailing Wall.
As to the words, I think that his denunciation of those who try to revise the history of WWII was a warning against fanning Russophobia in the border states (like the carnavalesque reenactment of the invasion of 1812 performed recently in Lithuania).
And in fact it was Israel who erected the memorial for the Red Army!
Almost thinking that the pandering is from the other side!
PK @ 12:04 pm
That was very well said!
Rachel, Blogger’s been screwing with me, too.
It won’t allow people to subscribe to my site and I’m pretty sure they’re running my numbers down. I’ve actually seen my hits going backwards. Looks like ol’ Fitz has come up on Jew Central’s radar. LOL!
I can only imagine how fiercely they’re attacking Brother Nate. You just want to have everything backed up for the day they pull the plug on your site.
Jews Arrested for Vandalizing Yad Vashem Holocaust Memorial.”
——–
Need I say more.
Muzza.au
Indeed, indeed,
Actions do mean much more than words.
Donations rather than long commentaries should be a priority for all those who want this site online.
Not to speak of a possibility of weekly live video-podcasts and the long-awaited, but impossible for pecuniary reasons, legal action against the Hanuka Menorah on W.H. Lawn. Brother Nathanael has ambitious plans and lots of energy but empty pockets as of today.
Donations - you people - keep this site online and only you can keep it going.
Never forget this simple fact of life.
@AWS
While it is true that most who follow Brother N’s work yet who don’t contribute to this site, despite having the ability to do so, should be contributing, there are some who simply cannot.
Those such as myself working but part-time and thus not having adequate income to make contributions are NOT hypocrites and insincere leaches as you have charged.
Nonetheless, despite my poverty I still made a very modest donation to Brother N. one time in the past, and if things get a bit better I hope to offer more.
An insincere hypocritical cheapskate I am NOT!
I really like and respect Brother N’s work, despite the wretched and grim circumstances I presently find myself.
Citizenfitz [June 27, 2012 @ 7:50 pm] …
You must surely know by now that Blogger is owned by Google?
And isn’t Google the most kosher of all the silly corporate internet companies created by Jews since the Dot.com bubble?
There are alternatives, including a DIY blog. Blogging software is available. All you need do then is rent some space from an ISP. Indeed, this is the precise model Brother Nathanael has been following.
If you drop Microsoft Windows and make the relatively easy transition to Linux, then you will get access to free blog editing software. It may not be of fully commercial quality, but it will get the job done and allow you to blog without you having to fret every day about what Google’s Blogger is going to think!
Rachel [June 27, 2012 @ 6:03 pm] …
QUOTE–”As we speak, webpages containing important information are being blocked, taken down, etc. I wonder: should people copy webpages that contain important info?”–UNQUOTE
With your high intelligence, I think you knew the answer to your question as you were writing it.
YES!!! Everyone must work hard to build a library of essential documents, blog articles, and historical images, so that as little as possible gets lost while the ADL and their stupid minions attempt to scrub the World Wide Web of all incriminating evidence against them and the so-called ‘Jews.’
It is essential that those who have the time and nouse, copy onto local disk (hard drive, or CD, or USB drive) all articles that contain evidence of past crimes by Jews, and also those articles that contain evidence exonerating the Jews’ past enemies, such as the Russians (under the Czar), and the Germans.
Such information, held in a vast, informal, distributed library, will never be lost to future generations.
I believe that Israel is setting up the super-powers to go to war with each other (China, Russia and the U.S.) so when WW3 is over they will have the only nukes left and will,(with their subs armed with nuclear weapons) claim dominance over the whole world.
Once the superpowers are gone they will claim themselves as victors, and will rule what’s left of the world for themselves and be the NWO.
Am I close? Just A thought.
While I do not deny the Holocaust, I do make the dispassionate observation that it provided the critical mass of international support for the founding of the modern state of Israel - something the United States had long resisted despite decades of lobbying by Zionist groups, because displacing Palestine with Israel was recognized as not being in the US’s national interest.
The persecution of Eastern European Jews, or more precisely, the exaggerated media portrayal of such, is what pushed the United States and other United Nation member countries into recognizing Israel as a modern state. So the Holocaust served Zionism quite well.
The Jews who escaped were used to populate modern Israel, and the Jews who died in labor camps (far fewer than 6 million, if you believe almanacs) were Zionist collateral damage, and were used to guilt the Goys for the unprovoked slaughter (more commonly just imprisonment and expulsion) of the innocent Jewish lambs.
@ Jason-wise
Unfortunately, what you just said makes perfect sense and fits their typical modus operandi.
Found a great and interesting article on this subject.
holywhiteirish.hubpages.com/hub/Pact-between-Israel-and-Russia-to-infiltrate-and-destroy-America
“Nonetheless, despite my poverty I still made a very modest donation.”
That is my point. Even if working part-time you can afford a few bucks.
+BN probably works for free and he should not. +BN makes little income yet he puts out a bunch of quality videos. It also takes time to manage comments.
I maintain that only people who have donated should be allowed to comment. Meaning if you donate at lest $5 in one month you can comment that month. That is just my suggestion.
If you have time to read and post you can find a few bucks working part-time or not.
I am tired of excuses. Instead of a cup of coffee one day a month donate that money to +BN.
Hi Brother Nathanael,
I read your first message about the donations you need.
At the moment I am not able to donate anything because I’m starting a new business and things are tight.
But as soon as it is up and running I will donate as much as I can to you as well as to other charities.
I think this site is brilliant. I am also Greek Orthodox. I love all your updates you are so smart.
You have certainly opened up my eyes.
@Jedi Command
Quoting you:
“The agenda is DEATH and DESTRUCTION for the International Jew, plain and simple.”
Isn’t the agenda of International Jewry death and destruction of non-Jews for some sort of bizarre joy and benefit of International Jewry?
Unfortunately, I too think Jason could be uncomfortably close to the truth.
It’s a disquieting fact that Jews have been living in China for well over 1000 years. Those Jews interbred with the Chinese and today they look just like Chinese but according to the articles I’ve read, they are Talmud practicing Jews.
There is no doubt in my mind that these same Chinese-looking Jews have infiltrated the top branches of the Chinese government and military because, well, that’s just what they do.
The Jews will ALWAYS attempt to infiltrate and take-over any and all nations that are powerful. In that respect, China is no different to them than Russia or the USA or for that matter, Germany before WWII.
How many Jew-owned corporations now operate out of China? Think about it. If China and Russia take out Israel and even do some collateral damage to the USA, aren’t the Jewish elite already prepared for that event?
Some very large Jew-owned corporations have a very solid base in China today, and even if Israel got blown to kingdom come, the Jewish power elite would not lose out. THEY don’t live in Israel!
Brother
As soon as I get back on my feet I will send what I can.. I hope you continue to write great articles until then.. God shall provide in the end..
Jay..
Regarding the numerous back and forth comments about Putin’s visit to Israel, my 1.5 cents:
For Putin to be any kind of player in the game to stop the inevitable strike against Iran and the full takeover region-wide of the world’s last and only mineral deposits that are not under Jewish control (will they morph from “Goldberg and Silverstein” to “CrudeBerg, OilStein and PetrolMan?), he has to toe the line like Ron Paul with the hollow hoax b.s.; he also made a strategically wise decision by giving the credit to the Red Army for ending the hollow hoax.
In so doing the latter, he provides these enemies of all Civilization with a debt, due and payable to his country that can not only never be repaid, but makes all absurd accusations of “anti-semitism”, more accurately called anti-Polish Corridorism, patently ridiculous.
This is called Triangular Diplomacy. It is the linking of the world through self interest, according to the charismatic and peace-loving Henry Kissinger.
Putin is using Kissinger’s sinister Talmudic logic against the terrorist state. The idea is to play one side one way, playing up to their vanities, self interests and most importantly, vulnerabilities and limitations.
You then do the same with the other side, but not Iran here; Putin will approach the U.S. here as the 3rd party. Putin has the ability to actually separate the U.S. from the terrorist state and force us to bargain under different terms that AIPAC will not be able to fully thwart.
He’ll get a better deal here by deviously and secretly creating a division of some kind, probably using the Joint Chief’s angle and playing both “sides.”
As Brother Nate has already stated here, there are very high ranking members of the U.S. military who already know this Iran crap is b.s., so all Putin would be doing is reaffirming what the Joint Chiefs of Staff already know and are themselves lobbying for.
I am an American patriot and it is in the best interest of this country for its corrupt politicians to be forced to go cold turkey on their AIPAC addictions; if Putin can force this, great. The U.S. is worth saving in my view and I will defend it if necessary, of course.
It was a very smart move and the only move for Putin to make. He does not want to be rendered ineffectual on the world stage as another Ahmadinejad. (People who can’t spell the guy’s name without a spell check have no right to say we need to (”do something about Iran.”)
Putin has a certain moral authority with the U.N. which the terrorist state does not. The terrorist state’s human rights record and history of violation of U.N. resolutions is a piece on the chess board to be exploited. This will be yet another side to play off.
There is one very important point about Putin that is never really mentioned on the internet: Putin is the world’s leading expert authority on the art of Judo and he wrote the definitive manual on the subject. He is a 10th degree black belt.
He has beaten numerous world champions in competition and even trains and spars with MMA G.O.A.T. Fedor Emelianenko, so Putin is also a master of Sambo, obviously. Judo is a physical chess match, requiring supreme mental strength and confidence, as well as obvious physical superiority.
There isn’t a man in the entire IDF that could beat Putin in a street fight, and you can bet your kosher aluminum foil and Clorox toilet cleaner that Netanyahu knows it. This is not the typical politician’s profile. Do you think that a terrorist like Netanyahu is going to bully THIS man?
Its very strange indeed that the answer to the threat to world peace and the best interests of the U.S. would be represented by our historical arch enemy.
@ Kelly
From what I have heard there is a big battle going on in China between the Chinese “secret societes” and those that serve the Western-Judeo Interests.
Also the local Chinese groups are actually in control atm.
I hope that would be the case.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – Israel operates the largest foreign espionage organization in the United States of America. Their agents and Jews serving in our Federal Government have literally taken control of nearly every key area of our Federal Government.
Additionally, they have compromised the integrity and fidelity of the US Senate, House of Representatives, Judiciary and White House. Every single department and agency of our Federal Government is under the watchful eye and in some cases, complete control, of Jews whose allegiance is to Israel first. The Federal Government of the United States of America is now a tool in the hands of Jewish Zionist for the benefit of Israel and their New World Order.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – We must pray to God that He will raise up US Military commanders who will see the plight of our Constitutional Republic and will lead their troops, equipped with the right materials and firepower, to remove and arrest every Jew who is serving in the Federal Government. Not one Jew must be allowed to serve in any capacity in the Federal Government of the United States of America. They must all be removed.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – We must pray to God that He will raise up American Law Enforcement leaders who will arrest every Jew is working to influence and direct policy for the United States of America. Any think tank or public policy entity that currently has Jews on its staff is to be shut down, disbanded, forbidden from operating. No Jew may be allowed to practice law or be an educator. They must all be removed.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – We must pray to God that He will raise up American Law Enforcement leaders who will remove and arrest every Jew who is engaged in commerce in the United States of America. They must be forbidden from participating in any commercial business in the United States of America. Jews must be removed from every area of commerce including, among others; finance, banking, media, manufacturing, defense, agriculture, medicine, law, transportation, consulting, and insurance. They must all be removed.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – We must pray to God that He will raise up Americans who will help identify every Jew and their property. All real property owned by Jews must be confiscated. Additionally, they must not be allowed to serve in local or state government. They must all be removed.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – Bottom line - Our Constitutional Republic is on ther precipous of collapse and the time has come for Americans to rise up and force the deportation of every Jew in the United States to the State of Israel. The longer we wait to accomplish this action, the more damage will be done to our beloved Constitutional Republic.
LISTEN UP AMERICANS – No innocent Jew man, woman or child is to be physically harmed. Those Jews who are arrested, charged and convicted of a crime are to be punished in strict accordance with American law. As Americans we will respect human life, even the life of those who care not for our well-being, or for our Constitutional Republic. We will be firm in our resolve to remove the insidious influence and effect of Zionist Jews in America, yet exercise compassion for human life.
The saints on the synagogue:
There is indeed a considerable difference between Putin and Lukeshenko but this is limited only to their external behavior. Lukashenko is more open with his thoughts, Putin is more reserved. But when it comes to the so-called essentials, both men are relatively similar, both have similar aims.
Putin’s visit to Israel was nothing special, though in a certain way there was an extra dimension to it.
First of all, Putin told the Jews things that they probably found difficult to swallow. He did not go there to beat his chest and feel guilty about alleged Russian anti-Semitism. On the contrary - he said that the Jews owed their existence to the millions of dead Russians and other Slavs (the main ethnic composition of the Red Army).
In this way Putin put the Russian sacrifice above the Holocaust. You are absolutely right, Goys In The Hood, he put the Jews in a difficult position.
They won’t be able to use their usual trump card of anti-Semitism against Russians, Belarussians and Ukrainians so easily.
While in Israel, Putin made a display of his commitment to Christianity by visiting all the major Christian shrines in Jerusalem.
In addition to all that, he also openly refused to accept any military actions against Iran. By doing this he made it clear to the Jews that he will not follow the dictates of the global Zionist regime.
There may have been other reasons why Putin wanted to go to Israel.
In the late 19th century (yet before the Bolshevik Revolution) the Tsarist government constructed a number of buildings in the Holy Land. The buildings included churches as well as hostels/hotels for pilgrims.
At the time, when Israel was created, Russia was the Soviet Union. Because the Soviet Union was an atheistic state the fate of the said buildings was ignored and soon they were taken over by the Jews.
Now Orthodox Christianity has made a comeback in Russia and other parts of the former Soviet Union. The Orthodox Christians of Russia, Belarus and Ukraine want their buildings back.
Putin had demanded these buildings back yet during the time of being the premier and some of them were actually returned to the Russians by the Israeli government.
Apart from all that, it must be mentioned that today Israel is home to thousands of Russians many of whom profess Orthodox Christianity.
The numbers of these Christian Orthodox believers are estimated between 70 thousand to 100 thousand. In the 90s there was a large exodus of the so-called Jews from Russia to Israel.
Soon it became clear that most of these people were not Jews. Some were only married to Jews but were not Jewish themselves. Others had fake Jewish identities. Yet others were able to come to Israel thanks to a help of some distant Jewish relatives, some aunt or uncle. There was also another group of people who became a “problem” for the Israeli government:
Russians or Ukrainians who had a Jewish father but a goy mother. According to the Israeli laws, a person whose mother is not Jewish is not Jewish, unless he or she converts to Orthodox Judaism. Because few of these non-Kosher Russian Jews were willing to embrace Orthodox Judaism, many ended up becoming Orthodox Christians.
The result is such that all of these Russian Orthodox Christians regard themselves as Israelis but not as Jews. They serve in the Israeli army but they celebrate Christian festivals such as Christmas and Easter.
One such Israeli soldier said: I am an Israeli but I am not Jewish, I am an Orthodox Christian. My wife was Jewish but we divorced several years ago. I am not going to go back to Russia. This here is my country. I have been serving in the Israeli army. But I go to church and celebrate Russian Christmas and Easter.
Putin is aware of the Zionist games but he is also aware of the complex nature of the Israeli society, more specifically, of the Russian non-Jewish element in that society. To ignore it would be stupid, especially if we take into account the fact that what is called Israel is in fact the Holy Land, a place which is particularly sacred to Orthodox Christians of all ethnic backgrounds.
Putin, no doubt, would like to see a greater expansion of the Orthodox Christian factor in Israel.
Alpha Hog Hunter @ 11:08 pm:
You said it well. At this late hour our only hope is to return to Christ.
…again, good insights with historical facts.
It keeps ‘ringing-up’ that jews and israel are destroying America and the Muslims for their greed and god.
The REAL reason why Putin in Israel said that he finds WW2 revisionism unacceptable is because he is being blackmailed by the Jews!
The Jews have a Dolphin-class submarine carrying nuclear warheads targeting Moscow!
Israeli Professor Martin Van Crevel: .
“Our armed forces are not the thirtieth strongest in the world, but rather the second or third. We have the capability to take the world down with us. And I can assure you that that this will happen before Israel goes under.”
Dr. Hesham Tillawi: “One of the Israeli professors said a few months ago that ‘we have the nuclear capability of hitting every major European city,’ is that true to your knowledge?”
Mordechai, every where,….”
Thank you, Bro Nathanael, for helping the world to become “Semitically aware.”
After all the “Anti Semitic” propaganda we can now get our much controlled brain around a large stumbling block. This is to rid our selves of the fear which has been programmed into the collective mind by the use of words, stolen and redefined by our propagandists.
For instance, Arabs are all assumed to be “anti-Semitic,” when one takes a look at the words of the media today, however they cannot be as the Arabs are Semitic!
We must be “Anti-Evil” and “Semitically AWARE!”
Pm
” I have chiefly had men’s views confided to me privately.
What was this power to which Wilson referred? Why was it talked about in hushed tones and behind closed doors? ” Judy Andreas Rense.com
We have some idea who it is today. The wealthy elite as always. The secret groups (Bilderberg Group, Trilateral, G 8, etc.) are those who our leaders betray us from behind closed doors (violates the Logan Act and Constitution).
It is like a secret frat club but they are playing “adult games” (war, robbery, lies, hate, slavery, over throw of governments, etc.). The elite few are the greedy, power hungry, etc. They don’t care about their children’s future or their country. It is not even a ideology (Fascism) or politics in my mind. It is a mafia. They play the game to be part of the powerful elite. By ignoring it and accepting it we make them more powerful. Where else are you to go if you want riches and power?
Maybe we should pass a law that Harvard and Yale students, etc. be taught democracy, ethics and morals instead of globalism and fraud? A hard working, intelligent American learns to be part of the criminal elite at these universities (corporate run). Even lawyers turn out to be bad members of our society.
John Edwards, Elliott Spitzer, and Mark Sanford () are examples of “bait and switch for power”. They were elected as Progressives which the elite had to destroy…the movement from within. The people who were “selected” to replace these popular politicians (promised us what we wanted) could not get elected. The “selected ones” are just puppets of the elite. It is all a game to them. Forget the lives they ruin in their wake.
As Spitzer said about Wall Street, it is always the same small group of people who do all the crime. He knew them but never sent them to jail. 911 and Wall Street robbery was never investigated as he promised the people of NY State. It all ended there for it to continue. LIke the British elite empire builders they use sex scandals to remove them from office.
Thank you Rense.com for your work and concerns. The truth is hard to believe because the treason and criminality is so cruel and inhuman (Iceland, Katrina, 911, Shock & Awe, Japan melt down, etc.). Only the elite could get away with it. The media, communications, top secret research and technology, entertainment industry, military, government heads and financial sectors of our society are run by these people. Americans know something is not right and they are being lied to. That is why the Congress and President’s poll ratings are historically low. Our government is run by liars and crooks. Worse than that…murderers who do war and genocide for proift and power. The enemy is within and we even know who they are.
Solving 911 by Christopher Bollyn just about says it all. If he knows it why doesn’t the FBI and the Justice Department? It has little to do with anyone’s god or Muslim religion. They are the “boogymen” like the Jews in WWII. Strange the WWII boogymen Jews have become what they hated. It is a world criminal mafia.
People located in two small countries of the world (declared our friends by all) are destroying our culture and “freedoms” blaming Bin Laden, Muslim terrorists, etc. What else do they have? The British have never given up getting us back the fight and use our resoources for their own power and wealth (the Americas is to be theirs). Israel (theocracy) was created to cause constant chaos and wars in the Middle East (Middle East Union). It is a long term plan which is evil and destructive. These huge unions will soon be fighting each other for power, resources, slave labor, wealth, etc.
The World Order Government plan (Fascism) is a failure since even the few elite will go down. Our world destroyed with nuclear and chemicals. Problem is…they never give up. Wealth and power seems to bring a type of insanity. There can never be enough of either. Follow the money is always the MO of these criminal groups.
Fits somehow to the the topic:
CIA recruits 6000 “Black Water” mercenaries to commit massacres in Syria
The Vice-President of the Turkish Labor Party, Bulent Aslanoglu, confirmed that about six thousand people from different Arab, Afghan and Turkish nationalities, have been recruited by the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) to commit terrorist acts in Syria.
…
He pointed out that the Zionists are the ones controlling the U.S. capital, which means that the fight between Syria and Turkey is considered a war in the name of “Zionists and rich Jews.”
—
In 2009 the head of news agency AP claimed that Pentagon has 27,000 spindoctors on its payroll who tries to manipulate journalists. Now it seems that Pentagon has succeeded in overtaking Amnesty International.
Suzanne Nossel is now the head of AI US, former employee of Hillary Clinton.
Pro-NATO propaganda from AI:
—
A one man news agency in UK - a former clothier - is now a major news source for all Western news magazines like Spiegel or CNN regarding Syria:
Syrian Observatory for Human Rights.
You couldn’t make it up. A down-and-out brandy blossom is now the main source for all allegedly reputable western newspapers.
This was one of the most interesting collage of comments I have read in years.
However I cannot bring myself to belive that a man of Putin’s grit is so stupid and so intimidatable that he would have kissed Jew asses for reasons of some dark fear of the ‘Sampson Option’.
Aside from the VERY astute VERY necessary recommendations of Alpha Hog Hunter - if we don’t have the guts to save our own nation using his correct and logical defense.
I KNOW the Jew - from the boardroom arm chair warriors in the US when I was in a business with which I had to associate with these reptiles.
And, from on-the-ground experiences inside non-tourist parts of IsraHELL with their girly-men cowards in their terrorist IDF, whose best exploits have been against 5 year old children, the infirm, the ill, old women and generally anybody who was unarmed and defensless.
When you have PERSONALLY trained over a thousand young warriors in every capacity immaginable from instructor to company commander - you know every mother’s son’s ethnicity race and face. THERE WERE NO JEWS IN ANY OF THESE young warriors. NONE - NOT ONE - GET IT YET?
They were all at home doing what the Jew does best - bedding down your wives, sweethearts, and sisters, and worshiping their god- MONEY!.
Once more good people, I didn’t read this or hear about it - I LIVED it!
THEY ARE GUTLESS COWARDS!
I guarantee you that if the day comes and so much as ONE Jew A-bomb falls on ONE city outside of IsraHELL, that there will be billions of survivors who have stored up a lifetime of hatred for the cruelty and evil they have suffered at the hands of these putrid child murdering thugs, their baby-penis sucking Rabbis, and their nation of whores thieves, sadistic murders, white slavers, porn kings, opportunists and parasites.
I have been there as an insider and it is ALL TRUE! They wet their pants and shit themselves if they get captured by their victims - I kid you not!.
I have never in my 40 years and 30 nations of travel met a more thoroughly putrid, evil, filthy, degenerate, demonic, vile ilk of cowardly creatures in my LIFE! Their entire lives are dedicated to their evil, selfish, demonic, Godless, purient, salacious lifestyles.
You will witness a fullfillment of justice unlike the world has never known: a one-on-one final justice on every Jew that is under every rock, nook and cranny everywhere on EARTH! For once - the Jew terrorists will now ALL know the meaning of REAL piss-in-your-pants terror.
I would be one of that immense number who, if I survived on my feet, after IsraHELL has been reduced to a glowing molten glob of glass by the military of free world nations, I would use my last savings to go TO that miserable little shithole they stole from their neighbors, and hunt down every last miserable surviving piece of human garbage man woman and child and dog until I was too exhausted to carry on.
Then I would return home - rest and continue with the job.
Jews KNOW that is EXACTLY what would happen to ALL of them if they did not themselves prevent the event from happening in the first place.
I and millions more would have nothing mmore to lose. They stole the goodness of my country - my honor - my son - my friendship with my ex wife and a lifetime of other irreplaceable friendships; every non-material thing that made life worth living.
Outside of a tiny precious handful, I do not care for ONE STINKING SINGLE JEW LIFE. THEY ALL KNOW THIS REALITY! They are NOT Going to sacrifice their posh parasitic comfortable lives of pleasure, corruption, avarice, greed, gluttony and general materialistic evil for early graves for the insane agendas of a handful of madmen like ‘Bibi’.
AND YOU CAN TAKE THAT TO THE BANK.
Now mulitiply my quest for justice by a billion times and that is what will ALWAYS be in the back of the minds of ALL Jew bastards AND other treasonous Christ-mocking scum like the Evangelicals and BaptDUHS.
They would suffer far less if they turned their nukes against themselves - like Masada - only on a grander scale.
Are you Jews listening to your angry victims? You had better!
Now RJN readers - please go to MY site and further educate yourself to learn my personal experiences of what Brother Nathanael has already so truthfully warned you about jew evil for so long.
Joe Cortina |
2008 Country Reports on Human Rights Practices - Honduras
Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights, and Labor
February 25, 2009
Honduras is a constitutional, multiparty democracy with a population of approximately 7.7 million. In 2005 Liberal Party candidate Jose Manuel Zelaya Rosales won the presidency in elections that were considered generally free and fair by international and domestic observers. The Liberal and National parties continued to dominate the politics of the country. While civilian authorities generally maintained effective control of the security forces, there were instances in which elements of the security forces acted independently of government authority.
The following human rights problems were reported: unlawful killings by members of the police and government agents; arbitrary and summary killings committed by vigilantes and former members of the security forces; violence against detainees by security forces; harsh prison conditions; corruption and impunity within the security forces; failure to provide due process of law; lengthy pretrial detention; politicization of the judiciary, judicial corruption, and institutional weakness; erosion of press freedom; corruption in the legislative and executive branches; government restrictions on recognition of some, particularly of youths and children by vigilante groups that may have included members of the security forces. Casa Alianza reported that at least eight such cases involved security forces. The Prosecutor's Office pressed charges in some cases, but there were no known convictions during the year, and Casa Alianza had no data regarding sentences issued in the case of child and youth murders. The government has a Special Unit of Investigation of Child Murders, but the investigative process seldom identified the perpetrators.
Through August the NGO Casa Alianza reported the killings of 86 minors under age 18 and 273 youths ages 19-22. Casa Alianza reported that more than 78 percent of the killings were committed by unknown assailants, 9 percent by acquaintances, 5 percent by private security forces, 2 percent by government forces; 8 percent were attributed to gang violence.
Several groups and families of juvenile victims claimed to have provided public prosecutors with evidence of collusion between police elements and business leaders in perpetrating killings. The Ministry of Public Security stated that it investigated individual police officers for participation in killings of street youth; however, there was no information available on the outcome of the investigations.
In midyear a Tegucigalpa court dismissed all charges against retired colonel Alexander Hernandez Santos, a member of the disbanded Intelligence Battalion 3-16, for human rights violations, forced disappearances, and assassinations in the 1980s of 184 persons.
While observers linked some killings of high-profile targets, such as environmentalists, labor leaders, attorneys, and politicians, to organized crime and narcotics traffickers, other cases were apparently politically motivated.
On July 11, two unknown assailants killed attorney Marco Antonio in front of witnesses; he was the 17th legal professional killed up to that date.
In July unknown assailants outside the town of Juticalpa ambushed and killed Shamir Guifarro Ramirez, Henry Arturo Chacon, and Nelda Ochoa – the son, father-in-law, and mother-in-law, respectively, of environmentalist Mario Guifarro, who was himself killed in September 2007. Guifarro Ramirez was the only witness to his father's killing. There were no suspects in either of the Guifarro killing cases. Public Ministry investigations identified Yuny Alexander Sanchez, Jorge Tejada Pacheco, and Jose Angel Rosa Pacheco as the principal suspects in Mario Guifarro's killing and indicated that Mario Guifarro may have had illicit business dealings with Rosa Pacheco.
In the run-up to the November 30 primary elections, there were several politically motivated killings, which analysts interpreted as a "message" from organized crime for the Liberal Party and President Zelaya in particular to stop maneuvering to remain in power. On November 12, vice mayoral candidate Danilo Edgardo Castro Hernandez was killed in La Lima. On November 14, Julio Cesar Padilla, Liberal Party candidate for mayor of Morazan, Yoro Department, was killed. On November 22, masked gunmen killed Mario Fernando Hernandez Bonilla, a Liberal Party congressional deputy and one of four congressional vice presidents.
There were developments in several high-profile killings in earlier years. On October 14, authorities in Chiapas, Mexico, arrested Rodolfo "Fofo" Humberto Salinas Castejon, a principal suspect in the 2007 killing of army Captain Alejandro Humberto Zavala, a bodyguard of President Zelaya. Salinas Castejon remained in pretrial detention at year's end. Investigations also identified as suspects Juan Ramon Castejon Mendozo (who died in June 2007) and Darwin Alexander Villalta, who remained at large.
The Public Ministry ordered the arrest of David Portillo in connection with the June 2007 killing of Garifuna leader Felix Ordonez Suazo in Punta Piedras, Colon Department. Portillo remained at large at year's end.
Authorities identified Carlos Alberto Navas Gonzalez as the principal suspect in the November 2007 killing of Regional Red Cross President Jose Raul Carranza Soto in Puerto Cortes. There were no known developments in the prosecution of the case, but Navas Gonzales remained in prison on illegal arms charges. The only witness for the case was killed two days after testifying to the police.
On July 1, a court convicted four policemen of the 2006 killings of Heraldo Zuniga and Roger Murillo, two environmentalists working to protect the forest in Olancho Province. The policemen, Linton Omar Caceres Rodriguez, Rolando Antonio Tejeda Padilla, Juan Jose Talavera Zavala, and Jose Arcadio Gonzales, faced sentences of 20 to 30 years' imprisonment. However, between July 21 and 24, Caceres, Talavera, and Gonzales escaped from prison, and their whereabouts remained unknown at year's end.
On April 29, authorities arrested Italo Ivan Lemus Santos (who had just been deported to the country) for the killing of environmentalist Carlos Luna in 1998. Other suspects including Jorge Adolfo Chavez and the alleged intellectual author, Jose Angel Rosa, remained free, and there were no known developments in the prosecution of the case..
On June 11, Irene Ramirez, a member of the Aguan Campesino Movement (MCA), was killed in Trujillo. She had previously received a number of threats from local land owners and large-scale ranchers in the region. There were no known developments in the case.
On August 5, 11 persons were killed in a massacre stemming from a land dispute between the family of police official Henry Osortos and the MCA in Silin, Colon Department. After the killings, the government reportedly negotiated a payment to the ranchers of over 75 million lempira (approximately $3.9 million) to allow the peasants to stay on the land, receive legal titles, and obtain permission to construct 400 new homes. On October 17, authorities arrested Jose Isabel Morales Lopez on charges of planning the Silin massacre. According to the public prosecutor, 31 other peasants, all members of the MCA, were also charged with aggravated arson and the murder of the 11 victims.
On October 2, 9, and 14, unknown assailants killed three land-rights activists and community leaders, Fredis Osorto, Elias Murcia, and Ubence Aguilar, in the Cofradia sector of Cortes Department.
b. Disappearance
Through May 22, authorities reported receiving 227 cases of disappearances of minors: Some disappearances were thought to be criminally-motivated abductions killings, and others were attributed to voluntary acts of persons leaving the country for employment elsewhere.
On October 6, Jose Alfredo Guevera, Carlos Lazo and Hector Herrera disappeared reportedly after being detained by police officers.
There was no information, and none was expected, in the 2007 disappearance of Milton Elias Cardona from his house in Siquatepeque, Comayagua.
There was no information, and none was expected, regarding the disappearances in 2006 of Panamanian nationals Jose Camilo Miranda, David Rodrigo Villalobos Valladares, and Jorge Luis Villalobos Valladares (all last seen in the custody of Roatan police) or of Jorge Ruiz Rosales, former advisor of the National Association of Farmers of Honduras, and Elvis Zepeda Barrientos, both of whom government authorities had detained.
On December 5, the government published a decree that created the National Reparations Program, which was to consider specific cases of deaths and disappearances for reparations; the program directors not been named by year's end.
c. Torture and Other Cruel, Inhuman, or Degrading Treatment or Punishment
Although the constitution and law prohibit such practices, there were instances in which government officials employed them, including police beatings and other abuse of detainees.
On July 23, policemen fatally beat Carlos Enrique Mayorga of Copan. Officer Wilson Rubio arrested Mayorga and took him to the local police station where five other policemen beat Mayorga on the head, stomach, and genitalia before releasing him. Mayorga died hours later at the hospital; Rubio was suspended from duty.
Both Marvin Javier Martinez Bermudez and Jose Santiago Lopez Villalobo remained in prison pending trial on charges of killing Judge Alba Leticia Bueso. Allegations that security authorities tortured them in August 2007 to compel a confession were not confirmed. Two other suspects, Ruben Antonio Pineda Hernandez and Olvin Alexander Lopez Moreno, involved in the killing of Judge Leticia Bueso remained at large.
In December 2007 the Public Ministry charged five police officers for the torture and illegal detention of several members of the NGO Lesbian-Gay Rainbow Association of Comayaguela. There were no known developments in the case.
Prison and Detention Center Conditions
Prison conditions were harsh, and prison security was poor. Human rights groups reported that prisoners suffered from severe overcrowding, malnutrition, and lack of adequate sanitation. On July 11, the Special Prosecutor for Human Rights announced an investigation of a basement cell possibly used as an inhumane holding cell in the remote village of Villa Vieja; however, a Public Ministry investigation determined there was no conclusive evidence of torture or human rights violations.
Prisoners were subject to other abuses, including rape by other inmates. Adequate food or other basic necessities were not provided. Prison escapes through bribery or other means continued to occur. On October 23, the NGO Center for Torture Prevention and Rehabilitation reported that seven of 10 inmates were tortured or otherwise abused in, or on their way to, prisons and jails. Their report also found that municipal and preventative police routinely rounded up vulnerable or "delinquent" youth (for example, gay, lesbian, transsexual, sex workers, and drug addicts) without cause or explanation of their rights.
Several prison officials, including Wilfredo Maradiaga Oseguera and Aldo Rodolfo Oliva Rodriguez, were under investigation for abusing their authority and permitting prisoners illegal furlough privileges.
Prison disturbances, caused primarily by harsh conditions and intergang violence, occurred in the larger facilities of San Pedro Sula, Tegucigalpa, and Choluteca. Through October 27, the Ministry of Public Security reported that 39 prisoners had been killed while incarcerated, in most cases due to rival gang violence.
Prison authorities attempted to hold prisoners from opposing gangs in different facilities or in different areas of the same prison to reduce intergang tensions and violence. On April 26, nine prisoners died in the San Pedro Sula penitentiary in a riot between common criminals and gang members., as enforce these prohibitions effectively.
The Committee for the Defense of Human Rights in Honduras (CODEH) alleged that an undetermined number of security officials had arrested arbitrarily, and sometimes tortured, more than two dozen persons, under the government's Operation National program. The program consists of sets of different police operatives ordered by the government to monitor the population in different sectors of the major cities.
Police arrested persons based on such factors as forms of dress and types of tattoos.
On September 29, policemen wearing ski masks allegedly arrested Mario Alvarez, Nelson Alvarez, Heliodoro Amador, and Alonso Andino, peasant land-rights activists with the Union and Strength Campesino Association, in the town of Suntule, Francisco Morazan Department. The following day, according to credible media reports, another police squad came to the house of the group's secretary general and forced his wife at gunpoint to sign documents that handed over the group's lands in 60 days. There was no known investigation.
Role of the Police and Security Apparatus
The Ministry of Public Security oversees police operations, including those of the Preventive Police, Criminal Investigation Division (DGIC), Transit Police, Frontier Police, Tourist Police, and Prison Police. Corruption and impunity were serious problems within the security forces. The new Police Law approved in October restructured the Ministry of Security, resulting in creation of an Office of Internal Affairs (IA) answering directly to the minister.
The IA investigates allegations of illegal activities committed by members of the police force. The Preventive Police and the DGIC each have an office of professional responsibility that conducts internal reviews of police misconduct.
According to the Public Ministry, during the year 312 reports were filed against the police with the Special Prosecutor for Human Rights, of which 163 cases were investigated and 43 were discovered to have merit. The majority of these reports involved excessive use of force, unlawful detention, and extortion.
On April 17, during the march for striking prosecutors, an armed man threatened and unsuccessfully attempted to force educational leader Sergio Rivera into a vehicle. Witnesses said that the vehicle was full of government elite Special Forces agents.
On June 6, a court found guilty and sentenced 21 of the 43 members of the government implicated in the 2003 "El Porvenir Jail Massacre"; those sentenced included the chief of police of La Ceiba and the police commissioner.
On September 10, after infiltrating an Autonomous National University of Honduras (UNAH) union meeting, two plainclothes National Police officers were identified and found to be carrying a list of more than 130 recognized leaders from various sectors of civil society named as "dangerous" on the list. The list included the crossed-out name of slain labor leader Altagracia Fuentes with the written words "dead" next to her name.
The Ministry of Security reported that during the year authorities prosecuted 268 police officers for offenses ranging from abuse of authority to drug trafficking, rape, and homicide.
Gang violence and intimidation, notably on public transport, remained serious problems and led the government to station security officers on many public buses. In some instances police lethally targeted youth and minors, often with impunity.
Arrest and Detention
The law provides and and the right of prisoners 53 filed with the DGIC in 2007, were the only organizations that brought charges against human rights violators by seeking monetary damages. A litigant can bring such charges when the criminal court determines that damages).
2. Respect for Civil Liberties, Including:
a. Freedom of Speech and Press
The constitution and the law generally provide for freedom of speech and of the press, and there was substantial press freedom in the country. However, there were reports of government intimidation of journalists, government takeovers of television transmission frequencies,.
In August the National Commission of Telecommunications (Conatel), disregarding a judge's ruling, transferred the rights to broadcast on Channel Eight from a private enterprise, Teleunsa, to the Office of the President. Earlier in the year, Conatel refused to release the broadcast rights of Channel 12 to their owner, the Eldi business firm. On November 20, a court ruling ordered Conatel to turn over the broadcasting rights to Eldi; however, Conatel had not complied by year's end.
On September 11, NGOs published two reports describing threats to media freedom by the practice of "official publicity." The reports detailed how the government guided press coverage through greater access and advertising revenue for those producing favorable reporting while denying access or making legal threats against those who did not. The reports noted that "official publicity" had increased and was worsened by concentration of media ownership.
On November 17, President Zelaya announced that he would seek to regulate the media through legislative means to counter a "culture of death" propagated by the media with support of National Congress President Roberto Micheletti.
NGOs reported that the government also gave substantial sums of money to selected members of the media who covered their stories in the manner they requested. The government exerted considerable influence on the print media through granting or withholding publicly funded official advertisements.
The news media continued to suffer from venality, politicization, and outside influences. According to NGOs, government ministers and other high-ranking and to the president, especially on international visits, was limited to the "friendly" press and was arbitrarily awarded and withdrawn by presidential palace staff.
Thelma Mejia, a member of the National Anti-Corruption Council and former director of the NGO C-Libre, reported that at least three dozen journalists, many of them in rural areas, were subjected to threats and intimidation during the year.
On January 1, two unidentified men shot and killed Jose Fernando Gonzales, the owner of Radio Mega in Trinidad, Santa Barbara Department. The local press reported that local police had identified but had not apprehended the perpetrators.
In April in Santa Rosa de Copan, Copan Department, reporter Carlos Roberto Chinchilla of Channel 12 news and his cameraman, Marlon Dubon, received several death threats from two armed men wearing masks, warning them that they had five days to get out of town before being killed.
In May the Director of Radio Globo Sandra Maribel Sanchez announced that she and her family had received threats and had been repeatedly followed by unmarked vehicles due to her support for the prosecutors' hunger strike that began on April 7 (see section 3).
On October 27, authorities arrested German David Almendarez as a suspect in the October 2007 killing of Radio Cadena Voces journalist Carlos Salgado. At year's end Almendarez remained in custody at the Tamara National Penitentiary awaiting trial.
Internet Freedom
There were no government restrictions on access to the Internet or reports that the government monitored e-mail or Internet chat rooms. Individuals and groups could engage in the peaceful expression of views via the Internet, including by e-mail. According to the May National Institute of Statistics Household Survey, 10 percent of the population had access to the Internet. authorities applied the law prohibiting illicit associations to arrest individuals for being members of Mara Salvatrucha and other gangs. The government used criminal code reforms outlawing illicit association to arrest and take land away from suspected gang members, farmers, and persons from indigenous communities.
c. Freedom of Religion
The constitution and law provide for freedom of religion, and the government generally respected this right in practice. The government requires foreign missionaries to obtain entry and residence permits.
Societal Abuses and Discrimination
There were no reports of discrimination or violence against religious groups, including anti-Semitic acts. There was a very small Jewish population.. Through November 19, the Office of Migration reviewed no applications for refugee status. The government cooperated with the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, the International Organization for Migration (IOM), and other humanitarian organizations in assisting refugees and asylum seekers.
On November 4, authorities detained eight South Africans with false passports at the Guatemala border. The individuals subsequently filed for asylum. As of November 20, they remained in jail but were being assisted by CODEH while awaiting a decision on their applications. Liberal Party presidential candidate Jose Manuel Zelaya Rosales won in elections, which international observers considered generally free and fair. Observers noted irregularities at approximately 1,100 ballot boxes but no systemic patterns of fraud. Political parties could operate without restriction or outside interference.
Women participated actively in politics. There were 31 women in the 128-seat National Congress, and 16 women presided over congressional committees. Eight of the 15 members of the Supreme Court of Justice, including its president, were women. There were three female secretaries of state, six female vice ministers, one female general police commissioner, and five female ambassadors.
There were two Garifuna and one Lenca members of the National Congress.
Government Corruption and Transparency
The law provides criminal penalties for corruption; however, the government did not implement the law effectively, and officials engaged in corrupt practices with impunity. The executive and legislative branches were subject to corruption and political influence. There was a widespread perception that the country's anticorruption institutions had not taken the steps necessary to combat corruption and were unwilling or lacked the professional capacity to investigate, arrest, and prosecute those involved in high-level corruption. The World Bank's worldwide governance indicators reflected that corruption was a serious problem.
Many observers argued that the considerable institutional control exercised by the country's elite created the potential for abuse of the country's institutions and democratic governance.
In April a network trafficking Cuban immigrants through the country to the United States was identified. At least 15 Cubans allegedly received fraudulent work or residency visas from the Honduran consul in Havana. In July five of the parties implicated in the scandal resigned, including the minister of migration and immigration law, the secretary general of migration, the secretary general of the Chancellery, and the consul in Havana. Investigations by the prosecutor against organized crime remained pending at year's end.
On April 7, four public prosecutors set up tents on the ground floor of the congressional building and started a hunger strike to protest alleged corruption within the government. The protest quickly gained strength with 40 participants by the end of April; the protesters called for an independent audit of the Public Ministry and the removal of Attorney General Leonidas Rosa Bautista and Adjunct Prosecutor Omar Cerna. Public prosecutors ended their 38-day strike on May 14 shortly after the National Congress passed two measures meeting many of the strikers' demands.
On August 11, a court ordered the detention of Guillermo Seamman, the former head of the Civil Aeronautical Authority, pending trial for 39 charges of abuse of authority. Seamman allegedly approved more than 39 certifications for airline employees, nationals of Peru and Venezuela, who had not completed requirements for receiving licenses and had entered the country to file the paperwork, as required by law. At year's end Seamann had been released pending trial.
There was no information available on the Supreme Accounting Tribunal's investigation into charges made in 2007 that 13 mayors misused poverty reduction funds provided by donor countries.
In August a court found the former mayor of Tegucigalpa, Oscar Acosta, guilty of fraud for buying land at an overvalued price without a public bid and in September sentenced him to four years in prison, but permitted him to pay 14,600 lempiras (approximately $800) to cancel the sentence.
There were no known developments in the anticorruption prosecutor's investigation, which began in 2007, of the National Registry of Persons for illegally collecting money from persons for birth certificates and national identity cards.
4. Governmental Attitude Regarding International and Nongovernmental Investigation of Alleged Violations of Human Rights
A wide variety of domestic and international human rights groups operated in the country, investigating and publishing their findings on human rights cases. Government officials generally cooperated with NGOs and, with certain notable exceptions, were usually responsive to NGO views. In practice government bureaucracy delayed the registration for some civil society organizations, including gay and lesbian advocacy groups.
On April 2, an unidentified gunman shot and killed Luis Gustavo Galeano Romero, an educator and promoter for the Tocoa, Colon, departmental delegation for the National Human Rights Commission (CONADEH). Human Rights Commissioner Ramon Custodio petitioned the Inter-American Human Rights Commission for help protecting Romero's colleagues, and the Ibero-American Ombudsman Organization called for an investigation into Romero's killing.
Throughout the year the Association for a More Just Society (ASJ) continued to receive threats. On January 31, authorities arrested Cesar Amador, an investigative police agent and former SETECH security company employee, and Ramon Solis, a SETECH employee, on charges of killing ASJ attorney Dionisio Diaz Garcia in 2006. At year's end the two were in custody awaiting trial.
The government cooperated with international organizations such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, whose representatives visited the country several. On June 22, Custodio warned that the country was becoming a "narcostate" and stated that there was proof that at least three drug cartels had already infiltrated the national police. The legislature was responsive to the report's findings. The public placed substantial trust in the pronouncements of the commission but was dissatisfied that the government provided the commission with inadequate resources to perform its duties effectively., including systematic killing (femicides), became increasingly government did not enforce the law effectively with regard to domestic abuse. The Public Ministry stated that domestic violence accounted for most of the complaints it received and estimated that complaints during the year would exceed the more than 8,000 recorded in 2007. On June 4, the Public Ministry announced it was dedicating 27 prosecutors to cover the growing trend of femicides.
While announcing their campaign to bring an end to "femicides," the Center of Women's Rights and the Center for Women's Studies reported that 171 women had been killed through November 18 and that 90 percent of the deaths went unpunished.
The government worked with CARE and other NGOs to provide specialized training to police officials on enforcing the law relating to domestic violence. Two facilities, both operated by NGOs, provided shelter for battered women. The shelter in Tegucigalpa could accommodate 20 women and their families. Additionally, six other private centers for battered women offered legal, medical, and psychological assistance. There were 61 civil society NGOs grouped under the Women's Collective against Violence involved in combating violence against women.. According to the National Institute of Statistics 2008 Household Survey, women's salaries were 87 percent of those for men. Despite legal protections against such practices, workers in the textile export industries continued to report that they were required to take pregnancy tests as a condition for employment.
The National Women's Institute law provides for free, universal, and compulsory education through age 15; however, a 2008 National Institute of Statistics study estimated that 59 percent of children ages five to 18 attended some type of school or learning center, while 90 percent of those five to 12 attended school.
Child abuse was a serious problem. The law establishes prison sentences of up to three years for persons convicted of child abuse. There was no information available regarding the number of reported cases of child abuse.
Abuse of youth and children in poor neighborhoods and by gangs remained a serious problem. (see section 1.a.).
Trafficking in children for commercial sexual exploitation and child prostitution was a problem. Child labor was a problem, particularly in coffee and melon cultivation, fishing, lobster diving, and limestone and lime production.
On August 26, Raul Edgardo Aragon was charged with aggravated sexual assault against children. Aragon was the former administrator of the New Hope Center that takes care of at-risk youth.
In August the Education Commission of the National Congress announced an official inquiry into the sexual abuse of students by professors. There were 10 documented testimonies of these cases in the Public Ministry. On December 3, authorities arrested Professor Rene Arturo Valderramos for sexually abusing his students.
On October 31, the government distributed to the media the names of approximately 100 suspects of sexual crimes against children who remained at large.
The law outlaws "illicit associations," including gang and organized crime membership, for which it prescribes prison terms ranging from three to 12 years. Year-end statistics indicated that there were approximately 36,000 gang members, many of them minors. The NGO Washington Office on Latin America estimated that gangs were responsible for 15 percent of violent crime in the country. Gang membership was primarily confined to the Tegucigalpa and San Pedro Sula areas.
The government and children's rights organizations estimated that there were 20,000 street children, only half of whom had shelter. An Inter-American Development Bank study reported that 88 percent of street children used illegal substances, including glue inhalants and marijuana. Many street children were sexually molested or exploited. According to the UN Children's Fund, more than 2,700 children emigrated unaccompanied during the year. on average 85 to 100 formerly trafficked girls (ages 12-17) stayed at their shelters and participated in recovery programs. Casa Alianza provided assistance to approximately 2,500 children yearly, attempting to reintegrate as many as possible with their families. Other private organizations and centers of the Institute of Children and the Family also housed street children and cared for approximately 2,500 children.
Trafficking in Persons
Although the law criminalizes trafficking in persons, 100,000 to 500,000 lempiras (approximately $5,300 to $26,500) and imprisonment for four to 20 years. The law was not enforced effectively. Inadequate government funding to combat trafficking, corruption, and routine dismissal of government employees limited the government's ability to address trafficking.
A reorganization in the Special Prosecutor's Office for Children in Tegucigalpa assigns antitrafficking responsibilities to one district attorney, two lawyers, three Public Ministry investigators, and two DGIC agents. In San Pedro Sula, two district attorneys cover trafficking issues, while one attorney does so in Choluteca.
The Division Against Abuse, Trafficking, and Commercial Sexual Exploitation, a unit of the criminal investigative police, conducted detection operations throughout the country including highways, airports, ports, and hotels.
During the year, 10 sexual exploitation cases were tried in Tegucigalpa, and 48 cases remained open. There were 32 formal complaints and investigations outside of Tegucigalpa through September.
On August 26, authorities charged Juventina Alicia Cruz Barahona for trafficking an unknown number of women to Guatemala. She was convicted and sentenced to a 10-year prison term.
On November 10,.
The government referred at least seven child trafficking victims to the IOM for repatriation and referred dozens of victims each month to both government- and NGO-run shelters for assistance. One child was repatriated from Guatemala and six from Mexico; one for commercial sexual exploitation and the rest for labor trafficking. In the year ending in September, Casa Alianza cared for 245 young girls rescued from sexual exploitation.
Since 2006 the government has conducted antitrafficking training for approximately 7,000 police, prosecutors, and judges and 10,000 students. The government also coordinated with NGOs and the IOM to place victims in shelters and provide them with reintegration assistance. The Intra-Institutional Task Force on Trafficking developed a protocol for Assistance to the Victims of Commercial Sexual Exploitation, while the government's Institute for the Family focused on reintegrating child victims back into their families and society.
See also the State Department's 2008 Trafficking in Persons Report.
Persons with Disabilities
The law prohibits discrimination against persons with physical and mental disabilities in employment, education, access to health care, or the provision of other state services, but the government did not adequately enforce these provisions. The illiteracy rate for persons with disabilities was estimated at 51 percent,.
On October 10, the Honduran Association of Deaf persons marched on the Autonomous National University of Honduras to demonstrate against their exclusion from the education system, citizen participation, dignified work, and the media. The group estimated that approximately 85 percent of an estimated 75,000 local deaf persons were denied these rights.
Congresswoman Dayana Burke, a Garifuna blinded at the age of 15, was the first woman with disabilities to become a member of Congress. She advocated reform efforts for the rights of persons with disabilities.
Indigenous People
Approximately 621,000 persons, constituting persons..
In March unknown actors killed two Tolupan youths, Jose Mastul and Geovanny Banegas Sevilla, who purportedly belonged to a group dedicated to reclaiming the Tolupan tribe's ancestral land. No arrests were made in the case.
On June 5, Garifuna activist Santos Feliciano Aguilar Alvares was abducted, beaten, and threatened by 10 private security guards employed by a real estate company in San Juan Tela, Atlantida Department. Immediately prior to the beating, Santos had participated in a community assembly meant to facilitate dialogue between the community and the company.
On June 23, almost 3,000 Maya-Chorti armed with stones and spears closed the Copan Ruins to protest the government's violation of the terms of their 1997 land-rights agreement, which, they claimed, provided them with only 35 percent of the land they were promised.
On September 24, armed forces personnel patrolling the Cuero y Salado wildlife preserve allegedly shot at eight Garifuna fishermen with M-16 assault rifles, killing Guillermo Morales Herrera. The Garifuna asserted that the incident illustrated a pattern of discriminatory harassment on the part of local officials acting in conjunction with business interests aimed at driving the group from their traditional lands to permit construction of industrial and hotel ventures. Authorities apprehended three of the four soldiers implicated in the killing, while the fourth fled the area. Garifuna leaders held meetings in October with military leaders who agreed to respect traditional Garifuna rights.
The government. Many NGOs indicated that hate crimes increased, particularly during political campaign season when minorities became political targets. Representatives of NGOs focusing on sexual diversity rights asserted that security forces killed and abused their members. In cases where lesbians, gays, and transgender persons were found dead, the prosecutor often encountered serious difficulties because the victims had either concealed their identity or sexual orientation or, in many cases, were hiding from their families.
Criminal investigations did not recognize a "transgender" category. Sexual diversity rights groups asserted that security forces, government agencies, and private employers engaged in antigay discriminatory hiring practices. These groups also reported that intimidation, fear of reprisal, and police corruption made gay and lesbian victims of abuse reluctant to file charges or proceed with prosecutions.
The government stopped requiring that, as a condition for legal registration, sexual diversity rights organizations remove any reference in their bylaws to promoting respect for the rights of gay, lesbian, or transgender persons.
In October transvestite and gay rights groups filed a complaint with the Committee on Human Rights asking that authorities remove the ban on having national identity card photographs taken with make-up and feminine accessories.
There were multiple killings or attacks on persons presumably because of their sexual orientation. The sexual diversity rights organization, Lesbian-Gay Rainbow Association of Comayaguela, asserted that between January and March, unknown actors killed seven homosexuals because of their sexuality and that a number of gay persons had fled the country out of fear of social and security-force persecution. On October 30, an attacker killed Yasmin, a transgender sex worker in Camayaguela, and the following day an attacker shot Bibi, another transgender sex worker, in the center of Comayaguela. On December 18, a transgender sex worker, Cynthia Nicole, was attacked by three men with pipes and clubs after hailing a cab in Comayaguela.
In March 2007 police beat and detained Donny Reyes, the treasurer of the Lesbian-Gay Rainbow Association of Comayaguela. Police then reportedly jailed Reyes in a cell with 57 gang members who raped and beat him. The only witness to Reyes's initial arrest was killed in October 2007. Reyes filed a formal complaint, which at the urging of the Supreme Court, Internal Affairs investigated. The investigation concluded that, while Reyes had many of the symptoms of being raped, it could not definitively determine it took place during his detention. During the course of the investigation, the offices of the Lesbian-Gay Rainbow Association offices were burglarized, and all archives and computers were stolen. Internal Affairs cited five policemen, Nelson Daniel Gaitan Sosa, Hill Lainez Nunez, Walker Josue Reyes, Denis Esau Cruz Varela, and Walter Cruz Espina, for dereliction of duty.
There was no reported societal violence or discrimination against person with HIV/AIDS.
On October 17, unknown assailants killed two youths associated with the punk subculture "Emo."
Job-related age discrimination remained a serious problem.
6. Worker Rights
a. The Right of Association
The law provides for the right of workers to form and join unions of their choice, but in practice workers exercised this right with difficulty. The law prohibits members of the armed forces and the police force from forming labor unions and also prohibits public service employees from presenting union organizing petitions or participating in collective bargaining. According to MOL statistics, there were 519 unions representing approximately 8 percent of the work force, excluding the agriculture sector, and as of July approximately 13 percent of the 133,000 apparel assembly workforce.
Union leaders were occasionally subjected to violence and threats. On May 23, Julio Paz killed Israel Garcia, leader of the National Association of Honduran Farmworkers (ANACH) labor group. The killing was motivated by a National Agrarian Institute land-use ruling favorable to ANACH.
On April 23, unknown masked assailants shot to death Altagracia Fuentes, secretary general for the Honduran Workers' Federation, and two companions, labor leader Yolanda Sanchez, and their driver, Juan Bautista Aceituno. On May 17, Maynor Celin Hernandez Matute, a suspect in the shooting, was arrested on an unrelated robbery charge. In April the homicide prosecutor's office issued a warrant for the arrest of 11 car-theft gang members for the killing of Altagracia Fuentes and her companions. Gang members were arrested and charged with the killing and attempted robbery. Despite these arrests circumstantial evidence suggested that organized crime or nefarious elements within the labor movement committed the killing.. Although civil servants occasionally engaged in illegal work stoppages without experiencing reprisals, the.
In September a teachers strike over back wages paralyzed the school system and accounted for a loss of more than 40 school days ending early October. Ministry of Labor (MOL) for labor inspectors to perform their duties. The country's labor inspectorate offices did not have financial resources to cover travel for inspections and requested that the government provide transport facilities and other necessities to enable inspectors to carry out their duties.
In March the original members of the SitraFHIA union were fired without reason and then reinstated by Honduran Foundation for Agricultural Investment (FHIA). In the following months, 13 more unionists were similarly dismissed without cause while the SitraFHIA awaited official registration with the MOL. In July SitraFHIA received official registration. In October SitraFHIA was broken by FHIA management with nine of the last affiliates remaining on October 1, leaving only the president and two members. FHIA allegedly paid the affiliates to renounce union membership and return under new nonunion contracts.
On February 8,60 unionists of the Alcoa Factory were unlawfully dismissed. The workers were eventually reinstated and given their back pay. In July Alcoa Inc. announced it would cease operations at maquila plants in El Progreso and Choloma, and on August 22, Alcoa closed those plants and dismissed all 1,800 workers. On September 12, the Alcoa plant union leader, Lorna Jackson, received death threats in the form of text messages and was shot at by two unidentified men. At year's end Jackson remained in hiding, and a Public Ministry investigation continued.
On May 12, Honduran Women's Collective filed a report citing the Productos San Jose textile factory in San Pedro Sula for human rights and labor law violations; it outlined a systematic covering up of work-related health and injury reports.
In October Jerzees Choloma, a local subsidiary of Fruit of the Loom, closed its plant four months after the plant's union received its official registry from the MOL in July. Earlier in the year, workers were fired from Jerzees Choloma without reason. In October SITRAJERZEES, the newly registered union at the SitraJerzees Plant in Choloma, was in the midst of its first collective bargaining negotiations when management broke off negotiations and declared that the plant would close within six months. Workers alleged that management had made more than 100 threats to union members, indicating the plant would close if the union was formed.; however, there were reports of trafficking in children for commercial sexual exploitation and of child prostitution. Human rights organizations frequently reported that, in the private security and household sectors, workers were typically obliged to work more than 60 hours a week and only earn the legal limit of 44 hours.. Through September the MOL had authorized 36 child workers and conducted 28 home visits. MOL did not effectively enforce child labor laws outside the apparel assembly sector, and there were frequent violations of the child labor laws. The ILO expressed concern about the government's decision to appoint child labor inspectors only to offices in Tegucigalpa and San Pedro Sula and requested that it comply with the legislative requirement to conduct child labor inspections, even by using nonspecialized labor inspectors.
Census results issued in May by the National Statistics Institute reported that 13 percent of children ages five to 17 worked, of whom 76 percent were boys; 74 percent of child labor occurred in rural areas. The average monthly wage of a child worker in an urban zone was 2,199 lempira (approximately $115), compared with 1,471 lempira ($78) in rural areas.
Most working children were employed in agriculture (56 percent); others engaged in commercial activities (18 percent), manufacturing (9 percent), and services (8 percent). Children often worked harvesting melons, coffee, and sugarcane or rummaging at garbage dumps; working in the forestry, hunting, and fishing sectors; and working as deckhands and divers in the lobster industry. Children also peddled goods such as fruit, begged, washed cars, and hauled loads. Some were employed in limestone and lime production. Children, predominantly girls, also worked as domestic servants, where they were sometimes subject to maltreatment by third-party employers. Many children worked out of economic necessity alongside other family members.
On December 26, the government announced an 11 percent general increase in the minimum wage to 5,500 lempira (approximately $290) per month to be effective January 1, 2009. The increase put the private sector minimum wage (not including agriculture) on par with the public sector minimum wage. In the agricultural sector, employers often did not pay the minimum wage.
The daily minimum wage scale is divided into 10 sectors based on the size of the worker's place of employment. The scale ranged between 55 lempiras (approximately $2.88) for unskilled labor and 135 lempiras ($7.13) for workers in financial and insurance companies.. |
Publications (20)17.93 Total impact
Article: Nanosized Pt-, Ru-, and Pd-containing catalysts for organic synthesis and solution of environmental issues[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: Synthesis of Pt-, Ru-, and Pd-containing nanoparticles in the pores of polymeric matrix of hypercrosslinked polystyrene, their structure and catalytic properties are under consideration. Physicochemical studies have shown that metal nanoparticle formation depends on the properties of the polymeric matrix porous structure, the nature of metal precursors and the synthesis conditions. The study of catalytic properties of metal nanoparticles stabilized in mesoporous matrices showed promising applications of these systems in the reactions of selective oxidation and hydrogenation, which are intermediate stages in the synthesis of precursors of vitamins and medicines. In order to solve environmental problems, nanocatalysts were investigated in the processes of oxidative degradation of phenol and reductive denitrification of nitrates for purification of sewage and natural water. Keywordsnanocatalysts–organic synthesis–ecology–hypercrosslinked polystyrene–Pt–Ru–Pd–oxidative degradation of phenols–catalytic oxidation of glucose–catalytic oxidation of phenolCatalysis in Industry 05/2012; 3(3):260-270.
Article: Nanostructured metallopolymer catalysts in fine organic synthesis[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The article presents results of the synthesis of the nanocatalysts formed in the nanostructured polymeric environment and their properties. These nanocatalysts were analyzed in the reactions of selective hydrogenation and oxidation, which are the basic stages of synthesis of vitamins and aromatic compounds. The amphiphilic block copolymer micelles, ultrathin layers of polyelectrolytes and the nanopores of hypercrosslinked polymers were used as nanostructured polymeric matrices. The formation and properties of both mono- (Pd, Pt) and bimetallic (PdPt, PdAu, PdZn) nanoparticles stabilized by polymers were considered. The efficiency of nanocatalysts in combination with the high stability makes them easy to produce and promising for industrial application.Catalysis in Industry 04/2012; 2(1):11-19.
Article: Nanosized catalysts in fine organic synthesis as a basis for developing innovative technologies in the pharmaceutical industry[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: This investigation of the catalytic properties of noble metal nanoparticles stabilized in hypercrosslinked polystyrene (HPS) matrix shows the prospect for their application in regioselective oxidation region--containing the food and pharmaceutical industry).Nanotechnologies in Russia 04/2012; 4(9):647-664.
Article: Nanosized catalysts as a basis for intensifications of technologies[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: This investigation of the catalytic properties of noble metal nanoparticles stabilized in hyper crosslinked polystyrene (HPS) matrix shows the prospect for their application in selective hydrogenation, selective oxidationcontaining food and pharmaceutical industries).Chemical Engineering and Processing: Process Intensification. 01/2011; 50:1041-1053.
Article: Kinetics of phenol hydrogenation over Pd-containing hypercrosslinked polystyrene[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: Hypercrosslinked polystyrene (HPS) has been used as a support for preparation of the palladium-based catalyst, Pd/HPS, for gas phase hydrogenation of phenol to cyclohexanone. At the phenol conversion 99%, the catalyst provides selectivity for ketone not lower than 95 mol%. The Pd/HPS catalyst showed high stability, retaining its catalytic performance at least for 20 days. Kinetics was used to compare Pd/HPS with the commercial Pd/Al2O3 catalyst. The catalytic efficiency was assessed using the derived dimensionless kinetic equation without a ‘time’ parameter. Three major reaction routes with their rate parameters and activation energies were revealed. From kinetic parameters, the maximum possible yield of cyclohexanone in the temperature range of 120–180 °C was determined. The important feature of the Pd/HPS catalyst is that selectivity is independent of the temperature at a certain phenol conversion. At elevated temperatures (160–180 °C), the selectivity is at least 2–3% higher as compared to the commercial catalyst Pd/Al2O3, which makes Pd/HPS largely promising for industrial applications.Chemical Engineering Journal. 01/2011; 176–177:33-41.
Article: Kinetics of phenol oxidation over hypercrosslinked polystyrene impregnated with Pt nanoparticles[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: Liqiud-phase catalytic wet-air oxidation (CWAO) of phenolic compounds is one of the most prospective methods of waste water purification at high concentrations of toxic phenolic compounds. In this work the synthesis and catalytic properties of mixed platinum-containing nanoparticles stabilized in polymeric matrix of hypercrosslinked polystyrene are discussed. The size of platinum nanoparticles was determined by transmission electron microscopy. Proposed catalytic system showed the high activity, selectivity and stability in the phenol CWAO. The optimal conditions of phenol oxidation leading to the selectivity of 98–99% at 99% conversion were determined and the kinetics of the process at various catalyst loadings, substrate concentrations, and temperatures was studied. Mathematical modelling of the process was carried out allowing the calculation of the reaction network model.Chemical Engineering Journal 01/2007; 134(1-3):256-261. · 3.46 Impact Factor
Article: Platinum-containing hyper-cross-linked polystyrene as a modifier-free selective catalyst for L-sorbose oxidation.[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: Impregnation of hyper-cross-linked polystyrene (HPS) with tetrahydrofuran (THF) or methanol (ML) solutions containing platinic acid results in the formation of Pt(II) complexes within the nanocavities of HPS. Subsequent reduction of the complexes by H2 yields stable Pt nanoparticles with a mean diameter of 1.3 nm in THF and 1.4 nm in ML. The highest selectivity (98% at 100% conversion) measured during the catalytic oxidation of L-sorbose in water is obtained with the HPS-Pt-THF complex prior to H2 reduction. During an induction period of about 100 min, L-sorbose conversion is negligible while catalytic species develop in situ. The structure of the catalyst isolated after the induction period is analyzed by X-ray diffraction, transmission electron microscopy, and X-ray photoelectron spectroscopy. Electron micrographs reveal a broad distribution of Pt nanoparticles, 71% of which measure less than or equal to 2.0 nm in diameter. These nanoparticles are most likely responsible for the high catalytic activity and selectivity observed. The formation of nanoparticles measuring up to 5.9 nm in diameter is attributed to the facilitated intercavity transport and aggregation of smaller nanoparticles in swollen HPS. The catalytic properties of these novel Pt nanoparticles are highly robust, remaining stable even after 15 repeated uses.Journal of the American Chemical Society 11/2001; 123(43):10502-10. · 9.91 Impact Factor
Article: Nanostructured Inorganic−Organic Composites as a Basis for Solid Polymer Electrolytes with Enhanced Properties[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: A family of lithium electrolyte materials based on a polymer−inorganic hybrid is described. The base material is a blend of poly(ethylene oxide) and an organic−inorganic composite made from polyether-functionalized methoxysilanes and aluminum alkoxides. Lithium is incorporated through addition of a salt. The resulting materials are shown through a combination of methods, including transmission electron microscopy and solid-state NMR, to consist of an amorphous inorganic network, with nanoscopic voids, which stabilize the added polymer. The composite polymer electrolytes show good resistance to crystallization and good conductivity, as determined by differential scanning calorimetry and impedance measurements, respectively. The nanoscale structure of the underlying inorganic material is concluded to be responsible for the bulk properties of the system, especially those that differ from the properties of similar, pure salt-in-polymer electrolytes.08/2001;
Article: Cobalt Nanoparticle Formation in the Pores of Hyper-Cross-Linked Polystyrene: Control of Nanoparticle Growth and Morphology[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: Impregnation of hyper-cross-linked polystyrene (HPS) by either Co2(CO)8 in 2-propanol or the [Co(DMF)6]2+[Co(CO)4]-2 complex in dimethylformamide (DMF), followed by thermolysis at 200 °C, results in the formation of discrete Co nanoparticles. The concentration and characteristics of such nanoparticles were investigated by X-ray fluorescence (XRF) spectroscopy, ferromagnetic resonance (FMR) spectroscopy, and transmission electron microscopy (TEM). The FMR data here confirm the formation of spherical nanoparticles. At relatively low concentrations of Co, the magnitude of the FMR line width reveals that the mean Co nanoparticle diameter is about 2 nm, which agrees closely with the mean particle diameter discerned by TEM. An increase in Co content higher than 8 wt % is accompanied by an increase in mean particle diameter due to an increase in the population of large Co nanoparticles up to 15 nm across. Regulated nanoparticle growth over a wide range of Co concentrations is attributed to nanoscale HPS cavities, which serve to physically restrict the size of growing particles.10/1999;
Article: Polystyrene-block-Poly(ethylene oxide) Micelles in Aqueous Solution[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The formation of micelles, micellar clusters, and aggregates in aqueous solutions of polystyrene-block-poly(ethylene oxide) macromolecules (PS-b-PEO) in the presence of various additives is studied. Behavior of the PS-b-PEO micellar solutions is examined with static light scattering and sedimentation in the ultracentrifuge. Sedimentograms of the solution of PS-b-PEO in water exhibit two peaks which correspond to the formation of single micelles (Rg = 12.8 nm) and secondary micellar clusters (Rg = 42.1 nm). Experimental data show that the weight fraction of micelles and micellar clusters in the solution strongly depends on the chemical composition of the dispersing media. The addition of 1.5 vol % toluene, which is a good solvent for the glassy polystyrene cores, decomposes the micellar clusters due to an increase of mobility of macromolecules forming micelles. Addition of inorganic salts interacting with poly(ethylene oxide) tails also results in the disappearance of micellar clusters. Alcohols introduced as cosolvents can strongly change the morphology of the amphiphilic PS-b-PEO micelles.08/1999;
Article: Complexes of Polyelectrolyte Gels with Oppositely Charged Surfactants: Interaction with Metal Ions and Metal Nanoparticle Formation[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The interaction of polyelectrolyte gel/oppositely charged surfactant complexes with AgNO3 and H2PtCl6 was investigated. Three kinds of gel/surfactant complexes were studied: a complex of the anionic gel of poly(methacrylic acid) with the cationic surfactant cetylpyridinium chloride and complexes of the cationic gel of poly(diallyldimethylammonium chloride) with two anionic surfactants: sodium dodecyl sulfate and sodium dodecylbenzenesulfonate. After reduction of metal compounds by hydrazine−hydrate, sodium borohydride, or UV-irradiation, Pt and Ag metal particles embedded in the body of the hydrogel were formed. The degree of metal ion exchange was higher for the oppositely charged metal ion and the polyelectrolyte gel; i.e., Ag+ is strongly absorbed by the complex poly(methacrylic acid)/cationic surfactant, while PtCl62- ions are mainly consumed by the complex of poly(diallyldimethylammonium chloride) gel with anionic surfactants. Small-angle X-ray scattering data indicated different structural changes in the gel for the complex of an anionic gel with cationic surfactant and for complexes of cationic gel with anionic surfactants. The incorporation of the metal ions in the body of the hydrogel and the growth of metal nanoparticles was found to lead to the loss of order provided by surfactant aggregates if the distance between charged groups in the polyelectrolyte does not provide a strong hydrophobic interaction between surfactant molecules.01/1998;
Article: Cobalt nanoparticles in block copolymer micelles: Preparation and properties[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The preparation and properties of Co nanoparticles in polystyrene(PS)-poly-4-vinyl-pyridine(PVP) micelles were studied. Elementary Co was generated by two methods : (i) by reduction of micelles loaded with CoCl2, and (ii) by thermal decomposition of Co2(CO)8 in micellar solutions of such block copolymers. Co particles formed by both processes are effectively stabilized by the block copolymer matrix and do not aggregate. For CoCl2 as a Cosource, the formed particles have a size less than 1 nm. Thermal treatment of such dried polymers at 200 °C for 2 h leads to spherical particles of 3–5 nm in size. The polymeric hybrid materials prepared in this way display remarkably high values of magnetization at rather low Co contents in the polymer, i.e., we obtain a tenfold increase of the specific magnetization density. Co2(CO)8 as a Co source, results in a more complex behavior. Co2(CO)8 dissolves in the solvent as well as in the micelle core where it is converted to an cationic—anionic complex involving the 4-VP units. The shape and size of the Co nanoparticles formed by thermolysis can be controlled by the balance of 4-VP/Co and can be varied from spherical particles in the limit of lower Co loads being mainly attached to the micelle core to a star-like and cubic morphology in case of excess of Co2(CO)8. Both superparamagnetic and ferromagnetic materials can be prepared. For ferromagnetic samples coercive force varies from 250 to 475 Oe depending on Co content and polymer sample.Colloid and Polymer Science 04/1997; 275(5):426-431. · 2.33 Impact Factor
Article: Specific features of complexation of organometallic compounds with polybutadiene and its copolymer in solution[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The formation of complexes of Zr, Fe, W, Pd, and Rh with polybutadiene and polystyrene-polybutadiene block copolymers is studied. Linear organometallic polymers are formed when every metal complex interacts either with one active group of the polymer or with two groups forming a stable cyclic or conjugated bonds. Polymer cross-linking occurs when complex formation takes place with two or more active groups that belong to different macromolecules. The interactions with palladium and rhodium compounds are typical examples.Journal of Inorganic and Organometallic Polymers 11/1994; 4(4):415-424.
Article: Surface characteristics of block copolymer solutions and reaction mixture components as key elements to understanding of the behavior of block copolymer based hydrogenation catalyst[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: This work is devoted to the investigation of surface characteristics such as contact angle and surface tension of the poly(ethylene oxide)-block-poly(2-vinyl pyridine) (PEO-b-P2VP) block copolymer solutions. The block copolymer was used for the development of micellar and heterogenized selective Pd-containing hydrogenation catalysts. Besides, surface tension of solutions of a reactant (dehydrolinalool) and a product (linalool) were investigated as a function of solvent nature and composition. It was found that varying the solvent polarity allows tuning the access of the reactant to catalytic sites and the removal of the product from the micelle core. The surface tension measurements were in accordance with the results of the catalytic investigation. Among the investigated solvents the iso-propanol plus water mixture (30 vol.% of H2O) was found to provide the best catalytic properties, although such a complex solvent revealed higher surface tension than pure iso-propanol. In the case of heterogenized catalyst, a scheme of the block copolymer interaction with the SiO2 surface was proposed.Colloids and Surfaces A Physicochemical and Engineering Aspects 383:102-108. · 2.24 Impact Factor
Article: PHYS 458-Characterization and application of self-assembled virus-like particles with magnetic coresAbstracts of Papers of the American Chemical Society. 235.
Article: Mixed Co/Fe oxide nanoparticles in block copolymer micellesLangmuir 24(2008),12618-12626.
Article: Hydrophilic monodisperse magnetic nanoparticles protected by an amphiphilic alternating copolymerJ. Phys. Chem. C 112(2008),16809-16817.
Article: Composite Solid Polymer Electrolytes Based on Pluronics: Does Ordering Matter?Chem. Mater. 19 (25)(2007)6258,6265.
Article: Interaction of metal compounds with ‘double-hydrophilic’ block copolymers in aqueous medium and metal colloid formation[show abstract] [hide abstract]
ABSTRACT: The interaction of a ‘double-hydrophilic’ polyethyleneoxide-polyethyleneimine block copolymer (PEO-b-PEI) with AuCl3, PdCl2, Na2PdCl4, H2PtCl6·6H2O, Na2PtCl6·6H2O, and K2PtCl4 in aqueous medium was studied. Micellar structure formation was observed for all metal compounds except Na2PdCl4 where additional protonation of the polymer was required to induce micelle formation. The characteristics of the micelles formed depended strongly on the metal type, the molar ratio polymermetal compound, and the type of reducing agent. Micellization in the presence of AuCl3·H2O is accompanied with reduction of the salt and the formation of gold colloid without reducing agent induced by oxidation of the PEI block. The interaction with PtCl62− ions results in narrowly distributed micelles wi size depending on the metal compound loading. In the case of loading with H2PtCl6, it was found that the size and shape of the colloids can be controlled by changing the molar ratio PEI:metal salt. The lower is the metal loading, the smaller are the particles. In addition, differently shaped Pt colloids were observed. This phenomenon can be controlled by the relative ratio of reactants.Inorganica Chimica Acta.
Article: Morphology of hybrid poly styrene block poly ethylene oxide micelles Analytical ultracentrifugation and SANS studies
Top Journals
Institutions
2012
Russian Academy of SciencesMoscow, Moscow, Russia |
Lewis County, NY
This is a page of older queries, this page is no longer updated. If you have queries for Lewis County, please post to th e Message board on RootsWeb and Ancestry.com for Lewis County, NY. Thank you, your webmaster.
Date posted: 18 Nov 2008
I am searching for any other HALL researchers. Franklin
L. Hall Sr. m.Fannie M. Flanders, had these children: Franklin Jr., Kenneth, Eva
May, Lois Evelyn, Ruth, Minnie (Mame). I know that Franklin Sr. was born in
Clayton, I don't know where he married and had his children. I have his ancestry
back to a man b. in 1788 in Cape Vincent, NY, and would like to combine efforts
with others of this family.
I am searching for a paper record of the marriage license of William Chapman (son of Shubal
Chapman) and Mary L. (Polly) Crandall.
I would appreciate exchanging information with anyone
who could give me any leads, suggestions or details regarding the parents of
Peter Keyser/Keiser/Kayser/Kyser Bowman, physician, according to the
censuses, born 1819, NY. Peter was first seen on record in Lauderdale
County, AL., in July, 1848, marrying Margaret Ann Campbell, daughter of Ailsy Reeder (dau
of David Reeder) and James Edward
Campbell. Peter and Margaret migrated to Hempstead County, AR, in
~1849 and are seen on the Hempstead federal census in 1850 with baby Francis,
2. They are later seen on the Little River, AR, census in 1860 without
Francis, but with children, Silas
Wright, James Edward,
Calbert Cleveland, Villie, John
and girls, Mary Ella and martha. Peter died in 1865, intestate, his family
indigent, and there is no record that he participated in the Civil War,
I'm looking for any descendants of JAY MARKHAM or descendants of
his brothers or sister. JAY was born 5 March 1871 and was coowner of a feed mill
in Lyons Falls. He died 28 April 1956 is the General Hospital in Lowville, NY.
Jay and his wife the former Lou Jones, has two daughters - Marion, born 25 Aug
1896 and Catherine, born 21 March 1904.
We have unpublished letters from 1834 addressed to Joseph Bradford
I am looking for any pictures of the Old Glastonbury Inn. My
recently deceased Brother in law ( Rhone ) lived there as a child, and we would
like to have a drawing done of the building for his wife.
We are looking for family records for Laura Caroline
Blake and Philander Bennett.
I am looking for any info on surnames VanAernam/Mcintyres
Am looking for information on the names of
the parents and siblings of Nichols Reimiller (Rimiller) 1831 - 1907 of Mudd
Lake near West Leyden. He was
married to Louisa Sassenbury. He is my great-grandfather. I can't
find him on any census prior to his marriage. He is buried in the West Leyden cemetery. I can't find
marriage records in the
internet.
I am looking for a Katherine Horvath, Born: 1882 in Hungary, D: 1972 in Broome County,
NY, she is buried in the Old Germany Cemetery in Lewis County with her 3rd husband Jacob A. Depan. She
was married to a Charles Kery in Virginia and a Youhse or Yousey in Lewis County
at one time. I am related to both Kery and Lewis lines in Lewis County.
Subject: Copenhagen Soldier's Monument
Date Posted: 10 Nov 2008
I would like to know the year the Copenhagen soldier's
monument was unveiled. I have a souvenir creamer from f lansing company
with a sketch of the monument on it's front. Does anyone know any history
on this item? I seems very old.
Researcher: Lynn Gaulin
Surnames: Fall, Wright, Vaughan
Date Posted: 10 Nov 2008
John H. Fall, Listed in1810 Census, Lewis
County. Would like to know what town John Fall lived in. Not
listed on census. Any information about Fall Family or Wright
Family. Erastus Fall Married a Wright Daughter and trying to find links
and information about families.
My family tree has roots in Jefferson County (Peter
Greeney), Lewis County (Charles
Delano). Some of the
names dating back to the mid-1800's are Mary
Burch Greeney (Peter's wife), David, George, Belva, and Lewis
Greeney; Jane Caval Delano (Charles' wife) and dau. Martha
Delano. Any information or leads would be
apprecated.
Researcher: Joe Kery
Surnames: Lewis, Depan
Date posted: 10 Nov 2008
Looking for
information on Herman N.
Lewis (Born 1889) and his wife Helen D. (Born 1889); and their
children Margaret (Born 1914), Amy(Born 1911), Helen (Born 1922),
Ruth(Born 1917), Eleanor (1908), Harold (Born 1909).
Researcher: Marcia Buffett
Surnames: Hardy
Date posted: 10 Nov 2008
Looking for parents and siblings of Albert Hardy who
lived in Montague Township, Lewis
County. Albert was born about 1888 and married Mildred (?) He had a
son Charles in 1917. Any information about this family will be greatly
appreciated.
Researcher: Marcia Buffett
Surnames: Hardy, Hutchins
Date posted: 10 Nov 2008
Looking for parents and siblings of
Charles Hardy
(1917-1978) married to Loretta Hutchins (1921-1987). charles was born in the
Township of Montague and may have been the son of Lyle V. Hardy who is buried in
Beeches Bridge Cem. any help would be greatly
appreciated.
[email protected]
256 Orchard Lane
McClure Pa 17841
717 543-5254
Surnames: Anderson, Packard, Clark
Date Posted: 10 Nov 2008
I am looking for any descendants of Joseph Anderson who
was born in Hingham Mass in 1721, Married Hannah Packard, His father was
Jonathan Anderson and Jonathan's father was Joseph Anderson who was born in
Scotland in 1699.
Joseph Anderson B 1721 moved to Cummington Mass where he lived until 1804.. This is when he traveled with John Clark and his family to Lewis County NY and settled on the hill near the old # 3 road.. Joseph Andrson is burried in the Riverside cemetery along Deer River in Copenhagen Ny... Joseph's son Elijah moved from Lewis County with his son John Wesley Anderson to Crawford County Pa, Elijah and John Wesley are burried in the old Edinboro Cemetery near Edinboro Lake in Edinboro PA . They owned land in Washington County on Sherrod Hill Road,,
Surnames: Urtz
Date posted: 19 Oct 2008
I am looking for information and a picture of the Urtz
homestead in Prussian
Settlement that burned on May 6, 1951.
Researcher: [email protected]
I am searching for my husbands family, I
understand they had a small farm near LOWVILLE. His name was Joseph, she was Eugenia. They
had 5 children Frank (Francis) Lillian, Leonard, Tessie, and Eugene. The
approxamate time should be 1908-1925.
I am looking for an obituary for a Joseph
Dickinson who is in the 1840 census in Turin, Lewis County. He is between
70-80 at that census, and I believe he died there. Or any other
information on this Joseph would be greatly appreciated - a burial site, will,
etc. I believe he had a son, John L., in Martinsburg, and a son, Richard,
in Lowville around 1840-50. Marcell Dickinson Warren
Hi.
Researcher: Alan
R. Clark
Surnames: Stockwell
Date posted: 01 April 2008
Seek an obit for
Catherine COOPER passed on 11/10/1945 Copenhagen
Alan R. Clark
Adult Reference Librarian
Jacksonille Public Library
Jacksonville, Florida 32202
904-765-5402
Researcher: Fay
Stronach
Surnames: Stockwell
Date posted: 01 April 2008
Looking for info on
Saloma Allen Stockwell, who died in Carthage in the late 30's children,
Lyndon Stockwell, Willard Stockwell, also Florence, Bessie and Lula Allen from
her first marriage to Drayter Allen I just verified that Saloma was
my great grandmother and I would like to find more info on her, would love
to know her maiden name and nationality. Thanks
looking for info. on Drayter (possibly this is a middle
name) Allen who married Saloma Reed lived in Monague in 1880, they had one child
that i know of my grandmother Florence born 1879 i recently found Florences obt.
so have verified she was my grandmother, would really like more info. Drayter
must have passed away and Saloma married Charles Stockwell and had several
children by Charles Bessie, Lula, Willard, Lyndon, and i believe Dorthy.
Florence is the only Allen child i can find. would really like more info on
Drayter and who his parents and sibblings were.
Researcher: Barb
Surnames: Dobson Vena
Date posted: 01 April 2008
Looking for Charles Adelbert
Dobson, aks Bert Dobson and wife Melvina
(Vena)Francis Dobson. Bert Dobson's dob is 1880 at Harrisville, NY, dod
1934 and believed to be buried at Harrisville Catholic Cemetery. Bert was a
guide and had many camps in the High falls and Wanakena area. Son of Myron
and Ella Palmer Dobson. Melvina was from Fine NY and died abt 1916 at High
Falls. They had 4 children, Marion Christina,dob 1908 harrisville Ny, Helen,
Roger and Canna Elizabeth. Bert had 2 brothers, Herbert and Guy Dobson.
Melvina had a sister that married Nelson St. Lawrence from
Harrisville. I have not been able to locate this family in any census records and
would welcome any feedback. Bert and Melvina are my husbands grandparents.
also Looking for information of a marriage for Vena Francis to Bert Dobson.
probably between 1903-1907 in the Harrisville, NY area. Vena is the daughter
of Fred and Amelia Francis and Bert is the son of Myron and Ella Palmer
Dobson also from the Harrisville area. Vena and Bert are our
grandparents.Also tracing Joshua and Diana Kinsman Dobson.Bert Dobson's
birth name is Charles Adelbert (albert) but he ended up going
by Bert and most all writings about him list his name as Bert.(seems he was
a well know guide in the area and he had many camps where folks came from
many areas and stayed.they were known as "Dobson Camps". Vena's full name
as best we can fiqure was Melvena Francis but Vena is the name on her death
certificate. She died when our Mom was 7 so it has been very hard to find
much about her. I have searched all the old newspapers on here and find her
name about 3 times but it was always before she married Bert. They had 4
children, all born in Harrisville as was she and Bert. I know Vena had sisters,
one married Nelson St. Lawrence and a brother that was killed on his job in
1912.
I am trying so hard to know this part of the family and hope that someone might
know them or be related and respond.
Thanks so much.
Greetings:
I am looking for birth/baptism information on two Gagnon ancestors
(siblings) for a Marie (c. 1885-86) and a Jean (John) Baptiste (c.
1887) in
Harrisville-Diana area. Both were the children of Joseph or Joachim
GAGNON
and a Mathilde GARRON/GAREAU.
Thank you.
Researcher: Charlene
Surnames: Radell
Date posted: 31 Mar 2008
Researcher: Shelley
Surnames: Baldwin Dailey McFaul
Date posted: 31 Mar 2008
Looking for any information on Stephenson Baldwin (b1838,
d 1878), Letitia McFaul Baldwin (b1838, d 1924, probably in Jamesville/Syracuse
area), their daughter Jessie Baldwin (b1874 - d1904), who married William
Dailey (b 1867 - d1903), Jessie lived in Grieg c1890 - 1904 until her
death. Letitia's father was Archibald McFaul (b 1816, d ?), Letitia I
believe was born in Canada.
Jessie and William Dailey had 5 children who survived to adulthood: Nellie
Dailey (married Harrienger), Bessie Dailey (married Teal, then Quant), Mary Lily
Dailey (married Reed), Florence Dailey
(later adopted and renamed Lelia Terpenning - my grandmother), and Norris
Dailey. Thank you for any/all responses!!
My husband's gg grandfather was Warren Rice (b 13 Jul 1815
in Martinsburg) His parents were Ebenezer Rice (d 17 Jun 1859 in
Martinsburg) and Sarah Fuller (d 2 Sep 1840 in Martinsburg). We are
planning to be in that area at the end of April, 2008. We want to research
this family more. Do you have genealogy resources in the library?
Are there other places we should visit? Thank you for any help you
can give.
Researcher: Bernice
Baker
Subject: J E Haberer Furniture Company
Date posted: 31 Mar 2008
I am looking for anyone with any clues to the
death of Henry D. (Driggs or Diggs) Civil War Veteran. He was married to
Polly Ward in in 1848 had son DeAlton M. Hubbard in Sep. 1849. A daughter may
also have been born to them.
Researcher: Dana
Dean
Surname: Mott
Date posted: 07 Feb 2008
Looking for any information relating to Francis
J. Mott, born 1834, in New York . I believe he may have been from Lewis
County . He enlisted in the 7th New York Cavalry (aka, 1st Mounted Rifles
or Black Horse Cavalry) in 1861 in Lowville. He appears in the 1875 Kansas
Census in Lola Township, Cherokee County, Kansas, as F. J. Mott (although an
apparent transcription error lists him as T. J. Mott) with his daughter A. (we
believe it to be his daughter Alice) born in Texas 1873, and son J. A. Mott born
in Kansas 1875, who is also known as Delbert or Adelbert James Mott. With
him in the census is also M. Mott, a female, born abt 1835 in New York . He
married a woman named Susan who was from Missouri . Francis later appears
in Jasper County , Missouri , census of 1880, with Susan and children. She
applied for his Civil War pension death benefits in 1894. I assume he
passed in Missouri but cannot find anything to support that. I am
interested in finding out if there is a relation to Jeremiah and Melissa Mott,
from Lewis County , whose children were Alice and James. Really looking
for any information on Francis J. Mott or any possible relations that could help
me discover who his parents are and if he had any siblings and their
identities. I cannot find anything about him prior to his Civil War
service. His son, Adelbert, is my great grandfather.
Thank you.
Researcher: Barbara
Badger
Surnames: Stanford Finch
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
I am looking for information of Edwin Joseph
Stanford (b.England abt. 1820), spouse Emily E. Finch (b. England abt. 1840,
Immigrated abt 1857/na 1858): First child, Fabian C. Stanford born Harrisville,
Lewis Co., 1862. Find no 1860 Census records.
Other children:
Edwin b.1866; Joseph H. b. 1867; Ruby (Rosa) b. 1867, Anna (Hannah) b. 1869,etc.
By 1870 (and after) they were in Jefferson County and show up in respective U.S. Census.
Thank you,
I am looking for any information with the
surnames of Hamblin/Hamlin or Kitts. Circa 1800 and later. Lowville,
Martinsburg, Carthage, Harrisville areas.
"May God Bless Our Troops and Veterans, Guide and Protect Them. God Bless the USA!"
Researcher: Starr
Hays
Subject: Copenhagen Cemetery in Lewis County ?
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
Can you tell me if there is a Copenhagen
Cemetery in Lewis County ? I have searched several sites as well as a
Google web search and have found references to it, but no listing. I
am looking for specific members of my family with no luck. Maybe it is not
Lewis County or on the county line with an adjoining county
Any help would be appreciated
Researcher: Judy
Moody
Surnames: Wright Rhoads
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
I am looking for the family of Sarah A Wright,
who was born in 1816 in Martinsburg, New York. She married Peter Rhoads
and lived in Waterloo, New York before moving to Columbus, Ohio before 1870.
Thank you
Researcher: TOM
AND SARAH (FORD) BARKER
Surnames: Ford Rowell Vincent Stetson Van Court
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
I AM LOOKING FOR ANY INFORMATION ON A JOHN
FORD THAT SETTLED IN DIANA ,LEWIS COUNTY POSSIBLY IN THE MID 1800'S. HERE
ARE A FEW FAMILY MEMBERS
Gilson Ford settled in Ohio; Guilford Ford remained in Madison county; Marie Rowell, a sister, resided in Wisconsin, and was the mother of thirteen children; Matilda Vincent resides in Wisconsin. Of his wife's relatives, Jesse Stetson left a large number of descendants, prominent among whom were Dr. Ezra Stetson, of Peoria, Illinois, and Mrs. Hannah Van Court, who resides in St. Louis.
WITH MORE RELATIVES IN THE LAFARGEVILLE NY AREA
TOM AND SARAH (FORD) BARKER
Researcher: Dianne
M Sealey
Surnames: Kreiner Grann
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
I am looking for the burial site of Jean George
or George Kreiner in 1853. He lived in Lewis County with his wife and family and
three brothers who all moved to Michigan shortly after he died. I am not sure if
any of his family stayed in NY so if I can get information on any other Kreiner
family members that would be great. In the 1860 Census they were listed with the
last name of Grann. Thatnk sof any help.
Researcher: Fred
DeLano
Surnames: Delano Murphy Caval
Date posted: 05 Feb 2008
I am researching Charles Henry Delano, married
1. Catharine Murphy, son Francis Henry Delano 25 Feb 1844 Oswego NY,
married 2. Jane Mariah Caval m. 1851. Charles Henry Delano died 30 Jan
1909 in West Turin NY, buried in High Street Cemetery Constableville NY.
Lived with their daughter Nora Delano ?.
Francis Henry Delano is my G Grandfather. Any information connecting Francis Henry Delano to Charles Henry Delano would be most helpful.
Fred DeLano, Retired
Researcher: Karen
A. Gould
Surnames: BUSHNELL HODGE
Date posted: 18 Nov 2007
Seeking
information regarding William W. BUSHNELL (b. Leyden, Lewis Co., NY,
1825, d. Copenhagen,
Lewis Co., NY, 1906). Who were his parents? Where
is he buried? He married Araline W. HODGE (b.
Denmark, Lewis Co., NY, 1836, d. Copenhagen,
Lewis Co., NY, 1918). Who were her parents? Where
is she buried?
Thanks! 5509 Bewdley Road , Richmond , VA 23226 ,
Researcher: Bernard
A. Brown
Surnames: Brown Thompson Snider Carpenter Graves
Date posted: 15 Oct 2007
I have identified
a Richard "Ellison" Brown b. 1860 possibly in Lewis County. d. 1927 in Oklahoma
City. He is a great uncle of mine through marriage of his sister, Ellen L. Brown
b. 25 Mar 1853 in NY, to Herbert LaGrand Graves. Ellison appears to have been
quite an accomplished builder.
Ellen and Richards parents were Charles E. Brown and Elmina Sheperd Brown. There are four other siblings listed: Erwin G., Effie B. (Snider) Mary A. and Charles C. Brown.
I am attempting to locate living relatives of Richard. He married a Willamina Thompson and had one daughter named Elva M. Brown b.1907. I do not know what became of Willamina or Elva after Ellison's death. I have two undated photos of Ellison and one with his family that I'd be more than happy to share with his descendents.
Researcher: Jan
Biross
Surnames: Hoskins Post
Date posted: 12 Oct 2007
Hi, I
have been looking for Cyrus Hoskins born 1806 Turin twp., Lewis co. ,NY ,I
cannot find his death date or where he is buried ???? I understand he was buried
in East Turin cemetery but can't get it on line ??? Also I need Cyrus Hoskins
wife Jemima (Post) Hoskins born 1803 death date and where buried ???? If
there are any other Hoskins buried with them ,I would like them too!! Thank You
so much !!! Looking forward to hearing from you !!!!
Researcher: Paul
E. Root
Surnames: Peifer Smith Hoffman Croniser
Date posted: 12 Oct 2007
Looking
for death and/or burial information for Anna Peifer Smith. She was the wife of
Paul Smith who died in 1875 and is buried in St. Michael's Cemetery, Mohawk
Hill. They were the parents of Margaret Smith, Mary Hoffman, and Barbara
Croniser. The last mention of Anna is in the 1880 census, living with her
daughter Margaret Smith. Anna was 63 years old at the time. I have not been able
to find any record of the death of Anna in cemetery or church records.
Thank you!
Paul E. Root
Business Analyst II
National Government Services
Phone: 315-442-4067
Researcher: Jim
Downs
Surname: Downs
Date posted 20 Sept 2007
Two
of my cousins, Their last name was Downs, they lived in Lowville between 1875
and 1895. Their mother was married to a man named Draper. Their father was
killed in the Battle of Gettysburg in the Civil War.
Do you have any record of their marriages?
Thanks,
Researcher: Holly
Massia
Surnames: McConald Fenton McGlauchlin
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
I
am seeking information on the William C.McDonald family and/or the McGlauchlins
of Martinsburg
William is buried along with his wife(maiden name Ainsworth) in the Port Leyden Cemetery, and upon visting there a few times I have noticed fresh flowers on the graves from time to time. This leads me to believe there are living members of the family in the area. My grandfather was his brother Lester who lived in Little Falls NY where both parents( William Edward and Eliza ( Fenton) McGlauchlin) of William and Lester lived until their death he in 1932, she in 1933. I have the death certificates of both of them as well as the location and picture of their burial site.
The parents of William are listed as Edward and Mary McDonald, both being born in NYS, but no particulars as to where????
Any information on the McGlauchlins or the McDonalds would be greatfully appreciated.
Holly Massia
Cape Vincent NY
Researcher: Holly
Massia
Surnames: McConald Fenton McGlauchlin
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
My
ancestors were the McDonalds who lived in the Pinney Settlement area of Port
Leyden. They were in turn related to the Fentons and McGlauchlins. I found a
grt.grt uncle buried in the Port Leyden cemetery, William C. McDonald and would
like any information available on him and his family also. I assume there area
relatives of him in the area as when I stop I find flowers on his and his wife's
graves. I live in Cape Vincent at present but lived in Little Falls where
William and Eliza McDonald also lived.
Thank you,
Researcher: John
H Northrup
Surname: Williams
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
Would
like to contact anyone who might have information on a Mariett Williams, born
1859, died 1860, struck by lightning. I found his/her headstone in the Gardners
Corners cemetery, Gardner Road, Tug Hill, and would like to know some history.
thanks,
Visit us at:
Idle Chatter:
Researcher: Andy
Dann
Surname: Johnson
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
I
am seeking information about Julius Johnson who was born in New York between
1795 and 1799. By 1817 he was living in Martin County Indiana. He named his
first son Shelden Joseph Johnson or in other listings Joseph Sheldon Johnson.
The 1800, 1810, 1820 and 1830 censuses list a Sheldon/Shelden Johnson in Leyden.
The 1810, 1820, and 1835 censuses list a Joseph (surname) Sheldon also. are
there any probate documents for Sheldon Johnson in Lewis County? Is Julius
possibly a son of the Sheldon Johnson in Lewis County? Is Sheldon Johnson
related to Joseph Sheldon? Any information would be greatly appreciated. Julius
Johnson is my ggg-grandfather. He died in 1831 in Martin County, Indiana. Thank
you Andy Dann
Researcher: Joe Eckhardt
Surnames: Jaqui Jacky Yokey Eckhard(t) Haas
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
I'm looking for
any descendants of Christian Jaqui (Jacky/Yokey) and his wife Elizabeth
Eckhard(t); and Michael Eckhard(t) and his wife Magdalena Haas, all of whom
lived in the Leyden area from the 1830s through the 19th C. I have traced the
origins of these families in
Alsace, and am now trying to find all of their descendants.
Researcher: Frank
O'Neil
Surnames: Maher O'Neil
Date posted: 20 Sept 2007
Hi Sandy, et al;
In
the St Peter and Paul cemetery in New Boston is the stone of a
William Maher 1829-1897 Templemore Parish Co Tiperarry Ire
Eliza his wife 1831-1904
Can anyone on the list tell me the maiden name of Elizabeth?
I'm still beating on bricks re Michael O'Neil and Hanora his wife
trying to find their prior home in Ireland. I recall my dad saying he had
Maher's as relatives....and one of Michael and Hanora's daughters was
named Elizabeth...just wonder if the Maher could be her?
Thanks
Frank O'Neil
Cleveland O
Researcher: l
godde
Surnames: Bowen Peebles
Date posted: 09 Sept 2007
Looking
for the date Sally (or Sarah) Bowen Peebles died and what cemetery she is
buried. Need to check on date her husband Sanford Peebles died,
(04/05/1865). I believe they are buried in a cemetery in or near
Martinsburg. I believe Sally died some time between 1880 and
1890.
Researcher: Ginny
Alfano
Subject: Old Oscela Road & Kotary Road
Date posted: 09 Sept 2007
I am looking for a
copy of an old map from the 1800's or any information that might show the Old
Osceola Road near Kotary Rd in Constableville. Mention is made in my deed
of this road going through my property on Kotary Rd. back in that time period
and I was just curious as to where it started and how it took it's course to
Osceola. Thank you.
Researcher: Elaine M Universal
Surnames: Clap Rogers Gillett Harlow Wheller
Date posted 27 July 2007
Clapp,
Wheeler & Rogers Family: I am looking for info on Abner & Mercy
Clapp, Jr. family who lived in Martinsburgh from app. 1801 - 1835. Sons Ela Harlow, Martin Gillett and Ralph plus daughter Emily were born here. Also any infor on James & Charity Wheeler & daughter Evoline, who lived there from ~1830 - 35. Evoline Wheeler married Ela Harlow Clapp here 3 Mar 1835. Also Marcellus Rogers, born here 30 Jul 1827 and Asa Moor Rogers who married Emily Clapp 12 Oct 1823.
Researcher: Jane McGarvey
Surname: Sullivan
Date posted: 04 June 2007
Does anyone know of any information regarding a woman named
"Kate" who was the first wife of Cornelius Sullivan? I have
a copy of her will in which she leaves everything to Cornelius,
including the farm in Highmarket. There are some indications that this
woman "Kate" was married to Cornelius in Ireland, but nothing
concrete. Any information no her would be appreciated.
Surnames: PARK, PARKS
Researcher: LaRene Kauffman
We're
looking for any information about our ancestor,
Newton Park, and his
family. He was born in 1794 in New York State and he first
appears in the NY 1820 census in Martinsburg,
Lewis County. The 1825 and 1830 census lists have him in the
town of Watson.
Looking for
information on my greatgrandmother Mary May Hutchins Johnson. She was born in
1876 around or in Lowville. Father was John C. Hutchins born 1836 in Canada,mother was Elizabeth born
1838 in Canada. She had two brothers
Charley S. and George M., I think they were artists, and one sister Edeth E..
Mary married Clifford L. Johnson in 1895 in Martinsburg. My grandfather Harold
C. (johnson) Gates was born 1895 Tug Hill, although he was born Johnson he went
to live with Henry and Vine Gates ( I think they were cousins) and upon entering
WWI took the last name Gates. My father Gerald F. Gates died on Jan. 23, 2006,
he left very few family facts. Any information on Hutchins, Johnson and Gates
would really help.
Surname: KORNILUK
Looking for
information on my grandparents, Leon and Elizabeth Korniluk. Their address
was listed as RFD #1, Lowville, NY. I understand
the land now belongs to the state and has been reverted back to its natural
state. They had a farm on Tug Hill. He died in 1939 and she in 1971
in Utica. The Lewis County
Clerk's office has a Register of Deaths that lists him being buried in Lowville
Rural Cemetery but the cemetery association's list of people buried there does
not contain his name. It was misspelled on the death register as
Korncluk. Thanks for any help offered.
Surnames: Simmons, Bush
Date posted: 19 May 2007
Researcher: Ginny
Alfano
Looking for
relatives to Alma Simmons (1885-1910) - married to Ervin George Bush
Married 12/18/1903
Lived in Belfort, NY (Lewis County)
Had four children
1. William John Bush (1905-1978)
2. Druscilla Mary Bush (1907-1973)
3. Clarence timothy Bush (1909-abt 1931)
4. Ervin John Bush (1910-1910)
Alma was my mother-n-law's grandmother for which she was named after.
Thanks
Yvonne
My
4th Great Grandparents Rev. John Clark and his wife Chloe (Pratt) Clark moved to
Leyden (Lewis), New
York, about 1800 from
Saybrook, (Middlesex),Connecticut. I
have been told he was the 1st Baptist Minister in Leyden but haven't been able
to prove this. John's wife Chloe died in 1813 in Leyden and John remarried in
1818 to Isabella Delia Kent. They had 3 more children. I found this out on a
copy of Johns will. The only thing I have on the 3 children are their names.
They are Adalin B. Clark, Harriet S. Clark and Berinthia Clark all born in
Leyden. I would appreciate any information on the 3 children. I also need
information on 5 of John and Chloes children they are Ruth Clark b:16 March
1801, John Anson Clark b: 4 February1805, Reuben Pratt Clark b: 6 August 1807,
Allen Clark b:December 1810 (died young) and Cynthia Sophronia Clark b: 11
November 1811, all these children were also born in Leyden, (Lewis),
New
York. I believe they did live in
Lowville too. John, Chloe and Delia Clark,are all buried in Leyden Hill (Lord)
Cemetery. Also their daughter in law Elizabth Clark married to Reuben Pratt
Clark is buried there too. Thank You for any information someone might be able
to help with. Robert E. Clark , Maple
Grove, Minnesota.
Researcher: No Name just click to reply
Surnames: Strife/Streiff, Roundy, Sharp/Sharpe, Flick, Wheeler
Date posted: 19 May 2007
My grandmother was Grace Strife/Streiff, born in
Lowville July 4, 1877/78. Someone sent me a census stating the Grace was 2
yrs. old in 1880, living with Michael Strife. When I checked census in
Lowvile, there is a 2 year old, Ann, listed. Grace had a female child,
born app. 1904. Grace married (?) a Frank Roundy.
Supposedly there is a Miller family cemetery lot in a
cemetery known as Union cemetery in Constableville around the first quarter of
the 20th century. A founder, Col. Seth
Miller and son Stephen T. Miller had an area. But I cant locate that cemetery
name. Does it still exist and does it have a different name?
Charles
Baltimore, MD
Researcher: Linda Glover
Surnames: Weiss, Wise, Seymour
Date posted: 18 May 2007
Researcher: Ted Metcalfe
Subject: Early Lowville Resident 1860 1870s ~ Benjamin Howard NICHOLS
Date posted: 18 May 2007
I am looking for
information on my GG Grandfather Benjamin Howard Nichols and his wife Harriet
Freeman (Scott) Nichols
They migrated from Sawston, Cambridge, England, to Lowville, Lewis County around the 1860s
They had five children born there; Benjamin was a merchant living in Lowville for ten years before returning to England
On returning to England they then migrated to Australia then on to New Zealand.
Thank you for
anything you may be able to add
Ted Metcalfe
New Plymouth
New Zealand
Researcher:
Beca Lehr
Surname: COVEY
Date posted: 8 March 2007
Hello,
I am trying
to find a cemetery called the Jacox
Cemetery in Croghan, Lewis County, New York.
It appears the cemetery is on Long Pond Road, but
darn if I can find it. Any help you be ever so king of you. I think my 4th Great
Grand Uncle, George Covey & his wife, Nancy are buried there. Thanks
much!
Sincerely,
Beca Lehr
Sutter Co. CA
Researcher:
Patty Burnett
Surnames: MAHAR/MAHER/MEAGHER
Date posted: 8 March 2007
Researcher: John Hoffman
Surnames: CALVER, DEBYAH
Date posted: 8 March 2007
Researcher: Liz Wemott
Surnames: WEMOT, WEMOTT
Date posted: 26 February 2007
My gr. gr.
grandfather Mitchell or Michel Wemot died by accident 1
August 1847 in Martinsburg, Lewis County, NY. He had formerly been a
resident of Denmark, Lewis County, and still owned land there when he
died.. I would like to know where his burial is. Hopefully, someone
will know.
Researcher: Jared Myers
Surname: Myers
Date posted: 25 February 2007
I am trying to
find my paternal grandfather who died between 1910 and 1914 in the town of Lewis, NY, His name is Gustave Myers. Can you
help me?
Subject: ROCKWELL
Researcher: Sharon
Date posted: 18 Dec 2006
Subject:
BARROW
Researcher: J.J. Mercier
Date posted: 18 Dec 2006
Searching
BARROW born in France 1850 Croghan, works in tannery 1880 us
census
Wife LAFAVE born 1856 in Canada
Dau magdalen 1875
Dau emma 1877
Son Charles 1879 or 1880
Many thanks for your help.
J.J.Mercier
Subject:
Watson
Researcher: Leah
Date posted: 16 Dec 2006
I am related
to the Revolutionary War Veteran Major Watson. (Major being his first
name). He was the son of
an Irish/Scot Immigrant named John Watson. Does the founder of the Town of
Watson--in Lewis County---have any relation to my Major Watson. Major had
at least 7 children...John, James, Major Jr., Joseph, Elizabeth...2 other
daughters. I am not sure (probably not) if James, the son of Major, is the
founder of the town. Any help's appreciated.
Leah
Subject:
Wallis - Whitney 1810
Researcher: Malcolm Wallace
Date posted: 09 Dec 06
I
am looking for any information regarding John
Whitney and Abner Wallis. They are listed next to each
other in the 1810 NY census for Lewis County. My
gggrandfather Abner Wallace(Wallis) was married to
Emeline Whitney about 1808 +/-. Their children were
Walter, b 3 Feb 1809; Nathaniel b 23 May 1811; and
Emeline b 13 Jan 1817. This is a long shot, but its'
all I have in trying to identify Emeline(Emmaline?)
Thanks
JEFFERS,
Joseph: His obit on rootsweb Jeffers Forum says he died at Pinkney, Lewis
County, New York in 1945 perhaps on the 28 June, and that he was a Rev War
Vet. I could not find him in the Lewis County Military pension census of
1841 . Can anyone tell me if he was actually living in Pinkney or just
died there? And what cemetery he is buried in? Thanks Nancy
sChleich.
*(p.s. the webmaster of this site is also a decendant of Joseph JEFFERS)
Looking for
information on my great grandparents, back 5 generations,
Asa and Rebecca (Elithorpe) Bowen. They were born in Windham County,
Connecticut around 1754-1755. He fought in the Revolutionary War and
the War of 1812. I found Asa in the 1790 Thompson, Windham County,
Connecticut Census. I know they had a son Asa and another son and three
daughters. In early 1800's they moved to Guilford Vermont. They moved to
New York, but not sure if they all moved together or separate.
Asa Senior died in Selby, Orleans or Genesee County, New York on
September 4, 1823. I am looking for information in where he and his wife
are buried. I believe they were living with a son other that Asa Jr.
Possible name of son is Abiel. Abiel became a doctor. He married Anna
Sterling Cone around 1825. They lived around Medina New York. When he
retired he lived on a farm.
Asa Jr married Mehitable Boyden in Guilford, Vermont. They later
moved to Martinsburg, Lewis County, New York. They are buried in Beeches
Bridge Cemetery in Watson, New York.
They had ten children, I have names of nine of them, looking for the
name of the tenth child. Probably died at young age. Their first
child Hiram lived a little over a month. The second child is also named
Hiram. Hiram and younger brother Daniel B. Bowen moved to Michigan. I
know Daniel Boyden Bowen was born in Martinsburg, Lewis County, New York
on March 3, 1811.
Looking for any information, especially they the parents and siblings
of Asa Bowen senior. Would like to know where they are buried. Also
would like to know the names of their other children.
Did the counties to biographical sketches of the families living in
the community? I have a couple nice biographical sketches of both Hiram
and Daniel in the township, county they moved to.
Again any information would be helpful, or suggestions of where to
look for this information.
Thank you. Linda Godde
Looking for burial
place of Mrs . Isaac Scouten. Died March 21,
1909. Lived at her daughters home Mrs. Edward Mootz in Port Leyden. Was interned
in the Port Leyden Cemetery receiving vault temporarily and buried in the
spring, in North Steuben Cemetery. Would like any information, doctors death
certificate, Corners report, W.J. Porters information on the funeral. We have
the obituary from one newspaper.
Thank you,
Subject:
Sauter family
Date Posted: 27 March 06
I am looking for any
ancestor's/descendants of Adolph Sauter. I don't have a birthdate, but am
assuming sometime around 1880-1890. He had at least 2 sons by first wife, Carl
and Fred, and a little girl. She died, then he remarried and had more sons.
There is some confusion as to his wives, and children. Carl married Mae Henry.
Subject:
ANDERSON in Riverside, Denmark
Cemeteries
Researcher: Kim Weinstein
Date Posted: 27 March 06
Looking for Joseph
ANDERSON (II) b. April 12, 1755 d. June 4, 1839.
He is buried in Riverside Cemetery. Wife Hannah Packard ANDERSON b. March
30, 1764 d. Jan. 21, 1846 and buried in Denmark Cemetery. Any info or
cemetery records would be most appreciated. They had 13 children.
Thanks.
Subject: LAMBELL
Researcher: Shirley A. Vanderstow
Date Posted: 10 February 06
Where would I find
information on a Peter Lambell who married Christina Wolf around 1853? Peter
died in Greig, Lewis County Sept. 1863 and was my great grandfather. Children
were John, Frank G, Emily L, Jennie, Isabelle, and William who was born after
Peter died and was legally adopted by William Glenn. Peter did have a brother
John Lambell.
Thank you, |
GOST National Standards
GOST
National Standards
SNiP
Construction Codes and Regulations
OST
Industry Standards
GTN
State
Technical Inspection
VNTP
Industry-Specific Norm on Technical Design
MISC
Miscellaneous Documents
NPB
Fire
Safety Regulations
SN
Building Codes
SanPiN
Sanitary Norms and Regulations
SP
Code
of Practice
RD
Regulatory Documents
KZ
Kazakhstan Regulatory Documents
VSN
Industrial Construction Standards
GGTN
Russian Federal Mining And Industrial Inspectorate
MPOT
Occupational Health and Safety Rules for the Operation of Electrical
Installations
PUE
Operation Standards for Electrical Equipment
PB
Safety Regulations
RDS
System Regulatory Documents
GN
Hygiene Regulations
REG
Russian Government Regulations
RCR
Russian Customs Regulations
RFS
Russian Financial System
GD
Government Decree
MDS
Methodical Documents in Construction
RUSSIAN FEDERAL
MINISTRIES
RUSSIAN FEDERAL
AGENCIES
RUSSIAN FEDERAL
SERVICES
BACK
FORWARD
GOST 10178-85
Portland cement and Portland blast furnace cement. Technical requirements
GOST 10180-90
Concretes. Methods of determining strength on test specimens
GOST 10348-80
Plastic-insulated multi-core installation cables.Specificaitons
GOST 10702-78
Rolled stock of high quality structural carbon and alloyed steel for cold extrusion and upsetting. Specifications
GOST 10704-91
Arc-welded straight seam steel pipe. Range of sizes
GOST 10705-80
Electrically welded steel pipes. Specifications
GOST 10706-76
Arc-welded straight seam steel pipe. Specifications
GOST 10922-90
Welded reinforcing products and embedded pieces, welded joints of reinforcement and embedded pieces for reinforced concrete structures. General specifications
GOST 11017-80
High-pressure seamless steel pipes
GOST 11851-85
Oil. Method of paraffin determination
GOST 11969-79
Fusion welding positions and designations
GOST 12.0.001-82
Occupational Safety Standards System. Key provisions
GOST 12.1.004-91
Occupational safety standards system. Fire safety. General requirements
Occupational standards safety system. Fire Safety. General requirements
GOST 12.1.005-88
Occupational safety standards system. Sanitary requirements for work zone air
Occupational safety standards system. General health and hygiene requirements for working zone air
GOST 12.1.006-84
Occupational safety standards system. Radio-frequency electromagnetic fields. Permissible levels at workplaces and requirements for monitoring
GOST 12.1.007-76
Occupational safety standards system.Noxious substances. Classification and safety
GOST 12.1.009-76
Occupational safety standards system. Electric safety. Terms and definitions
GOST 12.1.011-78
Occupational safety standards system. Explosive mixtures. Classification and testing methods
Occupational safety standards system. Explosive mixtures classification and testing. Classificaiton and test methods
GOST 12.1.012-90
Occupational safety standards system. Vibrational safety. General requirements
GOST 12.1.018-93
Occupational safety standards system. Fire and explosion safety of static electricity. General requirements
GOST 12.1.020-79
Occupational safety standards system. Noise. Method of control for sea and river vessels
GOST 12.1.030-81
Occupational safety standards system. Electric safety. Grounding neutral earthing
GOST 12.1.038-82
Occupational safety standards system. Electric safety. Max permissible touch voltages and currents
GOST 12.1.041-83
Occupational safety standards system. Fire and explosion safety of combustible dusts. General requirements
GOST 12.2.003-74
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial equipment. General requirements
GOST 12.2.012-75
Occupational safety standards system. Devices for safe work execution. General requirements
GOST 12.2.016-81
Occupational safety standards system. Compressor equipment. General safety requirements
GOST 12.2.021-76
Occupational safety standards system. Explosion-proof electrical equipment. Order of checking technical documentationa, testing and certification procedures
GOST 12.2.032-78
Occupational safety standards system. Working station ofr operator working in sitting position. General ergonomic requirements
GOST 12.2.040-79
Occupational safety standards system. Positive-displacement hydraulic drives and lubrication systems. General safety requirements for design
GOST 12.2.044-80
Occupational safety standards system. Machines and equipment for oil transportation. Safety requirements
GOST 12.2.047-86
Occupational safety standards system. Fire safety engineering. Terms and definitions
GOST 12.2.061-81
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial equipment. General safety requirements for working places
GOST 12.2.063-81
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial pipeline valves. General safety requirements
GOST 12.2.085-82
Occupational safety standards system. Vessels working under pressure. Safety valves. Safety requirements
GOST 12.3.002-75
Occupational safety standards system. Production Processes. General safety requirements
Occupational safety standards system. Manufacturing Processes. General safety requirements
GOST 12.4.011-75
Occupational safety standards system. Means of protection. Classification
GOST 12.4.040-78
Occupational safety standards system. Symbols for the identification of equipment controls
GOST 12.4.089-80
Occupational safety standards system. Building. Safety belts. General technical specifications
GOST 12004-81
Reinforcing-bar steel. Tensile test methods
GOST 12248-96
Soils. Laboratory methods for determining the strength nad strain characteristics
GOST 12971-67
Nameplates for equipment and instruments. Dimensions
GOST 13109-87
Electric energy. Requirements for quality of electric energy in general-purpose networks
Electric energy. Requirements for quality of electric energy in general-purpose networks
GOST 13580-85
Reinforced concrete slabs for strip foundations. Specifications
GOST 13862-90
Blowout prevention equipment. Standard schemes, basic parameters and technical design requirements
GOST 14098-91
Welded joints of reinforcement and inserts for reinforced concrete structures. Types, constructions and dimensions
GOST 14249-89
Vessels and apparatus. Standards and methods of strength calculation
GOST 1437-75
Dark petroleum products. Accelerated method for determination of sulfur
GOST 14782-86
Non-destructive methods. Welded joints; ultrasonic methods
GOST 1497-84
Metals. Tensile test methods
GOST 15150-69
Machinery instruments and other technical products. For use in various climatic regions. Categories and operating, storage and transpotation conditions with particular reference to environmental nad climatic factors
GOST 15543.1-89
Electrical articles. General requirements for environmental climatic aspects stability
GOST 1577-81
Rolled sheets and universal wide strips of structural steel. Specifications
GOST 16037-80
Welded joints in steel pipelines. Main types, design elements and dimensions
GOST 16293-89
Complete drilling rigs for development and deep exploratory drilling. Basic parameters
GOST 16511-86
Wooden boxes for electrical equipment. Specifications
GOST 17-1-3-12-86
Nature protection. Hydrosphere. General rules for water pollution protection over well drilling and oil and gas extracting on land
GOST 17-2-1-04-77
Nature protection. Atmosphere. Sources and meteorological factors of pollution, industrial emissions. Terms and definitions
GOST 17.0.0.04-90
System of standards in the area of environmental protection and improved management of natural resources
GOST 17.0.02-79
Metrological support for the atmosphere, surface water and soil contamination monitoring. Basic principles
GOST 17.1.3.02-77
Regulations on water protection from contamination occurred as a result of drilling and operation of oil and gas offshore wells
GOST 17.1.3.05-82
Nature protection. Hydrosphere. General requirements for surface and underground water control against pollution by oil and oil products
GOST 17.1.3.08-82
Nature protection. Hydrosphere. Procedures for sea water quality control
GOST 17.1.3.10-83
Nature protection. Hydrosphere. General requirements for surface and underground water control against pollution by oil and oil products transported through pipeline
GOST 17.1.4.01-80
Environmental protection, surface water. General criteria applied ot methods for hydrocarbon determination in natural and waste waters
GOST 17.2.6.01-80
Nature protection. Atmosphere. Devices for air sampling in settlements. General technical requirements
GOST 17.4.3.02-85
Nature protection. Soils. Requirement for fertile layer conservation in performing earth-moving
GOST 17.4.4.02-84
Nature protection. Soils. Methods for sampling and preparation of soil for chemical, bacteriological and helminthological analysis
GOST 17.5.1.01-83
Nature protection. Land reclamation. Terms and definitions
GOST 17.5.3.04-83
Nature protection. Land. General requirements for reclamation of land
GOST 17.5.3.06-85
Nature protection. Soils. Requirement for determination of the fertile soil layer standard disposal while performing excavation
GOST 17299-78
Technical ethyl alcohol. Specifications
GOST 17314-81
Devices for fastening thermal insulation of steel vessels and equipment. Design and dimensions. Technical requirements
GOST 17516-72
Electrical articles. Operating conditions as to environment mechanical aspects influence
GOST 1759.1-82
Bolts, screws, studs and nuts. Tolerance, monitoring methods of dimensions and deviations of shape and surface orientation
GOST 1759.2-82
Bolts, screws, and studs. Surface imperfections and monitoring methods
GOST 1759.3-83
Nuts. Surface imperfections and test methods
GOST 1759.5-87
Nuts. Mechanical properties and test methods
GOST 17624-87
Concrete. Ultrasound method for strength determination
GOST 18105-86
Concrete. Strength testing rules
GOST 19109-84
Plastics. Method of determining Izod impact strength
GOST 2.301-68
Formats
GOST 2.316-68
Rules for placing of inscriptions, technical data and tables on the drawing
GOST 2.601-95
Unified system of design documentation (USDD). Operational documents
GOST 20060-83
Combustible natural gases. Methods for determining water vapor content and dew point fo moisture
GOST 20061-84
Combustible natural gases. Method for determination fo hydrocarbon dew point temperature
GOST 20440-75
Gas turbines. Acceptance tests
GOST 21.508-93
Rules for the detailed design of master plans for production plants, buildings, residential and public areas
GOST 21.604-82
System of building design documents. Water supply and sewerage outside networks. Working drawings
GOST 21924.0-84
Reinforced-concrete slabs for pavements of urban roads
GOST 22727-88
Rolled sheet and plate ultrasonic inspection methods
GOST 23055-78
Non-destructive testing. Fusion welding of metals. Welds classification by radiography testing results
GOST 23118-78
Metal building structures. General specifications
GOST 23120-78
Steel stairways, landings, and guardrails. Specifications
GOST 23499-79
Structural materials and assemblies for sound absorption and insulation. Classification nad general technical requirements
GOST 23740-79
Soils. Laboratory methods for determining organic content
GOST 24.104-85
Unitized system of standards for computer control systems. Computer controlled systems. General requirements
GOST 24211-91
Concrete additives. Specifications
GOST 24634-81
Wooden boxes for products for export. Basic specifications
GOST 24756-81
Vessels nad apparatus. Norms and methods of strength calculation. Rated strength calculation of column-type apparatus from wind loads and seismic influence
GOST 24940-96
Buildings and structures. Methods of measuring luminance
GOST 25100-95
Soils. Classification
GOST 25468-82
Equipment for roundtip operations and swivels. Connecting dimensions
GOST 25773-83
Pressure vessels. Passport certification documents
GOST 2590-88
Round steel bars. Range of sizes
GOST 2591-88
Square hot-rolled steel bars. Dimensions
GOST 26291-84
Reliability of nuclear power stations and equipment thereof. General provisions and reliability index nomenclature.
GOST 26423-85
Soils. Methods for determination of cation and anion composition of the aqueous extract
GOST 26633-85
Heavyweight concrete. Specifications
GOST 26673-90
Downhole motors. Basic parameters and dimensions.
GOST 26976-86
Petroleum and petroleum products. Methods of mass measurement
GOST 2715-75
Metal wire mesh. Types, key parameters and dimensions
GOST 2761-84
Sources of centralized economic-drinking water supply. Sanitary and technical requirements and rules of selection
GOST 27751-88
Reliability of building structures and foundations. Principal design rules
GOST 27751-88 AMENDMENT
Reliability of building structures and foundations. General provisions of analysis
GOST 27772-88
Rolled products for structural steel constructions. General specifications
GOST 27834-88
Weld-on tool joints for drill pipes. Specifications
GOST 28408-89
Manual hoists and trolleys. General specifications
GOST 28537-90
Thermowells with female thread. Dimensions
GOST 2874-82
Drinking water. Hygienic requirements and quality control
Drinking water. Hygienic requirements and quality control.
Potable water. Sanitary requirements and quality control.
GOST 28759.1-90
Flanges of vessels and apparatus. Types and parameters
GOST 2879-88
Hot-rolled hexagonal steel. Range of sizes
GOST 29273-92
Weldability.Definition.
GOST 30416-96
Soils. Laboratory testing. General requirements
GOST 380-71
General purposes carbon steel. Types and technical requirements
GOST 3877-88
Petroleum products. Determination of sulfur by calorimetric bomb method
GOST 400-80
Glass thermometers for testing of petroleum products. Specifications
GOST 50591-93
Industrial gas burners. Limiting noxious concentrations in combustion products
GOST 5180-84
Soils. Laboratory methods for determining physical properties
GOST 5264-80
Manual arc welding. Welding joints. Main types, design elements and dimensions
GOST 533-85
Rotating electrical machinery. Turbo-generators. General specifications
GOST 550-75
Seamless steel tubes for petroleum processing and the petrochemical industry. Specifications
GOST 5520-79
Carbon, low-alloy and alloy sheet steel for boilers and pressure vessels. Specifications
GOST 8.009-84
State system for ensuring the uniformity of measurements. Standardized metrological characteristics of measuring instruments. Standard technical documents
GOST 8220-85
Underground fire hydrants. Specifications
GOST 8639-82
Square steel pipes. Assortment
GOST 8732-78
Seamless heat-deformed hot tubes. Range
Seamless hot-worked steel pipes. Range of sizes
GOST 8734-75
Seemless cold deformed steel tubes . Range
GOST 9467-75
Metal covered electrodes for manual arc welding of structural and heat-resistant steels. Types
GOST 9965-76
Oil degree of preparation for oil-processing plants. Specifications
GOST P 50969-96
Automated gas fire-extinguishing units. General technical requirements
GOST R 12.3.047-98
Occupational safety standards system. Fire safety of technological processes. General requirements. Methods of control, v.1
GOST R 21.1207-97
System of design documentation for construction. Graphic symbols on drawings of highways, ver2
GOST R 21.1701-97
System of design documentation for construction. Rules for execution of working documents for motor roads
GOST R 50587-93
Material safety data sheet (passport). Basic provisions. Safety information for production, use, storage, transportation, and disposal
GOST R 51164-98
Main steel pipelines. General requirements for protection against corrosion
GOST R 51330.9-99
Electrical apparatus for explosive gas atmospheres. Volume 10. Classification of hazardous areas
GOST R 51858-2002
Crude oil. General specifications.
GOST R ISO 9003-96
Quality system. Model for quality assurance in final inspection and test
GOST 12.1.012-78
Occupational safety standards system. Vibrations. General requirements
GOST 3900-85
Petroleum and petroleum products. Methods of determination of density.
GOST 12.1.019-79
Occupational Safety Standards System. Electric Safety. General Requirements and range protective means
GOST 12.2.003-91
Occupational Safety Standards System. Industrical Equipment. General Safety Requirements
GOST 12.2.007.0-75
Occupational Safety Standards System. Units of Electrotechnical Equipment. General Safety Requirements
GOST 12.2.007.1-75
Occupation safety standards system. Rotating electric machines. Safety requirements
GOST 10157-79
Gaseous and liquid argon
GOST 12071-2000
Soils Sampling Packing Transportation and Storage
GOST 12536-79
Soils. Methods of Laboratory Granulometric and Micro-Aggregate Distributions
GOST 19912-2001
In Situ Static And Dynamic Penetration Tests
GOST 20276-99
Soils-Methods-Determination-Strength
GOST 20522-96
SOILS - Methods for the statistical processing of test results
GOST 21508-76
Icing protection of aircrafts and helicopters. Terms and definitions.
GOST 22733-77
Soils-Laboratory-Methods-Maximum-Density
GOST 25246-82
CHEMICAL-RESISTANT CONCRETE
GOST 25584-90
LABORATORY METHODS FOR DETERMINING HYDRAULIC CONDUCTIVITY OF SOILS
GOST 25820-83
Lightweight concrete. Technical specifications.
GOST 27006-86
Concretes. Mix-proportioning rules.
GOST 6370-83
CRUDE OIL, PETROLEUM PRODUCTS AND ADDITIVES Method for Determination of Mechanical Impurities
GOST 7473-94
Concrete Mixes Technical Specifications
System of design documentation for construction. Graphic symbols on drawings of roads.
GOST 11533-75
Automatic and semi-automatic submerged arc welding. Acute and obtuse joints.
GOST 12.0.002-80
Occupational Safety Standards System. Terms and Definitions.
GOST 12.0.004-79
Occupational safety standards system. Organization of Staff Training for Labour Safety. General Provisions.
GOST 12.1.010-76
Occupational safety standards system. Explosion Safety. General Requirements.
GOST 12.1.013-78
Standard system of labour security. Construction Electrical Safety.
GOST 12.1.044-89
Occupational safety standards system. Fire and Explosion hazard of substances and materials. Range of indices and methods of their determination.
GOST 12.1.045-84
Occupational safety standards system. Electrostatic Fields. Permissible Levels at Workplaces and Monitoring Requirements.
GOST 12.2.007.7-83
Occupational safety standards system. Low-voltage Complete Devices. Safety Requirements.
GOST 12.2.010-75
Occupational safety standards system. Pneumatic Hand Machines. General safety requirements.
GOST 12.2.033-78
Occupational safety standards system. Operator's station when working in a standing position. General Ergonomic Requirements.
GOST 12.2.037-78
Occupational safety standards system. Fire engineering. Safety requirements.
GOST 12.2.049-80
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial equipment. General ergonomic requirements.
GOST 12.2.064-81
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial Equipment Controls. General safety requirements.
GOST 12.2.115-86
Occupational safety standards system. Blowout preventer equipment. Safety requirements.
GOST 12.2.132-93
Occupational safety standards system. Oil Extraction Wellhead Equipment. General Safety Requirements
GOST 12.3.003-75
Occupational Safety Standards System. Electric Welding Operations. General Safety Requirements
GOST 12.3.003-86
Occupational safety standards system. Electric-welding operations. General safety requirements.
GOST 12.3.009-76
Occupational safety standards system. Loading And Unloading Works. General safety requirements
GOST 12.3.010-76
Occupational safety standards system. Industrial Packing. General safety requirements.
GOST 12.3.016-79
Occupational safety standards system. Anticorrosive protective works. Safety requirements.
GOST 12.3.046-91
Occupational safety standards system. Automatic fire-fighting sets. General technical requirements.
Page
H
O
U
S
T
N
9225 Katy Freeway,
Suite 400
Houston, Texas 77024
USA
Phone: (713) 827 8800
[email protected]
4/3 Strastnoi blvd., Ste. 29
Moscow
Russia
Phone: +7 495 2092472
[email protected]
M
C
W |
Bruce Schneier
Crypto-Gram Newsletter
Books
Essays and Op Eds
News and Interviews
Audio and Video
Speaking Schedule
Password Safe
Cryptography
About Bruce Schneier
Contact Information
A blog covering security and security technology.
« Terrorism Entrapment |
Main
| Parental Fears vs. Realities »
If you're a typical wired American, you've got a bunch of tech tools you like and a bunch more you covet. You have a cell phone that can easily text. You've got a laptop configured just the way you want it. Maybe you have a Kindle for reading, or an iPad. And when the next new thing comes along, some of you will line up on the first day it's available.?
More and more companies are letting you. They're giving you an allowance and allowing you to buy whatever laptop you want, and to connect into the corporate network with whatever device you choose. They're allowing you to use whatever cell phone you have, whatever portable e-mail device you have, whatever you personally need to get your job done. And the security office is freaking.
You can't blame them, really. Security is hard enough when you have control of the hardware, operating system and software. Lose control of any of those things, and the difficulty goes through the roof. How do you ensure that the employee devices are secure, and have up-to-date security patches? How do you control what goes on them? How do you deal with the tech support issues when they fail? How do you even begin to manage this logistical nightmare? Better to dig your heels in and say "no."
But security is on the losing end of this argument, and the sooner it realizes that, the better.. It might even be the CEO, who wants to get to the company's databases from his brand new iPad, driving the change. Either way, it's going to be harder and harder to say no.
At the same time, cloud computing makes this easier. More and more, employee computing devices are nothing more than dumb terminals with a browser interface. When corporate e-mail is all webmail, corporate documents are all on GoogleDocs, and when all the specialized applications have a web interface, it's easier to allow employees to use any up-to-date browser. It's what companies are already doing with their partners, suppliers, and customers.
Also on the plus side, technology companies have woken up to this trend and -- from Microsoft and Cisco on down to the startups -- are trying to offer security solutions. Like everything else, it's a mixed bag: some of them will work and some of them won't, most of them will need careful configuration to work well, and few of them will get it right. The result is that we'll muddle through, as usual.
Security is always a tradeoff, and security decisions are often made for non-security reasons. In this case, the right decision is to sacrifice security for convenience and flexibility. Corporations want their employees to be able to work from anywhere, and they're going to have loosened control over the tools they allow in order to get it.
This essay first appeared as the second half of a point/counterpoint with Marcus Ranum in Information Security Magazine. You can read Marcus's half here.
Posted on September 7, 2010 at 7:25 AM
• 63 Comments
To receive these entries once a month by e-mail, sign up for the Crypto-Gram Newsletter.
JKordish • September 7, 2010 8:04 AM
I think mobile devices will only become the launching pad to a virtual desktop employed through some fancy new VDI solution. So the security of the end-user device is moot.
richrumble • September 7, 2010 8:14 AM
>In this case, the right decision is to sacrifice security for convenience and flexibility. Corporations want their employees to be able to work from anywhere, and they're going to have loosened control over the tools they allow in order to get it.
I think it depends on your data, we issue our BB's to our users and have some control over them, but when we assert full control over them, what app's they can and can't install, some "higher-up" needs an exception, and his buddies at the company too, then everyone else feels slighted. We've even tried to "coup" only the have our jobs threatened for a stupid calender app... something the BB has anyway, but isn't as easy as this 3rd party.
I agree with the rest of the statements by Marcus and Bruce, the consumer devices are the driving forces, and the corporate needs are an after thought, much like security in general with said devices. I don't agree with Bruce's tradeoff, there is no way we would let iPhones/iPads etc on the corporate side of our network, and we take steps to try to prevent that (mac filters, NAC which is a joke no matter what vendor; and IDS). We can't prevent it 100%, but we are making it known through polices and training our users that it's a big no-no to use their personal gear, whatever that is, on our corporate network and why that is so. We seem to have made a bigger impact with this training/awareness campaign than we did when trying to block the activities without telling them of the corporate view, even if they were told when first hired about doing such things, the refresher was a lot less effort for us and paid off better (we think).
As for our own company supplied devices, were still in the same boat, people want these apps for this and that, and they are for certain non-work related, but they bitch and moan like babies until some SVP/VP/CEO agrees for whatever reason, and overrides our "authority". Exceptions were to be made for business case's, we have no issue with that, it's the "because I said so" override that irks us, and spits in our faces. These same overriders are the ones who signed off on these policies, blindly I'm sure, so it's a tough road to hoe, but we are still fighting to regain some "teeth" in these matters. I'm sure we will once one of these apps proves to be a back door, and then it's CYA time, we like CYA time, we finally get to do our "we told ya so" dance.
-rich
Matt White • September 7, 2010 8:17 AM
This is a very interesting and timely response to this article:...
Chris Swan • September 7, 2010 8:22 AM
For too long this corporate versus consumer debate has been about the network rather than the data. At last things are starting to move along.
The whole NAC/NAP thing was the last gasp of a lost war. Protecting the network by insisting on standard builds was just too difficult to accomplish, and didn't serve the objective or adapt to the realities of globalisation. The result - standard builds that were supposed to be hardened for security but that ended up months behind regular consumer systems with auto update turned on.
I disagree with JKordish about VDI. Whilst VDI provides a convenient way to put a control bubble around data it doesn't resolve the occasionally connected state management problem. Luckily the VDI vendors have woken up to that one and come up with means to carry state around when off net and sync it up later.
Of course if we're going to look after the data rather than the network then there needs to be effective means to do this - particularly where there's local state on an easily lost/stolen device. Some platforms do this well, others less so. The Jericho Forum talked a lot about deperimiterisation, but I prefer to think about it as reperimiterisation. The perimeter has moved from a network defined by physical boundaries (of the building holding the network) and become virtual and around the data that belongs to the corporation. That virtual boundary needs to be well defined and have the right controls at its ingress/egress points.
HJohn • September 7, 2010 8:22 AM
@: "Should enterprises give in to IT consumerization at the expense of security?"
___________
The answer (IMHO): it depends.
Depends on the data, the function, the how who what when where and why.
I can definitely see this been a legal liability nightmare for some companies.
Luigi Rosa • September 7, 2010 8:29 AM
But if you let everyone use their own newest tech toy, you end up in a babel of formats and "standards".
People want to have their address list updated in every device, want to access to the Sent Mail, want to check the calendar and want all these data backed up and restored.
How can you give this services considered "basic" if you have various and different versions iOS, Symbian, Android, RIM and God only know what other platforms?
What happens if the schedule is updated on RIM, partially updated on Android (except for, say, the recurring events) and not updated at all on iOS?
And who pays for all this different platforms, programs, data plans...?
Clive Robinson • September 7, 2010 8:30 AM
@ JKordish,
"So the security of the end-user device is moot"
Far from it that is where the attacks will come from. Effectivly the device via the user is in the corperate network. Thus anyone who works out how to do an end run around the Encrypting tunnel, will have the equivalent access as the user (maybe more).
mcb • September 7, 2010 8:47 AM
@ Matt White
Thanks for the link to the tasty blog post. The most thought compelling bit:
"If you want to keep those millennials that are already in the organisation, then perhaps it's time to move to adopt their ways of working rather than enforcing yours?"
Here's a link to source article...
May you live in interesting times.
Larry Lard • September 7, 2010 8:48 AM
Somewhat hilariously, it would appear that 'Information Security' magazine have attempted to implement a paywall, but have put their 'printer-friendly' pages *outside* it...
Anonymous coward • September 7, 2010 9:21 AM
@Larry Lard: link?
gary • September 7, 2010 9:27 AM
"In this case, the right decision is to sacrifice security for convenience and flexibility."
I hope they're not responsible for protecting my data. How about you?
Antonio Rodriguez • September 7, 2010 9:56 AM
On a completely unrelated note, the techtarget.com website that Bruce's links point to has a weak spot.
Confronted with a reg-wall when I first clicked on the link, I couldn't remember which of my e-mail addresses I had used before (or even if I had registered), so I entered one of them, and was confronted with the standard form for new registrants. Not wanting to fill the form out again if I already had registered with a different e-mail, I clicked back, only to find that the reg-wall had disappeared and that I could see the whole article.
AC • September 7, 2010 9:58 AM...
Chris Swan • September 7, 2010 10:19 AM
Another important point for consideration is that whilst many enterprises still forbid consumer devices from connecting to their network they allow them into the building. It's almost impossible to use 3G data in places like Canary Wharf due to the density of iPhones, iPads and Netbooks with 3G cards. Where corporate policy blocks consumer sites like Gmail, Facebook and Twitter, consumer devices route around that blockage.
Of course the next step is that those consumer devices leave the desk side and come into the meeting room. They become the one thing that's taken on the business trip due to travel weight. They're where the meeting minutes and customer notes end up regardless of policy (perhaps emailed to the corporate account later for integration with 'official' systems).
When this happens there are only two choices remaining - confiscate devices at the turnstile (as happens at sensitive government and military sites) and make the workplace even more hostile, or embrace consumerisation and make security work within it.
Nick P • September 7, 2010 10:49 AM
@ Chris Swan
"When this happens there are only two choices remaining - confiscate devices at the turnstile (as happens at sensitive government and military sites) and make the workplace even more hostile, or embrace consumerisation and make security work within it."
No, there are alternatives. This isn't always an all-or-nothing game. Take Kroger for instance. They have a cell phone ban that doesn't work and they have thin clients that use browsers to access confidential data. Everything on the thin clients is logged and access anomalies are investigated. People could be storing massive amounts of confidential data on their phones or iPads, but they don't. It's too inconvenient to copy it all by hand. So, they just use the company provided tools.
In the area of mobile phones and laptops, certain RTOS vendors are producing strong hypervisors that allow devices to have a "work VM" and a "personal" VM. INTEGRITY Global Services and LynuxWorks already offer this. So, if businesses demand it, cell phone vendors might start loading the hypervisors on smartphones to isolate business data from risky personal browsing. This could also work for laptops using Intel VT. This scheme is already used in products like the Sectera Edge, QubesOS, Turaya Security Kernel, and the Motorola Evoke (for baseband processing isolation, though).
So, there are more options to consider. Businesses just aren't looking into them. Many businesses can get away with forced restrictions, although they might needs an IDS for the executives' devices. (rolls eyes) I've seen so many successfully employ the approach that I know more could. Not every company, but many companies. Not every risk or piece of data, but much of it. What's their excuse? The Apple-loving workers will quit their job during the recession? Heh, maybe... probably not...
Mark Hanby • September 7, 2010 11:01 AM
The war is on between corporate assets and personal assets. Companies are just beginning to understand the most important asset the company has: DATA!. Once a company loses it's data the company has lost it's cyberspace presence. I am responsible for the company's cell devices, laptops/desktops, the the company's network (plus a other technology). The direction we go always includes dollars in the decision. I see relaxation on personal cell phone access to the network for mail and I also see the early seeds of data protection sprouting.
A lot of companies will need to invest heavily to move legacy systems and ideas from 1980's to the present. This will be long road with lots of frustration. The fustration is the preception that once data is in the cloud resources can be removed from the company. People will still need to manage the data and security no matter the access device.
Brian T. O'Hara • September 7, 2010 11:16 AM
I have held for quite some time that one of the biggest challenges facing us today in networking as well as security is that we keep wanting to shift control, responsibility, blame etc. ( I believe you call it the CYA syndrome or something to that effect) onto the someone else when what we as security professionals ought to be doing is developing a standards based criteria for apps and devices to comply with as an industry. If we built security into both the devices and applications from the ground up, we would surely have fewer problems. What I would propose is a consortium much like the IETF or WiFi Alliance who take on the responsibility of developing criteria that would certify an application or device having passed differing levels of compliance. FIPS would be a an example but a bit of overkill in this situation. Then in order for vendors to attain the "seal of approval" they would have to meet certain criteria for secure communications. A huge undertaking but maybe one step at a time we can get there. Meanwhile let's get on to IPV6 :)
Just my two cents.
Brandioch Conner • September 7, 2010 11:25 AM
@Nick P
"In the area of mobile phones and laptops, certain RTOS vendors are producing strong hypervisors that allow devices to have a "work VM" and a "personal" VM."
I think you missed the point. Even if that is an option, the users will still want to use THEIR systems on the corporate network.
Whether their system can be set up in a hypervisor nor not.
The problem here is the age-old problem of whether the executives have to conform to the rules they set down or not.
You have more status if you have the latest, coolest toy. And none of the executives will settle for having obvious signs of reduced status. Nor for their people.
Don Marti • September 7, 2010 11:31 AM
Whoever is running the IT Department as the "Department of NO" is not paying attention to the last 20 years of outsourcing, offshoring, and working with contractors and vendors instead of 100% in-house teams.
Almost any project of meaningful size is going to have participants "outside the firewall" on their own IT systems. So, except for a few highly regulated industries, the in-house people who have to get some work done are going to put the project's info on 37signals or Google Docs anyway. At that point, enforcing a clunky browser for the in-house staff doesn't buy you anything.
Not really anonymous • September 7, 2010 11:45 AM
I would expect someone to be crazy to use the same machine to keep both personal and corporate data on it. When you leave, you may end up losing your personal data when the machine is repossessed by the company. Even if the hardware belongs to you they may be able to make you give up the machine temporarily using the legal system, in order make sure you don't have proprietary data on it. While that could happen anyway, you have a much better case for opposing the seizure if you can claim a strong separation between work and personal stuff.
Brandioch Conner • September 7, 2010 12:18 PM
@Bruce
"But security is on the losing end of this argument, and the sooner it realizes that, the better."
Just because an executive over-rules you does not mean that you are wrong or that he is right.
It just means that in that specific instance, he had more authority than you did.
Now, what happens when that "losing argument" becomes the company's bank account info and passwords?
I cannot agree with that. It is an easy statement to make in a vague, generalized fashion. But it is difficult to justify AFTER the bank account passwords have been compromised.
"Also on the plus side, technology companies have woken up to this trend and -- from Microsoft and Cisco on down to the startups -- are trying to offer security solutions."
And like most retrofitting, these will have massive holes and edge-cases that allow information to leak out.
Instead, I'd recommend that IT be provided with a budget for "new toys". And be allowed to evaluate such PRIOR to allowing them on the network. And to maintain a listing of the devices / services that are NOT allowed and the specific criteria where they were not sufficiently secure / manageable to be allowed access.
Amare • September 7, 2010 12:22 PM
I've got a situation.......unbeknownst to me. I've been having issues with my Blackberry and I stumbled across my certificates. I've got ALOT of DOD certificates ROOT CA-2 (listed 1-24) and DOD CLASS 3 EMAIL- ca-7, ECA ROOT ca-5, DOD intermediate CA-11 ROOT CA 2, IDEN TRUST ECA 1 , ECA ROOT CA, ORC ECA FOREIGN NATIONALS CA....a whole bunch of them, no two alike all issued by Department of Defense. I do not nor have I ever worked there deeper into them the read PKI= serial 1f key usage-digital sig , key 1 cert...and RSA-PKCS1/SHA1..........okay i'm worried and there is more but i need advice. I've already contacted appropriate agencies to give them my info and I got the brush off. When I know its so much more. I done my research for hours now this came about last night. worried
mcb • September 7, 2010 12:50 PM
@ Anonymous coward
"link?"
Just to the right of the article title labelled printer-friendly.
Or...
Some weary boomer probably assigned their website scut work to some millennial intern...
Amare • September 7, 2010 1:18 PM
@bruce. Okay bare with me- I don't blog. Came across Bruce's site and here I am. I have 50 of these certs on my BB! I pulled more stuff off net that pertains to them- here it goes. Fairfax, Va Operational Research Consultants, INC put into full operation the ORC External certificate Authority for issuing DOD authorized digital certs to contractors, vendors, allied partners, North Atlantic Treaty Organization, foreign nationals, members of goverment. Commencement of full operational status follows the recent memorandum of agreement of external certificate authority policy management as signed by the acting asst. Secretary of Defense. JUNE 29. 2004 - there is some sort of infastructure with VPN on my BB too. I don't use a VPN . I think these certificates are trying to copy, mimick or gain access to CAC cards and maybe there are modules on BB devices to read them properly so "people" may use just their handheld to access data. REGARDLESS this crap is on my phone. Still worried .....be back with somemore "printer-friendly" stuff ............Amare
Sam • September 7, 2010 1:38 PM
Great example of what Bruce is talking about is Obama wanting to continue to use his blackberry after becoming President.
Muffin • September 7, 2010 2:46 PM
Executive Summary: The more you tighten your grasp, the more systems will slip through your fingers. (Computer systems that employees use, this time, not star systems.)
In fact, this quote seems to be quite worth remembering for security in general, both IT and non-IT.
Millennial • September 7, 2010 3:14 PM
Personal devices (laptops, smartphones, etc.) connecting to the company network accessing company data? It's possible as long as all the parties are "on the same page", regarding security and privacy matters.
There are many things to consider which will impact both the company and the employee. Do employees accessing company data on their personal devices understand they will lose access to their device (and all their personal data on the device) when a legal hold is put in place? How will privacy matters be handled when company support personnel need to access personal devices to fix problems? Who owns the software licenses for company required software installed on the employee device? What about personal devices used for company business with unacceptable software or images (which might violate acceptable use policies for company owned devices).
Lots to consider.
James • September 7, 2010 6:23 PM
Bruce,
I think there's a lot to be said about companies that make these consumer goods to collaborate on security to a point where they can be trusted more by companies. It's what should happen anyway.
James • September 7, 2010 9:01 PM
"security decisions are often made for non-security reasons"
Because they don't understand the risk of something going bad and they rather milk all the money and spend as little as possible.
Gustavo
30something • September 7, 2010 9:13 PM
So why is it when we wanted to uses Linux devices in the corporate network it was okay to tell us no, but we can't tell the new kids they can't use Apple devices?
Are we really concerned about losing talent? Aren't most people still just trying to keep the job they have?
Matt M • September 7, 2010 10:13 PM
How can you allow these devices while keeping risk down, and being able to show compliance with regulations when you have no insight into the device access and connecting with your data and network?
With increased regulation requirements, data retention laws, and E-discovery requirements
Nick P • September 8, 2010 1:55 AM
@ Brandioch Conner and others
Good point about the devices. My main point, though, is that if the low level employees are dictating corporate behavior, rather than management, then the company has serious problems. A policy requiring certain devices to process internal data and strong enforcement usually insures compliance. Even people who don't like to do something they will often do it if there is a real risk that exposure results in their firing.
The hypervisor solution provides a compromise in that, while it's not *their* phone, they get to use a nice phone with the latest apps or OS's. They don't necessarily have to look at dinosaurs with horrible interfaces and apps, yet security is still maintained.
Classification of data is also useful here. Nonsensitive data may be allowed on personal devices, whereas confidential data may only appear on work approved devices. Data like human resources or marketing plans might not ever be allowed to leave the corporate network or certain in-house machines. The use of classification can give the user more freedom, while providing measurable risk reduction for sensitive data. This assumes they have dedicated work devices and the company does strong policy enforcement. Again, there are thousands of companies that do this in practice and still innovate, keep talent, etc.
Tom T. • September 8, 2010 2:33 AM
I thought "cloud computing" was a stupid idea the first time I heard about it. Nothing since has changed that; the more I hear, and the more it spreads, the stupider it seems. It's hard enough to control the data, sw, and hw in my own hands, but at least I can try, and *know* what efforts I have made.
I know that this trend isn't going to change, and nobody asked, or asks, my opinion before implementing it. But there will be some satisfaction in being on record the day that the cloud becomes a mushroom cloud, in having been the boy who said aloud that the Emperor has no clothes.
The same goes for everything else in the article, about letting whiny babies bring their shiny toys inside the corp. Go dig ditches for a living, and then you can listen to your iTunes all you want to while you do so.
There's a reason why computers at CIA don't have USB ports....
Cheers.
Robert • September 8, 2010 4:03 AM
Maybe it is a little bit cynical but I always assumed that IT security guys job was answer ever simple question with confusing gobbledygook, say no to every reasonable request AND gracefully resign whenever the S**T hits the fan.
Are you guys trying to change the job definition? :-)
AC2 • September 8, 2010 6:12 AM
Everyone has already cherry picked this line, but here goes anyway..
"Security is always a tradeoff, and security decisions are often made for non-security reasons. In this case, the right decision is to sacrifice security for convenience and flexibility."
Sorry but to state that as a universally applicable truth is just dumb.
There are still far too many situations for corporates (e.g. financial institutions - customer financial data) where this can result in losses well in excess of any benefits gained from the convenience and flexibility gained.
James Sutherland • September 8, 2010 6:53 AM
Sensible security requires considering what you are trying to guard against and what is really needed. If you're the CIA with informant identities, or indeed a bank with a big pile of cash, you stick it in a vault, surround it with armed goons and don't let anything in or out without serious searches - but most companies just aren't in situations comparable to that. Is letting a utility company sales rep access company email from an iPhone rather than a BlackBerry a problem? It shouldn't be - apart from anything else, it's almost certainly the user rather than the device which poses the relevant threat, intentional or otherwise (letting slip about the big new offer starting next month, planned price rise, etc).
Working (sometimes remotely) for a university is an interesting experience. There is a firewall - but with email being outsourced off-site and the majority of users accessing services from outwith the university network, is it really any use? As a kneejerk response to some malware using malicious DNS servers, it blocks port 53 - forcing users to go through what was, at the time, an unpatched and vulnerable BIND installation rather than using something more secure; no doubt future versions of that malware will implement the DNS service locally rather than rely on an outside server anyway, eliminating what little benefit that gave entirely - but of course leaving the downside in place. End result of this and other port blocks? Increasing numbers of users VPNing out to get proper Internet access despite the firewall.
When increasing fractions of both the resources and their users are external to the network, what exactly can a firewall or restrictive connection policy achieve besides getting in the way? Protect the resources themselves appropriately, and accept that the real role of your internal network is little different from a regular ISP: one possible route for your users to access resources. Malicious users - and remember, statistically most of them are internal ones - WILL compromise your network if it benefits them, whether installing packet sniffers or probing for vulnerabilities, and they won't worry about any "policy" against doing it. If your security relies on controlling end-user devices, it's already failed.
AppSec • September 8, 2010 7:56 AM
@Tom T:
I initially hated the concept of the cloud from a security and architecture perspective. It seemed like we were going back the client server days and reliance more on things out of our control (corporations to manage servers). And then our data was out of our hands.
Then I got to thinking about a small company that is trying to start up. It's not necessarily in their skillset, financial means, or business need to manage the infrastructure. And even some large companies might be better off not doing it.
So now, I'm conflicted. I understand and agree with the theory.. The implementation leaves a lot to be desired.
goom • September 8, 2010 8:12 AM
We all here, because we have some experience of security, more or less. We give our advice about secuirty for other people. But the problem, that many people don't realizing everything about what they should do. They try to do choise, by asking google or "Grandma Tips Telegraph". Only equal individuals do their choise by investigation of technology. Theres nothing to be change. It's alwayse be better by feeling the chain of faith.
Amare • September 8, 2010 11:26 AM
@ Bruce. Hmm...Well I'm here to update you on my status of my nightmare BB device. I'm the one with the. +40 Department of Defense Certificates that magically appeared on my device. After searching for hours I came across Bruce's site and this seemed the place to be to let it all out.
ROUND2. IT's gotton worse and well here it goes..
In my frustration and angst; I decided to take the dive and go through my BB device for more possible clues. I went in 0ptions, than Apps, and nothing special until I clicked menu and than clicked modules from there. In this long list I came across MIDP Root certificates. I didn't see those under my security section like the others.
So I researched for awhile and pulled this- its a Two-factor Authentication. that verifies that a BB device is bound to a smart card. It prompts the user to type the smartcard password to turn on the two-factor authentication by using the smartcard. Then binds to the smartcard by storing the binding information in the store in the BB device memory that the user cannot access. Than it needs the name of the java class that the BB smart card reader requires. Then binding that information so it can format the smartcard type and name of the java class the smartcard code requires a unique 64 bit identifier that the smartcard provides a smartcard label that pushes the current IT policy to the BB smartcard reader. So now I was left with DOD certs and this MIDP cert and I thought oh sh*t my info gathered a day prior to this lead my to CAC cards from the DOD certificates. So panicked now I went through the long long list in the same modules for anything relative and BAM I came across this exactly as I list now..net_rim_smartcard_gsacac. What caught my eye aside from smartcard was the lettering CAC in the gsacac. I clicked on that and it didn't give any significant info that said I'm a goverment issued CAC card it was looking like what I guess a normal property module but its description listed it as unavailable. I know squat about smartcard so I researched again just on the lettering of gsacac. Low and behold its a CAC. That's how its listed apparently. So now how and when and WHY?? Is this here, what's the deal? So. After my findings I brought it to the attention to Home Land Security and the NSA. Why is it my damn BB? And who put it there? And what's the purpose that what really blows my mind. I'm off to follow a lead and to make sure it won't serve its purpose for whatever reason it was put there. And to backtrack it all the way to the source. Any advice ? Ideas? Plz share.. BY THE WAY- earlier posted by J. Sutherland.
.I'm not a malicious user nor am I a statistic of "oops" malware. I'm a Mom of three and I don't get all cyber happy and let it consume my time. I shop occasional QVC here and there nothing big. And my email has around 3000+ and hasn't been checked I'm months. Until recently I upgrading like all the people out there from a simple flip phone to this Blackberry. I dont have any clue as of yet. But I'm also not ignorant to the computer world either my Dad was a very smart man and forced me learn all about computers, programs, langs ETC. He was a programmer in the Air Force years and years ago. He taught me really young and I had no childhood. Thus why I'm a HOUSEMOM for more than seven years not a malicious user. With that note ...off to yoga and to ponder with my grey matter. I will be back for sure..later though. Help me figure this out!!
Ms. Nay • September 8, 2010 12:47 PM
New services and business changes are always created WITHOUT security in mind. Security doesn't become an issue to the overpaid airheads until something happens. Security should always be a vital part of the planning stages.
BF Skinner • September 8, 2010 12:56 PM
@Amare "Why is it my damn BB? And who put it there? And what's the purpose that what really blows my mind."
Disclaimer. Don't have a BB and you've gotten deeper into the internals then I ever have...
At a guess; RIM pushed out the certs for USGov to all BB devices by default? (Sounds stupid to me but maybe it's easier to do all by default than just some devices.)
You have indeed found a Common Access Card (what DoD calls CAC) certificate store.
That GSACAC would be listed is not surprising. GSA has management responsibility for the HSPD12 system. The HSPD12 system is the Identity Management system for all Government employees and contractor employees on contract to the department and agencies.
In accordance with Excutive Order HSPD12 it provides all USGov workers with a strong Personal Identification Verification credential and a horse for it to ride on.
The output of the HSPD12 process is a CAC (a smart card with photo, data and fingerprint biometric and a pki certificate(s)).
USGov is a heavy user of the BB (other phones haven't yet been certified though Apple has great hopes for Iphone v4) so it makes sense that they would do a mass push of certificates (if in fact they didn't come with your phone when purchased.)
Maybe an overly broad distribution of public certificates but unlikely to be nefarious.
DHS should have been able to give you some information; just gotta find the right person there (not easy). NSA won't care since they doubtless have back doors into the RIM servers.
Nick P • September 8, 2010 2:59 PM
@ BF Skinner
Yeah, you're probably right about them pushing the certs in. I actually wish they did the same for IE and Firefox. I don't mind having a few certs' because I know what they mean: an identity has been verified by someone to some degree. They say nothing of certainty or trust. Of course, this could be dangerous for lay people and I wouldn't recommend it. But it would be nice to have an option to download all the CA certs for one's government and military.
Back to preloading being useful, I remember when I originally went to DOD portals to get info on EKMS and certain Type 1 platforms I got warnings that the CA's were invalid and the site "may be untrustworthy." That made me a tad nervous, considering the potential MITM-attack value of these portals. Ever the paranoid, I spent a decent amount of time looking into the DOD PKI and validating their CA certificates. Then, I added them, made a written note of them for later reinstalls, and proceeded to enjoy peace of mind.
"NSA won't care since they doubtless have back doors into the RIM servers."
Will be at the firmware, driver, or OS level. Quite a few avenues for attacks in a phone with no backdoors. I've always thought that, if NSA was given source code, they'd probably sit on any zero day they find that's sophisticated to exploit and hard to remove. I know they backdoored Lotus and made secret modifications to Windows 2000's public release, so assuming backdoor by default is a reasonable thing to do.
Nick P • September 8, 2010 3:04 PM
@ jkordish
You're actually right about VDI or thin client approach moving to mobile phone. You might want to look into the OK Labs Nirvana phone. It runs a phone OS and a Citrix remote desktop client side-by-side using the OKL4 "microvisor" (microkernel w/ virtualization support). You plug a monitor, keyboard and mouse into it, load the software, and BAM! you have a desktop PC to work with. It might be at your house, at your office desk, or a VM in a server farm. Best of all, the microkernel's isolation is stronger than most OS's and this helps in data loss prevention.
duffer • September 8, 2010 4:45 PM
I imagine that many of us are trying to work out how the trend of consumerisation is going to work out where we have information assets of high value. It boils down to how can we deliver services to all legitimate users without having to care (much) about the client device or the network. Some clues above, but not many. And such services will frequently need to cross organisational boundaries. I don't see any real solutions in the near term, although I could find a use for them.
csrster • September 9, 2010 1:33 AM
Our security policy forbids installation on our company PCs of any software not approved by the IT department. As I'm a software developer, this means I'm technically in breach of the regulations any time I compile my code. (As a workaround I have considered only writing code that won't compile.)
Matt • September 9, 2010 6:13 AM
"...if the low level employees are dictating corporate behavior, rather than management, then the company has serious problems."
I used to be the sysadmin for a high school, and this is exactly what happened. When the school district set a GPO above my head requiring secure passwords, teachers flew off the handle over having to set their passwords to "MathIs#1" instead of "math". Fast forward 90 days into the school year, and there was another round of teachers flying off the handle over having to change their passwords. I was actually quite happy the GPO was set above my head, so I could truthfully say I couldn't do anything about it.
One teacher in particular went to the assistant principal because she did not want to participate in the whole "screen locks after 1 hour idle" thing. This was a GPO I had set myself, but when I was asked about giving just this one teacher an exemption, I told a white lie and said that there was no way to do that.
What did we learn here? That if management lets employees dictate security policy, you don't get security. If the university housing department allowed dorm residents to dictate security policy, no doors would ever get locked.
goom • September 9, 2010 6:49 AM
Don't familiar with Matt about management policy. I think that there is many ways to be secure by regarding policy of your organization.
Do you mean that security require some special software? So, it's whery easy to bypass corporate ips. For ex. using ssl anonymizer from home machine and have too much problems.
ylo • September 9, 2010 10:00 AM
Maybe the solution to this will be to provide a virtual machine... at the moment, Paragon go-virtual software is used by many employees willing to work with more comfort from their desktop at home (compared to their corporate laptop)!
For Paragon, maybe we can be confident with the tool... but this use could make their mind to others willing to break-in employees generated VMs!
So maybe providing what people want is the best way to keep some control and virtualisation can help a lot.
As well, just having a machine on the internal network having a SSH server that do not administratively prohibit tunnels (and so, reverse tunnels!)... combined with an HTTPS proxy not white filtering (or at least filtering dyndns and no-ip domains)... and anyone can go trough the most severe controls with proxytunnel on corporate machine (supports adding an ssl layer to avoid ssl banner detection and can be given another less suspicious process name! Great tool!) and an stunnel4 on the home side able to get traffic from 443, remove the ssl, and forward this to 22 on the ssh server: So you make you own VPN and as the tools exists on almost any OS (desktop+mobile)... problem solved for 99% corporate environments.
Simon Jester • September 9, 2010 1:39 PM
The problem with the consumeration(sp?) is that the Security department will be the ones getting axed when the VP's Iphone is used as a remote access point and the company db servers puke private data to outside entities.
M Jones • September 9, 2010 2:27 PM
Along with TARP came greater levels of scrutiny by the banks of their vendors. One of the most frequent questions we get these days is 'Do you allow non-company owned assets on the corporate network?". To answer yes to this question is to invite almost certain death as a bank vendor.
Jim • September 9, 2010 6:21 PM
Security is about risk management at the end of the day. You can decide to allow your users to use their own devices to access/store/process your business information but you need to understand the risks of doing so and then do a cost/benefit analysis to see whether the risks is justified.
If you can't retain staff because your secure operational environment makes it too hard for them to work then that is a risk to your business. It has a real cost that can be evaluated and compared to the possible cost of staff using unmanaged devices - malware/data loss/etc.
I can't imagine achieving PCI compliance if every admin used their own PC or mobile device for convenience.
Pat Cahalan • September 9, 2010 10:01 PM
You really want to prevent this sort of thing?
"You can use whatever you want, knock yourself out. If it's not A, B, or C, don't call the helpdesk. If you lost Accounting's database it's on the director of Accounting to explain it to the CEO... and it's on the director of Accounting to pony up the budget funds to pay for data recovery. And the next time the director of Accounting tries to convince me to use something, I get to throw this in their face and say, "No."
It's not coming out of my budget. If you're using an iPhone, don't ask my network guy to fix it for you. I can't budget for things I can control, any more than you can. You can't complain that nothing works right when I have no predictive capability to build infrastructure because you get to change the specs tomorrow."
I agree, Bruce, that to disallow people to use toys is largely a losing battle... but it's a losing battle because the IT department (in most organizations) is considered to be a value-neutral or value-negative part of the organization. Sort of like government oversight: at best, a pain in the ass to be worked around.
And, for the most part, we let them do it. Read CIO magazines, they're all talking about doing whatever the users want, whenever the users want, and doing it all on less budget than last year and with a grin on your face. Don't lead. Enable. It's the industry trend..
Davi Ottenheimer • September 10, 2010 1:12 AM
Kind of disappointed that you didn't emphasize that the upgrade might be FOR security. Cars, for example, that boast better braking and handling etc. are being sold on the premise that cool and new also actually means much more secure. The only sacrifice is your wallet.
Clive Robinson • September 10, 2010 1:27 AM
@ Pat Cahalan,
"No other profession allows itself to be treated this unprofessionally."
Are we a profession in anything other than our own minds?
Think how users see us, we are the "reparman who play with toys and speak nonsense"
Think how users see their computers some like phoness, some like cars, others like personal jewellery, but in nearly all cases as "unreliable".
You ask a user about their computer experiances at work it's about "how it let them down"
Once upon a time kids who had been lazy said "the dog ate my homework" and quite rightly the teacher did not believe them. Now however they say "Dad fixed the computer and my homework vanished" and the teacher believe's them.
We have an image problem we are seen less favourably than that shady guy selling rust bucket auto's on that downtown corner on the other side of the tracks.
Our whole "profession" is about being confidence tricksters on the make, you only have to read the first few paragraphs of an End User Licence Agreement to see it, then try and negotiate a site licence to feel it.
But then think how we look as we get close to the board room... We cannot give any predictability about function only failure, we cannot show return on investment, at best we offer a high risk of liability.
Which brings us around to "security" we cann't measure our effectivness in a testable and verifiable way. We cann't even offer any assurance that we will know when data has been stolen.
What do we put on the table when it comes to budget appropriation time? doom gloom and sunk costs. And what of the budget competitors, even the building manager can say he can keep the lights working, the doors locked and the toilets clean with more certainty than we can.
So what happens we don't do "security" any more we do "compliance by audit" to minimise liability. We do "best practice" as done by our competitors who say they have not done as badly as we have, but the reality? Who knows they certainly don't any more than we do.
Do we honestly look like a "profession" to others?
Sasha van den Heetkamp • September 10, 2010 7:24 PM
If one sacrifices security for convenience and flexibility, why have security at all? I don't like the cliché of the weakest link in a chain analogy, I rather compare it to a rubber band; one can stretch security and provide more flexibility. But the more you stretch it, the more tension on the rubber. And eventually it either snaps or wears out in elasticity. Eventually, humans demand even more flexibility, and thus the rubber band of security wears down and looses all it's flexibility: the rubber band just lost it's functionality, so why have it all? The trade-off, I guess, is to let the rubber band of security bounce between restriction and release.
Nick P • September 11, 2010 11:17 PM
@ Pat Callahan
Nice post. If you don't mind, I'm archiving these three paragraphs for use in future business presentations (with credit given):
."
It was just so well said. :)
Amare • September 12, 2010 2:59 AM
When I wrote a couple of days ago, - stated my last resort of help. All the big-wigs gave the brush off. But- rest assure somewhat I did not reveal what I know is detramental and what common consumerism gone haywire for hacks. I put my contigencies in order before I did this. Sercurity Hill has been informed. before I went on a search for knowlegde of why, how, when. There is really nothing I've stated that wasn't available at the right click. I did walk away with lots of info and great advice from here. And - hold Bruce in my highest respects he is the man that is far more surpassed than I or you will ever be. I have figured out the "big components" to this . It was just a matter of turning on the lights and seeing which ones scatter. I did this in a way to protect my country and its security. So feel free to copy the blog and post it at your schools "this is not what to do" its like seeing um..let's a James bond movie in the 80"s and "what's that 9ue" it's a liquid crystal image-sharpest of its kind. But 9ue has. Had it in the goverment padlock a long long time. So believe me when I say I left the BIG stuff out and that going inder our goverment padlock. And let's say some things out there to think about and worry over too. We don't need this kind of tech float freeky in certain places, situations, or hands for that matter. On that note - some of these blogs have the right idea and some a decade behind. First post I quotes the Asst.acting Second. of Defense and that was ten tears ago. And that was about the new and improved CAC cards and they chunked the old ones because they we proven Hmm..flexalbe rubber bandish. So yes let's keep certain things that can cause big problems out of plaaces that need serious security. And yes make sure we run ports and components and apps only for certain issues thatwould need it. Bruce is right Do we really need like five different ways to check. Our email? With that note I bidd you good night and farewell.
Tom Dibble • September 12, 2010 11:39 PM
Two notes. First there are a few "what, are the employees going to find another job in a recession???" comments above; IT policies tend to not change when the economy picks up, and if you start playing capriciously with your employees they will treat the company the same way. Sorry, that's not a good argument to make. Moreover, the employees that are really hard to replace are also the ones who can get a job elsewhere the most easily, even in a recession, and they also tend to be the ones most likely to bristle at needlessly overbearing controls. Finally, the company is also facing the realities of a recession, and losing key personnel because of this type of issue can tip a company over the edge as well.
Second topic: I think the main issue that a lot of folks have with their IT department is that security is seen as black and white. Someone's email might contain sensitive information, thus everyone may only ever view their email on an approved device all the way down to the secretary. The email server is on the company network, so no non-approved devices may use that network. Some folks deal with credit card info, therefore all access to the corporate network must be "guarded" by password rules that make the Gestapo seem friendly. What happened to security zones and adjusting levels of security to the specific needs of the data being secured?
It's harder, yes, but (again, only in my experience) this is an area where, if IT was more "on the side" of the folks who just want to get work done, they'd have a much better relationship with the rest of the company and we'd end up with better security, not worse. The main problem is that folks "in the trenches" of the company's line of business end up seeing IT as that evil org that puts loads of "lockdown" crapware on every employee desktop/laptop (which crashes certain computers at 4:00 every day like clockwork but can't be taken off until the vendor puts out a fix because that would compromise security) and keeps the contractors in Costa Rico from being on VPN and accessing WebEx at the same time. They aren't a part of the org helping us keep data safe; they are the part of the org keeping us from creating that data in the first place.
Anyway, just a thought. If you are already customizing zones of control and working with the rest of the company to make sure you achieve the right balance of security vs obstruction, that's great. It just seems like a very rare thing from the non-IT side of the "fence", especially when the company has more than a few hundred people in it.
Clive Robinson • September 13, 2010 7:18 AM
@ Tom Dibble,
"What happened to security zones and adjusting levels of security to the specific needs of the data being secured?"
Two things happened to it the first is the resourses required expand not with the number of zones but the complexity of interaction between the zones.
Secondly moving to a "web based solution" to reduce resource issues on the users machine means that the zone issolation that is possible at the OS level is not realy available at the browser level (although this is changing).
As was once remarked "you get what you pay for" thus a resource straped IT department is looking to reduce complexity to be able to perform at all.
Most users and managers assume either a linear relationship between "objects" and resources required, or one that decreases per object resources as the number of objects increase.
Few understand (even when explained carefully) that from the security asspect complexity is the driver and even at the simplest level complexity goes up by the number of simple relations between objects ( ie a half n^2-n).
So if you have a browser with shared memory between open windows there is the issue of how many open windows or "tabs" and how you ensure adequate segregation between memory spaces to ensure security whilst still providing a secure mechanisum by which information can be moved from one window to another (ie simple cut-n-past) whilst maintaining adequate mechanisms to prevent accidental or deliberate disclosure.
Batsy • September 13, 2010 2:12 PM
Security is an area of ebbs and flows.
I agree that it 'll be harder and harder to say no especially if the CEO says to do it and security has been and always been a balance.
While the consumerization of IT will shift the balance of power over to the 'left', all it will take is for a number of high profile incidents or an increasing rash of incidents for the pendulum to swing back to the 'right'.
Personally, considering the issues surrounding Android security and that all of the smart phone platforms are have or are starting to have banking apps on their platforms - I feel that this may happen sooner rather than later.
billswift • September 13, 2010 6:05 PM
Bruce, how about you and Marcus publishing your point/counterpoint essays on a non-spammer, or maybe talk Marcus into posting his halves on ranum.com like you do here? In the less than a week since I signed up to read this I have received more than a dozen emails from all sorts of IT related stuff that I am not interested in.
Nick P • September 14, 2010 1:22 AM
@ billswift
Yeah. That's why it pays off to give them false information. Sad, but true.
Kevin Cantu • September 16, 2010 2:36 AM
This is why bringing your own device is risky to the user, though: Exchange's killer remote wipe capabilities.... |
Lesson Plan
Awesome Ancient Ancestors! Discussion Guide
- Grades: 3–5
About this book
Discussion and Seriously
FUN Study Guide to:
America's Horrible Histories:
(Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth & Awesome Ancient Ancestors)
By Elizabeth Levy
Illustrated by Daniel McFeeley
“The word horrible comes from the Latin word ‘horree’, which means ‘to bristle or make your hairs stand on end,' and it's the horrible parts of history that can keep you awakeÂ…and interested!” — author Elizabeth Levy
Why Is America's History So Horrible?
Well, it's not really horrible, but it can be weird, gross, and downright surprising at times! Elizabeth Levy's books offer a zany but fact-filled journey before recorded history — all the way back to the time of T-Rex. From there, Levy invites readers to explore the evolution of North America and learn about American pyramids, ancient rats the size of cows, and the hairiest mammalsÂ…including our first ancestors. Levy wants kids to know that America never was a "new" world. At the time of the Greeks and Romans, in the Americas there were great cities, and even pyramids along the Mississippi.
With cartoons, timelines, and "travel" guides to museum exhibits and other landmarks of pre-history, the engaging format of America's Horrible Histories will capture the attention of readers at all levels. Plus, it provides a fresh way to supplement a school social studies or science curriculum. Sassy sidebars and cultural facts throughout the books will have readers laughing while they learn.
So What Are These Books About Anyway?
Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth?
Almost 250,000,000 years ago, North America and other continents were joined as one super-continent called Pangaea (Greek for "All Earth"). In this prehistoric time, it was every dinosaur for himself (or herself), whether roaming alone or in packs. But life back then was much more than hungry dinosaurs. Plants and insects were evolving, too. With the shift in tectonic plates, and climate changes, the Americas drifted west. Pangaea started to break up. When the Ice Age arrived, all-new creatures began prowling the area we now call North America. Soon, two-legged creatures (our distant relatives) joined them!
Levy examines numerous theories on how these North American changes happened, and describes the many ways creatures either adapted or became extinct. Readers have a chance to look at prehistoric facts and see where they fit in this country's history.
Awesome Ancient Ancestors
Picking up where Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth? left off, this book shares theories on how humans came to settle in America — and what they did once they had arrived. When did humans first get here? Did all humans walk or ride across the Beringia Bridge? Why was corn so important to humans? What did people do for fun back then?
Levy introduces readers to numerous ancient peoples — from the Olmecs to the Mound Builders to the Mayans. She explains how people changed from nomadic hunters and gatherers to farmers living in permanent settlements. Her tongue-in-cheek examination of myths, legends, fossils, artifacts, and art shows readers how American civilization, as we know it, got its start. And it was way before Christopher Columbus!
Before You Read the Books — Try This!
Timeline for the Ages
How can we understand history unless we understand the passage of time? We can't! Levy provides ongoing timelines in both books to help show when the prehistoric events she describes happen. But before diving way back in time into America's Horrible Histories, create and discuss a historical timeline based on the world you know today. Make your timeline on a piece of paper or across a blackboard.
First, think about key dates from your own life. When were you born? How old are you now? When were your parents or grandparents born? Mark these dates near the right side, or the end, of the timeline.
Next, think about the lives of other important American historical figures. Where would Abe Lincoln fit on your timeline? How about Christopher Columbus? Plot these dates onto your timeline. They should fall somewhere close to the right side (not in the center, as you might expect!).
Now, think about the books you're about to read, and the time when they take place. Where would 65 million years B.C.E. go your timeline? What about 8000 B.C.E? Now you're really ready — literally — to go back in time!
P.S. Don't toss your timeline! Add to it as you read the booksÂ…
"I Was A 2,000 Pound Bison" and Other Writing Prompts
As you read, take time to write while thinking about the facts from the books and using your imagination.
From Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth?
- Read pages 44–59 and examine the different extinction theories Levy has included. Which theory do you believe? Support your argument with facts. Or, just for fun, invent wacky ideas from your imagination. Did angry space aliens land in a Sauropod's backyard? Did every volcano on Earth erupt at the same time? Could dinosaurs have died because of their own gas, or did they get crisped from staying out in the sun too long?
- Read pages 64–70. What if you boarded a time machine back to the swamps for a visit with some of the earliest mammals? Describe what you find — from the teeniest to the biggest mammals alive. Which mammal would you want to have as a pet and why?
- Read the top ten list of American Ice Age mammals starting on page 101. Levy describes giant sloths that look like Jabba the Hutt, beavers the size of bears, and even enormous camels. Why do you think the animals were so big? (Hint: there are other clues throughout the book.) Make list of these reasons. If you were a prehistoric mammal, what would you want to be and why?
- It's millions of years ago and you are a human crossing the Beringia Bridge. What five things are you carrying and why? Where are you going?
From Awesome Ancient Ancestors
- If there were an Ice Age version of the hit TV show, Survivor, the winner would be the bison! Why did he survive when other animals didn't? Write a short story about an encounter between a bison and a human. What happens? Go for that gruesome endingÂ…it's okay when we're talking about horrible histories!
- Read pages 83–87. Now, put yourself in the shoes of the first archaeologist who discovered Teotihuacán, the great ancient city located in Mexico. Think about what life in that city must have been like. Research it and describe it. Now, travel to Chaco Canyon. What do you see there? Why is this place so like the Emerald City of Oz in The Wizard of Oz?
- On page 111, Levy describes how Mayans offered blood to the gods so crops would grow. What other rituals did they perform? There are many legends about the power of a Native American "rain dance." Can you think of some other rituals people today perform to get things done?
- Some of the ancient peoples had funny names, like the Stinkards described on page 144. If you were given the task of renaming all the ancient animals and peoples, what would you call them and why? Try to rename them based on how they act, what they look like, or what they eat.
Science, English, and Art…Oh My!
Even More Activities for You To Do
America's Horrible Histories are about history, of course, but they're about lots of other stuff too. As you read the books, think about how dinosaurs and ancient American civilizations relate to you, living in the twenty-first century. Let Levy's fun facts help you to explore science, art, and more!
Wanna Pangaea?
- Get a flat map of the world (also called a "mercator"). Trace the continents. Then, cut out their shapes in construction paper (or any paper) like the pieces of a puzzle. Now, make Pangaea by pushing them together. What land masses look as though they were fit together before the big break-up?
- When Pangaea split apart, it split into two major masses called "Laurasia" and "Gondwana Land." Using an encyclopedia or the Internet, look up information on these "lost" continents. Where were they moving? As you explore the formation of the seven continents we know today, you can learn about how mountain ranges, volcanoes, and earthquake zones formed. Big things to think about, even beyond America.
o How did Australia end up down in the Southern hemisphere — and why does it have so many unique plants and animals?
o When India crashed into Asia, the Himalayan Mountains formedÂ… so why is Mount Everest still getting taller?
o A woolly mammoth was recently discovered buried deep in Siberia. What do you think lies underneath the snow and ice of frozen places on Earth like Greenland or Antarctica?
- Ancient peoples often explain natural occurrences with myths and legends. Make up your own myth about how and why Pangaea came apart. How could you imagine what happened to Pangaea happening again to North America or any of the other continents? Will parts of the world ever crash into one another again?
Dinosaurs are Dyn-o-mite!
- Choose a North American dinosaurs and research it. When did it live? What were the differences between dinosaurs from the Palezoic, Mesozoic, and Cenozoic eras? Put your research together with others to create a group dinosaur timeline.
- Levy has included "travel" boxes in both books that explain where you go to see fossils, bones, and other prehistory relics. How many places have you visited? Is there somewhere special you would like to go?
- Look for fossils online, too. Take a virtual visit to the Petrified Forest in Arizona, or explore the La Brea Tar Pits in California. There are special places all over North America where fossils are the main attraction! Where will you go? Try these search words: fossil, paleontologist, or anthropologist.
- Check out page 47 in Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth? You can make your own Dino-Trading cards using facts from the books and facts you gather on your own. Write these "Dino-Stats" on the back of each card. Have your friends do the same — and swap 'em!
- Imagine you have been chosen to design your own amusement park. You decide that the theme will be "Prehistoric Dinosaurs." What are the rides and what is the amusement park layout going to look like?
Make Me A Prehistoric Fossil!
- Well, we don't want you to be a fossil — but you can make your own. Here's what you will need: plaster of Paris or molding clay (available at any crafts store). Press leaves, shells, sticks, and other objects into the plaster or clay before it has dried. After it hardens, write about what these fossils could tell someone from the future. Do the objects tell a story about people, animals or a special place? What do the objects say about our climate? How do the objects help to describe our habitat? For example, if you do this exercise and fill your fossil with shells and sand, chances are you live by the beach.
- You bug me! Get a tube of clear-drying glue and some waxed paper. Take it outside on a sunny day. Leave a glob of glue and wait to see what it attracts. Chances are that a wandering ant or mosquito may find its way into the glue. Once the bug is trapped in the glue, add another drop on top. Wait for the glue to harden. It will be transparent — your version of a bug that has been found in amber. Can you examine its parts?
- Does your state have a state fossil? Nebraska's state fossil is the mammoth, while California's is the saber-toothed cat. Look up facts about your state fossil or a neighboring state fossil. If your state doesn't have one, what do you think it should be?
Ancient Travel Brochures
- Glacier Getaway with Free Woolly Mammoth Breakfast Every Morning! Pretend you're a travel agent from the year 40,000 B.C.E. What would you feature inside your travel brochure to encourage prehistoric peoples to visit North America? What would the "hotels" be like? What food would be served? What would be your travel warnings? What would you advise visitors to pack? Where are some of the most popular destinations and why?
- We Build It — You Come! Now, prepare a special brochure especially for more "recent" ancient peoples. Try planning a "Visit to the Mound Builders." Then, imagine a "Trip With the Mayans." What's special about traveling back in time to visit these civilizations? What do the "visiting" settlements look like? Are tourists welcome at ancient Mayan Death sacrifices — or are the tourists the sacrifices? Yikes!
What's On the Menu?
- Hungry for…chocolate? In her books, Levy explains how ancient Americans ate and grew some very cool foods that the rest of the planet didn't even know existed! Take some time to research the history of some of these foods and how they (and we!) changed the world. Sometimes they made it betterÂ…sometimes not. Investigate!
Potato
Tobacco
Corn
Tomato
Chocolate
Vanilla
Pumpkin
Avocado
Peanut
Turkey
Pineapple
- Hungry for… Pleistocene? The Pleistocene Epoch (Ice Ages) lasted from about 1.65 million years ago until 10,000 years ago. Many of the animals from that era are now extinct, but others live in select states. Following are two lists. The one labeled "Extinct" is a list of some animals that are extinct. The other labeled "Survivors" includes ancient animals that still survive in the U.S.A. Divide up your group so that each person researches one of these animals. Look up information about them (and other animals mentioned in both books), then combine your findings and discuss why you think some species died out while others survived to the present day.
Extinct
- Ground Sloth
- Beautiful Armadillo
- Short-faced Skunk
- American Lion
- Saber-toothed tiger
Survivors
- Grasshopper Mouse
- Starnose Mole
- Northern Bog Lemming
- Snowshoe Hare
- Cockroach
Weather or Not
- Take a look at how "cool" prehistory really is. How did Antarctica cool off the rest of the planet and create new land on some continents? How did cool weather make grass? Why did grass become so important to animals and people in North America?
- In prehistoric times, animals adapted their bodies and feeding habits based on changes in climate. For example, in Who Are You Calling a Woolly Mammoth? we learn that when it got cooler, animals like bison and cattle developed multi-chamber stomachs in order to digest grass properly. Think of other ways in which animals have evolved as they adapted to climate changes.
- Have you ever watched The Weather Channel? You can see how different temperatures and storm systems all over the country can affect where you live. How do we adapt our "settlements" (i.e. houses, apartments, farms) to fast changing weather patterns? We use lightning rods, tornado cellars, and flood walls, to name a few. Make lists of the ways that different parts of the country adapt their lives to deal with weather. Don't forget major weather events like El Nino and La Nina. What about global warming?
Don't Be Petrified by Petroglyphs (And Other Ancient Art)
- Rock On!
Materials you need: rough sandpaper (a few sheets), black spray paint, and a nail or sharp-tipped object (to scratch design).
- Apply black spray paint unevenly on your sandpaper so it looks like the surface of a rock. Let it dry.
- Cut sandpaper into several, equal-sized pieces.
- Prehistoric people used symbols on cave art to relate ideas and messages. Make up your own symbols and carefully scratch them into the pieces of painted sandpaper. Scratch the outline of a bison, or a fish, or maybe your little brother!
- Mix and match your rock art to make up different messages. You could decorate your bedroom door with an ancient "Keep Out" message if you want!
P.S. If you're really feeling expressive, step outside with some chalk and draw petroglyph symbols right on the real rocksÂ…or the sidewalk.
- This Art's For the Birds
In Awesome Ancient Ancestors, Levy describes giant bird art created and rediscovered in a place called Poverty Point, Louisiana (see page 62). Enormous ridges made the shape of a giant bird that could be seen from overhead. Make your own art based on this idea. What shape or symbol would you make and why?
Materials you need: pencil, colored construction paper, white glue, and colored or beach sand.
- Put down a piece of paper and trace your design or symbol in pencil. Make a silly face, another giant bird, or "Stick Man." Anything goes!
- Drip a trail of glue over the pencil marks so now your symbol is outlined in glue.
- Sprinkle colored sand over the glue and let dry.
- Getting A-HEAD of Prehistoric People
In Awesome Ancient Ancestors, Levy describes the creation of giant head sculptures by the Olmecs that stood more than 9 feet tall and weighed up to 50 tons each. What was the significance of these heads? You can make a slightly smaller version of your own with this simple paper-mache recipe. Materials you need: powdered wallpaper paste, water, one inflated balloon, strips of newspaper, and a pin. You'll also need some time — the mold will take time to dry between layers!
- Use your balloon to make the basic head shape.
- Make your paste solution mixing together the water and the powdered paste.
- One at a time, dip each strip into your paste, making sure it's completely covered, but not clumpy. Lay the strip over the mold and press it into place with your fingers. Not too hard-don't injure the balloon!
- Dip next strip and overlap the first. Repeat until balloon is covered.
- Let these strips dry, then repeat the procedure again, creating a second layer of paper over the first dried layer. As you build layers, begin to shape the newspaper into a nose, eyes, mouth and other head features.
- Once the paper has all dried into the mask shape you want, stick a pin through the paper into the balloon. It should pop and you have your own Olmec or Mayan head!
P.S. If you're feeling really inspired, decorate your head with glitter, feathers, magic markers, paint…or even petroglyphs!
Meet the Awesome Author
I don't just use jokes to make us laugh at our history (because a lot of what's happened over the years isn't all that funny, actually); but I do think that we've got to learn to laugh at ourselves and see how much we have in common with people through all ages. If you can share a joke, it's hard to hate . . . history is too important to be taken seriously because kids have to learn that we all do odd, strange things and no one has a monopoly on making mistakes!
Elizabeth Levy
Author Elizabeth Levy is the award-winning author of over eighty books for children, including If You Were There When They Signed the Constitution, Invisible Inc. Mysteries (Scholastic), Seventh Grade Tango (Hyperion), and My Life as a Fifth Grade Comedian (Winner of the Maryland and Georgia State Awards, and included in the New York Public Library Top 100 Books of the Year).
Watch for future America's Horrible Histories titles!
- Subjects:American History, Cooperation and Teamwork, Codes, Messages, Signs, Environmental Conservation and Preservation, Content Area Reading, Reading Comprehension, Research Skills, Writing Prompts, Glyphs, Arts and Creativity, Evolution, Paleontology and Fossils, Prehistory, Science through Literature, Climate, Weather, North America, Indigenous Peoples, Landforms and Topography, Maps and Globes, Historic Figures, Social Studies through Literature
- Skills:Reading Comprehension, Maps, Online Sources, Reference Sources, Science, Social Studies, Timelines, Codes, Messages, and Signs, Research Skills, Writing
|
Serviços Personalizados
Artigo
Indicadores
Links relacionados
Similares em SciELO
Bookmark
História, Ciências, Saúde-Manguinhos
versão impressa ISSN 0104-5970
Hist. cienc. saude-Manguinhos vol.18 supl.1 Rio de Janeiro dez. 2011
ANALYSIS
Gender and assistance: historical and conceptual considerations regarding assistance practices and policies*
Ana Paula Vosne Martins
Professor, Department of History/Universidade Federal do Paraná. Rua General Carneiro, 460, 6º andar, 80060-150 - Curitiba - PR - Brasil. [email protected]
ABSTRACT
The article offers some theoretical and historical reflections on the concept of gender as it relates to the notion of assistance. Explores the political dimensions of both concepts and problematizes the dichotomy between the gender-marked realms of the political and the pre-political, a dichotomy that has greatly influenced modern political theory and thought. It examines the modern state's care practices and the transformations in assistance which occurred within the charitable and assistance organizations that took shape in parallel and in consonance with this state action.
Keywords: gender; assistance; politics; care; Brazil.
Much to the contrary of what has been said, woman has always been and will always be the holy soul that guides men in the great destiny of the fatherland and especially in matters of assistance, where their knowledge is more refined than that of men. Much has been said about woman's role in organized societies, but everything that has been said about her is little compared to how great, truly very great, she shall be in the future.
Otelo Renzo Turi (1946, p.12).
Social assistance is a science that demands of those dedicated to it their perseverance, work, dedication, and moral superiority.
Boletim da Legião Brasileira de Assistência (1946, p.1.)
Founded on August 28, 1942, the Legião Brasileira de Assistência (Brazilian Assistance Legion/LBA) had a long life and represented a milestone in the organization of social assistance in Brazil. Its first efforts focused on the needs of the families of soldiers fighting in Europe, following Brazil's entry into World War II. The organization's very name in fact has a military connotation. First Lady Darcy Vargas gathered women from the country's most well-to-do classes to form a legion of women fighters who would never see the battlefields of Europe but would nevertheless serve as veritable soldiers in Brazil, doing what they were able to: caring for the needy, above all the families of recruits. Soon after the war ended, the LBA newsletter explained that in peacetime the organization would provide social assistance in collaboration with government agencies and private institutions, covering a broad gamut of services (O programa..., 1945, p.6). Structurally speaking, the LBA was organized along the lines of a super-ministry or super-department, with services ranging from social assistance to healthcare, education to housing, social research to publicity - in other words, it was active on a number of fronts, not incidentally priorities under the Vargas administration.1
The organization of the LBA and its specialization in social assistance illustrate how the Estado Novo laid the foundations for exercising what we might call a feminine citizenship based on women's social usefulness, thereby extending their maternal role in moral terms to society. This quite conservative strain of citizenship was also found in other political contexts, like Salazar's Estado Novo, Fascist Italy, and Francoist Spain. These regimes enjoyed substantial support from women organized in associations much like the LBA, grounded on the idea that women should participate politically using their specific skills for social intervention, that is, their naturally endowed ability to nurture.
The creation of the LBA was contemporaneous with the organization of social assistance rooted in the political rationale of welfare states and based on the scientific research norms, strategies for action, and human resource training approaches employed by Western countries. This new political scenario is the point of departure for this article, which explores the links connecting three distinct words, both theoretically and historically: state, assistance, and women. In principle, these words have different historical origins and could hardly be aligned, as I'm proposing here; after all, they belong to distinct lexicons: the term state belongs to the political lexicon, while women and assistance form a duo that is associated with other moments of life, that is, reproduction and care - outside the bounds of politics. However, these words and the agents that lend them substance meet, mix, and mutually sustain and transform themselves over time along multiple, complex pathways.
Taking historical and philosophical feminist scholarship on gender and politics as my point of reference, my analysis articulates the category of gender with historical experiences in care, in the intent of arriving at an understanding of the links between state, assistance, and public action by women. I am including assistance as part of a set of activities and values that Joan Tronto (1996, p.142) has called care: "caring [can] be viewed as a species activity that includes everything that we do to maintain, continue, and repair our 'world' so that we can live in it as well as possible". In this article I am not adopting a differentialist or essentialist view of the concept of care. If care-related activities have historically been associated with women and therefore gender-marked, we must take a step beyond that, as Tronto (1996) has underscored. This step is both hermeneutical and theoretical. Analysis should not serve to second the dichotomous thinking that pits politics against care, public against private, the ethic of justice against the ethic of care, or masculine against feminine. On the theoretical level, we must understand the role that gender plays in defining human activities and their social and moral status. Likewise, gender is a cognitive category that sanctions places, positions, status, privileges, and authority in the construction of power relations and social hierarchies. As a category, it is key in establishing symbolic values and creating binary oppositions between spaces, bodies, and different human actions. The gender approach pushes us to construct more comprehensive, complex, and plural interpretations of politics, object of this article; this examination of the discourses and practices of assistance ultimately leads me to propose a resignification of both terms, care and politics.
From moral duty to assistance policy under the modern state
Caring for those who for a wide variety of reasons need help and attention entails a range of distinct activities: taking care of children, the infirm, and the elderly, or, more usually, caring for people classified as poor and for those who are not minimally able to survive and must depend upon others to do so. These activities were long associated with the realm of the household and with patriarchal and slave/master power, at least until modernity.
According to Aristotle's Politics, home and family - as determined by the natural order of things - exist to provide for our more immediate material needs, like food, childcare, and care for the sick and elderly; thus they fulfill their natural purpose, which is the reproduction of life. In his differentialist, hierarchical view of the political order, Aristotle argues that family constitutes the first natural order of power, based on the principle of men's preeminence and superiority. Persons involved with care are not citizens, according to Aristotle, but non-political subjects, like women and slaves. According to Politics - a classic of political thinking even in modernity - care activities are secondary and even inferior to political action because they are limited to technique and to dealing with bodies and matter; they entail relations of dependence and do not generate autonomy. In the Aristotelian view of the political order, care activities are restricted by circumstances and are quite localized in time and space, and only those who manage to transcend these limitations can participate in the dynamic, lofty sphere of politics. From this viewpoint, the world of politics stands in stark contrast with the world of specificities, needs, and care, leaving a deep ontological and functional dichotomy between both, marked by social condition and gender. In Aristotelian thought about the differences between the patriarchal world of family and the political world of citizens, gender is a key category. Within the family, power belongs to the man - husband, lord, father - while it is here that women play their role in the reproduction and sustenance of life. Women are expected to comply with the dictates of nature, thereby remaining confined to this space and to the limits of their duties. The dichotomy between politics and pre-politics (family) in Aristotelian political thought means that these two worlds are considered interdependent spheres, closed to the possibility of interconnection because the world of politics comprises free and equal people at a remove from any interference by bodily needs or by the misfortunate social conditions of inferior people.
This dichotomous view that contrasts politics with care long held sway in political thought, at least until the Christian notion of charity was introduced. As underscored by Tronto (1996) and Geremek (1995), neither Christian authors nor followers of the new religion saw poverty and its attendant forms of suffering as a misfortune but rather as a sign of salvation - after all, the son of God had dwelled among the less fortunate and had defended humility and the poor. The ascetic, monastic traditions of Christianity held poverty and caring for the neediest in high regard, but Christians interpreted these practices from an angle that differed from the Aristotelian opposition between politics and care, that is, from the angle of religious and spiritual experience. Caring for the needy thus occupied a realm quite different from that defined by Aristotle. The notion of care became associated with compassion for those who truly suffer, whether the cause is wretchedness, illness, or any other inability to care for oneself. In the ideological and moral framework of Christianity, giving alms, sustenance, or even one's time to care for the ill, the abandoned, or the persecuted became a lofty spiritual virtue. According to Tronto (1996), such actions were seen as rising above worldly values and goals, and thus above politics, which was usually concerned with the immediate and sometimes not very Christian interests of the 'earthly city.' Those who sought the true joy of salvation and their share in the blessings of the 'city of God' possessed the talent of charity. The care they offered those who were suffering - the poor, the infirm, children, women, the persecuted - did not make them either subjects of a realm prior to politics or political subjects per se; rather, the charity and compassion they showed sufferers and the needy set them apart, in a place belonging neither to the realm of apolitical exclusion in the home nor to the political arena of equals. Their place lay above these; it was defined by talents, faith, and the spiritual motivation of salvation.
Seen as an activity that was either pre-political or above politics, care has always been associated with certain social positions and positions of power. In the Aristotelian dichotomy, care had to do with the reproduction of life and thus belonged to an essentially female world. Caring for, assisting, providing for, helping, and protecting were all activities that could only be performed by subjects who were closer to the lowly, be the latter lowly by condition or by temporary circumstances. In the social order as conceived by Aristotle and his Western readers, women, owing to their natural condition, were linked to the world of matter and its vicissitudes and thus excluded from politics by their immanent inferiority, left to occupy a place outside politics and public affairs, a place reserved for care.
In Christian ethos, gender was not at first so relevant or even defining when it came to care activities. Since care was not associated with politics but with religious life and its spiritual dimension, both men and women could possess and develop the talent of charity. In hagiographies, we see how the men and women who walked the path to sainthood did so not only through martyrdom but also by making a preferential option for the poor and by helping the needy and misfortunate. Starting in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries, mendicant orders lent greater visibility to the question of renouncing the world of wealth and sin. The biographies of female saints thus depict them as women who loved poverty (even though some had been members of the nobility) and devoted themselves to aiding the needy. Hagiography and mariolatry, which also spread through the medieval Christian world, strengthened this connection between charity and femininity. Among the many titles given Mary, mother of Jesus, we find lady of charity, of aid, of the needy, and of the afflicted - along with many other names that reflect her willingness to care for her many children. Hagiographic models certainly played a vital role in the education of noble women and in constructing a notion of what was expected of them not only as women but also as the daughters and wives of great lords, who should display this Christian virtue-action, that is, charity (Duby, 1989).
Subsequent to the union of the Aristotelian and Christian concepts, care acquired a double meaning in modernity. On the one hand, it was still associated with the sphere of the home and with female management. On the other, following the sixteenth-century religious reforms and what we could call a spiritual revival that commenced among both Protestants and Catholics in the seventeenth and eighteenth centuries, charity not only represented a most praiseworthy Christian virtue but was also associated with moral worthiness, in the case of both men and women. Nevertheless, it is noteworthy that the initial distinction between the realm of care and of politics remained nearly unchanged, reinforcing gender marks, because even if Catholics and Protestants did not assign care exclusively to women, women were always at the fore in both actual daily practice and in the establishment of charitable institutions; likewise, charity was just as important as virtue and modesty in defining female qualities (Davis, 1990, 1997).
We should also bear in mind that when the aristocracy underwent a reconfiguration in modern Europe, especially in countries like England and France, the traditional notion that the privileged classes should support the needy through almsgiving or by donating money to build hospitals and orphanages was fortified. According to this paternalist tradition, aristocratic women were expected to play the role of protectors and providers of aid to the lowly, as well as the role of intermediaries between their powerful fathers, husbands, sons, or brothers and the subaltern.
Despite these subtle changes in the concept of care from the view of the Christian ethos of charity, there was no shift in the dichotomy between the realms of care and of politics, just as there was no shift in the places assigned the genders within these two realms. Power and action in the world of the Republic were the attributions of men, while care was the attribution of women, starting with care for those closest, like children, the elderly, and the infirm inside the family nucleus. In compliance with the norms of Christian life, women should also look out for those who deserved their aid, despite distance between social classes.
An important, double-faceted change transformed the Aristotelian-Christian view of care, inaugurating what we could call the political problematization of care. This was first manifested in the organization of institutions and the drafting of laws meant to ameliorate the harsh effects of urban impoverishment that ensued from the introduction of capitalist production and new forms of labor. This new economic organization was a corollary of the formation and strengthening of modern states around the concepts of political sovereignty, centralization, and the personalization of political power. The second sign of change lies in the formulation of political thought or, more precisely, of political philosophy, which defined the Otherness of the state and in so doing expanded its attributions, including those in the realm of care. In Leviathan, Hobbes leaves no doubts about the fact that this matter is political: Uncharitablenesse in any man neglect the impotent, so it is in the Sovereign of a Commonwealth to expose them to the hazard of such uncertain Charity.2
Christian rhetoric notwithstanding, in this passage Hobbes calls attention to the political dimension of assistance, or care for the needy. In his homeland of England as in other European nations, the state began organizing the principles of what we could call public assistance, with varying degrees of direct presence. Since the sixteenth-century drafting of the Poor Laws, social assistance had been emerging in England and other European countries in the form of hospitals and institutions to protect invalids, the sick, and orphans. More precisely, the modern state did not take it upon itself to organize the work that was in the hands of private charities, as Hobbes points out, but it did begin to intervene, even if only in localized or sporadic fashion, in a sphere that had previously lain outside politics (Geremek, 1995; Himmelfarb, 1988).
It must be emphasized that this intervention by modern states in the field of charity or care for the needy differed greatly from what would later become public assistance policy. Within the context of the solidification of modern states, the paternalistic, Christian ethos of charity was reiterated, now led by the sovereign and his ministers. Despite limitations, it is remarkable how philosophical texts written in that context began to introduce into the political lexicon, even if only in localized fashion, words and activities that had previously been absent from both political vocabulary and political practice.
This signaled a significant change, which commenced in the West and was to have substantial impact on gender politics. Despite the persistent dichotomy between the spheres of care and politics, the subjects of both began interacting more often. Perhaps even more pertinent was the resignification of care when it became part of the political agenda of liberal states. Inaugurated in the late nineteenth century in Europe and the United States, and in some Latin American countries as well, this process opened up new possibilities for women, not only bringing their practices and values into the sphere of politics but also affording them the chance to participate professionally through the enforcement of new assistance policies.
From the gender of assistance to gender politics
The paternalist tradition governing assistance to the poor through the mid-eighteenth century saw both men and women taking part in charity efforts. Yet the women historians who have studied the ideology of domesticity and its correlate configuration in gender relations have shown that women were the ones who began devoting themselves more heavily to charitable activities, in consonance with the ideological values of gender in the middle classes, in both Europe and the United States (Elliott, 2002; Smith, 1981; Prochaska, 1980; Poovey, 1984; Perrot, 1998).
In England and France particularly, the conjoining of religious and philosophical discourse resulted in a utilitarian moral definition of women. If we turn to the main educational texts published as of the late seventeenth century and throughout the eighteenth century - a long tradition, of which Locke, Fénelon, Madame de Sevigne and Rousseau are some eminent representatives - we will observe the unfolding of a model of women that represents neither the 'genteel' woman eager to enter the world of letters and philosophy nor the aristocrat from the superficial world of luxury and appearances but the maternal figure who personally sees to raising and educating her children, without ever forgetting her Christian duty towards the weak and needy. This educational, advice literature ushered in the maternal empire that was to have a long and contradictory existence.
So women's place had been well defined: it was in the home, as loving wives, devoted mothers, and benevolent ladies. Their natural, moral qualities equipped them for maternity and domestic affairs, but from both a religious and a moral-philosophical point of view, they were also expected to place these skills at the service of others, those who were suffering and in need of care. According to a meticulous analysis by Elliott (2002), the ideology of domesticity constrained female ambition and bridled women's thirst for knowledge, the right to express themselves, and a role in the public world, while concomitantly suggesting it might be possible to take part in the world precisely from the place that had always anchored women outside of public and political life: the place of care. A good share of women from the elites began devoting themselves to this socially sanctioned work, through the religious discourse of charity or the new secular discourse of philanthropy, formulated in the context of the Enlightenment.
At first, not-for-profit work unconnected with need or with survival was not marked by gender, and male forays into charity and philanthropy are well known, especially on the part of successful middle-class businessmen who won renown for their benevolence (Elliott, 2002). However, as women began to participate ever more actively in charitable work and as it grew more closely associated with woman's gendered place as defined by the ideology of domesticity, the link between philanthropy and femininity steadily tightened until the former eventually came to be seen as a female activity.3 So it was on the basis of gender policy which excluded women from the public world that assistance became defined as female work that did not jeopardize a woman's morality or virtue.
This feminization of care and assistance for others developed into part of the middle-class imagination in the mid-eighteenth century, a tendency that literature of a moral nature as well as novels helped spread. Many female characters in novels devoted themselves to philanthropy and were generally described as women of lofty morals, sympathetic to the suffering of others, benevolent and empathetic. They were examples of how women could and even should concern themselves with others, perhaps thus finding the happiness that eluded them in their relationships. This female construction of assistance and care was also an expansion of the notion of maternity, including single women who were not mothers. So even if women played ever more public roles through philanthropy, this work was not antithetical to the ideology of domesticity, because it was grounded on the notion that this activity complemented maternity and those qualities that had been deemed feminine, extending them into the world beyond home and family. In this regard, it is worth noting how the female professions occupied by educated middle-class women came to be defined in areas consistent with this gendered construction of assistance, like nursing, medicine, teaching, and, later, social work.
Defining the gender of assistance was not a process devoid of contradictions. As a political procedure inherent to the development of the ideology of domesticity, the separation of public and private harbored a conflict that many nineteenth-century observers wrote about: the contradiction between the place women should occupy in the private sphere and their participation in the public world through philanthropic work (a trend that was on the rise albeit not in linear fashion). If many advocates of feminine philanthropy saw nothing incongruous in this two-way movement, some of the more conservative feared that women's constant exposure at assistance institutions, the dwellings of the poor, in the streets, at public events, and in the anterooms of politicians and ministerial offices could be prejudicial to the decency, morality, and even health of such fragile, sensitive beings. Elliott (2002) remarks that writers did not fail to feature this contradiction in their novels, especially Dickens, a social observer. Female characters who worked in philanthropy began to be depicted in pejorative, stereotyped terms, like the impertinent, authoritarian, unfeminine spinster who stuck her nose into the lives and homes of the poor. This inversion challenged the maternal ideal of the woman who worked in philanthropy and made it clear that women should not use the good purposes of philanthropy to cross the lines between public and private. Care was required and necessary, but clear lines had to be drawn, putting limits on just how far outside the home this shift could take women.
Despite such conservative, derogatory reactions, women did not retreat. Many embarked on another movement that carried them definitively into the public and even political world. Organized on both sides of the Atlantic, the reform movement mobilized women from a broad scope of ideological bents, from Catholic and Protestant conservatism to socialism and feminism. There are a variety of reasons why so many women became involved with the reform movement in European countries and the United States. The early nineteenth century was marked by temperance campaigns, women's participation in the abolitionist movement (especially in England and the United States), and wide-ranging forms of female participation in what we could call social issues.
The growth of cities and factories drew increasing numbers from the countryside and smaller towns, a phenomenon in turn tied to a sharp rise in poverty and its attendant ills, triggering social criticism. It was precisely in the nineteenth century that the problems deriving from capitalist society became the object of analysis within social thought. In this endeavor to understand reality and intervene in it, women participated in the sphere of social issues through their recognized 'natural talent' to provide assistance to the needy (Himmelfarb, 1988; Koven, Michel, 1990; Elliott, 2002; Perrot, 1998).
Until quite recently, feminist historians paid little heed to women's participation in philanthropy because they understood it as an example of the mechanisms that serve to reproduce the ideology that public and private life belong to separate realms, as well as the notion that women are subaltern and passive. Many women doing philanthropic work certainly defended the idea that they were naturally different from men and that this difference determined their places in society. Nor can we forget that many of these women agreed with this separation of place and also that boundaries had to be established for the activities of men as well as women. Ergo, if women could not and should not take part in the public world through politics and business, men could and should not occupy themselves with affairs of the home and of care. The notion of a physical and intellectual as well as moral difference between men and women underlies this dichotomous thinking, a point constantly driven home by reform women and women engaged in philanthropy.
In this female reshaping of the differentialist discourse present in philosophy and medicine since the eighteenth century, their sensitivity and maternity reinforced the notion that women possess greater moral stature. This view of female morality explains why women believed they were better equipped not only to gestate and bear children but also to provide care. For many reformers, the meaning of care grew ever broader, encompassing such work as participation in abolition movements, the fight against child labor in mines and factories, support for single mothers and working women, and the creation of various assistance organizations.
As women grew active in the reform movement and they became prized for their morality, one political and ideological outgrowth of philanthropy came to have sizeable significance in the drafting of gender policies by liberal states, starting in the latter half of the nineteenth century and especially at the dawn of the twentieth: maternalism. This development did not come about in the same way or at the same time in all Western countries. Nor did the women who took part in assistance practices grounded in maternalism share the exact same political ideals and moral values.
Here I am adopting the concept of maternalism employed by Koven and Michel (1990), a term used by female historians who study women's social and political participation from the viewpoint of the moral and social defense of maternity and the glorification of maternal qualities related to care for others (not only children) and to assistance: "Maternalism always operated on two levels: it extolled the private virtues of domesticity whyle simultaneously legitimating women's public relationships to politics and the state, to community, workplace, and marketplace. In practice, maternalist ideologies often challenged the constructed bounderies between public and private, women and men, state and civil society" (p.1081).
But why was maternity the road that effectively led many women to challenge such well-guarded boundaries between public and private? Why was the defense of maternity and of its moral value one of the paths by which women entered the public world, the world of politics, and the world of professionalization, awakening in some a feminist consciousness? To answer these paradoxical questions, we must understand why maternity gained such visibility as a social issue starting in the nineteenth century.
As of the 1830s and 1840s, both fictional narratives and official reports published in England showed that the extreme poverty mounting in popular neighborhoods of cities like Manchester and London was hitting women and children the hardest. Statistics on child mortality started to be released in England during the Industrial Revolution, as well as in France and Germany. With the intent of warning authorities about the problem, physicians and philanthropists were the first to make use of these data, incomplete yet very revealing of the effects of poverty.
Looking at the whole of medical texts published between the 1850s and 1870s, particularly in France, we realize how much this social issue was transformed into a moral and political one. The high infant mortality rates in Europe's industrialized countries were basically a reflection of poverty. Studies by doctors highlighted the housing situation and child nutrition as the main causes of death and disease rates. Yet rare were those who sought more comprehensive solutions to the matter, questioning, for example, the organization of labor relations or, more specifically, family relations. On the contrary, physicians started blaming mothers for infant deaths, pronouncing a moralist discourse about the value of breastfeeding while ignoring these women's need to work. The doctors rarely addressed the question of female labor and when they did, it was to condemn it, as if it were a matter of individual choice and not of women being forced into factories by economic pressure.
As Alexandra Kollontai (1916) made so clear in one of the most thoroughgoing early twentieth-century analyses of maternity, those engaged in this debate had an outdated, anachronistic view of the family, since in capitalist society the family was no longer a productive unit where all activities entailing childcare and care of the elderly, infirm, and incapacitated were performed without greater ado or hardship. With the profound changes generated by the Industrial Revolution and capitalist production, all family members had been brought into the world of wage labor, and this change had a direct effect on women, who for the first time ever had to find individual solutions for childcare while they continued to work, without any resources or any type of help.
Authors like Kollontai who were engaged in the defense of women's and workers' rights pointed up the enormous hardships that laboring women faced, since most had to leave their children alone or had to put the youngest with wet nurses. What physicians and others involved with the matter failed to or did not want to see, according to Kollontai (1916), was that raising and educating children could no longer remain the sole responsibility of the family and women but had to be assumed by society and the state. The government had to be more active, intervening in the relations between capital and labor in order to protect working mothers and children - for example, by offering maternity allowances, creating institutions that provided milk and food for mothers and children, and establishing daycare facilities and shelters.
A number of those taking part in the debate defended this idea, or variations thereof. The central question in Kollontai's text and other writings by female reformers of the late nineteenth and early twentieth centuries is that protecting maternity and childhood could no longer be confined to the sphere of the family and dealt with as a private matter. Motherhood and childcare were matters of public interest and a woman's right; therefore, they would be treated as such, that is, protected by the state.
While physicians, women activists, labor organizations, philanthropists, and religious figures had different focuses, the issue of maternity and childhood gained in both visibility and importance starting in the 1870s, when it found its way onto the agendas at medical association meetings and labor and women's congresses. The issue also touched a chord with a few representatives of the employer class, who introduced certain protective measures, like compensation funds that provided family allowances; however, these measures were meant to supplement the wages of the heads of large families, indeed as a way of ensuring that the worker's wife would remain in the home (Beltrão, 1962, p.129-131).
As ties between the issues of maternity/childhood and women's labor grew more apparent and irreversible, the more conventional, conservative ideas were supplanted by others of a reform nature, giving rise to the first laws to protect women's and child labor as well as maternity. Some representatives of Catholic thought, however, defended the need for men to receive higher wages (the family wage) so they could fulfill their role as family provider, keeping their wives from leaving home to work. Perhaps one of the texts that best synthesizes these ideas that opposed women's work with the intent of protecting the family and children is German Bishop Wilhelm Emmanuel von Ketteler's The Labor Question and Christianity (1864), a precursor to the ideas later expressed in Rerum Novarum (Van Gestel, 1956, p.85). Worker grievances included a ban on child labor and on women's work in factories, "especially mothers of families. Religion ordains that a mother should spend her day at home fulfilling her holy, lofty mission towards her husband and children" (p.85).4
Ideas about the dichotomous roles played by each gender persisted in this debate. Even among representatives of non-Catholic worker organizations, it was a challenge to broach the issue of female labor and maternity in social terms, as Kollontai (1916) explained in her comments on the first European worker congresses, which began in the 1860s. According to this author, while labor leaders debated whether working mothers should be offered protection, the measures they proposed lacked solid foundations and were generally contradictory, therefore not representing workable solutions.
The bibliography on welfare and the shaping of policies to protect maternity and childhood reveals that viable arguments and solutions were advanced by physicians and women activists, both feminist and non-feminist. Hygienists, obstetricians, and pediatricians used statistics on infant mortality as their main argument, defending children's right to be near their mothers, who could care for, nurse, and educate them. For physicians, the question had very serious moral and political implications, thereby requiring cautious interference, timid as it might have to be in order not to threaten domestic privacy or authority within the family. Physicians constituted the most conservative reform group, although some were quite daring in their humanitarianism, espousing measures like the establishment of maternity shelters for women who needed to hide their pregnancies, investigations of paternity, maternity insurance for single mothers, and an end to the distinction between legitimate and illegitimate children for the purposes of legal protection.5
Another group quite active in drafting laws and policies to protect maternity and childhood were activist women. In addition to the aforementioned women's organizations that grew out of religious and lay philanthropic work, another form of activism sprung from the women's rights movement. Generally comprised of educated, well-informed, middle-class women, this group also advanced the notion that women and maternity had claim to a special moral stature. But its representatives went beyond moral discourse, politicizing maternity by affirming that it was not simply a natural function, limited to the sustenance of family, but rather one of the most important social functions, demanding of women much dedication, time, and work. Since maternity had a social purpose, then it also had rights, and these the state should guarantee.
It should be noted that this type of political activism that valued maternity also stemmed from a differentialist view of gender. Although women should develop their talents and skills and exercise their rights as citizens, it was not a matter of making women equal to men but rather of protecting them in their differences; maternity and housework should not be considered inferior to other activities or bereft of rights. Gisela Bock (1995, p.453) explains that these women "did not underestimate the gender difference but insisted on a woman's right to be different, a position seen as expressing a woman's pride, power, and self-affirmation and not her lack of power or her resignation."
Maternalist political action consisted of activities in organizations, the development of programs among poor women, and participation in international meetings and congresses where women exchanged ideas and learned about the forms of political action used by other women and organizations. In most European countries that adopted the earliest legal protection measures, the proposals put forward by women's movements were at least partially adopted.
In analyzing the first laws to protect workers and specific social groups like the infirm, elderly, incapacitated, and mothers and children, it is important to note that the actions that became known as social policies - related to education, housing, sanitation, health, welfare, and social assistance - were, even if sporadically and partially, formulated and implemented by private groups and organizations of the most varied political and ideological stripes. Taken as a whole, they represent social welfare thought, ranging from religious-based philanthropy and humanitarian and reform activism to ideas of socialist inspiration. The common thread running through them all was an awareness of the social question, the need to be responsible for the weak and powerless, and the need to improve or even transform the realities of those concerned.
This clarification is necessary because these welfare policies were not necessarily a product of new arrangements in the relations between state and society or even of the welfare state. To the contrary, the policies were advocated and enforced by very different organizations, at times working alone and at other times in collaboration with other organizations or even in collaboration with local authorities. Perhaps this explains why the first welfare state policies to be adopted were those already implemented by civil organizations, which were, after all, the ones that could count on enough political mobilization to pressure the legislative branch and also had experience working with the social groups targeted for assistance. This was the case with policies to protect maternity and childhood.
It is worth highlighting at least two initiatives later adopted by municipal authorities and central governments, taken from the experience of women activists working with poor mothers: 'social visitors' and maternity homes. Activism by women in both England and France was aimed at improving the living conditions of poor mothers. Periodical visits were made to their homes in order to learn about the popular classes' customs and more urgent problems. The visitors were not always well received by the poor, as middle-class women generally judged the latter by their own moral values and ultimately blamed them for their own poverty. Yet not all observations produced class prejudice. Many of the women committed to social reform managed to overcome cultural differences between the classes and arrive at quite realistic diagnoses of poverty and social causes. They also helped ensure that the information on hygiene and eating habits disseminated among poor women was more accessible and less authoritarian (Thane, 1996). Local British authorities adopted this model as part of its visiting physicians service, intended to prevent disease and disseminate information on nutrition, hygiene, and health.
As historian Françoise Thébaud (1986) has reported, the other initiative, that is, to create maternity shelters or homes for unwed mothers, emerged in France and was meant to serve the needs of single mothers - the 'pariahs' of motherhood - most of whom came from small towns and villages or were immigrants. Motherhood outside of wedlock was vehemently condemned, but feminists and some doctors tried to protect these mothers, as much for natalist reasons as for humanitarian ones. Pregnant women could find shelter in these homes until their babies were born or could give birth and nurse there. A woman's identity was confidential in these places; there were no formalities or any type of investigation. The women and children also received medical consults, and efforts were made to prevent disease and infant mortality and encourage mothers to breastfeed.
Generally speaking, almost all European countries had private assistance policies for mothers and children that served poor women, generally unwed mothers, widows, or women abandoned by their husbands. But these policies were not enough, as they reached only a very small number of women. Both the public receiving these services and the services themselves had to be expanded, and in this regard a combination of voluntary efforts and the action of local authorities proved quite fruitful, during the time before central or federal governments moved to enact maternity and childhood policies, creating institutions, providing personnel, and allocating funds.
In principle, female maternalist activism lays bare a paradox, since it was the experience and values associated with the world of care and private life that allowed many women to cross this frontier and become active in the public world. In moving from the margin to the center, many women activists, feminist and not, resignified the actions and values of care in political terms, blurring the lines between public and private, between politics and care. In this sense, when we observe the diverse forms of political action taken by maternalist activists, we can see that many women transformed their exclusion into action through a restrictive, exclusionary gender ideology, the gender of assistance. In so doing, they contributed to the formulation of a gender policy devised by social welfare states that, despite its limitations, tried to respond to the most urgent needs in the areas of health, income, food, housing, social security, and education.
Some political dimensions of assistance in Brazil
So far we have explored the tense, ambiguous, contradictory, and yet historically convergent relations between care activities and care values and the institutional and professional dimensions of politics. But there are other political dimensions of assistance that merit an examination, besides the inclusion of demands from the care experience on social welfare state agendas.
In order to avoid the pitfalls of the dichotomy addressed in the first part of this article, I will begin by looking at criticisms of the concept of care, or of assistance. Tronto (1987) has forcefully criticized the concept of an ethic of care as put forward by Carol Gilligan (1985) and employed by other feminist authors, as Tronto believes Gilligan's contrast of an ethic of justice with an ethic of care is problematic.
In brief, the argument goes, the ethic of justice is the product of the moral development of men, underpinned by values like right and wrong and the premises of equality and universality, with the individual serving as the moral reference point. The ethic of care, on the other hand, is the product of women's moral development, grounded in responsibility and relationships more than in the individual and in the interconnections between people, everyday experience, and the problems of particular historical, cultural people rather than on abstract, universal values. Like Tronto (1987), I believe it is questionable to equate care with women since this implies that one originates from the other or that there is a necessary relationship between gender and morality, and between women and the ethic of care. As much as Gilligan and the women authors who have drawn inspiration from her research may have understood that the moral and ethical differences between men and women are the result of historical and cultural processes, their studies did not include the political dimension of other variables, like class, race, and ethnic-cultural issues, and so they failed to avoid the pitfalls of differentialism's dichotomous thinking.
On this basis, I would argue that the discussion about the political dimensions of care and assistance should not be associated with gender alone, relegated to the world of women and their supposed drive to care for life. Differentialist and even essentialist thought ultimately debilitates both gender politics and care politics. According to Tronto (1987, p.662), unless we move beyond gender in this discussion of care and assistance, we run the risk of reproducing the discourse of difference that was historically constructed on contrast and on relegating women's place to the segregated activities of care.
Going beyond gender does not mean neglecting it; rather, it means directing our attention to the political, institutional, and symbolic forms assumed by this category in the conception and organization of care. This raises some important questions not only about historical investigation but also about the care policies developed by the state and by civil society. With this in mind, I will turn my analysis to some specificities of the issue in Brazil.
If we start with a more general question, like the boundaries of care, we can think about how the agents involved with care in Brazilian society built models of benevolence and of beneficiaries based on social hierarchy, especially the hierarchy of a society historically marked by slavery and paternalism. Research on patronage relations, kinship, elitist sociabilities, and relations of subalternity can help us understand the historical construction of these boundaries. This means we must understand, from the early days of the country, what values and references shaped the concept of who was considered deserving of care (family members, neighbors, slaves, soldiers, the infirm, foundlings, orphans, the dead) and to what extent and how this boundary was loosened or tightened, in consonance with interests, the assignment of merit, and a willingness to care for and assist.
This issue should be further investigated as it relates to the organization of social assistance in Brazil, a terrain about which we know only a little to date. There are inarguable documental limitations, but access to the little-known records of charitable and philanthropic organizations (especially those founded as from the 1910s, which later worked in partnership with the state) could help us elucidate not only the question of the boundaries of care but many others as well. Brazil's federal and state archives hold well-preserved records on the organization of social assistance.6
Minutes of meetings, reports, letters to the authorities, and, as available, interviews with those who took part in these organizations can supply information on changes in the motivations of agents of benevolence and especially on the relations between the two care models. The first model was founded on the Christian, moral duty to care for the needy, while the second - the rational model under which care would target different social groups - was established by the scientific discourse of medicine and social service and by government bodies, especially starting in the 1930s and 1940s.
There is a political dimension to care that warrants greater consideration, especially in research on the topic in Brazil. Because of the attention that U.S. and European historiography has directed to maternalism and its ties with feminism and with the awakening of a consciousness about more far-reaching movements, like civil rights and women's rights, power relations and differences within maternalism itself and within the practices and policies of care and social assistance have been overshadowed or disregarded. As Linda Gordon (1991, 1992, 1994) has suggested, views of care, welfare, and the people whose needs should be met, and even the very definition of these needs, have been forged at the intersection of gender, class, and race differences and inequalities. Gordon's research on the organization of U.S. welfare policies uncovered differences between the models and actions of black and white women activists.
We know that in Brazil public care work was first tied to the moral concept of Christian charity, conducted under the responsibility of men and women from the most well-to-do classes. The agents of benevolence were people who shared the idea that poverty was a fatality and that it was up to good Christians to ease the misfortunes of the poor and helpless. This understanding found resonance not only within Catholicism but also within the networks of protection and dependence formed by both the master-slave society and by other social groups, like slaves, freedmen, and whites and those of mixed-race who often times lived on the edge of poverty, forced to rely on protection from their peers or the charity of masters and their benevolent wives.
Starting at the close of the nineteenth century, there was a growing perception within medical circles that the problems stemming from poverty could not be left merely to charity or the good will of some. Influenced by the critical thinking of their French colleagues, Brazilian physicians began defending the need to implant public assistance in Brazil, organized by the government, founded on rational, scientific, objective bases, and equipped with an institutional structure as well as technical and administrative personnel.
In this late-nineteenth/early-twentieth century context, this moral model of care began interweaving with the new rationalist, public model that Brazil was just beginning to implement, then called philanthropy. Two important agents of assistance were most directly involved in this interweaving: physicians and women from the upper and middle classes, not all of whom had ties to experience in assistance or charity work. With the help of these women, physicians also began enjoying more space, a larger clientele, and the infrastructure that would allow them to put their assistance ideas into practice. Institutions that served mothers and children were organized in a number of Brazilian cities, like the women's associations to protect maternity and childhood, Protetorados do Berço (associations that provided clothing for newborns), Gotas de Leite (modeled after the French Gouttes de Lait, which furnished sterile cow's milk), milk dispensaries, crèches, and children's and maternity hospitals (Leite, 1997; Martins, 2005; Mott, 2001; Rodrigues, 2004).
Records from women's associations await further exploration, as do the records generated in their relationships with government, particularly after the 1930s, a period when an intricate web of agreements and interactions developed between public agents and women working with assistance. Access to these records and to the memories of people active in philanthropy and social assistance could clarify a number of questions: how women became involved with the public activity of care; under which circumstances and in accordance with which values they decided to work with assistance associations; how the type of assistance they rendered was organized; and what support strategies were used (familial, friendship networks, or political and governmental means). In other words, this information would allow us to understand the motives and mechanisms behind assistance action.
This type of investigation interrupts the dichotomy between care and politics by looking for their contact points and, above all, by realizing that the definition and social organization of care must necessarily take place in the realm of politics, even when in ideological terms care seems connected to the realm of women's good will and kind hearts. Assistance activists knew they had to learn to work resourcefully within public spaces and to organize politically if their assistance work was to be successful.
Another outgrowth of an analysis that emphasizes the political dimensions of care has to do with the production of alterities, that is, of those who deserve care. Assistance activities are necessarily based on the perception of social, cultural, and racial differences. The groups and individuals who receive care are defined by benevolent agents on the basis of their needs, degree of vulnerability, and how difficult it is for them to support themselves. But these definitions are not givens; that is, the parameters or criteria for establishing alterity are not defined by need or happenstance (for example, droughts, famine, joblessness, loss of income, war) but by the ideas and values that have been historically constructed about the Other. These ideas and values reflect ideologies of gender, class, and race, and thus the organization of assistance work and the decision about who does or does not deserve care is determined by places of power. This means that a relevant research question would be the exploration of the power relations between benevolent women and beneficiaries. Not much import has been assigned this topic in research on women in Brazil, as researchers have overlooked class and race conflicts and inequalities in their eagerness to bring to light women's actions and organization.
Thinking about the political dimensions of care leads us to another facet of the matter, which is how the meanings of gender have slipped into the political realm and the political lexicon. As discussed in the first part of this article, care has historically been organized and articulated in tune with the binary opposition between public and private, male and female, practical reason and feelings.
When the meaning of care underwent a political rearticulation based on a profile of humanitarian, secular, scientific, and rational values - a process that got underway in Brazil at the dawn of the twentieth century and gained institutional form under Vargas - the boundaries of this gender contrast began to be blurred by the era's nationalist ideological discourse, which called for women to participate in building a new social order. Women were supposed to contribute politically to the nation and the state from their place, using their own 'natural' skills. An appeal to women's natural sentiments, like goodness, solidarity, and sympathy for the suffering of others, urged them to go beyond domestic and family care, engaging in assistance work among the poor and needy.
When the meanings of gender entered political practice and discourse another outgrowth was that it opened up new professional possibilities for middle-class women. Women teachers, doctors, nurses, social workers, lawyers, and civil servants from the administrative area of services took active part in organizing Brazil's welfare state - a process about which we have little information as yet. We must bear in mind that the era's political discourses - exemplified by this article's epigraphs - fostered an overlapping of values and meanings by asserting that qualities previously defined as female and related to the world of feelings and care should be extended to the rational, practical world of politics. Especially under authoritarian political regimes, as was the case of Brazil, the state and personalized political authority were defined according to a set of values and concepts that were familial and emotional in nature: the state should care for workers as if they were all one family. The head of state was thus made to resemble a paternal figure who protects his children and guarantees them security and proper living conditions, while women were called upon to play a role in this political arrangement - and the familial state should be transformed by these so-called female qualities.
The partial research agenda on care and the organization of assistance in Brazil presented in this article may contribute to expanding not only social policy studies and studies on the specificities of the welfare state but also studies of the intricate networks linking private assistance institutes and the government, from a gender perspective. A political approach to care and assistance could certainly shed light on the complex ways in which gender takes form politically and how it is shaped within political orders and discourses.
NOTES
* A preliminary version of this article was presented at the International Seminar on Government, Philanthropy, and Assistance (Seminário Internacional Estado, Filantropia e Assistência), sponsored by the Casa de Oswaldo Cruz/Fiocruz and held in Rio de Janeiro in November of 2009. The reflections in this article are based on research conducted as part of my postdoctoral work at the Casa de Oswaldo Cruz, with funding provided by CNPq.
1 A systematic study of the LBA has yet to be undertaken but in her book, Simili (2008) offers a thought-provoking analysis of Darcy Vargas and the LBA.
2 Thomas Hobbes, Leviathan, London, Printed for Andrew Crooke, at the Green Dragon in St. Pauls Church-yard, 1651, p.251. Available at: &q&f=false; accessed on Nov. 4, 2011 (Translator's note).
3 Starting in the eighteenth century, the terms charity and philanthropy began to be used synonymously, although the former was associated more with religion and the latter was a formulation of moral philosophy that acquired a secular significance in the nineteenth century.
4 In this and other citations of texts from Portuguese, a free translation has been provided.
5 Examples of these physicians include Adolphe Pinard (France), Eliseo Cantón (Argentina), and Joaquim Martagão Gesteira and Clóvis Correia da Costa (Brazil).
6 LBA records constitute an unexplored trove for such a history. It would be valuable to know where these records are, as well as those produced by the different LBA chapters around Brazil.
REFERENCES
ARISTÓTELES. Política. São Paulo: Nova Cultural. 2000. [ Links ]
BELTRÃO, Pedro Calderan. Família e política social. Rio de Janeiro: Agir. 1962. [ Links ]
BOCK, Gisela. Pobreza feminina, maternidade e direitos das mães na ascensão dos Estados-providência, 1890-1950. In: Thébaud, Françoise (Org.). História das mulheres. Porto: Edições Afrontamento. v.5. 1995. [ Links ]
BOLETIM... Boletim da Legião Brasileira de Assistência, Rio de Janeiro, ano 2, n.20, p.1. 1946. [ Links ]
DAVIS, Natalie Zemon. Nas margens: três mulheres do século XVII. São Paulo: Companhia das Letras. 1997. [ Links ]
DAVIS, Natalie Zemon. Culturas do povo: sociedade e cultura no início da França Moderna. Rio de Janeiro: Paz e Terra. 1990. [ Links ]
DUBY, Georges. Idade Média, idade dos homens: do amor e outros ensaios. São Paulo: Companhia das Letras. 1989. [ Links ]
ELLIOTT, Dorice Williams. The angel out of the house: philanthropy and gender in nineteenth-century England. Charlottesville: University Press of Virginia. 2002. [ Links ]
GEREMEK, Bronislaw. A piedade e a forca: história da miséria e da caridade na Europa. Lisboa: Terramar. 1995. [ Links ]
GILLIGAN, Carol. Uma voz diferente: psicologia da diferença entre homens e mulheres da infância à idade adulta. Rio de Janeiro: Rosa dos Tempos. 1985. [ Links ]
GORDON, Linda. Pitied but not entitled: single mothers and the history of welfare, 1890-1935. New York: The Free Press. 1994. [ Links ]
GORDON, Linda. Social insurance and public assistance: the influence of gender in welfare thought in the United States. The American Historical Review, Bloomington, v.97, n.6. 1992. [ Links ]
GORDON, Linda. Black and white visions of welfare: women's welfares activism, 1890-1945. The Journal of American History, Bloomington, v.78, n.2, p.559-590. 1991. [ Links ]
HIMMELFARB, Gertrude. La idea de la pobreza: Inglaterra a principios de la era industrial. México: Fondo de Cultura Económica. 1988. [ Links ]
HOBBES, Thomas. Leviatã. São Paulo: Ícone. 2000. [ Links ]
KOLLONTAI, Alexandra. Society and motherhood. Disponível em:. Acesso em: 11 ago. 2004. 1916. [ Links ]
KOVEN, Seth; MICHEL, Sonya. Womanly duties: maternalist politics and the origins of welfares states in France, Germany, Great Britain and the United States, 1880-1920. The American Historical Review, Bloomington, v.95, n.4, p.1076-1108. 1990. [ Links ]
LEITE, Márcia Maria da Silva Barreiros. Educação, cultura e lazer das mulheres de elite em Salvador, 1890-1930. Dissertação (Mestrado) - Departamento de História, Universidade Federal da Bahia, Salvador. 1997. [ Links ]
MARTINS, Ana Paula Vosne. O Estado, as mães e os filhos: políticas de proteção à maternidade e à infância no Brasil da primeira metade do século XX. Humanitas, Belém, v.21, n.1, 2, p.7-31. 2005. [ Links ]
MOTT, Maria Lúcia. Maternalismo, políticas públicas e benemerência no Brasil (1930-1945). Cadernos Pagu, Campinas, v.16, p.199-234. 2001. [ Links ]
PERROT, Michelle. Les femmes ou les silences de l'histoire. Paris: Flammarion. 1998. [ Links ]
POOVEY, Mary. The proper lady and the woman writer: ideology as style in the works of Mary Wollstonecraft, Mary Shelley and Jane Austen. Chicago: University of Chicago Press. 1984. [ Links ]
PROCHASKA, Frank K. Women and philanthropy in nineteenth-century England. Oxford: Clarendon. (1980). [ Links ]
PROGRAMA SOCIAL... Programa social da LBA na paz. Boletim da Legião Brasileira de Assistência, Rio de Janeiro, ano 1, n.15, p.6. 1945. [ Links ]
RODRIGUES, Fabiana Mehl Sylvestre. Proteger as mães para salvar os infantes: o maternalismo e as práticas de benemerência em Curitiba entre as décadas de 1930 e 1960. Curitiba: Universidade Federal do Paraná. Relatório de pesquisa de iniciação científica. 2004. [ Links ]
SIMILI, Ivana. Mulher e política: a trajetória da primeira-dama Darcy Vargas (1930-1945) São Paulo: Editora da Unesp. 2008. [ Links ]
SMITH, Bonnie. Ladies of the leisure class: the bourgeoises of Northern France in the nineteenth century. Princeton: Princeton University Press. 1981. [ Links ]
THANE, Pat. Las ideas de género en la construcción del Estado de bienestar británico: el caso de las mujeres del Partido Laborista británico y la política social, 1906-1945. In: Bock, Gisela; Thane, Pat (Ed.). Maternidad e políticas de género: la mujer en los estados de bienestar europeos, 1880-1950. Valencia: Ediciones Cátedra. p.171-214. 1996. [ Links ]
THÉBAUD, Françoise. Quand nos grand-mères donnaient la vie: la maternité em France dans l'entre-deux-guerres. Lyon: Presses Universitaires de Lyon. 1986. [ Links ]
TRONTO, Joan C. Care as a political concept. In: Hirschmann, Nancy J.; Di Stefano, Christine (Org.). Revisioning the political: feminist reconstructions of traditional concepts in Western political theory. Boulder: Westview Press. p.139-156. 1996. [ Links ]
TRONTO, Joan C. Beyond gender difference to a theory of care. Signs, Chicago, v.12, n.4, p.644-663. 1987. [ Links ]
TURI, Otelo Renzo. D. Darci na grande obra de assistência social no Brasil. Boletim da Legião Brasileira de Assistência, Rio de Janeiro, ano 2, n.20, p.12. 1946. [ Links ]
VAN GESTEL, Constantine O.P. A Igreja e a questão social. Rio de Janeiro: Agir. 1956. [ Links ]
Received for publication
in May 2011.
Approved for publication in August 2011.
Received for publication
in May 2011. |
<<
Sarvan kumar
Thanks for Shaadi.com.Sheetal my life partner always 07 life.
Poonam Motwani
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Mahaboob Shariff
She took the first step in contacting me. We initially started with emails, then to facebook and then to instant messaging. I saw a friend in her, took the plunge and went to Sydney (for the 1st time alone) from Singapore to meet her and her family, without my family\'s knowledge. I fell for her there and then. And then we got our families to meet and the rest is history. Inshallah, we will have a memorable wedding and a wonderful marriage.
Mohitkumar saraogi
Our family liked each others profile and added them. Later we started chatting and sharing emails at a good frequency and could see a connection building up between us. The connection grew stronger and stronger with every passing day and before we could realize we started liking each other. The building of connection was important for both of us and we guess when the ONE is in front of us the connection builds quickly. We also believe that when the ONE comes we can see love through air and everywhere around us. It is also true that before we could realize, our so called arranged meeting had turned into a mere formality and we had realized that both of us are in love with other. Our marriage started as an arrange marriage however when we get married it will be not an arranged but a LOVE marriage.
Shabina Khan
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Bhavna Dabhi
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Manoj
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Manbir Kaur Sandhu
Well, first of all thanks to Shaddi.com who did a great help in finding the better half of my life.
When i made my profile here,while looking for the matches i send him request for accepting the interest as i liked his profile, then my interest got accepted. With the span of time we found each other compatible and finally we are together.
rishpal singh
Lots of thanks Shaadi.com.
Tanushree Vaidya
It started whn he 1st sent me an email thru Shaadi.com with his email and ph. no., we started exchanging emails...Although he was in Australia and myself in India, I was amazed by his traditional approach towards the marriage...We would video chat a lot before we got engaged in Sept\'10 when he 1st came to India for Ganesh festival ..My parents n I met his family beforehand just to get an idea how they were... A very decent and loving family, I cud not ask for more...And when he met me for the 1st time, I had nothing more to say but a YES...we got engaged within a week on 18th Sept as he was flying back soon....3 months later we got married and it was the best day.......Its been over a year now...we\'ve been thru many ups and downs and discovered each other and love each other immensely...He\'s an absolute brilliant person and I am very thankful to god and Shaadi.com for helping us get together bcos I dont know how else I wud hv met a person who was miles away in a different country...
Thanks guys!!
Good luck!
Tanu-Tejas
Suruchi Aggarwal
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Ishita
Thank you Shaadi.com.
anu neog
It was a random search..... i found his Profile....liked it and sent request to him.... he accepted the requested it n called me up.. n from that very single call we knew n sensed the sparkles of love.... now we r going to get married..... our engagement is due on 27th of Jan 2012....
My heartiest than x to the Shaadi.com team...
n cordially invites u on our wedding...
Tarandeep Sambi
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Tanya sahni
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Anil Kumar
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Mehul Chandaria
Hi Shaadi team,
Thanks for creating such a great website!
Mehul & Beena
Prabha Bhat N
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Noopur Shree
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Gurpal Singh
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Mansi
He sent me a request on Shaadi.com and we found his profile very genuine and appropriate.Our parents met and then,we met and the rest is history.Thank you Shaadi.com for helping me meet my soul mate.Wish you and your team all the very best!
OMAR GALSOOLKER
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Salma Begum
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Husain Amreliwala
This matrimonial site can be proved from our story.... we met through Shaadi.com and it seemed to be successful.. i Hussain had registered on 8th Dec 2011 and immediately after registration on 11th Dec 2011, i found my soul mate.... thanking u to help me to find my partner very soon....
Member
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Yasmin zamurca
I meet my Gurinder on Shaadi.com and i thank u to all team Shaadi.com for this as i wasnt payed member he contacted me first, it was love at first sight and we plan now to meet and then god help us to marry. Thank u Shaadi.com for ur services. I recommend to my friends as well this site. God bless u all.
Parul Neb
Our parents saw the snaps first and then we were brought into the picture. We exchanged some more photos on e-mail and then we spoke. And then things started picking up. His parents visited our house to meet us and then he came later to meet us and we got enagged. Thanks to Shaadi.com. You made it happen.
Sukhwinder Lidder
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Rahul c
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Bharti Biniyani
I check my Shaadi.com profile daily one day I found my husbands ID on Shaadi.com in which his mobile details are also given I took her number and SMS him. And after some time we start talking each other and we become good friends. After few days we both found each other and looking for mariage ahead and we tell our parents and they fix our engagement on 18 may 2011 and very next day our marriage date is fixed which was on 14 Nov 2011. Now we both are happy after finding each other as a life partner.
Thanks to Shaadi.Com
Bharti Naveen Vidhani
Abhinav Varshney
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Nahida
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Sonia Mishra
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Karan Goswami
We met each other Through Profile Match.
Kshitija
He expressed interest and we met n then on this date we got married by way of arya smaj at vashi.
Dilpreet Singh
Its very simple , firstly we go through eachother profile and realize that we are suitable for each other, and start interacting each other, after chat and talking 4-5 months we decided to get married and decided to get married on my partner birthday 13 nov.
PSM
Thank you Shaadi.com.
RB
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Kunal
Thank you Shaadi.com.
sheenu
It was my father who ist initate,then in subsequest conversation/meeting the things were materialised.
Evita Fernandes
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Catherine Blessy
Thank you Shaadi.com.
bhavesh patel
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Deepa Chordia
My fiance had paid membership on Shaadi.com. He expressed interest on my profile and the families met. We liked each other and decided to proceed.
Thanks to Shaadi.com for the facilities you provide. He is very satisfied with the services and I am happy to find him!! :-)
tina
I registered on the site at the begining of the year in 2011. My husband now had then, expressed interest in me in february of that year which i accepted after much thought. We then started talking over emails which quickly resulted in speaking over the phone where we completely fell for each other. The freindship had slowely changed into love and we both with the blessings of family decided to get engaged and married at the end of the year 2011.
I really did not have much hope when i intially registered with the site, but now thanks to the site i was able to find the partner that i had been looking for. My husband is my rock and we both love each other form the bottom of our hearts. Thanks Shaadi.com for making both our dreams into reality.
Shashank Bhatia
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Samir Majumdar
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Abhishek Jain
It all started with an interest obviously. Since both of us worked, it was hard to find time to meet but one day we just decided to do it and that was one of the best days of our life. We met on October 15, 2010 at Life Style and had sweet corn and then walked together to CCD outside Garuda Mall where we talked for almost 2 hrs (nope, we did not order coffee so it didn\'t happen over coffee :). She was fasting that day and I was so hungry as I had missed my lunch (which I do very often and it annoys her very much). So I was hogging and she was just watching me eat. Since then we cannot stop talking :-) To my pleasant surprise, it turned out that we had few (no, actually quite a few) common relatives. A visit by my parents to meet her and her family was followed by a ceremony called Roka. We enjoyed our courtship period of about 3.5 months and for both of us, it has been a treasure to cherish. And then, we became permanent roommates (as I call it jokingly at times) on Feb 19, 2011 with the blessings of our well-wishers bestowed upon us. It has been an amazing journey, a dream come true. Thanks, Shaadi.com.
PRATIMA GULDEOKAR
Thank you Shaadi.com.
ranjit
Since i was a paid member . i used to chat with members who were online, then i came across my wifes profile i found her a gud match 4 me ,v started with chat on Shaadi.com, then v switched to yahoo.com and then on phone, v started liking eachother, n then after a year finally v got married thnks 2 Shaadi.com.
Kaushal
We meet on Shaadi.com started chating soon talking on phone then our parent met... I went India things got settle n we happily got married. thaks to Shaadi.com and its team.....
Fauzia
We met through Shaadi.com on oct 2010 and got married in Apr 2011 in six month . Thanks to Shaadi.com
pomela gehani
It was a very lazy afternoon when i got a call from pankaj, (had sent an intrest a day before) he is from madagaskar and though initially things were proceeding very slow as it tuk tym to match the horoscopes and all but as he came to india in a couple of months we started chating first through Shaadi.com chat and later things proceeded. m reallllyyyy glad to find him as my partner as he has all those qualities that girls wish for... he has the correct proportion of spirituality , ambition, responsibility and love. i\'m tooo tooo tooo glad to find him. thanks to Shaadi.com
Singh Deepinder
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Abhishek singh
We started our chat and then were chatting every day and were trying to know about each other.Then we thought we are the perfect match for each other and i came down to India from states to meet her and her family and then discussed about our marriage and i came to know that it cant be said as arrange marriage bcOz we have feelings for each other so it will be perfect to call it love marriage.
Madhu Rai
I recieved a mail from partner who was interested in my profiled and would like us to proceed forward thru phone no. We called up and had talked with partner\'s sister and then met the boy and liked him and their family. They came to see my sister-in-law and liked her and our family and hence marriage came true :)
Mahima Mehta
He expressed interest in my profile. I accepted. We had a chat, then we planned to meet & here we are now, Many thanks to Shaadi.com for making me meet my soulmate through this medium.
Aman
Well i login my profile after 12 days and i got request from her id with msg then we start chat meet at same day after 16 days we both agree for marriage i love her she amazing person i ever met thanks to Shaadi.com team.
Aditi Dey
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Neelam sharma
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Kajal Deka
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Deepjyoti Sawant
I found him thro specific search option\'s thank you Shaadi .com.
Nayalii Nayar
Satish called me up in December, just a few days before new years. I told him I wasn\'t interested in the match and we were just going to part ways when he queried about my name and what it meant, we somehow spoken for about 2 hours at a stretch that day, added each other on external messaging systems and carried on from there. He has since met my parents and we are very much an item :) Thank You Shaadi.com.
Pancham
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Sukhi
Thank you for helping us find each other! :)
suma
Dilip shown interest in my profile, even i accepted his interest he called me we met each other
We spoken about our families, then we informed to our parents also, even they agreed.
Date not yet fixed for marriage i will inform you soon.
thanks a lot for Shaadi.com, its really appreciably.
We both of us very thankful to Shaadi.com.
Sashmita mallik
It was a dream come true when we found each other. Thanks to Shaadi.com for making these happen.
Mamta Dhanmeher
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Jaswant
The initial contact was made by Surjit to Jaswant and from there the daily chatting began online. Then came the long phone calls and finally meeting, soon as we met we both clicked and found each others company great. 7 months later we got engaged and are now looking at planning our wedding.
pankaj mishra
I have taken package of Shaadi.com in which i got to see the contact details of some 30 female members.But the good thing was i got my match on the first click.Package of Shaadi.com really works.Best of luck to all other singles.Thanks Shaadi.com.
pankaj and shruti
KS GEETHALAKSHMI
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Cellina Constantine
I, Cellina Constantine, am a Sri Lankan Tamil living in Norway. My good friend Samreen Javed who also lives in Norway, created a profile for me on Shaadi.com, early in year 2011. In June 2011, Samreen introduced me to Robin Joseph, who is also a Sri Lankan Tamil living in Sri lanka, and a member of Shaadi.com. It did not take long time for both Robin and I to realise that we are made for each other. Therefore, with our families blessings, we got engaged in Sri Lanka on the 12th of December 2011. Our Catholic church wedding will take place in Sri Lanka on the 30th of June 2012. We wish to thank Shaadi.com and our friend Samreen Javed for making our dream come true. We believe that without your help, we would not have found each other so far across the oceans. THANK YOU.
Prashant Agarwal
Sometimes .. life happens to you through platforms like Shaadi.com :)
Its things like these which makes you believe more in destiny.
Rajesh Sadanandan
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Linh Phan
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Nitika Sharma
We met thru shaadi.com and after meeting each other we realized that yes this is the one whom I am waiting for so long....
Shanu
Amit sent a text after seeing my profile. We met. our parents met and ....
Chandni
He expressed interest in me, fortunately i have accepted the same on the same day, we chatted for a while then one thing let to other ...and now by the grace of the god we are tying our knots with each other for life time.On 25th April 2012.
I would like to Thank Shaadi.com
Regards
Chandni SIngh Solanki
Sarvpreet singh
I received interest from her but accepted after a month n after that our mother\'s spoke to each other and then we met in Ranchi on 23rd October,2011.After that everything went very smoothly n we got engaged on 6th Nov,2011 and finally got married on 25th Dec,2011.My heartiest thnx to Shaadi.Com who helped me finding love of my life.Thnx will be a very short word for the happiness i got in my life through this site.
Thnx again !!!
Sarvpreet
Pooja
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Renee Philip
I created my profile and paid for a membership on Shaadi.com, with the encouragement of friends, at the very end of the year of 2010. After a few months of finding nothing, and feeling that my membership cost was paid fruitlessly, my good friend asked me for my profile login information. She proceeded to message over 12 gentlemen with characteristics she thought would suit me. To my surprise, all of them messaged me back. Overwhelmed with the number of responses, I chose two to respond back to. From these two suitors, it was clearly evident after the second exchange of emails, that Sanoj and I were really well suited. We continued a long-distance relationship for about two years, before we decided to get married.
As a comical focale point of our wedding, we used the story of how we met to be our cake topper. We had an online vendor to create exact figuerines of the two of us in our wedding attire, sitting at a desk with laptops, and Shaadi.com written on the computer. We thought it would be great advertisement material for your company. We hope you can use the story and wedding pictures!
krupesh shah
Thank you so much Shaadi.com from our heart.
Thanks
Krupesh & Purvi
Mayank Kumar
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Jasmeet Singh
It was Shaadi.com who displayed my details in such a manner that it reached the right girl. It has so many features that u dont have to go to any other site.
It has a wonderful support system that guides you and helps to search for a right girl/boy in a very simplified way. I thank U Shaadi.com through which my particulars were read by the right girl who contacted me finally we got married.
RAJPUT MALEWALIA
We meet on Shaadi com.We going to marry next year. We never think about we will meet on Shaadi.com.
thank you Shaadi.com.
Jasmine Haque
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Mitali Gor
My parents expressed interest in him..he replied..we had communication with each other..we found suitable match for each other and finally our parents decided to make we both as one...We got married on 29th of nov\'11,and yet present i am living in USA with my husband and i am really very happy,the information provided by Shaadi.com was really great and true..Thanks to Shaadi.com..As because of it we met each other.
Yesha Shah
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Shilpa Choudhary
Thank you. Shaadi.com.
Maha Janjua
Thank you Shaadi.com.
Jaymini
Thank you shaadi.com.
Priya Dsouza
Priya and Ziren
Prior to Shaadi.com I was living the American dream but there was something missing. After some deep sole searching I decided to register on Shaadi.com. I registered on Shaadi.com in 2009 I actively started searching for a life partner. I accepted a few girls and started communicating with them. One of the girls that I had accepted was Priya. Initially we just kept in touch with just a casual hi, how are things . The time difference between Priya and me was a hurdle we had to overcome it was like a huge pill for me to swallow as I had to move out of my comfort zone. We initially kept in touch and stayed in touch as friends.
With the fear of rejection I never asked Priya for a number to communicate with her over the phone. In the summer of 2011 Priya took a bold step and asked me for my number. This kicked our summer romance in overdrive. As we started communicating on a regular basis our love blossomed like a flower in spring and our puppy love had taken off like white turtle doves. As we communicated Priya and her family on a regular basis asked me when I would come down to see her and take the entire relationship to the next level. I finally came down in December and saw Priya in person for the first time on the 8th of December. That very evening after we met I went and asked her mother for her hand in marriage and the rest is history We got married on the 29th of December in Mumbai.
From the first time our eyes met
to the very last kiss of last night
I knew we were meant to be
From now to eternity
And for all of destiny to see
Thanks to Shaadi.com
We found our destiny
Vikram Subramanian
We first met on Shaadi.com, I found that Komal lived in the Bay Area, California. I was living in Los Angeles, but I grew up in the Bay Area myself. We chatted on the phone and emailed each other for several months. We eventually met in person, and slowly fell in love. I eventually got a job in the Bay Area, and moved there. Komal and I grew closer because we lived close together, and we eventually decided to get engaged! We got engaged on December 25, 2011.
Shailendra Singh
Showed interest on the profile. Thank you Shaadi.com. |
- Navigation
- Forum
Topics
Profile
3
|
12
|
24
Hours
Search
Tree View
SingaporeMotherhood.com
Matters Of The Heart
Toddlers who fall sick often
<
>
Author
cindy (ciheal)
Junior Member
Username: ciheal
Post Number: 155
Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Thursday, January 10, 2008 - 2:57 pm:
Any mummies with toddlers who falls sick every month? My gal who is 2 and a half falls sick every month since she was 3 months old!
How to prevent them from falling sick like flu, fever, diarrhoea, endless list! Its always one after another! Should I be very worried and seek expertise help? The PD says its common. Any advice? Thanks!
mngo (mngo)
Intermediate Member
Username: mngo
Post Number: 3281
Registered: 8-2003
Posted on Friday, January 11, 2008 - 9:27 am:
my boy only started falling sick every month after he started childcare at 2.5 yrs old.
cindy (ciheal)
Junior Member
Username: ciheal
Post Number: 158
Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Friday, January 11, 2008 - 11:31 pm:
hi, i heard lots of kids getting sick after starting childcare but i just dun understand why my gal never go childcare also every month sick! hiaks!
cher (cher)
Junior Member
Username: cher
Post Number: 203
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Saturday, January 12, 2008 - 12:37 am:
It's quite common, kids not only fall sick when they attend childcare. Sometimes, they get virus from shopping malls and other environment. Basically, their immune system is not fully developed yet.
My mom put some cordyceps into DD's porridge ocassionally - to boost her lungs. I serve DD Sambucol 2-3 times a week to boost up her immune system. When see that she's coming down with flu, then gave her stronger dosage. It's actually stop the cold/flu in developing further.
cindy (ciheal)
Junior Member
Username: ciheal
Post Number: 161
Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Saturday, January 12, 2008 - 3:23 pm:
hi cher, whats sambucol? thanks!
cher (cher)
Junior Member
Username: cher
Post Number: 206
Registered: 6-2002
Posted on Sunday, January 13, 2008 - 9:03 am:
Here are some webbies that you can read up abt Sambucol:
You can get Sambucol from
cindy (ciheal)
Junior Member
Username: ciheal
Post Number: 164
Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Monday, January 14, 2008 - 11:02 pm:
thank you for your info!
Angela Tan (angela76)
New member
Username: angela76
Post Number: 29
Registered: 11-2007
Posted on Thursday, January 31, 2008 - 3:41 pm:
Yes, I agreed with Cher. My both son have attend to childcare. They also fall sick every month. Now I give them sambucol every morning. I realise they more better now, not so easy fall sick
If sick they also very fast get well
bbpete (bbpete)
Junior Member
Username: bbpete
Post Number: 217
Registered: 3-2007
Posted on Saturday, March 29, 2008 - 10:14 pm:
is sambucol suitable for babies as well? baby has been sick on and off eversince chinese new year. wondering if this will help strengthen his immune system. can this be taken when the child is sick?
poon kitty (poon_kitty)
New member
Username: poon_kitty
Post Number: 10
Registered: 5-2008
Posted on Saturday, June 14, 2008 - 11:57 am:
my boy started falling sick when attend childcare at 18mth, until recently withdraw him out wen he's 2 yrs old. Sian...
zenn (zenn)
Advanced Member
Username: zenn
Post Number: 6746
Registered: 9-2003
Posted on Saturday, June 28, 2008 - 11:01 pm:
is Sambucol available in spore?
cocoon (cocoon)
New member
Username: cocoon
Post Number: 98
Registered: 10-2007
Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2008 - 1:49 am:
Sambucol is available at Vitakids. I find that giving my daughter Childlife Colustrum (with Probiotics), Childlife Multivitamins and Nordic Naturals DHA since she's a bb is helpful. So far, only sick 2 times, now 18 mths.
lim zhe (limzhe)
New member
Username: limzhe
Post Number: 5
Registered: 6-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 3:39 pm:
i also given my gal colustrum & Nordic Naturals DHA cod liver oil is help to improve her immu system. u can try.
melsmw (melsmw)
New member
Username: melsmw
Post Number: 5
Registered: 12-2006
Posted on Sunday, November 09, 2008 - 11:10 am:
i give my girls monavie, it supposedly provides antioxidants and phytonutrients to build up your immune system and maintain good health
Sunshinekid (sunshinekid)
Intermediate Member
Username: sunshinekid
Post Number: 2128
Registered: 9-2005
Posted on Sunday, November 09, 2008 - 12:29 pm:
Hi,
My gal who is coming to 3YO next Feb also keeps falling sick! Aiyo, she can cough for 1 week, okay for 2 weeks, and start coughing again out of the blue.
I get so tired and sick as well, really pity her. We have a nebuliser at home whc she uses when she starts to wheeze.. and she hasnt started Childcare. I cant imagine her health when she really starts CC, whc shld be either next mth or come January.
Heard abt Sambucol for the longest time. Does it really help?
Pls advise. thanks.
tabbykat (tabbykat)
New member
Username: tabbykat
Post Number: 15
Registered: 11-2009
Posted on Thursday, November 19, 2009 - 12:44 pm:
i tink u also need to give more Vit C to ward off cold bugs lah - but Sambucol is not bad
Kwok Mama (kwok_mama)
New member
Username: kwok_mama
Post Number: 5
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Friday, August 13, 2010 - 9:54 am:
my kids used to fall sick very often too! my advice ... bring them for TCM massage.
son used to be skinny since young, and got very sensitive nose, fall sick every month and immune system poor. started him with TCM massage since he was 2 yrs plus. condition improves, starting to put on weight about 1.5 yrs after i started him with the TCM massage. now he is in P1, eating well, growing well and fall sick less often. even if sick also recovers fast.
now my little 2 yrs plus, also bring her for the TCM massage.
believe me ... the TCM massage thing works miracle. i also see malays, indians and even angmohs bringing their kids for this TCM massage.
mommies out there, dnt hestitate anymore, if ur kids fall sick very often, bring them for TCM massage.
KC (kckc)
Member
Username: kckc
Post Number: 763
Registered: 6-2004
Posted on Friday, August 13, 2010 - 11:34 am:
Hi kowk mama,
Where did you bring yr kids to TCM massage?
Thanks,
KC
Kwok Mama (kwok_mama)
New member
Username: kwok_mama
Post Number: 7
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Monday, August 16, 2010 - 10:13 am:
Hi KC,
I have been bringing my kids to the 'Yu Guo Chinese Physician Acupunture and Phyiotherapy', in Chinese 育国中医诊疗所. Address at 8-B Jalan Masjid #01-04 Kingston Terrace (near Kembangan MRT). Tel: 6447-4761.
They treat both adults and children. There are 3 physician (all Lady Physicians) treating kids, my kids have been seeing this 许珍育医师.
We all want our kids to grow well and healthy. :-)
KC (kckc)
Member
Username: kckc
Post Number: 764
Registered: 6-2004
Posted on Monday, August 16, 2010 - 11:38 am:
Hi kwok mama,
O, yes...Yu Guo.. I heard of it and went there went my kids cough is persistent.
But it is very far away from my house lor. THus cant go on regularly.
Thanks
Kwok Mama (kwok_mama)
New member
Username: kwok_mama
Post Number: 9
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Monday, August 16, 2010 - 12:29 pm:
Hi KC,
If you can afford, I think it's good to go on a regularly basis to at least build up your kid's immune system. I think it's worthwhile lor.
I know it's far, I myself is staying in Woodlands and travel there once a week for my little girls massage session. :-)
yawn (bboy)
Member
Username: bboy
Post Number: 992
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Tuesday, September 14, 2010 - 2:47 pm:
anyone know if sambucol suitable for what age of toddler?
爱爱LOVELOVE (heeheesan)
Member
Username: heeheesan
Post Number: 920
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Monday, September 05, 2011 - 4:56 pm:
My boy also fall sick almost every month ever since he started his nursery. I thought this is common to have cough and running nose.
I had tried to feed him fish oil but don't seems to work.
Do let me know if you have any recommendation to boost up his immune system and health.
Thanks
Ai Sakura (ai_sakura)
Junior Member
Username: ai_sakura
Post Number: 181
Registered: 8-2011
Posted on Tuesday, April 24, 2012 - 11:37 am:
That's true.. I find my girl falling sick more often ever since she started preschool. I guess it is common since so many kids are around? Hoping to build up her immunity with more vitamins and healthier diet.
Ai @
jan jan (jan4january)
Member
Username: jan4january
Post Number: 938
Registered: 8-2007
Posted on Friday, May 04, 2012 - 3:10 pm:
let the kid drink scotts also helps. n more fruits and greens!
babakba (babak)
New member
Username: babak
Post Number: 79
Registered: 11-2011
Posted on Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 11:28 am:
Do u give your child double dose of sambucol with flu medicine on days down with cough flu phlegm?
mumofamelia (mumofamelia)
Member
Username: mumofamelia
Post Number: 614
Registered: 11-2009
Posted on Sunday, May 20, 2012 - 1:56 pm:
Hi,
My younger gal who has in childcare since last year dec till now, but she seldom falls sick. Not like her sister who almost every week sick. I let her take Mannabear from Mannatech brand. Both my gals take it for 1 month & their appetite improves & get healthy.
My younger gal is allergy to dairy products since born & she has been on isomil milk. Whenever she eats cream cake, pizza etc, she will have diarrhao & stomach upset.
But after she takes mannabear for 1 month, during her birthday celebration, we let her eat cake & pizza, she does not encounter any diarrhao & stomach upset. Now, we are very happy as when we want to eat pizza, she also can eat unlike last time we have to consider her problem.
If anyone interested to know more of this product, can pm me or email me @
[email protected]
for more information.
Rainecath (rainecath)
New member
Username: rainecath
Post Number: 40
Registered: 7-2011
Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2012 - 3:11 pm:
I bought "bao ying dan" for my 2 yr old gal..
Rainecath (rainecath)
New member
Username: rainecath
Post Number: 41
Registered: 7-2011
Posted on Tuesday, May 29, 2012 - 3:11 pm:
is a kind of health supplement
Mummy_Mummy (davian)
New member
Username: davian
Post Number: 84
Registered: 1-2011
Posted on Tuesday, June 05, 2012 - 2:52 pm:
Like to know more on Mannabear from Mannatech brand can mumofamelia share abt it??
mumofamelia (mumofamelia)
Member
Username: mumofamelia
Post Number: 624
Registered: 11-2009
Posted on Tuesday, June 05, 2012 - 10:17 pm:
Hi Davian,
Had pm you.
2ww (verluv)
Junior Member
Username: verluv
Post Number: 414
Registered: 9-2010
Posted on Friday, June 08, 2012 - 12:21 pm:
My bb gal also keep falling sick since she is about 9months old. we went to this doc who prescribe a syrup for her that contains vit c and zinc. its suppose to booast her immune system. She dun catch flu bug that easily after taking the first bottle. I am feeding her the second bottle now.
I rather buy from a clinic than to go to GNC or watson to buy vitamin for kids.
i dun have the name of the vitamin now but maybe i will check and post it here.
babakba (babak)
New member
Username: babak
Post Number: 87
Registered: 11-2011
Posted on Saturday, June 09, 2012 - 12:09 am:
Hi verluv,pls post the name of that vit c n zinc thst pd gives. i'd like to ask if my gp can sell to my child too. thanks
Sophia Tan (trulylove)
Junior Member
Username: trulylove
Post Number: 374
Registered: 1-2006
Posted on Sunday, June 24, 2012 - 10:26 pm:
When a child grow older 6yrs & above, they will have better immune & not easily fall sick.
However, the most important thing is how fast can they recover. If they hv stronger body, they recover faster e.g a flu & cough can last from 1weeks or 1mth.
Therefore, it is good to consistently give multi Vit to bulit strong foundation till they old.
Peggy Lim (peggy19)
New member
Username: peggy19
Post Number: 30
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Thursday, June 28, 2012 - 1:30 am:
My 2 kids keep falling sick. They do not go cc but will hv flu n bad cough that lasts for almost 10 days, recover for less than 2 wks, catch virus n fall sick again. This vicious cycle keeps repeating since April.
Can any mummy advise what I shld do. Thk u!
babakba (babak)
New member
Username: babak
Post Number: 95
Registered: 11-2011
Posted on Friday, June 29, 2012 - 11:03 am:
How old is your 2kids? my child has similar prob since 2yr old till now. i did a reflect and think it could be that i seldom feed my child with vege and fruits unlike her first year. so, now i feed her dhatifen fm doc,redoxon vit c n zinc for kids,quail egg, double boil soup and reintroduce vege n fruits. i stop all vitagen. i earnestly hope my child can build back her health.
Peggy Lim (peggy19)
New member
Username: peggy19
Post Number: 32
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2012 - 12:37 am:
My elder one is 2yo n younger one is 1yo. My 2 started to fall sick quite frequently since they were few mths old. But it worsens these 2 mths. It's like every other wk.
Normally I'll add carrots n broccoli into their porridge. But I stop giving them fruits ever since they start to cough badly last mth.
babakba (babak)
New member
Username: babak
Post Number: 96
Registered: 11-2011
Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2012 - 12:42 pm:
Hi Peggy,
not to worry yet if it starts worsen only recently to every other week. you start to give warm water,warm soup and even double boil apple soup with meat bones or fish bones,meat. still can remedy fast.
Mine has been sick every two weeks for the past two years tgat i only recently start to realise multivit,warm drink,double soup,etc will help.
Peggy Lim (peggy19)
New member
Username: peggy19
Post Number: 33
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Sunday, July 01, 2012 - 10:07 pm:
Hi babakba
Thks for sharing. Will start to boil soup for them.
Wish our kids will b strong n healthy soon.
BENRI HOUSE (benrihouse)
Intermediate Member
Username: benrihouse
Post Number: 2430
Registered: 12-2009
Posted on Monday, July 02, 2012 - 10:03 am:
Hi mummies,
Giving ur child soup is a very good choice.
Yes, its true they need water, but not too much a day too as its causes more air in their stomach. When they are having dinner, either rice or porrige, give them a bowl of soup instead of water, u actually find that they eat more.
This is taught by my baby doc, I did that for both my child since 6-mths when they start having solid. I gave them abt 30ml-60ml of water abt 30-mins later after meal.
During meal, I only gave them a bowl of soup instead.
Advoid too much yakult/vitagen/ribena as they causes alot of phelgm. U can give them just once a week will do.
Very simple soup is already very nutritious for them, boil them with pork bones, chicken neck, fish bones.
Pear tea with honey is good for cough.
Just boil water with some pear(SHUI LI) and add small pcs honey rock sugar for 30-mins, cool to warm n let them drink.
Only child after 1-yrs old can add honey, if bb is below 1-yrs old, just boil the pear for them to drink as fluid. 1-2 times a week is perfect.
Hopes these helps!!
2ww (verluv)
Junior Member
Username: verluv
Post Number: 463
Registered: 9-2010
Posted on Tuesday, July 03, 2012 - 10:54 am:
I also heard that giving soup is good. HOwevr my gal is being taken care by my MIL. how do i ask my MIL to cook soup for my bb?
clxuan (xuan11)
Junior Member
Username: xuan11
Post Number: 316
Registered: 5-2011
Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2012 - 3:21 pm:
I give my children nutrition powder together with their milk to boost their immuse system. They will still fall sick sometimes but recover fast.
Peggy Lim (peggy19)
New member
Username: peggy19
Post Number: 34
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2012 - 5:02 pm:
Hi clxuan
Can share what kind of nutrition powder u give your children?
clxuan (xuan11)
Junior Member
Username: xuan11
Post Number: 317
Registered: 5-2011
Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2012 - 6:12 pm:
hi.it is soy n mix fruits powder beverage, a MLM product.
organic n taste good, they all like it.
Peggy Lim (peggy19)
New member
Username: peggy19
Post Number: 35
Registered: 10-2010
Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2012 - 11:07 pm:
Hi clxuan
Thks for sharing.
Diana (september)
Intermediate Member
Username: september
Post Number: 2719
Registered: 3-2005
Posted on Thursday, July 05, 2012 - 2:03 am:
I give G3 juice to boast my kids immunity.
elmobn (elmobn)
Member
Username: elmobn
Post Number: 528
Registered: 8-2010
Posted on Tuesday, July 17, 2012 - 4:45 pm:
I used to feed all kinds of supplement, tong cong cao to my kids, coz they were quite weak then got lots of allergy problems
but after i fed them these products, each with individual substance of High purity Oligopeptides & Oligosaccharides, their Eczema cleared off, immunity also improved. can say i cannot remember when they last fell sick.
Elaine (welovecoolnails)
Junior Member
Username: welovecoolnails
Post Number: 390
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 11:26 am:
My gal used to fall sick very often (flu and cough), I start giving her manuka honey UMF 5+ daily after she is 12 mths old(tiny spoon mixed with water) and a tiny spoonful of Virgin Coconut Oil in her porridge, it really boosts her immune system and seldom fall sick even others in the family falls sick. She is 17 months old.
Elaine (welovecoolnails)
Junior Member
Username: welovecoolnails
Post Number: 391
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Thursday, August 02, 2012 - 12:34 pm:
For manuka honey, you need to check if it is registered under UMF Honey Association in NZ so that you can be sure that the UMF is as it claims.
RKmum (rainecath)
Junior Member
Username: rainecath
Post Number: 149
Registered: 7-2011
Posted on Sunday, August 12, 2012 - 1:42 pm:
how about eating yoghurt and yakult..may help kid immune system stronger..
Elaine (welovecoolnails)
Junior Member
Username: welovecoolnails
Post Number: 409
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Sunday, August 12, 2012 - 2:21 pm:
I think yakult and yoghurt has a lot of sugar in it, those found in the supermarket also contains preservatives which may not be very good for kids who are too young.
starry (starrycarin)
Junior Member
Username: starrycarin
Post Number: 118
Registered: 12-2010
Posted on Monday, August 13, 2012 - 12:10 pm:
Children nowadays are more prone to flu/viral infections for various reasons, including a lack of nutritional diet. How many children actually take fruits and vegetables on a daily basis? Thats why is a must for my children to be on dietary supplements, good and safe from Pharmanex, This is what i give them daily, jungamal, marine omega,probio and G3. When they fall sick, I will quickly add colostrum.
Grace Ho (tempo4me)
Intermediate Member
Username: tempo4me
Post Number: 2582
Registered: 1-2010
Posted on Tuesday, August 14, 2012 - 2:39 pm:
My little girl actually falls sick every month since small as she is attending the infant care. Ask doctor but was told "Your little girl will stop falling sick if you reduce family size (I live in a 4 generations family house), stop work and take care of girl myself".
Why your gal still falls sick when she is not in CC, I don't really know. Can be due to your lifestyle. Even though your girl is not going CC, she is going out often? Your family size is as big as mine? Diet not good enough since she may be picky eater?
I let (and sometime forces) my little girl to eat vegetables every meal for every single day. PDs don't advise supplements "tablets" if possible.
Another thing I also find that may also have helped with my girl's immune system is this supplement that we had started in the family.
Google "4Life" and read about their supplements. I can said that it works really well for the whole family. It is some sort of colostrum as well.
However, you can also run the risk of your immune system being so super that it will reject other people's blood in blood transfusion. Thus my husband has stopped my little girl from eating it after 3 bottles lasting 1 year. |
January 31, 2006
In June 1940 Britain expected enemy invasion. The government decided it was necessary to evacuate children and others living in the direct bombing approach to London. Many children were sent to Wales, Scotland, Ireland and the open countryside of England but others were destined to go farther afield to Canada, America, Australia, New Zealand, and South Africa. Many children were sent to relatives in these countries but most were taken in by foster families.
The Children's Overseas Reception Board was established in June 1940 and organized the evacuation of hundreds of children to foreign countries during the war. 1,530 children were sent to Canada. The first group of CORB children, 39 boys and 43 girls, sailed for Canada on July 20, 1940 on the SS ANSELM. There is no complete list of ships and CORB batches in the CORB files but we do know that the SS NERISSA sailed for Canada on September 7, 1940 with 16 boys and 18 girls bound for Halifax, N.S. All of these children were transported across Canada to British Columbia. The next ship sailing for Canada on September 13, 1940 was the SS CITY OF BENARES. On September 17 she was torpedoed mid-Atlantic with the loss of 255 passengers, including 84 CORB children. The great exodus ceased but those already in safety had to spend several years far away from everyone and everything they knew.
A few years ago, through Pier 21, I made contact with Bernard Atkins, a former CORB child on the SS NERISSA. Bernard and his two brothers, Maurice and Michael, lived in Beckenham, Kent. In July, 1940 their parents decided to send them to relatives in Canada. Fate played a part in their lives as they were originally scheduled to sail on the SS CITY OF BENARES. Bernard has been a great help with the Nerissa website and become a valued friend. He kindly gave us permission to use a chapter from his personal family memories, "Back Then". The chapter not only tells the story of their voyage to Canada on the SS NERISSA but also gives us a detailed description of the ship. Our sincere thanks to Bernard.
» Please visit the Notice for Bernard Atkins
Although kept highly confidential, as it indicated imminent ship sailings, Father through his special press security privileges knew our point of embarkation to Canada. No sooner were we whisked away at Victoria station than both he and Ma were on the express to Liverpool. I remember catching a quick glimpse of Dad and telling my brothers of having seen him, before we were again hustled off out of sight and away.
Sometimes too much knowledge may not prove to be an advantage. As it turned out, what transpired was to torment them for weeks to come. There were some one hundred plus British evacuee children who, under cover of darkness, were to board the SS 'City of Benares' to slip away from the harbour, join convoy OB213, and sail for Canada; that date was Friday, the thirteenth of September. It seems that last minute one of our small group heading for western Canada was suspected of having chicken pox causing us to be detained and another group boarded in our stead. So we were held back 24 hours and put aboard the SS 'Nerissa'. There were twenty-eight of us children in all, a matron to tend our nursing, a curate to stand in for divine guidance, or in our case, as previously mentioned, Mums 'Me Devil'. There were five assigned to each cabin with the oldest of our group being in charge. At twelve I was the youngest of the oldies so, with sex separation, I ended up with three, all boys.
A Scot made up in orneriness for what my group lacked in numbers. To make sure he wasn't mistaken for one of the 'Sassenachs', unlike the rest of us, mostly in short trousers, he, poor wretch, was decked out in full Scottish regalia. Not only that, he spoke in monosyllables and sounded 'funny'! Traveling alone at that age, even at my tender years, I felt for him despite the desire to pop him on the nose.
In his cabin, Maurice had Michael, at six years old, the youngest in our party. As soon as allowed we set off to investigate our ship. The 'Nerissa' was built in Glasgow in 1926 to serve as a freight and passenger liner between the St. Laurence, New York, Halifax and St. Johns. She had an especially designed bow and hull to handle the arduous winter conditions of the ice floes she would encounter. We were soon to learn that this gave her a bucking motion to go with the roll of the open seas.
Her pre-War passenger capacity was 163 1st class and 66 2nd class passengers. She weighed over 5500 tons, which although told to us, meant little. The speed of 15.5 knots we could compare to the 'Queen Mary', the 'Hood', 'Bismark', P.T. Boats and others that, despite our youth, we would read of daily as we approached and entered the Way years. In the search of our ship, compared to the 'Old Man' taking us for an un-coordinated row in the amusement park or trip on the Thames, this was indeed a floating palace. It had wide curved staircases, grand pianos, marble columns, lush red carpets, a barbers shop that sold 'Andrews Liver Salts', that lovely fizzy drink powder, for only three-pence a tin and, a sweetie shop. We were amazed all this could stay afloat. Next morning with drumming of the gong we raced down for breakfast to the dining room which was obviously less luxurious than pre-War days with long tables replacing the ones shown on descriptive posters in the upper lounge.
Having surreptitiously been used as an American troop transport carrying back aircraft pilots and others following delivery of warplanes to Britain and like missions, most of the lushness was stripped away from the 'Nerissa'. The menu was much to our like, offering Sugared Rice Crispies, eggs, bacon, fried tomatoes, pancakes, kippers and oily bloaters with their heads still on. The latter two I ordered daily for breakfast even in the worst of storms and a request that I understand even gave the cook a turn. There was few of our group there for breakfast that first day, while not of concern it was hard to fathom. A later visit to the deck above gave reason for their absence. Our fellow passengers were all along the outer deck rail peering downwards, not so much enjoying the great height as being seasick on the dock below. Many parents in all their wisdom had assured them they would be ill. Despite the fact we were still tight to the wharf, they were meeting the family wishes. I decided then I would die before joining them at the rail any time on the voyage. I don't recall how many days we were at sea, possibly ten or more. Those of us who hadn't taken to our bunks were busy showing what good sailors we were, hands in pockets, rolling down the corridors bouncing off the walls. Being an icebreaker we got a forward rising and lunging along with the fore and aft rolling with the sea, which made it not only a challenge for our fun but later was also to prove a protective cloak. On the second or third day as the last sight of land slipped away we suddenly found ourselves surrounded by other ships with destroyers buzzing around us like mother hens. We had joined the convoy that would help see us safely the first three hundred miles on our way. The speed of a convoy as it zigzagged its way across the Atlantic was restricted to that of the slowest ship. In this case, convoy 23424 slugged its way at 5-6 knots, the speed of the 'Benares'.
With Mum's 'Me Devil' riding our shoulders we had little need and saw less of our Curate. No doubt he was there to act should calamity befall us and bring comfort to the needy, whomever they may be at the time. Different, was the need for the Matron. With God's little children throwing up their half digested sandwiches into the sea from the time of boarding. However, Michael in the care of pseudo mother Maurice was low on her list of priorities. She had to be Mum to a ship full of 'sickies'. Meantime, Michael was building up to be the icing on the chocolate cake. Weighing in at no more than 42 lbs., he was looked on as suffering everything from rickets to ringworm. Once out to sea, the rolling of the ship had him join the list of the seasick. This almost confined brother Maurice to the cabin caring for the one entrusted to him. With Mike's retching to contend with, Maurice himself succumbed to seasickness, leaving little I could do but offer sympathy, escape the stench and tend my own cabin. The worst was yet to come. How a body could be seasick and constipated for ten days at the same time was beyond all reason but Matron was not to have her charge reach land in such a condition. Mike was finally back eating, but what, we don't know other than he would take Matron's 'chocolate'. The day came when he finally exploded. A mother at the best of times does not relish such an occasion, but when it is the child of another there is no bond to compel them. I remember Maurice with his ward standing on a cabin bedside table, left to clean up Mike and the cabin, the matron doing little but supervise, and leaving the mess to a fourteen-year-old boy. Maurice never in any way held his brother to account for this. In fact, if anything, it endeared a bond but he never was to forget or forgive the Matron who walked away when he really needed help and understanding. Over the years, when reminiscing, it took little to bring that day back into his life.
It was four days after leaving Liverpool on Friday 13th September, 600 miles out at sea, wallowing in a storm like a sitting duck, the SS 'City of Benares' was torpedoed and quickly went to the bottom. Only a handful of the children survived. The Americans, yet to enter the War, released the grizzly story throughout the world within a matter of hours. The repercussions were enormous. The Germans were accused of doing it knowingly to help break the moral of the British people, while the British Government, under a hail of criticism, cancelled all overseas evacuation of children. Meanwhile we kids on the 'Nerissa' were bobbing, like a cork on our way towards Newfoundland, oblivious of what was going on. Meanwhile, at home, the 'Folks' received a terse telegram, "Your children are safe". Whereas in their position there was little the Government could say, it did nothing to dispel the fear that was to haunt the recipients of the message over the days to come.
One day, (I wish I had the date), the ships alarm sirens screamed out the alert, which was to send us all scurrying, lifebelts entangling our heads, to lifeboat stations. How we made it to deck let alone a specific station I'll never know. There, sitting off to starboard was the ominous dark outline of a submarine. Suddenly, after what seemed ages, we got the order for all the children to move to the rail and wave. "It's one of ours!" Our arms aching we suddenly saw the black shadow slip below the surface.
The German U Boats, unless threatened by warships, launched their torpedoes from the surface at their relatively helpless targets. I have also read since (in "This England Magazine, Spring of '84) that we were attacked but our bucking ship, bow to the heavens one minute and waving its screws the next, rose at the right time to let the torpedo pass below our stern. I wonder to this day if it was indeed 'one of ours' or, our Skipper, Captain G.R. Watson played his cards right and saved his precious cargo.
Again my memory fails me. I do not recall sighting land or coming into harbour, so I assume we must have docked overnight at St. John's Newfoundland. I remember lining the rail with all the others watching the cargo hatches being opened to discharge massive containers of supplies no doubt sent to help the cowboys fight those red Indians we had seen so often at the Saturday morning Mickey Mouse club movies. Just as we were all but ready to gallop into the throw, we were taken down the gangplank and whisked off and away, or should I say out the way, on buses. Our destination was a large white, wood planked community hall where the most friendly, generous people greeted us. Only our first taste of what we were to experience on our long trip still to come as we crossed what seemed an endless country portrayed so simply on a postage stamp. Our hosts, whoever they were, had really outdone themselves to present a table 'Canadian style', which was a learning experience for all of us. Not that we would ask, but seeing the gallon pitchers of milk all spaced up and down the tables did make us wonder how many cups of tea they expected us, English though we may be, to absorb in one sitting. Actually when Ginger Ale, Orange Crush, Lime Rickey and 7-Up came to the table we were instantly transformed into 'Canucks'. The ringer was dainty little triangular sandwiches with no crusts and a brown paste in the centre, which disappeared before they hardly had time to hit the table. It was one of the lovely ladies who let the cat out of the bag as to what it was by saying "We'll have to send out for more peanut butter!" Then when topped up to the point of bursting, with fizzy pop bubbles looking for any and every means of escape, they came around the tables with a gift for all of us by which to remember the day.
We each received a shiny new Newfoundland 10 cent piece. That each would be given one was generosity beyond expectation. The equivalent value of five pence was more than many of our party were given to carry them to their destination half way around the world.
Back on our ship life seemed to take on a renewed excitement. More of us were out of the bunks and buzzing around getting in the way and playing on the decks. Even the crew now in relatively safe and calmer waters seemed to relax their guard and want to smile and point out with pride to the highlights of their home on the eastern seashore. One such spectacular sight on our voyage was an armada of icebergs, one of which, even over the distance, made us feel like no more than a pea in the ocean. The children of the day being knowledgeable in worldly events thought 'Titanic', and became ship 'lookouts' for the day.
As we neared Halifax, the end of our sea voyage, the gentler waters brought out the romance of cruising. Between her spells of being seasick, I had become attached to a slim blonde little thing by the name of Doreen. When I say attached I mean we were usually seen hand in hand, nothing more that I'm aware of anyway. One day as we came down the wide curved stairway for dinner we were greeted with the resounding chorus of the wedding march and the grinning faces of all in the foyer. Possibly the last time ever, to be played on the SS 'Nerissa'. It was a short-lived affair though, as once on dry land, somewhere on route across Canada, I lost track of her. Whether she was met at a train stop, met a railroad Romeo or just got tired of secondhand peanut butter served between two protruding piano keys I don't know, but we were never to complete the celebration or meet again.
On April 30th, a few months later, on a return trip to Britain carrying American airmen and Canadian forces, U Boat 552 that was under the command of Captain/Lieutenant Eric Topp torpedoed the S.S. 'Nerissa'. It was reported that Captain G.R. Watson and all the 'Nerissa' crew went down with the ship. Only 35 of the passengers were to survive. Survivors could not agree on whether the second explosion was another torpedo or the cargo aboard, exploding. In their minds it was hard to justify such a small ship being so targeted.
Captain/Lieutenant Eric Topp survived the War and was taken to America. When questioned on the sinking of the 'Nerissa' he confirmed that, ordered back to Dresden, he fired his last 2 torpedoes at his target and turned for home.
There were many acts of bravery to go unreported throughout the War. It was not until 62 yrs. later on reading 'The Brentonian', my old College magazine, that I was to find that Barnett (Buster) Harvey, an old Brentwood College boy, was to have a lake in Strathcona Park named after him. Midshipman Harvey, having been serving in Singapore following five weeks leave, was transferring to Britain aboard the SS 'Nerissa' when it was sunk. He was last seen in the water lifting the child of one of the military passengers into the lifeboat, as the second explosion occurred.
It seems strange that, after over 60 years, having written a few lines to the 'Brentonian' magazine that the article on the honouring of Barnett Harvey and my lines, two former Brentwood College students and wartime passengers of the 'Nerissa', would come together on the same page.
Recent information, forwarded to me through Pier 21 and Ann Hentschel, who has created a Nerissa website (), causes me to continue to question some of my recollections. Regarding our sailing date, it differs from the report by Curate Anthony W. Muir who sailed with us, as reported in the 1984 Spring issue (page 65) of "This England" magazine, which states we sailed 24 hrs. after the City of Benares, which originally we were assigned to board. For me, still at loose ends is how long we were at sea and our arrival date in Halifax. I hope someday to resolve this query.
Records of C.O.R.B. sailings are incomplete as to departure and arrival dates, as is the number of passengers caused by cancellations. The age shown of children reflect that given at time of application. Passenger list shows that Curate Anthony Muir sailed on the S.S. 'Nerissa' 6 days prior to Rev. W. King (lost at sea) who was aboard the 'City of Benares', not after, as stated in This England Magazine, Spring 1984.
"Back Then" - Recollections of life in Britain up until Sept. 1940 and from then on, in Canada, until the present day - by Bernard H. Atkins.
Pages from Bernard Atkins' New Testament. Click a photograph to view a larger version.
Name of Child
Age
Sex
Country of Birth
Religion
Destination
Last Residence
HADDON, Peggy
14
F
England
C of E
Vancouver, B.C.
Bury St. Edmunds
ATKINS, Maurice A.W.
13
M
Victoria, B.C.
Beckenham, Kent
ATKINS, Bernard H.B.
11
ATKINS, Michael D.H.
6
JOHNSTON, Helen Margaret
7
Kenton, Middlesex
SIVERS, Ann
5
Nelson, B.C.
Ashford, Middlesex
NICKELS, Robert
Lula Island, B.C.
Pinner Hill, Mddx.
RICE, Martyn Arthur
W. Vancouver,B.C.
Whitton, Middlesex
RICE, Bernard James
9
SMITH, Shirley Astrid S.
Hillingdon, Mddx.
HALL, Sheila B.
Protestant
Harrow, Middlesex
HALL, Harold Kay
8
WATERS, Doreen Addelsee
11
Edgware, Middlesex
JONES, Bryan Sidney Powell
Mission, B.C.
JONES, Derek Hugh Powell
HAMILL, Peter John
R.C.
Pelkwa, B.C.
Feltham, Middlesex
HAMILL, Mary Angela
PHILLIPS, Beryl Veronica
Ocean Falls, B.C.
Coulsdon, Surrey
ELLIS, Joyce Helen
Cloverdale, B.C.
Epsom, Surrey
LUTLEY, Hazel Dora
10
Woking, Surrey
ENGLAND, Elizabeth Marion
Wellington, Surrey
ENGLAND, Mary Don
ENGLAND, Margaret Ann
STRUDWICK, Jennifer Isobel
Banstead, Surrey
WALLACE, Enid Agnes
15
Purley, Surrey
POVEY, Yvonne Rosamond
Mitcham, Surrey
POVEY, Pamela Maureen
BLURTON, Dennis Clive
Penticton, B.C.
Tadworth, Surrey
JEFFREY, Alan Roy
Tolworth, Surrey
KELLY, Brian Anthony
Summerland, B.C.
London, Middlesex
NAYLOR, Audrey
Lewisham, London
McCLUSKEY, Charles J.
Cranbrook, B.C.
OLIVER, William T. Hastings
Con.
Hot Springs, B.C.
KING, Allan George
Sooke, B.C.
N.Cheam, Surrey
Name
Occupation
RICHARDSON, Honor
34
England
Private Nurse
Eastbourne
WEBB, Ethel Rose
35
Hospital Nurse
London
MUIR, Anthony
27
Clergyman
Huddersfield
PHILLIPS, Florence M.
29
Girl Guide Officer
Kensington
ATKINS, Bernard July 16, 1928 November 21, 2009 At the age of 81 years, Bern passed away peacefully at home, surrounded by his loving family. He was born in Beckenham, Kent, England, and at twelve years old was evacuated in September of 1940 from the London bombing blitz along with two of his brothers, Maurice and Michael. Transported by ship, the SS Nerissa, and across Canada by train to Victoria, he lived briefly with his relatives, the Webb family. Bern happily became the foster child of Major & Mrs. C. Wilson in Gordon Head, and in his teens worked on their bulb farm, delivered mail and became a choker man in a logging camp before attending Brentwood College from 1943-46. Like his father before him, he loved photography and in April of 1947, Bern joined the B.C. Govt. Dept. of Travel Industry Photo Branch as a photo assistant. He travelled extensively throughout the Province as a still photographer, cinematographer, and film director, winning many awards including the "Teddy Roosevelt Award " for his conservation film "Valley of the Swans. " One of Bern's proudest achievements was his documentary film "The Silent Ones. " It won recognition for recording the expedition in 1957 to Anthony Island in the Queen Charlottes to collect a selection of totem poles to be transported south to the museums of Victoria and Vancouver for preservation, display and study. In a small way this documentary contributed to the Island being protected and declared a World Park. In 1959 after two issues of Beautiful B.C. Magazine, he took over the position of production editor until he was formally appointed Editor, a position he held until the Magazine was sold to private industry in the early '80's. Wearing many other hats, under the title of Director of Special Services, he produced numerous brochures and special publications promoting the Province; coordinated the first run of the Royal Hudson train from Vancouver to Squamish, headed the nine tourist regions of the Province, and revived the feature film industry. He coordinated a spectacular promotional event whereby he accompanied his much esteemed Minister, the Honourable Grace McCarthy, and her assistant, John Plul, on the Royal Hudson train to Southern California. During his exciting career he worked for thirteen different Ministers, retiring after 37 years service due to failing health. He loved the beauty of B.C., was proud to be a Canadian and often expressed his gratitude for the many opportunities his adopted country afforded, Liam and Celina Whitney; brother, Michael and family; Joan Popham and family; and the Colvin and Grant families. Bern will be remembered for the many attributes he passed on to his children and, in turn, his grandchildren: a dry sense of humour, hard work ethic, unconditional love and support of family and friends, endless generosity, and most of all, how to live life to its fullest, greeting everyday with a positive attitude. He will be loved and will live on in their hearts forever. At Bern's request, there will be no formal service. In lieu of flowers, donations in his memory may be made to the Heart and Stroke Fndn., Can. Diabetes, or Hospice. 570157
From remembering.ca. Published in the Victoria Times-Colonist on 11/28/2009 |
Episode 118 | Anti-piracy methods, HitTail, AuditShark and other madness
Show Notes
- Protecting against software pirates
- Actions to take when a software pirate steals your software
- WPEngine
- Micropreneur Academy
- WishList Member
- YSlow
- DotNetInvoice
- Mike’s Twitter handle: @SingleFounder
- Rob’s Twitter handle: @RobWalling
- AuditShark’s Twitter handle: @AuditShark
- HitTail
- GoDaddy
- TheSSLStore.com
- Comodo
- GeoTrust
- Trello
- thestartupkids.com
Transcript
[00:00] Mike: This is Startups for the Rest of Us: Episode 118.
’m doing good, Mike, aside from the fact that I don’t like anti-piracy code in DRM. Yesterday morning I wake up and I have an e-mail from our virtual assistant Andy who’s trying to log in to the Academy, micropreneur.com. He’s doing a little admin work and the WishList plug-in that manages our membership just keeps telling him, “You need to validate your product code. You need to click this button and validate the product code.” We’ve had this thing installed for four years, right? And although we’ve moved servers a few times, I mean we’ve never had to go through the step again. And it turns out that if you try to log in, it wouldn’t let us do anything in the WishList admin and then if you log in as a user to the Academy, it was deathly slow. It was like 20-second page load times.
[01:04] And so I’ve e-mailed WP Engine. I’m trying to run YSlow. I eventually e-mail WishList and as it turns out, they have piece of anti-piracy stuff in their plug-in that calls back to their server and if it can’t validate it by hitting their server, then it slows your site down. And their server was down. They told me the next morning that it had been hacked but that’s new to hearing there [Phonetic]. It was, you know, I tried to hit their server. I couldn’t hit it and so, I figure that that was the issue. And sure enough, when they come back up, everything worked again but it was just, ugh, it was like slap to the forehead, you know, like who does that? I mean honestly, I’ve heard of maybe one or two other vendors doing this and to me it’s such a single point of failure. It’s such a way to piss off thousands of your customers.
[01:50] Mike: I understand the mentality but it’s – I don’t want to say it’s the amateur mentality but it’s the mentality of people who feel like they’re probably not necessarily offering enough value or they’re too scared of pirates to understand that the people who are building real businesses are actually going to buy licenses for it.
[02:08] Rob: Right and actually you’re one of the first people who I had heard say that. This is like maybe 2005, 2006, you had a couple of blogs post on it and we’ll link those up in the show notes but you basically said because I always of the mindset, you know, like in the Shareware world, the MicroISP world, people would always have the license code and you know, in order to use it, you needed the specific license thing and you basically came out and said I don’t think that’s the right way to go and I think that hurts your customers, your paying customers more than it stops the people who are trying to pirate your software.
[02:35] And that was where we’re at the decision for our DotNetInvoice and we were looking at doing some type of registration code anti-piracy thing and we decided not to after reading your post and doing a little more research. But everytime I run in to this now and when I’m the customer and it causes me a great deal of pain and or a lot of angry e-mails from users, I totally think back to that argument of if you’re really a small vendor, the anti-piracy stuff is typically not worth it.
[03:02] Mike: That’s totally correct. I mean even the other way to look at it is how much time are you – and effort are you going to spend as the vendor supporting those people who are legitimate customers who really did buy your product and all you’re doing is you’re…you’re pissing them off and you’re making their lives miserable. And on top of that because they’re talking to you for a support help because your anti-piracy mechanisms aren’t working or there are something, you know, going on that’s making things slow or your server got hacked, it doesn’t really matter what the issue is. Every minute that you’re spending time working with those customers is a minute that they’re pissed off at you and a minute that you’re not getting worked done. So, you’re basically killing time on multiple people because you want to implement stuff that will theoretically help you but at the end of the day, it really doesn’t.
[03:48] Rob: Right and I think your argument in the blog post if you want to defeat pirates, keep releasing new versions of your software because nothing discourages someone from pirating your software more than seeing that they have an old version of it and that they can’t get the new version.
[04:01] Mike: That kind of came about because I had some software that I was publishing back in probably 2002, 2003 and I was selling it and I had put copy protection software on it and it gotten cracked and then we released a new version and then that got cracked and then we released a new version and then that one didn’t get cracked. And I don’t think that it was because somebody couldn’t crack it because it was the exact same encryption code, it was just the new version. I think that whoever was doing it, they just got bored and they said, “Ugh, I’m not going to bother.”
[04:28] Rob: So, I started the day off with a rant, you’re going to start it off with some positive news. Did you get an e-mail from someone?
[04:33] Mike: Yes, I did. So, last Thursday, I was having an absolutely horrendous day. There were tons of stuff that was just going right. And I got an e-mail from Bob Ropp [Phonetic] who said, “Just want to let you guys know that I really love the show. I found it searching through tech podcast about six months ago and I’ve been a loyal listener ever since. Thanks, guys and give up at the good work.” And as I always said, you know, it’s just kind of made my day.
[04:52] Rob: Very nice. I realized we haven’t mentioned our Twitter handles in quite some time. So, if you are a listener to the show and you’re not following Mike and I on Twitter, check us out. Mike is Single Founder and I am Rob Walling.
[05:05] Music
[05:08] Rob: Have an update on AuditShark? So, what’s the news?
[05:11] Mike: Based on your previous comment about Twitter, I started working on the AuditShark Twitter account and following a bunch of different people and just trying to get a small following there and I’ve got it up to around 40 or 50 people in three days or something like that, four days. I haven’t put it any extra time in to it since then but I’m starting to work on the process that I can hand to somebody and say, “Hey, I want you to start tweeting out links and stories and news articles to help grow that following a little bit.” And then in terms of the website itself, I roughly doubled traffics since November and December levels. So, I’ve been doing some content marketing and SEO that is kind of starting to pay off at this point. I got to go back and take a look at some of the inbound links and some of the different keywords that I was looking at as potential targets to go after for SEO but it’s a matter of kind of prioritizing those and putting up some new articles.
[05:59] Rob: And what’s the AuditShark Twitter account?
[06:01] Mike: Oh, it’s just AuditShark, @AuditShark.
[06:04] Rob: So, people who are interested in hearing about security world, is that what you’re going to be posting links about?
[06:09] Mike: Yeah. So, I haven’t kind of fully fleshed out my strategy for it yet but what I’m thinking about doing is kind of going to a bunch of new sources and trying to figure out what links would be relevant to the people who would be following the account and what sort of security things are happening in the world. So, for example, recently, there’s been a lot of problems in the Rails community because there’s been some pretty significant, I don’t want to say backdoors but security vulnerabilities that have kind of come out where you can take control of a server and basically run arbitrary code on that server even if the application is designed in a secure way because it has a problem to do with the framework itself, not necessarily the way that people are using it.
[06:49] And of course, it’s a problem because if your Rail server gets compromised, it means that they can get access to anything that’s on that server including the database and, you know, your customer data and then they can use that to go in to other servers. And just by doing a little bit of matching between different Rails applications, you could start whittling down to figure out, okay, well who between these two applications is using the same password on pretty much all their accounts. And then you could use that to launch massive attacks against some pretty major sites on the internet, you know, anything from Amazon or you know, Microsoft, Oracle, et cetera.
[07:21] I mean if these people are truly using the same e-mail addresses and passwords on all those websites, it would be very easy to go in to them and do different things and especially when it comes in to the things like banking. I mean because people use — if you’re reusing those usernames and passwords or the e-mail addresses, it can be a huge problem. So, I’ve been looking at that a little bit and trying to decide. I’ll say in how far in to that rabbit hole I want to go and I’ve actually reached out to a couple of people in the Rails community and see if they would want to use AuditShark to audit their servers to help monitor for changes of any critical system files. So, for example if the new user show up or a new software gets installed or if some of the code libraries are out of date, et cetera and I’ve gotten some responses from that [0:08:00] so I’m looking at those right now.
[08:02] Rob: Nice. So, if folks are interested in that kind of stuff, I see that’s what you’ll be talking about on your Twitter account.
[08:07] Mike: Yup.
[08:08] Rob: So, on Sunday morning [Laughter] I got an e-mail from both you and my HitTail product manager saying, “Your SSL cert is expired.” And what it have – this is totally me dropping the ball. When I acquired HitTail, it was maybe 18, 19 months ago, the previous owner had a 2-year SSL cert and she had bought it on February whatever two years ago and I don’t know if you can transfer ownership. I should had just bought a new one to be honest but it was on the server I’m working and I was able to export and re-import it when I moved servers and just never thought about it and so bam, right in the middle of – it was probably early Sunday afternoon Pacific Time, the thing just stops working. So, at least the website was up, the marketing site worked but you just wouldn’t, you know, when you click to register that’s SSL because they ask for credit card number and I wasn’t getting any trial.
[08:56] So, the kicker is I went in – I knew it was a GoDaddy SSL cert and of course, I go to GoDaddy to try to just renew the cert and I realize – that’s when I realized, I don’t actually own the cert so there’s no way that I can just renew it. So, I generated a new request on the server and I go to GoDaddy to try to fulfill the request and they say, “You can’t take out a cert for – a Wildcard cert for this domain name because one already exists in our system and it hasn’t been purge, doesn’t get purged for weeks after that.”
[09:23] So, I had to then call GoDaddy and I have to tip my hat to GoDaddy. I’m shocked at how good their customer service was over the phone on a Sunday afternoon and they – the guy I got on with their SSL Department and they purged the old one. I sent in the request and they turned it around in like 10 minutes. For a Wildcard cert, I was really impressed and oh, total time taking was about an hour from the time I heard, you know, from you and my product manager but it was a little stressful for sure. I didn’t know because I kept imagining back in the day, you’d wait 24 hours to get an SSL cert back and I was really hoping it didn’t laying in to Monday.
[09:57] Mike: It depends of what type of SSL cert is you’re getting. So there’s [0:10:00] this thing called an EV cert which is Extended Validation which gives you the – it’s not just the little lock icon in your browser bar but it also gives you the name of the company itself. So, if you like go to PayPal or Bank of America, they tend to have those Extended Validation certificates and it’s supposed to signify to the end user that, “Oh, we have done an extended background check on this company and that will take you several days or even a couple of weeks to get through.” But with yours, I mean it’s not an Extended Validation. So, you don’t have to worry about it and they can generally turn those around pretty quick. I get most of mine through either the SSL Store Comodo or GeoTrust and their turnaround time on most of them is, you know, minutes. It does not take fairly long at all.
[10:43] Rob: Yeah. So, that was good news. It was just a minor…little minor hiccup for Sunday afternoon. Luckily, it got resolved quickly. But Derek is my product manager for HitTail and I just start calling him by his first name. He e-mailed and then texted me and that’s what I needed was the text because I hadn’t check the e-mail that day.
[10:58] Mike: Cool. I just finished up writing an e-course. It’s an introduction to how to use Altiris for my Altiris training site and I’m working on building a landing page for it but I’m also touching base with some of the Altiris sales engineers to see if they’d be willing to tell people about it because they’re in the field all the time and they are talking to customers. So, these customers are obviously asking…going to ask them questions about where can we get resources and they will tell them but at the same time, if they knew about my site and they will probably tell them about my site and get more publicity for the site just because the sales engineers tend to have a lot of clout when they’re talking directly to the customers. They take their thoughts and opinions on whether or not a site is a good resource. They treat it as if they have some authority.
[11:38] So, I think that if just by touching base with some of my old contacts through that network, I can definitely get some more people to the website because the traffic is pretty much kind of leveled off back to where I had originally thought it would be. I don’t see it going significantly back up without some extreme measures [Laughter] just because the site doesn’t give very much traffic for the keywords that I’m targeting and there’s not much else I can target [0:12:00] for those keywords.
[12:01] Rob: Right, small organic SEO market which makes sense. What’s the e-course for? Is it to get SEO traffic? Is it going to rank for keywords or is it to give away and exchange for an e-mail?
[12:11] Mike: Yes, it’s to give away and exchange for an e-mail address and that because I’m getting a lot of people to the site or I’m getting, you know, enough people to the site but my conversation rate isn’t as high as I would like it to be. So, what I’m trying to do is first I want to get e-mail addresses from those people. Send them some valuable relevant content that they’re going to read hopefully on a daily basis and then try to draw them back to the sites who in an effort to get them to buy or to maybe sign up for other e-courses or something along those lines.
[12:36] Rob: Got it. Yeah, in terms of getting e-mail addresses, our landing page at GetDrip.com, I started sending some my paid traffic to that purely as a test of a couple of things, I’m split testing some different headlines and body text of the landing page. And that’s worked out well. There’s already one variation of the test that had just completely flopped and so that tells me that that particular, you know, that verbiage that I was using is suboptimal for this market. And what I like about the paid acquisition is it’s not that I’m trying to actually make money out of it, it’s just that it’s just so easy to send a bunch of traffic to it really quick and kind of see how it behaves.
[13:11] At this point, I’m getting around 20% of the traffic that I’m sending from these two niches to provide their e-mail address. So, I’m fairly happy with that. It’s not like outstanding but it’s definitely, you know, these are cold e-mails, people who’ve never heard of me or heard of the app or anything. So, the fact that they’re willing to type an e-mail in to our landing page is a good sign at this point.
[13:33] Mike: Yeah, that’s cool.
[13:34] Rob: I want to go back and update folks on my Trello versus paper competition, right? I’ve always use paper for to-do list and I moved to Trello a couple of months ago and although I’m still using – I have a Moleskine notebook, the black notebooks that I use for all my long-term items in my big thinking and you know, anything that’s like goals and such. But I got to be honest, man, I have not going back to paper for the to-do list since I wet to Trello and I have the iPhone app [0:14:00] and I have it on the iPad and I have it on my desktop and I loved that it’s all synced and then I can just pull it up anywhere and add stuff, move it around. It’s just – it really is someone finally cracked that nut. You know, Fog Creek finally cracked it and I really – I have not found a reason not to use Trello still. It’s pretty crazy.
[14:17] Mike: Yeah, it is. You know, it’s funny because…it’s funny that you bring up Trello because I was trying to think of how to move some of the UI for AuditShark in to the Cloud just because I was talking to the developer that I have working on AuditShark and we were trying to hash out where would be the best place to host all the stuff because right now everything is kind of split between the Cloud and then you have to have this policy builder and it gets kind of complicated for the user and it’s like well the easiest thing to do would just be have everything in the Cloud.
[14:44] So, we were discussing how to kind of rework the UI and make it easier to use and one of the things that I thought of was the way that Trello allows you to kind of drag and drop things between the different columns and I was thinking that will actually might make a very good UI for putting the policy builder in to the Cloud because I was trying to figure out how to do that, you know, using like grids and tables and adding things back and forth between different columns and within the policies and control points. And it gets…it gets a little bit complicated and hard to explain unless you’re kind of familiar with some of the different terms and how the policy builder works but basically the idea of being able to drag and drop objects on the screen, that right there would solve like 95% of those issues.
[15:26] Rob: Very nice and I wonder if…if Fog Creek use the framework or somebody you could piggyback on and say you don’t have to build it from scratch. You know, I imagine that you use jQuery or something that makes that easier.
[15:35] Mike: Actually, they…they posted a couple of links on their blog that tell you specifically what the Trello stack is. So, it started out – let’s see here, they say that they’ve got CoffeeScript, Backbone.js, HTML5. They have this thing called Mustache which is a templating language and then they also have Socket.IO and WebSocket, Ajax Polling. They’ve got MongoDB, Redis and a couple of other different [0:16:00] things in here. And I probably wouldn’t necessarily need all of these things but the fact is that they tell you basically what the use for that. So, if I wanted to build something that was similar that was specifically designed for AuditShark, then I could probably do it. It would be significantly better than putting much any other security product that is out there on the market right now. So, you know, it’s definitely something for me to think about. I just don’t know how much effort it would take to build something like that.
[16:26] Rob: Yeah and if you haven’t build something like that before, the learning curve will certainly be steep on the initial implementation. It’s nice that they – that’s why I like about software companies. There’s a lot of them will just say, “Here’s how we did this.” You know that Fog Creek published that so that other people can go build cool stuff is really neat and that’s not done in a lot of industries. You don’t see manufacturer showing you their process as a rule. I mean that’s pretty cool.
[16:48] Mike: You know, with software – I mean anybody can make it. It doesn’t matter whether you tell everyone about your idea or tell nobody. I mean the fact is as soon as you launch it, everybody is going to take a look at it and say, “Oh, well, I could build that and you know, this is probably how you did it.” And you can kind of reverse engineer most things. It’s just you kind of to have to put any effort and do the work in order to rebuild something like that. It’s not exactly a big secret.
[17:09] Rob: Oh, I have a couple last updates and then maybe we’ll dive in to a few listener questions. Regarding HitTail, January was the best month ever. It actually had – not only that but I had more trials than any month in the past and previously, June of last year had the most trials because it was the year or the month that the AppSumo deal ran and it sent a bunch of traffic. So, it’s a good kickoff to 2013 and what’s nice is since it’s a 21-day trial, February should actually look good too. We got an unexpected write-up in Search Engine Watch. The head editor had seen a HitTail ad and had been familiar with HitTail from years ago and so, he wrote us up and then invited me on their Search Engine Watch Podcast and obviously, that traffic would convert really well.
[17:50] And I guess the thing I realized, man is it’s like the more you’re out there, the more you have ads running, the more you’re just being written about, the more we’re getting contacted by joint venture partners, people who say, “Hey, we want to e-mail our list, you e-mail your list, you know.” Search Engine Watch finding us – I mean it – it just increased that, you know, that lock surface area like Justin and Jason talk about. I mean just being out there creates more exposure and more area free to expand your business. So, it’s definitely working out or at least it did work out in the month through January for us. So, trying maintain that growth and hit our growth goal of 2013 and on track for that so far.
[18:25] Last two update, one is I watch a movie on Netflix streaming. It’s called Indie Game: The Movie. I highly recommend it. It’s about some software developers who are building indie games and it’s – Indie Game is like it’s just one or two developers. So, they’re not associated with a studio. It is really cool. It captures the emotion, the struggles, the anxiety, how long it takes, how the internet can be really cruel if you put out a game and people don’t like it. I mean it’s very closely parallels what we do as developers also theirs world is a little more subjective, right, where people can just say your game is cool or not. At least with software, if we try to sell on value, we have a bit of, you know, a different measuring stick but if you’re all in to the software development stuff, I really recommend Indie Game. It’s nice because it’s free on Netflix if you have a subscription.
[19:11] Mike: The other problem with selling game is either people like it or they don’t and if people don’t like it, there’s not a lot you can do to save it. It’s not like a business application where it doesn’t meet somebody’s needs and you can tweak it until it does. But with the game, it’s really hard to tweak a game so that people like it if it was just a complete dot or bust from day one.
[19:33] Rob: Right. It’s much more hit-based. It’s like writing popular music or making a movie rather than building software for businesses.
[19:40] Mike: Yup.
[19:41] Rob: All right, last thing is our editor had a comment about last episode. Someone wrote in they were talking about the organic delivery idea in New York and she said that she – there is a grocery delivery service in New York City that delivers organic as well as other fresh food and it’s called FreshDirect. She said it’s a huge operation and it’s hard to imagine one person being able to coordinate that. She said FreshDirect is been around for a number of years and she sure they started out small but now they have a giant warehouse, thousands of trucks and drivers and deliver thousands of items within 24 hours of ordering them. There’s no subscription fee. There is a delivery fee at a minimal amount you can spend.
[20:18] You know, we touched on that a little bit just because there’s competition doesn’t mean that you shouldn’t do something if you can figure out a better way to do it. But if you are going to go head-to-head with a big incumbent player, you do need to figure out how are you going to be better or different than they are and obviously, the logistical aspects of handling all the perishable food is quite a big thing to bite off, if you’re wiling to do that and that’s the kind of thing that interest you, by all means.
[20:40] Mike: The problem with fruits and vegetables and things like that is you run in to a lot of what’s called shrink in the retail industry and shrink generally refers to any goods that are lost but when you’re talking about produce, what you’re generally talking about there is stuff that just could not be sold because it wasn’t any good. So, whether the…the apples have bruises on them or something just went bad, you know, the milk expired, things like that, there’s a lot more shrink in the produce industry than there is in the…the general retail but general retail does have shrink as well. I mean if clothes or something like that get ripped or if a TV set – nobody wants the TV set where the box is kind of destroyed a little bit or mashed in on the side. I mean that’s why in…in the past grocery stores used to take can goods and if the cans had dents in them, they would sell it to you at a discount. And now, they don’t do that anymore because people would take the cans and they just drop a whole case of them and say, “Oh, well, I get 50 cents off of each of this.” So – but shrink is definitely a big concern in an industry like that.
[21:39] Music
[21:42] Rob: Let’s answer a few listener questions.
[21:44] Mike: So, the first one comes from Glen Lawson [Phonetic] and he says, “Hi, Rob and Mike. Once again, thanks for continuing to produce the podcast. It’s been my favorite for several years now. Rob, I have a question for you. You’ve mentioned that you brought on a friend to be product manager for HitTail with the hope that he’ll one day take up more responsibility with allowing you to focus on new products. Once you’ve launched or acquired a product and built it up to a stage where others can manage it with little direction from yourself, how do you maintain growth and encourage your staff to be passionate about the business and have a desire to grow it? Would love to hear your thoughts. Regards, Glen.”
[22:12] Rob: There’s a couple of ways to do this for sure. First thing is you need to hire the right people, right? You need to hire someone who is generally going to be passionate and excited about whatever they work on because if they don’t have that, if you just hire someone who’s kind of ho-hum about any job they do, then you’re not going to be able to instill that in them. The second thing to think about is you want to hire someone who’s specifically excited about startups or about growing startups or about being a startup founder. It’s not something that I think can really be taught but if someone is naturally excited about this concept of being a software entrepreneur, then it’s awesome for them to learn on the job and that’s…that’s what I found with Derek is just that he has such a thirst for knowledge and had such a desire to learn all the [Audio Glitch] of the business that I mean I remember, you know, being this back in the day, right? It’s like you’re a kid in a candy store because you’re doing what you really enjoy everyday and you’re getting paid for it and you’re just learning all these awesome stuff.
[23:05] And so, those are the first few things that I think will carry you a long way and then at some point, I think if you’re looking at long term, you do have to think about putting your motivations alongside the person that you hire. In other words, if you make out really well in the businesses well, then you guys should both do well. And so that product manager should ultimately either get a share of profits or equity. And that’s again, may not be the first year or two that they work but if you’re thinking long term, that has to be something in the back of your mind because someone is not going to work forever just to put a bunch of money in your pocket and they are always going to work harder if there is some more motivation to do that either again make more money in terms of equity or a profit sharing?
[23:46] Mike: Well, I mean I think a lot of what you said rings through for most people but the other…the other side of the coin is I used to think this exact same way as well. You know, what’s in it for the people that you’re hiring? And the fact is not everyone wants to run their own business. I mean some people just want [0:24:00] to be able to go to a job and do that job and it doesn’t mean that they’re not passionate about it. It just means that they don’t want to have to think about it when they’re not working. So, those are the type of people who are perfectly content to work for you. They’re not going to actively be looking for the next ride to catch, you know, the next business to jump on to. I mean they want a job. They want a steady income and they want to be able to enjoy their career and as long as you’re providing them with an environment where they are actually enjoying what they do, then you don’t necessarily have to worry about that too much. And again, it depends on what type of person you hire and what they’re interested in. But you can definitely run in to those people who are more entrepreneurial in nature and want to go on and do their own thing. But there’s definitely contingent of people who don’t want that.
[24:48] Rob: Yeah, that’s a good point. And I think I have a…I have a hard time giving advice in this area because my end is one, right? I have only done this once and I found a certain type of person who works in a certain situation and at this point, I don’t know if I could replicate it yet. With a lot of the stuff that I give people advice about, I have done it many, many times in a repeated fashion, all the marketing, the starting, a company they’re growing, you know, the product revenue and all of that stuff, it’s something that I feel confident that I have done it enough times that I do have, you know, an end of 10 or an end 20. My sample size is just larger and so with this one, I have thoughts on it about how I would proceed, but to be honest with, you know, really I only experience to one person. I have lesson I like [Phonetic] to stand on in terms of giving others advice in my opinion.
[25:31]Mike: The next one is from Brian and he says, “I’m currently struggling with the decision whether or when to hire employee number one. My dilemma is I don’t quite have the revenue yet to support this but I’m also very bogged down in task that I’d like to hand off. So, it’s the chicken or the egg thing. An employee will help free me up to focus on growing revenue but without the revenue, I can’t afford an employee. Should I grind it out as I’ve been doing mostly solo with study but slow growth and hire someone later on when I can afford it or should I hire someone sooner and think of it as an investment just for a faster growth? Thanks, Brian.”
[25:59] I think that the thing that you have to do here is take a look at the tasks that you have that you are spending a lot of time on and try to figure out which one is you’re spending the most time on and which of those tasks could be outsource to somebody at a part-time rate. I don’t know as I would go down the path of hiring somebody fulltime yet but you can definitely find people who are looking for part-time work and especially if you’re doing things like support tasks where those types of things can be scripted and you can give somebody some general guidelines and say, “This is my general blanket policy. If somebody asks for a refund, give it to them. If somebody wants you to help them out, go ahead and help them out.” And you’re paying them on an hourly basis. You can kind of have them touch base with you if they have any questions about that stuff but what you’re really looking to do is free up some of your time without having to pay for them to do it fulltime for you.
[26:47] And that allows you to kind of slowly get in to it and the one thing I would caution against for most people in general is if you’ve never been a manager before, it’s very hard to jump in and just take on somebody as a fulltime responsibility and have to manage their workload at all times. If you’re having problems trying to makes end meet and pay their salary, the best suggestion that I would have is don’t do that. What you need to do is take them on a part-time basis and gradually move in to that role and if it doesn’t work out, then that’s fine. I mean you’ve only taken them on as a part-time employee as a opposed to a fulltime employee because once you start taking someone on as a fulltime employee, that’s a huge responsibility because especially if they’ve left another job to work for you and if it doesn’t work out and a lot of these situations do not work out the first time because you – people are notoriously terrible at hiring people.
[27:38] So, you’re better off hiring somebody on a part-time basis kind of testing the water and see how things go and then move on from there if things work out. But if they don’t then, you know, cut the cord. Move on to the next person and at that point, you’re not really torpedoing somebody’s career or taking them away from a job that they realistically could have stuck around in for a while.
[27:59] Rob: That’s exactly what what I was going to say. That’s why we talk so much and we have done this over and over. We did it with support and in the Academy, with support with HitTail. I could go on and on literally, five, ten times I’ve done this, hiring someone who starts off maybe only at 2 hours a week and they’re purely on as needed basis and that’s where nice project management tool like oDesk that actually tracks their time. There’s things that can really track someone’s time accurately and then like you said, you’re only on the hook for the time they work. They can linearly scale up as the time expands and in fact at this point, I now have multiple people working over 20 hours a week and I have one person working 40 hours a week but none of them started at that point. They all started working a couple of hours a week and allowed me to have the free cash flow to then go invested in other things in marketing approaches or in development cost. There’s no reason to tie up a bunch of money in a fulltime employee. I really don’t see any reason to do that.
[28:57] Music
[29:00] Rob: Our next e-mail is actually not a question. It was…it has a subject cool stuff found. It’s from Carl and he says, “A film is in the making that I thought might interest you and your listeners.” And so if you visit startupkids.com, you can see a trailer for a movie, that’s a documentary about young web entrepreneurs in the U.S. and Europe. Did give them my e-mail address because I’d love to hear when it comes out but it has interviews with the founders of Vimeo, SoundCloud, Kippt, inDinero, Dropbox, Foodspotting and several others. So, he said it should be out in March of 2013. I’m in to this type of thing, right? You know, I love movies that observe, you know, all the stuff that we go through and to see other people talk through it is just fascinating. So, thestartupkids.com.
[29:40] Mike: And I think our last question for today comes from Ricardo and he says, “Hi, Rob and Mike. Thanks for the show. We’re a small SaaS company from Brazil with nearly 250 customers. Obviously, we love to get new customers and hate it and I really mean hate it to lose them. I hate it to the point that I’m disappointed with the whole business and mad with anyone who crosses my path for a few hours after each cancelation. I know I should be doing more marketing to get more customers more quickly. What I want to hear from you is what is your strategy for when you lose subscribers from the moment someone request a cancelation to subscription to the moment you actually let them go, how do you deal with it? What sort of metrics do you think? At what point does it start to concern you and more personally, how did it affect your mood in the way you treat your products? Thanks very much, Ricardo.”
[30:19] Rob: First thing to think about is to look at your product and figure out are you past the point of product market fit meaning have you built something that people want to use, that solves a problem that they have and that you are marketing to the right market that really needs it. So, if you are at 250 customers and they are happy and they love what you’re doing and you are able to find new customers and bring them in to your app, then the answer to that would be yes. You know, if your churn rates relatively low, you know, typically when your growth starts going up, your churn goes down, then you know that you “hit” product market fit, okay? If you’re before that, then every cancelation is an opportunity to talk to that customer, find out why they canceled, find out if they just are never going to use your app or if you’re missing a single feature, if you’re marketing to the wrong people. You know, there’s a bunch of stuff that you can find out for them and that’s a whole another conversation but that’s the kind of pre-product market fit discussion.
[31:10] Once you’re scaling and you’re marketing and bringing new people in, churn is a fact of life, period. You’re going to have people that cancel every month and with 250 customers, I hope that number is not a lot of people but in fact in early days of a SaaS app while you’re trying to hone your funnel and hone retention and get all your features in to keep people happy, you can easily have churn of 10 or 20% a month. Now, you can’t have that for very long. You’re obviously losing a lot of customers. 20% churn with 250 customers is 50 customers a month and you’ll essentially be at zero in five months. So, realize that but no matter how well you hone that and how good you get that number, how low you get it, you are always going to have a few people that cancel.
[31:51] So, I think there’s kind of the mental aspect of it. You said you get, you know, angry when people cancel, I would take yourself out of that loop so that you are no longer receiving that e-mail and having to cancel them. If it really does impact you and impacts your productivity in the way that you’re working with other people, I would say give that to an assistant or a tier 1 support or something and let them handle that because you don’t need to know about every single cancelation if they’re comments given in the cancelation which you should always ask why are you canceling and require, you know, at least X characters. If their comments given in that, then yes, maybe you should see all of those every week and be able to read through them but in terms of you getting angry everytime they cancel, then you should probably remove yourself from that process.
[32:32] Second thing I think is you have to look at them in aggregate and that actually takes away a little bit of the emotion from it and what I mean by in aggregate is look at the percentage. So, tracking churn percent which is the number of customers who canceled in a month divided by the number of customers you have at the beginning of that month is, you know, an absolute key SaaS metric. So, you need churn. You want to calculate the lifetime value and of course, the monthly average revenue per customer. But in terms of churn, you also want to break it up in to multiple durations because with SaaS or with any kind of subscription, you’re going to have higher churn in the first period that there are customers. So, for some businesses, it’s the first 30 days has really high churn and that can be 20 or 30% and then after that, it’ll settle way down and by down, I mean it can be 2% or 5% like really low areas. In other businesses, your first 60 days have high churn and in other’s first 90 days.
[33:28] So, you’d just have to calculate yours and you see, you watch and look when that churn drops off and then I would look at your first X days, So, for you it’ll be 30, 60, 90, probably. So, I’d say, you know, look at your first 60 days churn and then look at your post 60-day churn. And those are really the numbers you want to track on an ongoing basis and you want to either have a graph of those that you can look at so you can easily see the change in churn or you want to have a table, you know, worst case, you have a table of your current month plus all your previous months so that you can eyeball it and see is my churn going up or down. When your churn is too high [0:34:00], then you have to implement a bunch of stuff to try to bring it down and again, that’s probably an entire podcast or maybe a MicroConf talk that needs to happen, talk about specific ways to bring churn down. There are a lot of different ways to do it. Those are my initial thoughts on it. Mike, do you have anything to add?
[34:16] Mike: I like a lot of the things that you said regarding what metrics to take and you know, when it should start to concern you. Those are good things. I think the number one point that you said was to kind of remove yourself from that feedback loop if it’s really affecting the way that you work and the things that you’re getting done. That I would say is probably the single most important thing to do.
[34:36] The one other thing that I would point out is that this is definitely a situation where it seems like you’re taking these cancelations personally and the one thing that I would point out is that while you’re getting these e-mails and somebody is actively telling you, “Hey, I’m really not interested in your product anymore,” it’s not a lot different than somebody coming to your website and looking at your products and saying, “I’m not interested.” And that 98% of those people who come to your website are not interested and they leave. But for some reason, those people are not irritating you, it’s these people who have actually gone through that extra stuff, have looked at your product, have probably made a couple of payments and at that point, that’s where, you know, you’re getting these feelings of anger from these people who are saying, “Well, you know what? I’ve tried it out. I really don’t like it. It’s not for me. It’s not going to fit for what my needs are.”
[35:24] And my point is that there is not a lot of difference between those two and there’s this much larger group of people who are telling you no and the only reason you’re taking it personally is because you don’t get that feedback loop. So, again, just kind of going back to what Rob said, definitely take yourself out of that, have somebody else e-mail them back, ask them why they’re canceling. Get the information that you need and then just give it to you and aggregate.
[35:45] Music
[35:48] Rob: That wraps us up for today. If you have a question for us, call our voicemail number at 888-801-9690 or e-mail us at [email protected]. Our theme music is an excerpt from “We’re Outta Control” by MoOt [0:36:00], used under Creative Commons. Subscribe to us in iTunes by searching for startups or via RSS at startupsfortherestofus.com where you’ll also find a full transcript of each episode. Thanks for listening. We’ll see you next time.
Mike, if you’re looking for a good way to checkout Backbone.js, I’d recommend
Not affiliate them in any way. I stumbled upon the site while trying to brush up on Backbone.js (among other things) for a new job.
$25 a month and you get access to all of the courses they offer. If you wanted to do some stuff with Websockets, the Node.js covers that, and they also have a couple of courses which hit on HTML5 and CSS3.
They also have a number of free courses, covering Ruby, jQuery, Git, etc.
Backbone.js would be well suited for handling the models and views for the UI you were describing, as well as handling the communication between the UI and the server when the models are updated, but you would probably want to use jQuery and the jQuery UI library for the drag and drop actions themselves.
Sweet. Thanks Eric!
I have tried to make Trello work for me in the past however the main issue I have with it is that it does not support recurring tasks. I’ve checked out all the various todo applications and Todoist is by far the best in my opinion.
There’s an API for Trello that’s in beta which you might be able to use to make recurring tasks. You could likely configure it to do anything you wanted at that point.
Should we have a drink every time Mike says “necessarily”?
It looks like it’s contagious as in #119 Rob started using it!
But seriously, what does that mean (from #117)?
“I don’t necessarily disagree with anything that Rob just said.”
:-O |
- Orear's with pedigree and citiations. Lots other's google martha O'rear and 1815 and see his page
The Pike branch of our family tree belongs to my father's (Frank Burt) mother's (Lula Pike Burt) family. This branch contains the other last names of Wilson, Lollar, Lawson, O’Rear, and Cooner.
The last name Pike originated in England and is an ancient Anglo-Saxon surname first found in the Devon area of England. It is said to be from the Middle Ages (it could have meant Pike as in the fish, or a hill) it is so old, its origins are unclear. The first Pikes arrived in Massachusetts as early as 1635.
The last name Wilson was originally a Viking name which meant "son of William." Most Wilsons lived in Scotland. The Wilson's began arriving in the New World in the mid-1600's with arrivals in the Massachusetts and Virginia areas. By 1760, our unknown ancestor had moved from either Virginia or Massachusetts to what was then considered the "Wild West" - York County, Pennsylvania. In the 1720’s, the first white men began to settle in the "Wild West" and many of those were Irish and Scottish immigrants who settled in the "York Barrens." The York Barrens eventually became York County, an area in southern Pennsylvania between Gettysburg and Philadelphia. In the 1700’s the “wild west” was in Pennsylvania – what a change from the “wild west’ of the 1800’s!
The last name Lawson is another ancient Anglo-Saxon surname. The first Lawson's were found in Yorkshire, England, and held a family seat from very ancient times (prior to 1050 A.D.) Lawson's arrived in America as early as 1623 in Virginia. From Virginia, our Lawson ancestors moved to North Carolina, then to South Carolina, and finally to Walker County, Alabama.
The last name Cooner is a harder name to find - there is an indication that is a variation of a German name. There is a document which indicates that three German brothers immigrated to America, landing in South Carolina. Their names were originally Kunner, but the name was changed to Cooner. From South Carolina they traveled, one settling in Alabama, one in Texas, and the destination of the third is unknown. Even if our ancestor was a Kunner, there is still not much information to be found.
The last name Loller is another ancient name from the eastern part of England - it can be traced back to 1133 in the Huntingdonshire area. Loller meant a pious person. Lollers arrived in Maryland in 1739 and in Pennsylvania in the 1740's.
An interesting note about our Pike ancestry is that I was told there was Native American blood in this branch of our family tree. My father told me that my grandmother (Lula Pike Burt) had Native American blood. Looking at this part of our tree, I am not sure where it came from. Aunt Diane believes it was an old-wives tale told to impress the young children in the family. I also found several websites which told folks to not believe the Indian princess stories in their family history as it seemed that every family with roots in the southern areas of America claimed to have had an Indian princess or maiden in its past. Oh well…..
I also remember being told that an ancestor returned from the Civil War as a hero for the losing Confederacy and was given land in the South as his reward. You’ll see the truth is far different from this story!
Around 1830, the Pike, Loller, Cooner, Wilson and Lawson families (along with the Boshell, Keeton and Romine families) moved together (approximately 400 miles) from their homes in the Carolina's to an area which is now Walker County, Alabama (northwest of Birmingham).
The amended land-grant law of 1819 (small areas of land could be purchased from the Government for $1.25 an acre) brought a host of settlers into this area of Alabama. The Indian trails were thronged with people from all classes of the social level seeking land under this new law. From wealthy planters with their slaves to the poorest (walking with their possessions on their backs), they each came seeking land in this wilderness territory. It was those of the poorer class, who before 1820, turned into the hill country of Walker county. These people, known as squatters, were few and widely separated.
Jasper became the county seat when Walker County was created. Jaspe r is named for Sgt. William Jasper, a South Carolinian who fought with distinction in defending Fort Moultrie during the Revolutionary War. Hugh Lollar, an early settler, is said to have named the town.
Walker County Alabama was originally part of the Mississippi Territory. Our ancestors lived in the section of Walker County in the vicinity of Townley, Holly Grove and Pleasant Grove, which are the earliest settlements in the county. Holly Grove was the first community with a post office for all the early settlers and it continued to be the trading center of the area but the community never grew, and its final doom came with the building of the Frisco Railroad in 1886, which laid its rails one mile south of Holly Grove, and the town of Townley, which was located on the railroad, came into existence.Pleasant Grove came into existence as a community in 1842 when a dissension entered the Baptist Church over the matter of missions. The Bethel Primitive Baptist Church, at Holly Grove, continued to follow the Primitive Baptist beliefs, while those who subscribed to the tenets of the Missionary Baptist organized and built their church at Pleasant Grove. Albert G. Lawson, grandson of our direct ancestor John Lawson, when he enlisted in the Confederate Army in 1862, indicated he was born near Pleasant Grove Baptist Church on Lost Creek in 1838. Several of our ancestors are listed in the membership of the Pleasant Grove Baptist Church.
Our Pike ancestors were living in Alabama since the early 1800’s before it was even a state. They were in America long before it was a country. Although we have English, Scottish, and Irish history in this branch, its got a lot of American history in it as well. Our ancestors from this branch fought in the Revolutionary War, the War of 1812, the Civil War, the Indian wars, and World War II. I am sure there are ancestors who also fought in World War I.
They were Southerners who fought for our country, farmed and hunted to put food on the table, had lots of babies, and worked hard to make sure their children had it a little better than they did.
The Pike family tree branch begins in the 1600’s in Ireland, so let’s go there.
In the past few years, many family researchers have tried to find information about the earliest O'Rear that lived in America. So far, no one has been successful in that regard. The consensus is that the earliest of the name was a John O'Rea who seems to have been in Virginia about 1675 when a son, John O'Rea seems to have been born or christened. There is speculation that the son may have been born aboard ship while his parent traveled to America and the record of his christening was after arrival. This speculation is based on a letter about the origin of the family written by Susan Marshall (an O'Rear descendant) in 1901. However, no records have been found of an O'Rea on any ship's passenger list. This doesn't mean that the name was never on a list, only that a list has not been found for various reasons including loss due to burning of courthouse records during the Civil War. Also back then, records were not diligently kept. Because we don't know when the first O'Rear came to America, we also don't know the origin of that first O'Rea. Opinions change as more records are located but the guesses vary from Ireland to Scotland to France. For many years, the thinking was that the O’Rear family came from France. This hypothesis was due to a number of factors, some of which are: (1) the settlement of the family near Brent Town which was primarily settled by French Huguenots, (2) the inter-marriage with some of the women from that area that were of French ancestry, (3) the existence of a Sword that was variously claimed to have been given to an O'Rea ancestor by the King of France, (4) the letter from Susan Marshall indicates flight "from persecution of the saints in Europe," and (5) the story that the O'Rear ancestors were French noblemen. Points one and two above may be just happenstance and the fact that the geographic closeness was the cause of the inter-marriages. It has been determined that the Sword of point three above dates from the latter part of the 1700's -- much too late for it to have any meaning about the family origin. The letter of Susan Marshall's does not specifically state the country of origin, but the statement about flight from persecution seems to lend credence to the French origin theory.As for the story of the family being French nobles, there is some support of that based on the report in the late Edward C. O'Rear II of Lexington, Kentucky's files. This report of unknown date was from an investigator in France who gave information on the Orré family. The name apparently is of Swedish origin although the family considered themselves Irish. This family (variously spelled Oree and Orea) seemed to have been of the Protestant persuasion and were apparently commoners in the 15th century that seemingly only lacked formalities which would have caused them to be noblemen. That at least some of the family must have been noblemen is thought because a register of arms gave a coat of arms for the Orré family of Poitou and Thouars. A hand-written description of the coat of arms appears to be: "D'azur au Lion d'o armé el Iampasse de guelles et au chef couser de gueles, chargé de 3 macles d'argent. Ecu timbré d'un caique posé de profil." The family motto is: "Non saeviat ore" which was interpreted in the report as "a Latin pun, meaning speaking of the lion, his mouth won't hurt you." The report states further that many records of the Orré family were destroyed and the family dispersed in the late 1600's following the Revocation of the Edict of Nantes (when the Catholics started killing the protestants in France).A family legend says that an O'Rea was an Irish baron in the court of Charles I. At the last minute as Cromwell seemed likely to win, the story is that Charles I entrusted his daughter to the O'Rea family to save her life, and supposedly the O'Rea family brought the daughter to America settling in New Jersey. The story goes on that Charles II came to America seeking his sister, never found her, and that she eventually married an O'Rea. There are a number of problems with this story. One is there are no records of either a Baron O'Rea or a daughter of Charles I. Another problem is that Charles II never came to America. Because most family legends have some basis of truth in them, one theory is that an O'Rea was a trusted servant of a baron, that it was the baron's daughter that was entrusted to the family, that she was known to Charles II (a childhood playmate?), and that she was taken to the Isle of Jersey which is known to have been visited by Charles II (not necessarily to see her). However, no real research has been made concerning this theory.Supporting the current thinking that the O'Rear family originated in Ireland is the finding of five persons named O'Rea listed in the 1651 Irish Census near the village of Cappamore. In addition to this, the affidavit made by George Washington O'Rear of Georgia on 17 Feb 1902 says that his great-grandfather came from Ireland. However, comparing his stated genealogy with the known family data reveals that the his great-grandfather was actually born in America as had his great-great-grandfather. Also his three-great-grandfather was either born in America or was christened here after being born at sea. Thus it seems that his claim overlooks a couple of generations. This overlooking of generations is not uncommon in stories such as this and in many printed genealogies, so the basic premise of his statement may be true, that one of his ancestors came from Ireland.It may be that the real origin is Scotland. The basis of this theory is that the great majority of Ireland is Catholic and most all of the O'Rear family seems to be Protestant -- primarily of a Calvinist background.
In any event, here are our oldest Pike family tree branch ancestors:
John O’Rea was born around 1650 in Ireland and died in 1710 in Virginia at the age of 60. At some point prior to 1675, he immigrated to Virginia from Ireland. John O'Rea was born in 1675 in Virginia or possibly "at sea" on the way to America and he died around 1716 in Stafford County, Virginia at the age of 41. He was the son of John O’Rea, who was born in Ireland. John was christened in 1675 at Dettingen Parish, Virginia. He married Mary Peck before 1700. John O'Rea was paid by the justices for trapping wolves in November 1702 at Stafford County, Virginia. On December 30, 1710, paperwork indicates that John O’Rea received a land warrant at Stafford County, Virginia for 198 acres of land. On May 31, 1711, he acquired an additional 400 acres of land in Stafford County, Virginia – on Dorrell's Run of the Occaquan River. John built the family home which he called Cloverfield and it stood until 1940 – over 200 years later.
Daniel Lanson O’Rear was burn in 1710 in Stafford County, Virginia and died in April, 1737 in Prince William County, Virginia at the age of 27. He was the son of John O’Rea who built the farm “Cloverfield”. Daniel is shown on the Tobacco Tenders List as 14 years old. The Tobacco Tenders List named farmers who grew tobacco. Therefore, we can assume that Daniel and his father John grew tobacco on their 400+ acres of land. Daniel married Ester Thorn before 1730. His estate was probated on April 25, 1737 at Prince William County, Virginia.
John O'Rear was born in 1730 in Prince William County, Virginia and died in 1810 in Hancock County, Georgia at the age of 80. John was the son of Daniel and Ester O’Rear. John married a Sarah in 1758 and is shown as living in Fauquire County, Virginia in 1759. By 1779 he had moved south to Wilkes County, North Carolina. We know this because in 1779 a restraining order was issued against John and his son Daniel (born 1758) by the Wilkes County Circuit Court for threatening bodily harm against a neighboring tobacco planter. John and his family moved to Georgia soon afterward. 20 years later, in 1799, John sold 100 acres on the waters of Shoulderbone in Hancock County, Georgia, to Jesse Brantley. In 1802, John O'Rear resided in Clarke County, Georgia. On September 7, 1809, John and Moses Lloyd sold 100 acres to his son-in-law.
Daniel O’Rear was born in 1758 in Fauquier County, Virginia and died in 1859 in Summerville, Georgia at the age of 101. Daniel was the son of John and Sarah O’Rear. Daniel served in the Revolutionary War. He joined Colonel Patrick Henry's Virginia Regiment in 1776 at Williamsburg, Virginia as a private. Between 1777 and 1779 he was a private in Captain John Ashley's Company. 1779 was a busy year for Daniel – he was paroled from the military, married Susan Gooch in Wake County, North Carolina, and had a restraining order issued against him and his father for threatening a neighbor. Daniel did receive a pension for service in the regular Army and the Militia in 1834. By 1838 he had moved to Bledsoe County,Tennessee and a year later he was in Chattooga County, Georgia. He died around 1859 in Summerville, Georgia and was buried at the Macedonia Baptist Church Cemetery, in Trion, Georgia.
Martin O'Rear was born in 1795 in North Carolina and died in Walker County, Alabama in 1864 at the age of 69. His parents were Daniel and Susan Gooch O’Rear. Martin was a farmer and it is believed he and his family moved from North Carolina to Tennessee. He married Letitia Alexander in 1817. By 1840 he was living in Walker County, Alabama where he was a founding member and first clerk of the Pleasant Grove Church, Walker County, Alabama in 1845. In 1859 he was the tax assessor for Walker County, Alabama. He died at “Snoddy’s Place” in Walker County, Alabama in 1864 and is buried at New Prospect Cemetery.
Martin and Letitia Alexander O’Rear had 15 children – seven of whom died as infants:
Martha 1815-1856 (this is our ancestor)
Jeremiah 1818-1890
Margaret 1819
Levicy 1820
Daniel 1822
Eliza 1825
Sarah 1826-1900
Frances 1827-1894
Elijah 1829-1907
Samuel 1830
Susan Ann 1833-1898
Lucenda 1834-1913
Caroline 1835
Anderson 1838-1907
Mary 1839
Martha O’Rear Nesmith was born around 1815 in Roane, Tennessee and died in 1856 in Walker County, Alabama at the age of 41. She married William Nesmith on June 21, 1835 in Morgan County, Alabama. At her death, she left behind children ranging in age from 8 to 24.
*****************************
William Pike was born in 1814 in Georgia and died in 1860 at the age of 46. He married Mary Richardson Pike.
Mary Richardson Pike was born in 1810 in Tennessee and died in 1898 at the age of 88 in Itawamba County, Mississippi.
At some point Mary and William Pike moved to Walker County, Alabama where they had at least four children:
Phillip Colton (this is our ancestor)
Mary Elizabeth
Sarah M.
Joseph V.
Philip Colton Pike was born in Walker County, Alabama in 1847 to William and Mary Richardson Pike and he died at the age of 82 in Townley, Walker County, Alabama where he is buried in Guthrie Cemetery in Townley.
Philip married Emily Jane Nesmith Pike. Philip served in the Civil War as a private with Company A of the First Alabama Calvary. Emily Jane Nesmith Pike was the daughter of Martha O’Rear Nesmith – Emily lost her mother at a very young age (See above). Emily’s father was Bill Nesmith (see below).
J.C. William “Bill” Nesmith was born on March 19, 1809 in Blount County, Tennessee and died on December 17, 1870 in Townley, Alabama at the age of 61. He married Martha O’Rear (the ancestor with roots back to Ireland) on June 21, 1835 in Morgan County, Alabama. He is buried at Fikes Cemetery, Townley, Alabama.
J.C. William “Bill” and Martha O’Rear Nesmith had ten children. Its interesting that papers show they married in 1835, yet they had children starting in 1832.
Alexander 1832-1906
Travis 1834
Gracie Frances 1835-1910
Elizabeth 1836-1934
John Wesley 1837-1914
Martin 1842
Malinda 1844
Lucinda 1847
Emily Jane 1848 (this is our ancestor)
You’ll remember that Martha O’Rear Nesmith died in 1856 at the age of 41. Her husband, J.C. William “Bill” Pike married a second time to Nancy Frazier, who became our ancestor’s step-mother. Our ancestor Emily Jane was only 8 years old when her mother died.
Emily Jane Nesmith Pike was born in 1847 or 1848 in _____ and died in 1912 at Walker County Alabama at the age of 64. She is buried at Guthrie Cemetery. She married Philip Colton Pike, whose parents were Mary Richardson and William Pike.
Emily Jane Nesmith Pike and Philip Colton Pike had five children:
John Campbell 1870 (our direct ancestor)
Nancy Emmeline
William Munroe
Lula Isabell
Philip Harrison
John Campbell “Johnnie C.” Pike was born in 1870 and died in 1953 at the age of 73 and is buried with his first wife Martha M. Cooner Pike at Guthrie Cemetery, Walker County Alabama. John married Martha Cooner Pike and they had five children:
Lula Nazrine (our direct ancestor)
Clelie
Ola
Ester
Grace
His wife Martha Cooner Pike died in 1904 at the age of 31 when Grace was only 2. John married a second time - to Suzan Randolph and did not have any more children.
Lula Nazrine Pike Burt is my father’s mother – your paternal great-grandmother – and we will get more to her – and to her mother Martha Cooner Pike – after we cover the history of the Cooners which we will begin next starting with the Lollar branch.
Isaac Lollar was born in Virginia in 1713. He moved to Burke County, North Carolina and in 1755 had a son - Jacob Lollar.
Jacob Lollar was born in 1755 in Burke County, North Carolina and died in 1840 at the age of 85. He married Elizabeth Gantt (1762-1840). After their marriage, they moved to South Carolina and eventually to Walker County, Alabama. Both Jacob and Elizabeth died in Walker County, Alabama. During their marriage, they had at least two children:
Martha Lollar (our direct ancestor who married a Cooner) Mary
Martha Lollar was born in 1794 in South Carolina and married James Patmon Cooner.
James Patmon Cooner was born April 10, 1789 in the Abbeville District of South Carolina.
His wife Martha Loller Cooner was also born in Abbeville County. He and his wife Martha Loller had seven children and migrated from South Carolina to Walker County, Alabama along with other families.
They "are buried on the home place, section 34, township 14 S, and range SW about 200 yards south of the Aunt Lottie Johnsons house place near the middle of a forty owned by Edcar Myers. At the 1945 Cooner reunion, Ed Cooner, Bruce Myers, Breck Sides, David Cooner, Billy Collins, Lenord Wilson, and others contributed enough money to erect a small granite marker in the cemetery to the memory of them. The cemetery is inactive and is located at the fork of Lost Creek, one mile south of Pleasant Grove Church. An anonymous annotation, which refers to Gilchrist Cemetery, reads "moved to Walker Memorial Gardens [North of Jasper] in 1988 due to coal mine stripping.”
Mahala Martha Parthenia Lawson was born on April 24, 1833 in Walker County Alabama to Sarah Wilson Lawson and John Lawson. Mahala died December 23, 1927 (at age 94) in Walker County where she is buried in Files Cemetery.
On March 16, 1854, she married John Carroll Cooner in Holly Grove, Walker County, Alabama. John was a farmer and Mahala was a housewife. According to the US Census, neither John nor Mahala could read or write. Their farm real estate was valued at $300 and their personalty valued at $200. John and Mahala had eight children:
Irene Elizabeth
John Wesley
Mary
James Patmon
Samuel S
Spencer Monroe ("Roe")
Daniel G.
Martha M. (our direct ancestor)
Mahala was spelled Mahaley and Mahaly. However, when she died at the age of 94, “Mahala” is what is listed on her death certificate and gravestone. The last census in which she is mentioned was taken in 1920 and she is listed as living with her son Spencer Cooner and his wife Mary in Beach Grove, Walker County, Alabama. Mahala died of appaplexey according to her death certificate, which nowadays is known as a stroke. The minutes of Pleasant Grove Baptist Church records, Walker County, Alabama 1845-1883, indicates Mahala or Mahaley Cooner a member of the Church. She is listed five times in the membership list at the end of the minutes.Mahala received a pension for her husband’s (James Carroll Cooner) service in the First Alabama Cavalry. She received her first pension payment on October 24 1914.
James Carroll Cooner was born December 25, 1835 near Pleasant Grove, Walker County, Alabama to James P. and Martha Cooner. John died September 11, 1914 (at age 79) and is buried with his wife Mahala in Walker County, Alabama at Files Cemetery James was a farmer. He married Mahala Lawson in March 1854 in Holly Grove, Walker County, Alabama. James and Mahala had eight children, as listed above, and their youngest daughter, Martha M. is our direct ancestor.
James was known as Carroll – the southern tradition was that you were called by your middle name. My father Frank Eugene Burt was Frank everywhere but in Alabama, where he was Gene or Eugene.
During the civil war, John was a member of Company G, 13th Alabama Cavalry for the Confederate States of America. He later left the CSA Calvary and tried to join the United States Alabama Calvary but he was captured and held as a prisoner.
In the book "Glimpses of The Myers Cavalcade", it states that George Allison Myers was a soldier in the Confederate Army but when the US Army got to Huntsville, he, his brother Howell, his brother-in-law, Jim Tindall, Carroll Cooner and Dave Wolf, with Dave acting as a guide, went through the woods from Walker County to Huntsville and joined the US Army. Some of them were imprisoned. John Martin Dombhart indicates in his book that James Carroll Cooner, on September 6, 1862, enlisted at Jasper as a private in Company G, Thirteenth Alabama Cavalry, under Captain Shepherd. He references Census of Confederate Soldiers, 1907. The following story was in the Daily Mountain Eagle, 'Opinion', dated February 28, 1979. "Two brothers, Sam and John Cooner, came from Germany and settled at Palmer on the lower end of Wolf Creek. Carroll Cooner married Mahala Lawson and they lived on the Beech Grove Road. During the Civil War both armies were moving across the South and they took provisions anywhere they could find them. The Cooner family had killed hogs and they hid the meat in a hole near the wood pile. They lined the hole with cloths, placed the meat on the cloths and salted it down. They put planks over the meat, covered it with earth and then moved the woodpile over it. US Troops saw the hog pen, questioned the family and searched the place but couldn't find the meat. The story was handed down by Elizabeth Cooner Alexander, a daughter of Carroll Cooner. Additional information of this period was given by Curt Cooner, a grandson. Carroll and Mahala lived at Wolf Creek. They always lived in Walker Co., with their residence/post office listed variously as Holly Grove (1864, 1915), Beech Grove (1889), Chickasaw (1896, 1902), and Townley (1911, 1914-1916). They were married by Wm. Sides, Justice of the Peace, and this was the only marriage for both.
In the Census of Enumeration of Confederate Soldiers Residing in Alabama, taken in 1907, James Carroll Cooner indicated he was born December 25, 1835 near Pleasant Grove on Lost Creek, Walker County, Alabama. He entered service as a private on the 6th of September 1862 at Jasper, Alabama, serving in Co. G. (Capt. Shepherd) 1st Regiment Alabama Partisan Rangers (later became the 56 Alabama Partisan Rangers). In Spring of 1863, he indicated he came home on furlough and then went to Decatur, Alabama to join the US Federal Army. Muster rolls dated July and August 1863 for 56 Regiment Alabama Cavalry indicated he deserted July 16, 1863.William Stanley Hoole, 1960, “Alabama Tories; The First Alabama Cavalry, U.S.A., 1862-1865”, shows Cooner, James C., pvt. G.A. enlisted Decatur for 3 years; muster in 4-13-64, Decatur; born Walker County, Alabama; age 28; farmer; deserted 11-17-64 Atlanta, Georgia. According to the Federal Army Pension Record of James C. Cooner, WC 786-002, National Archives, Washington, DC, he was 5’10”, 155 lbs., and had sandy hair, a fair complexion, blue eyes and no permanent marks or scars. The Record also has the following by his own attestation;
“I was forsed out in the confederate Armey by the Conscript ofiser but i left and went to the Federal Armey as soon as i cold get acros The lines.” He enrolled 8 or 28 Mar 1864 at Decatur, AL as private in Co. G of the 1st AL Cavalry under Captain John H. Hogan and was honorably discharged at Huntsville on 20 or 25 Oct. 1865. In Aug 1865 during a battle at Rome, GA, he was overcome by sun-stroke, which left him highly susceptible to overheating the rest of his life; he claimed this as a “nervous disability”. He said that he had been treated for this problem by Dr. J. F. Martan, Assistant Surgeon of the 1st AL Cavalry, at Rome in Sept. 1864, and during the summer and fall of 1865 at Decatur; that he was treated later by L. C. Miller; and that he “used pattent medisans mostly all the time”. In a later claim, he also said that he suffered from “Piles, Heart Truble, Rhumitism and Kidney Deases”. He was designated as a corporal only on his gravestone and in one of two post-death claims by his widow.
James Carroll served in both Armies. Both James and Mahala received a pension for his service in the First Alabama Cavalry. His pension started November 1889 and Mahala’s started October 1914.
James and Mahala Cooner were the parents of Martha Cooner Pike and Martha Cooner Pike is the mother of Lula Pike who is your mother’s paternal grandmother - your great-grandmother on your mother’s father’s side of the family. My father (Frank Burt) remembers Mahala as Grandma Haley.
Andrew Wilson was born in 1762 in York County, Pennsylvania. I do not know anything about his parents - where they were born, when, their names, or how they arrived in Pennsylvania.
At some point, we do know that Andrew Wilson moved from Pennsylvania to North Carolina or Virginia (approximately 500 miles) because as a young man he fought in the Revolutionary War (which took place from 1775 to 1783) for "Tate's Troops". He then moved to South Carolina (approximately 100 miles) where he married a woman by the name of Mariah (or Martha). While living in South Carolina, Andrew and Mariah (or Martha) Wilson had at least one daughter - Sarah Wilson in 1793.
Between 1830 and 1835, Andrew Wilson, his wife, and daughter Sarah (possibly with her husband John Lawson and their young family?) moved to Alabama with a group of families (approximately 300 miles). In November, 1850, at the age of 88, Andrew Wilson died and is buried just north of the US 278 (Sipsey River Bridge) in Double Springs, Alabama. No details are known about his wife Mariah (or Martha) or her parents. Andrew was a farmer.
Sarah Wilson Lawson was born August 23, 1792 in South Carolina. She married (questionably) a man with the last name of Ball and had a daughter Nancy in April 1816.
Later that year, in November, 1816, in the Mississippi Territory, which later became the State of Alabama. she married John Lawson and they had eight children:
Vinyard Lawson 1819
Jesse 1822
Unnamed infant boy 1825
Daniel John 1826
Unnamed infant daughter 1830
Patmon 1832
Mahala Martha Parthenia 1833 (our direct ancestor who married John Carroll Cooner)
William James 1836
Sarah and her husband John Lawson (13 years her senior) were farmers. Neither could not read or write according to a US Census. When they purchased land for their farm in Alabama, John signed with an "X". The 1860 census lists John and Sarah with real estate valued at $300 and value of personal estate is $370.
Sarah died in 1885 and is buried with her husband John Lawson in Files Cemetery in Walker County, Alabama. Sarah's gravestone reads: "Sarah wife of John Lawson died 14 Jun 1885 - age 92 years, 9 months and 22 days."
Caley Lawson was born in 1760 and died in 1855 in Walker County Alabama. We assume she was the mother of John Lawson born in 1780 because both the 1840 and 1850 census show a Caley Lawson born 1760 as living with John Lawson and his family. Caley is not mentioned in the 1860 census so we assumed she died during the 1850’s.
John Lawson was born in 1780 in North Carolina and died November 8, 1883 at the age of 103 in Walker County, Alabama. John was a farmer. All indications are that John Lawson and his family came into Walker County after 1830 and before 1835. It is believed he settled on Cane Creek, which is about 3.5 miles south of present day Townley, 4.5 miles south of Holly Grove and about 3 miles west of Pleasant Grove. In 1824 Holly Grove was the community center and post office of all the early settlers. This land on Cane Creek would be the same or some of the same land he sold to John Myers, March 16, 1876, which is about 7 years before his death. In the “History of Walker County, Alabama” by John Martin Dombhart, he states “The Boshell, the Pike, the Keeton, the Cooner, the Lawson, and the Romine families were established in this section before 1835.”
John died in 1883 at the age of 103 and is buried in Walker County, Alabama. John and his wife Sarah Wilson Lawson were married for over 60 years.
John served and was wounded in the War of 1812 (at the approximate age of 30): Master Roll of Captain James Cole's 1st Regiment, 1st Cpl. - John Lawson - wounded and served in the infantry.
At the age of 36, according to the research of Virginia Foxworth Lawson published in The Lawson Letters (#19, p. 165), John Lawson, with Vinyard Crawford and Goulder Fields as neighbors, were listed in the Mississippi Territory Census of 1816 as living in Monroe County, Mississippi Territory - an area from which Walker County Alabama was formed in 1823. That census was taken in the Mississippi Territory as a prelude to the establishment of Alabama as a state.
An interesting note on John - at the age of 44, he appeared in court: Superior Court Minutes 1819-1826, page 212, dated October 1824; State verses John Lawson, on the 7 October 1824 with force and angus assaulted John Mullins did beat, bruise, wound and ill treat and other wrongs to the said John Mullins then and other aid to the great damage of the said John Mullins and against the peace and dignity of the Sate of Alabama. He was fined $20.
The 1840 census indicates that John's household contains seven children, his wife, and his mother, Caley. All of the above were white, therefore it is assumed he owned no slaves.
John and Sarah Lawson are enumerated in the 1860 Western Division, Post Office Jasper, Walker County, Alabama Census with real estate valued at $300 and value of personal estate is $370. It states John was born in North Carolina and Sarah in South Carolina. He could not read or write. Age is given as 68 years.
First Court Records 1819-1849, page 48Taken up by Thomas Patton on the head of Greenwoods Creek – one cow and calf appraised to eight dollars by us – supposed to be twelve years old – marked with a crop of the right ear and a under leit (spelling?) of the left iers (ear or eye?) – before me William Ward and of the acting Justices of the Peace of St. Clair County this 31 October 1821. Paid $4.00Vinyard (X) CroffordJohn (X) LawsonFound in the St. Clair County library is a listing, page 23, of the officers at Ft. Strother, located on the Coosa River, in St. Clair County, during Dec. 1813 and Jan. 1814. Master Roll of Captain James Cole's 1st Regiment, company from White & Warren Counties, Tennessee, under the command of Colonel John K. Wynne, Robert's Brigade. In this Master Roll is; 1st Cpl. - John Lawson – wounded. I did find in the General Index Cards in the Birmingham Library a John Lawson, 1 Reg't. (Wynne's) W. Tennessee Militia (War of 1812), Corporal.In the Rutherford Co. Library in Murfreesboro, Tennessee was a book of Enlisted Men, War of 1812, which listed Cpl. John Lawson, served with Col. John K. Wynn, Capt. James Cole. Indicated John Lawson was wounded 12 Nov. 1813 (believe this may have been 9 Nov. 1813 unless he was wounded when there was no battle).In the Wallace State Community College there was a listing from the index for Corporal John Lawson, which gave the same information above, but also gave his date of enlistment as 4 Oct. 1813 and served in the infantry.Company Muster Roll for Captain James Cole’s Company of Militia, Colonel J. K. Wynne’s Regiment Tennessee Infantry. John Lawson, Corporal, Roll dated Nashville, July 9, 1814. Indicated John Lawson appears on Company Muster Roll for October 4, 1813, when mustered into service, to January 4, 1813, when discharged. Indicated he was absent. Under remarks it indicated on furlough wounded 12 November 1813. Company Pay Roll, not dated, for the same unit indicated John Lawson was on the Roll for October 4, 1813 to January 4, 1814. Term of service charged, 3 months, 13 days. Pay per month, $10.00 with subsistence of $1.69. Amount of pay $35.88. Under remarks it indicated on furlough wounded 12 November 1813.A brief history: For the Tennesseans who fought in the War of 1812, the Creek (or Muskogee as they are sometimes called) War (1813-1814) was the War of 1812. In one of the earlier battles, Andrewahatchie, Jackson surrounded the town with a brigade of militia under General Isaac Roberts on the left and a brigade of volunteers let by General William Hall on the right. A cavalry detachment, under Colonel Robert Dyer, was held in reserve and an advance unit, let by Colonel William Carroll, was sent in to lure the Red Sticks out into the open. When the Creeks attacked the section. (This could have been the battle that John was wounded in?)
In any event, John Lawson did marry Sarah Wilson Lawson and they were the parents of Mahala Lawson Cooner whom you read about earlier.
Martha M. Cooner Pike (1873-1904)
Martha M. (Cooner) Pike was born in 1873 in Walker County, Alabama. She was the daughter of Mahala Lawson Cooner and John Carroll Cooner.
She married Johnnie C. Pike and they had four children:
Lula Nazrine (our direct ancestor)
Clelie Ola
Ester
Grace.
Martha died in 1904 at the age of 31, when her youngest child was only two years old. Martha’s husband Johnnie Campbell Pike remarried to Suzan Randolph and did have any more children. Johnnie died in 1953 and is buried with Martha at Guthrie Cemetery in Walker County, Alabama.
Lula Nazarine Pike Burt (1892-1979)
Eugene "Gip" Gibson Burt (1885-1951)
Lula Nazarine (Pike) Burt was born April 24, 1892 in Townley, Walker County, Alabama. She married Eugene Gibson Burt and they lived in Walker County, Alabama. Eugene died and Lula remarried but did not have any more children. Her second husband did not live long and she then lived with her sister for the rest of her life. She died November 18, 1979 and is buried next to Eugene at Prospect Cemetery in Walker County, Alabama. Eugene and Lula had four children: Frank Eugene, Inez, and twins - Trudy and Truman.
Already a member? Login here
Story of My Life by Eravita® 2013 |
Below, you’ll find the entire annotated script for The Story of Change. If you’d like to download the PDF version, click HERE.
Ever since I learned where our stuff really comes from – and how this system is trashing people and the planet[i] – I’ve been trying to figure out how we can change it.
I’ve read a lot of these: 100 Ways to Save the Planet Without Leaving Your House, 50 SimpleThings You Can do to Save the Earth, The Little Green Book of Shopping.[ii]
I thought they might have the answers, but their tips all start here – with buying better stuff[iii] – and they all end here – with recycling[iv] all that stuff when I’m done with it.
But when it comes to making change, this story of “going green” – even though we see it everywhere – has some serious shortcomings.[v][vi] on the shelves or to allow slave labor in factories around the world.[vii] I didn’t choose to fill stores with electronics that can’t be repaired and have to be thrown away[viii]. I didn’t choose a world in which some people can afford to live green, leaving the rest of us to be irresponsible planet wreckers!
Of course when we do shop we should buy the least toxic and most fair products we can[ix], but it’s not bad shoppers – here – who are the source of the problem, it’s bad policies[x] and bad business practices[xi] – here. And that’s why the solutions we really need are not for sale at the supermarket.
If we actually want to change the world, we can’t talk only about consumers voting with our dollars[xii]. Real change happens when citizens[xiii] come together to demand rules that work.
Look, it is important to try to live green. As Gandhi said, “be the change.[xiv]”?[xv]
So how do we make big change?
To answer that question, I went back and looked at Gandhi[xvi], the anti-apartheid movement in South Africa[xvii], the U.S. Civil Rights Movement[xviii], and the environmental victories here in the 1970s[xix]. They didn’t just nag people to perfect their day-to-day choices. They changed the rules of the game.
It turns out, there are three things you find whenever people get together and actually change the world.
First, they share a big idea[xx][xxi] that puts safe products[xxii], happy people[xxiii], and a healthy planet[xxiv] first. Duh, isn’t that what an economy should be for?
Trying to live eco-perfectly in today’s system is like trying to swim upstream, when the current is pushing us all the other way. But by changing what our economy prioritizes[xxv],.”[xxvi]?[xxvii] But that was enough to make change – because those supporters took action – they did stuff. Today 74% of Americans support tougher laws on toxic chemicals[xxviii]. 83% want clean energy laws.[xxix] 85% think corporations should have less influence in government.[xxx]
We’ve got the big idea and the commitment. We just haven’t turned it all into massive action yet. And this is our only missing piece. So let’s do it.[xxxi].[xxxii] That’s one of those basic things that everyone’s just gotta do. But it gets way more exciting – and fun[xxxiii] –.
[i] I summarized what I learned about where our stuff comes from, and how current systems of production and consumption are trashing people and the planet, in The Story of Stuff movie () and book (The Story of Stuff, published by Free Press, 2010.)
[ii] The books we mention are just a couple in a long list of advice books on living green. The ones on my shelf right now are: The Little Green Book of Shopping (Diane Millis, 2008); Living Green – a Practical Guide to Simple Sustainability (Greg Horn, 2006),; The Lazy Environmentalist – Your Guide to Easy, Stylish, Green Living (Josh Dorfman, 2007); The Better World Shopping Guide (Ellis Jones, 2006); It’s Easy Being Green (Jennifer Pratt 2003); Just Green It – Simple Swaps to Save the Planet and Your Health (Ron and Lisa Beres, 2010); Save the World and Still be Home for Dinner (Will Marre, 2009); The Green Year- 365 Small things you can do to make a big difference (Jodi Helmer, 2008); It’s Easy Being Green (Crissy Trask, 2006); and 50 Simple Things You Can Do to Save the Earth (Earth Works Group, 1989).
These books have some very good tips – from avoiding disposable goods to buying energy efficient appliances and much much more. If you’re looking for simple steps to get started, these books offer lots of ideas from the obvious to the innovative. However, we agree with John Javna, author of “50 Simple Things You Can Do to Save the Earth” and later “50 More Things You Can Do to Save the Earth” when he captured the spirit of The Story of Change in this essay:
“As I explain in the book [50 More things…], I believe the answer is that we need a “new environmentalism” which focuses on issues rather than tips–one that goes further than simple individual effort, to harness the power of cooperation and community; one that not only works to change individual personal habits, but also to change society–laws, business practices, and even values; one that inspires a sustained, committed effort to solve specific problems, rather than simply encouraging random environmental action.
The simplest, most practical way to accomplish this is for each of us to find a single environmental issue that’s right for our lives–one that we really care about–and make that issue the focus of our efforts. It might be saving coral reefs, or supporting solar energy, or bringing a modern railroad system to America. Whatever it is, if we really believe in it, we’ll find it a pleasure to stay involved. We’ll be able to build a satisfying relationship with others who care about the issue–particularly the community of environmental groups that are already working on it–and in the long run, we’ll be part of the change we want to create. It doesn’t matter which issue you pick–big or small–because they’re all connected. If you work to cut carbon emissions from power plants, for example, you’re also helping to clean up waterways. If you clean waterways, you’re improving wildlife habitat. By improving wildlife habitat, you protect trees. And when we have more trees, we clean the air…which means less climate change. “ (Full piece at:))
[iii] Just to be clear, I am all for bringing our values to the marketplace! When we do shop, it’s good to choose products without toxic chemicals and unnecessary packaging, made by companies which treat suppliers, workers and host communities well. Where we buy matters too; buying from local businesses keeps more money in the local community, creating jobs and supporting your local economy. Michael Shuman () explains that “every dollar spent at a locally owned business generates two to four times more economic benefit—measured in income, wealth, jobs, and tax revenue—than a dollar spent at a globally owned business.” Buying used stuff may also help, by potentially reducing the resource use and pollution associated with making new stuff. Choosing products aligned with our values supports companies that are working to be part of the solution. Conversely, avoiding (boycotting) products that are unhealthy for workers, communities and the planet sends a message to companies that are still stuck in the dinosaur economy. Sometimes not buying at all, but making do with what we have or sharing with a friend, is the best option of all. These are all good things to do.
[iv] Of course, I am all for recycling too! Recycling keeps stuff out of landfills and incinerators, reduces pressure to harvest and mine more resources, creates jobs, conserves energy and helps combat climate change. As explained in “More Jobs, Less Pollution: Growing the Recycling Economy in the U.S.,” increasing the recycling rate to 75% in the U.S. would result in 1.5 million new jobs, reduced greenhouse gases and less pollution overall. (). To learn more about the many benefits of recycling, check out the U.S.-based Recycling Works Campaign at. For information on recycling and other Zero Waste strategies internationally, please visit GAIA, the Global Alliance for Incinerator Alternatives at.
[vi] Everyday products contain a variety of toxic chemicals. For more info, see:
[vii] We’ve all seen the reports about horrible working conditions in the factories that make our stuff, from iPads () to running shoes (). To learn more about worker rights issues in factories and fields around the world, check out the Institute for Global Labor and Human Rights (formerly the National Labor Committee) at.
[viii] See and the Electronics Take Back Coalition () for more information on planned obsolescence in the electronics industry.
[ix] And we’re lucky to have some excellent online resources to make it easier to find those better products these days. Environmental Working Group’s Skin Deep database () provides information on toxic chemicals in over 65,000 personal care products. And GoodGuide.com provides health, safety and environmental ratings for a broad range of everyday products, from sunscreen to snack foods to clothing to cars and even has an iPhone app for scanning product bar codes and getting instant info right in the supermarket aisles.
[x] In the U.S., like in most countries, there’s a wide range of policies that encourage our unsustainable dinosaur economy. In The Story of Citizens United v FEC (), we discussed rules that make it easier for corporations to influence election outcomes, creating obstacles for candidates who want to serve the public good instead of corporate interests. In The Story of Broke (), we explored the role that government subsidies play in supporting dirty energy, toxic polluters, mining on public lands and the throw away economy. In The Story of Cosmetics (), we discussed the lack of regulations to prevent companies from putting potentially dangerous chemicals in products we smear on our bodies. Other policies (or lack of policy) allow companies to externalize environmental costs, pollute local communities, use untested chemicals, produce products designed to be unrepairable and unrecyclable and much more bad stuff that we really should be moving beyond as a country. As author and activist Bill McKibben put it: “The laws of Congress and the laws of physics have grown increasingly divergent, and the laws of physics are not likely to yield.” So let’s make some better laws.
[xi] For too long, business-as-usual has meant striving for economic success at the cost of the environment and human health. Toward this end, some companies make and sell products that are unsafe, unhealthy and designed to break. Many companies use and release toxic chemicals. Some relocate factories to countries with weak labor and environmental protections. And a disgustingly large number of companies actively undermine good laws, from container deposit laws (bottle bills) to climate solutions. Business-as-usual has turned out to be unhealthy, unsustainable and often downright ugly. Fortunately, some companies realize that this isn’t a good idea in the long run; there’s no business on a dead planet. Some are leading the way with renewable energy, clean production, design for durability and even lending their voice to the call for sustainable policies and practices. For more on companies working for a better future, see the American Sustainable Business Council (asbcouncil.org).
[xii] “Voting with our dollars” has become a popular phrase these days. I appreciate the intent –let’s use our purchases to make a statement about our values and, hopefully, help shift the market towards better options. But, as the good folks at Treehugger.org point out, shopping is not voting (). For one thing, if we want to make change with our dollars, just remember that Exxon and Walmart have a lot more dollars than we have, so right away, we’re at a disadvantage. What we do have more of is people with voices and real votes, hope for a better world and love for each other. Those are the arenas in which real people – not corporations – can win.
Another difference between shopping and voting is that everyone shops and fewer than half of the voters in my country bother to vote! No wonder we end up with such losers in office! So sure, bring your values to the marketplace, but don’t stop there. Get yourself – and your family members, coworkers, neighbors — to the polls! And let’s work before the elections to ensure we have candidates worthy of our support, and after to keep them working for a better future for us all.
[xiii] When we talk about citizens, we’re not talking about national status or documentation papers. We’re talking about how one shows up in the world. Citizens recognize, as Eric Liu says, that we’re all better off when we’re all better off. Citizens work together to make our communities, our schools, our countries better for everyone. In The Gardens of Democracy, Eric Liu and Nick Hanauer describe citizenship as “living in a pro-social way at every scale in life…showing up for each other…the recognition that we are interdependent.” Citizenship is about pitching in to make the world better – in whatever way fits each of us best. Again, from The Gardens of Democracy: “Central to our conception of citizenship is an ethic of sacrifice – and a belief that sacrifice should be progressive. That is to say, being a citizen is not just about serving others and contributing when it’s convenient but also when it’s inconvenient. And the scale of the contribution should grow in proportion to the ability of the person to contribute. Just as progressive taxation asks those who can pull the most weight to do so, progressive civic contribution asks those who have the most civic capacity and who have benefited most from our civic culture to take the most responsibility.” At the Story of Stuff Project, we believe that bringing our values to the supermarket is a fine place to start, but if we want to make really big change – which we do – then we’ve got to build the kind of power that only comes from working together as engaged citizens.
[xiv] We know, we know, this is one overused quote, but it is a good one! Many versions of this quote are given: “Be the change that you wish to see in the world.” “Be the change you seek.” No one knows the exact words Gandhi said since this quote was paraphrased by his grandson, Arun Gandhi, years after Gandhi died. But we get the point. Walk the talk. Do the right thing. Live your values.
[xv] Gandhi did sew his own clothes and even spun his own fabric. He joined many other independence leaders in encouraging Indians to do the same, rather than purchase imported British goods, to support Swadeshi, or self-sufficiency. The goal of Swadeshi was to withhold economic support for British manufacturers, while instead investing in Indian-owned production. (Many local economy advocates encourage buying locally for the same reasons today.) Gandhi saw Swadeshi as critical to achieving Swaraj (self rule). While there’s inconclusive evidence that Swadeshi was successful at economically harming the British, the image of Gandhi sitting at his spinning wheel became a powerful call to action and continues to inspire people around the world today. However, he didn’t just sit there and spin and sew. He also marched, organized, did outreach and education, recruited people to join, challenged discriminatory social hierarchies, and advocated for new rules.
[xvii] Two good resources to learn about the anti-apartheid struggles are Long Walk to Freedom by Nelson Mandela, the film series Have you Heard from Johannesburg: Seven Stories of the Global Anti-Apartheid Movement, by Connie Fields. ()
[xviii] We highly recommend Taylor Branch’s trilogy on America in the King Years, from 1954 through 1968: Parting the Waters, Pillar of Fire, and At Canaan’s Edge. Check them out at a local bookstore or library.
[xix] To learn more about the U.S. environmental movement, we recommend
Philip Shabecoff’s ,A Fierce Green Fire (2003): The American Environmental Movement; Angela Mertig and Riley Dunlap’s edited book American Environmentalism (1992); and Robert Gottlieb’s Forcing the Spring: The Transformation of the American Environmental Movement, (2005). Also, check out the new documentary, A Fierce Green Fire ().
[xx] For more of our thoughts on where we need to be headed (and to chime in the conversation), please check out the Story of Stuff blog here: .
[xxi] The New Economy Network (of which The Story of Stuff Project is a member) has developed a list of principles for a new economy which sustains people and the planet. We think this is an excellent foundation from which to start building a new economy. Please read it and let us know what you think:.
Also, those in the U.S., please check out Gus Speth’s new book, America the Possible: Manifesto for a New Economy.
[xxii] Learn more and get involved in the campaign for safe healthy products at
[xxiii] To learn more about promoting happiness in your community, access the free tools at The Happiness Initiative:.
[xxiv] There are many things we’ve got to do to have a healthy planet, including reduce toxic chemicals, stop pumping climate altering carbon in to the atmosphere, restrain our resource use to that which the planet can replenish and move beyond a growth-based economic model which requires ever greater resource use. “One Planet Living” is the term used to describe living within the means of our one planet. According to the Global Footprint Network (), globally we are now using 1.5 planets’ worth of resources and waste assimilation capacity each year. That’s a problem, given that we only have one planet. And that resource use isn’t spread equally; some communities and countries are using way more than others. If everyone consumed like the average person in the U.S., we would need five planets! A healthy planet starts with recognizing and living within the limits of our one wonderful planet – and that includes way better sharing than we’re pulling off currently.
[xxv] Our economy is currently set up to prioritize economic growth – measured through GDP- above all else, prompting a growing number of people to ask “What’s the economy for anyway? (Also the title of a new book by SOS friends John DeGraaf and Dave Batker – check it out to learn more.) A number of alternative metrics – such as the Genuine Progress Indicator () and the Happy Planet Index () have been developed to measure other metrics beyond economic activity. While none is perfect, they all promote the same idea; We value what we measure and right now we’re measuring the wrong things. We need to measure, value and prioritize those things that really matter: public well being, environmental health and social equity.
[xxvi] OK, here’s overused quote number 2, but it’s another good one: Margaret Mead summed up the importance of working together when she said: “Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world; indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.”
[xxvii] “In August 1963, Gallup found considerable public opposition to the now-famous civil rights march on Washington in which King delivered his “I Have a Dream” speech. The poll was conducted about two weeks before the march, at which time 71% were familiar with “the proposed mass civil rights rally to be held in Washington, D.C., on Aug. 28.” Of those who were familiar, only 23% said they had a favorable view of “the rally”; 42% had an unfavorable view of it (including 7% who predicted violence would occur) and 18% said it wouldn’t accomplish anything.” And “In May 1964, Gallup asked, “Do you think mass demonstrations by Negroes are more likely to help or more likely to hurt the Negro’s cause for racial equality?” In response, only 16% of Americans — including just 10% of whites but 55% of nonwhites — said such mass demonstrations would help the cause.” From Gallup (), dated January 21, 2008, accessed May 1, 2012. If you want to learn more about the challenges King and the Civil Rights Movement faced, we recommend Taylor Branch’s excellent series on America in the King Years.
[xxviii] A survey of 825 voters in 75 swing congressional districts conducted between July 29 to August 1, 2010 by The Mellman Group on behalf of Safer Chemical, Healthy Families.
[xxix] February 2, 2011 Gallup Poll (“In U.S., Alternative Energy Bill Does Best Among Eight Proposals,”) discussed in GOOD (, dated February 8, 2011.)
[xxx] “Protecting Democracy from Unlimited Corporate Spending,” a national survey conducted by Hart Research Associates for People for the American Way, June 6 – 7, 2010. (Survey report available at: and more information at:). Results of the survey found:
-.
[xxxi] Go to and take our Changemaker Personality Quiz to find out which of your changemaking muscles are the strongest! Then, let’s get started putting those citizen muscles to work to build a better future.
[xxxii] If you’re not registered to vote, get going! In the U.S., our friends at RocktheVote have set up an easy process to get registered here: () Please register and then get all your friends to do so too. If you live in another country, I don’t know how you register to vote. It would be great if you would find out and then post it on your facebook, blog, tweet it – however you can get the word out. I know voting won’t solve everything, but it is an essential step in the process.
[xxxiii] It honestly is fun. Working for a better future adds meaning and purpose and joy to life. I am not saying every minute is fun (some city council meetings are boring!) but overall, it is a joyful way to live. Research done by The Story of Stuff Project reveals that a majority of experienced activists credit the increased meaning and fun added to life by working for a better world as among the top factors that inspired them to move beyond the simple green steps to deeper engagement. And Professors Malte Klar and Tim Kasser have documented a link between activism and social well being. (“Some Benefits of Being an Activist: Measuring Activism and Its Role in Psychological Well-Being” in Political Psychology, Vol 30, No 5. 2009).
As Paul Hawken said, working for a better world is not a way to get rich, it is a way to be rich. |
.
permalink.
Marlowe
- 30 Townsend St. San Francisco
- 415-974-5599
After six-and-a-half years in the Ferry Building Marketplace, ~DELICA~ has made some significant changes as of last Friday, starting with new extended hours from 4pm until 9pm. There is now a sushi bar, featuring only sustainable seafood (so don’t ask for any unagi), prepared by a sushi chef from Tokyo’s Ginza district (he even makes his own soy sauce). Owner Yasu Iwata recommends making a reservation at one of the five seats at the new sushi counter.
Plus there are inventive new small plates, like a halibut sashimi carpaccio with pickled radish, spicy curry croquettes with potato and American kobe beef, fried organic tofu with mizuna in a spicy sauce, and albacore with Oregon white truffle soy sauce. Everything is made with organic, sustainable, and seasonal ingredients. There is additionally a newly added wine and sake list, with two white wines, two reds, a sparkling wine, and three to four sakes. Swing by for happy hour Mon-Thu from 4pm-6pm, with beer for $2.50, and wine for only .
Local Mission Eatery
- 3111 24th St. San Francisco
- 415-655-3422
Cartman would be thrilled: starting this Wednesday the 17th, ~GREEN CHILE KITCHEN~ is going to start serving hot, fried sopapillas nightly, from 5pm until closing. For $3, you’ll get a basket of four, which you can douse with honey (a bottle will be on each table), or you can get them as a savory side dish with the green chile stew or pozole. (Look for stuffed ones coming later.) Launching a week later will be a green chile tortilla cheeseburger, and then the week after that, chile rellenos will be on the menu. 1801 McAllister St. at Baker, 415-614-9411.
As for the old GCK location at Baker and Fulton, it’s going to be Chile Pies & Ice Cream at the end of March. There will be pies like buttermilk pecan, apple, coconut cream, and even yuzu marmalade, plus ice cream from Straus (soft serve too!). Bonus: Ici is going to be making a chile chocolate flavor. There is also going to be a sole savory item on the menu: Frito chili pie! Hours will be Tue-Sun noon-9:30pm. 601 Baker St. at Fulton.
Photo from DJ Mr. E.
Tune into the Food Network’s Throwdown! with Bobby Flay this Wednesday night (10pm ET/PT) to watch Victor and Miguel Escobedo of local fave ~PAPALOTE~ take on the Flay in a Burrito Throwdown. And in true Mr. E style (Miguel is a DJ), there will be a viewing party at MILK in the Haight starting at 9pm, with a whole lineup of DJs to celebrate the premiere. Word.
And for those who aren’t following my Tweets, you should know Papalote’s special occasion Mexi-Pino Burrito, a cross-cultural mash-up of chicken adobo and garlic fried rice, is now available every day on the menu. Let’s hear it for popular demand. There’s also a vegan version with tofu, plus folks are ordering the chicken adobo in chilaquiles, quesadillas, and nachos. Palabra!
~NOMBE~ in the Mission is now serving brunch, whether it’s a Japanese breakfast of broiled black cod, lightly poached egg, miso soup with winter vegetables, seasoned rice with wild nori, a green salad, mixed pickled vegetables, and Balla’s house pickled plums (umeboshi) for $21; a fusion-y tuna melt: poached ahi tuna, grilled sourdough, cheddar cheese, mixed chicory salad, and a fried egg ($12); or warm beignets filled with yuzu jam and nested in creme fraiche ($7). There are also some brunch-y drinks like a blood orange mimosa ($8).
~LE COLONIAL~ has also launched weekend brunch service (Sat-Sun 11:30am-2:30pm). Rotating items may include beef pho soup with oxtail; banh mi cha cua (Vietnamese sandwiches with crab cakes); grilled pork chop with broken rice, fried egg, and pickled bok choy; and a shrimp and crab rice crêpe.
As of today, February 16th, you can now have lunch at ~THE RICHMOND RESTAURANT~ in… the Richmond (and you thought I was going to say North Beach). On the menu: American classics, like potato leek soup, a seasonal green salad, fried oysters with coleslaw, a seasonal fish dish, meatloaf, and a half-pound cheeseburger with fries. Starters will cost between $6 and $9, while mains will range from $9.95-$14.95. Lunch is served Tue-Fri from 11:30am-2pm. 615 Balboa St. at 7th Ave., 415-379-8988..
Thursday Feb 25, 2010
9pm
more info
On March 8th, Christine Law is returning to the kitchen as executive pastry chef for Mitchell and Steven Rosenthal (they all worked together at Postrio). She will be overseeing the pastry department at all three of their restaurants: ~TOWN HALL~, ~ANCHOR & HOPE~, and ~SALT HOUSE~.
In case you want to get a copy of The Butcher and The Vegetarian, the book highlighted in this week’s bookworm, author Tara Austen Weaver will be reading at a variety of events around town:
Thursday February 18th, 7pm-9pm
18th Hour: The Butcher and The Vegetarian Reading and Book Signing
18 Reasons, 593 Guerrero at 18th St.
$5 donation at the door (drop in)
Come and hear Tara read a bit of her book and meet the special guests from the 6pm panel discussion.
Monday February 22nd, 7:30pm
Book signing and reading
Booksmith
1644 Haight St., 415-863-8688
Saturday March 13th, 3pm
Book signing and reading
Omnivore Books
3885a Cesar Chavez St., 415-282-4712
A.
~SR24~, a restaurant from Josh Woodall (formerly the chef at South Food + Wine Bar) and Howard Schindler, is due to open on Monday February 22nd. SR24, which stands for State Route 24, is going to be “a classic American eatery with a consciousness for sustainability and the community.” The menu is designed to be affordable, with nothing over $20. Expect dishes like classic salads (wedge, green goddess, Caesar, chop), a variety of sandwiches, comfort staples like roast chicken and pot pie, a few pasta dishes like spaghetti and meatballs and lasagne, and a bunch of sides (baked beans, Yorkshire pudding). There will also be an affordable international wine list from Guillermo Guerra, with local beer on tap.
Hours will be Mon-Wed 11am-10pm, Thu-Sat 11am-11pm. Happy hour will be from 3pm-6:30pm, and you know there’s some PBR on the specials. 5179 Telegraph Ave. at 51st St., Oakland, 510-655-9300. Note: their official address is Telegraph Ave., but they are actually located on 51st St.
Perhaps you’re jonesing for some spicy tuna, or yuzu chicken wings? ICHI has the answer!
ICHI, a local family-owned catering company, offers to-go platters, business lunches, catering, and service staff for your next soirée or big business deal. We provide the finest in restaurant-quality sushi and Asian cuisine with seasonality and sustainability at the heart of our menus. What impresses the future mother-in-law or boss more than fierce chopstick skills and keepin’ it local?
To place an order or get a quote for your next event, drop us a line or call us at 415-822-4024. Arigatou.
Smoked trout, celery root latke.
Liberty duck breast.
Page mandarin sorbet.
Interior photo by Jesse Friedman.
I was sinking my choppers into such a soft, fluffy, flavorful piece of whole wheat and honey bread, and realized, yup, this place is different. It made me think of my mom’s homemade wheat bread, and right then, I felt at home.
Which is exactly the feeling ~BAKER & BANKER~ is after. Service is attentive and friendly, and the husband-and-wife duo of Lori Baker (pastry chef) and Jeff Banker (chef) regularly circulate the 49-seat room like the good hosts they are. The former Quince location has always had a cozy feeling, and now it feels more masculine and den-like, with lots of dark wood, leather banquettes, and a carpeted floor. There’s also a slightly industrial touch, with exposed ceiling pipes overhead and pendant lamps with Edison bulbs. It’s definitely more lit up than the dusky lighting I was used to at Quince, and the vibe is decidedly neighborhood-y. There’s a small six-seat bar in the back, but it’s tight if you’re bigger than a size four, so I think it’s a better waiting-for-my-table spot than dining-at-the-bar seat.
Banker’s market-driven New American menu shows an interest in Japanese ingredients (find me a chef who isn’t), with luggage stickers from places like Italy, France, and Thailand. It feels very San Francisco to me, without being fusion-y. My guest and I luckily got to try the spicy crab spring roll off the chef’s tasting menu ($55). It was an explosion of flavor: ponzu, sesame, frizzled shallot, yuzu, chervil, chive, mint. I was sorry it was only an amuse—I could have eaten six of them. Yeah, watch me.
I love seeing, nay, tasting innovations, like the spectacular beet reduction drizzled around the edge of the house-smoked trout dish ($12). Why haven’t I seen this more often? I started imagining all kinds of uses for beet reductions, starting with dessert. The hearty dish was almost like a Jewish breakfast, with flaked trout piled on top of a celery root latke sporting a healthy swath of horseradish crème fraîche. The dish became a touch soggy, but was super-satisfying the way it all melded together, brightened with acidity from pickled beets and shaved fennel.
The grilled Star Route little gem salad ($10) featured another ingenious touch: shaved sunchoke. The nuttiness of the brown butter hazelnut vinaigrette and the Parmesan cheese made a memorable combo, playing against the slight smokiness from the greens. A great salad.
We also tried the salad of tender Monterey calamari a la plancha ($13) with fresh chicories, hearts of palm, and fried chickpeas. I can see how everything was meant to fit together, brightened up with three kinds of citrus (ruby and Oro Blanco grapefruit, and Page mandarin), but with all the citrus, I feel like it tipped on the “too many ingredients” scale.
A few of the dishes perhaps border on one too many elements, but in the end, Banker knows exactly what he’s doing: the flavors groove. Sometimes we have to shelve our super-simplified Cal-Ital palates. The upscale preparations are interesting and clever—the food here has its own thing going on. And it’s obvious there’s a lot of technique and prep going into each dish. I also wonder if he is living at the farmers’ market, because it’s apparent how fresh and seasonal everything is. I’d totally bring someone visiting San Francisco here.
My Liberty duck breast ($25) was one of the better duck dishes I’ve had in a while—the fat was perfectly rendered, and the meat was cooked to the right temp and texture. Seasoned beautifully, too. Just ducky. The hearty and juicy plating included meaty shreds of duck confit, Chantenay carrot purée, parsnip gnocchi (another twist on the usual), spinach, and an intriguing whisper of licorice root and orange zest in the sauce. There was also a scattering of parsnip chips to keep the textures varied.
There are six mains in all, from a seared black bass ($26) with a Thai shellfish risotto, to a bacon-wrapped pork tenderloin ($24) with semolina Spätzle, Savoy cabbage, and a dried cherry reduction. My friend was happily feasting on his braised lamb shoulder that came on a bed of creamy polenta—the plate was punched up with black olives, a flourish that we both adored. It was the kind of dish that forced my friend to proclaim, fork in hand, “I will never be skinny.” I ate another bite of my decadent duck in solidarity.
After tasting the “I have no control, please stop me from eating all of this” bread at the beginning of the meal, I was primed for Lori Baker’s desserts (all $8) at the end. Release the hounds. The Page mandarin sorbet rocked my world—it was such a creamy sorbet, not icy at all. It was almost like a 50/50 bar. Brilliant. I just wanted the price brought down a dollar considering the heft of the other desserts.
The kumquat-prune sticky toffee pudding is initially the kind of dish whose sweetness could make your teeth hurt, but then the tart blood orange sauce cuts into the sugar—it was a smart twist on an old-fashioned favorite. And then there’s the XXX-triple dark chocolate layer cake, a barely legal layering of flourless chocolate cake, chocolate cheesecake, and devil’s food cake. When the slice is served, the table next to you will visibly covet your dessert—you’ll see. The Four Barrel French press coffee would have been great with the decadent cake, but was a bit weak (pressed too soon).
Be sure to peek at the blackboards for some wine specials—our snappy server was also very helpful in making pairing suggestions. The ambitious wine list by Collin Casey (he was last at La Mar) is full of Old World selections—many of them natural wines—and even has a few of my Italian favorites on there. I understand his POV, but considering how local the food is at the restaurant, I do think a little more California representation would be welcome on the list—and I can imagine some customers would like a few wines they have to think less about. I also had a hard time reading it—the right-justified formatting was challenging.
The crowd was a hodgepodge—some Pac Heights folks (they can appreciate the spendier bottles of Burgundy and Bordeaux on the wine list), couples on date night, industry folks checking it out… And it’s exactly the kind of scene the restaurant should have. The room was lively and social—you could almost ask your adjoining table about their dinner.
You can tell a lot of care has gone into this establishment, from the well-chosen silverware and glasses to the pretty tulips and server training. Baker and Banker both have a lot of restaurant experience in San Francisco, and they really wanted their restaurant in this location (Banker used to work here as a line cook when it was The Meetinghouse). As I sat and surveyed the room from table 14 (a swell corner table for two, by the way), it felt nice to see them manifesting their dream. Good for them.
This first impression was only based on a one-time visit—but I will be back. My lamb-loving friend will, too. I’m sure any of the small kinks I’ve mentioned are the types of things that will be fine-tuned in time—the owners are paying a lot of attention.
Note: at some point later this year, the duo hopes to open a tiny walk-up counter downstairs where you can pick up a few items like sandwiches and baked goods, plus coffee and cakes. They’re waiting on permits for now—you can keep up with the news in my column, of course.
Baker & Banker
- 1701 Octavia St., San Francisco
- 415-351-2500
Br.
Wednesday Feb 17, 2010
5:30pm–10pm
more info
Delfina
- 3621 18th St. San Francisco
- 415-552-4055
Prohibition Days kicks off tonight, and Harry Denton’s Starlight Room will be offering a complimentary cocktail class led by master mixologist Jaques Bezuindenhout, where guests will learn how to make (and taste) a number of delicious libations popular in the Roaring 20’s. (There will also be a burlesque dance class taking place to get guests ready for the Bootleggers Ball taking place on Saturday February 20th.) Plus there will be a 1920s-inspired fashion show compliments of Costumes on Haight. 6:30pm-8:30pm
And Friday night will include a special 1920’s-themed dinner in ~SCALA’S BISTRO~ wine salon by chef Jen Biesty. There will be five courses (prawn cocktail, vichyssoise, Waldorf salad, sautéed sole à la Grenobloise OR steak Diane, crêpe Suzette blood orange), paired with a variety of gin cocktails. 7:30pm. $50 for dinner only, $65 with gin cocktail pairings (one cocktail per course, gratuity not included). Call 415-395-8555 for reservations.
~CAV WINE BAR & KITCHEN~ is hosting an Introduction to Wine Class
on Saturday February 27th. During this two-hour session, they will break down the components of wine, go over basic terminology, and you will taste a selection of eight wines that illustrate tannin, acidity, body, and a variety of aromas and flavors. Seating is limited. 2pm. $40.
And then on
Saturday March 6th, there is a Varietal Comparison Class, focused on red wines, while the class on
Saturday March 13th will highlight white wines. The Varietal Comparison sessions are the perfect follow up to the Introduction to Wine class. In each, you will taste two examples, one from the “new world” and one from Europe, of four different grapes. The different characteristics of grapes as well as terroir will be clearly illustrated so that less-experienced wine drinkers can choose wines with confidence. 2pm, $40.
Saturday Feb 27, 2010
– Saturday Mar 13, 2010
2pm–4pm
$40
more info
CAV Wine Bar & Kitchen
- 1666 Market St. San Francisco
- 415-437-1770
Union Square’s ~URBAN TAVERN~ is offering no-corkage Mondays, from 11:30am to 10:30pm. And you also get five hours of free parking, which is available every day to guests dining at the restaurant. There’s also a new chef: Colin Duggan has taken the reins. 333 O’Farrell St. at Mason, 415-923-4400.
Thanks to this Tweet from Ben of Cooking with the Single Guy, I learned that there’s a new bar opening on February 19th in the Lakeshore District of Oakland called ~HEART AND DAGGER SALOON~. The tagline is “Good Spirits for Bad People.” All righty then. A couple informative posts on Yelp have more details: it used to be the location of the Serenader, and it’s going to be a rock ‘n’ roll bar (which you can gather from the logo). There’s reportedly an outdoor patio, a pool table, video games, and pinball. Oh yes, and cheap drinks. 504 Lake Park Ave. at Rand, Oakland.
Historic Veedercrest, a pioneering Napa Valley winery and participant in the infamous Judgment of Paris, won a Double Gold in the San Francisco Chronicle Wine Competition for its 2006 St. Helena Cabernet, and won Silver for its 2006 Mt. Veeder Cabernet. Double Gold means that every judge awarded the wine a Gold.
The wines will be available for tasting this coming Saturday afternoon in the VIP Pavilion at the San Francisco Chronicle Wine Competition tasting, Ft. Mason.
Veedercrest was founded in 1972 after a visit from legendary Andre Tchelicheff. Andre invited himself to dinner after hearing about founder Al Baxter’s good quality amateur wines. Andre rated the wines “excellent,” and recommended “going commercial.” At the Paris tasting, the wines were recognized as the “most French in style.” Veedercrest wines have been served at White House dinners and for a visit of the Pope.
You can reach Veedercrest by phone: 510-459-5115, fax: 510-451-1033, and email.
Tuesday Feb 16, 2010
I know, it was a pile-up this weekend with Valentine’s Day, Chinese New Year, President’s Day, and now ~MARDI GRAS~—but you can do it. Here’s a mini roundup of what’s going on:
~TOWN HALL~ in SoMa is known for its annual Mardi Gras blowout—this year will be their seventh. The evening kicks off at 6pm with unlimited buttermilk fried chicken, etouffée, gumbo, oysters, BBQ shrimp, jalapeño cornbread, Abita Beer, caipirinhas, and Hurricanes. The D’Amphibians will be playing, plus there will be face painters, balloon artists, and samba dancers (just when you thought it sounded like a kid’s party). Tickets are available for $70 per person (plus tax) at the door.
~FILLMORE STREET~ restaurants and clubs are going to feature live music (Black Quarterback, Bohemian Knuckle Boogie, Steve Snelling, and Bobbie Webb) at six Fillmore District venues, along with free Mardi Gras beads and signature $6 cocktails or wines. Participating restaurants and bars include: 1300 on Fillmore, Rasselas, Sheba Piano Lounge, Yoshi’s, Gussie’s Chicken and Waffles, Fat Angel Wine Bar and Café, Bruno’s, and the Boom Boom Room ($7 cover). Enjoy Fat Tuesday favorites including jambalaya, gumbo, fried oysters, and shrimp and grits. 5:30pm-midnight.
~TIPSY PIG~ in the Marina is celebrating their anniversary on the same night, so the kitchen is going to be adding hush puppies, gumbo, and (fingers crossed) crawdads to the menu. They’re also bringing in a three-piece New Orleans jazz band as well. Starts at 5pm.
~MISS PEARL’S JAM HOUSE~ at Oakland’s Jack London Square is hosting its first annual Mardi Gras Festival. Miss Pearl’s new chef, Peter Jackson will be offering a special and extensive menu with all kinds of NOLA favorites. There will be live local zydeco and samba bands starting at 7pm, plus $5 Hurricanes, $4 Jello shots, house-made King’s Cake, beignets, and a New Orleans trip giveaway. Entry is free; 7pm-midnight. One Broadway St., Jack London Square, Oakland, 510-444-7171.
And if you don’t want to deal with all the ruckus, but would still like a taste of some King’s Cake, ~ARIZMENDI BAKERY~ is serving slices today! Good luck on getting one with the little plastic baby.
Saturday Mar 27, 2010
VIP: 5:15pm; General: 6pm.
VIP: $120. General admission: $110.
Info/tickets
Hotel Nikko
222 Mason St. San Francisco
~THE.
Meatpaper, a San Francisco-based quarterly journal covering the art and culture of meat, is celebrating the publication of its tenth issue!
In Issue Ten, we continue our omnivorous approach to the topic of meat as we visit a Northern California meat rabbit farm, try pastrami at a New York deli, contemplate roast beef perfume, and consider the history of meat in rock, pop, and punk music.
Subscribe today and get Issue Ten delivered to your doorstep. Or look for it at fine local bookstores, newsstands, and meat purveyors.
And please join us at our issue launch party at Pizzaiolo in Oakland on February 21st.
On Wednesday, a tablehopper reader spotted ~Halle Berry~ at ~SCALA’S BISTRO~ dining with a friend. Per the reader, “She looked beautiful, natch.”
.”. |
Divorce and out-of-wedlock childbirth are transforming the lives of American children. In the postwar generation more than 80 percent of children grew up in a family with two biological parents who were married to each other. By 1980 only 50 percent could expect to spend their entire childhood in an intact family. If current trends continue, less than half of all children born today will live continuously with their own mother and father throughout child hood. Most American children will spend several years in a single-mother family. Some will eventually live in stepparent families, but because stepfamilies are more likely to break up than intact (by which I mean two-biological-parent) families, an increasing number of children will experience family breakup two or even three times during childhood..
Contrary to popular belief, many children do not "bounce back" after divorce or remarriage. Difficulties that are associated with family breakup often persist into adulthood. Children who grow up in single-parent or stepparent families are less successful as adults, particularly in the two domains of life--love and work--that are most essential to happiness. Needless to say, not all children experience such negative effects. However, research shows that many children from disrupted families have a harder time achieving intimacy in a relationship, forming a stable marriage, or even holding a steady job.
Despite this growing body of evidence, it is nearly impossible to discuss changes in family structure without provoking angry protest. Many people see the discussion as no more than an attack on struggling single mothers and their children: Why blame single mothers when they are doing the very best they can? After all, the decision to end a marriage or a relationship is wrenching, and few parents are indifferent to the painful burden this decision imposes on their children. Many take the perilous step toward single parenthood as a last resort, after their best efforts to hold a marriage together have failed. Consequently, it can seem particularly cruel and unfeeling to remind parents of the hardships their children might suffer as a result of family breakup. Other people believe that the dramatic changes in family structure, though regrettable, are impossible to reverse. Family breakup is an inevitable feature of American life, and anyone who thinks otherwise is indulging in nostalgia or trying to turn back the clock. Since these new family forms are here to stay, the reasoning goes, we must accord respect to single parents, not criticize them. Typical is the view expressed by a Brooklyn woman in a recent letter to The New York Times: "Let's stop moralizing or blaming single parents and unwed mothers, and give them the respect they have earned and the support they deserve."
Such views are not to be dismissed. Indeed, they help to explain why family structure is such an explosive issue for Americans. The debate about it is not simply about the social-scientific evidence, although that is surely an important part of the discussion. It is also a debate over deeply held and often conflicting values. How do we begin to reconcile our long-standing belief in equality and diversity with an impressive body of evidence that suggests that not all family structures produce equal outcomes for children? How can we square traditional notions of public support for dependent women and children with a belief in women's right to pursue autonomy and independence in childbearing and child-rearing? How do we uphold the freedom of adults to pursue individual happiness in their private relationships and at the same time respond to the needs of children for stability, security, and permanence in their family lives? What do we do when the interests of adults and children conflict? These are the difficult issues at stake in the debate over family structure.
In the past these issues have turned out to be too difficult and too politically risky for debate. In the mid-1960s Daniel Patrick Moynihan, then an assistant secretary of labor, was denounced as a racist for calling attention to the relationship between the prevalence of black single-mother families and the lower socioeconomic standing of black children. For nearly twenty years the policy and research communities backed away from the entire issue. In 1980 the Carter Administration convened a historic White House Conference on Families, designed to address the growing problems of children and families in America. The result was a prolonged, publicly subsidized quarrel over the definition of family. No President since has tried to hold a national family conference. Last year, at a time when the rate of out-of-wedlock births had reached a historic high, Vice President Dan Quayle was ridiculed for criticizing Murphy Brown. In short, every time the issue of family structure has been raised, the response has been first controversy, then retreat, and finally silence.
Yet it is also risky to ignore the issue of changing family structure. In recent years the problems associated with family disruption have grown. Overall child well-being has declined, despite a decrease in the number of children per family, an increase in the educational level of parents, and historically high levels of public spending. After dropping in the 1960s and 1970s, the proportion of children in poverty has increased dramatically, from 15 percent in 1970 to 20 percent in 1990, while the percentage of adult Americans in poverty has remained roughly constant. The teen suicide rate has more than tripled. Juvenile crime has increased and become more violent. School performance has continued to decline. There are no signs that these trends are about to reverse themselves.
If we fail to come to terms with the relationship between family structure and declining child well-being, then it will be increasingly difficult to improve children's life prospects, no matter how many new programs the federal government funds. Nor will we be able to make progress in bettering school performance or reducing crime or improving the quality of the nation's future work force--all domestic problems closely connected to family breakup. Worse, we may contribute to the problem by pursuing policies that actually increase family instability and breakup.
Across time and across cultures, family disruption has been regarded as an event that threatens a child's well-being and even survival. This view is rooted in a fundamental biological fact: unlike the young of almost any other species, the human child is born in an abjectly helpless and immature state. Years of nurture and protection are needed before the child can achieve physical independence. Similarly, it takes years of interaction with at least one but ideally two or more adults for a child to develop into a socially competent adult. Children raised in virtual isolation from human beings, though physically intact, display few recognizably human behaviors. The social arrangement that has proved most successful in ensuring the physical survival and promoting the social development of the child is the family unit of the biological mother and father. Consequently, any event that permanently denies a child the presence and protection of a parent jeopardizes the life of the child.
The classic form of family disruption is the death of a parent. Throughout history this has been one of the risks of childhood. Mothers frequently died in childbirth, and it was not unusual for both parents to die before the child was grown. As recently as the early decades of this century children commonly suffered the death of at least one parent. Almost a quarter of the children born in this country in 1900 lost one parent by the time they were fifteen years old. Many of these children lived with their widowed parent, often in a household with other close relatives. Others grew up in orphanages and foster homes.
The meaning of parental death, as it has been transmitted over time and faithfully recorded in world literature and lore, is unambiguous and essentially unchanging. It is universally regarded as an untimely and tragic event. Death permanently severs the parent-child bond, disrupting forever one of the child's earliest and deepest human attachments. It also deprives a child of the presence and protection of an adult who has a biological stake in, as well as an emotional commitment to, the child's survival and well-being. In short, the death of a parent is the most extreme and severe loss a child can suffer.
Because a child is so vulnerable in a parent's absence, there has been a common cultural response to the death of a parent: an outpouring of support from family, friends, and strangers alike. The surviving parent and child are united in their grief as well as their loss. Relatives and friends share in the loss and provide valuable emotional and financial assistance to the bereaved family. Other members of the community show sympathy for the child, and public assistance is available for those who need it. This cultural understanding of parental death has formed the basis for a tradition of public support to widows and their children. Indeed, as recently as the beginning of this century widows were the only mothers eligible for pensions in many states, and today widows with children receive more-generous welfare benefits from Survivors Insurance than do other single mothers with children who depend on Aid to Families With Dependent Children.
It has taken thousands upon thousands of years to reduce the threat of parental death. Not until the middle of the twentieth century did parental death cease to be a commonplace event for children in the United States. By then advances in medicine had dramatically reduced mortality rates for men and women.
At the same time, other forms of family disruption--separation, divorce, out-of wedlock birth--were held in check by powerful religious, social, and legal sanctions. Divorce was widely regarded both as a deviant behavior, especially threatening to mothers and children, and as a personal lapse: "Divorce is the public acknowledgment of failure," a 1940s sociology textbook noted. Out-of-wedlock birth was stigmatized, and stigmatization is a powerful means of regulating behavior, as any smoker or overeater will testify. Sanctions against nonmarital childbirth discouraged behavior that hurt children and exacted compensatory behavior that helped them. Shotgun marriages and adoption, two common responses to nonmarital birth, carried a strong message about the risks of premarital sex and created an intact family for the child.
Consequently, children did not have to worry much about losing a parent through divorce or never having had one because of nonmarital birth. After a surge in divorces following the Second World War, the rate leveled off. Only 11 percent of children born in the 1950s would by the time they turned eighteen see their parents separate or divorce. Out-of-wedlock childbirth barely figured as a cause of family disruption. In the 1950s and early 1960s, five percent of the nation's births were out of wedlock. Blacks were more likely than whites to bear children outside marriage, but the majority of black children born in the twenty years after the Second World War were born to married couples. The rate of family disruption reached a historic low point during those years.
A new standard of family security and stability was established in postwar America. For the first time in history the vast majority of the nation's children could expect to live with married biological parents throughout childhood. Children might still suffer other forms of adversity --poverty, racial discrimination, lack of educational opportunity--but only a few would be deprived of the nurture and protection of a mother and a father. No longer did children have to be haunted by the classic fears vividly dramatized in folklore and fable--that their parents would die, that they would have to live with a stepparent and stepsiblings, or that they would be abandoned. These were the years when the nation confidently boarded up orphanages and closed foundling hospitals, certain that such institutions would never again be needed. In movie theaters across the country parents and children could watch the drama of parental separation and death in the great Disney classics, secure in the knowledge that such nightmare visions as the death of Bambi's mother and the wrenching separation of Dumbo from his mother were only make believe.
In the 1960s the rate of family disruption suddenly began to rise. After inching up over the course of a century, the divorce rate soared. Throughout the 1950s and early 1960s the divorce rate held steady at fewer than ten divorces a year per 1,000 married couples. Then, beginning in about 1965, the rate increased sharply, peaking at twenty-three divorces per 1,000 marriages by 1979. (In 1974 divorce passed death as the leading cause of family breakup.) The rate has leveled off at about twenty-one divorces per 1,000 marriages--the figure for 1991. The out-of-wedlock birth rate also jumped. It went from five percent in 1960 to 27 percent in 1990. In 1990 close to 57 percent of births among black mothers were nonmarital, and about 17 percent among white mothers. Altogether, about one out of every four women who had a child in 1990 was not married. With rates of divorce and nonmarital birth so high, family disruption is at its peak. Never before have so many children experienced family breakup caused by events other than death. Each year a million children go through divorce or separation and almost as many more are born out of wedlock.
Half of all marriages now end in divorce. Following divorce, many people enter new relationships. Some begin living together. Nearly half of all cohabiting couples have children in the household. Fifteen percent have new children together. Many cohabiting couples eventually get married. However, both cohabiting and remarried couples are more likely to break up than couples in first marriages. Even social scientists find it hard to keep pace with the complexity and velocity of such patterns. Cohabitation, and Probably Remarriage."
Under such conditions growing up can be a turbulent experience. In many single-parent families children must come to terms with the parent's love life and romantic partners. Some children live with cohabiting couples, either their own unmarried parents or a biological parent and a live-in partner. Some children born to cohabiting parents see their parents break up. Others see their parents marry, but 56 percent of them (as compared with 31 percent of the children born to married parents) later see their parents' marriages fall apart. All told, about three quarters of children born to cohabiting couples will live in a single-parent home at least briefly. One of every four children growing up in the 1990s will eventually enter a stepfamily. According to one survey, nearly half of all children in stepparent families will see their parents divorce again by the time they reach their late teens. Since 80 percent of divorced fathers remarry, things get even more complicated when the romantic or marital history of the noncustodial parent, usually the father, is taken into account.. And so on. This is one reason why public schools have a hard time knowing whom to call in an emergency.
Given its dramatic impact on children's lives, one might reasonably expect that this historic level of family disruption would be viewed with alarm, even regarded as a national crisis. Yet this has not been the case. In recent years some people have argued that these trends pose a serious threat to children and to the nation as a whole, but they are dismissed as declinists, pessimists, or nostalgists, unwilling or unable to accept the new facts of life. The dominant view is that the changes in family structure are, on balance, positive.
There are several reasons why this is so, but the fundamental reason is that at some point in the 1970s Americans changed their minds about the meaning of these disruptive behaviors. What had once been regarded as hostile to children's best interests was now considered essential to adults' happiness. In the 1950s most Americans believed that parents should stay in an unhappy marriage for the sake of the children. The assumption was that a divorce would damage the children, and the prospect of such damage gave divorce its meaning. By the mid-1970s a majority of Americans rejected that view. Popular advice literature reflected the shift. A book on divorce published in the mid-1940s tersely asserted: "Children are entitled to the affection and association of two parents, not one." Thirty years later another popular divorce book proclaimed just the opposite: "A two-parent home is not the only emotional structure within which a child can be happy and healthy. . . . The parents who take care of themselves will be best able to take care of their children." At about the same time, the long-standing taboo against out-of-wedlock childbirth also collapsed. By the mid-1970s three fourths of Americans said that it was not morally wrong for a woman to have a child outside marriage.
Once the social metric shifts from child well-being to adult well-being, it is hard to see divorce and nonmarital birth in anything but a positive light. However distressing and difficult they may be, both of these behaviors can hold out the promise of greater adult choice, freedom, and happiness. For unhappy spouses, divorce offers a way to escape a troubled or even abusive relationship and make a fresh start. For single parents, remarriage is a second try at marital happiness as well as a chance for relief from the stress, loneliness, and economic hardship of raising a child alone. For some unmarried women, nonmarital birth is a way to beat the biological clock, avoid marrying the wrong man, and experience the pleasures of motherhood. Moreover, divorce and out-of-wedlock birth involve a measure of agency and choice; they are man- and woman-made events. To be sure, not everyone exercises choice in divorce or nonmarital birth. Men leave wives for younger women, teenage girls get pregnant accidentally--yet even these unhappy events reflect the expansion of the boundaries of freedom and choice.
This cultural shift helps explain what otherwise would be inexplicable: the failure to see the rise in family disruption as a severe and troubling national problem. It explains why there is virtually no widespread public sentiment for restigmatizing either of these classically disruptive behaviors and no sense--no public consensus- that they can or should be avoided in the future. On the contrary, the prevailing opinion is that we should accept the changes in family structure as inevitable and devise new forms of public and private support for single-parent families.
With its affirmation of the liberating effects of divorce and nonmarital childbirth, this opinion is a fixture of American popular culture today. Madison Avenue and Hollywood did not invent these behaviors, as their highly paid publicists are quick to point out, but they have played an influential role in defending and even celebrating divorce and unwed motherhood. More precisely, they have taken the raw material of demography and fashioned it into a powerful fantasy of individual renewal and rebirth. Consider, for example, the teaser for People magazine's cover story on Joan Lunden's divorce: "After the painful end of her 13-year marriage, the Good Morning America cohost is discovering a new life as a single mother--and as her own woman." People does not dwell on the anguish Lunden and her children might have experienced over the breakup of their family, or the difficulties of single motherhood, even for celebrity mothers. Instead, it celebrates Joan Lunden's steps toward independence and a better life. People, characteristically, focuses on her shopping: in the first weeks after her breakup Lunden leased "a brand-new six bedroom, 8,000 square foot" house and then went to Bloomingdale's, where she scooped up sheets, pillows, a toaster, dishes, seven televisions, and roomfuls of fun furniture that was "totally unlike the serious traditional pieces she was giving up."
This is not just the view taken in supermarket magazines. Even the conservative bastion of the greeting-card industry, Hallmark, offers a line of cards commemorating divorce as liberation. "Think of your former marriage as a record album," says one Contemporary card. "It was full of music--both happy and sad. But what's important now is . . . YOU! the recently released HOT, NEW, SINGLE! You're going to be at the TOP OF THE CHARTS!" Another card reads: "Getting divorced can be very healthy! Watch how it improves your circulation! Best of luck! . . . " Hallmark's hip Shoebox Greetings division depicts two female praying mantises. Mantis One: "It's tough being a single parent." Mantis Two: "Yeah . . . Maybe we shouldn't have eaten our husbands."
Divorce is a tired convention in Hollywood, but unwed parenthood is very much in fashion: in the past year or so babies were born to Warren Beatty and Annette Bening, Jack Nicholson and Rebecca Broussard, and Eddie Murphy and Nicole Mitchell. Vanity Fair celebrated Jack Nicholson's fatherhood with a cover story (April, 1992) called "Happy Jack." What made Jack happy, it turned out, was no-fault fatherhood. He and Broussard, the twenty-nine-year-old mother of his children, lived in separate houses. Nicholson said, "It's an unusual arrangement, but the last twenty-five years or so have shown me that I'm not good at cohabitation. . . . I see Rebecca as much as any other person who is cohabiting. And she prefers it. I think most people would in a more honest and truthful world." As for more-permanent commitments, the man who is not good at cohabitation said: "I don't discuss marriage much with Rebecca. Those discussions are the very thing I'm trying to avoid. I'm after this immediate real thing. That's all I believe in." (Perhaps Nicholson should have had the discussion. Not long after the story appeared, Broussard broke off the relationship.)
As this story shows, unwed parenthood is thought of not only as a way to find happiness but also as a way to exhibit such virtues as honesty and courage. A similar argument was offered in defense of Murphy Brown's unwed motherhood. Many of Murphy's fans were quick to point out that Murphy suffered over her decision to bear a child out of wedlock. Faced with an accidental pregnancy and a faithless lover, she agonized over her plight and, after much mental anguish, bravely decided to go ahead. In short, having a baby without a husband represented a higher level of maternal devotion and sacrifice than having a baby with a husband. Murphy was not just exercising her rights as a woman; she was exhibiting true moral heroism.
On the night Murphy Brown became an unwed mother, 34 million Americans tuned in, and CBS posted a 35 percent share of the audience. The show did not stir significant protest at the grass roots and lost none of its advertisers. The actress Candice Bergen subsequently appeared on the cover of nearly every women's and news magazine in the country and received an honorary degree at the University of Pennsylvania as well as an Emmy award. The show's creator, Diane English, popped up in Hanes stocking ads. Judged by conventional measures of approval, Murphy Brown's motherhood was a hit at the box office.
Increasingly, the media depicts the married two-parent family as a source of pathology. According to a spate of celebrity memoirs and interviews, the married parent family harbors terrible secrets of abuse, violence, and incest. A bumper sticker I saw in Amherst, Massachusetts, read unspoken traditional Family Values: Abuse, Alcoholism, Incest. The pop therapist John Bradshaw explains away this generation's problems with the dictum that 96 percent of families are dysfunctional, made that way by the addicted society we live in. David Lynch creates a new aesthetic of creepiness by juxtaposing scenes of traditional family life with images of seduction and perversion. A Boston-area museum puts on an exhibit called "Goodbye to Apple Pie," featuring several artists' visions of child abuse, including one mixed-media piece with knives poking through a little girl's skirt. The piece is titled Father Knows Best.
No one would claim that two-parent families are free from conflict, violence, or abuse. However, the attempt to discredit the two-parent family can be understood as part of what Daniel Patrick Moynihan has described as a larger effort to accommodate higher levels of social deviance. "The amount of deviant behavior in American society has increased beyond the levels the community can 'afford to recognize,'" Moynihan argues. One response has been to normalize what was once considered deviant behavior, such as out-of-wedlock birth. An accompanying response has been to detect deviance in what once stood as a social norm, such as the married-couple family. Together these responses reduce the acknowledged levels of deviance by eroding earlier distinctions between the normal and the deviant.
Several recent studies describe family life in its postwar heyday as the seedbed of alcoholism and abuse. According to Stephanie Coontz, the author of the book The Way We Never Were: American Families and the Nostalgia Trap, family life for married mothers in the 1950s consisted of "booze, bowling, bridge, and boredom." Coontz writes: "Few would have guessed that radiant Marilyn Van Derbur, crowned Miss America in 1958, had been sexually violated by her wealthy, respectable father from the time she was five until she was eighteen, when she moved away to college." Even the budget-stretching casserole comes under attack as a sign of culinary dysfunction. According to one food writer, this homely staple of postwar family life brings back images of "the good mother of the 50's . . . locked in Ozzie and Harriet land, unable to move past the canvas of a Corning Ware dish, the palette of a can of Campbell's soup, the mushy dominion of which she was queen."
Nevertheless, the popular portrait of family life does not simply reflect the views of a cultural elite, as some have argued. There is strong support at the grass roots for much of this view of family change. Survey after survey shows that Americans are less inclined than they were a generation ago to value sexual fidelity, lifelong marriage, and parenthood as worthwhile personal goals. Motherhood no longer defines adult womanhood, as everyone knows; equally important is the fact that fatherhood has declined as a norm for men. In 1976 less than half as many fathers as in 1957 said that providing for children was a life goal. The proportion of working men who found marriage and children burdensome and restrictive more than doubled in the same period. Fewer than half of all adult Americans today regard the idea of sacrifice for others as a positive moral virtue.
It is true that many adults benefit from divorce or remarriage. According to one study, nearly 80 percent of divorced women and 50 percent of divorced men say they are better off out of the marriage. Half of divorced adults in the same study report greater happiness. A competent self-help book called Divorce and New Beginnings notes the advantages of single parenthood: single parents can "develop their own interests, fulfill their own needs, choose their own friends and engage in social activities of their choice. Money, even if limited, can be spent as they see fit." Apparently, some women appreciate the opportunity to have children out of wedlock. "The real world, however, does not always allow women who are dedicated to their careers to devote the time and energy it takes to find--or be found by--the perfect husband and father wanna-be," one woman said in a letter to The Washington Post. A mother and chiropractor from Avon, Connecticut, explained her unwed maternity to an interviewer this way: "It is selfish, but this was something I needed to do for me."
There is very little in contemporary popular culture to contradict this optimistic view. But in a few small places another perspective may be found. Several racks down from its divorce cards, Hallmark offers a line of cards for children--To Kids With Love. These cards come six to a pack. Each card in the pack has a slightly different message. According to the package, the "thinking of you" messages will let a special kid "know how much you care." Though Hallmark doesn't quite say so, it's clear these cards are aimed at divorced parents. "I'm sorry I'm not always there when you need me but I hope you know I'm always just a phone call away." Another card reads: "Even though your dad and I don't live together anymore, I know he's still a very special part of your life. And as much as I miss you when you're not with me, I'm still happy that you two can spend time together."
Hallmark's messages are grounded in a substantial body of well-funded market research. Therefore it is worth reflecting on the divergence in sentiment between the divorce cards for adults and the divorce cards for kids. For grown-ups, divorce heralds new beginnings (A HOT NEW SINGLE). For children, divorce brings separation and loss ("I'm sorry I'm not always there when you need me").
An even more telling glimpse into the meaning of family disruption can be found in the growing children's literature on family dissolution. Take, for example, the popular children's book Dinosaurs Divorce: A Guide for Changing Families (1986), by Laurene Krasny Brown and Marc Brown. This is a picture book, written for very young children. The book begins with a short glossary of "divorce words" and encourages children to "see if you can find them" in the story. The words include "family counselor," "separation agreement," "alimony," and "child custody." The book is illustrated with cartoonish drawings of green dinosaur parents who fight, drink too much, and break up. One panel shows the father dinosaur, suitcase in hand, getting into a yellow car.
The dinosaur children are offered simple, straightforward advice on what to do about the divorce. On custody decisions: "When parents can't agree, lawyers and judges decide. Try to be honest if they ask you questions; it will help them make better decisions." On selling the house: "If you move, you may have to say good-bye to friends and familiar places. But soon your new home will feel like the place you really belong." On the economic impact of divorce: "Living with one parent almost always means there will be less money. Be prepared to give up some things." On holidays: "Divorce may mean twice as much celebrating at holiday times, but you may feel pulled apart." On parents' new lovers: "You may sometimes feel jealous and want your parent to yourself. Be polite to your parents' new friends, even if you don't like them at first." On parents' remarriage: "Not everyone loves his or her stepparents, but showing them respect is important."
These cards and books point to an uncomfortable and generally unacknowledged fact: what contributes to a parent's happiness may detract from a child's happiness. All too often the adult quest for freedom, independence, and choice in family relationships conflicts with a child's developmental needs for stability, constancy, harmony, and permanence in family life. In short, family disruption creates a deep division between parents' interests and the interests of children.
One of the worst consequences of these divided interests is a withdrawal of parental investment in children's well-being. As the Stanford economist Victor Fuchs has pointed out, the main source of social investment in children is private. The investment comes from the children's parents. But parents in disrupted families have less time, attention, and money to devote to their children. The single most important source of disinvestment has been the widespread withdrawal of financial support and involvement by fathers. Maternal investment, too, has declined, as women try to raise families on their own and work outside the home. Moreover, both mothers and fathers commonly respond to family breakup by investing more heavily in themselves and in their own personal and romantic lives.
Sometimes the tables are completely turned. Children are called upon to invest in the emotional well-being of their parents. Indeed, this seems to be the larger message of many of the children's books on divorce and remarriage. Dinosaurs Divorce asks children to be sympathetic, understanding, respectful, and polite to confused, unhappy parents. The sacrifice comes from the children: "Be prepared to give up some things." In the world of divorcing dinosaurs, the children rather than the grown-ups are the exemplars of patience, restraint, and good sense.
As it first took shape in the 1970s, the optimistic view of family change rested on three bold new assumptions. At that time, because the emergence of the changes in family life was so recent, there was little hard evidence to confirm or dispute these assumptions. But this was an expansive moment in American life.
The first assumption was an economic one: that a woman could now afford to be a mother without also being a wife. There were ample grounds for believing this. Women's work-force participation had been gradually increasing in the postwar period, and by the beginning of the 1970s women were a strong presence in the workplace. What's more, even though there was still a substantial wage gap between men and women, women had made considerable progress in a relatively short time toward better-paying jobs and greater employment opportunities. More women than ever before could aspire to serious careers as business executives, doctors, lawyers, airline pilots, and politicians. This circumstance, combined with the increased availability of child care, meant that women could take on the responsibilities of a breadwinner, perhaps even a sole breadwinner. This was particularly true for middle-class women. According to a highly regarded 1977 study by the Carnegie Council on Children, "The greater availability of jobs for women means that more middle-class children today survive their parents' divorce without a catastrophic plunge into poverty."
Feminists, who had long argued that the path to greater equality for women lay in the world of work outside the home, endorsed this assumption. In fact, for many, economic independence was a stepping-stone toward freedom from both men and marriage. As women began to earn their own money, they were less dependent on men or marriage, and marriage diminished in importance. In Gloria Steinem's memorable words, "A woman without a man is like a fish without a bicycle."
This assumption also gained momentum as the meaning of work changed for women. Increasingly, work had an expressive as well as an economic dimension: being a working mother not only gave you an income but also made you more interesting and fulfilled than a stay-at-home mother. Consequently, the optimistic economic scenario was driven by a cultural imperative. Women would achieve financial independence because, culturally as well as economically, it was the right thing to do.
The second assumption was that family disruption would not cause lasting harm to children and could actually enrich their lives. Creative Divorce: A New Opportunity for Personal Growth, a popular book of the seventies, spoke confidently to this point: "Children can survive any family crisis without permanent damage--and grow as human beings in the process. . . ." Moreover, single-parent and stepparent families created a more extensive kinship network than the nuclear family. This network would envelop children in a web of warm and supportive relationships. "Belonging to a stepfamily means there are more people in your life," a children's book published in 1982 notes. "More sisters and brothers, including the step ones. More people you think of as grandparents and aunts and uncles. More cousins. More neighbors and friends. . . . Getting to know and like so many people (and having them like you) is one of the best parts of what being in a stepfamily . . . is all about."
The third assumption was that the new diversity in family structure would make America a better place. Just as the nation has been strengthened by the diversity of its ethnic and racial groups, so it would be strengthened by diverse family forms. The emergence of these brave new families was but the latest chapter in the saga of American pluralism.
Another version of the diversity argument stated that the real problem was not family disruption itself but the stigma still attached to these emergent family forms. This lingering stigma placed children at psychological risk, making them feel ashamed or different; as the ranks of single-parent and stepparent families grew, children would feel normal and good about themselves.
These assumptions continue to be appealing, because they accord with strongly held American beliefs in social progress. Americans see progress in the expansion of individual opportunities for choice, freedom, and self-expression. Moreover, Americans identify progress with growing tolerance of diversity. Over the past half century, the pollster Daniel Yankelovich writes, the United States has steadily grown more open-minded and accepting of groups that were previously perceived as alien, untrustworthy, or unsuitable for public leadership or social esteem. One such group is the burgeoning number of single-parent and stepparent families.
In 1981 Sara McLanahan, now a sociologist at Princeton University's Woodrow Wilson School, read a three-part series by Ken Auletta in The New Yorker. Later published as a book titled The Underclass, the series presented a vivid portrait of the drug addicts, welfare mothers, and school dropouts who took part in an education and-training program in New York City. Many were the children of single mothers, and it was Auletta's clear implication that single-mother families were contributing to the growth of an underclass. McLanahan was taken aback by this notion. "It struck me as strange that he would be viewing single mothers at that level of pathology."
"I'd gone to graduate school in the days when the politically correct argument was that single-parent families were just another alternative family form, and it was fine," McLanahan explains, as she recalls the state of social-scientific thinking in the 1970s. Several empirical studies that were then current supported an optimistic view of family change. (They used tiny samples, however, and did not track the well-being of children over time.) One, All Our Kin, by Carol Stack, was required reading for thousands of university students. It said that single mothers had strengths that had gone undetected and unappreciated by earlier researchers. The single-mother family, it suggested, is an economically resourceful and socially embedded institution. In the late 1970s McLanahan wrote a similar study that looked at a small sample of white single mothers and how they coped. "So I was very much of that tradition."
By the early 1980s, however, nearly two decades had passed since the changes in family life had begun. During the intervening years a fuller body of empirical research had emerged: studies that used large samples, or followed families through time, or did both. Moreover, several of the studies offered a child's-eye view of family disruption. The National Survey on Children, conducted by the psychologist Nicholas Zill, had set out in 1976 to track a large sample of children aged seven to eleven. It also interviewed the children's parents and teachers. It surveyed its subjects again in 1981 and 1987. By the time of its third round of interviews the eleven-year-olds of 1976 were the twenty-two-year-olds of 1987. The California Children of Divorce Study, directed by Judith Wallerstein, a clinical psychologist, had also been going on for a decade. E. Mavis Hetherington, of the University of Virginia, was conducting a similar study of children from both intact and divorced families. For the first time it was possible to test the optimistic view against a large and longitudinal body of evidence.
It was to this body of evidence that Sara McLanahan turned. When she did, she found little to support the optimistic view of single motherhood. On the contrary. When she published her findings with Irwin Garfinkel in a 1986 book, Single Mothers and Their Children, her portrait of single motherhood proved to be as troubling in its own way as Auletta's.
One of the leading assumptions of the time was that single motherhood was economically viable. Even if single mothers did face economic trials, they wouldn't face them for long, it was argued, because they wouldn't remain single for long: single motherhood would be a brief phase of three to five years, followed by marriage. Single mothers would be economically resilient: if they experienced setbacks, they would recover quickly. It was also said that single mothers would be supported by informal networks of family, friends, neighbors, and other single mothers. As McLanahan shows in her study, the evidence demolishes all these claims.
For the vast majority of single mothers, the economic spectrum turns out to be narrow, running between precarious and desperate. Half the single mothers in the United States live below the poverty line. (Currently, one out of ten married couples with children is poor.) Many others live on the edge of poverty. Even single mothers who are far from poor are likely to experience persistent economic insecurity. Divorce almost always brings a decline in the standard of living for the mother and children.
Moreover, the poverty experienced by single mothers is no more brief than it is mild. A significant number of all single mothers never marry or remarry. Those who do, do so only after spending roughly six years, on average, as single parents. For black mothers the duration is much longer. Only 33 percent of African American mothers had remarried within ten years of separation. Consequently, single motherhood is hardly a fleeting event for the mother, and it is likely to occupy a third of the child's childhood. Even the notion that single mothers are knit together in economically supportive networks is not borne out by the evidence. On the contrary, single parenthood forces many women to be on the move, in search of cheaper housing and better jobs. This need-driven restless mobility makes it more difficult for them to sustain supportive ties to family and friends, let alone other single mothers.
Single-mother families are vulnerable not just to poverty but to a particularly debilitating form of poverty: welfare dependency. The dependency takes two forms: First, single mothers, particularly unwed mothers, stay on welfare longer than other welfare recipients. Of those never-married mothers who receive welfare benefits, al most 40 percent remain on the rolls for ten years or longer. Second, welfare dependency tends to be passed on from one generation to the next. McLanahan says, "Evidence on intergenerational poverty indicates that, indeed, offspring from [single-mother] families are far more likely to be poor and to form mother-only families than are offspring who live with two parents most of their pre-adult life." Nor is the intergenerational impact of single motherhood limited to African Americans, as many people seem to believe. Among white families, daughters of single parents are 53 percent more likely to marry as teenagers, 111 percent more likely to have children as teenagers, 164 percent more likely to have a premarital birth, and 92 percent more likely to dissolve their own marriages. All these intergenerational consequences of single motherhood increase the likelihood of chronic welfare dependency.
McLanahan cites three reasons why single-mother families are so vulnerable economically. For one thing, their earnings are low. Second, unless the mothers are widowed, they don't receive public subsidies large enough to lift them out of poverty. And finally, they do not get much support from family members-- especially the fathers of their children. In 1982 single white mothers received an average of $1,246 in alimony and child support, black mothers an average of $322. Such payments accounted for about 10 percent of the income of single white mothers and for about 3.5 percent of the income of single black mothers. These amounts were dramatically smaller than the income of the father in a two-parent family and also smaller than the income from a second earner in a two-parent family. Roughly 60 percent of single white mothers and 80 percent of single black mothers received no support at all.
Until the mid-1980s, when stricter standards were put in place, child-support awards were only about half to two-thirds what the current guidelines require. Accordingly, there is often a big difference in the living standards of divorced fathers and of divorced mothers with children. After divorce the average annual income of mothers and children is $13,500 for whites and $9,000 for nonwhites, as compared with $25,000 for white nonresident fathers and $13,600 for nonwhite nonresident fathers. Moreover, since child-support awards account for a smaller portion of the income of a high-earning father, the drop in living standards can be especially sharp for mothers who were married to upper-level managers and professionals.
Unwed mothers are unlikely to be awarded any child support at all, partly because the paternity of their children may not have been established. According to one recent study, only 20 percent of unmarried mothers receive child support. Even if single mothers escape poverty, economic uncertainty remains a condition of life. Divorce brings a reduction in income and standard of living for the vast majority of single mothers. One study, for example, found that income for mothers and children declines on average about 30 percent, while fathers experience a 10 to 15 percent increase in income in the year following a separation. Things get even more difficult when fathers fail to meet their child-support obligations. As a result, many divorced mothers experience a wearing uncertainty about the family budget: whether the check will come in or not; whether new sneakers can be bought this month or not; whether the electric bill will be paid on time or not. Uncertainty about money triggers other kinds of uncertainty. Mothers and children often have to move to cheaper housing after a divorce. One study shows that about 38 percent of divorced mothers and their children move during the first year after a divorce. Even several years later the rate of moves for single mothers is about a third higher than the rate for two-parent families. It is also common for a mother to change her job or increase her working hours or both following a divorce. Even the composition of the household is likely to change, with other adults, such as boyfriends or babysitters, moving in and out.
All this uncertainty can be devastating to children. Anyone who knows children knows that they are deeply conservative creatures. They like things to stay the same. So pronounced is this tendency that certain children have been known to request the same peanut-butter-and-jelly sandwich for lunch for years on end. Children are particularly set in their ways when it comes to family, friends, neighborhoods, and schools. Yet when a family breaks up, all these things may change. The novelist Pat Conroy has observed that "each divorce is the death of a small civilization." No one feels this more acutely than children.
Sara McLanahan's investigation and others like it have helped to establish a broad consensus on the economic impact of family disruption on children. Most social scientists now agree that single motherhood is an important and growing cause of poverty, and that children suffer as a result. (They continue to argue, however, about the relationship between family structure and such economic factors as income inequality, the loss of jobs in the inner city, and the growth of low-wage jobs.) By the mid-1980s, however, it was clear that the problem of family disruption was not confined to the urban underclass, nor was its sole impact economic. Divorce and out-of-wedlock childbirth were affecting middle- and upper-class children, and these more privileged children were suffering negative consequences as well. It appeared that the problems associated with family breakup were far deeper and far more widespread than anyone had previously imagined.
Judith Wallerstein is one of the pioneers in research on the long-term psychological impact of family disruption on children. The California Children of Divorce Study, which she directs, remains the most enduring study of the long-term effects of divorce on children and their parents. Moreover, it represents the best-known effort to look at the impact of divorce on middle-class children. The California children entered the study without pathological family histories. Before divorce they lived in stable, protected homes. And although some of the children did experience economic insecurity as the result of divorce, they were generally free from the most severe forms of poverty associated with family breakup. Thus the study and the resulting book (which Wallerstein wrote with Sandra Blakeslee), Second Chances: Men, Women, and Children a Decade After Divorce (1989), provide new insight into the consequences of divorce which are not associated with extreme forms of economic or emotional deprivation.
When, in 1971, Wallerstein and her colleagues set out to conduct clinical interviews with 131 children from the San Francisco area, they thought they were embarking on a short-term study. Most experts believed that divorce was like a bad cold. There was a phase of acute discomfort, and then a short recovery phase. According to the conventional wisdom, kids would be back on their feet in no time at all. Yet when Wallerstein met these children for a second interview more than a year later, she was amazed to discover that there had been no miraculous recovery. In fact, the children seemed to be doing worse.
The news that children did not "get over" divorce was not particularly welcome at the time. Wallerstein recalls, "We got angry letters from therapists, parents, and lawyers saying we were undoubtedly wrong. They said children are really much better off being released from an unhappy marriage. Divorce, they said, is a liberating experience." One of the main results of the California study was to overturn this optimistic view. In Wallerstein's cautionary words, "Divorce is deceptive. Legally it is a single event, but psychologically it is a chain--sometimes a never-ending chain--of events, relocations, and radically shifting relationships strung through time, a process that forever changes the lives of the people involved."
Five years after divorce more than a third of the children experienced moderate or severe depression. At ten years a significant number of the now young men and women appeared to be troubled, drifting, and underachieving. At fifteen years many of the thirtyish adults were struggling to establish strong love relationships of their own. In short, far from recovering from their parents' divorce, a significant percentage of these grownups were still suffering from its effects. In fact, according to Wallerstein, the long-term effects of divorce emerge at a time when young adults are trying to make their own decisions about love, marriage, and family. Not all children in the study suffered negative consequences. But Wallerstein's research presents a sobering picture of divorce. "The child of divorce faces many additional psychological burdens in addition to the normative tasks of growing up," she says.
Divorce not only makes it more difficult for young adults to establish new relationships. It also weakens the oldest primary relationship: that between parent and child. According to Wallerstein, "Parent-child relationships are permanently altered by divorce in ways that our society has not anticipated." Not only do children experience a loss of parental attention at the onset of divorce, but they soon find that at every stage of their development their parents are not available in the same way they once were. "In a reasonably happy intact family," Wallerstein observes, "the child gravitates first to one parent and then to the other, using skills and attributes from each in climbing the developmental ladder." In a divorced family, children find it "harder to find the needed parent at needed times." This may help explain why very young children suffer the most as the result of family disruption. Their opportunities to engage in this kind of ongoing process are the most truncated and compromised.
The father-child bond is severely, often irreparably, damaged in disrupted families. In a situation without historical precedent, an astonishing and disheartening number of American fathers are failing to provide financial support to their children. Often, more than the father's support check is missing. Increasingly, children are bereft of any contact with their fathers. According to the National Survey of Children, in disrupted families only one child in six, on average, saw his or her father as often as once a week in the past year. Close to half did not see their father at all in the past year. As time goes on, contact becomes even more infrequent. Ten years after a marriage breaks up, more than two thirds of children report not having seen their father for a year. Not surprisingly, when asked to name the "adults you look up to and admire," only 20 percent of children in single-parent families named their father, as compared with 52 percent of children in two-parent families. A favorite complaint among Baby Boom Americans is that their fathers were emotionally remote guys who worked hard, came home at night to eat supper, and didn't have much to say to or do with the kids. But the current generation has a far worse father problem: many of their fathers are vanishing entirely..
The deterioration in father-child bonds is most severe among children who experience divorce at an early age, according to a recent study. Nearly three quarters of the respondents, now young men and women, report having poor relationships with their fathers. Close to half have received psychological help, nearly a third have dropped out of high school, and about a quarter report having experienced high levels of problem behavior or emotional distress by the time they became young adults.
Since most children live with their mothers after divorce, one might expect that the mother-child bond would remain unaltered and might even be strengthened. Yet research shows that the mother-child bond is also weakened as the result of divorce. Only half of the children who were close to their mothers before a divorce remained equally close after the divorce. Boys, particularly, had difficulties with their mothers. Moreover, mother-child relationships deteriorated over time. Whereas teenagers in disrupted families were no more likely than teenagers in intact families to report poor relationships with their mothers, 30 percent of young adults from disrupted families have poor relationships with their mothers, as compared with 16 percent of young adults from intact families. Mother-daughter relationships often deteriorate as the daughter reaches young adulthood. The only group in society that derives any benefit from these weakened parent-child ties is the therapeutic community. Young adults from disrupted families are nearly twice as likely as those from intact families to receive psychological help.
Some social scientists have criticized Judith Wallerstein's research because her study is based on a small clinical sample and does not include a control group of children from intact families. However, other studies generally support and strengthen her findings. Nicholas Zill has found similar long-term effects on children of divorce, reporting that "effects of marital discord and family disruption are visible twelve to twenty-two years later in poor relationships with parents, high levels of problem behavior, and an increased likelihood of dropping out of high school and receiving psychological help." Moreover, Zill's research also found signs of distress in young women who seemed relatively well adjusted in middle childhood and adolescence. Girls in single-parent families are also at much greater risk for precocious sexuality, teenage marriage, teenage pregnancy, nonmarital birth, and divorce than are girls in two-parent families.
Zill's research shows that family disruption strongly affects school achievement as well. Children in disrupted families are nearly twice as likely as those in intact families to drop out of high school; among children who do drop out, those from disrupted families are less likely eventually to earn a diploma or a GED. Boys are at greater risk for dropping out than girls, and are also more likely to exhibit aggressive, acting-out behaviors. Other research confirms these findings. According to a study by the National Association of Elementary School Principals, 33 percent of two-parent elementary school students are ranked as high achievers, as compared with 17 percent of single-parent students. The children in single-parent families are also more likely to be truant or late or to have disciplinary action taken against them. Even after controlling for race, income, and religion, scholars find significant differences in educational attainment between children who grow up in intact families and children who do not. In his 1992 study America's Smallest School: The Family, Paul Barton shows that the proportion of two-parent families varies widely from state to state and is related to variations in academic achievement. North Dakota, for example, scores highest on the math-proficiency test and second highest on the two-parent-family scale. The District of Columbia is second lowest on the math test and lowest in the nation on the two-parent-family scale.
Zill notes that "while coming from a disrupted family significantly increases a young adult's risks of experiencing social, emotional or academic difficulties, it does not foreordain such difficulties. The majority of young people from disrupted families have successfully completed high school, do not currently display high levels of emotional distress or problem behavior, and enjoy reasonable relationships with their mothers." Nevertheless, a majority of these young adults do show maladjustment in their relationships with their fathers.
These findings underscore the importance of both a mother and a father in fostering the emotional well-being of children. Obviously, not all children in two-parent families are free from emotional turmoil, but few are burdened with the troubles that accompany family breakup. Moreover, as the sociologist Amitai Etzioni explains in a new book, The Spirit of Community, two parents in an intact family make up what might be called a mutually supportive education coalition. When both parents are present, they can play different, even contradictory, roles. One parent may goad the child to achieve, while the other may encourage the child to take time out to daydream or toss a football around. One may emphasize taking intellectual risks, while the other may insist on following the teacher's guidelines. At the same time, the parents regularly exchange information about the child's school problems and achievements, and have a sense of the overall educational mission. However, Etzioni writes,
The sequence of divorce followed by a succession of boy or girlfriends, a second marriage, and frequently another divorce and another turnover of partners often means a repeatedly disrupted educational coalition. Each change in participants involves a change in the educational agenda for the child. Each new partner cannot be expected to pick up the previous one's educational post and program. . . . As a result, changes in parenting partners mean, at best, a deep disruption in a child's education, though of course several disruptions cut deeper into the effectiveness of the educational coalition than just one..
The research overturns this optimistic assumption, however. In general the evidence suggests that remarriage neither reproduces nor restores the intact family structure, even when it brings more income and a second adult into the household. Quite the contrary. Indeed, children living with stepparents appear to be even more disadvantaged than children living in a stable single-parent family. Other difficulties seem to offset the advantages of extra income and an extra pair of hands. However much our modern sympathies reject the fairy-tale portrait of stepparents, the latest research confirms that the old stories are anthropologically quite accurate. Stepfamilies disrupt established loyalties, create new uncertainties, provoke deep anxieties, and sometimes threaten a child's physical safety as well as emotional security.
Parents and children have dramatically different interests in and expectations for a new marriage. For a single parent, remarriage brings new commitments, the hope of enduring love and happiness, and relief from stress and loneliness. For a child, the same event often provokes confused feelings of sadness, anger, and rejection. Nearly half the children in Wallerstein's study said they felt left out in their stepfamilies. The National Commission on Children, a bipartisan group headed by Senator John D. Rockefeller, of West Virginia, reported that children from stepfamilies were more likely to say they often felt lonely or blue than children from either single-parent or intact families. Children in stepfamilies were the most likely to report that they wanted more time with their mothers. When mothers remarry, daughters tend to have a harder time adjusting than sons. Evidently, boys often respond positively to a male presence in the household, while girls who have established close ties to their mother in a single-parent family often see the stepfather as a rival and an intruder. According to one study, boys in remarried families are less likely to drop out of school than boys in single-parent families, while the opposite is true for girls.
A large percentage of children do not even consider stepparents to be part of their families, according to the National Survey on Children. The NSC asked children, "When you think of your family, who do you include?" Only 10 percent of the children failed to mention a biological parent, but a third left out a stepparent. Even children who rarely saw their noncustodial parents almost always named them as family members. The weak sense of attachment is mutual. When parents were asked the same question, only one percent failed to mention a biological child, while 15 percent left out a stepchild. In the same study stepparents with both natural children and stepchildren said that it was harder for them to love their stepchildren than their biological children and that their children would have been better off if they had grown up with two biological parents.
One of the most severe risks associated with stepparent-child ties is the risk of sexual abuse. As Judith Wallerstein explains, "The presence of a stepfather can raise the difficult issue of a thinner incest barrier." The incest taboo is strongly reinforced, Wallerstein says, by knowledge of paternity and by the experience of caring for a child since birth. A stepfather enters the family without either credential and plays a sexual role as the mother's husband. As a result, stepfathers can pose a sexual risk to the children, especially to daughters. According to a study by the Canadian researchers Martin Daly and Margo Wilson, preschool children in stepfamilies are forty times as likely as children in intact families to suffer physical or sexual abuse. (Most of the sexual abuse was committed by a third party, such as a neighbor, a stepfather's male friend, or another nonrelative.) Stepfathers discriminate in their abuse: they are far more likely to assault nonbiological children than their own natural children.
Sexual abuse represents the most extreme threat to children's well-being. Stepfamilies also seem less likely to make the kind of ordinary investments in the children that other families do. Although it is true that the stepfamily household has a higher income than the single-parent household, it does not follow that the additional income is reliably available to the children. To begin with, children's claim on stepparents' resources is shaky. Stepparents are not legally required to support stepchildren, so their financial support of these children is entirely voluntary. Moreover, since stepfamilies are far more likely to break up than intact families, particularly in the first five years, there is always the risk--far greater than the risk of unemployment in an intact family--that the second income will vanish with another divorce. The financial commitment to a child's education appears weaker in stepparent families, perhaps because the stepparent believes that the responsibility for educating the child rests with the biological parent.
Similarly, studies suggest that even though they may have the time, the parents in stepfamilies do not invest as much of it in their children as the parents in intact families or even single parents do. A 1991 survey by the National Commission on Children showed that the parents in stepfamilies were less likely to be involved in a child's school life, including involvement in extracurricular activities, than either intact-family parents or single parents. They were the least likely to report being involved in such time-consuming activities as coaching a child's team, accompanying class trips, or helping with school projects. According to McLanahan's research, children in stepparent families report lower educational aspirations on the part of their parents and lower levels of parental involvement with schoolwork. In short, it appears that family income and the number of adults in the household are not the only factors affecting children's well-being.
There are several reasons for this diminished interest and investment. In the law, as in the children's eyes, stepparents are shadowy figures. According to the legal scholar David Chambers, family law has pretty much ignored stepparents. Chambers writes, "In the substantial majority of states, stepparents, even when they live with a child, have no legal obligation to contribute to the child's support; nor does a stepparent's presence in the home alter the support obligations of a noncustodial parent. The stepparent also has . . . no authority to approve emergency medical treatment or even to sign a permission slip. . . ." When a marriage breaks up, the stepparent has no continuing obligation to provide for a stepchild, no matter how long or how much he or she has been contributing to the support of the child. In short, Chambers says, stepparent relationships are based wholly on consent, subject to the inclinations of the adult and the child. The only way a stepparent can acquire the legal status of a parent is through adoption. Some researchers also point to the cultural ambiguity of the stepparent's role as a source of diminished interest, while others insist that it is the absence of a blood tie that weakens the bond between stepparent and child.
Whatever its causes, the diminished investment in children in both single-parent and stepparent families has a significant impact on their life chances. Take parental help with college costs. The parents in intact families are far more likely to contribute to children's college costs than are those in disrupted families. Moreover, they are usually able to arrive at a shared understanding of which children will go to college, where they will go, how much the parents will contribute, and how much the children will contribute. But when families break up, these informal understandings can vanish. The issue of college tuition remains one of the most contested areas of parental support, especially for higher-income parents.
The law does not step in even when familial understandings break down. In the 1980s many states lowered the age covered by child-support agreements from twenty-one to eighteen, thus eliminating college as a cost associated with support for a minor child. Consequently, the question of college tuition is typically not addressed in child-custody agreements. Even in states where the courts do require parents to contribute to college costs, the requirement may be in jeopardy. In a recent decision in Pennsylvania the court overturned an earlier decision ordering divorced parents to contribute to college tuition. This decision is likely to inspire challenges in other states where courts have required parents to pay for college. Increasingly, help in paying for college is entirely voluntary.
Judith Wallerstein has been analyzing the educational decisions of the college-age men and women in her study. She reports that "a full 42 percent of these men and women from middle class families appeared to have ended their educations without attempting college or had left college before achieving a degree at either the two-year or the four-year level." A significant percentage of these young people have the ability to attend college. Typical of this group are Nick and Terry, sons of a college professor. They had been close to their father before the divorce, but their father remarried soon after the divorce and saw his sons only occasionally, even though he lived nearby. At age nineteen Nick had completed a few junior-college courses and was earning a living as a salesman. Terry, twenty-one, who had been tested as a gifted student, was doing blue-collar work irregularly.
Sixty-seven percent of the college-age students from disrupted families attended college, as compared with 85 percent of other students who attended the same high schools. Of those attending college, several had fathers who were financially capable of contributing to college costs but did not. The withdrawal of support for college suggests that other customary forms of parental help-giving, too, may decline as the result of family breakup. For example, nearly a quarter of first-home purchases since 1980 have involved help from relatives, usually parents. The median amount of help is $5,000. It is hard to imagine that parents who refuse to contribute to college costs will offer help in buying first homes, or help in buying cars or health insurance for young adult family members. And although it is too soon to tell, family disruption may affect the generational transmission of wealth. Baby Boomers will inherit their parents' estates, some substantial, accumulated over a lifetime by parents who lived and saved together. To be sure, the postwar generation benefited from an expanding economy and a rising standard of living, but its ability to accumulate wealth also owed something to family stability. The lifetime assets, like the marriage itself, remained intact. It is unlikely that the children of disrupted families will be in so favorable a position.
Moreover, children from disrupted families may be less likely to help their aging parents. The sociologist Alice Rossi, who has studied intergenerational patterns of help-giving, says that adult obligation has its roots in early-childhood experience. Children who grow up in intact families experience higher levels of obligation to kin than children from broken families. Children's sense of obligation to a nonresidential father is particularly weak. Among adults with both parents living, those separated from their father during childhood are less likely than others to see the father regularly. Half of them see their father more than once a year, as compared with nine out of ten of those whose parents are still married. Apparently a kind of bitter justice is at work here. Fathers who do not support or see their young children may not be able to count on their adult children's support when they are old and need money, love, and attention.
In short, as Andrew Cherlin and Frank Furstenburg put it, "Through divorce and remarriage, individuals are related to more and more people, to each of whom they owe less and less." Moreover, as Nicholas Zill argues, weaker parent-child attachments leave many children more strongly exposed to influences outside the family, such as peers, boyfriends or girlfriends, and the media. Although these outside forces can sometimes be helpful, common sense and research opinion argue against putting too much faith in peer groups or the media as surrogates for Mom and Dad.
Family disruption would be a serious problem even if it affected only individual children and families. But its impact is far broader. Indeed, it is not an exaggeration to characterize it as a central cause of many of our most vexing social problems.. In fact, if family structure in the United States had remained relatively constant since 1960, the rate of child poverty would be a third lower than it is today. This does not bode well for the future. With more than half of today's children likely to live in single-parent families, poverty and associated welfare costs threaten to become even heavier burdens on the nation.
Crime in American cities has increased dramatically and grown more violent over recent decades. Much of this can be attributed to the rise in disrupted families. Nationally, more than 70 percent of all juveniles in state reform institutions come from fatherless homes. A number of scholarly studies find that even after the groups of subjects are controlled for income, boys from single-mother homes are significantly more likely than others to commit crimes and to wind up in the juvenile justice, court, and penitentiary systems. One such study summarizes the relationship between crime and one-parent families in this way: "The relationship breakup as the most important source of rising rates of crime.
Terrible as poverty and crime are, they tend to be concentrated in inner cities and isolated from the everyday experience of many Americans. The same cannot be said of the problem of declining school performance. Nowhere has the impact of family breakup been more profound or widespread than in the nation's public schools. There is a strong consensus that the schools are failing in their historic mission to prepare every American child to be a good worker and a good citizen. And nearly everyone agrees that the schools must undergo dramatic reform in order to reach that goal. In pursuit of that goal, moreover, we have suffered no shortage of bright ideas or pilot projects or bold experiments in school reform. But there is little evidence that measures such as curricular reform, school-based management, and school choice will address, let alone solve, the biggest problem schools face: the rising number of children who come from disrupted families.
The great educational tragedy of our time is that many American children are failing in school not because they are intellectually or physically impaired but because they are emotionally incapacitated. In schools across the nation principals report a dramatic rise in the aggressive, acting-out behavior characteristic of children, especially boys, who are living in single-parent families. The discipline problems in today's suburban schools--assaults on teachers, unprovoked attacks on other students, screaming outbursts in class--outstrip the problems that were evident in the toughest city schools a generation ago. Moreover, teachers find many children emotionally distracted, so upset and preoccupied by the explosive drama of their own family lives that they are unable to concentrate on such mundane matters as multiplication tables.
In response, many schools have turned to therapeutic remediation. not only to developing minds but also to repairing hearts. As a result, the mission of the school, along with the culture of the classroom, is slowly changing. What we are seeing, largely as a result of the new burdens of family disruption, is the psychologization of American education.
Taken together, the research presents a powerful challenge to the prevailing view of family change as social progress. Not a single one of the assumptions underlying that view can be sustained against the empirical evidence. Single-parent families are not able to do well economically on a mother's income. In fact, most teeter on the economic brink, and many fall into poverty and welfare dependency. Growing up in a disrupted family does not enrich a child's life or expand the number of adults committed to the child's well-being. In fact, disrupted families threaten the psychological well-being of children and diminish the investment of adult time and money in them. Family diversity in the form of increasing numbers of single-parent and stepparent families does not strengthen the social fabric. It dramatically weakens and undermines society, placing new burdens on schools, courts, prisons, and the welfare system. These new families are not an improvement on the nuclear family, nor are they even just as good, whether you look at outcomes for children or outcomes for society as a whole. In short, far from representing social progress, family change represents a stunning example of social regress.
All this evidence gives rise to an obvious conclusion: growing up in an intact two-parent family is an important source of advantage for American children. Though far from perfect as a social institution, the intact family offers children greater security and better outcomes than its fast-growing alternatives: single-parent and stepparent families. Not only does the intact family protect the child from poverty and economic insecurity; it also provides greater noneconomic investments of parental time, attention, and emotional support over the entire life course. This does not mean that all two-parent families are better for children than all single parent families. But in the face of the evidence it becomes increasingly difficult to sustain the proposition that all family structures produce equally good outcomes for children.
Curiously, many in the research community are hesitant to say that two-parent families generally promote better outcomes for children than single-parent families. Some argue that we need finer measures of the extent of the family-structure effect. As one scholar has noted, it is possible, by disaggregating the data in certain ways, to make family structure "go away" as an independent variable. Other researchers point to studies that show that children suffer psychological effects as a result of family conflict preceding family breakup. Consequently, they reason, it is the conflict rather than the structure of the family that is responsible for many of the problems associated with family disruption. Others, including Judith Wallerstein, caution against treating children in divorced families and children in intact families as separate populations, because doing so tends to exaggerate the differences between the two groups. "We have to take this family by family," Wallerstein says.
Some of the caution among researchers can also be attributed to ideological pressures. Privately, social scientists worry that their research may serve ideological causes that they themselves do not support, or that their work may be misinterpreted as an attempt to "tell people what to do." Some are fearful that they will be attacked by feminist colleagues, or, more generally, that their comments will be regarded as an effort to turn back the clock to the 1950s--a goal that has almost no constituency in the academy. Even more fundamental, it has become risky for anyone--scholar, politician, religious leader--to make normative statements today. This reflects not only the persistent drive toward "value neutrality" in the professions but also a deep confusion about the purposes of public discourse. The dominant view appears to be that social criticism, like criticism of individuals, is psychologically damaging. The worst thing you can do is to make people feel guilty or bad about themselves.
When one sets aside these constraints, however, the case against the two-parent family is remarkably weak. It is true that disaggregating data can make family structure less significant as a factor, just as disaggregating Hurricane Andrew into wind, rain, and tides can make it disappear as a meteorological phenomenon. Nonetheless, research opinion as well as common sense suggests that the effects of changes in family structure are great enough to cause concern. Nicholas Zill argues that many of the risk factors for children are doubled or more than doubled as the result of family disruption. "In epidemiological terms," he writes, "the doubling of a hazard is a substantial increase. . . . the increase in risk that dietary cholesterol poses for cardiovascular disease, for example, is far less than double, yet millions of Americans have altered their diets because of the perceived hazard."
The argument that family conflict, rather than the breakup of parents, is the cause of children's psychological distress is persuasive on its face. Children who grow up in high-conflict families, whether the families stay together or eventually split up, are undoubtedly at great psychological risk. And surely no one would dispute that there must be societal measures available, including divorce, to remove children from families where they are in danger. Yet only a minority of divorces grow out of pathological situations; much more common are divorces in families unscarred by physical assault. Moreover, an equally compelling hypothesis is that family breakup generates its own conflict. Certainly, many families exhibit more conflictual and even violent behavior as a consequence of divorce than they did before divorce.
Finally, it is important to note that clinical insights are different from sociological findings. Clinicians work with individual families, who cannot and should not be defined by statistical aggregates. Appropriate to a clinical approach, moreover, is a focus on the internal dynamics of family functioning and on the immense variability in human behavior. Nevertheless, there is enough empirical evidence to justify sociological statements about the causes of declining child well-being and to demonstrate that despite the plasticity of human response, there are some useful rules of thumb to guide our thinking about and policies affecting the family.
For example, Sara McLanahan says, three structural constants are commonly associated with intact families, even intact families who would not win any "Family of the Year" awards. The first is economic. In intact families, children share in the income of two adults. Indeed, as a number of analysts have pointed out, the two parent family is becoming more rather than less necessary, because more and more families need two incomes to sustain a middle-class standard of living.
McLanahan believes that most intact families also provide a stable authority structure. Family breakup commonly upsets the established boundaries of authority in a family. Children are often required to make decisions or accept responsibilities once considered the province of parents. Moreover, children, even very young children, are often expected to behave like mature adults, so that the grown-ups in the family can be free to deal with the emotional fallout of the failed relationship. In some instances family disruption creates a complete vacuum in authority; everyone invents his or her own rules. With lines of authority disrupted or absent, children find it much more difficult to engage in the normal kinds of testing behavior, the trial and error, the failing and succeeding, that define the developmental pathway toward character and competence. McLanahan says, "Children need to be the ones to challenge the rules. The parents need to set the boundaries and let the kids push the boundaries. The children shouldn't have to walk the straight and narrow at all times."
Finally, McLanahan holds that children in intact families benefit from stability in what she neutrally terms "household personnel." Family disruption frequently brings new adults into the family, including stepparents, live-in boyfriends or girlfriends, and casual sexual partners. Like stepfathers, boyfriends can present a real threat to children's, particularly to daughters', security and well-being. But physical or sexual abuse represents only the most extreme such threat. Even the very best of boyfriends can disrupt and undermine a child's sense of peace and security, McLanahan says. "It's not as though you're going from an unhappy marriage to peacefulness. There can be a constant changing until the mother finds a suitable partner."
McLanahan's argument helps explain why children of widows tend to do better than children of divorced or unmarried mothers. Widows differ from other single mothers in all three respects. They are economically more secure, because they receive more public assistance through Survivors Insurance, and possibly private insurance or other kinds of support from family members. Thus widows are less likely to leave the neighborhood in search of a new or better job and a cheaper house or apartment. Moreover, the death of a father is not likely to disrupt the authority structure radically. When a father dies, he is no longer physically present, but his death does not dethrone him as an authority figure in the child's life. On the contrary, his authority may be magnified through death. The mother can draw on the powerful memory of the departed father as a way of intensifying her parental authority: "Your father would have wanted it this way." Finally, since widows tend to be older than divorced mothers, their love life may be less distracting.
Regarding the two-parent family, the sociologist David Popenoe, who has devoted much of his career to the study of families, both in the United States and in Scandinavia, makes this straightforward assertion: Social science research is almost never conclusive. There are always methodological difficulties and stones left unturned. Yet in three decades of work as a social scientist, I know of few other bodies of data in which the weight of evidence is so decisively on one side of the issue: on the whole, for children, two-parent families are preferable to single-parent and stepfamilies.
The rise in family disruption is not unique to American society. It is evident in virtually all advanced nations, including Japan, where it is also shaped by the growing participation of women in the work force. Yet the United States has made divorce easier and quicker than in any other Western nation with the sole exception of Sweden--and the trend toward solo motherhood has also been more pronounced in America. (Sweden has an equally high rate of out-of-wedlock birth, but the majority of such births are to cohabiting couples, a long-established pattern in Swedish society.) More to the point, nowhere has family breakup been greeted by a more triumphant rhetoric of renewal than in America.
What is striking about this rhetoric is how deeply it reflects classic themes in American public life. It draws its language and imagery from the nation's founding myth. It depicts family breakup as a drama of revolution and rebirth. The nuclear family represents the corrupt past, an institution guilty of the abuse of power and the suppression of individual freedom. Breaking up the family is like breaking away from Old World tyranny. Liberated from the bonds of the family, the individual can achieve independence and experience a new beginning, a fresh start, a new birth of freedom. In short, family breakup recapitulates the American experience.
This rhetoric is an example of what the University of Maryland political philosopher William Galston has called the "regime effect." The founding of the United States set in motion a new political order based to an unprecedented degree on individual rights, personal choice, and egalitarian relationships. Since then these values have spread beyond their original domain of political relationships to define social relationships as well. During the past twenty-five years these values have had a particularly profound impact on the family.
Increasingly, political principles of individual rights and choice shape our understanding of family commitment and solidarity. Family relationships are viewed not as permanent or binding but as voluntary and easily terminable. Moreover, under the sway of the regime effect the family loses its central importance as an institution in the civil society, accomplishing certain social goals such as raising children and caring for its members, and becomes a means to achieving greater individual happiness--a lifestyle choice. Thus, Galston says, what is happening to the American family reflects the "unfolding logic of authoritative, deeply American moral-political principles."
One benefit of the regime effect is to create greater equality in adult family relationships. Husbands and wives, mothers and fathers, enjoy relationships far more egalitarian than past relationships were, and most Americans prefer it that way. But the political principles of the regime effect can threaten another kind of family relationship--that between parent and child. Owing to their biological and developmental immaturity, children are needy dependents. They are not able to express their choices according to limited, easily terminable, voluntary agreements. They are not able to act as negotiators in family decisions, even those that most affect their own interests. As one writer has put it, "a newborn does not make a good 'partner.'" Correspondingly, the parental role is antithetical to the spirit of the regime. Parental investment in children involves a diminished investment in self, a willing deference to the needs and claims of the dependent child. Perhaps more than any other family relationship, the parent-child relationship--shaped as it is by patterns of dependency and deference--can be undermined and weakened by the principles of the regime..
To take one example: independence is basic to successful functioning in American life. We assume that most people in America will be able to work, care for themselves and their families, think for themselves, and inculcate the same traits of independence and initiative in their children. We depend on families to teach people to do these things. The erosion of the two-parent family undermines the capacity of families to impart this knowledge; children of long-term welfare dependent single parents are far more likely than others to be dependent themselves. Similarly, the children in disrupted families have a harder time forging bonds of trust with others and giving and getting help across the generations. This, too, may lead to greater dependency on the resources of the state..
Nonetheless, as Galston is quick to point out, the regime effect is not an irresistible undertow that will carry away the family. It is more like a swift current, against which it is possible to swim. People learn; societies can change, particularly when it becomes apparent that certain behaviors damage the social ecology, threaten the public order, and impose new burdens on core institutions. Whether Americans will act to overcome the legacy of family disruption is a crucial but as yet unanswered question.
Join the DiscussionAfter you comment, click Post. If you’re not already logged in you will be asked to log in or register. blog comments powered by Disqus |
King’s House; June 20, 1820
He was renowned as the greatest gentleman privateer of his era, an accolade that amused him to no end. Gentleman and privateer were two words that should never be uttered in the same sentence, even if he was an exception to that rule. Cliff de Warenne, third and youngest son of the earl of Adare, stared at the newly constructed hanging block, unsmiling. While it was true that he had yet to lose a battle or his quarry, he did not take death lightly. He estimated that he had already used up at least six lives, and hoped he has at least three left.
A hanging always brought out the biggest crowd. Every rogue and planter, every lady and whore, were flocking into the city to watch the pirate hang. Tomorrow they would be breathless with anticipation and excitement. There would be applause when the pirate’s neck was broken with a loud, jarring snap. There would be cheers.
A tall, towering man with tawny, too long, sun-streaked hair and a bronze complexion. Cliff had the brilliant blue eyes; the de Warenne men were famous for. He was clad casually in high boots, pale white doeskin breeches and a fine linen shirt, but he was heavily armed. Even in polite society he kept a dagger in his belt, a stiletto in his boot, for he had gained his fortune the hard way, and he had made his share of enemies. Besides, in the islands, he had no time for fashion.
Cliff realized that he was later for his appointment with colonial the governor. But several fashionably dressed ladies were just entering the square, one a gorgeous beauty. They glanced his way, whispering excitedly. He saw that they were on their way to the scaffolding to inspect the site of tomorrows hanging. Under usual circumstances, he would mark one for his bed, but he could sense their bloodlust and he was frankly disgusted by it.
The imposing entrance of King’s House was directly behind him as he watched the three women stroll to the hanging block. The incessant fascination of the elegant ladies of the ton and island society was convenient; like all the de Warenne men, he was very virile. He recognized the blond, the wife of a gentleman planter he knew well, but the dark beauty was undoubtedly new to the island. She smiled at him, clearly aware of who and what he was, and as clearly offering him her services, should he wish to accept the,.
He did not. He nodded politely at her and he held his gaze before tuning away. He was a nobleman and a legitimate merchantman. When he was not accepting letters of marquee, but, the whispers of “rogue: and “rover” wafted after him anyway. He had even been called a pirate by one particularly passionate lover. The truth was, even having been raised a gentleman, he was more at home in Spanish town than Dublin, in Kingston than London, and he made no secret of it. When he was on the deck of his ship in the midst of the hunt, no man could possibly be a gentleman. Gentility meant death.
But he had never care about the whispers. He made his life into exactly what he wished, without his father’s helping hand, and he had earned his reputation as one of the greatest masters of the sea. Although he always earned for Ireland, the loveliest place in the world, it was on the main that he was free. Even at the earl’s estate, surrounded by the family he cherished, he was aware that he was not at all like his two brothers—the heir and the spare. Compared to his land-and-duty-bound brothers, he was very much a buccaneer. Society accused him of being different, an eccentric and an outsider, and they were right.
Just before Cliff turned to enter King’s House, two more ladies met with the trio, the crowd in the square growing. A gentleman whom he recognised as a successful Kingston merchant had joined the ladies, as had a few sailors.
“Hope he’s enjoyin” his last meal,” one of the sailors laughed.
“Is it true he slit the throat of an English naval officer?” One of the women gasped. “And painted his cabin with the blood?”
“It’s an old pirate tradition,” the sailor replied, grinning.
Cliff rolled his eyes at the absurd accusation.
“Do they hang many pirates here?” the beauty asked breathlessly.
Cliff turned away. The hanging was going to be a circus, he thought grimly.
And the irony of it all was that Rodney Carre was one of the least menacing and unsuccessful rovers at sea; he would hang because Governor Woods was determined to set an example any way the he could. Carre’s crimes were pitiful in comparison to those of the ruthless Cuban rovers now raging in the Caribbean, but Carre was the one inept enough to have been caught.
He knew the man, but not well. Carre was frequently in Kingston Harbor to careen his ship or unload his goods, and Cliff’s island hone, Windsong, was on the northwest end of Harbor Street. They’d exchanged only a few dozen words in the dozen years, and usually merely nodded at on another in passing. He had no real reason to be dismayed over Carre’s fate.
“And the pirate’s daughter?” one of the asked excitedly. “Will they hang her too?”
“La Sauvage?” The gentleman spoke. “She hasn’t been captured, and besides, I don’t think anyone on this island accuse her of a crime.”
Cliff realized why he was so disturbed. Carre was leaving behind a daughter. She was too young to be charged with piracy. Even if she had sailed with her father.
It was not really his affair, he thought grimly as he turned back to King’s House. Yet he recalled her vividly now, for he had glimpsed her from time to time, riding the waves like a porpoise in nothing but a chemise or standing boldly in the bow of her canoe, recklessly denying the wind and the sea. They had never met, but like everyone else on the island, he knew her instantly upon a single glimpse. She seemed to run wild about the island beaches and on the city streets and was impossible to miss with her long, tangled moon–colored hair. She was wild and free and he had admired her from a distance for years.
Uneasy. He shifted his thoughts. He would not even be in Spanishtown tomorrow when Carre was hanged. Instead he wondered at Wood’s summons. They were friends—they had frequently worked together on island policy and even on legislation, and in Woods’s term of office, Cliff had accepted two commissions from him. Successfully capturing the foreign brigands. Woods was a resolute politician and governor and Cliff respected him. On one or two occasions, they had caroused together, as well—Woods was fond of the ladies, too, when his wife was not in residence.
Two British solders sprang forward as he strode past the six Ionic columns that supported a pediment displaying the British coat of arms to the huge doors to the governor’s residence, the gold and ruby spurs he wore jangling. “Captain de Warenne, sir” one said, relaxing. “Governor Woods said you are to go in immediately.”
Cliff nodded at him and entered a vast foyer with a crystal chandelier. Standing on the waxed parquet floors of the circular entry, he could glimpse a formal salon done up in red velvets and brocades.
Thomas Woods rose from behind a desk, smiling as he saw him. “Cliff! Come in, my good man, come in!”
Cliff strode in to the salon, shaking Woods hand. The governor was a lean, handsome man in his thirties, with a dark moustache. “Good day, Thomas. I see the hanging will happen as scheduled.” The words slipped, unbidden
Woods nodded, pleased. “You have been gone for almost three months—you have no idea what this means.”
“Of course I do,” Cliff said, that odd tension filling him again, as he wondered at the pirate’s daughter’s future. It crossed his that maybe he would visit Carre at the garrison in Port Royal. “Does Carre remain at Fort Charles?”
“He has been moved to the courthouse jail.” Woods responded. The newly constructed courthouse, completed the previous year, was directly across the square from King’s House. Woods went to the bar built into the huge Dutch sideboard on one wall and poured two glasses of wine. He handed Cliff a glass. “To the morrow’s hanging, Cliff.”
Cliff did not join him in the toast. “Maybe you should attempt to capture the pirates flying the flag of Jose Artigas,” he said, referring to the gaucho general who was at war with both Portugal and Spain. “Rodney Carre has nothing in common with those murdering villains, my friend.”
Woods smiled firmly. “Ah, I was hoping you could tackle Artigas’s men.”
Cliff was interested, as the hunt was in his blood. Woods was now offering him a dangerous commission, one he would not usually think twice about accepting. However, he remained on another tack. “Carre has never been foolish enough to attack British interests,” he commented, taking a sip of his claret.
Woods started. “So he is a decent pirate? A good pirate? And what is the point of your defence? He has been tried and found guilty, he hangs tomorrow at noon.”
An image came to mind, one he could not chase away. Her hair as pale as a bright star, her shirt and breeches soaking wet, La Sauvage lifted her slim arms overhead and dived off the bow of her father’s sloop into the sea below. He had been coming home last year and standing the quarterdeck of his favorite frigate. The Fair Lady, when he had spotted her through his spyglass. He had paused to watch her surface, laughing, and had almost wished he could dive into the calm turquoise sea with her.
“What about the child?” he heard himself say. He had no idea of her age, but she was small and slender and he guessed she was somewhere between twelve and fourteen.
Woods seemed startled. ‘Carre’s daughter—La Sauvage?”
“I heard their farm was forfeit to the Crown. What will become of her?”
“Good God, Cliff I do not know. Rumor has it she has family in England. Maybe she will go there. Or I suppose she could go to the Sisters of St. Anne’s in Seville—they have an asylum for the orphaned.”
Cliff was shocked. He just could not imagine a spirit like that imprisoned in such a manner. And this was the first he heard of the child having family in Britain. But then, Carre had once been a British naval officer, so it was certainly possible.
Woods stared, “You are behaving oddly, my friend. I asked you to come here today because I was hoping you would accept a commission from me.”
Cliff shoved his thoughts of Carre’s daughter aside. He felt himself smile. “May I hope that you seek El Toreador?” he asked, referring to the most vicious of the rovers plaguing the area.
Woods grinned. “You may.”
“I am more than pleased to accept the commission,” Cliff said meaning it. The hunt would surely erase his irascible mood and the restlessness gnawing at him. He had been at Windsong for precisely three weeks—usually he stayed a month or two—and his only regret would be leaving his children. He had both a son and a daughter at his island home, and when he was at sea or abroad, he missed them terribly.
“Shall we go in and dine? I have asked my chef to make your favorite dishes,” Woods said happily, clasping Cliff’s arm. “We can discuss the details of the commission. I am also eager to ask for your opinions on the new venture in the East Indies. Surely you have heard of the Phelps Company?”
Cliff was about to affirm that he had, when he heard the soldiers at the governor’s front door shouting in alarm. Instantly he drew his sabre. “Get back,” he ordered Woods.
The governor paled, a small pistol appearing in his hand, but he obeyed, hurrying to the far end of the salon while Cliff strode in the foyer. He heard a soldier gasping in pain, and another fellow shout, “You cannot go inside!”
The front door burst open and a small, slender woman with a pass of pale hair ran through it, waving a pistol.
‘Where is the governor?” She demanded wildly, pointing the gun at him.
The most vivid green eyes he had ever beheld locked with his and he forgot that a pistol was pointed at his forehead. He stared, shocked. La Sauvage was not a child: she was a young woman and a very beautiful young woman, at that. Her face was triangular, her cheekbones high, her nose small and straight, her mouth lush and full. But it was her eyes, as exotic as a jungle cat’s.
His gaze swept down her figure. Her moon-colored hair was exactly as he had thought—a wild curly mane that reached her waist. She wore a huge man’s shirt, hanging to mid-thigh, but there was no mistaking the suggestion of a bosom beneath it. Her legs were encased in breeches and a lad’s boots, and were unmistakably long and feminine.
How could he have assumes, even from a distance, that she was a child, he wondered inanely.
“Are you a dimwit?” She shouted at him. “Where is Woods?”
He drew a breath and somehow smiled, his composure returned. “Miss Carre, please do not point the pistol at me. Is it loaded?” He asked very calmly.
She paled as if just recognizing him. “de Warenne.” She swallowed. The pistol wavered. “Woods. I must see Woods.”
So she knew him, somewhat. Then she knew he was not to be toyed with. Did she know that anyone else would die for brandishing a weapon at him in such a manner? Was she that brave, or that foolish—and desperate? His smile intensified, but he was not feeling amused. He had to swiftly end the crisis, before she was hurt or arrested. “Give me the pistol, Miss Carre.”
She shook her head. “Where is he?”
He sighed—and moved. Before she knew it, he had her wrist in his hands, and an instant later, he had her pistol.
Tears filled her eyes and he knew they were tears of rage. “Damm you!” She struck at him with both fists, pummelling his chest.
He handed the pistol to one of the wary soldiers and caught her wrists again, more gently, not wanting to hurt her. He was surprised at her strength; she was so slender she appeared frail, but she was not. However, she had no power compare to him. ‘Please cease. You will hurt yourself,” he said softly.
She was writhing in his grasp like a wildcat, hissing and spitting like one too, and even attempting to claw at his face.
“Stop,” he ordered, becoming annoyed. “You cannot triumph over me.”
Suddenly her eyes met his and she stilled, panting heavily. And as their gaze held, he felt a stirring of compassion for her. Even if she was eighteen, he sensed she was a child in many ways due to her unorthodox upbringing. And new he recognised more than desperation in her eyes; he saw her fear.
Tomorrow, her father would hang. Today she thought to accost the governor. “Surely you do not think to murder my friend Woods?”
“I would if I could,” she spat at him. “But no, I will delay his murder for another day!” She began to struggle uselessly again. “I have come to beg him for mercy for my father.”
His heart seemed to break. “If I release you, will you be still? I can arrange an audience with the governor.”
Hope flared in her eyes. She nodded, wetting her lips. “Yes”
He hesitated, confused at his odd emotions. It wasn’t appropriate, but he wondered how old she was. Of course, he was not interested in her, not that way. How could he be? She too young, and she was a pirate’s daughter. His last mistress had been a Hapsburg Princes, acclaimed to the greatest beauty on the Continent. His daughter’s mother, who was deceased, had been an exotic and beautiful concubine, enslave in the harem of a Barbary prince. Rachel had been a Jewess, highly educated and one of the most intelligent women he had ever met. He was very discriminating when it came to the ladies who shared his bed. He could not be interest in w eirld0wyes waif brandishing a pistol the way other carried parasols.
She was regarding him with a very neutral expression now. His instincts sharpened. “You will behave,” It wasn’t a question.
Her mouth formed a small, unenthusiastic smile.
Now he was alarmed. Was she hiding another weapon perhaps beneath that voluminous shirt? While she was not a lay, he did not feel comfortable searching her. “Miss Carre, give me your word that you will behave in a courteous and respectful manner while in the governor’s house.”
She gave him a puzzled look, as if she did not under a word he had said, but she nodded.
He briefly touched her arm, in the hopes of guiding her toward the salon, but she flinched and he did not attempt to touch her again. “Thomas? Would you mind stepping out? I should like to introduce you to Miss Carre.”
Woods strode forward to the threshold of the salon. He was grim, his color now high. “A mere waif got by my guards?” He was disbelieving.
Cliff recognised his rising temper. “She is worried about her father, and rightly so. I promised her you would allow her to speak.”
Woods seemed about to refuse. “She assaults my men! Robards, are you harmed in any manner?”
The British soldier remained alert and stiffly at attention in the foyer his fellow officer inside the house by the front door. He was flushed. “No, sir, Governor, I apologise for the terrible intrusion.”
“How did he manage to get past you?” Woods was incredulous.
Robard’s high color increased. “Sir, I don’t know—“
“I asked them to help me find my little lost puppy doe,” La Sauvage said, her tone absurdly coy, and she batted her lashes at Governor Woods. Then she swung her hips from side to side and shed a tear. “They were so concerned!”
Cliff stared, quickly reassessing La Sauvage, She had known how to use her considerable female allure to entrap the soldiers. She wasn’t as innocent, then, as she appeared.
Woods turned a cold regard on her, “Arrest her>”
She gasped, and whirled to gaze at Cliff with shock. The surprise became an accusation as the soldiers stepped towards her. “You promised!”
He stepped in front of her, blocking the two soldiers and preventing them from seizing her. “Do not,” he warned very softly. His tone was one he only used when he intended to follow it up with a dire consequence.
Both soldiers froze.
“Cliff! She assaulted my!” Woods objected.
She turned to face the governor. “And you are hanging my father!” She shouted furiously.
Cliff took her arm, intending to restrain her if need be, but also aware of the urge to protect her. “Thomas, you owe me more than one favor, if I recall, I am collecting now. Hear her out.”
Woods stared, dismayed. “Damm it, de Warenne,” he said, very low. “Why are you doing this?”
“Hear her out,” Cliff said even more softly. It was a command.
Woods expression filled with distaste. He gestured for La Sauvage to precede him into the salon.
She shook her head, her beautiful green eyes narrowing shrewdly. “You first.” She smiled coldly. “I never walk ahead of my enemies.”
Silently, Cliff applauded her. He worried again, however, that she might be concealing more weapons.
Woods sighed. “Robards, you may wait where you are. Johns, please return to your post outside of the front door.” As both soldiers obeyed, he strode grimly into the salon. La Sauvage was about to follow, but Cliff had seen her hide a smile and he seized her arm. “Hey! What do you think you’re doing?” She demanded.
Very softly, so Woods could not hear, he murmured, “You are unarmed, are you not?”
She stared into his eyes. “Am I a fool? Of course I’m not armed.”
She did not blink, not once. Her cheeks did not color. Her gaze did not waver. Yet he knew, without a doubt that she was lying.
His grip tightened. She began to protest, trying to pull back, but he restrained her. “I beg your pardon,” he said grimly, aware that he was flushing. With his free hand, over her shirt, he touched her waist, expecting to find another pistol strapped inside her shirt there. Instead, he was stunned at how narrow her waist was with no flesh to spare. He could probably close both of his hands around her, if he tried.
“Get your paws off me,” she gasped, outraged.
He ignored her, sliding his hand to the small of her back and trying not to this about drifting it lower. She started to struggle. “Lecher!”
“Be still,” he growled, feeling the other side of her waist.
‘Are you happy now?” she demanded, remaining scarlet but wriggling impossibly.
“You are making this difficult.” He said, and then he stopped. Something was strapped beneath her shirt on the ledt side of her waist.
She started to pull against him
He gave her a look, slid his ghand under her shirt and over the sharp edge of the dagger taped to her ribs.
“Damm you!” she hissed, attempting to twist away.
To his shock, the heavy underside of a full and bare breast bumped into his hand as he seize the knife.
She went still and so did he.
“Bastars!” She pulled free.
He tried to breathe, but he was aroused. Beneath that loose oversize shirst was an intriguing bodu, one that belonged to a mature woman. He slid her dagger into his belt. It was a moment before he could speak. “You lied.”
She gave him a furious look and marched after Woods into the salon.
He hoped she did not have another dagger taped somewhere else, perhaps on her hip or high thight/ He could not understand his respionse to her body, so lim in some places and far too soft in others. He’s had hundreds of beautiful, alluring women. He allowed himself desire when the moment was appropriate or when it suited him. He was not a green boy and he could control his lust. He did not want to feel any stirrings, now or ever, for La Sauvage. But his body had betrayed him.
He was very displeased,
He strode into the salon, leaving the door open. The governor had chosen to sit in a huge armchair, so that he appeared more royalty appointed. He indicated that she might speak, the gesture abrript and somehow disrespectful.
Cliff didn’t care for his manner. Clearly, Woods had made up his mind and nothing La Sauvage could day or do would change it.
But she began to cry, tears running down her breathtaking face. He knew the tears were contrived, born of her fear and desperation.
“Give her a genuine opportunity to speak,” he said to Woods.
“I do not need this,” Woods groused. He was angry.
“Please,” she whispered, the sound soft and feminine, a plea, and she clasped her hands as if in prayer before her chest. The gesture drew her shirt tight, revealing the shape of her surprising lush bosom. Cliff stared, instantly distracted, and so did Woods, apparently not oblivious to her allure, either.
“My lord, my father is all I’ve got. He is a good man. Sir, a good gather. He’s not really a pirate, you know. He’s a planter and you can got to Belle Mer to see for yourself. We have one of the best crops in years!”
“I think we both know he has committed numerous acts of piracy.” Woods said sternly.
Tears streaked her lovely face and she sank to her knees.
Cliff tensed. Her face was level with the governor’s lap. Did she know how
provocative her position was? “He has never been a pirate, you are wrong,
sir! The jury was wrong! He has been a privateer. He has worked for Britain,
hunting pirates—just like Captain de Warenne. If you will pardon him, he
will never sail again, ever.”
“Miss Carre, please get up. We both know your father has nothing common with Lord de Warenne.”
She didn’t move. Her full, lush mouth began to tremble. Even she had been standing, it was so provocative it would have been impossible to ignore. But she was on her knees, as if a skilled whore before a paying client. Woods was staring at her mouth. His face had become taut, his dark eyes turning black.
Cliff did not like what was happening.
“I can’t lose him,” she whispered throatily. “If you pardon him, he will obey the law like a saint. And I…” she stopped, licking her lips, “I will be so grateful, sir, forever grateful, no matter what…you ask me…to do.”
Woods eyes were wide, but he did not move.
She would prostitute herself for her father? Cliff seized her arm, hauling her to her feet. “I believe that’s enough.”
She turned a murderous glare at him. “No one wants you here! Leave me be! I am talking to the governor! Go mind your own affairs!”
“Propositioning him, is more like it,” Cliff said, feeling quite furious himself. He yanked her once. “Be quiet.” He faced Woods. “Thomas, why not pardon Carre? If his daughter is being truthful, he will give up his roving. If not, I promise you I will bring him in myself.”
Woods slowly stood. He briefly glanced at Cliff but then his gaze returned to La Sauvage. Although she stood straight and tall, she was trembling. I am going to consider your proposal, Miss Carre.”
Her eyes widened. So did Cliff’s. “You are?”
“I intend to spend the night doing so.” He paused, allowing his words to sink in.
And Cliff was livid, for he understood.
But La Sauvage was not as experienced as either of the men and it took her a moment. Then she drew herself up straighter. She was not red-faced. ‘Can I wait here, for your decision?”
“Of course.” He finally smiled at her.
Cliff stepped in front of him. “And to think I have thought of you as a friend,” he said tersely.
Woods raised both brows. “I am certain you would avail yourself of such an opportunity, as well. Now you defend her virtue?” He was amused.
It seemed that was what he was doing. “May I assume Mrs. Woods remains in London?”
“She is actually in France.” He was not perturbed. “Come, Cliff, do calm down. We shall adjourn to our delayed luncheon, while Miss Carre rest and awaits my decision.”
“I’m sorry, I have lost my appetite.” He turned to La Sauvage. “Let’s go.”
She was standing there, appearing very young and very grim—and very resolute. She might have been on the way to the gallows. She shook her head. “I’m staying.”
“Like hell,” he said softly and dangerously.
And the tears filled her eyes—real tears. “Go away de Warenne. Leave me be.”
Cliff fought with himself. Why did he care? She seemed young, but she couldn’t possibly be innocent, not having lived the kind of life she had. He wasn’t her protector.
“You heard the…lady,” Woods said softly. “She won’t be hurt, Cliff. In fact, she might be pleased.
He was blinded by a kind of rage he hadn’t ever experience. Images danced in his mind. Woods embracing La Sauvage, Woods ruthlessly availing himself on her slender, yet lush body. He fought to breathe, and when he could speak, he looked at the governor. “Don’t do this.”
“Why? She’s a beauty, even if her odor is offensive.”
She smelled of the sea and Cliff did not find it offensive at all. “She is expecting a pardon.”
“And are you her champion?” Woods was amused.
“I wish to champion no one,” he said sharply.
“Stop talking about me as if I am not here,” she cried to them both
Cliff slowly faced her. “Come with me,” he said. “You do not need to do this.”
She stared at him, as white as a sheet. “I need to free my father.”
Then get a written contract—your services for his pardon.” He was terse.
She seemed puzzled. “I can’t read.”
He made a harsh sound and faced the governor. “Will you be able to live with yourself afterward?”
He shook his head. “Good God, Cliff she’s a pirates daughter.”
Cliff turned back to her but she refused to look at him, her arms folded across her chest. He was furious with her, with Woods, and even with himself. He stalked out, leaving them to their lurid affair.
Outside, the clouds were gathering, a fresh breeze of almost twenty knots coming onshore. Spanishtown was a dozen miles from the coast, and he had come by coach, not the river, but he knew that the waves had swells and it would be a food day for sailing. In fact, just then he wished to race the wind, running full said before it.
His temples throbbed. Now he wished to runaway? He rubbed his forehead firmly. La Sauvage was not his concern
But she hadn’t understood, for she was naïve in so many ways. She thought to buy her father’s amnesty with her body, but Woods was going to use her and then hang her father anyways.
Jamaican was his home. And although he only spent a few months of the year there, he was one of the island’s leading citizens and very little happened on the island without his consent. Had he been present during Carre’s capture, he would have made sure his case never came to trial. But it had, and the news had been reported not just in the Jamaican Royal Times but on most of the other islands, too. Even the American newspapers had reported the pirate’s conviction. It was too late now to stop the hanging.
And Woods was a strong governor. There had been a few better, there had been many worse. Cliff supported his new policy of attempting to quell the Cuban rovers. No matter what happened now, he needed to remain on good terms with him. They had too many interests in common.
I am begging you, sir, begging you not to take my father from me. He’s a good man, a good father, and he’s all I have in the world!
She was not going to save her father, and certainly not in Woods bed. Cliff turned, starting at the imposing front doors beneath the white temple pediment of King’s House. By damm, he had to act.
He strode back to the house. “I’m afraid I have need of the governor again.”
Robards was chagrined, “I’m sorry, Captain. The Governor is not to be disturbed this afternoon.”
Cliff was in disbelief, but only for a moment. “This cannot wait.” Unconsciously, his tone had become soft and so very warning.
The young soldier flushed. “Sir, I am sorry…” he began.
Cliff put his hand on the hilt of his scabbard. He gave Robards a look and stepped past him, pushing open the front door. The silence of the house wrapped itself around him and he knew they were together. His heart raced. He knew all the principal rooms were on the ground floor, as was the governor’s private suite. As Woods has decided not to allow La Sauvage an afternoon’s respite, he doubted they were in a guest room. No, he had taken La Sauvage to his rooms. Cliff was certain.
Robards had followed him to the threshold of the foyer. “Sir! Please!”
Cliff smiled mirthlessly at him and kicked the door closed.
His blood surged and thickened.
He turned the knob and pushed open the door.
Instantly, he saw them.
Woods stood in the centre of the bedroom, a massive canopied bed behind him. He had shed his jacket, waistcoat and shirt, revealing a muscular torso. His trousers were open, revealing his manhood.
She stood by the bed, clad in a mans sapphire-blue silk dressing gown, but it was unbelted and ipen, revealing her lean golden thighs, soft belly and full breasts. Her expression was one of despair, but it was also fierce and determined. She would not stand down.
Cliff prayed he was not too late.
He strode to Woods, who was so preoccupied with his victim that he did not see him until Cliff raised his fist. Woods cried out but Cliff knocked him backward into the wall, the blow so stunning he slid down it into a heap, as if unconscious.
He stepped over him, reaching for his hair, yanking his head back. Dazed eyes met his. “Society would love this bit of gossip, don’t you think?” he snarled. The threat was impulsive but ideal; Woods had a reputation to maintain, and his wife would be livid should she ever hear of his scandalous behaviour.
“We are…friends!” Woods gasped.
“Not anymore.” Cliff had to fight himself not to hit him again. The he heard her choke.
He whirled, hurrying to her. She was on all hours, fighting for composure. He knelt, sliding his arm around her, terribly aware of her exposed body and also aware that Woods had probably used in the most despicable and disrespectful manner possible. Slowly she looked at him, her green cat eyes huge, and hurt and beseeching.
He hoped that what he thought had happened hadn’t. “I’m taking you out of here,” He said softly.
She shook her head, shocking him. “Leave me…be,” she whispered brokenly.
He wanted to kill his onetime friend; he cradled her face in his hands. “Listen to me!” he said urgently. “He is not going to pardon your father no matter what you do, or how many times you do it! Do you comprehend me?”
“But it’s the only chance I have to save him,” she gasped.
He realized her mouth was bruised. He lifted her into his arms and was surprised again, because she clung. Now there was no mistaking the fact that he wanted to protect her, but he was also aware of her open robe and her soft breasts, pressed to his chest. He had glimpsed the wet treasure between her thighs. “There was never a chance,” he said roughly, carrying her from the room.
In the hall he paused, suddenly realizing that soldiers were outside the front door, and he had just assaulted the royal governor. They’d have to make a hasty retreat through a window—and he had quite a bit of political manoeuvring to do in the days that followed. Woods might not be a friend anymore, but they needed to work together if he was to remain a viable and influential resident of the island. Suddenly he realised his burden was oddly still.
He looked at her.
She looked up at him, her hands remaining looped around his neck. She was blushing.
His gaze veered to her beautiful breasts, then lower to her slender torso, her rib cage faintly delineated, her small pink navel and the champagne-colored delta below. Buccaneer or not, he was a gentleman, and he jerked his gaze to her face feeling his own cheeks warm. With one hand, awkwardly, he tugged the wrapper somewhat closed. “How badly did he hurt you?” he asked roughly.
“Can you put me down?” She asked instead of replying.
Instantly he complied.
She smiled at him, and kicked him very hard in the shin. And then she pushed at him and started to run.
Stunned, he reached for her, but she was agile, swift and determined. She ducked his grasp and raced down the hall, her wrapper flowing behind her nude body like a banner. He started after her more slowly, unhappily aware of a terrible turmoil in him. He almost wished he had not gotten involved, for he senses this was just the beginning. And when he reached the entry, no one was there.
La Sauvage was gone. |
J August of 1939, at Stalin's direction, the Soviet Union entered into a non-aggression pact with Nazi Germany, containing a secret protocol, dividing the whole of eastern Europe into German and Soviet spheres of influence. Thereafter, Germany and the Soviet Union invaded their apportioned sections of Poland. The Soviet Union later invaded Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania and part of Romania, along with an attempted invasion of Finland. Stalin and Hitler later traded proposals for a Soviet entry into the Axis Pact.
In June of 1941, Germany began an invasion of the Soviet Union, before which Stalin had ignored reports of a German invasion. Stalin was confident that the total Allied war machine would eventually stop Germany[1], and the Soviets stopped the Wehrmacht 20 miles Operation Bagration and the Vistula-Oder Offensive. Stalin began to listen to his generals more after Kursk.
Stalin met with Churchill and Roosevelt in Tehran Conference and began to discuss a two-front war against Germany and future of Europe after the war. Berlin finally fell in April of 1945, but Stalin was never fully convinced his nemesis Hitler had actually committed suicide. Fending off the German invasion and pressing to victory in the East required a tremendous sacrifice by the Soviet Union, which suffered military casualties of approximately 35' treatment of their own soldiers who had spent time in German POW camps.
In August of 1939, Stalin accepted Adolf Hitler's proposal to enter into a non-aggression pact with Nazi Germany, negotiated by Soviet foreign minister Vyacheslav Molotov and German foreign minister Joachim von Ribbentrop.[2] Officially a non-aggression treaty only, an appended secret protocol, also reached on August 23, 1939, divided the whole of eastern Europe into German and Soviet spheres of influence.[3][4] The USSR was promised an eastern part of Poland, primarily populated with Ukrainians and Belarusians, in case of its dissolution, and additionally Latvia, Estonia and Finland were recognized as parts of the Soviet sphere of influence,[4] with Lithuania added in a second secret protocol in September of 1939.[5] Another clause of the treaty was that Bessarabia, then part of Romania, was to be joined to the Moldovan ASSR, and become the Moldovan SSR under control of Moscow.[4]
The Pact was reached two days after the breakdown of Soviet military talks with British and French representatives in August of 1939 over a potential Franco-Anglo-Soviet alliance.[6][7] Political discussions had been suspended on August 2 when Molotov stated they could not be restarted until progress was made in military talks late in August,[8] after the talks had stalled over guarantees of the Baltic states,[9][10] while the military talks upon which Molotov insisted[9] started on 11 August.[11][6] At the same time, Germany -- with whom the Soviets had started secret discussions since July 29[12][13][14][15][16] -- argued that it could offer the Soviets better terms than Britain and France, with Ribbentrop insisting "there was no problem between the Baltic and the Black Sea that could not be solved between the two of us."[6][17][18]."[17][19] By that time, Molotov obtained information regarding Anglo-German negotiations and a pessimistic report from the Soviet ambassador in France.[12] After disagreement regarding Stalin's demand to move Red Army troops through Poland and Romania (which Poland and Romania opposed),[11][6].[11] That same day, Stalin received assurance that Germany would approve secret protocols to the proposed non-aggression pact that would grant the Soviets land in Poland, the Baltic states, Finland and Romania,[20] after which Stalin telegrammed Hitler that night that the Soviets were willing to sign the pact and that he would receive Ribbentrop on August 23..[22][23][24] Stalin also viewed the Pact as gaining time in an inevitable war with Hitler in order to reinforce the Soviet military and shifting Soviet borders westwards, which would be militarily beneficial in such a war.[25][26]."[27] They further traded toasts, with Stalin proposing a toast to Hitler's health and Ribbentrop proposing a toast to Stalin.[27]
On September 1, 1939, the German invasion of its agreed upon portion of Poland started World War II.[2] On September 17 the Red Army invaded eastern Poland and occupied the Polish territory assigned to it by the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact, followed by co-ordination with German forces in Poland.[28][29] Eleven days later, the secret protocol of the Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact was modified, allotting Germany a larger part of Poland, while ceding most of Lithuania to the Soviet Union.[30] The Soviet portions lay east of the so-called Curzon Line, an ethnographic frontier between Russia and Poland drawn up by a commission of the Paris Peace Conference in 1919.[31] In early 1940, the Soviets executed over 25,000 Polish POWs and political prisoners in the Katyn Forrest.[31]
In August of 1939, Stalin declared that he was going to "solve the Baltic problem, and thereafter, forced Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia to sign treaties for "mutual assistance."[30]
After unsuccessfully attempting to install a communist puppet government in Finland, in November of 1939, the Soviet Union invaded Finland.[32] The Finnish defense defied Soviet expectations, and after stiff losses, Stalin settled for an interim peace granting the Soviet Union less than total domination by annexing only the eastern region of Karelia (10% of Finnish territory).[32] Soviet official casualty counts in the war exceeded 200,000,[33] while Soviet Premier Nikita Kruschev later claimed the casualties may have been one million.[34] After this campaign, Stalin took actions to bolster the Soviet military, modify training and improve propaganda efforts in the Soviet military.[35]
In mid-June of 1940, when international attention was focused on the German invasion of France, Soviet NKVD troops raided border posts in Lithuania, Estonia and Latvia.[30][36] Stalin claimed that the mutual assistance treaties had been violated, and gave six hour ultimatums for new governments to be formed in each country, including lists of persons for cabinet posts provided by the Kremlin.[30] Thereafter, state administrations were liquidated and replaced by Soviet cadres, followed by mass repression[30] in which 34,250 Latvians, 75,000 Lithuanians and almost 60,000 Estonians were deported or killed.[37].[38] The resulting peoples assemblies immediately requested admission into the USSR, which was granted by the Soviet Union.[38]
In late June 1940, Stalin directed the Soviet annexation of Bessarabia and northern Bukovina, proclaiming this formerly Romanian territory part of the Moldavian Soviet Socialist Republic.[39] But in annexing northern Bukovina, Stalin had gone beyond the agreed limits of the secret protocol.[39]
After the Tripartite Pact was signed by Axis Powers Germany, Japan and Italy, in October of 1940, Stalin personally wrote to Ribbentrop about entering an agreement regarding a "permanent basis" for their "mutual interests."[40] Stalin sent Molotov to Berlin to negotiate the terms for the Soviet Union to join the Axis and potentially enjoy the spoils of the pact.[39] At Stalin's direction,[41] Molotov insisted on Soviet interest in Turkey, Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary, Yugoslavia and Greece,[41] though Stalin had earlier unsuccessfully personally lobbied Turkish leaders to not sign a mutual assistance pact with Britain and France.[42] Ribbentrop asked Molotov to sign another secret protocol with the statement: "The focal point of the territorial aspirations of the Soviet Union would presumably be centered south of the territory of the Soviet Union in the direction of the Indian Ocean."[41] Molotov took the position that he could not take a "definite stand" on this without Stalin's agreement.[41] Stalin did not agree with the suggested protocol, and negotiations broke down.[40] In response to a later German proposal, Stalin's stated that the Soviets would join the Axis if Germany foreclosed acting in the Soviet's sphere of influence.[43] Shortly thereafter, Hitler issued a secret directive on the eventual attempts to invade the Soviet Union.[43]
In an effort to demonstrate peaceful intentions toward Germany, on April 13, 1941, Stalin oversaw the signing of a neutrality pact with Axis power Japan.[44] While Stalin had little faith in Japan's commitment to neutrality, he felt that the pact was important for its political symbolism, to reinforce a public affection for Germany.[45] Stalin felt that there was a growing split in German circles about whether Germany should initiate a war with the Soviet Union.[45]
During the early morning of June 22, 1941, Hitler broke the pact by implementing Operation Barbarossa, the German invasion of Soviet held territories and the Soviet Union that began the war on the Eastern Front.[46] Before the invasion, Stalin felt that Germany would not attack the Soviet Union until Germany had defeated Britain.[47] At the same time, Soviet generals warned Stalin that Germany had concentrated forces on its borders.[47] As well, two highly placed Soviet spies in Germany, "Starshina" and "Korsikanets", had sent dozens of reports to Moscow containing evidence of a German attack.[47][48] Further warnings came from Richard Sorge, a Soviet spy in Tokyo working under cover as a German journalist.[49]
Seven days before the invasion, a Soviet spy in Berlin warned Stalin that the movement of German divisions to the borders was for the purpose of waging war on the Soviet Union.[49] Five days before the attack, Stalin received a report from a spy in the German Air Ministy that "all preparations by Germany for an armed attack on the Soviet Union have been completed, and the blow can be expected at any time."[50] In the margin, Stalin wrote to the people's commissar for state security, "you can send your 'source' from the headquarters of German aviation to his mother. This is not a 'source' but a dezinformator."[50] Although Stalin increased Soviet western border forces to 2.7 million men and ordered them to expect a possible German invasion, he did not order a full-scale mobilization of forces to prepare for an attack.[51] Stalin felt that a mobilization might provoke Hitler to prematurely begin to wage war against the Soviet Union, which Stalin wanted to delay until 1942 in order to further strengthen Soviet forces.[52]
A theory suggested by Viktor Suvorov claims that Stalin had made aggressive preparations beginning in the late 1930s and was preparing to invade Germany in summer 1941. Thus, he believes Hitler only managed to forestall Stalin and the German invasion was in essence a pre-emptive strike, precisely as Hitler claimed himself. and especially Gabriel Gorodetsky reject this thesis.[53] General Fedor von Boch's diary states that the Abwehr fully expected a Soviet attack against German forces in Poland no later than 1942.
In the initial hours after the German attack commenced, Stalin hesitated, wanting to ensure that the German attack was sanctioned by Hitler, rather than the unauthorized action of a rogue general.[54] Accounts by Nikita Khrushchev and Anastas Mikoyan claim that, after the invasion, Stalin retreated to his dacha in despair for several days and did not participate in leadership decisions.[55] However, some documentary evidence of orders given by Stalin contradicts these accounts, leading some historians to speculate that Kruschev's account is inaccurate.[56]
In the first three weeks of the invasion, attempting to defend against large German advances, the Soviet Union suffered 750,000 casualties, and lost 10,000 tanks and 4,000 aircraft.[57] In July of 1940, Stalin completely reorganized the Soviet military, placing himself directly in charge of several military organizations, which gave him complete control of his country's entire war effort; more control than any other leader in World War II.[58]
A pattern soon emerged where Stalin embraced the Red Army's strategy of conducting multiple offensives, while the Germans soon overran each of the resulting small newly gained grounds, dealing the Soviets severe casualties.[59] The most notable example of this was the Battle of Kiev, where over 600,000 Soviet troops were quickly killed, captured or had gone missing.[59]
By the end of 1941, the Soviet military had suffered 4.3 million casualties[60] and the Germans had captured 3.0 million Soviet prisoners, 2.0 million of which would die in German captivity by February of 1942.[57] German forces had advanced 1,050 miles (1,690 kilometers), and maintained a linearly-measured front of 1,900 miles (3,058 kilometers).[61] The Red Army put up fierce resistance during the war's early stages. Even so, according to Glantz, they were plagued by an ineffective defense doctrine against well-trained and experienced German forces, despite possessing some modern Soviet equipment such as the KV-1 and T-34 tanks..[62] While the Germans pressed forward, Stalin was confident of an eventual Allied victory over Germany. In September of.[63] The British agreed to assistance but refused to agree upon the territorial gains, which Stalin accepted months later as the military situation deteriorated somewhat in mid-1942.[63] the German's war effort would crumble against the the British-American-Soviet "war engine".[64].[65] By December, Hitler's troops had advanced to within 20 miles of the Kremlin in Moscow.[66] On December 5, the Soviets launched a counteroffensive, pushing German troops back 40-50 miles from Moscow, the Wehrmacht's first significant defeat of the war.[66]
The Soviets then in early 1942 began a series of offensives labeled "Stalin's First Strategic Offensives", through there is no concrete evidence that Stalin actually engineered the offensives.[67] The counteroffensive bogged down, in part due to mud from rains, in the Spring of 1942.[60] Stalin's attempt to retake Kharkov in the Ukraine ended in disastrous encirclement of Soviet forces, with over 200,000 Soviet casualties suffered.[68] Stalin attacked the competence of the generals involved.[69] Later, General Georgy Zhukov and others revealed that some of those generals had wished to remain a defensive posture in the region but Stalin and others that had pushed for the offensive, though some doubt Zhukov's account.[69].[70] While Red Army generals saw evidence that Hitler would shift efforts south, Stalin considered this to be a flanking campaign in efforts to take Moscow.[69] The German southern campaign began with a push to capture the Crimea which ended in disaster for the Red Army, and caused Stalin to issue a broad scolding of his generals' leadership.[68] In their southern campaigns, the Germans took 625,000 Red Army prisoners in July and August of 1942 alone.[71].[72].[71] Hitler insisted upon splitting German southern forces in a simultaneous siege of Stalingrad and an offensive against Baku on the Caspian Sea.[73] Stalin directed his generals to spare no effort or shirk any sacrifice to defend Stalingrad.[74] Although the Soviets suffered in excess of 1.1 million casualties at Stalingrad, [75] the victory over German forces, including the encirclement of 290,000 Axis troops, marked a turning point in the war.[76]
Within a year after Barbarossa, Stalin reopened the churches in the Soviet Union.. One account states that Stalin's reversal followed a sign that he purportedly received from heaven.[77]."[77]."[77] Radzinsky asked, "Had he seen the light? Had fear made him run to his Father? Had the Marxist God-Man simply decided to exploit belief in God? Or was it all of these things at once?."[77].[78] canceled-1942. over half of European Russia, including 40% (80 million) of its population, and one million square miles of Russian territory.[83] The Soviets had also prepared for war for oforussiaorussia and the western Ukraine, along with the successful effective destruction of the Army Group Centre and 300,000 German casualties, though at the cost of over 750,000 Soviet casualties.[91]
Successes at Operation Bagration and in the year that followed were, in large part, of 1945.[97]
Other important advances occurred in late 1944, such as the invasion of Romania in August and Bulgaria.[97] The Soviet Union declared war on Bulgaria in September of 1944 and invaded the country, installing a communist government.[98] Following the invasion of these Balkan countries, Stalin and Churchill met in the fall in the subsequent Battle of Budapest until February of 1945, when the remaining Hungarians signed an armistice with the Soviet Union.[101].[102].
By April of 1945, Germany faced its last days with 1.9 million German soldiers in the East fighting 6.4 million Red Army soldiers while 1 million German soldiers in the West battled 4 million Western Allied soldiers.[103].[104][105] Stalin still remained suspicious that western Allied forces holding at the Elbe river might move on the capital and, even in the last days, that the Americans might employ their two airborne divisions to capture the city.[106]
Stalin directed the Red Army to move rapidly in a broad front into Germany because he did not believe the Western Allies would hand over territory they occupied, while he made the overriding objective capturing Berlin.[107] After successfully capturing Eastern Prussia, three Red Army fronts converged on the heart of Eastern Germany, with one of the last pitched battles of the war putting the Soviets at the virtual gates of Berlin.[108] By April 24, Berlin was encircled by elements of two Soviet fronts,[109] one of which had begun a massive shelling of the city on April 20 that would not end until the city's surrender.[110] On April 30, Hitler and Eva Braun committed suicide, after which Soviet forces found their remains, which had been burned at Hitler's directive.[111].[112] Despite the Soviets' possession of Hitler's remains, Stalin did not believe that his old nemesis was actually dead, a belief that remained for years after the war.[113][114] Stalin also later directed aides to spend years researching and writing a secret book about Hitler's life for his own private reading that reflected Stalin's prejudices, including an absence of criticism of Hitler for his treatment of Jews.[115]).[116] Although figures vary, the Soviet civilian death toll probably reached 20 million.[116] Millions of Soviet soldiers and civilians disappeared into German detention camps and slave labor factories, while millions more suffered permanent physical and mental damage.[116] Economic losses, including losses in resources and manufacturing capacity in western Russia and Ukraine, were also catastrophic.[116] The war resulted in the destruction of approximately 70,000 Soviet cities, towns and villages.[117] Destroyed in that process were 6 million houses, 98,000 farms, 32,000 factories, 82,000 schools, 43,000 libraries, 6,000 hospitals and thousands of miles of roads and railway track.[117]
After taking around 300,000 Polish prisoners in 1939 and early 1940,[118][119] [120][121 ][119] NKVD officers conducted lengthy interrogations of the prisoners in camps that were, in effect, a selection process to determine who would be killed.[122].[123] This became known as the Katyn massacre.[122][124][125] Major-General Vasili M. Blokhin, chief executioner for the NKVD, personally shot 6,000 of the captured Polish officers in 28 consecutive nights, which remains one of the most organized and protracted mass murders by a single individual on record[126][127] During his 29 year career Blokhin shot an estimated 50,000 people,[128] making him ostensibly the most prolific official executioner in recorded world history.[126]
Stalin personally told a Polish general requesting information about missing officers that all of the Poles were freed, and that not all could be accounted because the Soviets "lost track" of them in Manchuria.[129][130][131] After Polish railroad workers found the mass grave,[132] the Nazi's used the massacre to attempt to drive a wedge between Stalin and the other Allies,[133] including bringing in a European commission of investigators from twelve countries to examine the graves.[134] In 1943, as the Soviets prepared to retake Poland, Nazi Propaganda Minister Joseph Goebbels correctly guessed that Stalin would attempt to falsely claim that the Germans massacred the victims.[135] As Goebbels predicted, the Soviets had a "commission" investigate the matter, falsely concluding that the Germans had killed the POWs.[122] The Soviets did not admit responsibility until 1990.[136].[137] Their family members were subjected to arrest.[138] The second provision of the order directed all units fighting in encirclements to use every possibility to fight.[138] [138] The order also required division commanders to demote and, if necessary, even to shoot on the spot those commanders who failed to command the battle directly in the battlefield.[138] Thereafter, Stalin also conducted a purge of several military commanders that were shot for "cowardice" without a trial.[138]
In June of.[56].[139] Many others were simply deported east.[140][141]
In July of 1942, Stalin issued Order No. 227, directing that any commander or commissar of a regiment, battalion or army, who allowed retreat without permission from his superiors was subject to military tribunal.[142] The order called for soldiers found guilty of disciplinary measures to be forced into "penal battalions", which were sent to the most dangerous sections of the front lines.[142] From 1942 to 1945, 427,910 soldiers were assigned to penal battalions.[143] The order also directed "blocking detachments" to shoot fleeing panicked troops at the rear.[142] In the first two months following the order, over 1,000 troops were shot by blocking units and blocking units sent over 130,000 troops to penal battalions. [142] Despite having some effect initially, this measure proved to have a deteriorating effect on the troops' morale, so by October 1942 the idea of regular blocking units was quietly dropped[144] By 20 November, 1944 the blocking units were disbanded officially.[143]
After the capture of Berlin, Soviet troops reportedly raped German women and girls, with total victim estimates ranging from tens of thousands to two million.[145] During and after the occupation of Budapest, (Hungary), an estimated 50,000 women and girls were raped.[146][147]?"[147]
In former Axis countries, such as Germany, Romania and Hungary, Red Army officers generally viewed cities, villages and farms as being open to pillaging and looting.[148] For example, Red Army soldiers and NKVD members frequently looted transport trains in 1944 and 1945 in Poland[149] and Soviet soldiers set fire to the city centre of Demmin while preventing the inhabitants from extinguishing the blaze,[150] which, along with multiple rapes, played a part in causing over 900 citizens of the city to commit suicide.[151].."[152][153] Accordingly, all evidence of looting, rapes and destruction by the Red Army was deleted from archives in the Soviet occupation zone.[154 ]
Stalin's personal military leadership was emphasied as part of the "cult of personality" after the publication of Stalin's ten victories extracted from 6 November 1944 speech "27th anniversary of the Great October socialist revolution" (Russian: «27-я годовщина») during the 1944 meeting of the Moscow's Soviet deputies..[155]
Soviet POWs and forced laborers who survived German captivity were sent to special "transit" or "filtration" camps meant determine which were potential traitors.[93] Of the approximately 4 million to be repatriated 2,660,013 were civilians and 1,539,475 were former POWs. [93] Of the total, 2,427,906 were sent home and 801,152 were reconscripted into the armed forces.[93] 608,095 were enrolled in the work battalions of the defense ministry.[93] 272,867 were transferred to the authority of the NKVD for punishment, which meant a transfer to the Gulag system.[93][156][157] 89,468 remained in the transit camps as reception personnel until the repatriation process was finally wound up in the early 1950s.[93] |
Best Bowie knives
THR
>
Tools and Technologies
>
Non-Firearm Weapons
> Best Bowie knives
PDA
burnse
January 20, 2009, 02:56 AM
Could someone list the best bowie makers they know of? The more traditional looking, the better. Also, I am not too fond with most Cold Steel products, but if their bowies are really fantastic, let me know.
If you enjoyed reading about "Best Bowie knives" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join
TheHighRoad.org
today for the full version!
Lone Star
January 20, 2009, 09:43 AM
Frankly, unless you are going to look at expensive handmades, I think you should consider Fallkniven.
When you select "English" and see the main models display, select NL1 and NL2.Look hard at them. They balance beautifully in the hand.
I think one or the other is what you may want. Here is a large pic of the NL-2:
Fallkniven knives aren't cheap, but they do the job, and look good as well.
You have the advantage that a university performs stress tests on them, and they are very strong. The Swedish Air Force issues their F-1 model as a pilot survival knife. They have also passed USAF and USN survival knife tests and are authorized for unit purchase. (F-1 and S-1 with the black blade option.)
If you want a more practical size for most use than the big NL series, but still basic Bowie lines, see the S-1 and the A-1.
Lone Star
P.S. If you have limited funds, get a Buck Model 119.
HoosierQ
January 20, 2009, 09:56 AM
Can't beat the Western Bowie. I've had mine since about 1969...got if for Christmas like Ralphie and his BB gun. "The best Christmas gift I ever received or ever would receive". Big, sharp, balanced, sturdy, and priced for a normal budget...maybe $125 bucks these days?
Lone Star
January 20, 2009, 10:00 AM
Western is out of business, and their knives were of average quality.
hso
January 20, 2009, 11:34 AM
Could someone list the best bowie makers they know of?
"best" is an awfully vague word. What's your criteria? What's your price range? Production or handmade? What use do you intend to put it to? Which pattern of "traditional" Bowie? There's a lot implied in the word "best" that only you can know.
There are knifemakers that produce "traditional" knives that will cost you a thousand dollars and those that will make them for a few hundred dollars. Do you want forged, which would be "traditional" or would stock reduction work for you?
HoosierQ
January 20, 2009, 12:57 PM
I was afraid of that...Western out of business. I am sure happy with mine...it is sharp as a razor and holds an edge like crazy.
hso
January 20, 2009, 02:14 PM
Western was part of Camillus and went when they did.
burnse
January 20, 2009, 02:41 PM
"best" is an awfully vague word. What's your criteria?
I am just curious as to who make some of the better (in quality) bowie knives which are designed as fairly historically accurate, or traditionally styled bowies. As far as my purchasing interests go, forged is certainly preferred and I am the type to buy a knife I can trust every day for the entirety of my life, but it can be production if it is good.
So just keep 'em coming and bring pictures if you got 'em.
Valkman
January 20, 2009, 02:59 PM
I make bowies in my 7" Super Camp and 6" Fighters. Here's a Super Camp with stag that I just made:
Piraticalbob
January 20, 2009, 03:30 PM
If price is a concern, you can get some nice bowie knives from Atlanta Cutlery. () The bowies they make are handforged in India by Windlass Steelcrafts. The quality ranges from good to excellent. They aren't masterpieces handcrafted by artisans, but Atlanta Cutlery has a dozen different patterns available and none of them is priced over $100.
Here is one, the 1850 coffin hilt:
A.G. Russell sells a couple of bowies, also. You can check his website, you can search under the term "bowie" and come up with some good stuff, including the Bill Bagwell bowies made by Ontario Cutlery.
In the end, you get what you pay for. If you wish to pay $5000 for a handcrafted bowie made of damascus steel, made by a Master Smith of the American Bladesmith Society, you certainly can do so. Not all of us have that much spare cash. :rolleyes:
rklessdriver
January 20, 2009, 03:53 PM
I always liked Mike Wise. Hand forged just like in the old days. Top quality work and he is a super nice guy. Very reasonably priced.
I have a few of his blades and have never been disapointed by them.
Will
burnse
January 20, 2009, 04:13 PM
for me, less than 500 would be great. Under 250 for a starter would be better.
Valkman
January 20, 2009, 04:22 PM
Mine are $250 with "regular" handle materials, +$100 for stag or giraffe bone. I finished one last night (Super Camp) with killer spalted maple handles, $275 for that one but no sheath has been made yet. Custom leather sheaths run $50 extra.
Travis Bickle
January 20, 2009, 04:34 PM
Also, I am not too fond with most Cold Steel products, but if their bowies are really fantastic, let me know.
I don't know much about knives, but someone has a review of Cold Steel's bowie knife on youtube that might help:
Lone Star
January 20, 2009, 06:42 PM
Here, a reviewer who can't even pronounce the names of the knives he reviews covers Fallkniven's A-1. He just turns it in his hand, but you can see the knife, here in the optional black blade version, with the Kydex sheath that is no longer offered. It has been replaced with a Zytel sheath A leather sheath is still offered.
I think this guy is not as informed as he'd like us to think he is. A man who can't even pronounce names like Fallkniven and Camillus shouldn't be reviewing knives. But Nutn' Fancy is a prolific reviewer of outdoors products.
For the record,
"Fallkniven" is pronounced, "FELL-ka-neeven". I can't reproduce it here, but the "a" has an umlaut over it, changing the pronunciati0n to an "e" sound in Swedish. I have this information directly from Peter Hjortberger, the company president.
"Camillus" is pronounced as, "Ca-MILL-us." He says "CAM-uh-lis."
He said that he managed to chip the blade on a Fallkniven A-2 by hitting it on a rock. Well, whoop-de-doo! You can chip almost ANY blade by hitting the edge against a rock. All it takes is enough force, at the wrong angle. The Fallkniven knives have been extensively tested by the Technical University of Lulea (in Sweden) and by US military evaluators, and tbey came through with flying colors. The only reason why the A-1 isn't listed for unit purchase is that it's too big for the sheath on US aircrewmens' vests. I think it's an outstanding knife for military or survival purposes. It has been extensively used by Norwegian Marines, and is a favorite private purchase knife with them. I believe these men are also the ones who requested the A-2 model, which they use to check for mines in Afghanistan.
Don't understimate the Buck Special, their Model 119, either. It's an excellent knife, at a reasonable price. It is the favorite knife of the Canadian guy who has a survival program on Discovery TV. His is the valid survival program. (The former SAS man who stays in hotels and creates unneccesary trials for himself has a knife designed for him. It's quite probably a fine knife, but the reputation of his show detracts from its image.)
Look at this video to see the Fallkniven knife, but I distrust the reviewer's comments at times.
Lone Star
Lone Star
January 20, 2009, 07:09 PM
Additionaal Fallkniven reviews:
S-1 Forest Knife: (Different reviewer)
A-1 chopping:
S-1 and Frost knife:
Macmac
January 20, 2009, 07:35 PM
burnse , If you asked me first, I ask you first whatcha going to do with it?
You can get a Bowie with a 5 inch long blade, or a 15 inch long blade, and I mean just the blade.
What kind of steel?
Safe queen? User? If so what for?
If you buy a silly stainless blade and it is 5 inches long and you take it to pre 1840 VOO to show it off, the Buck Skinners will laugh at you!
In the other hand if you bring a 15 inch carbon steel blade to the local SWAT gathering they will laugh at you for that monster?
Just the word Bowie means about a million things to the same number of people.
The supposed historical blade, sometimes sold, that is supposed to be a reproduction of the 'Sand Bar' knife probably isn't, not that I wish to be involved with any endless debate. The fact is on that; No One Knows..
JShirley
January 20, 2009, 09:20 PM
I like strong tools that can also be weapons. My Himalayan Imports Crow is about my ideal hard use bowie. You should be able to find one for less than $140. It won't be perfect, but it should last a lifetime with just a little maintenance now and then. It's one of those 15" blades Mac's mentioning.
On the other end of the usage spectrum (but still nowhere near the top end of what you could pay!), Valkman's Camps and Fighters are very attractive, clean, sturdy pieces that are smaller than short swords. :)
Crow next to Kim Breed fighter
Regards,
John
7X57chilmau
January 20, 2009, 09:27 PM
I've used a Himalayan Imports kukri before and found it to be a damned fine tool. Slightly crude, imperfect to be sure, but a really enjoyable knife that worked, was tough, held an edge well...
If the crow is anything like, it'd be plenty good enough....
J
JShirley
January 20, 2009, 09:55 PM
Yeah, they're great knives (), both the kuks and the Crow. HI makes several other "bowies", including the Cherokee Rose.
The Rose is mostly a dedicated (LARGE) fighter, and seemed oddly delicate for a HI piece. The Crow is a tool that can be a weapon.
J
hso
January 20, 2009, 11:39 PM
burnse,
You haven't answered the question of what will you use it for. Honestly, what will you use it for? Please be realistic. The answer matters a lot.
Big Daddy Grim
January 20, 2009, 11:48 PM
lotta nice bowies here and to think I still carry my old Buck bowie
burnse
January 21, 2009, 01:47 AM
hso and macmac,
This one will, first and foremost, be hanging on the wall for now, but I want something that will do in a pinch for HD, (I have moved for school and am away from the guns for the semester). And if the S were to HTF, I am more than comfortable with heavy blades, and am doing pekiti tersia. That being said, I know that I could get a barong from traditional filipino weapons in the same price range, but I like the feel of a bowie, and a clip point is a plus.
So anywhere around 12" is great. And I do prefer convex grinds, but as long as it would look pretty on a wall, I'm happy. So, yes, a usable display piece.
I should also mention that I think carrying a bowie makes me feel more god than man because it is such a thing of legend and great American stories of the past.:) (that sounds dumb but that's how i feel.)
Piraticalbob
January 21, 2009, 07:54 AM
Here are two of the bowies that Ontario Cutlery makes, designed by bowie authority Bill Bagwell. A.G. Russell sells them for $144.95 (check to see if they are in stock). The larger of the two sounds like what you describe, these are very light and quick in the hand, yet attractive enough to serve in the wall-hanger role.
hso
January 21, 2009, 08:42 AM
burnse,
That information helps a lot. Since you're taking PKT I'd recommend focusing on the narrower bowie styles than the big bellied styles.
If you want the best bang for your buck look at Ontario's SP-42 and-43. While they don't have the look of a "traditional" bowie Dan Maragni has completely redesigned them and retooled the manufacturing for Ontario. The reviews on them are impressive, especially for PKT.
Next notch up in price for production pieces would be the Cold Steel bowies. The Laredo (~$100) and Natchez (~$350) would do well.
Next would be Ontario's Bagwell Bowies, if you can find one.
Customs range from $300 up.
bkduckworth
January 21, 2009, 10:19 AM
Have you looked into Bark River Knife and Tool? They make (in my opinion) a very nice production knife (close to custom) at a relatively reasonable price. Here is a link to a limited run bowie they made:
Good Luck!
Brandon
burnse
January 21, 2009, 01:45 PM
That Bagwell designed plainsmen would certainly do the trick for now. It's not huge, but looks very quick, and the coffin handle makes a very nice, showy touch. I can go hunting for giants later.
Thanks, everyone and keep them coming if you know of any more.
hso
January 21, 2009, 02:30 PM
What's your upper price limit on a custom? Do you have any stag scales or rounds suitable for the grip (or ivory or buffalo horn or ...)? That can help drop the price.
Vonderek
January 21, 2009, 02:33 PM
A Puma Bowie is a nice knife and can be had for $70.
Here's a hand-forged Japanese Bowie with stag handle:
Macmac
January 21, 2009, 08:18 PM
Ok, now were talkin.. You like the so called classic pattern. This site has some interesting bowies and other knives they call bowies. The name Bowie just about can mean anything. This is a auction site I think.
If you want the right price, and a custom made blade I might suggest you check this link.
I met Don Fogg in his home when that was in NH. He has a forum, where other people can sell their wares, some of which can be reasonable, different and very nice. These are not anything anyone else will have. Most blade makers make one in their style and never again make that same thing over again.
Even the out of date old posts show some fine working , although not many are bowies. There is a nice skull pick made of a hammer you could buy for me! :D
Oh this kid is a real sicko... hso this stuff is just off the wall, this kiddie is going places. just look at this sick work! I am so disgusted!
It is a good thing that blade is long gone for my poor wallet...
Lone Star
January 21, 2009, 08:42 PM
Although they are not in the class of the Fallkniven that I mentioned above, do consider Buck's discontinued General (#120) model. It has a seven or 7.5 inch blade and was a good seller for Buck for many years. You can find them at gun shows and the like.
Keep in mind any legal issues pertaining to carrying such knives.
If you need a shorter one, the Fallkniven S-1 at a fraction over five inches would be my quick choice. Randall's Model 5 with five-inch blade is comparable. Either is legal in my state. (Neither has a sharpened false edge, although Randall will sharpen it on special order. But that opens the can of legal worms. Check your laws.)
Lone Star
loandr.
January 21, 2009, 10:34 PM
Lamey, Lancanio and American Kami are a few of my "Available" favorites :evil:
LD
hso
January 21, 2009, 11:10 PM
Macmac,
Now why did you have to go and bring young Mr. Moss to my attention?!?! That's an awfully nice piece of work he did. Now I'll have to start looking for him.
burnse
January 22, 2009, 01:04 AM
really. Thanks, macmac. That thing is beautiful.
And, yes, I am a big fan of the "classic" style (or maybe "so-called classic" is a better description), especially after reading a very old book in my university's library covering a history of the bowie (I'm going to get it again later, so I can get the author).
The Highlander
January 22, 2009, 02:00 AM
I have a few Case Bowies which have stood up to years of abuse. I've got a special edition one that I keep in an old leather sheath in the dresser next to my bed. Classic bowie lines.
hso
January 22, 2009, 03:29 PM
Guys, there is no "classic bowie" because no one knows exactly what the knife at the Sandbar Fight looked like and subsequent knives owned and given away by the Bowie brothers were in a range of patterns.
Most folks think a "bowie" knife is a heavy big bellied blade with a clip point. Historically that isn't correct and Jim Bowie's knife that fateful day could have just has easily been a big "butcher" knife made a bit pointier for thrusting.
Look over the previous bowie threads for pictures of "real" bowie knives.
Tell me if you think the knife in the picture is what you think of as a "bowie knife".
Macmac
January 22, 2009, 05:01 PM
hso, To me on page 1 in this thread the 'plainsmen' is a classic style, where as the one you show to me is a natchez.
As I see it the classic has a longer slender clip point, and some form of a straight guard. Mostly the only reasons I would think this definition was important is because the internet is a hell of a way to communicate.
The next thing to figure out is 'IF' burnse wants a copy of a bowie anyone can buy any time he has money, and so there are likely to be hundreds owned all over the world, or he wants one of one, as custom makes don't really make one clone after another for many of much.
Some custom makers might make as many as 1,001 sometimes, but that is probably pushing it, unless a particular pattern really floats their stick.
That is up to the maker, and whom ever he serves. I know I have never come close to duplictaing any thing like that number, while I may have made 10 similar blades, really trying to make each one the same.
The type of people I served wanted the one and only one. Buck Skinners don't like mass produced blades and if they did the only one still around would be 'Green River'.
burnse, I really don't think you are going to get in a situation where a bowie saves your hide, not from any two legged predators anyway. I think what is really going on is you want to collect a bowie you can use, and i also think you want one of a kind. So what that means to me is you should save up more money than you really wanted to spend. I am assuming you have a good part of that right now. If you just doubled that amount and took your good time searching for a new young maker, one where he is carefull and you are carefull, that would supply your future needs more than just once.
If you choose one from Don Fogg's site there is nearly no risk, so long as you are carefull. What that gets you will be a blade that will live longer than you do, even if you grow to be wealthy and very old.:D
In todays world there is very little left as classic and very little left that will be a quality heirloom and or antique. I had some serious doubts a Glock pistol will ever be a classic antique, and I an dead sure no cars made today will ever be collectable. Even the so called best wooden furniture these days under that paper thin veneir is no more than saw dust and glue.
A top notch custom blade well cared for in carbon steel will always either be usefull or collectable.
When I made knives often times a year after i sold one to someone, that same someone would return to see what else I had. That worked out well for both of us.
AND if I can, I would like all you guys to call me Mac.. just plain ol' Mac.. :neener: Most sites plain ol mac is taken... see?
Todd A
January 22, 2009, 06:19 PM
Tell me if you think the knife in the picture is what you think of as a "bowie knife".
Actually, yes it is.
burnse
January 22, 2009, 11:36 PM
mac you're probably right on the not needing to use it in defense some day (let's hope the same for any gun that goes into my hand), and I would really like something one of a kind, so I probably will just keep saving. I think I'm also going to make a practice blade for.. practice, anyway.
Generic Name
January 23, 2009, 02:08 AM
This site has some interesting historically inspired custom knives for "gentlemen".
A less expensive version would be Bark River's Rogue.
burnse
January 23, 2009, 03:21 AM
That one is especially beautiful.
Dr.Rob
January 23, 2009, 08:17 PM
I got my Ontario Bagwell "Plainsman" in Dec 2003, its a pretty serious knife for the money.
Travis Bickle
January 23, 2009, 08:28 PM
In todays world there is very little left as classic and very little left that will be a quality heirloom and or antique. I had some serious doubts a Glock pistol will ever be a classic antique
Macmac
January 23, 2009, 08:57?
burnse, Once I knew a wealthy man who wanted a 12 ga shot gun for home defence. Well he went to buy one and when he came home he was something like 10 grand lighter! LOL After work in ther evening he say in a over stuff cahir and held the gun in his lap admiring the over all quaility, the rick grained wood, the charcoal blue, the engraved art, and the gold leaf.
A bit of time passed and then he went back and bought another pump gun this time for about $125.00.
Anyway if you choose well you may use a very well made and expensive knife with no harm.
The day I met Don Fogg here in NH was at his home, long ago when he lived north of me. At that time he had just finished a short sword. It was beautiful.
The blade was a 'leaf' blade with viking helmets forged down the center line standing up on both sides.
Don handed it to me and I thought at first to admire, which I did, but what he ment was for me to attack a 55 gallon barrel, and when I refuse he took the weapon from me and did it himself. He hit the crimped edge first, and then stabbed and slashed that barrel, always making deep cuts ahd holes.
He was aggressive and I thought he was angery. When he was done he handed the piece to me again to see if I could find any damage. I couldn't.
I have never seen him face to face since. He moved to the south east coast, and just 3 days ago I learned he has returned to Maine. I doubt he would remember me, but I never forgot him.
I learned alot in that one day, about men, blades and fire. I like that Plainsmen alot too. If I had one I would pull off the tag plate and either buff it out for my inicials, or make another plate like it in silver.
But then my tastes are in more simple things.
Travis Bickle
January 23, 2009, 09:21?
I actually think it's the ugliest, tackiest thing I've ever seen. I just posted it so everyone could laugh at it.
JShirley
January 23, 2009, 10:13 PM
That Glock is close to the ugliest thing I've ever seen.
And I like Glocks.
John
Byron Quick
January 24, 2009, 01:30 AM
You two gentlemen are incredibly fortunate in your viewing of ugliness. While I think that Glock is very ugly; it is far from the ugliest thing I have ever seen. You both have lived sheltered lives.
TimboKhan
January 24, 2009, 02:22 AM
Tacky guns are a thread unto themselves, and there have been a couple right here on the forum. I assure you, that Glock looks like a million bucks compared to some of the gaudy, tacky and flatly horrible stuff that people have posted.
As to the bowie knife question, I have never been real sold on a knife that big as being particularly useful, but that's just me. I think they are cool to look at, and I have had a few guys show me Bowies that are works of art, but in the end, they are just not my particular cup of tea.
JShirley
January 24, 2009, 02:14 PM
close to
Byron, you were there for the ugliest thing I've ever seen. If you recall.
TimboKhan
January 24, 2009, 02:29 PM
Byron, you were there for the ugliest thing I've ever seen. If you recall.
Was there or was?
burn.:neener:
JShirley
January 24, 2009, 04:02 PM
His comment was, "Aw, John. She needs love, too." :barf:
Macmac
January 24, 2009, 06:53 PM
WOW! 3 guys on one thread agree that the fancy Glocks are ugly!
About Glock all I know is what I read. I prefer another type of hand gun, and the only plastic gun I have like a glock is as ugly, one EAA poly Witness Compact, but it has a 1911 sort of feel. i wanted to know what a poly gun was like, and this EAA Witness was cheaper.
Now I own a pretty big bowie, because i found the blade in a stone wall, which was once a cellar. Around here we call em cellar holes.
So I can't tell you any make for this Bowie, and or how old it is. All I can tell you is that it is 15.5" long, is a full 1/4" thick, is high carbon steel, that was rusted and is pitted, but that just makes it better.
Since it had no guard and no grips I made them. The guard is plain brass, and the slabs grips are moose antler, held on with brazing rod pins.
Getting this sharp is pretty easy, and so it is sharp enough to shave hairs off my wrist all the time.
It weighs apx 1.5 pounds, and is a dammned handy camp knife.
The scabard is made of walnut, pinned in the same brazing rod brass.
The scabard has a copper wire belt hook, so when it is worn, the knife in the scabard is thrust between me and my belt crossing my back.
I can sit in a saddle this way and not feel it. When I rode horses with this i tied it in the scabard, so if somehow it fell and I did to we wouldn't have a bad meeting.
Once a wild raccon came into a canvas tent when I was nearly asleep. The coon began to drink from a still on fire citronella bucket candle!!!
Somewhat less than thrilled I reached over and swatted that coon with the scabard, and cracked the wood slightly, and just recently with this thread I began to fix it. This is one of my favorite knives.
JShirley
January 25, 2009, 04:00 PM
I'd really like to see a picture, Mac. It sounds pretty neat.
John
Macmac
January 25, 2009, 05:25 PM
John, That just woke me up. Time to slather more linseed oil on that scabard.
I need to get a lot of pics taken, in a very over all way. Not being very computer savey the task falls on my Bride...
I did get her to take a shot of my latest axe project, which is for fun and a What I did, over a how to, but in some ways it will be a how to.
So far the axe has been cut to be re-shaped to a profile I want, and I have another axe in this same profile only better.
This Bowie I have may not be all that old, and it just might be that connecting a date to a cellar hole, is all wrong, and it could be a kid hide this blade some years before I came on to it. I was hired to clean up the area, and build on it again.
Moving old cellar stones out of the hole I ended up the ground man to chain up large hunks of granite.
I have seen similar looking bowies, but upon inspection the blades have been apx 1/2 " shorter.
on edit: I forgot to mention that in time something happened to the scabard, and the blade sort of self locks in place inside it.
The scabard was designed on purpose to appear too small for the blade to fit, but it does fit.
This was the first scabard I made and so both halves are inlet 1/2+ a little more for the blade to be inside. I did this with some dirks I made latter, and with these scabards I cut the wood a bit different, and did all the inletting on one side only, and then put the top back on.
I still have one of these dirks, because my wife saud she wanted it. other wise it would be long gone. This one has the other side of the same moose antler rack, left alone as it came off the moose. The bowie being sanded and most folks think it is bone.
The dirk has a Amethest installed in the button end, with a sliver of sterling silver embedded under it. The idea being to reflect light. The problem is I can't get the stone out myself, if ever the silver turns black. The wood for the dirk is birdseye maple, and the scabard is lined in thin deerhide on the inside. I can't take a picture of that ever either, and it is because i wanted the dirk to be silent. This dirl scabard has a chain to suspend it, but I didn't like the way it worked, and so one day I will have to build a leather frog to suspend it. I'll get pics of this one too.
Byron Quick
January 26, 2009, 10:48 PM
I'm not sure if he's referring to the Korean gal who bit him or the, shall we say, incredibly hefty lady who fell for him like a ton of bricks.
Macmac
January 27, 2009, 10:36 AM
This is one of the bowie pics, others are on this page, with other knives.
JShirley
January 27, 2009, 03:48 PM
I think it was a picture you sent me, Byron.
Macmac
January 27, 2009, 05:37 PM
I mentioned somewhere that the blade is ment to appear to big to fit the scarbard.
What do you think?
burnse
January 28, 2009, 02:34 AM
certainly seems a tight fit. Also, the last knife on the linked page is very nice looking.
JShirley
January 31, 2009, 01:54 PM
Good looking knife. Good shape.
Macmac
January 31, 2009, 05:15 PM
Yeah considering it was buried in a stone wall, meant to be a cellar that blade cleaned up real well. It seemed worthy of a moose antler grip.
If you enjoyed reading about "Best Bowie knives" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join
TheHighRoad.org
today for the full version!
vBulletin® v3.8.6, Copyright ©2000-2013, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. |
People often tell me in private, either though emails or when I meet them face to face, that they know I don't like talking about autism or biomedical treatments much, but they would really love to hear more. I always assure them that I really don't mind talking about it, I just have to keep it in balance with everything else in my life. And I'm done watching and reading anything fear-based, like "the other side" of the vaccine debate (pro-vaccine)—so don't bother sending it to me ;-) I know what they say, and no amount of biased garbage is going to convince me otherwise.
For instance, I was up in Loveland last week and I bumped into someone (well, not literally :-) who knew my blog. She apologized, but said she really wanted to ask me how I had the courage to have another baby. I wondered if there are more of you who are asking yourselves the same question. Let me explain.
When Ashley was having her most severe period my husband and I decided we couldn't have any more children, like we had planned. At that point it wasn't so much of a worry that it would "happen again"—that we would have another child with autism. We were just franticly working around the clock with Ashley.
But eventually I did come to fear that if we had another baby, they may have problems like Ashley. And eventually, after we began chelation (removing poison), Ashley improved dramatically. You can read more about all that here.
Then a good friend of mine came to visit last summer. We took our kids to the park, where she asked me if Andy and I were going to have any more children. I said no, and admitted my fears to her. Her response really hit me. She said that we're all predisposed to probably lots of potential problems. It's really a matter of whether or not those things are triggered.
I thought about that deeply. For all I know, Zoe is also predisposed to autism, but for her it wasn't triggered. In my family's history are heart conditions, diabetes, depression, cancer, and more. I could be predisposed to many things myself.
But still, after that day at the park with my friend, I didn't think of having more children again.
Then in November I thought I was pregnant. Oops. Only I didn't feel panic. I didn't get scared. I was giddy. Andy was giddy. We couldn't stop smiling. But a few days later we were wrong. I wasn't pregnant. We were so disappointed.
After a lot of thought, and talking about it, we decided to just see. I didn't have the easiest time getting pregnant with Zoe and Ashley, especially considering how young I was (I was 24 when I had Zoe). It took over six months before I was pregnant with Zoe and Ashley. Andy and I thought that if I got pregnant this past December, that it would be meant to be.
Two weeks later I was pregnant.
We thought it was a good sign :-) Almost ten years after having our first, we were pregnant with our third, and it didn't take six months this time. Isn't it usually the other way around?
But there were some other things I considered, before deciding to "just see." Of course I was thinking about what my friend had said—that just because we may be predisposed doesn't mean it will be triggered. Also, I've been eating gluten-free for many years now, which is very important for a celiac's fertility. And, I've done detoxification of my own over the past couple years. I did a cleanse two years in a row, followed by a colonic. Plus, I finally got rid of my candida as a result of my diet and cleansing. (Phew.) I avoid toxins, eat organic as much as possible, and haven't had any mercury fillings put in or removed. And I won't have my last two mercury fillings replaced until after the baby has weaned.
Still, there are no guarantees. And that's okay. We try to lead a guided life, and we feel like this baby was meant to be :-) It was blind faith that led us to Colorado with no jobs and no money, and our lives have been blessed ever since.
And now that I've been so serious, I'll leave you with something light—my favorite breakfast lately, quinoa flake porridge, and a photo of the girls and I in their room this morning. Four months pregnant :-) I thought I would share a photo with you at the beginning of every month, so you can share in our excitement.
Cinnamon & Sugar Quinoa Flake Porridge
grain-free, gluten-free, dairy-free
Add to pot:
3 cups cashew milk (cashew milk video)
1 cup coconut milk
Bring to simmer.
Add:
1 & 1/4 cups quinoa flakes
Reduce heat to low and stir until thickened (one or two minutes).
Add:
3 tsp cinnamon
1/4 cup coconut sugar (which is low glycemic index)
1/4 tsp sea salt
Optional toppings:
Toasted shredded coconut, raisins, cooked apples, sliced bananas, walnuts.
Makes about 4 servings.
♥, Kelly
59 comments:
I'm a new reader to your blog. Great post. And quinoa flakes have been a breakfast favorite for a while in my family. :)
You and the girls look so radiant and beautiful! Thanks for sharing this, Kelly. I think your approach is really inspiring and admirable - I think that people live too much in fear, allow it to cloud their ability to listen to their own intuition. It seems, from my perspective as a regular reader, that you and your husband have done an INCREDIBLE job supporting your two children, and the approach you have taken to improving their ability to grow and function well seems absolutely amazing. If you have another child with autism, you will know what you need to do to create an environment that can be nourishing and supportive to their needs. Every child should be so fortunate, no matter their developmental/psychological/physical/etc situation. Thanks for sharing a piece of yourself and for sharing your journey - it is inspiring in more ways than you could ever know. xo
oh yeah, and the porridge looks good too ;)
What a great way to look at it as well as a yummy recipe. Thanks you for all your hard work and sharing what you have learned along the way with us.
Such a great post, Kelly. Your baby bump is beautiful!! :)
Great post! My first child has autism, we have since had 2 more. There was a lot of fear, but I just new our family was meant to be bigger.
Younger 2 are both NT, and doing great. I also get asked that question..
I always wanted 4 or 5 kids(coming from a large family) but at 3 we are feeling settled and like our hands are full. There was some greif with making this decision, but at a place where we feel at peace and whole and complete now. My little suckypoo Grady was MEANT to be the baby of the family :)
and really I love babies! I could likely be a Douger! and have 19, not sure I would ever feel*done*
There are no guarantees, except the love we have for our kids no matter what!
Thank you for this. I needed it today. After yesterday reality set in. We could be in for something big ... or not. Very overwhelming. Thank you for your strength, honesty and transparency...and porridge :)
Ps. you look so radiant!
What a wonderful and beautifully written post. Thank you so much for sharing. I am very excited for you and your family as you embark on this new journey! :)
Thanks for sharing such candid and person thoughts. I love hearing about autism recovery stories and am happy to hear that Ashley is doing so well. After about a year of dabbling with a gf/cf diet, I committed about a month ago. I've been dealing with chronic and severe eczema that came on out of the blue about 2 years ago. My guess is that I have candida overgrowth, but haven't been able to find a doctor willing to explore this with me. Do you have any advice? Any testing recommendations? Thanks!
Thank you all so much!
Mercedes, There is a test called an OAT (organic acid test). And this is one of the best products out there: Biociden Hugs, Kelly
I'm really happy for you! I hope my question was not upsetting. I definitely didn't mean it disrespectfully, just as a fellow mother of a daughter who has had similar issues. I think it says a lot more about my own fears than anything else. I am impressed and I think it'll be wonderful for you.
I think I beat myself up a lot, especially, because I didn't vaccinate, breastfed for more than two years, have never been vaccinated myself, etc...and I still had a daughter with issues and I think this triggered a LOT of insecurity in me.
I think your approach and spontaneity is excellent. I wish the best for you and your family.
Gracias,
Hannah
You and your girls are so beautiful. Thank you for sharing this - such a good reminder not to live in fear. And the porridge looks lovely.
Hannah, Not upsetting at all! I understand how you feel. For years I was planning on not having another because I was afraid. And like I told you, not all of Ashley's heavy metals came from vaccines (though most of them did). She has lead poisoning in addition to mercury and aluminum, and lead isn't in vaccines. She is so blessed to have a mama like you :-) Lets see each other again soon. XOXO
Kelly, you look absolutely gorgeous and your story is beautiful. Somehow we all know what is right for us and when we do, it happens. Love that recipe. Not sure which milk I'll use. No dairy, cashews, or almonds for me right now.
xoxo,
Shirley
Good, I'm glad you weren't too upset. I know this is not an easy topic. I appreciate your viewpoint and the great information you share with all of us. It's nice to know someone who has dealt with some rough stuff and believes in herself enough to move forward. These things can be quite isolating...it's good to realize there are always people out there that are like-minded.
Happy fourth pregnancy month!
Oops...I totally posted a comment with the wrong account. Oh well. :) I have a tarot blog that I'm sure most people probably wouldn't care about. Lol!
Kelly,
Thanks for such a candid post! I've been reading your blog for a while and it is always inspiring to hear someone speak from the heart. I beleive that God gives us the child he has intended for us, in the situation we are in. Whatever health concerns (or not) that your baby might have,you will be the very best momma for your baby in the whole world. God has chosen this baby for you. Perhaps prior learning experiences with your two girls will help, and perhaps not, but one thing is for sure--No one will be better equipted to raise your prescious baby than you! :-)
Also, I have battled with candida way too long and it has dramatically affected my health. I saw your comment to Mercedes, but if you could do a post on how you eradicated (or controlled) candida, I would be very grateful.
Laura
ps- your are definitely getting that wonderful pregancy glow!
I have read your blog for a while, but rarely comment. I just had to say that your friend at the park is so right that we are all predisposed to something. We found out a year ago that our youngest has Celiac. Then we found out I gave it to her. So we had our other two older children tested for the genes. Both carry Celiac and gluten sensitive genes but neither one is a Celiac (yet!). We are ALL gluten free because why take the chance that we can 'turn on' the gene?! I LOVE hearing stories like yours. When the parent is PROACTIVE in changing their children's lives!! On a side note: You are positively glowing!!
Thanks for sharing this Kelly. I think your babies are so super lucky to have chosen you for their mommy. xo
Kelly, your baby bump is so gorgeous! And I love your 'do. I wish we saw more of each other. Your post made me all teary in a warm fuzzy sentimental way.
BTW...did I tell you that I am making your pumpkin muffins for my department at DMNS tomorrow? I took one in for them to sample to see if they liked it and everyone LOVED them. :D
Fantastic photo and fantastic blog on God's amazing grace! Thank you for the encouragement.
Awesome recipe, to boot! Looking forward to trying it SOON! I KNOW my kids will love it.
Kelly,
I know in the past I have asked you a lot of questions concerning going gluten, dairy and sugar free...I guess what I need the most help with is how did you "start" to go this way? Did you just start to weed it out slowly or start cold turkey? I have implemented a lot of what you have taught us on your blog but I am having a hard time with the transition as to me things like coconut milk and stevia do not taste very good to me...maybe you can give some pointers on how to go this way...btw this recipe looks AMAZING!
Thanks for all your help! It means a lot to a girl who has struggled since she was 13 (will be 31 this month) on hormone imbalance, irregular periods, pcos, and "unexplained" weight gain (which as I research this I find WHY it is happening)...
Ann Marie
ahhh so sweet! and thanks for sharing.:)
Hey Kelly,
Both of my sons are on the spectrum. I've been really scared to try chelation...we're GFCF and done other biomedical things, but chelation makes me really nervous. Any words of advice on this point?
Ann Marie, We found out that Zoe and Ashley were reacting to gluten first, then Andy and I were diagnosed after them. We went cold turkey. It wasn't so easy back then. It's so much better now :-)
Angela, Have you done a porphyrin test for them? I would have your DAN get you one (they're just urine, nothing invasive). Then you will know if you need to chelate. And there are some natural chelators you can try first, like IMD.
Beautiful post, Kelly. Your approach to pregnancy is admirable, and seems to me the fact you and your hubby were happy when you first thought you were pregnant (and then disappointed when you weren't) is very telling. You seem like such a great mom--just look at your two girls!--I think this is going to be one lucky baby. And your little bump is so cute!
I love porridge in the morning--will give this one a try. :)
Hi Kelly,
I would second Laura's comment. I am interested in knowing how you got rid of your candida and how long did it take? I didn't do a test but I was told based on my symptoms in June that I had a candida overgrowth. I would appreciate any advice you have after winning your battle with candida. Congratulations on your pregnancy!
WOW! I just want to say thank you. I was truly blessed by what you shared. Thank you also, for all your wonderful creations.. The best to you and your beautiful family.
Wow! I was truly blessed, thank you so much for sharing with us. I wish you and your beautiful family the best.. P.s. Any tips or advice on getting rid of Candida. Thanks
Beautifully written. You look radiant. I love that you are embracing life-- we should all take your lesson and be doing that and leaving our fears behind. -Tessa Sansovich
Kelly - you look radiant! Sounds like everything is working out just as it was always meant to. I am sure you will have an amazingly healthy baby with everything you do for yourself. The quinoa flake porridge sounds divine, mmmm! -A :)
Thanks for sharing Kelly! This baby is a blessing and meant to be! So excited for you guys!
Cari in Iowa
Kelly -
Thank you so much for such a heartfelt post! It is wonderful to read about your experience, and so great that you are able to share this with others. I feel honored to be able to read your story, and inspired to maintain a healthy diet and lifestyle for when we start having children of our own.
Thank you -
Alena
I agree, I'd love to hear more about your experiences with candida. It's a battling I'm just starting, and really struggling with, so hearing about your success would be very inspiring!
Hi Kelly! I've been enjoying your blog and recipes for about a month now. I have been having a lot of fun trying out your recipes and also using them as inspiration for some of my own gluten free, sugar free, dairy free recipes, as I am also trying to eliminate my own problem with candida.Out of curiosity, what cleanses did you say you have done in the past? I have been doing Dr. Natura's colon cleanse for about one month now and trying to follow a strict anti-candida diet (coffee and wine are a little hard for me to give up I admit), but I would like to try another type of cleanse in the future to really help eliminate the candida and cleanse my blood and organs once and for all. Any advice will be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your awesome blog and congrats on your pregnancy! God Bless.
LOVE your blog and recipes! We too have children that are GC/CF so your recipes are VERY helpful! 2 of my 3 have autism and we're expceting #4 in May. I understand your fear and my heart sank when we found out this one is a boy (my oldes is a boy and has autism, my youngest is a girl and also has autism...our middle child is normal) Somehow, the thought of it happening again, is very real. Best wishes on your pregnancy and keep up the wonderful blog!!! It's a lifesaver! :)
Hello.
This is a pretty nice blog. And I've brought it to the attention of my daughter. I'm hoping that she'll get time to read it some day.
I've been reading your blog off and on for a couple of months now. And have learned quite a bit - not only about my sons autism, but my own as well. I didn't find out about my autism until I was probably in my late 20's, and found that I was celiac (and had been most likely since childhood) until my early 40's. Now... I never really thought that there was anything wrong with the autism. In fact I still don't, really. I laugh when people ask me if I feel badly for it (I rather like it, you see). But due to your blogsite, and several others, I've been looking into the effects of diet on neurological disorders. And I've noticed that since I've cut way down on the dairy, and taken corn out of my diet, the symptoms from celiac, autism, and ms have reduced greatly.
Thanks for the information. And the recipes.
~Rhonda
You are so darling! Can I say that? Lovely family picture.
I too can identify with concerns over a second child. With our first she had severe allergic colitis and I had to stop eating all allergens etc. in order to breastfeed her. It was such a stressful period that sometimes I think I'd be crazy to try to go through it again. And yet... in the end, my daughter was fine, and it all worked out. She may develop Celiac one day, and she may not... but the world is so wonderful with her in it. Some day I hope to have the courage to have another one...
Many blessings to you in your pregnancy. I wish you the very best and happiest of pregnancies, and a beautiful healthy baby.
This quinoa sounds lovely. I see cashew milk in my future!!!
-Sea
You are just wonderful!
Hey guys,
More specifically how I got rid of candida:
I went gluten, casein, and sugar free—not for candida, but for other reasons. I was doing that for a couple years first.
Then I decided to do follow The Raw Food Detox Diet. I did that for a couple months, then had a colonic. Eventually I stopped eating that way, and went back to my regular gf/cf/sf diet.
About a year and a half ago I began taking supplements like Biociden, and Monolaurin. I did that for a few months, then went on the Master Cleanse. At the end of the cleanse I had another colonic, and I haven't had the symptoms ever since.
I hesitated to tell you because this particular cleanse is controversial, but you asked what I did, and I want to be honest with you. I think I only did it for about 4 days though, and I didn't follow it the way you're supposed to. I ate a raw dinner every night, like from The Raw Food Detox Diet.
This entire time (for years) I've also been taking probiotics, rotating brands every few months. One that we love is Klaire Labs. Also, as you know I've been making my own yogurt for a while now. That reminds me I need to make some this weekend :-)
Love, Kelly
PS My yogurt recipes are under the post label: Yogurt
One more thing! Just wanted to clarify that I WAS gluten free this whole time. I didn't eat gluten while I was on the Raw Foods Detox Diet. :-)
Hi Kelly,
Thank you for so honestly sharing your wealth of knowledge with us-I learn so much visiting your blog.
Aren't quinoa flakes the best? I must try this porridge:) I've been making a lot of grain-free fruit crumbles for dessert lately, using quinoa flakes and either almond or hazelnut flours.
Thanks for sharing the beautiful picture, too-congratulations & wishing you great health! Kate.
Thanks, Kelly, for the info on how you got rid of your candida. I was a little stumped tho when you said
"I hesitated to tell you because this particular cleanse is controversial, but you asked what I did, and I want to be honest with you."
What cleanse were you talking about? The Raw Food Detox Diet or the colonic? This is all new to me. Also, after you did your program, can you enjoy fruit and other things with sugar now, within reason?
Kelly you are GORGEOUS and are the cutest little pregnant mom ever!! It is hard to believe that people say the things they do sometimes, but I am so glad that your friend shared her perspective about the potential for us ALL to have various problems! It is so true!
Our little one's medical problems could happen to us with another baby...but we know now that we started her off "on the wrong foot." We had all our old, unhealthy habits. But truly, even if we had another baby with all of her problems (God forbid), it would mean another little one with all the love and wisdom and joy that our Sophia has, too!
Think of all the amazing changes you have made! You are an incredible mom and your girls will make the most amazing big sisters ever! I am so happy for you guys!!
You have been such an inspiration to our formerly-junk fed family! I can't wait until things turn around for us and I can buy 20+ copies of your newest amazing cookbook for friends who desperately need it..whether they know it yet or not! ha! :-)
We love you!! Praying for an easy and enjoyable pregnancy!! Treasure every second!! Pregnancy is such an incredible journey!!
Thanks guys!
Laura, I was referring to The Master Cleanse as controversial.
Katrina, No one said anything bad :-) People, including myself, can just be afraid sometimes, and they sometimes ask me how I have courage :-) I love you guys too! XOXO
I also wanted to respond to Rhonda (Metal Walflower). Rhonda, Thank you for sharing with us :-) We love Ashley to pieces, and I wanted to clarify that the treatments we do for her are for her health and wellness. If you read my posts about "recovering Ashley" you will see that Ashley used to scream all day and bang her head on the wall and floor. She also suffered from constant diarrhea, severe anxiety, and painful sensory processing issues. She was not a happy girl. There is a great article about the kids now days with "autism" that you might like to read: There is no Autism Epidemic Much love, Kelly
As the mama of a spectrum kid, I applaud you for having a third baby. The difference between this pregnancy and thereafter, and your experience with Ashley is that your eyes are open.
You know the truth of vaccine burden and gut/brain connections.
You know the DAN! protocol, biomed, and healing through diet.
Your body is healthier because of this, and you will not be unloading those toxins to your new child during gestation.
I wish the best for you and your family. Your blog has been and continues to be a tremendous help to my family when I began GFCF with my son.
Kelly, i just saw your baby bump, and it made me tear up a little. I'm so happy for you, and I love you guys!!!!
I so agree with your friend's comment about tendencies being there for everyone. My oldest has autism and our second child, though he has some minor sensory issues, has not developed any "spectrum diagnosable" issues. We haven't done everything perfectly, but our second has had much fewer of the triggers than our firstborn did.
I have been blessed by a number of your recipes passed onto me by friends, and now by your commentary on your life. Thanks for sharing!
In return, you might be interested in my post on special needs children:
as well as a great recipe:
I hope you enjoy them both!
Hey Kelly!
Thanks for the great post :-) My 4yo son, Caleb, has an autism diagnosis and I have also been asked the same question....more times I have been given the "look" by others. We have a 2yo daughter who I know was created by God specifically to be his little bossy, fiesty sister and we are due with our 3rd child in May. This baby was a complete surprise as we tried for over 3 years to have Caleb and about 5 months to have Chloe. I love it when people have the courage or feel comfortable enough to ask me how we find peace in having a third child. It allows me to share our real story not just the noise and propaganda they only hear in the news. I hope it also gives hope and insight to others as I share how far Caleb has come through diet and nutrition, biomedical and homeopathy and the carefully selected therapies we utilize. No longer is autism a dead end for the child and the family!
Congrats again and I look forward to following your pregnancy :-)
God bless!
Great post...thanks for sharing!! I also would like to know how you overcame candida, since I suffer from it as well. Good luck with your pregnancy!
Wow-beautiful post. I love that you aren't giving into anything fear-based. Right on!
And the recipe looks super yummy! I loooove quinoa ;)
Thank you!!! I love to see your posts everyday, and it encourages me with the issues that we face with both of our sons. You are such a blessing!
Kelly,
What a beautiful and insprirational share, and you look glowing and radient.
Kelly, I love this post. It's such a journey, isn't it? I'm glad you've found your peace and won't allow the fear-based dogma to come across to you. Might just be coincidence, but perhaps your peace and health was the reason you were blessed so quickly with the third. You are positively glowing. And this porridge sounds delightful - I love quinoa.
Congratulations on your pregnancy! What a blessing and an inheritance from the Lord. I "thought" you looked pregnant in the smoothie video, but in case it was weight gain and not a baby I didn't want to say anything until I was sure. Well this post confirms it! Again I say CONGRATULATIONS!
I have quinoa flakes and wondered what in the world to do with them... know I know! This will be breakfast tomorrow morning.
Blessings,
~Mrs. R
I know its good to soak nuts and grains, but does one need to soak quinoa flakes? I know its good to rinse regular quinoa to get rid of the saponin, but the flakes are pre-rinsed from what I gather. But what about soaking to get rid of the acids and whatever else one soaks grains to get rid of??
Great idea! Thanks for the suggestion. I’ll be updating the post text and be sure to include it up there, thanks.
lol I couldn't find where I left off, that's all. But great post. =)
Thank You. Yahweh bless you and yours.
~Rhonnie |
UPS is an acronym for United Parcel Service, which is a parcel delivery company that is headquartered in Sandy Springs, Georgia, United States. The brown vans owned by this company, which have a stamp of UPS in fine gold across the back, are widely known around the world. The trucks, which are usually referred to as package cars, are operated in many countries across the world. These trucks are also known for their well dressed drivers who have been trained and are expected to perform at particular levels of professionalism. The company estimates that it delivers up to 15 million packages daily to an ever growing customer base. In fact, UPS has a presence in about 220 countries in the world and has its own airline service that provides quicker overseas transport. At UPS, the salary of a driver usually depends on the hours that have been worked, the benefits due and the level of seniority. On average, the salary of a driver in this company can range from $72,000 to $130,000 or more.
Fedex on the other hand is an equally widely acclaimed transportation service. It is a package delivery service who major clients are businesses across the world. With a fleet of vehicles and deadlines to meet, Fedex uses the most specialised and skilled drivers in the market. The average salary of a fedex driver is $46,000. However, the actual amount that a driver receives is determined by the location of the company, the benefits due and the level of experience that a driver has.
The process of becoming an employee of UPS or Fedex
Often, most of the people who end up as drivers start off as part time employees. Typically, these people are attached to package handling and they get to experience firsthand, the requirements of the job, before they can apply for it. Some of the requirements that this job need as include:
Absence of a criminal record – the handling of packages is a sensitive matter since clients entrust the delivery company with a variety of products. As such, it is important that the employees of these companies can be trusted. The absence of a criminal record is simply the first step in the qualification process.
Drug and physical tests – before you are employed, you will be required to pass a drug and physical test at the company’s facilities. These tests are aimed at maintaining the integrity of the people applying for these jobs and ensuring that they are physically capable of handling the pressure of the job.
Literacy – reading and writing of English, often fluently is a requirement for these jobs. This is because the clients that the drivers interact with need to be able to communicate with the drivers properly. As such, these firms will most likely require that you have a GED or High School Diploma.
Valid driver’s licence – it goes without saying that a valid driver’s license is required for a driving job. You should also have a clean driving record, usually for a period of at least 5 years or more. It is also necessary for you to demonstrate that you can drive a manual transmission vehicle comfortably and for a long distance in case it is required. Some positions may even require very special licences that will be specified once an opening comes up.
Age – often, the people between the ages of 21 and 25 are preferred since they are younger and more energetic. However, some of the jobs may require people with more experience thus the need for more mature drivers. However, it is important to consider the age limitations that the position may have.
Demeanour – as an employee, you will be portraying the image of the company and it is important that you portray a good attitude. You should also be clean shaven, usually without tattoos and piercings as described by the company. The image that you portray as an employee of the firm, goes a long way in determining if the clients are satisfied with the job or not.
After the requirements have been met, you can apply for these jobs in a variety of ways. Often, most of the job openings are posted on the official website of the company. Once you notice a job opening that you are suited for, you could either apply online or visit one of the offices to drop your application. If your application is deemed to successful, you will be invited for an interview, where your abilities and capacity will be determined. The interviews can take many forms, from practical tests to written and oral examinations. As such, you should be well prepared for the interview both physically and mentally. Since the jobs in these two firms are very competitive, you may be required to come with a picture ID and proof of eligibility to work during your interviews. This also authenticates your application and moves you a step closer to being an employee of UPS or Fedex.
It is important to note that Fedex usually outsources some of its operations to other contractors, which means that you may be called up to be a driver by one of the contractors who work for Fedex. By proxy, you will be an employee of Fedex; however, you immediate employer may someone else. This does not in any way diminish the level of professionalism that is expected of you. This is because the contractors are held to a code of professionalism and conduct. The same code is expected to be taken down to their employees. On the other hand, UPS normally sources their drivers from the part-time freight handlers that are in their employ. These part-time freight handlers are usually promoted to full time employs and then to driver’s after they have learned the job. The drivers are also required to pass a six day training course that is mandatory for driving UPS vehicles
Pingback: Fedex salary | Vanisson
Pingback: Call Of Duty Black Ops 2 Guide
Pingback: Free Money
Pingback: Post Free Classifieds
Pingback: Call of Duty Black Ops 2 Player's Guide
Pingback: cheap edu links
Pingback: pediatric nurse salary 2012
Pingback: get edu backlinks
Pingback: pediatric nurse salary in texas
Pingback: neonatal nurse job vacancy dubai
Pingback: neonatal nurse gifts
Pingback: nurse practitioner salary nyc
Pingback: living trust forms california
Pingback: euro millions
Pingback: Catherine Vandewerker
Pingback: office cleaning services durham nc
Pingback: Marvis Goldy
Pingback: Clorinda Anidi
Pingback: Barb Charron
Pingback: jewelry atlanta hwy montgomery al
Pingback: hostgator coupons 2012
Pingback: sherman oaks tv show
Pingback: portable dvd player cases
Pingback: drupal hostmaster
Pingback: bluehost godaddy domain
Pingback: ipage justhost
Pingback: link
Pingback: ipage vs fatcow vs hostgator
Pingback: Click Here
Pingback: great christian apparel
Pingback: Sana Lisbey
Pingback: Jasa SEO
Pingback: dual screen portable dvd player
Pingback: edu link building service
Pingback: hostgator 1 cent
Pingback: free ipads
Pingback: best 40 inch led tv
Pingback: penis advantage review
Pingback: purchase backlinks
Pingback: cheap xbox
Pingback: Belajar Bisnis Forex Trading
Pingback: Katherine Esten
Pingback: how to get edu backlinks
Pingback: hostgator reviews
Pingback: get a free ipad
Pingback: best 32 led tv
Pingback: buy penis advantage
Pingback: backlinks services
Pingback: Mario Sieloff
Pingback: buy penis advantage
Pingback: does penis advantage work
Pingback: buy edu links
Pingback: free ipads
Pingback: best led tv brand
Pingback: penis advantage scam
Pingback: backlink services
Pingback: free xbox 360
Pingback: best portable dvd player
Pingback: edu backlink service
Pingback: hostgator coupon 2013
Pingback: free ipad
Pingback: best 55 led tv
Pingback: penis advantage reviews
Pingback: purchase backlinks
Pingback: xbox 360 giveaway
Pingback: portable dvd player reviews
Pingback: cheap edu backlinks
Pingback: hostgator 1 cent
Pingback: win a free ipad
Pingback: best 32 led tv
Pingback: penis advantage scam
Pingback: backlink service
Pingback: xbox 360 giveaway
Pingback: dual screen portable dvd player
Pingback: the truth about six pack abs review
Pingback: penis advantage scam
Pingback: hostgator 1 cent
Pingback: free xbox 360
Pingback: portable dvd player for car
Pingback: Mardell Summer
Pingback: cheap edu links
Pingback: Tony Radebaugh
Pingback: win a free ipad
Pingback: best led tv brand
Pingback: backlinks service
Pingback: penis advantage review
Pingback: penis advantage
Pingback: Cornell Lugg
Pingback: Carol Ambroziak
Pingback: get edu backlinks
Pingback: hostgator promo codes
Pingback: get a free ipad
Pingback: best led tvs
Pingback: buy penis advantage
Pingback: buy backlinks
Pingback: free xbox 360
Pingback: kids portable dvd player
Pingback: the truth about six pack abs
Pingback: penis advantage scam
Pingback: reservations brokers
Pingback: the truth about six pack abs
Pingback: Business Week
Pingback: Credit Card References
Pingback: best sg hotels.
Pingback: Eugenio Tahon
Pingback: penisadvantage
Pingback: cheap edu backlinks
Pingback: hostgator discount
Pingback: win a free ipad
Pingback: best led tv deals
Pingback: Dermatology Sites
Pingback: penis advantage review
Pingback: Fur Guard
Pingback: backlinks services
Pingback: xbox 360 giveaway
Pingback: Classified Clubs
Pingback: portable car dvd player
Pingback: the truth about six pack abs
Pingback: Golf Quake
Pingback: penis advantage review
Pingback: the truth about abs
Pingback: penisadvantage
Pingback: Antonio Lafrance
Pingback: Landon Mockler
Pingback: Shawanda Heckmann
Pingback: Johnna Pawlowski
Pingback: how to get edu backlinks
Pingback: hostgator 1 cent
Pingback: how to get a free ipad
Pingback: best led tv brand
Pingback: penis advantage scam
Pingback: buy quality backlinks
Pingback: free xbox 360
Pingback: portable dvd player reviews
Pingback: the truth about abs
Pingback: penis advantage reviews
Pingback: Sandwich Rolls
Pingback: Cary Sleaford
Pingback: Katheryn Silleman
Pingback: Facial Patch
Pingback: Verlie Chism
Pingback: Thalia Vogds
Pingback: Jerrell Honokaupu
Pingback: Sushi Seeker
Pingback: Toy Appraisers
Pingback: Delmar Hudek
Pingback: Chong Spizzirri
Pingback: Johnie Sjulstad
Pingback: Lakeside Parking
Pingback: Vada Tolman
Pingback: Subliminal Broadcast
Pingback: Jone Huyard
Pingback: Mom Reviews
Pingback: Marcus Botdorf
Pingback: Carolann Meehleder
Pingback: Irvin Canela
Pingback: Mel Szynkowicz
Pingback: Roland Creese
Pingback: In Silva
Pingback: Pamella Hohensee
Pingback: Stevie Saleeby
Pingback: Lynn Repenning
Pingback: Emile Commins
Pingback: Twila Balasa
Pingback: Stevie Saleeby
Pingback: Leda Tepe
Pingback: Roland Creese
Pingback: Mohammed Castro
Pingback: tao of badass review
Pingback: Lindsay Stollar
Pingback: Fatin Shidqia Lubis
Pingback: Alonso Broege
Pingback: tao of badass review
Pingback: Pedro Hufty
Pingback: Gene Rought
Pingback: Jamal Shamir
Pingback: Major Ramsby
Pingback: Teena Aleff
Pingback: Vanetta Daiz
Pingback: Huey Cluff
Pingback: Marion Farley
Pingback: Lee Jargas
Pingback: Annalisa Narrow
Pingback: Nita Burkins
Pingback: Twila Balasa
Pingback: Russell Fingleton
Pingback: Trenton Dewick
Pingback: Geoffrey Giorgi
Pingback: Tillie Dungan
Pingback: Cedrick Gorius
Pingback: Lavelle Ferrini
Pingback: Corrine Hepperly
Pingback: Audria Vanlaere
Pingback: Ruben Kravetsky
Pingback: Olen Goodmon
Pingback: Bethel Martey
Pingback: Gretchen Bowers
Pingback: Kerry Vivenzio
Pingback: Rita Linzan
Pingback: Caprice Borgen
Pingback: Fleta Worthley
Pingback: Love Zuck
Pingback: Jong Shike
Pingback: Florencio Battenfield
Pingback: Rupert Zocklein
Pingback: Florinda Winningham
Pingback: Tyson Broida
Pingback: Corey Jobe
Pingback: Oliver Shenton
Pingback: Larhonda Laventure
Pingback: Jerry Funchess
Pingback: Sparkle Plesant
Pingback: Step by Step Cash System
Pingback: Carmen Henao
Pingback: Major Legate
Pingback: Ariel Kurylo
Pingback: Taisha Jolissaint
Pingback: Jamaal Crier
Pingback: Sandie Lanzarin
Pingback: Dorthy Gehris
Pingback: Oliver Shenton
Pingback: Jayna Sayloe
Pingback: Jann Perrins
Pingback: Alica Graci
Pingback: Rolland Nuhn
Pingback: Gretta Mach
Pingback: Jed Phyfiher
Pingback: Horacio Merante
Pingback: Modesta Timmons
Pingback: Xiomara Hasbni
Pingback: Elliot Artibee
Pingback: Morgan Kolbeck
Pingback: Tyrone Ragusa
Pingback: Quincy Wolfer
Pingback: Alex Jerrett
Pingback: Johnathon Marer
Pingback: Clotilde Watzke
Pingback: Virgil Kiker
Pingback: Conrad Arizmendi
Pingback: Leoma Alterio
Pingback: Elsa Baffa
Pingback: Claudie Wyss
Pingback: Aimee Bridenstine
Pingback: Cristin Feeler
Pingback: Johnathon Malgieri
Pingback: Sharie Stauss
Pingback: Matilde Levers
Pingback: Ron Farkus
Pingback: Rana Scheidler
Pingback: Gavin Fillinger
Pingback: Burt Galipeau
Pingback: Dennis Voorhies
Pingback: Lawrence Pohorilla
Pingback: Arden Loson
Pingback: Adolph Villalvazo
Pingback: Glen Mallo
Pingback: Melania Peak
Pingback: Miles Falsetti
Pingback: Dewitt Burch
Pingback: Lanette Crouter
Pingback: Sarita Gloston
Pingback: Celena Wurdeman
Pingback: Rocio Kesinger
Pingback: Lory Burtin
Pingback: Billy Hettwer
Pingback: Sherita Mcbryde
Pingback: Joel Canwell
Pingback: Dia Kushlan
Pingback: Ida Romanski
Pingback: Terra Florez
Pingback: Austin Gulston
Pingback: Thaddeus Gehring
Pingback: Kermit Sammut
Pingback: Shyla Vanvliet
Pingback: Dong Serrano
Pingback: Jeff Powless
Pingback: Owen Mignone
Pingback: Virgil Higaneda
Pingback: Katie Stacer
Pingback: Christeen Piner
Pingback: Daren Seminario
Pingback: Melynda Coomer
Pingback: Aimee Bridenstine
Pingback: Sharri Holtgrewe
Pingback: Benjamin Berkowitz
Pingback: Shala Sudo
Pingback: Milford Joya
Pingback: Damon Coville
Pingback: Stevie Thebeau
Pingback: Genny Sauredo
Pingback: Josiah Lorraine
Pingback: Kylee Bellair
Pingback: Valentine Tenley
Pingback: Risa Victory
Pingback: Celena Wurdeman
Pingback: Jeffery Wyatt
Pingback: Gene Shuler
Pingback: Many Veldkamp
Pingback: Laquanda Amos
Pingback: Deandra Vonderheide
Pingback: Chester Salfelder
Pingback: Kelly Cortijo
Pingback: Fern Ghazal
Pingback: Christie Bent
Pingback: Jerold Barmer
Pingback: Roderick Maguet
Pingback: Garry Castaner
Pingback: Alvaro Brinkerhoff
Pingback: Toby Terinoni
Pingback: Carmelina Mruk
Pingback: Toni Alphonse
Pingback: Margart Balicki
Pingback: Miles Tomehak
Pingback: Eddy Fetty
Pingback: Caryn Coulas
Pingback: Waldo Cordas
Pingback: Arletta Birk
Pingback: Chara Neske
Pingback: Bernadette Pedrin
Pingback: Desmond Sawransky
Pingback: Felix Tomory
Pingback: Rodrigo Whelton
Pingback: Dave Wackerbarth
Pingback: Alfonzo Enwright
Pingback: Nelle Froeliger
Pingback: Jess Founds
Pingback: Rhea Duenez
Pingback: Annabelle Maltez
Pingback: Wallace Caiafa
Pingback: Noah Hooks
Pingback: Bernardo Tacata
Pingback: Mattie Zimlich
Pingback: Delmer Turli
Pingback: Patricia Lazarz
Pingback: Arica Littich
Pingback: Marcela Riggs
Pingback: Ernie Rigby
Pingback: Rosendo Herschelman
Pingback: Jacob Worton
Pingback: Fred Dreyfuss
Pingback: Karla Turcott
Pingback: Sanford Allstott
Pingback: Darren Bann
Pingback: Gaston Cordovano
Pingback: Jarod Biglin
Pingback:
Pingback: Kaitlin Gambill
Pingback: Vance Feauto
Pingback: Dorsey Aboudi
Pingback:
Pingback: Bulah Guerrouxo
Pingback:
Pingback: Georgetta Pingree
Pingback: Percy Groeneveld
Pingback: Voncile Barasch
Pingback: Maribel Lunemann
Pingback: Gale Miyose
Pingback:
Pingback: Junior Trundy
Pingback: Rick Goossen
Pingback: Jarvis Poma
Pingback:
Pingback:
Pingback: Marian Dalal
Pingback: Tommie Bartron
Pingback: Drema Chowenhill
Pingback:
Pingback:
Pingback: Pierre Rotondi
Pingback: Bennett Chamness
Pingback: Scottie Quirarte
Pingback: Gita Nowell
Pingback: Nydia Nicolo
Pingback: Bea Kast
Pingback: Tia Krzan
Pingback: Jere Rondell
Pingback: Petronila Bouten
Pingback: Elbert Schuermann
Pingback: Kandis Wamhoff
Pingback: Shantay Koenigs
Pingback: Edda Pomrenke
Pingback: Delmer Dexheimer
Pingback: Scott Boniello
Pingback: Roger Tweten
Pingback: Wilson Santorella
Pingback: Roy Callery
Pingback: Bert Yett
Pingback: Carma Leeker
Pingback: Alana Cuckler
Pingback: Lolita Ritchie
Pingback: Ignacio Rohs
Pingback: Denver Deleo
Pingback: Francine Dechambeau
Pingback: Teodora Kinsey
Pingback: Rolf Scarrow
Pingback: Adriane Brazzel
Pingback: Kurtis Cokeley
Pingback: Jamey Zager
Pingback: Lakenya Nobbe
Pingback: Ethelene Gates
Pingback: Kassandra Cagey
Pingback: Patrick Khora
Pingback: Providencia Fratus
Pingback: Viki Parrillo
Pingback: Gerald Allender
Pingback: Cythia Sivia
Pingback: Andres Speegle
Pingback: Jan Creehan
Pingback: Alonzo Arrocho
Pingback: Hyun Varughese
Pingback: Bambi Moschella
Pingback: Darlene Slovinski
Pingback: Denis Danby
Pingback: Quinton Folkes
Pingback: Eleonor Lebowitz
Pingback: Kristine Vijil
Pingback: Porter Omullan
Pingback: Randa Ravert
Pingback: Fabian Eckard
Pingback: Cleveland Secundo
Pingback: Angelia Trufin
Pingback: Abram Torti
Pingback: Warner Mason
Pingback: Fren Blog
Pingback: Deon Demary
Pingback: Lisandra Shadd
Pingback: Odell Bekhit
Pingback: Cameron Teesdale
Pingback: Walter Caroselli
Pingback: Bonny Czech
Pingback: Giuseppe Skattebo
Pingback: Elyse Mccalpin
Pingback: Dana Searby
Pingback: Berita Terbaru
Pingback: Melani Crumrine
Pingback: Wana Kencana
Pingback: Timothy Stumb
Pingback: Tena Marlett
Pingback: Ardell Gitter
Pingback: Fashion Style
Pingback: Jackie Kuney
Pingback: Lorinda Berggren
Pingback: Sherita Youssefi
Pingback: Fidel Mailey
Pingback: Savanna Lash
Pingback: Madalyn Merel
Pingback: Kacy Koskela
Pingback: Quinton Bissonette
Pingback: Stewart Birkland
Pingback: Lon Siena
Pingback: Melva Dejongh
Pingback: Darron Mcgloster
Pingback: Christeen Salazan
Pingback: Cliff Mccaleb
Pingback: Belen Echenique
Pingback: Vernon Norse
Pingback: Lilly Sirrine
Pingback: Seymour Hormell
Pingback: Helene Macnamara
Pingback: Kamala Blaha
Pingback: Marianna Vendrick
Pingback: Daniel Vigiano
Pingback: Noble Ancheta
Pingback: Elisa Mulzer
Pingback: Colton Granberg
Pingback: Louie Ogrady
Pingback: smu bugil
Pingback: Ahmad Vecino
Pingback: Brant Bibo
Pingback: Christoper Dandrea
Pingback: Lincoln Hendricks
Pingback: football australia
Pingback: Cortez Vassie
Pingback: 2013 ford explorer sports
Pingback: Car Reviews
Pingback: Candance Guler
Pingback: Sharlene Junick
Pingback: Toi Kintop
Pingback: Toby Boelke
Pingback: Trent Hluska
Pingback: Todd Minneweather
Pingback: Kip Leddon
Pingback: Bradford Ortea
Pingback: Lenard Arbertha
Pingback: Randolph Cuestas
Pingback: Talitha Littlefield
Pingback: Sanora Comp
Pingback: Lakia Wykle
Pingback: Aurore Ieng
Pingback: Winter Maholmes
Pingback: Lester Faehnle
Pingback: Luanna Geris
Pingback: Augustus Mckanic
Pingback: Laquita Baughan
Pingback: Giovanni Ryden
Pingback: Ladawn Lausen
Pingback: Dominic Lubke
Pingback: Gita Ugalde
Pingback: Leon Herod
Pingback: Mike Kassell
Pingback: Eden Yearous
Pingback: Salvatore Colglazier
Pingback: Antony Ziolkowski
Pingback: Lillian Lal
Pingback: Bert Hurwitz
Pingback: Jonnie Petty
Pingback: Rhett Conces
Pingback: Mitchel Bonepart
Pingback: Wilfred Stephensen
Pingback: Debora Tetter
Pingback: Penni Saintlouis
Pingback: Kermit Kooser
Pingback: Mario Waitman
Pingback: Jacque Blanks
Pingback: Windows 8 HD Wallpapers
Pingback: Ellis Ghil
Pingback: Anastasia Gigstad
Pingback: Vannesa Scarcia
Pingback: Elisha Beloate
Pingback: Francis Quelette
Pingback: Zona Smeja
Pingback: Noel Rammer
Pingback: Jalisa Bolante
Pingback: Patria Sanna
Pingback: Bennett Lonzo
Pingback: Dante Ballweg
Pingback: Burl Zanter
Pingback: Eli Francios
Pingback: Raquel Ollis
Pingback: Claudette Encalade
Pingback: Step by Step Cash System
Pingback: Minh Glaze
Pingback: Vito Calnick
Pingback: Carl Christion
Pingback: Pablo Gotto
Pingback: Cristin Kobrin
Pingback: Latoyia Zbinden
Pingback: Tana Bungo
Pingback: Tamesha Dub
Pingback: Rodney Brindley
Pingback: Linette Peckham
Pingback: Kirby Curlee
Pingback: Camelia Walth
Pingback: Mittie Lona
Pingback: Ji Berne
Pingback: Adell Mithani
Pingback: Brain Lindsley
Pingback: Sharyl Eckblad
Pingback: Bridgett Deakins
Pingback: Art Laughner
Pingback: Abraham Yerry
Pingback: Trent Larve
Pingback: Clementine Mcgahan
Pingback: Quintin Delira
Pingback: Magali Strizich
Pingback: Caleb Treisch
Pingback: Ervin Sammut
Pingback: Merle Critzman
Pingback: Magdalene Belin
Pingback: Archie Malesky
Pingback: Donald Nanthanong
Pingback: Alice Weed
Pingback: Mickie Mcfadyen
Pingback: Regan Reeve
Pingback: Bernadette Potteiger
Pingback: Merri Furner
Pingback: Annemarie Tartt
Pingback: Alecia Lavecchia
Pingback: Shiloh Tasso
Pingback: Roman Rupp
Pingback: Lillie Morgen
Pingback: Roseanne Hosang
Pingback: Maryln Causby
Pingback: Vicente Gudgell
Pingback: Micah Onaga
Pingback: Tod Kaizer
Pingback: Freddy Sewade
Pingback: Alline Vastardis
Pingback: Demi Lovato X-Factor
Pingback: Patty Vigueras
Pingback: Victoria Negroni
Pingback: Paula Grom
Pingback: Wally Leyson
Pingback: Rubi Eyubeh
Pingback: Elvis Mcgreevy
Pingback: Elvia Bemiss
Pingback: Reynalda Hollett
Pingback: Isela Gazzo
Pingback: Bailey Menlove
Pingback: Virginia Oquinn
Pingback: Brady Janeway
Pingback: Mitchel Crincoli
Pingback: Kennith Cornelison
Pingback: Paige Fischer
Pingback: Towanda Imming
Pingback: Dwayne Sieker
Pingback: Daphne Costenive
Pingback: Reanna Imholte
Pingback: Neal Boehme
Pingback: Krystle Grise
Pingback: Ailene Mitchelle
Pingback: Randolph Troise
Pingback: Raphael Brandel
Pingback: Hermina Connarton
Pingback: Jacob Tipold
Pingback: Tamesha Crowley
Pingback: Lenny Galas
Pingback: Marcelo Mclaney
Pingback: Nilsa Carrizales
Pingback: Everett Kiyabu
Pingback: Francis Wardrip
Pingback: Jan Cini
Pingback: Bo Reyne
Pingback: Anitra Nabity
Pingback: scam hosting
Pingback: Mathilde Holyoak
Pingback: Meghan Penninger
Pingback: Priscila Miggins
Pingback: Iliana Navarrette
Pingback: Ferdinand Fechner
Pingback: Jamaal Smither
Pingback: Desire Chairez
Pingback: Luvenia Lawrenz
Pingback: Carolyne Helfinstine
Pingback: Jerome Peckens
Pingback: Noble Reeds
Pingback: Keli Laitila
Pingback: Lionel Zubiate
Pingback: Dirk Shike
Pingback: Krishna Alba
Pingback: Joeann Anderon
Pingback: Catharine Saitta
Pingback: Valentine Durkin
Pingback: Andre Ebbert
Pingback: Jacinto Yance
Pingback: Frank Durough
Pingback: APK Files
Pingback: Jody Nwakanma
Pingback: Domingo Jhanson
Pingback: Lulu Schumpert
Pingback: Demetrius Spadaccini
Pingback: Ludivina Kannady
Pingback: Tisa Biscoe
Pingback: Karole Rinehardt
Pingback: Deadra Demyan
Pingback: Buck Grindeland
Pingback: Rocco Proa
Pingback: Manuel Cabla
Pingback: Jamey Friehe
Pingback: hostgator
Pingback: Michelina Dumesnil
Pingback: Donetta Sheinbein
Pingback: Doug Battiata
Pingback: Melodee Trippet
Pingback: Erwin Karpin
Pingback: Helen Mcnicoll
Pingback: Arnoldo Ahmau
Pingback: Saul Piedmont
Pingback: Kena Peart
Pingback: Clifford Kyung
Pingback: Susie Eubank
Pingback: Inga Brownlee
Pingback: Jayme Schlinger
Pingback: Max Glandon
Pingback: Stephanie Vergo
Pingback: Bobbie Chen
Pingback: Christal Locke
Pingback: Kendrick Kirsh
Pingback: Graig Hanrath
Pingback: Willard Jarrard
Pingback: Lakeshia Hyler
Pingback: Les Iino
Pingback: Elbert Zieman
Pingback: Marquerite Ketchie
Pingback: Lanelle Oger
Pingback: Ron Langenfeld
Pingback: Shae Vanderhoff
Pingback: Humberto Thruthley
Pingback: Kelvin Sutch
Pingback: Winnie Riskin
Pingback: Riley Trybala
Pingback: Phillip Finey
Pingback: Omar Nemec
Pingback: Steffanie Hitchens
Pingback: Lloyd Minarcin
Pingback: APK Files
Pingback: Siobhan Lauri
Pingback: Al Yehle
Pingback: Piper Eversmann
Pingback: Cornelius Narvaez
Pingback: Merlin Rosoff
Pingback: Wilfredo Muhs
Pingback: Miles Paskin
Pingback: Deon Mceneny
Pingback: Cami Gautier
Pingback: Janay Byndon
Pingback: Rudolph Carolus
Pingback: Antionette Formanek
Pingback: Marylou Raleigh
Pingback: Guadalupe Golar
Pingback: Scarlett Najjar
Pingback: Lorenza Letteer
Pingback: Ludivina Patrice
Pingback: Billye Boyance
Pingback: Dorian Kabir
Pingback: Melita Andronis
Pingback: Diego Kannenberg
Pingback: Zack Lustig
Pingback: Rueben Delosier
Pingback: Louis Rosalez
Pingback: Coralee Kasee
Pingback: Emmett Harnly
Pingback: Dick Wiggers
Pingback: Loretta Pectol
Pingback: Augustine Mcdannell
Pingback: Christina Monteverde
Pingback: Rodrick Rathrock
Pingback: Ai Kochanski
Pingback: Moshe Abreo
Pingback: Robby Filo
Pingback: tesc 789
Pingback: Neal Herschaft
Pingback: Lorette Schweinert
Pingback: Lanette Dymond
Pingback: Lori Guildford
Pingback: Wes Ramsuer
Pingback: Keira Nabity
Pingback: Erasmo Marthe
Pingback: Bernie Mcardell
Pingback: Hellen Szermer
Pingback: Bernie Mcardell
Pingback: Ervin Stawasz
Pingback: Morris Alecca
Pingback: Mallie Hedrington
Pingback: Aurore Cossio
Pingback: Marline Weeth
Pingback: Esteban Fellner
Pingback: Enrique Escutia
Pingback: Rachelle Vina
Pingback: Jewell Spruel
Pingback: Inge Fathree
Pingback: Rea Rauchwerger
Pingback: Bettye Oballe
Pingback: Chelsey Kufner
Pingback: Kyle Daryanl
Pingback: Bennie Borja
Pingback: Cherie Waterer
Pingback: Henry Mcgoogan
Pingback: Delsie Fedigan
Pingback: Gwyneth Slingland
Pingback: Leta Manaugh
Pingback: internet marketing in Nashville
Pingback: Billy Hesselbach
Pingback: Jami Roark
Pingback: Lorenzo Vidrine
Pingback: Elvis Arends
Pingback: Lou Goderich
Pingback: Bradford Madyun
Pingback: Damaris Rainge
Pingback: Kary Harrow
Pingback: Saul Layton
Pingback: Ciera Theam
Pingback: Percy Oquendo
Pingback: Mao Overmeyer
Pingback: Denver Baisten
Pingback: Ramiro Camidge
Pingback: Joan Clouser
Pingback: Donya Rama
Pingback: Virgil Goodenow
Pingback: Doretta Kowalec
Pingback: Winston Massoud
Pingback: Rhonda Strey
Pingback: Zack Taff
Pingback: Analisa Stjames
Pingback: Barbie Claxton
Pingback: Annmarie Sturrup
Pingback: Edgardo Beliveau
Pingback: Waltraud Srygley
Pingback: Geoffrey Boissonnault
Pingback: Clare Lagan
Pingback: Buddy Tritt
Pingback: Carylon Birkhimer
Pingback: Charlesetta Mccurren
Pingback: Allison Verplanck
Pingback: Bambi Goyda
Pingback: Kermit Krakowsky
Pingback: Enrique Crafts
Pingback: Jonathan Canel
Pingback: used car dealers in Madison tn
Pingback: Aleta Rivkin
Pingback: Merry Alliman
Pingback: Donte Birdsell
Pingback: Latoya Hammontree
Pingback: Freeman Wetklow
Pingback: Jenee Shyne
Pingback: Charlie Drymon
Pingback: Adolph Insley
Pingback: Conrad Suydam
Pingback: Mazie Pailet
Pingback: Michel Garrard
Pingback: Emelia Drafall
Pingback: Norah Swatloski
Pingback: Jimmy Bachus
Pingback: seo for wordpress
Pingback: Nashville private investigating
Pingback: covert surveillance in Nashville
Pingback: Sherrie Menna
Pingback: Kenneth Autullo
Pingback: Stanton Cristello
Pingback: Nakia Sida
Pingback: Alisia Luhmann
Pingback: Christian Ancy
Pingback: Debra Sholar
Pingback: Bob Keyt
Pingback: Monroe Goren
Pingback: Tad Spoonamore
Pingback: Na Kennin
Pingback: Thanh Hamstra
Pingback: Lane Fritz
Pingback: Stacia Picolet
Pingback: Josefina Vandeusen
Pingback: Nicky Crumley
Pingback: Leo Clements
Pingback: Hyacinth Raheem
Pingback: Kirk Moorhead
Pingback: Nashville car alarms
Pingback: Noah Hartup
Pingback: Ronald Moudry
Pingback: Millard Henerson
Pingback: Hugh Starbuck
Pingback: Julius Pruchnik
Pingback: Lenny Rottner
Pingback: So Boggioni
Pingback: Olivia Puga
Pingback: Garland Telfair
Pingback: Mertie Lavalla
Pingback: Eunice Goude
Pingback: Ruben Guertin
Pingback: Gwenn Manternach
Pingback: Emma Anson
Pingback: Jennell Jesmer
Pingback: Cassaundra Dollak
Pingback: Tonda Oien
Pingback: Jarrett Macdaniel
Pingback: Enrique Lasley
Pingback: Romona Iachetta
Pingback: Yee Skyers
Pingback: Hans Mawhorter
Pingback: Rufina Mcilwaine
Pingback: Hal Wauson
Pingback: Earl Fosher
Pingback: Morris Capoccia
Pingback: Hildegarde Nicoletta
Pingback: Trent Gambrell
Pingback: Teri Stinde
Pingback: Austin Reddout
Pingback: Stella Lasenby
Pingback: Roderick Sillas
Pingback: Ben Pehowich
Pingback: Samira Riemann
Pingback: Desire Siebenberg
Pingback: Jonah Wanders
Pingback: Max Callum
Pingback: Elmo Epps
Pingback: Joseph Hoemann
Pingback: Edmond Cisowski
Pingback: Parker Rhew
Pingback: Domingo Keavney
Pingback: Lincoln Minic
Pingback: Mauro Hrycenko
Pingback: Alfredo Camey
Pingback: Patrick Ratledge
Pingback: Luna Ruzicka
Pingback: Brenna Delonais
Pingback: Shannon Ayyad
Pingback: Pamelia Niesborella
Pingback: Holli Maczko
Pingback: Donnie Simeone
Pingback: Alfred Policz
Pingback: Sang Tussey
Pingback: Amalia Vangorp
Pingback: Aurelio Mccosker
Pingback: Kathie Baras
Pingback: Alonzo Pirillo
Pingback: Karl Shellnut
Pingback: Coy Luvian
Pingback: Almeta Depottey
Pingback: Abdul Batcheller
Pingback: Damon Basini
Pingback: Noble Hema
Pingback: Emelina Ridgill
Pingback: Freddie Landing
Pingback: Londa Eisele
Pingback: Moises Greely
Pingback: Rima Toenges
Pingback: Leonie Vojna
Pingback: Anitra Cabag
Pingback: Tomika Schlangen
Pingback: German Tipple
Pingback: Soo Malichi
Pingback: Anitra Cabag
Pingback: Carmon Cantara
Pingback: Chin Kralik
Pingback: Armand Yehle
Pingback: Hassan Simlick
Pingback: Berniece Tarman
Pingback: Marcie Redrick
Pingback: Ricky Bentley
Pingback: Amiee Steinbrook
Pingback: Dennis Hallinan
Pingback: Jeremiah Ailstock
Pingback: download free hd wallpapers
Pingback: Renee Klahn
Pingback: Willy Nevison
Pingback: Ronna Lindy
Pingback: Evita Harajly
Pingback: Alyse Sepe
Pingback: Stephany Mccade
Pingback: Janis Zenner
Pingback: Leonardo Marceaux
Pingback: Eda Devoto
Pingback: Nanette Blunk
Pingback: Florencio Maglio
Pingback: Maryann Lamberti
Pingback: Lane Mainero
Pingback: Leta Reusswig
Pingback: Yevette Scantlen
Pingback: Kurt Dittberner
Pingback: Tajuana Hebron
Pingback: Antione Lascody
Pingback: Jack Rantz
Pingback: Isaias Spana
Pingback: Estella Pacetti
Pingback: Loyd Winks
Pingback: Toi Icard
Pingback: Angla Culhane
Pingback: Joya Bednarek
Pingback: Brant Cabeceira
Pingback: Lakia Mutschelknaus
Pingback: Albert Laday
Pingback: Ileen Hang
Pingback: Cory Guzi
Pingback: Kurtis Demo
Pingback: Lavern Stowell
Pingback: Jeremy Hattabaugh
Pingback: Roy Baack
Pingback: Rey Kirckof
Pingback: Mohammad Tapia
Pingback: Barbie Heister
Pingback: Carson Madden
Pingback: Kelvin Nicolella
Pingback: Merissa Barends
Pingback: Morgan Mahoney
Pingback: Kraig Rothfuss
Pingback: Sandi Starcic
Pingback: Christiana Mcelhinny
Pingback: Cassondra Graeser
Pingback: Thad Cotroneo
Pingback: Linn Copen
Pingback: Lucien Elskamp
Pingback: William Mcclaine
Pingback: Marva Mercier
Pingback: Gretta Mcmurtrie
Pingback: Margarette Defibaugh
Pingback: Arthur Robotham
Pingback: Cortez Vielma
Pingback: Brant Jablonsky
Pingback: Jarred Bolton
Pingback: Lorilee Mantilia
Pingback: Patria Rater
Pingback: Lorri Strenge
Pingback: Danita Leake
Pingback: Vida Krol
Pingback: Caitlyn Tlatenchi
Pingback: Shanelle Stayton
Pingback: Shelli Brunelli
Pingback: Joanne Gutenberg
Pingback: Clifton Ruka
Pingback: web marketing in Nashville
Pingback: My Falgoust
Pingback: Sebastian Labrake
Pingback: Kenton Petrini
Pingback: Samual Whaite
Pingback: Pedro Shirah
Pingback: Quinn Bethel
Pingback: Jackson Leakes
Pingback: Jamison Perr
Pingback: Ellis Gunsolley
Pingback: Maryellen Lomonte
Pingback: car sales in Madison tn
Pingback: Edmund Friedle
Pingback: Lamar Videtto
Pingback: Nanci Prisoc
Pingback: Shani Coogen
Pingback: Corazon Huckabay
Pingback: Tomasa Hillered
Pingback: Mariam Izaguine
Pingback: used car dealers in madison tn
Pingback: Lennie Lamoore
Pingback: Perry Bertelle
Pingback: Daron Durhan
Pingback: Oliver Mcglinn
Pingback: Timothy Parisio
Pingback: Lawerence Shutters
Pingback: Karin Malensek
Pingback: Marjorie Geddings
Pingback: Renaldo Rigdon
Pingback: Federico Folmar
Pingback: Perry Gordineer
Pingback: Elois Acedo
Pingback: Jannet Szczepkowski
Pingback: Demetrius Laberge
Pingback: Clark Marier
Pingback: Norman Sugahara
Pingback: Archie Eichstedt
Pingback: Marvis Haydock
Pingback: Rob Gange
Pingback: Vernia Morta
Pingback: Lovie Nale
Pingback: car audio in Nashville
Pingback: Guadalupe Laro
Pingback: Anneliese Inglis
Pingback: Chuck Bidner
Pingback: Ellis Maltos
Pingback: Loraine Galanga
Pingback: Corrinne Gelfo
Pingback: Chia Kwon
Pingback: Eduardo Boshears
Pingback: Krystle Chirico
Pingback: Lizeth Sheffield
Pingback: Jacinta Spayd
Pingback: Orval Schunemann
Pingback: Virgilio Kitten
Pingback: Norris Dinovo
Pingback: Verlie Mardirosian
Pingback: Sharda Nakken
Pingback: Lynda Francesconi
Pingback: Herman Bagi
Pingback: Lavelle Fuger
Pingback: Joey Lindman
Pingback: Jame Romig
Pingback: Jermaine Meaux
Pingback: Gricelda Janovsek
Pingback: Elsy Thews
Pingback: Ignacio Ochakovsky
Pingback: Orlando Demara
Pingback: Cedric Anglade
Pingback: Arnold Shub
Pingback: Ivory Tillis
Pingback: Diego Demattia
Pingback: Jarvis Lissy
Pingback: Luciana Varakuta
Pingback: Floyd Goff
Pingback: Jarrod Seigfried
Pingback: Jung Kupiec
Pingback: Iva Garity
Pingback: Demetra Merlos
Pingback: Felipe Cordel
Pingback: Isidra Cooperider
Pingback: Williams Sampaga
Pingback: Claud Golub
Pingback: Jina Koziol
Pingback: Alfred Magliulo
Pingback: Janelle Borgmeyer
Pingback: Kent Eon
Pingback: Dorian Pruner
Pingback: Trula Speidel
Pingback: Erminia Pridham
Pingback: Dollie Ardman
Pingback: Rosalba Babish
Pingback: Dwight Trevillion
Pingback: used cars in Madison tn
Pingback: Dorcas Paskert
Pingback: Branden Ludera
Pingback: Bennett Catalani
Pingback: Leif Ledonne
Pingback: Nita Schnicke
Pingback: Delana Sprinkel
Pingback: Alphonso Rugg
Pingback: Marta Hartje
Pingback: Lewis Cutshall
Pingback: Madison tn used cars
Pingback: Get Facebook Likes
Pingback: maillot de foot montpellier
Pingback: Alopecia |
droz
The Dr. Oz Show Episodes
2009, TV Show
Main
Photos
Videos
TV Listings
Episodes
News
Cast & Details
Episode Detail: Dr. Oz's Colonoscopy - The Dr. Oz Show
Dr. Oz shares the results of his colonoscopy in the second-season premiere. Also: five lifesaving numbers.
Episodes: The Dr. Oz Show - 687 total Episodes
5/17/2013: America's Wackiest Health Trends Put to the Test!
5/16/2013: Angelina Jolie's Double Mastectomy: The Life Changing Decision
5/15/2013: What Really Happens at the End of Life?
5/14/2013: Health Splurges That Can Actually Save You Money!
5/13/2013: Suppress Your Cravings Naturally! Dr. Oz's Dopamine Diet
5/10/2013: Embarrassing Medical Myths Even Dr. Oz Believes!
5/9/2013: Long Island Medium: What Really Happens Inside a Psychic's Brain?
5/8/2013: Breaking Health News: Is Sunscreen Dangerous?
5/7/2013: Dr. Oz's Pain Clinic!
5/6/2013: Dr. Oz's Favorite Holistic Cures to Reboot Your Body!
5/3/2013: Dr. Oz's Swimsuit Cleanse: Drop 5 Pounds in 5 Days!
5/2/2013: The New 3-Day Weekend Cleanse!
5/1/2013: The Meditation Cleanse to Soothe Your Stress With Deepak Chopra
4/30/2013: Dr. Oz's 3-Day Energy Boosting Jumpstart Cleanse!
4/29/2013: 7 Belly Blasters That Work!
4/26/2013: Eva Longoria's Health Mission!
4/25/2013: New Ayurvedic Fat Fighters!
4/24/2013: How Bad Are Your Health Mistakes?
4/23/2013: Super-Powered Drink to Fight Heart Disease and Live Longer!
4/22/2013: Paleo Diet Craze: Does It Work?
4/19/2013: Rogue Bacteria: When a Simple Infection Turns Deadly!
4/18/2013: Sofia Vergara Reveals Her Surprising Health Struggles
4/16/2013: Dr. Oz's Real Age Quiz to Drop a Decade!
4/15/2013: What Do Female Doctors Know That Male Doctors Don't?
4/12/2013: The New Relaxation Drinks: Can You Find Calm in a Can?
4/11/2013: Gwyneth Paltrow
4/9/2013: Eat Your Way Thin! How to Eat More to Boost Your Metabolism
4/8/2013: Can Iyanla Vanzant Fix Your Broken Health?
4/4/2013: What Does Your Personality Reveal About Your Health?
4/3/2013: The Truth About Antidepressants
4/2/2013: Joan Rivers Uncensored and Like You've Never Seen Her Before!
4/1/2013: Should Artificial Sweeteners Be Allowed in Milk Products?
3/28/2013: Are Your Silver Fillings Making You Sick?
3/27/2013: What Do We Know About Jesus' Health?
3/26/2013: Does the Government Have the Right to Ban Large Sugary Drinks?
3/25/2013: Toni Braxton's Life-Changing Diagnosis
3/20/2013: The Flu or a Parasite? Why Your Food and Water May Be Making You Sick!
3/19/2013: Manology: The Secrets of How Men Think Revealed!
3/18/2013: TV's Top Investigative Reporters and Dr. Oz Expose the Biggest Scams Threatening Your Health!
3/14/2013: Food Safety Alert: Horse Meat; The Duggars
3/13/2013: Dr. Oz's Super Immunity Diet!
3/12/2013: Dr. Oz's Sleep Plan to Get Your Perfect Night's Sleep!
3/11/2013: Are We Headed for an Antibiotic Apocalypse?
3/8/2013: The Man Who Says You Can Prevent Alzheimer's!
3/6/2013: Dr. Oz's Super Longevity Prescription!
3/5/2013: 5 Celebrity Rehab Deaths: Dr. Drew Sits With Dr. Oz
3/4/2013: The Fatigue Solution!
2/28/2013: Michelle Obama's Big Announcement!
2/27/2013: The Medical Intuitive Who Says You Can Heal Yourself!
2/26/2013: The Big Food Cover-Up!
2/25/2013: Dr. Oz's 24-Hour Stress Cleanse
2/22/2013: The Truth About Antioxidants: Could They Cause Cancer?
2/21/2013: The Disease Your Doctor Can't Diagnose! Medical Mystery Solved!
2/20/2013: The Myths Even Gynecologists Believe!
2/19/2013: The #1 Diet! Dash Diet Secrets Revealed!
2/18/2013: Deadly Adderall Abuse!
2/15/2013: What Your Face Reveals About Your Health
2/14/2013: The Most Eligible Doctors Reveal Their Best Health Secrets!
2/13/2013: Dr. Oz Answers Your Most Awkward Questions of All Time!
2/12/2013: Could Your Sleeping Pills Be Killing You? Dr. Oz Alert!
2/11/2013: Counterfeit Foods: Buyer Beware!
2/8/2013: The Best Weight Loss Tricks for Your Body Type!
2/7/2013: Rev Up Your Metabolism Slump!
2/6/2013: The HCG Shot for Weight Loss: Is It Right for You?
2/5/2013: Dr. Oz's Flat Belly Plan!
2/4/2013: Fat Melters!
2/1/2013: Ultimate Medical Myths Busted!
1/31/2013: All-Natural Appetite Suppressants to Stop Your Hunger!
1/30/2013: What's in America's Food and Drink Products? Banned in Other Countries: The Chemicals You're Feeding to Your Kids
1/29/2013: Laxative Abuse: The Hidden Dangers
1/28/2013: Dr. Oz's Detox Plan! Lose 10 Pounds in One Month!
1/25/2013: What's Your Sixth Sense Trying to Tell You About Your Health?
1/24/2013: 6 Days to Your Complete Body Reshape!
1/23/2013: Are Gel Manicures Safe?
1/22/2013: The New Hypnosis for Weight Loss: 7 Days, 7 Techniques
1/21/2013: Secrets the Fast Food Industry Doesn't Want You to Know!
1/18/2013: How to Avoid the Flu From Striking: The Deadly Flu
1/17/2013: Extreme Controversial Vitamin Injections
1/16/2013: Charlie Sheen Sits Down With a Doctor for the First Time
1/15/2013: Dr. Sanjay Gupta and Dr. Oz for the First Time They Sit Down Together!
1/14/2013: 5 Energy Boosters That Work for Every Type of Energy Slump!
1/11/2013: Dr. Oz's No-Pill Pain Busters!
1/10/2013: 5 Epic Diet Mistakes Smart Women Are Making!
1/9/2013: Meredith Vieira
1/8/2013: America's Funniest Health Videos Takes Over With Tom Bergeron!
1/7/2013: The Anti-Diet: The Plan for Weight Loss!
1/4/2013: The Biggest Loser's Biggest Secrets to Lose Weight!
1/3/2013: Dr. Oz's 13 Miracles for 2013!
1/2/2013: Shred Your Fat Pants! The Revolutionary Plan: 6 Weeks, 4 Inches, 2 Sizes!
12/31/2012: 7 Years Younger! The Revolutionary Anti-Aging Plan!
12/21/2012: The Provocative Doctor to Revolutionize Your Health!
12/20/2012: Dr. Oz Takes On TV's Sextuplet Toddlers!
12/19/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Insider's Guide: The Newest Medical Breakthroughs!
12/18/2012: Dr. Oz's Happiness Boosters!
12/17/2012: Making Sense of Newtown
12/13/2012: Dr. Oz on Location! The Biggest Lifesaving Hour in Oz Show History!
12/12/2012: Medical Mystery: Lifesaving Secrets From Dr. G Medical Examiner!
12/11/2012: The Controversial Doctors Who Say Everything You Know About Cholesterol is Wrong!
12/10/2012: Randy Jackson's Shocking Health Secret!
12/7/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate "How Healthy Are You?" Quiz!
12/6/2012: Nate Berkus!
12/4/2012: Dr. Oz's Cold & Flu Winter Rescue Rx!
12/3/2012: Are You Addicted to Wheat?
11/29/2012: J.R. Martinez: Surviving the Unthinkable
11/28/2012: From Gay to Straight? The Controversial Therapy!
11/27/2012: Shut Down Your Stress! How to Stop It From Becoming Toxic
11/26/2012: Secrets Restaurants Don't Want You to Know!
11/21/2012: Red Flags Your Body is Aging Too Fast!
11/20/2012: Boost Your Energy in Record Time!
11/19/2012: Deepak Chopra: Reverse Memory Loss and Prevent Alzheimer's!
11/16/2012: Andrew Weil's 5 New Essentials You Need Now!
11/15/2012: A Dr. Oz Alert! Sensa: Weight Loss Sensation or Senseless?
11/14/2012: Eat Twice as Much and Lose 5 Pounds This Month!
11/13/2012: Tony Horton's Breakthrough Plan to Reshape Your Body!
11/12/2012: Melt Your Fat Fast! How to Reset Your Secret Fat Loss Hormones
11/9/2012: That's Awkward: Dr. Oz Answers the Questions You'd Never Ask Your Doctor!
11/8/2012: Your Biggest Cancer Risks: Dr. Oz's Biggest Solutions!
11/7/2012: Five Diet Myths Busted! The Shocking Health Myths Even Your Doctor Believes!
11/6/2012: Dr. Oz's After-35 Survival Kit!
11/5/2012: Turbocharge Your Metabolism for Your Body Type!
11/2/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Shopping List! Save Time, Save Money!
11/1/2012: How to Drop a Decade! Secrets to Cheat Your Age!
10/31/2012: Cut Your Carb Cravings in One Week – Lose Weight With Carbs
10/30/2012: Dr. Oz's 5 Miracles Solutions From Around the Globe!
10/29/2012: The Newest, Fastest Fat Busters!
10/26/2012: Recharge Your Body 5 Ways in 5 Days
10/25/2012: Exclusive: Rosie O'Donnell's First Interview
10/24/2012: Am I Normal...Or Nuts!?
10/23/2012: Medicine's Most Controversial Leaders Reveal Their "Fountain of Youth" Secrets
10/22/2012: Valerie Bertinelli's Weight Loss! How She Kept It Off!
10/19/2012: The #1 Way to Fight Fatigue!
10/18/2012: Boost Your Immunity, Fight Disease and Prevent Cancer!
10/17/2012: Are Genetically Modified Foods Safe?
10/16/2012: Elisabeth Hasselbeck: The Hidden Food Allergy You Don't Know You Have!
10/15/2012: Jenny McCarthy's Shocking "Bad Habit" Health Confessions!
10/12/2012: Andrew Weil's Anti-Inflamatory Diet
10/11/2012: 30 and Older: The New Faces of HPV
10/10/2012: Rick Springfield's Secret Health Battle With Depression
10/9/2012: What the Heck?! One Full Hour of Dr. Oz's New Simple Advice!
10/8/2012: Oz Alert: Are Sugar and Butter Substitutes Hazardous to your Health?
10/5/2012: Silent Reflux: The New Secret Killer!
10/4/2012: Breaking News: Are Pesticides the Greatest Threat to Your Kids' Health?
10/3/2012: Caught Red-Handed! Your Most Cringe-Worthy Moments Revealed!
10/2/2012: Ripped From the Headlines! The Best Doctors on Television With the Biggest Headlines in Health News
10/1/2012: The Long Island Medium
9/28/2012: Secrets Your Supermarket Doesn't Want You to Know!
9/27/2012: Is Going Gluten-Free the Answer You've Been Waiting For?
9/26/2012: The Craziest "No Shame" Overshares of All Time!
9/25/2012: Breaking News on Melatonin!
9/24/2012: The #1 Reason You're Exhausted!
9/21/2012: Dr. Oz's Guilt-Free Hour!
9/20/2012: Inside Dr. Oz's Hospital! Your All-Access Pass
9/19/2012: Secret World of Binge Eaters
9/18/2012: Is This the Secret to Weight Loss?
9/17/2012: Kirstie Alley!
9/14/2012: A Dr. Oz Event! The Ultimate Intervention: How to Let Go of Your Emotional Baggage
9/13/2012: Oz Uncensored: Your Most Humiliating, Embarrassing Confessions Answered!
9/12/2012: First Lady Michelle Obama!
9/11/2012: Restart Your Body! 200 Women Take Back Their Health!
9/10/2012: The Fat Burner That Works!
6/8/2012: Dr. Oz's All-Time Most Embarrassing Questions Answered!
6/7/2012: Secrets of Plus Size Models! Look 4 Sizes Smaller Without Diet or Exercise!
6/6/2012: Three Tests Every Woman Needs to Take
6/5/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Cooking Challenge!
6/4/2012: The Oz Approved Crash Diet! Eat All You Want and Lose Weight Safely
6/1/2012: The All-Time Biggest Shocking Celebrity Confessions!
5/31/2012: The Memory Cure!
5/30/2012: O-M-G! Your Biggest "I Can't Believe You Asked" Questions Answered!
5/29/2012: Dr. Oz's Cancer-Fighting Grocery List!
5/28/2012: The Curvy Girl's Guide to Get Fit and Fabulous!
5/25/2012: Dr. Oz's Supplement Hour!
5/24/2012: Dr. Oz's Dream Team Summer Survival Guide!
5/23/2012: Dr. Oz's Transformation Nation: Million Dollar You! The Finale!
5/22/2012: Paula Abdul!
5/21/2012: The Long Island Medium! What Happens When You Die?
5/18/2012: Dr. Oz's Biggest Ambush Ever: Meal Makeovers to Lose Weight!
5/17/2012: Weird or Worried? Your Strangest Questions Solved!
5/16/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Girl's Guide to Health for Your Total Body Makeover!
5/15/2012: Defy Your Age! Look 10 Years Younger!
5/14/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Swimsuit Slimdown!
5/11/2012: Ancient Ayurvedic Secrets to Lose Weight!
5/10/2012: What's Up Down There? The #1 Surgery You Don't Need!
5/9/2012: Carb Lover's Diet: Eat 5 Nights of Carbs to Lose 5 Pounds!
5/8/2012: The Biggest Health Myths You Believe! Exposed!
5/7/2012: Best Appetite Suppressants to Lose Weight!
5/4/2012: Flat Belly in 30 Days!
5/3/2012: Montel Williams' Secret Struggle
5/2/2012: The Body Type Diet: Weight Loss Solutions for Every Shape
5/1/2012: Dr. Oz's Best Advice Ever!
4/30/2012: Turbocharge Your Metabolism
4/27/2012: TMI: Too Much Information! Your Shocking and Intimate Questions Answered!
4/26/2012: Burn Fat Fast! 5 Fat Burners to Melt Your Fat!
4/25/2012: The Sexual Phenomenon: 50 Shades of Grey
4/24/2012: Supercharge Your Body!
4/23/2012: Eat More to Weigh Less!
4/20/2012: Ancient Health Secrets: The Five Tibetan Rites
4/19/2012: The New Silver Bullet for Weight Loss!
4/18/2012: No You Didn't! Grosser Than Gross Questions!
4/17/2012: 24-Hour Energy Boost! The Ultimate Plan to End Your Fatigue!
4/16/2012: The 3 Silent Killers of Women: Why You Must Know the Early Warning Signals!
4/13/2012: Re-Energize Your Life: 5 Ways to Kick-Start Your Day
4/12/2012: The "Real Housewives" Cancer Scare!
4/10/2012: The Man Who Tested Every Diet, Supplement and Health Product Reveals What Works!
4/9/2012: The Ultimate Guide to Your Health From A to Z!
4/5/2012: Dr. Oz's Ultimate Anti-Aging Plan for Your Skin Type!
4/4/2012: Dr. Oz's Foolproof Guide to Getting Healthy Instantly!
4/3/2012: What the Yuck?! Your Grossest Questions Ever!
4/2/2012: Dr. Oz's Supermarket Survival Guide!
3/30/2012: Warning Signs You are Aging Faster Than You Should!
3/29/2012: The Transgender Families: When My Husband Became a Woman
3/27/2012: The Best Solutions for Your Pain
3/26/2012: Dr. Oz's Health Ambush! The Three Easy Tests That Could Save Your Life
3/23/2012: Medium vs. Medicine: What Really Happens When You Die
3/22/2012: The New Underground Craze! The Super Pill Women Are Popping
3/21/2012: The Top Four Body Pains You Should Not Ignore
3/19/2012: Eat Twice as Much and Lose 10 Pounds This Month!
3/14/2012: 5 Controversial Solutions to Your 5 Biggest Complaints: Back Pain
3/13/2012: The Worry Cure
3/12/2012: What's Your Problem? Fast Fixes for the Health Issues That Drive You Crazy
3/9/2012: Can Taking "The Pill" After 40 Reduce Your Cancer Risk?
3/8/2012: What's Your Craziest Health Confession?
3/6/2012: Women Dying to Be Thin!
3/5/2012: The Lazy Girl's Guide to Getting Healthy
3/2/2012: It's Easy: Simple Ways to Get Healthy!
3/1/2012: Dr. Oz Goes Head to Head With the Men Who Hate Him
2/29/2012: Secrets of Ayurvedic Medicine: What Your Body Type Is Telling You About Your Health
2/28/2012: Are You Normal...or Nuts?
2/27/2012: Five Diet Mysths Busted! What's Really Making You Fat?
2/24/2012: Secrets to Cheat Your Age - How to Drop a Decade
2/23/2012: The Weird Reasons You're So Tired
2/22/2012: 4 Shocking Ways to Bust Your Fat Butt
2/21/2012: Radical All-Natural Cures Your Doctor Thinks Are Crazy
2/20/2012: 4 Belly-Blasting Supplements
2/17/2012: Dr. Oz's Snack Attack: Eat More and Weigh Less
2/16/2012: 4 Body Pains That Could Mean Cancer
2/15/2012: The Man Who Can Bring Your Best Body Back
2/14/2012: That's So Awkward: Shocking Questions You Would Never Ask Your Doctor
2/13/2012: Super Charge Your Body Instantly
2/10/2012: All-Natural Cures From Dr. Andrew Weil and Dr. Oz
2/9/2012: Has Montel Williams Discovered the Fountain of Youth?
2/8/2012: The New Hypnosis for Weight Loss! Can You Trick Your Body Into Thinking It's Had Gastric Bypass Surgery?
2/7/2012: Dr. Oz Takes on the Fattest Women in America: Dying for the Record
2/6/2012: 5 Fat Busters, 5 Body Types, 5 Days
2/3/2012: Fat-Urday
2/2/2012: Rosie O'Donnell
2/1/2012: Inside Dr. Oz's O.R.: 5 Warning Signs of the #1 Killer of Women
1/31/2012: Your Ultimate Grocery List! 99 Foods Dr. Oz Wants in Your Shopping Cart!
1/30/2012: Dr. Oz Busts the Most Shocking Health Myths Even Your Doctor Believes!
1/27/2012: When Are You Too Old to Have a Baby?
1/26/2012: You Asked What?!?? Your Most Outrageous Questions Answered!
1/25/2012: The Shock That Could Save Your Life: Electroshock Therapy for Depression
1/23/2012: The Most Underperformed Surgery You Should Be Getting!
1/20/2012: The New News About Alzheimer's
1/19/2012: Secret for You to to Lose Weight Instantly
1/18/2012: Is Your Orange Juice Safe To Drink?
1/17/2012: Could Your Miracle Weight-Loss Supplement Be Deadly?
1/16/2012: Food Addiction: Are You Addicted to Food?
1/13/2012: Dr. Oz's Disease Detectives With the New Power to Heal You!
1/12/2012: Goldie Hawn's Secrets to Staying Young!
1/11/2012: Are You Getting Enough of the Vitamin That Keeps You Young?
1/10/2012: Jennifer Hudson
1/9/2012: 7 Days, 7 Solutions for Pain
1/6/2012: Miracle Plan to Reboot Your Metabolism
1/5/2012: What's Your Risk for Stomach Cancer?
1/4/2012: The Alternative Medicine Guru Who Says You Shouldn't Trust Your Doctor!
1/3/2012: The Belly Fat-Blasting Supplements Montel Williams Swears By
12/22/2011: Deadly Drug Interactions: Are Your Meds Putting You at Risk?
12/21/2011: The Secret Reasons You're Exhausted
12/20/2011: How Safe Is Your Drinking Water?
12/19/2011: Dr. Oz's 12 Days of Christmas Giveaway
12/16/2011: Suzanne Somers' Cancer Battle
12/15/2011: Dr. Oz's Prevention Power Hour
12/13/2011: Jane Fonda
12/12/2011: Rachael Ray Solves Your Biggest Holiday Cooking Disasters
12/9/2011: Steve Harvey: How to Retrain Your Man's Brain
12/7/2011: Oprah
12/6/2011: Miracle Energy Drinks: Do They Really Work?
12/5/2011: Emeril Lagasse's Must-Have Items to Revolutionize Your Health
12/2/2011: The No-Fear Zone! Your Most Embarrassing Questions Answered
12/1/2011: Breaking News: Arsenic in Apple Juice Update
11/30/2011: Paula Deen's Shocking Health Confession
11/29/2011: The New Face of Hunger in America
11/28/2011: The Dr. Who Believes Everything Dr. Oz Says About Weight Loss Is Wrong
11/23/2011: The Largest Free Health Clinic in the Country
11/22/2011: Is Your Fat Causing Cancer?
11/21/2011: Nurses' Secrets That Can Save Your Life
11/18/2011: 400th Episode!
11/17/2011: Joel Osteen: Does Prayer Have the Power to Heal?
11/16/2011: The Revolutionary Cure for Pain
11/15/2011: Lisa Ling: Sex Trafficking in America
11/14/2011: Supermodel Tyra Banks Takes on Body Image Bullies
11/11/2011: A Dr. Oz Event: The Buddy Plan for Weight Loss
11/10/2011: Health Myths Busted
11/9/2011: The Ultimate Happiness Plan
11/8/2011: Dragonfly: The Deadly New Legal Drug (Who Is at Risk?)
11/7/2011: Lose 40 Pounds By Spring
11/4/2011: Alternative Treatments That Are Dr. Oz-Approved
11/3/2011: Explosive Wives: Do You Suffer From Perimenopausal Rage?
11/2/2011: The Cancer You Fear Most
11/1/2011: Montel Williams' Suicide Attempt
10/31/2011: 10-Minute Miracle Plan to Shed Your Fat for Good
10/28/2011: Dr. Oz's Most Extreme Experiment Ever: Could a Prehistoric Diet Save Your Life?
10/27/2011: Biggest Breakthroughs for Every Body Type
10/26/2011: What's Wrong With Sleep in America?
10/25/2011: 5 Things Men Don't Want You to Know
10/24/2011: Quick Fixes to Prevent the Diseases You Fear Most
10/21/2011: Could Your Marriage Survive: How Likely Is Your Spouse to Cheat?
10/20/2011: The Controversial Healer - Could His Controversial Methods Cure You?
10/19/2011: ADHD: The Diagnosis That Could Save Your Marriage
10/18/2011: Healthy on the Cheap: The Dr. Oz $1000 Savings Plan
10/17/2011: The Ultimate "After 40" Guide
10/14/2011: The Dr. Oz National Sex Survey---Our Shocking Results!
10/13/2011: The Controversial Shot: Could HGH Be the Foundation of Youth?
10/12/2011: The Dr. Oz Super Power Hour: Recharge Your Body 5 Ways in 5 Days
10/11/2011: Dr. Oz Takes On the Queen of Southern Cooking, Paula Deen, and Paula's Shcoking Health Confession
10/10/2011: Chris Powell: Cut Your Carb Cravings in One Week
10/7/2011: The Detox Solution: Dr. Oz's 48-Hour Weekend Cleanse
10/6/2011: The Top 7 Health Scams: Are You Being Duped Now?
10/5/2011: Biggest Anti-Aging Hour Ever: No Makeup Show— What's the Real Age of Your Skin?
10/4/2011: 5 Habits Making You Fat
10/3/2011: Dr. Oz Gone Wild: 50 Embarrassing Questions
9/30/2011: 7-Day Miracle Plan to Boost Your Metabolism
9/29/2011: Near Death Experiences: Are They Real?
9/28/2011: How to Turn Back the Clock for Your Best Sex Ever!
9/27/2011: Why Your Doctor Thinks You're Crazy! Is Your Chronic Pain a Disease?
9/26/2011: Million Dollar You: How to Lose Weight and Win a Million Dollars
9/23/2011: The 100 Foods Dr. Oz Wants in Your Shopping Cart
9/22/2011: The Woman Who Doesn't Want Dr. Oz's Help
9/21/2011: The Holistic Prevention Guide From the Diseases You Fear the Most
9/20/2011: The Cancer You're Most Likely to Miss: Pancreatic Cancer
9/19/2011: 6 Secrets to Living Younger From the Nation's Best of the Best Experts
9/16/2011: The Movie "Contagion": Are We at Risk for a Global Pandemic?
9/15/2011: Are Your Pee and Poop Normal?
9/14/2011: Arsenic in Apple Juice
9/13/2011: Stop The Silent Killer: Would you Know the Ovarian Cancer Warning Signs
9/12/2011: 5 Steps to Blast Your 40-Plus Belly Fat~
Advertisement
Cast & Details
Premiered:
September 14, 2009
Rating:
TV-PG
User Rating:
(790 ratings)
Add Your Rating:
Premise:
The heart surgeon and former 'Oprah Winfrey Show' health expert dispenses advice on healthy living.
Cast
Mehmet Oz
Host
more The Dr. Oz. Oz Show Profile, Episodes, News, Cast & Crew, Character Bios, Interviews, Videos, Forums, and Free Prizes at TVStar.com
Dr. Oz |
He continues to collect material and donates the material to WHMC annually.
SCOPE AND CONTENT.
SERIES DESCRIPTION
Series 1, Background and Miscellaneous Material: This series contains material which does not easily fit into any of the other categories. It includes information which is pertinent to other parts of the collection. Folders 1-18; dates range from 1977- 1992. This series is arranged alphabetically.
Series 2, Events in the Gay and Lesbian Community: This series contains playbills, posters, flyers, and other memorabilia from various events in the community. Events include movies, plays, benefits, and fund raisers. Folders 19 through 67; dates range from 1978 to 1992. Arranged alphabetically by title.
Series 3, Gay and Lesbian Resources: This series contains information concerning organizations, bars, restaurants, and the like which have existed in the gay and lesbian community. Folders 68 through 179; dates range from 1974 to 1992. Arranged alphabetically.
Series 4, Newspaper Articles: This series consists of newspaper clippings, predominately from the St. Louis area. Folders 180 through 194; dates range from 1972 to 1992. Arranged alphabetically by topic.
Series 5, Publications from Other Cities: This series contains newsletters, newspapers, updates, and magazines from across the United States, excluding St. Louis. Folders 195 to 238; dates range from 1972 to 1992. Arranged alphabetically by title.
Series 6, St. Louis Publications: This series contains newsletters, newspapers, updates, and magazines from the St. Louis area. Many of these publications are complete sets and are irreplaceable. Folders 239 through 341; dates range from 1973 to 1992. Arranged alphabetically by title.
Series 7, Photographs: A few photographs were included in the collection. Folder 342; dates range from 1977 to 1992. Arranged chronologically.
Series 8, Recordings: This series contains cassette recordings from the radio show Lambda Reports, and of a few concerts. Folders 343 through 345; dates, 1989 to 1992. Arranged chronologically.
Series 9, Artifacts: This series contains buttons, a fan, bar tokens, and a sash. Folders 346 through 349; dates range from 1984 to 1992. Arranged chronologically.
Series 10, Oversize Material: This series contains oversize flyers and posters, along with a large chronology of the gay and lesbian community. Dates range from 1980 to 1992. This material is loose in Box 20.
Series 11, T-Shirts: This series contains pride t-shirts, and other shirts from bars and organizations in St. Louis. Dates for these range from 1981-1992. This material is loose in Box 21.
FOLDER LIST
SERIES I: Background and Miscellaneous Material
BOX 1
1. A.I.D.S./H.I.V. Directory of Resources, 1991, n.d.
2. America Responds to A.I.D.S. Posters, 1991
3. Brigg's Initiative, 1978
4. Brochures, 1991-92; n.d.
5. Concert Flyers, 1979, 1990, n.d.
6. Correspondence to Legislators, 1977-78
7. Durable Power of Attorney for Health Care Directive, n.d.
8. FCC Regulations, n.d.
9. Felton T. Day Memorial Award, 1978
10. Goss, Robert--Interview, 1991
11. Hanky Code, n.d.
12. Hate Crimes/Legislation Information, 1983-92
13. Homosexuality in the Scriptures, n.d.
14. Library Services to Gays and Lesbians; Book Descriptions, 1992
15. Membership Cards, 1977-78; n.d.
16. Miscellaneous, ca. 1979-92
17. Movie Flyers, 1989-91, n.d.
18. Parliament House (Orlando, FL), 1991
SERIES 2: Events in the Gay/Lesbian Community
19. "Any Day But Sunday" at St. Marcus Theatre, August 3-12, 1989
20. Before Stonewall (Movie Screening), 6/22/91
21. "Benefit for the St. Louis Gay Community with Elaine Noble as Guest of Honor," 1/17/78
22. "Bent" at Forest Park Community College, June 18-20, 1982
23. "Bent" at SIU-Edwardsville, March 5-7; 12-14, 1992
24. Eastern Missouri A.I.D.S Summit, October 8-9, 1990
25. "Eastern Standard" Program, 1991
26. "Fairy Tales, Faerie Tails" at Forest Park Community College, August 1, 1990
27. "5th of July" at CASA, November - December, ca. 1980
28. Finding Our Focus-II Conference, October 4-6, 1991
29. Forward Thinking Achievement Awards, 1991
30. From All Walks of Life, Fund raiser, 1991-92
31. "Gone" at Northminster Presbyterian Church, n.d.
32. A Healing Service in the Time of A.I.D.S. at Christ Church Cathedral, n.d.
33. "He's Having Her Baby" at St. Marcus Theatre, October 19, 28, ca. 1990
34. "intimacies" at St. Marcus Theatre, May 1-3, 1992
35. "Into the Woods" at Fontbonne College Theater, 5/31/91
36. Lambda Art Group Shows, 1987-88; 1990
37. "limbo" at Midtown Arts Center, April 10-25, 1992
38. "Magic to Do" (Pride Celebration Benefit), 1981
39. "The Many Faces of A.I.D.S." at Belleville Area College, 3/90
40. March on Washington (1987) Reunions, 1987-88
41. Midwest Men's Festivals, 1987-91
42. Midwest Wimmin's Festivals, 1987-89
43. Miss Gay Heart of America Pageant, 1988
44. Miss Gay Missouri Pageants, 1980, 1988
45. Missouri March for Women's Lives, 11/12/89
BOX 2
46. Ms. Missouri Leather, Feb 7-9, 1992
47. "National Day of Mourning" for Privacy Rights, 6/30/89
48. Pride Celebration in Columbia, MO, 1978
49. Pride Celebration in St. Louis (Sponsored by Lesbian/Gay Organization for Acceptance and Liberation, or LGOAL), 1980
50. Pride Celebration in St. Louis (sponsored by Pride Committee), 1981
51. Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1986
52. Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1988
53. Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1989
54. Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1990
55. Queermas Eve Ball at SIU-Edwardsville, 12/28/91
56. "Rally for Rights" with Malcolm Boyd, 11/4/78
57. "Roommate Wanted" at Northminster Presbyterian Church, Feb. 27-28; March 1, unknown year
58. St. Louis International Lesbian and Gay Film Festival, May 1- 7, 1992
59. Silverstein, Charles: Booksigning for The Joy of Gay Sex at Washington University, 3/9/unknown year.
60. "Sleepin' Round" and "Mala Noche" at Tivoli Theater, 12/16/90
61. "Some of My Best Friends Are..." at St. Marcus Theater, October - December, 1989; and July 1990
62. "Stay with Me" at St. Marcus Theater, May 8-31, 1992
63. Stop the Church Protest, April 19, 1992
64. Supporting our Lesbian and Gay Families and Relationships Conference (sponsored by PREP & UMSL Women's Studies Program), Sept. 27-29, 1991
65. Symposium on Racism, Sexism, and Homophobia in Legal Education at Washington University, Feb 1-2, 1990; Jan 31- Feb 1, 1991
66. "Vampire Lesbians of Sodom" and "Coma" at St. Marcus Theater, Aug 2-18, 1990
67. "Women Take Back the Night" Marches, 1989-90
SERIES 3: Gay and Lesbian Resources
68. ACT-UP, 1990-92
69. Affirmation (Methodist)-St. Louis, n.d.
70. Agape Church of St. Louis, 1990-91
71. A.I.D.S. Foundation of St. Louis, 1990-92
72. A.I.D.S. Vaccine Evaluation Unit at St. Louis University, ca. 1990
73. American Civil Liberties Union of Eastern Missouri, 1991
74. American Friends Service Committee, 1991
75. Attitudes (Bar), 1988
76. Black Gay and Lesbian Leadership Forum, 1991
77. Blue Max/Clementines (Leather Bar), 1988-90
78. Cafe Infiniti, ca. 1991
79. Challenge Metro/St. Louis Gay and Lesbian Community Services (GLCS), 1983-92
80. Citizens for Human Rights, 1977-78
81. Club Body Center/Club St. Louis, 1991
82. "Coming Out of Hiding" (Radio Program on KDHX), 1989-92
83. Committee to Elect Tim Cusick/Friends of Tim Cusick, 1989-92
84. Concerned Gay Students of Washington University (CGS), 1979
85. Delta Mental Health Institute, 1990
86. Dignity-St. Louis (Catholic), 1983-92
87. Doorways, 1988-90
88. Eagle Forum (Pro-Family Group)-St. Louis 3/91
89. Food Outreach, 1990
90. The Forum, 1984
91. Freedom of Choice Council, 1990-91
92. Gabriel's (Bar), 1992
93. Gateway Democratic Club/Independent Voters of Eastern Missouri, 1977-78
94. Gateway Men's Chorus, 1988-92
95. Gateway Motorcycle Club, 1988-92
96. Gateway Saloon/Nites (Bar), 1992
BOX 3
97. Gay Academic Union (G.A.U.), 1978-79; n.d.
98. Gay and Lesbian Archives (Begun by Challenge Metro), 1987
99. Gay and Lesbian Association of Students at SIU-Edwardsville (G.L.A.S.S.), 1991
100. Gay and Lesbian Contractors Association, n.d.
101. Gay Rodeo Association, St. Louis Chapter, 1992
102. Girth and Mirth of Greater St. Louis, n.d.
103. Growing American Youth (G.A.Y.), 1978-91
104. Human Rights Campaign Funds, 1992
105. Integrity-St. Louis (Episcopalian), 1978
106. Iris, 1981-82
107. Kindred Spirits, 1991, n.d.
108. Lambda Program (Chemical Dependency Treatment), n.d.
109. Lambda Reports (Radio Program), 1989-90
110. Lesbian Affirmative Support, 1991
111. Lesbian Alliance Legal Committee (Chicago), n.d.
112. Lesbian and Gay Alliance for Justice, 1992
113. Lesbians Rising in Resistance, n.d.
114. March on Washington Committee, 1992-93
115. Metropolitan Community Church of Greater St. Louis (MCC), 1982, 1988-92
116. MCC Christian Social Action: Correspondence, 1976-79
117. MCC Christian Social Action: Letters to Legislators, 1977
118. MCC Christian Social Action: Monthly Reports, 1977-78
119. MCC Christian Social Action: Newspaper Articles, 1976-78
120. MCC Christian Social Action: News Releases, 1977; n.d.
121. MCC Christian Social Action: Noble, Elaine--Visit, 1/17/78
122. MCC Christian Social Action: Pamphlets and Brochures, 1978, n.d.
123. MCC Christian Social Action: Speaking Engagements, 1976-78
124. MCC: Resource and Referral Manual, 1977
125. MCC: Universal Fellowship of Metropolitan Community Churches By-Laws, 1977
126. Metropolitan Life Service Center/Midcontinent Life Services Corporation (MLSC): By-Laws, 1976
127. MLSC: Correspondence, 1977-78
128. MLSC: Meeting Minutes, 1976-80
129. MLSC: Miscellaneous, 1976-78
130. Metropolitan Organization of St. Louis Students (M.O.S.S.), 1991
131. Metro St. Louis Task Force on A.I.D.S., 1985
132. Midwest Region National Women's Studies Association, 10/1/85
133. Missouri Coalition for Human Rights, 1978-79
134. Monte's (Bar), 1988
135. Mother Source, 1989-90
136. The Names Project ( A.I.D.S. Memorial Quilt), 1988-92
137. National Center for Lesbian Rights, 1991
BOX 4
138. National Gay and Lesbian Task Force (N.G.L.T.F.), 1977; 1987; 1990-92
139. Northside A.I.D.S. Outreach Project, 1991
140. Our World Too Bookstore, 1987, 1991
141. Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays (P.F.L.A.G.), n.d.
142. Perspectives (Bar), 1988
143. Pets Are Wonderful Support-St. Louis, 1992
144. Philadelphia Lesbian and Gay Task Force, 1990
145. Positive Images Support Group, 1990
146. Presbyterians for Lesbian and Gay Concerns, 1992
147. Privacy Rights Education Project (P.R.E.P.), 1987-92
148. P.R.E.P.: Background Information, 1987-88
149. P.R.E.P.: Flyers, 1989-92
150. P.R.E.P.: Legislative Alerts, 1990-91
151. P.R.E.P.: Meeting Minutes, 1988-92
152. P.R.E.P.: Newspaper Articles, 1987-91
153. P.R.E.P.: Summary of Legislative Report Cards, 1990
154. Project Inform, 1991
155. Queer Nation-St. Louis, 1991-92
156. Rags (Restaurant), n.d.
157. Sabres of Artemis, 1992
158. St. Louis Acts Out, n.d.
159. St. Louis A.I.D.S. Memorial (S.L.A.M.), 9/92
160. St. Louis Arch Rivals, 1990-92
161. St. Louis Effort for A.I.D.S. (E.F.A.), 1989-92
162. St. Louis Frontrunners, 1992; n.d.
163. St. Louis Gateway Femmes (later called St. Louis Gender Foundation), 1991; n.d.
164. St. Louis Lesbian and Gay Pride Celebration Committee, 1989; 1992
BOX 5
165. St. Louis Lesbian and Gay Research Project (UM-St. Louis), 1991
166. St. Louis Task Force For Human Rights, 1977
167. St. Louis Woman's Choir, 1988
168. St. Louis Womyn's Coffeehouse, no year given
169. Sex, Inc., 1981
170. Sharing Center, 1990-92
171. Slightly Older Lesbians (S.O.L.), 1989-91
172. Twist (Bar), 1991-92
173. UM-St. Louis Student Groups (G.L.S.U./L.G.C.O.), 1985-90
174. Unicorn Productions, Inc., 1982
175. Wired Women Productions, Inc., 1985-92
176. Women's Car Repair Collective, n.d.
177. Women's Counseling Collective, 1988-91
178. Women's Eye Bookstore, 1984; n.d.
179. Womenspace/Women's Place/Lesbian Alliance, 1974-78
SERIES 4: Newspaper Articles
180. A.I.D.S., 1985-92
181. Arts and Entertainment, 1985-92
182. "Coming Out of Hiding," (Radio Program) 7/91
183. Cusick, Timothy 1990
184. Discrimination, 1977; 1990-91
185. General Articles on Homosexuality, 1972-90
186. Hate Crimes, 1991-92
187. Metropolitan Community Church, 1974-84
188. Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays, 1980-90
189. Police Entrapment/Sex Crimes, 1984-88
190. Pride Celebrations, 1977-92
BOX 6
191. Privacy Rights, 1989-90
192. Religious Debate, 1986
193. Surrounding Areas, 1977-79
194. Thomas, Jim 1984
SERIES 5: Publications From Other Cities
195. The Advocate, 12/25/80; Summer 1991; 11/19/91
196. "A.I.D.S. Treatment News," (San Francisco), #119 (1/18/91); #120 (2/1/91)
197. The Alternative Arts and Counter Culture in Phoenix, #52 (9/11/91)
198. BLK (National Black Lesbian and Gay News Magazine), v.3, n.6 (6/91)
199. Bulletin Board (California), #151 (8/16/91)
200. The Centerfold (Central Florida), v.5, n.6 (8/91)
201. Christopher Street, March 1979
202. "Coming Out" (Columbia, MO), #11-#13 (9/90-11/90)
203. "Comingt Out"(Columbia, MO)v.2, numbers 1-12 (12/90- 11/91)
204. "Coming Out"(Columbia, MO) v.3, numbers 1-10 (12/91-9/92)
205. A Different Light Review, v.2, numbers 2-3 (Summer-Winter 1991)
206. Fresh Fruit Records Produce Report, 1991-92
207. A Friendly Voice (Florida), v.5, numbers 31 & 32 (Jul-Aug 1991)
BOX 7
208. "G.A.U. Newsletter" (National Gay Academic Union), v.1, numbers 1, 2, 3 (Spring 1978-Winter 1979); v.2, n.1 (Spring 1979)
209. Gay Community News (Boston), v.18, numbers: 18-25 (11/90-1/91)
210. Gay Community News (Boston), v.18, numbers: 26, 28-33 (1/91- 3/91)
211. Gay Community News (Boston), v.18, numbers: 35-37, 39, 46 (3/91-6/91)
212. Gays in Uniform by Kate Dyer, ed., 1990
213. "Gays on the Hill" (MCC-Washington, D.C.), v.1, n.5 (3/77; v.3, n.4 (3/79)
214. "The G.L.A.A.D. Bulletin" (Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation), 1/89; 6/89; 8/89; 1/90; 5/90; 9/90; 1/91; 3/91; 5/91
215. Heartland (Midwest), v.2, numbers: 5-7 (May - July 1991)
216. "Human Rights Agenda" (Citizens for Human Rights), v.1, n.1 (9/92)
217. Human Rights Project Newsletter, Fall 1991
218. "It's Time" (NGLTF), v.4, n.1 (10/77); v.5, n.5 (5/78); v.5, n.10 (12/78); v.6, n.2 (2/79); v.6, n.3 (3/79)
BOX 8
219. "Lambda Rising News"/"Lambda Book Report," 4/91; Summer 1991; Holiday 1991; v.2, n.12 (9/91); v.3, n.1 (11/91)
220. Lesbian and Gay Archives Roundtable Newsletter, f.3, n.1(8/92)
221. "lesbianismo" in el medico responde, 1992
222. Low Country Gallery (South Carolina), v.1, n.3 (8/91)
223. "Midwest Roundup," v.2, n.5 (9/92)
224. National Institute of Mental Health Task Force on Homosexuality: Final Report and Background Papers, 1972
225. News and Notes (Civil Rights Enforcement Agency), 6/77
226. "NGTF Action Report," 2/77; 10/77; 5/78
227. Olivia Records Catalog, 1992-93
228. "PI Perspective" (Project Inform), 12/90; 4/91; 10/91
229. Pride Guide, San Francisco, 1981
230. "Sexual Identity of 37 Children Raised by Homosexual or Transsexual Parents" by Richard Green, 1978
231. Sexual Law Reporter, v.4 numbers: 3-4 (7/78-10/78)
232. Sexual Preference Study by Community Relations Commission of Tulsa, OK 11/76
233. Shocking Gray Catalogs, Autumn 1991; Pride 1992; Summer 1992
234. "Southern Californians for Whitman Radclyffe Newsletter," v.1, n.6 (12/77)
235. Southern Voice (Atlanta, GA), v.4, n.12 (8/91)
236. Time articles, 1/8/79 & 3/23/79
BOX 9
237. twn (Florida), v.14, numbers: 48-49 (July - Aug 1991)
238. Windy City Times (Chicago), v.3, n.34 (5/19/88)
SERIES 6: St. Louis Publications
239. "Absolutely Positive" (Sharing Center), v.1, n.1 (2/91); v.1, n.2 (Spring 1991)
240. "The Agapian" (Agape Church of St. Louis), v.9, numbers 2-4 (12/89-5/90); v.10, numbers 1-2 (10/90-12/90)
241. Blacks Assisting Blacks Against A.I.D.S. (B.A.B.A.A.) Newsletter, v.1, n.4 (7/91); v.1, n.5 (10/91)
242. "Challenge Metro Newsletter," v.2, numbers 1-6 (1/89-12/89); v.3, numbers 1-4 (1/90-12/90); v.4, n.1 (Spring 1991)
243. "Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter," ca. 1980
244. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.2, n.8 (9/82)
245. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.3, numbers 1, 4-9 (2/83- 10/83)
246. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.4, numbers 1-2; 5-7; 9-17; 19-20 (2/84 - 12/85)
247. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.5, numbers: 2-3; 5; 7; 9-12 (3/86-1/87)
248. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.6, numbers: 2-3; 5-7; 9-10 (3/87-11/87)
249. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.7, numbers: 2-5; 7; 9; 11-12 (3/88-1/89)
250. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.8, numbers: 1; 5; 7; 9-11 (2/89-1/90)
251. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.9, numbers: 1-12 (2/90- 1/91)
252. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.10, numbers: 1-12 (2/91- 1/92)
253. Dignity-St. Louis Newsletter, v.11, numbers: 1-5; 8 (2/92-9/92)
254. Eye on Privacy (Newsletter of PREP), v.1, n.1 (Summer 1991)
255. "Food for Thought" (Food Outreach), v.2, n.1 (Sprint 1990); v.3, n.1 (Spring 1991); v.4, n.1 (Spring 1992)
256. "The Forum Newsletter," 1988
257. "Friend" (Friends of Tim Cusick), 1/91
258. "Frontline" (E.F.A.), v.1, numbers: 6, 10-12 (2/88-8/88)
259. Frontline (EFA), v.2, numbers: 1-12 (9/88-8/89)
260. Frontline (EFA), v.3, numbers:1-12 (9/89-9/90)
BOX 10
261. Frontline (EFA), v.4, numbers: 1-10; 12 (10/90-8/91)
262. Frontline (EFA), v.5, numbers:1-11 (9/91-7/92)
263. "Gatherings" (Washington University), v.4, n.2 (4/83)
264. Gay Academic Union Newsletter-St. Louis, v.1, numbers 1-2 (12/78-1/79); 6/79 issue
265. Gay Life Magazine, numbers: 1 (1978?); 3 (2/16/79); 4 (3/30/79); 5 (6/22/79)
266. "Gayly Forward" (Gay Men's Support Group), v.2, numbers: 5-7 (5/90-7/90); v.3, numbers: 3, 5, 7-9 (3/91-9/91); v.4, numbers: 1, 3-4, 7 (1/92-7/92)
267. Gay St. Louis (formerly Prime Time): 9/77; v.3, n.10 (11/77); v.4, n.1 (5/78); v.4, n.2 (7/78)
268. "Gay Women's Newsletter"/"St. Louis Lesbian News," 5/73; 6/73; v.1, n.4 (7/73)
269. "Gazette" (St. Louis Gender Foundation), v.5, n.3 (8/89
270. Gazette (St. Louis Gender Foundation), v.6, numbers 1-6 (2/90-12/90)
271. Gazette (St. Louis Gender Foundation), v.7, numbers: 1, 3, 5- 6 (2/91-12/91)
272. Gazette (St. Louis Gender Foundation), v.8, numbers 1-3 (2/92-7/92)
273. "The lavender Dragon" (Kindred Spirits), v. 1, numbers 1-3 (1/91-8/91); v.2, numbers 1-3 (1/92-7/92)
274. "Lavender Moon Calendar" (Lesbian Agenda), May 1989-Jan 1991
BOX 11
275. LesTalk, v.1, numbers: 1-7 (July 1991 - Jan 1992)
276. LesTalk, v.1, numbers 8-12 (Feb - Jun 1992)
277. "Live Wire"/"Wired Women Dance Productions Update," 1/90; 6/90; 12/90; 4/91; Summer 1991
278. "Metcom News" (MCC of Greater St. Louis), 10/90
279. MLSC Newsletter, v.1, n.1 (7/75); v.2, n.2 (4/78)
280. Moonstorm, v.1, numbers: 1-6 (8/73-1975?)
281. Moonstorm, v.2, numbers: 1-2 (1975)
282. Moonstorm, v.3, numbers: 1-2 (1976)
283. Moonstorm, #9 (Spring 1977)
284. "Mumpsimus Broken" (Integrity-St. Louis), 6/9/80
284b.Moonstorm Numbers: 11-21, 23-25; 28-29 (4/78-Summer 1983)
BOX 12
285. "The New Light" (MCC of Greater St. Louis), v.1, n.5 (9/74); 7/76; 12/76; 6/78; 1/79; 8/83
286. "Newsletter of MCC of Greater St. Louis," v.1, n.3 (5/92)
287. No Bad News (NBN), v.1, numbers: 1-7 (6/80-12/80)
288. No Bad News v.2, numbers: 1-12 (1/81-12/81)
289. No Bad News v.3, numbers: 1-5; 7-12 (1/82-12/82)
290. No Bad News v.4, numbers: 2-12 (2/83-12/83)
BOX 13
291. No Bad News (NBN), v.5, numbers: 1-12 (1/84-12/84)
292. No Bad News v.6, numbers: 1-12 (1/85-12/85)
293. "O.W.T. Newsletter", Numbers: 1-3; 5-12 (3/88 - 1/92)
294. The Pathfinder News, v.1, n.1 (4/91)
295. "P.A.W.S. Press" Newsletter, v.1, n.1 (2/92), 3/92, 9/92
296. P-FLAG Newsletter, 9/90; 10/90; 1/92; 3/92; 10/92
BOX 14
297. Plus Magazine, 9/2/87; 9/16/87; 10/7/87; 10/21/87; 11/4/87
298. "Pride Committee Focus, v.1, numbers 3-6 (3/92-9/92)
299. Pride Guides, 1981
300. Pride Guide, 1982
301. Pride Guide, 1983
302. Pride Guide, 1984
303. Pride Guide, 1985
304. Pride Guide, 1986
305. Pride Guide, 1988
306. Pride Guide, 1989
307. Pride Guide, 1990
308. Pride Guide, 1991
Note: Pride Guide 1992 is in oversize material.
309. Prime Time (MLSC), v.1, numbers: 2-3; 5 (10/75-12/75)
310. Prime Time (MLSC), v.2, numbers: 1-12 (1/76-12/76)
311. Prime Time (MLSC), v.3, numbers: 1-9 (1/77-9/77)
BOX 15
312. Queer Nation News: 10/91; 11/91; 1/92; 2/92; 3/92; 4/92; 6/92; 9/92
313. St. Louis Advisor, v.1, numbers: 3-6; 8; 10-11 (1991)
314. St. Louis Advisor, 6/91; 12/91
315. St. Louis Advisor, 2/3/92; 3/10/92; 3/26/92; 4/24/92; 5/9/92; 5/21/92; 9/25/92
316. St. Louis/Kansas City Night Gazer, 9/92; 10/92
317. "St. Louis Lesbian and Gay Research Project Newsletter," v.1., n.1. (9/91)
318. St. Louis magazine, 2/90
319. The St. Louis Women's Calendar (Iris), 1982
320. Show Me Guide, numbers 1-15 (1988)
321. Show Me Guide, numbers 16-23 (1989)
BOX 16
322. Show Me Guide, numbers 24- 29 (1989)
323. Show Me Guide, numbers 30-33 (1989)
324. Show Me Guide, numbers 34-40 (1990)
325. Show Me Guide, numbers 41-47 (1990)
326. Show Me Guide, numbers 48-52 (1990-91)
BOX 17
327. Show Me Guide, numbers 53-57 (1991)
328. Show Me Guide, numbers 58-61 (1991)
329. Show Me Guide, numbers 62-65 (1991)
330. Show Me Guide, numbers 66-71 (1991-92)
BOX 18
331. Show Me Guide, numbers 72-76 (1992)
332. "SNAP" (African American Gay Men), v.1, numbers 5, 10, 12 (8/90-8/91); v.2, n.1 (9/91)
333. "Speaking Out" (Washington University), Fall 1985
334. "The Spirit of Living Faith" (MCC of Living Faith), 12/91; 1/92; 3/92; 5/92
335. Steppin' Out, pre-issue (4/89); v.1, numbers: 1-5 (5/89- 9/89)
336. Steps Alano Club Newsletter, v.3, numbers 1-2 (2/91-5/91)
337. Twisl, 9/17/92; 9/24/92; 10/8/92
338. Viewpoint, v.1, numbers 1-20 (9/86-8/87)
339. Viewpoint, v.2, numbers 1-5 (9/87-11/87)
340. Women's Eye Bookstore Newsletter, 1985-87?
341. Women's Sports Connection Newsletter, 1984-86
BOX 19
SERIES 7: Photographs
342. Photo 545.1-545.2: Elaine Noble at Washington University, ca. 1976-77 (two 8x10 B&W) Photo 545.3: Beverly Hills (Miss Greater St. Louis), 1988 (8x10 B&W) Photo 545.4: Michael Kearns of "intimacies," 1992 (8x10 B&W) Photo 545.5: Pride Fest Billboard, 1990 (4x6 color print)
SERIES 8: Recordings
343. Lambda Reports: Challenge Metro, September 3 & 9, 1989 (2 cassette tapes)
344. Gateway Men's Chorus, 6/21/91
345. Another Carnival, 1991
SERIES 9: Artifacts
346. Buttons: St. Louis Pride Celebrations: 1984; 1985; 1986; 1992; Friends of the Quilt, 1992
347. Tokens from Faces in East St. Louis, n.d.
348. Queer Nation-St. Louis Sash worn during first protest at the opening of the Galleria Mall, August 1991
349. Pride = Power Fan, 1992
SERIES 10: Oversize Materials
BOX 20
loose in box
A.I.D.S. Memorial Service & Candlelight Procession Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
Aspect Magazine, 7/91
"Bent" Poster, ca. 1982 (11" x 17")
Blue Max 15th Anniversary Poster, 1990 (8.5" x 14")
Bouffants and Boutonnieres Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
Challenge Metro Benefit poster, 1989 (12.25" x 18")
Clementines Ten Year Anniversary Poster, n.d. (10" x 15.5")
Clinton, Kate, Concert Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
Clinton, Kate Concert Poster, no year given (11" x 17")
"Crabs" poster, n.d. (11" x 17")
Delta Mental Health Chronology, 1990 (16" x 20")--5 panels
Dignity-St. Louis 15th Anniversary Poster, 1989 (11" x 17")
"Divinity and Debauchery" Poster, 1989 (11" x 17")
"Fairy Tales, Faerie Tails" Poster, n.d. (11" x 17")
From All Walks of Life Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
From All Walks of Life Poster, 1992 (11" x 17")
Gateway Men's Chorus, "Our Voices Rise" Concert (11" x 17")
Gateway Men's Chorus, "Diversity in Song" Concert (11" x 17")
Gateway Men's Chorus, "Holiday in Song" Concert (11" x 17")--4
copies
Gay/Lesbian Vote 1988 Poster (20" x 16")
Great Plains Mr. Drummer Contest Poster, 1989 (11" x 17")
Heart Poster, n.d.(12" x 16")
Hotline Logo, n.d. (17" x 11")
Lavner, Lynn Concert Poster, 1989 (11" x 17")
March on Washington Poster, 1987 (11" x 17")--4 copies
Masquerade Express Poster, 1980 (10" x 14")
Miss Gay Pageant Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
Pride Fest Poster, 1988 (19" x 25")--2 copies
Pride Fest Poster, 1990 (11" x 17")
Pride Guide, 1992 (2 copies)
Queermas Eve Ball Poster, 1991 (11" x 17")--2 copies
Romanovsky and Phillips Concert Poster, 1989 (11" x 14")
St. Louis Responds Poster, 1989 (11" x 17")
S.L.A.V.E. (St. Louis Area Volleyball Enthusiasts) & Arch Rivals Poster, 1990 (9" x 12")
"Some of My Best Friends Are..." Poster, 1989 (17" x 22")
Torch Song Trilogy Poster, n.d. (14" x 21.5")
SERIES 11: T-Shirts
BOX 21
loose in oversize box:
Coming Out of Hiding/Queer Radio, 1992
From All Walks of Life, 1991
From All Walks of Life, 1992
Iris, ca. 1982
Mitchly's Saloon, n.d.
Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1981
Pride Celebration in St. Louis, 1984
Pride Celebration in Unknown city, 1990
<!keywords>INDEX
"5th of July," f. 27
"Absolutely Positive," f. 239
ACT-UP/St. Louis, f. 68
The Advocate, f. 195
Affirmation-St. Louis (Methodist), f. 69
Agape Church, f. 70, 240
A.I.D.S., f. 180
A.I.D.S. Directory of Resources, f. 1
A.I.D.S. Foundation of St. Louis, f. 71
A.I.D.S. Memorial Quilt, see Names Project
A.I.D.S Treatment News, f. 196
A.I.D.S. Vaccine Evaluation Unit, f. 72
American Civil Liberties Union, f. 73
American Friends Service Committee, f. 74
America Responds to A.I.D.S., f. 2
"Any Day But Sunday," f. 19
The Alternative Arts and Counter Culture in Phoenix, f. 197
Before Stonewall, f. 20
"Bent," f.22-23
Black Gay and Lesbian Leadership Forum, f. 76
"Blacks Assisting Blacks Against A.I.D.S. Newsletter, f. 241
BLK, f. 198
Boyd, Malcolm, f. 56
Brigg's Initiative, f. 3
Bulletin Board, f. 199
The Centerfold, f. 200
Challenge Metro, f. 79, 242
"Challenge Metro Newsletter, f. 242
Christian Social Action (MCC/St. Louis), f. 116-124
Christopher Street, f. 201
Citizens for Human Rights, f. 80
"Coma," f. 66
"Coming Out," f. 202-204
"Coming Out of hiding," f. 82, 182
Committee to Elect Tim Cusick, f. 83, 257
Concerned Gay Students of Washington University, f. 84
Congressmen, Correspondence to, f. 6
Correspondence to Legislators, f. 6
Cusick, Timothy, f. 83, 183, 257
Day, Felton T., f. 9
Delta Mental Health Institute, f. 85
A Different Light Review, f. 205
Dignity-St. Louis (Catholic), f. 86, 243-253
"Dignity-St. Louis," f. 243-253
Discrimination, f. 184
Doorways, f. 87
Drag Shows, f. 43-44,
Durable Power of Attorney, f. 7
Eastern Missouri A.I.D.S. Summit, f. 24
"Eastern Standard," f. 25
E.F.A., see St. Louis Effort for A.I.D.S.
"Eye on Privacy," f. 254
"Fairy Tales, Faerie Tails," f. 26
Families and Relationships, f. 64
Felton T. Day Memorial Award, f. 9
Finding Our Focus, Conference, f. 28
"Food for Thought," f. 255
Food Outreach, f. 89, 255
Forum, The, f. 90, 256
Forward Thinking Achievement Awards, f. 29
Freedom of Choice Council, f. 91
A Friendly Voice, f. 207
From All Walks of Life, f. 30
"Frontline," f. 258-262
Gateway Democratic Club, f. 93
Gateway Men's Chorus, f. 94, 344
Gateway Femmes, see St. Louis Gender Foundation
"Gatherings," f. 263
Gay Academic Union, f. 97, 208, 264
Gay Academic Union Newsletters, f. 264
Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation (G.L.A.A.D.), f. 214
Gay and Lesbian Archives, f. 98
Gay and Lesbian Community Services, see Challenge Metro
Gay and Lesbian Students at SIU-Edwardsville (G.L.A.S.S.), f. 99
Gay Community News, f. 209-211
GayLife Magazine, f. 265
"Gayly Forward," f. 266
Gay Men's Support Group, f. 266
"Gays on the Hill," f. 213
Gay St. Louis, f. 267
"Gay Women's Newsletter," f. 268
"Gazette," f. 269-272
G.L.A.A.D. Bulletin, f. 214
Girth and Mirth of St. Louis, f. 100
"Gone," f. 31
Goss, Robert, f. 10
Growing American Youth (G.A.Y.), f. 103
Hate Crimes, f. 12, 186
Heartland, f. 215
"He's having Her Baby," f. 33
Hills, Beverly, f. 342
Homophobia, f. 65
Homosexuality in the Scriptures, f. 13
Human Rights Agenda, f. 216
Human Rights Project Newsletter, f. 217
Independent Voters of Eastern Missouri, f. 93
Integrity-St. Louis (Episcopalian), f. 105, 284
"intimacies," f. 34, 342
"Into the Woods," f. 35
Iris Committee, f. 106, 319, t-shirt
"It's Time," f. 218
Kindred Spirits, f. 107, 273
Lambda Art Group, f. 36
"Lambda Book Report," f. 219
Lambda Program, f. 108
"Lambda Reports," f. 109, 343
"Lambda Rising News," f. 219
"Lavender Dragon," f. 273
"Lavender Moon Calendar," f. 274
Lesbian Affirmative Support, f. 110
Lesbian Agenda, f. 274
Lesbian Alliance, f. 179
Lesbian Alliance Legal Committee (Chicago), f. 111
Lesbian and Gay Alliance for Justice, f. 112
Lesbian and Gay Archives Roundtable Newsletter, f. 220
Lesbians Rising in Resistance, f. 113
LesTalk, f. 275-276
"Limbo," f. 37
"Live Wire," f. 277
Low Country Gallery, f. 222
"Mala Noche," f. 60
"Many Faces of A.I.D.S.," f. 39
March on Washington, f. 40, 114
"Metcom News," f. 278
Metropolitan Community Church of Greater St. Louis, f. 116-125,
187, 278, 285-286
Metropolitan Community Church of Living Faith, f. 334
Metropolitan Life Service Center, see Midcontinent Life Service
Corporation (M.L.S.C.)
Metropolitan Organization of St. Louis Students (M.O.S.S.), f. 130
Metro St. Louis Task Force on A.I.D.S., f. 131
Midcontinent Life Service Corporation, f. 126-129, 279
Midwest Men's Festival, f. 41
Midwest Region National Women's Studies Association, f. 132
"Midwest Roundup," f. 223
Midwest Wimmin's Festival, f. 42
Miss Gay Heart of America, f. 43
Miss Gay Missouri Pageants, f. 44
Missouri Coalition for Human Rights, f. 133
Missouri March for Women's Lives, f. 45
"M.L.S.C. Newsletter," f. 279
Moonstorm, f. 280-283
Mother Source, f. 135
Ms. Missouri Leather, f. 46
"Mumpsimus Broken," f. 284
Names Project, f. 136, 346
National Center for Lesbian Rights, f. 137
National Day of Mourning for Privacy Rights, f. 47
National Gay and Lesbian Task Force (N.G.L.T.F.), f. 138
National Institute of Mental Health, f. 224
"New Light," f. 285
News and Notes, f. 225
"NGTF Action Report," f. 226
No Bad News, f. 287-292
Noble, Elaine, f. 21, 342
Northside A.I.D.S. Project, f. 139
Our World Too Bookstore, f. 140, 293
"O.W.T. Newsletter," f. 293
Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays (P/F.L.A.G.), f. 141, 188, 296
The Pathfinder, f. 294
"P.A.W.S. Press," f. 295
Pets Are Wonderful Support-St. Louis (P.A.W.S.), f. 143, 295
"PI Perspective," f. 227
Plus Magazine, f. 297
Police Entrapment, f. 189
P.R.E.P., see Privacy Rights Education Project
Pride Celebrations, f. 50-54, 190, 228, 342, 346, 349
"Pride Committee Focus," f. 298
Pride Guides, f. 299-308, oversize
"Prime Time," f. 309-311
Privacy Rights Education Project (P.R.E.P.), f. 147-153, 191, 254
Project Inform, f. 154
Queermas Eve Ball, f. 55
"Queer Nation News," f. 312
Queer Nation/St. Louis, f. 155, 312, 348
Quilt, the, see Names Project
Racism, f. 65
Rally for Rights, f. 56
"Roommate Wanted," f. 57
Sabres of Artemis, f. 157
St. Louis Acts Out, f. 158
"St. Louis Advisor," f. 313-315
St. Louis A.I.D.S. Memorial (S.L.A.M.), f. 159
St. Louis Arch Rivals, f. 160
St. Louis Effort for A.I.D.S., f. 161, 258-262
St. Louis Frontrunners, f. 161
St. Louis Gateway Femmes, see St. Louis Gender Foundation
St. Louis Gay and Lesbian Community Services, see Challenge Metro
St. Louis Gender Foundation, f. 163, 269-272
St. Louis Gay and Lesbian Pride Celebration Committee, f. 164, 298-308
St. Louis Gay and Lesbian Research Project (UM-St. Louis), f. 165, 317
St. Louis International Lesbian and Gay Film Festival, f. 58
St. Louis/Kansas City Night Gazer, f. 316
"St. Louis Lesbian News," f. 268
St. Louis Magazine, f. 318
St. Louis Task Force for Human Rights, f. 166
"St. Louis Women's Calendar," f. 319
St. Louis Women's Choir, f. 167
St. Louis Womyn's Coffeehouse, f. 168
Sexual law Reporter, f. 231
Sex, Inc., f. 169
Sexism, f. 65
Sharing Center, f. 170, 239
Shocking Gray Catalogs, f. 233
Show Me Guide, f. 320-331
Silverstein, Charles, f. 59
"Sleeping Beauty," f. 66
"Sleepin' Round," f. 60
Slightly Older Lesbians (S.O.L.), f. 171
"SNAP," f. 332
"Some of My Best Friends Are...," f. 61
Southern Voice, f. 235.
"Speaking Out," f. 333
"The Spirit of Living Faith," f. 334
"Stay with Me," f. 62
Steppin' Out, f. 335
"Steps Alano Club Newsletter," f. 336
Stop the Church Protest, f. 63
Thomas, Jim, f. 194
Time Magazine, f. 236
Twisl, f. 337
twn, f. 237
UM-St. Louis Student Groups, f. 173
Unicorn Productions, Inc., f. 174
"Vampire Lesbians of Sodom," f. 66
Viewpoint, f. 338-339
Washington University, f. 84, 263, 333
Windy City Times, f. 238
Wired Women Productions, Inc., f. 175, 277
Women's Car Repair Collective, f. 176
Women's Counseling Collective, f. 177
Women's Eye Bookstore, f. 178, 340
"Women's Eye Bookstore Newsletter," f. 340
Womenspace, f. 179
Women's Place, f. 179
"Women's Sports Connection Newsletter," f. 341
Women Take Back the Night Marches, f. 67 |
Predictors of attrition during the outpatient detoxification of opiate addicts
Sections
Abstract
Method
Attrition characteristics
Summary
Details
Author: Carl D. CHAMBERS , Walter R. CUSKEY,, William F. WIELAND
Pages: 43 to 48
Creation Date: 1970/01/01
Predictors of attrition during the outpatient detoxification of opiate addictsPh.D. Carl D. CHAMBERS
Director of Research, New York State Narcotic Addiction Control Commission, New York City, Ph.D. Walter R. CUSKEY,
Associate in Community Medicine, University of Pennsylvania, PhiladelphiaM.D. William F. WIELAND
Program Director, Narcotic Addict Rehabilitation Program, West Philadelphia Community Mental Health Consortium, Philadelphia
Abstract
Both institutional and ambulatory techniques have been utilized in the detoxification of addicts from narcotics. This study was designed to provide empirical data on attrition from an outpatient programme for hard core heroin addicts. The background and treatment characteristics of 86 addict-patients were analysed. Education, marital status, and the abuse of other drugs concurrently with heroin were the only variables analysed to the extent that they determine whether or not the addict remains under treatment until the detoxification process is completed. A multivariant analysis isolated the concurrent abuse of other drugs with heroin as the most potent predictor for remaining in treatment.
Until quite recently the detoxification of opiate addicts in the United States was accomplished only in institutional or inpatient settings. In 1969, Wieland and Chambers [ 17, 18] reported the first results of a large scale attempt to detoxify addicts entirely as outpatients. Controversy about the relative efficacy of these two contrasting approaches has yet to be resolved.
Advocates of the inpatient technique point to the high incidence of concurrent psychiatric illness and the adverse social influences surrounding narcotic addicts as necessitating hospitalization. For example, Hekimian and Gershon [ 9] recently reported that 50 per cent of a sample of 22 heroin addicts at the Bellevue Psychiatric Hospital in New York City suffered from sociopathic personality disorders before addiction occurred and that the incidence of addiction among related family members-a potent recidivist force-was reported in 20 per cent of the cases. They went on to indicate that 50 per cent of their respondents reported that "a search for euphoria" was the primary reason for narcotic use. This was interpreted as evidence of chronic underlying clinical depression. In support of their argument of adverse social influences, the writers indicated that an additional 22 per cent of their subjects reportedly used narcotics because of "influence by friends and environment."
Others [ 4] , however, point out that institutions, at least in the United States, have too often been used as "dumping grounds" for social deviants and other "undesirables" and that utilization of inpatient facilities for the treatment of addiction can represent disengagement both on the part of the community, at the time of hospitalization, and on the part of the hospital staff, at the time of discharge. And despite the necessary preparation during hospitalization to utilize community services, to obtain productive employment, and to build the ego to resist negative social pressures, long-term hospitalization can produce an "institutional personality" less able to face the exigencies of the social setting. Writers such as Freeman and Simmons [ 7] [ 14] have well documented the difficulties in rehabilitating and reintegrating hospitalized psychiatric patients. One writer, Kurland [ 11] [ 12] even suggests that in view of the poor clinical and social results obtained from inpatient treatment, prolonged hospitalization is unwarranted. Results derived from numerous empirical follow-up studies of patients from inpatient treatment facilities would tend to reinforce Kurland's suggestion [ 3] [ 13] [ 15] [ 16] .
At the operational level, a major consideration of outpatient treatment modalities is that they are much less expensive to operate than inpatient units. When organized properly, outpatient clinics with proportionately smaller numbers of professional and clerical staff than required in an inpatient unit would have the capability of dispensing medication, providing counselling and giving medical, vocational and educational services to a larger number of patients on a daily basis [ 17] [ 18] .
The chief benefit of the outpatient modality for the patient is that even during the detoxification process, he can begin to learn new or re-establish old non-addict social patterns. This time can also be utilized to engage in ego-building experiences such as meaningful family and peer relationships and re-establishing himself in educational or occupational roles.
There is, however, a major clinical disadvantage in the outpatient detoxification modality. This modality, more than any other requires that each patient assume an active role and subsequently the largest share of responsibility for staying in treatment. The patient must come to clinic daily to receive medication and he must also follow the ingesting regimen without supervision.
With the increased incidence of opiate addiction in the United States as well as in other parts of the world, the advantages of having reliable outpatient modalities are obvious. At the present time, however, attrition prior to completing treatment occurs in almost one third of the cases [ 17] [ 18] . If the efficacy of outpatient detoxification is to increase, this premature attrition must be decreased.
This particular study was designed to ascertain what attributes of the addict or his background were associated with terminating treatment prior to attaining abstinence. This design presumes that if the attributes are known, clinicians can better predict which of their addict-patients will require a greater concentration of time and skill.
The selection process
Admission to the outpatient clinic was dependent on having been addicted to a narcotic and living within the geographic boundaries defined as the programme's catchment area. No other selection criteria were utilized. Addicts most frequently hear of the clinic's programme from informal communications on the street with the addicts who are already in treatment. Only a small proportion of referrals come from private physicians or agencies. The admission procedure, at the time of this study, consisted of an intake interview with a social worker or ex-addict counsellor. The counsellor talked with the addict and, when possible, with a member of his family, obtained a brief social and drug history and scheduled the patient for a complete physical cheek-up. Patients were then assigned either to a social worker or ex-addict counsellor, depending on which was available. Before the detoxification process with methadone was initiated, the staff psychiatrist evaluated each patient through a personal interview and a review of the social and drug history taken at intake. The psychiatrist then establishes the medicine regimen.
The treatment process
The detoxification attempt is conducted in the following manner. Patients normally begin treatment with methadone tablets at a dosage of 40 mg per day. Occasionally, patients with "smaller habits" start at 20-30 mg per day and patients with "larger habits" and see on every visit their designated counsellor who may be a social worker or ex-drug addict.
As soon as the patient reflects progress in the area of drug "cheating", criminality and normal social functioning, the daily dosage of methadone is decreased by a 10 mg increment. If the patient continues to show progress at the reduced dosage, the dosage is again reduced and so on until total abstinence of the drug has been maintained. The frequency of clinic visit may also be reduced to a minimum of one per week. In the event of relapse, the dosage and frequency of weekly visits may increase until re-stabilization occurs.
Besides individual counselling, the patients receive vocational and educational counselling, group therapy, and medical services where indicated.
The rate of detoxification is highly individual so that it may take as little as a week or as long as a year or more to complete the process. Treatment relapses are evaluated to determine whether they might benefit from a more intensive treatment, by temporary suspension from treatment, or by transfer to a separate methadone maintenance programme.
Method
To better understand the addict-patients who, in spite of their avowed desire to detoxify, do terminate the detoxification process prior to its completion, two separate statistical analyses were planned. First, as the plan of the study was to ascertain, wherever possible, any significant differences between those who terminated the detoxification process before its completion and those who remained in treatment, a chi-square analysis was planned. A second technique, multi-variant analysis of low frequency events, was utilized with the same dependent variables in an attempt to isolate any predictors of attrition [ 10] .
To accomplish these planned statistical analyses, all addicts admitted to the clinic between 1 August and 1 November, 1968 were defined as the study sample. During this three month period, 86 addicts were admitted into treatment. A cut-off date of March 31, 1969 was chosen. This date provided an 8-month maximum and a 5-month minimum "at risk of attrition" period. Completing or active patients were defined as those who were still in treatment as of the cut-off date. Attriting or inactive patients were those who had terminated the detoxification process "against medical advice." This A.M.A. status was ascribed to any patient who quit coming to the clinic to receive his methadone medication and failed to respond to written or telephone suggestions that he continue in treatment.
Data isolating the variables utilized for these analyses were collected by a social worker at the initial treatment visit or during subsequent routine clinic visits.
Patient characteristics
As a group, the 86 addicts could be characterized as typically being Negro, male, under 30 years of age, school drop-outs, married and legally employed at the time they requested treatment. In contrast to an earlier study (6) of an addict population with comparable attributes, most of these addicts had not become addicted until after the age of 20. Except for their addiction problems, these patients did not have many of the social casualty characteristics typically associated with being hard core heroin addicts in the United States. For example, a majority did not report any prior formal detoxifications, they did not have histories of being on welfare, they had not been abusers of alcohol, they had not been convicted of any crimes, and they were not concurrently abusing other drugs with their heroin.
TABLE 1
Characteristics of the addict-patients
Attrition characteristics
Of the 86 addict-patients, 59 or 68.6 per cent terminated the detoxification process against medical advice. During the study period, 10.2 per cent of the drop-outs terminated within the first month of treatment. The largest percentage of attrition occurred during the last two months of the study period with 55.9 per cent of all the terminations occurring within this period. Length of treatment ranged from less than one week to more than 30 weeks with a median of 24-26 weeks.
TABLE 2
Distribution of A.M.A. terminations by month of attrition
* Patients were admitted only during these months.
Chi square comparisons
Only two comparisons of demographic variables produced any significant differences in attrition-having left school prior to completing the eighth grade and being married at the time of admission for treatment. At the conclusion of the study period, 95.5 per cent (N = 21) of the 22 subjects with less than an eighth grade education had terminated A.M.A. This compared with only 59.4 per cent (N = 38) of the 64 subjects with more than that level of education. Attrition among the 49 married patients was 77.6 per cent but only 56.8 per cent among the 37 patients who were not married.
Only one statistical comparison for the social casualty variables was significant. Patients who were abusing another drug or drugs concurrently with their heroin were more likely to remain in treatment.
Multivariant analysis of low frequency events
Separating the patients into groups with either a low or high risk of A.M.A. termination through the multivariant technique, the following comparisons were produced. Those addict-patients with a low risk of A.M.A. termination were more likely to be the older patients averaging about 35 years and were more likely to be the patients who became addicted to heroin later in life having an average addiction onset age of about 27. In comparison, the average age for high risk addict-patients was about 26 and they became addicted at about 21 years of age. The low risk group was more frequently married at the time they began treatment but had completed fewer years of formal education. Having a history of a criminal conviction and concurrently abusing drugs with heroin were more frequently associated with the low risk patients. With the exception of the abusing of other drugs concurrently with heroin, none of the differences are statistically significant.
TABLE 3
Comparisons of basic demographic variables by attrition
TABLE 4
Comparisons of social casualty variables by attrition
To verify the significance of concurrent drug abuse with attrition, a further analysis combining the previously determined [ 1,2,5] inter-actional effects of age, a history of a criminal conviction and the concurrent abuse of drugs with heroin was performed. The influence of this latter factor, concurrent abuse, was clearly demonstrated.
Attrition was found to be the highest where the addict was abusing only one drug, heroin, regardless of age or having a criminal conviction. Conversely, the lowest attrition was found among those addict-patients concurrently abusing drugs with their heroin and this was also the case regardless of age or having a criminal conviction.
At least by these methods of analysis and among those factors analysed, concurrent or multiple drug abuse prior to the beginning of detoxification appears to be the most potent predictor for remaining in treatment until detoxification is realized.
Summary
This study was designed to assess the background characteristics of those addict-patients who either remained in or dropped out of an outpatient methadone detoxification treatment programme for hard core heroin addicts. Of 86 heroin addicts admitted for detoxification during the study period, 59 (68.6 per cent) terminated treatment against medical advice and prior to becoming detoxified.
The highest rate of attrition was found to occur between the sixth and eighth months of treatment.
Statistical comparisons between those who terminated A.M.A. and those remaining in treatment produced significant differences in only two demographic areas. First, the greater the amount of formal education, the greater the potential for remaining in treatment. Secondly, those addicts who were married at the time of initiating treatment were more likely to terminate treatment prior to detoxification. This first finding is, of course, compatible with similar studies relevant to the utilization of medical and psychiatric services. The second finding is meaningful only if one acknowledges the pressures on the family man to return to normal productive roles as soon as it is possible. In this case, it would be as soon as his addiction and/or detoxification became manageable.
Statistical comparisons were also made of a set of attributes associated with various states of social casualty. Only one of these comparisons produced a significant difference between those terminating A.M.A. and those remaining in treatment. The concurrent abuse of other drugs with heroin at time of initiating the detoxification process was more frequently associated with remaining in treatment than was the abuse of heroin alone.
A multivariant analysis was accomplished to isolate the predictors of attrition. The association between the number of drugs abused and attrition was reinforced through this level of analysis. To be abusing only heroin was the most potent predictor of attrition among these outpatients attempting to detoxify with the use of methadone. Although this finding cannot, of course, be conclusively interpreted, the authors surmise that addicts who concurrently abuse multiple drugs will correctly perceive of their detoxifications as being more difficult and requiring more time. Heroin-only addicts, on the other hand, would experience fewer physical and psychological changes and would perceive of their detoxifications as being less difficult and requiring less time. It is therefore probable that the heroin-only abuser can more readily ascertain when his addiction and/or detoxification becomes personally manageable and is more likely to judge for himself when treatment should terminate. Further studies, including repetition and comprehensive follow-up studies, are required, however, before complete interpretation is possible.
References001
J. C. Ball, "Two Patterns of Opiate Addiction in the United States", J. of Criminal Law, Criminology and Police Science (1965) 56:203-211.002
J. C. Ball, C. D. Chambers and M. J. Ball, "The Association of Marihuana Smoking with Opiate Addiction in the United States", J. of Criminal Law, Criminology and Police Science (1968) 59:171-182.003
J. C. Ball and D. O. Pabon, "Locating and Interviewing Narcotic Addicts in Puerto Rico", Sociology and Social Research (1965) 49:401-411.004
A. K. Berliner, "Bridging the Gap Between Institution and Community in the Treatment of Narcotic Addicts", Mental Hygiene (1968) 52:263-271.005
C. D. Chambers, "Barbiturate-Sedative Abuse: A Study of Prevalence Among Narcotic Abusers", International J. of the Addictions (1969) 4:45-57.006
C. D. Chambers, A. D. Moffett and J. P. Jones, "Demographic Factors Associated with Negro Opiate Addiction", International J. of the Addictions (1968) 3:329-343.007
M. E. Freeman and O. G. Simmons, The Mental Patient Comes Home, New York, John Wiley & Sons, 1963.008
D. L. Gerard and C. Kornetsky, "Adolescent Opiate Addiction: A Study of Control and Addict Subjects", Psychiatric Quarterly (1955) 29:457-486.009
L. J. Hekimian and S. Gershon, "Characteristics of Drug Abusers Admitted to a Psychiatric Hospital", J.A.M.A. (1968) 205:125-130.010
J. Ipsen, R. S. Paffenbarger, A. I. Wing and F. E. Ingenito, "Single and Multivariate Analysis of Early Predictors o Hypertension". Paper presented at the National Hear Association Meetings, November, 1969. Proceedings are forthcoming.011
A. A. Kurland, "The Narcotic Addict: Some Reflections on Treatment", Maryland State Medical Journal (1966) March: 37-39.012
A. A. Kurland, L. Wurmser, F. Kerman and R. Kokowski, "Controls in the Treatment of the Narcotic Addict", J. Amer. Psychiatric Assoc. (1966) 122:739-742.013
J. A. O'Donnell, "A Follow-Up of Narcotic Addicts-Mortality Relapse and Abstinence", Amer. J. of Orthopsychiatry (1964) 34:948-954.014
O. G. Simmons, Work and Mental Illness, New York, John Wiley & Sons, 1965.015
G. E. Vaillant, "A 12-Year Follow-Up of New York Narcotic Addicts: III. Some Social and Psychiatric Characteristics", Archives of General Psychiatry (1966) 15:599-608.016
G. E. Vaillant, "A 12-Year Follow-Up of New York Narcotic Addicts: IV. Some Characteristics and Determinants of Abstinence", Amer. J. of Psychiatry (1966) 123:573-584.017
W. F. Wieland and C. D. Chambers, "Two Methods of Utilizing Methadone in the Outpatient Treatment of Narcotic Addicts", International Journal of the Addictions (1970-Forthcoming). Also presented at the Second Annual Methadone Conference in New York City on October 27, 1969.018
W. F. Wieland and C. D. Chambers, "Narcotic Substitution Therapy", International Journal of Clinical Pharmacology Therapy and Toxicology (1970-Forthcoming). Also presented before the American Society of Clinical Pharmacology and Chemotherapy meetings in Philadelphia on November 26, 1969. |
Military Resource Center
The Otsego Republican.
NEBRASKA CORRESPONDENCE.AURORA, Neb., April 1, 1896.
WASHINGTON CITY.
On the evening of July 10th, 1864, my regiment, the 30tb U. S. C. T., occupied that portion of the line of entrenchments in front of Petersburg that had been vacated at an earlier hour by the 121st New York Volunteers.
The lst division of the 6th corps had been ordered to City Point to embark for some other place, unknown to all except those high in authority. The change was a welcome one, let the destination be whither it might. Since May the 4th they had been facing the flower of the rebel forces, battle after battle had been fought and long lines of breastworks had been built, weary marches by night and by day had been made, their ranks had been decimated time and again and no change could be made that would not be an improvement on what these troops had been passing through. Rapidly embarking on the vessels provided, down the James River they swiftly glided, past Fortress Monroe, into the Chesapeake Bay and then up the Potomac River, the early morning found them near Mount Vernon and a few hours later at the wharves of Washington.
CANNON WERE BOOMING
in the distance, the city was in the greatest confusion, business was at a standstill, some houses were closed and hundreds of teams were hauling merchandise and valuables of every kind out of the nation's capitol.
GEN. WRIGHT AND STAFF
galloped towards Halleck's headquarters, ten thousand veterans were soon formed in companies, regiments and brigades, and with guns at a "right shoulder shift," forty rounds of cartridges on their belts and with the easy swinging gait of the route step, were marching out on Seventh Street. - Confidence came at once to the entire population. "The red cross; why this is the old sixth corps. Who cares for old Jubal Early now?" Such remarks were heard on every side.
Yes, it was the cannon of Gen. Lee's most valiant lieutenant who, with eight thousand of Southern soldiers, were at the very gates of Washington; nearer than Grant had been to Richmond, and had it not been for the gallant fight made by Gen. Lew Wallace - the same who wrote Ben Hur - at the Monocacy River, the city would doubtless have been taken. Early had been sent by Gen. Lee, immediately after the battle of Cold Harbor, to drive back the Union forces under Gen. Hunter that were threatening Lynchburg. This he easily did, and then struck northward for Maryland. Gen. Grant, no doubt, knew of his whereabouts all the time, and when the proper time arrived, sent troops from Petersburg to check his further progress. Gen. Early made things count on this trip in Maryland.
HE LEVIED $200,000
on the little city of Frederick, and had he taken Washington, he would have squeezed that metropolis for all there was in it. But when he reached the line of defences that surrounded the city, deployed his skirmishers and formed his line of battle to attack Fort Stevens, which was only defended by government employees hastily armed, home guards and a few reserve batteries, behold in his front was formed another line of battle that apparently knew exactly what to do on such an occasion, for, with a firm, quick step - it wasn't the route step now - the new line advanced to meet Lee's favorite legions.
PRESIDENT LINCOLN
came out in the forenoon to watch results and encourage the defenders by his presence. Occasional shots were fired by rebel marksmen, and one man was hit only a few yards from the President. What a feeling of relief came to all when Bidwell's brigade deployed in front of the fort and moved out to meet the rebel lines. Brigade after brigade made ready for action, but only Bidwell's did any fighting, for Gen. Early wisely concluded to retreat after a short time of light skirmishing. In the morning the rebel army was nowhere to be seen, and now came another opportunity for Gen. Grant to display his capacity as General-in-Chief of the Union forces.
A GENERAL WAS WANTED
to lead an army in pursuit of the retreating rebels and to desolate the Shenandoah Valley so that no future event of this kind should ever occur. Gen. Sheridan was the man selected, and, although the Secretary of War objected, on the 7th of August he assumed command of the "Army of the Shenandoah."
I think perhaps the "Onesters" passed over nearly the same line of march as we did in September, 1862, only striking the Potomac River opposite Harper's Ferry in place of Bakersville.
Sheridan's motto was always to "push things," and his cavalry kept the rebel Gen. Early continually on the lookout for something new. Sept. 19th Early concluded to make a fight near Winchester, and the old 2d brigade was in it for keeps. Gen. Russell was killed, Gen. Upton was severely wounded by a piece of shell, and the 2d Conn. Heavy Artillery lost their major, five company officers and one hundred and thirty enlisted men.
Although Gen. Upton had been in the artillery before he was commissioned as colonel of our regiment, he would always speak lightly of the shells, apparently having but little confidence in their doing much damage. While wounded he was at the Ebbitt House in Washington City. This was in September, 1864. I had been wounded in July, and on returning to my command, called on him. "Well, General," said I, "you will have more respect for the Napoleon guns after this, won't you?" "Col. Bates, this was purely accidental," was his reply. I saw the wound; a piece of solid flesh as large as two fingers had been taken from the thigh, and his recovery was about the same length of time as mine, with a minie ball through the head.
Do the boys remember about the first of October, when
GEN. MEIGS' SON
was shot by a guerilla? What was Sheridan's order the next morning? Every building within five miles of where the murder was committed should be burned to the ground. Of course innocent ones had to suffer, but it taught the people not to allow any more work of that kind unless they were willing to take the consequences. Such little events as this are only thrown in as side lights, that those unfamiliar with the arts and practices of war can see that the responsibilities falling upon the commanding general of an army are many and varied.
Not a day passes in time of war but what questions arise that need prompt and vigorous action. An officer who can solve all such questions in the best possible way is a success, and he who cannot, is sooner or later a failure, and when you hear persons say that there were hundreds of officers who could have done as well as Grant, Sherman or Sheridan, had the opportunity only been theirs, take my word for it, they don't know what they are saying. Three such men as they were could not have been found elsewhere in the Union armies. These three were head and shoulders above all others. Grant was the great directing mind while the other two could successfully execute any plans the great chieftain saw fit to entrust them with. This is the opinion of.DELEVAN BATES.
The Otsego Republican.
WAR REMINISCENCES.AURORA, Neb., May 15, 1896.
COL. EGBERT OLCOTT.
At the battle of Cedar Creek the 121st N. Y, Vols. were under the command of Captain J. D. V. Duow - not Dunn, as the compositor made my last article read. He was of the old Duow family of Albany, and received his commission as a lieutenant in our regiment through the influence of Col. Franchot. He was killed in this action.
Col. Olcott was in command of the brigade. I have said but little about this officer as my acquaintance with him was slight. He was of a high-toned, wealthy parentage, and had a liberal education. - Outside of the art of war he was probably in all respects the equal of Col. Upton. As a man of the world he was Upton's superior, being far better adapted to meet the demands of society, and especially at the festive gatherings which sometimes were indulged in by congenial spirits, was Col. Olcott always at home, while Upton was more reserved, and not inclined to participate in the "jolly good time" which is an essential in making such occasions a success. - His taste in dress was as refined as that of any lady, and not a wrinkle could ever be seen upon his elegant uniform. He was
OUR FIRST MAJOR,
and, like all the rest of the regiment, not over well posted in the tactics at the first of our term of service.
Who will ever forget the battalion drills at Bakersville before Col. Upton came to us? Col. Franchot never attempted to drill us, but Lieut. Col. Clark and Major Olcott had seen a little duty in other commands, and did the best they could to teach the regiment the mysteries of the evolutions of the battalion. Once in a while they would get things mixed, then Olcott would pull from his pocket a copy of tactics and study out a solution of the proper move, but generally the movements had been well studied in advance that were to be given in the day's lesson.
When Col. Upton assumed command he and Clark did not work well together, so much so that Col. Clark soon resigned, but Major Olcott was an apt pupil, and with Upton's assistance, soon became competent to handle a regiment or a brigade as well as the best.
Col. Upton had been an artillerist, in which branch of the service it is an essential to be an accurate judge of distances, so as to give the correct elevation to the gun when firing, and also tell the length of fuse a shell should have to make it explode in the right place. Sometimes the two would for an hour test their skill in estimating the number of paces from point to point and verifying each estimate by actual measurements.
Col. Olcott always had a supply of choice literature in his tent which I often envied but never had an opportunity to examine, as there was as much difference between his position and mine at that time as there was between the captain of a company and a non-commissioned officer.
At Hazel River he had his quarters made of straight poles hewn on one side and laid up like a log cabin. It was not only commodious but elegant and nicely furnished inside. Good carpenters could be found in every company who were always willing to work around headquarters, thus getting excused from ordinary fatigue duty about the camp. I was in this beautiful habitation but once, which was enough to leave a picture on my mind which has not yet been effaced. The floor was neatly carpeted; a comfortable cot, an easy chair, a couple of camp chairs and a center table, upon which was a full set of Christopher North's
NOCTES AMBROSIAN
elegantly bound. How I wished that some day I could be a major and live in such style as that.
On the battlefield Olcott knew no such word as fear. The night that Gen. Bartlett's headquarters were attacked in September, 1863, with a Deringer cooked in his hand, far in advance of his regiment, he galloped toward the heaviest firing. In the Wilderness he was wounded in the heat of action. At Cedar Creek he kept the 2d brigade right to their work, giving the 121st N. Y. and the 2d Conn. the warmest places, while the 95th Pa. and 65th New York backed them up as the occasion demanded. In Feb., 1865, he no doubt saved the rout of the corps by his prompt action, when the fifth corps gave way near Hatcher's Run. Like many others, he did not receive the promotion that he deserved for gallant conduct and efficient service on the field of action. After Cedar Creek he was given a leave of absence for a time.
CAPTAIN DANIEL D. JACKSON,
who I think entered the service as a non-commissioned officer in company D, was in command of the "Onesters." All the other captains were absent, wounded, and no field officers were present, and, in fact, I believe Olcott was the only field officer that belonged to the regiment at that time. The 121st N. Y. Vols, had seen
AWFUL HARD TIMES.
There were not men enough for duty in the regiment to make two full companies. Captain Jackson and Chaplain Adams were the head and front of the field and staff. And yet through the balance of October, November and the first week in December, the campaigning was quite enjoyable.
NO FIGHTING
and plenty of foraging. The only objectionable feature was the continual orders for "picket duty," and the many severe storms. Rains were abundant in October, and in November and December snow came occasionally, which no one can say is enjoyable for an army in the field.
For a time while in camp near the battle ground of Cedar Creek, the rains were more dreaded than after the move was made to higher ground. Some commanding officers do not appreciate the value of a good drainage when selecting a camping ground. In dry weather it makes no difference whether the surface is level or undulating, but when the windows of heaven are opened and the rains descend, if a fair outlet for the waters is surrounding the pitched tents, the inmates are always happy. No one could tell
HOW LONG THEY WOULD STAY,
but all fixed up as much as possible so as to guard against the wet and cold, and then as usual came the orders to strike tents, and just a little nearer Winchester the tents were pitched again. The report was that the rebel army was coming back in force and perhaps
BREASTWORKS WOULD BE NEEDED.
Trees were felled, dirt was thrown up, and now let them come if they dared. - The "Onesters" are put to the front. A whole week's duty on picket during which time the weather was almost unendurable, severely cold and an occasional storm. But the rebels found all the entertainment they cared for with the cavalry, and no fighting occurred in which the infantry were needed.
Thanksgiving a turkey dinner was enjoyed by all, a generous recognition by the commissary department that was appreciated.
The last of November a visit was made by
MAJOR GENERAL UPTON,
who had been promoted and assigned to the command of a division of cavalry in the Western Department. While all were pleased to hear of his advancement, it was with regret that the "Onesters" parted for the last time from the gallant officer who had made for them a record second to no other regiment in the service. The name of
UPTON'S REGULARS
that appears upon the regimental monument at the base of Little Round Top at Gettysburg is one of which every soldier is proud whose name appears upon the muster roll of the 121st New York Vols., and those who left the regiment for higher honors in other fields yet speak with pride of the command in which they took their first lessons in the art of war.
December lst tents were struck once more and at an early hour the regiment marched toward Winchester. From thence to the railroad at Stephenson, where box cars were in waiting to transport the first division of the 6th corps to Washington. No stop this time, but hastily embarking on boats that were in readiness, down the Potomac into the Chesapeake Bay, past Fortress Monroe, up the James River to the old wharf at City Point, which the regiment left on July the 10th and reached again December 4th. The brigade was placed on cars and taken out several miles to relieve a part of the 5th corps which were needed elsewhere, and what was the first thing recognized?
FORT HELL
that the 2d brigade had built just before they started for Washington. Five months had made but little difference in the surroundings. There was the same long line of earthworks, the same rebel entrenchments in front and the same opportunity of getting shot that existed when there before.
Gen. Grant was well pleased when they arrived, for where the Greek Cross was, he knew his lines were safe.DELEVAN BATES.
A Record to be Proud of.
From the "Libby Prison Chronicle"
June 1894
Chicago, Illinois.
Gen. Delevan Bates, president of the 1st National Bank of Aurora, Neb., donates to Libby Prison War Museum two flags of great interest and two large photographs of himself - one taken in 1865, the other in 1890. One of the flags belonged to the 1st brigade, 4th division of the 9th army corps. It was given to the brigade at the time of the organization of the division, in May, 1864, by the War Department, and was carried at the head of the brigade during the campaign of Gen. Grant from the Rapidan to Petersburg. It floated over the breastworks of the front at Petersburg and the Bermuda front until the organization of the 25th army corps in 1864. It is rectangular, instead of being a triangle, as is given in the official records of the Quartermaster General, in his book called "Military Commanders and their Designating Flags," which shows that man makes mistakes. The other flag, designating the 1st brigade, 3d division, 10th army corps, army of Ohio, was not furnished by the War Department, but was made by order of General Delevan Bates from rebel bunting obtained in Wilmington, N.C. It was carried at the head of the brigade as far as Raleigh, thence to Beaufort and then to New Berne, N.C., where the brigade was disbanded in December, 1865.
In looking up the war record of Gen. Bates we find the following: "Helped recruit the 121st N.Y. Volunteers - Upton's Regulars, Aug., 1862; commissioned 2d Lieut. August 18, 1862; 1st Lieut. July 4, 1863; Colonel 30th U.S. (Colored) Troops March 1864; Brev. Brig. Gen. U.S. Volunteers July 30,1864; assumed command of 1st brig. 4th div. 9th army corps, Oct. 11, 1864; 1st brig. 1st div. 25 corps, Dec. 2, '64; 1st brig. 3d div. 25 corps, Dec. 24, '64; 1st brig. 3d div. 10th corps, April 3d, '65; 3d div. 10th corps, July '65; mustered out Dec. 23, '65. He took part in thirteen battles and many skirmishes; was captured May 3, '63 and confined in Libby Prison from May 7 to May 23, '63; shot through the head inside the rebel lines July 30, 1864. His photographs show a large wound on his left cheek. He received an Medal of Honor for gallantry displayed on numerous occasions.Ex-prisoners of war are invited to contribute to the Libby Prison Chronicle.
Jm. S. Ransom (signed)
A DAY WITH THE COLORED TROOPS.
The Test of Negro Mettle in the Fight of the Crater.
Editor National Tribune: July 30, 1864, was a red-letter day In the life of the writer of this reminiscence. On this day his regiment, the 30th U. S. Colored Troops, led the charge of the colored division at the battle of the Mine. Col. Delevan Bates was shot thru the head with a minie ball, was given a Medal of Honor for distinguished services, and on his return from the hospital was made a Brigadier-General of Volunteers by brevet and assigned to duty according to his brevet rank, which position was honorably filled until his muster-out In December, 1865.
The 30th U.S.C.T. was organized at Camp Belger, Baltimore, in the early part of the year 1864, from the colored people, and most of the recruits had been slaves until the Emancipation.
The Emancipation Proclamation of President Lincoln made them free. The commission of the Colonel was dated March 1, 1864, and was signed by C.A. Dana, Assistant Secretary of War.
The regiment was well officered, every one from the Colonel in command to the Second Lieutenant of Co. K having had experience in actual warfare, and passed a creditable examination as to proficiency in the Army Regulations, the tactics and management of troops in the field.
They had come from regiments that had fought under McClellan on the Peninsula, had helped charge the heights of South Mountain; they had been on the bloody field of Antietam, with Burnside at Fredericksburg, Hooker at Chancellorsville and Meade at Gettysburg. They understood well the duties of the picket and skirmish line; they had not only been in the advancing column, but had helped repel charges such as no war ever saw surpassed, either in deeds of valor or in decisive results. They knew what success was and also what it meant to save the rear of an army from the pursuit of an enemy flushed with victory.
Responsibilities of Officers.
The responsibilities of the officers in the colored service were much greater than those incurred by the officers in the command of white troops, and also were their chances for death much greater. The rebels had a special antipathy against the colored troops, which extended from the Confederate Congress down to the private soldier in the ranks of the Confederate army. In 1863 the following resolution was passed at Richmond, Va.: "Resolved, by the Congress of the Confederate States of America, in response to the message of the President, Sec. 4, That every white person being a commissioned officer, or acting as such, who during the present war shall command negroes or mulattos in arms against the Confederate States, or who shall train, organize or prepare negroes or mulattos for military service against the Confederate States, or who shall voluntarily aid negros or mulattos in any military enterprise, attack or conflict in such service, shall be deemed as inciting servile insurrection, and shall, if captured, be put to death or be otherwise punished at the discretion of the court." We laughed at such resolutions.
When the mighty army of Gen. Grant crossed the Rapidan in May, 1864, the colored troops at Baltimore were organized into the Fourth Division of the Ninth Corps, and were assigned the duty of guarding the immense wagon train, 4,000 teams, which if extended in a single line would have reached from Washington to Richmond, 130 miles. These teams were busy, many of them by night as well as by day hauling supplies from the nearest railroad to the troops at the front, and many were the contentions and controversies between Quartermasters and Wagonmasters in regard to the right of way during the six weeks that passed while the army was forcing its was thru the Wilderness, beyond Spotsylvania, across the North Anna River and on the blood fields around Cold Harbor.
One little episode in which the Quartermaster of the 30th C.S.C.T. was involved will give an idea of how the right-of-way question was sometimes solved. Lieut. Baldwin was one of the best Quartermasters in the army, and his teams were generally among the first to reach their destination when the bivouac was ordered. But one day he was bluffed by a Quartermaster from the Fifth Corps, and thus delayed for several hours. The next day he asked for a Sergeant and six men to accompany his train. The detail was given him, and he held his way amongst the wilderness of teams at the point of the bayonet whenever the occasion demanded. He had received his training in the 44th N.Y., one of the best regiments the State sent out, and he understood his business well, feared nothing and could always hold his own when he had sufficient backing.
On the Firing Line at Petersburg.
When Petersburg was reached the colored troops were placed on the firing line in front of the rebel Army of Northern Virginia, the best troops the Confederates had in the field during the entire war. The distance from our lines to the rebel lines was but a few hundred feet; both lines were well intrenched; breastworks, bomb proofs, covered ways and abatis, as was best suited for the surroundings, were seen on every side, and an irregular but continuous firing was kept up both night and day for weeks and weeks. Each side was ever on the alert for what the other might try to do. Finally a rebel battery was undermined, blown up and an assault was the last against the rebel lines of a long series commencing May 5, and all of them against a strongly intrenched foe. These charges were all desperate and bloody, and, including the one in which the colored division participated on July 30, it is safe to say the total loss to the Union army was at least 70,000 men, a large army of killed and wounded, and yet with no decisive results.
The mine was 510 feet in length, and at the terminus under the rebel works had side galleries about 35 feet length. In these galleries were placed 320 kegs of powder of 25 pounds each, 8,000 pounds, strongly, tamped and connected together with wooden tubes half filled with powder. Three fuses were run back about 100 feet; and the main gallery was filled with earth and well tamped for about 30 feet. The original plan of attack was for the colored troops to advance immediately after the explosion, and when the crater was reached the leading regiment should turn to the right and proceed as far as possible down the enemy's line the second regiment turn to the left and sweep down the line in that direction, the remaining regiments of the division to advance rapidly thru the gap in the rebel line toward the city of Petersburg, to be followed by the other divisions of the army as soon as they could be rushed in.
Informed of the Assault.
The day before the assault, the company officers of the 30th U.S.C.T were assembled at regimental headquarters, and the following talk was given them by the Colonel: You all heard rumors of a mine that is to be exploded. That mine is now ready. It will be blown up at a 3 o'clock tomorrow morning. Gen. Burnside has directed that the Colored Division the charge, which will be made immediately after the explosion. Our regiment will lead the division, and will be formed in double column, closed in mass, at our outer line of works opposite the mine. As soon as the explosion occurs we will rapidly advance to the rebel works, and as soon as they are entered the movement will be, "Right companies, right into line wheel; left companies on the right into line, and we will go down the line as far as we can and there remain. I shall expect every officer to do his full duty, and file closers must allow no soldier to leave the ranks."
As the officers returned to their companies a serious smile was, noticed the faces of some, but all were glad that the time had come to try the mettle of the colored soldiers in the Army of the Potomac. The company commanders next informed the men of what was coming in the early morning and what was expected of them, each giving words of advice and encouragement according to his own idea, and most of them closing with. the admonition to "Remember Fort Pillow," and not to give up or surrender under any circumstances, for it would mean sure death, as no quarter could be expected from the rebel soldiers.
All this was well understood by privates as well as officers, and the death loss of the morrow showed the desperate valor with which the colored soldiers fought on that disastrous day.
The Non-Commissioned Officers.
After the company officers had thoroughly, instructed the men in what they should do, some of the more intelligent of the non-commissioned officers made short but pointed remarks to the privates. One of the speakers, a Sergeant, , who had been a preacher on the Eastern Shore of Chesapeake Bay, was a very good talker, and being anxious to know how the boy's were taking the situation, I walked over to where he was addressing the members of Co.H. His remarks ran something like this: "My deah bredern, dis am gwine to be er gre't fite, de gre'tes'' we'uns hab eber seen; if we'uns tek Petrsburg mos' likly we'l tuk Richmun, and derstroy Mars Gin'ul Lee's big ahmy and den cloz de wah. Ebery man had orter lif up hisself in praher fur er strong hyart. O, bredern, member de pore cullud fokses ober yer in bondage. En 'member Marse Gin'ul Grant, en Marse Gin'ul Burnside, en Marse Gin'ul Meade, en de uder ob de gre't Gin'uls ober yunner watch'n yer, en, moreover, de fust nigger dat goes ter projeckin' es gwine ter git dis byarnut inter him. 'Fore Gawd, hits sho nuff trufe Ise tellin' yer."
Such speeches as these from men of their own color were perhaps of more practical value to the common soldier than all that was said by the officers. But, be this as it may, every man in the 30th U.S.C.T., both white and colored, felt that a great event for the Fourth Division of the Ninth Army Corps was near at hand and that the results of the coming fight would either place the colored troops side by side with their comrades of lighter hue, or else they would never again be given such responsibilities as were now before them.
A Change in the Program.
Morning came and with it a change in the program. A consultation of the leading Generals had been held during the night and it was decided to let the white troops take initiative after the explosion of the mine. Senator Benjamin F. Wade, Chairman of the Committee on the Conduct of the War, did not hesitate to say that this change was the cause of the disastrous result. His words can be found upon page 10 of the official report of that committee. Gen. Grant in his testimony before this same committee Dec. 20th, 1864, uses the following words, viz: "Gen. Burnside wanted to put his division of colored troops in advance, and I believe if he had done so, it would have been a success." The writer, however, has no criticisms to make, he is merely telling the story of what his regiment did on the eventful day.
The explosion of the mine was a success. The crater made by the explosion of 8,000 pounds of gun powder was 135 feet long, 97 feet broad and 30 feet deep. Two hundred and seventy-eight men were buried in the ruins. To add to the terror of the scene, the Union forces commenced a bombardment with 170 cannon and mortars. Elliot's rebel brigade near the crater were panic stricken and fled in every direction. Now was the time for the Union charge, which must be well directed and well executed to obtain the desired results, viz: to make a gap in the rebel lines thru which the reserve troops could rush toward Petersburg. But the white troops selected did not appear to realize the situation and 8 o'clock found them huddled in the crater having made no well-advised attempt to widen the gap as was the intention of the colored brigade.
The Confederates Recover.
The Confederates had now entirely recovered from their surprise and were ready for any farther advance of the Union army. We thought all was over, but in response to repeated orders from Gen. Meade to send in more troops, Gen. Burnside now sent in the colored division. The 30th U.S.C.T. was next to the Union breastworks, and in tones loud, clear and in quick succession, came the commands of the Colonel, "Attention, battalion!" The men sprang to their feet; "Fix bayonets!" There was a sharp rattling of steel and then came "Trail arms! - Forward, March!" and the regiment, led by the Colonel and Adjutant, went over the breastworks and thru the opening that had previously been made in the abatis, in columns of four, out onto the fated plain and toward the Crater. The appearance of the regimental colors seemed to be the signal for the enemy's batteries, and it was volley after volley of canister and shrapnel they gave us. Every round they fired took a set of ours and sometimes a double set. The brains of the Color Sergeant were spattered over the flag, but a stalwart Corporal seized the staff before the silken emblem touched the ground. The line officers all shouted "Forward, boys, forward!" It was our only safety to reach the rebel lines as soon as possible. Next came a volley of musketry followed by the "zip," "zip," "zip," of the firing at will, and on every side were men falling, falling, falling like leaves in the forest in the gales of Autumn.
As we neared the rebel intrenchments a change of direction of the head of the column to the right brought us directly in front of the enemy's line, and then came the order, "By the left flank, March!" and over the breastworks clambered the dusky warriors, officers vieing with the men as to who should first be inside of the rebel works. The abatis made but little impression, even the breastworks made but a short pause, and the negroes were in a hand to hand fight with as good troops as the Confederacy had ever mustered. The black faces assumed an ashy hue, the eyes glared like those of wild animals, the lips were tightly drawn, showing the white teeth, and the expression on every face was terrible to behold as over the works we went. "Surrender! Surrender! Surrender!" was heard on every side, and those who defiantly refused were given the cold steel without mercy. For 18 months I had served in "Upton's Regulars" in the fighting Sixth Corps. I had been at South Mountain, Antietam, Fredericksburg, Salem Church and Gettysburg, but never had seen "lovelier fighting," as Phil Kearny would say, than this at the battle of the Mine. Well do I remember the Confederate Captain who while vainly trying to hold his command to their work kept yelling, "Kill 'em!" "Shoot 'em!" "Kill the damned niggers!" but while endeavoring to help carry out his own commands a bayonet in the hands of a dusky opponent as brave as he, pierced him thru and thru.
Enjoyment in Killing.
It is the only battle I was ever in where it appeared to be just pure enjoyment to kill an opponent. The Southern soldiers view this battle in the same light that the writer does, for Col. F.W. McMasters, of the 17th S.C., says in a newspaper article, "We slaughtered hundreds of whites and blacks, with decided preference to the Ethiopians."
The enemy's works on this part of the line was a perfect honeycomb of bomb proofs, trenches, covered ways, sleeping holes, and little alleys running in every direction, and in each hole there appeared one or more rebel soldiers, some ready to "kill the niggers" when they came in view and some praying for mercy. Such prayers as this were heard on every side while the battle raged the fiercest. "Lord, have mercy on me, and keep them damned niggers from killing me," plentifully interspersed with ejaculations like these "Kill the niggers," "Shoot 'em," "Kill 'em." But such fighting as this never lasts long, and when it was over the colored troops had accomplished a work of which they might well be proud. Two hundred yards of the enemy's strongest line had been carried at the point of the bayonet and 250 prisoners captured with a stand of colors.
One would think this was enough to ask of a single division on such an occasion, while there were 40,000 other soldiers within gun shot that had not been engaged, but before our lines had been reformed an Aid from the staff of Gen. Burnside appeared upon the scene of action and accosted the writer of this sketch, who was the ranking officer present, as follows: "Well, Colonel, what next?" The reply was, "This is as far as my orders go." The officer pointed to a white house in the direction of Petersburg, near which a rebel battery was posted, and said, "That will be your next objective point; advance at once,"
The Colors Rushed to the Front.
The colors were rushed to the front, an alignment attempted by the company officers and an advance ordered. We went but a short distance, for we were met by the First Brigade of Gen. Mahone's Division of Confederates, that had just formed a line of battle in a ravine 200 yards in the rear of the line we had just captured. Gen. Bushrod Johnson was in command of the division that occupied the rebel line in which the Crater was located, but he appears to have taken no part in the reestablishment of the broken line. Gen. Robert E. Lee was among the first to realize the situation, and immediately sent an order by Col. Venable to Gen. Wm. Mahone, whose division joined Gen. Johnson's on the right, to send two brigades at once to the field of action. Gen. Wm. Mahone was one of the best officers In the rebel army, and his division, containing his old brigade of Virginians, Gen. Wright's Georgians, Gen. Saunders's Alabamians, Gen. Harris's Mississippians and Gen. Finnegan's Floridians, were recognized as the best division in Gen. A.P. Hill's Corps.
Gen. Mahone said. "I can't send my brigade to Gen. Johnson, but I will go with them myself," so taking the Virginia and Georgia brigades he went to Gen. Johnson's headquarters, where he found Gen. Beauregard, who was in command of the defenses of Petersburg. Gen. Mahone was at once given command of the line and had just got his Virginia brigade ready for business, was forming the Georgia brigade and had sent back to have the Alabama brigade brought up to the battlefield when the peremptory order came for the colored troops to advance.
Meeting Mahone's Men.
As mentioned before, we started, but upon reaching the open plain, Gen. Mahone's troops, advancing from the ravine in which they were stationed, gave us a volley that decimated our ranks, and this was immediately followed by the old rebel tell and a charge such as veteran troops alone knew how to make. Officers as well as men went down thick and fast. Col. Bates fell shot thru the head, the Major was killed, eight company officers were killed or wounded and every third man in the 30th U.S.C.T. tasted rebel lead that day. Many a dusky warrior had his brains knocked out with the butt of a musket, or was run thru with a bayonet while vainly imploring for mercy. When we came to bury the dead the next day under flag of truce one of our Captains was found with seven ugly wounds on his body, but there were six dead rebels lying near him and his lifeless hand yet grasped his 44-caliber revolver, every barrel of which was empty.
Singly, in couples and squads the survivors of the Colored Division sought refuge in the Union lines, but that night witnessed a sad roll call in every regiment of the Colored Division, for out of 4,500 guns that were carried in the fight in the morning only 2,835 were present when the retreat was sounded at night. Sixteen hundred and sixty-five were numbered among the killed, wounded and missing.
Altho the day's work as a whole was not a success, one thing has been proven, viz, the colored troops dared meet not only in open field the best troops of the Confederacy, but they also dared attack them behind breastworks almost impregnable, and as to results the best standard by which to test the qualities of an army is this: The number killed on the battlefield.
A writer well recognized as authority on war statistics says, "This is a harsh standard, but It is nevertheless true that where the dead lie the thickest there is where the bullets flew the fastest." All of the witnesses before the Congressional Investigating Committee testified that the Colored Division did nobly, while Gen. Robert E. Lee recognized their bravery by promoting Gen. Wm. Mahone from a Brigadier to a full Major-General for the work he did that day. Mahone's fighting was with the colored troops, the fighting of our white division being with Elliott's Brigade of Bushrod Johnson's Division of rebels, and at an hour before Gen. Mahone's troops were on the ground.
-Delevan Bates, Brevet Brigadier-General U. S. Vols., Aurora, Neb.
© 1998-2003 by John G. Saint, Ted & Carole Miller |
Tribute to the Med Flight Crew: Message Board Homepage
Memorial Funds
Video
Med Flight Tribute Message Board following condolences and personal memories were submitted from May 11-June 20. Thank you to those who have shared your support for the UW Health community and the family and friends of the dedicated Med Flight crew members killed in the crash.
Memorial Funds
The families of our Med Flight crew have designed memorials in honor of the crew members. In cooperation with the families, we share this information for those interested in making a contribution: Memorial Funds for the Med Flight Crew
Tribute Message Board
Submitted by: Susan Pollack, MD
06/20/2008
Just wanted to send my condolences, my thoughts and support not only for the three fine crew members, their families and friends, but also to all of you who worked with them as colleagues. We lost a flight crew here some years ago, and thus I wanted you to know that we here will think of you and send our support for both your grief and your healing. Here we are at the tertiary care level, but in circumstances before this I have once stood at the door of a small rural West Virginia hospital and once stood in the middle of a rural Pennsylvania field and both times blessed the helicopter crew coming to help. We will never forget them. Please take care of each other and know that we are with you in spirit.
- Susan Pollack, MD
University of Kentucky Children's Hospital
Submitted by: Sandy R.
06/11/2008
Thank you to the crew and staff of Med Flight. I was transported to UW Hospital after crashing my motorcycle in 2005. Your staff was wonderful. They were reassuring and patient with me, and the nurse even came to visit with me while I was hospitalized. Without your dedication to your profession of helping others I would not be here to raise my two young sons, as well as to help others through my employment as a social worker. I always thank flight crews when I see them making public appearances, since I don't remember the crew who transported me. Thank you for all that you do.
- Sandy R.
Adams, WI
Submitted by: John Siedschlag
06/11/2008
It has been some time since the crash, but I miss seeing Steve land at our hospital. As the night maintenance/security person, I escort the crew to where they need to go. Steve was a wonderful pilot and easy to talk to. He and the entire crew will be missed by us at BDCH.
- John Siedschlag
Beaver Dam Community Hospital Maintenance/Security
Submitted by: Sara, UW Hospital and Clinics colleague
06/11/2008
I have had the pain of loss of a husband and an 18-year-old daughter. I want you to know, as their families, that you are not forgotten in my prayers. I will always remember them when I hear the sound of a helicopter. You will survive this terrible loss and smile again. I am so sorry!
Submitted by: Michael Ellsworth, patient
06/10/2008
May god see you through your time of despair.
Submitted by: John
06/09/2008
Though I only knew Darren, it is very apparent that all three of these men were of the highest quality. Having grown up around Darren, there is no doubt that he continued to live by the principles that were a part of his life from the very beginning. My family's prayers are with all the loved ones of these three wonderful men. God Bless.
Submitted by: Nicholas, colleague and student
06/06/2008
As a former student, my heartfelt prayers and sympathies go out to the family and friends of that crew. They're part of God's EMS crew now. God Bless.
- Nicholas
Genetic Disease Researcher (Dallas)
Submitted by: Sheryl Kinyon
06/01/2008
On behalf of the Cassville Rescue Squad, we would like to extend our deepest condolences to the friends and families of the Med Flight crew. It is a tough job that they do up there. We commend all of the Med Flight crews for the tough job that they do. On behalf of the Cassville Rescue Squad, thank you.
- Sheryl Kinyon
Cassville EMS
Submitted by: Scott Driskill
06/01/2008
Thank you for your dedication and service. You made a difference to a lot of people.
- Scott Driskill
New Holstein, Wisconsin
Submitted by: April Nolan, colleague and student
06/01/2008
I'm so sorry. You will be missed.
Submitted by: Elizabeth Hartley-Pawloski
05/30/2008
My condolences to all my former colleagues and the three families regarding the loss of your Med Flight crew. I remember the ED staff worked together as a family. To lose three family members at once must be incredibly painful. My thoughts and prayers are with you all.
- Elizabeth Hartley-Pawloski
San Jose, California
Submitted by: Dianne Mayr, RN, BSN, EMT
05/28/2008
I have had the pleasure of knowing Mark Coyne and Dr. Bean through the years when they would come to pick up critical patients from my small-town hospital. Also, Mark taught me ACLS throughout the years. I remember the very first class after I ran the mega code. He asked me how close I lived to UW Hospital, trying to get me to come work at the UW. He always had a smile on his face and never forgot a person's face or name and never was too busy to answer a question. It saddens my heart and I offer my condolences that we had to lose these great people.
- Dianne Mayr
Former UW Hospital RN, Brook's Ambulance Service employee
Submitted by: Amy Curcio, colleague
05/28/2008
What can you do in this time of sorrow, but cry and give the family your condolences? What can you do in this time of grief, but remember the good time you had with these three courageous men? What can you offer their families in this time of sadness, but hold your head up tall and be proud and honored that you knew these three brave men and share story after story? What can you do in this time of loss, except dedicate our lives to our work in caring and healing and continue with our dreams? What can we do in this time of pain but remember that the pain is only temporary and the memories last a lifetime? And now with only my dreams and inspirations to give back to Darren, Mark, and Steve, I open my arms wide open to the skies and thank them for all they have taught me and all the fond memories that I can cherish throughout life. It has been such a wonderful experience to have been a coworker of these three brave men, though their time with us was way too short. So with this all said, the only thing that I have to give back is my dedication and love for my job. I know they would all be proud and want me to move on in my nursing career, so at this time I would like to dedicate my EMT-I certificate that I received on 5/16/08 to these three brave, courageous heroes and coworkers of the UW Med Flight crew. This is what I have to give back to them and the one thing that I can have great memories of to learn in my future to become one of the best flight nurses that I can be. I can only hope that I have half as much dedication, caring and compassion as each one of these men did to put towards my career and life long dreams. Thank you, once again, Dr. Bean, Mark, and Steve. I appreciate all that you have done for me and others. I will always remember you. In loving memory and may you rest in peace.
- Amy Curcio
UW Emergency Room NA
Submitted by: Edward Claassen, patient
05/26/2008
At this great time of grief, I would like to thank all the staff of the UW Med Flight services. I would not be here today if you guys had not saved my life three and one-half years ago when I was in a serious car crash. To all the families who lost loved ones - these people are in a much better place now.
- Edward Claassen
Edgerton
Submitted by: Marilyn (from Madison)
05/26/2008
These men gave their lives to help others. We all mourn their untimely loss.
Submitted by: Randy Kunkel, frequent patient
05/26/2008
I have had many surgeries at UW. What a wonderful group of doctors, nurses, techs, meal preparers and janitorial proffessionals. As I lay in my hospital bed, I frequently heard the UW helicopters come and go. I always said a prayer that somebody's life had just changed forever! I send my prayers and blessings to these wonderful caregivers, and love to the families and friends. God bless all at UW!
- Randy Kunkel
Hazel Green
Submitted by: Delores Burrington
05/23/2008
I worked in the laboratory of Prairie du Chien Memorial Hospital in the '80s and took a lot of calls with that position. Although I did not know this crew, I can't help but remind everyone of the many times UW Med Flight helped numerous people in that rural community whether it was taking them to LaCrosse or Madison hospitals. That job is tailor-made for the people who do it over and over again. Thank you and condolences to all the families and the UW family.
Submitted by: Jennifer Schrimpf, friend and colleague
05/23/2008
I am very sorry to hear of the loss. I knew most of the crew very well. My heart goes out to all of the employees for Med Flight and the families of the crew.
- Jennifer Schrimpf
West Columbia, South Carolina
Submitted by: John Erickson, CRNA, colleague
05/23/2008
My thoughts and prayers go out to the families, friends and relatives of the three men. As a fellow aviator and health care worker, I know that they loved what they were doing, and I thank them for their selfless service to others. It is indeed tragic that their lives have ended so soon. May the strength and peace of God be with them, their families and friends.
- John Erickson
Gundersen Lutheran Anesthesia Department
Submitted by: Ann E. Van Atta
05/22/2008
I was shocked when I learned the Med Flight Crew was missing and then profoundly saddened to learn of the tragic deaths of your three beloved collegues, friends and family. I am sure they will forever be an inspiration to all who knew them and the many patients and families whose lives they touched. Reach out to each other in these difficult days ahead as you move forward to continue their mission. Blessings to you all.
- Ann E. Van Atta
Gundersen Lutheran Medical Center
Submitted by: Colleen McKee
05/22/2008
I wish to extend my condolences to the families of the Med Flight crew who lost their lives near LaCrosse. I am a cancer survivor who is extremely grateful to the University of Wisconsin Hospital and Clinics. Even though I didn't know any of the crew, I still feel as though I lost a dear "friend." I consider anyone affliated or employed at UW Hospital and Clinics a dear friend. Just remember that "Only the Best are Chosen." I am sure these Angels of Mercy were among the very Best. May God Bless All of You.
Submitted by: Jennifer, UW Health colleague
05/22/2008
My last memory of Dr. Bean was one week before the accident. He smiled and asked, "When are you going to have that baby?" That is how I shall remember him: walking in through the EMS doors, with a large coffee in hand and a big smile on his face. May God be with you.
- Jennifer
UW Emergency Room nurse
Submitted by: Karla Eppler, student
05/22/2008
Mark was my medic instructor and I remember his passion for EMS. He cared about his students and shared his wonderful knowledge. My thoughts and prayers are with the families of these brave men.
- Karla Eppler
Winona Area Ambulance Service
Submitted by: Noah Creaven
05/21/2008
Our deepest condolences for your loss. No words can fill the hole these fine people have left in your team but know that as a community we are all thinking of you. From all of us, LifeLink.
- Noah Creaven
University LifeLink (Aurora, Colorado)
Submitted by: Cindy, friend, colleague and student
05/21/2008
I've had Mark as an instructor as well as taught classes with Mark. He was a good man with a kind heart and will be missed greatly! His contribution to the Emergency Medical Service was exemplary!
- Cindy
MATC and Marquette County EMS
Submitted by: Sangeeta Agarwal
05/21/2008
I was extremely sorry to hear for your loss. It was very unfortunate. Sometimes we don't know why things happen, because we cannot see or perceive the big picture.
- Sangeeta Agarwal
Gundersen Lutheran Healthcare
Submitted by: Dawn Klitzman, colleague
05/21/2008
My thoughts and prayers are with the families of these three wonderful men. They are truly heroes and have touched many lives. You should be proud of all of them.
Submitted by: Laura Long, RN, friend and UW Health colleague
05/20/2008
I dedicate this rememberance to Mark. He is one of the people who told me that I should be an RN. I had the positvie attitude and drive for it. He told me that patients appreciate me, and for that I have decided that I would further my education in the medical field. The last time I saw Mark, I was feeling down and I didn't think I could do this schooling any more. He told me some inspirational words, and I will never forget. "You're here for a reason, and you must do it well, or you wouldn't be doing it at all. Remember, if you need help, come and see me." I have taken those words and put them deep into my heart. I will go on, and I will graduate, and as I graduate, I will remember Mark telling me, "I can do it!" The Med Flight Crew was and is an incredible group of people. I have friends who have been touched by their incredible well-being. I am proud to be part of the UW team. They will be missed!
Submitted by: Elizabeth Lor
05/19/2008
To the families, friends and all professionals in our medical field: Every single life that has been through our hands, benefits from our passion, our love and care. When we save someone's life, it makes us feel so happy and so proud of what we did. To all who are in the medical field, may God bless. Especially to those who lost their loved ones. Our love and our prayers will be with you all.
Submitted by: Amy Gempeler, RN, UWHC Emergency Department colleague
05/19/2008
One of my last memories of Darren is seeing him in the cafeteria on Saturday afternoon. I asked him if he got the note I left in his office the previous day. It was about a concern I had regarding a local EMS service. I didn't know who to go to with my concerns but I knew Dr. Bean would have an answer. He took about five minutes to let me vent my concerns and told me about plans he had to start a sort of hotline to report such concerns. If only he could make it around all the HIPPA "hoops." He must have had a list as long as his arm of all the projects he wanted to implement. His aspiring attitute was contagious. That's my last memory of talking to him. Later that evening, Med Flight brought in a Level One motorcycle accident to one of our trauma rooms. It wasn't my patient, but I can still picture him outside the room washing his hands talking to the ER attending for the patient, Dr. LaCharite. Desiree not only lost her husband, Steve, she also lost a best friend in Darren. Words cannot express how this has affected our department. Med Flight is our family. We lost three brothers last week. My hope is that this tragedy will make me more "Bean-like." Once the dust has settled, we will prevail and fly again. It's what Darren, Steve and Mark would have wanted. My deepest condolences to Stacy, Kaitlin and Parker Bean, Desiree LaCharite, and Ann Coyne. You are part of our ER family and will always be in my heart.
Submitted by: Brenda Hovey
05/19/2008
I am truly sorry for your loss and our hearts and prayers are with the families of Darren, Steve and Mark. With the loss of our own family at our AE16 Base in December, we know the pain you're feeling and want you to know we care. God Bless you all.
- Brenda Hovey
Air Evac EMS, Inc., Missouri
Submitted by: Trez Tianen Zotkiewicz, friend and colleague
05/19/2008
As a former UW PICU Nurse and friend of Mark Coyne's, I am saddened at the news of the Med Flight Crew. The story made it into the Wall Street Journal, but without names, so when my husband showed me the article, I prayed that it was not anyone I knew. A phone call from another nurse friend confirmed the worst. Even though it has been over 20 years since I worked in the UW PICU with Mark, we remained friends and corresponded annually at Christmas like people with busy lives usually do. He checked on me and my family after Hurricane Katrina to make sure we were OK. He was the only person who got away with calling me "Mamma Trez" when one of my primary patients stayed in the PICU 20 months! It's amazing how the memories of Mark's humor on the job and fun times on his "cat" sailboat are coming back to me now. My heart goes out to Ann and the rest of the Med Flight Crew's families during this difficult time. May God Bless you all!
- Trez Tianen Zotkiewicz
Maternal Child Clinical Nurse Specialist, New Orleans
Submitted by: Amy, colleague
05/19/2008
Although I did not have the honor to know these great men, they are still in my thoughts and prayers. I just wanted to let all know that in this time of sorrow, we need to stick together and take each day like it's our last because you never know what tomorrow will bring. I will also pray for these families affected by this great tragedy in this time of sorrow and hope they can move forward when it is appropriate for them. And to their children affected by this, I hope they know what their fathers have done to make this world a better place. Putting others before them and not wanting anything in return except a feeling of satisfaction at the end of the day. Take care to all, and deepest sympathies.
Submitted by: American Red Cross - Badger Chapter
05/19/2008
The Badger Chapter of the American Red Cross has recently launched a training program in compression-only CPR, a form of CPR that we know will save lives. Dr. Darren Bean was our advisor and our inspiration this endeavor. Dr. Bean was passionate in his conviction that compression-only CPR will save lives in instances of sudden cardiac arrest. He helped us design this innovative training program. He trained our Red Cross staff and volunteers and he cheerfully answered what seemed like a thousand questions, turning skeptics into believers. He was highly skilled, patient, kind and instilled great confidence in others. Dr. Bean was our favorite, indefatigable cheerleader! We will miss him deeply. Our area-wide training campaign will teach tens of thousand of local residents how to save lives through this simple form of compression-only CPR.
- Staff and friends
American Red Cross - Badger Chapter
Submitted by: Carrie Todhunter, patient
05/19/2008
Thank God for these unselfish people. My husband was a heart transplant recipient at UW Madison. Through the years we met and used some of the flight crew. My heart sunk when I returned from vacation and read of our loss. God Bless all of you at UW and the families of the victims. I remember when the nurses were having a rough time getting a needle in the correct spot to draw for blood gases, someone said, "If we cannot get it, we will go get the flight nurse. They are the best!" Yes, you are. Thanks.
Submitted by: Candice, colleague
05/18/2008
Respectfully to all, words cannot even come close to addressing this tragedy and the emptiness I feel. You all make a difference. My thoughts are with the Med Flight organization. We all know the risks. I have had one near-hit in my aeromedical career. I'm able to write about it and I feel miserable. It doesn't feel right, nor is it right. Gravity and terrain weren't fair to you this time. The unfairness is indescribable. Steve - I did not know you but Mark spoke of you, I know you made a difference. Darren - we've had the opportunity to talk EMS and work together at scene flights. You made a huge difference educating the public on resuscitation so they can help those in need. Mark - If I could have traded places with you so you would not have had to endure what you did, I would have done so without hesitation. I miss and love you, our bond is not broken. "Two feet up, two feet down...," well, you know, and, we'll get there...Wow. To Mark's siblings, especially Mignon, I will do my best to "defy gravity, cheat death, and stamp out ignorance and superstition." My thoughts are with you all, and thank you for your support and understanding.
- Candice
MedEvac and Beloit FD
Submitted by: Shana, colleague
05/18/2008
That Saturday night I was working in paging, internal communications for the hospital, when word got out Med Flight was not responding. I waited, hoping with all my heart that these brave, remarkable men were perhaps stuck somewhere but otherwise OK. In all my years here my heart has never been so heavy as when I discoved Dr. Bean, Steve, and Mark were no longer alive. My thoughts and prayers with all of us who have been missing them, and especially to their families and co-workers. All the good they have done will never be forgotten.
Submitted by: Tammy Olson, friend and UW Hospital colleague
05/18/2008
My deepest sympany to the families of the three men. I have been an RN here at the UW just over 10 years. I had both the honor and privilege of knowing Mark through my years here. I will always remember his smile and his humorous stories. The kind you just couldn't help busting out laughing even in the Peds ICU in the middle of the night. Mark told me once when I was working in the ED, "Sometimes you just got to find the humor in it, to keep going. After all, laughter is the best medicine for patients as well as staff." You will never be forgot in our hearts. God bless your families, they are in my thoughts and prayers.
Submitted by: Marie
05/17/2008
You're in my thoughts and prayers.
Submitted by: Collin Mc Allister, friend, student, patient and colleague
05/17/2008
I would like to offer my condolences to the family and staff of the UW team who lost their lives. I will especially miss a good friend in Mark. He was one of the best EMS instructors I ever had. He was also a good friend as when my wife was ill and in the UW Hospital. He stayed with me as she went through a very long procedure. Mark was always making the EMTs he taught better by pushing us to be the best we could be. Thank you, Mark. I would also like to thank both Steve and Dr. Bean for all of their work as well. I know that we would have less people alive today without all of yur work that you did.
- Collin Mc Allister
Retired EMT-I Tech (Lake Delton)
Submitted by: Traci Segar, RN, colleague
05/17/2008
To the family, friends and UW EMS community, I can not imagine your loss. As the wife of a flight paramedic and a ground transport nurse myself, this felt very close to home. These three men have saved many lives and are heroes to all of us.
- Traci Segar
MedLink Air Specialty Care Transport (LaCrosse)
Submitted by: Jennifer Brooks, former UW ER social worker
05/17/2008
Desiree, Sweet Steve loved you so much. The way he looked at you just said it all. Your friend always, Jennifer.
- Jennifer Brooks
Dallas
Submitted by: Jon Keevil, friend and colleague
05/17/2008
Darren, I am pleased to know that my children met you briefly. Simon was excited that you might show him the "aircraft" some day. Margo could tell immediately what a kind and caring person you were. They noticed you picked hot chocolate instead of coffee from the machine like they did. They were still talking about you on Sunday before we knew you were gone. We are heavy with grief, but being able to share with my kids how great you were, helps the pain a little. Thank you for everything. I miss you.
- Jon Keevil
UW Cardiology
Submitted by: Deb, RN
05/17/2008
Words cannot express how sorry I am for the loss of these three wonderful men. I have had the pleasure of working with them as a nurse at UW but also in the ERs of other facilities. I was amazed by all. Though Steve was not a medical professional, he helped with whatever needed to be done. He did his job proficiently and, may I add, quietly. Mark would come to the ICUs or call facilities to check on patients and always told a story and was willing to lend a hand where it was needed. My first encounter with Dr. Bean was in the UW ER at a trauma. He was so composed during a very stressful situation. Where other MDs would have the residents step aside, he used that opportunity to teach them in a very professional manner. He encouraged questions and discussion and never turned down an opportunity to teach. I was amazed at the dedication and compassion these three men had. They will be missed. My heartfelt condolences go out to the families, friends, and colleagues of these brave men. Though their stay on this earth was short, the legacy they have left will live on.
Submitted by: Kim, student, patient, friend and colleague
05/17/2008
It's been a great loss. I will miss you all, and the smiles you brought to me every time I saw your faces. You have brought joy to many people and had touch lives that you never know. Thanks for all you did. May God Bless you and take you home.
Submitted by: David Henning, friend and colleague
05/17/2008
I've been a paramedic for over 30 years. I have known Mark for over 20 of them. We both taught EMTs and paramedics in the state and I had the opportunity teach, sit on state commities and be a good friend with Mark. He will be missed throughout the state by the EMS community. The one thing that I see when I think about Mark is the big smile and positive being. He was a great guy and friend, I will miss him.
- David Henning
Gold Cross Ambulance
Submitted by: Jonathan Chun and Jeannie Yang, former colleagues
05/16/2008
I had the privilege of spending last year on the trauma/general surgery staff at UWHC while my wife finished her chief residency in general surgery. After meeting Darren, it was quickly obvious why my wife and so many others spoke so highly of him. Interacting with him throughout the year only reinforced that impression. We were devastated to hear of this tragedy. May God provide peace and comfort to all the families and friends of these three brave and dedicated men.
Submitted by: Lynda and Steve Siewert, MDs, colleagues
05/16/2008
Our most sincere sympathy to the families, friends and collegues of the Med Flight crew lost well before their time. We've both had the pleasure to work with Darren and Stacey through St. Mary's Hospital and understand the challenges of being a two-doctor family. Our hearts break for Stacey, Caitlyn and Parker but know that they'll "be OK" after last night's moving memorial. Stacey showed amazing grace and strength with her thoughtful tribute to Darren...he would certainly be proud. What a touching way to help us know Darren and Steve in ways that only you did. The community support, humbling experience of the funeral processional and personal memories shared by family and friends was an amazing way to celebrate the lives of these two men. We must strive to live each day to the fullest and dedicate ourselves to honoring their work and memory in our life's passion. "I'd rather give my life than be afraid to give it" - Lyndon Baines Johnson. May God bless your loved ones with comfort during the long journey to healing.
- Lynda and Steve Siewert
Wildwood Family Clinic
Submitted by: Julie Truitt, colleague
05/16/2008
I am so sorry for your loss. My thoughts and prayers are with you all.
- Julie Truitt
Meriter Hospital Operating Room
Submitted by: Ann Louise Tetreault, colleague
05/16/2008
Mark will be remembered for his many contributions at work and his never ending compassion and commitment to the community as a registered nurse and instructor. I remember Mark fondly having worked with him over his many years at UWHC. His engaging smile, dry wit, laidback nature and helpful mannerism with patients put them at ease and staff assured that he could handle the unexpected. SEIU Healthcare members recall his participation in the early years of United Professionals as an independent union. He was elected as a delegate to state conventions and was a member of the Board of Directors serving in the early administrative decisions of the union. Mark served on the 1199W/UP bargainging team representing the nurses and other health care professionals at UWHC leading to some on the benifits that we enjoy today. I will remember you for your passion for fun and adventure as a sailor, pilot and colleague. You are looking down upon us today concerned about us and how we are coping, humbled by our words of praise that describe you so well. Take care, Mark. We offer our prayers to your family and friends.
- Ann Louise Tetreault
SEIU Healthcare District 1199
Submitted by: Michelle, family member of patient
05/16/2008
I didn't know any of the men personally, but I had the opportunity to see Dr. Bean in action when he helped my mother in the ER last year. Not only was he a skilled physician, but he was a caring and compassionate human being. Such a tragic loss cannot be comprehended. My deepest sympathies go out to the families, friends, and colleagues of the Med Flight crew. May the love and support of those around you guide you through this difficult time.
Submitted by: Marilyn Leavitt (Trempealeau)
05/16/2008
My condolences to the family and friends of these fine men. My heart goes out to the families and will always be remembered.
- Marilyn Leavitt
Gundersen Lutheran
Submitted by: JoAnn Henrickson, friend
05/16/2008
My deepest sympathy on the loss of your courageous crew. It seems that even though all of them were so young, they had a big impact in their short time on earth. My thoughts and prayers are with all their families during this tragic time.
Submitted by: Jennifer Weiss, UWHC colleague
05/16/2008
As an Internal Medicine resident at the UW, I had the amazing opportunity to work with Darren. His enthusiasm for teaching, learning, and patient care was obvious from the moment you met him. Everyone who came in contact with him was blessed. I still find it hard to believe that this tragedy occurred. My thoughts and prayers are with the families and friends of all involved in this tragic event.
Submitted by: Sandy, colleague
05/16/2008
I am a nurse at UW and even though I did not know these three men, I have so much respect for the Med Flight program. I could not believe it when I heard the news on Sunday morning. I always love seeing Med Flight in the sky and think how proud I am to be a part of the UW. I would like to send my condolences to each of their families, friends and everyone who knew these three great men. God Bless you all.
Submitted by: Staff at Monroe Clinic
05/16/2008
Many of us in the Monroe Clinic and community at large have followed the story with great sadness. There is an added poignancy to the gratitude we all feel for the risks taken by the people of Med Flight as well as their families and colleagues to help with the safety of others in surrounding communities. Of the three people killed, the one who touched us most directly was Darren, who came down several times and spent much time with me and others, in person and on the telephone, in his efforts to upgrade our regional EMS capabilities. It was really special to get to know him as a great professional and human being.
- Staff at Monroe Clinic
Monroe, Wisconsin
Submitted by: David Hyslop
05/16/2008
My wife and I wish to extend our deepest condolences to familes of the Med Flight crew members and to the greater medical community in Madison and LaCrosse. We lost our oldest son Scott in the crash of CareFlight 4 near Durango in 2005 so we can empathize with the loss the families are feeling and the grief they are experiencing. There are several stiking similarities with the two crashes. Scott left a wife who is a doctor and a five-month son. The flight nurse on CF4 was also in his 50s and was loved by all. To all of the friends and colleagues of the crew, pleae continue the support of their families. They will be traveling a long road to recovery.
- David Hyslop
Denver, CO |
- .
- Dogs love them! Review by safergus
All my dogs love these. I think they are much healthier than the rawhide I used to give them b/c they are easier to digest. (Posted on 5/17/13)
- Awesome! Review by SuprDave62
Last, and the price is right! (Posted on 5/16/13)
- Great Product, Great Value Review by KyRebel58
Been buying bully sticks for years for my pack of smaller dogs, and these are the perfect size for them. Price is excellent, ordering was easy, and my order arrived quickly. Will definitely be back for more! Sending other bully sticks fans your direction too. (Posted on 5/15/13)
- Good deal but thinner than hoped for Review by Opie
A good treat for dogs but disappears faster than other brands because of the smaller diameter. Price is fair for the quantity you get. (Posted on 5/13/13)
- Excellent Review by Harris
My dog wakes me early for a bully stick treat. She loves them. (Posted on 5/11/13)
- FABULOUS Review by TJ
FAB products, FAB prices, fast and affordable shipping, and AWESOME service.
Will continue to be a loyal customer! (Posted on 5/10/13)
- Good quality, fast delivery, extremely small product Review by Jim
I wish I didn't have a black lab - these would be better for a chiwawa. Will try again! (Posted on 5/8/13)
- Bully sticks and puppy pads Review by Shelley
We are hobby breeders and have been ordering pads (and now bully sticks) from this company for quite some time. The delivery is always so timely and the products are very good (Posted on 5/6/13)
- Fast shipping but thinner than expected Review by Rachel
Good price and fast shipping. The sticks are a bit smaller/thinner that hoped. I will consider ordering a thicker bully next time. (Posted on 5/6/13)
- Great Review by Bonnie & Clyde
Great Product, Great Price, Great Service and Quick Shipping. (Posted on 5/5/13)
- GREAT FOR TEETHING PUPPY Review by Peekaboobers
Kernal Custer seems to enjoy chewing on these sticks even more than the True Chews sold at Petsmart for a much higher cost. Custer is almost 6 months old and these are great for his constant teething. He likes to "bury" the sticks around the house, too, so it's great I can buy in bulk. (Posted on 5/2/13)
- Love it! Review by SC
Our dog was introduced to these as a puppy to prevent destructive chewing on other things in the house or yard, and has loved them ever since. We tried the extra thick bully sticks which took days for him to finish or he would lose them in the yard, now we purchase the regular size for a medium size dog that works out great as a treat. He looks forward to these bully sticks each time. (Posted on 4/30/13)
- Love there treats Review by susan
My dogs love these treats they enjoy the lasting of the treats.They fight for the last one.They look forwards receiving there treats.I enjoy the free shipping. (Posted on 4/30/13)
- Good price but smaller than hoped Review by Max
Good price and shipping was fast. The sticks are a bit smaller that hoped. They disappear almost as fast as they were delivered.
Will probably consider ordering the larger diameter next time.
Max (Posted on 4/30/13)
- It's great for puppies Review by Pepper
My pups love them (Posted on 4/29/13)
- very thin Review by sass
I have purchased bully sticks from other sites and gotten MUCH thicker sticks. These are truly like a pencil....but apparently they still taste good! (Posted on 4/25/13)
- Fast shipping, great service Review by Julie
Good quality product and I love how quickly the package arrives. I plan on continuing to do my shopping for bully sticks here. (Posted on 4/20/13)
- Gotta love it! Review by Bernese Momma
As a breeder I have lots of puppies around. I love these little sticks for chewing. The puppies can get them in the back of their mouth for some good chewing action. They are the perfect size for puppies or small breeds. And as many as I go through buying in bulk is much more cost efficient, the pet stores charge 2-3 x's as much. For my adult dogs I purchase larger sizes. Having a natural product is important for the health of my dogs and rawhides can cause digestive blockages. This is a GREAT option! (Posted on 4/17/13)
- Great price for this product Review by HodgePodge
Great value for this! My dog is small so one of these lasts forever! She carries it around it her mouth for a while then settles down to work on one end. (Posted on 4/17/13)
- Bully Sticks rock! Review by SuprDave
Mu dogs love them, and they are healthier than rawhide... (Posted on 4/15/13)
- Loves 'em Review by Poppi
Poppi prefers the Medium bully sticks, but now that she's had some teeth pulled, she prefers the regular size. (Posted on 4/10/13)
- Great Review by catfish ray
The government could take note on how to run a business like yours. Very fast and free shipping and my dog likes her Bully sticks. (Posted on 3/29/13)
- excellent product Review by smitty
These bully sticks are fantastic! Our dog loves them. I just wish I had ordered the larger size as the ones we ordered are chewed and gone within minutes. (Posted on 3/9/13)
- excellent value! Review by somart
You have the best price I can find for bully sticks. They can be expensive but by buying 100 at a time I'm getting them for less than a dollar per stick and I get free shipping! (Posted on 3/7/13)
- Great snack Review by dora
Small but serves it purpose as a snack. (Posted on 3/2/13)
- good value Review by Amy
Got exactly what I ordered. I have large dogs who chew these up pretty quickly, but at least they don't inhale them. (Posted on 2/26/13)
- Excellent Review by Jo
My pup loves to chew. She enjoys this product and it keeps her out of trouble. (Posted on 2/25/13)
- Dogs love them, great size Review by LadyDoc
These Bully Sticks are on the thinner side, which is what we wanted (you have the option on this site of buying thicker sticks). Our two dogs adore them, and are used to getting one each after dinner--they come running whenever they hear the canister open. On the rare occasion when I give them a second one, I am not uncomfortable because of their thinner size, and the dogs clearly think they are having a lucky day. (Posted on 2/21/13)
- excellent price and service Review by Papa-don
I spent a couple of hours online searching for what I considered a good value in bully sticks. When comparing price, quantity, weight and delivery, I picked ValuePet Supplies and placed the order. To my, and my dog's delight, the delivery was on my door step in 2 days. I consider that outstanding. It means that when hey said it was in stock, it was. It also means that they got on it as soon as I placed the order. And the product was exactly as described in their online write up. (Posted on 2/19/13)
- My Dogs Love Your Bully Sticks! Review by Jetsetkennels
My Dogs love your bully sticks and the first time I bought them I was really pleased. I had been buying from a big Warehouse Chain and didn't like cutting them in half for my little dogs. Your 6" sticks were just as thick and the price was about the same but I didn't have to cut them in half! I did feel on my second order that the bully sticks were much thinner than the first time. Even the bag was smaller. I ordered the same thing both times. (Posted on 2/18/13)
- Not what we expected - too small and too soft. Review by Joe
Much smaller size for a "regular" than other brands. These would be no more than a small size elsewhere. The size and softness make for a stick that lasts only minutes not hours as most other regular size sticks. (Posted on 2/9/13)
- ValueBull sticks are fabulous and provide hours of fun!!! Review by Green Machine
Your company is the best and provides wonderful service! I have been purchasing the Bully Sticks for the past year and they are great. Thank you for selling such a wonderful product!!! (Posted on 2/9/13)
- bully sticks Review by Ron
they are not 3/4-1' in diameter as advertised. At least half were under 1/2". Unfair advertising. Costco...12 @ 23.99 3/4" - 1+". length...12 -14". Soooo, where is my savings per your advertisement? (Posted on 2/7/13)
- Good product but small Review by Angie
My dogs love these bully sticks they go crazy whenever I pull out the bag. I just wish they were a little bigger. About 20 out of the 100 were extremely small and light. I guess I will be trying the next size up next time. (Posted on 2/6/13)
- fantastic Review by dirtwolf
great product, my dogs love them, i'm happy that they are american made and the service was really great (Posted on 2/5/13)
- Great product. Review by heat
I have 4 Yorkies. They love these bones. Fast shipping. Will be reordering for sure. (Posted on 2/5/13)
- Goldens love! Review by Amers
Will and Grace,my 1 1/2 yr old Golden's immediately sat when I opened the package this time as they knew what was inside! They love these treats! Excellent price and great customer service. Thanks Value Pet! (Posted on 2/3/13)
- Pacifiers for furry babies! Review by TJ and Abby's mom
We have used bully sticks for years because we know that they are the safest for our babies. It's like happy hour for them at 5:00 because that's when they expect one! (Posted on 1/21/13)
- Love, love, love Review by EllieandEinie
First, a comment about your company: Fast, reliable service and I like the fact that it's family owned and not some big conglomerate that makes its food in China. As far as the bully sticks, they're like drugs for my dogs! NOTHING else in more than nine years have brought about such a reaction. I love watching them having so much joy especially because they're getting on in life. I want them to have as much joy as well. I just started but I'm hoping their teeth will benefit as well as others who wrote in. (Posted on 1/20/13)
- Good price and Happy Dog! Review by Misile
My Rhodesian/lab mix is 9 yrs old now. I used to buy the larger bully sticks and they did take longer to chew but I like the smaller ones for a quick treat and to help clean her teeth. She loves them! (Posted on 1/16/13)
- Fantastic Review by Daisiedoo
Our Silky Terrier snarfs these down. (Posted on 1/9/13)
- love these bones Review by italian1
MY GERMAN SHEPARD/MIX LOVES THESE BONES, SHE GETS ON EVERY NIGHT AND SHE GOES AT THEM, I WILL RECOMMEND YOUR COMPANY TO MY FRIENDS, THANK YOU (Posted on 1/9/13)
- My dogs love them. Review by Gerri
My pups really love them, the only problem is,they are not as hard as they should be, they can chew one in a matter of minutes. Would like for them to last longer. (Posted on 1/5/13)
- GREAT SERVICE Review by MR. BOGY
ONLY ONE THING I WOULD LIKE DIFFERENT IS IF THEY ALL WERE SAME SIZE. (Posted on 1/4/13)
- loves the bones Review by bella1
my german shepard mix just loves these bones, yes i would recomend these products, i will always re-oder these products thank you very much (Posted on 1/3/13)
- Dogs love it! Review by alibies1
Dogs love these things and they were here in no time. Cheapest prices i can find for these things also. (Posted on 12/22/12)
- Great Value! Review by Tara
I bought these for a dog rescue down in Alabama. They are loving them. You can't beat the price and Value Pet got them there quickly too! Thanks!!!! (Posted on 12/22/12)
- Not satisfied. Review by Camie
Product was good. Issue is that it should state exactly what size stick is good for the size of dog. 6 inch was great however the thickness of the sticks were horrible. I have a 70 pound dog and he eats them in seconds.
I would have exchanged them however the freight would have cost me, and I wouldn't have been ahead. I thought this was going to be a great thing and in fact it wasn't.
Thank you,
Camie Lopez (Posted on 12/12/12)
- excellenty Review by bobbie
The service was excellent. The on line system work wonderfully. I received an email with my order number and just clicking on it I received the status report. I did not have to remember it, then try and get the number right, etc. They had every detail well thought through. Excellent work, will be back with more orders. (Posted on 12/2/12)
- Great Review by Josh
The bullies are great! My dogs love them! They arrived about 2 days after ordering them; shipping is very fast, prices are good. (Posted on 7/30/12)
- My dog loves your bully sticks. Review by Bellzie
Your sticks are the best. Nice and thin for my Cairn Terrier. If she had her way, she'd eat several every night. (Posted on 3/2/12)
- My Dog Loves 'Em Review by Greg
I purchased 100 regular sized for my Boxer/Sharpei. He absolutely loves them and his teeth are looking whiter since. I give him two a day. Because he likes them so much, they don't last too long (about 5 mins each). When these are gone, I'm getting the thicker ones. (Posted on 2/28/12)
- No Puking! Review by Heavy
This is one of the only foods that my dog can keep down. (Posted on 1/25/12)
- cujo loves them Review by joanna
I have a container of them in top of my refrigerator and Cujo sits and looks up at them and then at me and then he looks back up at them until I give him one. (Posted on 1/8/12)
- My dog loves these. Review by linda
the new ones are not as hard and my small dog can eat one in about 5 minutes. the previous kind use to take her several days. she likes the funky odor and that's what makes it attractive to her. She doesn't like the odorless ones. I wish the new ones would last longer, they are more like treats now. (Posted on 11/26/11)
- Bullysticks Review by Ruth
I have a young Rhodesian ridge back, 9 months now.I give her two 6" Bullysticks a day,1 after each meal! Her teeth are awesome. Plan to show her, and teeth must be perfect. When they went on sale, 20% off I bought 200 more,even though I had approximately 60 left. Will continue to purchase!!! Customer service is superb! Not used to thiskind of sevice so much anymore,and I am grateful.Thanks for making them available! Ruth DeGroat (Posted on 4/8/11)
- Curly Pizzle Bully Sticks[...] Review by Zeke and Zoe
We use the Bully Sticks as a reward for good behaviors as positive reinforcement for our two Havenese puppies. Our pets love them! ValuePetSupplies sent them quickly and efficiently. Thank YOU! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- [...] Review by Brian
[...] I'd certainly do business again!Thanks,Brian (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Dog candy!! Review by The Grey hound House
We like to beable to give a treat that has food value, we have to watch the weight on our hounds, so it is part of there daily diet. They will demand them after dinner each night! I'ts like desert!! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Good shape - dog loves them! Review by Dog lover...
Buy in bulk - dog likes 'em cold in summer and warm in winter! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Review by Cornice1
My dog loves these bones. They last a while and clean her teeth well. The only bad part about these bones is they are stinky. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- great for keeping dogs quiet Review by Stacey the mom to both dogs
I love this product when my 2 dogs play too rough with each other. One is 6 pounds the other is 30 pounds.
It keeps them occupied for long periods of time.
They smell terrible when chewed, and they are hard for small dogs to chew. My small dog only likes it after the big dog has chewed on it for a while. GROSS!!!! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Yummy and long-lasting Review by CrazyDogLady
Good price, yummy treats. They leave no mess and have no odor, and they keep my 2 small dogs busy on rainy days. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Good price, varied sizes Review by M.
This is a good value for bully sticks, but they are very varied in size. Some are very thin and my 3.5 month old lab mix can go through them in less than ten minutes. Others are larger and can take from an hour to a day to chew. There is a slight choking hazard when the dog chews the bully stick down to a smallish size. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- bully sticks Review by Linda
These are the best for my little dog. It is a real treat for him which makes me happy. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great value Review by Sadie's Mom
This was a great value for my money [...]. My dog loves bully sticks but I keep them in an airtight baggie to contain the smell. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- She Absolutely Loves them Review by Nutritionunltd
My Maltese loves these. She receives them about once or twice a week. It keeps her occupied for short period of time. We cut them in half being that is too large for her to consume at one time. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- great deal & my dogs loved them Review by JMT
Great Deal good product (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Sticks Rock Review by MJDavis
These bully sticks are smelly to me but my dog loves them. The sticks will keep him occupied for quite a while. He seems to love them. The sticks give him chewing exercise, seem to digest easily, & cause so harmful side effects so far. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Can't Stop, Won't Stop! Review by Jazz's Mom
These are a great treat! My 10 week old Pitbull puppy enjoys these very much. She works them down diligently. Because she has little to no self control, I keep an eye out on her and take these away before they get to small b/c I am fear she will choke on it. When it gets a certain size, she pops the whole thing in her mouth, chews it down and starts gagging! So I only give these when we are around to ensure she is not going too hog wild. :) Other then that, I have been giving these to our family dogs for years. A great option for a teething puppy! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Wish I found this before! Review by Mack
Fantastic quality chew product! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Doggy crack! Review by scorp5
You must get past the smell of these bully sticks, but my dogs (& their doggy friends) go nuts over these! It is their fave treat! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- BULLY STICKS ALL NATURAL Review by Joe with WGS dogs
great for rainy days when my dogs have energy to burn. 2 or 3 sticks keep them occupied and burns off the nervous excess energy (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Best treat for your bully breed dog! Review by PitbullLvr
Best treat for your hard chewers. I have a working American Pitbull Terrier and there is no treat she goes wild for besides bull sticks. Best product ever! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- [...] Review by owner of cole the bully stick addict
prevents dog from chewing on furniture (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Yum, yum, yum Review by tomitoes
Clarabelle, my Cairn Terrier, loves your bully sticks. She gets one every few days. They keep her entertained for hours. Being a small dog, she doesn't eat the whole stick. It takes her a few days. After hiding it, she'll get back to it and finish it off. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Our Pomeranians love them... Review by Jen
These bully sticks are great, and keeps our pups busy in the evening all night. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Excellent Service Review by Tiger's Mum
A good healthy treat for dogs. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- smelly bully sticks Review by Stacey the Therapy Dog Owner
I love this product. I just didn't think that the smell would be so powerful. If it was a good smell it wouldn't be so bad, but it's awful! I WILL buy again, but next time I will buy the low odor or no odor kind. I also have 2 dogs of very different sizes. I need to get fatter ones for my larger breed dog. He can chew these smaller ones up in a few minutes. However, overall I really do love them for my dogs. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Three Dogs Go Nuts Over Bully Sticks! Review by Mike Duffy
My Pit Bull and Chocolate Lab get one 6" Xtra Thick stick as a reward for our walk in the woods. Trust me, it is one of the highlights of their day! The absolute best treat I have ever given a dog. Despite the slight odor of the sticks, I recommend them because their smell is part of the canine "ambiance" and bully stick experience. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Love the product Review by D
My dog absolutely loves Bully Sticks, but the last order that I got (50) were much thinner than the ones that I previously got. Is there a way that I can order by thickness rather than quantity? These only last one day while the others lasted about three (3). I have a Yorkshire Terrier, so it's not like she can devour them like a much larger dog would in one day. Thanks for your help. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dog is too picky Review by julie
I started looking for bullies online after our local store changed brands (and increased the price). The bullies we got from VPS were a great deal...but my dog is not as excited about them:( No fault of the website. That's just my dog's way of thanking me for spending almost $50 on treats:/ (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Excellent Product Review by Yorkie Mom
We give our dog these and she loves to chew on them. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- A Package of 50 6" Bully Sticks Review by SlimJim
I board dogs of all sizes. I like to have a variety of treats and chews on hand to offer my charges. Bully sticks are enjoyed by many of them. These bully sticks appeared to be fresh. [...] (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great Product Review by Shi-Poo
Great Product Our Shi-Poo Loves them Great Value (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Always good quality! Review by Candice
I have two dogs that are around 40 pounds and one dog that is 6 pounds and all three eat the same sticks. They last my little dog for a whole day, the other two finish theirs in an hour or so. They are great for clean teeth and for a big reward. They are the cheapest here out of any place on the internet I've looked.[...]I've ordered them at least 4 times and will continue to do so! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My Dogs LOVE THESE STICKS Review by Deb
Dog's are crazy for them and they last a long time. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- [...] Review by Lil M
My dog loves the chew sticks. His teeth have gone from an unhealthy yellow to sparkly white. The plaque is gone and he now has a great smile! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- We chew on them daily! Review by The ankle-biters
We chihuahuas were eaten the base boards off our owners home until they bought us these chews. The only problem is we go through this size too fast and we are very small chihuahuas. They will have to order the next size up next time or there will be consequences! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs love these things! Review by LuAnne C
My dogs go crazy when they hear me open the bully sticks bag. They just love these sticks and I feel good about giving them to my dogs because they're just beef. There are none of those unhealthy artificial flavors and bi-products that are found in other treats. Great product! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great Product! My dogs love it. Review by Owner of 3 Bostons
I have 3 dogs. Two small and one medium size. I give the medium size dog a 6" bully stick and split one for the two smaller dogs. They get one before breakfast every morning and they go crazy until they get it. They really enjoy this product. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great stuff Review by teach
Dog sits by the cupboard every morning in anticipation. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great treat! Time consuming Review by Koa's Mom
My dog loves the taste. It keeps her occupied for at least half an hour or longer. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- The dogs love them. Review by Bully sticks
I give them to my dogs when I'm going to be gone for a while to keep them busy. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Find out what all the Bark is about Review by Eric The Red
I have two dachshunds who love to chew. When we watch TV at night sometimes they are a little wound up. Once we give them the their bully sticks they calm down and their tails don't stop wagging. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- KEEPING THE DOGS HAPPY Review by Linda
The bully sticks were recommended to me and I love them. They keep the puppies from chewing everything else. The older dogs love them also. They digest so much better and less choking hazzard than so many other dog chew items. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- This product saves my evenings! Review by Bandit's Mom
I like the product...and the service is exceptional. I made a mistake, and ordered twice, but the problem was easily remedied.
Thanks~ (Posted on 3/10/11)
- EVEN MY TOOTHLESS DOG LOVES THEM! Review by Grace the Ebay Lady
I use the sticks everyday for my 1 year old dog Trinket. She still chews odds and ends and this keeps her focused on the good things to chew. She loves them. Valerie my 5 year old is toothless but still likes to gum the things. She even steals Trinkets. Thinks it great fun! One a day for each is a perfect end to a perfect day. Keeps everyone busy without me having to pay attention to them. I get my own time to myself and get to watch them enjoy! A bit on the smelly side but everything in life can get a bit stinky. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs love them Review by Kathy Bunny
Buying them from value pets saves me a ton of money and time. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great Product for Dogs Review by Jeff
My vet thinks rawhides are bad for dogs and can cause stomach and intestinal problems. These are a great alternative and my dog ALWAYS looks forward to getting one as a treat. The only way they could be better would be to be longer lasting. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- NO BONES ABOUT THEM Review by GREAT WAVE INVESTIGATION CO.- ADJUSTERS
THESE BULLY BONES WERE A GOOD SUBSTITUTE FOR THE 12' ONES WE USED TO BUY, AS 'GIBSON' DOESN'T CARE HOW BIG THEY ARE, JUST THAT HE GETS ONE AFTER BREAKFAST EACH MORNING. THE THICKNESS ON SOME OF THEM WAS SOMEWAHT THIN, BUT HE MADE IT THROUGH THE DAY, AND SAVED THE LITTLE ENDS FOR THE NIGHT TREAT (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs love 'em! Review by Berner Mom
Since my dogs like to take everything chewable into the backyard, the bully sticks are the perfect everyday treat, since the dogs love them and they are quickly eaten, leaving no mess behind. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs LOVE these! Review by Debbie
My dogs fight over them! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Best treats my dogs have ever had Review by Summer
These are by far my dogs favorite treats, and my dogs teeth have never looked better since snacking on bully sticks. Other people have even remarked to me how great my two dog's teeth looked. Although slightly expensive as far as dog treats go (because my lab can eat one in a minute and I tend to give her a few a day), I think they are definitely worth the money. I have recommended them to every dog owner I know. And even though slightly expensive, I have similar items in different stores and ValuePetSupplies.com definitely has the best price by far. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- I would buy this product again and again Review by Lanmowerman
These are a little Pricey but the enjoyment my dog gets and quality of the product make it worth it. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- These are all that I give to my dogs!! Review by Home alone with dogs
My dog chews all other bones in no time, even though they say "last for hours. But these seem to last longer than others I have tried. The smell can sometimes be bad but for the cost difference between these and the low odor, I'll deal with it. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- great Review by cb
puppy gets them as special treats and loves them.
they seem to be more easily digested than other brands (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Beagle for Bullys Review by Indy's Father
Indy, my Beagle mix, goes absolutely crazy when he senses I'm getting one of these out of his 'secret' closet. He just loves them - it's like catnips for dogs. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Sticks Too Thin for Big Dogs Review by Shepherd Lover
We have two shepherds that LOVE bully sticks, but these were just too thin and the dogs would finish them so fast. If you have bigger dogs and you want them to have a longer lasting chew, then these are not the ones to get but rather get the thicker ones that are available. Spending upwards of $75 and have these bully sticks last a short time is not worth it. These would be perfect for a dog with smaller teeth. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great product for chewing! Review by J.O. Tran
Our two dogs love these chewy treats. We have a 50lb dog and a 20lb dog, both adults and they chew on these for about 30-60 mins. Sometimes they last a day or two. These do not smell as bad as some similar products and this is a great price! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great treat Review by Anny
I have 3 dogs and they love the bully sticks. They get it as an evening snack 4 to 5 times each week. The only thing is that they smell a little but it doesn't bother me much. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Sticks Review by Jan
My Shiloh Shepherd loves Bully Sticks. I use them as a treat, just because she's wonderful and I like to give them to her. Thank you Value Pets for offering this size box, otherwise I'd be running to the store every other day, and spending a fortune. It's only because of Value Pets that I can give my dog these treats so often. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Stick Review by Coldfeet49
Frequent treat that is always desired. A bit thin, but considering the competition, still very competitive. Not as smelly as others. Great value. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- product is exactly how it was advertized Review by honey bunny
[...] my dog is so happy with bully sticks! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- who knew that buying bulk saves $$$$ Review by Sit boo boo
My dog loves bully sticks. It takes my 20 pound dog a couple days to devour one of these sticks, on the other hand, give one to my neighbor's dog (a golden retriever) and it's consumed in minutes. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Excellent All Natural Healthy Treat Review by Chris Bruin
My dog loves them - I give him one after his walk every night and now he knows to run to the cabinet and wait when we get home....like the all natural nature of the treat too (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Stick Quality - Disappointing Review by Melissa
I have ordered approximately 100 bully sticks every other month now for the past 2 years or so. This last shipment I received were probably 1/2 the weight of the previous orders. It is very disappointing to see the quality deteriorate. Perhaps bully sticks should be sold by the pound and not by the number. If the next order I place is an inferior product, I will have to locate a different source for my pets bully sticks.
Thank you. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great product Review by Ryan
I've been using this product for my 10 year old yellow lab and my 1 year old Shih Tzu & Maltese mix and they both love them. I love having an alternative to rawhide. [...] (Posted on 3/10/11)
- skinny sticks, but still a good deal Review by Chad
I give these to my 4 year old puggle daily. Bully sticks are like a treat to him, but he only sometimes likes rawhides. These bully sticks are the best value I've seen. That said, the quality is slightly less. Some have good thickness, but a lot of them were pretty skinny. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs love them and will buy again I Review by CAT AND DOG LOVER
MY DOGS LOVE CHEWING THEM BUT THAT DIDNT LAST AS LONG ON CHEWING AS THE OTHER ONES DID BEFORE (Posted on 3/10/11)
- great Review by Frankie
my dog loves these and they keep him busy for a while. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Bully Sticks Review by Jan
My Shiloh Shepherd loves these, and you can't beat the price. Yes, they're thinner than the ones you'll buy at a store, but the price makes the difference. Also, because they are thinner, and less expensive, I give them more frequently. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Good daily treat Review by Pandra
When I eat dinner (about two hours after I feed my dog), I give her one of these. She can finish one off in about the time it takes me to eat, so there's kind of a sense of sharing supper without doing anything disgusting or bad-habit-forming, like feeding her from the table. She loves it, and it keeps her teeth clean. A daily bully stick is a little pricey, but these are the best quality/price I've found. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Excellent Product Review by Adopt a Shelter Animal - Save a Life
I gave these to my two dogs as a Christmas gift because the price was soooooo good and they absolutely love them!!! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great Value Review by DC Wisconsin
Wonderful product, great pricing, easy ordering [...]...could not ask for more! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dogs love these things! Review by Holleybery
I usually order the thick bully sticks - these don't last as long - but the product itself is great. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- the stinkier the better Review by Steve
She likes to get at least 1 a day, She'll bring me an older, unfinished one for a new smelly one (Posted on 3/10/11)
- I would buy this product over & over! Review by Shawna
I treat my dogs every evening with a bully stick. They know where each of their spots are before they get their treat. They love them! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- LOVE EM!!! Review by the massage lady
my 2 small dogs live for their bully bones.....they only get them on wednesday and sunday since they are so high in protein, but they seem to know what day it is and pester me after dinner on both days until they get them! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Just the best! Review by Nancy
My dogs, 2 golden retrievers and a toy poodle would chew these all day long. Due to their cost, I am forced to limit them to one per dog per day. I use them when I leave the house to occupy them while I am gone. These are spectacular chews for all sizes of dogs. Even my daughter's 7 year old mini poodle likes them! When you socialize with others who have dogs, it's great to bring one as a hostess gift for the house dogs! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Not great- but cheap enough Review by Pegas
Most of these are very thin bully sticks- thus the price. However, I have four dogs who wait for these each night after they take their walks and they have not complained so far. If I had to give each one a more expensive bully they would not get them so often and they really look forward to them before bed. Besides, I don't let them shop for themselves and they have not seen the larger bullies in a long time- so I don't think they notice. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My dog just loves the bully sticks. Review by joanne's desire
8 P.M. is treat time for my shihtzu. She reminds me to give her the bully stick. Product is very good. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Totally Enjoyed by all................. Review by Di
Enjoyed by all three dogs, three breeds, three sizes! First time buying bully sticks - the all seem to enjoy them. Keeps them quiet for a time. The big dog (Mixed breed 80 lbs)goes through them quickly, but he goes through EVERYTHING quickly. Will buy again! Change in pace from the pig ears (that they also LOVE!). (Posted on 3/10/11)
- a quality product Review by my3dogs
i have 3 labs of various ages and they all love them. yes they are smelly but that is a plus for them. they can eat them inside without staining the carpets. they each get one in the morning and after their dinner. i found these at a local store for the same price but the quality has been decreasing rapidly. that is why i went looking for another source and am very pleased with the quality of these. i just placed my second order. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Kind of wimpy Review by BichonMom
These bully sticks are as thin as pencils, and pretty skimpy on the filling. I was hoping for a long lasting chew for my dogs. My little bichons can finish these in a matter of minutes. I probably won't buy this brand again. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- My puppy thinks these are great!! Review by Tiger Lady
My puppy enjoys chewing these sticks every day and carts them around the house. I personally don't feel the need to have myself a chew of them, but she sits content for a long time with one chewing while I read a book. The cats appreciate the chewys to keep her busy from barking at them. :-) (Posted on 3/10/11)
- I will be back for more Review by 76657
Our dog shadow just loves these bully sticks, he wait's by the front door [...] and can hardly wait for us to get the box open and give him his treat. When he gets his treat he will spend hours chewing on it. We give him a stick about every other day or so.They is no smell to these at all unlike other brands we have bought,we have had to keep them out in the garage because they smelled so bad. We have even shared some with my sister in-law and her daughter and both of there dogs just love them. You can't go wrong getting these because there is no smell and leave no marks on the carpet. To us these are the perfect treat for your dog and at a great price. Check around, in some cases I found that their price was half of what other places wanted. I promise your dog will love them, as you will love the no mess to pick up.Richard (Posted on 3/10/11)
- MY DOG DEMANDS THEM Review by GIZMO THE MIGHT
MY DOG BEGS FOR THESE AT NIGHT, IF I DON'T GIVE HIM ONE HE STICKS HIS BUTT IN THE AIR AND BARKS (I THINK IT'S KISS THIS) (Posted on 3/10/11)
- As thin as swizzle sticks!!! Review by Tucker
These Bully Sticks looked much thicker on the website. They are thinner than a soft drink straw. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- ValueBull 100 ct Review by belyflyr
I'm assuming that it's tasty as my dogs beg for them. Great treat to give them just before I have to walk out the door for work. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Beef Pizzels Review by UBU 001
Not as thick as some, therefore the dogs don't get to floss their teeth as well. They snap and break them too easily and don't get the stringing going on. They only last a day. Others that are thicker, last up to 4-5 days. I still think they are good value for your money. L. (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Great price and size bullysticks Review by PlanetJanet
My two westies have been eating these sticks for years. Other than one of them swallowing a small chunk at the end and pooping it out, they have never had any issues with them. My husband is worried that the small piece might get stuck inside but it hasn't happened in 10 years. It's hard to find things that are safe that these little westies can chew on for a while. So I'm not ready to give up! This company offers great price on these sticks [...]. Will continue to buy from them! (Posted on 3/10/11)
- Just The Usual .. FANTASTIC!!!!! Review by Casper
Every evening at 8PM, my maltese, Casper, runs to his chair and waits for his beloved bully stick!... He is a little over two years old and he has been enjoying these wonderful treats since he was six months old. He likes the taste and the long chew and I like the fact that they are healthy,digestible and help clean his teeth! Thank you ValuePet for a great product,your reliability [...] (Posted on 3/10/11) |
Ledgerwood J, et al.A West Nile Virus DNA Vaccine Utilizing a Modified Promoter Induces Neutralizing Antibody in Younger and Older Healthy Adults in a Phase I Clinical Trial. J Infect Dis 2011 203 1396-404.
Chowdhery R, Gonzalez R. Immunologic therapy targeting metastatic melanoma: Allovectin-7®. Immunotherapy 2011 3 17-21.
Sullivan S et al. Vaxfectin: a versatile adjuvant for plasmid DNA- and protein-based vaccines. Expert Opin Drug Del 2010 7 1433-1446.
Bedikian AY et al. A phase 2 study of high-dose Allovectin-7 in patients with advanced metastatic melanoma. Melanoma Res 2010 20 218-226.
Sed.
Smith LR et al. Phase 1 clinical trials of the safety and immunogenicity of adjuvanted plasmid DNA vaccines encoding influenza A virus H5 hemagglutinin. Vaccine 2010; 28 2565-2572.
Soares HP, Lutzky J; Velimogene aliplasmid. Exp Opin Biol Ther 2010; 10 841-851.
Hartikka J et al. Vaxfectin®, a cationic lipid-based adjuvant for protein-based influenza vaccines. Vaccine 2009; 27 6399-6403.
Moss RB. Prospects for control of emerging infectious diseases with plasmid DNA vaccines. J Imm Based Ther Vacc 2009; 7 3.
Muller WJ et al. Herpes simplex virus type 2 tegument proteins contain subdominant T-cell epitopes detectable in BALB/c mice after DNA immunization and infection. J Gen Virol 2009; 90 1153-1163.
Schleiss M. VCL-CB01, an injectable bivalent plasmid DNA vaccine for potential protection against CMV disease and infection. Curr Opin Mol Ther 2009; 11 572-578.
Shlapobersky M et al. Vaxfectin®-adjuvanted seasonal influenza protein vaccine: correlation of systemic and local immunological markers with formulation parameters. Vaccine 2009; 27 6404-6410.
Vilalta A et al. Analysis of biomarkers after intramuscular injection of Vaxfectin®-formulated hCMV gB plasmid DNA. Vaccine 2009; 27 7409-7417.
Ye M et al. Rapid development of a Vaxfectin®-adjuvanted DNA vaccine encoding pandemic swine-origin influenza A virus (H1N1) hemagglutinin. Gene Ther Reg 2009; 4 45-55.
Bedikian AY, Del Vecchio M. Allovectin-7 therapy in metastatic melanoma. Exp Opin Biol Ther 2008; 8 839-844.
Dery M, Bausch DG. A DNA vaccine for the prevention of Ebola virus infection. Curr Opin Mol Ther 2008; 10 285-293.
Go V, Pollard RB. A Cytomegalovirus Vaccine for Transplantation: Are We Closer? J Infect Dis 2008; 197 1631-3.
Hartikka J et al. Physical characterization and in vivo evaluation of poloxamer-based DNA vaccine formulations. J Gene Med 2008; 10 770-782.
Horton H, Lalor P, Rolland A. IL-2 plasmid electroporation: from preclinical studies to phase I clinical trial. Methods Mol Biol 2008; 423 361-372.
Lalor PA et al. Plasmid DNA-Based Vaccines Protect Mice and Ferrets against Lethal Challenge with A/Vietnam/1203/04 (H5N1) Influenza Virus. J Infect Dis 2008; 197 1643-52.
Mahajan R et al. A TaqMan® Reverse Transcription Polymerase Chain Reaction (RT-PCR) In Vitro Potency Assay for Plasmid-based Vaccine Products. Mol Biotechnol 2008; 40 47-57.
Martin JE et al. A SARS DNA vaccine induces neutralizing antibody and cellular immune responses in healthy adults in a Phase I clinical trial. Vaccine 2008; 26 6338-6343.
Pan CH et al. Use of Vaxfectin adjuvant with DNA vaccine encoding the measles virus hemagglutinin and fusion proteins protects juvenile and infant rhesus macaques against measles virus. Clin Vaccine Immunol 2008; 15 1214-1221.
Wloch MK et al. Safety and Immunogenicity of a Bivalent Cytomegalovirus DNA Vaccine in Healthy Adult Subjects. J Infect Dis 2008; 197 1634-42.
Abai AM et al. Novel microneutralization assay for HCMV using automated data collection and analysis. J Immunol Methods 2007; 322 82-93.
Jiang G et al. Induction of multi-antigen multi-stage immune responses against Plasmodium falciparum in rhesus monkeys, in the absence of antigen interference, with heterologous DNA prime/poxvirus boost immunization. Malar J 2007; 6 135.
Jimenez GS et al. Vaxfectin™-formulated influenza DNA vaccines encoding NP and M2 viral proteins protect mice against lethal viral challenge. Hum Vaccin 2007; 3 157-164.
Kaslow DC. Biological feasibility of developing prophylactic vaccines for viral pathogens: incubation period as a critical parameter. Hum Vaccin 2007; 3 1-7.
Martin JE et al. A West Nile Virus DNA Vaccine Induces Neutralizing Antibody in Healthy Adults during a Phase 1 Clinical Trial. J Infect Dis 2007; 196 1732-1740.
Sandbulte MR et al. Cross-reactive neuraminidase antibodies afford partial protection against H5N1 in mice and are present in unexposed humans. PLoS Med 2007; 4 e59.
Selinsky C et al. Qualification and performance characteristics of a quantitative enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay for human IgG antibodies to anthrax lethal factor antigen. Biologicals 2007; 35 123-129.
Tompkins SM et al. Matrix protein 2 vaccination and protection against influenza viruses, including subtype H5N1. Emerg Infect Dis 2007; 13 426-435.
Vilalta A et al. Vaccination with polymerase chain reaction-generated linear expression cassettes protects mice against lethal influenza A challenge. Hum Gene Ther 2007; 18 763-771.
Dunachie SJ 2006; 74 5933-5942.
Gonzalez R et al. Phase 2 trial of Allovectin-7 in advanced metastatic melanoma. Melanoma Res 2006; 16 521-526.
Hahn UK, Aichler M, Boehm R, Beyer W. Comparison of the immunological memory after DNA vaccination and protein vaccination against anthrax in sheep. Vaccine 2006; 24 4595-4597.
Leamy VL et al. Comparison of rabbit and mouse models for persistence analysis of plasmid-based vaccines. Hum Vaccin 2006; 2 113-118.
Margalith M, Vilalta A. Sustained protective rabies neutralizing antibody titers after administration of cationic lipid-formulated pDNA vaccine. Genet Vaccines Ther 2006; 4 2.
Minke JM et al. Use of DNA and recombinant canarypox viral (ALVAC) vectors for equine herpes virus vaccination. Vet Immunol Immunopathol 2006; 111 47-57.
Rolland A. Nuclear gene delivery: the Trojan horse approach. Expert Opin Drug Deliv 2006; 3 1-10.
Romano M et.
Sedegah M et al. Vaxfectin enhances immunogenicity and protective efficacy of P. yoelii circumsporozoite DNA vaccines. Vaccine 2006; 24 1921-1927.
Hirsch-Lerner D et al. Effect of "helper lipid" on lipoplex electrostatics. Biochim Biophys Acta 2005; 1714 71-84.
Rolland A. Gene medicines: the end of the beginning? Adv Drug Deliv Rev 2005; 57 669-673.
Selinsky C et al. A DNA-based vaccine for the prevention of human cytomegalovirus-associated diseases. Hum Vaccin 2005; 1 16-23.
Vilalta A et al. I. Poloxamer-formulated plasmid DNA-based human cytomegalovirus vaccine: evaluation of plasmid DNA biodistribution/persistence and integration. Hum Gene Ther 2005; 16 1143-1150.
Vilalta A et al. II. Cationic lipid-formulated plasmid DNA-based Bacillus anthracis vaccine: evaluation of plasmid DNA persistence and integration potential. Hum Gene Ther 2005; 16 1151-1156.
Yanagie H, Eriguchi M. [Gene therapy for liver metastasis of colon cancer]. Nippon Rinsho 2005; 63 Suppl 12 537-543.
Arpicco S et al. Synthesis, characterization and transfection activity of new saturated and unsaturated cationic lipids. Farmaco 2004; 59 869-878.
Evans TG et al. Long-term memory B-cell responses in recipients of candidate human immunodeficiency virus type 1 vaccines. Vaccine 2004; 22 2626-2630.
Ferrari ME, Hermanson G, Rolland A. Development of anthrax DNA vaccines. Curr Opin Mol Ther 2004; 6 506-512.
Galanis E et al. Intratumoral administration of a 1,2-dimyristyloxypropyl-3-dimethylhydroxyethyl ammonium bromide/dioleoylphosphatidylethanolamine formulation of the human interleukin-2 gene in the treatment of metastatic renal cell carcinoma. Cancer 2004; 101 2557-2566.
Geall AJ et al. Targeting malaria with polyamines. Bioconjug Chem 2004; 15 1161-1165.
Hermanson G et al. A cationic lipid-formulated plasmid DNA vaccine confers sustained antibody-mediated protection against aerosolized anthrax spores. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 2004; 101 13601-13606.
Kaslow DC. A potential disruptive technology in vaccine development: gene-based vaccines and their application to infectious diseases. Trans R Soc Trop Med Hyg 2004; 98 593-601.
Li J et al. The immunoregulation of mice by somatic transgenic expression of porcine interleukin-6 gene and CpG sequence. Vet Res Commun 2004; 28 33-46.
Li X et al. [Modulation of immune response to Plasmodium falciparum apical membrane antigen 1 DNA vaccine by cytokine plasmids]. Zhongguo Ji Sheng Chong Xue Yu Ji Sheng Chong Bing Za Zhi 2004; 22 136-138.
Locher CP, Witt SA, Ashlock BM, Levy JA. Evaluation of genetic immunization adjuvants to improve the effectiveness of a human immunodeficiency virus type 2 (HIV-2) envelope DNA vaccine. DNA Cell Biol 2004; 23 107-110.
Bergen M, Chen R, Gonzalez R. Efficacy and safety of HLA-B7/beta-2 microglobulin plasmid DNA/lipid complex (Allovectin-7®) in patients with metastatic melanoma. Expert Opin Biol Ther 2003; 3 377-384.
Coker C, Majid M, Radulovic S. Development of Rickettsia prowazekii DNA vaccine: cloning strategies. Ann N Y Acad Sci 2003; 990 757-764.
Dai B et al. [Analysis of CpG motifs in endoflagellar gene (flaB2) and expression vector (VR1012) of leptospiral DNA vaccine]. Sichuan Da Xue Xue Bao Yi Xue Ban 2003; 34 1-4.
Dumonteil E, Maria Jesus RS, Javier EO, Maria del Rosario GM. DNA vaccines induce partial protection against Leishmania mexicana. Vaccine 2003; 21 2161-2168.
Fischer L et al. Rabies DNA vaccine in the horse: strategies to improve serological responses. Vaccine 2003; 21 4593-4596.
Fischer L et al. Vaccination of puppies with a lipid-formulated plasmid vaccine protects against a severe canine distemper virus challenge. Vaccine 2003; 21 1099-1102. 171-178.
Hellum M et al. Photochemically enhanced gene delivery with cationic lipid formulations. Photochem Photobiol Sci 2003; 2 407-411.
Nukuzuma C, Ajiro N, Wheeler CJ, Konishi E. Enhancing effect of Vaxfectin on the ability of a Japanese encephalitis DNA vaccine to induce neutralizing antibody in mice. Viral Immunol 2003; 16 183-189.
Rainczuk A, Scorza T, Smooker PM, Spithill TW. Induction of specific T-cell responses, opsonizing antibodies, and protection against Plasmodium chabaudi adami infection in mice vaccinated with genomic expression libraries expressed in targeted and secretory DNA vectors. Infect Immun 2003; 71 4506-4515.
Rainczuk A et al. The protective efficacy of MSP4/5 against lethal Plasmodium chabaudi adami challenge is dependent on the type of DNA vaccine vector and vaccination protocol. Vaccine 2003; 21 3030-3042.
Rath A et al. Characterization of immune response in mice to plasmid DNA encoding dog zona pellucida glycoprotein-3. Vaccine 2003; 21 1913-1923.
D'Souza S et al. Improved tuberculosis DNA vaccines by formulation in cationic lipids. Infect Immun 2002; 70 3681-3688.
Ferrari ME, Rusalov D, Enas J, Wheeler CJ. Synergy between cationic lipid and co-lipid determines the macroscopic structure and transfection activity of lipoplexes. Nucleic Acids Res 2002; 30 1808-1816.
Galanis E. Technology evaluation: Allovectin-7, Vical. Curr Opin Mol Ther 2002; 4 80-87.
Gaucheron J, Santaella C, Vierling P. Transfection with fluorinated lipoplexes based on fluorinated analogues of DOTMA, DMRIE and DPPES. Biochim Biophys Acta 2002; 1564 349-358.
Hogset A et al. Photochemical transfection: a technology for efficient light-directed gene delivery. Somat Cell Mol Genet 2002; 27 97-113.
Hong YS et al. Localized immunosuppression in the cardiac allograft induced by a new liposome-mediated IL-10 gene therapy. J Heart Lung Transplant 2002; 21 1188-1200.
Kaslow DC. Transmission-blocking vaccines. Chem Immunol 2002; 80 287-307.
Ota T, Maeda M, Tatsuka M. Cationic liposomes with plasmid DNA influence cancer metastatic capability. Anticancer Res 2002; 22 4049-4052.
Prasmickaite L, Hogset A, Berg K. The role of the cell cycle on the efficiency of photochemical gene transfection. Biochim Biophys Acta 2002; 1570 210-218.
Rath A et al. Antibodies generated in response to plasmid DNA encoding zona pellucida glycoprotein-B inhibit in vitro human sperm-egg binding. Mol Reprod Dev 2002; 62 525-533.
Sankar V et al. Salivary gland delivery of pDNA-cationic lipoplexes elicits systemic immune responses. Oral Dis 2002; 8 275-281.
Seki M, Iwakawa J, Cheng H, Cheng PW. p53 and PTEN/MMAC1/TEP1 gene therapy of human prostate PC-3 carcinoma xenograft, using transferrin-facilitated lipofection gene delivery strategy. Hum Gene Ther 2002; 13 761-773.
Singh G, Parker S, Hobart P. The development of a bicistronic plasmid DNA vaccine for B-cell lymphoma. Vaccine 2002; 20 1400-1411.
Timmerman JM et al. Immunogenicity of a plasmid DNA vaccine encoding chimeric idiotype in patients with B-cell lymphoma. Cancer Res 2002; 62 5845-5852.
Uchida E, Mizuguchi H, Ishii-Watabe A, Hayakawa T. Comparison of the efficiency and safety of non-viral vector-mediated gene transfer into a wide range of human cells. Biol Pharm Bull 2002; 25 891-897.
Vellon L et al. Enhanced uptake of antisense oligonucleotides using cationic liposomes and the apoptotic effect of idarubicin in K-562 cell line. Leuk Res 2002; 26 669-676.
Vilalta A, Whitlow V, Martin T. Real-time PCR determination of Escherichia coli genomic DNA contamination in plasmid preparations. Anal Biochem 2002; 301 151-153.
Zhang T, Tsang TC, Harris DT. Comparison of cis and trans tat gene expression in HIV LTR-based amplifier vectors. Biotechniques 2002; 33 1146-1151.
Baccaglini L et al. Cationic liposome-mediated gene transfer to rat salivary epithelial cells in vitro and in vivo. J Gene Med 2001; 3 82-90.
Belldegrun A et al. Interleukin 2 gene therapy for prostate cancer: phase I clinical trial and basic biology. Hum Gene Ther 2001; 12 883-892.
Daniels GA, Galanis E. Immunotherapy of renal cell carcinoma by intratumoral administration of an IL-2 cDNA/DMRIE/DOPE lipid complex. Curr Opin Mol Ther 2001; 3 70-76.
Ferrari ME, Rusalov D, Enas J, Wheeler CJ. Trends in lipoplex physical properties dependent on cationic lipid structure, vehicle and complexation procedure do not correlate with biological activity. Nucleic Acids Res 2001; 29 1539-1548.
Fleeton MN et al. Self-replicative RNA vaccines elicit protection against influenza A virus, respiratory syncytial virus, and a tickborne encephalitis virus. J Infect Dis 2001; 183 1395-1398.
Gebhart CL, Kabanov AV. Evaluation of polyplexes as gene transfer agents. J Control Release 2001; 73 401-416.
Gleich LL et al. Clinical experience with HLA-B7 plasmid DNA/lipid complex in advanced squamous cell carcinoma of the head and neck. Arch Otolaryngol Head Neck Surg 2001; 127 775-779.
Hartikka J et al. Electroporation-facilitated delivery of plasmid DNA in skeletal muscle: plasmid dependence of muscle damage and effect of poloxamer 188. Mol Ther 2001; 4 407-415.
Hartikka J et al. Vaxfectin enhances the humoral immune response to plasmid DNA-encoded antigens. Vaccine 2001; 19 1911-1923.
Madry H, Reszka R, Bohlender J, Wagner J. Efficacy of cationic liposome-mediated gene transfer to mesangial cells in vitro and in vivo. J Mol Med 2001; 79 184-189.
Parker SE et al. Safety of a GM-CSF adjuvant-plasmid DNA malaria vaccine. Gene Ther 2001; 8 1011-1023.
Pleyer U et al. Efficiency and toxicity of liposome-mediated gene transfer to corneal endothelial cells. Exp Eye Res 2001; 73 1-7.
Pupa SM et al. Prevention of spontaneous neu-expressing mammary tumor development in mice transgenic for rat proto-neu by DNA vaccination. Gene Ther 2001; 8 75-79.
Reyes L et al. Vaxfectin enhances antigen specific antibody titers and maintains Th1 type immune responses to plasmid DNA immunization. Vaccine 2001; 19 3778-3786.
Sanchez GI et al. Immunogenicity and protective efficacy of a Plasmodium yoelii Hsp60 DNA vaccine in BALB/c mice. Infect Immun 2001; 69 3897-3905.
Schleef RR, Olman MA, Miles LA, Chuang JL. Modulating the fibrinolytic system of peripheral blood mononuclear cells with adenovirus. Hum Gene Ther 2001; 12 439-445.
Scholl FG et al. Effects of human tissue plasminogen gene transfer on allograft coronary atherosclerosis. J Heart Lung Transplant 2001; 20 322-329.
Simberg D et al. Phase behavior, DNA ordering, and size instability of cationic lipoplexes. Relevance to optimal transfection activity. J Biol Chem 2001; 276 47453-47459.
Stopeck AT et al. Phase II study of direct intralesional gene transfer of allovectin-7, an HLA-B7/beta2-microglobulin DNA-liposome complex, in patients with metastatic melanoma. Clin Cancer Res 2001; 7 2285-2291.
Suzuki S et al. Liposome-mediated gene therapy using HSV-TK/ganciclovir under the control of human PSA promoter in prostate cancer cells. Urol Int 2001; 67 216-223.
Ushijima K et al. Anti-HIV-1 activity of an antisense phosphorothioate oligonucleotide bearing imidazole and primary amine groups. Bioorg Med Chem 2001; 9 2165-2169.
Vilalta A, Wu D, Margalith M, Hobart P. Rabbit EPO gene and cDNA: expression of rabbit EPO after intramuscular injection of pDNA. Biochem Biophys Res Commun 2001; 284 823-827.
Yonezawa T et al. Detection of transgene in progeny at different developmental stages following testis-mediated gene transfer. Mol Reprod Dev 2001; 60 196-201.
Abul-Hassan K, Walmsley R, Boulton M. Optimization of non-viral gene transfer to human primary retinal pigment epithelial cells. Curr Eye Res 2000; 20 361-366.
Aujame L, Seguin D, Droy C, Hessler C. Experimental design optimization of filamentous phage transfection into mammalian cells by cationic lipids. Biotechniques 2000; 28 1202-1206, 1208, 1210 passim.
Blanton JR, Jr. et al. Plasmid transfection and retroviral transduction of porcine muscle cells for cell-mediated gene transfer. J Anim Sci 2000; 78 909-918.
Clark PR, Stopeck AT, Parker SE, Hersh EM. Cationic lipid gene transfer of an IL-2 transgene leads to activation of natural killer cells in a SCID mouse human tumor xenograft. Cell Immunol 2000; 204 96-104.
Clark PR et al. Studies of direct intratumoral gene transfer using cationic lipid-complexed plasmid DNA. Cancer Gene Ther 2000; 7 853-860.
Clayton J, Middlebrook JL. Vaccination of mice with DNA encoding a large fragment of botulinum neurotoxin serotype A. Vaccine 2000; 18 1855-1862.
Dai B et al. Protection against leptospirosis by immunization with plasmid DNA encoding 33 kDa endoflagellin of L. interrogans serovar Lai. Chin Med Sci J 2000; 15 14-19.
Dassow H, Lassner D, Remke H, Preiss R. Modulation of multidrug resistance in human leukemia cells with mdr1-targeted antisense oligonucleotides using variable treatment schedules. Int J Clin Pharmacol Ther 2000; 38 209-216.
Dumonteil E et al. Comparative study of DNA vaccines encoding various antigens against Leishmania mexicana. Dev Biol (Basel) 2000; 104 135-141.
Gleich LL. Gene therapy for head and neck cancer. Laryngoscope 2000; 110 708-726.
Gutheil JC. Novel immunologic and biologic therapies for breast cancer. Curr Oncol Rep 2000; 2 582-586.
Gutheil JC et al. Targeted antiangiogenic therapy for cancer using Vitaxin: a humanized monoclonal antibody to the integrin alphavbeta3. Clin Cancer Res 2000; 6 3056-3061.
Hartikka J et al. Sodium phosphate enhances plasmid DNA expression in vivo. Gene Ther 2000; 7 1171-1182.
Hoffman DM, Figlin RA. Intratumoral interleukin 2 for renal-cell carcinoma by direct gene transfer of a plasmid DNA/DMRIE/DOPE lipid complex. World J Urol 2000; 18 152-156.
Horiguchi Y et al. Intravesical liposome-mediated interleukin-2 gene therapy in orthotopic murine bladder cancer model. Gene Ther 2000; 7 844-851.
Kunitomi M et al. Selective inhibition of hepatoma cells using diphtheria toxin A under the control of the promoter/enhancer region of the human alpha-fetoprotein gene. Jpn J Cancer Res 2000; 91 343-350.
Larchian WA et al. Effectiveness of combined interleukin 2 and B7.1 vaccination strategy is dependent on the sequence and order: a liposome-mediated gene therapy treatment for bladder cancer. Clin Cancer Res 2000; 6 2913-2920.
Le TP et al. Safety, tolerability and humoral immune responses after intramuscular administration of a malaria DNA vaccine to healthy adult volunteers. Vaccine 2000; 18 1893-1901.
Madry H, Trippel SB. Efficient lipid-mediated gene transfer to articular chondrocytes. Gene Ther 2000; 7 286-291.
Mizuta T et al. Inhibitory effects of an antisense oligonucleotide in an experimentally infected mouse model of influenza A virus. Biochem Biophys Res Commun 2000; 279 158-161.
Norman JA et al. DNA vaccine encoding PSMA significantly reduces tumor growth and prolongs life in mice with TRAMP tumors. Clinical Cancer Research 2000; 6 511.
Sedegah M et al. Improving protective immunity induced by DNA-based immunization: priming with antigen and GM-CSF-encoding plasmid DNA and boosting with antigen-expressing recombinant poxvirus. J Immunol 2000; 164 5905-5912.
Takagi T et al. Effect of cationic liposomes on intracellular trafficking and efficacy of antisense oligonucleotides in mouse peritoneal macrophages. J Drug Target 2000; 7 363-371.
Thompson JA et al. Phase II trial of plasmid DNA/lipid (leuvectin) immunotherapy in patients with metastatic renal cell carcinoma. Clinical Cancer Research 2000; 6 517.
Vellon L, Cuello T, Gargallo P, Larripa I. [Antisense oligonucleotides increase the apoptotic effect of idarubicin in K-562 cell line]. Medicina (B Aires) 2000; 60 143-145.
Zelphati O et al. PNA-dependent gene chemistry: stable coupling of peptides and oligonucleotides to plasmid DNA. Biotechniques 2000; 28 304-310, 312-304, 316.
Zhang YY et al. Immunogenicity of plasmid DNA encoding the 62 kDa fragment of Schistosoma japonicum myosin. Vaccine 2000; 18 2102-2109.
Abai AM, Hobart PM, Barnhart KM. Insulin delivery with plasmid DNA. Hum Gene Ther 1999; 10 2637-2649.
Abai AM, Hobart PM, Norman J. Gene therapy for type-1 diabetes. Diabetes 1999; 48 51.
Akporiaye ET, Hersh E. Clinical aspects of intratumoral gene therapy. Curr Opin Mol Ther 1999; 1 443-453.
Anderson KL et al. PU.1 and the granulocyte- and macrophage colony-stimulating factor receptors play distinct roles in late-stage myeloid cell differentiation. Blood 1999; 94 2310-2318.
Barnhart KM. Simplified PCR-mediated, linker-scanning mutagenesis. Biotechniques 1999; 26 624-626.
Cameron FH et al. A transfection compound series based on a versatile Tris linkage. Biochim Biophys Acta 1999; 1417 37-50.
Chang Y, Prud'homme GJ. Intramuscular administration of expression plasmids encoding interferon-gamma receptor/IgG1 or IL-4/IgG1 chimeric proteins protects from autoimmunity. J Gene Med 1999; 1 415-423.
Clayman GL, Dreiling L. Local delivery for gene therapy. Curr Oncol Rep 1999; 1 138-143.
Fernandes J et al. In vivo transfer of interleukin-1 receptor antagonist gene in osteoarthritic rabbit knee joints: prevention of osteoarthritis progression. Am J Pathol 1999; 154 1159-1169.
Figlin RA, Parker SE, Horton HM. Technology evaluation: interleukin-2 gene therapy for the treatment of renal cell carcinoma. Curr Opin Mol Ther 1999; 1 271-278.
Galanis E et al. Immunotherapy of advanced malignancy by direct gene transfer of an interleukin-2 DNA/DMRIE/DOPE lipid complex: phase I/II experience. J Clin Oncol 1999; 17 3313-3323.
Hasan UA et al. Nucleic acid immunization: concepts and techniques associated with third generation vaccines. J Immunol Methods 1999; 229 1-22.
Hermanson GG, Singh G, Hobart P. Immunogenicity and protective effects of coadministered cytokine and chemokine plasmid DNAs in a murine B-cell lymphoma model. Cancer Gene Therapy 1999; 6 112.
Hernandez P, Hof R, Parker S, Horton H. Systemic treatment of cancer by intramuscular injection of an interferon-alpha-expressing plasmid DNA. Cancer Gene Therapy 1999; 6 108.
Hersh E et al. Long-term follow-up of melanoma patients who have received Allovectin-7 gene therapy treatment. Cancer Gene Therapy 1999; 6 92.
Horton HM, Hernandez P, Parker SE, Barnhart KM. Antitumor effects of interferon-omega: in vivo therapy of human tumor xenografts in nude mice. Cancer Res 1999; 59 4064-4068.
Horton HM, Parker SE, Wloch MK, Norman JA. DNA vaccines for cancer therapy. Expert Opin Investig Drugs 1999; 8 2017-2026.
Horton HM et al. A gene therapy for cancer using intramuscular injection of plasmid DNA encoding interferon alpha. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1999; 96 1553-1558.
Horton HM et al. IL-2 plasmid therapy of murine ovarian carcinoma inhibits the growth of tumor ascites and alters its cytokine profile. J Immunol 1999; 163 6378-6385.
Ilan Y. Technology evaluation: naked DNA. Curr Opin Mol Ther 1999; 1 116-120.
Kisich KO, Malone RW, Feldstein PA, Erickson KL. Specific inhibition of macrophage TNF-alpha expression by in vivo ribozyme treatment. J Immunol 1999; 163 2008-2016.
Klavinskis LS, Barnfield C, Gao L, Parker S. Intranasal immunization with plasmid DNA-lipid complexes elicits mucosal immunity in the female genital and rectal tracts. J Immunol 1999; 162 254-262.
Klinman DM, Barnhart KM, Conover J. CpG motifs as immune adjuvants. Vaccine 1999; 17 19-25.
Li K, Stewart DJ, Ward HJ. Technology evaluation: gene therapy (FGF-5), Vical. Curr Opin Mol Ther 1999; 1 260-265.
Martin T et al. Plasmid DNA malaria vaccine: the potential for genomic integration after intramuscular injection. Hum Gene Ther 1999; 10 759-768.
Miao J et al. [Humoral immune response in mice to hybrid nucleic acid vaccines containing Plasmodium falciparum merozoite surface protein 1 block 17-based gene]. Zhongguo Ji Sheng Chong Xue Yu Ji Sheng Chong Bing Za Zhi 1999; 17 302-304.
Neglia F et al. DNA vaccination against the ovarian carcinoma-associated antigen folate receptor alpha (FRalpha) induces cytotoxic T lymphocyte and antibody responses in mice. Cancer Gene Ther 1999; 6 349-357.
Ochiya T et al. Evaluation of cationic liposome suitable for gene transfer into pregnant animals. Biochem Biophys Res Commun 1999; 258 358-365.
Oku N. Delivery of contrast agents for positron emission tomography imaging by liposomes. Adv Drug Deliv Rev 1999; 37 53-61.
Pal S et al. Vaccination of mice with DNA plasmids coding for the Chlamydia trachomatis major outer membrane protein elicits an immune response but fails to protect against a genital challenge. Vaccine 1999; 17 459-465.
Parker SE et al. Plasmid DNA malaria vaccine: tissue distribution and safety studies in mice and rabbits. Hum Gene Ther 1999; 10 741-758.
Pereira-Chioccola VL et al. Comparison of antibody and protective immune responses against Trypanosoma cruzi infection elicited by immunization with a parasite antigen delivered as naked DNA or recombinant protein. Parasite Immunol 1999; 21 103-110.
Prud'homme GJ, Chang Y. Prevention of autoimmune diabetes by intramuscular gene therapy with a nonviral vector encoding an interferon-gamma receptor/IgG1 fusion protein. Gene Ther 1999; 6 771-777.
Ramasamy R et al. Mammalian cell expression of malaria merozoite surface proteins and experimental DNA and RNA immunisation. Biochim Biophys Acta 1999; 1453 1-13.
Rini BI, Selk LM, Vogelzang NJ. Phase I study of direct intralesional gene transfer of HLA-B7 into metastatic renal carcinoma lesions. Clin Cancer Res 1999; 5 2766-2772.
Schreiber A et al. Effect of Leuvectin, an interleukin-2 gene therapy agent, on prostate-specific antigen (PSA) in patients undergoing neoadjuvant or adjuvant gene therapy for prostate cancer. Cancer Gene Therapy 1999; 6 91.
Smith GJ, 3rd et al. Fast and accurate method for quantitating E. coli host-cell DNA contamination in plasmid DNA preparations. Biotechniques 1999; 26 518-522, 524, 526.
Smooker PM et al. Humoral responses in mice following vaccination with DNA encoding glutathione S-transferase of Fasciola hepatica: effects of mode of vaccination and the cellular compartment of antigen expression. Parasite Immunol 1999; 21 357-364.
Wloch MK et al. Human gp100 plasmid DNA vaccination induces cytotoxic T lymphocytes (CTLs) that lyse interferon-alpha (IFN-alpha)-treated but not untreated mouse melanoma cells. Cancer Gene Therapy 1999; 6 113.
You Z et al. [Immunogenicity and immunoprotection of a leptospiral DNA vaccine]. Hua Xi Yi Ke Da Xue Xue Bao 1999; 30 128-132.
Zelphati O, Liang XW, Hobart P, Felgner PL. Gene chemistry: Functionally and conformationally intact fluorescent plasmid DNA. Human Gene Therapy 1999; 10 15-24.
Anchordoquy TJ, Girouard LG, Carpenter JF, Kroll DJ. Stability of lipid/DNA complexes during agitation and freeze-thawing. J Pharm Sci 1998; 87 1046-1051.
Barnhart KM et al. Enhancer and promoter chimeras in plasmids designed for intramuscular injection: a comparative in vivo and in vitro study. Hum Gene Ther 1998; 9 2545-2553.
Campain JA et al. Lipid- and adenoviral-mediated gene transfer into AIDS-Kaposi's sarcoma cell lines. Cancer Gene Ther 1998; 5 131-143.
DeBruyne LA et al. Lipid-mediated gene transfer of viral IL-10 prolongs vascularized cardiac allograft survival by inhibiting donor-specific cellular and humoral immune responses. Gene Ther 1998; 5 1079-1087.
Doolan DL et al. DNA vaccination as an approach to malaria control: current status and strategies. Curr Top Microbiol Immunol 1998; 226 37-56.
Felgner PL, Rolland A. Preface. Adv Drug Deliv Rev 1998; 30 1-3.
Ferrari ME et al. Analytical methods for the characterization of cationic lipid-nucleic acid complexes. Hum Gene Ther 1998; 9 341-351.
Gleich LL et al. Alloantigen gene therapy for squamous cell carcinoma of the head and neck: results of a phase-1 trial. Arch Otolaryngol Head Neck Surg 1998; 124 1097-1104.
Hedstrom RC et al. In vitro expression and in vivo immunogenicity of Plasmodium falciparum pre-erythrocytic stage DNA vaccines. Int J Mol Med 1998; 2 29-38.
Hernandez P, Anderson D, Parker S, Horton H. A novel plasmid DNA gene therapy for treatment of metastatic disease. Cancer Gene Therapy 1998; 5 D11.
Horton HM et al. Development of a novel plasmid DNA gene therapy for treatment of distant primary and metastatic tumors in mice. Cancer Gene Therapy 1998; 5 28.
Huang CY et al. Lipitoids--novel cationic lipids for cellular delivery of plasmid DNA in vitro. Chem Biol 1998; 5 345-354.
Konopka K et al. Delivery of an anti-HIV-1 ribozyme into HIV-infected cells via cationic liposomes. Biochim Biophys Acta 1998; 1372 55-68.
Lahijani R et al. Quantitation of host cell DNA contaminate in pharmaceutical-grade plasmid DNA using competitive polymerase chain reaction and enzyme-linked immunosorbent assay. Hum Gene Ther 1998; 9 1173-1180.
McCluskie MJ et al. Direct gene transfer to the respiratory tract of mice with pure plasmid and lipid-formulated DNA. Antisense Nucleic Acid Drug Dev 1998; 8 401-414.
Murphy JE et al. A combinatorial approach to the discovery of efficient cationic peptoid reagents for gene delivery. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1998; 95 1517-1522.
Nabel GJ, Hobart P. Keystone symposia on: molecular and cellular biology of gene therapy and synthetic non-viral gene delivery systems, Keystone, CO, USA, January 19-25, 1998. Biochim Biophys Acta 1998; 1378 R19-26.
Raghupathi R et al. BCL-2 overexpression attenuates cortical cell loss after traumatic brain injury in transgenic mice. Journal Of Cerebral Blood Flow And Metabolism 1998; 18 1259-1269.
Rolland A, Felgner PL. Non-viral gene delivery systems - Preface. Advanced Drug Delivery Reviews 1998; 30 1-3.
Saffran DC et al. Immunotherapy of established tumors in mice by intratumoral injection of interleukin-2 plasmid DNA: induction of CD8+ T-cell immunity. Cancer Gene Ther 1998; 5 321-330.
Sawai K et al. A novel method of cell-specific mRNA transfection. Mol Genet Metab 1998; 64 44-51.
Sedegah M et al. Boosting with recombinant vaccinia increases immunogenicity and protective efficacy of malaria DNA vaccine. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1998; 95 7648-7653.
Stopeck AT et al. Transfection of primary tumor cells and tumor cell lines with plasmid DNA/lipid complexes. Cancer Gene Ther 1998; 5 119-126.
Surovoy A, Flechsler I, Jung G. A novel series of serum-resistant lipoaminoacid compounds for cellular delivery of plasmid DNA. Adv Exp Med Biol 1998; 451 461-467.
Wang R et al. Induction of antigen-specific cytotoxic T lymphocytes in humans by a malaria DNA vaccine. Science 1998; 282 476-480.
Wang R et al. Simultaneous induction of multiple antigen-specific cytotoxic T lymphocytes in nonhuman primates by immunization with a mixture of four Plasmodium falciparum DNA plasmids. Infect Immun 1998; 66 4193-4202.
Weiss WR et al. A plasmid encoding murine granulocyte-macrophage colony-stimulating factor increases protection conferred by a malaria DNA vaccine. J Immunol 1998; 161 2325-2332.
Zelphati O et al. Stable and monodisperse lipoplex formulations for gene delivery. Gene Ther 1998; 5 1272-1282.
Barnfield C et al. Characterization of gene expression following intranasal immunization with nucleic acid. Biochem Soc Trans 1997; 25 335S.
Doh SG et al. Spatial-temporal patterns of gene expression in mouse skeletal muscle after injection of lacZ plasmid DNA. Gene Ther 1997; 4 648-663.
Doolan DL et al. DNA vaccines for malaria: the past, the present, & the future. Indian J Med Res 1997; 106 109-119.
Duncan JE, Whitsett JA, Horowitz AD. Pulmonary surfactant inhibits cationic liposome-mediated gene delivery to respiratory epithelial cells in vitro. Hum Gene Ther 1997; 8 431-438.
Eastman SJ et al. Biophysical characterization of cationic lipid: DNA complexes. Biochim Biophys Acta 1997; 1325 41-62.
El Ouahabi A et al. The role of endosome destabilizing activity in the gene transfer process mediated by cationic lipids. FEBS Lett 1997; 414 187-192.
Fasbender A, Zabner J, Zeiher BG, Welsh MJ. A low rate of cell proliferation and reduced DNA uptake limit cationic lipid-mediated gene transfer to primary cultures of ciliated human airway epithelia. Gene Ther 1997; 4 1173-1180.
Felgner JH. Separation and quantitation of cationic liposome components by high performance liquid chromatography with evaporative light-scattering detection. Pharm Res 1997; 14 1269-1271.
Felgner PL. Nonviral strategies for gene therapy. Sci Am 1997; 276 102-106.
Felgner PL et al. Nomenclature for synthetic gene delivery systems. Hum Gene Ther 1997; 8 511-512.
Gao L et al. Mucosal delivery of nucleic acid elicits both cellular and humoral immunity. Biochem Soc Trans 1997; 25 336S.
Gramzinski RA et al. Malaria DNA vaccines in Aotus monkeys. Vaccine 1997; 15 913-915.
Hedstrom RC et al. The development of a multivalent DNA vaccine for malaria. Springer Semin Immunopathol 1997; 19 147-159.
Hersh EM, Stopeck AT. Advances in the biological therapy and gene therapy of malignant disease. Clin Cancer Res 1997; 3 2623-2629.
Hersh EM, Stopeck AT. Recent advances in the treatment of malignant melanoma with gene therapy. Mol Med 1997; 3 636-651.
Hersh EM et al. Phase II study of intratumoral injection of HLA-B7/beta 2M plasmid DNA-cationic lipid complex (Allovectin-7) therapy for metastatic malignant melanoma (MMM). Cancer Gene Therapy 1997; 4 124.
Hoffman SL et al. Strategy for development of a pre-erythrocytic Plasmodium falciparum DNA vaccine for human use. Vaccine 1997; 15 842-845.
Hoffman SL et al. Toward clinical trials of DNA vaccines against malaria. Immunol Cell Biol 1997; 75 376-381.
Horton H et al. Gene therapy of ovarian cancer via IL-2 plasmid DNA and cationic lipid. Cancer Gene Therapy 1997; 4 149.
Hsiao M et al. Intracavitary liposome-mediated p53 gene transfer into glioblastoma with endogenous wild-type p53 in vivo results in tumor suppression and long-term survival. Biochem Biophys Res Commun 1997; 233 359-364.
Klavinskis LS et al. Mucosal immunization with DNA-liposome complexes. Vaccine 1997; 15 818-820.
Kochel T et al. Inoculation of plasmids expressing the dengue-2 envelope gene elicit neutralizing antibodies in mice. Vaccine 1997; 15 547-552.
Konopka K, Harrison GS, Felgner PL, Duzgunes N. Cationic liposome-mediated expression of HIV-regulated luciferase and diphtheria toxin a genes in HeLa cells infected with or expressing HIV. Biochim Biophys Acta 1997; 1356 185-197.
Luke CJ, Carner K, Liang X, Barbour AG. An OspA-based DNA vaccine protects mice against infection with Borrelia burgdorferi. J Infect Dis 1997; 175 91-97.
Marquet M, Horn NA, Meek JA. Characterization of plasmid DNA vectors for use in human gene therapy.1. Biopharm-The Technology & Business Of Biopharmaceuticals 1997; 10 40-45.
Norman JA et al. Development of improved vectors for DNA-based immunization and other gene therapy applications. Vaccine 1997; 15 801-803.
Parker SE, Ducharme S, Norman J, Wheeler CJ. Tissue distribution of the cytofectin component of a plasmid-DNA/cationic lipid complex following intravenous administration in mice. Hum Gene Ther 1997; 8 393-401.
Rodman DM et al. In vivo gene delivery to the pulmonary circulation in rats: transgene distribution and vascular inflammatory response. Am J Respir Cell Mol Biol 1997; 16 640-649.
Rubin J et al. Phase I study of immunotherapy of hepatic metastases of colorectal carcinoma by direct gene transfer of an allogeneic histocompatibility antigen, HLA-B7. Gene Ther 1997; 4 419-425.
Rubin J et al. Phase I/II trial of the IL-2 DNA/DMRIE/DOPE lipid complex as an immunotherapeutic agent by direct gene transfer in patients with advanced melanoma, renal cell carcinoma, and sarcoma. Cancer Gene Therapy 1997; 4 125.
Snyder DS et al. Ribozyme-mediated inhibition of a Philadelphia chromosome-positive acute lymphoblastic leukemia cell line expressing the p190 bcr-abl oncogene. Biol Blood Marrow Transplant 1997; 3 179-186.
Stopeck AT et al. Phase I study of direct gene transfer of an allogeneic histocompatibility antigen, HLA-B7, in patients with metastatic melanoma. J Clin Oncol 1997; 15 341-349.
Tanner FC, Carr DP, Nabel GJ, Nabel EG. Transfection of human endothelial cells. Cardiovasc Res 1997; 35 522-528.
Teifel M, Heine LT, Milbredt S, Friedl P. Optimization of transfection of human endothelial cells. Endothelium 1997; 5 21-35.
Waddill W, 3rd et al. Human gene therapy for melanoma: CT-guided interstitial injection. AJR Am J Roentgenol 1997; 169 63-67.
Zuidam NJ, Barenholz Y. Electrostatic parameters of cationic liposomes commonly used for gene delivery as determined by 4-heptadecyl-7-hydroxycoumarin. Biochim Biophys Acta 1997; 1329 211-222.
Bebok Z et al. Efficiency of plasmid delivery and expression after lipid-mediated gene transfer to human cells in vitro. J Pharmacol Exp Ther 1996; 279 1462-1469.
Bourne N, Stanberry LR, Bernstein DI, Lew D. DNA immunization against experimental genital herpes simplex virus infection. J Infect Dis 1996; 173 800-807.
Doolan DL et al. Circumventing genetic restriction of protection against malaria with multigene DNA immunization: CD8+ cell-, interferon gamma-, and nitric oxide-dependent immunity. J Exp Med 1996; 183 1739-1746.
Felgner PL. Improvements in cationic liposomes for in vivo gene transfer. Hum Gene Ther 1996; 7 1791-1793.
Gardner MJ et al. DNA vaccines against malaria: immunogenicity and protection in a rodent model. J Pharm Sci 1996; 85 1294-1300.
Hartikka J et al. An improved plasmid DNA expression vector for direct injection into skeletal muscle. Hum Gene Ther 1996; 7 1205-1217.
Konopka K, Pretzer E, Felgner PL, Duzgunes N. Human immunodeficiency virus type-1 (HIV-1) infection increases the sensitivity of macrophages and THP-1 cells to cytotoxicity by cationic liposomes. Biochim Biophys Acta 1996; 1312 186-196.
Lahijani R et al. High-yield production of pBR322-derived plasmids intended for human gene therapy by employing a temperature-controllable point mutation. Hum Gene Ther 1996; 7 1971-1980.
Liang X et al. Novel, high expressing and antibiotic-controlled plasmid vectors designed for use in gene therapy. Gene Ther 1996; 3 350-356.
McCarthy M. DNA vaccination: a direct line to the immune system. Lancet 1996; 348 1232.
Nabel GJ et al. Immune response in human melanoma after transfer of an allogeneic class I major histocompatibility complex gene with DNA-liposome complexes. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1996; 93 15388-15393.
Oku N et al. Effect of serum protein binding on real-time trafficking of liposomes with different charges analyzed by positron emission tomography. Biochim Biophys Acta 1996; 1280 149-154.
Parker SE et al. Plasmid DNA gene therapy: studies with the human interleukin-2 gene in tumor cells in vitro and in the murine B16 melanoma model in vivo. Cancer Gene Ther 1996; 3 175-185.
Schwarz LA et al. Delivery of DNA-cationic liposome complexes by small-particle aerosol. Hum Gene Ther 1996; 7 731-741.
Stephan DJ et al. A new cationic liposome DNA complex enhances the efficiency of arterial gene transfer in vivo. Hum Gene Ther 1996; 7 1803-1812.
Syrengelas AD, Chen TT, Levy R. DNA immunization induces protective immunity against B-cell lymphoma. Nat Med 1996; 2 1038-1041.
Tripathy SK et al. Long-term expression of erythropoietin in the systemic circulation of mice after intramuscular injection of a plasmid DNA vector. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1996; 93 10876-10880.
Wheeler CJ et al. A novel cationic lipid greatly enhances plasmid DNA delivery and expression in mouse lung. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1996; 93 11454-11459.
Zhu J et al. A continuous intracerebral gene delivery system for in vivo liposome-mediated gene therapy. Gene Ther 1996; 3 472-476.
Felgner PL, Zaugg RH, Norman JA. Synthetic recombinant DNA delivery for cancer therapeutics. Cancer Gene Ther 1995; 2 61-65.
Felgner PL et al. Improved cationic lipid formulations for in vivo gene therapy. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1995; 772 126-139.
Harrison GS et al. Optimization of gene transfer using cationic lipids in cell lines and primary human CD4+ and CD34+ hematopoietic cells. Biotechniques 1995; 19 816-823.
Hoffman SL et al. Nucleic acid malaria vaccines. Current status and potential. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1995; 772 88-94.
Horn NA, Meek JA, Budahazi G, Marquet M. Cancer gene therapy using plasmid DNA: purification of DNA for human clinical trials. Hum Gene Ther 1995; 6 565-573.
Lew D et al. Cancer gene therapy using plasmid DNA: pharmacokinetic study of DNA following injection in mice. Hum Gene Ther 1995; 6 553-564.
Logan JJ et al. Cationic lipids for reporter gene and CFTR transfer to rat pulmonary epithelium. Gene Ther 1995; 2 38-49.
Marquet M, Horn NA, Meek JA. Process Development for the Manufacture of Plasmid DNA Vectors for Use in Gene Therapy. BioPharm 1995; 8 26-37.
Mor G et al. Complexity of the cytokine and antibody response elicited by immunizing mice with Plasmodium yoelii circumsporozoite protein plasmid DNA. J Immunol 1995; 155 2039-2046.
Norman JA et al. Preclinical pharmacokinetics, manufacturing, and safety studies supporting a multicenter cancer gene therapy trial. Hum Gene Ther 1995; 6 549-550.
Parker SE et al. Cancer gene therapy using plasmid DNA: safety evaluation in rodents and non-human primates. Hum Gene Ther 1995; 6 575-590.
Zabner J et al. Cellular and molecular barriers to gene transfer by a cationic lipid. J Biol Chem 1995; 270 18997-19007.
Abai A, Kuwhara-Rundell A, Margalith M, Morrow J, Parker SE, Rhodes GH. Coinjection of the Genes for Interlukin-2 and Antigen does not Increase Humoral Immune Response. In: Norrby E BF, Chanock RM, Ginsberg HS (ed). Vaccines 94. Cold Spring Harbor Press: Cold Spring Harbor, NY, 1994, pp. 77-81.
Felgner JH et al. Enhanced gene delivery and mechanism studies with a novel series of cationic lipid formulations. J Biol Chem 1994; 269 2550-2561.
Nabel GJ et al. Immunotherapy for cancer by direct gene transfer into tumors. Hum Gene Ther 1994; 5 57-77.
Plautz GE et al. Direct gene transfer for the understanding and treatment of human disease. Ann N Y Acad Sci 1994; 716 144-153.
Raz E et al. Intradermal gene immunization: the possible role of DNA uptake in the induction of cellular immunity to viruses. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1994; 91 9519-9523.
Raz E, Carson DA, Rhodes GH, Abai AM, Tsai YJ, Wheeler CJ, Morrow J, Felgner PL, Baird SM. Cationic Lipids Inhibit Intradermal Genetic Vaccination. In: Norrby E BF, Chanock RM, Ginsberg HS (ed). Vaccines 94. Cold Spring Harbor Press: Cold Spring Harbor, NY, 1994, pp. 71-75.
Rhodes GH et al. Characterization of humoral immunity after DNA injection. Dev Biol Stand 1994; 82 229-236.
Schmid S, Rhodes G, Morrow J, Hoffman SL, Kang AS. Nucleic acid vaccines against the preerythrocytic stage of rodent malaria Plasmodium yoelii. Cold Spring Harbor Symposium, October 1994 (abstract).
Sedegah M, Hedstrom R, Hobart P, Hoffman SL. Protection against malaria by immunization with plasmid DNA encoding circumsporozoite protein. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1994; 91 9866-9870.
Sorscher EJ et al. Gene therapy for cystic fibrosis using cationic liposome mediated gene transfer: a phase I trial of safety and efficacy in the nasal airway. Hum Gene Ther 1994; 5 1259-1277.
Vahlsing HL et al. Immunization with plasmid DNA using a pneumatic gun. J Immunol Methods 1994; 175 11-22.
Vogelzang NJ, Lestingi TM, Sudakoff G, Kradjian SA. Phase I study of immunotherapy of metastatic renal cell carcinoma by direct gene transfer into metastatic lesions. Hum Gene Ther 1994; 5 1357-1370.
Zhou X et al. Self-replicating Semliki Forest virus RNA as recombinant vaccine. Vaccine 1994; 12 1510-1514.
Cohen J. Naked DNA points way to vaccines. Science 1993; 259 1691-1692.
Duzgunes N, Felgner PL. Intracellular delivery of nucleic acids and transcription factors by cationic liposomes. Methods Enzymol 1993; 221 303-306.
Dwarki VJ, Malone RW, Verma IM. Cationic liposome-mediated RNA transfection. Methods Enzymol 1993; 217 644-654.
Felgner PL. Genes in a bottle. Lab Invest 1993; 68 1-3.
Liu M, Ulmer JB, Friedman A, Martinex D, Hawe LA, DeWitt CM, Leander KR, Shi X-P, Montogomery DL, Donnelly JJ, Parker S, Felgner P, Felgner J. Immunization with DNA Encoding a Conserved Internal Viral Protein Results in Protection from Morbidity and Mortality Due to Challenge with Influenza A in Mice. In: Ginsberg HS BF, Chanock RM, Lerner RA (ed). Vaccines 93. Cold Spring Harbor Press: Cold Spring Harbor, NY, 1993, pp. 343-346.
Manthorpe M et al. Gene therapy by intramuscular injection of plasmid DNA: studies on firefly luciferase gene expression in mice. Hum Gene Ther 1993; 4 419-431.
Nabel GJ, Felgner PL. Direct gene transfer for immunotherapy and immunization. Trends Biotechnol 1993; 11 211-215.
Nabel GJ et al. Direct gene transfer with DNA-liposome complexes in melanoma: expression, biologic activity, and lack of toxicity in humans. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1993; 90 11307-11311.
Rhodes GH et al. Injection of expression vectors containing viral genes induces cellular, humoral and protective immunity. In: Ginsberg HS (ed). Vaccines 93. Cold Spring Harbor Press: Cold Spring Harbor, NY, 1993, pp. 137-141.
San H et al. Safety and short-term toxicity of a novel cationic lipid formulation for human gene therapy. Hum Gene Ther 1993; 4 781-788.
Ulmer JB et al. Heterologous protection against influenza by injection of DNA encoding a viral protein. Science 1993; 259 1745-1749.
Yankauckas MA et al. Long-term anti-nucleoprotein cellular and humoral immunity is induced by intramuscular injection of plasmid DNA containing NP gene. DNA Cell Biol 1993; 12 771-776.
Jiao S et al. Persistence of plasmid DNA and expression in rat brain cells in vivo. Exp Neurol 1992; 115 400-413.
Kumar R, Gardner MF, Richman DD, Hostetler KY. Equal inhibition of HIV replication by stereoisomers of phosphatidyl-azidothymidine. Lack of stereospecificity of lysosomal phospholipase A1. J Biol Chem 1992; 267 20288-20292.
Nabel EG, Plautz G, Nabel GJ. Transduction of a foreign histocompatibility gene into the arterial wall induces vasculitis. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1992; 89 5157-5161.
Felgner PL, Rhodes G. Gene therapeutics. Nature 1991; 349 351-352.
King DH. Fluorinated pyrimidines: a new change for old drugs. Transplant Proc 1991; 23 168-170.
Hostetler KY et al. Synthesis and antiretroviral activity of phospholipid analogs of azidothymidine and other antiviral nucleosides. J Biol Chem 1990; 265 6112-6117.
Wolff JA et al. Direct gene transfer into mouse muscle in vivo. Science 1990; 247 1465-1468.
Duzgunes N, Goldstein JA, Friend DS, Felgner PL. 1989; 28 9179-9184.
Felgner PL, Ringold GM. Cationic liposome-mediated transfection. Nature 1989; 337 387-388.
Felgner PL, Holm M, Chan H. Cationic liposome mediated transfection. Proc West Pharmacol Soc 1989; 32 115-121.
Malone RW, Felgner PL, Verma IM. Cationic liposome-mediated RNA transfection. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1989; 86 6077-6081.
Felgner PL et al. Lipofection: a highly efficient, lipid-mediated DNA-transfection procedure. Proc Natl Acad Sci USA 1987; 84 7413-7417. |
"Should Christians stay away from yoga because of its demonic roots? Totally. Yoga is demonic," Driscoll said. "If you just sign up for a little yoga class, you're signing up for a little demon class."
Mohler received heavy criticism for his article calling yoga "contradictory" to Christianity. He responded to all the letters, emails and rebutal editorials by pointing out the following:
(1). Not one protest against his article contained a "theological" argument.
(2). More than 90% of the protests came from women.
(3). Those who protested are replacing Christianity with a religion of their own invention.
(4). Women who argue for yoga have no reference to "biblical Christianity."
(5). The evangelical world is in "worse shape" than he ever thought.
Even a casual attempt at research would have caused both Mohler and Driscoll to find websites such as Holy Yoga, which places their doctrinal statement on the front page. Under a detailed confession regarding the person of Jesus Christ, Holy Yoga is as theologically orthodox, if not more, than the Abstract of Principles of Southern Theological Seminary.
There are two main issues with Mohler's and Driscoll's comments about yoga. First, the spirit in which the comments are conveyed seems haughty. It sounds as if Mohler and Driscoll are saying those who oppose their statements against yoga are theologically incompetent. One of the tell-tales signs of spiritual arrogancy and an unhealthy debate is for one side to act as if the other side has no ability to counter one's arguments. Second, Mohler and Driscoll seem to be confusing a cultural bias with a theological argument. Instead of investigating what Christians who practice yoga actually believe, there is an assumption that Christians who practice yoga can't believe correctly.
One of these days we will realize that culture evolves, civilization's habits change, and peoples' perspectives alter over time. It used to be that culture considered fat people rich, prosperous and educated because people with access to an abundance of food became fat and were the elite of soceity. Now, culture often discriminates against fat people, believing them to be inferior to the elite of society. Those kind of judgments are wrong. In my opinion we Southern Baptists should be very careful about judging a fellow believer who practices yoga by assuming they aren't theologically sound. It would akin to judging a fat Southern Baptist pastor as theologically unsound before we ask him what he believes.
The best way to discover whether or not Christians who practice yoga are involved in a "dangerous" practice or participating in a "demon class" is to ask the yoga participants what they believe about Jesus Christ. Any judgment against Christians practicing yoga before this happens is at best premature or at worst reveals some sort of cultural bias.
134 comments:
This post is very personal to my life. Why? I am a Christian (former Hindu) who happens to practice Iyengar Yoga. I practice yoga at least twice a week with my yoga instructor. My main motivations for practicing yoga is for health issues that have been tremendously helped by yoga.
There are two parts to yoga. One is the physical exercises and other part is meditation. In Iyengar yoga the meditation comes at the end and it is only undertaken by people who have mastered the body first.
But I do practice Christian meditation and sometimes this also called yoga by some.
What are the demonic things I do in this meditation?
As I go through my daily routine (walking, working and so on) I say a short prayer of St. Francis.
My God and my all.
This short prayer (also called a mantra in hindu texts) centers me in Christ. Wherever I am.
I am known to say this even in my dreams.
I also do a form of meditation. This involves reciting the prayer of St. Francis s-l-o-w-l-y in my mind one word at a time, as a drop of water falling into a pond. understand the above form of meditation goes against the teaching of Our Lord Jesus Christ against mere repetitions of prayer.
So these are the demonic things I do, while being centered in Christ.
Well said Thy Peace.
Well said.
A description of 'repetitive prayer' from Revelation:
8 . . . "Day and night they do not stop exclaiming:
"Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God almighty, Who was, and Who is, and Who is to come."
An MSNBC article says that he objects to "the idea that the body is a vehicle for reaching consciousness with the divine."
I guess that means that in addition to yoga, people should also give up fasting, preaching, praying, thinking, singing, going to church, helping others, etc. etc.
Thy Peace, perhaps we are a bit different in our theological beliefs, but I am not surprised that you are a meditator because of the spirit in which you usually communicate. Meditation, though I am not very accomplished at it, has changed my life for the better. In fact, meditation is really, really paying attention to life - that's one simple way of describing it. It's a partial "waking up" from the sleep-walk that we all fall into in our daily lives.
I aspire to try yoga someday. Sounds wonderful.
I do meditation all the time. But my meditation is solely on reading through and meditating on the Scripture. I am going through the book of Romans right now and mulling over and meditating on each phrase and how it relates to what Paul has already said or will say in a few verses. Meditating on God's Word causes me to find peace and spiritual growth through the washing of the water of the Word. This is Christian meditation that is found in the Scriptures. It is a means of grace that God has designed for us. But are "Christian" mantras a means of grace given by God? There are many who had a strong walk with God but who found themselves slowly drawn towards spiritual practices in common with non-Christian religions through the door way of yoga. For them it is not how they started, but how they will finish. For many who start these practices will end pulled away from the pure Word of God and firmly planted in spirituality that takes them away through subtle deception that causes compromise.
Our ministry sells a DVD called Yoga Uncoiled from East to West available at I would encourage every one who thinks that the practice of yoga meditation is compatible with Christianity to be willing to be challenged by watching this DVD to see what goes on behind the veil. It is an act of love to warn our brothers in Christ that there is subtle deception out there disguised as Christian spirituality.
I have to smile when I read this post.
I once commented to another blogger on 'imonk' who had studied about meditation and after viewing the film 'Into Great Silence', saw no point at all in any of it for Christian people.
Thy Peace has given me another idea to include in my original remarks to that man:
"In all your ‘studies’, did you ever ask to visit a monastery?
And to stay there for a while? You can do this, you know. Maybe you didn’t know.
This is an important question.
There is in Christianity that which cannot be contacted by simply reading or hearing. It must be lived deeply over time for it’s effect to be absorbed. For some, the background of silence is what is needed for the full impact of the Words of Christ to be experienced. These are the men and women that God ‘calls’ into the quiet. They understand what you may not know.
In the Gospel of St. Mark we find this: ‘And He saith unto them, Come ye yourselves apart into a desert place, and rest a while.’
The ‘deep silence’ may not be for everyone, no.
But there is a part of everyone that needs, at times, to ‘come away, and rest for a while’ because the world’s demands have drowned out the ‘quiet still Voice’ of the Lord.
A monastery?
Or the quiet of camping in the woods ‘by the still waters’ ?
Silent sailing at night out in the deep under the stars?
Or a steaming cup of coffee at four-thirty in the morning, before the household awakens, with a candle lit for prayer, instead of the electric lights?
We all have our mini- versions of the cloister, if we think about it . . . . "
And I would now like to add to my 'mini-cloister' list:
"A LYENGAR YOGA CLASS "
Thank you, THY PEACE :)
One of my college professors was a real Renaissance man. He knew about EVERYTHING. He had studied yoga and meditation. He said that he stopped one day because after meditating he stood before a class and could not produce the simplest calculation. His mind was blank- which was the goal of the yoga he was studying. In eastern religions the goal is to empty the mind. In Christianity the goal is to fill it with Christ. Yoga is not the issue. The real issue is what is being meditated on. The critics should stop being lazy and get the facts on what Christians are actually studying instead of 'demonizing' them!
I firmly believe that what matters is Who we are worshiping, not the form that worship takes. When God made a covenant with Abraham, it was done in the form of covenant-making as it existed in Abraham's time. God didn't reject the form as a "pagan" practice. Abraham divided the animals in half, and God passed between them. His power filled the form of Abraham's ceremony.
I think what matters is not whether we say a mantra, but what the focus of the mantra is, and Who we are focusing on when we say it. It is not whether we do yoga, but why we do it, that matters. I think this is a Scriptural principle, particularly in the New Testament. The external form takes a back seat to the internal power. As long as the practice is not inherently sinful, harmful to ourselves or others, we are free to turn it to the glory of God.
What's ironic is that Dr. Mohler admits that the evangelical world is "worse shape."
But don't most evangelicals who practice yoga, do it in order to get in or stay in shape?
The stinkers!!!!
First they turned Halloween into a "thing of the devil." Now they are taking on Yoga.
What's next---don't you mess with Old St. Nick or the great pumpkin!!!
Mohler is a LLH = "Lightweight Looking for a Headline" in my opinion.
Just think--a few weeks ago he was awing new students with his "over the top" personal library at his little SBTS President's Mansion and saying Time Magazine considered him a "leading theologian."
Mohler, et al, "better watch out / better not shout / Santa Clause is coming to town!!!"
Mohler interviews Philosophy prof at Denver seminary, Doug Groothius about yoga. Groothius happens to be an egalitarian and married to Rebecca Groothius who edited Complimentary without Hierarchy...the response to RBMW.
I think Yoga is ok. He is hard to understand sometime and his green pointy ears are very strange, but that little guy can hold his own with any Sith Lord in the Empire! Another thing I like about Yoga is...oh...wait...woops....my bad!
Just a couple of observations:
1. Many want to "Christianize" things they like such as Yoga. This can be confusing and deceptive if we are not careful.
2. I agree with Mohler about Yoga and the dangers. I also agree with what Cheryl wrote that folks can easily be lured in deeper without realizing it. It would be less confusing if it is just "special stretching" to call it something else. I, personally like the stretching positions and practice them but it has NOTHING to do with my mind. It is strictly a physical exercise.
Keep Matt 12 in "mind" when emptying the mind:
43"When an evil.
(continued...)
(...continued)
In "The Church's One Foundation",we sing about this "mystic sweet communion....". I certainly hope all this doesn't cause a re-think of all that....
:)
Absurd! Trying to find God through any means other than Christ is absurd and unbiblical. The Holy Spirit guides this process, not some man-made bodily alignment process. Yoga, or Labyrinths for that matter serve no purpose but to replace the Spirit with an idol. Would better to bang ones head against a brick wall to a bloody nub and find God than all this nonsense.
Religion in the physical, Wade, is a sad thing to be teaching your followers. You lead them to hell and not to Christ. Meditation on self is for the eternally damned. That is what they will do for eternity. Prayer and obedience to Christ is for the redeemed.
You're on a roll...
Mind-emptying meditation works for all religions:
sound of silence
Mind-emptying meditation is a well-known method of self-hypnosis:
self-hypnosis
Even Satan can heal and work miracles. But do we actually believe that God has withheld the best and most direct path to physical and spiritual health from us, by utterly failing to even hint at them in the pages of scripture? (remember not to try lifting a few proof texts out of context)
Think about it! ;-|
Anon TK421
Wade,
Now that OU is back on track to go to the Big 12 game you must really be bored if this is all you can come up with. Please find better things to complain about in the SBC. I'm sure they are out there if you look real hard.
It seems that those promoting yoga in the West are taking Eastern terms, like mantra, and assigning completely new meanings to them? Al Mohler is raising a legitimate concern based on the emails he has received and I believe you are over generalizing his argument. He suggests that those who engage in the exercises in a Christian context shouldn't call it "yoga," lest they promote confusion of Christian meditation with Hindu meditation. Hindu meditation is designed to empty the mind of external sources of knowledge so that one can find enlightenment from within. Christian meditation focuses the mind on the Word of God that the Holy Spirit might use it to transform our thoughts and actions. I don't doubt that there are Christians who promote the latter and package it as "Christian yoga." The question is: Should they call it "yoga"? Whether you agree or disagree, I think there's a legitimate discussion here.
John,
Tthose promoting yoga in the West are taking Eastern terms, like mantra, and assigning completely new meanings to them ..."
Uh hmm.
It's a little like taking the Arabic word "Allah," which means God, and redefining it to mean "The Father of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."
Not necessarily wrong if, like many said above, who is being worshipped is the only Savior given among men.
Kevin Crowder,
You are missing the point by creating a straw man. No Christian who practices yoga is "Trying to find God through any means other than Christ." We all would agree that to do so would be unbiblical.
The issue is, plain and simple, "Can a genuine Christian who has come to know God through Jesus Christ, the only Savior given to sinners, practice yoga?"
Mohler and Driscoll say "no" -- or if one does "call it something else."
I say there's nothing wrong with taking the terms that lost people are familiar with, redefining them, and teaching them about Jesus Christ -- which after a quick examination of a few Christian yoga sites is what these Christians are doing.
Off on a staff retreat.
Everyone meditate over what you have written before you stretch out your finger and punch "Enter."
Smile.
Wade,
I think their point is that Yoga is not an amorphous thing left open for each practitioner to fill in the gaps. It came from somewhere. Mohler is arguing that it is an alternative gospel that is incompatible with a solid Christian theology.
Those who strip down Yoga of its spiritual dimension in order to make it compatible with the gospel are not really practicing Yoga anymore. They're just doing some exercises. This is the danger of a consumer culture that feels every right to pick and choose certain elements of every religion and customize it to one's own liking.
"This is the danger of a consumer culture that feels every right to pick and choose certain elements of every religion and customize it to one's own liking."
Exactly. This is what Augustine did in renaming the statues of pagan gods into Christian "saints". This is what the reformers did when they merely renamed the priest into the pastor, sacraments into ordinances, etc.
Check out this link: interview with a zen master. How can any Christian think that it is a trivial thing to adopt all the terminology and many of the practices of this obvious pagan religion and sanctify it with Christianese? A rose by any other name...
Sorry, I wrote Augustine when I meant to write Constantine.
"Everyone meditate over what you have written before you stretch out your finger and punch "Enter.""
How can we meditate over what we've written when we aren't even supposed to meditate on what GOD has written?
A "staff retreat"... yes, retreat! You are being defeated by scripture and the real Holy Spirit! Let the "generals" rethink their strategy and consider surrendering to God and renouncing this false king.
I like Yoga, and don't know what all the fuss is about. Sure, I don't think he got enough credit for his defensive skills behind the plate, and his sayings like "it ain't over til it's over" show he is not a great philosopher or theologan, but you people need to get off his back!
I'm all for Yoga!
Strider Said:
" In eastern religions the goal is to empty the mind. In Christianity the goal is to fill it with Christ."
AMEN! so few words, so much truth.
Why do people still give credibility to Mohler? I gave up on that years ago. Education and a quick mind to do not equal wisdom.
If two people do yoga and practice it exactly the same, can they say that one is for the purpose of emptying the mind while the other is for filling it? If both chant a sound and reach the same kind of "enlightenment", can one say that the chanting emptied their mind while the other says it filled their mind?
Doublespeak!
"It's a little like taking the Arabic word "Allah," which means God, and redefining it to mean "The Father of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ."
Actually, that is a big problem. Lots of people, even professing Christians, do think it is the same god as the God of Abraham.
Words mean things and when they lose or take on variations of their meaning, confusion reigns.
So when immature believers see the Word "yoga" approved by other believers, they think it is ok. After all, it is "spiritual".
It is not that different than when the mega church bookstore sells Rob Bell or Joel Osteen books. That communicates approval of their doctrines.
I don't think Mohler made a good case in his original article. He does not make distinctions and only later admitted that if they are simply stretching, it is not Yoga as Yoga is defined.
Strider: " In eastern religions the goal is to empty the mind. In Christianity the goal is to fill it with Christ."
I was raised Society of Friends. They attempt to empty the mind every Meeting precisely in order that it may be filled with God; perhaps in that complete silence can we listen fully. There is a long, long Christian tradition of trying to empty out the self so that there is room for God to come in.
It frustrates me when ancient Christian practicess are called unholy merely because other religions share them. Should we give up praying next?
Lydia,
"Words mean things and when they lose or take on variations of their meaning, confusion reigns."
I don't disagree. That's why I think those in a Christian yoga class are instructed about Christ. That which I resist is a general denunciation of all Christians practicing yoga without the caveat that some Christians could be meditating and filling their minds with the good news of Jesus Christ while stretching and call it Holy Yoga.
:)
The problem is with the word Yoga. What does it mean? Obviously it means different things. There certainly could be some forms of yoga that are not healthy for Christians. Other forms, called Yoga for simplicity, are simply a series of stretches and exercises. Can a Christian do that type of yoga? Or does the word Yoga taint the very practice?
The same applies to martial arts. Some forms of MA employ spiritual and meditative aspects which would no doubt be unhealthy for Christians. But does that mean Christians cannot learn how to disarm an attacker or flip some guy over their shoulder?
To come out and say that Yoga, or MA or ( ) is incompatible with Christianity is too simplistic.
Any physical activity can be coupled with a spiritual or religious component. By the same token those physical activities can be practiced without the spiritual or religious component.
We don't object to non-Christians eating bread and drinking wine do we, even though we perform that activity as part of a religious observance.
It is also interesting that Mark Driscoll is a huge fan of Mixed Martial Arts, to the point of suggesting that all real Christian men are fans of MMA.
Lydia,
I appreciate your comments about Allah not being the God of Abraham. I got accused of "splitting legalist hairs" last week when I made the same statement. Allah is a reinvented version of a tribal moon god, the very fact that Isalm did not come around until somewhere around 600 AD should give people a clue to this fact.
Would those of you who see nothing wrong or harmful with "Christian yoga" explain what it does that cannot be achieved any other way?
Are practitioners of "Christian yoga" more enlightened than non-practitioners? More spiritual? More loving?
Its a good idea to remember that most people who practice yoga are doing so purely for the physical benefits. They do not meditate on anything other than keeping their body in the proper position for as long as they can without hurting themselves.
There are physical benefits to stretching of various kinds. The yoga routines do have good stretches. IMO the best way to approach it is to divorce the meditation concept from the routine altogether. Next best is to replace them with a prayer time in general with the Lord. Have a good long chat with God. I think anything beyond that is not the best though it still may be OK to recite a prayer I don't think its the best thing to do. Having been raised as Catholic I now do not see any great benefit to reciting rosaries or repeating saints prayers. Best to say your own from your heart.
Bottom line is to NOT repeat the spiritual recitations of the yoga routines even if you are aiming them differently.
I have read a lot of comments that reference "emptying the mind". Meditation is about emptying the mind of distractions - of compulsive thinking.
"What's for lunch?" "I have to remember to pick up the cleaning" "I can't believe she wrote that!"
Replaying argument in our heads, inventing fantasy arguments, thinking of all the things we have to do, trying to pursue some little chemical pleasure (candy, rest, complimenting oneself) etc. etc. etc. etc.
Meditation is about trying to wake up to life, rather than sleep-walking through much of it driven by urges which lie below the surface of our mindfulness.
As the song leader started a repetitious new song, I overheard an elderly woman say, “Here we go with another little ditty.”
The leader said, “Just turn your mind off.”
Is this type of church singing of almost chanting a type of yoga?
That's exactly what the zen master said in that link above. Turn off the mind from its normal activity.
But if yoga is tied in any way to a Christian's spirituality, it is much more than mere exercise, and it is being used as an elitist path to "enlightenment" or "more spiritual than thou". That's the attitude I always see in those who practice yoga or mysticism. They look down their noses at Christians who don't practice them or who think they're spiritually dangerous. Just like Gnosticism.
Point being, that if yoga/mysticism isn't a spiritual requirement or exclusive path to spiritual maturity, then the Christian has no need of it. Why work for that which we all receive for FREE when we are saved-- the indwelling Holy Spirit? Didn't we get all of Him when we were saved?
I see nothing in yoga/mysticism to compare to the indwelling Spirit and nothing keeping me from knowing God as "abba, father" in the Word or in my "cluttered" mind.
Some people see a meadow as "cluttered". After all, it's filled with many forms of life and they are not marching like an army. But I see that meadow as the design of God, a harmony that needs no "practices" or "disciplines". It just is. And that's what the mind filled with the Word is: a spiritual meadow, cluttered with life.
I'll take that meadow over the stark, gray, bland "order" of mysticism any day of the week. You can't claim that this "ordered" mind is anything else.
Jesus, the Word, the Spirit... I have it all and it was a gift.
A lot has been written about this topic, and most of it unnecessarily.
I think that Wade and Lydia hit upon the true issue when discussing the meaning of the word "Yoga."
If that word is defined by it original meaning by those who created Yoga, I suspect all of us would be in agreement (or at least a substantial portion of us).
In the U.S we have the uncanny and wonderful ability to take something from another culture, to keep its moniker but re-create it into something else.
That's what we have done with Yoga.
I did a quick search on-line for a definition of Yoga. Here is what I found:
yo·ga[ yṓgə ]NOUN
1. Hindu discipline: a Hindu discipline that promotes spiritual unity with a supreme being through a system of postures and rituals
2. system of exercise: a system or set of breathing exercises and postures derived from or based on Hindu yoga
[ Late 18th century. < Sanskrit yogaḥ "union" ]
In the U.S., 99% of the people who practice Yoga, practice the later, not the former, though the derivation is from Hindu practices.
I suspect that there is not one of us that is going to say that Yoga, as defined by "spiritual unity with a supreme being through a system of postures and rituals" is Christian.
But many of us, have been to the local YMCA or something similar to "Holy Yoga" (that must make the people who keep the flame of the founders of Yoga puke).
There is nothing unholy about a local YMCA stretching class called "Yoga."
The term "Yoga" and the practice of Yoga in the U.S. has been so completely bastardized from its original concept and meaning that in my opinion, it is harmless.
I have taken Yoga classes, and have found them quite helpful to my endurance athletic performance. But the classes I took had no spiritual component or true Yoga masters etc.
I will agree that there is a good warning to unknowledgeable people who may become involved in Yoga studios where they have spiritual classes in addition to the stretching. They should know what "Yoga" means and from where it is derived so they can avoid things that would not be helpful.
I think that it is fine for Dr. Mohler to point out the difference between how Christianity teaches people are to come to know God, and what Yoga teaches.
I think his writing and communication would be better if he were more clear with his definitions. That would have dispelled any incorrection notions that have so dominated the discussions.
If anyone should be upset about all this, I think it would be the creators and founders of Yoga.
Louis
Anon,
That's one of the problems with Christianity - it can degenerate into a religion with no concrete practice for self-improvement. Christianity is profoundly mystical - it says "fill the mind with Christ" but too often it offers no practical methods for doing so.
But if one wants to preserve the status quo in one's mental activity, then meditation is probably a bad idea. I have found, however, that developing a bit of mental discipline (and in my case it's only a bit!) has been extremely effective.
But of course, I think some people focus more on the spirit of what one is pursuing and others focus more on the "correct" names and mental pictures.
As a Lutheran minister friend of mine said recently, "Who am I to tell the Holy Spirit when, where and how it should do its thing?"
Hinduism is a generous, ancient religion with much to offer..
Steven Stark,
Problems with Christianity? You mean "Jesus Christ and him crucified" isn't good enough? Can't the Holy Spirit "improve us"? And isn't it clear that filling our minds with Christ means what Paul said to the Philippians, and Romans, etc.?
Christianity isn't about methods or practices or disciplines from the world's religions. It is not defective or incomplete. The "status quo" you deride as inferior is what the Christian knows as "the Sabbath rest", a place of having peace with God. And it's all given for free to any who ask.
Christianity isn't about ME, about SELF, but about JESUS. All the "discipline" in the world is a mere house of cards compared to the Rock that is the risen Jesus.
(See the "holier than thou" attitude from the practitioners of mysticism/yoga?)
So who all here did MasterLife back in the day?
Go on, raise your hands.
Remember the last session?
The whole find a quiet place, relax, and meditate on the Lord with copious amounts of prayer?
Same thing if you ask me...
So basically you can't start your day with a calm relaxing meditation centered around Christ while doing stretching exercises that are good for you?
That would first explain the obesity and gluttony of an overwhelming majority of our pastorate that everyone notices but no one addresses.
No. Yoga is perfectly alright if you're meditating on the Word of God and spending time with Christ. That's no different than those who have micro-worship sessions in their cars or who lock their office door for a half hour to have a bible study of one.
Heck, if you really want to make them mad, make sure you have a glass of red wine with lunch afterwards...
What DO Christians 'chant' these days? Oh, yes, they DO 'chant'.
And the litany goes like this:
'We thank You Oh Lord that we are not like those other sinners who:
-practice yoga
-celebrate 'The Great Pumpkin'
-drink wine
-have gender issues
-pray using 'Allah' for 'God'
-celebrate St. Nicholas at Christmas
-just love Halloween
-accept people as they are
-have no problem with the Easter Bunny
-here we can add your own speciallity
of what makes 'us' better than 'them'
Now THAT's a 'litany', but just not one of praise (except to ourselves)
My own personal favorite, of which I am SO very guilty is 'God I thank You that I am not like those others who engage in the 'pointing of the finger'.
Time to sing a new song unto the Lord. . .
it's long overdue
How many ways can we say that Christian meditation is on the BIBLE? Yet somehow, now this is the same as yoga!
Of course, that only brings us back to the question, who needs yoga?
Can a moment of meditation bring you closer to Christ ?
See for yourself:
I have never been involved with Yoga, although I do have friends who have been/are. Yet this post and the comment thread reminds me of an experience I had long ago.
I made my living a little differently than most people before God saved me. My entire way of life drastically changed after my conversion. I had to leave most everything behind.
After having been a Believer for a little over a year, I went to hear a well known evangelist preach. It was during the time when almost every professional evangelist had at least one sermon against demonism and Satan worship taking over America through the likes of Anton LaVey.
During the evangelist's sermon he mentioned the evils of practicing Martial Arts due to the presence of demons in the lives of those are "caught up in it and spend hours and hours practicing it." (not an exact quote, but pretty close)
Now, I must admit, I had known some pretty evil guys who were very good at Martial Arts, but I had not encountered any who could levitate, hurl green vomit from a rotating head or had tried to get me to join the Church of Satan. Their evil desires were usually to leave you in a broken heap on the ground.
After the sermon, I got the opportunity to spend some time with the evangelist. During the conversation, I realized he knew very little about Martial Arts as a whole and especially as it was practiced in Western culture.
One part of the exchange we had that I remember was something similar as the following:
He said, "Karate people are in danger of letting demons into your lives." To which I replied, "Well, preacher, all I know is that it has kept a whole bunch of devils from takin' it."
That particular evangelist is still holding meetings. I don't think he preaches much against Martial Arts anymore. Especially since the chief Parliamentarian for the SBC since back around 1986 is a Black Belt. :-)
I saw the film biography of Bruce Lee. Everybody would agree that Bruce Lee wasn't what we'd consider an evil man. But toward the end of the movie he was told he had to "choose a demon".
So demons are okay as long as they don't make someone a serial killer or pedophile or ::shudder:: a fundy?
Whatever you people want to call this religion you're making up as you go along, I just hope someday you'll accept Jesus as the ONLY savior and stop trying to add the world's spirituality or organizational charts or whatever to Him. And please, stop looking down your noses at people who disagree with you.
Steven Stark: "Hinduism is a generous, ancient religion with much to offer. "
Go ask some shudras or chandalas what they think about that.
Hinduism is a vicious religion which denies Christ and imposes unending "karma" on people. Choose a god, hope that you can make them happy and maybe you won't come back in a lower caste.
Generous? In what way?
Steven Stark,
You need to inform your Lutheran minister friend that said, “Who am I to tell the Holy Spirit when, where and how it should do its thing?"
That the Holy Spirit is not an “it” but a person.
Steven Stark comments, "I have read a lot of comments that reference 'emptying the mind'. Meditation is about emptying the mind of distractions - of compulsive thinking." I agree with him completely. Although I have no first-hand knowledge of yoga, I do sometimes practice various forms of meditation in my walk with Jesus; and whether the source is eastern or western (and we in the west sometimes forget that Christianity itself is an eastern religion), the idea is to reduce distractions so that we can hear God speak. I would however go one step further than Brother Stark: those distractions can be not only little worldly things ("Did I turn the stove off?" "Is that my dog I hear barking?" and so on), but can also be me reciting Scripture or praying. After all: if I am busy talking, even if it is about God, even if it is in my mind rather than with my mouth, can I possibly hear the "still small voice" of God?
Something else that occurs to me: to say "yoga" is inherently evil or demonic comes quite close to saying that a "thing" is, in and of itself, evil and demonic, rather than how that thing is used/misused/abused. I am not sure I can agree with that; but then I don't think that beverage alcohol in itself is evil or demonic or sinful, but that such judgments come with its use/misuse/abuse. Maybe there are a few things which are inherently evil (a ouija board comes to mind), but yoga I'm not so sure about.
John
In the 1960's when my mother enrolled me in ballet class, my great-grandmother was certain it would lead to my moral ruin. In the 80's my grandparents where appauld by Christian Jazzercise classes.
It seems that what is going on is a dance of definitions.
Yoga, the word, traditionally means the whole system of Hindu discipline which encompasses both body AND mind, focusing on self-enlightenment, clearing away distractions so that the "true" self is found. That is antithetical to Christianity.
So, if one finds physiological benefit to the stretching and movement of yoga, should we call it yoga? I answer with other questions: If one finds satisfaction in adopting orphans and taking care of widows should they call it Christianity? If one enjoys singing songs together with others, should we label it Christian worship?
Calling the mere exercises "yoga" is not evil in itself, but calls for a redefinition which distorts the original and could end up harming someone who ends up in a REAL yoga situation.
Why do Christians want to call the exercises "yoga?" Is it because of marketing? Is it because of a fascination with Eastern religions? I don't think either of these is a good reason to co-opt the term.
I do think Driscoll, as usual, goes overboard with his language.
Let "yoga" mean "yoga," not merely the stretching. Then we have a reason to defend the term "Christian" against the onslaughts of those who would deny the Gospel is necessary for those who would call themselves Christian.
"In the 1960's when my mother enrolled me in ballet class, my great-grandmother was certain it would lead to my moral ruin. In the 80's my grandparents where appauld by Christian Jazzercise classes."
So anything goes, right? Nothing is dangerous if we personally benefit, right? There are no standards, no boundaries, as long as Jesus tags along, right?
And what part of Jazzercise is supposed to bring you closer to God?
Sheesh, what lame arguments people use to justify their pet heresies!
I've never heard of Jazzercize described before as 'a heresy' by an extemist-fundamentalist.
This is a first !
Are Christians allowed to walk around the block for exercise ?
Or even breathe ?
But that's another story . .
BNettles, You said exactly what I wanted to say but could not articulate!
"I've never heard of Jazzercize described before as 'a heresy' by an extemist-fundamentalist."
Wow... That would be HILARIOUS if it weren't due to completely missing a point! Point being: Jazzercise is not at all like yoga because only yoga is touted as a way to get close to God.
Get it?
Oh, and what exactly is a "extemist-fundamentalist", and how is it worse than a Buddhist/Hindu Christian, especially the kind that look down their noses at the unenlightened?
I didn't mean to imply that Christianity is inferior to other religions, simply that it often lacks concrete steps a person can take for self-improvement. And I have met few Christians who are not interested in self-improvement. I certainly believe that feeling the grace of God can "grease the wheels" for self-improvement, but if I don't practice the piano, the grace of God is not going to make me into a virtuoso. It's no different with our thought patterns and actions.
I sat and thought about whether I should use the pronoun "he" or "it" for the holy spirit. Maybe I chose wrongly! We will have to hope that the Holy Spirit doesn't mind. ;)
John Fariss,
Thanks for an enlightening comment. You are so right that it is not the nature of particular thoughts running through the mind that is the problem necessarily. It is the involuntary, reactive way of thinking.
I do think that Hinduism can be a very inclusive religions, and every Hindu I know has shamed me with the level of generosity they demonstrate. One of my college friends worked for hours at a gas station so he could earn enough money to rent out a restaurant and throw a party for all his friends. Wonderful, wonderful people. But yes, the caste system can be nasty business.
She's BAAAACK . . .
The Christian faith is all about us being saved, and then about us becoming like Jesus. The focus turns from self to God, and then we are transformed by the Holy Spirit-- not through our own efforts but through the power of God.
Of course this doesn't mean we don't lift a finger. God will only work with what we give Him. But our "work" is to trust Him and to live to please Him. We cannot know what pleases or displeases Him without reading scripture, because our own personal ideas of right and wrong are flawed. Neither can we take our cues from the world.
Nobody is saying other people aren't generous or compassionate, or that Christians can't improve in this area. All we're saying is that yoga, mystical disciplines etc. are cheap substitutes that the world uses because they don't have the Holy Spirit.
Our righteousness before God does not come from our good deeds but from whether we have the blood of Jesus on our hearts. Salvation is a gift, not an earned wage. What we do after that should all flow from gratitude for this gift, and that takes time walking with Jesus-- not through "disciplines" or postures but simply talking and listening, using the mind as well as the heart.
We are to sit at Jesus' feet and learn, not open our mouths like baby birds who have no concern about who or what feeds them or what is dropped in. Jesus taught His disciples with many words and with examples in action. But not once did Jesus lead them in meditation. In fact, when they asked Him how to pray, He used words; remember "the Lord's prayer"?
Look to scripture to find out how to grow spiritually, not to false religions, no matter how much they do appear to be "angels of light".
Anon TK421
."
Well said, John Wylie, worth repeating...
Pastor Burleson,
Even though I do not subscribe to reformed theology or believe in TULIP doctrine, I applaud you sir for contending with those in your belief system who expect all others to fall into lock step with every pronouncement they publish. Keep up the good work!
"We cannot know what pleases or displeases Him without reading scripture, because our own personal ideas of right and wrong are flawed. Neither can we take our cues from the world."
."
Pondering is good.
But are we called to something more as Christian people?
John Wylie wisely states this:
"But in no way is the idea of emptying one's mind in view when the word is used in the Bible."
But yet . . . there is another way to see the emptying of self as the 'letting go' of our own mind's pride, and self-righteousness, and smugness;
and in its place, we may look to the Bible for a word from St. Paul:
"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jes.
Meditation, to me is about having a conversation with the Holy Spirit. Prayer is when I talk and meditation is when I shut up and let God through the Holy Spirit talk to me. You can't hear what God has to say if your mind is cluttered with every day items.
I personally don't like humming, mantras or chanting. I found the one time I was at a rosary service that all the repitition did was numb your mind from hearing what God might have to say.
I liken this to Elijah when he was in the cave and he heard the "Still, small voice of God."
"You can't hear what God has to say if your mind is cluttered with every day items."
Not necessarily.
One of my sisters is a professional singer. I remember hearing her college choir and telling her afterward that I could pick out her voice. She wondered if she was too loud and I said, "No, not at all, the balance was perfect. But I know your voice and could hear it even when all the other voices were the same volume".
If you really know God, you will hear His voice even in the clamor of life and the "clutter" of your mind. The important thing is not whether the mind is cluttered, but what with.
Anon TK421
"If you really know God, you will hear His voice even in the clamor of life and the "clutter" of your mind."
sounds like 'I'dol worship to me.
"sounds like 'I'dol worship to me."
"My sheep will know my voice..."
Sounds like a lot of Christians can't tell Jesus from idols.
sounds like people casting God in their OWN image
Yep... God is whatever pops into your head when you empty it. That's what mysticism teaches.
The Bible, on the other hand, tells us that when we are saved we get the Holy Spirit to indwell us, and we are predestined to be conform to the image of Christ. It's all a gift-- something to be grateful for, not ashamed of.
Well, what an interest Biblical Critical thread today. I need to ponder it do I? :)
I would observe that "yoga" really is a form of praying conflating a Biblical practice nuanced by verses like these:
2Sa 7:18 Then went king David in, and sat before the LORD, and he said, Who am I, O Lord GOD? and what is my house, that thou hast brought me hitherto?
Psa 46:10 Be still, and know that I am God: I will be exalted among the heathen, I will be exalted in the earth.
Psa 46:11 The LORD of hosts is with us; the God of Jacob is our refuge. [[[Selah]]].
Now one wonders, ponders or [[[Selah]]] where King David gets this whole idea of going into the Glorious Presence of Almighty God and being still and then conversing with Them?
Might King David have had sufficient access to Holy Scriptures such as this one then taking the time to ponder it and as a good Jew does after coming into an understanding of such, practicing it too, not only for his welfare and health, but also so he could guide God's people with God's Wisdom, Knowledge and Understanding into the same Spirit of Grace and Truth as Moses was led into?
This seems rational to me?.
Notwithstanding Aaron, Nadab, Abihu, and seventy of the elders of Israel all got to had lunch with the Lord that day listening intently I am sure to the lunch conversation over roasted Lamb God was having with Moses, we also see after lunch Moses went forth as he was instructed and began sitting there for six days in silence before God, Who then proceeded to speak to Moses and as we all remember, wrote out the ten commandments with His finger on two tables of stone!
I think smart business people have been using yoga having hijacked those practices we see God taught to the earliest members of Abraham's people. And we should protest, or at least seek to collect royalties, not because of the practices yoga engenders, but for using the name without giving credit where credit is due? Maybe we should try to replace it's name back to what one can best describe the practice of sitting in the Presence of God as a God breathed and man practice Prayerful Intent!
What do you say, anyone game? :)
Gee, I sure do hope that they apply this 'evil roots' argument to everyting.
So much of our culture- from the days of the week, saying "bless you" when someone sneezes- even our Christmas trees ad Easter eggs are pagan in origin.
I get so sick of this "You have to justify everyting you do through the Bible nonsense....I don't think it was ever intended to be used in that way. Think about it- how much of our day to day lives can we justify 'Bilicaly.'
This gives me even more reason to thank God daily for freeing me from lies people have tried to wrap the Bible around.
You know, everything I really know about yoga isn't in a book selling yoga to Christians. It's reflected, accurately, on the wikipedia page about yoga.
I especially thought the Jainism comments and the references to tantric sexual rites (on the tantra wikipedia page) were interesting.
Of course, we can pretend there's nothing dangerous about a system of thought with strong gnostic/mystical undercurrents if we wish. But to say that Christianity is compatible seems to me to deny the truth of Scripture.
Are there health benefits from yogic "stretching exercises"? Possibly. But why do you need eastern, cultic methods when you can do the same thing without the baggage?
And I'm thankful I don't have to pose or control my breathing or numb my mind to know Jesus and bask in the warmth of His love.
But I suppose it was too much to ask for Christians to follow the Bible or be concerned about any spiritual dangers, because there are none, right?
So, for those of you who don't like the Bible being quoted when it impinges on your favorite practices, what do you need it for (the Bible that is)? Why not just throw it out? And why bash people about what they do or believe, since you don't like them doing the same thing to you?
Seriously, who needs the Bible or a profession of faith if the Hindus had a handy, non-judgmental exercise that gets you to God anyway?
Anonymous writes (among other things):
Seriously, who needs the Bible or a profession of faith if the Hindus had a handy, non-judgmental exercise that gets you to God anyway?
Or why did Jesus have to die on the cross if there is another way to re-establish the relationship between humanity and the inhabitant of the Holy of Holies? The claim of the book of Hebrews is that the Old Covenant was necessary, but neither sufficient--because sin continued--nor superior--because sacrifice had to continue, as well--after all.
"Or why did Jesus have to die on the cross if there is another way..."
Some of the regulars here will tell you that because Jesus died, then everybody worships the one true God whether they know it or not. So anything that sounds good to their ears is okay now, because Jesus paid it all. They've got a license to sin--- only there's no such thing as sin anymore, unless it's people trying to quote the Bible.
So they'll tell you Jesus died so that as long as people worship something and act spiritual, they're in. But come to think of it, a loving God wouldn't send anyone to hell anyway (except Bible thumpers), so that whole "Jesus died" thing is probably a lie the Bible thumpers made up.
Which is why the question, what do they need the Bible for anyway? Why does anyone need to know Jesus died for them, since everybody's going to heaven anyway, as long as they don't quote the Bible?
[/sarcasm]
I find it hysterical that some people are looking down on those who practice yoga (or are OK with it) while whining tha those OK with yoga are looking down on them.
I find it hysterical that some people are looking down on those who don't practice yoga while whining that those who don't are looking down on them.
And I find it pitiful that so-called Christians can't even define saving faith or say there's anything the Bible teaches that can't be taught or practiced better elsewhere.
"Christians" promoting Hindu religious practices and hating those that still believe the Bible is God's Word... judgment is near.
What irritates me more than people trying to wrap lies in the Bible is throwing Bible verses out- Such as the "lord Lord" verse (Matthew 7:21).....cuz someone quoting that PROVES that those who support Yoga are not really Christians!11!!! When will someone throw out Matthew 7:13 futher "proof?"
"Christians" promoting Hindu religious practices and hating those that still believe the Bible is God's Word... judgment is near.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Oh please!
'Judgment' has always been near...that evil rock n roll, men with short hair, women going to work... I doubt the sanitized version of Yoga practiced by Americans is going to hasten anything.
Honest question...do you realize how much in your day to day life has (so-called) 'evil' roots?
Do you justify *everything* you do VIA the Bible? Can you justify being online with the Bible...I mean it could be an **GASP** "appearence of evil" you could be watching porn for all anyone knows...
..typing too fast...that shoud be men with *long* hair/ women with short hair...
"Oh please!" is right. What leaps!
People promote a dangerous spiritual practice, others appeal to the Bible against it, then the first group starts throwing out red herrings to take the spotlight off of what the Bible says about those practices. Even legalistic Judaism was seen as a danger in the Bible, but no, we can't say anything is dangerous or we're trying to call every single human activity dangerous!
And they think we who quote scripture are the ones with the attitude!
Good night!
WOW.
L's,
I hate yoga and women becoming pastors, but I love wine and Halloween.
Can we be half friends? :)
-K
PS: Won't be trick-or-treating this year though, going to hear Dr. Tom Nettles speak at a Reformation Day Conference. Can't decide if I want to dress up like Calvin or Spurgeon. :)
All I know is that though I may practive Yoga from time to time, I know in WHOM (Jesus Christ) and WHAT (His shed blood) I believe.
A few stretches and breathing exercises won't be changing that.
Kevin, I am going to wear my old bride's maid dress, give myself a big hair style, and add a tara& a sash that says "Miss Understood."
Or maybe I'll be a glowstick witch...haven't decided yet.
Either way, I am surely helbound for taking my daughter (who wil be a ladybug) trick or treating. I better get some good chocolate in exchange for my soul.
Why call "a few stretching exercises" yoga?
As for us Bible thumpers, we're so unenlightened and unspiritual we must have no souls to lose. Another reason not to bother the enlightened and oh-so spiritual. Let's let them tune out and invent their own personal Jesus, it makes them happy.
"As for us Bible thumpers, we're so unenlightened and unspiritual we must have no souls to lose."
you forgot 'mean as hell, too'
...because the stretching and breathing exercises ARE, in fact, yoga?
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
you forgot 'mean as hell, too'
WORD! Really, the only 'down looking' I see in this thread is from the 'Bible thumpers'.....those of us who engage in Yoga are far too relaxed and mellow to get our unders that twisted. ;-P
As I do my martial arts streatching and the exercises that have been know to be healthy for centuried, (longer than america is old) I think of:
Y is for YAHWEH
O is for ORDAINED
G is for GODLY
A is for ATTRIBUTES
I pray, exercise, stretch and meditate to the glory and honor of my Creator.
I think Romans 14 applies here. Vs. 3 & 4:.
Look it up in context. I know we're talking yoga, not food, but it seems the same principle.
I was looking for info on yoga from a Catholic perspective and, as usual, there is a 'diversity' of opinion on the subject.
But I did find the above site, one of the premier Catholic Universities in California, Loyola Marymount University,
has really well-developed programs for teaching yoga.
I have this feeling that 'diversity' is not to be feared in the Body of Christ, but embraced.
Sometimes people get distracted and worry way too much about the unimportant things;
and then they neglect those matters that are so dear to the very heart of Our Lord.
We are better off staying focused on Him.
Having read the comment stream, I don't see yoga as a threat to anyone's faith.
And I think it could really help people as a form of exercise.
I do respect that some people have concerns about the ancient practice of yoga, but I have noticed that, in the past, some of these same people have also indicated fearfulness about many other things that are strange to them.
For them, I wish more peacefulness in Christ, and, also in time, the gift of Christian courage to venture out of their 'comfort zones' with less fearfulness and less dread.
WOW!!!
Mohler, the twit, sure got us going with his tweet!!!
For me, it is of little worry and another Mohler "tempest in a tea pot."
I'm just glad I read all this stuff before taking my cup of coffee to the deck and watching the sun rise of the Pamlico just before it opens out into the Sound.
I watched the setting in a beautiful autumn sky last night / slept good / watched a Clint Eastwood movie / got up early / will watch the sun rise and praise God / then go cut some trees for my living.
Question: Is there any tantric value in pecking a keyboard of the 'puter late into the night????
Some of us are getting over-extended on this one. I'm getting my costume ready for Halloween / reading my Peanuts coffee table book in the Great Pumpkin section / oops---this one ain't worthy of great biblical exegesis.
Mohler throws rotten husks before swine rather than pearls of wisdom. How the heck did he ever get a graduate degree---I know---a Craker Jacks BoX!!!!
"you forgot 'mean as hell, too'"
Nice words from a "Christian". And of course it's always "mean" to disagree with the super-spiritual but not "mean" for them to mock us Bible thumpers. Mystics are such hypocrites.
But they have "tuned out" for so long it's no mystery why they can't hold rational thoughts together, so what's the point? If they want to practice Hinduism and put a Jesus mask on it for Halloween, let them. And if they want to call cow dung chocolate pudding, let them.
ike the attitude from ANON @8:06 is even remotely 'Christian"
ike the attitude from ANON @8:06 is even remotely 'Christian"
Tue Oct 12, 08:32:00 AM 2010
Seriously. But it's probably Gene S, just look at his post right above it.
"mean as hell too"
Righteous !
Hinduism is a generous, ancient religion with much to offer.
Mon Oct 11, 12:45:00 PM 2010
Much to offer whom? The little girls who are forced to work as Temple prostitutes to make money for the Hindu priests? The widows thrown on the husband's funeral pyre? (This still goes on in remote areas) Or the Caste system.
Big business in India: Sonograms to determine gender and subsequent abortion if it is female.
Not a lot to offer females in your generous Hinduism.
" Nice words from a "Christian". And of course it's always "mean" to disagree with the super-spiritual but not "mean" for them to mock us Bible thumpers."
one out of control 'thumper' tried to 'take an uzzi' to a group of bloggers over at SBC Voices:
just a bible-thumper?
more likely, a blasphemer against Jesus and Paul, who is trying to use them as an excuse to practice abusive treatment of others
"more likely, a blasphemer against Jesus and Paul, who is trying to use them as an excuse to practice abusive treatment of others"
And there you have it: harsh words for people who use harsh words. Can the hypocrisy get any clearer? Judging the judgmental, making themselves God's ambassadors over people who allegedly make themselves God's ambassadors... THAT's hypocrisy! It's always fine to flame flamers, as long as the flamers are Bible thumpers.
Gene S. can fire at will and still be "loving" just because he's liberal. But let a conservative object and its hate speech.
Hypocrites!
Here comes another one:
blaspheming against Jesus is an unforgivable sin
take that !!!!
BONK !
THUMP !
WHACK !
thumper is down for the count
Kevin:
"Can't decide if I want to dress up like Calvin or Spurgeon. :) "
More original would be Edwards or Boyce.
Q: Are you a Calvinist?
A: I'm as Baptist as Boyce.
Kevin, you would like Boyce. He thought you should use wine for communion. :)
Um. . . Wade said this before he left:
Off on a staff retreat.
Everyone meditate over what you have written before you stretch out your finger and punch "Enter."
But this whole conversation has descended to the level of personal attacks. Can we all stop flaming one another and agree to disagree?
Shhhhh . . .
bible 'thumper' is out cold
it's quiet now
Wade,
Someone once said, "A little knowledge is a dangerous thing".
That is so very evident in the comments regarding the subject of your current article.
A chap by the name of Pope said,"Twas well observed by my Lord Bacon, That a little knowledge is apt to puff up, and make men giddy, but a greater share of it will set them right, and bring them to low and humble thoughts of themselves."
Wade,
Please hurry and get home and put up a new post so you can spare us all this discussion about something that noone cares about in the first place.
I'd even rather see yet another post on women preachers than this thing.
"Even a casual attempt at research would have caused both Mohler and Driscoll to find websites such as Holy Yoga, which places their doctrinal statement on the front page."
So ones doctrinal statement which affirms scripture (sola scripture), salvation through Christ alone... is enough to believe an organization is OK? does the same thing. Are you ready to support them?
I am not saying AM is right on this but the statement you made above is not true in all situations. Who gets to decide?
why not let people think for themselves . . . or is that now discouraged completely ?
Did it ever occur to anyone that AM 'goes with the flow'.
Could it be that AM follows 'the base'?
B Nettles said...
Kevin:
"Can't decide if I want to dress up like Calvin or Spurgeon. :) "
More original would be Edwards or Boyce
Your brother Tom does an impressive Edwards. :)
-----
Tom
The bias Wade refers to in his post title might be a type of cultural xenophobia.
All the symptoms are there for that phenomenon, so the term fits.
Part of it is how Yoga is being defined. If it's just the exercises then it seems it's not really Yoga. If people try to Christianize Yoga such as Christoga is it really either?
"why not let people think for themselves . . . or is that now discouraged completely ?"
Does that include you letting AM think for himself and give his opinion, even if you disagree?
'."
If we are all allowed to have and give our opinion why ask:
"why not let people think for themselves . . . or is that now discouraged completely ?"
You contradict yourself.
'playing to one's base' may be a personal choice,
but it is not the same as 'thinking for oneself'
Dang and I love yogart! Guess I will have to give it up.Do they make a patch or some gum to help a person trying to quit,or, does one have to quit cold turkey?
A lady from our church was upset when eastern religious practices were brought into the church. She was told by the leadership that keeping the non-Christian spiritual name doesn't mean that the practice is against Christianity because they have Christianized it. She thought a bit and asked them if it was okay for her to have a witches coven that would focus on prayer. She asked them if calling her prayer group as "Christian witchcraft" would be acceptable to them. They were silent.
Often I wonder what God thinks. Is he okay with aligning our exercise programs with eastern religious practices and calling them the same thing? What's wrong with having a class on stretching or exercising? Do we really have to call it Yoga? And would God be offended by us calling it "Christian" Yoga when He seems to be very interested in keeping us pure and away from any unholy alignment with the occult? If not, then why not Christian witchcraft? Surely if God is okay with Christian Yoga, then we should be able to attach "Christian" to anything that had an occult or eastern religious foundation and God should be perfectly fine with that.
Cheryl,
I think you bring up a great point. Is it what we call something that matters, or what it actually is? What it promotes, what the spirit is, etc.?
If something is negative and selfish, but called a Baptist church, and something is positive and compassionate but called witchcraft, then I would take the "witchcraft".
But this has alway been a struggle with religion, or any other human organization. What is the right balance between preserving the personal experience and preserving the hierarchal, organizational structure? It's not always an easy call.
A quick counterpoints to some of the arguments/reasonings being advocated.
My name is a hindu name. Most person names in india who are hindus to begin with are names after gods and goddesses. I do not worship any hindu gods because my name reflects one of the hindu gods name.
I am fully familiar with the philosophy of yoga and the Atman or the Self (which is separate from the self). Yoga texts claim that the Self is the same in all human beings. The self is a mask over the Self.
I do not worship the Atman or the Self. I worship Jesus Christ.
I enjoy listening to music. Mostly classical music. Both western and eastern. I enjoy opera from different languages. I also enjoy listening to south indian classical music, which is ALL religious music. They are mostly praising indian gods. I do not worship indian gods while listening to this music. I happen to enjoy the music. In my heart I worship Jesus Christ.
I can not divorce my indian upbringing and culture just because I have become a Christian.
I enjoy cooking. I make elaborate indian dishes. They all have hindu names and meanings. I do not stop making indian dishes, because I have become a Christian.
The essence of what I am saying, it is the heart which matters and whom the heart is worshipping.
Clearly sorcery and witchcraft are a no-no for christians.
I firmly believe yoga is not wichcraft or sorcery.
Yoga is simply "awareness" and "focus".
I respect lot of the commentators here.
Thy Peace,
What is it about what you do that is "Yoga". What makes it "Yoga". Do you see where I am coming from with this?
I do not think the traditions of your upbringing are any cause for concern like food, names, etc. Some believers in the NT were named after Greek gods. Like Apollos. Those things are no cause for concern at all. Not even dress. My cousins were missionaries in India and dressed in Sari's, etc the whole time there. They ate the same food, etc.
And as I said, I love the stretching exercises/positions. I bought one of those cheap pocket books at the grocery years back with a whole slew of the positions of stretching but it said nothing about meditations, etc.
What if I announced Kaballah for Christians. Could it be done?
I can not claim Iyengar Yoga is Christian. There are hindu concepts and philosophy built into this yoga. Especially breathing and focus/meditation excercises. At least from what I know, one does not chant any mantras or attempt to "blank" one's mind. But so far my experience is all the asanas (poses/exercises) are simply bringing awareness and focus of the mind to the different parts of the body and most of Iyengar Yoga is the breathing in and out during various asanas that streches/relaxes various muscles of the body.
I am only in the beginning stages of this yoga. In the later stages of yoga, the "dhyana" asanas comes in. In Iyengar yoga, Iyengar believe that the body is easy to master than the mind, so most of the beginner asanas are body asanas.
I've taken classes from time to time at a local yoga studio. It calls itself this, and calls what it does "yoga". There is no guru: I have experience with the guru system, and the whole idea gave me the willies even before I was called to Christ.
Some of the language used during the class is non-Christian in the sense of belonging to other spiritual practices, but mostly it's non-Christian in the sense of lacking religious or spiritual content: The teachers there are very grounded in the practical physical aspects of the practice, and help people incorporate whatever modifications they may need to because of injury, etc.
Practicing yoga, for me, it helps me to have space in which I can breathe: to act instead of simply reacting. To focus on Christ more often in my interactions with others rather than on my own perceived or real woundedness. This would not even be possible without the Holy Spirit within me, and perhaps there are other ways I can listen to the Spirit, which I am open to and seeking for, but I wanted to share my experience, as a Christian person, with yoga.
Yoga may be good for some Christians, yet tempt other Christians to stray from Christ. I also do not expect it to be beneficial for all Christians to be vegetarian, as I have been, or to drink alcohol, as I do, as these things are not good for all people.
The owner of the studio, who is also one of the instructors, is not a Christian. He and I have spoken about the fact that I am a Christian and that he welcomes Christians to the studio. Some of you may point out that he may be Satan luring Christians into the evil of yoga. I mention his attitudes merely to note his lack of open hostility toward the faith. |
-
Recent Reports:
- Who is Dr. Conspiracy and why has he been hacking into my computer and planting malware?
- 05.09.2013. BRIEF OF AMICUS CURIAE LUCAS DANIEL SMITH, PRO SE, IN SUPPORT OF APPELLANTS. HUGH McINNISH, et al. vs BETH CHAPMAN, in her capacity as Secretary of State. SUPREME COURT OF ALABAMA. Case No. 1120465.
- 16mm film (400 ft) footage of birth in Barack Obama’s Kenya!
- Steven Spielberg’s “Obama” (Published at the whitehouse youtube channel on April 27, 2013.)
- Luke finally finds cryptid dinosaur Mokele Mbembe deep in the Congo (Africa)!
- Barack H. Obama (Sr.) – Bachelor of Arts – University of Hawaii – June 17, 1962.
- Close-up Barack Hussein Obama (Sr.) passport photographs (1959 & 1964).
- Barack Hussein Obama (Sr.) – Kenya Passport (no. 5866) – September 18, 1964.
- Barack Obama’s width between shoulders. Dr. James Ang’awa, Shoulder Presentation and Shoulder Dystocia.
- Barack Hussein Obama (Sr.) – British Passport – April 29, 1959.
- 1952 – Kenya Principal (Police) Ordinance, Section 34: footprint identification and record.
- The High Court of Kenya at Nairobi. Dr. Barack Hussein Obama died on the 26th day of November, 1982?
- Backside of Barack Obama’s 1961 (2009 certified copy) Coast Province General Hospital, Mombasa, British Protectorate of Kenya, Certificate of Birth.
- Joel W. Pett
- Cody Wilson: Fabricate your own gun with a 3D-Printer.
New Comments:
- This is probably your saddest,...
- @ KJA617: Save the tears &a...
- You're one sick SOB! How dare ...
- @ Emmor Oyde: WHEN DID A SILL...
- @ Greatkim: " KISS " ( KEEP I...
- this could be useful...
- you are now stating you have b...
- Since when did being a small t...
50 Preceeding Comments:Voice of Reason: This is probably your saddest, most pathetic attempt at a smear yet. Guess that scary black man being in the White House has cost you so much sleep, that your little racist brain just can't handle it any more....Rambo Ike: @ KJA617: Save the tears & phony outrage. Re: "I’ve read Doc C’s site for a couple of years and if there is one thing he doesn’t tolerate is people being harassed." Lmao. Pot, Kettle. I've read Dr Con's site off & on for the last couple of years, plus some of the archives. The whole mode of operation there is to harrass, belittle, and smear anyone that isn't in lockstep with him & his useful idiot lapdog choir. Here's a recent example of how the operation works: On...KJA617: You're one sick SOB! How dare you go after someone's family members, publishing private information for all the birther nutjobs to see? We know what they've done at Orly's direction and now you're trying to get them to follow you with your nutty theories. I've read Doc C's site for a couple of years and if there is one thing he doesn't tolerate is people being harassed. I don't know why you feel the need to do this, you've proven nothing except that you're a lowlife POS. We already know you'...AMERICAN ADVOCATE: @ Emmor Oyde: WHEN DID A SILLY ASS WITH A WEIRD NAME BECOME ELIGIBLE TO QUESTION SUCH A VALID DOCUMENT OR THE MAN WHO OBTAINED IT FROM THE SOURCE?...AMERICAN ADVOCATE: @ Greatkim: " KISS " ( KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID ) WHAT A WASTE OF TIME AND SPACE TO POST THIS ARTICLE ( BOOK ) ON THE COAST PROVINCE GENERAL HOSPITAL . SINCE YOU IMAGINE THAT LUCAS IS A PUPPET , WE INVITE YOU TO STAY OFF THIS BLOG AND BE BURIED BESIDE YOUR DEAD DOG KIM . YOU HAVE BEEN A PAIN IN THE ASS FOR TOO MANY MONTHS NOW , AND IT IS TIME YOU FIND SOMETHING ELSE TO DO ....Greatkim: this could be useful: you are now stating you have bribed the Hospital's Chief Admin Othigo with USD 5000. How do you think she will react should the judge order to inform her ? She has become quite a prominent figure in the meanwhile. The alternative, if you are lucky, is that he trashes your brief without examining it, and that is what you are hoping for ! Lucas, I don't know who is pulling the strings here, but you are obviously a puppet and you don't have a clue about what you are risking...Emmor Oyde: Since when did being a small time criminal , forger, and con artist make one a "sociologist"?...Mary: LOL! You also never address the issues. The "baby" on your fake BC is waaaay short. President Obama is of above average height. You cannot find a single birth certificate, hospital keepsake or government-issued, that lists "width between shoulders". There is NO reason to measure "width between shoulders" except for a medical research study. The measurements that are done on newborns are: length, weight, head circumference, chest circumference and abdominal circumference. There are goo...Andi: The Usurper can just take his shoe off & settle this now!...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote:, ‘Credible evidence that Barack Hussein Obama II was not born within the United States of America’ (pages 7-11) to be of primary and particular interest...Bruce: Free Republic is running a thread titled, 'Oh My!: Obama's Kenyan Birth Certificate Submitted To The Alabama Supreme Court Ballot Appeals Case', which was started 5/14/2013 by 'Cold Case Posse Supporter' The thread references: Excerpt: BRIEF OF AMICUS CURIAE LUCAS DANIEL SMITH, PRO SE, IN SUPPORT OF APPELLANT...Bruce:, 'Credible evidence that Barack Hussein Obama II was not born within the United States of America' (pages 7-11) to be of primary and particular interest. However, I th...Bruce: (1) Total Embed Views on the scribd Amicus Brief - 17,400 (7:10 pm ET, 5/15/2013) (2) Some additional blog posts and links concerning the topic: Lucas Smith Files Amicus Brief in AL McInnish/Goode v Chapman Obama Eligibility Case: (Note - The 5/13/2013 'Birther Report' and 'Before It's News' posts are separately covered in the comments above.) This log will be updated, from time to time, when judged appropriate. Obama State Ballot Challenge - 5/13/2013 of Reason: And in doing so, you've doomed the case....Bruce: Obama’s Purported Kenyan Birth Certificate Submitted In Alabama Supreme Court Case Before It's News 5/13/2013 View the complete post at:: Comment to the above cited Birther Report post by 'julio schwartz' on 5/13/2013 I would say that paper has bounel's footprints all over it! LOL...Bruce: Obama's Purported Kenyan Birth Certificate Submitted In Alabama Supreme Court Case Birther Report 5/13/2013 Excerpt: Obama's Purported Kenyan Birth Certificate Submitted In Alabama Supreme Court Case Via David LaRocque: Investigator Files Amicus Brief in Alabama Presidential Eligibility Case Claiming to Prove Obama’s Kenyan Birth BRIEF OF AMICUS CURIAE LUCAS DANIEL SMITH, PRO SE, IN SUPPORT OF APPELLANTS. HUGH McINNISH, et al. vs BETH CHAPMAN, in her capacity as Secretary of S...Lucas Daniel Smith: Mary wrote:! Calm down, Cujo. No one here "disappeared" your previous comment. You posted your previous comment (...Mary:!...Ericka Gallinger: de...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote: State Department orders firm to remove 3D-printed guns web blueprints The overreaction to this thing is really over the top! As a teenager, in the mid-and-late 1990s (before the internet was popularly accessible) I was a subscriber to Loompanics Unlimited mail catalog and Paladin Press mail catalog and Eden Press mail catalog. Back then they published hard to find and controversial books. Paladin Press was even sued regarding a book called "Hit Man" by Rex Feral which the...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote: Liberator – Dawn of the Wiki Weapons Thanks for posting this, Bruce. I saw the video earlier this week but I was tied up and could not post it. I'm really proud of Cody Wilson and his team. It appears that they have created the first totally and categorically plastic gun (aside from the common metal nail which is inserted as the firing pin). Furthermore, it appears to be an original design. No copyright or patent infringements/violations. (Even though nearly all AR ri...Lucas Daniel Smith: @ Bruce: Mary Ang'awa (born in Mombasa and daughter of Obama's birth doctor James Ang'awa) attended the Limuru Girl's School. Very interesting indeed, Bruce! I found another reference as well: ...ehancock: Re: "Hasn’t officials in Hawaii also said there is no Birth Certificate? " Answer: No, no official in Hawaii has ever said that there is no birth certificate. A birther site said that the current governor of Hawaii said it, but he didn't say it, and three officials in Hawaii (two Republican and one Democrat) have said that they saw the BC in the files where it is supposed to be and that the facts on it were EXACTLY the same as on the one that the White House showed. No one has shown th...Bruce: State Department orders firm to remove 3D-printed guns web blueprints Defense Distributed tweeted on Thursday that 'Liberator' project had 'gone dark' at the request of government officials The Guardian Amanda Holpuch, Ewen MacAskill in New York and Charles Arthur in London 5/10/2013 Excerpt: The US government has blocked a Texas-based company from distributing details online of how to make a plastic gun using a 3-D printer. The ban, by the State Department citing international ...Bruce: Liberator - Dawn of the Wiki Weapons WATCH: First 3D-Printed Plastic Gun Fired In Texas Mediaite Matt Wilstein 5/6/2013 Excerpt: Who needs a background check when you can just print your own gun in the comfort of your own home? That’s just one of the many questions to arise from the latest product created by Defense Distributed, a non-profit based in Texas. The organization has reportedly invented the world’s first 3D-printed gun, and released a video of the product in ac...Bruce: Greatkim wrote: ... Kenyans have children. Yes! Kenyans do indeed actually have children. Thank you for pointing out that obscure and interesting tidbit of information. According to InspectorSmith: By the way, did you know that the doctors own daughther, “Mary Ang’awa” was born in Mombasa? Reference: Comment 31, as linked the the below-linked Free Republic thread: Thus, it seem BOTH BHO-II and Lady Justice Ma...Greatkim: @ Voice of Reason: that Kenyans have children....Bruce: Glenn Beck: Man with AR15 commits suicide NRA Convention, 2013 Glenn updates the NRA audience on what happened in Houston and why he thinks the man with an AR15 fired shots before he committed suicide....Voice of Reason: Congrats. You've proven....what exactly?...Bruce: JUSTICE MARY ANG'AWA, daughter of the late Dr. James O.W. Ang'awa who delivered Barack Hussein Obama II on August 4, 1961 at the CPGH, Mombasa, Kenya is appropriately classified as a 'Luminary' graduate of the Limuru Girls School in Limuru, Kenya. Thank you Lucas for posting the interesting film giving a view of life in Limuru from the perspective of some folks in the lower socio-economic strata of Kenyan society in 1970, just...Rambo Ike: @ ehancock: Ike- “Why would a clerk be in the files of the Hawaiian Dept. of Health filling out a form to generate the short-form BC in 2007 when it wasn’t until 2008 when the Obama operatives requested it?” ehancock: "Because, duh, you got your facts wrong. Obama requested it in 2007." Going to go with you on this one. Dan Pfeiffer most likely lied to the American people. Obama operatives were in the Hawaiian Health Dept. records in 2007 putting something together as cover in ...Rambo Ike: @ ehancock: Re: "..the fact that Columbia University says that Obama attended Columbia College is sufficient." "Columbia University says" ~grin~ Release the records then we can end all this "who said what" nonsense. Re: "The fact that people who hate Obama claim that these facts did not happen only shows that they hate Obama." And Bush, Clinton, Bush Sr., Reagan, Carter, Ford, Nixon, Johnson, Kennedy were also hated. Bush was hated so much that your ilk had rallies in cities around...Rambo Ike: @ ehancock: Re: "Who are Bruce and Arnold Tapp?" That's funny, because you've replied to both of them further up on this thread. Re: "The officials in Kenya say that they investigated Obama being born there, and he wasn’t. The officials in Hawaii say that there is proof that Obama was born there, confirmed by the birth notices in the papers..." Still working what the people said angle: "The officials in Kenya say.." & "The officials in Hawaii say.." Hasn't your Dear Le...Rambo Ike: @ ehancock: Re: No I didn’t. If you read it again, I said that IF you had to determine whether the birth certificate was real or fake you had to compare it with the original. But I never said that you have to determine whether the birth certificate is real or fake. You stated very plainly on Oct 4th that it was "true" re: there was noway to prove whether a copy is genuine or a forgery without having the original to compare it to. ” Now you want to backtrack from that. Sure looks to me li...AMERICAN ADVOCATE: @ Mary: >>> AND " WE THE PEOPLE " WHO ARE AWAKE AND AWARE OF THE FACTS AGAINST YOUR VILLAGE IDIOT ARE LAUGHING AT AND PITYING YOU AND ALL OTHERS WHO ARE DUPED , FOOLED, TRICKED BY THE TREASONOUS , FRAUDULENT , INELIGIBLE , INEPT , INCOMPETENT , LYING COMMUNIST MUSLIM LOVER . ARE YOU SO IGNORANT AND STUPID THAT YOU DO NOT KNOW OF THE MANY NATIONWIDE EFFORTS TO EXPOSE obummer AND REMOVE HIM FROM OFFICE ??? THERE IS LITERALLY A MOUNTAIN OF PROOF THAT obozo HAS NO CLAIM AT ALL TO CITIZEN...Mary: Funny how you NEVER have addressed the FACT that the weight and length of your purported "baby Obama" on your FAKE Kenyan birth certificate is so far off the wt/lt charts that it indicates the child would be a Dwarf. Yeah, President Obama really looks like a dwarf. Mebbe you should look for records of leg transplants. LOL. Also hospitals do not issue anything but vanity birth certificates - have you found any from non-US hospitals? There is NO REASON to keep a copy of such in a medical record...Bruce: Image credit: CrazyFoolz.com Maybe I should just pack up and go home to Kenya!...Bruce: An American navy man's most SECRET and PRECIOUS possession!: @ Inspector Smith: Phyllis was a wonderful, witty lady and a true patriot. I miss her as well....Voice of Reason: I firmly believe concepts like sarcasm and irony are lost on birthers....Emmor Oyd: What is with the wrinkled paper background? That is really amateurish. I have never seen a diploma that didn't have the field that the degree was awarded. Couldn't you find that BHO Sr. got his BA in Economics before you produced this in GIMP? (I figure Lucas is too poor to afford a real copy of Photoshop.)...Bruce: greatkim wrote: Unless you really believe it wasn’t Obama playing Lewis playing Obama. OF COURSE the video WAS a spoof and Obama WAS playing Lewis playing Obama. Duh! --- But what part of the below quoted TRUE but rather puzzling statement by 'friend' Spielberg in the Obama Administration's approved video DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND? We never got his transcripts ... --- Quoting the wise words from an accomplished and internationally well-funded, Kenyan-born politician: The on...greatkim: common Bruce, you can't be serious ! It's a spoof shown at the WH correspondents dinner. Unless you really believe it wasn't Obama playing Lewis playing Obama....Bruce: AMERICAN ADVOCATE wrote: >>> YEEHAW , Y ‘ ALL <<< I GREW UP IN HOUSTON , TEXAS – JUST ACROSS THE BORDER FROM LOUISIANA , AND LEARNED TO LOVE THEIR MUSIC , INCLUDING " BLUE BAYOU ( ROY ORBISON ) , " JAMBALAYA " (HANK WILLIAMS) AND " ADALIDA " BY GEORGE STRAIT . Carl, It sounds like you might also enjoy a 'no frills, down-home' Louisiana based video I posted yesterday over on the 'Inspector Smith Forum' titled, 'D.L. Menard sings The Back D...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote: Phyllis was living in Lacombe, Louisiana at the time of her passing. However, she had lived in Mandeville, LA at some time previous to that. Mandeville is a small, friendly lakeside community located across Lake Pontchartrain from New Orleans. I and my family also lived in Mandeville for a short while in the mid 70s, although likely not during the same time period as Phyllis. We frequently enjoyed the local, fresh cooked gumbo! Bruce Steadman, thank you for sharing some of your ...Lucas Daniel Smith: AMERICAN ADVOCATE wrote: I GREW UP IN HOUSTON , TEXAS – JUST ACROSS THE BORDER FROM LOUISIANA , AND LEARNED TO LOVE THEIR MUSIC , INCLUDING " BLUE BAYOU ( ROY ORBISON ) , " JAMBALAYA " ( HANK WILLIAMS) AND " ADALIDA " BY GEORGE STRAIT . Arnold Carl Tapp, thank you for sharing some of your history with all of us here at the WOBIK blog! Always a pleasure to learn more about you!...AMERICAN ADVOCATE: @ Inspector Smith: @ Bruce: >>> YEEHAW , Y ' ALL <<< I GREW UP IN HOUSTON , TEXAS - JUST ACROSS THE BORDER FROM LOUISIANA , AND LEARNED TO LOVE THEIR MUSIC , INCLUDING " BLUE BAYOU ( ROY ORBISON ) , " JAMBALAYA " ( HANK WILLIAMS) AND " ADALIDA " BY GEORGE STRAIT ....Bruce: I found the following statements by Spielberg, occurring between the 0.17 and 0.25 marks in the video, to be particularly interesting: ... I mean - Who is Obama really? We don't know. We never got his transcripts and they say he's kind of aloof. ... His remark about Obama refusing to provide his college transcripts, as requested by Trump and others, is certainly significant. It's also a bit puzzling as well because this entire video was obviously pre-cleared for showing at the event by ...Inspector Smith: AMERICAN ADVOCATE wrote: . I also miss Phyllis....Inspector Smith: Bruce wrote: Carl, Thanks for sharing that wonderful story with us! Phyllis is greatly missed by many, many folks, most certainly including me. She was an exceedingly patriotic, brave, tenacious and witty lady. I agree and I too miss Phyllis....Bruce: The following is a link to posts made by Phyllis (VikingLady) on the 'Inspector Smith Forum': AMERICAN ADVOCATE wrote: SEVERAL DAYS AGO , I COOKED A FANTASTIC CHICKEN GUMBO , USING THE RECIPE SENT TO ME BY NONE OTHER THAN PHYLLIS VRETTOS . IT WAS SO GOOD THAT I ATE 3 BOWLS AND MY WIFE ATE 4 BOWLS . ... I MISS HER . Carl, Thanks for sharing that wonderful story with us! Phyllis is greatly missed by many, many folks, most certainly including me. She was an exceedingly patriotic, brave, tenacious and witty lady. The following is a post by Lucas entered July 22, 2012: ...AMERICAN ADVOCATE: @ Bruce: TO CHANGE THE SUBJECT TO SOMETHING PLEASANT , WHICH IS OF INTEREST TO LONGTIME FOLLOWERS OF LUCAS : ....Bruce: Free Republic is running a thread titled, 'Breaking: Federal Investigators Now Believe a Third Terrorist May Have Been Involved in Boston', which was started 4/26/2013 by '2ndDivisionVet' The thread references a 4/26/2013 Gateway Pundit article written by Jim Hoft - Excerpt: Megyn Kelly reported Friday that the bombs used in the Boston Marathon attacks had...Bruce: 4 Major Questions That Remain About the Saudi National Tagged as 212(a)(3)(b), ‘Terrorist Activities’ TheBlaze Madeleine Morgenstern 4/26/2013 Excerpt:...Bruce: Top-Ranking GOP Rep. Says There Are ‘Clearly More Persons of Interest’ in Boston Bombing TheBlaze Madeleine Morgenstern 4/27/2013 Excerpt: The chairman of the House Intelligence Committee said there are “clearly more persons of interest” in the Boston Marathon bombing, despite some officials saying the Tsarnaev brothers acted alone. “I hear a lot of definitive statements out there that it was just these two men and it’s over, but I will tell you I hear these briefings e...Rambo Ike: Is this the same "ellen" that posts here as "ehancock"?: "They [Birthers] have a motive, and it is not at all nice. They only act as if the truth was meaningless because they hope to find a nut with a gun who believes the lies." "But most birther sites and most of those who post on them just say that they believe that Obama was born in a foreign county even though they really don’t because they hope there will be a violent nut who believes that claim." Looks likes, if that's her, she'...Voice of Reason: Looks like dementia has finally taken a firm hold....Lucas Daniel Smith: @ Edward C. Noonan: Barack Obama's Kenyan birth certificate (2009 Certified Copy of 1961 Coast Province General Hospital, Mombasa, British Protectorate of Kenya, Certificate of Birth) has not been debunked. Moreover, I don't believe that the document can be debunked. The document is authentic. The chief intendment and objective of the Was Obama Born In Kenya Blog is that of confirming authentication of Barack Obama's Kenyan birth certificate. Within your comment you reference the footpr...Bruce: Edward C. Noonan wrote: ...the opposition says it was “debunked” and even Mike Zullo agrees. I am unsure who OBC thinks debunked your Kenyan BC, but I guess they know something that I do not… Edward, If you have not done so already, please check out the following two references which are posted on the 'Inspector Smith Forum': (1) The Lucas Daniel Smith, Obama Kenyan Birth Certificate is AUTHENTIC, Compilation of Support Data: C. Noonan: Lucas, Today I got an email from OBAMA BALLOT CHALLENGE which reported as a fact that "It occurred to Carl Tapp, upon seeing our last post on the AL Democrats’ alleged submission of a fourth “birth certificate,” that there were other good or better ones around. He sent me this (link below). Most of you have already seen it before and know that the opposition says it was “debunked” and even Mike Zullo agrees. I don’t know if Mike concurs (unlikely), but it seems that if we could c...Lucas Daniel Smith: ...Lucas Daniel Smith: @ tom: Well said. I certainly don't agree with everything you written but, nonetheless, you have presented (in your 2nd comment) a number of cogent valid points. Leveled headed and well stated. Thank you for contributing to the WasObamaBornInKenya (WOBIK) blog....tom: Lucas: 1) Your stats on the Iraq war and your whole argument that the USA has committed horrible acts of war on innocent civilians all over the world is, in my opinion, absolutely correct (I mean, we dropped 2 atomic bombs on civilians...) -- but how does that detract from my point that leaving bombs in a marathon crowd is a cowardly act? Dropping atomic bombs is not "brave" either. Drone strikes aren't "brave." Enlisting in the army (or being forced to enlist circa WWII), and being deployed ...Bruce: Bill O'Reilly To Glenn Beck: Initial Boston Bombing Suspect Member Of Saudi Royal Family Birther Report 4/26/2013 Excerpt: Video View the complete Birther Report presentation at: Daniel Smith: @ tom: Thank you for your opinions. I have a few facts for you: Do you know how many Iraqis were killed, by US troops, between 2003 thru 2009 in the Iraq War? You don't, but I 'll tell you what the US Gov. has recorded: 109,023 Iraqis. Did you know that 66,081 of those Iraqis were innocent civilians (not insurgents)? That's nearly 2/3. Most of those 66,081 were murdered and were not victims of stray bullets or indirect victims of bombings nor were they what is typically referre...tom: A few thoughts: - Setting off bombs in a crowd of unarmed civilians to kill them or hurt them horribly (children included), and slinking off afterwards, is one of the most cowardly things a person could do. - Trying to compare the courage of the police officers on the scene of that shootout with the "courage" of Tamerlan as he strolled out, gun-a'blazing, like a scene from Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, is very misguided. Tamerlan was motivated by hate, and possibly by a delusion that h...Bruce: Glenn Beck: End Of Obama Admin; White House Editing Documents; Saudi Visited White House? Birther Report 4/25/2013 Link to coverage of this fast-breaking, important topic on the 'Inspector Smith Forum' at:: oops forget the img...greatkim: thanks Bruce. Where action, he is ! This one is dedicated to all good birthers courageous and unaware victims of the changing world. 2nd from the "Watch Your Back" series Bruce, for your solace, I am planning some images about the riducules of Obotism as well. The shooting president is a good starting point. Then Something like birthers and obots uniting against the common enemy Mbembe. After that a "Birthers and Obots Unite" video with a joint band of country stars and rappers prai......Bruce: greatkim wrote: sad loss of art indeed. But what about my aim when shooting darts Bruce ? Congratulations! You appear to be equally talented at both Photoshop and darts! This looks like something Andy Warhol might have crafted during his prime, creative years - LOL. I don't think the ART has been 'lost'. You have just converted it from 'fantasy patriot art' (Go Luke! Ride that ferocious, cryptid beast all the way to Mombasa!) to 'pop obot art' (Luke is finally getting what he dese...greatkim: Bruce wrote: Tragically, in a rit of fealous jage he pinned the PRICELESS ORIGINAL IMAGE of Luke riding Mokele Mbembe up on the wall and used it thereafter as a DART-BOARD, thereby ruining its artistic and historical value. – very sad, indeed! sad loss of art indeed. But what about my aim when shooting darts Bruce ?...Bruce: Throats Slit, Triple Jewish Murder Tied to Boston Jihad Bomber Happened on September 11th Atlas Shrugs Pamela Geller 4/23/2013 Excerpt: UPDATE:. .........Lucas Daniel Smith: greatkim wrote:. No. It's called a 'movie' and a movie review. The main character's n...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote: ...nefarious and conniving ‘greatestkim’, who surreptitiously followed Luke to the Congo as a spy for a competitive film company. The spy 'greatestkim' kept Luke in sight at all times, even as Luke used the bathroom (urinated) in the Congo jungle. greastestkim quickly jotted down the following notes: 1. WTF! 2. Goddamn that's a gimongous hose. 3. Appears to be excellent water pressure. 4. Is that thing real???...Lucas Daniel Smith: Bruce wrote: A prominent character featured in ‘The Obama Project’ is shown in the following image attempting in vain to shoot Luke off the back of the fast moving Mokele Mbembe. Is that an Assault Rifle or a Weapon of Mass Destruction!...Bruce: A prominent character featured in 'The Obama Project' is shown in the following image attempting in vain to shoot Luke off the back of the fast moving Mokele Mbembe. The now-inseparable pair, Luke and 'Moke', successfully elude all challengers and head East to Mombasa in search of a rare, authentic historical document! ...Bruce: In 'The Obama Project' the 5 star rated sequel to the highly acclaimed 'The Dinosaur Project', Luke can be seen firmly in control of a ferocious Mokele Mbembe and riding off in the general direction of Mombasa, Kenya. The rare, mint-condition image shown below was produced by the nefarious and conniving 'greatestkim', who surreptitiously followed Luke to the Congo as a spy for a competitive film company. When 'greatestkim' learned that a copy of this historic and amazing image had been s...greatkim:....Bruce: Tamerlan Tsarnaev and Family Received Welfare The Weekly Standard Daniel Halper 4/24/2013 Excerpt: Tamerlan Tsarnaev was on welfare, sponsored by tax payers. Tsarnaev, now dead, is suspected of bombing the Boston Marathon last week. "Marathon bombings mastermind Tamerlan Tsarnaev was living on taxpayer-funded state welfare benefits even as he was delving deep into the world of radical anti-American Islamism, the Herald has learned," reports the Boston Herald. "State officials c...Lucas Daniel Smith: "Petition to guarantee Dzhokhar Tsarnaev the right to a fair trial."...Lucas Daniel Smith: @ Bruce: I hope that guy in the video has a good place to hide because the Boston/Watertown police are coming for him! (lol). His neighbors, and everyone else in the city/town where he lives are soon to be a little annoyed, and maybe even furious, because the Boston/Watertown police are about to issue a "Shelter in place" so there gonna be stuck indoors for a while!...Lucas Daniel Smith: DGroundhog wrote: Saddam Hussein did not have WMDs but the Boston bombers did. Got it. Well said! I wouldn't be surprised if you soon see that printed on T-shirts! It'd also make for a riveting book title!...Bruce: Free Republic is running a thread titled, 'Saudi ‘Person Of Interest’ Is Osama Bin Laden’s Son', which was started 4/22/2013 by 'LucyT' The thread references a 4/22/2013 GOPTheDailyDose post by Amy - View the complete Free Republic thread at: Excerpt: HAMZA IS KNOWN AS THE “CROWN PRINCE OF TERROR,” AND VOWED REVENGE VS. USA. HA...greatkim: Lucas, you are obviously an intelligent man and you have obviously gone through much suffering. You are still young, you probably have talent, why waste your days with childish frauds ? Internet popularity is not worth the risk of schizophrenia and social and mental alienation. Think about it. You have my mail...Bruce: Consider the following quote from page 12 in the referenced publication, Defining "Weapons of Mass Destruction" by W. Seth Carus The phrase “weapons of mass destruction,” for example, is an amorphous one, changing meaning according to the whims of the speaker. Raising the specter of WMD is more a way by which politicians assign blame or take a stand on seemingly objective moral standards than a way by which they assess a particular weapons system. I'm in a funky, contrary mood this mor...DGroundhog: Saddam Hussein did not have WMDs but the Boston bombers did. Got it....Imi Roheim: I leave a comment each time I especially enjoy a article on a site or if I have something to add to the conversation. It is a result of the sincerness communicated in the article I read. And after this article The High Court of Kenya at Nairobi. Dr. Barack Hussein Obama died on the 26th day of November, 1982? | Lucas Daniel Smith's Blog. I was actually moved enough to drop a thought :-P I actually do have a couple of questions for you if you don't mind. Is it only me or do some of the...Lucas Daniel Smith: @ greatkim: Are you nuts? I have absolutely zero sympathy for the alleged Boston bombers. (and lay off all the George W. talk about terror, terrorists and terrorism) I don't support broadly interpreted laws such as Weapons of Mass Destruction. My cell phone could be turned into a Weapon of Mass Destruction. I don't believe in enemy combatants either. There proper terminology is Prisoner of War, see the Geneva Convention. Lastly, I prefer the facts and if the facts indicate that the...greatkim: pressure cooker filled with explosives IS a weapon of mass destruction because .....it can cause massive destruction. + according to just. dpt he will not be treated as enemy combatant. I am under the impression you are moved by some sympathy toward these two terrorists. Am I wrong ?...Bruce: Lucas Daniel Smith says: I see it as a desperate attempt to save his brother’s life. I agree with your assessment regarding the likely scenario of events surrounding the incident under discussion here. That is, the younger brother had a desperate, instinctive plan to first 'scatter' the BPD officers by charging at them with the SUV and then somehow to stop, retrieve his brother, and escape. Dzhokhar Tsarnaev's plan was NOT WISE and it certainly DID NOT WORK AS INTENDED but I agree t...Lucas Daniel Smith: I just read that Dzhokhar Tsarnaev could possibly be slapped with a "weapon of mass destruction" charge, which carries a penalty of death. Pressure cooker improvised explosive devices = weapons of mass destruction? Damn George W. Bush and his 'enemy combatants' and 'weapons of mass destruction'. Daniel Smith: Dzhokhar Tsarnaev is now awake in the hospital and responding, in writing, to questions. It seems that he cannot, or is having serious difficulties with, talking because of a gunshot neck wound which authorities are indicating may have been an attempt at suicide before his capture. I understand that there is not a defense attorney present and that 72 hour deadline has not yet expired....Lucas Daniel Smith: My younger brother went on to graduate from the University of Iowa and is now working on his Masters degree....Lucas Daniel Smith: Lawmakers Push for Federal Trial [as apposed to a 'military tribunal'] of Boston Suspect The New York Times By MARC SANTORA Published: April 21, 2013 Excerpt: "Many local and national lawmakers said that the federal courts would be the best place to hold a trial, rather than a military tribunal. "“I hope he’s brought to trial in federal court. He will get a fair trial,” said Senator Lindsey Graham of South Carolina. “The public defender assigned to him should vigorously def...Lucas Daniel Smith: Ku Daytaw wrote: That’s excellent! Where was this obtained? It looks like Mr. Obama, Sr. balled it up and threw it in the trash, and it was rescued for posterity’s sake. Was this found on your many travels to Kenya? No, I did not find this while traveling in Kenya. I also need to point out that, for the record, I was in Kenya in 2009 but I have not traveled "many" times to Kenya. I will release the source soon. I'm allotting reasonable and sufficient time for others to asce...Lucas Daniel Smith: @ joeymac: Larcenous Lucas has done so much and is such a player, but tried to hit Orly Taitz up for meal money to avoid “living on bananas,” shoplifts from Eckerds, and steals juice from the power company. You know everything about me because you can read stuff about me online? My entire life is online? Yet its been two weeks now and you, nor anyone else with an internet connection, can locate and ascertain the ‘source’ of Barack Obama Sr.’s passport (British and Kenyan passp...
The Annals:
Related Sites
- 2012 Patriot – Dont Tread On Me
- Arnie Rosner – Scanned Retina
- Beckwith – The Obama File
- Birther Headlines
- Charles Edward Lincoln, III – Tierra Limpia
- Conservative Arizona Patriot
-
- Occidental Dissent
- Orly Taitz – Defend Our Freedoms Foundation
- Philip J. Berg – ObamaCrimes
- Radio Patriot
- Sam Sewell – The Steady Drip
- The Obama Hustle
- The Post & Email
Tag Archives: Iowa election day vote Romney |
Press Briefing
February 22, 2013 | 53:23 | Public Domain
White House Press Briefings are conducted most weekdays from the James S. Brady Press Briefing Room in the West Wing.
Press Briefing by Press Secretary Jay Carney and Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood, 2/22/2013
James S. Brady Press Briefing Room
11:34 A.M. EST
MR. CARNEY: I just want to say that it is my pleasure, and clearly yours, to have with me today the Secretary of Transportation, Ray LaHood, who is here to speak with you about the impacts of sequester, if it comes to pass, on the American travel industry.
And as we’ve talked about a lot, the indiscriminate, deep cuts will affect everyone, really, in America, and industries. And Secretary LaHood is here to discuss one aspect of that with you and to take some questions. And afterwards, I’ll be here to take questions on other issues.
I just want to remind you that we’re on a slightly constrained time schedule. We have the President’s meeting with national governors -- Democratic governors, and then also the pool spray with the Prime Minister of Japan.
With that, I turn it over to Secretary LaHood.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Sequester will be a very -- will have a very serious impact on the transportation services that are critical to the traveling public and to the nation’s economy. At DOT, we will need to cut nearly a billion dollars, which will affect dozens of our programs. serious impacts of sequester. Here is what these automatic cuts are going to mean for the traveling public.
Obviously, as always, safety is our top priority, and we will never allow the amount of air travel we can handle safely to.
So we are beginning today discussions with our unions to likely close more than 100 air traffic control towers at airports with fewer than 150,000 flight operations per year. And we’re talking about places like Boca Raton, Florida; Joplin, Missouri; Hilton Head, South Carolina; and San Marcos, Texas. The list of the towers -- the list of potential towers that are to be closed, or elimination of midnight shifts, is posted on our website as I’m speaking now. So you can see the entire list there.
We’re also beginning discussions with unions to eliminate midnight shifts in over 60 towers across the country. The closures will impact services for commercial, general aviation, and military aircraft. This will delay travelers and delay the critical goods and services that communities across the country need.
These are harmful cuts with real-world consequences that will cost jobs and hurt our economy. The President has put forward a solution to avoid these cuts. And as a former member of Congress of 14 years, I urge my former colleagues to address this issue when they get back next Monday, and to work on a long-term, balanced solution to our deficit challenges.
And with that, I’ll be happy to answer some questions.
Q Mr. Secretary, these cuts and these cutbacks that you’re talking about, are these the type of things that the public will start seeing on March 2nd? Or is this going to be a longer rollout?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: We think the rollout will take from March 1st to April 1st, and they’ll begin to see the activity in the layoffs and the delays probably beginning around April 1st.
Q Are there any other ways to avoid the cuts other than those you have outlined? There are some Republicans who say you could mitigate these effects by doing other things in your budget system.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Look, the sequester doesn’t allow for moving money around. It just does not. And it’s very clear. And the idea that we can move money from one pot, say like AIP, which is the Airport Improvement fund -- which in most places has a pretty good chunk of money -- sequester doesn’t allow that.
Look, this is very painful for us because it involves our employees, but it’s going to be very painful for the flying public. As a former member of Congress, I heard complaints all the time from my constituents when their flights were delayed or when their flights were cancelled, and this is going to have an enormous impact.
Q Could you clarify why the flights will be delayed? Is it a matter of mileage between flights?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Because we’re going to reduce the number of controllers, which will reduce their ability to guide planes in and out of airports.
Q So more distance between planes -- landing distance --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, it’s going to reduce the number of controllers, which will reduce their opportunity to guide the same number of planes that they would ordinarily do at full capacity.
Q How about TSA implications?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: TSA is under Homeland Security. We’re not -- that’s a different lane.
Q Your total budget at DOT is, what, $70-some billion?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: $70 billion, in round numbers, yes -- 55,000 employees.
Q So help the public understand -- a billion dollars cut. You’ve got a big budget. Can’t you find some other way to cut that without telling air traffic controllers to stay home?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, we’re doing that. We’re looking at every contract, and we’re going -- our lawyers are looking at every contract to see what penalties we would have to pay as we begin to cut or adjust contracts. We’re looking at everything possible; and everything possible that’s legal, we will do. But.
Q But let’s be clear -- it’s less than 2 percent of your budget.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: It’s a lot of money, Jonathan. And where I come from, which is central Illinois, a billion dollars is a lot of money. And it’s very difficult when you have this kind of -- the number of employees that we have guiding planes in and out of airports to do anything except look at everything, and that’s what we’ve done.
Q Are you just basically throwing out whatever sounds like the most severe consequence in order to ratchet up pressure? And are you having discussions with some of your former colleagues up on the Hill to warn them of what’s coming?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: The answer is, yes, we are having discussions with members of Congress. We have briefed staff people on the respective committees -- commerce committee in the Senate; T&I committee in the House. And they know the impact and they know why we’re doing this. They know a lot about these numbers we’re dealing with because we work with them on a regular basis. And the idea that we’re just doing this to create some kind of a horrific scare tactic is nonsense. We are required to cut a billion dollars, and if more than half of our employees are at the FAA, the FAA -- there has to be some impact. That’s the reason we’re announcing what we’re announcing.
Q Mr. Secretary, what sort of impact will these delays have on the airline industries and their financials, specifically? Do you have any forecast for what that will do?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, we’re talking to the airline industry today -- A4A, which represents all of the airlines, we’re talking to them. We’ll be probably talking to individual airlines. We’re making this announcement today, and obviously we have to work through with them what impact this will have. But there’s no question they’re going to have to restrict some of the flights that they currently -- are on their books to fly in the next -- within the next 30 days.
Q Will they be required to compensate passengers for delays?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: You’ll have to talk to them about that.
Q I mean, isn’t that part of U.S. law that they have to do that? Where does this figure into that?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: You’ll have to talk to the airlines about that.
Yes.
Q Just to be clear, have the airlines specifically said they will definitely have to choose --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: You know, we just started to talk to the airlines today. They’re hearing about this. We’re on the phone -- our folks are on the phone with them right now. We’re on the phone with the airlines, we’re on the phone with our unions. We’re sending an email to all of our employees so everybody gets the same information at the same time.
Q So they have said it’s a possibility this is one of the things that --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, we believe that it’s not possible to continue the same schedules with less people.
Q And then on the issue of safety, how can you guarantee that safety standards will be met if you’re scaling back?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Because that's what we’re in the business of. That's what we do every day. Our people get up every day and think about safety, and we think about it in a way that maybe nobody else thinks about it -- certainly common, ordinary citizens. I’ve said many, many times people -- thousands of people today boarded planes, buses, got in their cars, and the thing they didn't think about was safety. We do.
And we’re not -- we will never take a back seat when it comes to safety. We just absolutely will not. And that's the reason, back to Jonathan’s question, we’re looking at everything. We’re not just looking at furlough days. We’re looking at every contract. Our lawyers are looking at every contract to see what impact it has for us to try and find some savings in those areas.
Q Mr. Secretary, why is the alarm being raised now? Why not three, four months ago? Why now?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Because we’re within 30 days of sequester. I mean, sequester really begins March 1st, but we have a 30-day window here to prepare people. And we’ve been working with our colleagues here at the White House and OMB for a number of months on what impact this is going to have. And now is the time to do it.
Q Mr. Secretary --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Jim.
Q Yesterday, at the Airlines for America briefing, the airline lobby actually said that there would be no effect, that they suspected there would be no significant impact on the air travel system. Where is the disconnect between what you’re saying and what the airlines are saying?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I don't think they have the information we’re presenting to them today. I don't know what they used for that, Jim. But it’s -- I think when they see the kind of cutbacks that are going to be made at some of these towers, they're going to have no choice but to really look at the fact that there are going to be delays, and there are going to have to be some cutbacks on some of these flights.
Q Let me follow up on safety, if I could. What is going to be the effect on FAA inspectors? Are you also going to furlough some of them that are doing the -- who are reviewing the safety of these planes?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Everything will be impacted in terms of the controllers and contracts. When it comes to our safety programs, there will be no compromise.
And those are things that we’re looking at, but we want to make sure that those people that are, for example, doing the work on the 787, doing the work on inspecting planes, no compromise when it comes to safety.
Q Mr. Secretary -- thank you, sir. Mr. Secretary, as far as international carriers are concerned, are you in touch with international carriers, if international passengers are going to be affected from this? Because whatever happens in Washington, whole world is affected, people around the globe.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Yes, we’ll be in touch with all of the airlines.
Q Mr. Secretary, you said you’ve been talking with the unions about this. Are they going along wholeheartedly with your proposal? Or are they --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: We just started our talks today. Our FAA Administrator, Michael Huerta, has been talking to Paul Rinaldi, the head of the controllers union. But the call today will be with the entire leadership of the controller’s union.
Q Are you concerned that they could object to the kinds of cuts you are proposing?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, we’ll find out. I mean, look, the discussions are beginning now. I’m sure that they’ve never been bashful about expressing their point of view.
Yes, sir.
Q Mr. Secretary, does this in any way affect Amtrak all that much?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: No, sir.
Q No.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: No, sir, it does not.
Yes.
Q Mr. Secretary, we went through this rodeo once before two months ago, the last time we came to the sequester deadline. Did any of these conversations happen at the end of December last year with the unions and with the airlines?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Of course. When we thought that there was going to be a sequester, of course we -- we’re in continual discussions with these folks. We have a great partnership with them. And the answer is yes, of course.
Bill.
Q Mr. Secretary, if the sequester goes through and these cuts kick in, how quickly can you turn off the switch and put things back to normal?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Look, all of our planning and all of our discussions and all of our work are about getting to where we’re at today, with this announcement, with our discussions, and we’ll see where it takes us. And planning for a restart is -- we haven’t had a lot of discussion about that at this point.
Q Is there any requirement under the sequester that once it kicks in it has to last three months or four months or five months?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: No, not that I know of.
Q What are you telling Republicans in Congress, Mr. Secretary?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: That this is going to have a huge impact on their constituents. Look, and I can tell you --
Q When you break it down politically for them, what are you saying?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: That your phones are going to start ringing off the hook when these people are delayed at airports, and their flights are delayed 90 minutes, or their flights are cancelled, or their air tower is closed.
Look, you all know I was in Congress 14 years. I represented central Illinois, which included Peoria and Springfield, both with air towers. Any time there was even a threat of a closing of an air tower in Peoria/Springfield, our phones started ringing off the hook from controllers, but also from people who use the airport.
So it’s not only the impact on the passengers, it’s the impact that it has on airports, control towers, people who work there, airports. And their phones are going to start ringing. Why does this have to happen?.
Q But to Jonathan’s question, you’re going to scrub everything to make sure the priority is safety and usability, right?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Number one is safety. Always has been, always will be. We never take a back seat when it comes to safety. We will never compromise safety -- ever. Never have and never will.
Yes, sir.
Q Do you agree with the administration’s position that this is a manufactured crisis, one manufactured by your former House colleagues?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I think Republicans need to step up here. I served for 14 years. During those 14 years, I was -- 12 of those years I was in the majority party. Speaker Gingrich was the Speaker. He worked with then-President Bill Clinton. We balanced the budget five of those fourteen years. It meant that there was compromise..
Yes, ma’am.
Q Yes, have your phones been ringing from members of the public? And if so, what are they saying?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I’m sorry have --
Q Have your phones been ringing from members of the public yet?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: No, but look, this is the announcement today. We’ve been doing a lot of this background work, and so I have no doubt my phones will ring from members of Congress -- why is my control tower being closed?
Q Mr. Secretary, where were these warnings two weeks ago, a week ago? I mean, speaking of movie references, this might be called an acting performance, because you are -- you’re going to be scaring the public today. This is going to be scaring the public about their travel plans.
SECRETARY LAHOOD:.
And we want to get it right, so we’ve spent the last few weeks putting all of this information together so we do have it right. So that we are not just taking a meat axe to one part of FAA, that we’re looking at the full breadth of the entire agency.
Q Mr. Secretary, you said that you want these guys to wake up. Have you awakened them by using a phone? Have you called any Republicans recently?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Yes, I just said I’ve been talking to Republicans and their staff on the T&I committee and on the Senate Commerce --
Q Can you tell us who you spoke with and what the nature of those interactions were? And what are they saying to you in terms of their own leadership?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I doubt if you really want a list of the members of Congress I’ve been talking to, okay? But take --
Q How many? Enumerate.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: A half a dozen.
Q And what are they telling you about what they think about their own leadership?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I didn't talk to them about their leadership. I talked to them about the impact on air travel and air traffic control towers.
Q What was their reaction?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: It’s not good. They get it.
In the back.
Q The Republicans would say -- and they have been saying this -- that the Democrats in the Senate should act on two bills that they passed in the summertime. Why aren’t you calling the Democrats in the Senate and saying, pick up -- act on the Republican bills and avoid sequester that way? What’s wrong with that approach?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I’ve been working on trying to figure out how we’re going to get to a billion dollars.
Yes, sir.
Q Mr. Secretary, in all the discussion about the sequester, you’re the first Cabinet Secretary that’s been brought into a White House briefing to talk about this for us recently. So, I mean, do you and the President think that the impatience of the American people at the airports is the strongest leverage point to press with the Republicans?
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I would describe my presence here with one word: Republican. They’re hoping that maybe I can influence some of the people in my own party.
Look, this is a big deal. It’s a big deal because a lot of people -- common, ordinary citizens fly. A lot of people use airports. And this is going to have a real impact.
Q The Department of Transportation is taking part of this hundred-city tour called the Connecting Your Community to talk about proposals in the President’s State of the Union address. Will you end your participation in that tour as a way to cut some savings right now? Sending DOT employees out to --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: Well, I was supposed to be in Orlando and South Carolina today, so I guess I have ended it.
Q Is it not going to happen? Is there going to be a bridge -- Tom Coburn is asking for an explanation of why it’s being held in light of the sequester potential? The hundred-city tour.
SECRETARY LAHOOD: You’ll have to ask Jay about that.
MR. CARNEY: I’ll take that one.
Q Mr. Secretary, let’s say -- I’m finally traveling to India in the next two weeks, should I be worried? (Laughter.)
SECRETARY LAHOOD: You’re going to be delayed. (Laughter.)
Yes, ma’am. Last one.
Q You said you’re telling Republicans to come to the table. Are you telling them to raise taxes? I mean, are you telling them to --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: No, I’m telling them to come to the table and start talking to Democrats about how we solve this. They’ll figure out the solution, just like they figured out the solution on the fiscal cliff.
Q So you’re not telling them that they shouldn’t --
SECRETARY LAHOOD: I have not told them the specifics about how to solve it. Come together, talk to one another. Figure it out. That’s the way we’ve always done things around here.
Have a great weekend, everybody.
MR. CARNEY: I want to thank Secretary LaHood with whom it is always a pleasure to share this podium. (Laughter.) No, I mean that seriously. And he’ll be missed by me and everyone else here at the White House.
If I could just -- in answer to the question in the back, we’ll just go straight to the issue here. The way to avert sequester is to pass a bill that can be agreed to by Democrats and Republicans that either buys down the sequester or, when there was time to do this, that achieves the $4-trillion goal by reducing the deficit further along the lines of the big deal that President Obama and Speaker Boehner were talking about during the fiscal cliff negotiations. There’s the offer the President made is still on the table -- spending cuts, entitlement savings, and revenues through tax reform.
In this process, if you accept the premise that for Democrats it is hard to go along with spending cuts -- or harder to go along with spending cuts and hard to go along with entitlement savings, that they might prefer to do revenues over that. So the tough sell to Democrats is to go along with spending cuts and entitlement savings, and that the tough sell, as we all know, because we hear it all the time, for Republicans is to go along with revenue increases; and that leadership is represented in part, certainly in the discourse here in Washington, by a willingness by the leaders of one party to convince their members to go along with tough choices.
And I would then ask you to look at the proposals that we put up, that I had on the screen here yesterday, the offer that we made to Speaker Boehner, the President’s budget, the President’s submission to the super committee, which was specifically designed to eliminate the sequester. And in every single one, he has put forward balance. He has put forward spending cuts and savings from entitlement reforms. And as all of you know who have covered Washington, some of that savings is a hard sell to Democrats. But this President has been leading on the issue.
Unfortunately, we have not seen any commensurate action by Republican leaders. Their answer always is: spending cuts only, no revenues, entitlement savings only, no revenues, burden borne by seniors or FAA employees or border security guards or children with disabilities, but not the wealthiest, not corporations who enjoy tax breaks, not oil and gas companies who get subsidies. That is always their answer.
So you can’t -- it is hard to find a compromise solution with a side that says the only available solution from our view is if you come 100 percent to us. And that, unfortunately, has been the narrative that you have been dealing with -- and certainly we have been dealing with -- now for -- really since the beginning of 2011.
The President supports the proposals that the Senate Democrats have put forward and the House Democrats have put forward that would buy down the sequester and give Congress time to work on a bigger deal to reach that $4-trillion target in deficit reduction. The President has signed into law, as you know, already $2.5 trillion in deficit reduction -- two-thirds of which is comprised of spending cuts and savings from entitlements. So only a third of that has been from revenues.
We want balance. The American public wants balance. There was, I think, a public poll that was published in USA Today -- I don’t see a representative from that fine newspaper here today -- but yesterday that I think cited 76 percent of the American people support a balanced approach to this challenge. Something like 19 percent supported a “my way or the highway” spending cuts-only approach.
Yes.
Q Since we’re a week away from the deadline, is it the White House expectation at this point that the sequester will take effect next Friday?
MR. CARNEY: We remain hopeful that Congress will act, that the proposals Democrats have been working on in both Houses will be taken up and passed, that Republicans will -- having heard some of the information about what the impacts will be on real people out there, and the macro impact on the economy -- will come to the conclusion that it is better simply to do what they did in December and allow this manufactured deadline to be postponed so that they can get back to the work of doing what Secretary LaHood was just talking about, which is coming together and finding a reasonable, bipartisan compromise, a balanced compromise, to complete this job of achieving $4 trillion-plus in deficit reduction over 10 years.
Q But what are the realistic prospects of that happening over the next week?
MR. CARNEY: I’ve never done very well in Vegas or Atlantic City, so I’m not going to make odds for you. We obviously are discouraged by the line that Republican leaders have taken, which is that the book is closed on revenue, despite the 76 percent of the American people who believe that balance is the right approach; that the only way to do this is the way they propose, which is not supported, obviously, in the Senate and not supported by the American people, and not supported by the President.
But we remain hopeful, and we will continue to engage with Congress. We will continue to make our case around the country about why we need to avoid the sequester, what the damage of that would be to the economy and to average folks out there who -- some of whom are working today but will not be working 30 days from now if the sequester takes effect.
This is incredibly important. It’s about the broader enterprise here that everyone is engaged in -- those who are elected and sent to Washington -- and that is taking steps to try to improve our economy, help it grow, and help the middle class. This does not help the middle class. It does the opposite. And it’s bad policy, by design, so we should not let it take place.
Jackie.
Q Jay, could you tell us about what the President’s message was to the Democratic governors this morning about this subject?
MR. CARNEY: I confess I was in other meetings so I wasn’t present. I know that the President intended to speak with governors about the issues that are of concern to them. And I think what we all know about governors is that the issues that are of concern to them tend to be issues that aren’t broken down by party affiliation. And that’s the need for actions to be taken that help job creation, the need for investments in infrastructure; issues involving implementation of the Affordable Care Act, I’m sure, immigration reform -- many of the issues that we are discussing here in Washington. But that’s not a readout, that’s just my understanding of what those conversations were likely to look like.
Q Is he intending to talk to them about encouraging them to go public with their concerns about the real-world impact of this in their states?
MR. CARNEY: Well, I don’t think you get elected governor in any state in this country if you are not out there talking about the issues that affect your constituents. And I don’t -- so I guess my answer to that is I don’t think he would have to tell governors of either party to be concerned about it or to communicate with their constituents about it. I expect that that’s going to happen across the country. And Democrats and Republicans are going to have to explain what implementation of the sequester will mean in terms of job loss, furloughs, reduced economic growth, closure of airport towers, or reduced hours for air traffic controllers at their airport. These are just a handful of the impacts that we would see if the sequester goes into effect.
Q Jay, the Secretary said sequester doesn’t allow for moving money around. Is that completely true? Does OMB have any discretion? Do the agencies have any discretion?
MR. CARNEY: I can’t remember if you were in the chair when I had Danny Werfel here to talk about this from OMB about how the law dictates what must happen in terms of the cuts. And I think Secretary LaHood reflected the -- in layman’s terms -- the facts, which is there is very little flexibility in terms of how to make those cuts happen.
Within that limited flexibility, Secretary LaHood made clear that he will -- he and I’m sure other Secretaries are doing this -- are doing everything they can to deal with these cuts and absorb them, prepare for them in a way that allows them to achieve their mission. And in the case of the Department of Transportation and the FAA, top priority is safety.
So as he said at the top, that would mean -- because the FAA is such a big chunk of the Department of Transportation and unavoidably would be affected by furloughs -- that you would have only the number of takeoffs and landings that the system could bear with a reduced staff. And that means -- and still maintain the levels of safety that the FAA does. So that means reducing the number of flights, or delaying flights, with all that means for travelers.
Q And I wasn’t just referring to the transportation, but broadly, the answer is that the flexibility is very limited?
MR. CARNEY: That’s correct. And again, I would point you to the briefing that was done I believe last week in which Danny Werfel addressed this.
Q And just one follow-up. Generally, can you give us any sort of a hint about what other plans you guys have for next week? We know the President is traveling on Tuesday, but otherwise how you intend to keep pushing this message up until the Friday deadline?
MR. CARNEY: Well, I don’t have any other events or travel to announce. He will be going to Newport News, Virginia next week, as you know, to highlight the negative consequences of sequester and how they will be felt in that town, in that state.
The fact is we have a full agenda, but it is certainly going to be the case next week that sequester and the impending deadline will I think consume a lot of people’s attention here -- both on this side of the podium and your side. And I think that our activities will include engaging, as they have in the past, engaging with Congress, hoping that we can find resolution here, hoping we can find an agreement. We’re not -- the smaller agreement, just as was the case at the end of last year, is not asking of either side, because of its size, to make all of the hard decisions.
A lot of that work would still be saved for completing the job of hitting the $4 trillion-plus target a broader deficit-reduction deal. But as the Senate proposal shows and other proposals have shown, you can do this as they did in December, in a way that is balanced but should not be that difficult.
So we’re hoping -- we remain hopeful that that will happen.
Q One of the interesting things that you’re seeing in some of these polls -- and I know you mentioned some polling in your conversation with Brendan Buck, with the Speaker’s office last night --
MR. CARNEY: Good friend, Brendan. (Laughter.)
Q -- is that there’s a large number --
MR. CARNEY: I mean that seriously.
Q There’s a large percentage of Americans who are unaware of what’s going to happen with this sequester, don't even know what the sequester is, whether it should be called sequestration or sequester.
MR. CARNEY: We’re all still struggling with that one, I think.
Q Why are these warnings, like Secretary LaHood’s warnings, coming so late in the game? I mean we’re hearing about FAA delays one week before the --
MR. CARNEY: I refrained from interjecting because he’s a Cabinet Secretary, but I wanted to say -- I wanted to leap to the podium and point that we put out, as mandated by law, a report on the implementation of sequester, I believe last September, because the deadline at that time was January 1st. And the fact is we have been talking about this and answering question, and making clear that the planning was in effect in the lead-up to the potential deadline at the end of last year.
And it was only -- remember, we’re now, what, seven weeks since the 1st of the year, so it was only -- it hadn’t been that long since the last deadline passed, but it was pushed back by the fiscal cliff deal. There was a lot of concern, obviously, late last year; in fact, a great deal of concern on the part of Republicans about the potential for sequester taking effect. They seem to have had a change of heart about that. But at the time there was great concern expressed by Republicans about that.
What was also the case is we were engaged -- because of the other deadlines, the fiscal cliff, the fact that there was the potential that taxes would go up on middle-class Americans around the country -- we were in engaged in negotiations with the Speaker of the House in an effort to try to achieve a bigger deal that would have both dealt with averting those tax hikes and further deficit reduction. Unfortunately, the Speaker walked away from that deal.
But the environment was different. Now we’re not seeing any flexibility from -- it was different then than it is now. We’re not seeing much interest at this point from Republican leaders in even engaging in a discussion about how we can move forward with a balanced package. The line they keep drawing in the sand is, I don't care what the public says, I don't care who is hurt by it; our position -- the Republican position -- is cuts only, burden borne only by senior citizens, children with disabilities.
Q Is that a fair read of the substance of the conversations that went on between the President and Republican leaders?
MR. CARNEY: I’m not going to read out those conversations. And I think you’ve seen that the leaders themselves who have had those conversations with the President aren’t reading them out.
We continue to, as a broad matter -- not specific to any one conversation -- to make the case that compromise is available here; that compromise is represented by taking a balanced approach. I mean, again, it really is important to me -- you can't -- the sort of pox on both their houses, false equivalence business that a lot of -- some commentators engage in where everybody is to blame equally here for how we got to this problem because nobody will compromise, but it is just factually incorrect.
Again, going back to that basic premise that it’s harder for Democrats to go along with spending cuts and entitlement savings and harder for Republicans to go with revenue increases -- so who has made the hard choices here? Who has made the tough proposals?
Q But to that point, Democrats like to say Republicans only control one-half of one-third of government. So shouldn’t they just have one-half of one-third of the blame?
MR. CARNEY: The fact of the matter is that we can't get anything done without a bill passing the House of Representatives, and the Democratic Party and the President of the United States do not control the House of Representatives.
We are confident that there is in excess of a majority in the Senate that would support the balanced approach that the President has put forward, that the Senate Democrats have put forward. And we know, because your polling outfits tell the public this, that the public supports the balanced approach that the President has put forward. We also know it’s the best economic policy.
I was asked yesterday, I think, why can't -- doesn't the President have some power to just make the sequester go away on his own? And, of course, he would enjoy having that power, but the law of the land does not give it to him.
Jon.
Q Jay, even before we heard from Secretary LaHood, we’ve heard some dire warnings coming from the administration. Just to tick through a few, we’ve heard about more wildfires, more workplace deaths, higher risk of terrorism, criminals set free. Is there any exaggeration going on here?
MR. CARNEY: I think all of those things come from reduced numbers of people fighting fires, reduced numbers of people doing inspections of our food, reduced numbers of people engaging in air traffic control. I mean, those are just the facts, Jon.
Q No other way to squeeze 3 percent out of the federal budget?
MR. CARNEY: I think we had this colloquy yesterday. The fact of the matter is that you are talking about a 13 percent cut in our defense budget and 9 percent cut in our nondefense discretionary budget this year. And there is no way to do that, based on the way the law is written, without having hugely negative impacts on individuals and families. Furloughs would have to happen. Layoffs would have to happen. That is a fact.
And it’s not just us saying this. You don't believe us, maybe you believe the CBO. Maybe you believe Macroeconomics Advisers or Moody’s. They have projected fully a half a percentage point reduction in GDP growth. And you know, because you cover this stuff, what that means economically. They have projected three-quarters of a million people will lose their jobs if the sequester takes effect and stays in effect.
Those are real-world consequences. These are real people. It’s not political leverage. It’s a fact. And we’re out there making clear that this is an important issue to deal with because of the real-world implications. The reason why the President continues to put forward and we made clear again on paper what we have been making clear all along, the President’s very reasonable offer remains on the table because he wants to avoid this.
Let’s just, again, go back to my basic point.. And what we haven’t seen from Republicans is anything equivalent. And we’re just looking for a negotiating partner here. We’re just looking for somebody to meet us halfway.
Q Is this hundred-city tour going to be cancelled?
MR. CARNEY: You know what, I saw somebody -- a reporter sent me this right before I came out here. I haven't had a chance to ask anybody about it. But we'll get back to you on it.
Q But this would be the kind of thing, right? I mean, you wouldn't -- specific Cabinet members all around the country --
MR. CARNEY: I appreciate that a Republican member has sent this around. I just don't have an answer for it, but I'll look into it.
Q But the broader question, Jay, would be to prioritize those things out of a sequester matrix, wouldn't it? For this President to say, we can do without those things?
MR. CARNEY: -- the sequester matrix, so I'm not sure what that means, but it sounds cool.
Q You understand what I'm saying. The President would prioritize these things out of the budget and not label them a priority against meat and poultry inspections, against FAA air traffic controllers, against wildfire fighters. I mean, wouldn't he?
MR. CARNEY: Again, I would urge you to look at the law and look at what --
Q I have.
MR. CARNEY: -- the flexibility there is in the law, and it is extremely limited. And even if it weren't --
Q Yes, it's extremely limited, but the dollars and cents can be applied at agency discretion. If there's a hundred-city tour, it can be decided --
MR. CARNEY: I appreciate the talking point based on a letter that a Republican just sent moments ago. I haven't seen it. I don't have an answer for it at this time, but I will look into it. You can find an individual thing and say that this could be cut -- and maybe it should be, whatever it is -- but it represents a drop in the bucket to an $85 billion cut, a 13 percent cut to our defense budget, and a 9 percent cut to our nondefense discretionary budget this year, this fiscal year. This is not spread out over 10 years.
Q I understand that.
MR. CARNEY: This is not something you can backload. This happens now and it affects real people. And, again, don't take our word for it. Look at what Republicans used to say about it until I guess some consultant told them to say something else. Look at what CBO and Macroeconomics Advisers and Moody's have been saying. These are just the facts of the matter.
One of the reasons why we're here, one of the reasons why we had the fiscal cliff fight and why we're discussing this is that everybody recognizes that these kind of indiscriminate, across-the-board cuts aren't good for the economy, aren't good for our defense, and they're not the way to sensibly reduce our deficit.
Q I understand that. I'm just saying this President, as all Presidents before him, took pride in prioritizing. And I'm just asking, as a priority for the President, the signal to the agencies would be prioritize your core functions --
MR. CARNEY: Absolutely.
Q -- over non-essential functions like this or something like it.
MR. CARNEY: Again, I appreciate on the item that you mentioned and I'm sure that somebody will get back to you with an answer on that.
The fact of the matter is you just had a Cabinet Secretary with enormous responsibility for an agency that affects everybody who travels in our skies tell you exactly that -- that that's what he is doing on the instructions of the President. Within the law, he's looking at every available mechanism to lessen the impact of these cuts on the core mission of the Department of Transportation, the core mission of FAA. So I think the answer is to you, yes.
Q This may be self-evident, but is it your position from the podium today to instruct or ask the Senate Democratic leadership to with all due speed next week pass their alternative to the sequester and send it to the House?
MR. CARNEY: We would absolutely like to see the Senate take up and pass legislation that would avert the sequester in a balanced way, and the House to do that as well, yes.
Q And within that context, it's $85 billion over the next nine months remaining in our fiscal year. Does the deal that the White House envisions have to be $85 billion, or would it be smaller than that?
MR. CARNEY: The buy-down --
Q Would be $85 billion --
MR. CARNEY: The buy-down could be -- look, it was two months on January 1st, December 31st -- it could be that. But the bill that has been put forward by Democrats in the Senate I believe takes it to the end of the year. The sequester, as you know, the $1.2 trillion is stretched over 10, yes.
Q Right, but that’s over the next -- all those fiscal years. But just $85 billion is the contours of what you want, and you roughly have -- portion that half revenue and half spending cuts. So the federal budget could live with --
MR. CARNEY: Well, I would point -- whatever the ratio is in the bill, I would point you to the President's overall approach to this, which has been two dollars in spending cuts to one in revenue.
Q Jay, we've heard over the last couple of years from Secretary Geithner, from Lael Brainard, from Mike Froman, their concerns that countries in the eurozone were cutting too much, too quickly. To what extent does the President's experience in watching that inform his philosophy going into these negotiations?
MR. CARNEY: Obviously, every country has dealt with the global economic crisis that befell us in 2007, 2008 in different ways. We believe, and the President believes, that the approach that was taken here in Washington was the right one, and that as a result -- even though we suffered a calamitous recession, the worst of our lifetimes that took millions and millions of jobs -- we have been able through hard work and tough decisions, and the grit and determination of the American people, to come to a position where the economy has been growing steadily. And it has been creating jobs -- over 6 million private-sector jobs. That work is not done.
So the focus that the President has had was one that prioritized in the beginning the need to stop the bleeding, the need to avert a depression. And the actions that he took with Congress in 2009 are widely viewed to have done that. And then to, as things began to stabilize, to go about the business of getting our fiscal house in order in a reasonable, balanced, common-sense way. And we have been doing that.
As you know, it hasn't always been pretty, but over the past year and a half the President has signed into law now $2.5 trillion in deficit reduction; a significant portion of that has been spending cuts. But it's been done in a way that has allowed the economy to continue to grow and create jobs -- not fast enough, not enough jobs, but it's been positive growth and positive job creation.
I mean, I think -- I don't have the graph I had yesterday here, today, but the one that showed the dramatic decrease in the deficit in the last several years, the sharpest decrease in the deficit since World War II. And then, what would happen based on our projections if the President's proposal to Speaker Boehner were implemented in terms of bringing that deficit down even further and stabilizing it below 3 percent of GDP. That's the approach we believe is right, because it's the best for sustained economic growth.
Q To what extent was that, though, a powerful negative example for him? People's outlooks change from their experiences in the presidency. I have heard that it was a big spur for him to take this particular position.
MR. CARNEY: Well, I don't want to characterize the President's thinking on what other countries have been doing. He's focused on what he believed was the right course for the United States, and believes that while we have significant work to do to continue to grow our economy and have it create jobs, that we made the right choices. And the results have borne that out.
Again, very much like the fact that we need to continue to focus on growing our economy, expanding the middle class, helping people who aspire to the middle class enter the middle class. And that's why that's his number-one priority. It’s been the focus of his State of the Union address. And it's why the debate we're having over this crazy thing called sequester or sequestration is so important, because the last thing we should be doing in Washington is throwing a wrench in an economy that has been moving in the right direction.
Q Jay, two questions. First, just one month ago, Secretary Clinton said that the U.S. opposes any unilateral action seeking to undermine Japan's administration --
MR. CARNEY: I'm sorry, who said that?
Q Secretary Clinton.
MR. CARNEY: Hillary Clinton is no longer Secretary.
Q Yes, former Secretary.
MR. CARNEY: Oh, I see.
Q Yes, she said the U.S. will oppose any unilateral actions seeking to undermine Japan's administration over Diaoyu Islands. And I just want to know, is that the firm position that the President will address?
MR. CARNEY: I haven't seen those comments. I would simply say that the President's meeting with the Prime Minister in just a little while here, and there will be a pool spray, and I think they both will have statements. So I don't want to get ahead of that.
Q And also, on North Korea. Russia and China today -- they say they oppose any military intervention in North Korea. What's the position of the White House?
MR. CARNEY: Again, I would urge you to hear what the President has to say today. I think we got to go, because --
Q Can I do just one quickly?
MR. CARNEY: Yes, one more, Kristen.
Q Can you comment on or confirm the reports that the United States is preparing to establish a drone base in Northwest Africa?
MR. CARNEY: I think those reports are fairly old, but I have no comment on that. Thanks.
Q Week ahead, sir?
MR. CARNEY: I do have a week ahead.
Q Old but no comment?
MR. CARNEY: Well, I remember -- I don't know, is this a new report? There was a report that I --
Q Well, in light of --
MR. CARNEY: -- didn't comment on the other day or I had a comment on. I'm not sure this is a new report.
Q Do you have a timeframe on it?
MR. CARNEY: I'll have to get back to you, Kristen. I'm not sure what our --
Q -- that you’re aware of.
MR. CARNEY: Sure.
On Sunday, the President and First Lady will welcome the National Governors Association to the White House for the 2013 Governors Dinner. The Vice President and Dr. Biden will also attend.
On Monday, the President and the Vice President will deliver remarks to the National Governors Association in the State Dining Room. The First Lady and Dr. Biden will also deliver remarks.
On Tuesday, the President will travel, as you know, to Newport News Shipbuilding, a division of Huntington Ingalls Industries in Newport News, Virginia -- region of my forebears -- to highlight the devastating impact that the sequester will have on jobs and middle-class families if congressional Republicans fail to compromise to avert the sequester by March 1st. In just seven President will return to Washington, D.C. later in the day.
On Wednesday, the President will deliver remarks at the unveiling of a statue of Rosa Parks at the United States Capitol. In the evening, the President will deliver remarks at the Business Council Dinner here in Washington, D.C.
And on Thursday and Friday of next week, the President will attend meetings here at the White House.
Thank you all.
Q Jay, real quickly, have there been any furloughs in the White House? Has the Chief of Staff ordered any furloughs? Is your staff going to be affected?
MR. CARNEY: I took this question. As you know and has been reported, the EOP is affected by the sequester. And I'm sure that the OMB has been working on that as it has with every agency.
END
12:29 P.M. EST |
Possible clinchings for Sunday April 22, 2012:
CHICAGO clinches best record in East with a Miami loss.
LA LAKERS clinch division title with a win AND a LA Clippers loss.
We are 6 days away from the start of the 2012 playoffs!
Possible clinchings for Sunday April 22, 2012:
CHICAGO clinches best record in East with a Miami loss.
LA LAKERS clinch division title with a win AND a LA Clippers loss.
We are 6 days away from the start of the 2012 playoffs!
On Sunday February 5, 2012 the New York Giants and New England Patriots battled for the most coveted trophy in professional football, the Lombardi Trophy. After the first quarter seemed to be dominated by the Giants, the Patriots bounced back in the second quarter to take a 10-9 lead at the half. After another touchdown put the Pats up 17-9, the Giants were able to tack on two field goals to make the score 15-17 in favor of New England at the end of three quarters. After some stops from each team in the first half of the fourth quarter, Eli Manning got the ball back on his own 12 yard line with 3:46 left in the game. He then led his team on what would be the game winning drive that was capped off on a 6 yard touchdown run by Ahmad Bradshaw. Eli Manning was named the games MVP and finished with 296 yards, one touchdown and went 30 for 40(75% completion) on passes.
The NBA has been taken over by a new phenomenon by the name of Jeremy Lin. “Linning” is a new phrase being thrown around a lot lately and it is great for the game. A kid that bounced around from team to team may have just found himself a home in New York with the Knicks. The hottest selling jersey in New York is not Carmelo Anthony, A’mare Stoudemire or Tyson Chandler, but that of Jeremy Lin. They can’t print them fast enough! I am interested to see how Lins game will be once a healthy Carmelo returns to the line up. He sure is something special to watch and I for one can not wait to see more!
Below are the current standings for each conference almost halfway through the season.
If you are a fan of basketball like myself, then you have been treated to some great college games early this season. Some great players that are emerging to become superstars are Austin Rivers, Seth Curry, Anthony Davis, Tyler Zeller, Thomas Robinson and Jared Sullinger just to name a few. We were treated to a game that came down to a Austin Rivers buzzer beating shot to win it this week by North Carolina and Duke. Coach K and Roy Williams have always been two coaches who I look forward to seeing on the sidelines. This is an exciting time for college basketball and I am looking forward to the March Madness tourney this year more than I have in the past few years! Below are the most current rankings.
MLB quick hits……The pitchers and catchers are set to return by February 22nd……..Jose Canseco has announced that he will give it a shot in a Mexican League…..Josh Hamilton of the Texas Rangers had another relapse episode in his alcohol addiction battle…..AJ Burnett may be on the move to Pittsburg if the Yankees and Pirates can work out all of the numbers money wise……The Texas Rangers and catcher Mike Napoli reached a one year 9.2 million dollar deal to avoid arbitration……Boston Redsox 3rd baseman Kevin Youkillis is now engaged to Patriots quarterback Tom Bradys sister……Asdrubal Cabrera and the Cleveland Indians agreed to a one year 4.55 million dollar deal to avoid arbitration, Cabrera was easily the Indians best player last year so this is a win-win for both sides. Until next week, stay classy KnuckleHeadz!
This morning, Mr(s). David Stern and the owners blocked a potential trade that would have sent Chris Paul to the Lakers in a three team deal. I first learned of this blockbuster deal last night, only to wake up to hear that it was blocked by said commish. What really made me irate (ground my gears) was hearing that Dan Gilbert, owner of the Cavaliers, wrote a letter to the league stating that the proposed trade was “a travesty” and that it would be a simply be another case of a superstar demanding to be traded. In other words, the small market v. big market dichotomy.
Well Mr(s). Stern and Mr(s). Gilbert, I assume you fail to recognize the rise of the San Antonio Spurs and Oklahoma City Thunder. Let’s not forget that the Spurs, a small makret team that gets no love from any of the major sports networks, have won four (count them) championships since 1999. Furthermore, that Oklahoma City has rising stars Durant, Westbrook, et al., who gave the current champs (still won’t give them credit!) a run for their money. The small market/big market dilemma in this case is null & void. The trade would have made ALL of the teams involved better. Bottom line.
Does Mr(s). Stern & Co. actually believe that they can block this deal simply for “basketball reasons?” The backlash has been fierce and CP3 is considering legal action. What really bugs me is that Dell Demps, the Hornets manager, was given the green light to make this deal and when they presented it to the league office, it was shut down immediately. What repercussions will this have for the rest of the league? Will Stern shut down a Howard trade or Tyson Chandler signing? Highly doubtful. Where is the justification? What will the Hornets get in return will CP3 ultimately leaves after this truncated season?
Nothing.
…and that’s what I think of Mr(s). Stern, Mr(s). Gilbert.
The date was June 19th, 1988. I can remember it like it was yesterday. My dad had some family and friends over to watch game 6 of the finals that featured the western conference champions, the Los Angeles Lakers, against the eastern conference champions, the Detroit Pistons.
I had been watching the entire series with my dad and his pals, who were all Lakers fans and was forced to hear about how great they were all series long. Which indeed was true, let’s face it, a team that featured hall of famers Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Earvin “Magic” Johnson and James Worthy. Not to mention key contributors Byron Scott, A.C. Green, Michael Cooper and who could forget Kurt Rambis?! Now that is one tough line up to deal with night in and night out without a doubt, but I was fed up with my dad and his pals bragging about this team! So just to spite them, I decided to root for Isiah Thomas, Bill Laimbeer, Dennis Rodman, Joe Dumars and the rest of the “Bad Boys”.
The Pistons were up 3 games to 2 in the best of seven series, so this was an elimination game for Magic Johnson and company. Like I said, I had been watching the entire series but I did not really start paying attention until this game. I am not going to sit here and bore you with all the stats and what happened quarter by quarter. But what I will mention is what everyone mentions when they talk about game 6 of this series: Isiah Thomas’ sprained ankle. The one quarter that I do want to talk about is the 3rd one, where Thomas put on a classic performance. Oh and I must mention he did this with one severely sprained ankle for the last four minutes or so!
Despite playing with a sprained ankle, Thomas managed to score a NBA finals record 25 points in the 3rd quarter, a record that still stands to this day. The sprain came with a little under five minutes to go in the 3rd quarter when Thomas was making a pass to teammate Joe Dumars. Thomas had scored 14 points up until this moment but immediately after spraining the ankle, he could not even walk much less put pressure on the ankle. After sitting out for a minute(game time not real time) or so, Isiah checked back into the game and managed to score 11 of the Pistons last 15 points to give them a two point lead after trailing by eight points just a couple minutes earlier in the game.
It was then when I was amazed at how a man could play on basically one leg and still dominate the game and help his team come back after trailing for most of the game. Naturally, with the team that I was rooting for leading after the 3rd quarter, I began to rub it in my dad’s face. This began a face off that his friends did not hesitate to join in on! The rest of the game was back and forth with everyone yelling when each team would score a basket. It was official, I fell in LOVE with the game of basketball that night and haven’t fallen out of love ever since.
The next day I remember going to our back yard and pretending I was Isiah Thomas, shooting the ball on one leg and limping around as if I had sprained my ankle. Being young and blind I also thought that Earvin’s real name was “Magic” and thought that this was the coolest thing ever! I would imitate Kareem’s sky hook and shoot 3′s from the corner and yell “Michaellllll Cooooooooper”, just as the announcer would yell every time he hit a 3 pointer. I was hooked on this game and could not get enough! Every year, 95% of my friends and family anticipate the start of the NFL and NCAA football seasons, not I. I ALWAYS look forward to the start of the NBA season year after year, so it pains me to see this lockout continue to go on day after day with the chance of it ending growing smaller and smaller as the days go by.
So this was the moment that I fell in love with the game of basketball, what was yours?
What a perfect time for a new blog. 100 (+) degree weather. Casey Anthony found not guilty and a NBA lockout.
Here’s a quick recap of how we arrived at this particular juncture. Unlike the NFL & NHL, the National Basketball Association utilizes a “soft cap” which allows owners to exceed their cap space for special exceptions. The owners are now pushing for a “hard cap” or a fixed cap because of their reckless spending under the “soft cap” model. With a fixed cap they claim that they can promote a “more competitive and balanced league”. On the other side, certain players will be hurt financially by this new “hard cap” system. All of the exceptions (i.e. mid-level, Larry Bird & c.) have benefited from the “soft cap” system that has been in place since the 1983-4 season.
In the 1998 collective bargaining agreement, the owners essentially got what they wanted: 1) they received 43% of the overall revenue 2) the “soft cap” was implemented 3) mid-level exceptions and 4) maximum contracts were put into place under their assumption that they would keep costs down. However, here we are 13 years later with the owners complaining about the situation they put themselves (and us) in. Can we reasonably believe that they will have a better solution this time around?
The owners are not even able to convey a consistent message. At certain times they claim that they want to promote a “more balanced and competitive league” (i.e. the small v. big market dichotomy) and other times they claim that they want to simply increase overall revenues. These positions are contradictory. It has been proven that to increase revenue marketing muscle and talent should be filtered through big market teams (i.e. Lakers, Celtics, Knicks & c.), which would be able to support the entire league. In other words, if the owners wanted more balance among the league, it would take money away from these same big market teams and thus from the league as a whole.
Although the players have been silent for the most part, the owners, meanwhile, have been spewing out figures of how much they are losing. This has been the owners only consistent message and if this is all fans hear, they are liable to believe it (see politics). The players should either a) call them out and settle on a revenue sharing model, which would promote a more competitive league. If the owners don’t agree with that model, it would show that all they care about is revenue and taking all they can from the players or b) the players could also agree to a 50/50 split, which would negate the maximum individual contracts and hard cap. This extra money should be enough for the owners to manage their expenditures (if not then they probably shouldn’t be owners at all!)
It is a shame that what has been the highest rated NBA playoffs in the cable era will end with another NBA lockout. It’s unfortunate that the league is high in it’s popularity around the globe and yet not structured well financially. Although the league always seems to get what it wants, the players and the fans are the ones suffer from the owners imprudent ways. This is a repeat of 1998 (not the kind of repeats we want!) in that the league ended on a high note only to go into a lockout that same summer. What should trouble fans is that professional basketballs reputation is once again on the verge of being tarnished. It seems like if we keep following these owners advice we will be heading down this same path in the near future. Oh yeah, the leagues television contract expires in 2016…
A couple of surprises. A lot of foreigners. An impending lockout. A few highlights.
Everyone speculated that Cleveland was going to pick Kyrie Irving (Duke) as this years numero uno draft pick and they were correct. The Cavs acquired this pick from their trade with the LA Clippers. The Clippers felt that it was in their best interest to let Baron Davis go (along with his 2 year/28 million dollar contract), get Mo Williams [sic] in return and resign Jordan and Gordon. It will be interesting to see how this situation with Irving, Davis, Sessions and Gibson at the point plays out. As previously mentioned, please, no more comparisons to the “anointed one,” I just don’t have the strength to hear people complain!
However, what surprised a lot of people was that the Cavs chose Tristan Thompson (Texas) as their #4 pick. Irving seemed happy that Big XII Freshmen of the Year would be joining him in Ohio. Although he does need to develop his game, in the meantime, his 7’1″ wingspan, great foot work and ability to block a couple shots will surely suffice.
With the second pick, the Timberwolves chose Derrick Williams (Arizona) to join the Love Train. He was the obvious choice for number 2 and is probably the most NBA ready player in this years draft class (you probably already heard that one before). Minnesota will finally get Ricky Rubio at the point to play alongside Williams and Love. The problem with this acquisition is that the Wolves are already to committed to Milicic and are not giving up on Love (pun very much intended) after his streak of double-doubles. Will Minnesota try to move Beasley or keep Williams? It seems they are adamant on keeping their pick, I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.
Kemba Walker (UConn) was chosen by the Charlotte Bobcats as their 9th pick. The former Huskie point guard will join #7 draft pick in Biyombo (Congo) in Charlotte. The Bobcats acquired Biyombo from a trade that sent Stephen Jackson to the Bucks. Kemba is explosive around the net and his team first attitude is probably what got him drafted over Brandon Knight (Kentucky).
This draft day is a culmination of Jordan’s (Michael that is) new approach as majority owner. Charlotte recently let go of Tyson Chandler, Raymond Felton, Gerald Wallace and now Jackson. This new strategy of clearing the deck and going for a younger core of players has been happening for the past couple years, albeit he faced much criticism. It seems like Jordan is clearing cap space to make a move in the summer of 2012. I hope he knows what he’s doing.
Jim Jam (for fans of Weeds). Jimmer Fredette (BYU), the National Player of the Year and most talked about player of the season went to the Kings (via Milwaukee) at #10. He was exciting to watch at the college level and should continue to garner interest at the pro level. He has Tiger Woods range (not girl wise but shot wise, yes that was his teammate) and has the ability to finish in the paint. Although he has been criticized for his lack of defensive prowess, I think he will develop that aspect and it will come with time. He joins Tyreke Evans and DeMarcus Cousins in Sac-Town and should bring some money to the Maloof’s. Let’s just hope he’s still as exciting as he was in Brigham Young.
However, this all seems bitter sweet because there is an impending lock-out. Twenty-two out of the thirty teams are losing money (lots) and it seems that the players association and owners cannot see eye to eye. After hearing Derek Fisher saying the player’s union won’t back down to avoid a lock-out does not comfort me at all. I hope that they are able to come to an agreement, otherwise, these rookies will have plenty of time to practice!
Whether you’re a Spurs fan or not, it’s hard to argue the heart and passion that Fabricio Oberto has for the game of basketball. Oberto was forced to retire from the game due to a heart condition and I can personally say that it sad to hear. However, luck may have turned in his favor just in time for the Olympic Qualifiers taking place in Mar de Plata, Argentina. The tournament will begin August 30th and end September 11th and according to Ole.com, a statement was made that Oberto has been medically cleared to play.
Here is the statement (translated from original site)*
Finally the moment that we’ve all be waiting to announce, according to the results of many studies I have received medical discharge and consequently I am able to resume the practice of sport safely.
So from today I put myself at the mercy of the Technical Corps of the national team so that I may achieve peak physical condition and according to the Basketball Tournament in which we participate and the rank and prestige of our Selection that it requires.
In this regard, and because of the long downtime, it should be made clear that I will try every effort to arrive at suitable conditions to participate in the international tournament like the one we have before us, and maybe not achieve it; I will be the first to leave my place of respect that is required by the National Team and out of the love I have for my colleagues and friends.
We greatly appreciate all the continuing concern you have shown me and the affection and support constantly received.
I hope we meet in Mar del Plata.
It would be great to be able to watch Oberto play the sport that he loves once again. It was a bitter sweet day when he announced his retirement and I hope he can represent his country once again.
Argentina is seeded in Group B which also includes Puerto Rico, Uruguay, Panama and Paraguay. Group A includes Canada, Dominican Republic, Venezuela, Brazil and Cuba. For more information please visit FIBA Americas.
In other news surrounding Argentina, according to Leandro Ginobili’s twitter account, Manu Ginobili may be in doubt:
“Manu Ginobili in doubt, medical diagnosis? Hyperextension of the nasal septum! It seems he has suffered this from the age of 12.”*
It will be interesting to see how this latest development plays a role. If we’ve learned anything about Manu Ginobili, it’s that it takes a lot to stop him from playing.
*I have attempted to make sure that my translation is as accurate as I could make it. Please visit the original websites in which these comments were posted if you would like to see the original Spanish text.
From all of us here at 2 KnuckleHeadz, we would like to say Happy Father’s Day to the fathers around the world. For your enjoyment we leave you with a memorial staple in the legacy of one of, if not the greatest, to ever play the game of basketball, Michael Jeffrey Jordan.
Michael Jordan wins 4th NBA Championship on Father\’s Day
This is a different type of post.
I wanted to wait a couple days before I followed up on my weekly post. Mainly because a) I didn’t want to overreact and speak from an emotional stance b) I wanted to see what other people had to say on the situation and c) I am still waiting to wake up from this nightmare of a season.
Okay, I will give THAT team credit. Happy? They swept the Lakers and ruined my prediction, which I would still make! However, let’s get one thing straight. I never claimed to be a Miami Heat fan, I just dislike the M@$%&!#s that much. Which means it could have been ANY other team in the Eastern conference. What really makes me sick is frequenting the various “hot-spots” in and around San Antonio and hearing people actually cheering for the M@$%&!#s (projectile-vomit). So spoiled rich boy Mark Cuban decides to shut his mouth for once and all of a sudden he’s likable? Okay fair weather fans, when the M@$%&!#s visit the AT&T Center next year you need to STFU [noobs]. That’s right, I don’t care what the media says about the Heat or whatever antics LeBron or Wade are involved in (at least they didn’t hit their wives or get a bro-ner everytime Hasselhoff hits a high note), rivalry trumps everything! So I emoted, sue me.
This is what boggles my mind. After attending several games vs. the M@$%&!#s at the AT&T Center, I distinctly remember an all encompassing hatred of said team. Every sign I saw succinctly reflected this and every fan from this alien town looked genuinely frightened. Although it’s all in good fun, it’s simply part of the rivalry aspect. I’ll say it one more time, rye-vul-ree. It’s okay not to forget that there is a rivalry regardless of what the pretty shiny screen says in front of you!
If you want listen to the media and hear them constantly compare LeBron to Jordan, that’s just to draw up hatred (and/or ratings) and simply put, silly. Face it though, when someone is dubbed “The One” from what seems like infancy, that has to do something to your psyche. By no means am I giving any excuses for LeBron’s poor play (which was very poor!). I am talking about something deeper in regards to people searching for the “next Jordan.”
It seems awkward to say but deep down inside, we all want to see someone who is Jordan-esque (or better). Someone who simply transcends our understanding of the game of basketball and dominates in every way imaginable. It’s entertaining, inspiring and frankly, the reason we love the game! Believe me, there will be a day, when someone surpasses the likes of Jordan (blasphemy!). It’s inevitable. The law of the land. Records were made to be broken. However, will that person actually make it out of eight grade without a camera in his (or her) face and his (or her) high school games made available only on pay-per-view? Whether you admit it or not, if you are a fan of the game, then like me, you kept an eye on the young LeBron James. We like to raise people up but what we really love, is to watch them fall.
Just to be clear, I am not comparing James to Jordan or vice versa success wise. I am saying that we want our athletes to be great and have great character as well. LeBron clearly lacks character, sure, but there are dozens of people in the NBA who do as well. He just happens to be in the limelight although the masses came to him and paid for his high school games & c. (i.e. watched his every move since). If we are talking about off court antics, Jordan is no saint himself. If Jordan didn’t exist, the game wouldn’t be the same as it is today. However what gets me thinking is if the media exists as it does today would Jordan still be the same Jordan? In other words, if he were dubbed the second coming of Magic or Dr. J from HS would that change anything?
All in all, I’m glad that this nightmare is finally over! I’m looking forward to next season and forgetting this one altogether. It was an interesting year to say the least. Although, we were given this horror to try to wipe from our memory, I still love the sport of it and will be at the AT&T Center next season in a M@$%&!#s jersey!
Prior to Game 5, LeBron and Wade were seen mocking Dirk Nowitzki. Specifically, they coughed and giggled like a couple of school girls. Wade begins by coughing and saying, “Did ya’ll hear me cough? I think I’m sick…” LeBron then says, “Man, this weather man. It’s hard going from 85 degree weather then go to 90…”
Now, I’m not stupid. I realize in a competitive atmosphere, players will poke fun at the other team and (often) themselves to make light of a situation and ease the tension. But let’s be smart about this fellas. In front of a Dallas News TV camera?! Seriously? How stupid can you be? And of all the people to poke fun at on LIVE television, you choose to make fun of Dirk? The guy that is averaging 25 and 7 a game? The guy that has scored 52 points in the 4th quarter against you? Not to mention Dirk is one of the most humble superstars in the NBA. Great decision guys. You already know you’re the most scrutinized team on the planet so why give the media more ammo?
I think what really shocks me is Wade. I honestly would expect a childish antic like this from Baby Bron Bron, but not from Wade. I guess that confiden…whoops, I mean COCKINESS is going to be their achilles heel. One would think they would’ve learned their lesson after Game 2′s epic meltdown. Dancing around in front of the Mavs bench like you’re P. Diddy. Just to end up hopping on the plane with a big fat L.
Their antic blew up in there face as they lost by 9 in Game 5. *cough cough* still think you’re sick? *cough cough* Where are you LeBron? Are you sick too? You must be with that disappearing act you’ve been pulling. If you’re supposed to be the next Jordan, then act like it. Jordan never scored below 22 points in the Finals. Because I’m a fan of the game I realize LeBron leads in 4th quarter assists, which is an incredible stat, but when the pressure is on it should be YOU scoring the buckets to carry your team into victory. Wade said earlier in the Playoffs that this was YOUR team LeBron, so how about you stop acting like a 16 year-old school girl and man up.
Game 6 is tonight and I’m confident the Mavs’ defensive schemes and ball movement will continue to cause problems for the Heat in the 4th quarter. This has been an excellent series and one of the best NBA Finals match ups I’ve seen in a long time. When the Mavs win, I hope the Heat will learn a lesson in humility. If they don’t, well, have fun getting raped by the media with no lube.
I almost forgot. Hey LeBron, tell Rashard Lewis I said hey. He’s such a great guy isn’t he? *cough cough* |
Keep the Faucet Flowing
Summer Learning and Home Environment
The findings in the article that follows are based on the authors’ Baltimore School Study, which began in 1982 and is still in progress. Entwisle, Alexander, and Olson chose twenty schools on the basis of their racial composition (six were predominantly African American, six predominantly white, and eight were integrated) and their socioeconomic status (fourteen were inner-city working class and six were middle class) and then randomly selected 790 first graders from those schools. Although the authors went on to follow these students throughout their school years and beyond, the findings discussed here pertain to the children’s elementary school experiences. In addition to standardized test scores, the authors gathered data from interviews with the students and their parents, questionnaires completed by their teachers, and school records.
–EDITOR
By Doris R. Entwisle, Karl L. Alexander, and Linda Steffel Olson
In seeking to explain why poor children do worse academically than children from middle-class and wealthy families, analysts have focused on two major topics: differences in schools and differences in home environments.
Because government has more of a handle on schooling than on home environment, public policy has emphasized the former. This has led to a widespread impression that poor children are routinely shortchanged by their schools. In fact, poor and middle-class children make comparable achievement gains during the school year. But while the middle-class children make gains during the summer when they are out of school, poor or disadvantaged children often lose ground academically. So far, one appealing remedy for reducing the achievement gap—summer school—has been disappointing. How to explain this paradox? If summers are the time when differences are established, why does summer school do so little to close the gap?
Seasonal learning
Given all that has been said about the strong correlation between parents’ resources and school performance, it is astonishing that resources of Baltimore parents—both financial and psychological—did not predict how much children learned in winters when school was open. Their resources mattered only for predicting their children’s gains in summer. Many studies1 besides the Baltimore study indicate that when schools are closed for summer vacation, the achievement scores of children from disadvantaged families either stay the same or slip back a little. To see how these seasonal patterns contribute to children’s achievement, we calculated the children’s gains on standardized tests in summer, when schools were closed, separately from school-year scores in winter, when schools were open.
The achievement levels of all children, regardless of their socioeconomic status,2 moved up substantially during the winter of first grade. Between the fall and spring of that first year, poor children in the Baltimore sample gained fifty-seven points in reading and forty-nine points in math, and their more affluent counterparts gained almost exactly the same number of points—sixty-one points in reading and forty-five points in math.
In the summer after first grade, however, more affluent students gained fifteen points in reading and nine points in math, while the less affluent children lost ground. For example, in the summer after first grade, they lost four points in reading and five points in math.
And this pattern continued. In the course of the first five summers in elementary school, the low-SES students gained less than one point total in reading, and they lost eight points in math. At the same time, the higher SES children gained forty-seven points in reading and twenty-five points in math. However, during the winters, when children were in school, both groups gained virtually the same amount (one hundred ninety-three points in reading for low-SES children versus one hundred ninety-one points for higher SES and one hundred eighty-six points for both in math). So the increasing gap in test scores between the two groups of children over the first five years in elementary school accrued entirely from the fact that relatively affluent children continued to gain when school was closed whereas poor children stopped gaining or even lost ground.
A faucet theory
We think a "faucet theory" makes sense of these seasonal patterns. That is, when school was in session, the resource faucet was turned on for all children, and all gained equally; when school was not in session, the school resource faucet was turned off. In summers, poor families could not make up for the resources the school had been providing, and so their children’s achievement reached a plateau or even fell back. Middle-class families could make up for the school’s resources to a considerable extent so their children’s growth continued, though at a slower pace.
This seasonal pattern is not obvious because most schools give standardized tests once a year, and spring-to-spring comparisons convey the distinct, but wrong, impression that middle-class children learn more over the entire year than poorer children. Thus, it looks as though home resources help year round—and as though schools are failing poor children. The seasonal scores, however, show that home resources matter mainly—or only—in summer.
The seasonal data from Baltimore are not a statistical fluke—they agree with seasonal data for children in Atlanta, New Haven, and several other localities. In addition, as the scores demonstrate, poorer children in Baltimore derive just as much benefit from school as their better-off classmates do when school is open in winter. And because they have lower scores when they begin school and gains are usually proportional to starting scores, the progress they make when school is open is quite extraordinary. If we could get poorer children up to speed before they start school, perhaps schools could do even more to close the achievement gap.
Explaining summer gains
What is it that better-off parents and neighborhoods do in summers that poorer parents and neighborhoods do not? To answer this question, we need to step back and consider parental attitudes toward school and learning. First of all, middle-class parents see themselves as partners in the learning process while blue-collar or poorer parents see education as the school’s job.3 Because middle-class parents take an active role, they know more about their children’s school programs than poorer parents do. They understand how schools work, what determines success, how to get along in a complex bureaucracy, and how present actions relate to future interests. Middle-class parents themselves have been successful in school (e.g., they are more highly educated) and in the workplace (e.g., they have higher income and job status), so they are in a position to encourage activities at home that will lead to success in school.
For many poor parents, schools are intimidating—the rules and conventions are foreign and the middle-class professionalism of school personnel, threatening. Poor parents tend to defer to school personnel, they advise their children to "follow the rules," and they rely on "professional authority" to decide what needs to be done for their children rather than deciding themselves.
Higher family income allows expenditures for books, games, computers, and other resources that could promote learning in summer, but more income is far from being the whole story. Parents’ financial capital overlaps their human capital, their social capital, and especially their psychological capital. In the Baltimore study, parents’ psychological capital, as measured by parents’ expectations for children’s school performance even before the children started school, was of about the same importance as family socioeconomic status in predicting cognitive growth.
These expectations continue to be of great importance when children enter school, and for poor families they may be unfairly undercut by the grades poor children get. Researchers do not gauge children’s progress in school by looking at their marks because marking standards vary so much from one school to another and from one teacher to another. Instead, they use standardized test scores. However, most families and children pay much more attention to marks than to test scores, and although many do not understand the significance of test scores, the youngest children and the poorest parents know a low mark when they see one. Further, children come home every day with marks on papers and homework, and they receive report cards several times a year. Parents who see low marks react by believing that their children are not learning very much, but they are often at a loss as to what to do. Children themselves are disappointed and also confused. All of this turns marks into a key dynamic in the link between poverty and learning deficits.
If poor children are progressing as well as their more affluent counterparts, why does this fact not show up in their marks? We found that children’s marks corresponded to the socioeconomic status of their neighborhoods. In schools where 30 percent or fewer children were in poverty, over one-third received a first reading mark of A or B, while in schools with more than 30 percent of children in poverty, only 5 percent received an A or a B. It strains credulity, but in one school where 88 percent of children received meal subsidies, all the students in our study failed reading in the first quarter of first grade.
In other words, poor children were not being marked in terms of how much they advanced during the school year but in terms of where they started—even though, judged by the gains they made on standardized tests, they improved as much as the youngsters from more affluent families. Tragically, the message sent home on report cards was thus that many of these children were already academic failures. This negative picture helps to shape poor parents’ reactions to their children, thus further eroding parents’ valuable psychic capital, which is essential to undergirding children’s long-term academic prospects.
The level of marks, generally, in a school also seemed to affect how teachers viewed their students. At the end of first grade, when asked to predict how their students would perform in grade two, teachers’ predictions shadowed the marking patterns of the school. Teachers in the top ten schools, judged by their economic status, expected their pupils to get more A’s and B’s in reading than C’s or below, while teachers in the bottom ten schools expected nearly all their students to get C’s or below.
And teachers’ ratings of children’s classroom behavior corresponded to these marks. In a school with only 11 percent of children on meal subsidy, teachers rated their pupils significantly higher in general interest and classroom participation than did teachers in a school where 90 percent of children were on subsidy. Actually, the correlation between the meal subsidy level of the school and teachers’ average ratings of their students’ class participation is almost perfect. In schools with high percentages of children on subsidy, some children were rated so low in terms of class participation that they were at the bottom of the scale. In the more affluent schools no student was rated at the bottom of the scale on these qualities.
The overall picture is one of poor children assigned poor marks, expected by teachers to get poor marks, and perceived as deficient in classroom behaviors known to foster learning. The great inequity is, of course, that during the school year, the poor children learned at a rate equivalent to that of the better-off children in the same school system. Parents and the community as a whole accepted the evaluations with which they were furnished without being aware that the level of these evaluations reflected children’s home addresses rather than children’s progress in reading or math on standardized tests.
The school’s role
School systems and society in general are misinformed about the origins of social difference in children’s school performance. The strong impression that home resources help all year long is mistaken. Instead, family resources make a difference mainly when school is closed. One implication is that schools are doing a far better job than they have been credited with. Another is that middle-class parents’ aspirations, attitudes, activities, and psychic investments in their children are major reasons for the social class differences in children’s cognitive growth when schools are not open.
However, at present, misperceptions about the process of schooling needlessly depress poorer parents’ psychological resources. In addition, this mismatch between children’s actual progress and how that progress is viewed is highly inequitable. When Baltimore children started school, their pre-reading and pre-math skills reflected their uneven family situations, but despite this, children in our study, regardless of socioeconomic level, progressed at the same rate over first grade. In June of first grade, though, the unevenness in test scores present at the start was still there. Poor children started from a lower point than better-off children did, so when school let out for the summer they ended up at a lower point even though both groups made equal gains during the year. In addition, in summer the poor children’s growth just about stopped while better-off children’s continued to rise.
Summer school as a solution
If economically disadvantaged children fall behind their better-off classmates in summer, it seems obvious that attending summer school could, or should, bring poorer children up to speed. Sad to say, this course of action so far does not work. The few careful evaluations that have focused on attending summer school for the purpose of closing the gap between social groups (racial, economic, or both) find just the opposite. The evidence on summer school for this purpose is clearly negative. Summer school increases the gap.
On average, the summer school gain for students of all socioeconomic levels is quite small: about one-seventh of a standard deviation—roughly one month on average or a few test points (out of three or four hundred) on standardized tests like those used in the Baltimore study. This small gain is for rich and poor combined, so the first question is whether disadvantaged students attending summer school make any gains. The literature suggests they do not.
However, the failure of summer school to narrow the learning gap is not really surprising. Many other programs undertaken in the past have also had disappointing results. A major aim of "Sesame Street," for example, was to reduce the knowledge gap between minority (or poor) preschool children and their majority (or better-off) counterparts. But though, on average, it was clearly of benefit to preschoolers, it backfired in terms of decreasing the learning gap, which grew larger rather than smaller.4
The counter-intuitive outcome of summer school, like that of "Sesame Street," is an example of the "Matthew Effect," an often-observed phenomenon that takes its name from the gospel of Matthew 25:29—and that can be roughly paraphrased by the old saw, "the rich get richer and the poor get poorer." Providing add-on services across the board benefits advantaged students more than poor, bright rather than not-so-bright, majority more than minority, and so on. Why? One reason is that higher scoring and better-off children’s parents find out about special programs and see that their children attend them more often than do poorer children’s parents. In Atlanta, where summer school was voluntary, the Atlanta children who chose to attend summer school had higher achievement levels during the school year than those who chose not to attend.5 Similarly, the children least likely to attend preschool programs these days are children from low-income and single-parent families and those whose parents have the least education. For summer school and other programs to close the learning gap, they will have to be designed especially for poor children and provided specifically for them, as has been done with some compensatory education preschool programs.
Proposing a strategy
To determine the content of a summer program that will boost the summer achievement of poorer children, we need to know the kinds of learning experiences they lack and when to offer such programs. An important consideration for timing of programs, which we have not mentioned so far, is that children’s cognitive growth slows down precipitously as they progress upward through the grades. The reading achievement of Baltimore children improved twice as fast in grade one as grade three, for example, and the gap in summer gains between better-off and poorer children shrank over time.
Considering (1) the relatively small gap in children’s test scores associated with family income at the point when they start first grade, (2) the seasonal profiles of achievement growth with better-off children gaining more in summers, and (3) the marked deceleration in the rates of cognitive growth over the early school years, we suggest the following course of action: Provide poor children with high-quality preschools, and then follow up with summer school just for poor children in the summers before and after first grade.
Where to start? A good place would be to provide programs to help bring poorer children up to speed before they start first grade. We already know this can be done, because scientifically impeccable data show that good preschools can improve the early school success of disadvantaged children. A major effect is to reduce the retention rate in first grade,6 which is higher than in any subsequent grade,7 and holding poor children back in first grade mortgages their futures. By age 23, Baltimore students who had been held back in grade one were three times more likely to have dropped out of school, even when family economic status, minority status, and actual school performance were taken into account. Attending a good preschool could be enough to protect economically disadvantaged youngsters against low placements in first-grade reading groups or early retention.8 However, such programs must be specifically targeted at those children. If preschools reach more of the wealthier than the poorer children, or if wealthier children find their way to higher-quality programs, the gap will get bigger rather than smaller.
More disadvantaged children also need to attend kindergarten, which is a kind of preschool. Because kindergarten is not compulsory, a surprisingly large number of children still attend half-day programs, and back when our study children were in the primary grades, many skipped kindergarten altogether. In Baltimore City, for example, which is one of the poorest school districts in Maryland, 10 percent of first-graders in our study had not attended kindergarten, compared to about 1 percent nationwide today. In addition, the Baltimore study children who came from the poorest families were more often enrolled in half-day than full-day sessions. (Of children who attended half-day, 77 percent were on meal subsidy compared to 32 percent of those who attended full days.)
The benefits of full-day as compared to half-day kindergartens for the Baltimore children were striking. With family background and many other variables allowed for, first graders who attended full-day kindergarten were absent fewer days in first grade, were less often retained, and earned higher marks and test scores than the half-day attendees. So in addition to preschools (age four and younger), having poorer children attend high-quality full-day kindergarten (age five) could help close the gap.
Summer school programs
The next logical step after increasing poor children’s attendance in full-day preschool is to develop summer school programs for poor children that add on to preschool. Preschools can reduce the achievement gap when children start first grade, but then we need to keep the faucet open during the summer to give poor children the extra resources that middle-class parents provide for their children.
What should these summer programs consist of? Summer activities related to reading top the list. Low-income children involved in Atlanta’s summer schools tended to read more on their own than did students not attending.9 Likewise, in Baltimore, first- and second-graders who went to the library more often in summer and who took out more books did better than other children. Both math and reading growth benefited from library activities.
Better-off children also did things in summer different from what they did during the school year—they attended day camps, took swimming lessons, went on trips, visited local parks and zoos, and played organized sports, to name a few. These activities provided children with experiences unlike their experiences in school. Probably summer programs for disadvantaged children should feature activities that include a substantial amount of physical activity for both boys and girls, especially games like soccer, field hockey, or softball that require very little equipment but have complicated rule systems and require children to take multiple roles. Adult leaders need to be cast in the role of "coach" rather than teacher.10
Program content is not the only concern, however. Higher-income parents have psychological capital of a kind that summer school coaches could emulate: using positive rather than negative reinforcement, teaching productive problem-solving strategies, encouraging children to be self-directed, having high expectations, and seeing that the means are there for children to meet high expectations. Perhaps most important, coaches need to encourage children to enjoy themselves: Engagement is key to learning, and engagement can be difficult to achieve if summer programs are perceived as punitive.
The logistics of summer programs need careful planning, especially in terms of teachers who can establish strong attachments to students and parents. The programs need to be located near pupils’ homes, so children can get to them easily and so parents can become involved. Changing the summer environment of children in low-income families may require community intervention.
No single approach is likely to close the academic gap between low- and high-income children, but summer programs bracketing first grade could help. It is absolutely essential to be aware that special programs, including summer school, given to children of all income levels would probably enlarge the gap between rich and poor. High-quality preschools and kindergartens can definitely improve the school performance of low-income children. But as they go through the first three grades, these children—especially the most disadvantaged—need additional resources to stay even. Programs mounted in summers before the first and second grades that emphasize voluntary activities—recreational reading, organized sports, and a variety of summer activities that middle-class families often pursue—hold promise. The programs should not be scheduled as "make-up" or billed as being for children who have "failed." The success of these programs, we believe, hinges on their non-school flavor and on providing them specifically for disadvantaged children.
At age six, when children’s cognitive development is proceeding at probably twice the rate it does two or three years later, the trajectory of children’s long-term educational careers is being established. For this reason, it is imperative to concentrate on the pre- and primary schooling of disadvantaged youth.
The larger picture
People who think and talk about inequality often ask why it is perpetuated and how we can get those at the very bottom of the ladder to move up. When social theorists and policymakers propose schools as a solution, they often seem to go along with the notion that education is a sorting device. Thus, students leaving school are channeled into job slots that correspond with how long they have stayed in school and how successful they have been while there. Those who win out in school will win out in the labor market as well.
To us this image of sorting students at the end of their schooling misrepresents the nature of inequality. Families sort themselves by income into neighborhoods. Then schools, which reflect the social strata of their neighborhoods, tend to eliminate any real contest between students from different income levels. Because the unequal distribution of resources across families is the engine that drives the system, tinkering with schools has not, thus far, eliminated this inequity. And, judging from the available research, we believe inequity would be exacerbated by noncompulsory summer schools open to all children.
The good news is that despite poverty and family disruption, young children’s ability to learn during the school year seems little impaired by scarce family resources. In seeking to address the achievement gap between rich and poor, we should begin by recognizing the efficacy of elementary schools in leveling the playing field. Most press coverage of American education today emphasizes the system’s failures, especially its failures vis-a-vis the most disadvantaged students. These negative perceptions often undercut popular support for elementary schools and public education in general, and they miss the extent to which schools make up for the deficits in poor children’s backgrounds. The real tragedy of current educational practice is that schools are organized—and children perceived—as though the more-advantaged groups are better able to benefit from the schooling process. Poor children are assumed to be "slower" learners—less capable of absorbing the curriculum—and these lower expectations color poor parents’ own perceptions about their children’s academic futures. This is especially unfortunate in the early grades when students’ achievement trajectories are being set and their cognitive growth is most rapid.
This recognition of the power of schools to make a difference in the lives of poor students needs to be coupled with efforts to involve parents and communities in the schooling process so that all parents, not just middle-class parents, are active collaborators in the education of their children. Preschool and summer programs, properly organized, can help develop economically disadvantaged parents and their neighborhoods into active supporters of children’s academic endeavors. These parents need to know, for example, that such simple activities as reading aloud to their children can have big academic pay-offs. Neighborhoods need playgrounds and coaches to encourage organized sports and craft activities in summer. Workshops and other outreach efforts could help disadvantaged adults develop some of the psychological and social capital that is so important to undergirding their children’s learning.
Doris R. Entwisle is emeritus professor, Karl L. Alexander is professor, and Linda Steffel Olson is senior research assistant in the Department of Sociology, Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore. This article is adapted from "Summer Learning and Home Environment" in A Notion At Risk, edited by Richard D. Kahlenberg, and it appears with the permission of The Century Foundation Press. A full account of the study and what Entwisle, Alexander, and Olson found appears in Children, Schools, and Inequality (Boulder, Colo: Westview Press, 1997).
Endnotes
1. As examples, see Barbara Heyns (1978), Summer Learning and the Effects of Schooling (New York: Academic Press), Richard Murnane (1975), The Impact of School Resources on the Learning of Inner-City Children, (Cambridge, Mass.: Ballinger). Much of this literature is reviewed in Harris Cooper, Barbara Nye, Kelly Charlton, James Lindsay, and Scott Greathouse (Fall 1996), "The Effects of Summer Vacation on Achievement Test Scores: A Narrative and Meta-Analytic Review," Review of Educational Research 66: 227-269.
2. Family socioeconomic status is indexed by information on student participation in the school meal subsidy program, a rough not-low/low-income measure, mother’s and father’s educational levels, and occupational status.
3. Annette Lareau (1987), "Social Class Differences in Family-School Relationships: The Importance of Cultural Capital," Sociology of Education 60: 73-85.
4. See Thomas D. Cook, Hilary Appleton, Ross F. Conner, Ann Shaffer, Gary Tamkin, and Stephen J. Weber (1975), "Sesame Street" Revisited (New York: Russell Sage), especially Chapter 1. For another example, see Launor F. Carter (1983), "Sustaining Effects Study" (prepared for the Systems Development Corporation). Students who entered Title I programs at near-average achievement levels profited most, whereas those entering at a low level profited only little or not at all. More recently in 1997, the New York State Legislature enacted a universal kindergarten for four-year-olds, but there has been underenrollment in the communities with limited access to quality preschools. See Foundation for Child Development, March 1999 Update (New York: Foundation for Child Development).
5. See Heyns, Summer Learning, p. 128.
6. See Irving Lazar and Richard Darlington (1982), "Lasting Effects of Early Education: A Report from the Consortium for Longitudinal Studies," Monographs of the Society for Research in Child Development 47, No. 2-3: ix-139; Consortium for Longitudinal Studies (1983), As the Twig Is Bent: Lasting Effect of Preschool Programs (Hilldale, N.J.: Erlbaum). For good general review, see W. Steven Barnett (Winter 1995), "Long-term Effects of Early Childhood Programs on Cognitive and School Outcomes," The Future of Children, Long-term Outcomes of Early Childhood Programs, 5 (3), 25-50.
7. Karl L. Alexander, Doris R. Entwisle, and Susan L. Dauber (1994), On the Success of Failure: A Reassessment of the Effects of Retention in the Primary Grades (Cambridge, Mass.: Cambridge University).
8. See Doris R. Entwisle (Winter 1995), "The Role of Schools in Sustaining Benefits of Early Childhood Programs," The Future of Children 5, No. 3: 133-44.
9. Heyns, Summer Learning, p. 191.
10. For a discussion of the link between organized sports and academic progress, see Doris R. Entwisle, Karl L. Alexander, and Linda Steffel Olson (1994), "The Gender Gap in Math: Its Possible Origins in Neighborhood Effects," American Sociological Review 59: 822-38. |
2011 Epcot
International Food & Wine Festival
September 30 - November 13, 2011
Kitchen Memories
Friday, October 14, 2011
10:00 a.m. - noon
Festival Center
Epcot
Guest Chef
Alan Wong, Alan Wong's Restaurants, Honolulu, HI
Wine Representative
Fred Dame, MS
Shrimp and
Pork Dumplings with Spicy Lemongrass Black Bean Sauce
Beringer Blanc, Knights Valley
Twice-Cooked Short Ribs with Korean Chili Sauce and Gingered Shrimp
Stags Leap Winery Petite Sirah, Napa Valley
Pineapple "Shave Ice" (not
your ordinary "Shave Ice") - Hawaiian Vanilla
Panna Cotta, Coconut Tapioca, Haupia Sorbet, Lilikoi
Sauce, "Shaved" Pineapple
Beringer "Nightingale" Botrytised, Napa Valley
Review by John Bowers
Aloha! Chef Alan Wong is considered a master
of Hawaiian Regional Cuisine, and on Friday, October
14, 2011, he was the guest chef at the Kitchen Memories
event at the Epcot International Food and Wine Festival.
Alan is the owner and head chef of Alan Wong's Restaurants,
based in Honolulu. Coordinating the wine pairings was
Fred Dame. Fred is a Master Sommelier and is
the first American to have served as President of the
Court of Master Sommeliers Worldwide. He is also Cellarmaster
of The Sardine Factory restaurant in Monterey, California.
And our hostess once again was Pam Smith. Pam has hosted
scores of events at the Festival over the years.
Alan started us off with a fun exercise in understanding sweetness. Each of us were given a small Snickers bar, a half cup of Coca-Cola, and a glass of water. It's easy to do at home, so here's how: Drink a little of the water, then a little of the Coke. Note how the Coke tastes sweet. Now take a bite of the Snickers bar, not the whole thing! A bite about the size of your sip of Coke. The Snickers bar will taste sweeter still than the Coke did. Now back to the Coke. After the Snickers bar, the Coke doesn't seem as sweet as it did after the water. Moral of the story: depending on what you are eating before and after other things, your perception of sweetness varies. Alan said many of his cooks are 18-30 years old and come into the kitchen with Cokes, candy bars, Red Bulls (!), etc., and when they start tasting food as they are cooking it, they can make mistakes in their judgment.
Our first
course was Shrimp and Pork Dumplings
with Spicy Black Bean Lemongrass Sauce. This
looks like a dish that might take some practice, and
it was sensational. Chef Alan mentioned the challenge
of featuring local cuisine in Hawaii, where 85% of
the food is imported. It takes a considerable amount
of creativity to feature local and regional cuisine
when such a small amount of food is truly local. Someone
mentioned the difficulty of finding one or two of the
exotic ingredients, and I believe Fred said all you
need to do is jump on the internet, and whatever you
wish for can be on your doorstep tomorrow. Or you can
jump on a plane, fly to Hawaii, and have Alan make
it for you! Either way, this was a wonderful, savory
treat. One of my tablemates said if she were at home,
she would lick the bowl to get every last bit of that
lemongrass sauce. Fred paired a Beringer Blanc with
the dumplings. This white wine is a blend of semillon,
sauvignon blanc, and viognier. Citrusy, toasty, and
aromatic, it provided a delightful complement to the
dumplings.
The main course was Twice-Cooked
Short Ribs with Korean Chili Sauce & Gingered Shrimp. Usually
when you cook short ribs, you sear them first to brown
them, and then braise them real slowly in order to
tenderize them. Alan flips it around, braising the
ribs first, then finishing them on a hot grill for
a few minutes to get some nice grill marks. To serve
them, you use a clean paintbrush to first brush your
serving plate with the Korean Chili Sauce. Then you
center the rib meat on the plate and put a single gingered
shrimp on top of the ribs. That's a small piece of
broccoli and one of cauliflower, plus a few pieces
of eggplant in the photo. Not the most inspired little
sides, and I wish we had a more substantial brushstroke
of that lovely Chili Sauce, but the short ribs and
shrimp were divine. Fred chose a Stag's Leap Winery
Petite Sirah to go with the short ribs. Petite Sirah
wines are bold reds, known for their very dark, inky
color and spicy, peppery, dark berry flavors. They
pair very well with spicy dishes like short ribs with
chili sauce. But Fred said the little piece of broccoli
on the plate was scary. Pairing any wine with broccoli
is, well, forget it.
Alan brought Michelle Karr along
with him. Michelle is Alan's pastry chef, and she showed
us how to prepare the dessert course: Pineapple "Shave
Ice," Hawaiian Vanilla Panna Cotta, Coconut Tapioca,
Haupia Sorbet, Liliko Sauce, "Shaved" Pineapple. Quite a description! I'm not going to even attempt
to describe the dish other than to say it's Hawaii
wrapped in a dessert. Sweet, tropical, rich, smooth,
cold, refreshing. Stunning. If you fly to Hawaii for
the dumplings, go ahead and get the pineapple "shave
ice." Fred paired a Beringer "Nightingale" wine
with Michelle's dessert. Nightingale is made with sauvignon
blanc and semillon grapes, which are picked, laid out
in small trays, and sprayed with the botrytis spores
that cause the grapes to dehydrate, concentrating the
sugars and fruit acids. When the grapes are fermented
into wine, the result is a sweet, intensely flavored
wine often tasting of apricots, peaches, and honeysuckle,
perfect for pairing with a fruit-based dessert. Not
so good with a chocolate dessert, Fred noted. A sweet,
fruity wine and a sweet, fruity dessert are truly a
match made in heaven.
The Kitchen Memories events are not cheap, that's for sure. If you haven't tried one, or if you haven't tried any of the myriad Premium Events, you owe it to yourself to do so. The Food and Wine Festival only happens once a year, and life's short. Aloha!
RECIPES
Shrimp and Pork Dumplings with Spicy Lemongrass
Black Bean Sauce
Serves 6
Shrimp and Pork Dumpling
Mixture:
1/2 pound ground pork
1/2 pound ground shrimp
1/4 cup oyster sauce
1/4 cup fresh water chestnuts, peeled and diced (can substitute with fresh lotus root)
1/2 cup green onion, green part only, thinly sliced
1 egg whole
1/2 teaspoon minced garlic
1 teaspoon sesame oil
1/2 teaspoon salt
1 pinch freshly cracked black pepper
Wrappers:
12 each won ton pi (dumpling wrappers)
1 egg, beaten
Method:
1. Combine all ingredients
in a bowl and mix thoroughly
2. Place the dumpling wrappers on a dry table and scoop 1 tablespoon of the shrimp and pork mixture onto the middle of the wrapper.
3. Brush edges of the wrapper with the beaten egg and fold in half into a triangular shape. Carefully push out the air and seal the moistened edges completely.
4. Brush the two smaller corners of the triangle with beaten egg and pinch together to form a tortellini shape.
5. Bring a pot of salted water to a boil. Without crowding the pot, add dumplings to the boiling water and cook for approximately 3-4 minutes or until they float.
6. Remove, drain, and keep warm on a plate.
Spicy Lemongrass Black Bean Sauce:
11 tablespoons
unsalted butter
3 tablespoons lemongrass, sliced thinly
2 each 3-inch pieces of lemongrass, smashed
1/2 tablespoon ginger, minced
1/2 tablespoon garlic, minced
1 tablespoon yellow onion, finely diced
2 tablespoons sherry wine
1/2 tablespoon fish sauce
1-1/2 teaspoons Chinese salted/fermented black beans, divided
3 tablespoons flour
2 cups clam juice (no MSG)
2 cups chicken stock (white)
6 each Kaffir lime leaves (3 chopped)
1-1/2 tablespoons Sriracha (Thai hot sauce), divided
6 each sweet basil leaves, roughly chopped (reserve a pinch to finish)
1 tablespoon cilantro, roughly chopped (reserve a pinch to finish)
1 teaspoon sherry wine
Method:
1. In a large sauce pot, heat 3 tablespoons
of butter, then add 3 tablespoons sliced lemongrass,
1/2 tablespoon ginger, 1/2 tablespoon garlic, and 1
tablespoon onion. Cook for 2 minutes until the onions
are translucent but not browned.
2. Add 2 tablespoons sherry wine, 1/2 tablespoon fish sauce, 1 teaspoon fermented black beans, and 1/2 tablespoon Sriracha; mix well.
3. Add 3 tablespoons flour to create a roux (paste) and cook for 5 minutes, stirring to prevent the flour from burning.
4. Add one-third of the combined clam juice and chicken stock. Mix thoroughly with a whisk and add the next third.
5. Bring to a boil and add 3 chopped Kaffir lime leaves, 5 chopped basil leaves, 1 tablespoon cilantro, and the last third of the clam juice and chicken stock.
6. Simmer for 15 minutes. Strain, discard solids, then place the sauce back into the pot and add 1/2 teaspoon Chinese black beans, 1 tablespoon Sriracha, 8 tablespoons butter, 1 teaspoon sherry wine, pinch of basil, and pinch of cilantro.
7. For aromatics, add 2 pieces of smashed lemongrass and 3 whole Kaffir lime leaves.
Plating:
12 pieces
of Shrimp and Pork Dumplings
12 ounces Spicy Lemongrass Black Bean Sauce
Method:
1. Place two Shrimp and Pork Dumplings in a small bowl.
2. Ladle 2 ounces of Spicy Lemongrass Black Bean Sauce over the dumplings. (Avoid adding whole lemongrass and Kaffir lime leaves.)
Twice-Cooked Short Ribs with Korean Chili Sauce
and Gingered Shrimp
Serves 6
Korean Chili Sauce:
Korean
Chili Paste:
1/2 cup Korean fine chili powder
3/4 cup water
1/2 cup white wine vinegar
4 tablespoons red Korean miso
1/4 cup honey
1 teaspoon minced garlic
1 teaspoon brown sugar
1/2 teaspoon fish sauce
Method:
1. Combine all ingredients in a food processor and blend until smooth.
Korean Sauce:
1 cup Korean Chili
Paste (above)
1 cup sugar
1 cup white wine vinegar
1 teaspoon soy sauce
1 tablespoon unsalted butter (optional)
Method:
1. Combine Korean Chili Paste, sugar, and
vinegar in a saucepan and boil until it becomes glossy
red.
2. Add soy sauce and mix well.
3. Optional: finish with 1 tablespoon unsalted butter to sweeten taste.
Twice-Cooked Short Ribs:
1 pound boneless chuck
short ribs, cut into pieces
2 cups water
1/4 cup sugar
1/2 cup soy sauce
1/4 cup mirin (sweet Japanese rice wine)
1/2 inch piece of fresh ginger, peeled and smashed
1/4 garlic (whole/head)
3 each green onion stalks, white bottom portion only, smashed (reserve green portion for Ginger Scallion Shrimp)
1 teaspoon corn starch
1 teaspoon water
Method:
Braising the Short Ribs: 1. Place the short ribs in a large saucepan or Dutch oven and add just enough water to cover them. Bring to a boil over high heat. 2. Reduce heat to a simmer and cook for 1 hour, skimming any impurities off the top. 3. Add the sugar, soy sauce, mirin, ginger, garlic, and green onions. 4. Continue to simmer, skimming the top, for another 2 to 3 hours or until the short ribs are fork tender. 5. Remove the pot from the heat and transfer the meat to a deep pan. Pour the braising liquid through a strainer into the pan, covering the short ribs. Cover and chill the short ribs overnight in the refrigerator. 6. The next day, remove any fat solids from the top.
Thickening the Braising Liquid: 1. Bring one cup of the braising liquid to a boil in a small saucepan. 2. Separately, combine the cornstarch and water into a slurry, then pour into the braising liquid. 3. Stir until sauce is thickened, then turn off the heat, strain, and set aside.
Grilling the Short Ribs: 1. Begin heating a grill. 2. Set the chilled ribs aside. 3. Transfer the remaining unthickened braising liquid to the large saucepan and reheat on the stovetop over medium heat. 4. When the liquid is hot, add the short ribs and reheat thoroughly. 5. Transfer reheated ribs to a plate and brush the meat with the thickened Braising Liquid. 6. To prevent sticking, 'season' the heated grill by wiping it with a towel saturated with canola oil. 7. Grill the ribs 1-2 minutes on both sides over high heat to achieve nice grill marks.
Gingered Shrimp:
6 shrimp, U-15 or 16/20 size, peeled and deveined
1/4 cup peanut oil
1/4 cup fresh ginger, peeled and minced
1/4 cup thinly sliced green onion, green portion only
1/2 teaspoon salt
1 teaspoon sesame oil
Method: 1. Rinse, peel, and devein shrimp. 2. In a stainless steel mixing bowl combine ginger and green onions, then season with 1/2 teaspoon salt. Mix well. 3. In a small pot, heat peanut oil to the smoking point. 4. Carefully ladle the hot peanut oil over the ginger scallion mixture. 5. Add the sesame oil to the hot ginger scallion mixture and stir in, then set aside to cool before use. 6. Heat a small saute pan. Add some oil from the ginger scallion mixture, being careful to use only the oil. Bring to medium heat. 7. Season the cleaned shrimp with salt. Place them all in the heated pan. 8. When the shrimp is almost done (approximately one minute on each side), add about 6 tablespoons of the ginger scallion mixture to the sauce pan. 9. When the shrimp is pink/orange in color, turn off the heat and reserve until needed.
Broccoli and Cauliflower:
6 pieces of 1-inch broccoli florets, rinsed and peeled
6 pieces of 1-inch cauliflower florets, rinsed and peeled
Salt
Method: 1. Fill two medium-sized pots with water and bring to a boil. 2. Add salt (1 teaspoon per cup of water). 3. Add the cauliflower and broccoli florets to separate pots. 4. Blanch the cauliflower for 3 minutes and the broccoli for 2 minutes. 5. Drain and transfer to a bowl of ice water to stop the cooking. 6. Drain and set aside.
Fried Eggplant:
2 long eggplants, partially skinned, cut into 12 2" x 1/2" x 1/2" sticks, towel-dried
4 cups canola oil
salt
Method: 1. Heat oil to 350 degrees F in a medium-size pot. 2. Add the eggplant in batches and fry for 1-2 minutes or until golden brown. 3. Remove from oil and drain on paper towels. 4. Season to taste with salt and keep warm.
Plating:
12 tablespoons Korean Chili
Sauce
6 pieces of Twice-Cooked Short Ribs
6 pieces Gingered Shrimp
6 pieces Broccoli and Cauliflower Florets
12 pieces Fried Eggplant
Method: 1. Spoon 2 tablespoons of Korean Chili Sauce onto the center of plate. 2. Place one grilled short rib in the center of the sauce. 3. Place one Gingered Shrimp on top of the short rib. 4. Place one piece each of Broccoli and Cauliflower Florets 1 inch above the short rib. 5. Place two pieces Fried Eggplant 1 inch below the short rib.
Pineapple "Shave Ice" (not your ordinary "Shave
Ice") Hawaiian Vanilla Panna Cotta Coconut Tapioca
Haupia Sorbet Lilikoi Sauce "Shaved" Pineapple
Serves 6
Hawaiian Vanilla Panna Cotta Yield:
6 servings
1 cup heavy cream
1/4 cup whole homogenized milk
1/4 cup granulated sugar
1/2 vanilla bean (seeds removed)
1 - 1/4 gelatin sheets bloomed in ice water (or 2 and 1/2 teaspoons Knox powdered gelatin)
Method: 1. Bring cream, milk, sugar, and vanilla to a boil, stirring until the sugar is dissolved. 2. Remove the gelatin sheets from the water and add to the boiled mixture. Stir to dissolve the sheets. Strain. 3. Pour 3 tablespoons into each of 6 martini glasses and let set in the refrigerator for 4 hours.
Lilikoi Sauce:
Yield 14 servings
3/4 cup
water
1 tablespoon clear gel starch
1/2 cup + 2 tablespoons passion fruit puree
1 cup water
1/3 cup sugar
Method: 1. Combine the 3/4 cup water and clear gel starch. Set aside. 2. In a small pot, combine the passion fruit puree, water and sugar; bring to a boil. 3. Add the gel starch mixture to the pot and return to a boil, then remove from the heat and chill until cold.
Coconut
Tapioca:
Yield: 12 servings
8 cups water
1 cup sugar
1/4 cup tapioca pearls
1/2 gallon ice cubes
1 cup + 2 tablespoons coconut milk
1/4 cup sugar
Method: 1. Bring the water and 1 cup sugar to a boil in a large pot. Add tapioca pearls and let simmer for 10 minutes, stirring occasionally. 2. Remove from heat, add ice cubes and let sit for 2 hours. Strain and set aside. 3. In a small pot, bring the coconut milk and 1/4 cup sugar to a boil. 4. Remove from heat and cool. 5. Fold the prepared tapioca pearls into the sauce and place in the refrigerator to chill.
Haupia Sorbet:
Yield: 20 servings
2 - 1/4 cups granulated sugar
1 - 1/3 cups water
1/2 cup Karo light corn syrup
3 cups extra-rich (25%) coconut milk
1 - 1/2 cups water
(Substitute last two ingredients with 4 and 1/2 cups of canned unsweetened coconut milk if unable to find extra-rich coconut milk)
Method: 1. Bring first three ingredients to a boil and simmer for 5 minutes. Strain and chill. 2. Once chilled, thoroughly combine it with the coconut milk and remaining water. 3. Transfer to an ice cream machine and freeze according to the manufacturer's directions.
Shaved Pineapple:
Yield: 6 servings
2 whole
pineapples, peeled, quartered, core removed.
Set aside
two quarters for garnish.
1 vanilla bean, seeds removed
1/4 cup ginger root, washed and sliced into 1/8" pieces
Method: 1. Combine all of the ingredients together in a Ziploc bag and set in the freezer for a day.
Plating:
6 martini glasses of Hawaiian Vanilla Panna Cotta (see recipe)
6 tablespoons Lilikoi Sauce (see recipe)
1 and 1/2 cups Coconut Tapioca (see recipe)
6 mint leaves, julienne cut
2 cups of fresh pineapple, diced into 1/2" cubes
1 - 1/2 cups Haupia Sorbet (see recipe)
6 quarters of Shaved Pineapple (see recipe)
1 lime
Plating each serving: 1. Take chilled martini glass of Hawaiian Vanilla Panna Cotta and pour one tablespoon of Lilikoi Sauce on top. 2. Add 1/4 cup of Coconut Tapioca. 3. Place 1 julienned mint leaf on the tapioca along with six cubes of diced pineapple. 4. Place 1 icecream-size scoop (approximately 1/4 cup) of Haupia Sorbet on top. 5. Using a microplane, coarsely shave one quartered frozen pineapple over the sorbet. 6. Grate lime zest lightly over the top. 7. Serve immediately. |
if you have been following along since the beginning of the countdown you know I mentioned I have some fun prizes in store. So I am going to kick off the fun today...make sure you read through to find out how you can WIN.
You may have noticed that I have a theme going on here. My absolute favourite colour is green so I am absolutely delighted by PTI's addition of Spring Moss. I hope you are too.
Candle Centre Piece
Candles are so elegant so it makes sense to use as or with your centre piece. Again, my goal for this release is to show you EASY ways to make your own wedding ensembles. The total time to make this project was 10 minutes and that is being generous! And you know what's even better than that? The project cost $1.25 CAD to make. If you add the base tray and the flowers it costs $4.50 CAD.
Step 1
Begin by stamping the large oval on a piece of white tissue paper in spring moss, followed by Wedding Day in black and August 8, 2008 in black too. Note: You only want to stamp on white tissue paper for a white candle.
Step 2
Cut out the image as close as possible.
Step 3
Glue the tissue paper to the candle.
Step 4
Wrap a piece of wax paper around the candle as tightly as possible and heat until the image darkens. Peel back slowly and ensure all areas have melted into the candle.
Tip: When heating do not apply heat directly over top of the image (the wax will run). Rather, heat evenly in a back and forth movement over the entire stamped surface.Step 5
Attach ribbon at the bottom.
Supplies
paper: Stampers Select White Cardstock by Papertrey Ink
ink: Black Palette, Perfect Match Spring Moss by PTI
stamps: Wedding Day (Urban Design) by Papertrey Ink
accessories: Spring Moss Satin Ribbon by Papertrey Ink, prima flowers
tools: scissors
misc: tissue paper
Personalized Wedding Favour
Again, the key to making your wedding favours is making the task quickly reproducible with the least amount of steps.
Step 1
Cut a piece of cardstock into a square 7.25x7.25 and stamp randomnly. I am showcasing white and spring moss but I also added black at the last minute which is not shown in this photo.
Step 2
Next, I turned the cardstock square to form a diamond and folded the right side of the paper across centre (try and avoid creasing). Repeat with the left side forming a cone. Then I adhered the left side (to secure) with double sided sticky tape.
Step 2
Then I filled the cone (I put pebbles to show you the depth etc) but you can put candies, flower seeds, flower bulbs etc of your choice. At this point I folded the tip over the opening (again avoid creasing paper).
Step 3
Now that the main wedding favour is complete I added the final touches. I stamped the flourished circle and cut it out using the nestabilities circle. I punched out Sara and Thomas with the 1 1/4th inch circle punch and adhered it to the centre of the circle with a pop dot.
I also decided to test out Lisa's FAB tutorial and stamp the decorative square image directly onto the twill ribbon to keep with the flourish theme.
Lastly, I formed the ribbon into a loop and placed it onto the wedding favour using a glue dot and secured the label to ribbon with a few pop dots.
Another variation of the flourished circle. I know how some people are LOVING the 08.08.08 date!
Supplies
paper: Stampers Select White Cardstock by Papertrey Ink, Spring Moss Cardstock by Papertrey Ink
ink: Black Palette, Perfect Match Spring Moss by PTI, Whisper White by SU!
stamps: Wedding Day (Urban Design) by Papertrey Ink
accessories: Spring Moss Twill Ribbon by Papertrey Ink,
tools: scissors, Circle die from Nestabilities by Spellbinders, 1 1/4th inch Circle Punch by EK Success
Have you made it this far? Well this is just the beginning of fun. I have two BIG prizes to award leading up to the release. I sure hope you can make it to the release party too. So what's up for grabs today? How about one of those GORGEOUS perfect match Spring Moss ink pads. Afterall green is my fav colour. How do you win? You can answer one of the following questions: 1) When are you getting married/or your sibling/friend/daughter/son etc? 2) What would you like to see for tomorrow's tutorial? 3) If you are getting married on 08/08/08 PLEASE tell me *wink* ...if you can't answer any of those questions just leave me a comment letting me know which of the two tutorials you liked today. Trust me when I say you WANT to leave a comment in the next few days. All I can say is it is to your benefit *smiles*
Make sure you stop by Candice's blog to see her new sneak peaks--her set looks adorable. She finally received it and is revved up to show you all the goods too.
Have a terrific day! Don't forget to check back again tomorrow.
167 comments:
Does the first post EVER win? Sigh. :O)
I loved both tutorials, but I can see myself doing the second one, for sure. I'm always helping out people with their wedding stuff.
I would have loved to get married on 8/8/8, alas, we got married 11/15/07. Nothing cool about the date at all. Just when the Rabbi had time for us. :)
I love BOTH of today's tutorials. The favor cone is adorable, and also great for Easter coming up...and I love to make hand-stamped candles! Unfortunately, we have no weddings come up, but my parents Golden anniversary is just a few years away, so I'm already thinking of what to plan for that!
I love the new Spring Moss color also. I have not tried the candle yet, so I would like to try that technique first. Again, no weddings in my future, but my anniversary is April 20, 1991, which means next month will be our 17th anniversary - time flies when you're having fun :) Thanks for the inspiration. Elizabeth S. in mid-Michigan
Hi Alli,
I just celebrated my 28th anniversary (woohoo) but I do have a wedding coming up; my daughter is the maid of honor in her best freinds wedding on June 14th and her other friend announced that she'll be getting married next September. I love the candle you created and the easy instructions! Thanks!
Kathyc on SCS
Alli, Your projects are gorgeous. I gotta browse down through the rest of them. Your blog is wonderful.
Ali - I love the candle. The wedding set is so elegant. I can't wait to see all of the new releases. Thanks for sharing.
Pattie Brown
[email protected]
Brilliant tutorials Alli, I love the spring moss collection too, it is so classy.
For tomorrow's tutorial I'd love to see save the date cards, wedding menu's or place settings as from what I've seen so far the PTI wedding set is going to be perfect for the whole wedding statioary as well as gifts and decorations.
I'm not getting Married but I may just remarry my husband just for a chance of that candle.
Wonderful tutorials! The embellished candle tutorial puts a new twist on others I have seen by using the tight covering of wax paper. What a wonderful detail to ensure success!
No weddings in sight for me, but I am working on a baby shower for my niece-- invitations are done, and now I have an idea for the favors (just different colors!), thanks to you!
Any ideas for a guest book?-- I'm thinking one that can be passed around and a brief note written rather than just a name.
Thanks!
Mary
I love the spring moss line too - bought almost everything! Now I'm thinking your set will be my first purchase on the 15th because of a wedding shower that I'm giving!
Beautiful tutorials.
debbies on SCS
I have thoroughly enjoyed all of your tutorials. I am new to Papertrey, and have fallen in love with their stamps. I really like the tutorial for the candle. Your new wedding set is so elegant.
I loved the candle tutorial. I have done this several times, but never thought of glueing the tissue paper down first. No weddings, but I celebrate my 17th wedding anniversary on April 6. I haven't tried the new colors yet, but I feel an order coming up.
Karen B in Texas
Since I'm coming up on my 2 year anniversary this June, I'd have to say the 2nd tutorial is my favorite of the two, as I can see myself using the favor cone for occasions other than weddings. Although, thinking about it now, the candle could be stamped with flowers, etc--things other than wedding-theme.
I love the favors tutorials. Thanks for sharing!
Glorie
Hi Alli! Great stuff! I really like your candle tutorial...I have seen them before, but never really knew how people did them. Yours is gorgeous!
oh my gosh, Alli your projects are fantastic. I wish I was getting married but I already am and plan to stay that way :o) I did add my own touch to my wedding invitaions though by adding dry embossing to the vellum overlay and I hand calligraphied all the addresses on the envelopes and the placecards too. I can't wait to see what else you come up with!
Ruth.
Hi Alli - I am getting married on 27th March 2009 - I would love to see a tutorial relating to place cards - I need some exciting ideas as to what I can place on the tables so people know where they are sitting - please help! x Karen x
Love the stamp set and the candle idea! That would work for gifts as well!
Great set and projects!!
I love the favour tutorial. There are so many uses for it. I love how you used the flourish stamp with three different inks. It really added a lot of dimension to the pouch.
My niece is getting married in May 2008.
08.08.08 is definitely a popular wedding date! Both a friend and my boyfriend's mom are getting married that day - guess I have to pick which one to attend!! :)
Hi Alli! Well I am not getting married on 8/8/08 but I am turning 39 that day! I love the candle tutorial! I can not wait to try it! Have a great day! Jessie
Really nice job on both tutorials! I would probably do the candle first myself, it seems a little less labor-intensive and with limited time I tend to go for the quicker projects. I'm loving all of the new PTI ink colors and I'm really looking forward to seeing what else you have in store for us with this release!
I would love to see a wedding scrap page tutorial. May be one that could easily be reproduced to mail with the wedding gift thank-you card.
Kellie
Both tutorials are great. I can use candle decor anytime and what family does not need some sort of favor holder? Thanks again for your ideas. Congrads on your work.
Retired Heather
My nephew is getting married in June and I am in charge of shower invites and favors (for which I used PTI Sweet Love and Piece of Cake!) and the wedding invites. I'm getting some great ideas from you girls! Thanks!
Your candle is so beautiful. Sounds easy enough that I just might have to try it. Thanks for such great tutorials. -Molly B
Beautiful projects! I especially like the candle. I will save that idea for my youngest son's wedding. No date set yet. Just for fun, we are celebrating our 31st anniversary on March 18th...seems like just yesterday! Thanks for the inspiration....love your blog!
I loved the favor box, because even though I am already married and don't plan to do THAT again, I could use that favor box for another type of event. Maybe an anniversary party for my parents! Thanks for the great sneaks!
Lisa K
I personally loved the candle today. And then, I also loved the stamped on twill with the cone project. What is it like to be sooo creative?
The wedding date reminds me of the date we adopted our cat from the animal shelter. We picked her up 6-6-06. This is the number for the antichrist...believe me she acts like one sometimes. :)
Thank you for your beautiful projects..they inspire me.
Kristyn
That is the cutest favor box... and you make it look so easy. I am excited to try it out myself. TFS
Julia Diane
I do not have an answer to any of the wedding related questions. I do hope my BFF will be getting engaged sometime this year:)
I love the tutoiral for the wedding favors-love the colors you chose. the black really added to the elegance. Also, the idea behind the cone could be carried over for any event! Thanks.
All your tutoritals are so beautifully detailed and your ideas fresh & fun. I enjoyed the one using the glassine envelopes for give aways. I will be trying that one for sure!
I have a nephew being married 10/25/08, AND I will be making the invitations, so am loving your ideas. Thanks so much, can hardly wait to see the entire set! Tina
My best friend's daughter is getting married July 11, and I will be co-hosting her bridal shower. I have SO many ideas for this set!! How could I possibly choose a favorite tutorial?!? Everything you've done so far is beautiful and elegant! :)
My big brother is getting married 7.12.08- just a few months away! I'd love to see some elegant thank-you cards that the bride & groom can send to thank guests for gifts. A new couple can always use those!
I love the post about the candles and my cousin is getting married on October 3 of this year. How about thank yous for after the wedding. Great stamp set and awesome job on all the projects. TFS!
Love all your projects/cards Alli. You are so talented. Keep em comin'!
I'm getting married in March 2009 (tentatively March 21 but we haven't officially set the date yet). I'm definitely making my own invites, programs, favors, and thank you notes - so thanks so much for the inspiration. I can't wait to see the entire set!
Hmm, as to what I'd like to see for tomorrow's tutorial - how about a wedding program? :-)
FYI, I used your instructions below (well, I resized it a little to create a wedding invite prototype! Thanks so much your sharing all your great ideas!
I've been married for 25 years...does that count? :)
I liked the first post best because we did the candle favors for my Godchild's wedding last year. When I showed her how to do it, the WOW factor was huge. It truly was cool.
Thanks for sharing your ideas.
Love all you have done so far. How about a bridesmaid or flower girl gift for your next tutorial. kim
All of your projects have been great! I really love the elegance of the candle...just beautiful! Thank you for sharing such wonderful ideas!! Tracey :)
My Son is getting married 9/5/08
both tutorials are great. I expecially like the candle one. I've gotta give it a try.
Hi Alli, Loved your candle project! It's just so elegant looking. I wanted to know how you got the lettering on your tissue paper. Do you just happen to have a stamp with the names? Any suggestions if you don't have a stamp.
What i want to see tomorow is anything you want to make, your creativity is better than mine. (I have ben married 17 years and am still happy!)
I'm loving all your sneak peak/tutorials. No upcoming weddings but will celebrate our 12th Anniversary on Aug 7.
Thanks for sharing!
I love both of these! That candle is beautiful -- I will definitely have to give that a try soon! (Maybe for our friends that are getting married on May 23!) But that favor cone is delightful! I'm throwing a baby shower for my sister-in-law in a few weeks, and this would be perfect! Thanks for sharing! (And I am a fan of spring moss, too -- so elegant!)
Oh my, I really really wish I hadn't already gotten married last year! My mom and I handmade all of my wedding invitations, favors, place cards, etc. with stamping suplies but it would have been 1000 times easier with this set! This is just what all the brides and thier moms need!
Both of your tutorials today (and in the days prior) were GREAT! I especially love the candle idea as I wanted to do that at my wedding but we couldn't figure out a good way to do so.
I would like to see you use the new sets to maybe create a save the date card.
Thanks for the great inspiration, now I can only hope that my old college roomate gettting married next summer will ask me for help with her wedding ;)!
Alli, I love all the tutorials you have given us. The one I like best today is the candle. It just seems it is more elegant for the wedding. The other is nice, but I vote for the candle. Alice Roushia
My sister is getting married on May 2nd. I would love to see what you can come up with for place cards. Both tutorials are great! Can't wait to see what you come up with next.
Love the set. I help lots of friends with thier weddings. Next one is coming up in May. Hopefully we will be able to use your set as we get ready! I love the cone shaped favor idea!
Allison
Ok, so ive been married for 8 years, and there's no change coming as far as that is concerned. BUT i do LOVE this favor tutorial and am thinking to use it for our easter party. It would even be great for my DS birthday *(he loves pirates) or thanksgiving (i see cornicopia!) I love how the possibilities are endless
dHi alli!! I am already married and I'm old enough that most of my friends are married but young enough that my neices and nephews are too young to get married yet!!! What would I like to see for tomorrow's tutorial?? Maybe thank you cards for the wedding (but honestly - anything would be great - your projects are all awesome). My favorite item today is the wedding favor - totally amazing. I also really loved the invitation you made yesterday! The Kraft, Spring Moss, and Black were so stunning together!! Thanks for these wonderful sneak peaks!!!
Donelda
LOVE that candle... SO beautiful! Looking forward to seeing the entire set. Congratulations again!
I loved the wedding candle tutorial. I've never done any candles, but have a friend getting married soon & this would be a sweet "extra" gift. Thanks for the idea!
Hey Alli, I'm another lover of the 08.08.08. It's so class. Love that it's dots and not dashes. Well, let's see, I like the candle project best. I love that you stamped the matching liner for the candle tray.
The candle turned out so pretty! I've made these before but I love your tip of wrapping it with waxed before melting it to keep it smooth. It turned out very pretty and classy! Well done!
I loved the candle that you made and its presentation. It is beautiful. I do not know anyone that is getting married this year, but I am going to try this project. Thanks Angelina
I really liked the candle tutorial. I've seen it before, but you made it look so easy and elegant...I think I'll have to try it! If only I knew someone who was getting married!
Thanks for your time and for sharing your talent with us all.
I love your blog and your tutorials! I've been married for 15 years so I don't plan on getting married again anytime soon! I do love the candle tutorial though and plan to use that! BTW, I do love your new PTI set- congratulations!
Gretchen
I don't have any family members getting married at this time but I so enjoy making favors and invitations for friends and can not wait to see this set release! Wooo Hoooo! You sure know how to build up the anticipation. I would also love to see something done using vellum, I've been wondering if the perfect match ink works well with that? And I absolutely LOVE the stamping on the ribbon!!!! Thanks for sharing with us all!! Awesome designs!!!
There are no weddings in my near future, but I was a maid of honor and bridesmaid in two weddings just two months apart last year and could have used these ideas then, LOL! Great stuff!!!
I really like the favor cone today. It can be used for so many occasions! I am not getting married, and all my friends are married, so no weddings for us in the near future...
THanks for sharing :)
Love the candle tutorial - I'll have to try one. Your new set is beautiful.
OMG these are beautiful. My sister is getting married in October, and when I showed her the Spring Moss color she said it was perfect for her wedding. (She is using Green and Brown as her colors). I was going to order some (And now the whole wedding set. Everything is so gorgeous) but before I saw your tutorials, I didn't even think about using it for favors too.!! So pretty.
I don't know anyone getting married this year, but I LOVE both of your projects. The candle looks so easy to make, and it's beautiful!
No close weddings in sight, but lots of baby showers. I really like your candle tutorial. You could do so much with that -- birthday gifts, admin assistants -- endless possibilities.
BTW, my nephew's birthday is 08-08. Unfortunately he turns nine on 08.08.08. That would have been very cool if he had turned 8 this year!
Thanks so much!
I love both tutorials. If I had to pick one and would say the wedding favors. I can easily see myself making these for friends.
I love all your projects, but I like the candle the most. My granddaughter is getting married June 22, 2008 and I really like these ideas.
I love that candle idea. I had no idea how to get the tissue on the candle. Fabulous! Just about everyone I know is already married, so ques. #1 is out. As for ques. #2, you guys come up with things I never would dream of! Thansk for inspiring me.
I'm so excited about this set, well all of them really. My brother is getting married in two weeks, so I should just get this in time to do a wedding card. I'd love to see a very SPECIAL elegant wedding card idea. And guess what, they wedding color is a soft green!!
My brother is getting married Oct. 4th and I'm compiling ideas to show him and his fiance to use as favors, centerpieces, etc. I'm hoping they will "ask" me to make some things!! *wink* So far I'm thinking this is my FAVORITE set! Love it!! ~ Donna M.
Love the tutorials, since my daughter is getting married in August of this year. Not sure if it will 08-08-08 or not, but that would be really cool, wouldn't it? She has to wait for her fiance' to get home from Africa where he is serving in the USN.
1) I don't know if I am ever getting married. I have been with my partner for 6 years, but marriage is not in the immediate future.
2)I would love to see something done with photos. I know lots of people send out thank you cards for the gifts they receive, and they include photos of the couple.
3rd attempt to say I wish your lovely tutorials had been available when we were married 10 yrs ago. I can use the treats holder for my twins' birthday the day before your wedding at least. Thanks!
I love the candle tutorial Alli. No weddings in the future for me that I know of though. Thank you so much for sharing these 2 awesome tutorials with everyone.
-*Linda*-
We got married on Pearl Harbor Day. Who does that? I always love to see tutorials on box-y things. I long to have a Scor-Pal so I can make all of those cool projects.
Thanks!
~Kathy
[email protected]
Awesome tutorials! I liked the candle one best, I've always wanted to know how to do that! :)
I have to say I WISH I wasn't married so I could be getting married and then I'd be CASEing every single one of these projects with your FAB Wedding Day set!! Alli you ROCK and keep up the WONDERFUL work!!
the centerpiece is my fav. They are all fabulous though!
Alli,
You are amazing! I love your work. I especially love your projects this week because after I got married in 2000, I had so much fun designing all of my wedding goodies (invitation, favors, programs, etc.) that I started my own wedding business. I was a vendor at many bridal shows and have designed hundreds of wedding invitations and accessories, so I have an extra soft spot for these projects. Your invitation is my favorite so far!
Since having kiddos, I have had to temporarily stop my wedding biz. (Just not enough hours in the day!) Your projects are really making me miss it!
Thanks for all you do! I check your blog daily and am never disappointed at what I find!!
I think all the wedding day projects are amazing! You do such beautiful work. I am not getting married but I have two friends who are and there dates are not set but are coming to me for idea's thank you for getting the ball rolling with such great idea's!! The Candle is my fav but not by much they are both devine.
Already been married for almost 13 years here. . .but I love the candle tutorial!! That's beautiful! I've been wanting to try the stamping with a candle and I think today may be my day. These new sets just make it all so elegant!!
Thanks for sharing with us. The wedding favors are amazing as well!
I'm not getting married...again...since I already am...but if I was, I'd be making those candles. They're pure genius!
My wedding date is almost as fun....We were married on 8-1-81!! Has made it easy for my hubby to remember!
Did you print the names for the favor on the computer? What font is it?
Awesome projects...love them all, especially the candle.
Stampingly yours,
Pam
beautiful projects - the black really added some pop to that favor cone! Hmmm, what would I like to see tomorrow? I like cute favor ideas as well as cards.
I love your tutorials. I thinking of using them for other uses (baby showers etc) because everyone i know is either already married or will probably never be married:) Did you print the Sara & Thomas on a computer? I just received my first PTI set this week and can't wait to order again! Just so excited to see whats coming!! Love the green too.
I have been married for 6 years on 8/3/02 but my bro and his fiance are getting married August 30 of this year.
I love the tutorial you did about the candle. I have yet to try it out but would love to get the chance. Thanks for sharing your projects and another great stamp set.
I loved both tutorials-and I love that shade of green. I don't have any weddings coming up but we do have our youngest's Quinceañera next year on 08/08 of all days (her actual bithday). My husband and I will be celebrating our 25th anniversary in March.
Olivia M.
My brother is getting married on August 29th an this would be an awesome set to do their favors with. Their main colors are pink and brown and his fiance really wants to try and bring in a spring green as well (like spring moss!).
Thanks Alli! I love your tutorials.
I loved the candle tutorial. It ended up so beautiful and I never would have imagined that it was a stamped image! Amazing!!!
I will be married 5 years on 8/15/08. These would have been great at my wedding. But I still have family I use the candle idea for. I think the candle has to be my favorite. It just looks so personal and elegant. I cannot wait for the release. All of your stuff Alli is amazing PTI is lucky to have you ... keep up the great work !!!!!
I love the candle tutorial. I've never tried to make one but I might have to now. ;) I love this new set. I can't wait to see more.
I have really loved this wedding theme! My friend's daughter is getting married in May, so I've been sending her links. :-) My 18th anniversary will be in April! LOL
--amysings
No weddings coming up, not even our anniversary which isn't until November. I loved both tutorials, but my favorite is the candle. I really want to try that some time.
no wedding coming up but I can see using both of these for anniversary bashes Donna in Fargo ND where is spring????
I just love the font and elegance of these designs. I'd love to see placecards... maybe not wedding, but Thanksgiving??
Alli - your stuff is WONDERFUL! I check your blog every day. Loved the candle technique today especially. No one around here getting married - although after almost 18 years, I'd do it all again with the same guy in a heartbeat! How about some easily reproduceable thank you notes for tomorrow's tutorial??? Thanks for sharing all your lovely work.
My anniversary is actually coming up, 04/02/05 , nothing exciting about that date, except it's not April Fool's. I liked the second tutorial, I can see how it can be used for other occasions not just weddings.
I love the candle. I wish I had seen these projects when my daughter was married. I still have one to get married so I might have the opportunity to make them.
My brother-in-law is getting married on May 2, 2008. Thank you for the candle tutorial, I might just have to make that for them! I'm not even going to suggest a tutorial for tomorrow because whatever you come up with will wow me more than anything I could suggest...
Melissa
Hi Alli!
BOTH tutorials are great! I will be trying the second one SOON! I can see all kinds of applications for that one.
I would love to win the Spring Moss stamp pad, as I was unable to order it last month! For some reason, it wouldn't take when I tried to put it in my "shopping cart". Thanks for the chance to win!
Kathy McDonald,Seattle
My Sister-in-law is getting married on 07-17-08. She had always wanted to get married on 07-07-07, but alas, she didn't have anyone to marry last year. Kind of an important detail, right? She really should have gone with 08-08-08, but I guess decided she didn't want to wait TOO long. As for another tutorial...perhaps something that's not wedding-related so I can see the true versatility of your set...how's that for a challenge?
I loved today's tutorials, especially the Candle Center Piece. It looks so beautiful and elegant. I will definitely try my hand at making them, thanks!
How to choose between those two? I am not getting married, but I have two daughters, not getting married yet, but someday. So all of these great ideas go into a file to be used later. Not only do we love saving money by doing things ourselves, we love the personal, individual look of doing it yourself, plus it is so much FUN! Thanks so much.
My Husband and I were married on Valentine's Day, a few years back. I love the wedding ideas and I will keep them in mind for my two daughter's future weddings!
Both projects are absolutely wonderful. My step-son is getting married on July 19, so I plan on showing these two projects to he and his fiance. This paper looks so fantstic with the black and white accents.
As far as tomorrow goes...how about a tutorial featuring the Something Old, Something New idea of a wedding.
Have a great day - Regina Davis
I love your ideas. My niece is getting married on August 16 so I am really enjoying all the ideas I am getting from you.
Diane D.
I love the candle tutorial! I want to go home and do that after work today...
I got married on 5/7/07 and made all of my own invitations, thank you notes, and favors. The next wedding coming up is my husband's cousin in July.
Thanks for the chance to win!
I love your tutorials! Will have to try the candle idea. I would love to see your version of place cards or programs for the ceremony ! You are really covering all the bases though! Thank you for sharing~
Both tutorials were just beautifull. I think personally I like the candle better. Maybe next you do something cute with the floral arrangments or maybe a card holder.
Marla
Love 'em both, but the favor cone is my fav. The color combo is striking & very elegant looking. Looking forward to anything else you do. Alas, I am already married but hey why not an anniversary party! Placecards would be nice to have something nice & do something different with.
Alli,
I think your candle is absolutely gorgeous!! I just love how stamping allows us to transform something so simple into something so elegant! I wish I knew someone getting married right now, but they are all at the baby stage. I am sure I can make lots of baby shower favors with these lovely stamps though! Thank you. Becky
Beautiful projects! Tomorrow I would love to see a thank you card for the gifts. Can't wait to see what you have up your sleeve :)
Oh wow - I love that candle and am so glad you showed me the proper way to do it. My friends daughter got married a couple months ago and the candle I tried to make for her jsut wasn't right. It was the wax paper step that I missed!!!
Love the candle tutorial. I was married on 11-11-00. My birthday is 08-05-08, just missed the cool date by a few days. ;)
I love both your projects. Green is my favorite color, too. Your live traffic feed is cool; I've never seen it before!
I SOO LOVE the new PTI stamps,inks and paper!!! I'm so excited to start creating, can wait to get my own. I like the second tutorial because the favor can be used for baby showers or other parties as well.
Love the tutorials! They are both the best! So professional looking! I don't know anyone getting married. I know people having babies though, that would be a good theme for a tutorial tomorow, something for baby showers or baby cards. Thanks for the change to win!
thanks for the candle tutorial. I want to try that for sure!
Well I can't realy answer either question. I have been married for 7 years and have 2 kids so I am at a different stage in life....but I love both these projects. I can see making teachers gifts with the candels and birthday party favours instead of wedding favour and much more witht these ideas. Thanks so much for your sharing your excellent talent and knowledge!
Catherine
Thanks for the wonderful tutorials! I love the candle project. I've been wanting to do something like that for a while now. No weddings in sight here, so I would love to see your new set used for something outside of the wedding area. I know the set is "wedding Day", but I'm sure it is very versatile. Show us more!!
Alli I love your site. Both of these tutorials were great today! Especially the candle tutorial, what a great idea. I love green also...I painted my office this color.
Alli--
I just love this new set you created. It is so elegant and I love that it can be used for so much more then weddings!
Amy O. in North Carolina
I'm already married (happily! for 21 years!), and no one I know is getting married soon--but I loved your candle tutorial. It could be easily adapted for many occasions. I love your projects and share your love of green. And from what I've seen of your wedding stamp set, I think I'll love it, even for non-wedding uses.
hi,
loved your candle tutorial. it looks great.
i would love to see any gift ideas in tins, or a double pocket card.
thanks
I am already married, but love the candle tutorial as this would be perfect for an anniversarry dinnner or a gift bag to a friend for a christening.
I love the candle tutorial with pictures. I can seee now how easy they really are....by the way, I was not married on 08-08, but 8-5-95. August is a great month!
Wendi Grant in NH
Hi Alli, I am already married, almost 13 years! My brother and sister-in-law are having a baby on 8-8-08, though!! I wanted my daughter to be born on 8-7-6, but she came in July, stubborn from the beginning!
I loved the candle tutorial. How about stamping on food or chocolate? I don't know if there is any food-safe way to do that, though. Thanks!
I'll be showing both tutorials and ideas to my son's fiancee, as I have offered to help with their wedding in the way of favors. They don't have a date yet, but it will probably be next year, so I should have a little time to make everything. Thanks for both tutorials and a chance at your giveaway!
Well, I must say I haven't been to a wedding in almost 3 years, but just this morning I got an invite to a wedding on April 12, 2008. (Guess you know you're getting old when all your friends and family are already married or NOT getting married. LOL!) I really liked the cone favor tutorial today. For tomorrow's tutorial I would like to see a simple and elegant bridal shower gift - since I now have one to attend this SATURDAY! Talk about short notice! LOL! Love your new set - can't wait to see it all.
Loved the tutorials. The "pebble cone" could also be used for a birthday party! I don't forsee any weddings in my near future, my kids are 11 and 8 , and I am happily married!
My brother in law is getting married on 20 June and I can't wait to get this set to make my wedding present for them. I love both tutorials - I haven't stamped on a candle before so this was very helpful. Have a great day. Heather
I love the candle. I am thinking this would also be a great mom's day gift!!.
noelani
Love that favour cone!!! We are celebrating our 10th anniversary this year but it is on 08/29/08. You continue to drop my jaw with your designing abilities!
Hi Alli..great ideas and made so nice... I really enjoyed the candle..so cool and easy to do..I will have to give it a try!! Thanks for your great ideas...
I'm planning a 90th birthday party for my grandma in July and the candle tutorial would be perfect for centerpieces. Thanks for the idea!!! melissa
Your tutorials are awesome! Question - Why do you glue the tissue paper on first? I did my first candle a few weeks ago but didn't glue mine. As for wedding, no 8/8/08 here but I'm celebrating my 8th anniversary in May! :)
I've just found this website and your products and am in love. I'm going to be ordering some paper and stamps. Have 2 married sons, where were you last year when the both got married 8 months apart? Still have a daughter who might be getting engaged, so I still have hope.
Both of your projects are beautiful. I especially love the candle- that can be used for so many occassions!
peggy lee
Love both ideas...but like the candle idea the best. Nope won't be getting married again anytime soon. My 25th wedding Anniversary is April 9th 2008.
Love your elegant candle, and saving the favor cone idea for maybe a b-day party favor. No weddings coming up but my husband's b-day is on 08/08! Thanks for sharing your talent here.
Sandra
My nephew is getting married June 21, 2008 and my mother and I are helping to make the invitations. We may need to do the favors too so I appreciate any ideas along that line. Love the candle too.
I know of only 1 person getting married at the beginning of next month. They've been together for 8 years and are finally making it official! They're daughter is happy about that, LOL! I loved the candle tutorial today. And how about a tutorial on something for an anniversary? I'm always stumped on a little gift to give for anniversaries.
I love everything you do and especially the wedding favor. I have a dear friend whose son is getting married on 05-03-08.
I can't wait to get some twill ribbon and stamp on it like you did. Such a cleaver idea.
Betty
I've made a candle like that before, but it was good to be reminded of that! I also liked the other cone wedding favor. You do great work! Can't wait to see the set!
Love the candle tutorial! Didn't realize it was so easy :-)
all your projects have been great lately! I love the candle and I have never heard the tip about the wax paper--so clever!
I got married 4-24-4, which is cool, but not nearly as cool as 8-8-8!
WOW, absolutely gorgeous, Alli! I have to say this tutorial was my favorite only because I ADORE that candle on the tray with the primas. . .gorgeous! I've loved EVERYTHING you've created with your new set though! :)
These are fabulous! I'm not getting married but my sister is getting married on April 18. I'd love to see more tutorials for wedding favors. We're still trying to figure out what to do for hers. Thanks!
I love the candle.
(How did you get everything to line up so straight?)
I would love to see a scrapbook page next :)
~Lisa
Love both tutorials. You are a very talented person!! I do not know of anyone getting married at this time. TFS
Cindy C.
[email protected]
Your tutorials are GREAT Alli! THanks for sharing all you do with us. Keep up the great work.
I'm not getting married, but my sister is on Sept. 13, 2008. I loved the candle and know another thing I can make for her now! Thanks!!
I love the little cone favor holder.
Love the treat/favor cone idea. So cool when everything coordinates!
Love the candle tutorial - but then again I like all of what you've done! The wedding set is delightful and elegant. Unfortuately no weddings soon (we just celebrated 29 years) but always lots of events and occasions.
I, too, would like to see elegant thank you cards for bulk use!
I love the candle alot. I wish our date was set for 08-08-08. It is really hard to get my fiance to set a date. Maybe if I show him all these cool thinkgs you are making, or even just start creating and then make him give me a date to put on these projects, LOL!!!!
Tanya
These are both fantastic! I've been wondering how to do the candles, I can't believe how easy it looks. Can't wait to try it out.
I love both projects!
Alas, I have been married for 13 years and we have young children so it will be a long time before any weddings here. I do keep an idea folder and both projects are going in it.
Great job!
well my stepson is getting married 4-26-08. I made 150 invitations for the wedding even though we are not too excited about it as they are so young. But what can you do? Loved both your tutorials...I always love new packaging ideas! [email protected]
My son is getting married next summer. No date has been set yet. I would like to see a tutorial of different favors that are placed at each place setting at the reception. As the mother of the groom, my place is to wear beige and shut up(no, I was not told that to my face), but being a paper crafter, I will have to do something creative and elegant just so I can say I helped!!
I loved both tutorials! Thanks for the ideas. I don't have anyone getting married too soon, but I do have two daughters, so we'll be paying for a wedding eventually! Congratulations on your new stamps!
My daughter's getting married in Oct. and Nicole already released the perfect color paper last month (we call it Tiffany Blue!)for her wedding invitations. Now I'm ready for the perfect stamp set!!
Alli, I loved both tutorials. I've never done the candle yet, so I definitely want to try that. the 080808 date is awesome...I can't take it tho, I've already taken 070501 nothing special about the numbers, but the date is really special to me! lol
I am amazed at how you make the candle seem so easy & "do-able" to someone who hasn't attempted it as yet. thanks!!!
i'll keep reading your blog, I love it!
Ret
Hi beautiful! I always love seeing what you're up to, you crafty chicky you :)
BTW, I just put up a picture of us on my blog, you should check it out. Great memories :) :)
Hugs
caro
Hi!
Today I posted an entry on my blog with a link to these tutorials.
Would you let me know if that's OK?
Thanks,
Nancy Ward
loved both projects, but especially the cone favor! |
vucubcaquix: I was honestly a bit at a loss for words for last week’s post. I didn’t dislike it and found it quite funny, but the animation was a bit weak in places and there wasn’t much to visually parse amidst the gags and slapstick. That’s not so for this week. In fact, halfway through I had to remark to my partner how absolutely beautiful some of the compositions for the scenes were. It’s not just the beauty that struck me, but also what’s being communicated through the imagery.
Take for instance the screencap I posted above. The scene from which it was taken has Tabuki and Yuri discussing the Takakura siblings and how it relates to their shared longing for Momoka. They both miss her and she is the light of both of their worlds. The Tokyo Tower that they both gaze at is a symbol of the lengths which Momoka went through to affect their lives. But Momoka is also a source for contention for the both of them, as you see by how the scene is bifurcated by the same Tower that they both venerate. Yuri cannot bring herself to forgive the Takakura children for what their parents did sixteen years ago, and her emotions about the situation are worn quite plainly for us to see. Tabuki on the other hand, deadens himself inside, convincing himself (if he doesn’t already believe it) that he holds no grudge against the children for what their parents executed. It is no small irony that the actress is the half of the pair who has difficulty concealing her emotions and opinions.
Their contrasting attitudes on how to feel about Momoka’s death is represented by the Tower dividing their positions in the room, but I also felt that there was a commonality that the two characters shared that was represented by the bottle itself. They both hurt, they both suffer for being without their friend, but both have kind of supplanted this feeling with the pursuit of the material comforts of wealth, extravagance, hobbies, distractions. They are meant as a sort of self-medication to soothe the ache of their missing purpose, a mindset that is very self-destructive indeed.
ajthefourth: Now that we have a bit more insight into Tabuki’s character, it’s interesting to see how he and Yuri represent two prevailing societal attitudes expressed by the majority of affected interviewees in Haruki Murakami’s Underground: the Tokyo Gas Attack and the Japanese Psyche. As mentioned above, in their conversation, Tabuki is the calm, cool, and collected party, while Yuri smoulders with rage, saying that she cannot forgive what the Takakura Family has done. Tabuki expressly reiterates that the sins of the parents are not passed down to the children, which Yuri obviously has a hard time believing. We see Ringo accept a “harmless” invitation to dine with Yuri with emphasis that Ringo should bring Himari in tow. The two are intercepted by Tabuki just as Yuri is intercepted by Masako. On the elevator, Tabuki seemingly eschews his previously-voiced opinion that the sins of the parents are not passed down to the children by saying that he will now enact the punishment that is owed to the Takakura Family. However, I’d disagree that he goes against what he said to Yuri in their apartment. He simply has a different approach to why punishment should be enacted.
Following any sort of catastrophic event such as the 1995 Tokyo Sarin Gas Attacks, the overwhelming and immediate response is to always blame something and subsequently retaliate as quickly as possible (this attitude is what Yuri represents). In a way, Tabuki represents the attitude (which I touched upon in a comment response here) that justice must be served, regardless of any initial emotional response or quick judgment. Seemingly, he seeks punishment for the Takakuras because it is naturally owed to them, not out of any rash, emotional reaction. He tells Yuri that he too has not forgotten Momoka, but that retaliation will hardly bring her back. Interestingly enough, he adds that her life was, “unfairly stolen away” which echoes the sentiments of the Takakura siblings in regards to Himari. The question remains, what is “fair” or “unfair?”
"In the human world, truth and reality aren't always one and the same. Humans just call their desires and ambitions as 'truth.' Humans will even kill other humans if they have 'truth' as an excuse. War, it's war. The war is about to break out."
Sanetoshi echoes these statements in the quote above, and the skewing of “truth” to fit one’s own paradigm of thought is especially interesting when applied to Shouma’s allegory in Episode 12. In a previous comment response, I had expressed my theory that society in general is represented by the Goddess in Mawaru Penguindrum. The episodes following Episode 11 (when it is revealed that the series is directly referencing the Tokyo Sarin Gas Attacks) have only provided fuel for this theory. After all, what is fair and unfair completely relies on the recipient of the gift or punishment, and their hopes and desires. As Sanetoshi would say, we call our desires “truths.” Shouma points out that the Goddess says that punishment must be, “The most unjust.” In addition to this, when Himari is brought back to life, the Goddess is paraphrased as saying that it would be no fun if the punishment ended there. To one listening to Shouma’s point of view, the Goddess is unbearably cruel and toying with their desires and ambitions in a way that seems incredibly unjust. The important thing to remember is that these things are unjust to Shouma, the narrator. Within the realm of one’s own thoughts, it’s near impossible to step outside one’s own skewed point of view made up of multitudes of experiences. This is where one has the tendency to place blame on fate or a whimsical Goddess, instead of becoming more introspective and critical of one’s self (and the people that one chooses to associate with, or society as a whole). Murakami cites a debt to the Japanese people as one of his primary reasons for wanting to write about the attacks. He states that most people, instead of examining the social climate and what could have caused people to turn to such drastic measures, tend to approach Aum with an “us” and “them” mentality. “They” are somehow different than “us” who are not crazy and have right on our side.
“Just where has this ramshackle bandwagon of mass consensus delivered us Japanese with ‘right on our side?’ What have we learned from this shocking incident? One thing is for sure. Some strange malaise, some bitter aftertaste lingers on. We crane our necks and look around us as if to ask: where did all that come from? If only to be rid of this malaise, to cleanse our palettes of the aftertaste, most Japanese seem ready to pack up the whole incident in a trunk labeled THINGS OVER AND DONE WITH.
-Haruki Murakami, Underground: the Tokyo Gas Attack and the Japanese Psyche
The sins of the parents may or may not be passed down to the next generation; however, the cyclical nature of our main trio’s personalities and outlooks on the world should hardly be ignored. Yuri, Tabuki, and Momoka is who Kanba, Shouma, and Himari will end up becoming if they each continue down their various paths. It’s a “fate” of a different kind that will be pushed on them if they do not take care to look inwardly at their own actions, and the actions of their predecessors (much like Episode 13 alludes to with its somewhat ominous celebration of the anniversary of the Tokyo Sky Metro). Himari’s preview for the next episode would suggest that she is willing to accept her fate (one could argue that she’s been ready since Episode Nine) as a sacrifice, so it will be very interesting to see where our two trios choose to go. The wild-cards in this have now become Masako and Ringo. Interestingly enough, these are the two characters who have seemingly accepted themselves, good and bad, and are more self-aware and self-assured. Ringo no longer follows in the shadow of her sister, and Masako is bold enough to reject Sanetoshi outright when he suggests that she join his group. Both are now forging their paths on their own terms, an interesting comparison to Tabuki, Yuri, Shouma, and Kanba, who are all still bound by something else (guilt, regret, anger, etc.).
vucubcaquix: The wheel of fate that binds the characters rears itself again in the narrative of the story. Despite the best efforts of a certain character to alter the fates of those who suffer under the yoke of what is “unfair”, the clockwork like nature of the world ultimately manages to manifest itself in a different way. What can the Takakura siblings do to prevent their eventual hardening into the bitter adults we see? The Princess of the Crystal claims that finding the penguindrum is what is necessary to prevent this, but her caginess in divulging the nature of the object they seek speaks volumes as to its nature. I’ve written about it before, but it seems as though the Princess herself is also aware of what the nature of the penguindrum is. In that, it’s not a physical object alone, per se, but also the sincere intention to sacrifice something of the self. To state what it is outright, I feel that the Princess may think it will tarnish the sincerity. Kanba also seems to be vaguely aware of it himself, which is partly why he thinks he can no longer be the one to save Himari since he has partaken in a Faustian bargain with Sanetoshi to artificially and unnaturally lengthen Himari’s life. Kanba is so invested in this that he has been wrapt up in Sanetoshi’s design to “take back the world” in order to pay off this debt that he has accrued with him. If we are to continue on the tack that Himari is channeling Momoka’s spirit during the survival strategies, then Kanba may recognize that what he is doing is in fact in direct opposition to Himari’s/Momoka’s ultimate desire. Similar to how Yuri’s actions right now would contrast and contradict violently with Momoka’s intentions and desires as a child.
Kanba feels that he is no longer able to save Himari for that reason. He’s in too deep. He’s too indebted. He’s too attached to the idea of being with Himari in the temporary physical sense, despite her apparent readiness to pass on. Kanba feels that he is fated to relive and reenact his father Kenzan’s actions, which will in turn create so many more characters who suffer from the uncaring nature of fate. He has become self loathing to a dangerous degree. If the penguindrum isn’t just an object, but also an expression of self-sacrificial love akin to agape that we’ve discussed, then he feels that he may no longer be capable of feeling or executing such things with the sincerity and integrity that is necessary. Hence, his despair during this week’s survival strategy.
But! All is not lost! This is where the convenience of storytelling comes in, in that we know that there is something special about Kanba. Something that both Sanetoshi and the Princess have alluded to as the Scorpion’s Soul. The Scorpion’s Soul in Kenji Miyazawa’s Night on the Galactic Railroad is a fire that the passengers on the railroad see in the night sky. It is representative of a penitent organism whose essence becomes the idea of self-sacrifice. Whether Penguindrum will treat Kanba’s soul as something of a more concrete plot matter or treat it with the same sense of allegory and metaphor that Railroad does remains to be seen, but both of the denizens from the Destination of Fate regard it as something incredibly important and worth scheming and sniping at each other for. Almost as if… it’s a vital component of the idea of the nigh mythical penguindrum itself.
13 Responses to Colloquium: Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 17
I swear when this episode ended, all I could think of as I starred at the title screen was like ‘OMFG I have to wait a week to see what happens next?!’ *pulls at hair*
The compositions in this episode were pretty darn outstanding IMO, particularly the scene with Yuri and Tabuki’s conversation. The way they used the Tokyo Tower to frame and bring more depth to their conversation was plain astounding. That framing with the wine bottle too. It really made me feel the isolation each of them felt in that room though they viewed the same scenery, they viewed it with different eyes though they’re technically allies.
Notice how when Yuri and Tabuki both drink from the same type of wine glass, next to Tabuki there is the silver based one which is full and he places his own glass next to it during their interlude. When Yuri denies Momoka’s death, he fingers it and agrees albeit despondently while he takes a drink from the silver glass instead. It seems to me as if Yuri is trying to keep Momoka alive through her words (thus her outright denial) whereas Tabuki is trying to keep her alive through his actions though his words say otherwise. Perhaps this is a reflection of his conflict and an allusion to what may happen in the next episode as to his motivations?
I find Kanba’s role in the story very interesting, especially the part where he tells Shouma that its ok if he stays the way he is. Its been brought up many times how Shouma is the useless brother always following the lead but I’m wondering if Kanba is keeping him as a backup. If Kanba now feels like he is unworthy of obtaining the penguindrum due to being too deep into the mess and going against the Princess of the Crystal’s wants, their conversation hints at a level of innocence required in obtaining the penguindrum. That brought me to the thought that perhaps to USE the penguindrum, one requires the innocence one has as a child and Shouma would obviously have that in truckloads more than Kanba at this point. That or in some ways Kanba is trying to hint to Shouma to ‘do as I say not as I do’. Kanba and the Princess however, changed my perception on his character. I was always under the impression that he was the more forward one when it came to how his incestuous relationship with his sister came about. It feels to me that the Princess seems to be testing him on many levels since it rather more feels and looks like she had been egging him regarding the whole relationship in the first place. Perhaps to get him to realize what it is he has (at this point we’re all assuming its the Scorpion Soul) to what end, I can’t entirely fathom.
Yuri and Masako both pose a really interesting contrast too. One being so modern and the other being so much more old school in so many ways. The mahou shoujo manner of their confrontation sort of further emphasized the very stage-like manner they both have in their speech and conduct. I can’t wait to see the results of that.
Another thing I noticed is that, I wonder if Tabuki actually could be doing this because he feels that the way Yuri wants to ‘punish’ the Takakura family by point blank shooting Himari (as is implied) is far too simple/quick? We’re not actually entirely sure if he and Yuri are on the same page of the dinnner plans, or whether he had been notified of it at all despite his attire. Perhaps his actions is a way for him to underline to Yuri how differently he views the situation and how differently he would have handled it. That or they’re truly partners in crime and Yuri’s battle with Masako is merely a diversion tactic.
That being said, I can’t wait for the next episode TAT I’m practically at the edge of my seat with anticipation TAT I hope I didn’t ramble too much. Late night comments always tend to make me ramble.
ajthefourth: I am of the opinion that Tabuki and Yuri are not on the same page at all, and are simply using each other in order to reach their own separate goals. Yuri wants to bring Momoka back at any cost, while I don’t think that Tabuki does, since he appears to be far more caught up by the idea of punishment. He may not harbor any anger towards the Takakura family; however, he’s definitely not above punishing them regardless. Although it may not bring Momoka back, Tabuki doesn’t care as much about bringing her back (which he may view as fruitless or not, the only indicator is his slight affirmative response to Yuri’s saying that Momoka is not dead) as he does about delivering justice.
Thanks for the comment!
vucubcaquix: The idea of one person relying more on words and the other relying on actions is also a parallel to the relationship between Kanba and Shouma. As to who specifically is the one relying on words and who is the one relying on actions, that is up to debate and interpretation I feel, since if you remember, Yuri was the one to steal the back half of the diary in episode 8 which is a very proactive action on her part. There does indeed seem to be the fuzzy outline of a parallel between the relationships between Yuri, Tabuki, and Momoka with that Kanba, Shouma, and Himari, but it’s in the realm of advanced character speculation at this point as to how hard those comparisons are meant to be taken (though there’s compelling circumstantial evidence to support it).
The idea of innocence is interesting, and it’s not something I thought of during my watch of the episode. I was more concerned with the idea of sincerity in one’s actions, but when we step back to see Momoka’s actions as a child, you can’t deny that she was both sincere and innocent in her actions. Almost to the point of naivete. Innocence and sincerity as concepts seem to have interesting correlation to each other, though I don’t think they’re necessarily wedded to each other either. At least, I don’t think innocence is a necessary prerequisite for sincerity, but innocence itself does indeed seem to be permeated with sincerity.
I hope that made sense. Thanks for the comment.
fufufufu the Tokyo tower in the glass! I totally did not pick up on that very cool! And ya finally we get to see another side of Tabuki! I have to hand it to penguin drum for hiding that so well, other shows that “evil” teachers never hide it…*cough* Yumekui Merry *cough* Anyway I sort of think Tabuki might be doing this stuff with Himari to prove to Yuri he misses Momoka? Or doing her a favor? haha either way great stuff! Maybe Tabuki is secretly a yandere? Fall is full of them maybe it’s related to Halloween.
And for the comical side that octopus! Damn thing was hilarious but distracting well the penguins are usually up to something random and funny, not to mention Himari+Penguin hat+Food = awesome
Now to sit back and see if Ringo stops Tabuki to save Himari or Kanba and Shouma come to her aid! We shall see ;D
NO WATCH OUT MR PRESIDENT!! Still the best line ever from 16 xDD
ajthefourth: I really liked the octopus parts. They made me laugh, and were a good reminder of how Kanba is in ridiculously over his head with whatever he’s doing for Sanetoshi. Fortunately, it looks like the Princess/Himari has confidence in him, so we shall see. Also, Penguin No. 1 and the octopus looking up girls’ skirts with magnifying glasses…hilarious.
As for Tabuki, I think he’s just emotionally dead inside, and although enacting punishment, he doesn’t feel any sort of emotion one way or another. Fortunately, Yuri more than makes up for it with her FABULOUS verbal and physical sparring with Masako. ^ ^
Now, off to buy some FABULOUS curtains.
vucubcaquix: I remember getting into a mini debate with Mystlord over that teacher from Yumekui Merry when he first showed up because I said he gave me the creeps since he had some personal space issues. Myst didn’t see it, but I kept saying that he was bad news by the way he stood really closely to the girls and acted too friendly.
But for Tabuki, I don’t know. I still get the impression that he’s more sad than anything else, despite saying that he’s over it and there’s nothing that needs to be done. Or at least, that it’s nothing to get worked up over emotionally.
But we’ll see!
Hmm, I can’t help but wonder about an element of the penguindrum being “sincere intention to sacrifice something of the self”. Back in episode 2 Princess says Ringo “probably” has it, but there was nothing to suggest she had such intent. Kanba has sacrificed a lot over the course of the show – yet despite what Princess said to him at the end of the survival strategy sequence she still tells both brothers they still need to obtain it.
I wonder if the abstract element could be willpower – an iron will to go against fate and make the future become one more favourable to your ideals. This is what Ringo has attempted throughout the show, and a quality that Momoka also possessed. Kanba has willpower, but he just seeks to hold onto the present state of affairs regardless of cost or consequence. If he can achieve that, he’s content to follow the fate handed to him by Princess or Sanetoshi.
Conversely, Shouma, Tabuki and Yuri all dwell on the past, rather than focus on the present or future. By doing so they bind themselves to their perceived fates to some degree.
ajthefourth: You bring up a really interesting point! Another thing to consider is that, although Kanba has seemingly made a large amount of sacrifices, we don’t know specifically what his intentions were. In episode 13, Kanba banters back and forth with Sanetoshi over Himari’s lifeless body. Sanetoshi asks him if he will use “this” as collateral and points to Kanba’s heart, calling it the hideous charred heart of a Scorpion. Kanba then argues that he wouldn’t dream of doing anything for himself, but then uses the words, “As long as Himari is with me…” an indication that his intentions are a bit more selfish than he himself probably realizes. This is where the sincerity comes into play. In Night on the Galactic Railroad, Scorpio’s Fire represents both an incredibly selfless and selfish act. It’s selfless because the scorpion is giving his life for something wholeheartedly, it’s selfish because it fulfills the scorpion’s desire to be useful to others. I think that this back and forth between what is selfless and selfish (as well as whether one can truly perform a “selfless” act) may come into play later on. I like your idea of willpower, and like that you brought up Ringo, since she, although hardly being selfless, has willpower, confidence, and a better sense of who she is as a person. Perhaps this is what Kanba needs as well.
Thanks for commenting!
vucubcaquix: Hmm, the idea of willpower is an interesting one. The sincerity I spoke of is closely tied to the idea of integrity, in that there’s a certain dishonesty in Kanba’s motivations and actions. He constantly claims that he will do anything and everything for Himari’s sake implying no thought on his part, when in reality there’s the very selfish component of his wanting Himari to exist in some form that’s also being affected by his physical lust for her. If willpower and the demonstration of it is indeed a factor in the manifestation of the penguindrum, then Kanba indeed has much to despair over since he hasn’t shown any indication that he has the ability to let go of the physical and temporary. It’s beginning to remind me of certain Buddhist tenets regarding the idea of suffering being related to desire, specifically that of the physical and temporary realm. One doesn’t reach Nirvana until they can break free of the karma they’ve accrued as a direct result of actions they take as unenlightened beings.
If the penguindrum is Nirvana so to speak, it can also be the end result of an individual whose come to terms with the sincerity and integrity necessary to sacrifice of the self, including attachments to the physical and temporary state of living beings. Being in a state that is unenlightened, before Nirvana, people’s actions build up karma which is a descriptor for the idea of cause and effect. That ties into a lot of the themes I saw into the show from the first episode, like Determinism and Existentialism, and the Clockwork Universe Theory. To use the penguindrum to break the cycle of cause and effect, to break a Deterministic fate, one has to be in a near enlightened state or at least willing to approach that state. I think Kanba is having a crisis because he doesn’t believe he can.
Phew, I don’t know where all that came from all of a sudden.
This episode might have had one of the worst cliffhangers in Penguindrum so far. Part of me knew that the episode would end just before the game-changing stuff, but part of me hoped, and hoped…and then the episode title card came up and I legitimately yelled at the screen. IKUHARAAAAAAAAAA
Otherwise, don’t have much to say about it, although as others have pointed out the composition of visuals here were pretty neat, even though the actual budget itself feels somewhat uneven. Then again next episode has been said to be “action-packed” so maybe all the money’s being poured into next episode? That would be something!
What really did stick out to me were the octopi in the early scenes. I’ve come to take the actions of the penguins in Penguindrum as revealing facets of the characters’s inner workings that they’re trying to ignore/too nervous to express; maybe the octopi laying siege to the penguins is a hint that the Takakura family dynamic is a lot more fractured than they’re willing to admit? Sure, the penguins are chopping the octopi up and turning them into food, but they seem to be having some trouble doing so. Sometimes I wish that Penguindrum was a little more vocal about what the characters were feeling–apparently things are much clearer in the novels, and while you can glean a lot from the background imagery I still wish we got more of a sense of Shouma’s deep-seated inferiority complex or Himari’s loneliness.
Finally, what did Himari mean when she said that the Penguindrum was something that Kanba had yet to give? What are we not privy too?!? ARRRGGHHHHH
“War is about to break out,” says Sanetoshi. SO looking forwards to this.
ajthefourth: Wow, you were posting this comment as we were responding to comments here and I was posting this comment over at Draggle’s Blog, which has a lot to do with what you bring up regarding the octopi and the penguins.
In short: Himari’s is the only penguin effective against the octopi because she has more mental fortitude than her two brothers. If you think about it, it makes sense considering that Himari has seemingly had to deal with adversity (both her sickness and her shameful exit from school) her entire life thanks to her parents. She has also seemingly never complained, choosing instead to cherish the time that she has had with her brothers.
Next episode, it seems like Himari is fully prepared to die, in order to serve the punishment that must be doled out to her family. Perhaps she sees this as setting her brothers free from their guilt/obligation. It will certainly be interesting to find out! Thanks for the comment!
vucubcaquix: I’m with you in saying that the budget is uneven, but I felt like this episode was one of the better looking ones in my opinion. Episode 10 had a lot of issues with characters being off model, and episode 16 also had some issues with characters being off model. It gave us some difficulty in choosing a good screenshot for Himari to open up the post actually, since her eyes were off and it was exacerbated when she opened her mouth.
As for the penguindrum being something that Kanba has yet to give, I’m actually of the opinion that it has more to do with being in the right state of mind for it to be effective or for it to manifest itself to him. I wrote about it at length in my response to Neriya right above here. He needs to be somewhat detached from the idea of holding onto Himari in the physical and temporary sense, in order for him to even have a chance at changing the fates that everyone around him are bound to. Whether or not the show will see fit to “reward” him with more time with Himari, I’m not sure.
This gets into heavy philosophical speculation and the ramifications of it one way or the other will be a river I’ll cross when I get there.
Pingback: Notes of Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 17 « Organization Anti-Social Geniuses
Pingback: Colloquium: Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 18 | The Untold Story of Altair & Vega
Pingback: Colloquium: Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 19 | The Untold Story of Altair & Vega
Pingback: Colloquium: Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 20 | The Untold Story of Altair & Vega
Pingback: Notes of Mawaru Penguindrum Episode 17 | Organization Anti-Social Geniuses |
Stop counting calories.
Really, just stop.
I don’t care if you want fat loss.
Or muscle gain.
Throw the calculator away.
And carb cycling?
Easy. Beyond easy.
So easy that it makes me want to write easy six more times so you realize just how easy carb cycling is.
Easy. Easy. Easy. Easy. Easy.
What follows is a simple nutrition plan that’s adjustable for any goal and can even be optimized for an awesome lifestyle.
And I’m not even going to tease you about oatmeal volcanoes. That’s what pictures are for.
Keep your eyeballs in their sockets, please.
Current flavor of fasting
Lately, I’ve fielded a lot of questions about my “diet.” (I hate that word.) It’s a tough thing to tackle because, all things considered, it’s ever-changing.
My latest fiasco was the Warrior Diet — or whatever freakish mutation I made of it.
It was great.
Except for when it was bad.
And bad it was at times.
That’s why I’m going back to old reliable — the plan that’s gotten me the most results with the least hassle. It borrows from Martin Berkhan’s Leangains, so it’s a mutation of intermittent fasting.
So before I slop that on you, here’s why I succumbed to what society sees as short-lived starvation.
Benefits of intermittent fasting
I’m a big believer in starting with why.
It’s been over a year since I converted to intermittent fasting. But the question remains: why intentionally not eat and live in hunger?
Few ask this question before picking up the glass of Kool-Aid. The answer surely isn’t because intermittent fasting is the only pathway to results. People use methods in stark contrast to intermittent fasting and still get big, strong, and ripped. Precision Nutrition is a prime example of using methods opposite of intermittent fasting.
And from a broad perspective, intermittent fasting is rather logical.
Martin Berkhan’s Leangains condenses a day’s worth of calories into three bigger meals. Ori Hofmekler’s Warrior Diet combines a day’s worth of calories into one big meal. Brad Pilon’s Eat Stop Eat (in the name of honesty, this is an affiliate link, but it’s a damn worthy one as it’s a fantastic resource) cuts out calories from a few meals that would otherwise be consumed. John Romaniello’s Feast Fast cuts out an entire day’s worth of calories.
It seems thermodynamics – calories in versus calories out – is winning.
…Or is it?
Intermittent fasting and body composition
Now, I’m far from a diet expert. There are plenty of websites dedicated to fasting. My two favorite are run by Martin Berkhan and Brad Pilon. So if you want specifics, go to them. This is just an overview.
Considering the forefathers of intermittent fasting are jacked and ripped, it sure is compelling for body recomposition.
But there may be more than thermodynamics to thank for this, like fasting boosting growth hormone, as explained by Brad Pilon. And Martin Berkhan surely isn’t lacking client testimonials.
Then there are anecdotes from the majority of fitness folk. Since writing about IF, many people have told me fasting was a key ingredient in getting them the leanest they’ve ever been.
There are a few hiccups here though. For instance, Martin Berkhan also recommends carbohydrate cycling. This undoubtedly has an effect on body composition. (I can personally attest to this.) And people may simply be eating less after switching to intermittent fasting since cramming six meals worth of calories into three is challenging at first.
But we can at least say intermittent fasting isn’t a negative in the body composition column.
Intermittent fasting and lifestyle
Psychologically, it’s reassuring to know that hunger isn’t going to melt our muscles like the Wicked Witch of the West under a bucket of water.
This is reason enough to give fasting a go as a beeping watch alarm every three hours in reminder of “meal time” isn’t a fun way of living.
It’s also nice knowing some food in the stomach and feeling “good” isn’t going to be “bad.”
Intermittent fasting and cognittion
There’s a group of people that theorize creativity skyrockets during times of hunger.
Hell, even Scott Adams – illustrator of famed comic, Dilbert – has his own take on breakfast and creativity. Starving may not be such a bad thing for the artist.
The rationale for this is that primitive man needed to be creative in times of hunger to find food.
So when you open your fridge and find nothing but scraps, you’re more apt to concoct a conglomeration of ingredients that don’t really make sense. A banana, celery, and bleu cheese omelette? Whatever.
So…what should I choose?
Great. Fasting is pretty cool. And good for us. But most fasting data is non-specific to the methods used. A fast is simply a prolonged period of time without food. What separates 16 from 20 from 24 from 40 hour fasts?
I’m not sure anyone knows. One or two weekly 24 hours fasts may be “enough,” as Brad Pilon suggests. Try many fasting lengths. You’ll understand and appreciate your body a lot more.
The plans below are mutations of Leangains (16/8 scheme) and Eat Stop Eat (24 hour fasts) because, from my experience, they are the easiest and “healthiest” from a mental perspective. Obsessing about eating every three hours is just as askew as dragging through hunger in countdown to the next meal.
Disclaimer of experience
Before I get to the meat, I want to remind you of just how much work went into this. This article is more than three days worth of writing and editing 3,000 words. This is years of experimentation.
Below is the progression of my diet.
- 6 meals per day – Summer 2006
- 4 meals per day – Summer 2010
- 4 meals, 2 snacks per day – Fall 2010
- 2 meals per day – Winter 2011 (broken foot)
- 2 meals per day, Leangains with Feast Fast Method – Fall 2011
- 2 meals per day, Leangains with Eat Stop Eat – Winter 2012
- 1 meal per day, Warrior Diet experiments – Spring 2012
So this has been curating for years. And that’s how most of my knowledge blossoms: through years of trials, tribulations, and failures.
Here’s the story from the most relevant starting point.
Broken foot, can’t cookK
In 2011, I began intermittent fasting. My diet was simple and based on advice passed down from a bodybuilder friend: center your diet around eating one pound of meat, six eggs, and three protein shakes every day. So, I did.
Because of my foot, and being unable to cook, I got used to eating two meals per day. And after healing, I kept this pattern. The first meal was at noon. The second, at dinner time or later in the day.
In late 2011, I started carb cycling. Carb cycling, for whatever reason, seemed like one of those uber complex things that wasn’t worth the effort. But that’s not true at all. And it’s well worth the effort.
Pictured above: Three chicken breasts, peppers, six eggs with cheese, 1500 calories worth of oatmeal volcano, three scoops worth of protein lava pudding (all volcanoes have lava, duh), cottage cheese (not pictured) was also down the hatch. And if you look in the top right hand corner, you can see part of my gamorrean guard mug. Awesome. (By the way, this was a Warrior Diet escapade.)
My greatest gains
The greatest gains of my life came from intermittent fasting, eating two meals per day, using “complicated” carb cycling, training on an empty stomach, and with a 12PM-8PM feeding window. The “complicated” carb cycling technique shakes out like this: On hardcore training days, down more starchy and simple carbs. On off days, down more vegetables and fats. That’s about it.
And this template, that’s been curating for over a year, is easily adjustable for muscle gain, fat loss, maintenance, and lifestyle. So there’s a template below for each. All are simple, but the key is being able to eat enough. Again, I have a deeper stomach than most so I can take down 1,000 – 2,000 calories in one sitting.
If two meals are overwhelming, break things down into three or four meals. Just center each meal around protein.
Start with the cruise control template. All variations stem from it, and it’s the method I use most frequently.
1) Cruise control template
No matter the goal, start with the cruise control template. This is my “money” template that just “works” for living life and slow cooking progress.
This is the ideal template for a “clean bulk,” or what I like to call “living life and training without obsession.”
The basic tenant of the cruise control template is getting at least one pound of meat, six eggs, and three protein shakes down every day. If you eat chicken, this shakes out to damn near 200 grams of protein and 1,200 calories. Fattier cuts of meat will obviously yield more calories, but chicken — being one of the leanest meats — represents the minimum caloric yield.
But that’s all of the calculations needed. Eat those three things, and you know you’re probably getting “enough” protein, which is most important. Everything else falls under the experimental umbrella.
Adjust the quantities based on how your body responds. It might take a few months to hone in on things, but everyone’s metabolic rate is different. That’s just the reality. I’m not about quick fixes either. You’re going to have to experiment.
From here we can add the complicated carb cycling principles: more starchy and simple carbs on hardcore training days, more leafy, cruciferous, exotic vegetables, and fats on off days.
Examples of starchy and simple carbs: oats, rice, potatoes, fruits
Examples of vegetables and fats: cheeses, nuts, broccoli, cauliflower, avocado, carrots, spinach, kale, lettuce, peppers, eggplant, etc…
Examples of lean meat: chicken, turkey
Examples of fattier meat: red meat, pork
Good editions on either day: cottage cheese
Personally, I almost always stick with oats because they are cheap. And I’m a little bit in love with my oatmeal volcanoes. I usually down cottage cheese on a daily basis too, even though it isn’t one of the three staples.
Neutrals, exclusives, and tweeners
I like thinking in terms of three categories: neutrals, tweeners, and exclusives. Neutral foods are lean meats, wholesome vegetables, plain protein powder — essentially pure protein and fiber. Neutral foods are good any time, any place, and with any meal.
Exclusives are foods that, when carb cycling, need to stay on their designated days. So nuts, being mostly fat, should be secluded to low carb days. Potatoes and oats, being mostly carbs, should be secluded to high carb days.
Tweeners are foods that teeter on neutral. Eggs are a great example of a tweener. There’s some fat, but not a whole lot. Cottage cheese is another example. So tweeners have a home, but they can float neutral as no day completely excludes one specific macro-nutrient.
High carbohydrate days (2-4 days per week)
High carbohydrate days have two distinct meals, with the first being post-workout. The post workout meal is flooded with complex and simple carbohydrates. Fat is kept to a minimum.
I like eating 0.5 – 0.25 pounds of the meat (usually chicken or lean turkey) and all three protein scoops at this meal (works well in the volcano). The simple and complex carbs add up to 1,000 – 1,500 calories.
The second meal is kept low carbohydrate and consists of the eggs, some vegetables, the rest of the meat, and any other neutral food.
12-2PM – Post Workout Meal
Lean Meats, complex and simple carbs, protein powder
6-8PM – Second Meal
Lean meats, cottage cheese, eggs, vegetables
If you work out later in the day, flip the meals.
All carbohydrates are shuttled to the immediate post workout window. With carb back loading gaining popularity, this is soon to be “outdated,” but it’s worked well for me for months — and years prior for a lot of folk.
If you train more than four days per week, think about picking the 2-4 days that you want to optimize — from a growth and recovery standpoint — and keep them high carb. Other training days will fall under a low carb days.
Low carbohydrate days (3-4 days per week)
Low carbohydrate days are rather simple.
Just be careful that you’re not overdoing it on the calories.
As crazy as it sounds, it’s easier to go overboard because nuts, avocado, and all of the fats add quick calories.
12PM-2PM – First Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
6-8PM – Second Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
Low carbohydrate days are for days you don’t train to build muscle. So if you just have a light retainer workout or are completely “off,” it’s a low carb day.
2) The muscle gain template
Remember, everything branches from the cruise control template. The muscle gaining template has one major swap, and that’s making the second meal on the high carbohydrate day mirror of the first.
On the cruise control template, carbohydrates are condensed to post workout. Not anymore. The muscle gaining template can be summed up with this: keep everything on their respective days. No tweeners allowed.
High carbohydrate days (2-4 days per week)
Fat, as a whole, is kept as a minimum, even to the point of dropping eggs.
12-2PM – Post Workout Meal
Lean Meats, complex and simple carbs, protein powder, any neutral food
6-8PM – Second Meal
Lean Meats, complex and simple carbs, protein powder, any neutral food
Low carbohydrate days (3-4 days per week)
For those that truly are looking to pack on the mass, go with 12 eggs on the low carbohydrate days.
12PM – First Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
6-8PM – Second Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
3) The fat loss template
Some people save money pennies at a time. They avoid morning coffee, thinking the $2.00 is a worthy savings.
Meanwhile, they bend over and take late fees and high interest rates — that exceed thousands of dollars — willingly.
Same goes for fat loss. Some stop eating the extra slice of toast, cutting out 100 calories every day — saving a whopping (sarcasm) 700 calories every week.
I prefer going for the juggular, Eat Stop Eat style. The basis behind Eat Stop Eat is fasting for 24 hours once or twice per week, which means cutting out one meal on each of the 24 hour fasting days. And since we only eat twice per day, cutting one meal means saving 1,000+ calories. Do that twice in one week, and you’re looking at +2,000.
But don’t screw it up by doubling the one meal you will eat.
On two of your low carbohydrate days, eat one normal sized meal. I recommend going with anything in the neutral category, as that cuts calories down further.
Don’t worry too much about the 24 hour part. Just eat one meal. The most convenient time is 3-4PM as anything earlier makes hunger late at night discomforting, and anything later makes the day miserable.
On this plan, high carbohydrate days stay the same per the cruise control template, as the post workout carbohydrates help maintain — and perhaps build — muscle.
High carbohydrate days (2-4 days per week)
See Cruise Control template for details.
12-2PM – Post Workout Meal
Lean Meats, complex and simple carbs, protein powder
6-8PM – Second Meal
Lean meats, cottage cheese, eggs, vegetables
Low carbohydrate days (1-2 days per week)
See Cruise Control template for details.
12-2PM – First Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
6-8PM – Second Meal
Fattier meat, eggs, vegetables, cheeses, protein powder, nuts, etc…
One meal days (2 days per week)
3-5PM – Only Meal
Lean protein, protein powder, eggs, vegetables, anything neutral
4) The lifestyle template
While experimenting with the Warrior Diet, I got used a certain lifestyle freedom — kind of a lack of obsession. On previous diets, the tone for the day was “set” after the first meal.
On the Cruise Control template, for example, you down 1,500 calories. Psychologically, this locks me in on my second meal. So if friends call and want to cook out, I’m hand cuffed. Stay high carb? Or go ace on some ribs and burgers?
And that’s the biggest hang up with carb cycling, and “strict” dieting in general — it limits your lifestyle and lends itself to mild obsession.
I wanted to get away from this. And we can by making the first meal “neutral,” meaning the second meal can go any direction.
For instance, the other day I worked, lifted, trained my cousin, had two softball games. Normally, this screams high carbohydrate. But on the lifestyle template, I was afforded freedom.
I got home late and I didn’t want to destroy myself with a huge meal, so I poured a glass of wine, cooked some eggs, and coasted into the night. (I never drink wine during the week.)
So this is ideal for people that are prone to have less control over dinner or simply want more selection. Find out your parents are cooking an awesome dinner? Sweet, crash the party and eat everything. Want to eat a food that’s a little less “clean?” You’re likely fine as long as you know how to control portions. (I don’t.)
You can keep all of the carbohydrate cycling principles too if you wanted. Just make the meal later at night reflect the direction you want to go.
Lifestyle days
12PM – First Meal
Neutral foods – lean meat, vegetables, protein powder, etc…
6-8PM – Second Meal
Wherever your heart takes you
….breathe
Ultimately, diet is just like training. The best plans are the one that fit both your lifestyle and psychology.
This is just another one thrown out into the world, and the one that works for me.
Dare I say, two meals per day for twice the gains?
Maybe.
But the first step is one pound of meat, six eggs, and three scoops of protein. That takes precedence over the fasting and “specifics.” (Part of me wonders about the validity of the specifics anyway.)
But, stick to the base, and you will find your way.
How do you eat? What’s your go-to diet? Drop some comments below and share the article if you found it useful.
ive slowly realized 2 meals is a bit better for me too – i get far too ravenous at night and far too full. i love the warrior diet but i would really really love to see your specific plan!!!
I just discovered your site, I was happy to see that there are huge over eaters out there. I’ve been IF for the last few weeks, but after reading your article I have a better understanding on how to eat . My question is: could you give a rough example of the portion sizes on the low carb days? Your 1000-1500 cal of carbs for high carb meals really made it easy, having all the scoops of whey in that meal was amazing too lol
Hrmm, lets see….
Could be two fistfuls of meat, six eggs, two large handfuls of veggies, and one small handful of nuts?
That make it a bit clearer?
Almost.. I know you say to not count calories but should I aim for around 1000 call per meal? For example I’m doing 300g T-bone steak, 3 eggs, veggies, somenuts and cheese. I just need a estimation so I don’t go overboard and try to fill up myself up with too much fat
I’m not going to be able to say how much food you can tolerate. If you’re worried about going overboard, start small and then work your way up. Fill up on veggies if you want to feel full. Multiply your body weight by 12. That will give you a good estimation of how many calories you need. Then split that into your meals.
I like the article but would be interested in a solid plan. I was a 6 meals a day eat,ER for awhile and I saw great progress, but I hate having to schedule my life around meals. Despite seeming healthy I think it leads to an imbalanced life obsessing over food/meals. I agree with you 100% about finding something that fits your life and philosophy.
Nice Post,
I also base my diet around intermittent fasting. The freedom is incredible when compared to eating 6 times a day. I also find it more useful when trying to stay away from food when going out as it’s much easier to say “I don’t want any, I’m dieting” than it is to try to find a way to squeeze in some food that is usually not a good part of the diet. And if it is your only meal, you can go all out
I’ve personally have done Eat Stop Eat, Warrior Diet, and Renegade Diet (which is pretty much like all fasting methods in one plan). I have to admit, the warrior diet for me is real hard, I love food too much for that haha.
Eat Stop Eat is my favorite and the Renegade Diet was another one I enjoyed, which ironically made a future return to the warrior diet much easier. No idea why but I’m not complaining.
I, like you, feel that I do my best with two big meals a day. The only hard thing about this stuff at least for me is the fact that I’m a vegetarian but as long as I don’t go crazy with the fasting and eat my heart out after my workouts, it’s all good.
My best fat loss results came from Eat Stop Eat and EDT for training. I did it for 6 weeks and it was awesome. I got to eat TONS of pasta and rice and trained only 3 times a week but burned fat like if it was nothing and built some muscle. It only worked for 6 weeks as I started to get hungrier on my “off” days from fasting but it was still great haha
Now I eat twice a day and I feel perfect.
I think everyone should try out all the different fasting methods like you did as each one is a little different in its own way and eventually just changes your whole way of thinking about food.
I would be interested in checking out your plan.
Good post (y)
Since you mentioned you’re a vegetarian, can you please share how you manage adequate protein intake while limiting your carb intake? I’m going through a “veggie only” period right now and I’m confused on what to eat!
Were you trying to build muscle or cut some fat with this diet?
Great stuff, man. Very well laid out and explained.
Awesome, easy-to-follow templates. That’s my style for sure.
Thanks Nia! Really appreciate you stopping by to read and comment.
Hi can you drink milk on any of the days?
Dairy is one of those things that’s entirely individual. Some people can drink it no problemo. Others can’t. I’d say if you’re used to drinking it, it’ll be fine as long as it fits within the ranges. I fair better with yogurt.
Any advice to someone who wants to go more plant based? Just substitute beans for the sources of protein?
Sorry Jeremy, don’t have any experience.
Do you have a recipe/instructions for making the oatmeal volcano.?
Actually shot and am editing a video right now.
This is great.
That is all.
Appreciate it.
Love this article. I hated the though of constant food intake calculations and would never want to be a slave to all that shit.
That was the inspiration for sure.
Intermittent Fasting, Lean Gains style. 2 Big meals a day, mostly higher fat-lower carb (just cause I like fatty stuff more hah). Very similar to the plan you laid out here though – I eat a 1lb of meat a day, 12 eggs a day, and no protein powder(don’t have any).
Nice. Can’t go wrong there.
Awesome stuff. Lifestyle freedom from your next meal is incredibly enlightening. Also, I read your first draft before you took it down and this is markedly better.
Thanks Jeff. Yeah, I had to re-do it. It was all over the place.
Hey Anthony, great article. Seems to be relatively simple when you put it like that. Just to clarify though. I train around 8.30-9pm at night and want to build muscle. Keeping in line with these principles could I have two meals pre-workout (bulk of calories) and then one post being a shake of some variety? I am fine to fast to around 1-2pm each day and so could eat my last meal at 9-10pm. Would that make sense?
I’d go two pre-workout meals, each consisting of about 25% total calories. Post workout meal being largest. I would think anything bigger would hurt your performance. That’s preference though.
Cheers. Thanks Anthony.
Welcomes.
Sorry Martin, but I think Anthony explains IF with greater clarity. For someone confused about specifics and new to intermittent fasting, you provide a host of options to chose from and an easily understood rationale as well. I showed someone (let’s just call them an average American who thinks Lean Cuisine is healthy eating) this article with the photos of the food and they went, “Ew, I hate weird food”. Isn’t it amazing that the average American doesn’t even recognize real food anymore? Keep up the great work.
Hah! Oats, chicken, vegetables.
Totally weird.
Oh my god!
This article is excellent…I have bookmarked it, and I am sure that i will refer to it again and again, and take notes as well…too too good. Anthony, you have outdone yourself.
I have read Eat Stop Eat, Leangains and the renegade…you stand out in the sense that you have laid out all the practical steps in a spartan 3000 word essay…fell swoop.
The website looks sharper too…good job…I notice that you have different subscription for skinny fats, 5 day freak athlete course etc. Do I need to sign up again?
Lovely stuff…please keep it coming…this content is gold.
Rajat – should be blasted out. No need to sign up again. Thanks for the kind words as always.
And I’m not sure about the chicken. I don’t know how it’s prepared. Nothing wrong with the skin on a low carb day if it’s prepared properly.
As far as what it looks like, I’d say you’re safe around three large breasts perhaps. But then again, the sizes of those vary as well.
Anthony,
I had a question with chicken. I get my chicken grilled from a restaurant nearby. It is a little oily on the outside. Should I just throw away the skin and eat the meat below?
What does 1 pound of chicken look like? My folks are vegan, and i grew up as a vegan. it is only from a few months that I eat meat. So, I am a little foggy
nice article and very easy to comprehend, good job. wanted to get your thoughts on something… i have tried IF before and it fits me quite well. actually i dont struggle at all and prefer to fast and be productive early in the day and eat larger meals at night. its just over the last year or so my acticity level has increased alot. i train in the AM, train others at around noon then go train kids for soccer in the late afternoon then have basketball practice or games in the evening. all this with the intention of building muscle and getting stronger. i know IF has its benefits but should just keep it in the shelves for now till the time is right? thanks!
Diego, if you’re maintaining your energy, there shouldn’t be an issue. From reading the literature, I’ve found that as long as you’re getting your calories in — some way or another — and the size of your meals aren’t bothering you (ie: uncomfortable digestion, feeling overly full), you’ll be good.
great post anthony. loving the cruise control template. i also find that eating fewer meals work best for me. however with irregular schedules it is hard to go strictly with the 16/8 method.for feast fast method, is it okay to have a high carb day before the feast day?since the point of the feast day is to increase leptin levels but wouldnt the high carb day prior to that disturb the production of leptin?thanks
You bring up a valid point that perhaps John Romaniello may be better qualified to answer. But to give you mine, I usually stick to a lower intake the day before and after if I feast. In fact, these days it’s one meal (ESE) before – feast (not really a feast though, just minor indulgence) – one meal day after (ESE). Works well. Not as daunting and making huge gains.
Excellent article…
do you recommend any supplements? I currently take curcumin/turmeric and fish oil. would it be okay to take these during the times of fasting or does that take away the benefits…
Thanks
I’d save fish oil for the feeding window.
Supplements: whey, creatine, fish oil, vitamin d.
I guess fish oil just on los carbs days?
You can do both, pending dosage. You can still take some fat in on high carb days, especially if it’s something like fish oil.
Thanks for the great article! I’ve been doing some form of LG/IF/Warrior for about 2 months now. Strength is up, inches are down a bit, and weight is static. I needed to tweek myself to more of a cutting phase for fat loss, and I’ll give your recommendations a try as it regards rest-days (I’m already doing the 24 hour fasts here and there as I only do 1 large feast around 9-10pm at night).
p.s. – lol, at the comment above me about “ew, weird food” from the friend… omg… feta cheese and olives? Oats, meat, eggs. THIS IS REAL FOOD AMERICA!
Thanks for joining the comment fun! And kudos to your Warrior shenanigans. I couldn’t handle it.
Quick, tiny error in your article (and I point this out, because I could see thing article being circulated widely as it is informative and well written).
“Psychologically, it’s reassuring to know that hunger isn’t going to melt our muscles like the Wizard of Oz under a bucket of water.”
…probably should be…
“Psychologically, it’s reassuring to know that hunger isn’t going to melt our muscles like the Wicked Witch of the West under a bucket of water.”
-or-
“Psychologically, it’s reassuring to know that hunger isn’t going to melt our muscles like the witch from the Wizard of Oz under a bucket of water.”
Yeah. Hahaha. Thanks a bunch. One of those brain farts.
Hi, this is great writing! thank you for having this website.
I’m trying to lose 10 – 15 lbs., I’m a almost 40 year old woman!
Which do you recommend? Leangains or Eat Stop Eat? I don’t have trouble fasting, I actually like it now that I have tried both in the last two weeks, I yet to see any results maily because I have not stuck with any of them yet, I’m just trying to figure out which one I should go for and test full force, please advise ( I also do strenth training 3 times per week for about 35-45 minutes).
You could very well do both. But ESE is more fat loss oriented since you’re cutting calories.
Great article, Anthony. Simply great!
I’ve been mixing 3-meals and 2-meals days, also with some cheat days followed by 30+ hours fast. Since my goal is to get upper body mass and lose belly fat, I will now switch to 2-meals days. I will also occasionally use the lifestyle days strategy to save the quality of my social life.
One question for you – what is your rough estimation of calories intake (%) in the first meal vs. the second meal (not in the lifestyle protocol)?
Is it around 60:40?
Hrm…let me think…
If I’m on cruise control, probably closer to 70-30 or 60-40.
Muscle gain, 50-50.
Anthony -
For those of us who like to have our cake and eat it too, would you recommend incorporating dessert into the latter meal so as to avoid the present possibility that dessert might morph into a third meal ?
Not quite sure what you mean here, Dale. Like, just eating too much dessert and having it turn into one huge meal?
I don’t really eat dessert outside of my one day of mini-indulgence, so I can’t help that much. I’d say keep a tight leash and put it wherever is best so that you won’t gorge.
Can you please tell me the recipe for the oatmeal volcano, it looks amazing!!!!
Video being shot.
I cannot understand why should I be in a calorie surplus on the training day and deficite on the rest day. For example, last night I had a feast day. Today I am full of energy because of my leptin high levels. I don’t need food. I am going to be active all day long and have a tough workout. Tonight I will have one small meal. And tomorrow when I need rest and food to recover I will eat all day long. That way, on the training day I will be in a huge deficite, and on the rest day I will maintain. So this is a miny cycle. An active day with very litlle food, and rest day with plenty of food. IF is all about this, no food when we are active, and plenty of food when we rest. That way we can combine leangain, ESE, feast days and normal days with breakfast. The minus of leangain’s and worrior’s protocols is that they are shedulled.
Well if you’re talking about the fat loss template, it’s all a wash. Deficit on rest day or training day, what’s most important is the deficit.
But you’re comparing a feast day with a regular day. Feasts will affect hormones differently than just regular meals.
From personal experience, I like eating more on training days because it helps my recovery more than doing so on rest days. Training and then sleeping without much food (even if it was eaten in a feast the day prior) will likely make me sore and stiff when I wake up.
But, again, this only applies to the fat loss template as low-carb doesn’t mean caloric deficit.
That makes sense to me Anthony
Another great article Anthony – maybe your best. Well done on making the thorny issue of nutrition plain and simple.
I know you don’t calorie count, but you weigh about 200lbs right and you’re only eating 2000 – 3000 calories or so per day (looking roughly at what you’re eating, I could be way off)? That in itself is food for thought.
I second whoever else said it though, you’ve absolutely got to hit us with a recipes article – that oatmeal volcano front and centre!
The overall intake varies Rory. But i’d say closer to 3000 most days. Low carb days with the fattier meats, nuts, and whatnot add up. But there are certainly days where I eat lower. I’m a big fan of nutrient autoregulation. So the quantity of my food will vary depending on how I feel.
For instance, I’ll throw in muscle building nutrition one day and fat loss the next if I want to. So nothing is ever set in stone for me. But that’s only because I’m at the point where all I’m concerned about is consistency over the long term. Not eight weeks.
Ah nice, thank you. I’m taking a long view too, to be honest. I’d like to get my body fat down from the 12 or so % it is now (with different measurements I’m either 12 or 13) to more like 8% but then cruise along with that while gaining muscle. Reading that back it’s probably what 90% of people want, but it’s my aim anyway.
Sent a few friends on links to this and they all agree with me – it’s a great article. I was one of the few who read the original draft before you yanked it, and this is miles better. Nice one for doing that.
Thanks Rory. The original had to be yanked. Clarity and uni directional focus is much better. I was all over the place, haha!
Anthony this is your best one yet! Loved it!
Thanks Jimmy!
Great post Anthony – a lot of my own sentiments are represented here.
. Not to mention your supplement choices! Great stuff mate.
You also seem to be channelling my own experiences with meal patterns dating back to 2006
Thanks Clint. Big fan of everything you got going on too.
Is this a good plan for women as well who aren’t looking to gain muscle, but rather want to maintain a lean and feminine physique?
You can cut the portions down. But basing a diet around protein never hurt anyone
*I think you intended to write “Wicked Witch of Oz under a bucket of water.”
Good article. I enjoy doing a mixture of Leangains during the week sprinkled with occasional Eat Stop Eat style days to help cancel out my weekend indiscretions.
Yes. Yes, I did. Thanks haha. Yeah, that’s the idea. Good strategy.
Anthony,
I have only discovered IF in the last 6 months. Whilst I had previously got good results with the 6 meals a day plan, I have found that IF gets me the results, much, much quicker. As an example over the last month I have used the 16 hour fast with 8 hour eating window approach and have seen my body fat drop by 2%, all the while not feeling like I have been missing out on food. On your advice, I’m going to start cycling my carbs to see what more improvements I can make to my body.
Interesting. Thanks for chiming in Niko. Another one of those empirical testimonies about IF.
Hi Anthony.
I just re-read the article for the 9th time. What is the rationale behind trace amounts of fat on the high carb day of the muscle building template. I understand that low fat post workout may be beneficial, but the rest of the day??
If higher levels of insulin are floating around you’re more prone to store things.
hmm, food for thought.
thought 1) Post workout is when my body is most responsive to an excess influx of carbs. Popular training wisdom says that this tails off in about 4-6 hours (I am sure this is broscience).. So I can have a carb ladden meal at 12 pm and a fattier dinner at night.
thought 2) The above is your cruise control template. Obviously muscle gain is helped along with an extra influx of complex carbs.
thought 3) When the hell will I stop overanalyzing, stfu and start doing?
1) It’s possible. But I don’t see why. Carbohydrate cycling as a whole is a theory of shuttling nutrients. With more insulin present, different things are happening and less protein overall needs consumed because it’s better worked with. I just wouldn’t want to mix the signals.
2) Not really. Six eggs isn’t hugely high in fat, and that’s about all of the fat on the PM meal.
3) Beats me, but you should.
Hi Anthony, I got a question..
Many experts recommend a serving of whey protein 30 min pre-workout. How important is it if my primary goal is body recomp with emphasis on muscle gain? Is training fasted better for muscle gain (the HGH response being the logic) or is it better to have a serving of whey preworkout to so that some aminoacids are floating around?
If you’re looking to absolutely maximize your gains, I’d say it’s a good thing. It will jump start protein synthesis. Most people recommend BCAAs though because they are the least likely to disrupt HGH response. But most HGH response is blunted by carbohydrates and fats.
Having said that, I don’t do it. But I’m not exactly the poster boy for maximizing gains in a shorter time. I’m about the long term.
Well, that and I’d rather save my whey for my oatmeal volcanoes… (truth).
I would agree with you. I am also here for the long term. But I also recognise that this period of 18-25 years are where my body is at its peak. Thus, I do not want to waste a single workout, or have a sub optimum workout
…however trainingwise, I am here for ever. There is SO much to explore.
…(apart from an awesome lemon cheesecake:)
“Well, that and I’d rather save my whey for my oatmeal volcanoes… (truth).”
Amen…protein pudding is now a staple…I do not even miss desert. Crazy huh! I downloaded this ebook called 51 protein powder recipes from prograde, and made this awesome chocolate brownie which I had with mashed frozen bananas (it attains the consistency of ice cream) and more protein pudding…I think I may never need commercial deserts again
Thanks for taking the time out to reply, Anthony.
The only way to waste a workout is to not show up OR show up when your body isn’t ready only to get hurt and hinder your training for the weeks and months to come.
Welcomes.
How low are the low carb days? I’m a vegetarian, so I find it hard to go low carb unless I drink loads of protein shakes….
Also, surely your body needs equally high calories on off days to recover?
It depends. Low carbohydrate days, for me at least, usually have carbs coming from vegetables. That’s all.
And about recovery on off days, not necessarily. I’ve found getting good sleep to be a bigger factor. You have to consider that if you’re loading up on calories the day of your training, that will help too. But just how “low” your off days go depends on your ultimate goal (muscle gain, fat loss, etc.). And then that goal will be the determinant of whether the performance hit is worth it.
So would the fat loss template be best for a skinny fat like me who just wants to loose the extra baggage (lean down) around the waist before moving on to the “Clean Bulk” plan for muscle gains?
Most likely, Bill.
Great, great article, Anthony! Carb cycling really seamed like rocket science, but I’ll definetly reshape my diet after reading this. How do you feel about weight gainers on high carb days? The one I’m taking is 625 calories 25g protein126,5g carbs and 2g of fat.
One more question: you said “The answer surely isn’t because intermittent fasting is the only pathway to results. People use methods in stark contrast to intermittent fasting and still get big, strong, and ripped.”
But do you think, as a former member of the Brohirrim, that for the skinny fat in particular, it IS the only way to go? I finally got my new diet with carb cycling down on paper, but I’m postponing the actual start, because I really don’t want to fail again…
The leangains method really seems to work fine, but I still can’t grasp on how I’ll be able o eat as much as I need to in so few meals (2-4)..
Do you think by just doing carbs cycle and eating the regular 6 meals a day I’ll see some change? I rember reading another article regarding skinny fats on kelly baggett’s site, in which he stated that the simple act of calorie cycling would change body’s hormonal response…
I think fasting/carb cycling works best. Did for me.
But if you go back and check out my journey, you can see I leaned down and gained some muscle in 06-07 with the standard six meals per day gig.
I think it comes down to nutrient autoregulation moreso than anything else. But that’s just me.
So if I wanted to do a serious fat loss cut, would an 18/6 fasting window work? I like to do fasted cardio workouts and weight lifting workouts with BCAA’s so that’s why the 24 hour fast wouldn’t work for me. I would still do a pretty strict carb cycle as well.
16/8 can work well for fat loss. 24 Hour fasts aren’t necessary, even though they can be helpful.
On the muscle gaining template, how much fat is to much? On the low carbs day I keep carbs below 100. Is it a good measure for fat as well?
What is your position about milk?
On high carb days, I like keeping fats below 0.5 grams per pound of BW.
Milk is OK if you can tolerate it. I find most people to feel “better” without it, but “most people” isn’t everyone.
Hi Anthony
I really enjoyed this, and am currently looking to improve my diet to lose some fat.
I wanted to seek some clarification, where you say…
“Adjust the quantities based on how your body responds. It might take a few months to hone in on things, but everyone’s metabolic rate is different. That’s just the reality. I’m not about quick fixes either. You’re going to have to experiment.”
… do you have any advice on how to hone in/ experiment? i.e. once I start getting down at least one pound of meat, six eggs, and three protein shakes down every day how do I then know if it’s working?
Cheers
Dan
You simply see how the body responds in a week or two to a consistent food intake. If you lose or gain weight, then you either eat more or less depending on your goals. So start with a CONSISTENT amount of food day in and day out to set that baseline.
Cool, thanks!
I ended up rereading this via the link from your recent Skinny Fat success story post, and I was curious about the extended fast days for fat loss, specifically: Do you not care about macros if you fast for 20 hours? I’ve taken to doing this out of convenience but while I tried to get as much protein as possible, I’ve also taken to doing it when I know I’ll be eating out somewhere and I don’t want to always chose a lean protein source. Afterwards, I feel like I am racing to get more protein in before bed, since I am in a deficit on the other rest days. Do I really need to bother and just not worry about it so much if my protein needs are met on most other days? The context is that I always lose way too much muscle when cutting even when I try to take it slow.
I don’t care about macros. I’ll just have one meal with my “normal” protein amount in that meal.
Hey Anthony. Amazing templates! I bookmarked this for my new IF diet. The only thing is that I eat at school at 12pm, and workout at 3pm. I wanted to wait till Post workout to eat, but I would be on a 20 hour fast before I ate, unless I had a window of 4-10 or 12pm. I was wondering if it is THAT important to train on an empty stomach. Also, if I had to eat something at 12pm, what should I eat out of my first meal? The protein? Carbs? Or half of everything? Thanks.
Hmm. Tricky situation. If I were you I’d have a small lunch. Perhaps lean protein and a few veggies. Just *something* in your stomach. No starchy carbs. Train. Then post workout, have your carb dense meal (probably dinner time). Have a second meal after that if you couldn’t fit in the calories.
Thanks Anthony. Love your articles. I will eat .25 pounds of protein and some veggies to break my fast. One more question: On Low-carb days, if I am eating red meat, 1 pound is pretty caloric. Does 1 pound of RED meat, 6 eggs, 3 scoops of whey, and healthy fats add up to 3000? It seems like it might go over. Thanks.
Hi Anthony
do you not eat at all between the 1/2 meals that you eat per day on this plan?
do you take any forms of supplements pre or post workout as well or are all your nutrient needs covered if your taking in sufficient protein, fruit, veg and carbs?
thanks
I don’t eat at all.
I take creatine. 5 grams on training days.
Nutrients come from varying fruits, veggie, and meat sources.
This article helps. So, thank you. I currently follow Martin’s IFing (been 2 weeks so far) with a 14/10 window. I haven’t noticed any difference in FL but, It works for me mentally & I am faily new to it based on the guidelines – more protein/carb cycling. However, I’ve lived the no breakfast life most of my life. So, it came easy to me. Right now, I’m on a FL path (more than 65lbs to lose) and am always afraid to eat more than calories allowed. I do calorie count but, I personally want to get away from it so, I can eat/live normally (meaning, protein high/carb cycle) without having to worry about numbers. Although, i don’t feel confident that I can lose the pounds without counting.
You mentioned – “first step is one pound of meat, six eggs, and three scoops of protein” – That is LOT of food and if I eat that much it is pretty much my daily calorie intake
. How in the world can I add other stuff – veggies, carbs, fruits – in my diet if I eat that much. I am not an athlete but, an everyday average woman who has a 100% sedentary job (& has a ton of weight/fat to lose). How would you advice to someone like me?? I strength train 3x per week and do LISS 2x per week. Any suggestions or recommendations will be appreciated. Oh I workout in the evening. Thank you!
Ah, yes, women are a different animal. This was written for a male.
Here goes: half the meat and egg recommendations.
3 eggs, 0.5 pounds of meat.
You might even be able to half the protein one too, but I’d opt for two.
This will still deliver a decent amount of protein.
Anthony, Thank you so much for replying. I calculated the protein amount you recommended for me and it comes up to be roughly 115 g per day. I had set mine for 125-130 g per day….which is close enough. I definitely have to fight to keep my protein up that high. With feeding window being 10 hours on average…it gets tough at times. But, I will definitely try to keep it up. I guess if I stop counting calories I can keep the protein up. Since IFing, I’ve been basically doing 2 meals and 1 shake before bed.
I have another Q – for protein shakes, do you recommend shakes with milk or water? I usually drink 2% lactose free milk – only with shakes & little with coffee. But, I can do either skim or water if that is considered better?
Oh one more, do you think potato (white or sweet) is a good PWO carb?
Thank you for your help
I think that potatoes are one of the best carb sources on training days if you put forth a meaningful effort.
And as far as shakes go, I’m not a big fan of milk. Some people, however, can tolerate it. Makes me gassy and whatnot and dairy as a whole tends to derail fat loss in a lot of people. This is individual though.
How can I do this if I am doing cardio as well. I dont do it for fat loss but conditioning. 4 spin classes a week (tues, thurs x2 and Sundays). I guess they are my off days right? Thanks and Regards
Tim, I think we talked about this over e-mail. Thanks for the reply.
Excellent article Anthony, thanks. The information here is really helpful. I lost 60lbs about a year ago, down from 240 to 180, but I still have some stubborn body fat that needs to go. I’ve been lifting for a few months now, and I’ve seen some gains, but I really want to get my diet sorted properly to lose the flab and get lean! I’m building it roughly against your fat loss template, but I have a couple of questions.
Firstly, on my high carb days, I’m still getting quite a lot of fat from the milk I use with my oats and the eggs. Is it worth cutting them out? Or perhaps just the milk? Secondly, should I be avoiding carbs completely on low carb days? I know certain diets push minimal carb intake. Would I benefit from avoiding them entirely on my days off?
Many thanks again!
I’d ditch milk completely. Some people can eat milk and get lean. Others can’t. If you have a gut, there’s a good chance you can’t.
Eggs are iffy. For those that want to carb cycle more precisely, I recommend substituting 1 to 1.5 cups of low fat cottage cheese in place of eggs on training days.
Carbs on training days should be leafy, cruciferous veggies. Spinach, broccoli, cauliflower, etc…
Hey Anthony,
I stumbled upon your site the other day and have been catching up on archived articles.? Are you risking storing some of those carbs as fat if ingested all at once? I’m a big eater like you, and would have no problem putting down the 300 g of carbs on top of my lean meat in one sitting.
I have carb intake in two meals on the gaining template so you could eat MORE. Not to break carb intake in half and eat them in each meal.
Ie: Regular — 300 g PWO
Gain — 250g PWO, 200 g later in day…
Not many people can tank 300 in one sitting, let alone 450 g.
Good read. Quick question: Your principle is based around 1lb lean meat, 6 eggs, 3 protein shakes. Your guidance for a one meal day is one normal sized meal. Are you trying to hit a protein level in this meal?
Hmm…I’m a little confused. If you’re eating two times per day your meal prolly will be a bit “more” than “normal.”
Split those three things across your day and you’ll hit the requirement. Two meals. Three. Four. Don’t matter.
Two meals per day here too!
With tasty high glucose cheat snack in between
Fits my macros so who cares
I agree leangains is easy and effective, I started eating more and started losing more fat. After being on very low calorie ketogenic diet that was super hard psychologically and stalling on fat loss
Cool stuff, Aaron. Yeah, a low carb diet is tough to sustain for some.
First, I absolutely love your writings.
On diet, what if it were simpler still? I did classic Leangains. It worked. But I always knew that its success was far more about food quality–over time–and food quantity (calories)–over time. Why? because I knew many who did not do Leangains yet looked just as good as any of them, likely because they ate qualitatively and quantitatively “well”–OVER TIME. A version of your well-named, “cruise-control”.
So I ditched special PWO meals, ditched nutrient partitioning. I ate what I would have eaten in a week, but just averaged over each day. I also went to a more normal 12-hour fast. Should I work a bit harder on one day I allow myself a bit more. No surprises: it works. Good news is that it does not involve much thought.
As to training, I am now inclined to the higher volume/higher frequency, less systemic mutilation approaches. To no surprise I hurt less and look better.
Good stuff, Louis. Thanks for the reply.
you spelled the word EXLUCUSIVES wrong.
Only (in)human…
Thanks!
Holy shit man! This article is awesome. I’m on day 5 of IF and I am loving it! I feel awesome and my workouts are explosive. I am doing 2 meas a day a. I have a long way to go at 6′ 3″ and 320 lbs but I am down from 387lbs so the journey is.moving along anyway. Thanks again man! Very cool site.
Appreciate it man. Keep on trucking.
hey Anthony bro.. I have some doubts, because let’s say I begin my workout on 8:30 am and end it near 10:00 am so I would be still 2 hours far from feeding period.. am I allowed to take right there my first protein shake since it is post-workout?? and in any case, when do I have to take my protein shakes exactly? another question: can i switch my workouts hours between days? I mean does it alter in any way if i train half week on mornings and the rest of it on afternoons?
thanks in advance.!
You can train whenever you’d like.
As for the protein, take it whenever you want. I usually make protein pudding and eat it as a meal (look back into the archives for the recipe). If you finish your workout before the feeding period, you have two options: sip on a protein drink until you eat or have a small meal with a piece of fruit and a chicken breast or something.
great.!! thx for replying bro..
I’ll start my fasting this week.!
Wait a minute – 1 pound of meat, 6 eggs and 3 protein shakes PER DAY? Given my shakes are 25g protein per shake, altogether that works out to around 230g of protein per day. I’m a 159 lb. guy looking to add bulk (obviously) but also lean up. Is that not a lot more protein than I could possibly need to build? My usual caloric needs top out around 2,000/day anyway. I see a serious danger for over-consumption, here, for me. What do you think?
I think you need to reconsider your goals — what are you going to do? Lean out? Or bulk up?
As for it being more protein, it might be. But these are just general recommendations for the world to check out. You can feel free to adjust them based upon what you feel you need. Won’t be “dangerous” unless you have any underlying kidney issues.
Hi Anthony, could you help me structure my eating schedule.. I am tied up at work from 9am-5pm on weekdays, and the earliest I get to the gym is 6pm. My workouts usually last anywhere between 45-60 mins. My problem would be getting all my meals in before I go to sleep, which is usually at 11 or 12, how should I go about this issue? My main goal is to bulk as clean as possible, and I’d like to try out the Cruise Control version.
Depends on how much food you can tolerate in one sitting. If it were me, I’d have a noon-time meal of eggs, chicken, and veggies. Post workout meal at night with the rest of the fixins’ to hit caloric needs on certain days.
This only works if you can stomach the food volume though, so that’s something I need to know.
According to “How much protein” by Brad Pilon, we don’t need so much protein.
Why you persist on eating that much protein? As far as Brad says: 60-120g is enough.
I eat it because I like eating it. And when you don’t eat it you have to compensate with another food. Protein has a great sparing effect when it comes to turning into fat. So you can “overeat” it without much issue.
So you can eat a lot and get full.
But even more so, if you want to teeter on the minimum amount, you’ll probably get minimal results. Your choice. In my opinion, I’m spending time in the gym and dedicating my life to this stuff. If I’m going to do the damn thing, I’m going to do the damn thing. I’m not going to err on the light side because it doesn’t make sense to me. I’m not going to try to cut corners.
thx for answer. I though that if i meet the minimum requirement going over wont get me anywhere. I am not trying cut corners, just save money if i dont need that much protein. I have been on lean gains for over 1 year. I started with 260G of carbs and 175 of protein and fat around 40g on workout days and 60g on non working out days. I progressed with lifts, but i cannot get ripped. I can see my top abs but lower abs are always hidden. I tried diet breaks and I tried to lower carbs to 200g, now I am at 150g and I still cannot get rid of the that little extra fat to get lean. I cannot understand what could be wrong as I must be on deficit but my body is stucked with weigh in between 172-180.
Maybe you’re not eating enough protein
Losing fat there is the hardest place to lose, no doubt. You have to do everything right — especially if you don’t have uber genetics. I’d have to see your entire training and diet scheme though. Might also have to incorporate some fasted low intensity cardio too. That tends to help, as does some other training methods.
thx man, I will force it to be more.
I love your site and your progress.
After I have read How much Protein by BP, I just could not justify overeating the protein, but maybe this is wrong. I am eating now between 600-1000g of meat a day since I have read your post, which should give me enough protein. I will leave the carbs at 150g for now and see what happens. I workout either 2 or 3 times a week.
1 Deads and chinups
2 One leg squats or lunges and shoulder press
(I dropped squats as I always injure myself (my muscles in head freak out and they get tight) and recovery is too long, so I decided to concentrate on Deads, I also do Hill Sprints once a week)
3 Bench and dips
all above are weighed
I am 6.1 and 179 pounds , 37 years old
my stats now are:
Dead 7×275 (there was time when I hit 305 but I started to work on form and it went little down)
Chin 35+body weight x 5
Incline Bench Press Dumbbells 65×11 (I tend to go for more reps as when i was doing heavier i had issues with going to start position, so now i slowly progress by doing more reps and then adding weight until I reach 10-12 reps)
Dips – 45+body weight x 4
Dumbbell Shoulder press – 50 x 9 (same as with bench , i go to 10-12
, before my max was 60 x 4 but i had same pain as with squats so I work on perfect form and reps first and slowly try to progress)
1 leg squats with assistance, lunges and hill sprints I do for legs.
I also play basketball 1 or 2 a week.
Carbs only on working out days, so 2 or 3 times a week.
Do you cycle calories at all? Maybe you’re in a constant deficit. People with that stubborn body fat often go severely low on calories and their body never responds well — hormones go to poop. Maybe you need to jack up carbs on training days and lower them on off days. This will help recovery for strength training too. More strength wouldn’t hurt your cause. Neither would some hardcore gymnastics abdominal work.
yes I do carb cycle, on training days I eat carbs and on non training days I don’t eat carbs at all unless there is some minimal amount in some food I eat (max 20-40g) I keep protein constant and fat around 80 on non training days and 40 on training days. I just though that if I am at constant weight it would mean I am not on deficit as I am not loosing that’s why I started to play with my carb days and started to go down from 280 to 150. Do you think that I could be on deficit and my body just got used to one weight? Few years ago, I tried to eat more and I was immediately gaining fat.
I said CALORIE cycle, not CARB cycle.
Not sure what is the difference. I though If i lower carbs then automatically calories go down. Am i missing something? Your world or wisdom would be welcomed here.
Well technically with carb cycling, fats also increase and decrease depending on the day. Ie: high carb day = low fat day. Low carb day = higher fat day.
So calories can stay even, but macro breakdown differs.
So, what do you recommend? Count calories instead of macros and cycle?
I personally recommend cycling calories AND carbs AND protein at times. But my scheme is soon-to-be released
Hi Anthony,
Fantasic article!
I am very intested in moving from the six meals per day “standard” to something along the lines of the cruise control/muscle gain template. I train during the evening (6pm) so am thinking my feeding windows would be between 12pm – 2pm and 7pm – 9pm? I would also like to understand if it is ok to have a morning coffee with milk?
Your feeding window isn’t really two separate times. You’d just have to meals under the feeding window. A lunch and then a dinner.
Most times you want to avoid milk and coffee. It’s not a great combo since coffee’s “power” usually is negated with milk.
Hi Anthony,
Thanks for your quick response, the support you demonstrate is fantastic… and motivating!
I may have missed something as I am a little confused with the response, there are no feeding windows? Just one big lunch and one big dinner yeah?
I also have another question – you mentioned in one of your other nutrition articles that maintenance is roughly = body weight in pounds x 16, so in the case of myself that 172 x 16 = 2752 calories. you also mention If you are happy with your body fat and want to gain you have to times by 1.1 or 1.2 on training days and times by .08 or 0.9 on non training days (roughly). So using that logic if I was to start the cruise control/muscle gain template would it look a little like this?
Training days:
Lunch = 1513 calories
Dinner = 1513 calories
Total calories: 3027 (maintenance x 1.1)
Non training days:
Lunch = 1100 calories
Dinner = 1100 calories
Total calories = 2220 (maintenance x .08)
????
Thanks again for the support.
Those old articles are old. I don’t agree totally with them anymore. Here’s some suggestions –
If you’re happy with your body fat start at BW x 12-14 on off days. 15-17 on training days.
After a few weeks if you don’t notice any change, bump calories up on training days. After a few weeks if nothing happens, bump them up on off days.
Then from there go solely training days.
As for the meal times, I personally go with a 4ish hour feeding window. So I use windows but I’m not quite so sure you’d have to.
Err carbs.
Mostly i want to say thanks for this article, I’ve taken a more serious stance to my training lately and this article will help me get the food I need, the lifestyle option suits my life well. specificaly “high carb day = low fat day. Low carb day = higher fat day” will be helpfull to reach my goals i think.
So again, thank you very much!
I do however have one question though(im new to thinking about nutrition), in general how much carbs would “high carb” be? (somehow ive always had prob with getting them carbs.)
Also, would it be fine to add in a couple of fruits along the day seperate from the meals(in the morning mostly)?
Thanks for your awesome articles!
As for “high carb” that’s totally dependent on what you normally eat and if you carb cycle. A lot of my coaching students are around 300ish on training days though to give you an idea.
As for fruits, that depends on if you want to be strict IF or not.
Aright thanks! (you’re a quick with the answers, cheers for that).
One additional question came up as I read through more articles here and elsewhere and i was wondering what your take is on training multiple times/day?
More specificly Weights + Muay Thai.
Would it be better to try and schedule these on my weight-off-days?
No you can do both on the same day. It gets tricky with nutrition and making sure one doesn’t interfere with the others, but it can be done. The problem with doing them on an off day is recovery. If the practices are intense you’re going to run yourself into the ground at first. Eventually your body might adapt though.
Hello! I just read this post, and in general your page has been very helpful and motivating. I just had one doubt, though, with schedule. Currently I am studying and I have classes (non-stop) from 8.30 am to 1.00 or 2.00 pm. I live in a student house with a roomate so all my workouts I do them in a gym (even bodyweight ones, the gym has an excellent room, very big and empty, with mirrors, where I do this workout) just to have more “privacy”. The problem is that I have to be there before 4.00 pm because of a limitation in my membership. Right now I’m following a plan of 3 workout days (Mon., Wed., and Fri.). I would like to know which kind of schedule would you recommend me to follow with this meal plan…
(Also if you have any recommendations for increasing my protein intake as a vegetarian).
All the best to you! This site is really cool and helpful.
If you can sustain your hunger and energy, train right after classes, eat dinner at 4PMish, and then anything else to fill in your caloric needs until you sleep.
Sounds awesome, I have but one hang-up: What about Breakfast??
What about it?
If you’re asking what to eat, you don’t eat breakfast.
Anthony, have you worked with vegetarians at all?
Nope.
Great read, easy to follow and all makes sense. Too many ‘diets’ you read have loads of variables and other stuff that’s just a put off before you really start reading it. This is simpler and easy to follow, thanks!
Couple of questions:
1. I like to workout early, like between 9 – 10AM, so is it still cool to haven first meal between 12 – 2? People just always say you should eat 30 mins to an hour after a WO, so it’s cool to scrap that?
2. I’m kinda in a tricky sitch as I have a terrific mum (best in the world) who prepares all my meals for me. Whenever I propose I’ll start doing my own plans like this or cook my own meals she’s not very open to the idea because she doesn’t want to change how she does things for the family, and says the clean up will be too tedious. I tell her I’m happy to take care of that stuff but she still isn’t keen.
Anyway so I’m kinda stuck when it comes to cooking stuff for myself and may find it hard to cook up red meat or vegetables and things. So, is it ok if I bought red meats like shaved ham, or shaved roast beef, that kinda stuff (like from supermarkets), or are we strictly talking steaks, fully cooked beef/lamb, etc?
Thanks Anthony, love your site.
1. You need something quick to digest PWO so that you can restock liver glycogen. Fruit, whey, or BCAAs will do the trick.
2. Lunch meat is generally not all that good.
This might help:
I inspired that article way back when I was having some trouble introducing new things with my family.
Hiya Anthony,
Firstly, this is by far the most easy to understand post on IF so cheers for that. I’m doing leangains which is a no brainer but wanted to add a day or two of ESE in there. What wasn’t clear is when you start and end your 24 hour fast? Is it 3pm-3pm? 6-6? I know it can be different for everyone but what window of time has worked best for you?
Check out my “how to start intermittent fasting” post. It basically depends on when you train and when it’s convenient for you.
Days:
Workout – Mon, Wed, Fri
Eat Food – Mon, Wed, Fri, Sun
Water/Tea Fast – Tue, Thu, Sat
I just wanted to know you’re experience on not counting calories on fasts like ESE. I’m just worried I might overeat on the days I do eat Food, and go over my calories even though I’m fasting 3 days a week. Is this possible? Even thought I’m 6000 calorie deficit.
Also I never understood how ESE days worked. When I fast, I won’t eat the entire day, then will eat the next day. So Tuesday no food, Wednesday Food. Yet with ESE you eat everyday?
Anything is possible. Don’t know what to tell you there other than a 6000kcal deficit is huge. If you’re pigging out on your eating days though, anything can happen. Just because you don’t count calories doesn’t mean you don’t know a roundabout amount of food you’re eating.
ESE is a 24 hour fast. If you stop eating at 5PM one day, 24 hours later is 5PM the next. So if you stop eating at 5PM one day you start again at 5PM next. Key is just to eat a regular sized meal and not make up for calories.
First off, I am glad I came around to this website. Makes carb cycling so easy a cave man can do it!
Question: On the fat-loss template in regards to the once a meal days, do you still get the same amount of protein in that one meal as other days (i.e. 3 scoops protein, 6 eggs, 1 pound meat) or would that be less as well?
Thanks in advance. This diet truly ends all diets.
-Matt
You don’t have to jam all of the protein in, a few days of a lower protein intake won’t hurt.
Anthony,
What do you think of potatoes? They ok to eat? I eat paleo and have cut them out but miss / crave them.
See my post called, “Does the type of carbohydrate matter.”
They’re fine.
Wow! I did not believe 1 meal per day really works. I am used to believing that 6 meals per day would be the best and the most effective diet plan for all levels of body building, may it be professional, novice, intermediate..etc. ( This seems to be outdated, I don’t know, really..
)
but seeing you in great shape with on meal per day experiments. I’m really excited to try it!
I have been working out for almost 1 year and a half now (MWF) and I’ve been following and studying post-workout and pre-workout diets with out anyone to guide me.
its just like self research. ALL OF THEM ARE CALORIE CALCULATIONS! which is a pain in the neck.
anyway, Question:
Is it okay if you do the 1 meal per day for 1 year? should it be really post workout or pre-workout? I’m guessing its most-probably post-workout meal?
I apologize if this question was already asked. I cant seem to read and browse all of the comments!
Thanks for the post man, No calculations and numbers what so ever. excited to try it!
Fiel
Do the one meal per day as long as you can do the one meal per day. Don’t commit long term, just try it out.
The meal should be post workout.
What are your thoughts on things like Carb Backloading and Intermittent Feast where they push all carbs to night regardless of when you lift? Granted CBL is pushes for a late in the day workout.
I like Nate Miyaki’s Intermittent Feasting. See my most recent blog post.
Great article. Great read. Very consistant information and your methods deliver.
Personally, I am always cutting. Even when I’m not intending to and am planning lean-gains. On my off days, I tend to perform intermittant fasting for 48 hours each week. I go on, pretty much nothing but water and tea.
On my work out days, which are 2-3 days a week for two hours a day or less. I have one meal a day of boiled broccolli (salt, pepper and chilled tahini sauce), around 500 grams which comes out to 200 calories, 33.2 grams of carbs and about 15 grams of protein. I’ll usually have about 3 tablespoons of Peanut butter (90 cals each) throughout the rest of the day and I’m good. I feel light as a feather and strong enough to lift rocks.
I feel much more satisfied with a “life ‘meal’ plan” that I can live with. Even if I can’t be 180 lbs of all muscle with a 1/2% of body fat. I am currently 155 lbs down from 240 lbs and at 5’11″.
While, for a man, that is pretty light. I feel comfortable being closer to 140 lbs.
I was hoping for your opinion on this Anthony.
I don’t agree with it. It’s not something I’d do. It doesn’t support my goals.
But it’s not about me.
If it works for you and you enjoy it, good things.
Hey bro thanks for all the info. Ive started IF about 2 weeks ago and already feel the difference. Question is that Im trying to get my woman to try it out since its more convenient to eat this way based on her schedule. I know its different for women then it is for men. She needs to loose some weight and lean out. What would a womans diet look like or do you have a link to where you have an outline for this? Thanks and keep up the great work.
There are some people that say IF isn’t as suited for women, but, as usual, there’s always two sides. Some women use it with great results.
But I don’t have anywhere to point you, sorry. I’d just google “intermittent fasting women.”
Hi everyone! I’m in need of some advice….
I have been IFing for the past few months and LOVING it. I’ve always struggled with dieting and have had a love-hate relationship with food, but I believe those days are finally over! I am female, 23 years old, and probably around 124 lbs.
I have been playing around with some different fasting styles, mainly sticking with the 16/8 lean gains, but I have been incorporating some 24 hour fasts on days when I will not be training as hard. Overall, I’m feeling very flexible with fasting lengths, anywhere from 16-24 hrs.
However, my diet and training has made it pretty difficult to figure out what days I should be having as my ‘higher’ carb days, vs. lower, etc. I am a strict vegetarian (no dairy, but eat eggs), and I am training for a half-marathon, but also crossfit 3-4x a week. Help!
With my diet it is hard to ‘low’ carb, and my focus is more on my running, as opposed to lifting heavy. I use crossfit to help improve my strength and running performance. At this point I really only take one day off, and 1-2 days a week are strictly only runs, no crossfit.
Overall, I am very confused and unsure of what my macros should be… Any ideas or suggestions anyone??
Honestly, I wouldn’t do CrossFit. It’s good that you’re into it, but you’d likely just benefit from the strength in general — and you don’t need CrossFit for that. You’re going to get your marathon skills running, not from CrossFit.
If you are doing CrossFit, you need to include carbs on those days — most of their training will zap your glycogen reserves and will need some care.
Running days are more fat as a primary nutrient, so you wouldn’t need to carb-fest.
This whole framework depends on what you want though — physique or performance. What’s your true goal? Is the marathon just a fun thing that to assist your physique or what?
Great article.
I believe that the best way to lose weight healthily is fitness. Together with healthy foods it will keep you in good shape and mood. In order to provide enough nutrition and be able to train more effectively I take NavySeal Formula. This is a dietary supplement developed for soldiers, but it is good for everyone, who wants to keep fit
This seems like a spammy product pitch. Are you robot spam, Carolyn?
Hey Anthony!
Great article.
I done IF at the end of a 6 month 6 meal a day carb cycling cut, only done the IF for 9 days and noticed a difference. I lost 2 stone in order to get my abs out but lost too much muscle!
Ive put a stone back on since then with a bit of fat coz lets say it was a pretty dirty bulk being during the festive season and all.
I started fasting today but wasnt sure what variation i was going to do so i googled it and landed here , so decided i’ll go for the 2 meal a day approach.
I dont work out untill around 6pm and i think i would struggle to get all my carbs in one meal post workout. Would it work to have just chicken , eggs , veg around 12 then two smaller meals post workout to split the carbs?
Thanks in advance
Gary.
Sure. Give it a try.
Hi Anthony!
Great article by the way.
I´m quite a noobie to this kind of schedule (used to the 4-6 meals a day), so I have some quick questions:
1- Do I need to start with the Cruise Control or can I just go on with the Muscle Gain template if that´s my purpose?
2- It says that you have 2 big meals, the first as a post-workout, meaning you go training with an empty stomach. Doesn´t it affect your energy during working out (lifting less intense, etc.)?
3- You convinced me of starting out with Tricking (got my kip-up already ^^), and that´s why I want to reschedule my whole planing. Used to lift weights 4 times a week, I realized that maybe lifting was not my main aim. Sure I want to get a little bigger and stronger, but just more as a complement to tricking. So here is the question, how do you organize yourself to do both things? 3 days lifting/3 days tricking? Tricking same days as lifting..? What about the meals? Do you trick at days off, or at high carb days?
Sorry for my english, it seems not as difficult to read thoughts written in english as to express them for a non native speaker.
Keep up the good work man!
1- You can do whatever suits your needs best.
2- Depends on when you work out. Most people, when they get used to hunger, are more focused and energized in a fasted state. Your energy comes from what you eat the day before in most circumstances anyway.
3- This would require me to write a book, and is what a lot of people struggle with. If you need personal help, it would be more of a personal programming gig. You can email me if this is something you’re interested in. Simply too long to write about, and I apologize.
This is brilliant. Just discovered leangains and the 16/8 really suits me but the macros seem a bit daunting. This article put my mind at ease. I’m currently trying to do a cut as I’ve suffered as a skinny fat for years and this bothers me more than my muscles so trying to start from a ‘lean base’.
Regarding your fat loss section I don’t know if I could do one meal a day. So I’m gonna try 3 meal/day with:
Training – high carbs/low fat
Rest – low carbs/high fat
I was just wondering if your 6 eggs a day could still work on training days because that’s like 45g of fat. I love eggs though so I like the idea of it.
Also, since looking at my maintenance calories I’ve realised that my previous ‘diet’ was decent but I was undereating. Any tips on bumping my carbs and protein up without feeling really full at each meal? May seem like a stupid question but it just seems like too much food! Even with the 3 meal split.
Cheers. And again, great article!
I like food. So it’s never “too much.” Can’t help you there.
As for 45g of fat being “too much,” that depends on how much you weigh and all of that fun stuff. If you eat 3000 calories, 45 g isn’t big. 2000…bigger.
Get it?
Ah yeah. Makes total sense. If I go by the leangains ratios I’m on 2300 training and 1350 rested so 6 eggs on rested days may be a little much. Think I’m just gonna see how I get on and try and adjust it if it’s not really working.
Thanks for your response anyway! And again, great article.
Yuppers. Experimentation is good.
Oh, I meant to ask what your opinion on whey and casein shakes is. I have no problem eating ridiculous amounts of meat, it’s just so expensive to eat that much protein (aiming for 140g a day; I’m 160lbs, about 18% BF). So to try and keep costs down I bought some whey and casein isolates. I don’t really want it to be a long term thing but in terms of cost it’s much easier to just have one of each a day.
I recommend the three scoops of whey, so I realize the cost effectiveness. I’d still eat the meat though. I mean, one pound of chicken is usually around $2 or something. Can even find it less so in bulk.
But I wouldn’t totally forego meat.
Ignore the last comment! ‘…and 3 protein shakes a day’.
Damn my sequential answering of questions.
wounder if you could tell me what to do if i cant afford any protein powder would be appreciated
If you can’t afford protein powder, how can you afford food? The former is insanely LESS expensive.
Got 3 kids and the 30 or 40 pounds it costs is always spoken for lol
Well I’m just saying that whey is the cheapest protein source you can buy.
Let me know if u can get it cheep anywhere dude
I buy from True Nutrition.
Hi,
You said you would say easy 6 more times, but it was only 5..!
Good eyeballs.
LOVE THIS PLAN! It’s similar to how I already eat, but helped me modify my plan. It took me years to understand (and train my mind) how to eat well. The 5-6 meals a day never worked for me. It made me think about food far too often and left me craving everything. This method is simple and easier to make it a lifestyle rather than a ‘diet’. Thanks for sharing!
‘Sall about chaos. Thanks Mona.
Is this 6 whole eggs? Would Cholesterol be a concern if I exercise (3 day lifting split and slow cardio 2-3 days a week). If so I can stop separating so many damn eggs!
Whole eggs. The idea of dietary cholesterol eggs (especially from eggs) increasing serum cholesterol is rather mythical. I suggest you do your own research as to why.
So for the past week i have been fasting at least 22 hours and only eating at night after my workout. My one big meal cant be more than 1500 calories. On the weekend i am trying to eat either only one meal or do at least an 18hr fast. I got on the scale today and it seems like i gained 3lbs. I dont know what i could possibly be doing wrong. I relatively eat clean paleo except for some sweet potato fries or wine during the week. On weekend i definitely have cheat meals and alcohol.
If your weekend habits are bad enough, they could be derailing progress. But before you do anything else, try to get a better estimate on hat you eat. I don’t know what eating clean means, it’s an ambiguous term that says nothing about QUANTITY. I don’t know how much wine you drink. I don’t know how much you eat, period. So calculate that FOR REAL, and don’t just make it an estimate.
Second, what’s your “training?”
Anthony, Wow! Great article! Came across you though finding leangains but this seems so much more detailed as what to exactly do! I’ve been following a intermittent fasting lifestyle for some time now… But I’m constantly looking for better ideas to increase performance(crossfit), save time on cooking(work long hours), and most of all save money(organic is expensive)… I started out breaking the bank on organic grass fed everything and soon money just ran out… I’m curious your thoughts on this specifically? It just gets hard to buy organic/grass fed meat especially at 1 pound a day! You also suggest 3 scoops of protein a day, do you have a specific brand of protein you use or suggest? I’ve gone through everything from the top of the line grass fed undenatured whey’s, to the cheaper whey’s, and often wondered does any of this organic stuff even freaking matter? So there goes my first post here, hope it wasn’t too long!! I’ve really enjoyed reading through your blog!
Welcomes.
you list Brad Pilon as someone you follow… What do you think about what he’s got to say about protein intake?
I think that his protein recommendations are better served for those that want to be on the conservative side or retain muscle mass. I’d rather just do the damn thing and take the protein. I’d honestly eat the food anyway. I love meat and eggs, so it’s no bones by me.
What would you do food, diet, and most of all cooking/prepping your meals with a extremly busy work schedule… On top of the extremly busy work schedule you’ve also gotta make time for the training side of things… So for me most nights I don’t get home from the gym until 7/730… So there I am, long freaking day, worn out from work, working out and staring the kitchen and cooking dinner and the next days lunch in the face… This is what I struggle with the most… One of the biggest things that turned me onto this intermittment fasting thing was the fact you’d only have to worry about eating twice a day… But I still struggle with finding easy things to cook in a timly manner and also be creative enough to make the meals enjoyable so I’m not tempted to head down the old path of eating out, especially for lunch… Dinner is obviously much easier than lunch, which I have to get ready the night before, pack up, and bring to work…. I work 6 days a week, so I’m not home much… Ideas for planning and food prep to help someone that struggles with lack of time would be greatly appreicated….
I’d forgo lunch, save for portable foods. Hard boiled eggs. Veggies. Fruits.
I’d make training sessions 1-2 movements. Hit it and get home.
I’d cook the same way I do now, which is super easy. Foreman grill for meat, eggs, lightly lemon sautee of veggies. Rice in a pot. Or taters in the oven.
Requires minimal effort.
When do you drink your protein shakes? You say 3 a day right? 1-1/2 during lunch, 1-1/2 after workout or during dinner? How long do you let hard boiled eggs sit in the fridge before you finish them off? how long will they stay fresh?
I don’t drink my protein shakes. I eat them. Search for my whey protein pudding post.
Hard boiled eggs – I don’t eat them hard boiled. Freshness? No clue. Google is your friend.
Anthony, so my simple brain is crystal clear here… lol…
training days
lunch: 6 eggs or .5 pounds lean meat(cottage cheese?), veggies, 200 grams of carbs
dinner pwo: 1 pound of lean meat(cottage cheese?), 3 scoops of protein, veggies, 250 grams of carbs
non traning days
lunch: 6 eggs or .5 pounds of fattier cut of meat(cottage cheese?), veggies, carbs or not? how much?
dinner: 1 pound of fattier cut of meat(cottage cheese), 3 scoops of protein, veggies, carbs or not? how much?
not counting the cottage cheese, curious when you fit that in, thats well over 200 grams of protein a day? would you split your scoops of protein up, or is it just your preference to have them all at night? obviously your intake of protein is different than mine, i’d like to stay around 185, so i’d adjust accordingly…
have you tried bulletproof coffee with grass fed butter, mct oil, and coconut oil? noticed your video of adding whey protein to your coffee? would that be considered breaking the fast?
Training day, core food + starchy carbs.
Rest day, core food + non-starchy carbs.
That’s all you need to know.
I only eat one meal per day, and I like my coffee black, so, no. I don’t really use the whey trick, I did back when I first started fasting. Technically anything “breaks” the fast.
Ok! Hey I thought you were eating twice a day now? You said warrior diet didn’t work well for you? All the example diets you listed, showed to feedings a day?
People change.
Hi Anthony, I’m what you would call skinny fat. I’m female 23 y.o 5’7 115lbs and I want to loose excess fat on my inner thighs/ butt area and just get lean in general. Is this method a good start?
I’ve been eating low carb/ gluten free for 2 years and I recently gained 10 lbs in 2 months. I noticed it might be the addition of excess olive oil/ avocado in my salads and eating a lot of baked Brussels sprouts drenched in olive oil. I also cut down on my usual gym routine, as I started waking up at 6 am for work and getting so exhausted I’d just come home instead of gym or I’d goon the elliptical but this hasn’t helped me loose fat.
So last week I started doing Hiit on the treadmill for 20 min (60 sec at 4.5 light jog and 60 sec at 9 full on sprinting like a bear is chasing me) then the next day, I do heavy weights ( 120 lb squat – on a machine though, I haven’t learned how to squat with a bar yet) and some 15-30 min elliptical after.
I also have a different schedule in April, I’ll be able to wake up at 10 am instead, would this help ? Id be less groggy. Maybe the weight gain was a hormonal thing as well?
Would this gym routine and trying IF work for me? Which plan should I follow to see the results I want and not get discouraged. I want to get rid of my lumpy butt and upper thighs. Help? Thanks so much
And since I’m a female what would you recommend for intake?
My advice generally only applies to those that strength train with free weights, so you’d have to alter this is you weren’t doing such.
Hi again. Sorry to bother, but I was wondering , does chewing sugar free gum like trident cinnamon affect my fast period? Say if I were to feel hungry and pop a few pieces before my first meal and then after the fast? What are your thoughts?
There’s some evidence that the sugar alcohol does have some kind of effect, but it would be low on the list of things to worry about. In other words, your gum shouldn’t be a limiting factor.
Hey Anthony. Was overhead pressing the other day and felt that annoying shoulder pain forcing me to stop. Probably trying to be over eager as have just started out and things were going well. Anyway. I’m resting it, trying to get full ROM back and gonna then do some cuff work.
My question is twofold:
1) what should I do about my ‘training’ day macros/calories if I’m not really lifting all that much?
2) any suggestions on training around this while I’m trying to rest my shoulder? (I know this is a diet post so sorry about that).
Thanks.
1) Less food, basically.
2) Do anything that doesn’t hurt the shoulder. I don’t make amends for localized injuries. You can still do a bunch of other exercises, and even find pain free pressing exercises. Do them. All while working on the problem that’s preventing you from overhead pressing. Don’t detrain. Retrain.
hi,
i have just started to train my muscles, previously i was lean throughout my life,but by consuming junk and fast foods i became fattier.
then, i started dieting ( may be i didnt understand how to diet so may be i went completely wrong about it) i did cardio most of the time and eleminates every kind of “oil” in my meals. i also skipped potatoes,sugar,cheese and fast foods. i became lean eventually and i got my six packs.
my problem is, after loosing fat from my body my face looks very skinny and small and starved where as my body is getting muscular day by day due to high proteing intakes. on a whole i dont look good due to a smaller face and muscular body.
kindly just help to maintain some fat on my face or tell me any jaw excercise to maintain a face which is propotional to my body. or recommend me a diet that i can follow to make my face propotional to my body without destroying my abs.
thankyou.
Your face will grow in proportion to your body fat and body weight levels. No exercise will help.
Anthony,
So you’ve now moved closer to the warrior diet as far as your daily eating patterne?
Me and my girlfriend are going to give this a try now as well… Question I have, when it comes to females, how does fasting or eating this way affect them or their hormones… Her doctor was stead fast against fasting for women in particular…
Also curious how fasting or eating this way for longer than normal periods of time affects testosterone in men? Any thoughts on this? Thanks!
Some women prosper. Others, not so much. I wanna say it depends on your initial condition, but I’m sure not many people know for sure. Also depends on if you’re trying to have kids, etc…
Yeah, I basically run with Warrior Chaos, per outlined in the Chaos Bulk.
Anthony!!! Dope ass article and so well written! I lift and do HIIT every week, but the 6 meals/day is getting tiresome. So, I’m going to give IF a try starting tomorrow! My question is I take 1 scoop of casein prior to going to bed and I plan on eating during 12noon-8PM–so, when should I consume that scoop of casein? Thanks and great job again on this article!
Eat it whenever you want from 12-8. You’re probably eating it pre-bed because you think your muscles will waste away. They wont.
Thanks Anthony! Much appreciated for the response.
Great information.
I’ve read Eat Stop Eat, the leangains website and a lot of people using these approaches.
One of the most interesting sources was this:
About a competing powerlifter combining Eat Stop Eat and Leangains resulting in fat loss and muscle gain!
What is your experience regarding fat loss and muscle gain at the same time?
It can happen. More so if you have lots of fat to lose. Definitely the “toughest” dietary operation. But possible indeed.
Hi Anthony!!
Great article man!!
Im planning on starting this eating 2pm-10pm, strength train mon/tue/thur/fri in the evening, HIIT at 1pm mon/thur and 30min power walk tue/fri, wed will be rest day. How does that sound for IF, was thinking of getting all carbs in after the evening training session??
Also on a Saturday night i may take a cheat meal (burger and fries) and couple of beers or wine, would this be ok and is it worth me doing some HIIT or a circuit Saturday afternoon just to offset the cheat meal slightly??
Cheers dude, thanks for the site its a great help!!
A moderate cheat meal should be fine, so long as you don’t gorge yourself.
Everything else looks decent. Certainly on the right track. Although I’d, perhaps, venture to power walk on the OFF days. Just me though. I don’t enjoy doing any fat loss dominated activity on a day that I’ll be carbing up or anything like that.
Ah ok, so maybe use wed/sat/sun as active recovery days in a sense and get some walking in!!
Cool man thanks so much for the reply!
Sorry mate i forgot to ask how much oats do you have weight wise??
Cheers dude!
I don’t weigh food, so I couldn’t tell ya. Whatever fits in the bowl I used.
Haha thats good enough for me!!
Cheers mate your a legend!!
Thanks man.
Hi Anthony,
How would you schedule your 2 meals (ESE) if you lift in the morning from 6:00 to 7 am?
I consider non-starchy veggies “free” foods, and thin skinned berries (among some other fruits) “free” foods. I’d probably snack on those as hunger necessitated until I had a big PM dinner.
Now you got me curious, Anthony. Which fruits and veggies are we talking about here?
Thin skinned berries = free. Fruit otherwise, 1-2 pieces.
Fantastic article! Just have a few questions.
1. Is this template still what you use in terms of your current diet?
2. Also, I was wondering, (maybe I didn’t check the blog carefully enough) if you used that exact fat loss template after you intentionally splurged and gained like 20 pounds in a few short days.
3. If I was interested in the mass gain template, could I have the first meal consist of lean protein and carbs, and taper down the carb intake for the second meal, but include more fat?
4. Dont worry, no more questions. Thanks, love your work!
1. I use stuff inside of The Chaos Bulk a little bit more. Similar, but not quite.
2. Again, Fractal Fat Loss guide inside of The Chaos Bulk.
3. Maybe. There are many ways to go about things depending on what you enjoy and what’s suited to your lifestyle. I only eat one meal per day these days.
4. Thanks.
For post workout im thinking of having 200g oats, 10 eggwhites, handfull berries, apple, 3 scoop protein, small glass almond milk and water, blend and drink!! Also a 3 whole egg ommlette!! Meat and veggies will be consumed in 2 other meals in the 8 hours!! Does this sound ok to you??
Also coconut oil in my 2 cups of morning coffee or just straight black!!
Cheers dude!!
Uh, beats me, just give it a go and see if it works. Everyone has a different metabolic rate. You didn’t even mention your goals, height, weight, body fat level, etc…so just go for it and adjust.
I drink coffee black.
Made protein pudding today with vanilla protein YUM! Just what I needed to shake things up. Trying the oatmeal volcano tomorrow–is it sad that I am excited about it?
Anyway I am so glad I found your article, I have been IFing for awhile and then I came across ESE. I have been trying to figure out the best way to utilize both so thanks for the great info!
Welcomes. |
>>.
165 comments:
I've been following since late 2006 when the desire to move to Alaska began to fully form in my mind. As a road cyclist I found myself googling "cycling" + "alaska". After visiting Homer in summer of 2007 I found myself with an even greater reason to read the blog weekly.
Found your blog via AKspokes which is now AlaskaBikeHub. Been reading via RSS since.
Hi, found you through "fat cyclist" back in 2009, while being stuck in a chair for 3 months, learning for my final exam ever (after 4 years of residency in small animals internal medicine) - I was desperate for movement and the outside and your blog provided that in a way. Thanks!
I found your blog after meeting you in Hawaii while you were helping Geoff for the HURT 100. It was great to meet you and then last year I remember passing you and Beat in the dark on a HURT loop during the race. Your blog is one of my favorites because you not only like to write, but you like to include a few photos to add to the details.
Hey Jill - awesome stuff going on with you lately. I've been reading your blog at least weekly since 2005/6 or somewhere in there, which would make it pretty much 80 percent of my total recreational reading, which is terrible, but on the other hand, your writing is great, and your adventures entertaining, so I suppose we read what we enjoy, regardless of if it turns up in the New Yorker or on blogger.com - I predict great things. You are so freakin' inspiring!
I'm not sure how I originally found your site, but it was after Ghost Trails was published and you were living in Homer. I promptly went back and read every post from the beginning. I've really enjoyed following your journey and am encouraged by the epic adventures that you undertake.
Funny coincidence that you are headed to Tahoe, I just flew out on Wednesday after spending a week with family. I can guarantee you that you'll find snow :) I wanted to do some mountain biking at Tahoe, but it sounded like most of the trails were still closed due to snow. I had to be content with some rides near Reno.
Tomorrow, for a change of pace, I'll be doing a supported tour near Coorg in Karnataka, India. No snow here!
Hi, been reading since around the time you got your Pugsley I think, so late 2007/early 2008? At first it was just to see the pics of the snowbikes and the scenery, but got sucked in by the stories.
That anonymous comment above is me (bazzargh). Office firewall crashed just as I posted, seems to have lost my identity as a result.
Been coming here since at least Susitna in 2006, possibly earlier. Think I came via Fatty. Bought your first book, will by your next and probably any more that you write.
I found your site via Fat Cyclist a couple of years ago. I always enjoy reading your posts about what your up to. It interesting and inspiring. I've already bought the Kindle version of the new book and have been immersed in it for a couple of days now. It's good stuff!
I started reading it about 3 years ago, found it through gwadzilla.
Hi Jill, I have been following this blog since November 2005 and enjoy every minute of it - I learned about your blog from Geoff and it is great reading. I have followed all of your adventures (some good and some not so good). You are an inspiring writer and an awesome person. So glad that you have found someone to share all of your adventures with.
Can't wait to read your new book - I bet it will have me glued to it just like Ghost Trails did.
Best of luck with the new publication and will be anxious to continue reading this blog for years to come.
Love,
Sharon
I think I've read your blog pretty much since 2005/2006. I don't remember exactly how I found it, must have had something to do with a search for Alaska, as I visited there in 2005. Have really enjoyed reading all your adventures, and look forward to reading more.
Lise
I was bicycling through all the seasons and living in Quebec, I stumbled upon your blog while just googling "winter bicycling", I think back in 2006. Your writing and photography is captivating and resonated with me so I stuck around!
People should change over six years? I should look into that...
Hi Jill! I found your blog from both Fat Cyclist and Team Dicky, maybe in 2009? I'm a cyclist too and I love reading your stuff. It's helped me keep focus on just pedaling on not stressing about gear or experience! Thanks for your perspective.
Sadly, I only found you a couple of months ago. After getting into blogging (and improving my fitness) a bit over 2 years ago, I started following some of the adventures of a couple of the UK ultra-runner / mtb type folks, and I'm pretty sure I stumbled across you from there - always fascinated at the journey that ends with you guys completing the feats you do!
Inspirational and interesting stuff!
Sue
I looked up your blog after reading your short write up in the Adventure Cyclist magazine when you started working there and have been hooked ever since.
Loved your first book, and started reading the second (ebook) two days ago as I couldn't wait for the hard copy.
Absolutely captivating - should finish it tonight.
Totally came across your blog like 2 years ago when i got into endurance cycling in montana. Started reading your journals about the tour divide because I heard about the crazy race that went through my town (butte) every time I chatted with people out riding, and have been a dedicated and inspired reader ever since!
I found your blog 4 years ago - I am very poor at time frames. I believe I followed a link from another blog and have loved your posts ever since.
Thanks for sharing so much and being so open. Even if I don't win I am going to buy the book and keep it with Ghost Trails.
Have a great weekend
I've been here since your "Ode To Pugsley" post.
Needless to say, ya got me with that one!! ;)
Peace
I've been enjoying your adventures since March of this year. I finally got my wife into riding, so as we set up our own blog I searched for women riders out there to help inspire her to push through the initial frustrations of tackling mountain biking... and here we are
I've been reading your blog for three or four years... not even sure how I found it, but the amazing pics of Alaska and stories of your snow bike adventures got me hooked.
Thanks for sharing all your stories with us!
Couldn't remember for the life of me when and how I ended up here. Look back through the blog archive and found an entry where you did a guest post for Fat Cyclist back on Nov 20, 2008. I am pretty sure that was it and I have been a faithful reader ever since.
Found you through Fatty. 2, maybe 3 years ago. Still here obviously. And still reading Fatty too. D.
Have been following since mid-2008. Someone (Team Dicky??) on mtbreview commented about your exploits.
I would guess I've been reading your blog for just about two years now. Don't remember how I found it either (wow - and it was only two years ago!), but I really enjoy your writing, the photos and your perspectives. I bicycle and run also (on a much smaller scale than you do), have spent time in Southeast AK and CA, and have subscribed to Adventure Cycling for years, so was initially attracted to your thoughts on outdoor exercise. Over time though, I realize I read your posts because I really enjoy your overall energy and enthusiasm for life. Thanks for the great reading!
PS Thanks too for changing your font recently! It was hard to read there for a little while ;)
a long time ago (2008?) when you still called it Up in Alaska and followed you since. It must have been Fatty of Bike Snob that mentioned you.
great work!
I first started reading during your 2006 Susitna. I found it because I was reading on other blogs about someone named Jill who was racing this crazy race in Alaska. It would later inspire me to buy a Pugsley and race the Arrowhead 135...Minnnesota's version of the Susitna..
I found your blog during your Tour Divide race - I was following John Nobile's race and since you and he rode together for a while, I got interested in your progress as well, and continued on to read about all the the other crazy - surhuman? - things you have been doing. Some call that vicarious living...
I came upon your blog in 2009 after reading this post over at Fatty's blog:
Been a fan/reader since then.
Regarding your bike training/race running wish, there may be hope. This weekend I met a guy on a big organized tour who rides a bareback bike, as in it has no saddle (top tube actually runs from the headset to the rear axle directly to the chainstay). By standing all the time, he is able to get in "about 70%" of his training for marathons. Oh, and he claimed to ride ~9,000 miles a year on his bareback.
It's been years, not sure exactly but I believe Kent Peterson had linked to your blog so I took a look and just never looked away. My wife and I always talk about your adventures! Crazy fun and one of the cyclists that has inspired me to ride farther.
I first came across your blog when it was mentioned on the VeloNews website when you were training for your successful Iditabike. Was that 2008? I've really enjoyed the outdoor photography and the quest for new challenges and adventures. I can relate.
Hey Jill, I found your blog thru Fatty and I've been addicted ever since. I think it was about two years ago but I've gone back and read some of your old posts to catch up. Keep writing and I'll keep reading!!! Love every minute of it.
I have probably been reading up about your adventures for about 3 years now. If I recall correctly, I think I came upon it by searching something about biking in Alaska. Anyway, I have enjoyed the great photos and narrative. I'm 60 years old living my dreams through others sometimes.
I started reading your blog when you were in Homer and working in the cement box. I love reading about your journeys.
I've been following you blog for a few years after hearing you on NPR.
"hurty-foot recovery plan" I like that:) Avoid plantar fasciitis at all costs. Mine has nagged me off and on for years and was one of the reasons I took up cycling.
I plan to start running again next week. I used to run and coach distance and I really do miss it.
You inspired me to try winter riding on a Pugsley and I thank you very much for that. Now, you've inspired me to start up my running once again, but I'm not sure if I'll thank you yet;) We'll see how it turns out.
The new book sounds fantastic! I can hardly wait to read it.
Wow - I don't know how long I've been following your blog, but it was from Fatcyclist - Gosh, I don't even know how I found him. I remember reading of your Tour Divide - thinking I'd never be able to do that. I do ride, but only on my flat Arizona streets and canals - I really need to get out of town..
Discovered you via Fat Cyclist, maybe in 2008 or 2009? Not sure. Very excited about your new book!
Winter/Spring 2011 - via link from another blog. Love your writing!
I found you through Fat Cyclist about a year and a half ago I'd guess and now check in every day.
I went back and read most all of your old posts and ordered Ghost Trails right away. Stayed up all night reading the day I got it until there was no more. Thoroughly enjoyed it.
You are I are about the same age but our lives are drastically different. I have 2 small children and a 40 hour per week desk job, so my freedom to pursue all sorts of adventures is limited, but I live vicariously through yours and continue to plan for my own adventures when the time is right.
Can't wait for the new book!
I started reading, I think, in 2006. Hilljunkie told me about your site. Bought the first book and even vacationed once in Alaska, which was probably somewhat inspired by you. Thanks for writing.
I think it was 3 years ago when I came across your blog by a link from a link to a link...
It's been great fun reading ever since.!
I've been reading for over a year now. Now sure how I found your blog...somebody's twitter link? Random blog surfing? I always enjoy reading your adventures and seeing your pictures.
I've been reading for about two years. Used to live in Fairbanks (just one year) and was thinking about Alaska so I hit Google. As I bike, the combo on your blog was an instant hit.
Good luck with the book!
Holy crap! Mention "free" anything and the commenters come out of the wood work.
I came across your blog in January or February of 2007, unsure which, after a random search of cycling blogs. Your honest revelations of Susitna and compelling photos had me hooked immediately. Thank you for providing us with ample inspiration to chase down our adventures. Looking forward to reading the new book!
I am saying four or five years - my friend had a link to your blog - yet had never read your blog himself - I turned my wife Stephanie who works for Olympus onto your blog and the rest is history - you and Fatty are only blogs I read religiously - ride/run on
I found your blog because google reader suggested I might like it, and they were right! This was back when you were still in Alaska but about to move away. You write really well and make me want to go out and do something outside that might even scare me a bit. It makes sitting at my desk all day a little more bearable.
I stumbled across your blog through Fatty a couple of years ago and have remained a frequent visitor. It has been entertaining to read about the ups, downs, moves, transitions and the crashes. Thanks for sharing!
PS If I win, can you give away a Nook version as I currently live (and work) in China? :)
I'll exempt myself from the giveaway for obvious reasons, but I found your blog in the spring of 2007 as my family was planning a cruise to Alaska -- I was googling all things Alaska and you popped up. Since I was already a blog addict and your writing style was right up my alley (despite the fact that I haven't ridden a bike in years), I was immediately hooked. :)
I stumbled across it when you were living in Juneau and discovering snow biking I think - and I had moved to Canada, and was thinking that biking on snow didn't sound so crazy anymore.
Fatty mentioned you at some point guessing 2006 and I have read ever since. Have a great day.
Oh, and my photo on here is me in front of that waterfall near the Mendenhall Glacier..the cruise was amazing! We've even trod some of the same ground, because we took that tram up the mountain in Juneau and hiked up around that area.
Found your blog in 2008 when I was researching Pugsley's. After I found your blog I was almost convinced you were a friend of mine (Brit) who had a similar life story, but that you changed some personal details to remain anonymous.
Looking forward to the second book.
mikE
I started following your blog several years ago after completing a thru-hike on the Appalachian Trail. I found your blog thru the Fat Cyclist blog and I read your post every week. Congrats on your new book. Happy Trails,
Sue & Knucklehead
I started reading your blog maybe 2 years ago after a friend repeatedly shared some of your posts from her RSS feed. I spent many hot hours one summer reading your snowbiking archives. It was glorious! Thank you for sharing so much of your life with us.
Pretty sure I clicked on a link from Fat Cyclist 2-3 years ago. I've really enjoyed reading your blog. Keep up the good work!
I've been reading faithfully since 2007. I heard about you on NPR before your first Iditarod biking trip. I actually heard about Fat Cyclist through you! Read the Kindle edition of the book, but would love to pass on the paperback and see any photos!!
Hi Jill, I found your blog through Fat Cyclist. I love your stories and photos. I look forward to your posts!
Hey Jill - - I'm another reader who first stumbled upon your blog via the Fat Cyclist in 2009 and have been reading ever since. I think you are an incredibly inspiring athlete and I was planning on buying your book (so I don't need to win a copy, if you pull my name).
Not sure how long I've been following, a while now. I probably noticed your blog after we became friends on facebook. My husband and I have both been eager followers since!
I have been reading your blog for about 3 years or so. I first found out about it from the Fat Cyclist. I have found it very interesting how you have evolved as an athlete and as a person. Keep it up!
mtb w
I'm somewhat neurotic when it comes to blog reading, so the path here was long, tiresome, and blah blah blah. In early 2009 I insisted on reading Bike Snob NYC from beginning to end, and he (at some point) linked to Fat Cyclist. So then I read Fat Cyclist from beginning to end, and he linked to you. And then I read THIS from beginning to end (finally catching up at the end of the Great Divide) and have been here ever since.
Even though I'm a NYC bicycle-commuter, I can appreciate/dream about the great outdoors. Must be nice..
I discovered your blog through Kent Peterson, a local tour divide participant (single speed), excellent writer and bike enthusiast. I check both blogs daily and enjoy reading about your adventures. Keep up the good work and looking forward to reading your latest book.
I found your blog around 2006 when I was Googling "mountain biking in Juneau Alaska". I live here and had recently purchased a bike (the first since I was a kid) with the goal of getting healthier and losing some weight. Your writing and adventures in my own back yard inspired me to actual get on the bike and ride and to see my hometown of 30 years through someone much more adventuresomes eyes. Thanks for that. I still read the blog regularly and continue to ride at least a couple days a week.
Thanks for letting us live vicariously through your adventures AND inspiring me to get off my fat...couch and ride.
AKMando
First read your blog during a brief, boring stretch at a state office job. You were just getting ready to leave on your first Iditabike and someone in the Juneau Freewheelers mentioned your blog in a Yahoo Group message to the club. Been reading it off and on ever since. Random luck that I checked in today!
I first found your blog sometime around 2008, and have been hooked ever since. I found it through references on Fatty's blog.
I came to your blog from Fatty's blog when you were preparing to do your first Iditarod and have been following your adventures ever since. I am inspired by your spirit of adventure and am looking forward to reading your book.
I'm not sure how I ended up here (through Banff Trail Trash maybe?) but it was in early 2010 when you were still living and hiking in Juneau. I didn't get really hooked until you book popped up in my recommended reads on Amazon around Christmas - I read it, loved it, then proceeded to read through your *entire* blog over a couple of months. It helped me cope with some illness and depression.
As a link from Geoff's blog when he linked to you for Sustina report. 2007.
Simply in awe of your mastery of the written word, at how your words transport your readers along for every ride, jog, and slog up the coldest Alaskan peak and, more currently, every descent into the California canyons. Stumbled upon your blog, circa 2007, though a fellow Alaskan's blog, Ed P., whose blog was fantastic too- loved learning about the scientific explanations behind the Alaskan topography and the peculiarities of water, like formation of hoar frost!
Thanks for sharing your writing, which easily provided entertainment and vicarious living through my bedtime reading of your blogs! Best to you always!
I'm still here. Been here since '05. I don't remember how our blogs crossed paths. I'm always rootin' for you.
Hi Jill,
Found you through fatty about four years ago, and I check in almost daily. Love your adventures and your telling of them.
It's been about two years, found the blog after seeing it nominated for an award for photography.
Been following since 2008. Came across it from a link on Fatty's blog. Don't put me in the running for the book because I've already got it on my kindle. Love the blog. Have you thought about being a guest on bicycleradio.com? They do a podcast on Tuesday nights. I think listeners would be interested in your book. I'm enjoying your book by the way.
Linked in from Fatty's blog in 2009 (don't ask me how I got there, but it was around the same time). Love the contrast in style between the two (shh, I prefer yours).
Hi Jill,
I discovered you after reading a nice review of your Ghost Trails book on
Cheers,
Dave
I discovered your blog shortly after you moved to Montana. I enjoy reading your posts so much, especially since you've been into ultrarunning.
Tam
I came across your blog while hunting for touring bicycles. I have jealously followed your blog for the last year and read though the earlier post.
I started reading your blog sometime in 2007. I was looking for Alaskan blogs and bloggers. I am not a cyclist but find your blog really inspiring. It makes me want to challenge myself.
I've been reading since I found out I worked two cubicles away from a crazy winter biker who loved riding in the rain, snow, slain, hoar frost and whatever else Southeast Alaska had to throw at her. Even after her departure from sleepy Juneau, I check it weekly to make sure she's still doing all the crazy things I would expect. Keep it up Jill! (I'm sure you don't miss the perpetual soggy sneakers)
After spectating the Leadville 100 in 2005, I stumbled onto the Fat Cyclist. From his site I ventured over here. I'd have to say I've been reading on a regular basis since winter 05/06, but this is my first comment. As a part time adventurer, I enjoy reading about your exploits.
I've been following your blog since um, not sure really! it was still "Up in AK" back when I found it, and I was researching fatbikes (aren't pugs grand?)...loved the pics, attitude, and exploits and have been reading every since!
Well, Jill, I can’t quite remember when I came across this blog or how, but it was probably sometime around 2006. It was my first experience with blogging and prompted me to start my own in 2007. So thanks for the intro. I actually just ordered your second book (congrats, by the way) yesterday from Lulu and I have to thank you for introducing me to them too. I combined shipping with your book and my first – it’s my first copy – I’ve never even seen it! Just a bunch of years of poetry that I can’t hardly recommend but still will be nice to have it all bound up in book form on my shelf. So I guess you don’t have to enter me in the raffle, although it would be cool to get a signed copy. One of these days I’m still hoping to reach the 50K level though so maybe then I’ll find you at a race and you can sign my copies then. You’ve helped a lot of people along their paths. Thanks, really, a lot…
Psyched to read your new book, I'm sure it will be inspiring. So cool that you are self-publishing and helping other adventure writers do the same. I might be one in the near future!
I found your blog when you were just moving to Homer. i'm not sure how but most probably through Fat Cyclist. I have been reading every post for many years, it's my favorite blog. Very well written and the pictures are amazing.
El animal
I've been reading your blog since summer 2007. My boyfriend recommended it (I think he found it through fat cyclist).
Hi Jill,
I found your blog in September of 2007. I remember the date because I had just started a Master's degree program and instead of reading my homework, I spent my evenings reading the archive.
I found it on accident. I was looking for something else related to Alaska (can't remember what), came across your blog, read a few entries and moved on. But then discovered I couldn't get your writing out of my head so I bookmarked the site and have been checking it daily since.
Thanks for sharing your adventures!
I found the blog about 4 months ago when my mother (who also follows your blog) let me know about the Susitina 100 and that I had to read your blog entries on the race. I've been following since. I love to read cycling adventures.
Is that eastbound hwy 92, just past Skyline Blvd?
It's been a couple of years since I encountered your blog. I don't recall how I came across it, but the beautiful pictures, and adventure write-ups, kept me coming back.
Congrats on the book.
I can't wait to read the new book! I first started reading your blog a few months before you moved to Anchorage. It doesn't seem like it was that long ago but reading about your training and races has really motivated me and helped me challenge myself more with my own training. Thank you!
I love bikes and great story tellers. A friend of mine rode his bike from here (Durango, Co) to Costa Rica and he would post his blog everytime he was able to find an internet connection and I couldn't wait for each installment of the story. After his trip I googled for more bike stories and found your blog on, which I noticed has not been updated in a while. Keep pedaling.
Neil
Kent Peterson and Fatty pointed the way to your blog. I stayed for the writing and photography. I enjoy the diversion and confess to swearing now and then at your freedom to travel. I especially enjoyed the year it seemed like you were climbing a mountain every day in Juneau because I was on a similar streak and wondered how you any energy left to go to work.
First started to read the blog when you started the Tour Divide race. Can't remember who mentioned it, but obviously I became enthralled.
I heard about your blog from the blog of a cyclist/photographer in DC whom I met once when I lived there - totally don't remember his name now. I started reading right around the time of your first Iditarod, and I was completely drawn in not only by your account of that race but by all your training logs and pictures. I now live in Chicago and find your winter riding stories endlessly inspirational. I have a 19 mile r/t commute to work and I'm planning my first century ride for hopefully later this month. Anyway, I'm a big fan, and I'm excited your new book!
- Shana
I saw a link to your blog in a post on an Ohio mtb forum regarding building snow bikes, probably about 4 years ago. Thought it sounded interesting and have been reading ever since. Loved Ghost Trails; can't wait to read your latest!
I created my blog in June 2006 and your blog was one of Google's recommendations. I've been following along ever since.
I first found your blog a year and a half ago during my many forays into online bicycling adventure and dreaming of eventually making my own adventure in the real world. I was struck by your narratives and your photos, which have brought me back regularly since.
I was in Afghanistan in 06, missing the winter riding back home in Winnipeg. I googled winter and biking or something like that and there you were. Reading your blog helped pass the downtimes when I needed to escape reality. I did a cruise to Alaska with my wife a couple of years later and had an awesome day trailrunning around Juneau. Thanks! Keep writing!
Jill, I probably started following your blog in 2007-ish, or whenever it was you got Pugsley and were seriously training (Ididarod??)... I had found about about Surly Pugsleys from Icebike, then stumbled upon your blog, and have been quietly following ever since! - Rachel from Bend
It was probably about a year ago I found your blog..... I read every entry.... There wasn't much getting done at work that week....
Hi,
I think I found your blog while pregnant with my kiddo 3 y ago (he's 2.5) yearning for ak and long rambling adventures on foot... maybe linked through another blog from a runner girl (sealegs)... i can't quite remember... i just know it was about the same time i figured out the "favorites" button on the computer (i'm slow with tech stuff) cuz it's my first in line fav button. :) my "long rambling adventures" are shorter now tho i still find time for a 50k and shorter race here and there... but i look fwd to introducing the kiddo to the lifestyle more and more. thanks for writing. i'd love a copy of your book... especially because i love to hold a book in my hands, dog ear the pages, and see it on a shelf waiting to be perused again.... or starting up a conversation with someone who sees it sitting there, too. i lived in ak awhile back... and it continues to be a part of me tho I'm not living there now... and so do the people, the trails, the mtns, and the weather.
cheers and best wishes on your continued adventures--all aspects.
kristin z
oregon
About 10 months ago, from the Fat Cyclist blog (I was doing research for my highschool graduation project on endurance cycling). You ended up motivating me to complete my first century, and sign up for a cross-America ride (I leave next Thursday, eep).
Sorry if this seems like I'm sucking up to you for a free book; sure, I'd love to win it, but I doubt this comment would (or should) sway you much. But i've never really gotten up the courage to comment on your blog, so I figure this is as good a time as any.
Good luck with your hurty foot, I hope it heals up soon.
- Rebecca G, from NJ
I started reading this blog around the time of the Tour Divide. I have enjoyed reading the evolution of Jill over the past couple of years.
Jill: Discovered your blog via a link from hilljunkie in 2008...found your writing and imagery of Juneau immediately compelling. Really enjoyed Ghost Trails & am reading Be Brave along with the current Tour Divide...
I've enjoyed your writing and your pictures for a while. A fellow cyclist forwarded a link to me sometime back when you were living in Juneau way before you developed an interest in hiking the mountains surrounding you. I'm looking forward to your next book.
I've enjoyed following your blog for four or five years. I think you had some coverage on NPR around then.
Your posts are inspiring, entertaining and very well written. Keep it up.
I started bike commuting in Ottawa in 2006 and so started reading a bunch of bike blogs. I think I found yours in 2007, but I don't remember where I found the link. I've been a regular reader since then. I loved the new ebook. :)
I found your blog last July when I was laying in the hospital after a bike wreck. I think I found Fatty's first (probably b/c I spent a LOT of time playing on my iphone while watching TDF - what timing to end up stuck someplace with cable!). I checked out most of his blogroll and I stuck with yours.
According to your archives, I have been reading your blog since early 2007. I was living outside at the time, and looking for any little bit of 'Alaska porn' to sustain me until I could move north again. I stared reading for the pictures of Juneau (my favorite set being your mountain binge), and I will stay for the writing. I will continue to follow you no matter where you live.
Found through Fatty, I think - went back and read every post from the beginning, and have been a regular ever since. Much vicarious enjoyment and admiration!
Found through a friend who organized a century ride around Lake Tahoe in 2008. He posted his favorite bicycling blogs and I've stuck with it since then. Great blog!
You will have to thank Elden for having you as a guest talking about snow biking. Been reading ever since. Love your work. Count me in for a signed copy of the new book. Can't wait to read it after faithfully cheering for a blue dot on a computer screen for 24 days, you certainly didn't disappoint.
I am pretty sure that I found your blog from the Alaskaultrasport website, I think there was a link to "Jill's story" which pointed me to your blog.
I really like to read about other people's race experiences, it gives me a good taste of the fun that I quite enjoyed. I am currently on hiatus from racing while my children are young, but I am planning to do the Nome race in '17.
Doug
I found your blog after finding love cycling at the age of 47. You inspire me to keep on going, not to give up, even though I am such a newbie. I've always been fearful, but I am shedding that past. Thank you for showing me a new journey!
I found your blog back in 2007 when i was setting up a blogger blog for my international travels. Your blog was in the special section on the dashboard of blogger that profiles different blogs.
Now from all your inspiration and after 4 years of international travel, I am heading back to the US to travel on a bike and going to make it a lifestyle.
Thank you Jill!
I think I've been around since the beginning (I'd have guessed more than six years), before any of the big rides or big runs. It's been fascinating and inspiring to see how you've evolved in your riding, writing, photography and running. I don't know how many times I've found myself riding into a headwind and thinking, wonder what Jill's doing today? Thanks for keeping at it!
I've been following at least for a couple years? I found your blog after listening to an NPR interview about the iditarod trail.
I've only been reading your blog a few months. Because I'm a woman into the outside, I'm always looking for blogs by other women. I also live about 10 min. from you and was surprised to see my neighborhood in your pics before you changed your location from Montana. Thanks for all your inspiration.
I think I first came across your blog around 2008 following a series of links from other blogs starting with a cycling friend in New England. I love the pictures.
Jill, I've been reading your blog for several months, but darned if I can remember what led me to it. I'd love a copy of your new book to review for BellaOnline.
november 2009. can't for the life of me figure out how i came across it, maybe from another bicycling or running blog.
really enjoy reading your blog, keep up the excellent work!
I've been following your evolution for about 5 years, as a snow biker, tourist, ultra cyclist, and now endurance runner. I don't recall how I stumbled on your blog, but have really enjoyed it. The $64,000 question is, "What next?" I have enjoyed your trip every step of the way. Thanks for the window to your life.
Martyuma
I can't remember when or how I fisrt started reading your blog. Maybe around the time you wrote about the frostbite incident. Funny story though - I was telling my friend about you, "there is the blog I read..." and how I thought you were totally kick ass. Then the conversation evoloves from one endurance sport to the next, being running (my friend is an ultrarunner) and 20 minutes after I metion you, he mentions Geoff Roes. I was like wait - the girl I was just talking about is his ex!
Came across your blog maybe 2009 via FatCyclist....been a fan ever since. Thanks for writing!
I started reading your blog quite faithfully sometime in 2005. I moved to AK about the same time you did, I think...June 2005 for me...and ran a search on Alaskan Blogs because I wanted to learn more about blogging! Found yours first thing and got hooked then. Thanks for all the great reading; it remains the best blog I've read ever since then! I'm still up here, by the way. And I've seen you in the flesh at the start of the ITI! By the way, I think Mama Roes deserves a free book, somehow! Congratulations on your latest!
I can't remember how I came across your blog. I think it was in late 2007 or so. At the time that I started following, there weren't too many other followers, maybe 30 some. Its some strange addiction that I've remembered to check back almost everyday for 4 years. Thanks for keeping me entertained!
I had recently been following the Big Ring Circus back in 2005, a blog based in Tallahassee, Fl that you occasionally visit, and that Blogger (Juancho) turned his readers on to this crazy bike chic in AK. Been reading both of you ever since.
I've been reading your blog since 2009. I've enjoyed your photos and stories. I just took up running two years ago, so I'm enjoying your running tales. Keep up the good work!
I first heard you on your NPR commentaries. Caught my attention since I used to live in SE and now live in Fairbanks.
Tom M.
Fairbanks
I first heard about your blog from another adventure-oriented blog written by a woman. I don't recall which one, but you were in the blogroll. That was maybe two years ago? Maybe a bit less? Not sure, but I love reading what you write!
I have been reading for quite a while, 4 or 5 years I think. I got hooked after following a link from the Fat Cyclist. I hope you keep it up for a long time to come!
Found you via Dave Chenault who kept on referring to you on Twitter and his blog! Must have been about last year autumn that I subscribed, and have been a silent reader since.
Hi Jill, I've been following your blog for a couple of years now. A fellow cyclist and photography friend sent me your link when I started talking about making a trip to Alaska. I'll be happy to leave hotter then hell Florida for my first trip to Alaska on Friday. Yippee!I've downloaded "Be Brave" to my ipad and look forward to reading it on the plane.Love, love,love your post!
This is a fun one today...to sit and think back of when I first found you 'Up in Alaska.' I was in Atlanta, and was terribly, terribly homesick for Alaska. I was googling around in blogs for "Alaska" and yours came up first. I immediately connected to your style of writing, georgous Alaska pictures and your love of the outdoors. Funny, I know the exact day - 9.18.2007 - because I stole your old miles/temp format and started my own blog that day! You inspired me to get outside again and rediscover the outdoors (I didn't know I could love the outdoors outside of Alaska!), take pictures and write about it all. Thanks for being there all these years! ;-)
And... for the record I found Fatty through your blog! So Jill came first in my book!
Hello- found it in october 2009 while Tour Divide dreaming and got hooked. Love the fact there are other girls out there living it too :-)
Found your blog in 2007 searching for info on winter cycling. You inspired me to do some long distance cycling
Hi!
Love your blog...found it 3 years a go while researching Nunuvut and Alaska blogs and was living on a remote Scottish island at the time so had more time to read blogs....but I still follow your adventures with envy!
fiona
ps. I read Ghost Trails (delivered by post to the island of Iona on Scotland -- where the postman wouold bring the mail in the house and hand it to us while we were eating lunch!) After I read your book I sent it down to a friend in England.
I am eagerly awaiting your next book!!
I found your blog on June 16th, 2011, probably through Fatty's blog. Since then I have read Ghost Trails and I'm almost finished with the pdf version of be brave, be strong (so you can omit me from the giveaway). Both books have been so incredibly inspiring, and I've become obsessed with the idea of training for the Tour Divide. Your writing is just beautiful, and your attitude towards life is one that many people can aspire to! I'll be diving in the blog archives when I'm done with the books, for sure...
Take care of that foot. I've had PF for over 1.5 years and had to quit running and take up biking (maybe a blessing in disguise, but still, you don't want PF!!!)
I was mistaken! I apparently found your blog through Kent's bike blog on June 7th. Yeah, I'm not *that* fast a reader... Thanks, browser history.
I am a principal at a school for the deaf. I became interested in your blog over a year ago. Years ago, in 1991, I almost acccpted a job teaching at the Paul Banks school in Homer. I was telling my children about my almost move to Homer and was doing an online search about Homer. Somehow, the search lead to your blog. I am not a cyclist or runner, however your writing does provide a glimpse of a life vastly different from mine in a way that gives me a tiny glimpse of what my life could have been like to experience the beauty of Alaska. Students at my school are amazed at the dedication and endurance that comes from what you do.
KaAnn V.
I have been reading for several years now, and found you through Fatty, who I found through Skibikejunkie. I have loved reading ever since. I grew up south of Missoula, and have family there. It was fun to read about your adventures there.
probably 3 years ago while reading someone Else's Alaska blog who had you as a link...can't remember who though!...
Hi Jill, I am not sure how I found your blog (possibly from the Surly Blog?) but I do know it was Nov/Dec of 2008. It may have been a link to your new book that brought me to your blog then, but I do remember that I did order an autographed copy of your new book from you as soon as I found your blog. I am looking forward to ordering an autographed copy of your newest book when it is available from you! Thanks,
Ace
I started reading your blog after Leslie on her Banff Trail Trash Blog mentioned hosting you before you started the Divide Ride.
Hi, Jill! I found you on another blogger's blogroll several years ago. Don't remember which one though.
Hi Jill.. I believe I started reading in the middle of 2007. I honestly can't remember what led me to your blog. It was probably linked from another blog? Fat Cyclist maybe? I had only been cycling myself for just over a year and was inspired by your words and pictures. Plus, you showed a lot of confidence in the cold! I am a wimp even though I live in a cold northern Michigan. My extremities do not allow me to pursue all that I wish I could outdoors! brr! :) I took some time off from blog hopping about a year ago. Then, my parents visited Alaska last August.. they brought me back a necklace that was made locally in Homer. I thought of your blog & have been following your latest endeavors ever since. I might even start running again. eek.
I found your blog about the time you did the Iditarod the first time, and have been following you ever since. I don't even recall how it was I found you.
We actually live in Sandy, and I was surprised when I first learned you were from here originally.
I got here through Geoff's blog after his first win of the 50 mile race in Alaska. I got to his blog through an ADN article regarding his record-breaking effort. I've been hooked ever since.
Yo Jill...just back from the Alaska cruise vacation...(I took the tram up to Mt Roberts, but didn't have the time for the summit hike...sadly, it was a short day in-port).
I found your blog when Fatty first referenced you a few years back (you were still up in Juneau). You were still with Jeff, and I got a signed copy of Ghost Trails even! I will surely be ordering a copy of your new book (even if I WERE to win a copy, I'd still prob get a copy for my brother).
And speaking of Fatty, I know you have a ton on your plate, but he has just started a new mission with World Bicycle Relief (buys bikes for kids in remote places of the world where they need them). ANYBODY can join his team and all miles you run, jog, mt bike, rd bike and prety much ANY other exercise you can think of are accepted...and you get "Kudos" for uploading data (they accept Garmin, or you can manually enter your miles/time/etc). Then SRAM will donate .0015 cents per Kudo, buying the bikes. It's FREE for us...except for our time. You and Beat should join! (and tell your friends!) See Fatty's post from yesterday for the links and info.
Oh, and if somebody (or many somebodies) already mentioned the Fatty/WBR thing, I apologize)...my first day back from the Vac and I have a TON of stuff to do, and don't have time right now to read all the comments like I usually do)
Late to the comment party but don't care about the free book. Glad to pay. Found you when Kent Peterson posted about you on his blog, Kent's Bike Blog. Mostly fascinating reading including the moves and the running stuff.
Cheers, Gene in Tacoma
To clarify the note about Kent's Bike Blog, I'm referring to the FIRST time Kent posted about you (whenever that was).
Gene
I'm probably too late to win a book, but that's OK... I'll be buying one! But anyway...I started reading your blog during your Tour Divide ride, and I've been reading ever since. Keep it up, Jill!
I don't need a book because I've already gotten them :) but I've been reading your blog ever since Blogger made you a "Blogger of Note" or whatever it was called way back in, oh I don't know, maybe 2005? I happened to stumble upon their highlighted blogs one day and it was the day yours was up. I've been a faithful follower ever since!
Hi Jill, Yes, you still have followers from way back when. I stumbled across your blog a number of years ago. Your posts about your first Iditarod race drew me in. I went back to the beginning of your blogs then and read them through like a book. I sometimes fall behind when things get busy here, but always go back to where I left off and catch up. I really enjoy your posts and they motivate me to ride more. I enjoyed your first book and just ordered the second - can't wait to read it.
I first came across your blog when you were training for your successful Iditabike, 2008 maybe? Being an endurance racer and outdoors person myself I have really enjoyed following your adventures. |
.
On Jan. 8, the Combined Maritime Forces (CMF) in Bahrain created Combined Task Force 151, a multinational counterpiracy naval force of more than 20 nations. Previously, coalition efforts against piracy included ships and aircraft from CTF-150, which was established at the outset of Operation Enduring Freedom to conduct of Maritime Security Operations (MSO) in the Gulf of Aden, the Gulf of Oman, the Arabian Sea, Red Sea and the Indian Ocean.
“Some navies in [CTF-150] did not have the authority to conduct counter-piracy missions,” CMF commander Vice Adm. William Gortney said. “The establishment of CTF-151 will allow those nations to operate under the auspices of CTF-150, while allowing other nations to join CTF-151 to support our goal of deterring, disrupting and eventually bringing to justice the maritime criminals involved in piracy events.”
These patrols have had some success. During the fall of 2008 the U.S., Russia, Britain and India separately thwarted multiple piracy attacks. On Christmas day, the German frigate FDS Karlsruhe, one of the four vessels patrolling with the EU, assisted a 65,000-ton Egyptian bulk carrier in fighting off a pirate attack. In January, EU naval forces intercepted an attempted pirate attack against the Greek-flagged crude oil tanker Kriti as it was sailing in the Gulf of Aden, and on Jan. 13, a helicopter from a Russian frigate disrupted an attempted piracy hijacking of the container ship Nedlloyd Barentsz. The Russian helicopter opened fire on the pirates as the container ship fled. The pace of piracy attacks slowed in January, but that may be due more to the onset of the monsoon season that restricts pirates to the shores than the increasing naval presence.
Merchant shipping firms are taking additional steps to protect vessels and crews. Many slower vessels with lower freeboard, such as heavily laden tankers, are avoiding the area altogether, choosing instead to make the longer trip around the Cape of Good Hope. After the supertanker Sirius Star was seized in November, Denmark’s A.P. Moller-Maersk decided to divert some of its 50 oil tankers around the cape instead of using the more convenient route through the Suez Canal in order to steer clear of the Gulf of Aden. Norway’s Frontline, which carries much of the oil from the Middle East to world markets, is considering doing the same, and the additional cost amounts to $1 million per transit. Diverting vessels around South Africa may not make them safer, and the trip increases both the cost of shipping and the time of transit, driving up the price of manufactured goods and commodities. The global shipping industry is especially vulnerable now, dealing with the attacks at the same time that it faces volatile fuel costs, plummeting freight rates, containership surpluses and increased insurance premiums for transits through the pirate-infested western Indian Ocean.
Some vessels, such as retail banks, are increasing passive and nonlethal security measures to foil armed robberies. Instead of using dye packs and silent alarms, ships are ringing lifelines with concertina wire, employing fire hoses to repel boarders, running underway with bright lights to increase visibility and spot trouble earlier, and they are entering convoy protection, when it is available. One nonlethal system, the Long-Range Acoustic Device (LRAD), already is on board some commercial vessels. The system can clearly broadcast at uncomfortably high levels of volume prerecorded warnings in Somali or Arabic, and a new model of LRAD contains laser dazzlers to temporarily confuse attackers. Another system, known as the Active Denial System (ADS) or “pain ray,” emits a directional high-powered, 6-foot wide millimeter-wave beam of energy that creates an unbearable sensation of burning on the skin. Vessels are employing navigational tactics as well, including, for higher-speed vessels, evasive rudder steering to throw up a larger wake in the path of inbound piracy speedboats. Mariners and some naval officials express some concern that a more robust defense or greater resistance on the part of merchant ships might lead to more aggressive tactics by pirates. Private defense contractor Blackwater has deployed a security escort ship that includes a helicopter to the Gulf of Aden. The primary benefit of such an asset, however, is using the helicopter for over-the-horizon scouting to avoid trouble, not to pick a firefight.
But more than one-third of attempted ship hijackings in the Gulf of Aden are successful, illustrating that passive defense and patrols by naval forces have been unable to deter or disrupt many attacks. Moreover, once pirates successfully board and hijack a ship, they take the crew hostage and threaten to sink the vessel, limiting options by on-scene warship commanders to rescue the crew and free the ship. Incredibly, 300 seafarers and dozens of ships still are being held for ransom by pirates in the area of Harardhere, Somalia, a situation reminiscent of an earlier era. Confronting criminal acts at sea in an area that stretches 2,000 miles, however, poses significant logistical, operational and political challenges that require us to work smarter, not harder. This means that although there have been calls for expanded naval patrols in the western Indian Ocean, these efforts only will be effective if we change the way we address the problem.
Partnership and action
The key to solving contemporary Somali piracy builds on the efforts of the U.S., partner nations and international institutions to make the seas safer. In January 2006, the destroyer USS Winston S. Churchill thwarted an attack against the bulk carrier M/V Delta Ranger, which was fired on off the coast of Somalia by pirates wielding AK47s and rocket-propelled grenade launchers. Disrupting the attack, the warship took 10 pirates and freed 16 Indian captives. Eventually, the pirates were transferred to Mombasa, Kenya, and later convicted in court and sentenced to seven years’ confinement. This was a noteworthy example of effective maritime constabulary action, and it was the first major anti-piracy operation by the U.S. Navy in 150 years. After the Churchill interdiction, Navy lawyers in the Pentagon conducted a review of maritime and international law and policy, and proposed drafting a new national policy to articulate U.S. interests in combating maritime piracy. The result was a comprehensive policy governing diplomatic and legal action to fight piracy that was signed by the president in summer 2007. The top national goals in the policy include deterrence of piracy through maritime force presence, merchant ship vulnerability assessments, holding pirates accountable through criminal prosecution, preservation of freedom of the seas and a renewed commitment to work with other nations. Perhaps most importantly, the policy emphasized collaborative strategies by maritime and regional states, working in conjunction with the civil maritime sector, to prevent piracy attacks. Annexed to the National Strategy for Maritime Security (NSMS), the policy was used as a basis for the December 2008 National Security Council (NSC) strategy on combating piracy off the Horn of Africa, which sets forth three goals. First, the U.S. seeks to prevent pirate attacks by encouraging merchant ships to update their ship security plans and use the established Maritime Security Patrol Area (MPSA) set up by CMF. Second, the U.S. supports creation of a regional counterpiracy coordination center, an objective that is near fruition. Finally, the U.S. seeks to ensure those who commit acts of piracy are held accountable through negotiation of agreements to formalize custody, extradition and prosecution.
In addition to testing the nation’s resolve in dealing with transnational maritime criminal organizations, the U.S. effort against piracy is the first real test of the Cooperative Strategy for 21st Century Seapower, released by the sea services more than one year ago. The strategy emphasizes that no single country can secure the maritime domain, and it places a premium on multilateral action. The goal of the new maritime strategy is to leverage the benefits of working together and capitalize on international law and institutions to facilitate closer collaboration among states. The Global Maritime Partnership, or figurative “1,000-ship navy,” embodies these principles in an interagency application, bringing the Coast Guard and the Department of State into the effort. Admirals from Ghana, India, Indonesia, Japan, the Netherlands and Norway, among others, have recognized the potential value of the concept for increasing effective international cooperation. Recently, U.S. Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Gary Roughead re-emphasized the importance of international collaboration in his 2009 guidance, and piracy repression is a fertile area for increased collaboration. So far, however, international cooperation for counterpiracy has unfolded in an ad hoc fashion. New bilateral and regional treaties and a global mandate from the U.N. Security Council are untangling the diplomatic and logistical knots. The essential element for multilateral cooperation is ensuring all the players agree upon a common rule set, which is why international law and law of the sea have become the principal force multipliers in the new fight against piracy.
The problem of PUCs
The main problem maritime powers now face with piracy is not a lack of operational resources to counter the threat, but what to do with the perpetrators when they are caught. Once pirates are detained and become so-called “persons under control” (PUCs), there are few good options. Additionally, what should be done with victims and witnesses, some of whom may be injured? Determining which state should prosecute pirates detained at sea is particularly vexing. It is typical of the vessels attacked by Somali pirates that the ship is registered in one state, such as Malta, owned by a corporation located in another state, such as the United Arab Emirates, and operated by a crew composed of nationals of several additional states, such as the Philippines and Pakistan. Furthermore, the vessel is likely to be transporting either containerized cargo or bulk commodities owned by companies in yet another country, such as the Sirius Star, which was registered in Liberia but owned by Aramco, a Saudi corporation. Moreover, a piracy attack may have been interrupted by a warship from yet another state, all of which have different tactics and distinct rules of engagement., and international agreements can standardize and speed up the process.
Depending on the circumstances, there are a variety of legal rationales that could support a compliant or noncompliant boarding of a hijacked vessel or pirate ship. During armed conflict, merchant vessels may be boarded under the belligerent right of visit and search to determine the neutral character of the goods on board, but that rule of naval warfare does not apply to maritime piracy. In peacetime, boarding a vessel by the naval forces of a state other than the state of registry may be conducted with the consent of the flag state under articles 92 and 94 of the Law of the Sea Convention. The U.S. recognizes that the master of the vessel also may provide consent to a boarding of his vessel. Under article 51 of the U.N. charter and customary international law, all nations may exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defense against a vessel committing a hostile act or demonstrating hostile intent. Naval forces also may board merchant vessels under the right of approach and visit pursuant to article 110 of the Law of the Sea if there are reasonable grounds to suspect the vessel is engaged in piracy. In some cases, the extension of port state control measures may be used by the port state authorities to board a vessel that has declared a nearby port. The Security Council may authorize all states to take action against piracy under chapter VII of the U.N. charter, providing yet another potential authority for boarding pirate vessels.
Collaboration, not kinetics
Collaboration and regional partnering, not armed force, is the long-term solution to piracy. Maritime piracy is a violation of international law and a universal crime that imposes a duty on all states to take action. The Law of the Sea Convention, the constitution for the world’s oceans, is the essential framework for peacetime maritime security cooperation, and it defines piracy as an illegal act of violence or detention committed for private ends. Maritime piracy is distinguished from maritime terrorism, which is committed for political ends, and efforts to combine the two are not productive. Developing the international law and domestic legal capacities necessary to defeat piracy begins at the International Maritime Organization (IMO) in London. Situated on the Thames, the IMO is the specialized U.N. agency for maritime matters and has 167 member states. Because the organization is a technical rather than a political body, and since it operates under consensus decision-making rules, the IMO has served as an effective, no-nonsense venue for making shipping safer and more secure.
Addressing the problem of piracy off the coast of Somalia in November 2007, the IMO adopted Resolution A.1002(25), which called on regional states in east Africa to conclude a treaty to prevent, deter and suppress piracy. Also at the prompting of the secretary-general of the IMO, in 2008 the Security Council turned its attention toward combating piracy and adopted four key resolutions under chapter VII of the U.N. charter, authorizing “all necessary measures.” The Security Council resolutions promote enhanced counterpiracy collaboration among nations, strengthening operational capabilities, removal of piracy sanctuaries in Somalia and support for increased criminal prosecution. Beginning with Resolution 1816 on June 2, the Security Council faced the issue of defeating piracy emanating from a fragile or failed state. For years, pirates in the Horn of Africa eluded capture at sea by fleeing into the jurisdictional protection of Somalia’s 12-nautical mile territorial sea. Resolution 1816 authorized naval forces entry into Somali’s territorial waters to pursue pirates. Since its adoption, the resolution has been extended to permit operations on the land territory of Somalia. The resolution also emphasized cooperation for logistics and prosecution by calling on states to collectively determine jurisdiction in the investigation and prosecution of persons committing acts of piracy off the coast of Somalia. Finally, the resolution also encouraged states to increase and coordinate their efforts to deter acts of piracy in conjunction with the Transitional Federal Government of Somalia, a ruling authority inside the fractured state. Since Somalia has no maritime law enforcement capability, the resolution also called on states, the IMO and other international organizations to build a partnership to develop coastal security forces.
Next, the Security Council adopted Resolution 1838, expressing its grave concern over the proliferation of acts of piracy and armed robbery at sea against vessels off the coast of Somalia, and the threat it poses to the delivery of World Food Program shipments to Somalia. The resolution called upon states to take part in actively fighting piracy by deploying naval vessels and aircraft to the Gulf of Aden and surrounding water. The Security Council also reaffirmed that the Law of the Sea Convention embodies the rules applicable to countering piracy and armed robbery at sea. Security Council Resolution 1846 of Dec. 2 broadened the international political support and legal capabilities to combat piracy off the Somali coast. The resolution suggests states consider application of the 1988 Convention on the Suppression of Unlawful Acts against the Safety of Maritime Navigation (SUA) to facilitate the extradition and prosecution of pirates. The SUA Convention arose from the 1985 hijacking of the Achille Lauro cruise ship by four heavily armed terrorists from the Palestinian Liberation Organization. After seizing control of the Italian-flagged vessel, the terrorists murdered a disabled American passenger, pushing his wheelchair into the sea. At the time, most states lacked adequate criminal statutes to prosecute vessel hijacking. To fill this void, the IMO brought together member states to develop a maritime criminal law treaty, and SUA emerged from the process. The treaty entered into force in 1992 and has 149 state parties. States that seek to prosecute maritime piracy but do not have current national laws proscribing the crime, such as Japan and Spain, still might be able to prosecute some crimes such as ship hijacking, under legislation implementing SUA. Denmark, Oman and other states have suggested that developing standard rules for arrest, detention and criminal prosecution of pirates is the most pressing issue for suppressing piracy. In most cases, Resolution 1846 and SUA provide a firm legal basis for doing so, and states should ensure their domestic authorities are consistent with the resolution and treaty.
Two weeks later, the Security Council adopted Resolution 1851, authorizing states to take action against piracy safe havens on the shore in Somalia. The authority is likely to be cautiously implemented, however, since major land operations in the country could be perilous. The resolution also invited the states with maritime forces in the area and the regional states to conclude “shiprider” agreements or arrangements so that local law enforcement officials could embark on board foreign warships patrolling the area. The regional countries are particularly important in this regard because they are ideally situated to conclude the endgame — conducting a criminal investigations and criminal trials.
In addition to the four Security Council resolutions, there are three additional breakthroughs in maritime diplomacy that have set the stage for more effectively addressing the threat of Somali piracy. First, the U.K. signed a counterpiracy cooperation agreement with Kenya in December, agreeing to transfer captured pirates to Mombasa for prosecution. The U.S. and Kenya concluded a similar arrangement on Jan. 29. These agreements will facilitate the handling of PUCs and will benefit the naval forces patrolling the area by ensuring that pirates obtained during counterpiracy operations are quickly removed from warships, freeing the vessel for follow-on tasking. Second, Resolution 1851 encouraged establishment of a multinational Contact Group on Somali Piracy (CGSP), and the inaugural meeting for the group was held at the U.N. on Jan.14. More than 20 countries, as well as observers from the EU, NATO and the African Union, participated in the discussions. The CGSP formed several working groups to develop collective action against different aspects of the effort against Somali piracy. These groups divided functional lines, with the U.K. leading a group focused on naval operations and information-sharing; another group led by Denmark reviewed the judicial framework and issues associated with PUCs; the U.S. led discussion on strengthening industry awareness and capabilities; and a final group led by Egypt focused on strategic communications and public information. Most importantly, many representatives at the CGSP acknowledged the need for an east African counterpiracy coordination center (CPCC), and Yemen, Djibouti and Kenya each offered to host the center. Third, at an IMO-sponsored meeting in Djibouti on Jan. 29, agreement was reached on a regional arrangement to fight piracy. Based on text that was developed at a previous IMO meeting in Dar Es Salaam, Tanzania, eight coastal states situated on the Gulf of Aden, the Red Sea and the western Indian Ocean, plus Ethiopia, concluded the Djibouti code of conduct to combat acts of piracy against ships, fulfilling the request made by the IMO assembly in 1002(25). The agreement is based on the 16-nation counterpiracy treaty, Regional Cooperation Agreement on Combating Piracy and Armed Robbery against Ships in Asia (ReCAAP), which has been remarkably successful in reducing the number of piracy attacks in East Asia. Just as ReCAAP was the first Asian agreement dedicated to counterpiracy, the Djibouti code of conduct is the first regional agreement between Arab and African countries to address maritime piracy.
The momentum from these global, regional and bilateral diplomatic successes should be maintained. Each development is complementary and promising, but more can be done. Now that there is agreement to share actionable information, cooperate to dismantle maritime criminal gangs and bring their members to criminal trial, the maritime and regional states and largest shipping nations such as Panama and Liberia should ratify the agreements and take the next steps to implement them.
First, the CPCC should be designed to serve as a fusion point for real-time coordination for dealing with PUCs. In the U.S., the interagency community resolves difficult national-level maritime issues pursuant to a maritime operational threat response (MOTR) plan that facilitates rapid and real-time communication among the State and Defense departments and the Coast Guard. Each agency is required to operate continuously a tactical watch center that can make agency decisions arising from time-sensitive maritime diplomatic issues. The MOTR process is used to quickly form administration positions and courses of action on the full range of maritime exigencies, including interdiction of foreign drug trafficking fast boats and interception of migrants at sea. We need an international MOTR that maintains 24-hour communications among the maritime states patrolling offshore, the major flag states and the regional states so that partner nations may quickly coordinate issues regarding on-scene interdiction of vessels hijacked by pirates and pirate “mother ships,” and resolve more deliberative questions regarding PUC disposition and logistics.
Second, the maritime states should increase efforts for maritime security capacity-building in the states of the Horn of Africa in order to forge tighter maritime security partnerships with strong regional partners. The states of east Africa are in desperate need of capacity-building assistance to actually implement the Security Council resolutions and new treaties. For example, Kenya has stepped out on many occasions to prosecute PUCs, but it requires greater support. The recently concluded counterpiracy arrangements with the U.K. and U.S. can serve as models for similar bilateral agreements with other maritime states patrolling the area. But the states in the Horn of Africa require development assistance to be able to more effectively implement their new commitments. Not only do the states in the region lack resources for building naval and coast guard force structure and training maritime law enforcement officers, but they also are in need of greater assistance for developing a mature judicial criminal justice system. The states have insufficient numbers of lawyers and judges, and they sometimes lack essential equipment such as computers and printers.
The Global Train and Equip program under section 1206 of the U.S. National Defense Authorization Act of 2006 is used by the State and Defense departments to methodically assess how to increase the capability of partner nations to solve local problems before they require outside intervention. The program leverages Defense Department funds to train and equip regional forces, mitigating the risk that small problems such as piracy will grow into larger security issues.
One way for the U.S. to develop greater maritime security capacity throughout the Horn of Africa would be to broaden and fully fund Global Train and Equip. About one-third of the program focuses on strengthening maritime security support to regional countries and includes development of coastal surveillance infrastructure, patrol boats and maritime interdiction capabilities. In 2007, for example, Djibouti was awarded $8 million for such purposes. Last year, there were $800 million in requirements, but only $300 million of these were funded. Much like the G-8 has pooled resources to fund Cooperative Threat Reduction for nonproliferation, the major maritime powers should develop and fund a shared and coherent program of maritime security capacity building based upon the Global Train and Equip model. Contributions toward this endeavor can pay off for everyone. In Asia, for example, ReCAAP operates a technologically advanced Information Sharing Center (ISC) in Singapore that serves as secure communications center to coordinate effective multinational operational responses to maritime piracy among member states. But the ISC would not have been possible without generous sponsorship support provided by Japan, and a CPCC for east Africa will not be possible without support from outside the region.
Third, following Kenya’s example, regional states should make a greater commitment to accepting PUCs, either temporarily or permanently, and to prosecuting pirates in criminal court. In the past, some pirates were captured, only to be released for lack of a regional country willing to prosecute them. Such action undermines the credibility of the international community and encourages more piracy. For example, the Danish warship on patrol has successfully disrupted numerous piracy attacks, but the media has tended to focus on the one instance they had to release 10 captured suspects because of an inability to prosecute. Toward this end, regional states should conduct a national review of their counterpiracy laws and policies to ensure they can serve a constructive role in the region. Furthermore, the states of east Africa have an opportunity to capitalize on the establishment of a CPCC to broadly develop a more effective maritime security cooperation network in the region. Regional states will be more willing and capable of enforcing the maritime rule of law in their neighborhood if they develop the legal architecture and operational capabilities to deal with piracy — patrol craft and communications systems are needed, as are more lawyers, courtrooms and confinement facilities.
International law has become the most effective force multiplier for developing maritime security, and nowhere is this more evident than in the waters off the Horn of Africa. Naval air and sea operational missions conducted by the world’s most capable maritime powers have been unable to arrest Somali piracy because they cannot prosecute the endgame. Piracy flourishes at the seams of globalization because legal jurisdiction is unclear, the costs and time for states to conduct diplomatic transactions are too great, and pirates are able to exploit the inherent isolation of individual vessels and nations. Somalia is a failed state, and the pirates are more powerful than the ruling government. Regional governments have underdeveloped maritime security forces and judicial systems, and suffer from a severe lack of operational, logistical and administrative resources. We need to better connect the capabilities and sea power of the maritime states with the regional expertise, local networks and self-interest of the east African states. In this setting, international law is more important than adding another warship to the equation. In order to “operationalize” the U.N. mandates and international agreements, the CGSP should agree to establish a CPCC at their next meeting in March. The CPCC can serve as the hub for a comprehensive network of states that includes an international MOTR process; command, control and communications for linking major maritime powers, flag states and regional partners; and to coordinate requirements for assistance from outside the region. An international MOTR process would create a network of interested states that could begin to coordinate in real time, working effectively across legal and jurisdictional lines of demarcation to bring collective action against this threat. These initiatives will enhance the capabilities of the states in east Africa to exercise maritime constabulary authority in their own neighborhood, and with that, we will all be better off. |
Printed from:
"Even though, it apeases the Sharonists in the White House, but the ripple effect of make-belief-terrorism involving the phrase: "converted to Islam", cannot fail to sound repetitious. It must be reminding the listeners of Aesop's Fables and the lesson: "Don't cry 'wolf' when there is no wolf!."
Unlike Christianity, conversion to Islam does neither need a priest with imperial vestments nor the use of incense, holy water, burning of candles, light before the altars and a holy mass in a Church, with hundreds of witnesses. All it needs is an oath to believe in one God without any partner added with Him. Because of this conversion simplicity in Islam, any mercenary in terrorism, can conveniently declare himself as a convert to Islam. No wonder why names as Vinay Kohly, Suresh Kumar, Vikash Chand, Sarjiyo, Samudra, Richard Reid, Jack Roche, Germaine Lindsay, Brandon Mayfield and many others were branded as Islamic converts, caught in the act of terrorism. No forensic minds can ignore the real pressure behind this phenomenon in recent times. Consequently, the forensic minds must be asking themselves: "is it merely a coincidence of repeated occurrence, or a planned agenda dedicated to demonizing Islam?"
Many years ago, I happened to see a book of cartoons, entitled: LBJ Lampooned. There in the book, was a cartoon of Lyndon Baines Johnson, the successor to the US Presidency, after the assassination of JFK. The book was solely dedicated to depicting LBJ's pretext for dragging the US to the Vietnam War. A cartoon on the cover-page, showed LBJ with a Baseball-bat in his hand, aimed over the head of a skinny Vietnamese. The Vietnamese, kneeled before LBJ, had a swelled-up skull as if a base-ball and the caption read: "That was for nothing - now do something."
In fact, this US-hallmark remained unchanged since the Korean war to today's "war on terror" as George Bush loves to call it. With its money and muscle, the US must have sensed it to be shameful on its own brand of democracy to attack anyone without any reason. The attacked nation or its religion has to "do something." that the US could use as a pretext to exerting its muscle. And when the awaited "do something" doesn't appear on its own, there are several built-in mechanisms to make it look like an event that really happened.
The wars in Korea, Vietnam, bombing Beirut and Libya, deploying troops to Somalia, fighting Iraq-Kuwait War, and the recent quagmire in the protracted war in Afghan and Iraq, are just a few to mention here that linked these countries for "do something" programme of the US. These track-records of the US, exemplify the blatant war-crimes committed behind a hidden agenda. With its lame excuse for protecting its citizens, who live thousands of mile away from the war zones, the US war-machines never stopped. After the World War II, the US make-belief theatrics, dedicated to generating war-euphoria for its legislators, caused such immeasurable atrocities and killing of helpless people all over the world, that make the "holocaust" look like a pussycat.
Lyndon LaRouche of New Hampshire, a Democrat and former contender of the US Presidency, foresaw the aims of the key-players of the Bush administration. He branded them as the "Sharonists in the White House". He didn't have a choice other than to use the term "Sharonists." After all, the "freedom of speech" that was once the epitome of democracy, now gets stifled in the US court when the term Zionist is used by anyone. Lyndon LaRouche has accused the Sharonists of using the US for an Israeli scheme, engineered for a permanent annexation of the entire West Bank and Gaza Strip. He, about four years ago, predicted the objectives of the Sharonists and emphatically identified Israeli connivance towards eliminating the Saddam Hussein regime in Baghdad for the sole purpose of destabilizing the governments of Syria, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Iran and beyond.
During the peak of George Bush's euphoria for attacking Iraq, The Executive Intelligence Reviews had an article by Edward Spannaus, entitled: "Scare Tactics: Ashcroft's Phoney War on Terrorism". There, the author had drawn a parable that labelled the US Attorney General, John Ashcroft as "America's "de facto Minister of Fear."
Edward Spannaus then wrote: "The blunderbuss tools given by Congress to the Justice Department have enabled Ashcroft and Co. to use the threat of draconian prison sentences to force defendants to plead guilty to offenses that they may or may have not committed. As a result, the Justice Department can point to hundreds of convictions in "terrorism" cases—almost none of which have anything to do with protecting the United States from real terrorism. ...... it's clear why Ashcroft and the Justice Department will go to extraordinary lengths to avoid public trials, which further expose the shallowness and fraud of their phony war on terrorism."
The phrase "shallowness and fraud of their phoney war on terrorism" cannot fail to arouse "shock and awe" to all level-headed citizens of America unless they happened to be those identified by Lyndon LaRouche as the "Sharonists." The names, though include many, are underscored for Richard Perle, then the Chairman of the Defense Policy Board, Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, Douglas Feith, the Assistant Secretary of Defense for Policy; David Wurmser, John Bolton and a host of others.
The incidents of Iraq these days, that involve constant bomb blast on the Iraqis from unknown sources, including rocket-attack from unidentified aircraft make one wonder about the prophet-like vision of Lyndon LaRouche. No doubt, that's why Lyndon LaRouche is not favoured by the US media.
Strangely enough, after staging the 9/11 carnage in 2001, the "Israeli mole" in the White House could not believe that their manifesto, written over a year ago by Paul Wolfowitz, would really be happening before their eyes. A paramount event of this manifesto, now incorporated in the Bush administration's foreign policy, called for the need of a "catastrophic and catalyzing event like a new Pearl Harbor" on the US main land, that would, with its chain-reaction, help implement the "new world order." In reality, this objective was totally achieved by the planned demolition of the World Trade Center.
The Televised inferno of the Twin Tower, crumbling before the viewers' eyes, soaked the ground soft enough with tears. As a result, Islam vilification became rampant and reached its highest peak. Even a bearded Sikh was thought to be a Muslim and was shot to death. Naturally, vengeance was boiling in the bloods of the sympathisers and world opinion heavily tilted towards the US to attack Afghanistan for the elimination of its government, harbouring Osama, the onetime buddy of the Bush dynasty.
About six months before the unprecedented success in implementing the "catastrophic and catalyzing event", the role of Mossad had to get deeply active in the fulfilment of its ultimate goal. The key to their success then was pivoted on a world-wide vilification and denunciation of Islam. The prelude to such a vilification had to be pre-planned. The destruction of Buddha's statue in Afghanistan helped the goal accomplished.
Afghanistan was ruled by the Muslims since the eighth century. Millions of Islamic people there, under hundreds of rulers, had no problem or dissension to the statue of Buddha, in their heart, before March 2001. Even Sultan Mahmood Ghaznawi, who was known to have destroyed some Indian temples, didn't even touch the statue of Buddha in Afghanistan. Assuredly, the demolition of the statue of Buddha became an agenda for the Mosad-crews for generating the "catalyzing" effect towards maximizing the hatred for Islam all over the world. Even the Buddhists, who never had any problem with the Muslims, were quick to jump on the bandwagon of George Bush.
Perhaps, the normal question is how the Sharonists did it - wasn't it Mullah Omar? Surely the Sharonists didn't have to do it themselves - but they had it done - money, women, brainwashing, safe heaven in the US or even assassination threat would work like miracle. This is not the first time such an incident happened. For instance, since seventh century, the Christian and Jewish population of Jerusalem enjoyed mutual respect and tolerance under the Muslims, and thrieved there. This harmony continued for centuries. Then there came the infamous Al-Hakim, the sixth Egyptian Caliph from Fatemide dynasty.
Al-Hakim had mentally drained and unstable personality, coupled with hallucinating beliefs in rituals. Gradually, he became too close to a Muslim convert from a band of zealots, that lived in the Christendom, came to Al-Azhar for learning. Al-Hakim kept on taking his advice on many affairs that eventually culminated in sacking the pilgrimage hospice in Jerusalem and destroying the Church of the Holy Sepulchre. In 1063, Pope Alexander II had given papal blessing to Iberian Christians in their wars against the Muslims. This, in fact, started the seed of distrust and revenge between these two cousins of the Abrahamic religion and continues even today. Here too, a convert to Islam worked like a miracle in paving the way to war between these two religions - Christianity and Islam.
Coming back to the US scenario, the whole world feels today that George Bush, being a puppet in the hands of his Israeli approved entourage, is practically powerless to say "no". That's why George Bush couldn't defy the pressure of the Sharonist gang in the White House, to divert the war efforts from Afghanistan to Iraq. Evidently, He must have succumbed to the threat that came from the "war party" within his administration, controlled by Israel. After all, George Bush knew it well that if he didn't comply with the wishes of Israel, his days in the White House would be numbered. And for sure, a phoney Islamic-Oswold is sure to be dragged out - and this time, it wouldn't be from a movie theatre, as happened in Kennedy's case. While linking Oswald to communism was the limelight then, now it is Islam - not for communism but for terrorism.
As soon as George Bush diverted his hunt for al-Qaeda, from Afghanistan to Iraq, it became clear to the whole world, that 9/11 was just a smoke-screen towards paving the way to attacking Iraq. The passion, however, wasn't for the US, but instead it was for Israel to have a perpetual safe-heaven in the Middle-East, coupled with the oil-interest of Dick Cheney, the US president in disguise.
With the repeated failure of the Bush administration to prove the existence of WMD in Iraq, oppositions and protest erupted all over the world. Although Spain's prime minister José María Aznar accepted an invitation to enjoy good-time with George Bush in Crawford, Texas on February 22-23, 2003, Spain had about 90% of its population opposing the war.
George Bush also counted on Prime Minister John Howard of Australia. John Howard, on the other hand, was counting heavily on the UN resolution, conducive to attacking Iraq. But to the great dismay of the US led coalition, the UN was split over the issue that called for the use of the previous resolution against Iraq, expired with the Kuwait-Iraq war. The opposition Labour Party leader of Australia, Simon Crean warned that committing Australian troops would increase the risk of terror attacks. He, vehemently, opposed his Prime Minister, John Howard. As the uncertainty continued in the UN, the Israeli interest in eliminating Iraq was quite uncertain and the "Zionist mole" in the White House must have got nervous.
Undoubtedly, Mossad didn't spare any time to remind the other members of the US coalition about al-Qaeda's terrorism. The two bombs, which ripped through a busy night-club area in Bali, killed mostly foreign tourists. Australians lost 88 lives, the greatest number of casualties.
As a consequence, Australian Prime Minister John Howard, propelled by the induced wrath generated by the Bali-bomb, quickly committed his countriy's troops to the American-led war against Iraq, on Tuesday, 18 March 2003. He just abandoned his earlier commitment on a debate in the Australian parliament.
The Indonesian police presented evidence against the alleged mastermind behind the Bali-bomb carnage and identified him as an Imam of a mosque named Samudra. Interestingly, Samudra is a Sanskrit term for "ocean". The term occurs 133 times in the Rigveda - the Hindu equivalency of the Torah. In fact, almost all converts to Islam, identify themselves with a traditional Muslim name. Even Cat Steven, the famous singer of the 70's, named himself as Yusuf Islam after his conversion. Obviously, the name, Samudra - with a divine link to Hindu origin, makes many thinkers wonder why the name Samudra remained unchanged even when he assumed the spiritual duties of an Imam, equivalent to a priest of a church.
The story doesn't end here. Sarjiyo, a 32-year-old Christian convert to Islam, was the third man to be jailed for life over the attacks and was linked to al-Qaeda.
A British-born, Jack Roche, converted from Christianity to Islam, initially pleaded innocent against his charges in Perth, Australia to plotting with Osama and senior members of al-Qaeda. Surprisingly, Jack Roche unexpectedly changed his plea to guilty on the final day of giving evidence, after a short adjournment of the court. Anyone, exposed to the real scenario of these incidents, would have no riddle to ponder how a short recess may reverse a criminal case. Would it be hard to realize what money can do?
Right from the days of 9/11 incidents, the emergence of the converts to Islam played a vital role in establishing Islamic connection to terrorism. For instance Richard Reid, a British citizen, was on board Flight 63 on December 22, 2001. He was caught when a flight attendant saw him attempting to light a match on the tongue of his shoe. He was then wrestled to the ground before he succeeded in doing anything. It might sound shocking, but Richard Reid was given an easy access to Israel, just six months before the "shoe-bomb" incident. More to the point, his flight to Tel Aviv was accompanied by an armed air-marshall, seated close to him.
The FBI and British intelligence confirmed that Reid became involved in street crime and spent time in a number of prisons, including Feltham Young Offenders' Institution. Evidently, his travel to Israel, onboard an El-Al flight, wasn't for fun - was it? Plainly put, would Israel allow a convict and a convert to Islam on an El-Al flight without a planned goal? The FBI, after the "shoe-bomb" incident, kept on referring him as Tariq Raja as well as Abdel Rahim. As a result, the media exposed him to the world as a convert to Islam involved in terrorism.
After a miserable failure of the Bush administration, propelled by the blatant lies behind the WMD, the opposition to Iraq war has become increasingly stronger these days in the US soil. Consequently, the Sharonists in the Bush administration have recently been experiencing a dire need for incidents of terrorist activities involving Muslim participants. And when no Muslims do budge in responding to the temptation of wealth and safe heaven in the US, the terrorism does still continue in Islam's name. Amazingly, these orchestrated terrorist activities are invariably connected to converted Muslims - either from the Christian or the Hindu communities.
The London bomb scenario includes Lindsay, a 19-year-old convert to Islam. He has been identified as the one who blew himself up on a tube-train just after it left King's Cross station. The London police declared the weight of the bomb being 10 pounds after it got blown-up and Lindsay seemed to have been carrying it. Could it be that they had knowledge of the weight prior to its detonation?
Vikash Chand, is another Hindu convert to Islam, apparently involved in a terrorism in Canada. Chand's lawyer, Batasar, also of Hindu origin, presented the case as if he was the government prosecutor. Far from pleading for his clients, he stunned the courtroom by revealing that his client and the 16 others, intended to take politicians as hostage, and murder them as part of a massive terrorist plot.
Naturally, an inquisitive mind cannot fail to question if Chand and his chosen lawyer, Batasar are in the same payroll, dedicated to creating credence on the Bush doctrine: "War on Terror." The existing minority government of Canada, headed by a radical conservative leader, Stephen Harper had a dire need for a terrorist incident in Canada. This helped him establish for the next federal election that Canada too has Muslim terrorists, and as such, sending combating troops to Afghanistan was totally justified.
Incidentally, according to Canadian "Law Times", Batasar, the lawyer for Vikash Chand is "under fire" from his criminal law colleagues. According to the Toronto Star newspaper, Vikash Chand was a member of the Royal Regiment of Canada, the second largest reserve regiment of the Canadian Forces.
Though it dates about 3 years ago, most people who keep track of the world affairs, would still remember that a few powerful countries of Europe, namely France, Germany and Russia caused a deadlock in Iraq issue in the UN. Consequently, here comes again the creative pretences of Mossad to make France rethink about opposing the Iraq war. A bombing in Pakistan killed 11 French technicians and 23 others sustained injuries outside a five-star hotel. An explosive-laden car rammed into a navy vehicle taking the French to a dockyard. Then in October 2002, a French super-tanker was on fire, off the Yemeni coast after a mysterious explosion.
Despite the Zionist controlled media quickly identified al-Qaeda for all these bomb blasts, it couldn't sway the French determination to opposing the Iraq war in 2003. The sharp minds of President Jacques Chirac and Foreign Minister Dominique de Villepin must have known it well that while France was trying to avert a war in Iraq, al-Quida couldn't have been involved in provoking those who were against such an unjust war.
There is nothing new to the rest of world that Israel is a terrorist state who is armed to the teeth by the US. It actually meets all the definitions as set out by George Bush. Israel, right from its inception, has used Mossad to carry out violence and terror, including assassination. Even the Canadian-born astro-physicist, Gerald Bull wasn't spared. He was murdered on the entrance of his home in Brussels, Belgium.
Mosad, though successful in most of the times in its terrorism assignment, it must have been a severe miscalculation on its part on the morning-rush-hour in Madrid on March 11, 2004. Its powerful explosives ripped open carriages, killing at least 200 commuters and wounding more than 1,500 others. But ironically, the initial arrest included two Indian Nationals - Vinay Kohly and Suresh Kumar. Even though Spain's government blamed Basque separatist group Eta for the attacks, an audio tape in Arabic was planted by the perpetrator and the media quickly put the blame on the al-Quida. Perhaps it didn't occur to Mossad and the media that Vinay Kohly and Suresh Kumar are not Muslim names, they, rather, are Hindus.
While the Madrid bomb investigators couldn't find a convert to Islam immediately, he was eventually uncovered over a year later, on Friday, 23 June 2006. A CNN broadcast tells us that a lawyer and former Army officer, Brandon Mayfield, who converted to Islam, was arrested as a material witness in the deadly train bombings in Spain. He was from Portland suburb of Aloha, USA.
On June 23, 2006, a CNN report tells us again that a federal indictment unveiled Friday alleges seven men in Miami were engaged in a terrorist plot to blow up the Sears Tower in Chicago, Illinois, and other US government buildings in Miami, Florida. Another report qualifies them as: "These are native born Blacks who converted to Islam"
Even though it appeases the Sharonists in the White House, but the ripple effects of these orchestrated terrorism involving the phrase: "converted to Islam", cannot fail to sound repetitious. It must be reminding the listeners of Aesop's Fables and the lesson: "Don't cry 'wolf' when there is no wolf!". The CIA-Mossad partnership must realise that if al-Queda represents Muslim terrorists then they would not keep non-Muslims, especially Hindus, and Christians in its payroll. Doing so would be equivalent to Israel employing Osama to destroy the al-Aqsa Mosque.
Sources:
[1]. Scare Tactics: Ashcroft's Phony 'War on Terrorism'
by Edward Spannaus - "de facto Minister of Fear.":
%22de+facto+Minister+of+Fear.%22&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=2
[2]. Richard Reid
He visited Israel in June 2001 and onboard the El-Al flight to Tel Aviv was accompanied seated close to an armed air-marshall. The FBI, after the "shoe-bomb" incident, kept on referring him as Tariq Raja as well as Abdel Rahim.
[3]. Vinay Kohly, Suresh Kumar - [BBC News. Madrid Bombing]:
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/3597885.stm+Vinay+Kohly+
%2B+Suresh+Kumar&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=4
[4]. Vikash Chand - [CTV news]
ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20060607
/terror_canada_update_060607%3Fs_name
%3D%26no_ads%3D+Vikash+Chand&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=7
[5]. Sarjiyo - Bali Bombing
Sarjiyo, a 32-year-old Christian convert to Islam, is the third man to be jailed for life over the attacks:
+%22Sarjiyo,+a+32-year-old+Christian%22+%2B%22
third+man+to+be+jailed%22&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1
[6]. Samudra - [BBC News]:
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/2499943.stm
+Bali+%2BBomb+%2B+Samudra&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=2
[7]. Samudra in the Rigveda - The term occurs 133 times in the Rigveda, referring to oceans (real, mythical or figurative) or large bodies of water as well as to large Soma vessels, e.g. RV 6.69.6 (trans. Griffith)::
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samudra+Samudra+%2BRig+Veda&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1
[8]. Jack Roche - After converting to Islam, British-born Australian Jack Roche
[9]. Germaine Lindsay
The fourth suicide bomber was identified as Jamaican-born British resident Germaine Lindsay, who lived in Aylesbury.
4678837.stm+Germaine+Lindsay&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1
[10]. CNN news - Federal indictment unveiled Friday alleges seven men in Miami were engaged in a terrorist plot to blow up the Sears Tower in Chicago
2006/US/06/23/kent.cnna/index.html+%22federal+indictment+unveiled+Friday
+alleges+seven+men+in+Miami
+were+engaged+in+a+terrorist+plot+to+blow+up+the+Sears
+Tower+in+Chicago%22&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=3
[11]. "these are native born blacks who converted to Islam":
These+are+native+born+Blacks+who+converted+to+Islam%22&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=1
[12]. Brandon Mayfield - Muslim-convert Brandon Mayfield spent 17 days in detention ...
2004/05/26/fbi_madrid_blunder/+Brandon+Mayfield+%2Bconvert&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=3
[13]. Catholic Encyclopedea - In 1063, Pope Alexander II had given papal blessing to Iberian Christians in their wars against the Muslims
cathen/08355a.htm+Al+Hakim+%2B+first+Crusade+Catholic&hl=en&gl=ca&ct=clnk&cd=6
Source:
by courtesy & © 2006 Mesbah Uddin
Copyright © 2000 - 2013 MMN International Inc. All rights reserved.
Reproduction in whole or in part without permission is prohibited. |
:?"
I'm glad this question came first, as it's actually the first time I've heard a question phrased this way from any Christian. Notice Licona doesn't ask why I don't believe, he asks why Christianity is a turnoff. Which is quite a different matter. Licona has noticed that, apart from disbelief, there is something about religion in particular that rubs atheists the wrong way. Very astute, Mike. (Except, of course, for slipping in the mistaken attempt at equivocation with the ever-popular Christian weasel word "worldview." Atheism is not a "worldview." It is merely the disbelief in gods.)
I'll take the final question first. When credible evidence for a deity comes to light — a thing theists have singly been incapable of providing — then I will doubt my atheism. This does not mean I have a closed mind towards the idea. Even when I say, with full confidence, that I don't believe in any gods, I'm not making a dogmatic proclamation of absolute knowledge. But here, it's like the question of leprechauns. Would I believe in leprechauns if evidence for them ever made it sensible to do so? Sure. But in the absence of such evidence, I'm quite confident in maintaining my disbelief in leprechauns. Ditto gods.
There's nothing about Christianity troubling to my atheism, per se, so much as troubling to my humanism and ideas about goodness and decency. What turns me off about Christianity is that I consider it morally confused at best, and morally bankrupt at worst. Indeed, the Doctrine of Hell alone forever disqualifies Christianity as a moral belief system of any kind. Put bluntly, any religion that not only uses threats of eternal torture and punishment to enforce compliance, let alone considers eternal torture morally acceptable in the first place, simply for the "crime" of not being Christian, can only be considered not merely immoral but evil. Let us, for the sake of argument, say God exists. Am I to understand that this deity — said to be omniscient, omnipotent, omnific — is so insecure in his rule over his creation that he would find it necessary to consign me to eternity in hell merely for using my reasoning capacities (which he presumably gave me) to doubt his existence, especially when this God has deliberately chosen to refuse to reveal his existence unambiguously? Am I supposed to consider such a being worthy of my admiration, let alone my love and, most incredibly, my worship?
I often ask people who call the television show to imagine an abusive spouse, who tells his wife the following: "Honey, I love you with all my heart. But I swear, if you ever leave me, if I ever even think you're looking at another man or thinking about breaking up with me, so help me, I'll break your neck!" Now, is this a man you'd introduce your lady friends to? Is this someone you'd consider, not only a good man, but the best and most moral kind of man possible? No? But look closely. This man is your God. Don't worship him to his satisfaction, don't accept the divine love he so generously offers you, and go directly to hell, boom, no passing "Go" or collecting the proverbial two Benjamins.
Honestly, can you really be so clueless as to why Christianity turns atheists off, when it offers such an appalling deity for our devotion?
The immorality of Christianity doesn't stop there. This is a religion that preaches "love one another," and yet encourages the most virulent forms of hate. True, Islam does this to a degree Christianity can only dream of, but Christianity is still pretty objectionable. It is Christianity that inspires essentially 100% of the homophobia that is practiced in this country, and it informs most of its racism as well. You could say that this activity is merely bad people misinterpreting Christianity to their own ends. But it's hard to sell that excuse when passages in Leviticus calling for the execution of gays, and similarly hateful passages in Romans exist.
And why do so many racist groups openly identify themselves as Christian, giving themselves such pompous names as "World Church of the Creator"? This, I'd say, is perhaps not something particular to Christianity as it is to the very nature of religion itself: religion has historically been a tool for people to justify violence, atrocities, bigotry, oppression, even outright murder by giving such activity the divine stamp of approval. Todd Rundgren comments eloquently on this in his song "God Said," in which he imagines God replying to the prayers of a desperate and insecure believer.
You are not serving me, you're serving something else
Cause I don't need to be pleased, just get over yourself
You can't suck up to me, I know you all too well
But I don't dwell upon you, so get over yourself
Cause you're not praying to me, you're praying to yourself
And you're not worshiping me, you're worshiping yourself
And you will kill in my name and heaven knows what else
When you can't prove I exist, so get over yourself
You might say, again, that religiously-inspired hate and violence is man misusing religion, and doesn't come from God. But outside of Rundgren's song, I don't see God doing much to put a stop to such activity in his name. And when you consider, as I (and Todd) have, that what people call God is pretty much always simply their own idealized self-image, projected upon the universe, is it any wonder that religiosity has so often taken such an ugly form?
Another thing that turns me off about religion in general and Christianity in particular is the way such beliefs encourage delusion and bankrupt knowledge. I could go on (and have) at length about the way Christian fundamentalists in America are engaged in an all-out war on science education, specifically the study of a subject — evolutionary biology — that is vital to the understanding of our health and of our ability to treat disease. And the roster of scientific all-stars suppressed (Galileo) or just plain murdered outright (Giordano Bruno) by the Church is a stain you'll never wash off. But this post is going to be long enough as it is, so I'll move on..
Regarding the so called "resurrection expert", it appears he fancies himself an expert in something that actually happened. It's as if a "Star Trek expert" somehow deluded himself that the Starship Enterprise really exists. One can be an "expert" on fictional events, but the bizarreness of religionists is that they have, mostly through peer pressure, convinced themselves that the myths and fables of their ancient books aren't fiction. It's a very weird psychological phenomenon, one which I find endlessly fascinating.
Similarly, I always get a chuckle when someone condemns me to hell for being an atheist, because they invariably fail to understand the simple fact that for a threat to be effective the person at whom the threat is directed has to believe it to be real. Otherwise it has all the power of a six year old child threatening his parents that the monster in the closet is gonna get them..
There are video clips where he is answering "questions" from people, but I could only stomach one of them, his answer to "Misquoting Jesus", where he launches a huge ad-hominem attack against Bart Ehrman and his book, without addressing any of the points raised in the book. One vitriol spilled command to "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain"..
You are so right, and I hope I have learned my lesson since my last row with Rho over gay-marriage. Fundies like Rho are like coming across dead animals in the woods. The mere sight is so sad, I feel compelled to poke them with a stick a bit. In some vane hope, I guess I expect they will just "wake up" and scamper off to live out a normal life. But, alas, they simply lie there, lifeless and dead (from the neck up), just like when I found them.
DagoRed,
Love the allegory! With that carcass, even the trees weep.
Actually, in my discussions with him I considered that he might be a troll posing as a theist, just to get a rise. But given the time he has put into it, and the numbers of other individuals like him, I have to assume he is being honest, or at least honest as he sees it.
Tommy - ."
Nuh-uh. Don't you know that the default position is that the historians are accurate? (/sarcasm)
which leads to here (better links, IIRC):
So: "You simply cannot be serious. Be consistent then with all textual evidence and see where that gets you. Become a historian and then you'll know why they treat textual evidence as prima facie true unless discomfirmed. THEY MUST DO THIS! THERE IS NO OTHER ALTERNATIVE!"
I just amazes me how the most important "historical event" of Christianity is plagued with so much contradiction in the inerrant Bible.
Yeah... you are SO clever in your own little world, on your own little blog in cyberspace, where you have hours upon hours to type and re-type answers to these questions. Why don't you get some balls and debate Mr. Habermas, a foremost Christian scholar, in-person? And then we shall see who the victor is!
I've watched extended-length footage of Habermas taking on Antony Flew before a live studio audience. Habermas decimated Flew. He would do the same to you.
Habermas has written many books. Some of them answer each and every point you've posted here (and frankly, your points are just recycled atheist garbage that keeps getting regurgitated on various corners of the internet ad-naseum). Why don't you form some original opinions instead of re-using the same old, tired points that people came up with while you were still in diapers?
And the fact you start your post by denying that Jesus ever lived is the most ridiculous assertion I've ever heard. While I'll concede that Jesus' resurrection is an unknown variable, his existence is almost certain, even if only based on prima facie evidence. To assert otherwise is simply illogical and makes me believe you have been living in a cave for the majority of your adult life..
It really wouldn't matter who the opponent was. You could pit Ken Ham against a panel of Nobel Prize winners; it wouldn't make one bit of difference to you. You'd still conclude that your guy "decimated" them - because that's what you need to believe.
.
There is, of course, a reason why religious apologists generally (and creationists in particular, BTW) always want in-person debates. It allows them to use theatrics, personality, hand waving and obfuscation to "win" the debate, rather than doing so on the merits of the argument - assuming they actually stick to the topic, that is.
Written arguments/responses are much preferred for anyone really interested in generating more light than heat. It allows you to parse exactly what the other person has said in detail, followed by the ability to research a well-considered answer without being interrupted or steered away from the topic.
The Sam Harris-Andrew Sullivan online debate is an excellent example of how written debates are better, despite the fact that Harris is usually a decent debater in person. The format kept Sullivan from wriggling off the hook in certain areas, where the same situation in person would have yielded less fruitful discussion and more yelling and interruption.
Habermas has "answers" to atheist arguments, but they're crappy answers that only convince people who are already in the tank and who have clearly shown a distaste for considering any non-miraculous explanations for the "events" in question. Strange how Muslims and Jews agree with the atheists and find his case uncompelling. Wonder why that is? you'd care to produce any of this "prima facie" evidence you claim makes Jesus' existence "almost certain," then be my guest. But even having ironclad evidence that the Jesus of the Gospels was a real person would not, in and of itself, constitute evidence of any of the supernatural or divine claims surrounding him. You know that, right?
In any case, throwing an adolescent shit-fit over my article and calling it "recycled atheist garbage" does not constitute a refutation of it. If I've gotten my facts wrong, explain where and how, in detail. I expect you cannot, and a hysterical tirade is, in fact, all you've got.
If Habermas asked to debate me, I might consider it. But I cannot see the point of it. Debates do not establish facts. Evidence does. I know Christians like debates, because, as Kingasaurus pointed out, debates are all about performance, bluster, and getting a laugh from the audience. Christians are good at that, and debates give them the illusion they've got facts on their side by virtue of enjoying the applause of a congenial audience.
Since you're obviously a huge Habermas fan, though, why not do this: alert Habermas to this blog post, and if my points are as lousy as all that, he should have no problem demolishing them in reply, either here or on his own blog or both. Something like that would certainly be more likely to impress me and the other readers here, than a pissed-off rant from a petulant fundie scorned.
@Martin. So this is a case of these guys coming to us. If Habermas wants me to consider all of his apparently vast scholarly work on the subject, then he should present a better question than one whose premise is rooted in a number of assertions he doesn't back up. Where does he show the proof that "75%" of scholars agree the Resurrection happened? Who are these scholars? Are they real academics, or just fellow fundamentalist apologists like himself? If he wants to present a series of claims as part of a question for atheists, he needs to be the one to bring all of his facts to the table first. It isn't my job to chase after his facts. If I get asked a question by an apologist, I will answer the question asked. It's a bit foolish to say, "Oh, I'll ask you a question, but before you answer it, read all my books too."
Do historians say that Hannibal never crosses the Alps because Polybius contradicts Livy on the event? heck no. that is why it is stupid for you to appeal to discrepancies in the gospels. It is nothing but special pleading.
Look up what the special pleading fallacy is first, before accusing someone of it. If anyone is trying for special pleading, it's the Christians, who want to claim ironclad historicity for Biblical claims on extremely flimsy evidence at best. And as for Livy and Polybius, neither of those men's writings have had 2000 years of followers proclaiming them the inerrant word of God, nor do either of them claim Hannibal performed unheard of supernatural feats like rising from the dead and becoming ruler of the universe...
If you read how Habermas presents his case he doesn't go for "ironclad historicity" but usually goes with the 5 facts that even skeptics accept.Even most non-Christians scholars (Bart Ehrman and Pinchas Lapide are 2 examples) accept the minimal facts..
If you come to my house and claim you're lateness was due to a traffic jam, I'm inclined to take your word for it. Traffic jams are commonplace, and even though there is a slim statistical chance that you are lying for some reason unknown to me, I'm not going to be really motivated to thoroughly investigate whether the traffic jam actually happened. But if you claim an elephant escaped from the zoo, and during its rampage trampled your car, I'm not likely to just go along and buy it. A zoo escape (or even an alien abduction) doesn't contradict naturalism, but it is sufficiently unlikely that if you claim it happened, I'd really like some ironclad evidence beyond your say-so.
In the same vein, claims of supernatural "miracles" qualify as extraordinary claims - NOT just because they contradict the known laws of the universe that we've discovered, but also because they are sufficiently outside our everyday experience that we can confidently say that reports of real "miracles" are less likely to be accurate than the person simply lying, being mistaken, or being deliberately fooled by another person. Doesn't mean there's absolutely no chance that something supernatural happened, but the evidence had better be darned good before we buy into it.
This is why things like "I saw some guy levitate" simply doesn't get accepted on the person's say-so.
There are modern gurus who perform "miracles" in front of throngs of eyewitnesses who are convinced the person in question has real supernatural powers. Very few outside the true believers are convinced by such stuff, as people educated in sleight of hand and subterfuge can state that it's much more likely that the guy is simply doing tricks.
Such gurus, as Sam Harris points out, don't even make the nightly news. Yet plop down some similar (decades old) accounts in some hearsay-ridden ancient books, that come out of the pre-scientific, superstitous environment of the first century Roman empire, and billions of modern people think it's a worthwhile project around which to organize their lives.::
Thanks for posting the link to this article to my blog post. I hadn’t read it, but it’s funny. I find the questions “asked” nearly rhetorical in nature. In fact, I just reread an exchange I had with a theist back in 2008, where he asked specifically this question, and when atheists posted answers, he objected it was obviously not intended as a real question, but as rhetorical. It was Craig’s question: “What's the real reason you don't believe in God? How and when do you lose your faith in God?”
It’s the sort of question you ask a person when you just don’t like the answer you’re getting. I can’t help people who don’t get answers they want to rhetorical questions. But I can say that if you’re asking questions rhetorically and not wanting answers, then you’re assuming you already know the answer. But what’s interesting with the theists who offer this as rhetorical, is that 10 times out of 10, they’re assumptions are wrong. So, humorously, they ask without wanting to know, and they demonstrate that what they think they know is wrong. The very person who could learn in this situation is, ironically, assuming he has nothing to learn from the people he is asking.
“Resurrection expert”? Is that like Big Foot Cryptozoologist? I sometimes ask when I see a divinity degree, if that means the person has graduated to god. There is something special about being an expert on something nobody can confirm ever existed or actually happened.
In your reply to Habermas, I’m reminded of the Luke Gospel. It has no named author, but we use Luke. Then we proceed to discuss that book as “Luke’s Gospel,” disregarding that we really don’t know it was authored by a person named Luke. And that becomes “everybody accepts Luke wrote it…” Well, we refer to it as though Luke wrote it, because it’s handy to do so; but that doesn’t mean Luke wrote it. Then when we address that whoever authored Luke wasn’t an eyewitness. And the reply is that he _interviewed_ eyewitnesses. And how do we know this? Well, because this anonymous author said so in the text. Did he also tell us how he knew these people were eyewitnesses? Was there any screening? Seriously, how did Luke weed out real eyewitnesses—if there were any—from the people we all know and love who will assert they experienced/saw anything in order to simply have someone to talk to? Were these the alien abductees of antiquity? How do we know they weren’t? Did the author talk to anyone at all? Or did the author simply assert he did? How do we know his claim is accurate? How do we know, without original texts, if this claim was the same in the original or was added or revised later?
For any of these questions we can take a guess. And we can study and take a more educated guess. But we can’t really ever know the answers to these questions because the only means of examining these issues is long gone. We can’t interview anyone. We can’t look at any tomb. We can’t do anything that would be remotely necessary to establish this as “fact.” And that is the problem—when the theist or apologist puts this out as “fact,” tacks on the fallacy from popularity, and then declares challengers to their bald assertions are off their nut. No doubt he has the numbers to pull it off. But it’s dishonest, unreasonable, and dishonorable. I’m fine being considered nuts by a majority who asserts “facts” they simply _cannot_ demonstrate are, in fact, facts.
And yes, your breakdown of the resurrection myths is very helpful. |
Above is a rose from a rose bush I planted this year. It is an English rose named Pat Austin. It has a lovely coppery tone and sweet fragrance but its stem is not very strong. It could be that we planted it in an area which does not get enough sun. Below is another charming rose; it is a postcard from my vintage postcard collection.
Below is an inside view of one of the large meeting rooms in the Trocadéro._0<<_1<<
Mother had learned to dance the Charleston, but by then another dance was getting very popular worldwide, a dance from Argentina, the tango. Mother loved to dance – she went to many tea dances, as they were called, and danced the tango.
Carlos Gardel was born in France but since he is still so famous in South America, Uruguay has been trying to establish that he was born in their country instead, but he was not.
Tea Room Tango, by Jullius Müller-Massdorf, German, 1863-1963
She often reminisced about dancing Carlos Gardel’s tangos. He had come from Buenos Aires to Paris in 1928 and then again in the early ‘30s both in Paris and on the French Riviera. He was Argentina’s superstar and the best of all the tango singers in the world. He had a distinctive baritone voice and a great sense of rhythm. He was very elegant, impeccably attired and always smiling.
He was born as Charles Romuald Gardes in Toulouse, France (south west of France) on 11 December 1890. His mother Berta Gardes was single, and his father was declared as unknown. His French Government birth certificate is on the web. He lived with his mother at no. 4 rue du Canon d’Arcole in Toulouse.
Berta immigrated to Buenos Aires, Argentina with Charles in 1893 to join a French friend of hers who had a laundry business there.
In early 1924 Carlos Gardel visited his family in Toulouse. He went on to Paris where he performed in music halls and theatres. His success kept growing and he acted in several movies. But he would visit his family in Toulouse at least five or six more time until 1934.
Vintage postcard of Buenos Aires harbor.
Charles, who by then was called Carlos, spent his childhood in the “Mercado de Abasto” area where they nicknamed him “El Francesito” (the French man.)
Vintage postcards of Buenos Aires, Argentina. Top: Avenida de Mayo, bottom: Palacio de Gobernia_8<<_9<<
Around that time my mother left the House of Worth to start a business with a friend, rue de la Paix – a famous area of Paris, not far from the Opera.
She also did some free-lance in the high fashion business.
Style of dresses from that era
Mother told me many times though that she would often go with her girl friends to dance the tango, which was more popular than ever. Carlos Gardel was one of her favorite.
Whenever Carlos Gardel paid a visit to Paris Mother always tried to attend his performances.
Tango, by René Gruau French , 1909-2004
Whenever Carlos Gardel paid a visit to Paris Mother always tried to attend his performances.
Unfortunately on 24 June 1935 Carlos Gardel and several of his band members were killed when their aircraft collided with another on the airfield of Medelin in Colombia. Gardel left a will where he indicated that he was born in Toulouse, France. A partially burnt passport was found, bearinghis name, but from the country of Uruguay. This is the reason Uruguay is claiming Gardel as its own.
I read a lot on Carlos Gardel, mostly in French.
I also read some Spanish booklets (which I translated via Google translate.)
I even found on the Net a postcard that he had sent to his French family.
Postcard which says: ‘Dear grandparents Happy New Year I send you this little postcard to remind you that I always remember you with love and I also remember my good aunt Carlota and my good uncle Juan. Here we are very happy to know that you are in good health. We are all right and soon if God allows me I'll spend some time with you.
I read a lot on Carlos Gardel, mostly in French.
I also read some Spanish booklets (which I translated via Google translate.)
I even found on the Net a postcard that he had sent to his French family.
Your grandson that loves you and does not forget you. Carlos”What I found out though in my research is that French men who lived in foreign lands were exempt from military duty in time of peace. However when the First World War started they were called to serve France. In the Argentina’s census of the time it showed that there were 20,924 eligible French men living in Argentina. Only 5800 went back to France to fight in the war. The easiest way not to go to war was to change nationality. Still in his soul Carlos Gardel was from Argentina, not from France or Uruguay. He was formally naturalized as an Argentinian in 1923.
From my readings it is quite obvious that Gardel was born in France. First of all there was the authenticated birth certificate and witnesses and also, why would an Argentinian singer stop in Toulouse on five different occasions to see the Gardes family? Gardel’s chauffer, Antonio Sumage confirmed in 1944 while being interviewed by a magazine that he had driven his boss to Toulouse because Gardel wished to visit his mother’s siblings.
In 2009 UNESCO declared the tango as part of the world’s “intangible cultural heritage.” They have also classified Carlos Gardel’s voice a human patrimony where they officially state that Carlos Gardel was “a French Argentinian singer born in France.”
There has been a renewed interest in the dance and it is easy in summer to find places to dance the tango like in Paris, New York and other large cities. Dancing the tango has many health benefits. It has been linked to better balance, increased heart health and improved memory. My mother taught me the tango and I love it. I have many CDs of tango music, including Carlos Gardel’s.
When Carlos Gardel died in the plane crash on 24 June 1935 his fans were numb with grief. His body was returned to Buenos Aires and more than a million came to his funeral. To this day Carlos Garel’s tomb is visited by a large number of fans from all over the world and they bring flowers still.
Just like Valentino, Carlos Gardel in the 1930’s was the epitome of what a fashionable man should look like.
I am not sure if that was the type of man my mother liked.
51 comments:
*** Coucou Vagabonde ! :o) Tu nous gâtes avec ce post ! Tu nous emmènes dans une époque d'y il a des dizaines d'années et c'est un vrai plaisir ! La vie de Carlos Gardel, danseur, chanteur, comédien plein de charme, Paris et ses endroits d'antan et tes parents très beaux sur les photos... MERCI VAGABONDE ! Ce n'est que du bonheur de venir chez toi ! GROS BISOUS !!!!! Bon dimanche !!! :o) ***
Passionnant ce post sur cette star du tango, je dois dire que j'ignorais tout cela, j'adore regarder de bons danseurs, le tango n'est pas seulement une danse, c'est aussi un prélude à l'amour, la danse de séduction par excellence !
Ta maman était une très jolie femme !
Bon week-end Vagabonde !
It's hard to confess this, because I don't like being so ignorant, but I am wondering how you found so much information about someone I had never heard of.
You found a lot to document Gardel's French birthplace. So many beautiful photos, and postcards! I was thinking the other day that you must have a very good filing system for your postcards to use them to such advantage here.
This post is tremendous. I learned so much from it, feel that I know this handsome man. Thank you for digging and sharing what you found.
I love the rose, the color is so lovely. And it would be nice between my teeth in a tango I am Ruth after all. :)
This is a terrific post, Vagabonde - history, romance, family and the Tango. What a wonderful story you have to tell and your archival footings really bring it alive. Thank you.
I know little to nothing about the tango, other than the name. And absolutely nothing about Gardel! What a great and informative post. I also love those pictures of your mother from one of those photo booths. Now I will need to learn some more about Gardel.
What a wonderful post - the history and the family story entwined - I really enjoyed this.
When we were in Argentina a couple of years ago we saw people dancing the Tango on the street - everywhere. We heard the music of Gardel, CDs were available for sale in the shops and his name is still in the forefront of any discussion of Tango.
Lovely! Much appreciated!
Salut
Comme argentine... bravo et merci!
Un petit cou cou du dimanche
Amtiés
Elisa, en Argentine
You know what I did?
I bookmarked this post.
C'est vrai.
I must read it over and over again;-)
I love the way you can tell your mothers story through postcards and photographs. You are lucky to have such a rich history and that she documented it so well for you. The postcards are absolutely charming!
Carlos Gardel is not a name I have ever heard before.His photo shows him as a very handsome man, just the type that would have appealed to ladies in the 30s. My mother had her favourites too and they were all of a similar sort.
You are very fortunate to have such a brilliant collection of postcards. It shows that your family is spread all over the globe.
A lovely post and most interesting; I hadn't heard of him either. I love the tango and watching the experts dance on YouTube.
You certainly know how to get down to the nitty gritty. I joined a French genealogy page and paid for a year to find my Great-great-Grandparents but I'm not having much luck!
You have really done your research well to find out so much about Carlos Gardel, a man I have never heard of. But he was certainly a handsome man, amd I am sure there were many hearts broken when he died in such a tragic manner.
I like the three photos of your mother. I think women look very sexy in hats!
caught up on your posts! such wonderfful stories ,photos,postcards!! I am taken back to a wonderful time in history..I can hear your mother ,the sounds,the music ..all of it through your magnificent posts!!!
*** Coucou Vagabonde ! Par ces quelques mots je te souhaite un très bon début de semaine !!!!! BISOUS !!!! ***
That rose is a beaut. : j
Tango is still well loved in Paris. There's a park off of the seine on the "Quai de la Rapée", near "l'institut du monde arabe", that has three three mini amphitheatres, or giant alcoves ()... and in the summer season, a tango club bring a player and people just dance there in the evenings... In the other two alcoves there's folk dancing in one and swing dancing or capoeira in the other. And right nearby there's a largish square where they do salsa.
You are always such a fount of information, Vagabonde. WONderful information that just enriches our lives, post after post. I love the way you piece things like this together. I wonder if there will ever be a movie made about him...like there was of Edith Piaf? I can just see all the tango dances, which I would love!
Hi Vagabonde, thank you for your message on my blog! It is certainly going to be a big change in my life. I begin to fell better now, I hope this nausea will go away soon.
I love your post, as always! Very interesting those old pictures of Trocadero.
I went to Buenos Aires in 2008 and i just loved it! And tango is the most beautiful, sensual dance in the world (and must be one of the most difficult...). Tango is something you never get tired of looking at.
What a wonderful post, Vagabonde. Really enjoyed this especially as I knew nothing about Gardel. He has a superb voice and style. Can't understand why your mother would not have liked him. Was everyone like that in the 1930s, I wonder? The sophisticated veneer over a world preparing to tear itself apart. Sad about the old Trocadero. Looks a wonderful old place. I only know the Metro station.
Beautiful rose and a wonderful collection of postcards and old photos. It was really a different world back then. Thanks for bringing it alive.
*** Un petit coucou ensoleillé juste pour toi Vagabonde ! BISES AMICALES !!!!!! :o) ***
Je viens de faire un passage vite fait, Vagabonde. Je repasserai plus tard pour commenter. Tout ce que j'ai vu, c'est la rose comme celle du post précédent. J'ai les mêmes à la maison.
A plus tard donc !
I love coming here and just don't do it often enough. Gorgeous visuals and I always learn something. I've never heard of Carlos but the Tango? Truly the dance of love. No wonder your mother was so enamoured by it. The fashion postcards are just darling.
First, such a beautiful rose, it looks like a painting! And another wonderful story about your dear mother. The photos of her are priceless and I love the one of your father, too. I was not familiar with Carlos Gardel, but enjoyed reading about his interesting life. I love to tango, too. Cheers, cher!
I didn't know Gardel had been born in France, and from the way you explain it, it sounds as though Argentines would be reluctant to believe it (which interestingly I didn't know). Growing up in Buenos Aires in the 60's & 70's I heard his singing voice on every colectivo I ever took, and saw his photo swinging from the rear view mirrors of buses and taxis. I must admit that to a child such as I was then it sounded dated, although I did use to play "Caminito" on the guitar... His story is so fascinating though.
It's such a privilege to grow up bilingual, and a pleasure to make the effort to stay fluent in two languages - not one, but two different worlds open before you, with their people and their culture both equally dear and familiar - and comfortable. It's wonderful to understand them both from the inside, and clearly this is the case for you with France.
I've enjoyed reading back through your posts and appreciate all the research that has gone into them. Thank you.
Caroline (from Bristol, UK)
My, my. Isn't Carlos quite the Latin lover! Such a handsome man and that voice is memorable. I'll bet women were dying to get nex to him.
Your mom has such a twinkle in her eye, she is someone you just want to know.
The first rose is spectacular! I have one from Jackson and Perkins called "Antiqua" that is close, a touch more pink in the center and yellowish after it opens.
I would love to tango, but to do that dance really well, you would have to know your partner...really well!
I had such a good time looking at all the postcards. Another wonderful post. Thank you!
Merveilleux post, Vagabonde !
Belles illustrations. maintenant j'en connais plus sur Carlos Gardel qui faisait pâmer les femmes. Il avait une très jolie voix et était assez bel homme.
Je trouve que ton Papa a une certaine ressemblance avec le roi du tango. Le tango est une danse très sensuelle que je ne danse plus because que mon Chéri ne sais pas danser. Mais quand j'allais au bal je ne m'en privais pas.
Merci encore pour ce beau post.
Hmm...a singer, dancer and handsome man all rolled into one! Who could resist?!
What a wonderful way to tell the story of you're Mom - and what a nice contribution!
Thanks for sharing in every details and for all the lovely photos and cards.
As I just had company from Buenos Aires, I was very interested in your post. A handsome man and beautiful voice! Must ask my cousin about Gardel.
Thanks a lot for sharing all your wonderful memories with us, Vagabonde!
*** Bon séjour chez ta fille en Californie Vagabonde ! :o) Merci pour tes mots chez moi, je te fais de GROS BISOUS et je te dis "à bientôt !!!!" GROS BISOUS !!!! ***
Mais tu es une grande voyageuse !
A bientôt !
*** Un petit bonjour en ce vendredi matin !!!!! :o) Je t'envoie plein de GROSSES BISES Vagabonde !!!!!! ***
Another interesting post.I'd never heard of Gardel but what an interesting man he was.
The Charleston, Tangos and tea dances reminds me of my mother, too.
WoW! Very interesting post. Great history and fabulous accompanying images. Your mother must be / have been some women.
Thank you for visiting my blog once again, Vagabonde.
I am astounded with the wonderful information in this post! It was like traveling back in time, and learning of details and culture of that time gone past. I love history and learning about this kind of information -- specific cultural information of time periods -- in particular, so this was a real joy to read. Thank you for taking the time to research and write about Carlos Gardel, and with the added focus of your mother's history, too.
Also, your roses are gorgeous. :)
Here in Chile everybody loved Carlos Gardel too and my grandparents where his fans and I remember listening old vinyls with his tangos in my grands homes.
They told me about him and here his songs are still listened.
cariños,
maria cecilia
What a beautiful post. I was at a rose garden this past week, and noticed the McCartney rose. It is gorgeous.
I think that your father looks as handsome as Gardel. Your mother had good taste in men!
It is so much fun to be taken to another time and place, and learn of the people there. Thank you!
Nancy, Lorilaire, Elisa et Claude - Merci pour vos gentils commentaires. Ce post était long alors j’apprécie que vous ayez pris le temps de le lire et d’écrire un mot. Je suis toujours contente de lire vos impressions sur mes posts.
Elizabeth, DJan, Lakeviewer, TorAa, DianeCA, Shammickite, Ann, Paty, Fennie, Elaine, Baino, Marguerite, Linda, Jinksy, RennyBA, Sablonneuse, EarthGypsy, Karin, Maria Cecilia and Alwaysinthebackrow - It was a pleasure to read your comments. I always look forward to see what you think about my posts and photographs. Thanks for taking the time to write a note – I appreciate it very much.
Ruth – I was interested by Carlos Gardel so I had a document in my computer on him and every time I learned something new I would add it to my document, at least for a year. Thanks for your interest.
Ginnie – I do not know about a movie on Carlos Gardel. If one was made it may have been in Spanish. I’d love to see one, though. I always enjoy reading your comments.
Alesa Warcan – thanks for giving details about tango dancing in Paris – maybe some time I can be there when they dance it. Thanks for commenting.
Friko – I have been collecting old and new postcards for decades. I buy them when I go on trips and the vintage ones when I find them in flea markets. Thanks for visiting my blog.
Alaine – I saw a TV program in France which showed that many of the very old genealogy records for France have been bought by the big genealogy bureau in Salt Lake City, Utah.
Pondside – It is so nice that you could go to Argentina. I hope I can go some day. Thanks for stopping by.
Angela – I’d like to hear what your family thinks of Gardel. Thanks for commenting.
Lonicera – welcome to my blog. What an interesting childhood you had to be brought up in Argentina. Thanks for commenting on my post. I hope you will come back.
Your mother certainly lead a fabulous and fascinating life. I totally agree with everyone that you've done a wonderful job of putting together this post about Carlos Gardel.
Sam
This is the most astounding post! I adore the tango, knew of Gardel, but not much about him. Again, such wonderful use of vintage cards to illustrate.
Your mother's story is fascinating, Vagabonde -- it is one to be told, and I hope one day you will write it in full. She was lovely, your father handsome (and, I think, more my type than Gardel!). But oh, the tango!
I'm so very glad Ruth told me about you!
This is wonderful. I am Argentine by birth (Buenos Aires), American by naturalization and my ancestors were French. In Argentina is a well-known fact that Carlos Gardel (Carlitos for us), was born in France.
Being from Buenos Aires, I have visited his ABASTO neighborhood many times, his house (just form the outside), and of course his tomb in Chacarita cemetery. What is curious is that someone always places a cigarette in Carlitos bronze statue - as it was his custom when alive.
We have a saying in Argentina about Carlos Gardel who was known as "El Morocho del Abasto" (because of his black hair): "Carlitos, cada dia canta mejor", which means "Carlitos sings better every day".
My dad always tells me a story about Carlos Gardel. When my dad was about 8, he and his parents and siblings attended an acrobatic show at the Luna Park in Buenos Aires. Because there were so many people watching that show, it was hard for the children to see the stage. My grandparents were able to hold my two uncles up so they could see, but there was no other adult to hold my dad up. Enter Carlos Gardel, who was also in the audience and sitting next to my grandparents. Being very tall, he picked my dad up and held him for the whole duration of the show. From then on, he would often be invited to my grandparents house on social occasions.
Carlos Gardel was unique in his gentle ways, his charisma, his handsome traits (he was a beautiful man inside and out), and his magnificent voice.
It was a very sad day in Buenos Aires when the news of his death reach the citizens. To this day, he is remembered and revered by old and young alike.
Carlitos, each day that passes by, you sing better!
Anonymous – thank you so much for your long comment. It was so interesting and added a unique personal anecdote which I am sure everyone would like to read. I am pleased that you wrote this first-hand information on my blog and I hope that you will come back and read more posts.
Muy buenos días estimados amigos. Por favor no tengan miedo pero les estoy comunicando del mas aya... aquí me han dado permiso. Mi vida fue llena de bendiciones. Si nací en Francia pero me criaron y viví mi vida en la argentina. Por favor, sigan viviendo porque la vida es muy corta. Dios les espera y yo les espero en este otro mundo también lleno de vida y almas pero sin dolor. Escribo esto por hijo de mi hijo en los estados unidos. Vivan, mis amigos, vivan.
CG
Passionnant!
Et les documents d'époque sont très évocateurs.
Quelle belle façon de faire revivre ces années là.
En ce qui concerne Carlos Gardel voici un article de article de la Dépêche
Toulouse n'étant pas loin, j'irai faire un tour au 4 rue Canon d'Arcole. A suivre. |
1) Vegans on average live 6 years longer than non-vegans.
2) The average vegan total cholesterol level is 128. The lowest level for a heart attack is 150.
3) Milk consuption has been linked to cholic, ear infections, asthma, and a whole slew of other diseases.
4) Cholesterol can cause impotence
5) Vegans dont consume any cholesterol
6) Vegans dont smoke, and smoking is one of the leading causes of death
7) 33% percent of Americans are OBESE, while only 2% of vegans are
8) Tofu is a lot cheaper than steak
9) Fur has formeldahyde in it, which has been known to cause cancers and etc
10) Charred meats contain carcinogens that can cause cancers
11) Fast food meats like those at McDonald's have thousands of additives that are not only addictive, they can cause you to gain weight and mess up your whole body
12) The USFDA recognizes vegetarian and vegan diets as the healthiest diets.
13) Veal calves are often stillborn or unborn.
14) Veal calves that are born are raises in crates where they cant even turn around, and are fed only a diet of milk for 16 weeks before they are slaughtered.
15) Dairy cows on average live for 5-7 years, where as they are able to live to 20 years or more!
16) Pigs are more intelligent than dogs, and have the intelligence of a 3-year old.
17) Egg-laying hens are kept without water and food for 14 days at a time to force their bodies into another egg-laying cycle
18) It takes 7 cows to furnish a leather interior Mercedes-Benz
19) Milk is known to cause acne breakouts
20) MEAT IS DEAD FLESH
How many more reasons do you need?
70 comments:
but veal is so tender and so darn good
| the depp said...
|
| but veal is so tender and so darn
| good
No doubt cats taste fantstic, perhaps you should eat them too? What about humans? I'd bet if you tied them to the ground when they're first born and eat them after a few weeks you'd find they taste "so tender and so darn good" too. Doesn't make it right though.
Vegans are supposed to abstain from products that are tested on animals, and cigarettes are probably the worst product tested on animals.
A "vegan" who smokes would be considered only a strict vegetarian, just like a "vegan" who buys and wears leather, fur, etc.
Where's the evidence that Vegans live on averag 6 years longer then non vegans? I'd be interested to get a link.
Being a vegan I'm interested in the subject, and, I thought well researched.
As quoted by the Vegan society, there's no difference between the life expectancies of Vegans, Vegetarians and Omnivores.
Thanks
Becky.
If you know of a vegan that smokes you need to sit them down and start looking up how cigs. are tested on animals and the animal products that go into those. So being vegan does mean you dont smoke, or else your like a straight edge kid that drinks...your just saying it to be cool, or be diffrent or whatever.
Vegans living longer, I have a hard time agreeing with though, do to the fact that many chinese people live to be older than most, and they still consume a good amount of animal based products.
For those of you that strongly disagree with the things said within this blog, should really take the time to educate yourself. It is not a vegans job to sit down and be like "I got my info from here" or to be like "here let me look that up for you"
We have done our studies to be able to bring you information, if you dont want to take it, look it up for yourself.
Simple as that.
X?X
Blackbasement Collective
It is true that the human body, like any mammal's is designed to process milk, however the human body is NOT designed to process cow's (or any other mammal's, for that matter) milk, which is drastically different from human milk. It's just not natural and very unhealthy. And mammals lose their ability to process milk after infancy, anyway.
It's true that humans are supposed to breast feed after they are born, but after a certain age we actually produce an intolerance to any kind of milk, because we are supposed to be eating food by then. Also, I used to eat meat, and I used to get horrible stomach aches all the time, but since I stopped, I haven't had any. The way that livestock is treated these days, with hormones, bad living arrangements, and the way they are sloppily slaughtered(sometimes the stomach is accidentally sliced and ends up in your meat! yum!), maybe thats why I got sick. That's my reason for being vegetarian. I've decided to become vegan because of these same reasons. Cheese, yogurt, butter, stuff like that just seems unnatural to me. Plus cheese has something called casein in it, which has the same effect on the brain as morphine, hence, it can be addictive! Eggs don't seem right to me either, I mean, they're dead animal babies! That's just my opinion, but I think I have a few points. I've had my doubts about whether any animal products are meant to be eaten by humans, but I think they're ok for a treat every once in a while, if your not vegan or vegetarian. But, if I had time, and I knew how to hunt, I'd go get me some tasty fresh meat! Otherwise, just go see how these animals are taken care of. That should be enough to make you vegan!!!
Milk does not cause any health problems unless consumed in extremely high doses. The human body, as with all mammals, is designed to process milk."
THE HUMAN BODY WAS MADE TO CONSUME MILK, BUT ONLY THAT OF IT'S MOTHER AND NOT AFTER INFANTCY.
One of the many differences between vegans and strict vegetarians is that vegans avoid products tested on animals. Cigarettes are one of the cruelest products in history to be tested on animals (often dogs.)
If you consider yourself vegan and you smoke, you might as well give a donation to March of Dimes or something of the sort.
More reasons to be vegan:
ANIMAL RIGHTS
*the egg/dairy industries absolutely could NOT exist without the meat industry. There would be too many males. Simple as that. They are reliant on each other. Think it through carefully and you'll understand. Even if you eat the eggs of your pet chicken, it's still bad as you could not have done this without the egg and therefore the chicken industries existing. Also:
*even free range organic chickens are slaughtered at 16 months, as after this age the eggs are less lkely to be perfect
*dairy cows are also the mother cows, making veal calves.
*remember there is no such thing as an "ethical" method of killing. Would YOU like to have your throat slit or have your neck snapped for example?
*if a person has had a happy life, does that make it acceptable to cut his life short and take away his future? Remember that humans are animals too and we all have an inherent will to live (obv except suicidals etc)
*honey bees are usually killed as the beekeepers take all the honey when the bees need some to survive
ENVIRONMENT
*at any one time livestock out number people 3.5 to 1. Think of all the food that need to be grown for them, when humans could eat the food themselves and cut out the middle man (animals)
*25% of global warming is due to rainforest destruction and change of land use, and the vast majority of this of this is caused by farming.
*farming (cows I think) produces huge amountsof nitrous oxide and methane which are respectively 296 and 23 more potent greenhouse gases than CO2
*it takes Huuuuuuuuge amounts more energy and water to produce meat than veg. I can't remember the statistics but trust me they are phenomenal.
*there are way too many livestock animals in the world. If you think the human population is too big (10% of all humans ever alive are alive NOW) think of the farmed animals - it's unnatural.
*"ethical" farming is even worse green-wise as the animals need even more land and resources.
*basically the world simply does not have enough resources or room to be anything other than vegan. As one very important bloke says: "we have to treble food production by 2040 without using any more land or create 5 billion vegans"
*people don't realize all this because they don't associate global warming with it. They think that because theres physically nough room for loads of animals and people there are no problems. HELLO - GLOBAL WARMING.
*the British government are trying to gently get this message across but so far have been to pussy. They think it will make people hate Labour even more.
NOTEs TO STUBBORN NON-VEGANS:
*please do not preach non-veganism to us. If you don't like what you're reading/talking about then carry on with your ignorance, carry on with your "out of sight, out of mind" approach and leave us alone.
*as said, if you don't agree with what we say go and educate yourself. I'm not going to quote everything I've read, or prove something is a fact - if you don't believe us it's YOUR job to find out. remember we are vegans for a reason.
MYTHS
*It is absolutley NOT DIFFICULT to get all your nourishment.
*there is very little efffort needed to get protein, all 8 amino's. This is the most annoying myth. Just because meat is high in protein (inferior protein to vegan sources, as it happens) and milk is high in calcium (also inferior) does not mean these are the only sources.
*every vitamin etc are available naturally in the vegan diet. B12 would come from root vegetables but not anymore due to unnatural modern farming methods.
*People always say "I'd rather be happy" etc. Your happiness will NOT be effected, and your life won't either.
*People are daunted by the prospect of veganism and are put off.
*The biggest mistake is try to have a diet exactly he same as before with vegan substitutes. Bad idea, you won't enjoy it and will feel you're living off 'fake' stuff. You need to think of all the vegan things available that yu haven't tried yet.
*No you can't eat cheese again, but you will find things in the vegan diet that you enjoy just as much. Anyway why should people and animals die and the environment be affected jjust for your tastebuds?
vegans don't smoke?? why?
nvm i get it sry i asked.
I respect your position, although I myself am an omnivore. I won't get into how environmentally unfriendly soy farming is, but I will say that (at least in europe) there are brands of organic rolling tobacco that are not tested on animals. There's lots of companies that hire rational people that are perfectly aware of the risks to test their products.
Anonymous said: *basically the world simply does not have enough resources or room to be anything other than vegan. As one very important bloke says: "we have to treble food production by 2040 without using any more land or create 5 billion vegans"
You forgot the best option: Get rid of 3 billion people.
Sorry, I can't go Vegan. There's nothing quite like a good burger, and I believe humans have a right to raise animals, kill them, eat them, chew them, and poop them. I do, however, respect the Vegan lifestyle and it is admirable how you people have the discipline to control your eating habits.
Vegans do smoke. Most people I know roll there own. there is organic tobacco available. I smoke organic mugwort. It's a natural herb and it's fantabulous!!
I would but as I don't live by myself, the rest of my family will feed me meat
i stopped eating eggs after my biology teacher said in class: "eggs are chicken period." yuck.
It's funny because the comments actually have made me think more about becoming vegan than the actual article. Thank you for all of your comments.
i actually know a lot of vegans who smoke...
if vegans dont consume cholesterol then why do they have a cholesterol level of 128?
not trying to start and arguement, just curious.
GO VEGANS!
man going vegan is good for the earth yourself and pretty much everything
and if you're that shallow and all you care about is looks vegans are sexy too!
Eggs are not check periods.
I'm a vegeterian. Due to my mothers refusal to let me become vegan and my intense dislike of soya and rice milk I still eat milk and eggs. However, I fully intend on finding a milk substitute that I like so I can become an ovo-vegeterian.
Hello, I liked your list and so I made a YouTube video of me reading it. I don't mean to come off narcissistic, please like the video and not ask me to take it down.
im a 15-yr-old vegan and find it easy to be vegan, but many people are just all like "Oh, i would die if i was a vegan" im just like wutev. Go fellow vegans/vegetarians. the animals need us :) booo all u animal killers, u suck !! :P
to sarahe_21:
I'm on your side in this argument, but...
Eggs are not dead animal babies. They are unfertilized. They are the result of the chicken's menstrual cycle - in other words, the chicken's 'period'.
I'm a vegan and I smoke. In January I will be a vegan for one year. Although I'm not vegan for health reasons, or necessarily for animal rights, although those things are pluses. My decision is based more to a response to a sustainability problem, resources and environment. That is also why I switched to rolling my own cigarettes instead of buying those with filters...
Any way, the point is some Vegans (at least this one) do smoke :)
You are a faggot. Oh my God, your self-righteous bullshit makes me glad that you will be a doddering, diaper-filling prick for 6 years more than I will be. I look forward to eating my bacon double cheeseburger tomorrow, because meat is awesome, and you are not.
hey i was just wondering..
do cows NEED to be milked? a friend told me by not milking the cows it can lead to an infection in the udder etc. :S
sorry, actually posted that before i google'd it
I love these facts, now I know more :)
I am currently vegetarian, but I am on my way to becoming vegan. Thanks for the extra facts I never knew!!! :)
I don't think we should have to live up to every vegan standard.
I smoke, and drink and I have a few leather items.
I still don't eat meat, eggs or milk.
I consider myself a Vegan, and maybe you think it's not legit, but I'm living up to my vegan standards, not yours or anyone else.
That's the way it should be.
I tried to just cut back on meat and eat more vegies and i got sick
can anyone explain this to me
Sam, I recommend that you wean yourself off meat. Take away one form at a time until it's gone. You don't want to shock your system. When my family and I went vegan, we cut out red meat first, then milk, then all cheese, then pork, then chicken, fish, and eggs went bye bye last. None of us got sick, but your body will have to adjust, and your digestive functions may be off for a little while.
I can honestly say that going vegan was the best decision I ever made, and my husband and kids have come right along with me and are are really happy.
Good luck, if you decide to try again. I will recommend 2 websites to you: vegweb.com and vegsource.com.
Kudos to Krista Sue!:)
I was vegetarian for 6 years and then went back to the omnivore lifestyle in college, only to return to vegetarianism for 4 years and have been vegan for the past year. I think it is important to identify as vegan, but i do not feel my veganism has to impress anyone. From time to time, i will eat an egg, but only from chickens that are rescue birds. I feel very passionately that supporting chicken rescues and not wasting the resource of the egg is one of the best solutions to this current epidemic of animal overpopulation. Eggs are in fact seeds; as a nut begets a tree, so an egg grows into a chicken. The heart of veganism resides in compassion for ALL life. No life, plant or animal (and yes animal includes human) is more precious than any other - all life is precious and deserves respect - no omnivore, carnivore, or herbivore would argue that.
as for the guy going on and on about devouring cheeseburgers, nobody is telling you not to do that. Do what feels right to you. If you are offended, that is coming from within yourself.
Love for everything, including those who don't agree. After all, we're all one :)
Who says smoking isn't vegan? I smoke organic tobacco which I roll myself using hemp or rice paper.
Smoking tobacco is also not as big of a killer as people are made to believe, much like marijuana, when smoked in large amounts it increases risks of cancer, but I am a firm believer (and there is plenty of evidence to support) that anything that is grown on this earth that isn't a poison when ingested is not a large risk to our health. Why are there 90-100+ year olds in Mongolia and other Asian countries in particular who smoke rolled tobacco daily and are still healthy?
I suggest vegans concentrate more on the GMO's and other chemicals being put into their foods (especially soy based) which have been linked to numerous cancers and health issues.
Looking into the likes of Monsanto is a good start.
A large proportion of my diet is Vegan, and I have many friends who are as well. We all smoke rolled cigarettes and are more concerned with the chemicals being put into our bodies and human rights than preaching veganism and the killing of animals (which is not seen as unethical to many) to non vegans or vegetarians.
Humans are also not animals. By biological definition yes, but science is far behind our age and reality in recognising our own existence (put as 20 times off by the likes of Michio Kaku). Human spirit lives on through other dimensions, and whilst we can connect with animals through energy, vibrations and tone, animals do not.
Lastly global warming doesn't exist, it's simply to steal even more of your money through emissions taxes ;)
TOTALLY TURNING VEGAN
Didn't know that about the cigarettes. I'm quitting now :)
You may have just also saved me from lung cancer. Thanks for some awesome motivation.
hey. i really like this site. i'm a new vegan and the reason i am a vegan is because of the animals...for about a month now, i've been trying out the vegan thing and absolutely loving it and knowing i'm standing up for something amazing while doing it. i followed a vegetarian diet for seven years before and an ovo-vegetarian diet towards the end. it ended up being that the only thing i was eating that was dairy was cheese and the dairy in the veggie products (morningstar farms) so i just stopped.
BUT, I SMOKE. i've been smoking for three years and believe me, before i decided going vegan i searched everything. because i'm pretty much an ethical vegan more than anything else and anyone else like that can still smoke. american spirit cigarettes are vegan, actually and you can also roll your own or make your own cigarettes because that's unprocessed tobacco most of the time.
so don't generalize vegans into being non smokers. i refuse to believe that i abstain from eating any kind of dairy products AND i switched to all natural beauty produsts a looooong time before this. so just because i smoke, i'm not good enough? i'm doing my part to save the environment. but if i want a cigarette that isn't tested on animals, i'm allowed to have one and be vegan.
marijuana is ALSO vegan :) and i'm sure lots of vegans still smoke that. smoking isn't just cigarettes either.
Thanks for the info and encouragement. Though I think it gets a little ridiculous though when it goes so far as to say you can't smoke and be a vegan. That's like saying you can't drive a car cause look at that oil spill over there in the Gulf and how many animals it's killing, or you can't read a book cause the trees that were chopped down to make it probably caused the death of some forest critters. Doing anything causes 'harm' in one way or another, it is ALL CONNECTED. However, we can make the obvious choices and be the positive change in humanity by being conscious of your actions. That's all. Going vegan now. Cheers.
Very ital site you have!
Keep up the vegan work..
italandveganworld.com
Blessed love
Well, I just came across this blog tonight. I've been considering for an awful long time becoming a vegan. I've noticed that consuming animal products (specifically eggs, turkey burgers, etc) make me feel sluggish and crappy and when I eat it I have zero energy for the whole day. So I have been ready to give it all up. Well, after doing some research (and watching that video, "meet your meat" on peta's website), I have no doubt that this is the right decision for me. I cannot in a right conscience support what goes on with the cattle, cows, chickens, piglets... It's so awful. I cannot condone it. For good.
i wanna go vegan and i think this post helped a little lately every time i eat meat i get so disgusted because i start picturing aminals
Haha, I've been vegan for.. maybe three months? I'm a boy of 16 years. My transition was like.. I started to have more often the vegetarian option on the school food list (as we have school food paid from tax cash here in Finland) and during the last summer, I ate more and more vegan meals 'til I stopped eating any animal products. I don't usually smoke, just sometimes begging a random cig from mates. But I can't see any ethical reasons for refusing to drink booze.. as the Finnish mass lagers (that are mostly drunk to get wasted :P) don't use any animal clarifying, and neither do the hard spirits.
Again a random post with no sense, typical for me. :/
Why are people saying eggs are dead baby animals? I disagree.
However, that said, I personally find eggs disgusting and revolting and do not understand why anybody would want to eat one.
I'm going to make it easier for you guys to understand the Myths and Truth about being a vegan. Lets say it in a better way, keeping yourself healthy by living a life with out Chemi-kills. If you would like to learn more about living a healthier life just click on
I might be helping someone's life by leading them to this type of information.
After all we can see a 20 gr8 reasons here.. still some kinda Animals won't agree. Still one more reason left behind... Going vegan makes you show love to fellow beings of this gifted planet. Vegan is the difference between the 6th sense and the Nasty hunting 5th sense. Imagine, someone sucking yo momma's breast to feed their baby, leaving yo hungry behind. Imagine, someone killing yo jus born baby for protein and six packs. GO VEGAN pals.
I am not a vegan and will not be. I will admit that this is completely selfish, but let me show you a few holes in your argument.
1) True, or at least sounds very likely.
2) So, because there is low cholesterol, they are not likely to have heart attacks. Got it.
3) Colic is only common in babies and very few who are not infants are subject to it. As for the other diseases, the fact that it is milk has nothing to do with spreading the disease.
4) So can becoming old(:
5) Cholesterol is needed for your body to function properly, along with producing Vitamin D and helping to digest foods properly. 128 is a very low level and may not be completely healthy for a person.
6) While smoking is a leading cause of death, there are cigarettes that have stated that they are not tested on animals. With this in mind, you can still smoke while being a vegan.
7) This is only because there is a low level of fat in vegan and vegetarian diets. Healthy consumption of regular foods and a balanced diet can prevent obesity just as well as being a vegan can, if not better.
8) And? While tofu is a seemingly healthy alternative, it is a disgusting food in my opinion, and is basically dehydrated, cubed soy milk.
9) A lot of thing have formaldehyde in them. Heck, a basic chemistry lab does too!
10) If you're careful how you cook your meat, you have nothing to worry about.
11) This is why it is the individual's own responsibility to stay away from McDonalds. Being a vegan is only a motivation to stay away, nothing more.
12) Healthy doesn't always mean beneficial. While a person can get all the essential nutrients it needs, in some cases those who do not know where to get what they need to survive can be subject to malnourishment and things like that.
13) This will not change by you not buying or eating veal.
14) Cruelty to animals is to be taken up with the slaughter houses. Not buying the meat will only effect the grocery store instead of the slaughter house itself unless it is on a much larger scale. You alone cannot change that.
15) Most cows in the U.S. are dairy cows, and this will not change. The milk will still be sold and processed. If you don't buy the milk and consume it, the cow's life will be worth nothing(:
16) Yet those in third world countries do not seem to see the difference between dogs and pigs as it has been said that they are both consumed. While this is an obvious stereotype with little to no grounds to support it, it still brings across an interesting point in my opinion.
17) Read my reasoning for number 15, and just change it to eggs.
18) So don't buy Mercedes. These cows will still be killed, sold, and skinned.
19) As are many dairy products, and this can be prevented with frequent washing with or without dairy products.
20) Your fingernails are dead flesh. Yet you don't seem to complain.
I just began vegetarian, and I want to become vega, but my parents will not allow me, I'm only 13
Go vegetarians and vegans!!! I am curently a 13 year old vegetarian, but when I move out, I WILL become vegan!!!!
I don't understand why people are so judgemental, i am a vegan, i amproud of being a vegan. Though to each his own, if you think eating meat is the right thing to do awesome for you, but i dont, so dont try to convince me, nor critsice me for something you dont even understand. I do wht i think is rught and so can you. I believe that humans and animals are simmilar and that we form bonds with eachother, which means that animals have feelings, sadness, grief,happiness and pain. So therefore killing an animal is the same as killing a human to me. I am healthy, thin, have a great complexion and have endless ammounts of energy, and i am saving the encironment and animals lives at the same time. Veganism makes you sexier, smarter, healthier and most of all compassionate. Please dont judge before you learn what we are about. I want to spread the ease and conveinance of veganism i also want to spread the word of get off your ass and cook something like you are supposed to.
thats just what i believe.
Veal may be nice but remember veal is a child of a cow and you know what sort of people eat/hurt children .. sink ya brain into that fact numbnuts
To the person saying not buying meat will not effect slaughter houses - supply and demand my friend. The less people eat meat, the less is demanded from the grocery store and the less is needed to be slaughtered. Therefore if enough people become vegan, the amount of animals being slaughtered will drop dramatically because to kill them without enough people to buy will lose them money.
And as for the 'too low cholesterol levels', our body produces all the cholesterol it needs itself, it doesnt NEED extra, it just starts to clog us up.
I believe that people cannot know true spiritual happiness until they wake up in the morning and know that they are not killing countless other intelligent life without need. Don't get me wrong, if i got dropped on a desert island and had no food i'd be chasing those boars around like a crazy bear until i got myself some food. However in modern society we do not NEED to kill, we are CHOOSING to kill. It is murder without cause, and murder that is making us sick.
Actually... Vegans can smoke. A brand called Natural American Spirits does NOT test products on animals
however, i am not encouraging smoking
"Vegan's don't smoke" SHUT UP!! I, as well as many other vegans and vegetarians I know smoke. Not all tobacco companies test on animals. Very ignorant, what's next? Vegans don't smoke weed, inject heroin or snort cocaine? Just because you don't smoke, and fail at researching, doesn't mean all vegans and vegetarians abstain from it.
You're only in fucking university, grow up & do some more research. Also, your "raw veganism" at such a young age is going to be a severe health risk, I hope for your health you're taking supplements + vitamins. You're what I like to call a "pretentious vegan" so many of them in your age bracket.
Fuck vegan life, don't try push it on others.
Absolute bollucks that vegans live longer than 'non vegans'. Sure the diet is healthy, but so are non vegan diets. I know heaps of vegans that have to take tablets for iron and vitamins to compensate.
How is that natural?
Cholesterol is a substance that our body uses for various functions in including building cell walls. Cholesterol give cell walls fluidity and semi-permeability. It's not cholesterol that is bad for you, but rather too much of it. (Just like Calories aren't inherently bad, but too many Calories can be unhealthy.)
Cholesterol can be found in both animal and plant sources but plants tend to have much lower (sometimes insignificant) amounts of cholesterol because (unlike animals) plants have rigid cells walls. Therefore, vegans consume very little cholesterol while meat eaters consume more. The body is capable of producing all the cholesterol it needs if you eat the raw materials (found in fats). However, it is not bad to consume the cholesterol that you need because your body will just not produce the amount you consume. It is only a problem if you consume too much. Too much means your body is producing zero cholesterol and you still have more than you need. Then your body will start to store it in your blood vessels which can lead to health complications.
That "Cholesterol can cause impotence" is inaccurate. Rather eating too much cholesterol is correlated to higher rates of impotence in men.
It's great to see a lot of inquisition from non-vegans here - even the negative stuff. I personally welcome cynicism and even criticism. This provides an opportunity do to two things 1) share what you know and 2)learn what you don't know. When you don't know the answer, don't just make up stuff. Research it. There are pros and cons to veganism (as there are to all things in life). Ultimately, this is a very personal decision which can't be forced on anyone.
Some great resources to turn people to are: Diet for a New America (book), Earthlings (documentary), and, a fun one :), Skinny Bitch (book).
My advice: Don't be preachy, but be open to discuss your reasons for veganism when asked. Vegans are few and far between, and we should represent each other well by being educated, well versed, open to discussion, and above all else healthy and happy.
To those who bitch about soya products:
80-90% of the world's soya product if fed to livestock, which ends up on carnists plates.
well...meat is supposed to be dead. Although I do believe that animals are there for us to eat... says the bible and it follows the natural order of living things, etc...
But, as always, humans do ruin things by trying to make things better, but mostly by trying to make a bigger profit, by adding preservatives and chemicals, and torture of animals, etc... I believe that a lot of these additives are whats making people sick... which is the main reason I would like to go at least vegetarian, but for the most part, stay away from fast food...ugh..every time i go on a fast food binge I gain weight, get bloated, lazy, and just feel horrible all over.
GO TO THIS LINK AND READ EVERYTHING.
I AM 100% CARNIVORE..BUT I AM NOW THINKING TWICE AFTER I READ THIS.
To the anonymous person that said:
"GO TO THIS LINK AND READ EVERYTHING.
I AM 100% CARNIVORE..BUT I AM NOW THINKING TWICE AFTER I READ THIS."
If you are 100% carnivore, you are dead. Human beings cannot survive entirely on meat. Just saying.
Go vegan. Stop the murder of billions of animals. Stop the animal holocaust. See the real world. Vegans walk with a true purpose in life and a true meaning that no meat or animal product eater will ever know. The world will change. To the meat eater there ignorance is my bliss.
Great topic. Thanks!
If eating meat is bad why does it taste so good?
For those who are unsure of why we are vegan and choose to put us down, know your facts before you judge. Just google the trailer "Earthlings" and maybe it will help you understand :) It has to do with our health, unnecessary torture to animals, and caring for our environment. |
The Pam Ward Chronicles: Week Two
Saturday, September 06, 2008
We're back again for yet another day of Pammy goodness. I'm going to skip the formalities this morning and get right to the quotes (if that's okay with you). As always, keep the quotes coming and be sure to included your website(s) so I can give credit. Also, we need a calm Hanna to keep this thing up for the entire day. The winds are already pretty crazy, and the thing is literally going through my backyard, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed.
Your Week Two Announcing Schedule
“If they can get the center or guard to the linebacker, or the second level, at the point of attack....it’s out to the races.”- Chris Spielman
“They’re lead by their offensive line, offensively.”- Mark May
“He’s tired tonight. He did a Soccer game in Dallas last night. It was exciting, there was actually a goal in that game.”- Sean McDonough
"And the ball hit him in the wrong spot that time.....um.....Yeah."- Roland Williams
"What spot was that?"- Tom Hart
"In the old.....uh.....Hands."- Roland Williams
(Via Eric)
A Gameday feature on Tim Tebow?! WTF!!!?! (Via Kyle)
I can't stand ESPN's love with him. They've run that same trip to the Philippines piece about 40 times.
I hate Ohio State, and I hate Pam Ward. The only reason I haven't thrown my remote into the tv is because I'm waiting for Ray to say something entertaining. Only in America. Yes, it's 7 seconds into the game. (Via Charlie)
Hahaha. Tell us how you really feel.
"There's good looking James Laurenitis"- Ray Bentley (Via Anon)
"6' 6" 230 pounds he's not supposed to be able to move like that."- Andre Ware (Via Nick)
Really? That doesn't seem like a lot. Andre Ware is just not good with numbers.
"I guess you can say he's a "Threet" to run."- Dave Pasch (Via Nick)
Terrible.
"Tony Romo, not available today for Eastern Illinois."- Dave Pasch
And to think....I actually used to like Pasch.
"Mike Enyon made headlines when he won the lottery. $250,000"- Pam Ward
"That's a lot of pizza to buy for him and his buddies at Ohio University"- Ray Bentley
(Via Anon)
"Oh Chris, I've missed you so much."- Pam Ward
"Ohio State's first two possessions were 2-and-outs."- Ray Bentley
"And Scott gets it up..."- Pam Ward
Yes! We're getting "Innuendo" Pam today. Oh and someone tell Craig James to settle down....
"Doing things off the field, whether that's pool parties or swimming days."- Ian Allen
"The thing you like to see from a receiver, he goes up and makes that hands catch."- Ray Bent. (Via Anon)
"Yeah, let it wing."- Ray Bentley (Via Bazooka Jones)
"He rode that down like a mule."- Rick Walker (Via JG)
"That ball must be riveted to your ribcage."- Mark May
Ummm....okay?
"No man in history has won five consecutive majors in the same major, two different majors."- Dick Enberg on Roger Federer
"This is where they like to play Football."- Andre Ware on Michigan
Ummm....Miami has the ball at the Michigan 12 yard line. I'm pretty sure that's not true. And right on cue....
"You kick a field goal here and you get yourself within another field goal of tying the game"- Andre Ware
The score is 10-3 right now. (Via Anon)
"Right now they have their hands full of bobcats!"- Pam Ward (Via Jared)
DANGER!
"They are having a hard time getting to the Quarterback because of his elusivity."- Ray Bentley (Via Bazooka)
Wow.....just wow.
"You see him look to the right with his eyes right before the snap..."- Ray Bentley (Via Sam)
As opposed to looking with his feet?
"When it goes wrong, you gotta bring the butter."- Rick Walker (Via JG)
"If you're Solich, I think you have to punt this one....oh, wait, it's third down, never mind." - Ray Bentley
"Yeah, this isn't Canada. If we were in the CFL..." - Pam Ward
(Via S2N)
"He was catching everything last week. I can't believe he's dropping easy passes like that." - Ray Bentley
"You think that's an easy pass?" - Pam Ward
"Well, he got his hands up, that's what his hands are for." - Ray Bentley
(Via S2N)
"A 48-yard return...correction, 69 yards."- Pam Ward (Via Kyle)
Not even close and I'm pretty sure that this isn't AJ Trapasso and actually James Lauranitis....
"I tell you what. If I was a bartender, I'd give you no more to drink."- Lou Holtz to Mark May
"In a summer of Batman and Iron Man, we go to my other partner Cart Man."- Brad Nessler
"You have to play physically. Punch em in the mouth and hope they don't punch back. Not physically, but you need to play physically."- Lou Holtz (Via Bazooka)
"The kickoff goes and we're underway, it'll go out of bounds and Oregon State will have great field position."- Brad Nessler
"It was a dud!"- Bob Griese
"Exactly right, it was like lighting a firecracker on the 4th of July and nothing happens!"- Brad Nessler
(Via Anon)
"Can I rent you for New Years Eve, you know your useless information"- Pat Haden to Tom Hammond (Via Sean)
"That's two for Virginia Tech, they'll have a third and five."- Mike Patrick while calling the ECU-WVU game
"A pickup of 14 moves the change for A&M." - Joe Beninati (Via Steve)
"And they [Washington] have to go for it here, they can't give it back....oh wait, it's third down, sorry." - Petros Papadakis
"Thought you knew something, huh?" - Barry Tompkins
"Yeah, I thought I did. I must have gotten screwed up when he changed the down marker." - Petros Papadakis
(Via S2N)
"It is library quiet at Notre Dame Stadium." - Pat Haden
"I've been to libraries with more noise." - Tom Hammond
"Baker... all the way... Rodney Ferguson... 45 yards, I beg your pardon it was the big back." - Joe Beninati (Via Steve)
"There were more people covering him than live in Calcutta"- Pat Haden (Via Sean)
"Better take that rifle away from the Mountaineer."- Mike Patrick after WVU turned it over on downs (Via Anon)
"Pitt needs to call a timeout here so they can get up a hail mary!"- Doug Graber
"Pitt is out of timeouts Doug."- Jon Saunders
(Via An."- Kirk Herbstreit (Via Noah)
"Superman does it again, but the Joker hung tough for a while."- Brent Musburger (Via Multiple Commenters)
"How do you ask your girl 'hey baby do you want to go to the game' and then take her up to the rock? I mean it's not like you got privacy up there"- Mark Jones
"They are certainly enjoying themselves."- Bob Davie
(Via Sean)
"This is the biggest event here since the Stones. Well sometimes you get what you want, and sometimes you get what you need."- Mark Jones
"You've been waiting to get that one in."- Bob Davie
(Via Anon)
Labels: College Gameday, ESPN College Football, Pam Ward, Pam Ward Chronicles, Quotes
105 Comments:
From yesterday's PTI cut-ins discussion: "the next logical step is to put products in their hands during the cut-ins."
Like when McDonough & Spielman were talking about Chris' favorite brand of Jack Links Beef Jerky?
This exchange was kind of awkward from the Northern Alabama/Carson-Newman game last Thursday:
Roland Williams: "And the ball hit him in the wrong spot that time.....um.....Yeah."
Tom Hart: "What spot was that?"
Williams: "In the old.....uh.....Hands."
A Gameday feature on Tim Tebow?! WTF!!!?!
Aw man, Andre Ware is calling the Michigan game.
I hate Ohio State, and I hate Pam Ward. The only reason I haven't thrown my remote into the tv is because I'm waiting for Ray to say something entertaining.
Only in America.
(Yes, it's 7 seconds into the game).
Chris Spielman should be in the booth, not sideline reporting. Send Pammy or Ray-Ray down on the field.
"6' 6" 230 pounds he's not supposed to be able to move like that."
Andre Ware on a Steven Threet 7-yard run
"There's good looking James Laurenitis" - Ray Bentley
Hahaha....I don't know why that made me laugh so hard, Anon.
Way to bring the thunder early people. Especially when these games blow.
Wow...
"I guess you can say he's a "Threet" to run."
Dave Pasch
Anyway, looks like Michigan is going to blow out Miami.
Pam Ward: "Mike Enyon made headlines when he won the lottery. $250,000"
Ray Bentley: "That's a lot of pizza to buy for him and his buddies at Ohio University"
Bentley: "Ohio State's first two possessions were 2-and-outs."
Ward: "And (OU QB Theo) Scott gets it up..."
"You gotta get positive yards initially before you start having guys miss"
Ware
Is ESPN totally kissing Ohio's ass today or what? Ohio vs. Ohio State on ESPN while ESPN2 has Miami of Ohio vs. Michigan. WTF? BTW, how bad does Michigan need to get before we take away their tv privileges?
I'm a fan Pete and I approve of your ban.
San Jose State's up 7-0 on Nebraska in the first quarter. I'm surprised ESPN didn't throw the UPSET ALERT tag on the Bottom...
Rick Walker Doing the GA Tech / BC game:
"he rode that down like a mule."
On a tackle behind the line of scrimmage.
With GA Tech having a First and goal:
"you gotta do it better than the other team."
Thanks for the insight.
"Big time players make big time plays in big games". - Chris Spielman
Really? I never knew that...
Ray Bentley on the deep ball:
"Yeah, let it wing."
"Dr. Lou and Mark May on the couch, for some therapy." - Ray Bentley
Jesse Palmer's next endeavor after ESPN analysis: The Jesse Palmer School for Kids Who Can't Read Good
Damn, AA, do you have more TV's going than my 2? Way to throw tennis in the mix.
Whoever the color guy is on the MI/Miami game...
"You kick a field goal here and you get yourself within another field goal of tying the game"
The score is 10-3 right now
"They are having a hard time getting to the Quarterback because of his elusivity." -Ray Bentley
(Thanks, Firefox spell check, I already realized that's not a word)
Pammie: "Right now they have their hands full of bobcats!"
It's not much...but everything she says is wrong.
CBS is pissing me off. Stop telling us that if we want to know the score of the other SEMIFINAL to go to their website.
You're job as a sportscaster/network on a live event is to keep us updated, not to endlessly promote your shitty website.
And an update because I gave in and went to the site... Murray won the first set, 6-2, and is trailing 4-5 in the second.
I lost alotta respect for CBS.
"You see him look to the right with his eyes right before the snap..."-Ray Bentley on Boeckman on the last TD
what else was he going to look with?
Bazooka- I can't believe that they are going to show the whole match on a delay. We all know what the score is and I can see it on the TV behind Dick Enberg right now!
Rick Walker:
"When it goes wrong, you gotta bring the butter."
WTF ?
I dont know if anyone picked this one up during the Ball State/Navy game last night but Chris Spielman said one of the Ball State players was
"big hipped and big rear ended"
"The goal for this team is a national championship, and if you can't get back a good MAC team in Ohio U, you aren't gonna get to the national championship" -- Chris Spielman
Wow I screwed my last comment up...
"The goal for this team is a national championship, and if you can't get past a good MAC team in Ohio U, you aren't gonna get to the national championship" -- Chris Spielman
Really?
Pam Ward, on Ohio U's Week 1 loss @ Wyoming: "...up in Laramie, which is always a tough place to play."
"If you're Solich, I think you have to punt this one....oh, wait, it's third down, never mind." - Ray
"Yeah, this isn't Canada. If we were in the CFL..." - Pam
"That's a lot of beef!" - Ray Bentley
Mike Hogewood also at GA Tech / BC:
"he was in pain and in pain after that pass."
Describing a play when the BC quarterback threw an interception, and got hit hard.
Nothing like having a homer like Chris Spielman on the sidelines for the Ohio State game.
After the wideout drops a Boo Jackson pass that he had to leap for:
"He was catching everything last week. I can't believe he's dropping easy passes like that." - Ray
"You think that's an easy pass?" - Pam
"Well, he got his hands up, that's what his hands are for." - Ray
NO FLAGS ON THE PUNT RETURN? There was a clear block in the back around the 50.
Ray Bentley dropping some douchiness: "That's what hands are for!" on a dropped ball
And Pam Ward: "A 48-yard return...correction, 69 yards."
Rick Walker after BC quarterback tackled in end zone for safety:
"Where is the magna cum laude the tight end on that play ?"
Rick, I know you played TE in the NFL, but come plugging your own position.
On the ensuing kickoff :
"GA Tech can take command here on this series."
Uh, the safety made it 16-12 BC, so if even GA Tech scored a touchdown (which they did), they would be up by 3. That was he PbP guy, not Walker.
Hockey is about the only sport where being up by 3 is a commanding lead.
Oh, and bazooka, we counted at least two illegal blocks on that B.S.
"They said they'll kick from 43 and in. This is 33, plus 7, 40, 50 yards." -Rick Walker I believe
Thanks for the math lesson... There's this thing they stress in elementary school called Mental Math
Check that, it was Hogewood.
"Did you that there's not one man in that group?" - Barry Tompkins, after John Jackson does a sideline report surrounded by gorgeous white women.
Just wondering, but how many times
did they mention that Ohio St was playing USC next week ? I figured the game would be used as an infomercial for next week.
[As the coaches shake hands at mid field with the clock winding under 20 seconds]
"The game isn't really over, but the crowd thinks it is as they file out of the stands." -I can't get the announcers straight in BC/GT... I think Walker
"It makes a defense have to defend everything." -Flutie on the Tyrod Taylor/Glennon platoon
"You have to play physically. Punch em in the mouth and hope they don't punch back. Not physically, but you need to play physically."
-Find a new word Dr. Lou
This is a great day for it to be raining and there be an away game. Everyone is on (or off) their game.
Lou Holtz to Mark May: "If I were a bartender I would tell you 'No more drinks!'". Discussing Ohio State v USC.
Brad Nessler: The kickoff goes and we're underway, it'll go out of bounds and Oregon State will have great field position:
Paul Maguire: It was a dud!
Brad Nessler: Exactly right, it was like lighting a firecracker on the 4th of July and nothing happens!
Correction: Bob Griese called it a dud, not Paul Maguire.
"San Diego State hasn't run the ball yet. Here's their first run of the game, and you can see maybe why they haven't run it. Loss of a yard." - Tom Hammond
Hayden to Hammond after a discussion of the new stadium grass:
"Can I rent you for New Years Eve, you know your useless information"
Don Munson on the Citadel-Clemson game after a holding penalty by Citadel:
"He (Citadel player) ate a lot of Kourtnei Brown's jersey"
"Touch Down San Diego State!"
Oh, wait. My bad. That's not a flub... Notre Dame just sucks.
"Washington up 21-0." - John Saunders
It's 21-14, but whatever.
"And Washington's up 21 to nothing."
-John Saunders
This game has been back and forth, and the score of 21-14 was on the screen in front of him.
He had some good penetration in the backfield.
-Tom Hammond
"A pickup of 14 moves the change for A &M" - Joe Beninati (Texas A&M-New Mexico on Versus)
Beninati again:
"The Aggies have come out with their hittin' shoes"
May I note that neither the commenter who mentioned the quote nor AA himself have spelled the last name of Ohio State linebacker James Laurinaitis correctly. Although, I have to admit it is a hard name to spell.
"Baker... all the way... Rodney Ferguson... 45 yards, I beg your pardon it was the big back." - Joe Beninati, seriously, your lucky you're not a big hockey guy down there in DC.
"And they [Washington] have to go for it here, they can't give it back....oh wait, it's third down, sorry." - Petros Papadakis
Guys, check the fucking down counter before you talk. Second color guy to do this today.
"Thought you knew something, huh?" - Barry Tompkins
"Yeah, I thought I did. I must have gotten screwed up when he changed the down marker." - Petros
The refs just gave the game to BYU. This is ridiculous.
The football gods don't like the city of Seattle. One of the worst calls ever.
Washington may very well not win 2 games this season......
"It is library quiet at Notre Dame Stadium." - Pat Haden
"I've been to libraries with more noise." - Tom Hammond
Pac-10 officiating. A glorious amount of stupidity.
Pac-10 gives games to the other team!
They should just disband the conference and have them play as independents.
"I think Houston Nutt wanted more time to come off the play clock before that timeout." -David Norrie
There were 2 seconds on the play clock when they called the TO. He was incessantly yelling and pointing at the play clock, like it wasn't reset...
And it took them 10 minutes until someone told them what happened to figure that out.
Just horrible.
Hayden "There were more people covering him than live in Calcutta"
The receiver was double covered.
Wow, big win for Notre Lame
After WV turned it over on downs -
Mike Patrick: "Better take that rifle away from the Mountaineer"
"What scares you when officials make those calls is that they can vote."
-Dr. Lou redeems himself for a day of ridiculousness
I need to find Johnny Holliday... Comcast is pissing me off with this Terps/Middle Tennessee broadcast.
Chick Hernandez and some guy that has some affiliation to MTSU and every sentence he's spoken has contained a first person pronoun referring to the Blue Raiders.
Random announcer is Kelly Holcomb, who I just heard the MTSU PA announcer describe as a "Football star."
BS.
"Oregon with a Route 66 on Utah. 66-24." - Rece Davis
Two things: First of all, it was Utah State, not Utah. Secondly, "a Route 66"???
Credit the Rece Davis one above to "Jfein". I accidentally hit the wrong button. Sorry.
Pam Ward makes me want to throw up.
Just wanted to add that for my last comment of the day.
From the end of the first half in the Buffalo at Pitt game.
Doug Graber: Pitt needs to call a timeout here so they can get up a hail mary!
John Sanders: Pitt is out of timeouts Doug.
After Robert Marve throws for Miami's first first down of the night:
Kirk Herbstre."
I'm just waiting for the Mavre was / was not marvelous line or somebody to pick up on the fact his
last name ryhmes with Favre.
Noah
Herbstreit is beside himself having to be in SEC country for the first two weeks of the season
I agree because he has to go back to the boring Big Ten at some point.
"Turner goes up top to Darrell Scott and it's knocked away... No, wait. He held on to it." -Chick Hernandez
Watch out Chick, those pump fakes are really tricky. I bet you can trick Chick with a tennis ball the same way you can with a dog.
great moment with corso on the sidelines and the cameraman tapping him on the shoulder.
"Superman does it again, but the Joker hung tough for a while."
--Brent Musburger
Superman does it again. But the Joker hung tough. - Musburger
"Superman got it done, but the Joker hung tough" - Musberger
Nice job mixing your superhero and villian.
Brent Musburger at the end of the Florida-Miami game "Superman wins again, but the Joker hung tough"
clearly someone doesn't read his comic books
"Superman does it again, but the Joker hung tough" - Musberger (who apparently needs to brush up on his DC Comics)
I wish I would have caught the quote word for word, but early in the Texas-UTEP contest, Mark Jones was talking about how big a game this was for the Miners and their fans. He goes on to say this contest gives them a chance to get "oiled up." What he was implying I don't even want to speculate.
I may have missed something as I just turned the game on, but Bob Davie just claimed that Colt McCoy "is facing his first adversity of the season" but Texas is winning 28-13 in the 3rd.
Showing the mountain next to the Sun Bowl, Mark Jones circles a couple and says:
"How do you ask your girl 'hey baby do you want to go to the game' and then take her up to the rock? I mean it's not like you got privacy up there"
Mark Jones just used the room service quote again. I honestly hate him more than Pam Ward.
He also said at the end of the third: "This is the biggest event here since the Stones. Well sometimes you get what you want, and sometimes you get what you need."
Bob Davie: "You've been waiting to get that one in."
Musburger's Superman / Joker quote has to be #1 for this week. I mean c'mon...the "Dark Knight" (which broke every box office record imaginable) came out less than 2 months ago. You would think with all the publicity and widespread acclaim it (and Ledger's character) got, even an idiot would be able to differentiate the two.
If that's not enough, consider 5 different people posted it here.
After watching college football on ESPN yesterday, it's making baseball on FOX (with Tim McCarver and Joe Buck) look downright cheerful.
@Sean - re: Mark Jones and the couple on the mountain
You realize she had her hand down his pants, right? And Bob Davie's comment about how they were clearly enjoying themselves? Priceless.
The video game simulation on the ESPN football field is a lot better than I thought it would be.
Andre Ware might just be the worst announcer in all of college football.
Mark Jones said Texas' appearance in the Sun City was the city's biggest event since Mick Jagger and the Stones played the Sun Bowl. True, but I thought my appearance in El Paso as an LDS missionary 5 years ago was worth something...
I think I know who is responsible for the high speed chase in Pittsburgh. |
I received this anonymous comment on my post Paying the Price about compromising in the material world to receive spiritual benefits of life in Israel. It's such a powerful comment that I wanted to let it stand on its own. Please read it and then I'll say more about it afterwards.
I think I must have been totally naive to come here 5 years ago. I brought my family because of my religious zealotry. We have no family here and no rich relatives in the states to call when we need help. My family has literally starved , begged in the shuk, and we get frequent calls from the bank telling us we need to make more money. I have cleaned houses for the last 3 years. We have not been able to provide properly for our family. And my daughters school has threatened to take us to the bet din because we can't pay her school bill. No, education is not free it's 250 shek a month each kid. When hubby makes 40 shek an hour it's impossible. Gan is higher, Yes I know its cheaper than what we paid in the states but food is at least 2000 a month and rent is around 4000. Not any left over when you make 7000 a month. If you are well off, then come. If not ask yourself some hard questions. We are headed back to the u.s. as soon as we can get the airfare. We love the land but the system is harder than hard. There are no food stamps here no way can you go back to college here. No student loans. My husband made 50,000 in the states. Here, the companies don't pay sometimes for 3 months. Can you afford that? We will never be able to afford a car, much less a home. I have to ask myself do I want to be renting and taking buses in my old age? The NBN money only lasts about a year. Your cashed in 401 k the next year. If Momma's not helping you and you don't speak Ivrit you won't be able to work the system. If you are fired, there is no unemployment for 6 months. Can you survive that long? It's not fun to have your phone and internet cut off, to have to borrow to keep the electricity on. To have the landlord call cause the check bounced. Imagine all of this while the rabbi's tell you to daven harder and have more emuna. We gave one organization 250 a month while living in the states. When we needed money for Pesach that same organization couldn't help us becuse my husband works and isn't in kollel. The peole pushing for Aliyah on their blogs are rich! You have never been poor till you are poor here. Oleh Beware! I used to give Tzedekah now I have to take it. Not for long, Yeah I want to go back, I can help others there I can't even help my kids here. Please people stop criticizing those who can't come. I have no more pride. Hashem has broken me. You can all say I am a loser but my sorry tale is true. I never wanted any handouts, just an opportunity to live in the land. I am not sorry I came. Just regret I stayed too long.Let me start by saying that my deepest reaction is to feel sad that this woman and her family tried so hard and couldn't make it here. I have heard, we have all heard, of families and individuals who have made aliyah more than once because they just weren't successful the first time for whatever reason. It's often financial, but it's sometimes due to family dynamics and the needs of a child or one of the adult partners. It's not at all unheard of.
I have no idea why Hashem helps some people be successful in their aliyah and others have to struggle so. I know lots of American olim and the majority, the vast majority, are reasonably successful, meaning they are able to put food on the table and live a respectable lifestyle, not constantly dashing creditors and begging in the shuk. Sadly, that wasn't this woman's experience. I believe every word she wrote, that it really was that hard and she really is that desperate. I have no idea why Hashem is testing her family in such a dramatic way.
However, I would emphasize that her experience, tragic though it is (and it is), is far from typical. There are people who fail at every human endeavor. Should we not send our children to school because some kids drop out before graduating? Should we not attempt to train for a marathon because some people's marathon hopes are dashed long before the finish line? Should we not reach for a big goal because others have failed to achieve it?
She's bitter. That's utterly understandable. Who could read her pained words and not feel a deep sense of compassion? May Hashem bless this family with adequate parnassa, restore their dignity and help them return to the Land successfully when the time is right.
In the meantime, will I stop advocating aliyah, stop urging Jews to answer Hashem's call, stop making American Jews uncomfortable enough to question their motives for staying in chutz l'aretz at this time in Jewish history, because sometimes it doesn't work out?
Not on your life.
24 comments:
Please let your readers know that what happened to that family is rare and that it is doable. We made aliyah with 10,000 dollars, 9 boxes, no lift, didn't know one person in Israel, from lower middle class families in the US, no help from back home for many reasons, my husband is not college educated, neither one of us knew Hebrew, NO Nefesh B'Nefesh, no money basket from the government, absolutely NO PLAN as to where to live or how to make a living. We literally made Aliyah on "A wing and a Prayer." We took every opportunity that was offered us, every job no matter how bad the pay or working conditions, every loan or grant offer us, every opportunity to pay in payments, every extension to our overdraft that was offered. Yes, we had bounced checks and electricity turned off. We took gemach loans and anything else to figure our way out. We DOVE into Hebrew even speaking it in the home at one point. I am so proud to say that we own a house, we have jobs (not high paying, but enough) no car in our future, and still a small overdraft that I don't when we will pay off. We went from nothing to everything we ever wanted without realizing it was what we wanted. It is doable. Going back was never an option no matter how broke we were and at one point our overdraft was 40,000 sheks!! I sure hope no one gets discourage. You just have to be flexible and believe in the dream and see the big picture.
I came here with 8,000 dollars in debt and the nefesh b'nefesh money. My husband took the first job that came his way . There are jobs that work american hours. I work one of those.Truthfully, I want to teach myself hebrew and start my own business as well. We bought our home by borrowing from Gemachim and a drop of loans from family. We worked super hard and did without in order to make it. I still do. Yes sometimes it is scary but there is something about being here that you just work on faith . Life isn't easy in both countries. There might be food stamps in America but if you are even 10 dollars over their limit you will not get it. I tried to get it while I was there and could not get it for just being 10 dollars over. In America there was a time where I was lucky to have a piggy bank that had 65 dollars in it or else we would not have had food that week!
This woman might be hurt but she also has to take a good look in her decisions.
Obviously this is a very sad story, just as stories of agunot are, but does that mean that no-one should get married?
Living in Israel is a privilege, and parnasa in Eretz Yisrael is truly a nes. No-one can judge another person, or claim that their aliya worked out because they had a better plan or a better attitude. Rather, the attitude should be there but for the grace of Gd go I. Ultimately, it's all min shamayim. I made aliya without a plan, and B"D have been blessed, although there have definitely been challenges. Sometimes, the only thing that kept me going were shiurim and books by Rav Brody and Rav Arush. Bat Aliyah, if you can maybe suggest them to her. One of the things that I am grateful for is that the problems that I have are in Eretz Yisrael and not somewhere else.
Again, I feel truly sorry for this lady. I don't think that people should be judging her. If your own aliya is working out, you should be thanking Hashem every single day. I hope that things turn around for her in Eretz Yisrael.
I just wanted to add that she should be proud of herself that at least she tried, really tried, and that she was true to her beliefs.
It is also very important that in her pain she doesn't go around trying to put off other people from making aliya.
The Russian olim should train the Americans to succeed. We anglos just don't know how to skimp the way they do.
I've been here over 40 years, and I'm sure we would have had a tougher time in the states.
To the last anonymous, very well said! Everything is Mazel.
I deleted a number of comments to this post because they made me uncomfortable. There was a lot of good content in some of the comments, but there was also unkindness toward others and, since I don't have the ability to edit comments, I had to delete them in their entirety.
This story actually points to a huge failing in Israel - the lack of a government run welfare system. On the one hand Israel is considered a "successful" country because it lacks a welfare system. I was recently at a forum where we discussed many of the "social issues" in Israel - housing, labor, healthcare, education, and more. I pointed out that there is no welfare system here. I could not even find statistics to indicate the number of truly homeless in Israel. Israel boasts a lower UE rate (6.8%)than that of the US. But I know that my married daughter and her husband at times called me to tell me they had no money and needed food. I contacted numerous charitable organizations in Israel BEGGING them to help my kids. Nada, zip, zilch, kloom, nothing. Some of those organizations had benefitted from monthly contributions that I and my husband had made (to the tune of $360 per month, each) and I could get NO help for my kids. One person did arrange for them to receive ONE food basket -- but most of the food they received was rotten produce and packaged stuff beyond the expiration date! Why do people think it is okay to give such food to poor people? It was disgusting and a real let down. They did recieve a one time financial assitance -- when it was Pesach, for a small finite amount. But the rest of the year, they could starve. Part of the reason I made aliyah when I did was because I could not support two separate households. The plan was for us to share one household and in that way I would be helping them. Thus far that has worked out but it too is not without its problems.
I think that one of the comments you deleted was mine. I don't remember exactly what I said, but I am 100% sure that nothing was said mean spiritedly. There is nothing unkind about saying that ultimately everything is min shamayim, including all our failures, disappointments and losses. I'm saying this as someone who has been through all of these, and still is. Even though it is very hard, the only way through the challenging times is emuna. This is a spiritual fact. However, this is not a judgement on this lady or anyone else. We all have times when we feel we can't take it anymore.
It has occurred to me that NBN/Misrad Haklita should have a service for people who are considering leaving Israel after making aliya. Obviously someone already here is highly motivated, and the country has already invested in them. Maybe there is help available to them that they are not aware of.
It's easy to read one tragic story and assume it represents the whole.
The USA FTC have a rule about testimonials that if you are going to give a case study for a product or service you must then state the average result.
The reason for this is so results are not distorted in the eyes of the reader.
Jews don't give up on the land. In some cases yes people are faced with no choice but to leave and I really feel for the poor lady who was reduced to begging. My heart is with her and her husband.
BUT.. I know many of my friends and myself included who came to Israel with very little and Hashem blessed us with parnassa.
One of my friends came here not knowing a word of Hebrew and is now one of the biggest caterers in the country.
2 of my friends started an IT biz and are now millionaires.
The biggest tikkun the GRA says we have in this generation is correcting the sin of the Spies and also of the Second Temple which are both the same sin - Lashon Hara and specifically Lashon Hara against living in the land.
Just because a person has a bad experience does not mean they should put everyone else off or that because one could not make it no one else will
Israel and no other land in the world is our Land - its not just a a country but a gift given to us by Hashem. We need to respect that.
Imagine how many lives would have been saved in the Holocaust if so many so called leaders of Israel had not repeated the sin of their ancestors in the second temple telling the masses not to return to Israel, when they could.
History tells the tragic tale of 2,000 years of holocaust type suffering because we lost our land.
In those days of Babylnian Talmudic times Baruch Ben Nerya told everyone not to come back. The leaders said Hashem could not possibly tell us to come back through and anti semitic leader like Koresh. They used that as their excuse not to come home.
The rest of the story is sad tragic history
Ironic how history repeated itself. How many people died in the holocaust because of the Jewish leaders turning their back on our precious land.
Brothers and sisters its not long before the banking system of Europe goes completely under with the USA following. Read the signs its in front of our faces.
Its not long before they blame Ben Shalom Benrnanke and the other Jews who run the federal reserve bank for the economic recession that's looming over America. We have history to let us know what we can sadly expect in huge anti semitism to rise from that, as the all the Jews get blamed for the actions of the few.
Within the next few years 1 in 3 children born in Europe will be Muslim. The head of state in Germany stood up and said Germany will soon be a Muslim state governed by Shaarya law.
We dont need to be PHDs to realize what a huge muslim population means for our children. The attacks are increasing exponentially against Jews.
If we dont return to the land of our own accord we may be sadly forced to.
Hitler taught us that we cannot run away from our Judaism we either embrace it with love or it embraces us like a marriage partner who has been cheated on and wants justice.
Jews we are one and our people are one. We must stick to together and love eachother. Give to each other, be there for eachtoher and live together in our gift from Hashem the land he created for us.
Wake up and read the signs before its too late. Put your trust in Hashem not in America, or Europe.
In the UK they just removed disability benefits from millions of people because the govt cant afford it anymore.
It's not true that there are no charities in Israel supporting non kollel people.
I know because I was supported by generous charities during one tough period here in Israel.
Israel has one of the strongest economies in the world. Today the internet means you can work with any country in the world.
Ultimately the bracha of parnassa is all from Hashem. 100%.
Come to the land while the doors are still open.
PART I
I'd like to respond to the person whose comment was featured here. I hesitate to offer advice, but a few things come to mind which may help.
First of all, your comment indicates that you view yourself as the driving force behind your family's aliyah and no doubt you bear a lot of guilt over your family's suffering, feeling yourself to be responsible for it. I know, because I find myself in that situation frequently. But, you know, it's not true. It's a ploy the yetzer hara uses to weaken our resolve.
In fact, in this world, we are only playing out the decisions which were made before we were even born; when we were still in the spiritual realm where we understood what our souls needed to make their final tikunim.
You and your family members agreed to return to this world as a family unit in order to facilitate each others tikun and everything you have been through until now has been accomplishing that goal.
There is no denying that this has been a terribly painful process. I have some idea, having been through many similar experiences in my sixteen years in Eretz Yisrael. I've lost count of how many times I've walked the streets with tears flowing freely, sometimes on the verge of hysteria, crying "Why? Why? Why?" and pleading with Hashem, "It's too much, too much. I can't bear any mnore!" But, somehow, I continue to make it day to day. I'm already nearing retirement age. I have no mate to share the burdens. As things stand today, I will never again drive a car or own a home. I'm preparing yet again to move to a cheaper place as every year or two my rent is raised higher than I can go. I can't help my children or even buy them occasional presents. So, you can see that I sympathize with you greatly.
But, when my mind is filled with these kinds of thoughts of what I "lack" or what will be with the future, I have to stop and realize that this mental battle is no less real than the physical and the spiritual one. I have to force myself to focus on today. Do I have everything I need at this moment for this day? And inevitably the answer is "yes" and even in your terribly trying situation, it would seem by your description of events that even when something was lacking, somewhere, somehow the need was met in the end, granted in a humiliating, demeaning way, but provided nonetheless. We simply can't understand why things have to come to some people in such a difficult way, but know that there is very great reward in it. I've no doubt that Hashem would prefer that everyone would be strong enough to accept this kind of life so that He could reward them more gloriously in the future world, but not everyone can bear it as you have until now.
Those of us raised in Western culture have much to overcome since, from the cradle, we have absorbed the idea that the pursuit of happiness is the goal of life and that a life of trials and suffering is to be avoided at all costs. If we willingly choose the hard path instead of the easy way, we are fools, according to this worldview, but Hashem dearly loves such "fools."
Since you're still in Israel, there's still time to salvage the situation. Chaval to come so far and endure so much only to give up right at the end.
Imagine a runner running a race through obstacle courses, up hills and through deserts, scratched, bleeding, dying of thirst and just over the final tallest craggiest hill is a sign that says "FINISH," but he can't see it yet. This hill is the hardest climb of all and all he wants to do is give up. The race course was designed this way so as to make the attainment of the goal that much sweeter. Our runner is faced with two possible outcomes: 1) He can take command of his senses put every thought out of his mind except one - finishing his course, and will himself up and up and over the crest of that hill where he will suddenly rejoice at the goal in clear sight, or 2), he can quit and return back the way he came, (because going back to the US without a home or job or car is also no picnic, I know, I did it twice) but, one day, he will know how close he came to finishing the race and how he gave up right at the hardest point and he will have so many, many regrets for not having stuck it out just a little bit longer.
I'm convinced that this is why it is one of Rambam's thirteen principles, that we truly believe that Mashiach can come at any moment on any day. All we need is the strength to get through each day, one at a time. When the day is especially hard, we can rest ourselves in the knowledge that rescue can come at any moment, that the whole world can change and our fortunes as well. When we dwell on the negative aspects of life and imagine that this is all there will ever be, endlessly, with no hope ever of any release or respite, that is when we allow circumstances (read yetzer hara) to beat us down and defeat us.
My blog is my way of keeping in touch with that thought, that we really are progressing, step by step, to the goal of the messianic age and that the culmination of this process can be realized at any moment. We are sooooo close. Please, PLEASE, don't give up now when we're mamash arriving at the finish line!! Hashem loves you, my sister, and He is so very proud of you and all you have endured for His sake and for the sake of the mitzvah of dwelling in His land! He wants to give you your entire reward intact because you have earned it!!
I don't think anybody except the first poster is really criticizing the poster but just pointing out that she is not the typical. Yes there are horror stories but it is so easy to blame the Israeli system.If I wanted to I can blame the Israeli doctors who did my D &C for the fact that I needed a hysterectomy at my last birth and for the fact that I almost DIED on the operating table. Yet I won't. There are some good doctors here and some bad .. just like in America..
Let me tell you that we had many many extra expenses at that time and I was unable to work until my baby was 8 months old. We got a huge debt from that . B'H we received a loan from our bank to help us with it recently because it was getting out of control. I think a lot of the issues people have hear are nisyonos like in any other country. Chances are the same thing would happen anywhere. It's like the idea that if you don't go to Israel then you won't get blown up by a bomb.The bombing of the twin towers proved that was wrong. I can tell you my horrible experiences of doctors in America as well. People are constantly going off the derech and having bad marriages there too.
Sometimes I wonder if I am nuts when financially it does get bad but then I see others who seem to make it on nothing. I have a neighbor who basically does mending and a little kiruv over skype . Until a few months ago she was managing on that (which is maybe 1,500 shekel) and her husbands kollel stipend. She lives better than me who works! My best friend has 7 kids and she and her husband both work. They would seem on paper not to make ends meet but somehow they always have food and a roof on their head even when it's not easy.
Life aint rosy in a America either. When we made aliyah almost 8 years ago our rent was 900 dollars and the only reason why we were able to afford it was because it included electricity.We started off in America in a little one room apt in someones basement that cost 450 dollars while when we moved here the rent for a 3 bedroom was 420! Somehow it's easier to complain about Israel but in America it is just dealt with .
It's a fact that immigrants always have a rough time in the beginning anywhere they go. When my great grandfather moved to America from Russia in 1900 he had to work super super hard to keep his job eventhough he kept Shabbos.People were getting fired just for not coming to work on Shabbos. People were going off the derech like hot cakes.
The point is that you can have the very same complaints in America as well.
A decent apartment with 3 bedrooms where I lived would easily cost me over 1,200 dollars. To put that with the cost of kosher food and tuition in America I have no clue how we would make it there.
There is a price to pay for being here but it is so worth it.
I think what the anonymous poster needs is a group of friends to give her chizzuk. Let her watch/read Lazer Brody and the like. Someone bring her a meal to make her feel good.
Why was my comment deleted? We need to be able to contact anonymously the poster and give help, not words. We don't know what sort of qualifications they have nor if they are sure about relocating and if so, where in the USA. Original poster please make yourself an anonymous email account and post it here. It is impossible to give help otherwise.
This is a sad story and it is similar to mine. I made Aliyah with a healthy amount of savings but could not find work and had to return to the UK.
My advice is to do several practical things before going.
1.) Save as much money as possible. Sell off everything you do not really need.
2.) Learn some Hebrew. But do not drive yourself crazy over this, as you will learn in Ulpan and pick up Hebrew simply by practicing it every day with Israelis, and you will pick up intonation and timing and popular phrases too.
3.) Be aware that it will take most adults over age 25 about four to six years to be fluent in Hebrew, so you will have to work in English when you arrive.
4.) THE MOST IMPORTANT THING OF ALL.
No matter what job you do outside of Israel, you must research the Israeli labour market. You must get a skill or skills that apply to Israel.
If you can cyber commute then good, but realistically you should learn about digital marketing, technical writing, copywriting, graphic design etc. These are the jobs that many Anglo immigrants do, and you will need to be professional.
5.) Know that you will not save money in Israel. You will just about get by.
6.) Network like crazy, meet up with strangers if they are friend of friends, connections are vital in Israel.
7.) Know that jobs in Israel can take four months or more to get. You have up to three interviews and you have to chase the company, they are slack in getting in touch.
8.) VERY IMPORTANT!!: Rent is high, property is very hard to find. If you can , stay in a cheap absorption centre (Merkaz Klita) during your Ulpan. It will be slumming it, but you need to spend as little as possible whilst not earning.
9.) Join all immigrant groups. Nefesh B Nefesh, Jewish Agency (mandatory) plus the very good JIA, and networking groups such as Olimbo (on Facebook) and Gvahim (for Anglo entrepreneurs). Their events are often free and you can make friends who will help you.
Do not make the mistakes I did. You can easily get through £30,000 (US$50,00) in a year in Israel. Save hard, and B'Hatzlachah!
If you can make a successful Aliyah, it will be very satisfiying.
It's also a lot harder to make aliya when you are married with children than when you are young, single and stupid, like I was. I hurled myself into learning Hebrew, and succeeded, studied a new profession, and worked like a dog, but I'm glad I did it.
While I fully understand financial difficulties as being a problem, this is not the only reason that people find making aliyah as an adult extremely difficult and is not the only hurdle to overcome. The reality is that being an immigrant in any country is hard for a million different reasons, from the language and cultural barriers to the unshakeable feeling that the immigrant has no real "home." Israel may be the true home of the Jewish people, but that should not be taken to mean that every individual Jew will show up in Israel and feel instantly at "home" as though he or she grew up there. Add to that the absence of family and old friends (you can make new friends, but old friends take time to make, obviously, and for someone above school age it is not that easy, especially in a different culture), and many people end up feeling extremely lost.
I think people need to truly ask themselves what is best for them at this time in their lives, to attempt to spend some extensive time in Israel before making the decision, and not to make aliyah on a whim. While there are people who have done it successfully, you are the only one who knows yourself and what is right for you.
I find it offensive that some folks (ie Anonymous 6:02) falsely claim "you cannot save money in Israel." Maybe he or she did not but that was their individual position. We have made more money in Israel than we ever made in the U.S. and the key is not to have a negative attitude that "its tough here" "if you can put food on the table that's it" Look, immigrating to ANY country is tough as you have to learn the rules of the local economy (ie the game). The simple truth is for us (and many people we know) financially it is much easire here than in the US. We pay 800 NIS for school per year (dati leumi) that's about 70 NIS per month per child, our health insurance - another joke 200 NIS a month for the family extensive coverage, and synagogue expenses - "0" !!! We do our own gardening and we dont buy processed American imported frozen garbage food. Our groceries for a family of 7 are about 2000 per month. How expensive is schnitzel 25 NIS per kilo buy 3 kg per week 2 meals from it 75 per week or 300 a month. Twice a week shuk shop of fruits and vegetables and eggs - another 250 per week (1000 per month). Buy 8 chickens a month 14 NIS per kilo (comes to roughly 250 NIS per month and the rest on milk, cheese, yogurts, etc.
Stay away from any service provider who says "US service" or "anglo service" you will pay a lot more for your insurance or any other service. And shop around for your ISP company, cell phone company, etc. |
|
Bell Tower Birding
Sporadic Musings about Birds and Birding on both Sides of the Atlantic
Friday, 31 August 2007
What Am I ?
A little Mystery Bird Quiz for the Weekend.
No price, but a prelude to a post I have planned for early next week.
Happy birding everyone!
Posted by
Jochen
at
20:54
8 comments:
Genesis Of A New Nemesis: the one St. Louis bird that got away
Here.
Posted by
Jochen
at
17:20
3 comments:
Wednesday, 29 August 2007
Modern Marvels
I am mostly glad to live in a modern, advanced world. Sure, the times when Africa was still largely unspoiled by European "discoverers" were surely nice, or the times when all you had to do every few days was go for a walk with your buddies to hunt mammoths. No office hassle, no stressed out wreckage on a jammed highway trying to make it to work on time and all these other nasty things modern times are tied to. But honestly, could you say farewell to so many of civilization's wonders for the sake of a less stressful life?.
Posted by
Jochen
at
16:34
4 comments:
Tuesday, 28 August 2007
The One I Deserved: The last of the St. Louis lifers
As I have mentioned in a recent post, I prefer to see all the specials of a particular area instead of striving to add as many species to my list as possible, and to me these special bird species - but of course all of them are special in one way or another - are species one is most / only likely to encounter in that one particular area. Now, the Heartland of North America only harbors a limited number of these special birds as most of the local breeding species can be seen further South in winter or also occur at more popular birding destinations.
Let!
Posted by
Jochen
at
20:14
5 comments:
Monday, 27 August 2007
A New Room With A New View
The Bell Tower Birder has moved.
Not!
Posted by
Jochen
at
18:57
5 comments:
Monday, 20 August 2007
Bad timing...
Very!
Posted by
Jochen
at
21:38
5 comments:
Tagged Again...
David!
Posted by
Jochen
at
14:54
3 comments:
Saturday, 18 August 2007
The Heart of Darkness: the next episode of the St. Louis series
Having
.
Indeed, I do not find the differences in wing formula very obvious in my flight shots, and still have some doubts that those were really Fish Crows. Maybe and by unlucky chance, those were indeed - and as I had speculated - just American Crows flying past a spot where Fish Crows had been calling earlier..
I simply walked away with the birds still singing, regarding my chances of actually seeing them too slim to be anywhere near reality. Besides, they were so far off that a sight would have only meant a small moving dark dot against other moving green dots (leaves)..
Posted by
Jochen
at
02:33
6 comments:
Friday, 17 August 2007
Great News!!
Brilliant news
indeed
!!
To celebrate the return of Cindy "WoodSong", here's a small gallery of WoodSong... I mean Woodcock pictures I took on several visits to Ohio's Crane Creek.
All the very best, Cindy!!
Posted by
Jochen
at
19:01
4 comments:
Saturday, 11 August 2007
Test the West around St. Louis
When I depart for Germany in a few weeks, I will have spent a total of around 2 years in North America:
One year in a small town east of Toronto, Canada, as an exchange student in 1987/88 with a short trip to New York City,
4 weeks in Michigan/southern Ontario in May 2005 with a short trip to New York City and
almost one year in Michigan now with a few short trips to Northern Ohio and southern Ontario.
Two years, that's quite a mighty long time actually, but if you quickly check your map of North America, you will not fail to notice that basically all of this time has been spent in the same corner of the continent: the North-East.
It is getting quite difficult for me nowadays to still see new birds around here (about which I am not complaining) but I have noticed for quite some time now that those bird names I have on my life list are quite uniform with regard to their geographic description. Here are a few examples:
Northern
Shrike
Eastern
Wood-pewee
Northern
Harrier
Eastern
Phoebe
Northern
Mockingbird
Eastern
Kingbird
Northern
Bobwhite
Eastern
Bluebird
Northern
Flicker
Eastern
Towhee
Northern
Cardinal
Spruce
but not
Sage
Grouse,
Cape May
but not
Colima
Warbler.
You see what I mean?
Monotony in their names, always the same North-East-North-East-North-East...
What I think about this?
I'll give you one more bird name:
Mourning
Dove!
But then came the short trip to St. Louis!
No, I am NOT talking about
Eurasian
Tree Sparrow to break the
American
Robin,
American
Tree Sparrow,
American
Crow,... routine.
I am talking about this little bird
here
: The Western Kingbird.
Lifer No. 5: Western Kingbird
The normal range of the Western Kingbird is quite a bit to the West of St. Louis as can be seen
here
, but there has been a small breeding population around the city for quite some time now.
And the temptation of seeing something that bears the word "Western" in its name was too much to resist: that guy was on my most wanted list for sure!
An inquiry on the local Missouri birders forum was met with a precise description by Mike Grant, and I sincerely hope a few Sharp-billed Sandpipers will fly his way this fall:
A pair with young had been seen on the utility wires of a nearby Municipal Athletic Complex, a mere 10 minutes away from my hotel.
Well, as the title has already revealed - or rather has never helped in concealing - I drove there first thing in the morning of day three and found it.
One bird, with another one calling nearby, were found and have thus taken their place in honour and glory on my life list, the great first "Western" North American bird species to have achieved this mile stone.
Okay, it wasn't too easy as I actually had to drive around the athletic complex for five, maybe ten minutes until I found it, and it was indeed on the last stretch of utility wire, so I did feel a certain amount of anxiety until it appeared, but yet again, seeing it was pure decadency and I was starting to feel a bit guilty about not having to work hard for a lifer.
I will however get back to this particular topic later.
Looking around, it was easy to see why the Western Kingbird had chosen this particular stretch of landscape.
Couldn't this very easily be part of California's Central Valley, with a few Yellow-billed Magpies just around the corner?
It sure felt very Western to me there between the fields and the athletic complex.
And here finally are the pictures of this very magnificent creature.
I do like it when birds not only appear as I had planned them to, but when they also pose like this for a few nice pictures.
Decadence all around... and beauty.
This, again, is how not to scratch your ear if you're not a Cardinal or a Kingbird but an airline employee
Oh yeah, in the background around a few greenhouses, there was also a bunch of
Eurasian Tree Sparrows
.
Thought some might be interested, but I'll soon see plenty of those again.
Posted by
Jochen
at
00:34
4 comments:
Friday, 10 August 2007
Easy at Last, another St. Louis lifer
The Bell's Vireo - one of my main "target species" or rather one of the species I had sincerely hoped to see - had been very easy once I had gotten into the right habitat. This habitat however had been just a large expanse of fallow fields with a few bushes and not the precise reason one might consider driving 8 hours for if one is not a birder but a person in their right state of mind.
Lifer No. 4: Mississippi Kite
The next day was my third day in St. Louis, my second day birding there and I had not really been on the banks of the Mississippi yet, in those surely overwhelming lowland forests of this most majestic of North American rivers, a wilderness that was even a former haunt of the Ivory-billed Woodpecker, so it must still be overly impressive for sure. And you know what? Chasing after birds certainly is a nice thing to do, but some landscape elements should also be taken into account when traveling, and so I decided to head for the Mississippi valley on this second birding day.
Okay, of course I was hoping to find a few lifers there as well, like Mississippi Kite, Fish Crow and Yellow-throated Warbler. But experiencing the wild side of the Mississippi was surely going to be an immensely satisfying adventure as well.
Oh boy.
Well, you see, the Mississippi valley around St. Louis ... how shall I put it ... might indeed be more comparable to New York City's
Battery Park
than the
Bayou deView or Cache River
, if you know what I mean?
To say I was disappointed would be a bit harsh, but honestly, I was.
Anyway, after a bit of driving around and searching for anything even remotely similar to a natural landscape, I finally got to the so-called
Horseshoe Lake
, one of the prime birding destinations of the St. Louis Area.
A small cut-off section of the lake was drying out or rather the water was being pumped out and what was left was a huge mass of mud, puddles and dead/dying fish, bordered by reeds and cattail.
The smell itself was already an experience for itself that is not easily described, but the assembly of wading birds was truly outstanding, and I am dead serious about this: unimaginable if told, barely realizable when seen.
Here are my rough estimates:
Great Egret: 1,000 I would say is a conservative estimate
Little Blue Heron: 250
Great Blue Heron: 70
Snowy Egret: 50
Green Heron: 30
Black-crowned Night-heron: 2
Add to this around 300 Pied-billed Grebes in a tight flock and 26 American White Pelicans and the smell is barely noticeable anymore.
Oh, I see you raising an eyebrow in disbelief, surely it was the heat and the foul smell of rotting fish that hindered my realistic perception, you are thinking?
Seeing is believing, I know, so here are a few images of the scene, sadly taken against the light...
A truly and believe me very tiny fraction of the heron/egret assembly
The big dead fish and the Little Blue Herons that do have a sense of smell
Florida? Where's Florida and who needs it anyway?
Black-crowned Night-heron, not liking the heat - or was it me?
Spot the difference:
Snowy Egret
Immature Little Blue Heron
Adult Little Blue Heron, this time with a
decent hair do
It had been a nice day so far, and no doubt about that, but even though seeing 250 Little Blue Herons when you've only ever seen one before was rather pleasing, it wasn't precisely like seeing a new species. And
search and seren... pity-me
, there was neither Fish Crow (despite all the dead fish!) nor Yellow-throated Warbler nor Mississippi Kite around.
Good thing I had been given the St. Louis guide to birding sites. So at the end of the day before I had to return to the hotel, I consulted it again and shock and awe: Mississippi Kites - it read - were frequently seen over suburban areas of St. Louis, e.g. over University City.
University City?
Not bad, as this part of town was right in between Horseshoe Lake and the hotel I was headed for.
So I turned off the highway onto one of the smaller roads leading through University City, checked the sky and after about 30 seconds was treated to this:
After a bit of a struggle at first, it had been easy again.
I like it when a plan works out.
And I particularly liked the shape of the Mississippi Kite's tail.
Posted by
Jochen
at
20:32
2 comments:
Finally...
...he's
back
!
Next time, Charlie, don't try to scratch your ear the Cardinal way, please?
We couldn't bear bird blogging another 6 weeks without you!
Posted by
Jochen
at
18:52
Wednesday, 8 August 2007
Belltower Birder's Birthday Bell's, the next Chapter of the St. Louis Story
As a matter of fact, and I might not have told you before but I'll tell you now as it makes for a nice introduction, the first birding day around St. Louis just so happened indeed to be your humble
Belltower
Birder's birthday.
Before you ask: I am frankly glad to be one year older because it makes coping with an increased resemblance to Bald Eagles (by name) much easier.
Lifer 2: Bell's Vireo
It sure was nice and highly appreciated to have a Carolina Chickadee as my first bird-
thday
gift, but always striving to achieve a stylish life, I wanted something else:
Your
BELL
tower Birder had come to St. Louis ...
because his wife had to attend a meeting there if we're honest, but if we are not, just for a short moment
... only to be able to add
BELL
's vireo to his life list right on his birthday.
That sure sounded like a cool idea, something you can tell your grandchildren one day to make them laugh at how weired grandpa is!
I had not expected to find Bell's Vireos at Shaw Arboretum because the birder's guide to the St. Louis Area doesn't mention it as a likely species there. But this is what it said about a certain part of
Weldon Spring Conservation Area
[L1 in the book]: "The weedy fields are good for Loggerhead Shrike, Bell's Vireo, Blue Grosbeak,
Dickcissel
, and sparrows."
It does sound quite tempting, does it? Particularly so when you're only a 15 minutes drive away.
So, this is what greeted me 15 minutes later. There surely are more attractive landscapes to go birding in, but as long as these don't hold Bell's Vireos, they'll have a hard time competing...
Weldon Spring Conservation Area, more widely known as "The Place where Bell's Vireos Rock"
So I got out of the car, walked fifty metres along the gravel road, saw a Field Sparrow and then some movement in a bush, checked it out more closely and this is what I got:
Dull Brown with a hint of a white eye ring...
...two white bars on the folded wing...
...
could this innocently looking
...
...
conspicuously inconspicuous little critter really be
...
...
a
Bell's Vireo
??
I shall very much think so, indeed and thank you very much!
This was so easy it made me laugh! Admittedly, there was no Loggerhead Shrike and I also didn't find a Blue Grosbeak there, but
Dickcissels
put up quite a show and actually seeing a Sedge Wren was also more of a treat this time than the nasty tricks it had played on me in 2005 at Michigan's Upper Peninsular.
A
Dickcissel
doing its
dickcisseling
The prefect birthday present! Man, did I feel good
doing my job exploiting the planet
on that particular day.
Lifer 3: Northern Bobwhite
This one will be rather short: as if the place described above, with Bell's Vireos (8 in total), Sedge Wrens,
Dickcissels
and a whole lot of other neat birds like Orchard Orioles, Hummingbirds and Purple Martins hadn't already revealed itself to me as a fabulous birding destination, there was more to come.
On my way back to the car, and while it was getting late in the afternoon, I was brought to a full stop by a distinct call, best describes as "Bob-white", "Bob-white".
Some birds really make identifying them easy.
Identifying maybe, but catching a glimpse?
Well, that finally was too much even for such a neat area, and I never managed to see the Bobwhites themselves (there were actually 2 calling) as they were calling away from the gravel path in an extensive field with a few scattered trees and bushes.
Not complaining though, just something else to
pursue next time...
Posted by
Jochen
at
15:29
4 comments:
Posts (Atom)
Something Essential to Save
My Other Blog
Dr. Jekyll and Birder Hyde
Essential Blogs
10,000 Birds
A DC Birding Blog
Adventures of Bird Girl
Aimophila Adventures
Antshrike's Bird Blog
Ben Cruachan Blog
BirdChick
Birdfreak
Birding in Maine
Birding is NOT a crime!!!!
Birding Mongolia
Birding Peru
Birds Etcetera
Birds, Brews and Blither
Bitter Bonxie
blogbirder
Bogbumper
Bootstrap Analysis
Born Again Birdwatcher
Bourbon, Bastards and Birds
Brownstone Birding Blog
Conservation Conversations
Discovering Alpine Birds
Earth House Hold
Fraser's Birding Blog
Gallicissa (Sri Lanka)
Great Auk - Or Greatest Auk?
Huron River Birding
Loxia Fantastica
Michigan Hummingbird Guy
Mon@rch's Nature Blog
Nature Observances by Forestal
Nature's Wow
Nemesis Bird
NYC Nova Hunter
One Jackdaw Birding
Owl Box
Oygarden Birding
Peregrinations
Picus Blog
Reservoir Catz
Richard Ford's Birding Diary
Rurality
Search and Serendipity
Shorebirder
Sibley Guides Notebook
South African Photographs
Teach me about birdwatching
Tetrapod Zoology
The Bird Boy
The Drinking Bird
The Feather and the Flower
The Fledgling Birder
The Hawk Owl's Nest
The House & Other Arctic Musings
The Nightjar
The SW WI birder
Thomasburg Walks
Today in NJ Birding History
Tom McKinney's Site
Trevor's Birding
Vectis Birder
WoodSong
Wrenaissance Reflections
Essential Websites
ABA Code of Birding Ethics
American Bird Conservancy
BabelBirdy
Birding in the Adirondacks
Birds Korea
Birdstack
Bob Tarte's Site
Bowman's Bird Stuff
Dean Birders
Great Bustard Group
Hummingbird Migration Map
Portland Bird Observatory
Reporting Color Bands / North America
Reporting Colour Rings / Europe
Reporting Metal Band / North America
Reporting Metal Rings / Europe
Rouge River Bird Observatory
Washtenaw Audubon Society
German Birding Websites
Deutsche Seltenheitenkommission
German "Club 300"
Heidelberg Birding
Limicola
OAB
OAG Helgoland
OAMV
Bell Tower Birding Archive
February 2011
(1)
January 2011
(3)
November 2010
(3)
October 2010
(1)
May 2010
(3)
April 2010
(10)
March 2010
(7)
February 2010
(2)
January 2010
(4)
December 2009
(2)
November 2009
(6)
October 2009
(1)
September 2009
(4)
August 2009
(4)
July 2009
(5)
June 2009
(3)
May 2009
(5)
April 2009
(6)
March 2009
(5)
February 2009
(4)
November 2008
(1)
May 2008
(5)
April 2008
(4)
March 2008
(4)
February 2008
(4)
January 2008
(3)
December 2007
(2)
November 2007
(9)
October 2007
(3)
September 2007
(5)
August 2007
(13)
July 2007
(7)
June 2007
(9)
May 2007
(13)
April 2007
(20)
March 2007
(14)
February 2007
(12)
January 2007
(19)
December 2006
(26)
About Me
Jochen
View my complete profile
Followers |
We live in trying times. Hurricane Ike has pulverized Texas. Wall Street is in turmoil. And, most horrific of all, the New Kids On The Block are preparing for their reunion tour.
At each checkpoint you had to do a task like sign the manifest in your own real blood, bring roadkill, shotgun a beer, get slapped by a groupie, be anointed with fake blood and let all but 30 psi out of your tire.
I also read this comment from a participant on one of the sponsor's sites:
I listened to Bathory and Dissectiont the whole night.
I've taken the liberty of annotating this particular photo in order to draw attention to the bloodied animal, the depraved expression, and the torso in dire need of a manssiere.
And here's a closer look at one of the photos from above:
I suppose if I heard about a bunch of 14-year-old kids in rural Kansas riding around doing something like this I might understand it. I've been to rural Kansas, and while it certainly has a certain beauty I could also imagine it breeding a certain restlessness and destructive boredom in an adolescent hungry for social and intellectual stimulation. However, it's much harder to understand something like this when the participants are a bunch of adults in one of the cultural capitals of the world, who have thousands of dollars of high-end bicycle equipment, and, at least in some cases, also have expensive educations and white-collar office jobs as well as access to all the socially and intellectually stimulating pursuits those assets afford them.
Could they not think of anything better to do with their bikes or themselves? Moreover, if any of these people actually have romantic partners, what kind of exchanges did they have with theirs the next morning?
"What did you do last night, honey?"
"A few of us stopped by an art gallery. Then we had dinner, talked for awhile, and saw a really great show. What did you do?"
"I pulled the wing off a dead pigeon, shotgunned a beer, and wrote my name in blood."
Then again, I guess I shouldn't be surprised when people choose the stupid route. If you want to race your bike, why should you enter an actual race? Those are hard, and sometimes require you to get up early. Why not do an alleycat instead? And if you want to have a visceral experience, why go hunting or fishing? That would require you to think, and to learn something, and to deal with the consequences of taking a life. Plus, you can't really do it while dressed as your favorite Norwegian black metal hero. Indeed,.
I hope I'm wrong in my suspicion that any animal, no matter how low on the food chain, might have been killed just for an alleycat. But even if I am wrong, I think a bunch of yuppies riding around playing with roadkill represents a new low. I'd love to see some comments from the participants, who can perhaps show me that I'm overreacting and can prove me wrong on all counts. I mean, I must be, right? After all King Kog, home of the vegan toe straps, was one of the sponsors.
Oh well, I'm glad all the frat boys are still managing to have fun after graduation.
291 comments:1 – 200 of 291 Newer› Newest»
FIRST BABY!
I was working for teamseagal....
podium
why read when I can be on the podium!
What he say? How would I now
Nice.
wetarded.
top ten, but wind aided
Top Ten!
top ten?
That's an unusually bitter post Snob. Ill be interested to see what the response is...
I was wondering what King Diamond was up to these days, apparently he's masquerading as a hipster hampster slayer in NY?? Brutal.
I'm surprised you were against the cutting BSNYC, seems like bleeding to death by choice or playing with bacteria ridden carcasses with an open wound might quickly thin the herd.
I do however hope none of those deceased birds were killed in the war against pie plates.
Makes me want to come up to New York and play with some hipster roadkill. I'll happily supply it from this obviously endless pool of douchebags.
Los
MUAHHHHH HAHHAHAHAHA
NO ONE KILLED ANY ANIMALS SNOB!
Don't worry!
Self harm and animal sacrifice? I know the cliches were most likely deliberate, but it's like they read "The trustafarian's guide to being rock n' roll". Lame. The bitterness has never been more deserved.
trustafarian... hehe. nice.
top twenty!
You guys take yourselves too seriously. Relax a bit, you'll have more fun that way. "trustifaripsters" blah blah blah blah...
It's CRUSTifarians. Get it right. Sheesh.
What were YOU doing on your Saturday night?
Those jackasses are just one tiny tiny step away from Live Action Role Playing.
We can hold out hope that a few of them will come down with avian flu, rabies, crypotococcus, or some other zoonotic agent.
Man, i hate retards.
There should be a rule against people from trailer parks being allowed to move into metro cities.
There are enough junkies, and we don't need any more crap like this...
Makes me wanna burn down an Art Institute.
regardless of whether any animals were killed, that is the stupidest pre-Cromagnon shit I have ever seen on wheels.
what a bunch of dumb burners.
you're right Prolly....
nothing like a well organized, preplanned out evening of "chaos".
darn, if only we could be so cool.
karma's a bitch. They're unaware that they will be reincarnated as NYC sewer rats and pigeons after they decide to ride in traffic without helmets and lights and drunk.
What these idiots need is to get dropped from the pack into a headwind 75km from home just as it starts to rain. These guys are pussies and will never know what it means to really 'suffer' on the bike. All this 'hardcore' posing is laughable.
more "look at me I'm so hardcore" shit.....woopee.....bird flu would be an OK ending
They should do a fix gear death race.
Or maybe a little less extreme... Fix gear cage fighting?
anon 12:48--
NOW you're talkin' my language!
Even if no animals were killed, the participants were still using/playing with/? animal carcasses. I wonder how many of them were vegans - heh.
Yeah, I eat meat. At least it isn't going to waste.
"It's CRUSTifarians. Get it right. Sheesh."
I hope you were joking. Trustifarian refers to trust funds and... oh forget it.
BSNYC, you just don't get art. This reminds me of the famous Sniffy-the-rat incident in Toronto in the 90s. A rat was placed on a canvas below a 50lb concrete block, and the block was to be dropped on Sniffy live at the art opening.
Alas, due to protesters, Sniffy was freed and spent the rest of his life in a witness protection program, or running free on some rural farm, but most likely just died chewing on an electrical cord.
It's all cronicaled here.
"...They swarm the artist and one man whacks Gibson on the head with the heel of his hand, yelling, "They should drop a brick on your head!"
Good times.
This little gem was buried in there, but it really nails the race flyer to the church door -- Bravo BSNYC!:
"By the way, if you don't know what an alleycat is, it's something that used to be a messenger race, then became a race for people who copy messengers, and then became a race for people who copy people who copy messengers."
it's not even about suffering on a bike though. It's just about a pretty lame night. If you have to plan your wild night down to cutting yourself at checkpoint moronic, well, that doesn't sound exciting to me at all. And the whole animal thing is stupid as well.
Back in MY day, a friend would crawl in through your window, announce they had some drugs, you would walk somewhere but who knew where and something fun happened, not the least of which was because you had enough brains to to find things amusing.
But I guess people not being able to think for themselves is what gives Bike Snob so much material... hmmm
*
"crustifarians"
crust punks with trust funds... IQ lacking? this shit looks like a fuckign blast. yall have dicks up your asses.
Seems that there is a grand total of one proponent of the first annual Jeffrey Dahmer celebratory Alleycat; the rest of the "participants" are most likely still jiggling about in their beds, shaking with the DTs and embarrassed out of their minds.
bikesnob, how i love thee
let me count the ways......
#1 rides bikes
#2 jewish
#3 hates humans, loves animals
this explains the transendental goose experience
seriuosly though these people are to bicycling what burningman is to society
burnt out white people playing dress up and having no conscious or consideration of their actions and the impact on anything else(much like there repressed non-fantasy life but with more alcohol/barbituates, leather, spandex and fur)
i do not understand them and find myself to hold an unrelenting distain, disappointment and something that feels like hatred towards them
what i do understand is that a lot of times the things you find the most unsettling about others are the same qualities that you are ashamed of yourself
i am not saying that bike snob feels lame for his office job or time spent in front of the imac and wants for a more primal experience himself, i just think that maybe next vacation weekend or maybe a waldenesque trip to the woods and a reconsideration of lifes detication is a more appropriate escape, you can always ride your bike there
bs i love you tho
come to colorado there are a lot of berries to forage this time of year
-yours extremely creepily
Mr. Snob,
I'm with you, this is over the line, be it killing animals or morons playing with roadkill. Forwarded your post to the ASPCA, hopefully its just the roadkill scenario and these dumb fucks catch something nasty.
Always look forward to your posts, Thanks, -S
Bikesnob + Jessica = love...
Self harm's a stupid cliché
Since you're asking Prolly, I was at a house party on Saturday night, but I'm afraid it wasn't ironically themed (unless drink is a theme) so I must be a hopeless drone wasting my life.
Just to be clear, I don't have anything against people getting their kicks how they want, I just get the feeling that the whole thing was staged so as to have scars/flicr photos to show off afterwards more than for actual enjoyment.
He's just hating because John Prolly almost won something!
P.S. Morbid Angel is not a grindcore band.
First!
You can't deal with animal carnage because you are a pussy.
2nd??!!
as for road kill...
"I know him pretty well and he's a solid dude and has been partying with dead animals for a long, long time for whatever thats worth."
Golly, I thought an Alley Cat was something like the Hokie Pokie, Electric Slide or Macarena.
Oh wait, it sorta kinda is if you think about it: Cheesey, cultural shelf life measurable in nano seconds, and certain to leave past participants wondering "what the Hell was I thinking?"
There really is a stupidity epidemic in this country.
Thank God we can document it.
But Alley Cats won't truly have jumped the shark until Sarah Palin shows up for a ride and field dresses a slaughtered moose.
Let's just pray she's not holding a federal elected office at the time.
"hard core"
The Metalocalypse is upon us....
"road kill"
"#1podium"
DNF
"dick head"
Maybe this explains the blood on the corner of 15th and 4th Ave (in brooklyn)??
you all need to shut the fuck up and go back to bumblefuck USA and keep riding your fuckiing hipster bikes and let the people in the illest city ever do what we do best.... shit you've never seeen before. calm the fuck down and stop shitting your pants, it was just a race, albeit one with a retarted premise, but goddamn, hop off already!!
i think you guys are just jealous..........
Americans are as you tell girly men. Except women, who think they are men. You as people are copulated. When time to get seriousness we in motherland cook and eat Republicans. They taste just like moose.
MisjkAHHHHH mishkaHAHHAHAHAHA
NO ONE KILLED ANY ANIMALS SNOB!
"dont fret"
Bike Snob you are so righteous - and of course the first part of righteous is 'right'.
It's a shame there's no cure for the common idiot.
PS You'll be glad to know I finally nagged my wife into removing her pie plate from her cross bike despite her plea that "it stops the chain from going into the spokes". Of course as soon as her chain jumps off into the spokes I'm a dead man. Let's hope my carcass doesn't get used as a 'token' in an alleycat race for yupsters.
No animals were harmed in the typing of this comment.
"It rubs the lotion on its skin, or else it gets the hose again."
"ass hose"
What were YOU doing on your Saturday night?
Smoked abit, played some board games, had some take out, few beers. I don't have any pictures as proof though. Why do you ask?
this is only somewhat related but fits in with the whole animal planet theme. Last night on my ride I stopped to watch a fox chase a jack-rabbitt. The fox saw me, stopped chasing the rabbitt and walked across the road and sat down about 3 feet from me and stared at me for about 3 minutes, then got up and walked up to me, around my bike and walked away. It was pretty cool. Also Snob, take it easy on us rural folks...your narrowly constructed description of kids in Kansas drawn to animal sacrafice would indicate that your primary source of information on rural living is repeated viewings of Footloose, stick to what you know (making fun of hipsters in NYC) ...we're not all PBR swilling, truck driving, chicken disembowling rednecks dreaming of dirty dancing and cable.
jessica's a cutie.
prolly-i have seen you here and there on the web. yer the guy that just started riding track bikes less than 3 yrs ago, but have somehow devolved into doing really basic bmx moves on a bastardized track bike, and posting them on the web. why? i wonder? and this whole metal/track bike thing, it doesn't make sense, nor is it interesting, or funny, or really anything other than stupid. that "race" w/the idiots and the blood and the drunk people, wtf is that? aren't you like 30 or something? have you ever raced? have you ever been a mssnger? i am going to go ahead and answer for you: no to both. oh wait, alleycat racing, yeah, i did that 14 yrs ago when mssngers did it, not drunk fat guys w/stupid bikes w/gring guards, riser bmx bars, and all this other stupid crap color coordinated spoke card crap. move on prolly, take yer posse w/you. leave bikes to people who really ride them, not dipshits that just drag them from dumpster, to parking lot, to dive bar, to their apartment, etc.. what a bunch of fucking idiots.
I'm different! I do things you won't. I cut myself and sign my name in blood. It shows disregard of my body. I pick up roadkill. Others would say that's gross. I swear. I'm different than everyone else! Believe me. You're an office drone. I'm different.
Hey, watch what you are making fun of here. The only reason I ride my bike is to stay fit enough to keep my man-boobies down to a "B" cup.
Datamonkey, deny it all you want, but we all saw "Children of the Corn."
Damn, it's like a disease. Now I see knuckle tattoos everywhere I look:
self harm
cross bike
jonp rolly
girl ymen
trst farn
firs tant
urap ussy
Wait . . . was this thing in New York? I coulda sworn you were talking about Anchorage . . .
"and let all but 30 psi out of your tire" --- Tires normally have MORE than 30psi in them?
Look, while it is true I have shot a few signs in south central Kansas, I am not sure I remember me or any of my friends picking up road kill. Sure, metal rained, but for fux sakes! If some alleycat picks up a did chipmunk and brings it to a check point...SO HELP ME
Au contraire. I went to go see Children of the Corn with my dad when I was a kid, and he told me not to go, but I made him take me anyway, and then I made him leave in like 15 minutes I was so scared.
I also once got a McRib about 20years ago. I must've been one of three people to get those. I said, Dad, I want a McRib, and he said, Don't be a dumbass, get a cheeseburger. And I said, Dad, no, I really want one, they're delicious, please, please I want a McRib. He said, I'm not getting you a McRib, get a cheeseburger, if you get a McRib you have to eat it. And I said, Dad, please, please, I want a McRib, McRib, McRib, McRib, McRib, McRib, please, get me a McRib, please. And he got me a McRib. And the thing was just pre-formed mystery meat to look like a rib (I was a little kid, dude, how should I know?). And I started crying before I even swallowed the first bite.
So what's the point? Basically, I guess, I was a p~ssy as a little kid.
McDLT's were good though, but used a lot of styrofoam.
anon 1:37 - Thanks for keeping me in your thoughts. But wouldn't antf irst be more appropriate? I guess if you're a fan enough to get my bikesnob comments handle tattoed on you knuckles I shouldn't be so picky.
Here's another thought, how about a picture of an ant on the fist knuckle then 1st on the next 3. on the other hand have isa and an arrow pointing down towards your vagina, that way you can achieve both the firs tant and the urap ussy all in one.
If you guys don't have the constitution to shed a little blood, and kill a few animals, then I know some "Pig with Lipstick" that will do the job for you!
Hmmn. Interesting. I'm getting a faintly Monty Python vibe from these comments ("Your mother was a hamster...").
I often wonder why, in any "subculture," it isn't enough for some folks just to enjoy the thing itself - the cycling. Why it has to become about one-upmanship, about style on top of cycling. For me, at least, it's the ride that's the obsession. This other stuff is just so much junior high fashion show.
(and I realize that's going to sound like a pose of its own kind, but I mean it in earnest)
furb urgr
dunc ecap
Anon 1:52, I fart in your general direction.
Anon, 1:29 PM:
I moved here 4 years ago and started to ride a fixed gear. Before that I had multiple bikes. Get off my jock before you get sonned.
Geeze. Hasn't anyone heard of metal? Ozzy Osbourne? This is what metal kids do, the play with dead things and roll around in their own blood cause it's exciting. Humans don't really chase down and slaughter buffalo anymore so you've got to get your carnage kicks somewhere right? At least the kids are on bikes.
anon 1:52 - to be a subculcture, you have to differentiate yourself one way or another. If all cycling subcultures just enjoy the cycling in itself, they'd be one big culture. I think the problem is that messengers were a subculture, that further got subdivided into messenger-imitating hipsters, and we are now witnessing another division, the hipster messenger wannabes who aren't afraid to pick up roadkill. Can't wait for the next installement.
Gross! I read your page while I eat lunch and this made it difficult to swallow...
As someone who is from rural Kansas, there is no big mystery here. Fourteen year olds who might do shit like this are encouraged to move along to the big cities, where they are believed to have some chance of fitting in. I am not saying that is a good way to deal with mentally defective children, but it does happen that way.
The fact that I am from rural Kansas is in no way a reflection on my behavior as a child. I was merely encouraged to move to some other town.
prolly said
What were YOU doing on your Saturday night?
I was boning your girlfriend.
The McRib sandwitch was nothing more than McDonald's cynical corporate ruse to get more McNegroes to partake of their fine dining establishment.
Wasn't there some good looking mama at that race the other night dragging a dead moose around? Now that was some serious blood on the sidewalk!
Damn, prolly got sonned!
The boning your girlfriend comment is hilarious. Although posted 48 minutes late.
"But Alley Cats won't truly have jumped the shark until Sarah Palin shows up for a ride and field dresses a slaughtered moose." Thank you, I've been wanting to throw an alleycat here in Alaska for sometime now, I have a theme I would of course require the racers to kill their own moose because this is Alaska after all. I'm kidding some "hipster" twit will more likely throw one before I do being a boring old married fart these days. Yes, we've got 'em here and they outnumber real messengers 4-1
podium!
I love the McRib. I get to pretend I can bite through and chew up bones.
nah, getting sonned would include someone with a name saying that... not some anonymous coward...
Shoulda done the alleycat on all BMX bikes...then the whole juvenile delinquent theme would have fit together perfectly. At one of the checkpoints they could have made the participants huff paint and then get back on the bike.
As a matter of fact, now that I look at the larger photos, some of those idiots look familiar. I'm pretty sure "Man Boob" is the moron who puked on my car at the prom. We always wondered what happened to old Dink.
...devo lved...
...not yer knuckles, yer actions & comments, dumbasses...
Shameless promotion.
Snob = Prolly
I took a class in Psychology once, looks like a textbook case of split personality.
Jessica, BSNYC is a deadbeat.
Snobbie...come back to Anchorage..little snobbie Jr needs yew!!
blackrider,
This is what metal kids do, the play with dead things and roll around in their own blood cause it's exciting.
Cutting yourself and playing with dead animals used to be for metal kids. Now it's for people imitating metal kids.
nah, getting sonned would include someone with a name saying that... not some anonymous coward...
prolly said
What were YOU doing on your Saturday night?
I was boning your girlfriend.
-Brian Davidson
Chicago
SONNED
The good thing is that the fixed geared trend is almost over....
Brian D,
Prolly was giving you a hand job? That's disgusting.
so it's people imitating people imitating messengers imitating metal kids? Getting confusing. Who really cares? He said no animals were killed. Speaking up for the mass minority here, it sounds like a thoroughly retarded fun time. If you're into that.
Though I am surprised there was no paint huffing, good call C-A.
i don't realize why everyone cares so much about this "juvenile deliquency." bmx bikes are sweet! (and so are bmc's, for that matter). If loving the bicycle is just about loving bicycling, what's the harm in this?- this is a creative idea instead of the tired old messenger-themed alleycat (although those are fun too). if you don't want to come to a metal-themed race or disapprove of it's theme, metal, a subculture that in its own is about excess and grim/dark/death-centered stuff, then simply don't participate.
if someone had fun in a way that you might not have fun, and didn't hurt anything in the process, there are much more productive ways to go about talking shit than in the comments section of bikesnob anonymously.
perhaps to contrast this tomfoolery you'll go and put together your own race, and it can have adult sponsors like G.Q., Mini Cooper, Apple, Sperry Top-siders, etc. and you could do tasks like purchase a house in the suburbs, obey traffic lights, yeild to cars, ride only hybrid bikes with 40 psi tires on the sidewalks, collecting work clothes (biz-casual of course) in yr panniers, etc.
ANONYMOUS @ September 16, 2008 1:18PM...
...Bike races of all sorts are fun: Cross races, BMX races, Messenger races, Crits, whatever...I've done them, they don't suck. In fact. I've never felt bored with the objective in hand so much that I felt the urge to throw in some self-mutilation or animal sacrifice. Be it road kill or DOA, playing with dead animals is fucked up and seriously not at all humorous. You guys must truly be hardcore.
The self-mutilation thing I'm okay with because if you are that moronic to begin with, maybe it wouldn't be a bad thing that in the rush-of-it-all a few of you had mistakenly cut too deep and bled out before reaching the finish line. Survival of the fittest, survival of the ones born with simple common sense.
Speaking of how much hardcore fun these guys seemed to have been having; I wonder if they've done anything truly hardcore on a bike. For example: barreling down a winding decent at 45mph when you've out geared yourself? Or been caught in the middle of a sketchy overlap situation in a miss-and-out race at the local velodrome (for those of you "trackies" that don't know what that is, it's the origin of that fugly thing between your legs sans the 1"-risers and Ourys). And I’m not referring to toe-overlap, wannabes.
You've got pent up quarterlife aggression, so what. You listen to Slayer because your parents neglected your feelings as a kid, they didn't let you take that karate class and sent you to a top-rated college to study art history, tuition free. I feel sorry for you. Seriously.
It's not the homegrown Kansas Kids that are tearing the heads off pigeons (first off, pigeons don't really exist much in the Midwest) being a former Midwesterner I would know. I've been a part of the "fixie" community in Philly, LA and now SF and I have to say the "new-breed" of hipster-fixters is a strange phenomena. It's like track bikes are the new Marliyn Manson for misunderstood "kids" on Prozac. No offense to Manson fans or people who seriously need Prozac, but: "when you live with the Apes of man, it's hard to be clean." If you get my drift.
I wish the apocalyptic wrath of pigeon swarming on all of you teen-angst posers. Let them poke out the eyes of the pretenders.
That or I hope you catch a crab the next time you're out-geared cruising downhill from whatever Vegan diner that you’re coming from. I’m sure you’re parents will front the dentist’s bill when your front teeth are left on Cobble Hill. Enjoy the reconstructive surgery, because I don’t know anything more hardcore than having your parents front for that.
"a bunch of adults in one of the cultural capitals of the world, who have thousands of dollars of high-end bicycle equipment, and, at least in some cases, also have expensive educations and white-collar office jobs"
i think you have found the problem right there. as much as i like the stereotype of the inbred, redneck rural sociopath, the truth is that most rural people have a basic respect for life.
on the other hand, inbred redneck white collar office drones would make perfect SS officers, as they have been 'educated' in little more than machiavelli and excel macros.
having an expensive bicycle or, dare i say it, living in the 'right' city, does not make one a moral person, any more than buying a crass t-shirt makes you an anarchist.
i am puzzled, mr snob, though. as i ride my bike in my flyover state, i am incessantly confronted with roadkill, an reminded that i, myself, could be somewhat flat were it not for the grace of god. do you not have this daily affirmation in 'the city'?
Prolly is calling people out on their internet manners! He is definitely hard.
A (monkey)pox on you all. Way cooler than birdflu
...some folks have to sell it...
...some people just are...
What were YOU doing Saturday night?
Funny you'd ask. Sleeping hard after busting my ass working at a real roadrace all day, and most of the day before. Amazingly, nobody stopped to cut themselves, get slapped by groupies, sign their name in blood, or to pick up roadkill, the rabies threat being what it is out here in pickup truck-driving flyover country, West bumf*** D.C.
Although the guy driving the Sag Wagon for the Cat 4 race claimed he was picking up roadkill, we think he was exaggerating.
speaking of hampster hipsters
and all y'all can just shut the fuck up about this race - if you like road racing or triathlons or whatever better than something like this, go do that. who cares if you like stupid fun (i sure do) or knuck tats. sorry you stupid fucks are so damn cool
and props to prolly for doing something new on a track bike - what have you ever done new except been the first on nashbars email list to buy illuminated bar ends or wireless cyclocomputers. good for you
thumbs up
A++++++++++ would do business with again
Brilliant stuff Snob. This Lord of The Flies behavior has more to do with the human condition than it does with geography or accessible culture. It is the ugly truth that animals are really better beings than we are.
White people of privilege taking longer than others to mature. I don't see much wrong with it, especially since moving from NYC. I don't envy you, snob.
It's amusing to see how many of you think they know these people who raced. Like you need the internet to finally voice your pent-up aggression. Bisickle, you're the perfect example of kind of pretentious snob who needs to validate their identity by posting on Bike Snob. Claiming that everyone who lives in a city like New York is a trust fund kid. People work their asses off in this City to make it and this kind of release is one way to have a good time with friends.
Why would you assume they've never raced? Or hit 45mph on a descent? Or some other near wreck on turn 4? Do you know them? Probably not. I know for a fact that a few of those guys are hard-as-nails cyclists who could destroy anything with 2 wheels. Including your front wheel in a miss or win in out. So why are you so hung up on it?
Because you feel threatened in some way and your insecurities come out. That or you're too old to be able to let loose again and have fun without hating on everything. Just remember, there are always people who are faster and more experienced than you, so all your talk is bullshit.
And who thought that Morbid Angel was a grindcore band? Death Metal! Like that band, Death!
i think it's less about the race and more about prolly. don't let him represent you, new york, even if you all have better things to do than hone your internet personae.
At least Prolly has the balls to show up to this comment section and defend his actions against a very hostile crowd. I'd like to see some of you go on Fixter sites and talk shit about them there, instead of in front of your choir.
Just saying...
You guys are just jealous. Although playing with dead animals is indecent and dangerous, they still didn't hurt anyone or anything.
Bitchin' bikesnob.
Right on the head.
talk about getting defensive!
."
you said it, Snob.
talk about getting defensive!
that was meant about "had enough."
anon 2:55
Hey, enough hatin' on Prolly. I know him pretty well and he's a solid dude and has been commenting on bike blogs for a long, long time, for whatever that's worth.
I think a bunch of yuppies riding around playing with roadkill represents a new low.
ryanfromdeland = Investment Banker = YUPPIE
Had Enough--you're right, I don't know any of those people who raced cuz the people I know wouldn't be at some stupid shit race like that.
Prolly-I'll slap you. Several times if needed.
Hardcore alleycats probably eyeing this bike as an upgrade....
prolly, sat night i was wrenching on the bike and getting ready for CX. sunday the beers were well deserved. maybe you should take yourself more seriously because that was some of the dumbest stuff i've ever seen from the ny cool school.
Wild berry foraging in Colorado this time of year? I would have thought that was over by now. Perhaps lower foothill foraging or on the margins of the plains? It must be downright autumnal in those parts about now. I believe it is wild berry foraging season along the Fish House Road off of the 1/9 truck route in New Jersey. BSNYC, you should check it out. Take the PATH to Hoboken, p/u the monorail to the JC elevator and cycle on over to the FHR.
CommieCanuck:
"This reminds me of the famous Sniffy-the-rat incident in Toronto in the 90s."
This where I shite all over Commie for being Toronto-centric.
I remember this. It happened in Vancouver.
Just a Canadian thing. You all go back to your relevant comments.
I am so tired of you people coming to New York and insisting on doing stuff and letting loose. You're paying all this money to re-grow up where I grew up, and frankly you're better at it than me (I was only 14 for god's sake). Imagine the smartest most creative kids from everywhere converged on your town to be cooler than you were in high school. Makes we wanna son you for your North Face.
Prolly is rubber and we're all glue. Screw all of you.
i'm from the land of roadkill, and i can tell you, this is a waste of some good eatin'.
Anothercanuck-
Try being an Newf. It makes a lot of these redneck hillbilly comments kinda sting for sure.
great great post.
+
skkk brnzzz!
+
arrospok.
=
all you haters suck my balls.
brilliant sentiment and so eloquent.
and wtf is "sonned"
is it some sort of worn-crooked wide flat brimmed baseball cap thing/thang?
yeah general cunt, that's what it is...
anothercanuck 3:11:
I remember another Canadian thing: the tv show "Mr Dressup." He was a hell of a lot more creative and original than those alleycat tossers playing dressup with their metal clothes straight out of the hot topic tickle trunk. and that show was aimed at 5 year olds.
Sincerely,
Casey and Finnegan
ryanfromdeland-you are a tool, and you are from florida, and you are a tool. a metal themed race? say that, slowly, to yourself, and if you weren't an idiot-from florida, you would know just how fucking stupid that sounds. so shut it. and prolly-whoah-4 years, my mistake. and had multiple bikes? cool! keep doing half ass bmx tricks on your big bmx bike w/skinny tires, and wait! there is more, it doesn't coast!! wow! so fucking rad and cutting edge, i mean, bleeding edge stuff here. so cool and rad. you know what the hardest part of doing a barspin is? telling your parents you're gay. and you my friend, are gay.
what is SONNED? what does that mean? is that like, street/metal/fixie/tough guy/deep- v/cool talk? does anyone know what that means?
face it: a generation in their 20s have nothing to create for themselves. instead they re-make older culture with a twist: commodification!
cash in now honey...
lay off prolly
he's a strong satanist and was a solid yuppie for a long time
Great column, Snob. I ride every day, and most of my rides are solo. Stuff like this is why I prefer them that way.
Sonned is something white kids who went to high school in Manhattan in the early to mid 90's used to express the humiliating feeling accompanying the theft of your North Face jacket, or any such disrespectful incident. The highest form would be sonning one in front of one's whole crew (of like-minded buddies). Synonyms include herbing, owning, making someone your biotch. Sonning has no basis in hip hop or African American culture.
Hey everybody-
Ryanfromdeland says Nashbar just got a shipment of illuminated bar ends!!
Sweet!
Excuse me, I gotta go shopping.
Just wait til the library sees how I've accesorized those old illuminated manuscripts they have stuck in glass cases not even gathering dust.
WOW
firstoff i'm not really an investment banker - that was sarcasm - i'm actually closer to a mix between two other things you hate, a tall bike rider and a trickster, neither of these however, in my experience, have ever been confused with a yuppie.
yes i'm from florida and florida is way cooler than NY (about -100000 degrees cooler). Know what else is from florida? two aforementioned death metal bands - morbid angel and death.
it's cool if yr proud of where yr from, because i am too - in fact i'd bet money (that is, if i believed in money - im also an anarchist) that i have more fun than you do because cycling isn't such a serious thing to me.
know what's harder than telling yr parents you're gay? telling you're parent that you're anonymous...
see you at das peloton!
Prolly,
I checked out your blog for the first time in a long time. No more music reviews? ...any new dubstep artists worth mentioning for those of us out in Cow Town? Say what you want about Prolly's taste in bikes and dead vermin, but he does have good taste in music.
I'm a different anon than the one you're talking about, but I would find it harder to tell my parents I have an internet persona. You wouldn't last a second in true anarchy, nor would I. In case you were joking about the anarchy thing, making fun of yourself isn't funny when you actually suck.
from urbandictionary:
1) The action of being capable of calling someone else "son", in a derogatory sense.
2) Similar to owned and pwned. To prevail heavily over an opponent in some form of competetive sense, such as a verbal argument or physical confrontation; mostly used in a one word sentence fragment.
"mutha fucka your whole crew just got SONNED!!~!1!!"
Snob said it proper.
And now my 2 cents:
Yuppie scum, using their privilege to be materialist, apolitical, self-absorbed and puerile. Babies, the lot of 'em.
I'm loving all the hate today. Even Frilly's getting mean.).
just because i'm an idealist doesn't mean i think it will happen soon, although it has happened several times in history (see: spanish civil war/cnt/fia, etc) and in a microcosmic sense it happens even with the little "take a penny, leave a penny" thing you see in convenience stores.
i don't hope to "convert" you, nor do i expect you to take any of what i say seriously, but i intend not to be misrepresented as an "internet persona" from florida.
MORE SUNSHINE // LESS STATE
up the crust punks with trust funds lolllzzz
these comments! for a second here i thought i was on youtube.
manb oobs
Ant,
Let your haters be your motivators. You're from the ATL so you've heard that one.
kidd yprn
prolly, compared to ryanfromdeland, you are almost cool. florida blows, dipshit. tall bikes are stupied, and you just called yourself a trickster? get a job, one that won't wear out your kneepads, one that doesn't force you to steal all the scope from whoever's couch you are crashing on.
i meant it sarcastically too
thanks
Sarc Astic
"At each checkpoint you had to do a task like sign the manifest in your own real blood, bring roadkill, shotgun a beer, get slapped by a groupie, be anointed with fake blood and let all but 30 psi out of your tire."
That sounds like cross, except they'd be running their tires way too hard.
In the spirit of hate, I thought I'd add that NYC is filled with the most conformist, self-conscious people who can't make a move without thinking of all the different ways they might be described in the third person. And why does everything have to be documented and end up online or in a glossy or not so glossy art publication or gallery or whatever? I guess we'll never know about the unrecorded cool things out there, but I think people should stop documenting their experiences and stop acting like they're being documented. And if people were really hip, they'd set up shop in Newark (NJ, not Delaware). Just follow the Fish House Road to the Pulaski Highway.
trickster was sarcastic that is.
that's what people like you call me.
i may like tricks (coming firstly from bmx) but i can hang up my bike tomorrow or go get a *real* bike
but you'd still be an asshole
and florida blows? where are you from?!
we've made what we've got here, if you think you personally kick ass for living in some hip metropolis know full well it was like that before you had anything to do with it and would be just the same if you weren't there.
even if you hate on kids who ride bikes, they're just copying you
Way to go everyone for flaming a barely publicized hipster CAT4 race after the fact. I guess that's the point, though... sadly. It's just better when it's anonymous, I feel bad for prolly, et al., because they just wanted to have fun and helped to clean up the streets. Next time, hold it during the morning sometime between 630-1000 and have a BSNYC theme and dress up as CX weekend warriors, drink Rogue, and wear helmets.
I'm not one to leave comments on peoples blogs. Why would they care what someone whom they have never met thought of what they have posted.
That said, I agree with you 100% in regards to todays posting. the very idea of collecting road kill sickens me, and i'm not one who is easily sickened.
I see road kill almost everyday and it makes me think that we as a people have lost touch with our place on this earth with and have created a callus disregard with all of the other inhabitants who live here with us.
ant1st, one of the checkpoints was get slapped by a groupie, n'est-ce pas?
Prolly, I've never been to NYC, but I find it hard to believe there was that much roadkill on course. That jackass with the manboobs is looking way too smug regarding his 'find'.
And, about telling your parents about an internet persona, hafta agree. Mine would have a stroke, no matter how lovely the panties! Telling them I've gone Lindsay might be easier.
In case you got lost, it's the Pulaski SKYway.
UCI should consider adopting the cutting part. Collect a little for testing at the same time, and that's two, uh, birds with one razor blade.
hadenough:
Just a head's up, too old? I'm 24. I paid my way through college, have been hopping around "trying to make it" like you say. Across the globe a couple times in three years. The only thing constant is the bike I bring with me. I race, and am not fast-self admittedly. I used to be heavy into the fixie scenes in my old hometowns, and am simply angry at the progression. I love how diverse it's become, but there is a certain avenue that erks me, and this posting obviosuly, blatantly hit that nerve with a razor sharp wire-cutter.
I think the people I spoke about, if they are anything like the people I've come across associated with that "scene": more than likely resemble the stereotype I'm bashing. I'm not bashing all fixie riders, because I've been one since I was 8-years-old. That would be hypocritical. I was the odd kid out who rode bikes when all of my friends in Philly were skating.
I'm welcome to diversity of all kinds and the spread of the two wheeled cause. I just have a feeling they aren't helping much. People on the outside see that, cops on the outside see that: and next thing you know your next big group ride carnival has task force waiting at the end of the 4th street tunnel, waiting. If you were in LA when that happened, then you understand.
If I could post a Spock from Star Trek hand-gesture I would, but ride long with posture!
Peace.
they probably had to lie to themselves and made themselves believe the animals were njs stamped.
fucked up.
hopefully the open wounds and dead dirty animals mix. good luck with your diseases.
let us know when the funerals are going to be.
Don't give frat boys a bad name. Saturday night I was having pizza with two of my own frat brothers after volunteering for Denver's Tour de Fat. It was a collection of mainly white people playing dress up and drinking beer. I guess it wasn't quite as cool as this alleycat since no one was cutting themselves, seeing who could be more gutterpunk, or playing with dead animals.
I still claim being hardcore though, cuz once I was riding with my race team and my buddy grant decapitated a pigeon when it flew into his bladed spoke front wheel.
Fellow BS followers - I gots me an identity, so now you can know for sure that the bullshit I write is mine.
Frilly - My mistake, I see where you're coing from now. Kinky!
I feel bad for Prolly, but if it wasnt him, it'd be someone else. Someone that doesnt really get it, but is totally siked. Same shit with Skating in the 80's, posers were abound. I saw those pix and just thought it was the lamest shit in the world, but they had fun...so who gives a shit. Yeah he is hipster, and yeah the BMX tricks are lame...and saying "sonned" is REALLY lame...and the alley cats are super lame....it's like CAT 8 type shit. I think it's gonna get a lot worse though....then Prolly will realize just how lame he was in 2008.
also, FYI: Morbid Angel is DEATH METAL, not GRINDCORE.
Hey florida guy, you seem to have an advanced understanding of anarchy. It's good to read lots of stuff about impossible utopian ideals which require the suspension of human nature. It's up there with being a Star Wars expert or a Gnome scholar. -Freddy Berckx
...'classifications':...yuppies, anarchists, death metal-ists, conformists, hipsters punk rockers, non-conformists, fixsters, prolly-ists, non-prolly-ists...
...i am one lucky fuck 'cuz i don't "fit in" anywhere...
...i'm just a guy who rides bikes, all kinds a' bikes & i enjoy 'em all...sorta like music...
bgw - "prolly-ists, non-prolly-ists"
Good stuff.
ryanfromdeland -
Nobody's ever said anything bad about tall bikes. Come to NYC and ride one - now that would be batshit crazy! I bet you'd get mad props, son!
when did bikesnob call morid angel a grindcore band?
i think you folks calling him out on that clearly missed the point.
Braised Pigeons in Chocolate Sauce recipe
ingredients
4 pigeons weighing 500 g (18 oz) each
2 garlic cloves
1 tsp salt
2 pinches freshly ground black pepper
4 tbsp olive oil
1 tbsp plain flour (All purpose)
4 tbsp dry white wine
1 cup (8 fl oz) 250 ml chicken stock
200 g (7 oz) shallots
2 oz (50 g) plain/dark) chocolate
method
1. Peel and finely chop the garlic.
2. Wash pigeons inside and out, then dry and rub with salt and pepper, inside and out.
3. Heat oil in large, heavy bottomed pan and brown pigeons all over before removing from pan.
4. Fry garlic in remaining oil. Stir flour into oil, fry briefly, then add wine and chicken stock. Simmer for 5 minutes, stirring constantly.
5. Put pigeons into sauce, cover and cook for 50 minutes on a low heat.
6. Peel shallots, chop finely and add to pigeons after 30 minutes.
7. Pre-heat oven to 120°c (225°f) gas mark 1/4
8. Arrange cooked pigeons on a serving dish and keep hot in oven. Skim fat off sauce.
9. Grate chocolate and add to sauce, stirring continuously over a low heat until melted. Do not let the sauce boil again.
10. Season generously with salt and pepper and serve with pigeons.
serving amount
serves 4
BGW-
Prolly-ist. You're onto something. I've been kind of lost since I moved east and had to leave the Church of Saint John Will-I-Am Coltrane
Hey prolly, whatever happened to your road and track team? hahahahaha.
Dear internet personalities. This is Jack, the winner of the metal race. If you'd like to come ask me about the reality of the situation of this race and why I think it was a great time and well planned, please feel free to order from mighty diamond, salad queen, urban rustic, or teddy's tonight until around 10:45.
Not only will I engage you in a civil, friendly and informed discourse in real life, but I will also bring you food. Good food. Hopefully shortly after the time you order it. Maybe even with a smile on my face. Because I ride my bike for a living and that gets me stoked. Have a good evening.
- Jack Crank
I was in a scavenger hunt once that involved obtaining road kill. But... we live in the middle of Suffolk County. It's boring as shit out there most of the time, and road kill can remain in the street for days. I can't imagine it being easy to find fresh roadkill that's still bleeding. Unless that's people blood... but I'm doubting it. If you really want to be metal, don't kill animals and ride trendy hipster bikes, do what Dead did.
...jeezus, critical ass...what are you ???...french !!!...
...& props, ant1, but are you ant1st, cuz he's first...just sayin'...
...& prolly...next time, you can be last across the line & still win...just show up w/ a 'fresh' skunk roadkill carcass, preferably between yer teeth...
...now that sez "badass, death metal, motherfucker" in anybody's language...
This was not a cycling related event. It was a show for all of us. Please metal alleycat riders, accept this attention and discussion and feel superior. You are now +1 above all other allycat riders and +2 above the average fixie rider and best of all... +3 above the average cyclist. You are a winner, mommy and daddy love you.
lastnightsparty/cobrasnake or it didnt happen.
Jack, for some reason I have no appetite for food "from mighty diamond, salad queen, urban rustic, or teddy's." Sorry, Son. I wonder if any of those places know you are "advertising" for them.
bgw - I was wavering between going with ant1st, which would have been most applicable to comments on this blog, and ant1, which makes more sense for life outside this blog (not that I have a life outside this blog, but I may someday). ant1 won (came in 1st?). But worry not, ant1st is not going away.
ant1st
...yer there, dude...or here...fuck, i get confused talking on the intertubes...
...which is neither here nor there but i'm just sayin'...
Most fixed gear riders are fags I'd never want to hang with, ever. The bikes themselves are fun and fast, love them. The scene is lame, dirty, gay, etc... the clothes... you guys are so gay it hurts!
Prolly is lame. Mega lame. Buy a bmx and really throw down. Fixed gear tricks are lame.
The Metal alleycat, also lame. And I hope most of the participants meet with untimely deaths. And if they did kill any of the "road kill" maybe they too will become road kill due to the random act of a cager (car).
Now go play in traffic hipsters!
is the metal theme supposed to be cool or ironic?
What the hell are you all doing in New York?!
Where I live, you would be considered crazy to ride bikes with no brakes and dead animals.
Do you live in PETA Hill too?
bisickle:
You're 24 and you said fixie. You've said enough.
Here is a question: when did alleycats start to suck?
aw fuck this shit
hadenough:
you're pretty much a hypocrite.
you can have fun riding your fixed gear. i'll enjoy racing mine.
i have nothing to justify other than the ludocrisy of animal killing post-adolesceant jerk-offery. i guess it's because i'm "insecure and feel threatened." Give me a break.
i have no qualms with NYC. i love the place, i've had far too much grey's papaya in my day...but...i have a problem with people, be it cyclists or cell-phone jabbing, lexus-driving spawns that kill innocent animals for nothing more than "a good time."
fuck's sake, go watch a goddamned movie or something.
enjoy cutting yourself with razor blades and sacrificing pigeons in the name of hardcore.
Holy shit, pushing 200 comments. How is doing an alleycat for the photo-ops any different than chronicling your life on a blog? Granted it all looks pretty stupid, but how is a legitimate race any less ego-centric?
200th gets the trip sheet clip
it's all about the bike.
To anyone who is from NYC:
I do not hate on your beloved city, albeit I like Philly more, forgive me I'm partial. :)
Many apologies for calling out certain social groups within the fixed-gear-world.
I was more than angry when I woke up to read my morning blog, to find good people of the bike, violating the bodies of dead animals.
To anyone I offended, once again, my sincere apologies. But I ask you, next time. Go for with your messenger easter egg hunts, but please, leave the goddamned pigeons out of it.
Ride safe.
Hey Gerchof, I think these puppies need a little quiet time at one of your holiday gulag retreats
I make no apology to anyone who thinks this bullshit is cool. Grow up, assholes!
Just barely squeaking by in the top 200
I think some of you are overreacting to the killing of one single pigeon. I arrange the mass killing of many pigeons each year for the Wyomissing Pennsylvania Woodsmen's pigeon hunt. Since there aren't a lot of pigeons to be found in the vicinity of Wyomissing, I take my van around New York City and net live birds for the hunt. This is not some mindless, barbaric outlet of the rich. It is a longstanding tradition among the Wyomissing aristocracy to participate in a pigeon hunt and then bring their kill to their wives and daughters to properly butcher the squab for a feast at country estate supper clubs. Seated at long tables, you can still smell a bit of the old growth Pennsylvania woods. On chilly autumn days it is not uncommon to smell the scent of Pigeon a la Maitre-Jacques or a la Richelieu as well as creamed corn coming from the weedy, marshed interzones that divide pastoral Wyomissing from its more urban communities. It is not a cruel practice, as my Croatian father once instructed me, but a way of honoring the birds in the company of noble men served by their dutiful women. As he once said, "What is good in Istria is better in Wyomissing." It is as much a natural part of me as flight is to the pigeon. |